WEBVTT 00:00.500 --> 00:06.135 [SMPTE Universal Leader] 00:06.135 --> 00:09.567 [leader countdown] 00:09.567 --> 00:11.734 [image transform, TM] 00:11.734 --> 00:12.601 [countdown] 00:13.401 --> 00:19.434 [This audiovisual has been acquired for distribution by the National Medical Audiovisual Center] 00:21.366 --> 00:23.033 [?] Okay. [throat clearing] 00:23.034 --> 00:25.234 [Bob, floor manager:] Stand by. We're rolling shortly. 00:25.234 --> 00:26.534 [Copyright 1973 Ortho Pharmaceutical Corp. All rights reserved] 00:26.534 --> 00:30.634 [Bob:] You might catch that drape again, Al, down at the bottom. 00:30.634 --> 00:34.101 [footsteps, shuffling sounds] 00:34.101 --> 00:39.301 [Stan, director:] We're rolling Noam, will you take your place for the opening, please? 00:39.301 --> 00:45.368 [footsteps, shuffling sounds] 00:45.368 --> 00:48.434 [Bob:] Get the appointment book. Have a good show. 00:48.434 --> 00:50.167 [Dr. Beryl Chernick:] Thanks, Bob. 00:50.167 --> 00:53.934 [Dr. Noam Chernick:] Say, I feel anxious. [Dr. Beryl Chernick:] Tell me about it. 00:53.934 --> 00:58.134 [Dr. Noam Chernick:] Well, we're making a film and I'm not an actor. 00:58.134 --> 01:01.868 [Beryl:] We're not expected to be actors. We're just supposed to do what we do. 01:01.868 --> 01:05.334 [Noam:] Yeah, that's what makes me anxious. 01:05.334 --> 01:10.534 You see, we do sex counseling and that involves talking about sex. 01:10.534 --> 01:14.833 [Beryl:] Yes, I thought men talked about sex all the time. 01:14.833 --> 01:16.600 [Noam:] Well, yeah. 01:16.601 --> 01:23.300 They brag about it and they tell dirty jokes but they don't really talk about sexual feelings. 01:23.300 --> 01:26.733 [Beryl:] But they know all about sex. 01:26.733 --> 01:29.299 [Noam:] Where do you think they learn? 01:29.300 --> 01:31.233 [Beryl:] Weren't they born knowing? 01:31.233 --> 01:33.567 [Noam:] Not any more than any other kind of human being. 01:33.568 --> 01:38.966 [Beryl:] Oh. Well if they don't know, why can't they ask? 01:38.966 --> 01:43.233 [Noam:] Well, see, a guy can't ask because he's a expected to know. 01:43.234 --> 01:47.434 Right? And if he asks, then it means he doesn't know, so he doesn't ask. 01:47.434 --> 01:49.834 [Beryl:] I see. Well, that's an awful bind to be in. 01:49.834 --> 01:56.068 I can see where that would make you uptight, not wanting to talk about sex. 01:56.068 --> 01:58.368 [Noam:] You know, I got another problem. 01:58.368 --> 02:00.668 [Beryl:] Well, you better tell me about that one, too. 02:00.668 --> 02:07.934 [Noam:] Well, I'm a physician. You know, people go to their doctor and expect them to know all about sex. 02:07.934 --> 02:11.133 Say, how are the people watching going to know we're doctors? 02:11.133 --> 02:13.299 I mean, are we supposed to introduce ourselves? 02:13.300 --> 02:14.833 [Beryl:] I don't know. 02:14.833 --> 02:19.233 (shouting) [Noam:] Stan, how do the people know that we're doctors? 02:19.233 --> 02:22.766 (over intercom) [Stan:] Don't worry about it Noam, we'll just burn it in. 02:22.766 --> 02:25.233 [Avinoam B. Chernick, MD, FRCS (C)] 02:25.234 --> 02:27.901 [Noam:] They're going to burn it in. 02:27.901 --> 02:29.533 [Beryl:] What does that mean? 02:29.533 --> 02:30.533 [Beryl A. Chernick, MD., Ph.D.] 02:30.533 --> 02:34.633 [Noam:] I haven't the faintest idea. That's some kind of professional jargon. 02:34.633 --> 02:36.565 [Stan:] We're ready to start. 02:36.566 --> 02:41.633 (movie slate) [Bob:] Ortho Pharmaceutical Corporation presents "Bill and Sue", scene one, take one: 02:41.633 --> 02:44.899 A Co-Therapy Team Approach to Conjoint Sex Counseling. 02:44.900 --> 02:45.533 [slate snaps] 02:45.533 --> 02:47.400 [Stan:] We're rolling. 02:47.401 --> 02:54.234 Okay, Beryl, Noam, go ahead. Don't be nervous. 02:54.234 --> 02:55.468 [Beryl:] Do you want to start? 02:55.468 --> 02:57.868 [Noam:] I'm, I'm still nervous. 02:57.868 --> 03:01.633 [Beryl:] Oh, I think we've got some patients outside. Would you like to see them? 03:01.633 --> 03:04.967 [Noam:] Yeah, I always feel more comfortable when I'm with a patient. 03:04.968 --> 03:08.034 [Beryl:] Good. 03:08.034 --> 03:09.268 [Noam:] What are you doing? 03:09.268 --> 03:13.968 [Sue Williams:] I'm Mrs. Williams, a patient. I'm a nurse and I've been married for three weeks. 03:13.968 --> 03:19.501 [Noam:] I see. When you put on that jacket and that purse, then you're Mrs. Williams. 03:19.501 --> 03:23.468 [Sue Williams:] That's right and I've got a problem. I'm married to you. 03:23.468 --> 03:24.768 [Noam:] Oh, well. 03:24.768 --> 03:34.233 When I put on this jacket, see, and this pair of glasses, then I'm Mr. Williams and I'm a retail clerk in a clothing store. 03:34.233 --> 03:36.933 [Sue Williams:] Right. [Bill Williams:] And I've got a problem. 03:36.933 --> 03:39.567 [Sue Williams:] Oh? [Bill Williams:] I'm married to you. 03:39.568 --> 03:41.734 [Sue Williams:] And we've been referred by our minister for counseling. 03:41.734 --> 03:48.200 [Bill Williams:] He's a pretty understanding fellow. Where are we? 03:48.200 --> 03:50.968 [Sue Williams:] Oh, we're in the waiting room, waiting for our appointment. 03:50.968 --> 03:52.468 [Bill Williams:] We are? 03:52.468 --> 03:59.766 [Sue Williams:] Right. 03:59.766 --> 04:03.432 [Noam:] Uh huh. [Beryl:] Yes. 04:03.433 --> 04:07.133 [Sue and Bill William fidgeting in waiting room] 04:07.134 --> 04:09.334 [Noam:] I'll bring them in. 04:09.334 --> 04:13.801 [Beryl:] You can often get a very accurate impression of the patients you're going to 04:13.801 --> 04:16.434 see simply by observing them as they wait in the reception area. 04:16.434 --> 04:19.201 We find it's useful to conduct the patients in personally. 04:19.201 --> 04:23.734 It gives us time for this first assessment and begins the establishment of rapport. 04:23.734 --> 04:28.068 We notice, for instance, that much useful information can be gleaned from watching 04:28.068 --> 04:32.168 how patients seat themselves and where they sit relative to each other. 04:32.168 --> 04:35.801 It's very obvious at this point that the Williams' are both distressed. 04:35.801 --> 04:41.751 His constant scratching and her fumbling with her hair or purse reveal their discomfort. 04:41.751 --> 04:47.701 [footsteps, seat cushion crunches] 04:47.701 --> 04:50.433 [Noam:] Two little things before we start. 04:50.433 --> 04:55.366 But first, if it's all right with you, we'll use everybody's first name 04:55.366 --> 05:00.499 and that gets away from the which doctor's which problem. Mine's Noam. 05:00.500 --> 05:02.968 [chalk writing on slate board] 05:02.968 --> 05:04.366 [Beryl:] And mine's Beryl. 05:04.366 --> 05:07.666 [chalk writing on slate board] 05:08.101 --> 05:10.834 [Sue Williams:] I'm Sue and his name is Bill. 05:10.834 --> 05:15.301 [Bill Williams:] Yeah, well, like she says, my name is Bill. 05:16.433 --> 05:17.033 [chalk writing on slate board] 05:17.033 --> 05:22.466 [Noam:] Bill and Sue. That's fine. 05:22.466 --> 05:27.100 Now, the second little thing, we tape all our sessions. 05:27.101 --> 05:31.234 We do this so that we can play back to you what you say if this is helpful. 05:31.234 --> 05:34.168 We don't keep the tapes. We just recycle them. 05:34.168 --> 05:36.433 So if it's all right, we'll start the tape recording. 05:36.433 --> 05:37.233 [recorder button clicks] 05:37.234 --> 05:41.201 [Sue Williams:] I don't see anything wrong with it. It's okay. 05:41.201 --> 05:48.400 [Noam:] Okay, let's go back to you. Bill, can you tell us right now how you're feeling. 05:48.400 --> 05:54.068 [Bill Williams:] Fine, yeah. 05:54.068 --> 05:57.101 [Beryl:] And how about you, Sue, how are you feeling right now? 05:57.101 --> 06:00.668 [Sue Williams:] I'm feeling pretty nervous. 06:00.668 --> 06:05.068 [Beryl:] Most people feel pretty uptight when we begin, Sue. That's pretty normal. 06:05.068 --> 06:10.701 [Noam:] We find it very important to give the patient permission to feel the way he's feeling. 06:10.701 --> 06:17.534 Many people feel anxious when they come to see the doctor for the first time and especially in this type of anxiety-provoking situation. 06:17.534 --> 06:20.834 Bill, who said he is fine, is obviously not fine. 06:20.834 --> 06:28.634 In our society, men need to be given even more permission than women before they are able to safely divulge their feelings. 06:28.634 --> 06:36.268 Bill, can you tell us what you consider the problem between the two of you to be? 06:36.268 --> 06:38.901 [Bill Williams:] Oh boy. 06:38.901 --> 06:42.101 [Beryl:] I feel rejected. 06:42.101 --> 06:43.134 [Noam:] Tell me about it. 06:43.134 --> 06:48.134 [Beryl:] Well, I mean, I put out my hand and you rejected it and I feel rejected. 06:48.134 --> 06:50.768 [Sue Williams:] That's right. 06:50.768 --> 06:54.434 [Noam:] Well, you know how I get when you get sexy like that. 06:54.434 --> 07:00.233 [Beryl:] I wasn't getting sexy. I just needed some comfort right then and I figured you did, too. 07:00.233 --> 07:02.667 [Noam:] Well, I guess I did. 07:02.668 --> 07:11.100 But I was sore because when he asked me my name, you answered for me like I didn't even know my own name. 07:11.100 --> 07:18.334 [Beryl:] Oh, I'm sorry. [Noam:] Well, I guess I'm sorry, too. 07:18.334 --> 07:21.468 [Beryl:] Sue, is that how you were feeling? 07:21.468 --> 07:25.801 [Sue Williams:] Yeah. That's why I put out my hand. 07:25.801 --> 07:29.834 [Beryl:] Bill, did you realize that's what she was doing? 07:29.834 --> 07:35.301 [Bill Williams:] No, but what you said, yeah, I get it now. 07:35.301 --> 07:39.001 [Noam:] We often mirror the actions of the patients and then show 07:39.001 --> 07:42.601 them an effective way of letting each other know how they are really feeling. 07:42.601 --> 07:47.701 Mirroring and modeling are useful tools to a co-therapy team. 07:47.701 --> 07:50.534 [Beryl:] There was an apparent misperception on the part of the Williams'. 07:50.534 --> 07:56.301 I decided it would be a useful time to pick up the feelings they had but were unable to express to each other. 07:56.301 --> 07:59.801 Then I checked with them if we had accurately expressed their feelings. 07:59.801 --> 08:04.801 It was important to each of the Williams' to receive support from the therapist of their own sex. 08:04.801 --> 08:09.334 [Noam:] Okay, Bill, the problem as you see it. 08:09.334 --> 08:15.934 [Bill Williams:] Well, we'd been going together for three years before we got married. 08:15.934 --> 08:22.468 Well, we had lots of fun before we got married, you know, fooling around and, well, you know. 08:22.468 --> 08:23.801 [Stan:] Hey, Noam? 08:23.801 --> 08:25.401 (shouting) [Noam:] What now? 08:25.401 --> 08:29.501 [Stan:] This film is only so long. We can't go into all the details. 08:29.501 --> 08:32.134 [Noam:] Well, okay. We'll summarize. 08:32.134 --> 08:37.934 During their courtship, Sue and Bill decided that they would save sexual intercourse until after marriage. 08:37.934 --> 08:41.668 So they everything but including petting to orgasm. 08:41.668 --> 08:43.433 The problem began on the wedding night 08:43.433 --> 08:48.700 when an early attempt at intercourse provoked pain in Sue and Bill became frightened and backed off. 08:48.701 --> 08:51.801 The rest of the two-week honeymoon was a disaster. 08:51.801 --> 08:56.534 They continued on their planned motor trip but when they retired to the motel room, they renewed 08:56.534 --> 08:59.501 attempts at intercourse the first two or three days. 08:59.501 --> 09:05.333 After Bill encountered Sue's repeated distress, any further attempt at intercourse was prevented by his loss of erection. 09:05.333 --> 09:09.067 This, then, became the focus of their fear and concern. 09:09.068 --> 09:14.201 They avoided discussing sex and eventually even stopped having any physical contact. 09:14.201 --> 09:18.101 [Beryl:] Sue, can you tell us what you consider the problem to be? 09:18.101 --> 09:26.234 [Sue Williams:] Well, I mean, when I married him, I thought he was a man and knew about things. 09:26.234 --> 09:30.766 Now I find he doesn't know anything. 09:30.766 --> 09:33.200 [Noam:] I feel threatened. 09:33.201 --> 09:34.366 [Beryl:] Tell me about it. 09:34.366 --> 09:38.900 [Noam:] Well, it's this expectation that I'd know all about sex. 09:38.900 --> 09:40.900 [Beryl:] You mean men weren't born knowing? 09:40.900 --> 09:42.533 [Noam:] That's right. 09:42.534 --> 09:46.568 [Beryl:] Oh. But I expected that my husband would be in charge of that area. 09:46.568 --> 09:53.434 So you were pretty disappointed, Sue. But it wasn't a realistic expectation. 09:53.434 --> 09:57.966 Sue, can you tell us what happened on the honeymoon? 09:57.966 --> 10:03.900 [Sue Williams:] Well, I was real happy when we went to the motel on the first night and, well, we went to bed. 10:03.900 --> 10:06.133 And then it all happened so fast. 10:06.134 --> 10:09.333 He tried to put it in and it really hurt. 10:09.333 --> 10:12.965 And then he couldn't do it anymore. 10:12.966 --> 10:17.633 [Beryl:] Following the first part of the intake session where the couple was seen together, 10:17.634 --> 10:22.134 each patient was then interviewed separately by the therapist of the same sex. 10:22.134 --> 10:27.801 This is done not only to obtain an adequate history and helping the diagnosis, but also as a therapeutic measure 10:27.801 --> 10:33.034 during which feelings are explored and information and reassurance given. 10:33.034 --> 10:37.434 This session usually opens with history-taking over a cup of coffee or tea. 10:37.434 --> 10:41.234 The intentions of the patients with regard to their partners is explored. 10:41.234 --> 10:48.666 The intactness or ego strength of each individual is assessed with relation to their being able to continue with our form of therapy. 10:48.666 --> 10:51.833 [Noam:] When we finish the individual interviews, the couple waits in the 10:51.833 --> 10:55.667 reception area while we confer on what we found. 10:55.668 --> 10:58.001 We see if we can establish a diagnosis. 10:58.001 --> 11:03.900 We also compare their separate intentions with regard to the relationship. 11:03.900 --> 11:07.000 Well, let's call them back in now. 11:07.001 --> 11:08.000 [Beryl:] Right. 11:08.000 --> 11:09.134 [dissolve transition] 11:09.134 --> 11:14.734 [Noam:] Well, from what you people have told us, you've got a lot of things 11:14.734 --> 11:18.234 going for you in your marriage, many strengths. 11:18.234 --> 11:23.868 Most importantly, you want to put a lot of work into your marriage. 11:23.868 --> 11:28.001 Now, let's take a look at some of the problems. 11:28.001 --> 11:32.934 As you recall, on the night of your honeymoon, 11:32.934 --> 11:39.166 Bill was pretty uptight and without stopping to deal with Sue's feelings, 11:39.166 --> 11:40.066 [flow diagram] 11:40.066 --> 11:42.333 he tried to insert the penis. 11:42.333 --> 11:53.399 On the first night, Sue encountered pain and on succeeding occasions fear of pain which led in turn to increased vaginismus. 11:53.400 --> 11:54.500 [diagram flipped] 11:54.500 --> 12:01.600 The increased pain on Sue's part brought forth an impotence reaction on the part of Bill 12:01.600 --> 12:07.733 and his fear of failure led to failure and more impotence. 12:07.733 --> 12:09.366 [diagram flipped] 12:09.366 --> 12:18.267 The fear of pain and fear of failure resulted in an avoidance of each other leading to loneliness, 12:18.268 --> 12:30.168 accusations, withdrawal, and more avoidance, both of each other, and a lack of sex play. 12:30.168 --> 12:43.233 Each time the penis is inserted without adequate sex play, the pain of vaginismus and the failure of impotence will occur. 12:43.233 --> 12:46.133 [pointer dragging on the diagram] 12:47.300 --> 12:50.400 [Beryl:] We regularly employ flow diagrams. 12:50.400 --> 12:57.467 In a simple way, these illustrate for the patient our conception of the pathology, pathogenesis, and possible therapy. 12:57.468 --> 13:01.201 Having what they consider to be an immense problem laid out on a green board 13:01.201 --> 13:08.266 in less than five minutes allows the patients to see the situation in perspective and thereby reduces their anxiety. 13:08.266 --> 13:13.367 [Noam:] At the end of the intake, the Williams' were offered a series of four conjoint sessions 13:13.368 --> 13:18.368 spread over roughly four weeks with time in between to practice what they learn at each session. 13:18.368 --> 13:24.001 These sessions are aimed at reducing anxiety, providing information concerning sexual function, 13:24.001 --> 13:30.501 and setting up a series of tasks aimed at helping them to overcome the fear-of-failure cycles in which they are locked. 13:30.501 --> 13:34.566 We encouraged them to discuss their feelings about the intake sessions in general, 13:34.566 --> 13:39.700 and our diagnosis in particular before deciding to accept this therapy. 13:39.701 --> 13:44.600 [Beryl:] Fine. We'll see you then. Bye. 13:44.600 --> 13:45.501 [telephone hung-up] 13:45.501 --> 13:49.668 That was Sue Williams...the newlyweds we saw yesterday. 13:49.668 --> 13:53.068 They'd like to come back and we can see them in about two weeks. 13:53.068 --> 13:54.166 [Noam:] Okay. 13:54.834 --> 14:00.600 At the beginning of this session, we were pleased to learn that Bill and Sue had accepted 14:00.600 --> 14:04.434 our earlier suggestion to refrain from having sexual intercourse. 14:04.434 --> 14:08.501 By themselves, they resumed the petting they had enjoyed before they got married 14:08.501 --> 14:11.833 with the result that they were again bringing each other to orgasm. 14:13.601 --> 14:16.901 [Beryl:] Is there anything that concerns you now? 14:16.901 --> 14:26.234 [Bill:] Yeah. Well, what I want to ask is, uh, when will we be able to do it the normal way? 14:26.234 --> 14:30.566 [Beryl:] Well, what you're doing now, Bill, is one of the normal ways. 14:30.566 --> 14:35.632 Having sexual intercourse is just one of the ways people communicate sexually. 14:35.633 --> 14:40.466 Couples who are able to have sexual intercourse find that it's just one of the things that they choose 14:40.466 --> 14:41.932 to do to give each other pleasure. 14:41.933 --> 14:44.133 I'm sure you'll discover that, too. 14:46.600 --> 14:52.366 [Noam:] The major event in this session is the physical examination of both partners. 14:52.366 --> 14:55.533 [Beryl:] After the wife's general examination, the husband is brought into 14:55.534 --> 14:59.633 the examining room where they both participate in the anatomy demonstration. 14:59.633 --> 15:00.683 [door opening] 15:01.734 --> 15:05.300 [Noam:] Fine. Come on in. 15:05.300 --> 15:10.101 After Bill and Beryl enter the room, Bill is invited to look over my shoulder. 15:10.101 --> 15:13.733 I give Sue a mirror, which she can hold, 15:13.733 --> 15:20.833 and with Bill observe the demonstration of anatomy and explanation of the vaginismus phenomenon. 15:21.800 --> 15:31.068 [Bill:] Wow, I never knew really exactly where it was or what was, you know, in it. 15:31.068 --> 15:35.501 Well, for me it was always hit and miss. 15:35.501 --> 15:37.100 [Sue Williams:] I didn't know either. 15:37.100 --> 15:38.166 [Bill:] You didn't? 15:38.166 --> 15:38.999 [Sue Williams:] No. 15:39.000 --> 15:40.634 [Bill:] But you're a nurse. 15:40.634 --> 15:43.100 [Sue Williams:] Ha, how was I supposed to know? 15:43.100 --> 15:49.000 They never taught us about it and I wasn't even supposed to touch it and I certainly couldn't see it. 15:49.000 --> 15:51.633 After all, I'm not that good an acrobat. 15:51.633 --> 15:54.666 [Noam:] Now you both know that you're physically normal. 15:54.666 --> 15:57.499 Bill, your penis is quite normal. 15:57.500 --> 16:05.068 And Sue, your vulva and your vagina are quite healthy and quite adequate. 16:05.068 --> 16:13.668 [Sue Williams:] Then why do I tighten up like that and why can't he put it in? 16:13.668 --> 16:15.118 [Noam:] Watch, Sue. 16:15.118 --> 16:17.533 [Noam waves his hand towards Beryl] 16:17.533 --> 16:21.700 That was a perfectly normal reaction to fear. 16:21.701 --> 16:28.466 When Beryl overcomes her fear of my hand, see, she doesn't blink. 16:28.466 --> 16:34.066 [Beryl:] During Sue's examination, she was given a small lubricated dilator to insert in her vagina. 16:34.066 --> 16:38.666 She will proceed through a set of graduated vaginal dilators at her own pace. 16:38.666 --> 16:44.432 She has also been instructed to insert her finger into the vagina to have some idea where it is and how it feels. 16:44.433 --> 16:50.299 Together, the Williams' are instructed in the principle of pleasuring as outlined by Masters and Johnson. 16:50.300 --> 16:53.934 [Noam:] Well, it's now about four days later. The Williams' are back. 16:53.934 --> 17:01.466 We've already learned that Sue's been able to insert the smaller dilators and has ever been able to put the tip of her finger in her vagina. 17:01.466 --> 17:05.466 [seat cushion rustles] 17:06.068 --> 17:11.734 Sue, Bill, what have you learned from pleasuring each other? 17:11.734 --> 17:20.566 [Bill:] Well, once I got over being embarrassed, you know, I really enjoyed watching Sue. 17:20.566 --> 17:30.200 [Sue Williams:] And I liked the chance giving pleasure to Bill, really giving, not just lying there and letting him do everything. 17:30.201 --> 17:33.500 [Bill:] Yeah, only one thing still bothers me. 17:33.500 --> 17:35.434 [Beryl:] Say it, Bill. 17:35.434 --> 17:41.466 [Bill:] I still kind of come fast. 17:41.466 --> 17:45.232 [Noam:] I can see how that would concern you, Bill. 17:45.233 --> 17:47.533 We'll deal with that area. 17:47.533 --> 17:53.033 We've dealt with other areas and made progress in them and we'll make progress in that area, too. 17:53.033 --> 17:59.933 [Beryl:] I think it'll be clear if we just take a look at the whole sexual response cycle, just what happens. 17:59.934 --> 18:05.033 And from that, we'll be able to see how the fear of pain and the fear of failure affect the response. 18:05.033 --> 18:08.666 Okay? Let's just take a look at this graph. 18:08.666 --> 18:12.199 [Noam:] Last time they learned the anatomy of the sexual organs, 18:12.200 --> 18:15.666 and this time they learned the physiology of human sexual response. 18:15.666 --> 18:22.366 By explaining the effects of feelings on the response curve, we can demonstrate how the fear of failure leads to failure. 18:22.366 --> 18:26.466 This reinforces our earlier diagnosis and relates it to the therapy. 18:26.466 --> 18:34.966 The point of no return prior to ejaculation is noted on the graph and related to the squeeze technique for learning ejaculatory control. 18:34.966 --> 18:39.599 [Beryl:] In this session, we encouraged Sue to continue inserting the dilators, 18:39.600 --> 18:42.533 her finger and later Bill's finger into the vagina. 18:42.533 --> 18:48.266 Together, they will practice the squeeze technique to help them deal with Bill's ejaculatory control. 18:48.266 --> 18:53.099 [Noam:] It's now a week later and time for our next session with the Williams'. 18:53.100 --> 18:59.166 [Beryl:] Right. And Sue's looking fine but Bill's a bit unhappy. Tell us about it, Sue. 18:59.166 --> 19:05.966 [Sue Williams:] Well, I'm doing just fine. I can insert those dilators and I could even get my finger in. But, uh... 19:05.966 --> 19:07.799 [Noam:] Where'd you get stuck, Bill? 19:07.800 --> 19:13.966 [Bill:] Well, when I came close to her with my finger... 19:13.966 --> 19:16.132 [Sue Williams:] I had a spasm, and... 19:16.133 --> 19:23.499 [Bill:] It made me feel just like a failure, back to the old business, you know, right back where I started. 19:23.500 --> 19:26.900 [Sue Williams:] Oh, that's not true, Bill. You're a lot better. 19:26.900 --> 19:30.600 Your erection lasts a lot longer before your ejaculation. 19:30.600 --> 19:33.634 Hey, listen to the language I'm using. 19:33.634 --> 19:37.833 [Noam:] I hear Sue saying that she's real pleased with you, Bill. 19:37.833 --> 19:39.933 And I'm real pleased with you too. 19:39.933 --> 19:40.833 That's real great. 19:40.833 --> 19:45.033 [Beryl:] You're both doing well. It's predictable, Sue, that at this stage, 19:45.033 --> 19:48.866 anything that you didn't insert in the vagina would cause spasm. 19:48.866 --> 19:52.299 The next step will be for you to insert Bill's finger 19:52.300 --> 19:57.468 into the vagina in the same way as you become comfortable with inserting those dilators. 19:57.468 --> 20:01.466 In this session, the Williams' were given further reassurance and encouragement. 20:01.466 --> 20:07.432 In addition to the earlier tasks, Bill would insert his finger in the vagina, first under Sue's control, 20:07.433 --> 20:10.599 later on his own, and eventually during sex play. 20:10.600 --> 20:14.268 I'd like to make a special comment. 20:14.268 --> 20:17.800 It is important to understand the purpose of these tasks. 20:17.800 --> 20:21.366 They are just a framework for the real learning experience. 20:21.366 --> 20:25.132 This consists of constant feedback of feelings to each other. 20:25.133 --> 20:30.733 The knowledge of their partner's feelings makes them confident that what they are doing is effective. 20:30.733 --> 20:36.100 It protects them from turning their partner off and feeling like a failure. 20:36.101 --> 20:39.733 [Noam:] Let's see. The next session is the fourth session with the Williams'. 20:39.733 --> 20:40.866 [Beryl:] Right. 20:40.866 --> 20:42.866 [Noam:] And they've reported real progress. 20:42.866 --> 20:48.232 [Beryl:] And Sue's found great pleasure in her ability to stimulate Bill. Isn't that right, Sue? 20:48.233 --> 20:57.100 [Sue Williams:] That's right. I never thought it would happen but I like seeing him, you know, react. 20:57.101 --> 20:58.400 [Noam:] No kidding? 20:58.400 --> 21:04.700 [Bill:] I mean, I've always enjoyed watching Sue but I didn't know you liked it, too. 21:04.700 --> 21:06.933 [Sue Williams:] Well, you really turn me on. 21:06.933 --> 21:09.399 [Bill:] Geez! How about that? 21:10.268 --> 21:15.600 [Noam:] It's important to tell your partner when you're pleased and when you're not pleased. 21:15.600 --> 21:16.833 Isn't that right, Beryl? 21:16.833 --> 21:19.733 [Beryl:] I'm real pleased with you right now, Noam. You said that very well. 21:19.733 --> 21:21.133 [Noam:] Well, thanks very much. 21:22.333 --> 21:26.333 [Beryl:] This was the last of the sessions that we had contracted for with the Williams', 21:26.333 --> 21:29.233 but they didn't feel ready to terminate the therapy just yet. 21:29.233 --> 21:32.633 We agreed to see them again for two more sessions during the next month. 21:32.633 --> 21:36.033 Bill and Sue were instructed to continue the tasks outlined earlier. 21:36.033 --> 21:41.699 In addition, Sue would use his penis to caress her vulva and eventually her vagina. 21:43.368 --> 21:45.500 [Noam:] The Williams' were seen two weeks later. 21:45.500 --> 21:49.033 Both very pleased. They saw no further need for sessions. 21:49.033 --> 21:52.666 We asked them to come in for a followup in two months and stressed to them 21:52.666 --> 21:57.032 the importance of maintaining the effective pattern of communication they had learned. 21:57.033 --> 22:03.833 We warned them that there would be ups and downs and invited them to contact us if they really felt stuck. 22:03.834 --> 22:05.866 [Beryl:] Quite a difference, isn't there? 22:08.000 --> 22:13.566 [Bill:] Well, it's just great and we're trying some pretty new things now. 22:13.566 --> 22:15.899 [Sue Williams:] Bill has some pretty wild ideas. 22:15.900 --> 22:20.200 [Bill:] Hey, look who, look who's talking. Guess who it was last night who... 22:20.200 --> 22:21.866 [Stan:] Hey, Noam. 22:21.866 --> 22:23.499 [Bill:] What is it? 22:23.500 --> 22:26.066 [Sue Williams:] Hey, you're Bill, not Noam. 22:26.066 --> 22:29.766 [Bill:] Oh, darn it. Yeah. Sorry, Noam. 22:29.766 --> 22:33.299 [Noam:] That's okay, Bill. What is it, Stan? 22:33.300 --> 22:36.333 [Stan:] You got about one more minute to wrap this up. 22:36.333 --> 22:39.399 [Noam:] Okay. Beryl, do you want to start the wrap-up? 22:39.400 --> 22:45.866 [Beryl:] Sure. When the Williams' first came to see us, they were very depressed, caught up in two vicious cycles. 22:45.866 --> 22:49.032 [Noam:] By working with a male and female co-therapy team, 22:49.033 --> 22:54.499 they have found out that it is quite possible for people to talk comfortably with each other about sex. 22:54.500 --> 22:59.366 By sharing their feelings, they come closer together instead of withdrawing into the loneliness 22:59.366 --> 23:02.732 they were experiencing when we first saw them. 23:02.733 --> 23:06.966 [Stan:] That's it. Let's print it. 23:06.966 --> 23:11.566 [Produced Ortho Pharmaceutical Corporation, Department of Educational Services] 23:12.866 --> 23:16.799 [Executive Producer Charles Galbraith Producer-Director Stan Carlson] 23:18.133 --> 23:20.633 [Video Tape Editor Bob Howard] 23:22.300 --> 23:26.400 [Based on original material developed by Drs. Beryl and Avinoam Chernick 23:26.400 --> 23:30.600 who appeared through the courtesy of Sound Feelings Limited, London, Canada] 23:31.900 --> 23:36.366 [Produced through the facilities of Northwest Mobile Television] 23:36.366 --> 23:37.666 [fade to black] 23:42.433 --> 23:56.200 [end trailer]