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In Assembly, •] February 13, 188-1. f Mr. Haskell, of Madison, called up his resolution respecting the death of Evan D. Hughes, in the State Lunatic Asylum, at Utica. An amendment was offered to the original resolution, and the amendment being accepted by the mover, the resolution was carried, as follows: Whereas, Evan E. Hughes, late of the town of Nelson, county of Madison, State of New York, deceased, was committed to the Utica Insane Asylum, on or about the 26th day of January, 1884, as an insane person, and while an inmate of said institution died a violent death, caused by injuries received at the hands of his attend- ants; and Whereas, Other charges of a grave nature have been made against said institution and its management; and Whereas, By reason of the said violent death of said Hughes, and the other charges aforesaid, the public have lost confidence in the management of said institution, and regard with horror the atrocities alleged to have been there committed ; therefore Resolved, That a special committee of five, to be appointed by the Speaker, be and they hereby are directed, authorized and em- powered to make thorough investigation of the affairs and manage- ment of said Utica Insane Asylum, and particularly of the circum- stances surrounding the death of said Evan D. Hughes, and to re- port thereon to this House, with all convenient speed, to the end that any and all guilty persons may be brought to justice, and that such steps may be taken in the premises as may be necessary and 2 proper to restore public confidence in said institution and the management thereof. Resolved, That said committee be, and they hereby are, author- ized, in making said investigation, to subpoena witnesses, send for and examine books, papers and documents, hold sittings at such other places than Albany as they may deem proper, and employ counsel and a stenographer. In pursuance of the above resolution the Speaker announced the appointment of the following named gentlemen as such special com- mittee : Messrs. Howe, of New York; Haskell, of Madison; Olin, of Broome; Rice, of Ontario, and J. H. Brown, of Schoharie. Mr. S. S. Morgan, of West Winfield, counsel, and John H. Mimms, of Albany, stenographer. On Friday morning, February 16, the special committee pro- ceeded to Utica. At 1: 30 p. m. the committee visited the Asylum, and were met by Messrs. Lowery, Swan and Rogers, of the board of managers of the Asylum, and by Dr. John P. Gray, superintendent. The committee were escorted into the office of the superintend- ent, and an informal conversation occurred as to the nature of the investigation, mode of procedure, etc. Dr. Gray said, in substance, that in view of the strong comments and criticism in the press he was glad to see that a committee had been appointed, and that they were present for an investigation. He trusted the investigation would be thorough; the books, attend- ants, physicians, etc., were all open to a full examination. If the committee, after such investigation as they should deem proper to make, should make any suggestions we shall be glad to carry them out. Senator Lowery said: If it is in order now, 1 desire to say a few words and explain the position of the managers; for myself, and I think I speak for the other managers in this respect, I appear here with a feeling of delicacy, in view of the proceedings in the Assem- bly when the matter of this investigation was under consideration. I understand complaint has been made that during the course of the investigation of last year, that some of the managers, or the Asylum authorities, were present at the examinations, and that their presence had an influence upon the committee, and perhaps it will be better if we are not present ; we are at your service; we are desirous of 3 rendering you all the assistance in our power, but do not wish to in- trude our presence if we are not wanted; when you do not want us present, we will keep away, and when you want us, and we can render you any assistance, we shall be happy to be of service to the committee; I say this in view of the criticism made upon the pres- ence of the authorities during the last investigation. We trust you will make a full and complete investigation ; the closer you examine into matters the more we shall be satisfied. The accident that lias occurred, that gave rise to the resolution under which you are acting, no one regrets more than the managers. If there is any thing wrong about the management of the institution, point it out to us and we will endeavor to set it right. Mr. Howe — I am very glad you have made the suggestion, as it will relieve the committee of some embarrassment as to the conduct of the investigation ; we shall be pleased to have the assistance and co-operation of the board, but inasmuch as criticisms on this matter have been made in regard to the last investigation, perhaps it will be advisable that our sessions should be carried on without your presence, unless something arises rendering the presence of some of the managers necessary to facilitate our inquiry. The committee then, in company with Dr. Gray, Dr. Brush, Dr. Pilgrim and Dr. Backus, visited the wards of the north, or male de- partment of the institution, returning to the superintendent's office about 5:30 p. m. After another informal conversation as to matters pertaining to the care of the insane, etc.r suicides in the Asylum, etc., the com- mittee retired. In the evening, an executive session was held in " room 48, Baggs hotel, and the committee mapped out a general plan of proceeding, Mr. S. S. Morgan, counsel for the committee, being present. Adjourned until Friday, February 22, 1884. 1 TESTIMONY. Utica, N. Y., February 22, 1884. Pursuant to adjournment, the committee met in one of the asy- lum office rooms. Present — Messrs Howe, Chairman, Haskell, Olin, Rice and Brown of committee. Mr. S. S. Morgan, counsel for the committee. At 9:30 o'clock, a. m., the committee was called to order by Chair- man Howe, and the following proceedings were had: John P. Gray, sworn and examined, testified as follows 1>V Mr. Morgan : Q. What is your age ? A. Fifty-eight. Q. How long have you been Superintendent of the Utica Insane* Asylum ? A. Since the year 1854. Q. From what source do you get your appointment? A. From the board of managers. Q. How many are there of the board of managers? A. Nine. Q. How many of the board of managers are residents of Oneida county ? A. Now, at the present time, they are all residents of this county— Oneida county—but one ; let me see; they are all residents now ; this is the first time it has been so. Q. The board of managers are nominated by the Governor and confirmed by the Senate, are they not? A. Yes, sir. Q. In the nomination of the managers, are you usually consulted by the Governor before the nomination is made ? A. No, sir. Q. And have you at any time taken any part in the securing of the confirmation or rejection of any person named as manager ? 6 A. I have not; never, not in the slightest degree, directly or in directly. ,. , , . . , , Q. Are your duties prescribed and directed by written or printed rules or laws ? A. Thev are. Q. What are your duties as you understand them i A. As I understand them from the statute, I am the chief execu- tive officer of the asylum ; I am directed to see that every depart- ment is efficiently and economically administered and carried out, and according to'the rules and regulations which are printed ; that in regard to the officers, I am to nominate the resident officers, the assistant physicians, the steward and matron, and the managers ap- point them. Q. When you recommend a steward or physician, your nomina- tion has to go before the board of managers; that is, it must be in writing, and come before the board of managers, and a majority of the board of managers confirm ? A. Well, the board of managers confirms, either in majority or Otherwise; I do not think it states in the law as to that. Q. Who is the next in order to yourself in the asylum ? A. The first assistant physician. Q. What is his name ? A. Dr. E. N. Brush. Q. And who is the second ? A. Well, just now it is Dr. Charles W. Pilgrim ; he is acting second physician ; Dr. George A. Bloomer, the second assistant physician, having gone abroad to take a degree at Edinburgh ; while absent over there, he was attacked with tj^phoid fever, and he is still lying ill with it ; and will not be back until next May. Q. And in his absence Dr. Pilgrim discharges his duties ? A. Yes, sir; he discharges the duties of Dr. Bloomer. Q. And what is Dr. Pilgrim's position in the asylum when the second assistant is here ? A. Third assistant Q. Dr. Pilgrim is the regular third assistant ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Who is the present acting third physician ? A. Dr. Ogden Backus; he is discharging the duties of the third physician, and Dr. Hamilton Quinn, of Utica, is discharging the duties of fourth assistant physician. Q. And that is the extent of the medical staff, from the first to the fourth assistant physicians ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How old a man is Doctor Brush ? A. I do not know; I should have to ascertain their ages from them, personally ; they are all mature men. Q. Those gentlemen are nominated by you and approved or con- firmed by the board of managers ? 1 A. Yes, sir. Q. Who are the board of managers at the present time ? A. The board of managers at the present time are: Mr. Samuel Campbell, president; he is a manufacturer and his place of business is at the New York Mills, Utica; Theodore Pomeroy, secretary of the board ; he is also a manufacturer—I believe of oils, paints and that sort of thing — in Utica Mr. P. B. Rogers ; Mr. Rogers is a banker, of the First National Bank ; Mr. Dwight D. Winston, I believe his linn are forwarders and merchants, wholesale and retail dealers of grains and provisions ; he is also of Utica. Q. Who is the next ? A. Then there is Mr. S. S. Lowery ; he is engaged in manufac- turing knitting goods ; General James McQuade ; I don't know his business; I believe he is a lawyer by profession ; he is, I think, con- nected with some mining companies, or something of that kind, in New York ; his residence is in Utica ; then there is Judson R. Swan, a lawyer of Utica ; George A. Barnard, of Rome, a banker; you asked me as to the directors in Oneida county, I did not think of him ; and then there is Louis H. Lawrence, of Utica. Q. What is his business? "■'-"" "? A. He used to be a lumber man ; he is now a retired gentleman. Q. And he spends his winters in Florida ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Now, then, doctor, you may continue in stating what your duties are? -q ^ A. In addition to what I have stated, in the way of being con- nected with the organization of the asylum, I am to determine with the managers, as to the number of assistants, attendants and em- ployees necessary to carry on effectively the affairs of the institution. Then I have to maintain a general -government over all those matters; I have to direct the steward in the employment of the necessary number of employees, and in case of their inefficiency, or any violation of the rules of the institution, I have to direct him to discharge them, giving the grounds of such discharge. Then I have the general supervision of the entire medical department. I am directed to appoint the first assistant and second assistant in charge of each of the departments, male and female; also the third and fourth assistant physician ; and direct them to do such work, or perform such other service as may be required by the necessities of the institution, and to see generally that good order prevails every- where in the institution ; to familiarize myself with all these duties as the general executive; then I am directed also to see that all the necessary books and records are kept, recording the history of the patients, of their admission, and their progressive history through the entire time that they are here. Q. How often is that progressive history written up i A. Well, it is written up constantly ; in some cases they have to be written every day ; some less, and some more frequently ; it is according to the character of the case. 8 Q. Any thing further in relation to your duties, or does that com- prise generally the outline of your duties '! A. "Ho, sir; I do not think there is any thing further ; I think that embraces them all; of course it does not embrace them speci- fically but generally. Q. What are your duties so tar as visiting the patients and examin- ing them is concerned ? A. It is my duty to visit the patients and to know their condition ; of course that means a knowledge of all cases that need any change every day, and to know their condition, which I do by constant consultation with the medical assistants in charge of those wards. I will say this: I am now incapacitated for full duty ; ordinarily, before I received this injury, from which I have not yet fully recovered, I endeavored to go through each side of the house — a complete visit each side of the house — twice a week : and I gener- ally would take the most of the day on Frida}' as a day to adjust the business matters with which I am related to the institution. Q. In speaking of your injury, you may state its nature and ex- tent and how it occurred ; it was the shooting I suppose ? A. On the 16th of March, 1882, I had just returned from Washington, on the six o'clock train, and came home and took a cup of tea; I went into my office, that was about seven o'clock, and a person came in and shot me while I was sitting at my desk ; the name of the man who shot me was Henry Remshaw. Q. Had he been a patient in the institution ? A. No, sir. Q. Describe to the committee the extent of the injury you re- ceived, and where the ball struck ? A. The ball struck mo just at the outer and lower angle of the eye and the cheek, on the left side, and fractured the upper jaw or cheek bone and passed under, taking out the soft tissues and base' 'of the nose and coming out through the right cheek, five inches from where the ball entered, fracturing the right jaw also in its passage. Q. Mr. Remshaw was a resident of what place? A. Of Utica. r Q. Had you had any difficulty with Remshaw? A. No, sir. Q. Do you know of any reason why the assault was made upon you? A. iso, sir ; I have not been able to conceive any reason except that which he had in his own mind; I knew of nothing of the kind until after I was shot; I do not think I had ever seen him a dozen times in my life. Q. He had expressed disapproval of your evidence in the Gui- teau case m Washington ? A. Yes, sir; he stated afterward and it did appear that he had stated what he would do. Q. Had you had any difficulty with him ? A. No, sir; the only knowledge I had of him was that he was an -9 attendant in charge of a bath for some time atBagg's Hotel, and I only knew that his name was Henry, and that he had charge of the baths ; I had taken probably three or four baths there, but I don't think otherwise than in that respect I had ever seen him five 6r six times. Q. To what extent has that injury disqualified you or rendered you unable to perform the usual duties that have devolved upon you ? A. Simply to the extent of visiting the wards as frequently as I should desire to, to discharge those duties. Q. Before receiving that injury, you often visited the several wards, and made personal examination and investigation of the con- dition of the patients ? A. There was probably not a day passed by that I was not in some of the wards; I tried to visit the wards in such a way as to see all the wards on each side of the house, at least twice during the week. Q. And you would see all of the patients ? A. Well I could not say always that I saw ail of them; some of them might be out working, or perhaps in the ironing-room or some- where else about the place. Q. Since that injury how often have you visited the several wards and made a personal investigation of the patients ? A. Until July or August of that year I was either confined to my room, or away; my face was entirely paralyzed ; I was entirely unable to move any ot the muscles of my face until sometime in June, and I had paralysis of the lower eyelid at the time, and some of the powder in the eye itself; I also had double vision, so that I could not do any thing; for instance, I could not pick up an article like this (indicating the ink-stand) without putting my hand along the table, so that, during that period, I was absolutely unfit to do any thing. I went up to St. Paul and Winnipeg, with a view of getting clear, dry air, as it was exceedingly painful to breathe the ordinary air, especially when filled with dust, or dampness ; I then returned, and for a time I entered upon the office duties, and visited the wards occasionally, as far as I could ; I saw the sick and any per- sons that needed especial attention. Then I was away a short time again ; I began to have great pain and trouble through my face; the bones did not unite; then I returned again to duty and did all the office duties and wrote my annual report, and examined patients when they came in, and directed about all those matters until into March, 188.'*, when I began to suffer very much ; then I thought I would go South, but I went as far as Washington and stayed there some days and did not feel any better and came home and tried to "tuddle" it through; then I entered on my duties again, until the 16th of May; the bones of my face not uniting, and beginning to feel anxious, I consulted some surgeons for fear that I would have— or that I would lose the bones of the face from non-union. I then went away again, of course with the managers' assent from the be- 2U 10 ginning, that I should do what was best for my recovery ; I went to Newport quietly, and after some weeks the process of union of the bones set in ; I then came home and looked over the affairs of the institution a little and went back. Q. How long did you remain at home? A About a week, until I got so that every thing was going on all right; that is, until I saw how matters were going; I then went back to Newport and remained there until the latter part of A ugust, and since that time I have been almost constantly at work ; I have been able to work probably from eight to twelve hours a day. 1 have visited all over the house occasionally, and visited the sick frequently; nowl am awaiting an operation which I think will give me entire relief. Q. That is a surgical operation ? ■ A. Yes, sir; the removing of the obstructions in the nostrils which prevents my breathing, except through the mouth; in walk- ing it is very troublesome to me. Q. What portion ot the time have you been absent from the institution since the 16th of March, 1882 ? A. Except the times I have mentioned ? Q. You did not givems the length of time that you were absent; taking it all together, how much would you say would be the pro- portion of the time that you were absent, that is, how much time altogether ? A. I went away then, I think it was on 24th of May; I think I was first able to be out of bed somewhere about the 16th of May, 1882. Q. Then about two months you were confined to your room ? A. Yes, sir; and nearly all of that time confined to my bed ; and then, I think it was the 24th or 26th of May, I could not tell exactly which without looking, but it was either the 24th or the 26th of May that I went away, and returned in July. Q. You went away on the 24th or the 26th of May, 1882? A. Yes, sir. Q. And returned what time in July ? A. I could not 6ay the date, but it was about the middle of July or before the middle of July. Q. Then you were absent two months at that time ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Then you returned here, and how long did you remain in the asylum then ? A. I remained—I don't know just how long it was, but I after- ward went away with one of my sons for a couple of weeks. Q. And then you returned to the asylum ? A. Yes, sir; returned to the asylum and remained until the time I speak of, in March (March, 1883), when I went down to Wash- ington ; I think I was gone about two weeks altogether, and then I returned to the asylum ; I remained until the 16th of May when I went to Newport as I have stated, and came back toward the last of August. 11 Q. About how long did you remain at Newport at that time ; how Icing were yon absent from the asylum ? A. Until after the middle of August ; coming home twice and leaving my family there. Q. And when you came home on those two occasions, how long did you remain here ? A. Well, each time I remained, I think, a little more than a week or two. Q. Were you in a condition then, on your return to the asylum, to look over the affairs and see what the condition of the asylum was and in what manner it had been carried on in your absence ? A. Yes, sir ; I looked over every thing and went all through the institution and all about the building, everywhere ; and I read over, and had read over to me, the history of the cases, etc., and I con- sulted fully with the doctors. Q. And visited the patients ? A. Yes, sir ; I went through all of the wards at that time. Q. And then you went back to Newport and finally returned to the asylum ; now when did you return to the asylum with your family ? A.. Sometime in the latter part pf August; I am, not confident as to the date. Q. How long did you remain at the asylum then ? A. I have remained ever since ; I have been away down to New York twice for a few days ; and I went off to Boston for a few days. Q. During the time that you were away at the west or north-west, and at Washington and Newport and other places, who filled your position in the asylum and officiated in your absence ? A. Dr. Brush ; and perhaps I might be allowed to say that during all that time he wrote constantly to me and telegraphed me as well in any important matter ; he had the entire charge during my absence, the law providing for that. Q. During your absence you say that Dr. Brush communicated with you by letter and on some occasions by telegram; was there any difficulty occurred — any unusual disturbance in the asylum during your absence ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What was that ? A. One instance was the death of a patient caused by another patient. Q. Who was the patient that died ? A. A Mr. B----, of U.; I ought to say this that itocourred during my illness, while I was confined to my bed ; Mr. B., of U., a patient was struck by Mr. P----, another patient, and his skull was frac- tured, and death resulted from the mjury; I knew of that injury by being told of it at the time. Q. That was while you were confined to your room ? A. Yes, sir; I did not know it till just afterward ; the doctor communicated with me by telegram while I was in St. Paul upon 12 the question of whether or not he should give the facts of the case to the newspapers; I then wrote to him about it. Q. What was your reply to his inquiry about the newspapers ? A I replied that having communicated the matter instantly after the occurrence to the coroner and to the friends, and the matter having been acted upon, I would advise him at once to consult the board of managers and do whatever they advised i ^ Q. Do yon know what advice the managers gave m reference to giving that case to the public ? . A Only by the record; it appears in their communication, in their report to the Legislature of last year, that they did not think it was necessary to publish the thing themselves, or to give it to the newspapers; and I also learned, as a matter of record, the fact that the son of Mr. B., who came with the coroner, went to the news- papers and asked them not to publish it, as it would only grieve his mother who was an old lady ; that he was satisfied that nothing could have prevented it under the circumstances; and that he had asked not to have it published; so that no action was taken one way or the other, or a word said about it at the time to any persons unconnected with the asylum, or to the newspapers; some news- paper in Syracuse, however, published the matter. Q. Where did Mr. B----reside ? A. In Utica, or near here', his son resided in Utica, and he is the ticket agent of the N. Y. C. & H. R. R. R. Q. P----was the assailant, and he was an inmate ? A. Yes, sir. Q. P----is here now ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And he is now kept under restraint ? A. Part of, the time under restraint. Q. Where is he from ? A. He was sent from—I don't know what county, but he was sent for some crime, I think, and he was sent to the Syracuse Peni- tentiary ; there he had a violent altercation with some persons and he was found to be insane by persons who were appointed by Judge Riegel to examine him, and Judge Riegel discharged him from imprisonment; he did not, however, order him sent to the Crim- inal Asylum at Auburn; which, perhaps I ought to say, the law specifically directs, but he delivered him to his friends, and he was afterward taken home, and his friends being unable to do any thing with him, he was brought here ; he is a very dangerous man. Q. Under what power could Judge Riegel, after conviction and sentence, discharge that man from that sentence and return him to his friends? A. I have no idea; I know it was referred to the district attor- ney. Q. How long has this man been in the asylum now ; I mean P---? 13 A. He was brought here during the time I was ill, during the spring of 1882 it was. Mr. Rice—Mr. Morgan, I wish you would ask him how he knows that fact that he mentions about Judge Riegel; perhaps it may be hearsay ? A. No, it was from the officers that I got it; and from the papers; from the officers who brought him here; I requested Dr. Briush to refer the matter to the District Attorney of this county, and he knows all about it. Q. Was there an investigation into the death of Mr. B----. by the coroner? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did he call a jury ? A. No, sir. Q The coroner investigated himself withont a jury ? A. Yes, sir; the coroner came here, and he, and the sqn of the man who was killed, were here immediately after the occurence. Q. In brief, the coroner did not think it a case in which it was necessary to call a jury ? A. No, sir, that was it. Q. He made his report of it himself? A. Yes, sir; he made his report himself. Q. Who was the coroner then ? A Dr. James G. Hunt, of Utica. By the Chairman : Q. What was the report, or result of the coroner's inquiry ? A. Just how he came to his death, and that there was no person to blame in the matter. Q. That is no responsible person ? A. No, sir ; that is, such as attendants, etc. Q. How did the killing occur ; state about that ? A. It was in the morning, while they were all preparing for breakfast; they were on the open ward ; this Mr. P----. was on the ward; Mr. B----. was an old man, and he was walking toward the wash-room to wash his hands and face, and Mr. P----, sud- denly took a table leg, like this one (indicating the table'at which the committee were sitting), and gave it a jerk and broke it off, and in an instant he struck Mr. B—:—. with it; the patients and attend- ants were on the ward, and the attendants ran instantly to him ; it was too late, however, for he had given the blow, and struck him on the back of the head ; Mr. B----. immediately fell down, and they sent a special message to his son, and immediately to the coro- ner; that has been the course pursued, and they came up at once; and I understood that they made an examination of the attendants and persons on the wards, in the presence of young Mr. B----. and he talked with them himself; and that was the decision ren- dered ; the case is reported in the Board of Manager's Report to the Legislature of last year. 14 Q. There'was no judicial action then taken in the case ? A. No, sir. Q. During the time of your disability or absence, was there any unusual disturbance in the asylum? A. There was the case of Mr. Silkman; I don't know whether you would call that an unusual disturbance or not; I never saw Mr. Silkman as an inmate of the asylum. By Mr. Morgan (resuming): Q. Was he in the asylum ? A. Yes, sir ; he came in April or May, sometime; I would not be positive about the time, but I think that was it; I never saw him, and he was discharged by an order of Judge Barnard; that case was telegraphed to me. Q. Where were you when these proceedings were taken ? A. That was the time that I went from here down to Newport, the same spring, and after I came back from the west; I thought I was able to go to work then, but found I was not, and I was told that I probably would have caries, or necrosis of the bones of the face, and lose them, if I occupied my nervous system in attempting to work, and so I went away ; I knew of the short time he was here during that time, simply from reading the case books over and having them read to me, and conversing with the physicians about the matters of the institution ; when I was in Newport they telegraphed me that this writ had been served, and asking what they should do ; I told them instantly to make a report in accordance with the order of the court; to confer with Mr. Swann or any other lawyer on the board of managers, and in all respects to act in accordance with their di- rections in every way; Mr. Silkman had a hearing before Judge Barnard, before whom the writ was returnable, and he was dis- charged from the asylum upon habeas corpus; I think I saw him once; it was afterward, when he came here to serve a subpoena upon me. Q. And that was in Miss Lathrop's case ? A. Yes, sir. Q. When was Mr. Silkman admitted to the asylum ? A. I would have to get the record to find that out, I think you will find it in the annual report for 1883 ; I find that he was admit- ted on the 21st of May, 1882. Q. And he was taken out upon a writ of habeas corpus % A. Yes, sir ; that was on the 19th of August, 1882. Q. Before he was admitted to the asylum, after you received your injury, and he was taken out on Judge Barnard's "writ before your recovery and returned to the asylum to your duties ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And that accounts for you not seeing him ? A. Yes, sir ; that accounts for my not seeing him. Q. During the time of vour absence was there any other disturb- ance? 15 A. I don't think that there was any thing, except those two matters ; the most of the letters I received were ordinarily consulta- tions, about the ordinary affairs of the institution. If there is any thing you have in mind I will thank you to call my attention to it, if you know it, but I do not think of any thing myself. Q. Were you acquainted with Miss Lathrop ? A. Yes, sir ; I knew her well. Q. When was she admitted to the asylum? A. I shall have to refer to find that. Q. What was Mr. Silkman discharged for? A. On the ground that he was found to be sane. Q. And Miss Lathrop upon the same ground ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Was it assumed that he was sane when he came there? A. Yes, sir; Judge Barnard discharged him on the ground that he was sane, and so stated ; but I do not believe he was sane ; Judge Barnard in his decision stated that he did not believe that Mr. Silk- man was ever insane. Q. How did he get here — Mr. Silkman, how did he get into the asylum? A. He was brought here by his own family, his brother-in-law and his son were the persons who became responsible for him, and they paid the bills. Q. He was a paj'ing patient ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Was he brought there by his friends, or were any proceedings taken to have him confined in the asylum ? A. Oh, regular proceedings were taken, and he was considered to be a dangerous man. By Mr. Rice : Q. Upon what proceeding; upon the certificates of two physicians, or was it upon a writ of inquiry ? A. T don't know, really ; I could not state without referring ; I only know of the case at that time from what I was told. Q. Would your case book show all the particulars concerning that? ' A. Yes, sir; that will show. Q. And will it show what proceedings were taken ? A. Yes, sir; it will show all about it; I can get that case book and refer to it. [The case book, above referred to, was then produced and examined by the witness.] Witness (continuing). I find he was brought by a deputy sheriff from Westchester county and a Mr. V. Plank, on the certificates of two medical men, namely : Dr. A. C. Benedict and Dr. G. B. Balch, both of Yonkers, and upon a bond executed bv Theodore H. Silkman and D. G. Crosby: the first named was the son of Mr. Silkman and the other was his brother-in-law, I believe. Q. What is the nature of the usual bond given to the institution in BiTfh nn«'>s ' 16 A. It is simply an agreement; it is an agreement between the treasurer of the asylum and the parties to pay the expenses oi the person who is to be confined in the asylum as long as the person re- mains there. . „ Q. And such a bond is always taken in private cases ! A. Yes, sir ; such a bond as is authorized by the board of inana- gGQ. That authority is given to them under the law which enables them to make such arrangement ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What is done in the case of pauper patients ? A. If the person is actually a pauper without means, and is sent here on the certificate of the superintendent of the poor, with an order accompanying the certificate, and the certificate of two phy- sicians, who have been directed by the courts to examine, and who have been appointed medical examiners in lunacy, those certificates are to be approved on the back by the county judge of the county from which the patient comes, or by a justice of the Supreme Court of the district; if a person is in indigent circumstances and not a pauper, or, as the law states it, " a pauper unable tg support _ him- self and his family under the visitation of insanity," then the judge makes an inquiry* into the matter, as well as an investigation into the case; in case it is found that the person examined is dangerous to be at large the judge issues a warrant for his arrest and confine- ment here: the usual certificate accompanies that, though that may or may not be the case, because the judge is supposed to have ex- amined it ; in criminal cases they are sent by judges of the Supreme Court, and no certificates accompany them. Q. How do you recognize the signatures of the judges; is there a seal appended to it? A. Yes, sir; there is the ordinary certifi- cate, a copy of the original, with the seal of the county clerk upon it. Q. How long are such patients kept in the institution ? A. The criminals are kept until they are sent off by a proper order; others are detained until they are restored to their right mind; in other cases they are retained here until they do recover; when they have recovered, it is explained to the commissioner in lunacy and he would appear and examine the case and I would then make to the justice of the Supreme Court of this district a sworn statement of the case together with my opinion; that opinion would be con- firmed or not as the State Commissioner in Lunacy may or may not see fit. But it would have to be in writing. Then the judge makes an examination of the person himself, orders the person before him, and he is examined, and I am also examined and if it is thought proper the discharge of the patient is made. If the ease remains here and is one that is not liable to recover and becomes so danger- ous as to make it improper for him to remain among persons of this class, then I make a written application, under oath, to a jus- tice of the Supreme Court, stating the facts of the case, and why I 17 consider him dangerous, and then I transmit that to him with the papers upon which lie was committed to the asylum. In that case he also then examines me, then he requests the district attorney— that is the justice, or the State Commissioner in Lunacy orders the district attorney —to make an examination and report to him; he also requests or directs me then to communicate the matter to the district attorney of the county from which the patient comes; then he examines that patient and the transfer is made; the judge orders a transfer to the criminal asylum at Auburn. Q. What then becomes of the patient; does his case go to the district attorney to be tried for his crime? A. Yes, sir; then the law states,' or the order usually states the same thing and then within sixty days he has to be remanded to the county from whence he came to await his trial, or to be other- wise discharged; that is the way criminals get in and out of the asylum. Q. After your return to the asylum, and, in a measure your recovery from your injury, then what part of the duties did von assume and perform ? A. It would be difficult to answer that question ; almost every- thing except what I have stated heretofore. Q. Did you, after your return, visit the patients in the asylum« A. Yes, sir; I visited them. Q. What is the greatest length of time that has elapsed that you have not visited and seen the patients in the several wards ? A Well, I could hardly tell ; I don't think there has been a day that 1 have not been in the wards; in some of them ; but it is some time now since I went through the entire house consecutively, be- cause I found it was more of a labor than I could perform without being sick, or without suffering from it; I suffered from the after- pain and disturbance to such an extent that I concluded afterward, and so stated to the managers, that I could not go through the wards upon these consecutive visitations until I was relieved; and then I have no doubt I have consulted a great deal more with the physi- cians about the cases than I would have done if I had been able to see them myself more frequently. Q. Can you give us the greatest length of time that has elapsed during which you have not visited and seen all of the patients in the asylum ? A. No, sir; I don't think I could, Mr. Morgan; that has not occurred to me. Q. Has it been for a space of three weeks? A. No, sir ; I don't think there has been a space of three weeks y. Has there been a period of two weeks ? A. That I have not been through the whole house? Q. Yes ; since your return. A. Yes sir ; I think there has been; there has never been a week but what I have been to the house; if you are speaking of my under 3U 18 taking to go through the entire wards and back, I think probably there may be that time. Q. Two weeks? " A. Yes, sir. Q. Would there be three weeks, do you think ? A. I hardly think there would be, because I have gone in through half of the place, and then stopped and then gone in again. Q. In lieu of passing through and investigating, or seeing the patients during this time, what rule have you adopted in place of that personal examination ? A. When I have passed through, I have generally made personal examinations. Q. But when you have not been able to do them, what course have you adopted instead of the personal examination ? A. By talking to the physicians, and often to the matron, and sometimes to attendants ; though as a general rule I like to obtain every thing through the direct authorities under me. Q. And did you keep any record of the reports and investigations made by yourself with the attendants and physicians who have passed through the asylum ? A. Yes, sir; I was going to say in addition to that, that I read the notes — the current notes, of the attending physicians; we have what we call "ward books" on the men's side and on the women's ; which contain the name of every patient ; the name of every patient is in that book and it contains current notes that are taken of their daily condition, especially of those requiring notation, it is contained in that book; then there is a series of morning re- ports that are made by the night watchers of the condition of patients ; and then there is a report that is made by the heads of the departments of each ward, containing their movements of every day, where thejr are and what they are doing. Q. The attendants or the patients do you mean ? A. Patients 1 mean ; and with all these things I have had to use them more to help me in keeping myself posted, and I do keep my- self posted better then I would be if I had been able to go through myself; I have used all these means to inform myself of their con- dition, and if any question has arisen in reference to, any particular case, then I have asked specifically about that particular case. Q. Who makes the first original records in these ward books of the condition of the patients ? A. Do you mean iu the book that the doctors carry ? Q. You have an original entry that is made m the small book — a ward book—how about that? A. Whatever the physician finds on visitation, he makes that record. Q. Is there any record made by the attendants ? A. Yes, sir, that is what I alluded to ; there is a daily report. Q. Made by whom ? A. The attendants, of the movements of the patients ; and that 19 is kept; those are filed; then, every morning there is a report made of each department, which is in the office. Q. Now, in the various wards there are more than one attendant, I suppose ? A. There is no ward but what has more than one attendant. Q. Who makes the report in that case ? A. The head attendant. Q. Who does he report to ? A. He reports to the supervisor. Q. Of his ward ? A Yes,^ sir ; unless he reports directly, as he always does, to the physician in attendance, when a case arises of sufficient importance to warrant it; the attendant also reports to the physician as he goes through the ward, any thing occurring on that ward; he reports to the supervisor so that he may go to the office ; and no ward shall be left without the head attendant upon it. ^ Q. If the attendant reports to the supervisor, who does the super- visor report to ? A. Instantly to the doctor, the physician in charge; and if he goes into the office, and the physician is not in, there is always some doctor here ; this office is never left without some doctor; for in- stance, in a case of suicide or an accident, I do not think that the office has ever been left for a minute, or for half an hour, without a physician in it; it should not be, of course, and it is a rule that is always sbserved. Q. That is if one of the physicians should absent himself from the asylum for any space of time, even to go out upon the grounds, would that not be' a violation of the rule ? A. Yes, sir; a physician doing that would not be a suitable person to be in the institution. Q. What arrangement have you for regulating that matter with regard to the physicians in attendance in order that they may not all absent themselves at one time ? A. If a physician is going outside, anywhere, if he is called out- side, he always tells the others ; he says, I am going out, so and so, and then the other would not leave the office ; I have never known or seen such an instance, since I have been here, of there being no physician in the office. Q. There is a principal office for those several physicians? A. Yes, sir. Q. They all occupy one office ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And you occupy a separate office ? A. Yes, sir. Q. When a report is made by an attendant to the supervisor, and by the supervisor to the physician, then what becomes of that report ? A. That is a verbal report if an accident happens or any thing of that kind. Q. How is it in regard to these daily reports ? •J 20 ; A. That is on file in the office; I can show you that. Q. In this general office of the physicians ? A. Yes, sir; it is filed there. Q. Suppose there is an unusual disturbance on any of the wards, how is that reported ? A. That is reported instantly. Q. And when that gets to the physician of that ward, what becomes of that report ? A. That is reported verbally, and when he reports it he puts it down in his ward book and that comes to me. Q. Who reports that to you ? A. The physician. Q. Having charge of that ward ? A. Yes, sir; and if he is not in one of the other physicians im- mediately goes and they report to me. Q. What do you do ? A. I direct whatever is necessary, or go in myself if there is any thing special, I go in myself; for instance, if there were some question about putting a restraint upon a patient, they might imme- diately consult me about it, if it were some person who had not been accustomed to any restraint especially; if it were some person that they knew about the paroxysms, they would know what re- straint to put on. There was a consultation the other day ; a man came here with a certain history; now I was satisfied from my con- versation with him that he was suicidal; and I don't know but he was more than that; now, in that case, I said to the attending physician, "I think you will have to look out for him, he is a ' smart fellow, but he evidently is controlled by deeper delusions than he has given evidence of; " and so we put him under careful ob- servation. He had got Bright's disease, and we put him right under treatment for that condition. By the Chairman : Q. State as to how accessible the physicians are to the supervisors at night? A. We have four night watches, and when they go on duty they are expected to report everything. There are two on each side, be- sides special night watchers in the wards; and one of them has to report at once any thing that occurs. Q. To whom ? A. To the physicians in charge. Q. Where can the physician be found ? A. He is right on the second story, above here; they all reside in the asylum ; it is on the third story; I am forgetting that this is the first; the first floor contains the offices and dining-room of the steward and matron and the assistant physicians ; on the second story is the residence of the superintendent; the third story is occupied by the assistant phy- I sicians, and it is as accessible a6 this story is to those wards here; I 21 do not think that an assistant physician is three minutes away from any place in this house at night; then, if there is any thing unusual, they come to me. Q. Now, in the care of an attendant; suppose, in the night, a patient should be taken violently sick, what is done ? A. The attendants all sleep on the wards, and they have their doors open, and if they hear any noise they are quick to detect it. Q. Is there not a man there whose duty it is — A (Interrupting.) Then the night-watch reports; he speaks to an attendant and reports at once to the physician, and, if a person is taken sick, the physician goes right in. Q. How many night-watchmen are there on duty ? A. There are two night-watchmen inside; one night-watch for the sick, and one for the suicidal; and then when it is necessary, if any person is sick on any ward, an attendant is designated to be put there, ' one of the attendants of that ward, and he is permitted to sleep through the day. Q. And if a person is taken violently sick, or taken sick at all, what is done ? A. If a patient is taken sick at all — suppose he should complain of stomach-ache, or headache, it is immediately reported ; the night watch would at once tell the attendant, and would then report to the doctor ; of course the night watch would be in full dress and could go out, but the attendant would be undressed. Q. The attendant would stay on duty while the night watch re- ported to the physician ? A. Yes, sir." Q. Does it frequently happen that a patient is taken sick, or that a patient becomes violent in the night? A. I should not say that it was frequent, but it not infrequently happens. Q. Occasionally? A. Well, not infrequently would be the term. By Mr. Morgan : Q. In those cases are you ever called ? A. Yes, sir ; I have been called ; I am not called without— well, for instances, suppose a person should barricade his door — all these other things are immediately looked after — and he should be mak- ing a disturbance, and we should be of the opinion that he would be apt to kill himself or something of that kind, I should be notified of that. Q. When were you last called in the night to look after a pa- tient? A. Unless it was very necessary they would not call me. Q. (Repeated.) A. Well, I really could not say. Q. Have you been called by a physician, or by any person in care, within the last three years ? 22 A. Oh ! yes, sir. Q. Have you within a year ? A. Yes, sir, within a year. Q. And when you are called, do you always respond ? A. I always respond ; I may advise what they had better do and not go myself, but I always respond ; if I consider it necessary, I - go and see the patient, but it is not very often necessary. Q. Does it often occur that you consider it unnecessary to go ? A. Sometimes it is not necessary. Q. And for what reason do you think it is not necessary ? A. Well, from the nature of the case, and from my knowledge of the patient; sometimes it is necessary to do nothing more than to send out and get the carpenter to open the door; I have advised about such matters; they most always occur in the day-time and rarely at night. Q. And is there any other reason than the fact that you have confidence in the physician in charge ? A. I was going to remark that 1 have complete confidence that they will properly attend to the matter. I will cite a case : Some- time ago a patient'barred himself in his room in the evening ; he was a violent man, and though the physicians were perfectly com- petent to deal with the matter, they knew that I for some reason had more influence with that patient than anyboy else ; I imme- diately went up and I soon persuaded him to open the door, to take. the bed away from it; but ordinarily I would have no more influ- ence than anybody else. Q. How is this to your own personal influence with the patients ? A. That would be somewhat of a delicate matter for me to give an opinion upon ; do you not think so ? Q. Well, you know how it is | A. Yes, sir; I know I have influence with the patients. Q. That others might not have ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Then, is not the case that sometimes your influence would be entirely useless ? A. Yes, sir; entirely useless ; and so it is with some of the phy- sicians— a patient will sometimes have an unfounded prejudice toward some physician, and in that.case I would send another phy- sician to do io any thing with that patient. Q. Is it not true that there are physicians in the asylum who can go and visit patients and talk with them, and they will talk quietly and very sensibly to them, while they would be very much excited and enraged even at your making your appearance ? A. Yes, sir; there are such cases as that, where they consider ' me, apparently, the principal offender in confining them. Q. Take the case of a patient who has conceived the idea that you are the cause of his imprisonment, as he would call it, would you feel it your duty, or would you think it advisable not to visit that patient? A. In going my regular rounds I should visit him, '; 23 but I should abstain from talking to him; to give you an illustra- tion, there is the case of F----C----, he believes that I am the center of all the evil,; which he fancies surround him, and that I exercise control in every direction to oppress him and injure him and injure the Catholic Church and all sorts of things; now any conversation with him would be as injudicious on my part as it would be for me to open a sore and scrape it. Q- F---- C----, gets excited even at the mention of your name? A. Yes, sir ; or Judge T----, and various other names. Q. Now as to books; do you allow the patients to have books to read ? A. 1 es, sir. Q. Has there ever been any effort to take from F____C____ his book; he has a book there of his own, has he not? A. Yes sir; he has ; no, sir; there has never been any thing done in that direction as the taking away of his book. Q. When you go into the violently insane departments do you usually have an attendant with you ? A. The attendants are some- where near; but I must frankly say that I have no fear when I go on that ward. Q. Have you ever been struck by a patient ? A. I have been struck three times since I have been here, and sometimes a woman in the female department has slapped me, but not with intention of hurting me. I have not had auy serions injury in that way; men have arranged to attack me sometimes, but one of the main safe- guards is that there are no combinations here, and I should say that one man has formed the idea of attacking me; they have no idea of combination and that is the safety of the asylum; we have a large number of slungshots, knives, and various things that patients have secured with the intention of inflicting an injury. Q. Where do they get them ? A. While they are out walking, they will get a stone and tie it up in a handkerchief. The case that I referred to was one of a Mr. S----, whose case is one about which there was a disturbance ast year; he got a knife; I don't know how he made his knife, but he got a piece of steel that goes through a lady's corset, and had it mad every sharp, and got a wooden handle tied on to it, and he ex- pressed the fact, when he was detected, that he intended to kill one of the doctors; he said he could have cut his throat and severed an artery, just as a man did with Dr. Cook in the Canandaigua asylum. bometimes in such cases the patient meditating violence will com- mnicate his intentions to others. Now, he told his intentions to two others, one of whom was a very discontented man who thought he had great grievances himself, but he was filled with horror that ?-— should desire to take such vengeance, and he wrote me a note informing me of the matter, and telling me never to divulge it; that S----was so dangerous he would kill him if he should learn that he had written me this letter; afterward he wrote me half a dozen letters about it and was very fearful about the matter. 24 Q. Then there is danger of the patients securing some instrument by which they may do damage ? A. Yes, sir; nails, stones, crooks and horse shoes. Q. What means do you adopt for the purpose of guarding against those ? , „ ,. A. We soon find out the class, and they are examined from time time; that is their bed clothing and their wearing apparel. Q. Is it a fact that the patitents do occasionally go out tor a walK . A. Jl gs sir Q.' And when they are sent out what means are taken to protect them and to protect the public; what means do yon adopt ( A. We always send a sufficient number of attendants with them ; enough to take care of them. Q. Do you have to in any way restrain a patient when they are going out? A. No, sir. Q. Does it sometimes occur when they are out walking that they commit trespasses by breaking away from their attendants? A. They sometimes attempt to escape, and occasionally one has escaped; but I do not know of any particular injury to property that anyone has ever done; I do not recall any such instance now. Q. I mean by running into a man's yard for instance ? A. Yes, sir;'they may run in to get away, they would do it for that purpose, but not with the intent of harming the yard at all. Q. Have there been cases where they have actually gone to the door of a house and attempted to get in ? A. Yes, sir; to get protection, but that is all. Q. Now, in such a case as that, the attendants would at once recapture the man and bring him back into line ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Suppose an attendant finds that a patient, when out for a walk, is disposed to get away, what does he do ? A. Upon his return he at once reports the fact to the office. Q. Do they keep on their walk with such a man and let him con- tinue to walk with them, or do they send him back to the asylum? A. They generally take him close beside them so as to keep a watch upon him, and then continue their walk. Q. Have there been any cases reported to you at any time of a man being knocked down by an attendant while out walking ? A. 1 do not recall a case where any man has been knocked down; I recall several cases where they have had had a struggle with an attendant, but I do not recall any case of being knocked down. Q. Has there been a case of a man being knocked down and kicked by an attendant % A. No, sir ; there has been a case reported where a patient com- plained that he had been kicked. Q. Who reported that ? A. The attendant himself reported the case ; he reported the fact that the patient complained that he had been kicked, and also 25 reported the fact that while they were out this occurred that an attendant did kick a patient. Q. Who reported it ? A. One of the other attendants, who was out; it is the rarest possible thing that there is only one attendant; nearly always there are two or three together; that was reported to the doctor who happened to be near, and then it was reported to me ; this happened when they were out working, not walking. Q. What did you do when it was reported to vou ? A. I instantly ordered the attendant discharged ; I examined into the matter and ascertained that it was true; I also ought to say that the man was not hurt; but it was all the same to me whether he was hurt or not, and the patient was discharged in ten minutes. Q. Do you mean the patient ? A. The attendant. Q. About when was it that occurred ; how long ago? A. It was a year or two ago. Q. Then, taking it generally, if a case is reported to you of ill treatment, or injury, or an attempted injury, by an attendant upon a patient, do you investigate that yourself, personally ? A. Always ; first I let some body else make their report, and then I investigate it myself. Q. Do you call the person charged with doing the offense before you ? A. Not always; because sometimes it is so manifest and plain that I order him right out to the steward's office to be dismissed; for instance, when a charge is made against an attendant and he admits that the charge is true, of course there is not any use in my going any further in that case; if a man acknowledges he did it, I dismiss him instantly, without any thing further. Q. When those attendants, who are out with patients, return from their walk, do they always make a report of their outside work ? A. No, sir; not always ; sometimes it happens that they want to go further than usual, to the cemetry, for instance, and they report before they go, and ask permission. They are expected to go out walking or working in the yard every day unless the weather pre- vents it. Q. You have a first assistant physician in charge ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Who is the first assistant physician in charge now ? A. Doctor E. N. Brush. Q. Who next 't A. Doctor Charles W. Pilgrim. Q. What part of the institution is immediately under the super- vision of Dr. Brush ? A. The women's side of the house. Q. Does Dr. Brush have any supervision over the male depart- ment ? 4U .- .j 26 A. Not without I request him; I have sometimes requested Dr. Brush to do certain things for me. Q. Who has the supervision of the male department < A. Dr. C. W. Pilgrim ; and Dr. Quinn is associated with w. Brush on the women's side, and Dr. Backus with Dr. rugrim on tliG men s sicIg • Q. Have you a diary from which you can give to the committee the time that you have been absent from the institution tor the last five years ? A. No, sir; I never keep a diary. ,,..-, 9 Q. Are you in the habit'of being away delivering lectures i A Yes sir; I deliver — for the last few years I have delivered lectures/with one winter's exception, at Bellevue Medical College, and have lectured occasionally, or within the meantime, before the medical class at the Albany Medical School ; I do not know that I should say I delivered lectures, but I delivered three or four talks of an hour each to the college class this winter, just as I am talking here. Q. At what college ? A. Bellevue. Q. What is your compensation in the asylum« A. Four thousand dollars. Q. And furnished ? A. Yes, sir, I live here. Q. You live in the institution ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And your house is furnished by the State? A. Well, it ought to be, but is mainly furnished by myself, sim- ply for my own preference. Q. But so far as your servauts, are they not paid by the State ? A. Yes, sir, by the institution ; I have servants; they are in com- mon with the others. Q. They go on to the pay-roll with other attendants ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And when you go away to deliver lectures do you get —- are you compensated for that ? A. No, sir; I have been compensated some times, but 1 am not generally ; I do not get even my expenses when I go down and deliver these lectures at Bellevue. Q. You are not on the regular staff of this college ? A. Yes, sir; no — there are three or four special lecturers, for instance, Dr. Noyes lectures on the eye, some one on the ear, and I have lectured on insanity and jurisprudence. Q. But you receive no compensation ? A. None, now. . Q. Are you not sometimes called away as an expert witness? A. Yes, sir. Q. Frequently ? 27 A. Not very frequently; I have gone away when I felt I could not get out of it. Q. Occasionally ? A. Yes, sir. Q. In those cases do you receive compensation ? ■ A. Sometimes I do and sometimes I do not. Q. Take the Guiteau case, for instance; what compensation did you receive there ? A. I reeeived there a certain per diem, when it was over, but I do not know that I ought to state it; I would rather not; it was not any great compensation. By Mr. Haskell : Q. Is it not a matter of record, at Washington, how much you received ? Q. I suppose it is. Q. Then why can you not state it here ? A. Some are still trying to get their compensation adjusted; to a part of them they paid twenty-five dollars a day, and to some of the rest they gave fifty dollars, and we paid our own expenses. I got fifty dollars a day and paid my own expenses, and for a while I was concerned in some other matter where I got thirty dollars a day in addition, afterward. By the Chairman : Q. Are you willing to state any sum which you can say would limit your total receipts, outside, in the way of fees as an expert? A. I don't know ; but it is not an amount that amounts to enough for me to be willing to do it, and I have refused on every occasion I could ; I have sent Dr. Brush,' and used to send Dr. Andrews; I do not consider that in expert testimony, taking my life together, has compensated me. Q. You are aware that the people outside of the asylum have an idea that you have made a large amount of money out of the expert business ? A. In some cases—take one case, the Hagar case, I did not receive half the amount of my ordinary hotel bill. Q. Have you ever taken any private practice outside of the asylum ? A. No, sir; I have never taken any private practice. Q. Have you been called upon ? A. I have been called in consultation in some cases. Q. And you have received compensation? A. Yes, sir ; about the ordinary fee. Q. Do you ever charge a person a fee who comes here to the asylum and consults with you? A. Not without that person wonld be some person who was 28 thoroughly able to pay a fee, a person who is not coming here to the asylum to stay ; for iiistance a gentleman came here some time ago from Canada; he wrote to me that he wanted to consult me and came down and spent two hours that evening; he came to obtain my advice in a certain matter about a prominent man there, and I advised him what to do ; I charged him precisely the same as if he had gone.to the city; it was a case wherein the party was compe- tent to pay a fee for consultation; I have some letters now from people who want to 'come and see me, and want to know what my fee will be; I shall not say any thing about the fee, but I shallnot charge them a fee; if I were to say I would charge them any thing, they would not come here. Q. If you were requested to go to New York to examine a pa- tient there — a person of means — in order to advise such person's friends, would you be disposed in such a case to accept a retainer; that is, would you accept a fee in such a case ? A. Yes, sir. Q Would yon accept such employment? A. Yes, sir; I should not always go ; I might and I might not; I have refused; I think I may safely say that I have refused a great many more cases than I have attended to ; I have refused cases re- cently, and at all times. Q. Can you give the committee a statement of the outside work that you have done ? A. That would be a pretty difficult thing to do. Q. Have you any means of furnishing a statement ? A. Nothing but my memory. Q. Suppose you were called to New York to examine a patient there, and you do go and make an examination, and receive a fee, and retnrn home, do you make any record of that ? A. No, sir; I do not think I have been often enough to necessi- tate my making a record of it. Q. So that you would not make any record of it ? A No, sir. Q. Has it been an unusual thing during the last five years for you to go away from the asylum upon such private employment? A. Yes, sir; it has been an unusual thing; I have been asked and pressed to go to various places; to go to Canada, Con- necticut, Massachusetts and Rhode Island; and also to go through this State, and my usual reply has been, I have usually refused to go and unusually gone. I went once to visit a person while I was away, "when I went to Boston on a visit; I went out to see a person there; I got a very pressing letter from a physician in Michigan, who somehow or other learned I was there in Boston. I was there visiting an uncle of Mrs. Gray; she had gone down there on an anniversary, or something of that kind, to the Rev. Dr. Lathrop's on the occasion of his birthday. He had 29 asked me to go before and I had refused, but inasmuch as I was in Boston, and that it was a particular friend,I thought I would com- ply with his request, and I did so. But, as I stated, I have refused to go in a large number of eases; I have declined to go to New York a number of times this year, and I have written a long letter rather than go; I have sent Dr. Ford of this city ; Dr. Ford was formerly an assistant here. I have sent him and I have sent some others with whom'l was familiar, to attend to such matters in place of me. By Mr. Rice : Q. When were you last called to any private consultation, out- side of the hospital, doctor? A. Within a few weeks in a case in this city. Q. Have you been employed as an expert in any private or civil cases within the last year or two ? A. I went once in the case of Mrs. Fillmore's will at Buffalo ; that occurred a short time ago. By the Chairman : Q. And did yon receive a fee as an expert in that case? A. Yes, sir.- Q. Have you been to New York city recently as an expert in any case ? A. No, sir ; do not recall any. Q. Can you not state some period of time that you have been en- gaged, in the aggregate, in this line of expert business ; can you not state that you have not been engaged more than a certain definite time within the last two years ? A. I think I could; yes, sir. Q. Take the year 1883, can you state about what portion of the past year you think you were away from the asylum on expert work? A. During the past year, taking out cases where a judge has di- rected me to go down and examine into cases, one a criminal case at Ithaca, I should say that I do not think I have been away a week altogether. Q. For this past year ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How much were you away the previous year, if you recollect ? A. Not at all, that I can now recall; yes, sir, I was away in a case that year ; I went down to see the daughter of a sick friend ; there is that occasion and the instances I have mentioned. Q. During the timelyou were absent ou account of your illness, did you performany professional work of such a character? A. No, sir. 30 Q. None whatever ? A. No, sir, except what I would do anywhere, and in cases that would go without any particular fee ; nothing more than to see a person who was a child of a very dear friend of mine, which I would do now. By Mr. Morgan : Q. How much time did you devote to expert bWness in 1882? Mr. Rice — That is the year he received his injury, is it not? A. Yes, sir. Q. How much time did yon spend that year in expert business \ A. Not any. Q. In 1881 how much time did you spend in that direction ? A. I do not recall any, except the case of Guiteau. Q. How long a time were you engaged away from the asylum in the Guiteau case ? A. I was subpoenaed before he was tried — or rather I was not subpoenaed, but I was telegraphed to, and I declined; I had not read a word about the case, and I did not want to go ; then I got a kind of a telegram that the board of managers thought that unless I went voluntarily, after receiving that, that I should be compelled to go, and I thought I had better go ; that was some days, and I think it must have been two weeks before the trial; I went down then and examined him and made a report verbally, and afterward that report was taken down by a shorthand reporter and I came home, with the expectation — Q. (Interrupting.) Having been occupied about how many days? A. I think I must have been there a week; I think I left here Friday night and did not get back until Saturday of the following week ; then I was not expected to go back to Washington, until near the end of the trial; then I was to go back as an expert wit- ness ; on Saturday night I got a telegram saying " return to Wash- ington at once " — or words to that effect — " we need you here;" I went there then, and then I was there some time. Q. State how long you remained there then ? . A. Well, I remained there then until some time in January. By the Chairman : Q. How many weeks were you there at that time? A. About six weeks — well, more than that, it was about two months. Q. And then did you return home to Utica ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And you did not return again to the trial ? A. No, sir; then afterwards I got a communication requesting me to go to Washington, they desired me to examine the exceptions taken during the trial, and I went back there. Q. For a short time ? 31 A. Yes, sir; I was only there a short time on that occasion. Q. How long did you spend there on that occasion ? A. I think, I went either the last of February or the first of March, and came home on the sixteenth day of March. Q. Making about a fortnight that you were there ? A. Yes, sir; just about a fortnight. Q. Now go back to the year 1881, how much time did you spend away from the institution during that year in professional occupa- tion, including your lectures? A. Well, it is so little that I cannot really tell. Q. How much time altogether do your lectures take annually at Bellevue; how many days absence from the institution in a year ? A. Well, they are all comprised within two weeks; that is about all the time they take; I usually go down Wednesday afternoon at two o'clock, and lecture on Thursday and Friday morning, and then come immediately home; sometimes there are three lectures in that time; the highest number of lectures I have delivered have been twelve. Q. Twelve in one winter ? A. Yes, sir; one winter term; then three years ago I only deliv- ered four. Q. Can you recall any other professional expert work that you have performed outside of the asylum in the year 1882 except the Guiteau trial? A. No, sir; I cannot just now. Q. Can you recall any other professional work outside of the in- stitution ? A. In the year 1870 on my way to Europe, I stayed over a day in New York, I went down the day before I sailed; that was in a case there that I attended and I spent a day there ; and I think I went up to Batavia in that year. Q. On a private case ? A. No, sir. Q. Is that a case where you were subpoenaed ? A. No, sir; I have not always been subpoenaed ; I have generally gone at the request of the district attorney. These were both in cases of violence or threatened violence; it would not be public business in every sense, of course. Q. You spoke about going to Europe; how long were you away on your trip to Europe ? A. I was away from June of that year until the 6th of September. Q. Was that a pleasure trip ? A. It was a pleasure trip partly ; I went to visit the institution for the insane on the other side of the Atlantic, in Scotland, France and Italy, and of England especially. Q. And did you visit such institutions ? A. Yes, sir ; I visited the principal institutions. Q. Were your expenses paid entirely by yourself ? A. Oh, entirely ; I have never been away anywhere except to 32 meetings of the associations, or of the superintendents except my expenses were paid by myself; except on occasions that I have gone for the institution. Q. In the year 1878, can you recall how much time you spent in private professional employment outside of the institution ? A. I have been in some cases that I cannot confine to any partic- ular year; but, in thinking it over, it was not very much ; perhaps it was a month ; but I will look the matter up and after lunch I will state it. Q. Do you recollect of an instance where you were employed, about that time, to inquire into the mental condition of a gentleman in New York, where you were paid a considerable fee? A. Yes, sir. Q. Please state about what time that occurred ? A. .That occurred — I think it was either '78 or ' 79 ; I cannot state just when that was. Q. About how much time did that occupy you away from home ? A. I did a good deal of that work at home here during the even- ings ; I did it at night time, that is, reading it over; when 1 have such matters to engage my attention, I usually attend to them in the evening; I should say it was about, fifteen days that I was away from the institution, because I went at several different times. Q. What was the nature of your employment in that case ? A. It was a private case; the nature of the employment was this: I was employed to make an examination into the mental condition of this gentleman to whom you refer; to examine him and then to read the testimony, and the papers, and various things. upon the subject, and then form my opinion upon all those things. Q. What was the occasion of such inquiry ? A. It was in relation, I think, to the recovery of the charge of his property; or to create a trustee for his property, I think that was it. Q. Did you perform a portion of that work in the institution here? A. Yes, sir; I performed a portion of that work in this institu- tion, as I have stated, during my evenings. Q. What compensation did you receive in that case ? A. I received for the whole of that work, $1,800. Q. Did that include your disbursements ? A. Yes; every thing. Q Were you engaged in any other case within the last three years in the city of New York in which you received a large fee ? A. Yes, sir; I was in the Yanderbilt will case. Q. In what year was that case heard ? A. That must have been before ; no, I think it was after the last named case that I spoke of; I cannot state positively whether it was before or after, it may have been after; I think it was in 1878 or 1879. 33 Q. Was that before the death of Mr. Vanderbilt, or was it upon the occasion of the contest of his will ? A. It was the contest of his will. Q. About how much time did that occupy you away from this institution ? A. The three times that I was there upon that case — I think it was only three or four days; I was there three times, and two of those times I was on the stand, and it was when I went down to lecture. Then I spent some time in reading over the testimony ; I read over a large amount of it here, nights. I think I ought to Bay in justice to myself that I never read or wrote a line of any such matter within the twelve hours required by the work of this institution ; it was done between nine o'clock at night and two o'clock in the morning; at which time I read that testimony. And in the other case I referred to I did not take any of the time from the services or labors required by the institution, except the time I spoke of when I went to New York. Q. As a witness ? A. Yes, sir. Q. That you stated, I believe, was three or four days ? A. Yes, sir; well, it was more than that; I had to go down three times ; the first time I went down I could not find them at all, they gave me no clue to any thing, told me to go there and meet them, and I could not find them. Q. Did it occupy you two weeks ? A. No, sir; I don't think I was occupied two weeks in that matter. Q. Did it occupy you one week ? A. Yes, sir; perhaps more than one week. Q. Between one and two weeks, did you say ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Will you state what it was you received in that Yanderbilt case ?• A. That was not the Yanderbilt case that I was speaking about; I was talking about the other case. Q. How much time did you occupy in the Vanderbilt case ? A. I should think it was ten or twelve days, and probably twice as many nights. Q. The nights were occupied here ? A. Yes, sir ; except one or two. Q. But you spent twice as many nights in the institution as you were engaged days there ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What was your compensation in that case ? A. I received exactly the same compensation as in the former case — $1,800 — the same as the other case I mentioned. Q. Do you recall any other case in which you have received large fees? 5U 34 A. No, sir. In justice to myself I ought to say that in regard to the statements that have been made about my outside engage- ments ; two or three years ago I looked the matter up to ascertain if I had gained anv thing financially from expert testimony, and the reason of it was" that Mr. Woodin's committee asked me in that direction, I thought the matter over, and I thought that the amounts that I had received, including the occasions when I had received nothing and paid my own expenses—that the amount that I re- ceived had not up to that time compensated me; that is, I did not think I had received more than I had paid out for disbursements and expenses*in connection with such cases. Q. That Woodin testimony was not taken until 1880, was it ? A. Yes, sir; that is when it was taken, and since then I had made up my mind that I would not go away on such matters un- less I was compelled to go; I had looked the matter up previous to the time of taking testimony by the Woodin committee. Q. Do you now consider that you ought not to accept this out- side work ? A. Yes, sir. Q. You consider it as inconsistent with your duties here at the asylum ? A. I do not know that I could answer it in that way ; I think somebody, occasionally, has to go to such places; I have appealed to the board of managers to prevent me from going. Q. When have you made such appeals ? A. I did that recently ; I did it in the case of Smith, in Catta- raugus county some time ago, and in a case a number of years ago — the Buckhou't case, and under the advice of Mr. Kernan I tried to resist it. Q. Was that a case where you were subpoenaed to go ? A. No, sir ; I had not been subpoenaed, but I was requested, to go. Q. Do you receive a substantial fee in such cases ? A. Yes, sir ; but I do not want to go through the labor and anxiety and strain of it and the stress of it; but the result was in both of those cases that I was compelled to go by their sending for me and compelling me. .Q. Mr. Haskell, by a subpoena ? A. Yes, sir ; by the sheriff and a demand of the court. Q. Have you ever refused to accept employment as an expert where a substantial fee would have been expected ? A. Yes, sir ; I have on several occasions where it has been offered and where they have said to me "you may make your own terms." I have declined such cases within the last few years several times. Q. Why did you make such refusal ? A. Because I did not want to do it; and do not want to do any thing of the kind unless compelled to. Q. For the reason you believe it is your duty to stay here ? A. Yes, sir; and because I preferred not to go. 35 Q. Was there any other cases in New York city, where you have had an opportunity to receive a considerable fee, that you have declined to accept employment in ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Within the last few years ? A. Yes, sir; within the last four years I should say; any way within the last seven. Q. What reason have you to believe that you have had substantial fees in those cases ? A. I was told by the attorneys in such cases — by the counsel — that I could make my own terms. In some of the cases I have been assured that my fee would be liberal; some have used that expres- sion— your fee shall be liberal; and in other cases, as I have stated, I have been told that I might make my own fee, but I have declined a great many times in sueh cases. Some of the cases were repre- sented to me as being in connection with estates that were reputed to be very large. I remember of two instances where I was informed that they would give me a retainer, but I said I had never received a retainer in my life for any thing of that kind and never would take one; that when I had got through with the services, then that whatever they were worth, I would receive that. By Mr. Rice : Q. Within the last month, doctor, have you been called upon for counsel either at the institution or in private matters outside of the institution ? A. Not beyond the case I have mentioned. Q. Has that occurred within a month ? A. No, sir. Q. Have you, since the 1st of January, been called upon for con- sultation in private cases or at the asylum or at any other places ; if so, how many times ? A. Yes, twice ; persons have been here to see me on two occasions. Q. When you received compensation ? A. Yes, sir; for which I received compensation ; and there has been a number of times in which I have not received compensation. Q. Besides the cases that you have spoken of, where people have come here to take your advice, have there been cases where yon have given such advice for which you received no compensation ? A. Yes, sir, for which I received no compensation. Q. How many of those cases have occurred since the 1st of January ? A. I should say about six where I have given advice and have declined to receive any thing. Q. During that period of time have you been called upon in cases in the city of Utica or in other places ? A. Never, except the instances I have spoken of ; except in one case, I have declined to go several times within that period. Q. Now go back and take the last four months ; how many times 36 have you been called upon either here or at other places in private matters to give counsel in such matters ? A. In consultation or attendance do you mean ? Q. I mean in consultation ; where your time was actually taken up in consultation in private cases ? A. I do not now recall a case. Q. You have no memorandum of such things? A. No, sir; I have been once up to Vernon to see Mr. Williams, but that was a complimentary thing and I did not charge any thing. Q. I do not think the question of charge is of very much import- ance to the committee ; I want to get at the time you spent in such matters more particularly ? A. I went up there on Thanksgiving day at one o'clock, and I came back about four or five o'clock in the afternoon; I rode out to Clinton on Sunday, and came back the same day; and I rode out on the afternoon of another day; I _ cannot think of any thing else, , unless you have any suggestions to make; if you have any matter in mind, and will call my attention to it, I may be reminded of something. Q. Would the call made upon you here and elsewhere average one a day ? A. For my going out ? Q. In the case of persons calling upon you here to see you in a private capacity upon . professional matters, or of your going away from the asvlum in that capacity, would such cases average one a day? A. No, sir; they would not amount to twice a week. Q. Would they amount to more than once a week ? A. I do not think that they would ; I doubt very much whether they would amount to that. Q. That you are called upon here at the institution and elsewhere? A. Yes, sir; in the majority of cases that come here I consider them a sort of official thing, especially if they are cases where insan- ity is threatened ; I have been asked for advice as to what they should do or what they should not do ; a man called the other day to see me privately and personally; he wanted to see me about a member of his family ; I told him what I thought he ought to do, or he wanted to bring the person here ; I considered it within the line of my official duty to give advice to a person in such a case as that, but I do not think I have taken much of my time in that way ; I have taken very little time here away from the duties of the institution, and I will say on oath that I do not recall a duty that I have neg- lected in connection with any person who has ever come here for advice and counsel, whether it has been for pay or not for pay. Q. To what extent do the physicians connected with the institu- tion go away, if at all ? Are they called away for professional expert work not connected with the institution ? A. Not very much ; 1 think Dr. Brush is the only one, with the exception that Dr. Pilgrim has been down — was away in regard to some case — down to Fort Plain, some time ago. 37 Q. Do they ever go on private professional employment ? A. No, sir, not often; I think they have sometimes. Q. It is not unusual for them to go ? A. Yes, sir, it is rather unusual; that is, to go away on private employment, and for fee, I mean ; yes, it is rather unusual. Q. But they do it sometimes ? A. Yes, they do it sometimes. Q. Do you regard that as a proper thing for them to do, consist- ent with a thorough performance of their duties here ? A. Taking into consideration the particular cases for which it is done, I do not think any of the duties of the institution are neg- lected ; I have done things myself that, perhaps, do not belong to me to do, but there has been no duty neglected. Q. Have any of them gone to New York city on such employ- ment as that, or to Buffalo ? A. Yes, sir ; Dr. Brush went to Buffalo on the Filmore will case ; I do not think he has been to New York, but he has been down to Johnstown, and one or two, perhaps three or four, other cases ; he was up the other day at the Haight trial. Q. Was he employed there as an expert by private parties or was he subpoenaed ? A. No, sir; the district attorney came to see me about the matter, and I told him I could not possibly attend to it; that I could not 1 have any thing to do with it; Dr. Brush went, and he was subpoe- naed by the county and paid by the county for going there. Q. I hand you this pamphlet or book; 'please look it over, and state if it is a printed copy of the rules and regulations of the State Lunatic Asylum ? A. Yes, sir; that is a copy of the rules and regulations. [Marked Exhibit No. 1.] Witness —I was inquired of by your chairman, Mr. Howe, as ;. to the number of suicides that have occurred in this institution dur- l ing a certain period of years past; I promised him that I would r prepare such a statement; here it is (presenting the same to the : committee). Said statement is marked " Exhibit No. 2," and is as follows: 38 ft ft ft ft O Oh ft g g | 333333(*33333.a33-^HJ-i< ■uoissitnpu uo popping CO 7j . . .03 . . B « . 05 CO . . CO CO . tuo>ooocpooo©a>(i>o ^ ^ d rf •■- o o o J DO O ap-^DajaDaaBaaa^Kaoa "3 "3' rt c3 rf cS c3 rt M^^SSSSS^^hSS^ •iMpnqo ilOlOCO^HCCINNCO ■ajSais JO pSUXBJ^ SS^^«2S^cKS^SSSSSSSca •aSy Mt-MlO-*»OHfflHNCdOOIMOOOWO( WfMHCO-^NlCincOCdi-COQOOJCOHtMCO 0OC»c»aOaOa0c»CX>CX>00a>O0a>0Oa0aOO0a0 HHrtrlHrlHrlHHHHriHHrti-H cT co" co~ oo" % fcA ' a • •-£ > 'go > *> -*■= > *» ->> q u a ■ o > "3 co ?^° C a a ■>o ° r- : a -a «►>? o a 3 t. a u S s «s S S M u tffl ^ ?\ O u o a .3 «s„«)0a£ M^ 3 BJHfiHOO'S had to hold them in chairs while they were in their spells, and ttie insanity would pass off. . . . „^mnki,n^ Q. In any of those cases have there been any injuries complained of by the patient ? A. No, sir ; not as I know of. . „ Q. In your ward they have a stationary heavy cnair . A. No, sir; not in that ward; there is none there. Q. When a patient gets up and sometimes exhibits more insanity than usual, they sit him down in a chair ? A. Yes, I believe that is the way they do. Q. Suppose a patient insists upon getting up and walking round, what do they do then ? A. In the night time ? , -u j o Q. In the morning, or before you put them to bed i A Patients in all cases, is allowed the full sweep of the hall to exercise themselves, walking up and down, etc., and when they become noisy, or liable to injure other patients by striking them, 1 have noticed in all cases where attendants have taken them and set them in a chair until that insanity would pass off. . _ _ Q. Have you known of any instance of one patient injuring another ? A. Yes, sir ; it very frequently happens. Q. How is that done ? A. More or less through their delusions; they form _ a delusion against most any one at times. Q. They get a spite against some one that is a patient ? A. Yes, sir; and strike them. Q. How do they usually attack the one that they want to vent their spite upon ? A. As a general thing they have the same method as a sane per- son would —with their fist. Q. Is there any thing in that hall that they can use as a weapon to inflict an injury upon another patient ? A. No, sir; every thing is properly secured, except they break their arm on a chair. A. Are the attendants allowed to carry pocket knives ? A. No, sir. Q. Or pistols ? A. No, sir. Q. Or any thing in their pocket by which they could injure a patient ? A "No sir. Q. You have never been out walking with any of the patients? A N o sir. Q* Have you at any time done day duty at any time here ? A. Yes ; 'i did day duty previous to being night watch. Q How long were you engaged in day duty ? A I was engaged in day duty not quite a year. 53 Q. And what were your duties then ? A. Dining hall man. Q. Worked in the dining hall ? A. Yes, sir. Q.. And did you ever have any difficulty in the dining hall ? A. Nothing further than speaking to a patient; probably they would get cross and speak to them ; you would have to be firm with them and speak to them. Q. Did you ever see any demonstration by the patients in the dining hall ? A. As a general thing they are always very good in the dining hall, and they seem to be inclined to eat, etc. Q. After they have got through eating, how is it, do they go out—I suppose that when they come into the dining hall, they are all marched in line? A. No, sir; we do not as a general thing march them in line ; they are notified by the call man that the dinner is ready, and they all go up just the same as most any man would do — go to dinner. Q. Do they all have their own places at dinner ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And do they take that place ? A. Yes, sir. Q. When they get through eating, do they get up and go away without waiting for any signal ? A. .4s a general thing the knives and forks are collected before they leave the table, to see that they do not carry out any thing to do any injury to themselves, or others ; the knives and forks are all collected. Q. After the knives and forks are all collected, then what do thev do? A. They are allowed to go on to the floor for exercise, in the hall, so that the dining-room can be straightened up again, when it comes to the time to take the knives and forks. Q. Do the patients get offended frequently when that is done? A. No, sir; I have never known them to. Q. Have you ever known a patient securing a knife and fork ? A. Yes, sir; I have had some try to hide away a knife and fork, occasionally. Q. Do they ever succeed in getting from the table on to the hall with a knife or fork ? A. No, sir; never have known of one in my experience. Q. Then the care and vigilance is sufficient to prevent that ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Can you think of any mistakes, errors or abuses that have come within your knowledge since you have been in the asylum in any department? A.' Of the patients? Q. Of any one whatever — or any neglects or abuses of any kind? 54 A. I have never had any strict account, and it would be hardly fair for me to rely on my memory. . Q. Do you remember of any lack of duty in any one that came within your observation ? A. No, sir; I think I have noticed that every thing, and every one has fulfilled their duty always. By Mr. Rice : Q. I wish you would not say what you think —tell us what you know ? A. I have noticed since I have been in my position in this honse, everybody has fulfilled their duty. Q. Has there ever been an attendant discharged from your ward since you have been here ? A. No, sir. Q. Either when you were on day duty or on night duty ? A. There has been several discharged since I have been on night duty, though I don't know any thing about them. Q. Any attendants, I mean ? A. No, sir; not when I was on duty. Q. Have any of the attendants upon that ward been discharged? A. Yes, sir; there have been some. Q. Do you know who was discharged from your ward; what at tendant — do you remember the name ? A. There was none discharged while I was on day duty on my halls ; but since I have been on night duty, I believe there has been some discharged, but I don't know what they were discharged for. Q. Have you known who they were that were discharged ; that is, what their names were ? A. There have been so many there since I have been around that I don't know as I can recollect any names. Q. Have you ever known of any attendants coming on duty un- der the influence of liquor ? A. No, sir ; I have never seen any. Q. There have been a great number of attendants discharged from here for intoxication, have there not ? A. Not to my knowledge; as a general thing we do not hear what they are discharged for. Q. Then they are discharged without your knowing what they are discharged for ? A. Yes, sir; of course it is a practice not to inquire into such things. Q. Can you now recollect of any attendant having been dis- charged where you have thought that he had not done his duty, and where you could yourself see the reason for his being dis- charged ? , A. I don't think I could see the reason for his being discharged; I might have if I knew the reason, but I don't know as I knew. Q. Do you say that you have not seen any misconduct or want of 55 attention on the part of an attendant by which you, in your judg- ment, thought he ought to be discharged? A. I cannot get the meaning of your question ? "Q. Can you call to mind a single instance where you thought that an attendant should be discharged because you thought he was not a proper man for that place, and thought he had better be dis- charged ? A. I do not think I have seen where they have; but I can't get the drift of your question. Q. Do you known of any case where an attendant has been kept upon the ward, or in the employ here, where you thought he was not a fit person for the place ? A. I have seen or heard of some that had not performed their duly as required by the officers, but as I thought they had performed their duty very well. Q. Can you name one ? A.Mr. Williams; he had remained away over night without permission. Q. He left the institution and was gone away over night and came back the next day ? A. Yes, sir. ]Q. You thought that there was nothing wrong abeut that, did you? A. Well, I did not see as it was ; I thought it was not very bad. Q. It is strictly against the rules for a man to absent himself without permission ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And that is such a violation of the rules as that you under- stand an attendant ill be discharged for doing it ? A. Yes, sir. Q. You have nothing to do with the female department ? A. No, sir. Q. Do you know of any one who is now retained here who has been absent over night without leave ? A. No, sir; I don't know of any body. Q. Have you ever seen an attendant who was uuder the influence )f liquor ? A. No, sir; I have never seen one. Q. That is a violation of the rules as you understand it ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Have you ever heard of any one being discharged for that -eason — for intoxication ? A. I believe there has been one instance of it since I have been iere. Q. Do you remember who that was ? A. No, sir, I can't think of his name ; I was trying to think of t, but I can't tell it now. Q. Is that the only one yon think of ? A. Yes, sir. 56 Q. The only one you think of since 1882? A. Yes, sir. Q. If any. one were so discharged you would be likely to hear of it among the other attendants ? A. I think it is likely that I would. Q. They speak about those things among themselves, do they not? A. Ye^ sir ; they do, but I have not spent much time among them, and lately I do not see them at all. Q. Did you know Mr. Hughes ? A. I knew him by being introduced to him when I came on duty that night. Q. He was on your ward ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And it was your duty to look after him ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How was he when he came into your ward ? Did he come to your ward when he first came here, or was he transferred to your ward afterward ? A. I did not know he was on the hall when I came on duty at night. Q. And whether he had been in the asylum any length of time, or not, you do not know ? A. No, sir; I did not know. Q. Was he upon your ward when he met his accident ? A. No, sir. Q. What ward was he on then ? A. The fourth ward. Q. He was not on your ward at the time he received his injuries? A. No, sir. g . Q. Did you hear it talked about by the patients, about the injury ? "A. Not then. Q. How did he behave on your ward ? A. Up to eleven o'clock he remained in bed, and after that, when he began to revive from the effects of chloral that he had received, he began to get out of bed, and did not remain in bed, so that when I went to supper, Mr. Somers put him in the covered bed. Q. What time did you go to supper ? A. A quarter past eleven. Q. Who did you say put him in the covered bed ? A. Mr. Somers; the other night watch. Q. And kept him there until morning ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Was he noisy while in bed ? A. Yes, sir; noisy all night — very much disturbed. Q. Did he make violent efforts to get out ? A. No, sir. Q. He was simply noisy ? A. Yes sir; calling on folks at home, telling them that there was 57 such and such things in the cellar that they could get if they went Q. Did you inform the doctor of his condition ? A. Yes; I notified Mr. Somers and he notified the doctor- 1 believe it was Dr. Pilgrim that night. Q. Did the doctor come ? A. No, sir ; they sent him some quieting medicine. m Q. Did you notify the doctor ? Who gave him the quieting medi- cine ( ° A. Mr. Somers brought it from the physician. Q. Who gave it to Mr. Hughes ? A. Mr. Somers. Q. Were you there when he gave the medicine to Mr. Hughes« A. Yes, sir. b Q. Was that when he was in the covered bed ? A. Yes, sir. Q. After he was recovering from the effects of the chloral« A. Yes, sir. Q. And the doctor did not come ? A. No, sir. Q. Did he come at any time during the night ? A. No, sir; he was not notified again after that. Q. At what time was the doctor notified ? A. The doctor was notified between twelve and one o'clock. Q. And Mr. Hughes you say remained all night long, quiet» A. Yes, sir. ■ ^ Q. And you did not notify the doctor again ? A. No, sir. Q. Who gave him the chloral ? A. I don't know as I read in the paper who the physician was ■ 1 saw itin the paper that he had received chloral before he came to the institution, and that kept him clear up to that time. Q. You do not know, as a fact whether he had received chloral or not? A. No, sir; not until between twelve and one o'clock, when the physician of the asylum sent it to him. Q. Did he send him chloral ? A. He sent him night medicine, and I believe there is usually some in it. Q. Was this the first night this man was in the institution ? A. ft was the first night he was in the institution ; he was sent to the ninth ward, that is the suicidal ward; then he was transferred to the fonrth ward. Q. How long did he remain in your ward ? A. He was there when I left in the morning. Q. He stayed there one night? A. Yes. Q. Did you find him there when you came on duty ? A. I found him when I came on duty. 8U 58 Q. At what hour? A. Eight o'clock. Q. And he was then sleeping quietly ? A. Yes, sir ; I think so. Q. Was he sleeping ? A. Yes, sir ; I passed through the dormitory and he was asleep at my first and second visit through the dormitory. Q. How many beds are there in that dormitory ? A. Ten. Q. Did the other patients complain that he was disturbing them ? A. Yes, sir. Q. When he was taken and put in the covered bed was that in another room ? A. Yes, sir; that is in another room. Q. A room off to the end of the hall ? A. Yes, sir. Q. When he was put in that covered bed, was any notice given to Dr. Pilgrim of your intention to put him in the covered bed ? A. Yes, sir ; we always do that. Q. What word came back from Dr. Pilgrim ? A. To do the best we could with him and try and keep him quiet. Q. The doctor did not come himself ? A. No, sir ; he generally if he deems it necessary ; he generally comes, most all the time, but on this case we simply reported that he was noisy. Q. Do you ever put patients in the covered bed without instruc- tions from the doctor ? A. No, sir. Q. Does the doctor ever give any such instructions, or or does he usually give them without coming himself to see that they are carried out ? A. As a general thing he does. Q. Does he come, or does he not — which do you mean ? A. Does not come. Q. As a general thing he does not come — is that what you mean ? A. Yes sir; does not come. Q. He sends word to you to put the patient in a covered bed ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Does any doctor come into vour ward to visit regularly, every night ? A. No, sir ; not regularly. Q. Usually the doctor does not come into the ward after you go on duty ? A. No, sir. Q. It is a rare thing for the doctor to come into the ward after you go on duty ? A. He never comes except when he is sent for. Q. After eight o'clock at night that is ? 59 A. No, sir; he does not as a general thing ; the patients are all in bed, and if they see the physician coming though it kinder dis turbs them, and they want to talk with him. So I think it much better for them to remain away unless they are wanted. Q. Who is the supervisor of your ward? A. Mr. Jones. Q. He is not there during the night ? A. No, sir. Q. Where does he live ? A. He lives out of the asylum. Q. He is not there nights ? A. No, sir. By Mr. Haskell : Q. When you found that the medicine Dr. Pilgrim sent did not have any quieting effect upon Mr. Hughes, why did you not notify him again ? ^ A. I thought it was not necessary; when the first dose did not take effect, I supposed it would be useless to administer it any more to him. Q. So that after notifying the physician, you use your own judg- ment as to whether it is necessary or best to do it ? A. For the physician to come ? Q. Yes ; or sending again for medicine ? _ A. Well, we will simply notify the physician that a patient is sick. Q. And after notifying the physician once, you think yon have done your whole duty ? A. No, sir; if it is necessary, we send again. Q. But yon exercise your own judgment as to whether it is nec- essary or not to send again, after you have once sent? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do you not think that if Dr. Pilgrim had come and visited Mr. Hughes that night that he could have quieted him by medicine? A. I don't think he could. Q. What appeared to be the main hobby that Mr. Hughes dwelt upon ? A. On home, mostly. Q. Did he talk as though he thought he was then at home ? A. Yes, sir; I think he did ; he seemed as though he was talking with some persons ; he did not mention any names; sometimes he would speak in Welch, and sometimes in English ; he was saying that there was potatoes and apples in the kitchen, and that they could go and get them if they wanted them ; that is what he was talking about. Q. Is it a common occurrence on your ward for a patient to be awake and noisy ? A. Yes, sir. 60 Q. When a patient is awake and noisy, do you always notify the doctor ? A. Yes, sir. ., , Q. And do you ever notify the doctor a second time, it me patients keep up their being noisy and awake ? A. Yes, sir; we very often do. • .„ . Q. And notwithstanding the fact that you often do notity the doctor a second time in regard to some of the patients, you still say that the only reason that you did not notify him in regard to Mr. Hughes the second time, was because you did not think it necessary t A. Well, sir, that is a pretty strong question to answer, probably it was a fault of mine for not notifying him the second time, but 1 did not see that any thing could be done for him any further than what was done. Q. After the first occasion -when you put him in the covered bed? A. Yes, sir —no, sir; he was put on the covered bed before the doctor was notified ; the doctor sleeps in the center here. Q. How long after Hughes was pnt in the covered bed, before the doctor was notified ? A. Probably twenty minutes — from a quarter of an hour to twenty minutes; as soon as the other night watch came round; I told him he had better notify the doctor about it. Q. Was that before or after you had supper ? A. After. Q. Was he put in the covered bed before or after your supper? A. It was while I wras away at supper that he was put in the cov- ered bed. Q. Then you were not there present when he was put into the covered bed ? A. No, sir. / Q. Why did not Mr. Somers tell you to notify the doctor that he had put Mr. Hughes into the covered bed ? A. I don't know, it is probably a matter —he always goes 1o the physician and notifies him if there is any thing wrong in the dif- ferent halls, so that I let him go. Q. Why did he wait until you told him to go ? A. He was going his rounds in the other hall, and seeing that things were quiet; and I had to wait until he came round. Q. You say that Mr, Somers put Mr. Hughes into the covered bed while you wTere at supper, and that you did not know about it until you found him in the covered bed when you came back ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you know that he was going to put him in the covered bed when you went to supper ? A. No, sir. Q. The first you knew was that you found him in the covered bed? A. Yes, sir. 61 Q. And Somers did not inform the doctor until you called his attention to it, that he ought to ? A. No, sir ; he did not. Q. Did Somers say he had any difficulty in putting Mr. Hughes into the covered bed ? A. No, sir ; he went in very quietly, he said. Q. After you came back did Mr. Hughes ask to be let out of that ? A. No, sir. Q. You stated he was noisy ; did he talk very loud ? A. Yes, sir ; very loud ; you could hear him from one end of the hall to another. Q. There was no way that you could quiet him ? A. No, sir; I tried to reason with him the best I could, but he was so much disturbed that it did not seem to take much effect upon him. Q. Do you not think it would have been a good idea to have sent for the doctor and had him come and see if he could not do some- thing for him ; a new patient in a new place ? A. I don't know but it would have been a good idea. By Mr. Morgan : Q. Suppose the Hughes case were to be repeated with another patient, suppose a new patient is brought into the asylum, and the first night, after sleeping a while quietly, he becomes violent —,Mr. Hughes was violent, was he not? A. Well, that I don't know ; he was noisy, and what we call dis- turbed. Q. Greatly disturbed, was he not ? A. Well, considerably noisy. Q. If that case were to be repeated by another patient, would you be content with sending to a physician andfhis sending,]up a package of medicine for you to give the patient, would you be content with that if the patient continued disturbed ? A. I do not think I would ; I should notify him again. Q. Have you ever sent for a physician to come to your ward in the night ? A. Yes, sir ; very often. Q. Who did you send for? A. There is two physicians for the north side, and either one of them comes; Dr. Pilgrim and Dr. Backus are the physicians, and one of them two comes. Q. Have you ever sent for them when they have failed to re- spond ? A. No, sir; never. Q. What message do you send when you want the physician to come ? A. That he is wanted. Q. Do you report the fact that a patient is uneasy, or whatever 62 the fact is, and leave it to the physician's judgment as to whether he shall send medicine or come himself ? A. We leave it to his judgment. Q. You do not send and ask that he shall come, but you send the facts and let him use his own judgment as to whether he will come or not? A. Well, if the patient is sick, and it seems necessary for him to come and attend to them, he generally comes. # < Q. Then sometimes you suggest the propriety of the physician coming, and sometimes you simply report the fact that there is some disturbance or sickness, or whatever it is ? A. Yes. By the Chairman : Q. How often do you see Dr. Gray up there ; do you ever see him up thereat night? A. I have seen him up there, but not on my ward ; I have seen him passing through the halls to attend to sick patients and perform services that are required. Q. What time in the night? A. I have seen him there as late as twelve-o'clock several times, and sometimes between ----, well, whatever time, of course, he is called upon, but I never have seen him later than that. Q. And never have seen him on your ward ? A. No, sir. Q. How long have you been on your ward ? A. Since the 16th of last May. Q. Upon which of the wards were you engaged while you were here as a day attendant ? A. I was here as an " extra " for a long time, and I was about the different halls; I have been on and about wards three, eight and seven. Q. Now, during that time you say you were a day attendant for about a year ? A. Yes, sir; about a year or ten months. A. How many times during that space of time did you see Dr. Gray on your ward ? A. The exact amount I could not say because I have never kept any record of it. Q. Should you say it would be once in two or three weeks ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Would it be as often as that ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Oftener? A. I do not think it would be oftener than that. Q. Would you swear that there was any period of more than three weeks that he did not visit your ward ? A. I do not tink I would swear to that. 63 Q. Would you swear that he was there as often as once in every three or four weeks? A. I do not think I could. Q. Would you swear that he was there as often as once a month ? A. Yes, sir; I guess I could. Q. You think you can swear that he was there on the ward as often as once a month during the time you were there ? A. Of course there was times when I would be away, I could not tell how often he was on there then, and Sundays and half days when I would be off duty, and I would not be able to tell about such times as that. Q. I mean when you were there ; during the times that you were there, do you think you saw him as often as once a month during that year ? A. I don't think I could. Q. Would you swear that you saw him there once in every two months during that year ? A. I guess I could. Q. You would swear to that ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Can you swear you saw him as often as once in every six weeks during that year ? A. I don't know as to that. Q. But you will swear that he was there as often as once in every two months ? A. I think I could swear to that. .9* ^.° y°u tmnk that would fairly represent the number of his visits within your observation, about once in every two months? A. I think it would. Q. In what part of the building was that— what ward ? A. As I said, I have been on so many wards. Q. Now you are speaking of all the wards you were on ? A. Yes, sir. Q. During that time then you were in nearly all the wards in the house on the male side ? A. Pretty nearly. Q. When you left the hall where was Mr. Hughes ? A. He was still in the covered bed, I believe Q. And when you came back on duty that night, he was gone ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did he complain in the morning before you went away of any pain ? _ A. No, sir; I was not speaking to him, and I did not remove him from the covered bed in the morning ; the day men took him off. Q. Was he awake and talking when you went awray ? A. Yes. Q. Did he sleep any after he was put into the covered bed ? 64 A. He was a little quiet between five and six o'clock, but 1 don't think he slept any. Q. Did you hear any complaint of pain or injury ? A. No, sir. Q. When did you first hear that he had received an injury* A. When I came on duty the following night. Q. Who told you about it ? A. The day attendant on the hall. Q. On your hall? A. Yes, sir. Q. The attendant that worked on the hall where he received his injury ? A. No, sir. Q. Has any one talked with you in reference to your evidence in this case ; that is, any one connected with the asylum;_ have they talked with you in regard to the evidence you were to give ? A. No, sir. Q. You have not talked with Dr. Gray or any of the physicians ? A. No, sir. Q. Or any of the attendants ? A. No, sir, I made it a practice to keep by myself. By Mr. H askell : Q. Did you mention the fact to anybody that you had been sub- poenaed? A. I have to the attendants on the hall when your representa- tive gave it to me ; that night there was several standing by that see me get it, and I was asked about it. Q. Have you had any conversation with Dr. Pilgrim? A. In regard to the case ? Q. Yes, since you were subpoenaed ? A. No, sir. ' Q. Dr. Backus ? A. No, sir; I haven't spoken to any one. Q. Have you had any talk with Dr. Pilgrim at all since you were subpoenaed ? A. Upon business in regard to the hall, that is—notifying him him about patients, but nothing further. Q. Then you have seen Dr. Pilgrim to talk with him about other patients since you were subpoenaed ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And with Dr. Backus ? A. No, sir. Q. Where and when did you talk with Dr. Pilgrim? A. I talked to him last night, about a patient that was sick. Q. Did you go and see him? A. No, sir, he was on the hall then. Q. Have you talked with Mr. Dryer, the steward ? 65 A. No, sir, Q. Have you seen him ? A. I saw him this afternoon as#I came in. Q. Did you have any talk with him then ? A. No, sir. Q. And you have not had any conversation with any person con- nected with the asylum since you were subpoenaed about the fact of your having been subpoenaed ? A. No, sir, I haven't had any conversation further than with those that just asked me — those attendants — the night watch asked me was I subpoenaed, and I said yes; further than that I have had no conversation. By Mr. Morgan : Q. Is it a frequent occurrence for a patient to soil his bed at night ? A. Yes, sir, it is frequent. Q. What do you do in a case of that kind ? A. Simply take him up and change him, that is, change the sheets and put on clean linen. Q. You have to change the sheets in the room ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Have you ever known of an instance where a patient who has soiled his bed, and as a punishment has had it rubbed upon him ? A. No, sir, I have not known of that. Q. Did you ever hear of any thing of that kind ? A. No, sir, that would be nonsense to do that. Q. Have you ever seen them ,when mopping out or scouring the A. Yes, sir, I have been present when it was done when I was on day duty. Q. Have you ever known of a patient interfering with an attend- ant? A. No, sir, I do not recollect of any. Q. And have you known of any insult given by an attendant to a patient at that time ? A. No, sir, I do not recollect that I ever did. John Somers, sworn and examined, testified as follows: By Mr. Morgan : Q. Where do you reside when you are at home? A. Green street, near York, city of Utica. ^. What is your age ? A. I think — I am not quite certain — but 'I think it is forty- seven or forty-eight; I won't be certain. Q. What countryman are you? A. Born in Ireland. 9 U 66 Q. How long have you been in this country ? A. I will be here eight years the 14th of April coming.. Q. What was your business before you came to this country . A. My business was a carpentefc Q. How long have you been engaged in the asylum ? A. I came into this institution the 23d of May, 1876. Q. What was your employment when you first came here into the asylum ? A. I was employed as an attendant on the sixth ward ; as a day attendant. Q. What pay did you get then ? A. Twenty dollars a month for the first six months, and twenty- two the next; and, after a year I got twenty-four. Q. How much are you getting now ? A. Forty dollars a month, and board outside. Q. Are you now employed as night watchman ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What time do you go on duty ? A. At eight o'clock at night I go on to the wards. Q. What time do you leave in the morning ? A. Six o'clock. Q. What ward are you on ? A. I am general watchman for eleven wards; there is one ward where there is a night watchman stationed all night, the suicidal ward; that is the ninth ward. Q. What is his name? A. Mr. Mulherrin. Q. And your business is to patrol the institution ? A, Yes, sir. Q. And you commence at eight o'clock at night and close- at six o'clock in the morning ? A. Yes, sir. r- Q. When you come on to your duty, are not the patients usually in bed ? A. Yes, sir; the majority of them are in bed, except the patients in the hall. Q. State what your duties are; what do you have to do ? A. I have to make my rounds every hour through the wards, and any patient that is out of bed, or noisy, or sick, I have to see to them ; I have to see that all gas-lights are turned out at the proper hour, and see that all the water-faucets are closed. Q. What time does the gas have to be turned out ? A. The gas has to be turned out after the patients goes to bed ; as soon as they go to bed the gas is turned out to take the light away from the patients, but the gas is burning in the attendants' rooms; I think they go to bed at ten o'clock; I have also to watch and guard against fire, and the like of that, and be ever diligent for to see what will occur ; then we have to clean up the filthy men dur- ing the night; we have from thirty, thirty-five to forty filthy men that we clean up; twice during the night we have to take him and 67 clean him ; thirty-five or forty; we do that twice in the night, if a man makes a mess we take him to the bath-tub and clean him up. Q. And change his bed ? A. Change every thing; all that is mussed up. Q. Who assists you in doing that ? A. Mr. John Ferris; he is the night watchman in the center; he goes with me twice in the night to help me clean up these men. Q. Do yon notify him at the time to go? A. No, sir; he goes with me at night and we change these men; that is about mid- night; and we change them again about half-past three o'clock ; it takes us an hour or an hour and a quarter to go through with the filthy men and get them cleaned up. Q. How long does it take you to go the round of the eleven wards when you have cleaning up to do ? A. I should say twenty minutes or half an hour, according to what I have to do through the ward; if a man knocks to get a drink of water, or if I have to let him out to empty a vessel, or any thing, I can't tell how long it will take me, because I never timed it. Q. Suppose a patient calls for a drink of water, what do you do? A. I will take and get him a drink of water, or may be he will prefer to go himself, and then I go along with him and take him back to his room. Q. Are they allowed to have a tumbler or a goblet in the room ? A. In some wards they have, where they can know how to use them. Q. Where the patients can be trusted ? A. Yes, sir; in some wards they have a mug. Q. But in the wards where the vicious are they do not have them ? A. No, sir; because you might get one of them in the forehead when you would go into their room, you know. Q. Do you ever have the patients barricade the door ? A. Sometimes we do. Q. What do you then do in a case of that kind ? A. Coax them and try to get them away. Q. Do you always succeed? A. Pretty much always. Q. If you do not succeed, what do you do? a A. If we do not succeed, we would go and report the occurrence to the officer in charge of the north side, one of the doctors; we should not report that to a supervisor; he would come out to the ward himself; he would see and get it taken away. Q. But you generally succeed in coaxing them to do it? A. Yes; but sometimes, may be, we would have to send for a carpenter to cut the door and get the barricade away. Q. How do they barricade them ? t A. Sometimes they barricade the door with their bedsteads, some- times they put a bureau, and sometimes they will put a bureau and the bedstead as well. Q. And then it is effectually barricaded ? 68 A. Yes, sir. „ , Q. Were you upon the ninth ward on the night that Mr. Hughes was there, the first night he spent there? A. Yes, sir. Q. Who put him into the covered bed? A. I did. Q. Why did you do that ? A. Because he would not stop in bed. Q. What seemed to be the trouble with him ? What disturbed him? A. I could not say only he would not stop inr bed ; he was not speaking much at the time, and when he did speak I did not understand the language he talked in ; he said it was Welsh. Q. He talked Welsh a good deal, did he not ? A. Yes, sir. Q. When you put him into the covered bed, did you have any trouble getting him in there. A. No, sir Q. What did you say to him ? A. I told him that if he would not stop in bed, we would have to put him in the covered bed, so that he would have a good sleep, and be fresh in the morning. Q. What did he say to that ? A. He did not answer me. Q. When you said he must go into the covered bed, what was done ? A. He said he would go, or he did not say any thing to me, but he went as soon as I came out of the dormitory and came into the day- room he would come out after me; I would no sooner have the lantern set down on the table than Mr. Hughes would be out after me ;-I took another man out of the covered bed and I said : Now Mr. Hughes you get in there ; he got in and I locked him down. Q. There was another man that vou took out of the covered bed? A. Yes, sir. Q. And put Mr. Hughes into that bed ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What did you do with the man you took out of of the cov- ered bed ? A. I put him into the open bed. Q. Into Mr. Hughes bed ? A. Yes, sir. Q. After you got Mr. Hughes into the covered bed, what did he do? A. By this time Mr. Mulherrin came on duty again ; I was there to relieve him when he went to his supper; I was not long there, about three-quarters of an hour. Q. When did yon next see Mr. Hughes ? A. The next time was between twelve and one o'clock; then when I was on my rounds looking up the other men, when I was coming up stairs, Mr. Mulherrin called my attention to that state 69 that Mr. Hughes was in, that he was very noisy and that I had bet- ter see the doctor. Q. Did you go and see the doctor ? A. Yes, sir; I did ; I went to see Dr. Backus. Q. What did you say to him ? A. I told him that Mr. Hughes was noisy. Q. Was that all you said to him ? A. That is all; I said he was noisy. Q. Did you tell him you had had to put him into the covered bed? A. I did not; because, on that ninth ward, at the time Dr. Josselyn was there, he told us any man that would not stop in bed on the ninth ward, we could take a quiet man out of a covered bed and put the man in that was making trouble. Q. So that you put him into the covered bed without any other than that general direction ? A. Yes, sir. Q. When you reported to Dr. Backus, you simply told him that Mr. Hughes was noisy ? Q. What did Dr. Backus say? A. He prescribed some medicine for him and I carried it into the covered bed. Q. Did he get up and get the medicine ? A. He did get up in his room and get the medicine. Q. Do you know what he gave him ? A. No, sir; I don't know what medicine he gave ; I don't know ; one medicine from another. Q. How was it put up to give to him ? A. Out of a little cup with some water; I gave it to him accord- '• ing to the doctor's directions. Q. Did he give you a powder ? A. No powder; it was some liquid medicine, you know, and I gave it to him in some water and he drank it. Q. Did you have any trouble in getting him to drink it ? A. No, sir; he sat up half ways in a covered bed and he drank it and laid down, and that is all I know about Mr. Hughes. Q. Did you raise the cover of the bed wmen you gave it to him ? A. Certainly ; I opened it and he took tire medicine. Q. Did he make any complaint because J^^gave that to him ? A. No; he took it and drank it everyJf.rop. Q. Why didn't you ask Dr. Backus t^gp^up iAd see him ? A.I did not; if a man is merely now kfn! sijHng, or any thing like that, the doctor will send them ujrWjethmg to keep them quiet; but if he was violent or sick the* doctor would come. Q. Did Mr. Hughes make any complaint of pain to you ? A. No, sir. Q. Could you understand his talk after he got into bed ? A. No, sir, I could not; I did not know what he was saying. 70 Q. Do you know of cases where patients have been violent in the night ? A. Oh, yes, I have. Q. In that case what do you do ? A. The doctor would come and see them. Q. How is it reported ? . . A. Some one reports to the doctor that such a man was violent and he would go and see him. Q. Did you ever know of a case in which the doctor refused to go, or did not go ? . A. No, sir, never; the doctor was always willing to jump right out of bed and come along. Q. When the doctor comes to see a man has he ever said to you that you might have got along without calling him—the doctor ? A. No, sir"; never said a word of that kind. Q. Or ever make any complaint ? A. No, sir; never heard the doctor make any complaint, and I have awakened them as much as four or five or six times in the night. Q. Did you ever hear any of the patients complain that the doc- tor ought to come and see them ? A. No, sir; I would not hear them make any such complaint; some of them will tell me I have no right to keep them ; that I should open the door and let them out. Q. You don't obey them, of course? A. No, sir; I guess not. Q. Since you have been here, have you known of attendants being discharged ? A. I have known of attendants going away and it would be re- ported that they would be discharged and some one would say that they went away themselves; but I don't know, t can't say about that. Q. Do you know of any attendants that have been here since you have been here, that you thought have not been doing their duty! A. I could not exactly say as to that because it would not be my place to say to an attendant that he was not doing his duty. Q. You could tell whether he was not doing his duty ? A. As far as I could understand some of them would be a little careless, and some ojtfbm would be not-so. Q. Have you jdfcr^vttSbiessed any injury to a patient since you have been here ImL. t % A. No, sir; tJHpef'tliie'mly injury that I have known of since I have been hereJy * \-'J"f Q. You were not present when this occurred ? A. I was not, doctor.' Q. Have there been any cases that you have observed where any of the attendants have neglected their duty since you have been here? A. I cannot say that I do, doctor. 71 Q. Do you know of any case where an attendant has been away from duty when they ought to have been on duty ? A. I always see them attending to their duties, and they are in the house, that is, when I see them. Q. Can you explain to us why it is that 'the attendants that are discharged from the institution all of them complain that there is harsh treatment by the other attendants ? A. I don't know ; I never could see any thing; I don't think I ever saw an attendant treat a patient harshly, nor abuse them, or pound them. Q. Never since you have been here ? A. Never, sir. Q. Have you ever seen struggles between attendants and patients where an attendant undertook to have a patient go to bed, or sit down or keep still, where they have to struggle ? > A. I have not; because where I was first put upon it was the sixth ward when I came here, and that is a quiet ward ; the seventh ward also was a quiet ward, and I was also upon that, and on the suicidal ward; of course there was other wards and we were not allowed to visit from one ward to another ; so that I could not tell what went on in another ward. Q. The fourth ward is the most violent ward in the asylum ? A. Yes, sir. Q. In your traveling around during the night on duty do you ever have any struggles with the patients ? A. I might say not much ; of course when we get a man kinder ugly taking him out of bed to clean him up, you have to take hold of him with another man to help you clean him up ; sometimes they are ugly. Q. And they sometimes resist you, do they ? A. Yes, sir. Q. When they resist, I suppose you use sufficient force to over- come their resistance ? A. Why, we put them in bed again. (Q. Repeated.) A. You have to use strength enough to put them into bed. Q. Has there every been any complaint that you have been too harsh with a patient ? A. I have not heard anybody say so. Q. Have you ever been called before Dr. Gray ? A. No, sir ; never. Q. Have you ever been called to account for any act you have done here ? J A. No, sir ; never. Q. There never has been any investigation against you? A. No, sir ; never to my knowledge or belief. Q. When you sought a situation here in the institution, what did you do ? 72 A. I came here and applied for a situation. Q. To whom did vou apply ? A. To Mr. Dyrer. Q. Did you have any recommendation from any friends ? A. Yes, sir. Q. From whom? A. I had recommends with me from Canada. Q. From any asylum ? A. Yes, sir ; Joseph Workman- from the asylum at Toronto. Q. Had you been employed there? A. Yes, sir ; I was there about a year and a half. Q. When you applied to Mr. Dryer to a situation, what did he say or do ? A. He told me that my " testimonies " were very satisfactory; I showed him two or three ; he said they were very satisfactory ; he said he would let me know in a couple of weeks whether he would give me a place or not, and he sent for me and gave me the place ; he sent up by word of mouth. Q. Who did he send ? A. He sent word by John Graham, the fireman of the institu- tion. Q. And then you came to work ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What then occurred ? A. Then he put me onto the ward. Q. Was there something said about wages ? A. Of course; he did not say any thing about wages only that I would get twenty dollars for the first six months, twenty dollars for the next six months and then twenty-four dollars. Q. Provided you discharged your duties satisfactorily ? A. Yes, sir, Q. Did you talk with Dr. Gray any before you entered upon the discharge of your duties ? A. No, sir. Q. Was there any examination or inquiry made about your habits ? A. No, sir; nothing. Q. Didn't they ask you if you were in the habit of getting intoxi- cated ? A. No; I had " testimonies " that might satisfy any person in the State that I was not in the habit of getting intoxicated; I had some of the best recommends in Canada. Q. Have you a family ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Where do they live ? A. Green street. Q. You remain at home during the day ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And return here at night ? 73 A. Yes, sir. Q. Have you ever heard any of the patients complain of unkind treatment or neglect by the attendants? A. Sometimes you would hear them complaining about the at- tendants. Q. Have you ever had occasion to report of an attendant to Dr. Gray, Dr. fjrush, or Dr. Pilgrim ? A. No, sir. Q. Never occasion to report of an attendant as inefficient ? A. I have made a report about them leaving the doors open ; I would report that to the doctor. Q. Have you ever reported an attendant as inefficient; not doing his duty ? A. I never have, because there is the supervisor here; if he sees a man that does not do his duty it will be his place to report to the doctor, and then the man would be seen by the doctor; it is the supervisors, duty to report that. Q. Suppose you should find an attendant that you were satisfied that he had not done his duty, what would he do ? A. I don't know. Q. You never had a case of that kind ? A. No, sir; I have not. Q. Have you ever seen attendants under the influence of liquor ? A. I did once. Q. Who was he ? A. I forget his name. Q. Did you do any thing in reference to that ? A. Yes, sir ; I went and "reported that. Q. Who to? A. Dr. Josselyn. Q. What was the result ? A. He was discharged. Q. How long ago was that ? A. I think it was last winter. Q. Do you think they would permit a man to remain here as an attendant who got intoxicated ? A. They would not, or any man who comes in the institution the worse for liquor, he is reported, either by me or the other man, who is at the door, the other night watchman and then that man would be discharged in the morning. Q. There has been a good many discharged within the eight years in which you have been here for intoxication, have there not ? A. There have been two or three ; I cannot say exactly how many. Q. Do you know of any attendants being absent from the asylum building without permission ? A. No, sir. Q. Do you know of a case where an attendant has been dis- charged for that reason ? 10U 74 A. There was a man who went out without leave one evening; he stopped out about an hour or an hour and a half, and tliey dis- charged him for it. Q. Do they enforce .he rules here very strictly ? A. Yes, sir; they do. , , Q. And have you ever known of a person violating the rules that those who knew of it did not report such persons ? A. No, sir; I do not. Q. Have you ever had an attendant approach you and say he did not want you to report them? A. No, sir; I do not remember any. Q. Never had an occasion of that kind ? A. No, sir; an attendant would let me know any thing. ; Q. Mr. Hughes was removed from that ward, was he not ? A. So I heard ; I was not here. Q. On the night following, did yon see Mr. Hughes ? A. I did. , Q. Where was he then ? A. He was on the eighth ward; that was on the night follow- ing ; that was the night after he was injured; he was injured on the fourth ward. Q. Then after he received his injuries he was taken onto the eighth ward ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you see him on the fourth ward ? [ A. I did not. Q. He was on the ninth ward when you put him in the covered bed ? • A. Yes, sir. Q. What day did he come to the asylum ? A. It was the 25th January; that was the first night he was in the building. Q. And that night you put him in the covered bed ? A. Yes, sir. Q. On the 26th he was taken to the fourth ward ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And it was on that day that he received his injury ? A. Yes. Q. And then he was taken to the eighth ward ? A. Yes, sir. Q. It was on the next day after he came that he was injured? A. Yes, sir. Q. Why was he taken onto the eighth ward ? A. Because it is a quiet place. Q. That is a quiet ward compared with the others ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What was being done with him when you saw him on the eighth ward ? A. He was lying in bed. Q. Who was with him ? 75 A. Dr. Gray was in with him, and Dr Backus and Dr. Pilgrim. Q. What time did you see Dr. Gray there ? A. I think it was between nine and ten o'clock; Dr. Gray has been up there several nights with him afterward; I see him there at about eleven o'clock. Q. What was Dr. Gray doing when you saw him there ? A. He was examining him and giving him nourishment. Q. Could you understand any of the talk of Mr. Hughes « A. No, sir; he talked Welsh. Q. Did he appear to be in a great deal of distress ? A. He did not appear so to me; but I could not tell; I am not a physician, and of course I don't know. Q. You saw him on that eighth ward several times after the injury? A. Yes, sir. Q. How long did he remain on the eighth ward ? A. I think he died on the Saturday or Friday forenoon. Q. He died the next Friday or Saturday, as he was injured on the Saturday previous ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How soon after his injury was it before you saw his son here ? A. 1 won't be certain what day it was that I saw him, because I took no note of it. Q. Was Mr. Hughes uneasy after the injury ? A. I did not hear him; there was a man sat up with him in the ;E room all the time after he received his injuries, and until he died. By Mr. Haskell : Q. That you saw Mr. Hughes, when you got the medicine ; did " you see him again that night; were you'in the ninth ward again that night ? "& A. I was. Q. Was Mr. Hughes still noisy ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Why did you not report the fact to the doctor that he was still noisy, and that the medicine had not done him any good ? A. I did not report the second time. Q. Why didn't you ? * A. We'll, I did not do it. i! Q. Were you in there more than once that night ? A I was in there back and forward; but I was not in the room with him, because the other night watchman was with him all the tune. Q. Did you hear him every time you came in ? A. I can't say now ; I took the notes from the watchman in the ) morning; he reported him at twelve, one, two, three and four o clock noisy and awake ; at five o'clock I entered them in the note book. 76 Q. You say that on the ninth ward, with reference to those pa- tients that Dr. Josselyn told you what to do about putting them into covered beds ? . , , A. I say if they would not stop in bed, I was to do ™ax. Q. Did Dr. Josselyn tell you that you might put patients into the covered bed without informing him ? ^ A. Yes, sir; them that would not stay in bed. Q. When was that ? A. Some time ago; six months ago. Q. Was Dr. Josselyn here six months ago ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Is he here now ? A. No, sir ; he is not here now. # Q. Is that done on the other wards ? A. No, sir ; we do not put a man in a covered bed unless by the doctor's orders; unless it is on the suicidal ward; and that was the first ime I ever put a man into a covered bed without an order; and if that order had not been given some time before, I would have gone and seen the doctor first; I should have gone and ask the doctor what to do about such a man, that he would not stop in bed, and then he would tell us to put him in the covered bed. Q. How often do yon go to a physician and get permission to put a man into a covered bed. A. It is according to when it would be necessary. Q. Hew often does that occur ? A. Not very often. Q. Once or twice a week ? A. No, sir; sometimes, not often; but sometimes more often than at others. Q. And you say that the doctor told you to put them into the covered bed whenever they are noisy and disturbed ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How long ago is it since you were promoted to be night- watchman ? A. It will be six years in August. Q. Then during the years 1876 and 1877, you were a day attend- ant ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And you were employed on wards six and seven ? " A. Yes, sir. 'Q. During that time who were the physicians besides Dr. Gray? A. There was Dr. Andrews and Dr. Livingstone; they were phy- sicians when I was promoted to be night watch here. Q. They were here during the time you were here as . a day at- tendant ? a ^/ pg sir. Q." How often would Dr. Gray come through the wards that you were an attendant upon ? A. Several times ; I cannot say how many. 77 Q. Several times during the two years? A. Yes, sir; I knew of him coming several times on the first ward, but I could not say how many. Q. How often would Dr. Andrews be up on the wards? A. A couple of times a day; sometimes three times in a day. Q. And at stated hours he would be on the wards without being sent for ? A. Oh, yes, sir ; he often came into the wards in the evening. Q. Did Dr. Andrews make a practice of being in the wards at least twice a day ? A. Yes, sir; on the wards that I was on. Q. Who was the other physician ? A. Dr. Livingstone ; there was him and Dr. Andrews; they were there every day, I should say; of course sometimes I might be out in the garden or on the farm, and then I could not say how often they would be on at that time. Q. Then your duties took you on to the farm sometimes? A. Yes, I took the patients, out to work sometimes, after the work was done in the wards. Q. How many other attendants were there on the ward at that time ? A. There would be four, that is, four regular attendants and the supervisor. Q. How many patients? A. Twenty-three or twenty-five ; perhaps thirty; I could not say how many there were. Q. And sometimes you used to take the patients out ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you ever take the patients out walking ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you go alone when you took the patients out walking ? A. No; other attendants would go with me, sometimes four or five. Q. Did you make up a detail of patients from the different wards and take them out ? >' A. Yes, sir; there would be a man from each ward and from some wards there would be two or three go. Q. Dr. Gray did not have any regular times for coming on to the wards ? ♦ A. No, sir ; I don't think he had but I cannot say about that? Q. You did see him occasionally on the wards ? A. Yes, sir; frequently. Q. Did he come on to the wards on the occasion of the visit to the asylum of the board of managers? A. I see him go through with nobody but himself sometimes; none of the managers with him, nobody but himself. Q. Would he be there on the wards as often as once in three or four months ? A. I can't answer that question. 78 Q. How often do the managers of the institution go through the wards of the asylum ? A. They used to go through here when they came and sometimes they would not; that was at their meetings. Q. What meetings do you refer to ? A. When they had their meetings here for business. Q. How often in the year do they meet here for business ? A. I cannot tell you that. Q. Would there be one of the managers or more than one ? A. The whole board of them sir ; four or five together. Q. During the two years that you were on the wards, do you think they were in there as often as twice in each year ? A. Yes, sir ; I think they were. Q. Do you think they wTere there any oftener? A. I could not say how many times they would be there. Q. Do you think they were there more than once in a year ? A. I would not swear 1ijw often ; because a man that is doing his work, why he don't have much time to pay attention to managers going through ; he is doing his work and he don't look for them. Q. Do you know the board of managers by sight ? A. Some I do and some I do not; I know Mr. Anderson, but he is about the only man I do know; I was taking care of his brother George B. Anderson, and that is all I know about him ; he was in here. Q. What is the difference between the pauper patient and a pay patient ? A. In what way do you mean ? Q. In any way ? A. ]Sl ot any that we know about. Q. You never notice any difference ? A. No, sir. Q. The pauper patients and pay patients receive the same food, do they ? A. Yes, sir; the same food and the same table ; I don't know much about that. Q. Could you tell the difference between the patients; which were pay patients or otherwise ? A. No, sir; sometimes we would hear that such and such a man was pay patient, and that such a man was county patient. Q. You could only tell from what you heard « A. That is all. J Q. Do you know how much the pay patients were paying ? A. No, sir; I don't know any thing about that. Q. When did you hear or learn of Mr. Hughe's being injured« A. When I returned, Saturday night. Q. Who told you about it ? A. I heard it 'in the ward. Q. Do you recollect who told you ? A. Yes, sir; the attendants on the fourth ward. 79 Q. What are their names ? A. I believe it was Mr. Brown and Mr. Weir ; I cannot remem- ber which ; I was speaking to them all about the occurrence. Q. Then you did not learn of it from Mr. Brown or Mr. Weir first? A. I learned there was an accident before I saw them ; the doctor was the first one that told me of the accident, when I came in to receive orders. Q. Which doctor ? A. Dr. Pilgrim ; he told me that Mr. Hughes had happened an accident. Q. That was the manner that Dr. Pilgrim expressed it ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did he tell you how serious an accident it was? A. Yes, sir; he did ; he said he had his jaw fractured, or some thing like that. Q. What did he say about his ribs? A. He said his ribs were hurted bad. Q. Broken? A. He said the ribs were fractured bad. Q. Did he say that he thought that he was not going to live ? A. He did not; a physician don't say any thing like that to me. Q. From whom did yoti first learn that he would probably die? A. I didn't hear anybody say any such thing at all. Q. Until after.he was dead? A. No, sir. Q. You didn't hear there was any danger of his dying until he was dead ? A. Well, I thought myself that he looked poorly. Q. Was the fact of his having been hurt on the ward a matter of general talk in the asylum ? A. It was talked among the attendants around in the ward ; they talked about it several times. Q. Did they say it was any thing very serious? A. That I could not tell. Q. Did they think there was any thing wrong about his being hurt on the ward A. I can't say. Q. Did they talk with you ? A. They talked and told how that they were sorry for the man's getting hurted. Q. Did you hear anybody blame the attendants ? A. No, sir. ■ Q. Did anybody speak as if it were the attendants' fault ? A. No, sir; not as I heard ; I didn't hear anybody say any such thing. Q. Didn't they feel sorry for the attendants ? A. Yes, sir; sorry for the attendants as well as for him. Q. Because they had got into trouble? 80 A. Yes, sir ; I heard some of them said they was sorry for the boys getting into trouble. ^r TT . Q Who did thev seem most sorry for —Mr. Hughes or the boys ? A. More for Mr. Hughes than thev was for the boys. Q. You hoard them speak of being more sorry for Mr. Hughes than they were for the bovs ? A. They were sorry for Mr. Hughes and sorry for the boys, that the thing had occurred. Q. You did not hear anybody blame the boys ? A. I could not say that I ever did. Q. Did you have'any talk with Dr. Pilgrim at any time, except- ing the first night, about Mr. Hughes being injured, or about his injuries? A. I might say I did not. Q. Did you talk at any time with Dr. Backus ? A. I did not; I had nothing to do with the man at all; they did not give me any orders about it because there was a man sitting up there with him; Dr. Pilgrim told me the first night about the acci- dent occurring. Q. Did he give you any orders in regard to Mr. Hughes the first night ? , A. No, sir. Q. He merely mentioned the fact that there had been an injury ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Tell me every thing Dr. Pilgrim said about it? A. I have told you ; I cannot tell you any more unless I told yon what wasn't so. Q. You have told all that he said; did he tell you what ward Mr. Hughes was hurt on ? A. Yes, sir; he told me on the fourth ward. Q. Did he say who had hurt him ? A. He did not, because the}' could not find out then. Q. Did he say he could not find out ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did he state that he had tried to find out the cause ? A. At that time he did not know how it occurred. Q. Did he say he did not know ? A. I don't know ; when I came in Dr. Pilgrim told me there was an accident; he told me Mr. Hughes was hurt, and that he was sorry for it. Q. You think that was all he said ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did he not tell you that it was on the fourth ward ? A. Yes, sir; I said sir, didn't I ? Q. Now start in and repeat all he said. 81 A. I have started and I have told you all I know about it, and what he told me. Q. Now, tell me over again and say what you said, and give me the entire conversation that passed between you and Dr. Pilgrim, about Mr. Hughes getting hurt ? A. Dr. Pilgrim told me that Mr. Hughes had happened an ac- cident on the fourth ward. Q. What did you say ? A. I stated. Q. Didn't he tell you where he was hurt ? A. He told me about it; and that is that his jaw was fractured and ribs was fractured and hurted bad. Q. What did you say ? A. I didn't say any thing, only that I was sorry for it happening as same as any of the rest would be. Q. What did he say — any more than that ? A. No, sir. Q. Didn't he say he was sorry it happened ? A. Yes, sir; he was sorry it happened, too. Q. Did he tell you then that he did not know how it happened ? A. I don't know; I can't say. Q. Was there any thing said about your speaking about the fact of there having been an accident and about your not telling it out- side the institution that there had been an accident ? A. No, sir. Q. Didn't he say any thing about that — that you had better not speak about it outside the institution ? A. No, sir; I see that in the paper. Q. Did you see it in the paper before you came to the asylum that night ? r r j j A. No, sir. Q. There was nothing in the newspapers about Mr. Hughes be- ing injured until several days after that, was there ? A. I can't say ; I don't know. Q. Didn't he tell you that it was not best to speak about it then until they saw how serious the accident was going to be, or any thing of that kind ? A. Not a solitary word ; no, sir. Q. Is there a rule or regulation in the asylum that prohibits your speaking outside of any thing that happens'in the asylum ? A. I never heard of any such rule. Q. Never heard of any such thing as that ? A. No, sir. Q. Are not you and the other attendants cautioned about talking outside of what happens in the asylum ? A. We are cautioned nothing of the kind ; what sort of a man would it be that would do that ? Do you think I would go and talk about what goes on here ? You would not go outside and tell peo 11U 82 pie what happens in the Legislature, would you ? Of course a man wouldn't do any such thing as that any way. Q. Is it not understood to be a rule that the attendants shall not talk about what happens in the asylum outside on the streets i A. No, sir. . . Q. Do they caution you about not mentioning the names of patients who are in the institution. A. No, sir. Q. Then you are at perfect liberty to go out and tell what is going on in the institution and what patients are here ? A. What sort of a man would it be that would go out and talk about what goes on ? Q. And it is left to the individual choice of any man whether he shall tell outside what he sees in the institution, and who is here and all about it? A. No, sir ; I don't know. Q. You never heard that matter spoken of by anybody ? A. No, sir. Q. When visitors are going through the asylum during the day- time you are permitted to, and there is no rule forbidding you to mention the names of patients to them ? A. No, sir. Q. No such rule in the institution ? A. No, sir ; as far as I know. Q. And as far as you know you are at liberty to mention the names of patients ? A. I can't say about that. Q. Do you know of any rule that prevents your mentioning the names of patients to visitors ? A. No, sir. Q. With regard to this injury to Mr. Hughes — do you think yon were at liberty, if you chose to, to make it known on the street that a man had his jaw and rib fractured on the fourth ward ? A. I don't know; I could not say. Q. Do you think it would have displeased Dr. Gray and the other officials of the asylum if you had done so ? A. That is a thing I cannot, because I don't know. Q. You would not have done it ? A. I don't think I would have; but I don't know whether it would displease the physicians or not. Q. Was there any thing said to you about what you should say in answer to these questions ? A. No, sir; not one solitary word. Q. Have you had any conversation with any of the members of the institution in regard to the investigation ? A. No, sir. Q. When did you first know that you were likely to be sub- poenaed ? A. I did not know any thing about it until I was subpoenaed. 83 Q. Do you recollect who told you that there was to be an inves- tigation ? A. I don't know; it was in the paper; they said there was going to be an investigation. Q. Have you not heard anybody interested ? A. No, sir. Q. Have not the attendants spoken about it among themselves? A. They knew about as much about it as I did ; it was in the paper that a committee was coming from Albany to make the in- vestigation. Q. Have you heard any of the doctors or the steward speak about it ? A. No, sir. Q. When did Mr. Hughes die — what time in the day ? A. I think it was in the evening; I was in the asylum at the time and I helped to carry him out to the dead-house. Q. Have you ever read the printed rules hanging on the walls, and the rule contained therein about not giving visitors the names of any patients ? A. I don't know that I have. Q. You have sworn that you have never heard of any such rule? A. And I never did. By Mr. Olin : Q. Were you examined before the coroner's jury ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Have you been examined at any time by anybody else touch- ing the management of the asylum ? A. No, sir. By Mr. Haskell : Q. You never here say any thing about what happened to Mr. Hughes, as to who was to blame ? A. No, sir. Q. Have you handled any violent patients ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do you not. think you could have quieted this man without injuring him ? A. Well, I have handled a good many violent patients, and I know how to handle pretty good, but I cannot say that I could have done it any better; I cannot exactly tell you how it was done, you know ; I can handle a patient pretty good myself. Q. Do you think it was necessary to strike that man in the face ? A. I don't think it was; I think it was very wrong to strike the man's face. Q. Do you think there was any thing out of the way to hit him in the stomach ? A. Why of course it is not right to hit a man in the stomach ; 1 84 would not like to get hit in the stomach myself, and I don't think you, the learned counsel, would like it yourself. Q. Do you understand that one of the attendants struck him with his clenched fist ? A. I have seen it in the paper. - Q. Did you hear any criticism of their conduct ? A. I heard some of the boys criticise them. Q. Did you hear Dr. Pilgrim say any thing about it ? A. No, sir. Q. He stated that he was sorry for them, did he not ? A. Yes, sir; he said he was sorrv about it, as I said to you. _ Q. Did you ever see any unkind"treatment of patients by either of those three attendants, Brown, Weir or Bills? A. No, sir; because I never see those men in the daylight, it is only at night that I am there you know. .""^Alexander Barrisdale, sworn, testified as follows: Examined by Mr. Morgan : Q. What is your age ? A. Forty-eight. Q. Where do you reside ? A. Utica; in the asylum. Q. Are you married ? A. No, sir. Q. How long have you been an attendant in the asylum ? A. Nearly twenty years. Q. When you first came here, what were your duties ? A. My duties was the same as any other attendants. Q. You were an attendant ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Upon what ward did you go when you first came here ? A. No. 4 at that time, we calT it No. 2 now ; that is it was No. 4 then, but No. 2 now; I came on to No. 2 in the first place. Q. What are your duties now ? A. Supervisor; my duties is to pass the medicine, communicate with the doctors, and see that the patient is properly clothed ; and to keep the attendants' time ; see that the attendants remain at their duty in each ward, and remains in their proper place. Q. How long have you been supervisor ? A. Since 1868. Q. What time do you have to go upon duty in the morning ? A. I arise at the ringing of the bell in the morning — six o'clock. Q. And what time are you released from your duty ? A. I can't say that I am released from duty at any time while I am in the institution, at all. Q. There is a time when you are permitted to go to bed, is there not, when you may be said to be relieved from duty for the day ? 85 A. Oh, yes, sir; nine o'clock; or ten o'clock, just as I think proper. Q. When you retire, who takes your place ? A. The watchman. Q. The night watchman ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Is there a night watchman on each ward ? A. No, sir ; there is not. Q. How many night watchmen do they have ? A. There are three on the north side, Mr. Somers, Mr. Mulherrin and Mr. Ferris. Q. Now, in the performance of your duty, you watch and keep an eye upon the attendants, do you not ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And see that they perform their duty ? A. Yes sir; to see that they do it properly. Q. Have you had any instances where you have found that at- tendants did not properly attend to their duty ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Take it within the line to which your attention is called, what attendants have you had that did not properly attend to their duty ? A.- I cannot state any now ; in the last year with the exception of those three that the — Q. You mean Weir, Brown and Bills ? A. Yes, sir. < Q. You do not remember any others at present that have been discharged for inefficiency, or intoxication, or any other reason ? A. I do not really remember any at this time. Q. Have you had occasion to report any attendants to Dr. Gray, or to any of your superiors ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Within the last year have you had such occasion ? A. I could not remember that I have had since the last year. Q. Well, you speak of some case — what was the trouble that made it necessary to report that attendant to Dr. Gray ? A. There was one case for intoxication, but I do not remember how long it is ago. Q. You reported that to Dr. Gray ? A. It was reported to the head officers. Q. Who did you report to ? A. He was reported by the night watch in the first place. Q. To you? A. No, sir ; I believe he reported to Dr. Jocelyn, and he was dis- charged ; he was under my supervision at that time. Q. Do you know of any case of an attendants' being off from duty without permission — away from the asylum, without permis- sion ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What was done in that case? 86 A. That calls to my mind an attendant that was discharged for going out without permission ; his name was John Sage. Q. When was that ? . A. This present winter. Q. Was he discharged ? A. Yes, sir. , . Q. Do you know of any case where men have violated the rules, when they have been excused from that violation, and continued in the service of the institution ? A. Yes, sir; I remember such cases, but I cannot repeat who they were. Q. Do you know what the offense was ? A. No, sir. Q. Do you know that there have been cases where men have violated the rules and been returned ? A. Yes, sir; it was excused by explaining the matter. Q. Can you give any instance ? A. I cannot. Q. Does it frequently occur that attendants have difficulty with the patients ? A. The attendants have had difficulty on the fourth ward with the patients struggling with them, etc. Q. Do you know of any instance where the patient has received any injury of any kind — an injury through a struggle with an at- tendant, for instance? A. No, sir. Q. Do you know of any case where a patient has received an in- jury from an attendant other than this Hughes case? A. I know one case. Q. What one was that ? A. That was some years ago. Q. How long? A. A good many years ago. Q. What was that ? A. An attendant struck a patient on the arm with a club. Q. What was the result of that ? A. He was discharged. Q. Have you known of any case where a patient was injured by an attendant within the last five years ? A. No, sir. Q. Not any ? A. No, sir. Q. None ever came to your knowledge ? A. No, sir. Q. How were the men Weir, Bills and Brown as to their effi- ciency as attendants prior to this Hughes matter ? A. I looked on the three attendants as very good men, for any thing I ever see. Q. How were they as to temper ? 87 A. I never see either of the three men — in the first place, I wish to say that they have only been under my supervision since the middle of June last; I never see either of the men what I could say, "out of temper," when they injured a patient. Q. Have you ever known of their having any difficulty with any patient but Mr. Hughes ? A. No, sir; not any; only this—they may have some scuffle — some trouble with a patient; scuffle or struggle, but no injury. Q. No injury ? A. No, sir. Q. Did you ever know of either one of them striking a patient before Hughes ? A. No, sir. Q. Where were you at the time of the struggle between Hughes and Brown and Weir ? * A. On the first ward, I was. Q. How far is that from the fourth ward ? A. There is only two other wards between. Q. Who was the supervisor of the fourth ward ? A. I am, and I was at that time. Q. Do you pass from one ward to another ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And you were away from the fourth ward when this occur- red; now what was the first notice vou had of any difficulty with Mr. Hughes? A. The first notice I had was that I knew a patient had — Mr Weir came and reported him to me that he had been violent and very excited. Q. What did you do ? A. I learned that Dr. Backus was on the wards making his rounds, and I found him on the twelfth ward, and reported the case to him; and I went right down to the fourth ward. Q. When you got there what did you find? A. I found Mr. Hughes sitting in a chair with a belt around him. Q. That is, a leather belt ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Was he strapped to the chair ? A. Yes. Q. When you and Dr. Backus got there what did yon do ? A. Dr. Backus went and spoke to him, and I believe he seen blood on his lips, or somewhere round him, and so he examined his mouth ; he called my attention to his jaws, that it was broke. Q. Describe the jaw, will yon, by putting your hand to your jaw; describe the manner in which it was broken ? A. It was broken pretty near the center, a little to the right of the center ; just above here (indicating). Q. A complete fracture of the jaw ? A. It seemed to be loose when Dr. Backus called my attention to it. J 88 Q. So that it would separate? , A. I could not say as for that, I know Dr. Backus called my attention to it. Q. Describe all that was done when you and Dr. Backus found him? A. When we went down in the first place we found the strap around him, and Dr. Backus examined the jaw, and he returned to the office, here, I presume, to"report to Dr. Gray, or some of the officers; and I returned to number one, and went into my room for a few minutes. Q. Who did you leave in charge of Mr. Hughes at the time you . went away, as you have stated ? A. Mr. Weir and Mr. Brown, they were on the ward there at the time. Q. What had become sir> sorae of ^ 5 I used to live in Morrisville and I knew Mr. Hughes before he came there to the asylum. Q. When he arrived at the institution he was brought directly to your ward ? * A. Yes, sir. Q. Did he take his meals up there or go down to them ? A. He took his meals on the ninth ward. Q. Did he become excited or violent before you left that evening A. No, sir. & ' Q. Did the doctors visit him in your presence that afternoon ? A. Not in my presence. Q. Do you know whether the doctor visited him that afternoon ? A. He had been through that afternoon. Q. Which doctor ? A. Dr. Backus ; he had been through that department that after- noon. Q. When did you last see Mr. Hughes that evening, before leav- ing the department ? A. About five minutes to eight. Q.. AYas his condition then the same as stated ? A. It was as it had been during the afternoon ; he was very talka- tive and incoherent.' Q. Do you know whether any medicine had been given to him before you left ? A. No, sir, there was not; I did not take any medicine to him that evening. Q. If any medicine had been given to him while you were on duty, it would have been given by you ? A. Yes, sir. or I should have known it. Q. So that no medicine w^as given to him before eight o'clock 2 A. No, sir. Q. Do you know whether he slept in the ward that night or not ? A. No, sir, only by hearsay. Q. You believe he slept in that ward that night ? A. Yes, sir, because he was there in the morning. Q. AVas any report made to you the next morning of his condition during the night ? A. "i es, sir; that he was excited, was put in the covered bed about one o'clock that morning. Q. Who made that report to vou ? A. Mr. Orendorf. Q. Is he an attendant ? A. Yes, sir; he is the man in charge of the ninth ward. 134 Q. What was the condition of Mr. Hughes the next morning ? A. The next morning he was throwing his clothes about the ward. Q. When you first saw him ? • A. Yes, sir. Q. Was he dressed when you saw him ? A. He had his pants on, and his coat and vest was at the other end of the ward ; I went and talked with him and tried to get him to put them on; that was about seven o'clock, or ten minutes past. Q. Did he have any breakfast that morning ? A. Yes, sir, he had breakfast in the liinth ward. Q. He did not go down to the dining-room ? A. I would not be positive about that; I asked the attendant if he had had his breakfast, and he said yes ; there is a dining-room on each ward. Q. After that time, at what time was it he was taken to the other ward ? A. The attendant reported at half-past ten that Mr. Hughes was very violent, and has been striking several patients; I went to see him and he was talking something in Welsh ; I talked with him and wanted to sit down ; then I told the attendants to sit there with him on each side of him until I went to the doctor ; I went and saw Dr. Backus. Q. What did you tell the doctor ? A. Just what Mr. Hughes had been doing. Q. What did he tell you ? A. To remove him to the fourth ward. Q. The doctor did not come to see him at that time ? A. Not at that time. Q. Had the doctor seen him that morning ? A. No, sir, I think he had not, that morning, not to my knowl- edge ; I took Mr. Hughes down, I had two attendants walking on each side, I told Mr. Weir of the doctor's orders to take Mr. Hughes down there, and I told him he was very violent on the ninth ward. Q. Were vou here when Mr. Hughes was here before ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Was he under your care ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How much time was he here before — that is, how much time in'your ward ? A. I think about six weeks; he was here about three months; in all about that time. Q. Were you on the same ward then as you are now ? A. Yes, sir; it was the sixth ward at that time. Q. Was he put with you when he first came there? A.- No, sir. Q. Where was he put when he first came to the institution ? A. That I do not know ; I could not tell you. Q. You do not know what part of the institution he was put in ? 135 A. I do not know; he came from some other ward on to the sixth ward. Q. Do you know whether he came from the fourth ward ? A. I do not know as to that. Q. What was the occasion of his being removed to your ward ? A. His condition was better, and he had improved.' Q. Was he discharged from your ward ? A. No, sir; he was discharged from the first ward. Q. Did you know of him being injured on the fourth ward when he was here before ? . A. I never heard of it. Q. Y"ou don't know whether he was put there on the fourth ward when he first came or not ? A. I could not tell. Q. Did you know that when he was here the first time that he was here as a pay patient ? A. No, sir; I had no means of knowing that; I heard afterward — his son told me afterward that he was here as a pay patient; when he was here this time, I don't know about that. Q. Did you know this time that he was here as a pauper patient ? ^ A. No, sir, I did not; I have no means of knowing about that • his son told me that he was with him — that he brought him. Q. And that the county sent him this time ? A. Yes, sir; I did not hear it from any of the officials of the asylum, except what information the son told me, because we have no occasion to know any thing of that kind. Q. Do you not know which are which ? A. No, sir. Q. That is, you do not know which are pauper patients and which are pay patients ? A. No, sir, only by accident like that. Q. Do they all receive the same treatment ? A. I can see nothing different in the treatment of them, except when they are sick. Q. What is the difference then ? A. I mean that is the only difference in the treatment of the patient, that is when they are sick. N Q. Suppose some of the pay patients are charged $10, $17 and even $25 per week, do they receive any different treatment here from the pauper patients at $4 a week ? _ A. I don't know any difference except the doctor orders them different diet; the diet list is made out once a wreek. Q. For the different patients ? A. Yes, sir. Q. So that each patient receives special food ? A. Yes, by order of the doctor. Q. Whether they are sick or well ? A. Yes, sir — they are all supposed to be sick, but I mean sick in bed ; there is that distinction made of course. 136 Q. But they are each fed with what the doctor orders them to oe fed on and are not all fed the same thing ? A. No, sir. Q. And once a week the doctor gives you a list, you say ? A. I make out a list and take it down for his approval, and then 1 take it to the kitchen. Q. And he makes any changes in the food if he thinks proper ? _ A. I put it down on the list, and if he sees proper to changeit — if a man is down for egg and toast, and he wanted to put him on beef tea, he will change it in that way. Q. And in that way each patient in the asylum is fed in such a way as the doctor prescribes, for the week? A.' Not for the whole of the patients, I am speaking of the extra diet list which is presented once a week. Q. How do you make up the extra diet list, and who is it made up for ? A. For those that are sick, and them that have asked the^ doctor during the week when the doctor goes through; sometimes a patient wants such and such an article for dinner, and that list goes to the kitchen ; I keep that list and* then on Saturday I take the list down stairs, and, if the doctor desires to continue it, he signs it, if not, he crosses it off and that ends it; in the course of the week there may be twenty or thirty of these small little orders that go into the kitchen. Q. And you do not send any order into the kitchen unless it is first approved by the doctor ? A. No, sir; there is nothing ordered for the patients except through the doctor, except the general diet of the house which we are all having. By the Chairman : Q. What do you do with this injury book in which you make these entries ? A. The doctors call for it sometimes, to see it. Q. How often do you send the book to the office ? A. AVe never send it unless they call for it; sometimes once a week, or once a month ; at irregular times ; whenever they call for it, I take it down to them. Q. It is called for at irregular times you say; once a week, and sometimes not once a week ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How many times is it called for in the year, to the best of your recollection ? A. I really could not tell; perhaps forty times ; I could not possi- bly tell. Q. As a general thing, where is the book kept ? A. In my room; sometimes, if the doctor whistles up for the in- 137 ~ — jury book, I take it down; perhaps I get it back that day, or the next morning. Q. What inquiries are m'ade by the doctors as to the entries on those books ? ^ A. When he comes through the ward he inquires of the attendant as to any injury that is done, if they know any thing about it ; in some cases they are injured during the night, and nobody knows about that, only we ask some patient intelligent enough to tell about it. Q. How do the doctors know about any of the injuries unless they see this book ? A. They know it when they come through; every time it is told by the attendants, and we have to tell them every change in the patients when they come through. Q. So that it is not necessary for the doctors to see that book to know about the injuries ? A. No, sir; they would know before that. Q. Do they inform themselves of it by observing the patients? A. Their attention is called to it by the attendants on the wards. Q. Do the doctors ever question the attendants as to whether they — the attendants — ever inflict injuries up^n the patients? A. They very often ask me, and they ask the attendants under my charge if they are kind to the patients. Q. AVhat do you answer ? A. I tell them just as it is ; and if they are not, I report it if they do not ask it. Q. Have you ever reported the names of any attendants that have been unkind to the patients ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Can you name any attendants that you have so reported ? A. I do not think a case has happened now for a good many years ; but I have known one to be discharged for unkindness to patients. Q. How long was that ago ? A. That was fifteen years ago. Q. And since then you do not know of a case where an attendant has been unkind to a patient ? A. Not so unkind that I considered it a necessity of reporting it; if I see them taking hold of a patient roughly, then I think I should tell them to desist that,, or I should report them. Q. Have you ever known a case where an attendant has been intoxicated that you know of ? A. Not that I know of ; not in my department; I never heard of any such cases. Q. Or in any of the other departments? A. No, sir. Q. You never saw one in your department ? A. I do not recollect one in my department. Q. You never saw an attendant under the influence of liquor ? A. No, sir ; not in my department: but I have heard of some in some other departments, althdugh I never saw them myself. 18 U 138 Q. And you have never reported an attendant for improper treat- ment of a patient, within the last fifteen years ? A. I do not believe that I have. ... Q. Have you ever suspected that the black eyes and other injuries inflicted on patients might have been done by the attendants, and not bv the other patients as reported ? A." I always make a full investigation of it; asking those patients intelligent enough to tell me any thing about it. < Q. Do the patients ever say the attendants have inflicted the blow ? A. I have heard patients say that they had been abused when I knew the fact to be otherwise. Q. How did you know it to be otherwise ; is it by being present? A. I have known of it that more than one has told me; they say that they have been abused, when I have known for a positive fact that it was not so. Q. Have patients ever told you that they have been struck by attendants ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And you say that you have disbelieved it ? A. After I have made an investigation I could not find any thing to prove it. Q. So that every case of injury to patients, or bruises received by them, you attribute to accident or to injuries inflicted by other patients ? A. Yes, sir; I have made thorough investigations; they are all entered in the book. Q. What is the character of the attendants generally in the insti- tution; are they respectable men ? A. I do not know as I can hardly answer that question. Q. How long do the attendants average in their stay at the asylum ? A. That I could not answer, sir; they have not stayed as long the last two or three years as they usually did. Q. Have there been frequent changes during the last two or three years ? A. Yes, sir, a great many have left during the last two or three years. Q. How do you account for that change ? A. A large quantity consider the wages was not sufficient. Q. What is your opinion on that subject ? A. (Continued.) And a great many of them leaves on account of the long hours; that is another cause, and the little time that wc get out to ourselves; we only get two evenings a week, and a half a day once a month, and one Sunday once a month. Q. About what do the hours of labor average for the day ? A. Fifteen or sixteen hours a day. Q. What do the wages average ? A. The highest is twenty-eight dollars a month, so I have heard. 139 Q. And the board, washing and lodging ? A. Yes, sir. By Mr. Rice : Q. Do the attendants ever carry any weapons or implements to defend themselves against the patients ? A. I never heard of any such thing. Q. You never heard of any such thing as their having any thing for self-protection ? A. Nothing whatever that I ever heard of. By the Chairman : Q. What is your opinion about the rate of wages paid, as to its being sufficient ? A. I think you can get different qualities of men, like any thing else; you could get men there for $ 15 ; but I do not believe you can get the best class of men for even the wages they pay here; most of them that leave here get better wages elsewhere; of course that is an inducement for them to leave. Q. Do they go to other asylums ? A. There have been some ; they get more liberties in other asylums than they do here. Q. Do you know whether they get higher wages in other asylums than they get here ? A. I do not. Q. What asylum did you serve in, if any, before you came here ? A. I did not serve in any asylum before this. Q. Have you any statement to make in regard to this asylum ? A. No, sir, not that I can think of. Q. Can you recommend any changes that might be made which would improve things in this institution? A. Nothing, only what I told you in regard to the attendants ; I think they are overworked; I have as much reason to know that as anybody, for I have been here for twenty years ; a man cannot be bright and cheerful all the time when he is confined here like a patient all the time. Q. A re the doctors all as attentive and obliging as they ought to be? A. As far as I can see they are; I could not find any fault 'as to that; if there is the least the matter with a patient, they are imme- diately here to see them when it is reported to them. Q. Does Dr. Gray give all his attention to the asylum as far you know ? A. I could not tell any thing about that. Q. You merely know of Dr. Gray's relations to the institution by his appearance in your ward from time to time? A. I see him occasionally going through the department. Q. And you have stated that he appears at irregular intervals, from a week to a month apart ? 140 A. Yes, sir; and in case of serious sickness of a patient I have known him to be three times in one day to see him. Q. Have you known him to be there to visit patients more fre- quently within the last few years ? A. t don't know that there has been any change in regard to that. Q. Do you recollect any cases within the last few years where he has visited a patient ? A. Yes, sir, he has been to see Mr. Hughes ; he was there to see him three times. Q. That is, when a patient was very sick he was up there to see him ? A. Y es, sir. By Mr. Haskell : Q. Did you see Mr. Hughes after he was hurt ? A. Yes, sir, I was with him at the time ; he came upon the eighth ward after he had received his injuries, and he was there until he died. Q. What did Mr. Hughes tell you about how he got hurt ? A. I could not get any thing out of him that I could understand much ; he said he had had a big fight with somebody, I could not get any names; he said he got into a fight with a lot of men, but I could not get any names from him. Q. Did you give your personal attention to taking care of Mr. Hughes until he died ? A. Not entirely ; I used to see him as many as a dozen times in the day. Q. You don't know that any investigation was made to ascertain the cause of his injuries ? A. No, sir, I do not, only by hearsay. Q. What investigation did you hear was made i A. I heard that the doctors asked the attendants how it happened ; I heard that myself. Q. Did you have any talk with the doctors as to how it happened ? A. No, sir; I heard Dr. Gray talking with Mr. Hughes about it, trying to find out how it happened. Q. Did Mr. Hughes reply in any definite manner ? A. No, sir. Q. Do you see the managers of the institution occasionally in the asylum visiting ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Who of the managers have you seen there ? A. I have seen Senator Campbell there more than any one else. Q. Can you name any other managers that you have seen there occasionally ? A. I have seen Mr. Lawrence. Q. Any one else? A. Well, I am not acquainted with them much, but these two I 141 have known for a good many years ; Mr. Campbell is up there about once a week. Q. Does he go through all the wards? A. Not all the wards that I know of, but I see him up there about once a week, if not oftener. Q. Where do you see him ? A. In the center, sometimes, coming in there, and I have known him to come up on our ward to see some of the patients. Q. How often did you see him — Senator Campbell — on your ward ? •' A. I don't know exactly as to the number of times in a year. Q. Once or twice a year ? _ A. Yes, sir; oftener than that; certainly as much as six or seven times a year. Q. Ever since he was connected with the institution? A. Yes, sir. Q. Can you say that you have seen the other managers there as often as that? A. Not as often as Senator Campbell, and some of them come, but I don't know them all. Q. So they may have been there without you knowing it ? A. Yes, sir, without my knowing that they were managers. Q. Do they ever make any inspection of the institution together or in company as a board, so far as you know ? A. I believe they meet there once in every three months, they go through all the wards and look into the place and talk with the patients. Q. But you are not aware of any such visitation at other times by the board ? A. No, sir. Q. Or by a committee of the board ? A. They might have been and me not know it; I have heard sometimes when men went through the wards that one of them was a manager, but that is all I know; I am not acquainted with them. Mr. Haskell — I desire to call attention to four entries from the injury book. " First department, north," as follows : Fourth ward, July 17, '78. E. D. Hughes was very violent this morning while the attendants were bathing and dressing him, his nose was hurt a little, they did not know how it happened. Reported by attendant R. R. Morris. Fourth ward, December 31,1877. J. A. J----hurt his forehead last night while in a covered bed, it caused a black eye. Reported by attendant J. E. Roberts. Fourth Ward, August 7, 1878. J. E----bruised his forehead and knee quite badly last night in a covered bed ; removed to eleventh ward to day. Reported by attendant R. R. Morris. Fourth ward, November 6, 1878. H. B----black eye and bruised 142 his leg a little in a covered bed last night, tries t° 1DJur® J"™861* jjl he can, also refuses food and medicine. Reported by attendant i, W. Travis. , _ , , The three books read to witnesses, Barrisdale and Jones and used in connection with their testimony were marked, respectively, ex- hibits No. 4, 5, and 6, J. H. M. 'The following is a transcript of the contents of said books. On the first page of each book are the following instructions: Give in each report the following facts : -Dci/tG Q+ occurrcncG. 2. Name of person [specify which patient or attendant] injured. 3. Character of injury. 4. By whom inflicted. 5. Cause and manner. 6. By whom witnessed [specify whether patient or attendant]. First ward, December 19, 1876. H. W----had a fit; was stand- ing in his room sewing on a button; he fell striking his face on the windowsill; the right eye puffed up instantly; nose bled a little. Reported by attendant J. Evan. Fourth ward, May 7, 1877. T. L. S---- struck attendant Rick- ard in the face ; cut him under the eye. Attendant Rickard was feeding the patient. Reported by attendant Rickard, J. E. Fourth ward, May 20, 1877. While the attendants were put- ting the patients to bed, J. L---- and D. W----com- menced fighting in the back hall. Mr. L----got Mr. W----down and kicked him, breaking one of his ribs. Cause, he said Mr. W--- kept him awake the night previous. Reported by attendants R. Mc- Cormic and Rickard, J. E. Fourth ward, June 8, 1877. T. L. S---- struck at attendant McCormic while going to dining-room. He lost his balance and fell, striking his (T. L. S----"s) head against the door. This caused a black eye. Witnessed by attendant McCormic. Fourth ward, June 25, 1877. F. W. K----struck S. S----on the eye and blacked it. No cause could be ascertained. Witnessed by attendant Roberts, J. E. Fourth ward, July 6, 1877. J. E. St. J----had a fit, fell on the floor, struck his face, caused a black eye. AVitnessed by attendants Roberts and McCormic. Second ward, August 4, 1877. B. F. P---- scalded his hand severely by letting hot water run on it; said he wished to see whether he could endure the heat of hell. Reported by attendant Davis, D. K. Fourth ward, October 3, 1877. J. E---- struck J. A. J----on the head with a tin cup ; cut his head a little; no apparent cause. Reported by attendant Roberts. Fourth ward, December 31, 1877. J. A. J---- hurt his fore- head last night while in a covered bed ; it caused a black eye. Re- ported by attendant J. E. Roberts. 143 Third ward, January 1, 1878. Mr. M. C----kicked at D. R- — and hit a chair ; hurt his big toe a little, cause D. R----plagued him. Reported by attendant J. Rickard. First ward, January 5, 1878. H. L. L----while helping to carry a show-case to the shop, he accidentally struck his face against the corner of it, and caused a black eye. Witnessed by attendant J. Evans. Fourth ward, January 15. C. M.W----struck J. A. J----on the nose ; it bled very freely ; nose and eye somewhat black ; no cause could be ascertained for the act. Witnessed by attendant J. E. Roberts. Fourth ward, February 20, 1878. M. N. B----received a black eye by R. P----'s striking him with the back of his hand across the nose ; cause, Mr. B----took some meat off Mr. P----'s plate. Wit-4 nessed by patients Air. T----and Mr. W----. Fourth ward, April 13, 1878. J. E----, a black eye ; R. B---- struck him with his fist ; cause, Mr. E----plagued him. Reported by attendant J. E. Roberts. Fourth ward, May 6, 1878. T. L. S----attacked attendant T. Williams, and was thrown, striking his nose on the floor; nose cut a little. Reported by attendant T. Williams. Fourth ward, May 7, 1878. J. E----fell off the steps when going out in the yard, scratched his face and nose somewhat. Re- ported by attendant C. W. Travis. Fourth ward, June 12, 1877. W. G----, black eye. Attend- ant R. R. M orris was opening a door, Mr. G. was on the other side of the door and was hit in the face by the door. Reported by at- tendant R. R. Morris. Fourth ward, June 20. W. R. L. M----, black eye; struck by G. W. D.; cause, Mr. M----plagued him. Reported by attend- ant R. R. Morris. Fourth ward, June 23, 1878. W. L. M---- attacked attend- ant R. R. Morris and was thrown, hurting his nose a little. Wit- nessed by attendant R. R. Morris. Fourth ward, June 27, 1878. W. R. L. M----was hit on forehead — black eye — by J. W. S----without any apparent cause. Witnessed by attendant R. R. Morris. Fourth ward, July 16, 1878. W. L. M----. Mr. M. hit his head on the arm of a chair, caused a black and blue spot on forehead ; would not say why he did so. Reported by attendant R. R. Morris. Fourth w.-'ird, July 17, '1878. C. D. H---- wTas very violent this morning while the attendants' were bathing and dressing him; his nose was hurt a little, they did not know how it happened. Reported by attendant R. R. Morris. Fourth ward, July 29. L. M----. Mr. M----was asked to go to dinner; said he would not eat ; rushed into water-closet, broke two lights of glass with his hand, scratched his hand a little. Witnessed by J. F. Michael, attendant. 144 Fourth ward, August 7, 1878. J. E----bruised forehead and knee quite badly last night in covered bed. Removed to eleventh ward to-day. Reported by attendant R., R. Morris. Fourth ward, August 22, 1878. R. W. S----broke twenty-four panes of glass with his hands; cut one and scratched the other hand pretty bad ; he was trying to break out. Reported by attendant C. W. Travis. " # Fifth ward, August 27. A. H. B----was struck on face with a shovel by A. S. F----; cause, Mr. B---- asked him forthe shovel; slight scratch on face. Witnessed by patientsW. A----andF. W---- Fourth ward, September 7, 1878. D. CM---black eye; H. H. M----struck him ; no apparent cause. Reported by attendant R. R. Morris. * Fourth ward, September 30, 1878. W. G----struck _himself on forehead with a small stone while in the yard ; caused a slight bruise. Witnessed by attendant W. R. Jones. Fourth ward, October 10, '78. J. C. C----tried to get the keys away from J. P----in the yard, and also wrenched attendant W. R. Jones' hand. Witnessed by attendant R. R. Morris. Fourth ward, October 16, 1878. T. L. S----struck on forehead by W. McB----; slight cut over left eye ; no cause could be ascer- tained. Reported by attendant R. R. Morris. First ward, October 26, '78. G. B. H----was bitten by a dog on little finger; cause, he vexed the dog. Witnessed by patient C. H. L---. Fourth ward, November 4, '78. H. H. M----was struck on the eye by W. H. S----; said Mr. M----had hit him, but he had not; Mr. M----has a black eye. Witnessed by attendant R. R. Morris. Fourth ward, November 4, '78. J. B----attacked the attend- ants when they went to give him his medicine; he hit attendant C. W. Travis and J. Evans on the face, and in putting patient to bed, he must have struck his face on the bedstead ; had a little black spot under one eye next morning. AVitnessed by attendants J. Evans, C. W. Travis and J. F. McMichael. Fourth ward, November 5. G. H. P----, black eye ; was hit by J. G. W----; cause Mr. P----was undressed in water-closet. Reported by attendant C. AY. Travis. Fourth ward, November 6, '78. H. B----black eye and bruised his leg a little in covered bed last night; tries to injure himself all he can, also refuses food and medicine. Reported by attendant C. W. Travis. Fourth ward, November 6. W. McB----, black eye; was struck on the eye with a slipper by J. B----; cause, Mr. McB---- bothered him. Reported by attendant C. W. Travis. Fifth ward, November 15, '78. A. T----, a black eye ; caused by J. S. P----throwing an inkstand, they had a few words, but had apparently gotten over it. Mr. P----was writing; Mr. T—— happened to walk past him, he, P——, up with the inkstand, threw 145 it hitting Mr. T----over the left eye. Mr. P----said he though Mr. T----was going to kill him. Reported by attendant R. R Pugh. Third ward, November 27, 1878. J. L. D----accidentally cut the end of his left thumb off while at work in the slaughter-house. Reported by H. E. Jones, butcher. Fourth ward, December 28, 1878. H. F----, black eye; was hit by J. E. W----; no apparent cause. Witnessed by attendant W. R. Jones. Fourth ward, January 4, 1879. W. H. S----accidentally broke his right knee cap in making a charge on attendant W. R. Jones, for keys. Witnesses, patients J. G. W----and H. H. M----. Fourth ward, January 12, 1879. G. II. P----was hit by H. F---on the eye, lid cut a little ; no cause could be ascertained. Re- ported by attendant G. E. Philo. Fourth ward, January 19, 1879. J. G. W----, black eye; re- ceived a blow over the left eye from J. C. C----, said Mr. W---- insulted him. Reported by attendant G. E. Philo. Fourth ward, January 24. Attendant J. F. McMichael was struck on the eye by M. M----while the attendants were trying to put him in a chair. Witnessed by attendant G. E. Philo. Fourth ward, March 12,1879. F. C. B----, black eye; accident- ally hurt it in a scuffle with attendants. Witnessed bv attendants G. E. Philo, C. W. Travis, W. R. Jones. Second ward, May 11, 1879. C. L. H----tried to commit sui- cide by cutting his throat with a razor that he dodged into attendants room and got, while attendant H. A. Jones was asleep in the room. Reported by attendant D. R. Davis. Fourth ward, June 15, 1879. S. B^---bruised his cheek against the door easing while in a scuffle with attendants G. E. Philo and W. R. Jones. Fourth ward, September 1, 1879. A. K. C----received a black eye in the yard from Mr. B----. Witnessed by attendant W. R. Jones. Fourth ward, September 15, 1879. A. S---- bruised his cheek while bathing. AVitnessed by attendants G. E. Philo and J. Philo, Fourth ward, October 11, 1879. F. J----received a black eye from M. C—— without apparent cause. AVitnessed by attendant John Philo. First ward, October 21. W. O. B----, black eye; accidentally hit with ball while playing. Witnessed by attendant R. H. Jones. Fourth ward, November 16, 1879. B. D---, black eye; re- ceived while pounding around in his room last night. Reported by attendant G. E. Philo. Fourth ward, November 22, 1879. A. K. C----, black eye; re- ceived a severe blow from Mr. McG----. Cause, Mr. C---- hap- pened to touch him. Witnessed by attendant Richard H. Jones. Fourth ward, November 28. F. W. F----, black eye; received 19 U 146 a blow from Mr. C----; said he thought he was told to hit him. Witnessed by attendants John Philo and Richard H. Jones. Fifth ward, December 12, 1879. A. T. McL----, black eye; V. W. C---hit him with his elbow. Cause, Mr. McL--- was look- ing over his shoulder at a letter he was reading. Witnessed by patients P. D----, A. T----, M. K----. Third ward, December 3. B. F. P----, slight bruise on his head. Cause, kicked by a cow while milking. Witnessed by butcher, H. C. Jones. Fourth ward, December 7, 1879. F. B. H----, black eye, received while the attendants were trying to get him to bed ; he tried to get out of the room, striking his face against the door-casing. AA it- nessed by attendants G. E. Philo and J. Philo. Fourth ward, December 16, 1879. F. J----, slight bruise on his head; cause, hit his head against a door while passing through, in a disturbed state. Reported by attendant G. E. Philo. Fourth ward, December 21, 1879. B. D----, a small gash on his head ; wras thrown by S. C----, striking his head against a chair; ■ no apparent cause. Witnessed by attendant G. E. Philo. Fifth ward, January 19, 1880. A. T. McL----sprained his leg below the right knee ; he was fooling with J. G----; he stepped back and fell doWn ; no one to blame. Witnessed by attendant R. R. Pugh. Fourth ward, January 24, 1880. E. C----, slight bruise on the left side of his nose while in a scuffle with attendant G. E. Philo, takiug him from the dining-room. Witnessed by attendant J. Philo. < , Third ward, February 1, 1880. P. S----had his little finger of the left hand broken ; he was standing with his hand on the casing of the cow stable door; the wind blew the door shut on his hand; he supposed he had fastened the door open. Witnessed by Win, Prichard. Third ward, February 12. 1880. C. B. G----had three fingers; of the left hand sawed a little with buzz saw, accidentally, while he was using the saw. Reported by attendant J. Rickard. Fourth ward, February 14. E. C----bit the second finger of the right hand; made it pretty sore; said he wanted to suffer for his I friends. Reported by attendant D. E. Torpy. Second ward, February 16, 1880. W. II----, black eye. He I had a fit this morning; fell, striking his face on the floor. Wit- 1 nessed by W. H. H----and W. C. H----, patients. J Fourth ward, March 5. E. C----, black eye; hit himself 1 several times with his fist on face and forehead. Said he thought* he ought to be pounded. Reported by attendant D. E. Torpy. -M Fourth ward, March 22, 1880. E. P----, black eye. Was struck by E. C----; cause, Mr. P----bothered him. Witnessed by attendants D. E. Torpy and Juo. Philo. Fourth ward, March 26. J. B----, black eye. Received while; in his room last night; he said he fell out of bed. Reported by at-'3 tendant D. E. Torpy. 147 Fourth ward, April 10, 1880. J. B----, slight scratch on fore- head, while in yard, could not ascertain how it'happened. Reported by attendant D. E. Torpy. Fourth ward, May *2, 1880. E. P----, black eye; had a scuffle with J. B----, and before the attendants could intercede Mr. P____ had received the black eye. He began the trouble. Witnessed by attendants J. Philo and Richard H. Jones. Fourth ward, May 2. J. T ---, black eye; cause unknown. Reported by attendant D. E. Torpy. Fourth ward, May 14, 1880. J.' S. P----, black eyes, received while fighting with E. P----in the yard. Reported by attendant D. E. Torpy. Fourth ward, May 26,1880. D. B----, small cut over right eye; was kicked by Mr. McG----while in the yard ; no apparent cause. Witnessed by attendant Richard H. Jones.' Fourth ward, June 6, 1880. J. S. B----received a small cut on face by being pushed over a chair by G. A. P----; no apparent cause. Witnessed by attendant Jno. Philo. Fourth ward, June 8, 1880. M. McG----, in stooping to pick up a paper at dinner table, struck his head and received cut over left eye. Witnessed by attendant Richard H. Jones. Fourth ward, June 9, 1880. L. M----. Nose broken and eye blacked ; was struck by G. A. P——; no cause could be ascertained. Witnessed by attendant John Philo. Fourth ward, June 10, 1880. D. B----, black eye, was struck by M. McG----; said he hit him because he picked up a spittoon. AYitnessed by J. Philo. Fourth ward, June 13, 1880. P. R. T----, small cut on foot; stepped on a nail while getting into bed. Witnessed by attendant J. Philo. Fifth ward, July 22. E. D----, hip sprained ; was pushed down stairs by D. C. M----; he said he thought it was somebody else. Witnessed by attendant R. R. Pugh. Third ward, August 14, 1880. P. G----, black eye; caused by being hit accidentally by G. D----'s foot while he was caught accidentally on a shaft in the fan-room. AVitnessed bv attendant H. R. Hughes. Fourth ward, August 10. J. S. P:----, while in the yard, received a slight cut by E. P----thrusting a stick into the corner of his eye Witnessed by attendant D. E. Torpy. Fourth ward, August 16, 1880. J. B----and E. C----got into a quarrel, and Mr. B----got his eyes blackened and face scratched before attendant could stop them; Mr. B----started the fuss. Witnessed by attendant Jno. Philo. August 23, 1880. E. C—-.—, patient on the fourth ward, attempted to run away while out in the garden to work ; attendants Homer A. Jones, Daniel Torphy, Richard H. Jones and W. H. Bennett gave chase ; Homer was the first to overtake him, and in the scuffle 148 which followed, C----chawed off the end of the second finger of attendant Homer's right hand. , Fourth ward, October 13. P. L----received a black eye by be- ing pushed down on the walk by S. Y. M----while in the yard; no apparent cause. Witnessed by patient Mr. I----. # Fifth ward, November 1, 1880. S. B. K----sprained his left hip by falling, while blacking his boots in bath-room; he was found lying on the floor by attendant T. E. Morris. ' Fourth ward, November 8, 1880. J. D----, left ankle bruised while in the yard ; could not ascertain the cause. Reported by at- ' tpnclrtiI" Cj vv Tfavis Fourth ward, November 21, 1880. B. McL----, right wrist injured by C. W. Travis, attendant ; by resisting while being dressed. Re- ported b\ attendant I). E. Torpy. Fourth ward, November 24. "J. S----received scratch on nose by J. B----; cause Mr. S----pushed him. Witnessed by attendant R. H. Jones. Fifth ward, November 26, 1880. S. B. K----got up, walked a few steps from bed, fell, striking on his lame hip. Witnessed by attendant R. R. Pugh. Fifth ward, December 13, 1880. S. M----slight scratch on nose while in bed ; was hit by G. II----; cause, Mr. M----talked. Re- * ported by attendant R. R. Pugh. Fifth ward, December 26, '80. M. W----, bruise on forehead, left side ; was up in the night, took straw out of the tick and was fussing all around the room ; must have fell down or hit his head against the bedstead. Reported by attendant R. R. Pugh. Third ward, January 4, '81. M. F. M----cut left forefinger ac- cidentally while at work in the slaughter-house. Witnessed by H. E. Jones. Third ward, January 12, '81. M. F. M----cut second finger on right hand a little while at work in the slaughter-house. Reported by H*. E. Jones. Fourth ward, January 14, '81. E. L----, black eye ; was hit by H. H. M----; cause Mr. L----steped up near Mr. M----while he was talking with another patient. Witnessed by attendant D. E. Torpy. Fourth ward, January 14, '81. II. H. M----struck R. H. Jones, attendant, a very severe blow over the right eye; it puffed up and was discolored. Mr. M----said he thought he hit some one else. Reported by attendant R. II. Jones. Second ward, February 12, '81. A. AY----, left arm injured by the crank flying back and hitting him on the arm while lie was at work at the waiter. Reported by attendant II. A. Jones. t Fourth ward, February 13. R. B----received a blow under 1 the left eye, the skin was cut; he was talking with Mr. McG---- ' and Mr. McG----became excited and hit him. Witnessed by at- tendant D. E. Torpy. 149 Fourth ward, February 14, 1881. T. B----, left ear hurt a little, could not find out how it happened. Reported by attendant D. E. Torpy. Fourth ward, March 23, 1881. H. N----, slight bruise over left eye ; it happened in the night, he could not tell how he done it. Reported by attendant D. E. Torpy. Fourth ward, April 15, 1881. C. F. W----, black eye; he made an attack on Mr. M----; Mr. M----struck him in self defense. Witnessed by attendant F. C. Smith. Fourth ward, March 27,1881. E. J. R----, slight injury to penis; he was kicking spittoon around the ward. Attendant F.' C. Smith asked him to stop it; said he would not; Mr. Smith put him in a chair and in the scuffle Mr. R----struck the arm of the chair. Witnessed by attendant R. D. Griffith. Fourth ward, April 8, 1881. W. H. C----, cut on back of head about an inch long, was hit by A. P. C----as they were com- ing out of the bath-room, with a tin wash dish. Mr. C----said he was annoyed by Mr. C----, and that he was trying to get his tobacco. Mr. Torpy was near the bath-room door, did not hear any talking. The striking was witnessed by attendant D. C. Torpy. Fourth ward, April 9, 1881. J. F----, black eye; was hit in the night with a rubber chamber by J. B. E----; cause, Mr. F____ was fussing around the room and getting under the beds. Reported by attendant D. E. Torpy. Fourth ward, April 26, 1881. T. L. S----, slight bruise on right cheek ; was hit with a small stone thrown by F. L----from sixth ward while in the yard; no apparent cause. Witnessed by attend- ant J. J. Ellis. Fourth ward, April 30. T. W. B----black eye ; he had a scuffle with Mr. S----from the eighth ward while in the yard. Reported by attendant D. E. Torpy. Fourth ward, May. 2, 1881. A. W----cut right hand a little by breaking three lights of glass in day room ; said he wanted to break out. Reported by attendant D. E. Torpy. Fourth ward, May 11, 1881. T. W. B----, slight cut over right eye ; cause, he would not stay in bed ; was up around the room and pounding on the door; W. A. M----hit him with his fist. Wit- nessed by patient H. H. P----. Fourth ward, May 22. H. S. J----, slight cut on the right hand caused by his breaking two lights of glass ; said he tried to break out to see his wife. Reported by D. E. Torpy. 1881, May 24. Fourth ward. J. W. B----, cut on head ; was hit with a chamber by J. B. E----; cause, Mr. B----would not let him sleep, and tried to pull him out of bed. Witnessed by Mr. B----. Reported by attendant D. E. Torpy. Fifth ward, May 24. S. B. K----sprained left wrist; caused by falling. Witnessed by attendant R. R. Pugh. Fourth ward, June 7. J. F----fell out of bed last night; cut a slight gash over left eye. Reported by D. E. Torpy. 150 Fourth ward, June 11, 1881. F. M----, black eye; was hit on the left eye while in the yard ; could not ascertain who hit him, but it was supposed to be C. F. W----. Reported by attendant D. E. Torpy. Fifth ward, June 16. N. Y----had a fit last night; fell out of bed ; cut a small gash on top of his head, and received a bruise on the left side of client, and a bruise on cheek and chin. Reported by attendant R. R. Pugh. Fourth ward, June 30, 1881. J. F----, black eye ; he was found o:i the floor in the water-closet by attendant F. C. Smith. It was thought by the attendants that he had a fit and fell on the floor, striking on the right side of face. Reported by attendant D. E. Torpy. Fourth ward, July 14. Attendant R. R. Evan3, black eye; was hir by W. D----; cause, Mr. Evans asked him to get up off the damp grass ; he jumped up and hit him twice. Reported by attend- ant R. R. Evans. Fourth ward, July 16. P. S----, slight scratch on left side of t nose; he pitched on to attendant T. C. Smith and tried to take the mop away from Mr. Smith in the scuffle; he got scratched. Re- ported and witnessed by attendant D. E. Torpy. Fifth ward, July 25. B. S----, left hip bruised ; got off" bed last night, walked a few steps'and fell, striking on left side. Re- ported by attendant R. R. Pugh. Fourth ward, July 26. P. S----, cut over the right eye ; he hit E. C----; then Mr. C----knocked him down and kicked him over i the eye. Witnessed by attendant 0. W. Travis. Fourth ward, July 30. A. W----, slight cut over right eye; Mr. E. C----struck at him; he dodged and hit window casing. Witnessed by attendant D. E. Torpy. Fourth ward, August 13, 1881. P. S----, left ear bruised ; he attacked attendant T. C. Smith ; in the struggle he hit his ear against a door casing; the last part of the struggle was witnessed by attend- ant D. E. Torpy. First ward, August 16, 1881. J. A----, while trying a new trick on • the horizontal bar ; he fell on his face, knocked the skin off a little right side of face and forehead and left hand. Reported by Mr. A----. Fourth ward, August 19,' 1881. L. L----hurt his right elbow somewhat last night. Reported by attendant C. W. Travis. Fourth ward, August 20, 1881." T. McK----left ear cut a little; was hit by E. C----; cause, he kicked at Mr. C----. Witnessed , by attendant F. C. Smith. Fourth ward, August 30, 1881. T. McK----, right eye cut and abrasion of the skin on nose ; struck by C. D----; witnessed by E. L----; three patients ; (no cause for the act.) Fourth ward, August 31, 1881. L. L----kicked in right ear by C. D----; ear cut quite bad ; no cause for the act. Witnessed by L----; all three are patients. » 1 151 Fourth ward, September 1, 1881. O. F----, kicked and broke the skin under chin ; also kicked on left cheek of C. D----; no cause for the act. Witnessed by attendant T. L. Morris. Fourth ward, September 4, 1881. J. T. T-----, right eye black and slight cut over it; was hit by E. C—— while in the yard ; Mr. C----said that he was hit first, but Miv^s—— said not. Reported by attendant D. Torpy. ^^ Fourth ward, September 12, 1881. O. F——, lip cut and chin scratched ; was hit and kicked by E. C----while in the yard; no apparent cause. Witnessed by attendant R. D. Griffiths. Fourth ward, September 12, 1881. E. L----, small cut on the head ; was knocked down while in the yard by E. 0----; no appar- ent cause. R. D. Griffiths. Fourth ward, September 19, 1881. P. M——, black eye; he was hit by somebody, but would not, tell who it was ; thought by the attendants that E. C----hit him. Reported by attendant D. E. Torpy. Fourth ward, September vj:5, 1881. E. H----, nose hurt and. a black eye; was hit by M. L----last night; F. M----was in the room with them ; Mr. L----said he did not do it, but he is in the habit of striking ; Mr. M----is not in the habit of striking. Re- ported by attendant D. E. Torpy. Fourth ward, October 2< >, 1881. C. B. L----, slight cut on head; O. F----hit him with a bowl while washing dishes this noon ; no apparent cause. Witnessed by attendant A. G. Wier. Fourth ward, October 24, '81. A. L. R----, slight cut on head. L. R----had a fit in the yard, when he got up he threw a stone at A. G. Wier ; he dodged and it hit Mr. R----. Reported by attend- ant A. G. Wier. First ward, November 5, 1881. J. K----, slight bruise on left leg below the knee ; it happened while helping to unload some boxes for the clerk. Reported and witnessed by O. W. A----, patient, and II. E. G----;, patient. Third ward, November 14, '81. G. H----cut a small piece of fle.-h off left forefinger while helping to butcher hogs. Reported by II. E. Jones, butcher. Fourth ward, December 12, '81. T. L. S----, left eye black ; was hit by H. R. B----; no apparent cause; said he hit him in self-defense. Reported by attendant D. E. Torpy. Fourth ward, December 12. '81. A. W----, black eye; was hit by H. R. B----; Mr. W----has a habit of swinging his arm ; Dr. B----said he thought that he was going to be hit. Witnessed by attendant D. E. Torpy. Fourth ward, December 12,1881. L. L----scratch or* face: was hit by W. A. M----; no cause could be ascertained. Witnessed > by attendant D. E. Torpy. Fourth ward. M. L—'— knocked a cup of rice and milk out of attendant D. E. Torpy's hand and spilt it on the floor, then he jnmped out of bed, slipped and fell, striking his left side against the 152 covered bed, that caused a slight abrasion of the skin on the left side. Witnessed by attendant D. E. Torpy. Fourth ward, January 10, 1882. L. R----, black eye; was hit by E. C----on the left eye ; no apparent cause. Witnessed by attendant D. E. Torpy. Fourth ward, January 17. J. C----, left eye black and slight scratch on face under the other eve ; was hit twice by W. A. M-——. Attendant D. E. Torpy witnessed the trouble and thought Mr. C— was most to blame. Reported bv attendant D. E. lorpy. Fourth ward, January 21, 1882. J. P----, cut over left eye about an inch long; attendant F. C. Smith went to feed him, he grabbed hold of Mr. Smith and swung him around a few times and they both fell; Mr. P----struck his forehead against a chair when they fell. W itnessed by attendant A. G. Wier. Fourth ward, January 22, 1882. E. C---, both eyes black ; caused by butting his forehead against the wall and the floor at night and day time. Witnessed bv the attendants D. E. Torpy and A. G. Wier. Fourth ward, January 22, 1882. E. T. M----, black eye ; he had a scuffle with and 'threw Mr. B----down, and in some way received a black eye. Reported by attendant D. E. Torpy. Fourth ward, January 26, '82. F. M----, scratch on right side of forehead ; it was done in the night; it was thought by the attend- ants that he fell out of bed ; be" would not tell how it happened. Reported by attendant D. E. Torpy. Fourth ward, February 2, '82. H. L. B----, black eye ; was hit by E. C---; no apparent cause. Witnessed by attendant D. E. Torpy. Fourth ward, February 4, '82. W. C——, black eye ; was hit by L. McF----; no apparent cause. Witnessed by attendant 0. E. Torpy ; he told Mr. McF----that it was wrong to strike a man in that way; at that he pitched into Mr. Torpy. First ward, February 10, '82. J. P----got two scratches on hand from slipping on the steps while carrying out swill-pail, the steps being icy. Witnessed by attendant C Roche. Fourth ward, February 14," 1882. I). R. P----got a black eye from a blow by J. H----, who said Mr. P----was blowing some- thing on him. Witnessed by D. E. Torpy, attendant. Fifth ward, February 20, 1882. L. P. J----, slight cut over left eye. Had a fit and fell on the dust-pan. Reported by attendant J\ C. McGucken. Third ward, March 3, 1882. E. B----was kicked by a steer at slaughter-house on left knee. Injury very slight. Attendant H. E. Jones. Fourth ward, April 6, 1882. C. S----received a blow on nose from M. C----. Mr. C----was sitting on a bench in the yard when S----came up to him and kicked at him. Mr. C----then struck him on the nose. Witnessed by attendant E. A. Williams. 153 Fourth ward, April 14, 18S2. M. L----, black eye by coming in contact with chair, witnessed by attendant D. Lynn. ^ Fourth ward, April 27, 1882. W. B----had a fight with J. F— ; A. G. Wier, attendant, went to part them; 1.----then pitched into Wier and in the scuftie got his left ear hurt; also the right thumb. Fourth ward, June 6, 1882. F. McR----, black eye, was struck by IT. C----. Mr. McR----Avas talking very loud. C----thought he was talking about him and went up to him and struck him over the right eye and on the left side. Witnessed bv attendant A. G. Wier. Fourth ward, September 23, 1882, E. D. C----, small cut' over left eye; eye a little black ; he kicked at Mr. Lynn, the attendant, lost his balance, fell down, and in going down struck his eye against the casing on the wall. Witnessed by attendant A. G. Wier. Fourth ward, October 4, 1882. C. S----, upper lip slightly cut. Received a blow from II. R----; no apparent cause. Witnessed by attendant W. Williams. ' Fifth ward, October 20, 1882. R. D. Griffiths, attendant, re- ceived cut on the head; was struck by T. A----with a stono; he thought Mr. G----was poisoning him. Witnessed by attendant Mr. Sharhamer. Fourth ward, October 31, 1882. T. A----, cut on top of head ; he tried to knock his brains out against the building in the fifth hall yard. Witnessed by attendant D. Lynn. Fourth ward, November 15,1882. J. R. J----attacked attendant Barnes with a stick, in the yard; and in the scuffle that followed Mr. J----got a very slight cut on the nose. Reported by attend- ant Wier. Fourth ward, December 2, 1882. J. J——, black eye; was struck hj E. P—■— ; no apparent cause. Reported bv attendant A. G. Wier. Second ward, December 12, 1882. S. E----was kicked by cow at barn, in breast; breast injured very slightly. AAritnessed by at- tendant W. Prichard. Fourth ward, February 3, 18S3, E. 1.). C----, black eye ; was struck while in the water-closet, by B. W----. A\r---- said C---- stuck his chamber under his, W----'s, nose. Reportedby attendant A. G. Wier. Fourth ward, February 4, 1883. D. M. G----, black eye; was struck by P. C----; he'followed C----about the ward and tried several times to strike him. C----tired of it at last and struck him in the eye. Reported by attendant A. G. AVier. Fourth ward, March 7, 1SS3. M. L----, slight cut over left eye ; was struck by M. M----because he kicked him. Reported by at- tendant A. G. Wier. Fourth ward, March 21, 1883. W. F----, black eye ; was struck by J. J----;'no apparent cause. Reported by attendant A. G. A^ier. Fourth ward, March 29, 1883. T. S----had a fit while in the 154 dining-room ; he was laid on the floor by the attendants, and while working in the fit, he got his left shoulder against the heater and slightly burned it. Reported by attendant A. G. Wier. Fifth ward, March 30, 1883. ' E. J. R----cut his throat on both sides about 1 o'clock in the morning; he was discovered by the night- watch, John Sommers and John Ferriss; when discovered, the floor where he lav was covered with blood ; it was done with glass that he got while in the yard; the wound on the right side wasabout three inches long; the one on the left, about two and a half inches long. Reported by night-watch. Third ward, March 31, 1883. E. McA----tried to cut his throat in the slaughter-house; he was asleep on a chair ; got up and went and stood before the looking-glass ; he was asked by Mr. G----what he was doing; he said he was cutting the hair on his neck; just then Mr. IT----saw the blood running down his neck; they took the knife away from him and put him out of the slaughter-house ; he resisted, and tried to get back in again to finish the job; he inflicted a slight wound on the right side of his neck ; he was brought in and the circumstances reported by the butcher, II. R. Jones. Fourth ward, April 9, 1883. O. B----, black eve ; was struck on the nose by J. J----, because he, B----, pitched into J—— for a fight. Reported by attendant A. G. Wier. Fourth ward, May 17, 1883. J. S----, left hip silghtly injured; was attacked and thrown down by Mr. J----; cause of difficulty not known. Reported by attendant A. G. Wier. Fourth ward, May 17, 18^3. J. S----had rib fractured by P. C----; S----threAv two cups of hot Avater in C----'s face, and told . C----he was going to kill him ; C----thought he ought to be chas- tised for using the words, " kill him " ; C----threw him on the floor; fell with his kees on Mr. S----'s side and stomach, fracturing his rib. Reported by attendant A. G. AVier. Fourth Avard, May 17, 1883. P. C----Avas sitting on the ward; J. F----approached C----and struck him; they squared for a fight, C----getting in the first blow on F----'s nose, breaking the skill a little; they were separated by attendants Jones, J. R., and Quine, G. Reported by A. G. Weir, attendant. Fourth ward, May 23, 1883. T. S----, small cut over left eye; eye a little black ; he was found lying on the floor in a fit by the attendants with a cloth (a piece of a sheet) round his neck for the purpose of hanging himself, as thev supposed; received the injury to his eye Avhen he fell in the fit. Reported by A. G. Weir, attend- ant. Fourth ward, May 26, 1883. G. W. B----, black eye ; he was sitting in a chair partly asleep ; C. II. P----went up to him and struck him in the eye ; no apparent cause. Reported by attendant , A. G. Wier. Fifth ward, May 26, 1883. J. F----, slight scratch on left side of face ; C. G----was assisting him to a chair in the yard ; they 155 both fell to the ground, Mr. F----getting his face scratched. Re- ported by attendant O. Ladd. Second ward, May 30. N. D. W"——, black eye and skin broken on bridge of the nose ; was standing in his room at 8 p. m., leaning on the bureau ; he went to go out on the ward and fell in a fit, striking his nose and eye on the bed-post. Reported by attend- ant W. C. Mansfield. July 12, fifth ward. M. McG----, while out in the yard, at- tempted to walk about, Avhen he accidentally fell and struck his cheek bone against the gravel Avalk, which caused quite a bruise, and his eye to be somewhat black. Reported by attendant O. Ladd. August 1, fourth ward. L. T---- Avas sitting on a chair; C. II----was talking to and bothering him; the former shoved him down ; in falling he accidentally struck the bridge of his nose on the chair and gave himself a severe cut. Witnessed by Mr. P----and reported by attendant A. G. Wier. August 2, fifth ward. T. G----fell out of bed and gave him- self quite a bruise on the hip bone, and also fell in the yard and bruised the back part of his thigh. Witnessed by attendant E. C. Judson. August 6, fourth ward. D. R. P----wanted to go out on the highway; he attacked attendant A. G. Wier; in the struggle the latter got a bruise on the temple Avhich caused his eye to be black. Reported by attendant A. G. Wier. September 30, fifth ward. G. C. C----without any provocation struck T. R----and gave him a black eye. Reported by the latter. October 2, fourth Avard. S. K----became excited in his room and Avas swinging the chamber-pot around, and also struck himself with it above the knee which caused a v ery severe bruise. Reported by attendant A. G. Wier. October 24, fifth Avard. G. C. C----, Without any provocation, pushed E. W----doAvn in the chair and gave him quite a bruise on the cheek bone. Reported by attendant O. Ladd. October 25, fourth Avard. E. P----, without any provocation, struck E. McA----; the latter returned the blow and gave him a slight cut on the nose. Witnessed by attendant A. G. Wier. October 27, fifth Avard. G. E. C----, Avithout any known cause, attacked Y. P. M----and scratched both sides of his face and ears. Witnessed b}' attendant E. C. Judson. November 4, fourth ward. B. McL----said C. D. K----had, or Avas taking his brains, and attacked him. Attendant W. Hoff- man AArent to separate them, Avhen McL----attacked him ; in the struggle both fell, Hoffman spraining his knee. Reported by at- tendant J. BroAvn. November 5, fourth ward. J. R----came out of the covered bed this morning Avith a bruised eye. Could not find out by him or the attendant how he got it- November 29, fourth ward. D. R. P----, while at the dinner table, became excited, jumped up and struck attendant F. Bills a 156 severe blow in the neck: and threw his arm around his neck and tried to choke him. In the struggle both fell to the floor, face downward. Attendant A. G. Wier went to Air. Bills' assistance; then patient E. N. W----, with a table knife in his hand, threatened to assist B----. When the attendant got quiet restored, and Mr. P----up from the floor, it was found that his face was bruised ; which he re- ceived in falling; from which cause his two eyes became black. Re- ported by attendants A. G. Wier and F. Bills. December 17, fifth ward. E. W—— accidentally fell down the stairway, while going from the ward to the day-room, and gave him- self a slight cut on the cheek bone and eye-brows, from which cause his eyes became black. Witnessed by patient B----and attendant E. C. Johnson. December 26, fourth ward. AY. L. P----struck J. R----, and gave him a black eye, because he spat in his face. Witnessed by attendant J. Brown. 1883, December 31, fifth ward. P. AY----come out of the covered bed this morning with his left arm having a very bruised appearance between the sholder and elbow ; could not find out how or by what means he injured himself. Reported by attendant 0. Ladd. 1884, January 1, fifth Avard. E. W----came out of the covered bed this morning with a black eye; could not find out how he got it.' Reported by attendant O. Ladd. 1884, January 2, fifth Avard. Attendant J. Lynn left a cup of rice and milk on the table in the day-room while he was engaged feeding another patient. E. W----attempted to get the food ; he ' stumbled and fell against the table and gave himself a bruised eye. Reported by attendant J. Lynn. January 26, fourth ward. E. D. II----in a struggle got injured in theface and side. January 31, fourth ward. C. D. C----came out of his room this morning with a bruise on the right side of the head between the eye and ear; he has a habit of bruising himself. February 10, fourth ward. Patient I)?R. P---- is not allowed the use of a knife in the dining-room. When he entered to-day he took a knife belonging to another patient and refused to give i't up and struck attendant Bills with his fist behind the eves; the attend- ant had to force him out of the dining-room. AVhen taking him through the door he accidently struck "his eye-brow against ft and gave himself a slight cut. Reported by attendants J. R. Jones and Frank Bills. February 12, fourth ward. This forenoon patient J. M____ was mopping the floor ; patient McA----came up behind him and struck him on the head, and also kicked him in the side. The former turned on him and struck him in the left eye and temple which caused his eye to be black. Witnessed by attendant A. M Jones and reported by attendant J. R. Jones. 157 February 14 fourth ward. Patient C. B----was in the bath- room washing the chamber-pots; patient M. A----went in and tried to stop him from work ; the former refused, when the latter struck him over the left eye and ga<,e him a slight cut. Attendant J. R. J ones separated them. February 14, fourth ward. This morning patient D R____ was making his bed ; patient AY. R----went into his room and asked it—— to kiss lnm ; the latter turned on him and struck him on th« cheek bone and raised quite a lump, from which cause the corner o, his eye became slightly discolored. Separated by attendant J. Rf i .£?ATent8 of InJurJ' Bouk> " Second Department, North "—Ex- hibit No. 5 : 1876. December 5. F. M----, black eye by A. S----; eighth ward. 1V1-— P"* n"g fe----, a*>d result as above. Witnessed by attend- ant Jno. Oldham. J December 7 A. J. S----, eighth ward. Black eye by J. T. 5 " . , o --- P»shing Mr. M--- out of privy, and Mr. M----struck S----. Witnessed by attendant Wm. George. 1877. January 9. M W----, eighth ward. Small cut over right eye, while in a fit. Witnessed by attendant D. Torpy January 9. A. H Y---1, eighth ward, fell in a fit at breakfast table ; small cut on face. January 9 J. S----and D. McC----, eighth ward. While coming out of dining-room, S----struck McC----; both scratched each other s face a little. Were parted by J. Oldham and L. John- son. June 1 S. C E----struck IT. M----out in yard ; blacked his eye. Both eighth ward. July 22. J. G. T----, seventh ward, fell out of bed last night; bruised face. ° August 25. R. AY. H----struck G. R. R----on face without any provocation. W. H----said the power caused him to do so Witnessed by attendant R. IT. Jones. September 25. F. C. B----, black eye by J. B____B____ pushed B----, and B----struck him. Witnessed by attendant B Humphrey. October 17. J. G. T----fell in flour and bruised face, and small cut on eyebrow. Witnessed by attendant D. P. Salisbury November 30. G. S. IT----, eighth ward, struck his eye durin- •night in covered bed, and bruised. b 158 December 31. G. S. H---- struck F. M---- on forehead; bruised it a little. He said he didn't know why he struck mm. Eighth ward. Witnessed by attendant B. Humphrey. 1878. January 12. G. S. IT----, eighth ward, struck S. B.----at dinner with a tumbler; cut his head a little. Witnessed by the attend- ants. (G. II----said that B----had bothered him since he was three years old.) February 12. P. M----, eighth ward, struck W. McB----on left eye and bruised it considerable. M----said that McB--- bothered him and called him bad names. Witnessed by D. Torpy, attendant. February 11. S. M----, ninth ward, struck J. F'---- on the eye, bruised it some. F----, said he talked plainer than M----, and M---got provoked at that and struck him. Witnessed by at- tendant W. E. Morris. April 22. W. L. M----and F. S----, eighth ward, struck J. L----, bruised his eye and a small cut over the eye. Mr. L---- pushed Mr. S----and both turned on L----. Witnessed by Jno. Oldham, attendant. April 26. F. S----scratched J. L----'s face ; Mr. S----couldn't give any reason for doing so. Witnessed by B. Humphrey, atten- dant, eighth ward. August 17. T. II-----, seventh Avard, scratched J. J----'s face in water-closet. Mr. J----said he hit T. H---- because he was in his way. October 2. J. B----, eighth ward, struck J. K---- in the mouth, cut it some. K----called B----bad names, Avas the cause. Witnessed by B. Humphrey, attendant. November 8. E. B. P----struck W. G----; blacked his eye- no cause for it that any one could find out, eighth ward. AYitnessed B. Humphrey, attendant. 1879. April 12. IT. D. II-----and J. S. P----, cigthth ward. Mr. P—;— called H---- a thief; H----struck P---- on face and bruised it. Witnessed by B. Humphrey, attendant. April 30. A. B----struck W. G----on eye, cut a little and bruised. B----said that G—bothered him. Witnessed by B. Humphrey, attendant, eighth ward. October 29. P. R. T----struck J. S. P----, each claiming the other struck first; separated by D. Torpy, assistant, eighth ward. November 3. W. S. H---- struck S. Johnson, assistant, and scratched his face ; Mr. Johnson asked Mr. II----to stop making noise ; Mr. H----struck him. Sixth ward. 1880. March 8. W. L----struck D. S---in the eye, bruised it some; 159 cause could be ascertained for the act. Witnessed by D. P Salisbury attendant. J1 April 15. Mr. P----, patient on fourth ward, struck J. R____ on left eye and bruised it badly; couldn't find anv cause for it. AYitnessed by Jno. Oldham, attendant. May 9. G. A. P---- threw J. B----down on the floor ; bruised Ins face some; couldn't find why Mr. P----done it. Witnessed by B. Humphrey, attendant. Eighth ward. May 27. M. McG---- struck I. J----, because Mr. J----called him bad name; blacked right eye some. Witnessed by attendant T. C. Williams. Eighth ward. May 31. C. F. D---struck C. W---and throwed him on the floor; couldn't give any reason fordoing so; didn't hurt Mr. C____ hardly any. Witnessed by Wm. George, attendant. Sixth ward. July 15. H. E----struck P. L----on head with chamber; cut it so doctor had to sew it; impossible to find out why he struck L----. Eighth ward, 6:30 a. m. . July 19- G-- H. E---- struck I. J----; cut and bruised his right eye, without any cause or warning. Said he didn't know why he struck Mr. J----, Eighth ward. September 10. H. IT. M----struck II. M. N----with a tumbler; cut him some on back of head; while at dinner had some words about moving the chair. Mr. N----called M----some hard names. Witnessed by B. Humphrey, attendant. Eighth north ward. October 18. C. C. M— struck A. V—— on his head with a broom while sweeping the ward ; cut him a little ; Mr. M----gives as a reason for striking V"----, that he kept running in his Avay con- tinually. Witnessed by John Philo, attendant. Eighth ward. November. A. B----struck J. K----and bruised both eves. Mr. B----said Mr. K----struck him first, because he, Mr. B^—, took him from the dining-room door. AYitnessed by D. B Salis- bury, attendant. 1881. January 9. T. B----, while attendant E. C. Williams Avas taking him to the dining-room for dinner, resisted and accidentally struck his head against the door and cut a small cut on left eye-broAv." Eighth ward. January 26. Sixth ward. M. McK---- struck D. S----; bruised his face while playing dominoes ; D. S---- called M. McK---foul names aud irritated McK---and he struck him. February 7. W. T----, seventh ward, accidentally fell in bath- room and bruised left eye ; so he tells; no one saw him. March 27. P. A. C----, eighth ward, under the delusion that F. M----was in his heels and body, struck him (M.) back of the head until his face came against the Avindow casing; bruised and cut his eyebrows. Witnessed by attendant John Philo. April 6. Eighth ward, J. McD---- took hold of C H \ 160 McD----, refusing to let him go ; C. II----struck McD —- in the eye, bruised it a little. Witnessed T. C. Williams, attendant eighth ward. . April 8. Eighth ward, W. T----struck L. M----during the night in dormitory ; bruised Mr. M----'s eye. April 25. Seventh ward, F. L---- struck E. R----on the back of his head with a mop-handle ; cut it badly. May 30. E. J. R----insisting on going through the door, and J. Ph'ilo attendant taking him from the door, both had hold of each other and fell ; Mr. R----got hurt in his ankle. May 30. During last night in the dormitory in eighth ward, T. B----and T. IT----• had some quarreling; Mr. B., it seems, struck Mr. H----, Mr. II----scratched B----'s face. June 2. Seventh ward II. F. S----suddenly jumped through the window in dormitory door ; cut his forehead, also his fingers, and a small cut on his back. June 9. Seventh ward. I). D----, while out in the garden, at- tempted to commit suicide; he suddenly laid his head before the wagon, cut his left ear and bruised his face. June 16. C. D—— kicked T. McK----while out in the yard. Mr. D----claims that McK----hit him with a stone; bruised his body, also small cut on eyebrow. June 24. F. L----struck F. II----in the face ; small bruise; couldn't find out why Mr. L----struck him. Eighth ward. C. McL----struck J. C----during the night in the dormitory, seventh ward ; cut his lip a little; couldn't find out why he, Mr. McL----, struck Mr. C——. July 5. S. B. A—— hurt his right eye during the night in cov- ered bed; bruised and a small cut. July 25. Eighth ward. S. B. A----found in the Avater-closet by attendant J. Philo, with a wround on his left ear. P. J. C--- and F. II----, tAvo patients, Avere in the closet, and both denied having injured Mr. A----. August 16. J. R. M----, sixth ward, fell off the seat in the yard and bruised his right eye ; had a fit. September 10. Eighth ward. C. D., without any cause or provocation, struck P. McC. and G. B. Y.; bruised both patients' facea. Witnessed by John Philo, attendant. September 15. Eighth ward. A. S. struck D. L. on face; , bruised his eye ; Mr. S. claims Mr. L. spit in his face. Witnessed , by John Philo, attendant. September 16. Seventh ward. T. B. fell on the stairs while going to the yard and bruised his face. November 7. Seventh ward. J. Y. P. Gardner fell out of bed during last night and bruised his face. 1882. January 13. Eighth ward. M. McC, eye bruised by T. C. 'Williams, attendant, a. e., while putting him to bed, he resisting. 161 January 24. Sixth ward. A. S. and J. C. had a dispute about sweeping the floor; Mr. S. struck Mr. C.; C. struck back and bruised Mr. S.'s face ; also bit his finger. Stopped by John Torpy, attendant. March 1. C. O. G. struck W. P. M. in the face without any cause or provocation. Witnessed by John Philo, attendant. March 6. Eighth ward. J. V. P. G. struck F. H. without any cause, and Mr. H. hit Mr. G., and he fell against the baseboard and cut his head; doctor put three stitches in it. ' Witnessed by John Philo, attendant. April 1. ^ Sixth ward. J. C. struck A. F. L. over the eye; small cut and bruise. There was no cause or provocation for Mr. C. to strike Mr. L. Stopped by John Torpey, attendant. April 5. Seventh ward. D. M. tumbled and fell against casing of the door, cut his head on the front part. Dr. Russell put a stitch in. Witnessed, attendant Williams. April 25. Eighth ward. A. L. R. fell in the yard from the bench and cut his nose. May 7. D. R. P. broke a leg off the table in the ward and Avith the intention of striking Thomas E. Williams, attendant, struck G. F. B., a patient, four blows on the head. This occurred at 5:10 a. m., soon after rising. Thomas E. Williams, R. C. Jones and R. Chittenden, attendants, stopped D. K. P. as soon as possible. May 31. Eighth ward. J. J. struck H. B. (in the dormitory) during the night ; bruised his face. June 27. C. D. C. fell in a fit in the yard ; bruised side of face. July 1. J. H. struck H. F. S., bruised his eye and side of face. Mr. H. claims that Mr. S. bothered him. It was done while they were in the water-closet. July 16. Sixth ward. J. D. fell in a fit ; small cut on left eye- brow and also on chin; July 27. H. B., seventh ward, struck J. F., eighth ward, while passing through the ward, without any cause ; bruised Mr. F.'s eye. August 3. C. McL., seventh ward, while going into the dining- room, fell against the casing of the door and bruised his eye. August 9. C. F. A., eighth ward, teased and called J. McC. harsh names, and McC. struck him on left eye; cut and bruised his face quite badly. Witnessed by D. J. Hughes, attendant. September 4. M. McG., eighth ward. Attendant D. J. Hughes in going out of the dining-room accidentally went against M. McG., and he fell against the baseboard and cut his head. September 4. F. B. D., eighth ward, fell in a fit ; bruised his eye a little. Witnessed by D. J. Bellinger, attendant. October 1. L. P. J., seventh Avard, fell in a fit, and bruised his face. Witnessed by R. Chittenden, attendant. October 14. M. McG., eighth ward, small bruise on eye; no one knows how he came by it, but supposed he fell. October 16. R. A. R., eighth ward, small bruise on right eye. 21IT 162 Mr. Bellinger while cleaning bed-room was interrupted by Mr. R, who came into the room and tipped over a pail of water. Mr, Bellinger then assisted Mr. R. to the ward and seated him, when Mr. R. suddenly turned his head and struck against the arm of the chair. 1883. January 9. J. R. struck A. S. ; cut his lips a little ; Mr. S. was teasing Mr. R. Witnessed by D. J. Bellinger, attendant eighth ward. January 10. S. S. W., without any cause, struck W. O. on the head. AYitnessed by J. W. Jones, attendant sixth ward. January 16. J. J. D., seventh ward, fell out of bed during night while in a fit; cut on head and lip. February 20. J. W., seventh ward, fell out of bed and bruised his face. February 21. G. M., eighth ward. Attendant Bellinger seated him in a chair, and Mr. M. turned his head suddenly and against the arm of the chair ; small cut on eye-brow. March 15. E. W., admitted on ninth ward, had one large bruise on chest and several on sides and cut on face, also both ears bruised. March 20. Mr. L. T., eighth ward, found this a. m. with a small cut on eye-brow ; Mr. T. said he struck his head against the bed-post during the night. April 1. J. F., eighth ward, fell on the floor and broke his col- larbone. Witnessed by D. J. Bellinger, attendant. April 16. A. L. pushed Mr. W. L. P.; both were washing them- selves, in the morning ; Mr. P. struck Mr. L. and bruised his fore- head. They were separated by Mr. J. W. Barnes, attendant sixth ward. May 2. A. J. M., ninth Avard, struck the glass door on stairway and cut his hands (not seriously), under the delusion that he was fighting some one connected with the railroad company. Seen by attendant John B. Orendorf. June 5. C. H. P., fourth ward, threw a stone and hit Mr. A. I P., seventh ward, while out in the yard ; cut on side of head. July 4. J. McC. struck T. K. on the eye ; bruised and small cut; out in the yard ; Mr. K. asked for a chew of tobacco and swore at McC, was the cause of the trouble. Witnessed by Mr. Chitten- den, attendant. July 9. J. McC. struck T. K. while out in the yard ; cut aud bruised on forehead. McC. claims that Mr. K. called him bad names. July 12. E. J. R., ninth ward, got his eye bruised during last night ; cannot find out how he got it. October 3. J. F. and L. M., ninth ward, called each other harsh names, and struck each other. Mr. F. received a black eye. Jno. Orendorf, attendant, separated them. October 7. I. AY. and P. McD., eighth ward, got in a scuffle on 163 the ward ; Mr. W. struck Mr. McD.; Mr. McD. struck back and bruised Mr. W.'s right eye. Separated by attendant Wm. M. Jones. November 25. While sweeping the seventh Avard, L. S. W. at- tempted to strike F. P. Avith the broom; P. struck Mr. W. on right eye ; bruised and cut a little under the eye. Separated by attend- ant T. E. Williams. November 29. I. W. and D. L., eighth ward, Avhile playing, L. hurt Mr. W. on the eye and bruised it. 1884. January 26. Ninth ward. E. D. II. struck F. P. D., J. F. and F. IT. Avithout any cause or provocation, the latter with his slipper, and bruised his eye (2 eye). Witnessed by attendants J. M. Jones and M. Mahony. Patient removed to fourth ward. January 30. Seventh ward. T M. struck G. S. W. on the eye; bruised it some; Mr. M. had no provocation or any reason why he struck Mr. W.; patient M. removed to ward twelve. Witnessed by attendant W. IT. Sanford. February 14. Eighth ward. C. L. struck S. II. Avhile in the water-closet about 7:30 this evening; Mr. IT. fell and got hurt in his hips. No one was present at the time. Contents of book "Record of Injuries, Third Department — North"— being Exhibit No. 6. (Instructions on first page of book as in other books.) 1876. December 2. Tenth ward. Attendant J. J. Alexander unlocked E. W.'s room door, then returned to make his own bed, the latter got up, followed and struck him on the head with his chamber pot, inflicting a slight wound which vbled freely ; cause, he thought the attendant thought he was dead, and told him to get up, and also, that his room was full of spirits. Witnessed by attendant Geo. C. Smith. December 7. Tenth ward. Attendant Geo. C. Smith was walk- ing the ward ; J. B. came up behind, without any apparent cause, and struck him a severe blow which caused him to have a black eye. Witnessed by attendant John Brady. December 27. Twelfth ward. S. 11. struck F. R. and gave him a black eye ; cause, the latter was plaguing him. Witnessed by at- tendant t. F. Dillon. December 27. Twelfth ward. B. B. struck L. G. E. a very severe blow in the stomach because he was in his way on the ward. Wit- nessed by attendant T. F. Dillon. 1877. January 7. Twelfth ward. A. A. M. was standing up against the wall, M. R. struck him a slight blow which caused both his 164 eyes to -be somewhat black ; would give no satisfactory account what he struck him for ; the latter was very much excited. Reported by attendantT. F. Dillon. January 20. Tenth ward. J. Q. became excited and without any provocation pitched on attendant John Brady and dragged him into a room unknown to any one; in scuffling the room door became closed; the latter threw him down and accidentally cut his nose; they were both very much exhausted when heard by patient W. L. b. and attendant John Halpin. February 13. Twelfth ward. D. L. some time through the night bumped B. with his head and blackened his eye slightly, and also scratched F. R. on the eye. Witnessed by patient L. G. E. March 3. Twelfth ward. D. L. struck L. W. and gave him a black eye. Witnessed by attendant Thomas Humphrey. March 10. Eleventh ward. P. O. C. struck H. W. S., an epi- leptic, and gave him a black eye; the latter struck and spit at him. Reported by attendant B. McLaughlin. March 17. Eleventh . Avard. B. D., paretic, is so feeble that he fell doAvn and received a severe cut on the head. Reported by attendant B. McLaughlin. March 20. Twelfth ward. P. O. C. in self-defense struck W. D. a very severe blow on the upper lip and cut it open, over one-half aii inch in length, the latter pitched on him and threatened to whip him. Reported by attendant B. McLaughlin. April 21. Eleventh ward. C. E. P. struck J. T. and gave him a black eye Avithout any apparent cause. Witnessed by attendant P. Coleman. April 26. Twelfth ward. G. W. S. had a stone in his hand and struck D. L., which caused one side of his face to be very much swollen and eye quite black; the latter threatened him. Witnessed by attendant Thomas Humphrey. May 14. Tenth Avard. C. S'. became excited without any cause, and told Dr. Renrick he was king of England. Struck A. B. a slight blow on the eyebrow, which caused his eye to be somewhat black. Witnessed by supervisor Barisdale. May 31. Eleventh ward. M. R. threw D. M. down in the yard and cut his nose and forehead. Witnessed by attendant Philo. June 1. Eleventh ward. J. T. struck P.O. C. in the chest, the latter returned the blow, which caused his nose to bleed freely and have a black eye'. Witnessed by Alexander Barisdale. July 9. Eleventh Avard. P. G. T. and M. T. were sitting on the bench in yard, the latter kicked the former in the eye, which caused him to have a black eye. July 10. Twelfth ward. E. R. was out in the yard ; F. K., an epileptic, struck hiin with a stone under the eye and cut him se- verely, which caused his eye to be black. Witnessed by attendant 0. Adams. July 19. Eleventh ward. M. T. struck D. M. and gave him a black eye. 165 August 5. Twelfth ward. D. L. struck I. S.; the latter returned the blow and gave him a black eye. Reported by attendant T. F. Dillon. August 8. Twelfth Avard. P. B. and I. S. got into a scuffle in the water-closet; the latter struck the former and gave him a very severe cut on the eyebrow. Witnessed by patient G. W. S. September 17. Tenth ward. C. A. K. when admitted had black eye and a lame back ; said he received those injuries in the county jail. September 30. Eleventh ward. M. T struck J. T. on the mouth and cut his upper lip ; said he heard a voice telling him to strike. M. T. told this to supervisor Alex. Barisdale. October 5. Eleventh ward. H. M. is so feeble that he 6tumbled over a rocking chair and cut his nose. Witnessed by attendant B. McLaughlin. October 25. Twelfth ward. Patient J. H. D. struck H. C. F. and gave him a black eye. Reported by attendant T. F. Dillon. October 26. Twelfth ward. Patient J. H. D. became excited in the yard ; J. L. Evans, attendant, was taking him on the ward ; coming up stairs he attacked attendant E. ; in the struggle both fell, the former accidentally striking his eye against the staircase, which cause it to be black. 1877. November 19. Tenth ward. Patient A. C. H. (epileptic) struck W. W. W. a severe blow on the eyebrow and knocked him down on the floor without any apparent cause. Witnessed by attendant Geo. F. Davis. December 18. Eleventh ward. Patient M. T., some time during the night, struck S. S. and gave him a black eye, because he opened the window in the dormitory opposite his bed. Witnessed by pa- tient H. W. S. December 28. Tenth ward. Patient J. M., without any provo- cation, struck attendant Geo. Davis on the nose, which caused blood to flow freely, and both his eyes to be somewhat black ; would give no cause for striking him. Witnessed by patient A. F. December 28. Tenth ward. Patient J. R., without any cause, slapped J. H. C. on the face; patient F. K. took J. H. C.'s part and struck J. R, which caused him to have a black eye; J. R. said he did not know he struck him, and said he must have been beside himself. 1878. January 2. Twelfth ward. Patient J. S. struck D. W. and gave him a black eye ; the former said the latter threatened to put a ball through him and also put a head on him. Witnessed by patient E. B. January 29. Twelfth ward. Patient E. B. struck S. C. E. and 166 gave him a black eye because he was quarreling with E. M. Re- ported by attendant T. F. Dillon. February 7. Tenth ward. Patient H. O. Struck C. A. R. on the eyebrow which caused his eye to be somewhat black. The for- mer was tearing up papers. The latter tried to prevent him. Reported by attendant Geo. P. Davis. March 25. Twelfth ward. Patient S. H. struck P. A. C. and gave him a black eye. Reported by attendant T. F. Dillon. April 5. Tenth ward. Some time through the night in the dor- initory, patient J. L. struch T. S. in the mouth, the latter struck the former with a chamber-pot and gave him a severe cut on the head. Reported by patient J. B. O. G. May 14. Tenth ward. Last, night in the dormitory F. P. was restless and distubing the other patients. Patient J.Cooper struck and gave him a black eye. May 23. Twelfth ward. Patient J. M. struck F. S. and gave him a very black eye, because the latter threw the former's pocket handker- chief out of the window. Reported by attendant T. F. Dillon. June 11. Tenth ward. Patient B. S. S. struck C. A. R. and gave him a black eye. The former was talking quite loud, the lat- ter told him to shut up. Witnessed by patient AY. T. C. July 4. Twelfth ward. F. S. some time through the night in the covered bed bumped his head to such an extent that he gave himself several slight cuts on the head and eyebrow. Reported by attendant T. F. Dillon. July 5, 1878. Eleventh ward. Patient Win. McB. without any provocation struck N. F. W. a slight blow, which caused his eye to be black. Wituessed by attendant B. McLaughlin. July 7. Tenth ward. F. D. became so helpless that he stumbled against the door-casing and gave himself a very black eye. Wit- nessed by attendant John Brady. July 8. Twelfth ward. Patient F. L. was going to strike patient J. E. Attendant J. L. Evans prevented him. In a few minutes afterward the former without any warning struck the latter and gave him a black eye. Witnessed'by attendant F. E. Near. July 8. Eleventh ward. At 8:30 p. m., in the dormitory, patient A. M. got up and went to A. J.'s bed and struck him iu the eye. The latter returned the blow on his nose, which caused blood to flow freely. They was having a rough and tumble fight when attendant B. McLaughlin heard and separated them. July 10. Eleventh ward. Patient F. H. became so restless in the dormitory that he would not stay in bed and was disturbing the other patients; also trying to force open the door, when he slipped and fell, ptriking his eyebrow on the bed post, which caused him to have a black eye. Witnessed by patient G. T. July 17. Twelfth ward. Patient S. IT. without apparent cause struck F. S. and gave him a black eye. Reported by attendant T. F. Dillon. July 18. Twelfth ward. Patient S. H., without any provoca- 167 tion, struck J. E. St. J. which caused his eye to be somewhat black. Reported by attendant T. F. Dillon. July 20. In the yard, patient D. W. R. fL. M., without any warning, came up behind D. D. and pushed him over on the gravel walk, and gave him a very severe cut on the eyebrow. Witnessed by attendant H. O. Jones. July 27. In the yard, IT. H. M. was sitting on the grass. J. E. G., without any cause, kicked him tAvice. The former got up and struck him above the eye and gave him a slight cut, which caused his eye to be somewhat black. August 2. Twelfth ward. Patrick F. S. attacked P. M., the latter 'threw him down against the door-casing and gave him a slight cut on top of head. Reported by attendant T. F. Dillon. August 10. Eleventh,ward. In the dormitory at 11:30 p. m., J. T. became excited and struck T. R. on the forehead with his chamber-pot and gave him a severe cut, which caused him to lose a great deal of hood. Witnessed by patient P. G. T. August 27. Twelfth ward. Patient J. E. struck L. D. R. and gave him a black eye, because he was plaguing him. Reported by attendant T. F. Dillon. August 29. Twelfth ward. L. D. R. without any provocation struck M. Root below the eye and gave him a slight cut and also a black eye. Witnessed by attendant J. L. Evans. September. Eleventh ward. F. H. Avas sitting on the seat in the Avater-closet, he attempted to get up and fell against the urine trough, cutting his upper lip so much that it had to be sewed up by Dr. Brush. Reported by attendant B. McLaughlin. October 28. Twelfth ward. Patient W. R. L. M. kicked M. E B. twice, the latter struck him and bruised one side of his face very much. Witnessed by patient A. B. December 10. Twelfth Avard. Patient W. F. Avas talking out of window; A. B. struck him on the back of the head. The former returned the blow under the eye, which caused the latter to have a black eye. Reported by patient W. F. 1879. January 2. TAvelfth Avard. Patient J. R. for no provocation at- tacked W. F. ; the latter struck him and gave him a black eye. Re- ported by attendant T. F. Dillon. January 10. Tenth ward. Patient P. G. T. Avas sitting in the recess with his foot up; J. B. O'G. passed by and rubbed against him ; the former kicked him ; the latter struck him in the eye, which caused his eye to be black. Witnessed by attendant John Brady and patient J. B. T. January 10. Eleventh ward. Patient J. F. was going to dinner; he slipped in a wet place on the dining-room floor; slipped, fell 168 down and injured his hip joint. Reported by attendants E. D. Murtagh and J. L. Evans. January 12. Eleventh ward. Patient E. W. fell down in a fit on the floor and cut his nose and forehead, from which cause his two eyes became black. Witnessed by attendant B. McLaughlin. February 5. Twelfth ward, patient R. G. struck J. T., and gave him a black eye, because he called him a son of a b----. Reported by attendant T. F. Dillon. February 6. .Eleventh ward. W. H. stumbled over the settee, fell down and struck his nose against a chair and gave himself a slight cut which caused his eye to be somewhat black. Witnessed by patient E. W. February 9. Twelfth ward. Patient A. B., for no provocation threw L. T. M. down; in falling he struck his nose on the chair Avhich caused his nose and eyes to become swollen and discolored. Reported by attendant T. F. Dillon. February 14. Eleventh ward. Patient J. E., without any cause, struck F. D. and M. P. on the nose, which caused blood to flow freely ; and also struck N. F. W. and gave him quite a Cut on top of the nose; and, in a short time afterward I. D. took a seat beside him on the settee, he then struck him in the eye, which caused his eye to be slightly discolored. Witnessed by patient P. G. T. February 17. Eleventh ward. Patient W. M. stumbled over F. D.'s feet; fell down against a chair and gave himself a severe cut on the head. Witnessed by attendant E. D. Murtagh. February 23. Tenth ward. Patient F. R. said he wanted to knock the grace of God into these patients and make better men of them. He attacked P. W. A. for that purpose. They both struck at each other, the former received a blow on the nose which caused his eye to be black. Witnessed by attendants Alexander Barris- dale and George Davis. March 3. Eleventh ward. Patient J. E. went into the Avater- closet, took up a pail of water and attempted to carry it; he stumbled and fell against the water-pipe and gave himself three slight cuts on the temple and also bruised his cheek. Witnessed by patient P. G. T. March 12. Twelfth Avard. In the dormitory J. J. became ex- cited and struck J. T., and gave him a black eye. Witnessed by attendant T. F. Dillon. March 16. Eleventh ward. Patient F. D. got up off his seat and fell down against the door-casing and gave himself quite a cut on the eyebrow. Reported by attendant B. McLaughlin. March 21. Twelfth ward." Geo. M. D. B., when admitted bore the evidence of the height of abuse; several bruised spots on his chest and back, and his two wrists lacerated as if it Avere caused by handcuffs. Reported by attendant T. F. Dillon to Dr. Hailes. April 4. Eleventh ward. Patient F. D. fell down on the floor , 169 and gave himself a slight cut on the eyebrow. Reported by at- tendant B. McLaughlin. April 5. Eleventh ward. Patient E. M. was very restless in the dormitory, and disturbing the other patients ; he was struck in the eye, which caused his eye to be very much swollen and quite black; could not find out by whom he was struck. Reported by attendant B. McLaughlin. April 13. Eleventh ward. Patient G. B. became very much ex- cited in the dormitory; was running around and disturbing the other patients; some of them struck him and gave him slight cut in the eyebrow, which caused his eye to be black. Reported by attendant John Philo. April 15. Twelfth ward Patient J. T. went to bed with his clothes on ; when attendant J. S. Evans went and got him up, he threw himself right under the bed and became very much excited, and accidentally hurt his eye, which caused him to have a black eye. Reported by attendant J. L. Evans. April 28. Tenth ward. Patient D. D. threatened E. W.; the latter struck him a severe blow, breaking the bridge of his nose, which caused blood to flow freely. Witnessed by attendant Alex, Barrisdale and patient M. B. May 15. Tenth ward. Patients D. B. H. and M. H. were sit- ting alongside of each other on the settee, they got into a dispute, the former struck the latter a slight bloAV on the eyebrow; the latter returned the blow on his nose, which caused one of his eyes to be somewhat black. Witnessed by attendant John Brady. Out on the Farm. May 15. Patients F. R. and J. S. got into a dispute about a lead pencil, the former struck the latter and gave him a black eye. Re- ported by attendant D. E. Jones. May 27. Eleventh ward. Patient J. F. P., without any provo- cation, struck M. P. and gave him a slight cut under the eye, from which cause his eye became swollen and black. Witnessed by patients P. G. T. and L. T. M. May 28. Twelfth ward. Patient L. A. attacked attendant T. F. Dillon because he took hold of him by the arm and told him to make up his own bed. The latter threw him down and accident- ally struck his head against the bed-post, and gave him quite a bruise on side of the head. Reported by attendant T. F. Dillon. July 6. Eleventh ward. J. F. P refused to go to bed. Attend- ant E. D. Murtagh had to use some force, and accidentally struck his eyebrow against the edge of the covered bed and gave him a slight cut, and also caused his eye to be somewhat black. Reported by attendant E. D. Murtagh. August 2i3. Twelfth ward. M. N. B., some time through the night, in the covered bed, gave himself a slight cut on the eyebrow, which caused his eye to be black. Reported by attendant T. F. Dillon. 22U 170 September 23. In the yard patient L. R. accidentally broke his leg above the ankle, wrestling with patient L. B. Witnessed by attendants H. O. Jones and W. McMillan. October 3. Twelfth ward. G. S. M. was struck by some of the other patients in the dormitory some time through the night. His eye Avas quite black in the morning. Reported by attendant T. F. Dillon. October 9. Twelfth ward. Patient D. S. was out working ; he turned a somersault down the embankment and bruised his eyebrow, from which cause his eve became black. Reported by attendant T. F. Dillon. October 13. Twelfth waid. Patient M. McG. became excited at the tea table and threatened to strike one of the other patients with a bowl. The attendants had to force him out of the dining- room and he accidentally fell down and gave himself a slight cut on the eyebrow. Reported by attendant T. F. Dillon. November 8. Eleventh" ward. Patient H. D. S. struck J. R. with his slipper and spat at him. The latter struck the.former in the eye, which caused it to be black. Reported by attendant B. Mc- Laughlin. November 22. Eleventh ward. IT. D. B., in a fit, bruised his face against the side of the covered bed, and also scratched it and1 drew blood in several places. Reported by attendant B. McLaugh- lin. November 30. Tenth ward. Patients Q. H. and T. H. got a quarreling in the dormitory ; the latter struck the former on the nose, which caused the blood to flow freely ; they both, had their faces scratched quite badly. Witnessed by patient I. E. D. November 30. Tenth ward. C. A. K. fell down in a fit and gave himself a slight cut on the eyebrow, which caused his eye to be very much swollen and black. Witnessed by attendant D. E. Jones Twelfth ward. J. T. and J. S. P. got a quarreling ; they struck each other; the former received a black eye and the latter three or four slight cuts on the face. Reported by attendant T. F. Dillon 1880. February 20. Eleventh ward. J. F. had become so feeble that he fell down on the ward and gave himself a slight bruise on the cheek. Witnessed by patient A. S. - February 21. Twelfth Avard. Patient M. H. struck D. S. and gave him a black eye, because the latter called him a thief and a son of a b---- Witnessed by attendant F. E. Near. March 13. Tenth ward. E. S. fell out of bed some time through the night in an epileptic fit and gave himself a slight cut on the nose; was found on floor in the morning by attendant A. Harris-; dale. March 15. TAvelfth ward. J. D. and P. R. T. were strapped to. 171 a chair; the latter unbuckled his strap and struck former with the buckle and gave him two slight cuts on the head. Reported by at- tendant T. F. Dillon. April 10. Eleventh ward. S. R. fell down and accidentally struck his eye against the chair, which caused it to be black. Wit- nessed by patient J. R. May 7. Eleventh ward. J. E. fell down coming out of the diningroom and gave himself a severe cut on the eyebrow. Re- ported by attendant B. McLaughlin. May 8. Eleventh ward. Patient P. R. T. without any provoca- tion struck J. McC. and gave him a black eye. Reported by attend- ant B. McLaughlin. May 11. Twelfth ward. Patient P. R. T. without any cause whatever strck A. W. D. and gave him a slight cut on the nose and also a black eye. Reported by attendant T. F. Dillon. May 24. Eleventh ward. H. B. had a very black eye this morn- ing which he got some time through the night; could not find out by any of the patients that roomed in the dormitory with him how or by what means he came by it. Reported by attendant B. Mc- Laughlin. May 30. Eleventh ward. J. E. fell down in the ward and gave himself a severe cut on the eyebrow, which caused his eye to be somewhat black. June 3. Tenth ward. C. R. W. threatened to strike M. F. M.; the latter struck him in the eye which caused it to be black. Wit- nessed by attendant E. D. Jones. June 17. Twelfth ward. Some of the patients unknown to any one struck J. B. out in the yard and gave him a black eye. Re- ported by attendant T F. Dillon. June 23. Twelfth ward. H. B. fell down in an epileptic fit and gave himself a very black eye in the yard. Witnessed by attendant F. A. Randall. June 24. Eleventh ward. H. W. S. fell down in an epileptic fit in the yard, and gave himself a slight cut on the nose. Wit- nessed by attendant W. R. Williams. June 26. Eleventh ward. A. M. had his coat off on the ward ; patient M. E. tried to get him to put it on ; he refused ; the latter struck him a slight blow which caused him to have a black spot on the left side of his face. Reported by attendant B. McLaughlin. July 8. Twelfth ward. A. W. D. has become very feeble. He stumbled and fell down on the ward, and gave himself a slight cut on the eyebrow, and also his eye to be somewhat black. Reported by attendant A. E. Clark. July 19. Eleventh ward. J. R. became dizzy and fell down against the chair, and gave himself a slight cut on the eye, which caused his eye to become black. Reported by attendant B. McLaughlin. August 25. Twelfth ward. Out in the yard patient Gt. E. struck 172 J. McG. in the eye, which caused it to be discolored. Reported by attendant J. J. Ellis. . -~ September 4. Twelfth ward. Out in the yard patient D. b kicked G. H. in the privates, which caused them to be very much swollen and black. Reported by attendant Jas. Brady. September 5. Twelfth ward. Patient J. S. P. struck^F. S. and gave him a black eye. The latter was plaguing him. Reported by attendant T. F. Dillon. . September 10. Twelfth ward. G. H. hurt his right hand by striking it against a chair on the ward. Reported by attendant T. F. Dillon. September 27. Twelfth ward. Patient J. McG. struck J. B. with- out provocation and gave him a black eye. Reported by attendant T. F. Dillon. September 28. Eleventh ward. H. W. S. became excited in the yard; he was spitting at and threatening other patients, J. McG. struck him a very severe blow in the eye, which caused it to be very much SAvollen and black. Reported by attendant J. J. Ellis. October 9. Eleventh ward. A. M.'came out of the dormitory in the morning with black eye and also black spot on his forehead. Reported by attendant W. R. Williams. October 20. Eleventh ward. A. W. D. fell down on the floor and gave himself a severe cut on the eyebrow, in which Dr. Russell put two or three stitches. Reported by attendant B. McLaughlin. December 10. Eleventh Avard. A. K. C. has become so feeble that he cannot walk without assistance. This morning he attempted to walk to the dining-room and fell down striking his face on the floor, which caused his left eye to be very black. Witnessed by attendants J. J. Ellis and J. D. Ferris. December 11. Eleventh ward. M. L. struck H. W. S. a severe blow on the nose which caused blood to fioAv freely and also his left eye discolored. Reported by attendant J. D. Ferris. December 30. Eleventh wrard. A. M. was struck by some of the patients that roomed with him; he came out of the dormitory in the morning with a bruised eye. Reported by attendant 13. Mc- Laughlin. February 15. Twelfth ward. P. R. T. without any provocation struck J. C. a severe blowT on the nose which caused his nose to be very much swollen and his left eye to become black. Reported by attendant T. F. Dillon. March 2. Twelfth ward. J. C. struck W. N. M. and gave him a black eye because he was plaguing him. Reported by attendant T. F. Dillon. March 15. Tenth ward. C. R. struck A. F. on the eyebrow, which caused his eyelid to be quite black, for calling him a young scoundrel. Witnessed by patient M. B. 1881. March 23. Eleventh ward. C. T. W. struck C. C. and gave him 173 a black eye because the latter insisted on taking his paper away from him. Witnessed by attendant B. McLaughlin. March 22. Twelfth ward. E. D. C. became excited and struck W. L, in the eye, which caused it to be somewhat black. Witnessed by attendant J. J. Ellis. April 12. Twelfth ward. P. R. T. bumped his face against the covered bed which caused both his eyes to be somewhat black. Reported by attendant T. F. Dillon. # April 24. Eleventh ward. R. F. N. was taken with a fit, some time through the night, and gave himself a slight cut on the eye- brow. Reported by attendant B. McLaughlin. May 7. Twelfth ward. P. R. T. fell down in a fit and gave himself quite a bruise on the temple. Reported by attendant J. J. Ellis. May 18. Eleventh Avard. J. r. B. stumbled and fell down and struck his eyebrow against the door-casing which caused it to be quite black. Reported by attendant B. McLaughlin. May 25. Tenth ward. This morning J. T. passed by the water- closet with his chamber ; C. R. took hold of his arm to direct him, he turned on him and struck him with his chamber and gave him a severe cut on the left temple. Witnessed by patient J. B. T. May 26; Eleventh ward. A. B. P. came out of the dormitory this morning with two black eyes, and his face very much bruised ; E. P. attacked him sometime through the night, struck and jumped on him. Witnessed by patient G. D. May 31. Eleventh ward. E. P. struck at R. B. out in the yard; the latter returned the blow in the eye, which caused it to be dis- colored. Witnessed by attendant J.'J. Ellis. June 3. Eleventh ward. J. A. L. came out of the dormitory this morning with a slight cut on the eyebrow ; he must have been struck by some of the other patients. Reported by attendant B. McLaughlin. June 17. Tenth ward. C. R. undertook to hold J. R. on the seat out in the yard ; the latter took hold of the former by the thumb on the right hand and almost twisted it out of joint. Reported by U. lv. June 23. Tenth ward. D. C. M. became excited and attacked G. W. T.; attendant John Brady went to his assistance, and in the struggle he accidentally struck his eyebrow against the door-casing and gave himself a severe cut, from which cause his eye became very black. Witnessed by attendant A. E. Clark. June 28. Eleventh ward. J. P. B. attempted to walk; fell down and struck the left side of his head against the floor, which caused him to have a bruised ear. Witnessed by attendant 0. Ladd. July 13. Eleventh ward. J. B. was discovered with a black eye; he is very feeble and in attempting to rise fell on the side of his face; the patients who sleep in the dormitory were questioned, but could not give a satisfactory account. Reported by attendant B. McLaughlin. 174 July 25. Twelfth ward. H. C. came out of the dormitory this morning with a very black eye; he attempted to strike Mr. L. dur- ing the night, the first time he was told to get back to bed and did so, but he tried to strike Mr. L. again when the patient defended himself. Reported by attendant T. F. Dillon. In the struggle Mr. L. gave Mr C. a severe bite on the thumb of left hand. July 28. Twelfth Avard. Mr. E. D. C. was a little excited this morning when he got up and Avas talking to himself when Mr. R. got mad because he was making so much noise and struck at him, when Mr. C. scratched Mr. R.'s face and discolored his eye a little. Reported by attendant R. D. Jones. August 16. Eleventh ward. B. S. stumbled and fell down against the seat in the water-closet, and gave himself a severe cut on the eyebrow. Witnessed by patient H. B. August 18. Tenth ward. C. D. C. without any cause or provo- cation struck attendant Alex. Barrisdale and gave him a slight cut on the head, which caused blood to flow freely. Witnessed by patients J. A., F. S., AY. O. and P. H. August 22. Twelfth ward. C. D. C. fell off the beuch in the yard in a tit, Avhen he got over it he complained of a pain in the ankle; when examined his ankle was found to be swollen. Re- ported by attendant T. F. Dillon and J. D. Ferris. A. F. October 3. Eleventh wrard. J. D. L. became excited and at tempted.to walk off in a hurry ; he stumbled and fell down against the chair and gave himself a bruised nose, and also a slight cut on the left temple. Witnessed by attendant B. McLoughlin. October 10. Twelfth ward. R. B. struck C. C. M. on the nose which caused both his eyes to be somewhat black; the former said his grandmother rose from the dead and had her in bed with him; the latter came to his bed and insulted her; for which cause he struck hiui. Witnessed by attendant P. Crave. October 21. Tenth ward. A. F. was stooped down in the water-closet washing his eyes. D. C. M. came behind him and gave him a kick ; the former grappled with him to put him out of the closet; in the scuffle he scratched D. C. M's. face. Reported by £ November 2. Twelfth ward. P. R. T. came out of his room this morning with a black eye ; I cannot find out in what manner he got it. Reported by attendant T. F. Dillon. December 24. Tenth ward. D. C. M. fell down and accident- ally gave himself a slight cut on the nose. Reported by attendant J. D. Ferris. 1882. January 3. Eleventh ward. W. F. M. fell down in the water- closet against the urinal and gave himself a bruised eye, and also two scratches, one under the eye and on the nose. Reported by at- tendant O. Ladd. 175 January 15. Tenth ward. I. A. C. and J. C. quarreled in the water-closet about a.paper ; C. struck Curtiss a severe blow on the nose, which caused blood to flow freely, and his nose to have a bruised appearance, and also black under both eyes. Witnessed by attendant J. D. Ferris. February 1. Tenth Avard. A. II. came out of the dormitory with a black eye; he got up some time through the night, and with- out any provocation choked R. C. ; then went to M. M.'s bed and awoke him up; the latter struck him in the eye, which caused it to be very much swollen and black; the reason lie gave was that he was dreaming. Reported by patients R. C. and M. M. February 6. Twelfth ward. T. I. struck R. B. and gave him a black eye because he spat at him. Reported by attendant T. F. Dillon." February 6. Twelfth ward. T. I. Avas walking on the ward ; H. M. N. came behind him and struck him on the head ; I. re- turned the blow on his nose and head, Which caused his nose to have a bruised appearance, and also sprained his own hand. February 23. Eleventh ward. C. S. struck attendant J. F. on the head ; the latter took him by the arm to set him down ; he jerked his arm away from him, fell and struck his left cheek against a chair Avhich caused it to have a bruised appearance. Reported by attendant J. Farrely. April £6. Eleventh ward. C. L. was walking the ward ; he accidentally fell and gave himself a slight cut on the eyebrow and a very black eye. Reported by B. McLaughlin. May 6th. Eleventh ward. J. L. was going over the fence to es- cape from the yard attendant; Mr. Townsend caught hold of him by the feet to take him down, when he accidentally fell and gave himself a slight cut under the chin. May 30. Tenth ward. R. T., without any provocation, struck I. A. C. in the eye, which caused it to be very much swollen and black. Witnessed by attendant J. B. Ferris. June 7. Twelfth wrard. G. D. K., the day he was admitted to the asylum, when he was taking a bath, the attendant discovered bruised spots on his body ; one large spot on the right side of the chest, one on the back part of the left hip, not so large as the for- mer; the small of the back was also discolored. Witnessed by at- tendants J. W. Sage and Alex. Barrisdale. > June 11. Tenth ward. J. L. was sitting in the veranda asleep; C. P. M. jumped up very much excited and struck him two blows in the face before attendant Jno. Brady could prevent him ; he said L. was talking about him and his people, and calling his Avife a whore. L. has a cut nose and a black eye. June 16. Twelfth ward. G. D. became very much excited in the dormitory ; was talking quite loud and disturbing other pa- tients ; F. IT. struck him with a tin chamber-pot, and gave him a severe cut on the eyebrow. Reported by attendant J. W. Sage. 176 July 14. Twelfth ward. In the yard J. H. struck G. D. in the chest, knocked him down and gave him a slight kick in the eye-brow which caused him to have a black eye. Reported by attendant C. A. Scharmer. July 23. Tenth ward. G. J. F. fell out of bed in an epileptic fit on his face, which caused his nose and one of his eyes to have a bruised appearance. Witnessed by attendants A. Barrisdale. J. G. Thomas and J. Isdale. ,July 24. Twelfth ward. M. L. when coming out of the covered bed with the muff on, he stumbled, fell and struck his right temple against the door casing, which caused it to have a very bruised ap- pearance. Witnessed by attendant E Powell. Aug. 10. Tenth ward. H. R. struck E. S. and gave him a slight cut on the nose; the former accused the latter of tearing a book that he owned. Aug. 20. Tenth ward. N. A. G. fell in an epileptic fit and gave himself a severe cut on the eyebrow ; from which cause his eye became black. Witnessed by attendant J. G. Thomas. September 20. J. C. without any cause or provocation attacked attendant B. M. McLaughlin and struck him a severe blow on the eye, and knocked him over against the wall; before he recovered he struck him several blows in the face, then denied attacking him, and said that he did not know that he done so. Reported by attend- ants B. McLaughlin and J. W. Keon. November 2. Twelfth ward. IT. C. attacked attendant J W. S. in the dormitory and threw two chamber-pots at him ; in the strug- gle the attendant threw him, in falling he accidentally struck his eye against the bed-post, from which cause a bruised eye. Reported by attendant J. W. Sage. November 5. Eleventh ward. J. J. D. fell out of bed this morning in an epileptic fit, from which cause his eye was slightly bruised. Reported by attendant B. McLaughlin. November 7. Tenth ward. D. J. some time through the night struck J. F. and gave him a black eye, because he Avas restless and disturbing him in his bedroom. November 10. Eleventh ward. C. G. and J. J. D. got a quar- reling over a spittoon ; the latter struck the former and gave him a slight cut under the eye, from which cause his eye became very much swollen and black. Witnessed by patients J! L. and I. B. November 20. Tenth ward. This morning A. S. was going along shuffling his feet and spitting on the ward. Attendant J. D. F. cautioned him about it. He took hold of a chair, as if he was going to strike him with it. They grappled with each other. In the struggle the attendant got a very severe blow in the eye, Avhich caused it to be very much swollen and black. November 21. Twelfth ward. H. F. S. struck G. D. a slight blow with the broom-handle on the eyebrow, because he attempted to stop him from sweeping, which caused his eye to be somewhat black. Reported by attendant J. W. Sage. • 177 November 23. Eleventh ward. J. S. B. fell off his chair and gave himself a bruised eye. Reported by attendants B. McLaugh- lin and T. D. Roberts. December 3. Twelfth ward. F. McS. Avas sitting quietly in a chair. W. L. gave him a slap on the ear. The former struck him a heavy blow and gave him quite a cut on the temple. Witnessed by attendant J. W. Sage. 1883. January 30. Twelfth ward. II. C. ran against J. E. and threw him down. He struck his cheek-bone against the floor and gave himself a slight bruise, from which cause his eye became black. Reported by attendant J. W. Sage. March 16. Tenth ward. L. S. was sitting quietly on a chair. J. H., without any cause or provocation, struck him and gave him slight cut on the nose.' AYitnessed by attendant A. Barrisdale. ' March 22. Twelfth ward. J. E. went out to take exercise. As soon as he got out, he sat down in the snow and refused to go further. Attendant J. Isdale Avent to lift him up and assist him along. D. R., without any warning, ran up and gave him a severe kick in the side. March 28. Twelfth ward. D. R. Avas sitting on a chair. F. H., as he was passing .along the Avard, spoke to him ; the former got up and struck him on the cheek-bone, which caused his eye to have a bruised appearance. AYitnessed by attendants J. W. Sage, J. T. Davis and S. G. Barnes. March 30. Eleventh ward. J. W. B. was taking D. C. M. to the Avater-closet; the latter has a habit of throwing himself around, and accidentally struck eyebrow against the door, causing his eye- lashes to have a bruised appearance. Reported by attendant B. McLaughlin. April 3. Tenth Avard. J. G. F. was out with other patients tak- ing exercise; he became excited and violent; he had several quar- rels Avith patients, then he attacked patient J. F., when he struck him and gave him a black eye. AYitnessed by attendant F. G. Barnes. April 9. Tenth Avard. T. E. Avas helping the attendants to sweep ; he told G. A. B. to leave his Avay, and raised the broom as if he were going to strike ; the latter attacked him violently and struck him several blows before the attendants could separate them ; one in the eye, Avhich caused his eye to be very much swollen. Wit- nessed by attendants J Brady and A. Barrisdale. April 10. Tenth ward. J. IT. Avas spitting on the floor ; attend- ant Isdale told him he ought to spit in the spittoon ; as the attendant turned to go away, the former struck him, knocked him down and gave him a slight cut on the head. AYitnessed by attendant John Brady. April 11. Eleventh Avard. C. G. came out of the dormitory this 23U 178 . morning with a slight cut on the nose. Reported by attendant B. McLaughlin. April 14. Eleventh ward. D. C. M. came out of the covered bed this morning with a bruised eye. Reported by attendant B. McLaughlin. May^8. Eleventh ward. A. S., without any provocation, struck R. D. and gave him a slight cut on the eyebrow, from which cause his eye became black. Reported by attendant D. J. Bellinger. May 15. Eleventh ward. M. S. K. and H. W. S. quarreled and got into a scuffle; the former accidentally struck his eyebrow against the chair and gave him a slight cut and also a bruised eye. Reported by attendant D. J. Bellinger. ' May 27. Eleventh ward. G. M. came out of the dormitory this morning with a bruised eye. Reported by attendant D. J. Bellin- ger. June 8. Eleventh ward. J. E. C. was sitting with his back against a tree in the yard ; J. F. without any warning or provoca- tion gave the former a severe kick on the head and also a slight cut. June 9. Eleventh ward. Dr. N. came out of the dormitory this morning Avith a bruised eye. Reported by attendant D. J. Bellin- ger. : June 16. Twelfth ward. F. K. was struck in the eye with a stone thrown by W. B. L., a patient. Witnessed by attendant Henry Pflanz. June 27. Tenth ward. P. McD. and J. W. N. got into a scuffle on the hall and before the attendants could separate them Mr. N. struck Mr. D. on the eye Avhich caused it to turn[black. Witnessed by attendant J. Brady. July 16. Twelfth ward. R. C. came out of the water-closet yes- terday with a slight cut over the left eye; he said Mr. H. struck him, but for what reason I could not find out. Reported by attend- ant Richards. July 17. Tenth ward. While Mr. R. Avas mopping out his room this morning Mr. N. went to him and asked him for the mop ; Mr. R. handed it to him and at the same time struck him over the left eye and cut him slightly. Reported by attendants Gossin and Pflanz. August 6. Eleventh ward. As Mr. C. was passing Mr. S., the latter 6pit in Mr. C.'s face, and before an attendant could get to them Mr. C. struck Mr. S. in the left eye Avhich caused it to turn black. Reported by attendant J. R. Jones. August 7. Tenth Avard. Mr. B. and Mr. C. got into a scuffle on the ward, and before an attendant could get to them Mr. C. struck Mr. B. in the eye which caused it to turn black. Reported by at- tendant R. J. Gossin. August 11. Tenth ward. Mr. J. G. F. was found lying on the floor this morning when his door Avas opened; he must have had a fit and fell out of bed as his nose Avas slightly scratched and the floor covered with blood. Reported by attendant Gossin, K. J. 179 August 15. As Mr. L. was walking up and down the ward this morning he met Mr. R. and instead of turning out for him he pushed him aside. Mr. R. then struck Mr. L. in the nose and once over the right eye and cut him slightly. Reported by attendant W. W. Richards. August 30. Mr. IT. and M. F. were out in the lot to work with the rest of the men. Mr. H. called Mr. F. some names and offered to strike him with a potato hook, he had in his hand. Some of the attendants separated them, and as they Avere coming in Mr. F. walked up to Mr. IT. and struck him over the left eye and cut him so that it had to be stitched. Reported by attendant R. J. Gossin. September 12. Twelfth ward. While Mr. P. was in a disturbed condition this morning he struck Mr. G. without cause or provoca- tion. Mr. R. seeing him strike him Avent and separated them. Mr. P. then turned on him and injured him about the side and elbow, and in the scuffle Mr. P. received injuries about the face and hand. Reported by attendant W. W. Richards. September 16. As the patients were going into the yard this morning Mr. F. ran against Mr. J. S. P., a fellow patient, who be- came very angry at him, and struck him with a piece of brick and cut him slightly on the head. Reported by attendant W. H. San- ford. September 24. Mr. F. H. was in the water-closet this morning and had an earthen chamber in his hand, swinging it around. Mr. C, a felloAv patient thought he intended to hit someone with it and tried to take it away from him. Mr. H. became very much excited and struck Mr. C. Avith it on the right side of the face and head and cut him slightly. Reported by attendant J. R. Jones. October 9. Mr. T. B. became very much disturbed last night and broke some Avindows in his room, and in doing it cut his right hand and finger slightly. Reported by attendant W. W. Richards. November 12. As the patients were coming up the stairs from the yard, Mr. S. caught hold of Mr. P.'s coat, the latter became very much offended at him and kicked Mr. S. in the face, just below the eye. which caused it to swell and turn black. Reported by attend- ant AY. H. Sanford. November 22. Eleventh ward. As Mr. Jones, an attendant, was giving Mr. S. a bath this evening he got out of the bath-tub, and in trying to get him in again he struck the bridge of his nose against the tub," which caused it to bleed and swell, and the corner of his eyes to turn black. Reported by attendant R. H. Jones. 1884. January 16. Eleventh ward. Mr. J. B. was admitted to the eleventh ward, January 16th, his right eye Avas^ blackened, and his body, arms, and legs were bruised and the skin knocked off in places, it being done before entering the building. February 6. Mr. W. became very much disturbed in the dinin room and annoyed the patients so that he had to be removed out on 180 the ward, and in doing it a lively scuffle ensued, in Avhich Mr. W.'s arm was slightly bruised, while trying to set him in a chair. Re- ported by attendant AV. AY. Richards. February 12. Mr. II. W. S. while having a fit this morning fell and struck* his face against the bed, which caused his eyes to be dis- colored. Reported by attendant R. J. Gossin. February 13. Mr. l». P. Avas struck in the right eye by a fellow patient, Mr. W., without any cause or provocation whatever. Re- ported by attendant R. J. Gossin. February 15. While Mr. Bremiller was cutting Mr. M. L.'s finger nails this morning he resisted and attacked Mr. Bremiller, when Mr. W. interfered and attacked Mr. Bremiller also, and in trying to free himself from both of them Mr. AY. was pushed against the casing of the door in such a way that he struck his nose against it, which caused it t3 become swollen. Reported by attendant F. Bremiller. Giles A. Penny, sworn and examined, testified as follows: By Mr. Morgan : Q. Where do you reside? A. Unadilla Forks. Q. Otsego county ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How long have you lived there ? A. Always. Q. What is your age? A. Forty-one. Q. You are a married man ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Have you any family other than your wife? A. Yes, sir; I have children. Q. How many ? A. Five. Q. Children by a former wife? A. Yes, sir; three of them are. Q. And two by your present Avife? A. Yes, sir. Q. AVhat is your occupation ? A. I am a farmer. Q Have you always been a farmer? ■ A. Yes, sir; except a few months that I worked in Remington's employ at I lion. Q. AVhat was your father's name? A. Alvah Penny. Q. Your father was a justice of the peace of that town for a good many years, Avas he not? A. Yes, sir. 181 Q. Did you become a patient at the New York State Lunatic Asylum at Utica, at any time? A. Yes, sir; I was an inmate of that institution. Q. When were you taken to that Asylum ? A. Twentieth day of February. Q. And you were taken there as a pay patient? A. Yes, sir. Q. Upon what ward Avere you placed ? A. The seventh Avard. Q. Do you remember who the physician was who was in charge of the seventh ward ? A. Dr. Brush and Dr. Josselyn was together, they came through the ward together; I don't knoAV that any of them had any par- ticular charges. Q. AYho was the supervisor of that ward ? A. This man avIio went away just now, Mr. Jones. Q. Who were the attendants on that ward when you went there? A. Mr. Salsbury; I don't knoAV his first name; Ezra Pugh and Hughie Hughes. Q. Which of them was the head attendant ? A. Mr. Salsbury. Q. AArhat is the character of the patients of the seventh ward? A. AYhile I Avas there it was the patients that would refuse to eat their meals ; he was considered a very good man for attendant. Q. Do you mean the melancholia patients ? A. No, sir, I don't know as they were that; they would talk with yon and they could talk, and would talk if you wanted to. Q. How iong did you remain in the Asylum? A. I Avas there one year or a little longer; fourteen months and nine days; I was discharged the last day of April, 1881 ; I never had any writings, but they wrote to my friends saying that I was ready to go home. Q. And you considered yourself as recovered ? A. Yes, sir, as much as I ever would probably. Q. Did you remain on the seventh ward all the time you were there ? A. No, sir ; I was there about two or three weeks only, then I was removed. Q. Then where were you taken ? A. On to the sixth ward. Q. Who was the suprvisor of that ward ? * A. That is in the same division and Mr. Jones Avas the supervisor. Q. But there were different attendants ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Who Avas the head attendant on that ward ? A. Lou. Johnson and Johnnie Dillon at that time; witli the help of the "super," he helped some. Q. How long did you remain on the sixth Avard ? A. I was there two or three Aveeks. 182 Q. Then upon what Avard did you go ? 'A. I kept going along down, and went from six to three. Q. How long did you remain on ward three ? A. Two. or three weeks I should judge. Q. Then where were you taken ? A. On to Avard tAvo. Q. How long did you remain on ward two ? A. About two weeks. Q. Then no to what ward did you go ? A. I remember the time, it was the first day of April, or the second day of April, that I left No. 2 ward and was put clear back on to ward No. 8. Q. Do you remember why it was that you were transferred from ward to ward so rapidly ?; A. The attendants told me that I was getting right along ; I felt better; and I rested more and the medicine that they gave me seemed to cure me and I got along very well; I never had a word with any one; I went along pleasantly until I came down there to Avard two, that is next to the visiting-room; they said then they thought I would be ready to go home soon; and I expected to go home and to get home in time enough^to go to spring Avork ; I felt as well as ever up to that time. Q. So that the change from ward to ward was a progress toward recovery ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What was the reason of your changing to ward eight ? A. I don't know. Q. Do you recollect whether you were improved or Avorse after you got to ward two ? A. From that time after they had put me back, I grew worse; they told me then that just before my sister came and Avanted to take me home; my sister, Carrie Wheeler, had a notion of taking me home, and had come to take me home; they would not let me see her ; I said to them if you will let me know when they will let me go, I won't say any thing more about it; but they did not want her to see me, although she stayed there without her dinner waiting to see me; then she said they Avonld not let me go ; the doctors came round pretty soon after that and said to me that if I got away in quite a while (I don't knoAV as they stated the time), but " in a year or so," that I would do pretty well; and that discouraged me audi felt bad, still I did? not say any thing to any one about it; that night while I was in my room and asleep, I was woke up by two attendants rushing into my room ; they took and carried me off and would not let me walk; I Avas well acquainted with them, and I said I could walk; but they insisted on shoving and pullino- and they went a round-about way, and took me to eighth ward -°went along the side passages. Q. You say you were carried and pushed by the attendants ? A. Yes, sir. 183 Q. Who were those attendants',? A. Homer Jones was one of them; I don't know as I can SAveai to the other, but I remember him very well. Q. Do you know avIio the other one was ? A. No, sir, I do not; I could not swear to the rest of them. Q. When you were taken to the eighth ward what disposition Avas made of you ? A. 1 Avas thrown upon a mattress on the floor in the eighth dormi- tory ; they threAV me on to that; they had nothing to put over me at all. Q. Did they dress you before they took you away from the other ward ? A. No, sir, and they did not bring my clothes; they went right out and locked the door ; there were six or eight bedsteads there; it Avas in the night, and I had no bedstead ; they put me on a mat- tress on the floor Avith my head toward the flue or ventilation hole ; the draft disturbed me and I got up. Q. After leaving you there they left you upon that mattress and went out of the room ? A. Yes, sir. Q. AVhat season of the year was this ? A. That was about the 5th day of April ; I should judge it Avas somewhere from the 1st to the 5th of April. Q. The room was warmed, I suppose, as the other rooms Avere by hot air ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What year Avas this ? A. 1880. Q. The April following you Avere removed ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What next occurred after you were put in there; you say they went out and locked the door ? A. It disturbed these men that were in there ; Avhen the attend- ants came in and threw me down there, I Avas afraid to 'stay there, I at as kind of frightened and I tried to get up when they did, and go out with them, but they closed the door and locked it, after throw- ing me down there ; I went back and laid down but it had disturbed the rest of the men that were in there and made them uneasy, and I thought they would pitch right on to me ; I did not know their condition, so I got right up; thinks I, if they are going to pitch on to me I am going to do the best I can ; so I got up, but there was no violence from the patients whatever at that time ; still they got up and walked round, and one of them tried to shove up the window, and they walked round ; I partly sat on the bed and at that time I lost consciousness, and I did not remember any thing more till I found mysely strapped in a chair outside of the ward in the morning with my clothes on ; there Avere a lot of men in the other chairs hollering and swearing and they were very violent, but 184 I cannot tell who they were; I knew before this of one of them, who he Avas. Q. The next you remember of it was that the next morning you found yourself strapped in a chair ? A. Yes, sir; strapped to the benches, there is a long seat —a bench. Q. Then Avhat occurred ? , A. I was in restraint then, and I was kept strapped in front of the attendant's door on that first day for a long while. Q. Describe to the committee the manner in which you were strapped? A. The strap is about two inches and a half wide, made of russet leather, and it is passed around your waist and round back of the chair; then the strap is drawed up; they draw that up and strap you right there ; its an awful thing to be strapped up like that; some- times two or three of them pull it and they get it so tight that you can't breathe ; I have seen some of them drawed up with straps until I thought they were dead ; they would be all dark, you know. Q. Can you give* the name of any patient who Avas strapped until he fainted ? A. Yes, sir, I can; Giles A. Penny. Q. I do not refer to you personally, but were there any others? A. At that time I did not pay any attention to names of any- body, but I have seen G. IT. strapped. Q. II. of S. ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Any others ? A. A fellow named Booth; I have seen him. Q. NowT, how were your hands or arms secured Avhen you Avere strapped in the way you have described ? A. They were strapped in, and after that the doctor came in and told "[Bess" Humphreys, the attendant; it was Dr. Josslyn that came in, and Humphreys said to the doctor, " he is too many for me (meaning me). f Q. That is, Humphreys told the doctor that you were too many for him, Humphreys? A. Yes, sir; and the doctor says then, "you must use the camisole on him." Q. Describe the camisole. A. It is made out of coarse canvas, the same as is used on board ship; it is very coarse, heavy stuff; it opens on the back and you slip your handsTuto it and then they come together like that (indicat- ing) ; there are two button holes worked in the center, and they will pass the strap round you through the button-holes and that draws your hands in towards your stomach like that (indicating). Q. So that they are pressed hard against the stomach ? A.' Yes, sir; then there is a buckle on the straps that comes against your backbone ; the worst attendants leave it against your back, where it hurts; but some of the attendants would turn it around on to the side ; it would hurt the back until it got to be a regular 185 sore, you know ; then they would turn it around ; I have moved it for other patients to get it off of that spot on the back ; I would walk up to them and move the strap around; I knew what was the matter with them for I have had it myself. Q. How long Avere you kept in a camisole? A. They took it off me sometime afterward when I went on the eighth ward. Q. What kind of bed do they give you on that ward ? A They gave me a good bed after that; when I was taken out of tlnU room and taken to the dormitorv and afterward was put into this chair in front of the attendant's door, and strapped there, I remained there, as nigh as I could guess at it, 'maybe three weeks. Q. Were you ever put into the covered bed ? A. Yes, sir; in the crib ; you have a sense of feeling that you are confined, you cannot raise up and you cannot turn over; that is I could not turn over because I had tlie camisole on. Q. Could you have turned over in the covered bed if you had not the camisole on ? A. Yes, sir; you can turn over without that on. Q. Did they keep the camisole on you night and day ? A. Not on that Avard, they did not. Q. Did you have a covered bed in that ward ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And you did not have the camisole on all the time when you were in bed ? A. No, sir, not on that ward; they "cribbed " me always when I was there, except this first night, that is, after I was sent back from ward two to ward eight; then they "cribbed" me all the while I remained on that ward. Q. How long did you remain there on that ward ? A. I should say it Avas about two weeks, perhaps three; it might have been longer than that, I cannot say as to that prccisely,"be- cause I have kind of lost my reckoning of that time. Q. State what you saw in the w-ay of violence toward patients by attendants, and if you can. give the names of the attendants that used the violence ? A. They all pounded, and kicked, and struck, you know. Q. Give the names of the parties who did it, and who thev were that were struck ? A. I saw Bess Humphreys throw a man backward when he was going into his room ; his name was L. ; he threw him back and he struck his head on the threshold of the door; then he halted a min- ute or two and came back and kicked him in the sides; that is, the attendant came back after the rest of them walked round and over him, and he got down to the dining-room ; he kicked him and he crawled up on his hands and knees ; Avhile he was on his hands and knees he would kick him again, and after a while he kicked him so that he got up. 24 U 186 Q. What was the final result of that? A. He went on ; he went on to his dinner; and that was the last I ever saw of this man ; I never saw him afterward. Q. You don't know Avhat became of him ? A. No, sir. Q. Do you know any other case upon ward eight, where there was any cruelty; if so, give the name of the patient and of the attendant ? A. Do you mean other than in my own case ? Q. I refer to others than yourself? A. I don't know as I can give you any particulars. Q. Now give us your own treatment on ward eight ? A. They do not allow them to have any water on that ward, that is, there is no arrangement for water; it is a hard ward; the fau- cets are taken off of the water'pipes so'that you cannot get a drink of water yourself. Q. You have to call on an attendant ? A. Yes, but they would never give yon any water if you asked them for it. Q. How did you get water ? A. You got what you got at the table; of course they have coffee or something at the table to drink. Q. Are they not permitted to have water on the wards ? A. No, sir, there is no access to water on that ward. Q. I mean this, do they not have water there ? A. No, sir; not on the ward. Q. All the drink you got there was at meal times ? A. Yes, sir; during all this time I was not allowed to go out from the ward to my business ; I Avas strapped to the chair and they used to bring me some oatmeal with some milk on it, that is all I had. Q. Were you allowed no other drink than the milk in the oat- meal ? A. No, sir. Q. How long were you kept on oatmeal and milk without other drink ? A. As long as I was there on that ward, three weeks; but I did get water by stealing away when the rest of them were away in the dining-room; the boys have ice water by themselves; they have their victuals ; and they have ice water, and I used to go and cet some in that way. Q. Did you ask the attendants for water ? A. Oh, yes, sir. Q. What did they say to you ? A. That they would let you have water when they got ready ; it was very seldom that I got a drink of water when Tasked for it. Q. AYere there times that you suffered with thirst * A. Oh, yes, sir.^ Q. That"was on'the eighth ward? 187 A. Yes, sir. Q. What was the physician's name on that ward ? A. The same ones ; I never saw the physician only once while I was there, and that wras when Dr. Josselyn came there and ordered these restraints put on me—the camisole. Q. And you never saw him while you were on that ward again ? A. No, sir. Q. Did you see any physician on that ward ? A. No, sir.. Q. While you Avere on that ward did you see Dr. Gray ? A. No, sir. Q. When did you first see Dr. Gray after being taken to the Asylum ? A. I see him when they first took me in, but that was all ; he had made an examination and he had said something to my friends but he never said any thing to me. Q. Did he make any personal examination of you by looking at your eyes or tongue ? A. Not at all. Q. When did you next see Dr. Gray ? A. I saAv him on the eighth ward the second Sunday after I was put in there. Q. And did he talk with you then ? A. No, sir. Dr. Brush says : Here is the man that came in in a bag—they brought me in therein a bag—" Yes," says Dr. Gray, " I know him," then he turned his head and left the ward, he did not speak to me. Q. And you think that during the period of three weeks while you were on Avard eight the second time, you did not see Dr. Gray at all ? A. No, sir, I did not. Q. And only saw Dr. Josselyn once ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you see Dr. Brush at any time? A. Yes, sir, I saw him Avhen I was on the seventh ward. Q. Hoav was it in regard to the eighth ward? A. I saw him about once a week, perhaps oftener than that. Q. What other physician did you see on the eighth ward ? A. No other. Q. After they had kept you in this restraint for about three weeks, then what Avas done ? A. Then I was put on to ward four from eight, that is the vio- lent ward; then I had the camisole on and was not allowed to take it off, excepting that the strap was off, so that it was less trouble- some. Q. Do you remember who the head attendant was on ward four? A. Yes, sir. Q. Who Avas it ? A. Dan Torpey. 188 Q. AVho were the other attendants? A. John Philo, he was the dining-room man. Q. He was a New Hartford man ? A. I don't know where he was from, and the other Avas Jones; I cannot remember his given name, but he Avas a Welshman. Q. AVhat treatment did you get upon that ward ? A. I never was allowed to go to the table but once while I was there; I was on the fourth ward a long time ; I was on the fourth ward some four or five weeks or six weeks; it seemed an awful long time ; I can remember distinctly from the time I went there in April until August. t>). You wont to the fourth ward in April and remained there until August? A. No, sir; I was on the eighth Avard a number of weeks, and then I went from there to the fourth ward some time in June, I think. Q. And remained there until August ? A. SomeAvhere along there, I think. Q. AVhat treatment did you get while in that ward? A. It was severe ; I was kept in restraint all this time strapped down in the ward in the chairs; the patients there are much more violent; there is more fighting, and they come along and strike you and kick you ; they struck and kicked me while I Avas strapped in the chair, and no one paid any attention to it. Q. Von were under such restraint that you could not do anv thing? A. I could not raise-my hands or get out of the chair ; sometimes I was strapped in with my hands in, and sometimes they Ave re loose so that my arms were free ; that was so when they brought up my victuals or something of that kind; the victuals were always brought in a large dish or a large cup. Q. Did you see any injuries inflicted upon any other patients by the attendants ? A. On the fourth ward ? Q. Yes? A. Oh, yes ; a good many. Q. Can you give the name of the attendant, and the person in- jured ? A. Sometimes all three of the attendants would pitch on one man at a time, and knock him down. Q. Give the names of the attendants who assaulted one man, and give me also the name of the man who Avas so assaulted ? A. I could not give the names of those on the fourth ward, very well. Q. Your recollection is not distinct ? A. No, sir ; I did not have any chance ; they do not allow any one to speak on No. 4. Q. While you were on ]STo. 4, did you receive any injury ? A. Yes, sir; 1 did receive injury. 189 Q. AVhat was it ? A. Iliad all my teeth knocked loose — knocked out, some of them. Q. How many teeth were knocked out ? A. I had one tooth gone, in front, when I went there ; and when I came back away from there I only had five teeth on the upper jaw, and my lower jaw Avas broken. Q. Are you able to tell how you received the injury of breaking your lower jaw, and breaking y#our teeth ? A. It was done by the hcels'of their boots, stamping, it was done that month while I was there, after I was sent on to No. 4 ward. Q. Can you tell who did it ? A. No, sir; I know it was the attendants that commenced strik- ing me and knocked me down, in the first place, and then pitched on to me ; then they had some more help, and it was when I was down that I was injured. Q. Do you know why it was an attendant knocked you down ? A. No, sir; no more than I would keep talking. Q. Were you in restraint when they knocked you down ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you have any struggle with them ? A. Oh, yes, sir; I tried to defend myself. Q. You struck back the best you could ? A. Yes, sir; to get away from them. Q. When your -teeth were knocked out and your jaAV injured what wasxione by the physician ? A. They never meuJdoned a word to me about it. Q. Did they leave IX to unite of itself ? A. No, sir; it Avas left for a time; I was pounded senseless and carried off to my room ; pounded senseless, and when I came to the doctors were standing over me; Drs. Brush and Josselyn; they put a bandage around my head and bandaged up my jaw;' put on a flax-seed poultice. Q. Dr. Brush and Dr. Josselyn were in your room when you came to, examining into your condition ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do you recollect any attendant that Avas there at that time? A. No, sir; I don't think of any now. Q. What was your condition after this injury ; what was your mental condition ? A. I felt —well, I don't know as I could testify particularly to that. Q. Do you remember whether you was more disturbed after this injury, or less? A. No, sir; I don't remember about that. Q. From ward four, where were you taken ? _ A. They said they put me back on to eight; I inquired of them since, but I don't remember when. Q. From ward four to ward eight — if it was Avard eight? 190 A. (Interrupting.) It was only for a few hours they did not leave me over night, for I should have remembered that. Q. Then where Avere you taken ? A. On to ward five. Q. How long did you remain on ward five ? A. Almost until I came home; I stayed there a number of months. Q. On ward five ? A. Yes, sir. Q. «Didn't you get back to Avard two before yon left? A. No, sir'; I went from ward five to ward one, skipping over two wards —I mean from five to three; I went from ward five to ward three. Q. Now on ward three^did you receive any harsh2 treatment there ? A. No, sir. Q. Did you see any patients that did receive harsh treatment there ? A. No, sir. Q. Do you remember how long you were on ward three? A. No, sir ; I could not tell. Q. And from ward three you went to ward one ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How long did you remain there on ward one ? A. Three or four weeks; that is a very quiet ward. Q. You had no difficulty there ? A. No, sir ; had no difficulty on the seconder third wards; they don't know any thing about it on the second ward. Q. The first Ward contains patients that are nearly ready to leave the asylum, does it not, a large share of them? A. I don't know about that; there is men there that has been there 15 or 20 years. Q. But that is considered the dismissal or " send-off " ward ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do you remember how long you were there before yon were discharged ? A. No, sir; I didn't keep track of it. Q. You had no ill treatment there on that Avard? A. No, sir. Q. When you were taken away from there, who took you away from the asylum? A. My wife came there and my brother-in-law, Charlie Wheeler. Q. And you returned home on the cars ? A. Yes, sir. : ; Q. Did youjjjwalk from the Asylum down to the depot ? *" A. Yes, sir. Q. And from the time of your arrival at home up to the present time you have attended to your own business ? A. Yes, sir ; I have carried on my farm myself. 191' Q. Dairy farm? A. Yes, sir. Q. How many coavs ? A. Six. Q. Do you keep a hired man? A. No, sir. Q. I suppose some part of the summer time you have a hired man ? A. Last summer I hired a man, $20 a month through haying ; but I done enough of other work so that I paid the $20. Q You are a very hard working man ? A. Yes, sir; I claim so. Q. You have had no mental disturbance since you returned home ? A. No, sir. Q. (Jan you suggest noAv any thing that you think would be an improvement in the way of the management of the Asylum ? A. I think that friends when they come there to see the patients ought to have the privilege of seeing them, any way they should not be told that the friends are not in a condition to see them, and then pretend that it was on account of the friends that they did not want them to see them ; I didn't see any of my friends in eleven months ; they said that I was not in a condition to see them, and they stated in a letter to my wife that I had an abscess on my cheek, and that it had not got Avell yet; that was the first they heard of the matter of my injury, they did not know it. Q. From the time you went from ward two back to ward eight, you did not see any of »your friends ? A. No, sir; except that Avhen I was on the fifth ward I saw Charlie Wheeler; he was on the fifth ward and came to see me. Q. Was your wife there to visit you ? A. She visited me when 1 first came there; when I first came there they allowed everybody to see me, but when I left the second ward and went back to ward eight, I never see any of my friends until about eleven months ; then I got on to ward five and it was then that I saw Charlie Wheeler. . Q. How long did you say it wras that you did not see your friends after going back to ward eight ? A. Eleven months. Q. What ward were you on then ? A. The third ward. Q. How often during the time you were on that Avard did you see Dr. Gray ? A. I saw him pass through the ward with Adsitors. Q. Did he say any thing to you ? A. No, sir. Q. How many times was he on ward two while you were there ? A. I do not think I saw him more than once. Q. How many times was h^ on ward eight ? A. I never saAV him at all there on that ward. 192 Q. How many times did yon see him on ward six ? A. Once. Q. How many times on ward three ? A. 1 never saw him on ward three, I think. Q. IIoav long were you on Avard three ? A. 1 was there five or six Aveeks and did not see him ," I had two spells of being on ward three; I saAV him once on five ; I was on five the longest. Q. Yon saw him once on there ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Hoav often did you see him on Avard four? A. I never saw him on ward four at all. Q. And you were there how long? A. From June to August, about tAvo or three months. Q. How Avas it as to the other physicians, as to being attentive? A. They made themselves very scarce after I came to myself; when they see that I had come to my reason again they never came round any more; they left me after I came to myself. Q. Did the physicians —one or more of them — make a practice of passing through the ward morning and evening? A. It was generally in the middle of the day, in the forenoon, when they came on to the wards. Q. Did they come ou in the afternoon ? A. I could not say that I ever saw them there in the afternoon, Q. While you were there you Avere a paying patient ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Have you Avith you one or more of the bills you paid to the asylum ? A. Yes, sir ; I brought one of them along. (Produced.) j Q. Was this bill paid by you or your wife ? A. By my wife, or by Charley Wheeler, my brother-in-law; I guess he handled the money. ■» Q. This bill is from February 21, and is for twenty-three weeks— ; have you any other bill ? \ A. Yes, sir, there are four or five such bills. ' Q. Have you any thing to complain of about the bill ? A. Well, the camisole and strap is charged to me, but I did not get it when I came aAvay. Q. You thought you ought to have had it ? A. Yes, sir, but they did not let me have it. Q. Did you ask for them when you came away ? A. Yes, sir, I did. Q. Do you know what excuse or reason they gave for not letting , you have them ? • A. They did not give me any at all. Q. Have you visited the asylum since you were taken away fromi, there ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Hoav many times have you visited it since then ? 193 A. I have been there three times. Q. Why did you go ? A. I went there to see friends that were there,, acquaintances that I made there while I was there. Q. Did they allow you to go ? A. Yes, sir; I went with the rest of the visitors ; I had to wait my chance to go around. By Mr. Kice : *-■.*, ^ j Q. What were you taken to the asylum in a bag for? A. They considered that I might—well, they were afraid of me. Q. Your own friends took you there in that way ? A. Yes, sir. C^T You were taken with the consent and knowledge of your wife ? A. No, sir, she did not give any consent. Q. She knew about it, did she not ? A. Yes, sir. Q. You have no fault to find with the action of your friends ? A. No, sir, only I think they were hasty. Q. Had you been violent, or undertaken to do anybody any harm before you Avent to the asylum ? A. No, sir, only in one case, and that I think Avas no more than you or any other man would have done ; I wanted to walk, I was not content to lie down, I wanted to walk ; there was one of my friends, I had nothing against him, he said I must lie still, lie down ; he spoke very roughly to me; I said to him " keep your hands off of me " ; I started to go ont again, he grabbed me by the throat, I took his hand like that (indicating), threw him off, and in doing so I put his finger out of joint. Q. You have no doubt but ^vhat you were insane, have you ? A. No, sir. Q. What led to your insanity, if yon can state ? A. I could not say as for that; hard work and too much tobacco, I suppose. Q. When you were put into this^bag, did you go in voluntarily, or did they have to compel you to go in ? A. I went in voluntarily. Q. It was done simply to restrain you from doing any harm ? A. That was one purpose, and may have been the purpose; the bag was loose, but was tied at the neck. Q. Your head was not covered? A. No, sir. By Mr. Morgan : Q. Your father was in the asylum on two or three occasions before you ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And yon had a brother that was insane ? A. I suppose he was; he committed suicide. 25U 194 DAVID K. DAVIS, Sworn and examined, testified as follows: By Mr. Morgan : Q. Where do you reside ? A. In the town of Plainfield, Otsego county. Q. Were you an attendant at the New York State Lunatic Asylum ? A. Yes, sir ; I was there ten years. Q. How old are you ? A. Fifty-five years of age. Q. What wards were you on? A. I was on the second ward during all the time; I had charge of that ward. Q. During all the time you were on the second ward, did you see any abuse of patients by attendants ? A. No, sir; I never did on that Avard. Q. Did you on any of the wards of the asylum '. A. Not on any of the wards, myself. Q. Do you personally know of any injury having been inflicted on any patient ? A. No, sir; not in my presence. Q. During the time you were in the institution, how ofteu did you see Dr. Gray visiting your ward? A. I suppose about once a month ; sometimes not so often as that while I was there. Q. When did you leave the asylum? A. Three years ago last fall. Q. Before Dr. Gray's injury ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How often did he visit your ward ? A. Sometimes he would only come on to the first floor, with strangers, you know, and then he would come back ; that Avould be extra ; I guess he would average once a month. Q. When he came, did he go in to see any of the patients, or did he go in with people going through the asylum to visit it I A. Sometimes he used to come and see the patients with another doctor, Dr. Andrews, or any other of the asylum physicians; some- ; times he used to come through with strangers. Q. How often did the other physicians having charge of that ward visit that ward ? A. They used to come some years ago only once a day ; now these late years they come twice a day. Q. You were there how many years ? A. Ten years. Q. From your experience in the asylum and in that ward, in 195 your judgment did Dr. Gray visit that ward as often as you thought he should ? A. Well, I should think he should have come oftener; that was the cry, complaint; and I think he ought to have come oftener. Q. That he did not come upon your ward very often ; do you mean that was the complaint ? A. Yes, sir. Q. That he did not visit the patients as often as he ought to? A. Yes, sir. Q. Was any remark made to him about visiting the patients ? A. Not that I know. Q. Did you ever see an attendant afflict any blows upon a patient ? A. No, sir ; not to hurt them any ; but then they take hold a great many times of a patient, just to scare them a little bit, but not to hurt them; I never see any abuse or striking. Q. While you were on that ward were there any patients in- jured ? A. They were all very quiet on that ward; there was only one man accidentally hurt there. Q. How was that ? A. He got hold of a razor and cut himself; he got this razor accidentally. Q. Where was the razor left accidentally ? A. In the attendants' room. Q. And the patient got hold of it and what did he do? A. He put it in his pocket, and then afterward he cut a little gash in his throat, but he soon got well; he cut a gash on his throat, we catched him before he got far. Q. Before he inflicted any severe injuries upon himself ? A. Yes, sir; that is all I ever see on the ward. A. Who was the attendant who left his razor where a patient could get hold of it ? A. Well, I must say that I Avas the one myself; I left the cup- board open right in my own room, and the other attendant was in bed at that time; I did not \Arant to lock the door and lock him in, or else he could not have got out. Q. Did it come to the knowledge of Dr. Gray that you had left your razor out ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Who reported it to him ? A. I reported it myself; every thing was reported while I was there. Q. What did Dr. Gray say to you ? A. He told me to be more careful; he gave us the keys for this very cupboard, and after that we were more particular about such things. Q. How long did you remain an attendant after this accident i with the razor ? 196 A. I guess I was there two or three years after that. Q. Was there any other accident while yon were there ? , A. No, sir; that' is the only accident I remember. Q. And when you left the asylum you resigned ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What wages did you get ? A. Twenty-six dollars a month. Q. And your board, washing and lodging? A. Yes, sir. Q. What were your duties ? A. I had charge of the second ward; there was a supervisor over me, and a first attendant had charge of each ward beside; I was first attendant of that ward the whole time. Q. What time did you have to go on in the morning ? A. I used to go on at five o'clock in the morning in the summer time, and at half-past five in the winter. Q. And you remain until what time at night ? A. Until nine o'clock ; the patients are in bed at eight. Q. What do you think about the number of hours that you are required to be on duty there ? A. The night watch used to take our place — Q. You do not understand the question. Do you think the hours required of you are more than they ought to be ? A. Yes, sir ; I think that Avas too many hours. Q. What do you think of a man going on as early as that in the morning and then remaining on until nine o'clock in the evening? A. I say it is too much ; they are very long hours. Q. Were you sick at all while you were in here ? A. No, sir; I was all right. Q. Did you ever receive any injury from a patient ? A. Not to amount to any thimg. The committee here adjourned to meet again on Monday, Feb- ruary 25, at three o'clock in the afternoon, in room B, at the Capi- tol. 197 Albany, February 25, 1884. ) Room B, New Capitol. \ The investigation was resumed at 3 o'clock, this p. m., as under. Present — The full Committee. Dr. E. N. BRUSH, Sworn and examined, testified as follows : By the Chairman; Q. What is your age ? A. Thirty-two. Q. Where do you reside when you are at home ? A. Utica ; until I came to the Asylum my home has been at Buf- falo, N. Y. Q. What position do you hold at the Utica Insane Asylum ? A. First assistant physician. Q. How long have you held that position ? A. Since October, 1880. Q. What was your position there previous to that ? A. Fourth, third and second assistant physician. Q. Hoav long have you been connected with the institution ? A. I went there in March, 1878. Q. What are your duties at present ? A. My duties at present comprise the charge of the women's division of the house, and the duties of acting superintendent in the absence or illness of the superintendent, and I am supposed to keep a general oversight of the entire house, so far as possible and consistent with my other duties. Q. How often do you visit the patients? A. Either myself or the physician who is Avith me, as a rule, visit - the department we have charge of twice a day ; then, if there are any sick patients, or any thing on the ward that needs our atten- tion, we are apt to be there anywhere from three to a dozen times a day, but not through the whole house; we make a tour of the whole house in the morning about nine or ten o'clock, and in the afternoon about four o'clock. Q. How many patients are under your supervision ? A. About three hundred, Q. Do you say that you are directly connected with the female department ? A. Yes, sir; I have charge of the female department; it is a rule of the house that the elder physician who is, or may be a mar- ried man, is to have charge of the female division. Q. Do you have charge of the female wards altogether ? A. Yes, sir ; supervise all the female wards. Q. To whom do the attendants report ? A. To me, as a rule, or, if I am not in the office, to the physician, 1 198 t) ' i associated with me, or, if he is not accessible, to the next physician '■>, they can find. Q. How much attention does Dr. Gray give, personally, to the patients 1 A. That would be a matter dependent upon the character of the patients; for the past year or two the doctor, on account of his health, has been prevented from giving the attention to matters that he did before he was injured, and that he did when I first Avent there; I think it was March, 1882, that he was shot. Q. How frequently does he go through each ward at present, or has he, since his injury ? A. Sometimes he is on the wards two or three times a week, and sometimes not as often as once a week; it varies; I may say that I see Dr. Gray perhaps six and eight times a day in regard to patients under my supervision, and in regard to the men patients Avhen there i& any thing serious the matter. Q. Does he go through every ward in the institution as often as once a week \ A. I do not think every ward in the institution, he goes — for instance, to illustrate ; he might go to-day on the top floor, and to- morrow on the middle floor, then to-day on|to the back wards, or dis- turbed wards, and to-morrow on to one or two wards in the front of the building. Q. Hoav many wards are there altogether ? A. Twelve on each side of the institution when it is in full work- ing order; there are some repairs going on now on the women's side, and that makes it, practically, only eleven. >Q. What was Dr. Gray's prior custom as to the inspection of the wards ? A. He was on the wards, Avould go on to the Avards alone at differ- ent times frequently ; at other times he would come and say to the physician in charge, "I want to make your tour Avith you this morn- ing," at other times he would take the junior, and' in a measure give him a clinical lecture. Q. What is the pay of the ordinary attendant per month ? A. On the women's side, the female attendants get, I think, to commence with twelve dollars a month, and if their services prove acceptable after the first six months their pay is increased at the rate of a dollar a month, until they get sixteen dollars a month, unless thay have charge of a ward or are given some special duties like night nurses, or become supervisors of departments, and then their pay is fixed at a larger sum and stops; attendants in charge of a ward like the disturbed wards on the men's side, what we call \ "disturbed " wards, receive eighteen dollars a month; attendants ', in charge of other wards receive from sixteen to seventeen dollars a month, while supervisors receive more; I think their pay is twenty- J five dollars a month, that is my recollection. * Q. Do they retain their positions a long time, or are there fre- quent changes among them ? 199 A. There are changes among the attendants, the supervisors who are there have been in charge there ever since I have been in the house. Q. How about attendants? A. Some of the attendants have been there equally long ; well, not as long as the supervisors — I will correct that,'but some of ' them have been there as long as I have been there, and others have been there a shorter length of time; perhaps a third of the num- ber of attendants go away during the year; I should not want to be positive about that, it may be more and it may be less. Q. What estimate do you place on the character of the attendants as to their fitness for their places? A. It is very much as in other departments of life, they come up to the average of mankind — that is, the average of the people or class from which they are drawn. Q. Are you satisfied with the character of the attendants, as a general thing ? A. No, sir, I cannot say that I am satisfied with their character as a general thing. I am not satisfied with their standard of intel- ligence in the performance of their duties, and as illustrative of that, we are constantly trying to educate them. The matter has been under advisement for four or five months, and within the past two months we have originated there a training school, similar to the , training schools for nurses in Bellevue Hospital of New York, and other places. I started the training school in Buffalo General Bos pital with the object of improving the attaches, and lectures are de- livered to them every week, embracing the general line of their duties, and particularly the treatment of such matters as may come under their observation — for instance, how to stop a hemorhage from a cut vessel; but more especially in regard to their duties in connection with the insane — self-respect, self-control, enabling them to acquire a more intelligent appreciation of the character of insan- ity, what it is — what it means, Q. Does that apply to both male and female attendants ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do they stay in the institution long enough to benefit by the instruction ? A. Yes, sir, I think they do ; I think the instruction tends to improve them, and they have evidenced a great deal of interest in the matter and they take notes of the lecture; the female attend- ants, whom I see more especially, take particular interest in the thing and watch the procedure of the physician for instance, on the taking of the temperature of a patient; they manifest desire to know, and they do know, why it is that the temperature in a case of consumption should rise in the afternoon and fall in the morning; and the like; and they evince more interest than I supposed they would evince. Q. How much attention do you give to patients during the night ? 200 A. Whenever a patient is sick during the night we always go to see them ; we generally know pretty thoroughly the condition of the patient, and if the patient is only restless, excited, noisy, know- ing what treatment the patient is receiving, we send in a prescrip- tion and send the medicine if we have it, otherwise we go down to the apothecary's shop, get the prescription put up and send it, or go and see the patient. Q. One of the attendants at the last hearing spoke of receiving night medicine for patients. Is there any one prescription that ig used ? A. No, sir; it depends upon the patient; as a rule the medicine is in the nature of a hypnotic, but they are not the same, for what would produce sleep in one patient probably would not in another. Q. And the physicians make the prescriptions upon the report of the attendants during the night, based upon their knowledge of the patient's case ? A. Certainly. Q. Previously acquired ? A. Yes, sir ; and in the case books there is a list of the mental and medical condition of the patient, carried along from time to time. Q. Do you frequently observe patients with bruised noses, or black eyes in the institution { A. I cannot say "frequently"; I do not think is frequent; I know there are not tAvo on all the women's side of the house, out of three hundred and fourteen, or three hundred and fifteen pa- tients ; I think it is equally the same on the men's side ; I should say it applied equally the same to the men; and I had three years' service on the men's division. Q. When you observe such cases what do you do ? A. I inquire immediately how it happened. Q. Of whom? A. Of the patient, or if the patient is not in a condition to tell, of the attendant; generally here patients are found on the ward who know something about it. To illustrate, patient was going i into the dining-room on one of our wards last evening and resisted j goiug in, she was hanging back ; the attendant coming along and trying to assist her they both fell ; the attendant was hurt a little and the patient received a bruise on the cheek which will eventuate in a black eye; that, matter was reported to Dr. Quiuu. The assistant physician, Dr. Quinn, when he went in to administer medi- cine to a patient who would not take it from an attendant, he made inquiry into the matter to which I have just referred and reported it to me ; he inquired of the patient and'of the attendant, and their I stories confirmed each other ; but he went further and inquired of a patient standing by. Q. Is so particular an inquiry usual \ A. Yes, sir, unless the matter is perfectly self-evident how it occurred. 201 Q. Do you ever find that the attendants have struck at patients ? A. I have known those instances ; yes, sir. Q. Do the patients complain at any time of having been struck by attendants ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What do you do in case of such complaint ? A. Make'a thorough inquiry and if we find it to be true, discharge the attendant at once. Q. It appears from the injury books that patients are sometimes injured in the covered bed at night, getting black eyes; is it possi- ble to get a black eye in that bed? A. Oh, yes, sir; we find a patient injured sometimes; we depre- cate as much as possible putting the patient into the covered bed, especially if he struggles, preferring to put them in a room with mattresses on the floor, or in some other way furnished, or if neces- sary padded. Q. Do you yourself examine these injury books? A. Yes, sir. Q. From time to time ? A. Yes, sir ; from time to time; for the last year and a half or nearly two years we have had a series of daily morning reports from each of the supervisors. Q. In addition to the injury books? A. Yes, sir; which in a large measure have supplemented — or, that is not just the word, taking their place, superseded them ; we have those reports every morning. Q. H»w often do you see the injury books ? A. It varies from time to time ; whenever, for instance, we are writiug up a full history of a case we frequently make notes from those books; if an injury has been received, we send for the injury book in Avhich the supervisor or attendant has reported or recorded it. Q. One of the attendants who was implicated in the charge of inflicting injuries upon Mr. Hughes is named C. G. Weir ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do you rememder that attendant ? A. Yes, sir; quite well. Q. Had he been long in the institution ? A. My recollection is two years last September. Q. What character did he bear while in the institution ? A. He seemed to be a careful man, a man Avho was disposed to do every thing to obey the rules. ' Q. Was he ever complained against by any of the patients ? A. Yes, sir. Q. For what ? A. The general rule of complaints that we have every day of harsh usage and abuse and various things; there was, however, never any thing against him that inquiry revealed, and the inquiry was very thorough; I may say this in reference to Mr. Weir, that he last year testified before the Assembly committee, as you will see 26U 202 by reading over their testimony, and his statements in regard to him- self were such, as to his own good character, that it struck me, as well as my associates, that he was perhaps playing the part of a hypocrite, and for that reason he was watched more carefully than he otherwise would have been. Q. How old a man is he ? A. As a matter of guess, I should say about thirty-eight. Q. About what pnysical build is he ? A. About five feet nine or five feet ten inches ; I should say he was about the build of Mr. Rice. By Mr. Rioe : Q. Is he not at least six feet high ? A. Well, perhaps he may be from five feet ten inches to six feet. Q. About how much would he weigh ? A. About 160 pounds. Q. Is he an athletic, well-built man ? A. I should think so, though I never had any occasion to ex- amine him more than, once or twice Avhen he had a cold, and then I noticed that his chest was pretty well developed. Q. What would yon say as to his disposition and temper? A. As far as I have ever observed he is a man of even temper. Q. What about his habits ; Avere they temperate or otherwise as far as you observed ? A. As far as I observed, perfectly. Q. You say that there has been complaints against him by some of the patients of harsh usage and bad treatment; can you refer more particularly to any such complaints ? A. The most positive complaint I think was from a patient named P., a man who committed a homicide in the asylum in killing a pa- tient Mr. B. Q. Of what did P. complain ? i A. Mr. P. complained that Mr. Weir threw him down and struck him ; I am simply relating this from memory ; the investigation showed that Mr P. had — » Q. (Interrupting.) Was it an investigation made by you person-; ally or are you giving what some one told you ? A. An investigation which I directed, and part of which I made. Mr. Haskell — Doctor, please confine your evidence to what you have personal knowledge of, in this particular ? A. Well, my personal knowledge goes to the fact that there had . been a struggle on the waid with Mr. P., but that he was not seriously ] hurt; and the patients and other attendants on the ward denied that any harsh usage was made on the part of Mr. Weir, any more than defending himself from a sudden and very fierce attack'; Mr. Weir himself was hurt, because his clothing was quite badly torn ; beyondJ that, I directed Dr. Josselyn, then in the asylum, to'make a careful investigation of the matter, which he did, f believe. 2oa By Mr. Haskell : Q. Can you give me about the time of that occurrence? A I don't think I could ; it was some time last year during the fall; I should think perhaps along in September. Q. Was complaint made on that occasion that Mr. Weir had 'struck P. by any of the patients, or by P. himself? A. My recollection now is that P. complained that Mr. Weir had struck him. Q. What conclusion did yon reach in that respect ? A. The conclusion reached was that it was not so ; that conclusion was reached at the time, and that the injuries received by Mr. P., if any, were, in my recollection, very slight, and that Mr. Weir re- ceived more severe injuries in the course of the struggle; it was the result of a sudden and violent attack by Mr. P., such an attack as he has made once or twice since he has been in the asylum ; and he is kept under restraint Q. Can you recall any other complaints made by patients against Mr. Weir?' A. No, sir, I cannot; and I Avould not be a good witness on that matter perhaps, because of my not being so much on the men's divis- ion as on the female side of the house. Q. Noav, as to Mr. Brown, one of the other attendants who was present when Mr. Hughes received his injuries; will you briefly describe his age and appearance ? A. Mr. Brown is a large, tall, rather heavily built Irishman ; I think weighing from 190 to 210 pounds. Q. About what age is he ? A. I do not think he is thirty. Q. How long has he been on the institution ? A. I think not quite a year; perhaps about ten months, and it may be less than that ? Q. What was his reputation prior to this affair, for patience and good temper, and generally as to his conduct toward patients ? A. As far as I have any knowledge, and if I may add as far as I have ever heard, there had been no complaints against him ? Q. No complaints at all against him ? A. Not that I have any personal knowledge of, or ever heard about; that is, not that I recollect of, although there may have been, and it may have escaped my recollection. Q. Now as to attendant Bills, who was also present on that occasion, will you briefly describe his personal appearance, and state his age? A. He is a shorter man than either of the other two ; I do not think he is more than five feet eight, if he is that; he has a defect of one eye — is cross-eyed ; he is a well-built and compactly knit man. Q. How long had he been connected with the institution? A. About thirteen or fifteen months, I should think. Q. What reputation did he bear while he was there in the Asy- lum ? 204 A. His reputation was pretty good. Q. Had you heard any complaints about him from any of the patients ? A. No, sir. . Q. What methods do you employ for restraining violent patients? A. Either a waist belt, which you saw illustrated on the ward, passing around the body and around the bacK of a chair, or it may be put around a patient so that he may be about the wards, wearing in addition to the belt a couple of padded leather wristlets sliding on a ring on the waist-belt sufficiently loose to allow them to feed themselves with a knife and fork by bending the head ; in some in- stances, among the women more especially, and occasionally among the men patients, have a habit of mutilating the body or the face, by picking holes in the skin, or pulling out their hair, and on such patients we put leather mittens without any thumbs ; they are fast- ened around the wrist by a lock. Q. What are they called ? A. Mittens ; then there is what is called the camisole, which is generally made of canvas and restrains the hands and arms, pre- venting'the patients from getting into mischief or doing damage; then there is what we call the " muff," which e do not useasoftep as any of the others mentioned ; it gets its name from its resemblance to a woman's muff, and the hands are placed into it; the camisole takes its place largely, and it i> a little better, but some patients will tear the camisole with their teeth Avhich they cannot do with the muff; then there is the covered bed ; that is, to allintents and purposes, a child's crib ; it is large enough for an adult patient and is well ven- tilated, the cover fastens on to it by means of hinges and will lock on ; the covered bed is a necessary restraint especially when we desire to keep a patient in a horizontal position ; the cover is mov- able so that the bed may be used as a covered bed or as an open bed; the cover may be taken off, and it can be used as an ordinary bed. Q. Have you now stated all the restraints that are used in the in- stitution ? A. Yes, sir ; 1 think I have. Q. Is the covered bed very frequently used ? A. On some wards we have some patients who sleep constantly in covered beds; but the use of the covered bed depends a great deal upon the character of the ward and the character of the patient. Q. Are patients put into the coArered bed Avithout specific direc- tion from the physicianr ? A. The direction may be special in this way that a patient is to sleep in the covered bed, or that a patient is to have a room, or to be kept in the dormitory ; if they are up and about after such an hour the attendants are instructed to place them into the covered bed. Q. So that the attendants or supervisors can exercise a certain amount of discretion in that particular ? A. Yes, sir. Q. About putting patients into the covered bed, I mean \ A. A certain discretion in those directions. 205 By Mr. Rice : Q. Have they ever permitted any of those restraints to be upon patients, when they go into the covered bed; that is, do you require them to wear a restraint over the hands or any portion of the body when in the covered bed? A. Sometimes ; for instance, a patient now in my mind who has a habit of besmearing her body with foeces — her hands are restrained during the night. Q. How restrained ? A. She wears a camisole; she is placed into a covered bed ; that is a case where restraint is absolutely necessary. Q. Can a person turn round in a covered becl with one of those camisoles on ? A. Certainly. Q. From one side to another? A. Yes, sir. Q. AVhat space is there between the body and the patient and the loAver side of the cover or lid ? A. There is sufficient space so that a patient can raise up__a quarter of the way up. Q. Hoav many inches— take the case of a person lying on their back — how many inches could the patient raise up ? A. My recollection is, I took a measure of that matter for the furniture maker one time and I think from the top of the cover to the bed on the inside, that is from the top of the mattress to the cover, was eighteen inches. Q. From the mattress to the lid ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do you find that patients sometimes attempt to bruise them- selves by striking portions of their body against the lid of the bed ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And do they injure themselves in that way ? A. Yes, sir; we have a patient now in the Asylum who has attempted repeatedly and persistently to do that, and to such an extent that we have had to pad or strap pillows on the inside of the cover. Q. Would not that injury be prevented by upholstering the lid? A. It might be, but a pillow you can move and wash very easily, and the upholstery you could not; a pilloAv serves all the purposes required, and it is easily removable. Q. Is there any pain to the patient in wearing the canisole ? A. No, sir; it is so made that it does not confine a single muscle; it is made large. Q. Is there any way or method for drawing it up tight and draw- ing the arms in close to the body ? A. No, sir; there is in the middle of the sleeve two divisions through which a strap may be passed and that keeps the arms down to the body here, drawing1 the hands close together. 206 Q. What position would the hands occupy if the camisole were drawn close or tight? .. .. . A. They would be in a position something like that (indicating). Q. Could the hands be moved in that position \ A. Yes, sir ; when the camisole is fully extended, the hands can be brought that far apart (indicating), about a foot and a half, with- out restraint. Q. Of what material is the camisole made ? A. It is made of canvas and some of it is made of heavy linen duck . . j j Q. Which of those methods of restraining the arms do you regard as the less tedious and tiresome to the patients ? A. They are all more or less so I presume. Q. Which would you say Avere the most uncomfortable ? A. I should think the muff was the most uncomfortable. Q. And under which of those forms of restraint do they appear to suffer the least inconvenience ? A. They suffer the least inconvenience with simply a pair of wristlets running on the belt. Q. What cases have you in the Asylum that cannot be properly restrained with the use of that restraint? A. Patients who attempt self-mutilation ; patients,who attempt to disrobe themselves or those who destroy their clothing, and a cer- tain class of suicidal patients. Q. Do you mean to say that they can do this bodily injury to themselves or tear or take off their clothing when they have on the wristlets attached to the belts ? A. Yes, sir; unless the hands are confined down here (indicating) so very closely that it would be very irksome. Q. I suppose you have all those appliances in the Asylum at the present time which can be seen by the committee? A. Yes, sir; very little restraint is used in the Asylum in the shape of mechanical restraint, very little indeed ; the Commissioner of Lunacy recently requested a statement in relation to the restraint used in the Asylum, and the months of May and September, 1883, were selected ; the restraint on the men's division was less than one- half of one per cent, that is, the average number of restraints on the men's division during that period. Q. There are some wards there, I suppose, where no restraint is used ? A. It es, sir. Q. What would be the percentage on Avard number four at the present time ? ... ., A. Of mechanical restraints ? Q Yes? A. I do not think there are three out of the twenty-seven pa- tients on that ward so restrained ; I never have within the past three years seen at any one time three patients in restraint on that ward. 207 Q. This percentage which you have given does not include the covered beds? A. No, sir; I mean mechanical restraints aside from the covered beds ; we do not include the covered bed. By the Chairman (resuming): Q. How many hours do the attendants work at a stretch on an average ? A. During the summer months the bell rings in the morning at from five o'clock to half-past five; and the patients are all in bed at nine o'clock, p. m. ; the attendants are on duty from that time. Q. That is, from half-past five in the morning until nine o'clock at night ? A. Yes, sir. Q. About what hours are they employed in the winter? A. In the winter the bell rings in the morning at half-past six, and the hour for retiring is the same; that is, the patients are all in bed at that time ; the patients on ward number four would be in bed at seven o'clock. Q. So that the attendants are employed about fourteen hours a day in the winter months, and not far from fifteen or sixteen during the balance of the year ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And those attendants receive about $20 a month on the male ward ? A. They commence at $20 and run up to .$24, $26 and $28, de- pending upon their positions. Q. In the female at Avhat rate are the attendants paid ? A. They commence at $12 and run up to $16 and $18 a month. Q. Do they have any holidays ? A. They have two evenings a week, from six o'clock to ten o'clock, and later than that if they want to go to some entertainment in the city that is not out as early ; they have also every third Sun- day until ten o'clock at night, and once a month they have half a day ; but all leaves of absence are given only by written request through the supervisor, Avhich he lays upon my desk or upon that of the physician in charge of the men's division ; there is generally a list made of attendants who want to be out during the evening. Q. In your opinion is the compensation received by them suffi- cient remuneration for their services and time ? A. I should hardly think it was. Q. If the compensation were increased do yon think you could get a better grade of attendants ? A. I doubt that Q. Do you think that for the position they are as good attendants as can be obtained ? A. I think they are, because people Avho belong to the more in- telligent or more refined classes, so-called, do not like that kind of work and Avould not take that kind of work. 208 Q. Have you had any experience with attendants of any other asylum ? , , T A. I never have been in any other asylum except to visit; 1 have visited asylums in this country and Europe — in England and Scot- land. Q. Are you able to make any comparison between the character of the attendantsttf this institution andjothers to which you have referred? A. I think the attendants in this asylum are equally good with any asylum that I have ever visited either in this State or others;! have visited in Massachusetts and Michigan and the asylums in England and Scotland ; I visited eleven of the leading asylums of those countries. Q. Have you any knowledge as to the rate of wages paid in other institutions for the same grade of attendants in similar institutions to this? A. In some institutions they are considerably lower and very few are theyjhigher. Q. Is the rate of wages lower in any of the institutions in this country to your knowledge ? A. I only speak of my recollection that in the Massachusetts insti- tutions, some of them, in the Pennsylvania institutions it is lower. Q. Do you know of any where it is higher ? A. Only from general recollection. By Mr. Haskell : Q. I understand you to say that you do not think any increase in the wages would result in the improvement of the service, or of the grade of the employees ? A. I do not, and for this reason, Mr. Haskell, that people who earn the same wages, or who command the same rate of Avages would find positions more congenial in other callings in life; Iliad an illustration not long ago; a young woman Avas sent to the asylum from the city, she was said to be a good nurse and she had come from a hospital where she had that reputation, and it was said she would be good in an insane hospital ; she Avas sent to a ward where we had melancholia patients who had to be fed by means of the tube, which is not a very pleasant work ; she was requested to assist by one of the physicians, and she flatly refused to do so ; she said if that was the kind of duties she has to perform, she Avould leave the institution, and she did leave. By Mr. Rioe : Q. What do yon say to the effect of decreasing the hours of daily labor ? A. I have thought of that matter, and I have thought whether it , would not be wise and advisable to employ a certain amount of assistants to do the drudgery Avhich is always very wearing and very perplexing, and requires labor about the ward and cleaning up 209 after the dirty patients , to make the beds in the morning, and do that kind of work, and leave the attendants to be simply and solely attendants ; that is to employ servants to do that kind of work and m that way lessen the hours of duty and work of the attendants. By Mr. Haskell : Q. Do you think that would increase the effectiveness of the attendants ? A. It might; I cannot speak from any experience; it is merely a matter of speculation ; it is a matter that has presented itself to me, in thinking over the subject, and a matter about which I have talked with my associates, with Dr Gray and others.' Q. You simply think it might result in an improvement ? "A. Yes; my impression is that it would, from the mere fact that- ch (Interrupting) It is only an impression and does not get down to a judgment ? A. No, sir ; it is not a conviction. _ Q. So that if there is any thing seriously wrong in the institu- tion, or any abuses have crept into it, it is not on account of the amount paid to the attendants, or on account of the number of at- tendants, and the amount of work they have to do, in vour iudo-. ment? J J ° A. I do not think so. By the Chairman : Q. As to the care and attention given to the pay patients and to the pauper patients, is there any difference in any respect in their treatment ? A. No, sir; except in this respect, a patient might be brought there whose friends wish to employ a special attendant to look after him, and be with him, and room with him, by. paying the Avages of that attendant to a certain amount extra which would compensate for the room oocupied, they may do that. Q. Can pay patients obtain a portion of the time of an attendant, in association with other pay patients ? A. No, sir. Q. So that any one pay patient must have the exclusive assistance of an attendant, or he must be in company with the pauper patients and under the general charge of general attendants ? A. Yes, sir; and even if such a patient should have the exclusive use of an attendant, for which he pays extra, he would still have to be on a ward suitable to his mental condition. Q. Is there any difference in the table fare and accommodation of pay patients and pauper patients? A. No, sir; they all eat at the same table; of course if their friends send them any thing, they have that, but otherwise their diet is all the same. 27U 210 Q. Then what advantages do the pay patients have over the pan- per patients ? , , . ,. , A They have none; if a rich person comes and brings a patient and says : " I want this patient to have a private room, and to do this, that and the other thing, which many of their friends request, as to going out walking or riding, or something ike that, 1 say to them, or whoever receives that patient into the asylum says to them • " Your friend will be put on to a ward suitable to his con- dition ; if he is a proper patient suitable to be in a single' room, he will be put into a single room; if not, he will be put into a dormi- tory; or if he is suitable to be put into a covered bed, he will he put into a covered bed; he will be treated in all respects similar to any other patient; just the same in all respects." By Mr. Rice : Q. Are there any regular rates for pay patients ? A. Well, the rates are from six dollars per week to ten, depending upon the character of the case, etc., etc. Q. Do not some of the pay patients pay more than ten dollars 'a week ? A. There are a few, and one or two pay fifteen dollars a week. Q. And some pay as high as twenty-five dollars a week, do they not ? A. I do not think any patient who has not a private attendant pays as much as twenty-five dollars. Q. Then these prices, ranging from six to ten dollars per week and upward, do not include a private attendant ? A. No, sir. Q. What is the difference; why should one patient pay more or be charged more than another ? A. "Well —perhaps one patient may require a great deal more care than another; the quiet, mild cases of melancholia coming there, and getting along after a feAv months' treatment— well, some of the patients require the exercise of a good deal of care, you know — some of them require a great deal of time and attention. Q. What is the loAvest'amount paid by pay patients; is six dol- lars a week the loAvest ? A. I think there are some who pay four dollars and one or two who pay five. Q. AYhat is the character of those ? A. They are old cases who have been there a good many years, Q. Are there any patients there wTio pay less than four dollars per week ? A. I do not think that any have been received at less than that rate. Q. Are there cases wdiere friends of the patient pay a certain sum and the public pay a certain other sum ? A. No, sir. Q. The whole amount then that is paid comes either from the public or from the patient, or from the patient's friend ? 211 A. Yes, sir. Q. Are you familiar with the case of a patient named K. ? A. No, sir ; I do not remember such a patient. Q. Within three or four months coming there from Canandaigua ? A. We have not had a patient from Canandaigua for some years, I think. Q. Do you remember a .patient by the name of Mrs. C, from Ontario county ? A. Yes, sir ; she is there now. • Q. Does she pay six dollars a week ? A. I think she is there on the order of the county judge ; that is merely a recollection ; I could not tell you without referring to the book. Q. I understood it was four dollars a week she was paying? A. It may be in this Avay —I have known it in more than one instance—of a patient making an arrangement with the superin- tendent of the poor of the county they come from. Q. Referring to the difference in prices paid by the different per- sons, does it make any difference as to the ward they are on ? A. No, sir; there is a young man on the first ward, my recollec- tion is, that has been there since 1881, whose friends pay from twelve to fifteen dollars a week for him ; he has considerable liberty and goes out walking alone in the summer ; and his father sends him out into the North woods and Ave furnish an attendant who goes with him, and he pays the attendant wages while he is away ; his friends furnish him with a good many luxuries in the way of fruit and other things and in the way of going to entertainments; I think, as a rule, perhaps he goes to two entertainments a week. Q. Such a patient as that then gives you a little trouble? A. lie causes very little trouble. Q. How do you explain the fact that he pays so much money ? A. Well his friends are quite Avealthy and are perfectly able to pay it; but this is a matter that is entirely in the hands of the board of managers, and the rates are fixed by them ; the physicians have nothing to do with the collection of financial matters of the institu- tion. By Mr. Haskell : Q. As you understand it, do the managers fix the price of each patient ? A. No, sir ; I think it is fixed according to a general grade of prices, from $6 to $8, or from $10 to $15 a week ; for instance, when a patient comes there — if I were there in the office when a private patient came, I would state to Dr. Gray : " He is a private patient coming, who proposes to pay his own expenses;" I then give a history of the case.as I have taken it, that it is so and so, that the circumstances of bis family are such and such; u at what rate shall 1 fix upon in his case '. " and the doctor will fix the rate, $6, $8, $10 or $12 a week. 212 Q. So that it depends somewhat upon the ability of the patient to pay ? ' A. Yes, sir; to some extent, but more largely upon the nature of the case; both of those matters are taken into consideration. Q. What becomes of the fund that is realized from these pay patients? A. The bills are sent to private patients the same as they are sent to the county treasury, and the money goes into the hands of the treasurer and into the'general fund of the institution. Q. Out of the sum that is paid by the private patients, does any part of it go to Dr. Gray or the other physicians ? A. No, sir. Q. For extra attendance ? A. No, sir. Q. There is no extra charge by the physicians for extra attend- ance? A. No, sir ; not a cent. By Mr. Rice : Q. Is there any such thing as feeing an attendant? A. No, sir ; that is not'permitted, and an attendant who is known to receive a gratuity would be discharged at once ; I may say that patients have gone away and have afterward sent back presents to attendants; but while they are patients, it is in direct violation of the rule for an attendant to receive any fee, and he would be dis- charged at once in such a case. By Mr. Haskell : Q. Has there been any difference in the make of the camisoles within the last few years ? A. No, sir. Q. They always have been made the same ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Are there any difference in the sizes of them ? A. They are fitted to the patient; the tailor either makes a new camisole for the patient, or adapts one to the patient; but as a rule we have an assortment of sizes, so that we can fit a camisole to the patient. Q. And you testify that in no case that a patient has been put into the camisole can it be strapped so tightly that it Avonld bring his hands close to his person ? A. It would bring the center sleeve down to the — Q. ^Interrupting) Will you testify that the camisole could not be so applied as to draw the hands of the patient close to the person \ A. No, sir; not so close but what he could move his hands back- ward and forward from six to ten inches. Q. And in no case could it draw the hands close to the body ? 213 A. No, sir ; it could not do that. Q. When it is drawn that way, how is the strap fastened ? A- It is passed through loops at the side of the camisole, and then buckled behind or at the side. Q. Buckled or locked ? A. Usually locked. Q. Can you describe the lock ? A. We have two or three different varieties of lock-buckle; it is a regular buckle with a lock in the shaft of the buckle —the fore- part of the buckle. Q. And is that buckle sometimes placed in the middle of the back and sometimes upon the side? A. It can slide around anyAvhere; it is not fastened. , Q. Is it ever drawn tight ? A. It is drawn tight enough to keep the camisole down in front, bnt not so tight but that it can be slid around easily. Q. Have you ever known the buckle on the back to make a sore« A. No, sir. Q. Would it be impossible for it to do so ? A. I think it would, because, in the first place, a patient would not wear a camisole buckled on that way long enough at any time. Q. How long are the patients ever kept strapped in a chair steadily ? A. From fifteen to twenty minutes ; varying from that to two to three hours. Q. Are they ever kept there s0 all day ? A. No, sir. Q. Will you swear positively that that never has been done ? A. Well, no ; I won't swear positively that it never has been done ; but it never has, to my knowledge. Q. May it be done, and a physician not know it ? A. I don't think it would be. Q. How would the physician know if it had been done ? A. A patient who was placed in that position in the morning the physician would notice whether that restraint was on in the after- noon when he is visiting the wards on his round. Q. Suppose the physician were informed by an attendant that a patient had just been placed in that restraint ? A. We should make it a matter of inquiry. Q. Would not the physician be obliged to take the attendant's word ? A. Yes, sir, and the patient's word at the same time. Q. Where there is a conflict between the statement of an attend- ant and of a patient, are not the statements of the attendant taken ? A. Yes, sir; if there is any controversy, further inquiry is made to settle the matter. Q. Has there never been a direct conflict of statement between the attendant and the patient ? A. Oh, yes, sir. 214 Q. And in those cases you have invariably taken the attendant's word ?' A. No, sir, I cannot say that we have. Q. Can you state a case where yon did not ? A. I have discharged attendants for maltreating patients when they have emphatically denied it. Q. And the only evidence you have had — A. Has been the word — Q. Of the patient ? A. The first evidence has been the Avord of the patient; then the matter has been reported to me by the supervisor. Q. I am asking you as to cases where there, have been a direct conflict between tlie word of the patient and that of the attendant as to the inflicting of injuries ? A. Yes, sir, I understand, and I have discharged an attendant, I remember, last May or June. Q. On the woman's side ? A. Yes, sir ; and I have done the same thing on the man's side. Q. Can you recollect any other instances ? A. I do not recall any just now; some instances have been re- ported to me and have beeji inquired into ; a woman complained to me some time ago that while she was out walking an attendant called her back and she paid no attention to the attendant on account of deafness; the attendant ran after her and called her back again; she said, " I didn't hear you;" the attendant said, " I will teach you to hear me if you go away like that again." It was reported to me by a patient and I inquired into it. Q. Of whom ? A. Of the attendant's charge, and she denied it emphatically ; I then made some inquiries of the patients avIio were near whose state- ments could be relied upon, and the result was, that before night, the patient was out of the house. t Q. You mean the attendant, do you not ? A. Yes; the attendant, I mean, Avas out of the house before night; I also remember a case of the man's division. Q. On what ward ? A. On the eleventh ward, where an attendant was charged with abusing a patient; it was not reported by the patient because the mental condition of the patient was not such that he could report it, but it was reported by another patient and a patient on whose Avord I had implicit confidence; the attendant was discharged; I had that testimony and one other patient, who in a measure con- firmed, and a strong denial by the attendant. Q. So that the evidence of the patients is regarded by you, in some instances, as more reliable than that of the attendants ? A. At times it is. Q. So that the mere fact that a person is in the Asylum is no evi- dence that what they relate to have occurred, is not reliable ? 215 A. It is not conclusive evidence always ; it would depend upon the nature and condition of the patient. 1 1u _ Q. I suppose a great many of your patients, who are undoubtedly insane have very good memories, have they not ? A. Someof them have remarkable memories; yes, sir # ^. And I suppose that certain of your patients, although they are insane, yet have a regard for the truth ? A. Yes, sir. Q." And you can rely upon them ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Now I want to ask you a little further: Suppose a patient had become cured and discharged, he may recollect distinctly what had occurred in the institution, may he not ? A. Yes, sir ; he may. Q. And if he was a'truthful person and recollected accurately a great many things about which there could be no dispute, what would you say m regard to believing- what he said with respect to a matter Avhere there might be some dispute ? A. I understand you; the natural presumption would be that his recollection about matters in which there might be some dispute might be correct if he recollected a great manv things in which there was no dispute ; of course, on the other hand, those very things might be matters in relation to which he had delusions, or concern- ing which he had delusions, hallucinations of sight or hearing which had made such an impression upon him that he recollected them as matters of fact and actual occurrence. Q. But if a patient had recovered and was a man of known truth — a person of known truth and veracity — and in detailing occur- rences at the asylum, he recollected all those matters running through his case which could readily be corroborated, they were found to be correct, it would be a very strong evidence, would it not, that other matters which could not be corroborated were also true and correct? A. Oh, certainly, it would be presumptive evidence. Q. Hoav long have you been connected Avith the institution 8 A. Since March 7, 1878. Q. Hoav long have you been connected with the female side of the institution ? A. Since the summer of 1880, I think. Q- During the first two years you were on the male side of the asylum ?, A. Yes, sir. Q. Do you recollect EA-an D. Hughes wdien he was originally brought to the institution ? A. Yes, sir; I recollect the first time Mr. Hughes was brought. Q. A. ou were then connected with the male department of the asylum ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do you recollect of his being injured in a struggle with the attendants at that time ? • 216 A. No, sir ; I have not any such recollection. Q. You say that the supervisors now make daily reports, and that it has to a large extent superseded the injury books ? A. No, sir; they still keep up the injury books. Q. Do they keep them up in the same way that they used to ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And they are no less careful and correct about making their entries in the injury books, now that they make a daily report, than they were before ? A. I do not think they are, with one exception ; I found that one of the supervisors understood that this morning's _ report set aside the report in the injury book; that Avas the supervisor of the third department on the woman's side. Q. As I understand it, the records made in these injury books, at least prior to the time of making the daily reports, were in real- ity a written report of the supervisor in regard to any injuries that were received, and were so regarded. Is that the fact ? A. Yes, sir. Q. At the time you were on the male department of the Asylum, how often did you see the injury books that were kept in that de- partment ? A. Sometimes every tAvo or three days. Q. Did you make a practice of seeing them within a given stated time ? A. Not any given stated time, it was at irregular intervals; whenever I needed them for any matter, such as referring to them in making up my notes of a case, or something of that kind; to see what was reported about any particular patient. Q. Then you do not go to the injury book for the purpose of finding out what has happened ? A. No, sir; such a thing would be reported to me at the same time, and frequently I would see it before it was reported. Q. You would either see the case yourself, or would receive it as a verbal report ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Then the report in the injury book is not intended as a means of informing the physicians ? A. No, sir. By the Chairman : Q. What is the object of the injury book ? A. As a matter of record to a certain extent, and to impress upon the minds of the supervisors that those matters must be kept track of. Q. Kept track of, how ? By informing the physician ? A. Yes, sir; and to keep their eyes open. Q. Who informed you about it — the supervisors? A. I think in nine cases out of ten I would be informed by at- tendants on the ward. 217 Q. Would it be the supervisor's duty to inform you of what had occurred in regard to any injury ? A. It would be his duty to inform us at once. Q. If the injury were not of a grave nature, what would be the practice then? A. He would be apt to wait until I came in the ward and would say: " Mr. so and so has received a black eye." Q. Would he inform you ? Is it his duty to inform you ? A. Yes ; it is his duty. Q. It is the attendant's duty as well as the supervisor's duty to inform you of those matters when he sees you, is it not ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And you say that these injury books are also used in making up the records of cases ? A. They are sometimes used so, but as a rule we have these injuries recorded in our own note books or pocket memoranda. Q. But not always ? A. No, sir; not always; when I am writing up a case I spread out my OAvn notes of the case. Q. Is there any other record necessarily kept of such occurrences as appear in the injury books ; or is it a fact that certain injuries that appear here on the injury books would not appear anywhere else ? A. It might be in the case of a black eye or something like that. Q. Is a black eye regarded as a trivial matter ? A. No, sir; not so trivial but Avhat its occurrence and cause is examined into. Q. I call your attention to an injury in this book, " Exhibit 4," bearing date February 23, 1884, in regard to Evan D. Hughes; do you recollect that occurrence ? A. No, sir ; I do not recollect it. Q. You Avere at that time a physician on the male side ? A. Yes, sir; I recollect, in January, that Mr. Hughes was fre- quently quite violent during the first few weeks of his stay here, the first time he Avas brought to the institution. Q. Does it appear in the records of his case ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What form of insanity did you describe Mr. Hughes as suf- fering from ? A. When he first came there ? Q. Yes. A. It was a case of acute mania. Q. Did you see him when he came the second time ? A. Yes, sir ; l»saw him the day he came in. Q. Did you make an examination of him ? A. I remember going into the office and of hearing some one peak to me ; it was Mr. Hughes, and he said : u How do you do, W. Brush." Q. He recollected you, then 2 28 U 218 A. Yes sir. Q. And did you then recollect him? A. Yes, sir ;" I remembered him then. Q. Did you make any examination of him at that tmie . A. I talked to him about two minutes. Q. You ascertained his condition ? A. Not especially. . , ,, ,, „ Q. Did you examine him sufficiently to ascertain whethei theie was any difference particularly in the form of his insanity at that time, to what it was when he first came to the institution i A. lie impressed me as being very much depressed and quite nervous. . . ... ,. , Q. More than he was the first time he came to the institution i A. Yes, sir; I should say so. . Q. Is there a record kept of the changes of a patient from one ward into another ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And that would appear in the case book, would it i A. Yes, sir. Q. And it would appear upon the ward record also; would it appear in the case book also ? A. Yes, sir ; I stated that it would appear in the case book. Q. I suppose vou had nothing whatever to do with the medical case, or otherwise, of Mr. Hughes until after he was injured. A. No, sir ; not until after he was injured. Q. You may state what, if any, investigation was made, or whether you considered it a part of your duty to make any investi- gation in regard to the causes of his injury? A. Yes, sir. Q. State first whether you directed or made any investigation in regard to the causes of his injury i A. I made no particular investigation myself. Q. State if it were any part of your duty to do it ? A. I reported directly to Dr. Gray — Dr. Pilgrim reported to me and I to Dr. Gray; Dr. Pilgrim was directed to make an investiga- tion and I considered that my duty had ceased. Q. You made no further investigation of the matter ? A. No, sir. Q. When were you informed, and how, of the injury to Mr. Hughes ? # A. I was informed, I should think, about twenty minutes after it occurred. Q. By whom? A. Dr. Pilgrim. Q. And you reported it to Dr. Gray ? A. No, sir; lam mistaken — Dr. Pilgrim and I were talking together and Dr. Backus came and informed us; we then went im- mediately to the ward—Dr. Pilgrim, Dr. Backus, and myself, I mean; we went on the ward four, and Ave took Mr. Hughes to the attend- ant's room. 219 Q. Where was Mr. Hughes when you saw him ? A. Sitting in a chair. Q. Was he strapped in a chair ? A. Yes, sir; he was strapped. Q. Who unloosened him ? A. Mr. Weir. Q. At whose direction ? * A. By mine. Q. What was said ? A. My recollection is that I asked how it happened ; I asked Mr. Weir hoAv the injury happened. Q. What did he say ? A. He said that he did not know when it happened; that it oc- curred when he Avas gone from the ward, or something to that effect. Q. Did you make any further inquiries about the matter ? A. No, sir; not at that time; I immediately commenced paying attention to the man. Q. Then you made no further inquiries ? A. I examined Mr. Hughes and took him into the attendant's room and stripped him ; upon stripping him and making an exam- ination I found that the tenth or eleventh rib had punctured the lung. Q. Did you find that then and there ? A. Yes, sir ; and that there were other ribs broken. Q. Did you ascertain how many ? A. I did not continue the examination very far, because I found that one rib must have punctured the lung and I thought it would not be at all advisable to manipulate and find out how many had been broken ; nor was it very essential to ascertain how many ribs had been broken as the treatment would be just the same whether it was one or five that Avere broken. Q. Did you notice that two ribs had punctured the lung ? A. No, sir, I could not tell that, any more than one had ; the only evidence I had that it had punctured the lung was the escape of air under the skin. Q. Did you regard that as necessarily fatal at that time? A. No, sir. Q. As probably fatal ? A. In that case I did, as probably fatal. Q. In that case — necessarily fatal ? A. I say probably fatal; I had reference to such cases, generally. Q. And afterward you confined it to that case ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How did you consider it necessarily fatal in that case ? A. At that time ? Q. Yes? A. I could not say that it Avould be undoubtedly fatal; I said I considered it was probably fatal. Q. Does "probably" express the views you entertained at that •time ? 220 A. Yes, sir ; I could not say positively. Q. Did you at that time make any further examination of any of the attendants or did you make any further examination of any of t the patients to ascertain how the injury occurred ? A. No, sir; I immediately proceeded to the apothecary shop and got materials to take care of Mr. Hughes ; after we reported to Dr. Gray, he instructed me to tell Dr. Pilgrim to make inquiries care- fully and thoroughly about the matter. Q. And that ended your connection with the matter ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What was then done with Mr. Hughes? A. During my absence from the ward he was taken to the eighth ward ; I went up there and attended to him. Q. And did you attend to him more or less until the time of his death ? A. Yes, sir; I saw him more or less. Q. I suppose that no further examination was made of him before he died to ascertain how many ribs were broken? A. No, sir; it would not have been profitable. Q. State wThat examination was made after his death in regard to the extent of his injuries, if any ? A. There was no examination made at the Asylum. Q. Were you present at the time of the coroner's inquest ? Did you attend when that inquest Avas held ? A. I was out of the Asylum at the time. Q. Were you present at all at the inquest ? A. No, sir. Q. Mr. Hughes was injured upon what day ? A. That I cannot state. The day of the week do you mean ? Q. Yes. A. My recollection is that it was on Saturday. Q. The day after his arrival ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do you remember how long he lived ? A. He lived until the following Friday night, nearly a week; it would be just a week after he arrived. Q. Do you personally know in regand to what investigation was made with respect to the causes of his death, of your own personal knowledge, I mean ? A. No, sir. Q. Do you remember what day his body was taken away from the Asylum ? A. Saturday afternoon, after the coroner and jury had viewed it. Q. When were these three men discharged. AVhat day of the week ? A. I can't say. Q. Do you know personally what investigation was made in regard to the causes of the injury received by Mr. Hughes__that is, any investigation after his body was taken away from the Asylum' and during the ensuing week ? 221 A. I know personally that there was a coroner's inquest. Q. Any thing more than the coroner's inquest ? A. I know of nothing more than that. Q. Do you wish to give any reason why these three men, or either of them, Avere not discharged sooner than the second Saturday suc- ceeding — two weeks from the Saturday on which Mr. Hughes re- ceived his injury ? A. If it is proper I should like to state, I would rather have you say " Avish" instead of " can." Q. I will make the change then in the question ? A. I should be glad to give a reason if I could, but I don't know. Q. You don't know of any reason ? A. No, sir, I do not. Q. Who has the authority in that institution to discharge attend-' ants ? A. The superintendent, or in his absence, myself. Q. You two only ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And you only in the absence of the superintendent ? A. Yes, sir. Q. In case any of the officials of the institution discover any thing wrong, before an attendant can be discharged or suspended it is neces- sary to report the case to either Dr. Gray, or in his absence to your- self, and allow you to act ? A. You mean with regard to an attendant ? Q. Yes. A. Yes, sir. Q. And you have no power in the premises except in the absence of Dr. Gray ? A. No, sir, except in the absence of Dr. Gray. Q. Do you recollect the name of Mr. Giles Penny ? A. Yes, sir, I recollect him. Mr. Haskell — I should prefer to have the case-book before I question you about that, and I suppose you would rather have the dates ? Witness — I know about that case and I remember how his jaw was injured, though I do not remember the dates perhaps. Q. Have you any knowdedge of it ? A. Yes, sir, I saw it done; it was self-inflicted by pounding his head against the arm of a chair, and at the same time biting his lip, and trying to bite his cheek for purposes of self-injury ; at the time of his injury to his jaw he was wearing a camisole and sitting in the chair. By Mr. Rice : Q. How did he lose his teeth ? A. I don't recollect. Q. Suppose a patient is brought to the Asylum, and during the first evening of his being here word is sent to you that he is restless and 222 disturbed and noisy ; would you consider that your full duty was done if you did not go and see the patient ? A. It would depend entirely upon the nature of the word that was brought to me; if it was brought that he was sleepless and I had not already prescribed for him, and was thoroughly acquainted with the patient and the nature of his case, I think I could prescribe as intelligently if I did not see him as if I did. Q. So that the mere fact of its being the first day in the Asylum would make no difference, and would not be a factor in enabling you to make up your judgment as to Avhether you should or should not go and see him personally ? A. No, sir; it would depend very much upon the nature of the case and the character of the word that was brought; I have visited the wards as often as four or five times in the night, and then again I have not visited them for three or four or five nights at a time. Q. You came to the institution in 1878 ? A. Yes, sir. Q. At that time and until Dr. Gray received his injury will you state to me how often Dr. Gray made a thorough tour of the Asy- lum for the purpose of examining into and ascertaining the con- dition of the patients ? A. It would be a difficult matter to answer, except to say that every little while the doctor would come — either by himself or with Dr. Andrews, his associate, would come and go through a divis- ion. On some occasions I have been on the wards when I did not know but what Dr. Gray was doAvn stairs and 1 would find him there on the wards. Q. Could you say whether or not Dr. Gray made a thorough tour of the entire Asylum for the purpose of investigation and under- standing and ascertaining the condition of the patients as often as once a month ? A. Oh, yes, sir; I do not want to say — I should not want to swear that he made a regular routine tour of wards consecutively. Q. I do not mean consecutively. A. I understand what you mean — would he get an entire knowl- edge of the inmates once a month ? Q. Yes. A. Yes, sir, I should say he would. Q. Would he any oftener than that ? A. Yes, sir. Q. As often as twice a month, should you say ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Three times a month ? A. Perhaps not to go through the entire Asylum as often as that. Q. I am not asking about the entire Asylum. Would you swear that he did that as often as once a month from 1878, when you came (there, until the time of his injury ? A. 1 should think as a rule' that he did; I would not be positive or give figures. Q. How much time from 1878 — what time in the year 1878 did you go there ? 223 A. The 7th day of March. Q. From that time to March, 1882, a period of tour yeavs, how much was the doctor absent from the institution ? A. That I cannot say; during the time just before he was shot he was absent for two or three months; tAvo months, I guess it was, at the Guiteau trial. During the summer he would take a vacation of three or four weeks, although usually coming back once in that time. In 1879 he went to Europe, going, I think, on the 21st or 22d of May and returning the 5th or 6th of September, that was 1879. Q. Hoav was it in 1878 — was he absent several months during each of the years on vacation or business ? A. No, sir; I should not say several months — several maybe three or four. Q. While several weeks then in each of those four years ? A. Taking all of his absences together, yes, sir. Q. Several weeks in each of the four years on business or pleas- ure ? • A. Yes, sir; in 1878 I think he was aAvay for a few wTeeks in the summer and I have a recollection of his being away on vacation another time; during the winter of 1878 he Avent to New York and delivered his lectures. Q. The Avinter of 1878-9 how much time did he occupy ? _ A. My recollection is that he delivered twelve lectures ; that he goes on Wednesday afternoon and gets back Saturday nights ; deliv- ering two lectures a week, Thursday and Friday. Q. That Avould amount to five orsix weeks? A. That would take six weeks to dehVer the twelve lectures. Q. Then how is it as to his being away on expert or other business during that year ? A. I don't remember how that is. Q. AYith regard to the injury to Mr. Hughes, have you any suggestions that you would like to make, or that you can make, with regard as to Iioav the thing could have happened, and as to hoAv such ^accidents may be avoided in the future?' A. The thing happened — I have not very much doubt — through lack of judgment on the part of the two attendants, Brown and Weir; the lack, of judgment on the part of Mr. Weir in leaving the man for one attendant to look after while he went to report the mat- ter that he Avas disturbed, because he could much easier have sent some one. I think if he had sent some one — :_ Q. I do not care for an argument; please state briefly your vieAvs. A. The prevention of such accidents is of course only to be ac- complished by the instillation into the attendants of greater judg- ment, and impressing upon them the necessity of great care, Avhich has been as much done in the past as it can be in the future. Q. Then you think you do not see any Avay in which this unfor tunate affair could have been avoided or foreseen ? A. I do not see any way in which it could have been foreseen. 224 Q. And it does not suggest to you any change that should be made in the conduct or care of the ward ? A. One change which might be made would be to divide the ward into two wards. Shut off, as you recollect the day-room, shut off that from the balance of the Avard and place three or four attendants in charge of that end and three or four in charge of this end. Q. Then you Avould not suggest an increase in the number of at- tendants in that ward as a means of preventing such occurrences. A. Perhaps so, for the reason that even those two attendants, if they had simply set down and held him firmly without struggling I do not think this would ever have happened. Q. Then you think one cause for this affair was lack of sufficient , attendants ? A. No, sir, I do not think it was that particular reason that caused the injury; I think there were sufficient attendants there at the time to control him without further help. Q. I wish to call your attention further to the fact that a very large share of the' injuries which occur in the institution occur on the fourth ward. Have yon observed that ? A. If my attention had not been particularly called to that I should have said the injuries occurred most frequently on that ward. Q. Do you not recollect that you swore that in that part of the institution a large share of the injuries did occur ? A. Yes, sir, I think a larger proportion occurs on that Avard than on other wards, because there is a different class of patients there. Q. Has it always been so since you knew any thing about it ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do you not think that there are too many injuries occurring upon that ward, to be consistent with the good government of it ? A. No, sir, I am surprised that there are not more. Q. Are you surprised that there are not more violent deaths upon that ward ? A. No, sir; but I am surprised that there are not more injuries occurring on the ward—injuries in the shape of black eyes and bruises, and things of that kind. Q. I suppose you have no knowledge of the habits of the attend- ants of endeavoring to control the patients by striking them in their abdomen ? A. No, sir. Q. Does any reason suggest itself to you why a blow in the ab- domen would be a very practical means of controlling a refractory patient ? A. I should think it Avould control any person, because it would produce such a shock, and at the same time would not leave any mark on the patient. It would not be so apt to leave a mark as a blow in any other place. Q. It would not be so observable as a bloAV on the head ? A. Well, a blow anywhere else might break the skin ; it would not show very much there, of course. 225 Q. And, therefore, would not be so apparent to any person pass- ing through the ward ? A. No, sir. Q. Have you any reason to doubt the evidence of the attendants Weir, Bills and Brown to be true that they have been in the habit of striking the patients in that way, or are you not aware that they have given such evidence ? A. 1 Avas not aware that they had given such evidence. Q. AYere you present at the inquest when the evidence was taken ? A. No, sir. Q. Were you sworn before the coroner's jury ? A. No, sir. Q. Did you read the evidence ? A. No, sir ; as soon as it became at all probable that there was going to be an inquiry into the matter I abstained from reading the evidence, so that I could form an impartial opinion on the matter. Q. Did you have any conversation Avith Dr. Gray with regard to the discharge of these men, prior to their discharge ? A. Yes, sir. Q. That matter was talked about between you ? A, It was understood that they were going to be discharged as soon as the coroner's investigation was finished. Q. In your conversation with Dr. Gray did he tell you that they would be discharged as soon as the coroner's inquest was finished? A. Well, words to that effect. Q. When did you first have any words with Dr. Gray in regard to the discharge of these men ? A I cannot state noAV ; I think it wras immediately after the death of Mr. Hughes. Q. You did not have any until he died? A. No, sir. . Q. And not until after the inquest had commenced ? A. No, sir, I do not recollect any. Q. You said you always made personal inquiry in regard to every case of injury, if it came to your notice, when you were in the insti- tution ? A. Yes, sir. Q. I suppose all of the cases of injury appearing in these books Avhich occurred from March, 187>\ until the time you were trans- ferred to the female side of the institution, did not come to your at- tention ? A. I presume they all did, or nearly all of them. Q. So that very likely you would not be able to recollect them ? A. Some of them I would recollect. Q. Who was attendant R. R. Morris ? A. He had charge of the fourth ward. Q. What has become of him ? A. My present recollection is that the last I knew any thing about him he went on to a farm up near Oneida. 29U 226 Q. How long has he been gone aAvay from the institution. A. Some three or four years ; he left the institution in poor health and he has been there once since. Q. As an attendant ? . . A. No ; once or twice he has called at the institution on a visit. Q.. Do you recollect the case of J. E., who in August, 1878 bruised his arm and knee very badly while in a covered bed, and was removed to the eleventh ward on that account i A. I remember such a patient; I do not remember that exact in- stance ; it was a case of general paralysis of the insane. Q. Would a person suffering from 'general paralysis be inclined to injure himself that way? A.' AYhat Ave term " general paralysis of the insane " does not convey to your minds a correct appreciation of the case, because they may not be paralyzed in the usual acceptation of the term until toward the latter end of the disease, when they are quite helpless. By the Chairman : Q. Have you, yourself, attended to any outside expert Avork since your entrance into the Asylum as a physician? A. I have, to a certain degree. - Q. To what extent; during the time you have been here how much time has it taken you outside of the Asylum? A. I have never been gone more than three days at any time; I don't think that I have been engaged in more than half a dozen cases; one of them was by the direction of Governor Cleveland; I examined into the matter, came to Albany and reported to the board, and I went up to Morrisville on the Haight case. Q. That was the trial of Mrs. Haight for the murder of her hus- band ? A. Yes, sir. Q. For whom did you appear in that case ? A. I was called for the district attorney. Q. Were there any other public cases in which you were called for the people, or on their behalf ? A. Yes, sir; I was at the trial of Osterhout; the matter of in- sanity was raised there and was under consideration ; I was then called by the people; last fall I went to Buffalo and was there two days and a half in the matter of the will of Mrs. Fillmore. Q. On whose behalf ? A. The contestor. Q. Was Dr. Gray also there at the same time ? A. He was there the last day I was there. Q. Did you both receive compensation for your service in that case! A. I cannot say for Dr. Gray, but I did." Q. What salary do you receive in the Asylum ? A. Two thousand dollars a year, and I live there ; I want to make a statement; the statement is frequently made that these positions in Asylums are obtained through political influence; I went to the 227 Asylum in 1878 to fill a vacancy at the request of Dr. Gray ; I was then fourth assistant, taking the place of the regular fourth assist- ant, who had gone to Europe for three months ; Dr. James D. White, of Buffalo, told me that they wanted some one to fill a vacancy; I Avas then engaged in lecturing at the college on diseases of the nervous system; I told Dr. Gray that I should like to fill the vacancy, and see some practical work in relation to insanity ; I went to Utica on that understanding ; Dr. Kendricks died abroad, and I have re- mained there ever since; the present second assistant, Dr. Bloomer. who is now in Europe, applied at the Asylum for a position, and sent in his credentials from the University of Durham and the University of Edinburgh, at which places he had received his education ; he also had one from the University of Pennsylvania; he presented them and was engaged; that is how he came into the institution; the third assistant, Dr. Pilgrim, came there on the recommendation of Dr. Austin Flint, of New York; he had been an assistant at Albany; when Dr. Russell went to Europe a year ago last Decem- ber, Dr. Pilgrim, applied for the position and was appointed ; the fourth assistant, Dr. Backus ; his application was made by his father, Dr. Backus, of Rochester, in the absence of Dr. Gray last summer; I knew something of his father in Rochester, although I did not know his son, except by reputation ; I forwarded the letter to Dr. Gray, with the indorsement that he would get a good man if he secured him ; Dr. Gray immediately wrote to me to make inquiries, which I forAvarded to him and Professor Pepper of Philadelphia, and Dr. Backus Avas appointed; that is all the political or other influence that has been used in relation to any of the present staff. Q. Who had the appointing power of the present staff ? A. The superintendent nominates them to the board of manage- ment. Q. Have you any information as to the method of appointment of subordinates in the institution ? A. Yes, sir. Q. As to whether any political influence has any thing to do with them ? A. I am very positive that no political influence is used. Q. How much attention is paid to the Asylum by the board of managers in the way of personal visits? A. Mr. Campbell, the president of the board — during the summer months I hardly think a Sunday goes by but what he comes down and goes through with some of the wTard ; then he is there once or twice during the week, sometimes ; sometimes he is not; sometimes he does not come at all during the week. Q. When he comes there during the week is it his custom to go into one or more of the Avards I A. Not always, unless it is to see a patient; sometimes some friends will apply to him to see a patient, and he does so ; during the winter months he is not there quite so often ; other members of the board do not come there as frequently; Mr. Swan is there 228 sometimes, and General McQuade, who is chairman of the general executive committee—I don't remember just the title of the com- mittee— he is there quite often. Q. What is the practice as to the board of managers visiting the Asylum ? A. At the quarterly meeting they go through all the wards. Q. Is it usual to go through all the wards except on the occasion of the quarterly meeting ? A. It is, except in Mr. Campbell's cdse. Q. In his case, does he go through the wards quite frequently ? A. He usually goes ; as I say, takes one division on Sundaj', and the following Sunday he takes the other division. Q. Is he then the only member of the board who makes a thor- ough visitation of all the wards at regular intervals ? A. I think so ; yes, sir. Q. Is it an unusual thing for the managers to go through all the wards except at quarterly meetings ? A. It'is rather, for them to go through all the wards; during last summer we have been making repairs on the women's division, and some one of the board of managers was up there every Aveek, and some twice.a week. Q. On such occasions their visits were directed principally to the portions of the building undergoing repair ? - A. Yes, sir. Q And for the purpose of inspecting the work then going on? ' A. Yes, sir. Q. Do you know Avhether there is any rule requiring any member of the board to make a regular visitation except at the quarterly meetings ? A. I do not, except at the quarterly meetings; the rule requires that they shall go then. [Three books marked respectively, " Exhibits ' 7,' '8 ' and 9,' —J. H. M.," were then sIioavii to the witness and identified as the injury books of the female wards of the Asylum.] By Mr. Haskell : Q. Will you have the kindness to specify what are known as the " bad" or "disturbed " wards on the women's side of the asylum! A. Wards 7, 8 and 9, and to a certain extent, ward 11. Q. Which is the suicidal ward? A. No. 6. Q. Which are the convalescent or best wards ? A. No 1 to No. 4 are the wards in which the patients are in the best mental condition. Q. I call your attention to an entry on the injury book — "Ex- hibit No. ' 4,' in regard to W. H. S." — accidentally breaking his knee-cap, etc. Do you know any thing about that ? A. I recollect that. Q. Do you recollect what investigations were made in that case! 229 P"A. I cannot say whether myself or Dr. Andrews made an investi- gation in that case ; I remember dressing the leg ; I recollect how it occurred—but only from hearsay. Q. Mr. Weir has had charge of the fourth ward since you went on to the other side of the building — the women's side ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And would not have any thing to do with him personally? A. No, sir. Q. Did it ever strike you as strange, or was your attention ever 'called to the fact, that so many of the patients on the fourth ward get black eyes ? A. It never struck me as specially strange. Q. So that that matter has never made you suspicious that per- haps those injuries were caused by the attendants ? A. No, sir ; I cannot say that it has. JOSEPH R. SWAN, Jr., Sworn and examined, testified as follows: By the Chairman : Q. Please state your age and residence ? A. I am forty-two years old, and reside at Utica. Q. What position do you hold with reference to the Asylum ? A. I am one of the managers. Q. How long have you been one of the managers ? A. Since 1878. Q. When does your term expire ? A. It expired in 1881, and I am holding over. Q. What attention have you given personally to the affairs of the Utica Insane Asylum during your term of office — state generally ? A. The first feAV years of my term of office I was not a member of the auditing committee ; the auditing committee is the only standing committee that there is in the board of managers, and it is with the president of the board, substantially the executive committee of the board of managers. Q. And their duties are mainly with reference to the accounts? A. Not only with reference to the accounts but generally ; Dr. Gray, the superintendent, confers with the auditing board and with the president of the board of managers the same as he would if it were the executive committee of the board. During the first three years I did not pay as much attention to the Asylum as I have since, necessarily. The board of managers have four regular meetings— quarterly meetings of the board; one, the annual meeting, is Decem- ber, and the other three are in April, July, and October. At three of these meetings the board goes through the Asylum, that is they 230 are not bound or required to go through the whole Asylum, but they go through portions of it. Q. At the quarterly meetings? A. At either of the meetings except the annual meeting. At the annual meeting the whole board goes through the Asylum, from one end of it to the other. Q. At the other three meetings they do not take every ward ? A. They do not on every occasion ; sometimes they do and some- times they do not.' , Q. How much time, besides what you have stated, is giA^en to an inspection of the wards by the managers, personally? A. I could not speak about that, except as to myself. There is no time fixed for the board of managers visiting the Asylum, but different members of the board go there, and especially the auditing committee, or members of the auditing committee; they are re- quired to go there frequently about the business of the Asylum, and when they go it is usual, not always, but usual, to go through some portions of the Asylum. Q. How often on an average have you visited the Avards, or any of them, during your term of office ? A. I could not say exactly. Q. Once a month do you think ? A. I think 1 have been in the wards of the Asylum at least once a month, if not oftener. In some of the wrards of the Asylum, when I go there, I make it a point to go through the disturbed wards; I do not think that there is the same necessity for going through the other wards of the Asylum as there is through the disturbed wards; there it is necessary and proper for members of this board to go. It is also very essential that some members of the auditing board should know something about the outside affairs of the Asylum, for instance the butcher shop, or rather the ^slaughter-house, you might call it, and the bakery and the stables, and the garden and farm. Q. And those you visit from time to time ? A. Yes, sir; I visited them the other day when you were there; while the committee were going around, I spent considerable time in going over the premises; I did not go on that occasion into any of the wards, and I give this simply as an illustration ; the other day while you were examining Dr. Gray I went round to the barns, and to the slaughter-house and bakery ; not because I knew of any neces- sity of doing it, but because I wanted to do it. Q. For the purpose of seeing those parts of the institution ? A. Yes, sir; the Friday before that — to carry out my illustration — that is a week ago, while you gentlemen were going through the men's department, Mr. Rogers, Mr. Lowery and myself went through the disturbed wards on the female side. Q. When had you previously been through the disturbed wards on the female side? A. I think it was in December previous ; and I was thrqugh the men's ward about three months previous —no, sir ; I think it was in the latter part of December. 231 Q. About six or eight weeks previous. A. Yes, sir ; I went through the men's department, that is the disturbed Avards. and I had to pass through the other wards to get to them ; I think I have been twice since December; I could notTof course tell you each time I have beer, through, because I did not carry it in my mind, and I kept no memorandum of it. Q. How often are you Avilling to say that you have visited some of the wards during your term of office? A. I think, taking the last year for instance, that I should average more than once a month ; I should say in some respects more than that; 1 have been in some of the Avards at least a dozen times — rather more or less; I should think now that I have been to the Asylum on business ; it seems to me I have to go there every two or three weeks about something. Q. Would once in every tAvo or three weeks fairly represent the number of occasions that you have gone to the Asylum during the past year ? A. Sometimes, you know, I would go two or three times a week, and at other times I Avould not go as often ; as I would be called upon for some special reason. Q. Are you acquainted with the rate of wages paid to the attend- ants and officers ? A. I think I know generally. Q. What is Dr. Gray's salary ? A. He gets $4,000. , Q. What are the physician's salaries ? A. I may not get this exactly, but I think the first assistant re- ceives $2,000 a year, the second $1,800, the next $1,500, and the fourth $1,200. Q. What are the supervisors paid monthly? A. The men are paid $40. Q. What are the attendants on the men's side paid ? A. The attendants on the male side are paid all the way from $20 to $28 a month, I think. Q. It has been testified that they work from fourteen to sixteen hours a, day ? A. Yes, sir. Q. That is substantially true, according to your knowledge ? A. Yes, sir ; I think it is. Q. Do you think that the wrages paid the attendants are sufficient, considering their hours of labor and the duties required of them ? A. Before the commencement of these investigations it was easy to get attendants at those rates, but since the inquiries that have taken place, attendants have felt that they were subject to criticism — more than that — that odium was cast upon them and it has be- come, and is now, difficult to obtain the same class of attendants at those prices ; I state this on information ; the managers have noth- ing to do with the hiring or discharging1 of attendants. Q. Who has the hiring and discharging of them ? 232 A. Dr. Gray — no, sir, they are hired by the steward on the re- commendation' probably of Dr. Gray, and upon examination. My view about the relations between the managers and the officers of the Asylum is this: the managers appoint the -superintendent and the steward and matron, and tire assistant physicians are appointed by the board of managers upon the recommendation of Dr. Gray. They are responsible to the board of managers for the management of the Asylum, and it would only create discord and trouble if the managers' should undertake to interfere as between the governing head of the Asylum and the employees. Q. So that the employment of the attendants has been entirely left to Dr. Gray ? A. Yes, sir; Dr. Gray and the steward. Q. Are there not frequent changes among those attendants? Have there not been during the past few years ? A. I think there have been, as I am informed, but personally 1 knoAV nothing about it; I make inquiries about such things and get information. Q. Have you any opinion as to the character or fitness of the attendants ? A. I have nothing to do with it, and would have, under no cir- cumstances. A. Do you think that that should be left where it is, without any direction by the board of managers ? A. Yes, sir. Q. As a matter of the executive management of the institution? A. Yes, sir ; he and his assistant are the responsible heads of the institution. Q. I understand you to say that the employees are engaged by Mr. Dryer upon the recommendation of the superintendent? A. I think so ; when an attendant or other similar employee is engaged in the Asylum, as I understand it, he signs the following Agreement. In consideration of being employed by the Superintendent of the New York State Lunatic Asylum, for the said Asylum, I do hereby agree to work for the said State Lunatic Asylum for one year from date, at any Avork or service assigned me by the said superintendent, or other officer, on the terms specified opposite my name, payable after the first month, so that one month's wages Avill remain unpaid until the end of the year ; and I agree to observe and obey the rules and regulations of the Asylum, and the directions of the superintend- ent or other officers, from time to time; and in case I leave my employment before the expiration of one year from date, without the permission of the superintendent, or am discharged for the violation of the rules or neglect of duty, I am to forfeit one month's wages; and if I continue in the employment of the Asylum after the termination of this contract, I agree to be liable to forfeit one month's wages, on the conditions above specified. Dated this day of , 18 NAME. | RESIDENCE. | PBICE PER MONTH. 233 Q. Who purchases the supplies for the institution ? A. The steAvard of the Asylum. Q. And his purchases gre audited by the committee of which you are a member ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Have you any of the accounts presented to the Asylum for any of those supplies ? A. I have not with me. Q. Where are those supplies usually purchased ? A. They are usually purchased in Utica or the vicinity. Q. What effort is made, to your knowledge, to secure the best prices—by competition, or otherwise ? Do you knowr that at any time bids are asked for and received ? A. The steAvard, as I understand, has at all times gone to different persons to purchase his supplies; I believe that they are mostly purchased in the city of Utica and the vicinity ; and I believe that there are over 130 persons that he has to deal with ; sometimes he goes to one, and sometimes to another. Q. State, if you knoAV, what are the aggregate expenses of the institution annually ? A. My recollection is — I cannot carry these figures in my head, but my recollection is that it is something like, altogether, $180,000. Q. That is for all the purposes of the institution ? A. I think that covers all purposes of the institution except the salaries; whether it covers salaries or not I do not know. Q. In your opinion, is the method of purchasing supplies so arranged as to be fair ? A. J believe it is ; I believe that we have got a very exemplary, upright man for the position of steAvard. Q. What supervision is there over his method of buying the sup- plies ? A. The accounts are audited by the auditing board; I can show you the form of his account. Q. What have you to say as to the advantage of purchasing sup- plies for the Asylum by wholesale ? A. The suggestion Avas made about getting the flour, etc., at wholesale prices, and the effort has been made at different times ; Ave sent each month direct to the mills, and bought the flour there in hopes of getting it at a lower price ; we found, at that time, that it was more economical to buy the flour in Utica; bad weight was given, when the flour was sent, and if it had been purchased in Utica, it would have been returned, as not of the quality desired; and in that instance, at least, it was found that it was more economical to buy the flour in Utica. Q. About hoAv many barrels do you buy at a time ? A. About a hundred barrels at a time, I should think. Q. Is there any competition sought among the merchants in ob- taining supplies by inquiry to ascertain what prices the articles can be obtained at ? 30 U 234 A. I think there is to a certain extent. Q. Do you know that of your own knowledge ? # A. All this that I testify to about supplies and the purchasing of them, I do not know of my own knowledge, because 1 do not pre- tend to be present at the time any of this business was done. Q. All the purchasing for the institution is done by whom i A. Bv the steward of the Asylum. Q. And the only supervision is in the auditing of his accounts i A. In the examination and auditing of his accounts — that is the only supervision. Q. What knowledge has the auditing committee that the exact quantity charged for has ever been delivered to and received by the institution? A. I am not the book-keeper, birt if I had the books of the Asylum I could explain to you how it was done. Q. You mean to say that the knowledge of the auditing commit- tee is derived from the books ? A. No, sir, there is more than that. The steward every morning makes a list of all the articles that he is going to purchase that day; that is copied into a book by the book-keeper. He makes his pur- chase for the day and returns and reports what he has purchased. The goods are delivered by the vender with his bill in the usual form. Every article that goes into the Asylum is either weighed or counted. Whatever the measure may be, it is weighed by the assistant clerk, and is marked on his book by the book-keeper, and then the account is not paid until it is made out and presented to the vender in triplicate form in that shape (handing to the committee triplicate printed blanks of account). The vender has to SAvear to this account, as you perceive by one of the blank forms; it has then to be countersigned by the superin- tendent and the steward both, and has to be restated. There are three blanks, one of them is delivered to the treasurer of the Asylum, the second to the Comptroller of the State, and the third one is not sworn to and is kept in the Asylum; it is in this form, and is the copy of the account that was kept in the Asylum. Q. Who gets the one that goes to the Asylum ? A. It is kept by the steward's clerk in the Asylum ; he gets the books ; these supplies, for instance, such as butter and provisions and groceries and such things, are all kept by the storekeeper; there is not any thing, as I understand it, from a paper of pins to a barrel of flour but what is charged to some one when it goes out of the store- keeper's hands and has to be accounted for. By Mr. Brown : Q. I suppose you mean going into the different departments of the Asylum? A. Yes, sir. t 235 Q. Do you think of any other thing you want to say in regard to the business management of the institution ? A. Nothing, except I believe it is well managed; there has been one suggestion made that the affairs of the Asylum should be sepa- rated — that is, that the business management should be separated from that of the head of the medical department. Q. How does that present itself to you — favorably or unfavor- ably ? A. I think it is utterly impossible to do it and have justice done to the Asylum, because I think there ought to be, in such an es- tablishment, one responsible head for doing all of its business ; for transacting all the business affairs of the Asylum and all the medici- nal ; the treatment of patients as well as the purchasing of articles of supply for the patients, and luxuries for patients, etc. If it were otherwise, it seems to me that it would lead to a conflict of authority, which would be very prejudicial to the affairs of the Asy- lum. Either one or the other ought to be at the head— either the business managers ought to be at the head, or the superintendent of the Asylum ought to be at the head ; as it is now the superin- tendent of the Asylum is at the head, and we have a business mana- ger, who is the steward, and subject to the Superintendent. Q. Then you are perfectly satisfied with things as they are? A. As far as I know I think the business affairs of the Asylum are well conducted. Q. I want to call your attention to these injury books. Have you ever seen them before to examine them ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And have you examined them from time to time ? If so, Avhat examination have you made of them from time to time ? A. I have looked at them. Q. How often have you seen them to make an examination of them ? A. I do not knoAV. Q. Do you think you have ever seen all six of them to examine them ? A. I don't knoAV whether I have or not. Q. On how many occasions wonld you say you had seen any of them more than twice to examine them carefully ? A. I do not remember; I remember seeing those books and knowing what they were and that is all I can say. Q. You have never taken them carefully to make an investigation of what they contain, have you ? A. I have looked at them. Q. Have you looked at the outside or the inside ? A. I have looked at the inside. Q. Can you pick out of the six books lying on the table before you Avhich one you have looked at to examine ? A. I do not believe I can. Q. Have you ever taken any pains to acquaint yourself with the circumstances surrounding any of the instances recorded in the books ? 236 A. I have not; in going through the Asylum I have often asked the patients how they were hurt; when I have seen a man with a black eye, for instance, I have asked him how he was hurt. Q. Can you recollect any individual case, and the answer that was made to you ? , A. Yes, sir, I can remember one case where it was demonstrated by one patient, with regard to another; I inquired about that case, and learned how it occurred, that it was the result of an attack by one patient upon another. [The witness then stated what he was told by a patient.] Q. As I understand you, in going through the Asylum when you see an injury, or the evidence of an injury, you make some casual inquiries'with regard to it; but you do not make it a business to investigate those things ? A. I don't know ; 1 make inquiries ; I don't know whether you would call it a " business " or not. Q. Aside from the one case that you have just mentioned to us do you recollect any other case ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Where you followed it out? A. I remember going through the Asylum with the Woodin In- vestigating Committee; I remember a man there apparently badly injured in the face; I asked Senator Woodin to ask that man how he was hurt, and the man said he had hurt himself. Q. Do you recollect any others ? A. I do not remember any specific instances; I have no doubt I have made a good many of them that I do not recollect about. Q. (Repeated.) A. If I should rake back over my memory I might think of others that do not occur to me just now. Q. At the quarterly meeting of the board of managers are these injury books brought round and examined and the subject taken into consideration by the board ? A. No, sir. Q. Now, in regard to Dr. Gray's outside employment; what do you, individually, as a member of the board, think of his accepting outside employment ? A. I think it is just as proper for Dr. Gray to accept outside em- ployment, if it in no way interferes with the good government of the Asylum, as it is for a judge who writes a law book and sells it for a profit. And I would say one thing further ; that is: that I think it well for Dr. Gray to keep up his knowledge, as a physician and surgeon, by consulting with other physicians ; I think it is for the good of the Asylum in that regard. Q. Then what do you say as to whether or not you would recom- mend a stoppage of his taking employment away from the institu- tion? 237 A. Not if it interferes in nowise with the discipline and welfare of the institution. Q. Do you think that it does interfere with the discipline and welfare of the institution ? A. I have never found any evidences of it. Q. Have you ever taken any pains to look for the evidences of it, especially personal ? A. Only to examine into the welfare of the Asylum, and I do not see that it has deteriorated any from the facts of his having taken outside employment. Q. Do you know, as a fact, whether he took more outside employ- ment away from the institution before you became a member of the board than after you became a member of the board ? A. I do not know. Q. When did you learn of this injury to Mr. Hughes ? A. I heard of it the Saturday after he died. Q. Do you know what, if any, action was taken by the board in regard to his death; you may state what you did upon hearing of his death, if any thing ? A. Well, upon the — Q. (Interrupting) Had you heard of his injury until after his death ? A. I had not heard of his injury until after his death ; they im- paneled a coroner's jury on Monday, I think; I heard of it Saturday, and I saw Dr. Gray on Sunday at the Asylum in regard to it. Q. You went to the institution to see Dr. Gray particularly in regard to that matter ? A. Yes, sir; and on Monday (that is my best recollection) they impaneled a coroner's jury. It may have been that they impaneled the jury on Saturday ; on Monday I went up to the Asylum, and the coroner's jury had been impaneled; I suggested to Dr. Gray immediately that the district attorney ought to be employed and he agreed with me; and then a letter was produced from some one in Madison county by the coroner asking that the matter be ad- journed over, I think ; I then went down after the district attorney myself ; I Avent to his office and he was not in ; there was a note on his door that he was at the court-house; I went to the court-house and he Avas not there ; I then went to his house and I could not find him ; I then came back to the assistant district attorney's office and I found him in his office, and I asked him to go up and appear be- fore the coroner's jury ; but for reasons which he gave at the time, he declined to do it; I think the district attorney came in the after- noon. Q. Was there any meeting of the board to consider the case ? A. I think there has been, but I am not certain about it; I think there was a meeting to consider the matter. Q. Was that before or after the verdict of the coroner's jury ? A. I do not know ; I do not remember; I think every thing was done that was possible ; I do not think in either of those cases that 238 of Mr. B. or that of Mr. Hughes, that any human foresight could have prevented either one, by the board of the management or the officers of the Asylum. Q. What, if any, inquiries have you made personally as a mana- ger of that institution into the circumstances surrounding the death of Mr. Hughes, and who was responsible for it ? A. I went immediately into the ward as soon as I got up there that Sunday to find out; it may have been Saturday that I was up there first, but when I went up there I Avent into the ward and talked with any one I could find, about it, who knew any thing about it. Q. Do you recollect wdio you found to talk with about it ? A. I talked with Dr. Gray, principally, about it. Q. Did you talk with those in the Avard ? A. No, sir; I did not talk Avith them. Q. You did not talk Avith Mr. Bills ? A. No, sir, I did not, for I had learned after this that it had got into the hands of the coroner's jury, and I did net think that any one ought to interfere with it in'the most remote degree; I did not know about the matter before that time; I had simply talked with Dr. Gray about it. By Mr. Olin : Q. Who purchases the supplies for the Asylum ? A. The steward, Mr. Dryer. Q. Where are they purchased ? A. They are purchased in Utica and the vicinity. Q. From a large number of different persons ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Take, for instance, their sugar, teas and coffees ; do you know how they are purchased ? A. I think they are purchased in the manner I have already de- scribed to you in conversation ; the steward has an arrangement on behalf of the Asylum with Messrs. Butler & Hamilton that certain things, which, I think, consist chiefly of sugar, coffee and tea, shall be purchased by Butler & Hamilton with their other goods, and that the Asylum shall pay fifty per cent on the cash price. Q. And do you say that the flour is purchased in Utica ? A. It is purchased, I think, of different parties in Utica. Q. And their vegetables are purchased by the steward from whom ? A. A large number of vegetables are raised upon the farm. • Q. How is it about butter and milk ? A. The butter is purchased from different individuals — from the dairymen or grocers; I think they purchase it from the men that make it; that is, the butter. Q. Now, how is it about the milk ? A. Well, the milk — I don't know whether that is furnished from the farm or not, but a greater portion of it is ; they have a farm there and have to use what it produces. 239 Q. They give the farm credit for so much stuff? A Yes, sir; you can see it here from this steward's report that I hand yon ; for instance, " apples, fifteen bushels ; " there is an ac- count kept between the Asylum and the farm. Q. You think the milk principally is the product of the farm then ? ' A. I don't know what proportion, or whether all of it. Q. Do they buy cattle ? A. Yes, sir, they buy stock and kill it themselves; buy it on the foot. ' J Q. Do they keep their own butcher and baker ? A. Yes, sir, they do. Witness — There is one thing that I would suggest, that is about the convicts in the Asylum — 1 think they should not be there. Q. Have you any other suggestions to make whereby the general welfare of the institution could be improved ? A. With regard to the matter I have just spoken of, I think the laws ought to be amended so that criminal patients who are dano-er- oiis m the Asylum can be removed to the Asylum for Insane Convicts at Auburn ? There is another thing I would call attention to, and that is as to visiting the Asylum. There are over eight thousand visitors to that Asylum every year. There are five days in the week that visitors go in, and let me suggest this — those people who visit there, outside of the ones who come for the purpose of seeing their friends, are ignorant as a general thing. There are some exceptions in the line of philanthropists who come in there occasionally, but generally it is the ignorant and brutal. It is out of the power of the board of management to prevent such visitation, but I have no doubt that a larger number of people go through the Asylum than is at all necessary, and I think it results to the dis- advantage of the inmates. In my opinion no visitors should be allowed in the Asylum except friends of patients, unless they re- ceive a ticket of admission from some member of the board of management, that would cut off half of the visitors who go out of a morbid curiosity. Recess until to-morrow afternoon at 3 p. m. 240 Albany, N. Y., February 26, 1881. The committee met at 3 p. m. in room " B," pursuant to adjourn- ment. Present — The whole committee. Dr. OGDEN BACKUS, Sworn and examined, testified as follows: By the Chairman : Q. What is your age ? [ A. Twenty-five. Q. What is your residence, excepting the Asylum ? A. Rochester, New York. Q. What position do you hold in the Insane Asylum ? A. I am the fourth assistant physician". Q. How long have you held that position ? A. I was appointed the 13th of last August. Q. How long have you been connected with the Asylum ? A. Since that time — 13th of last August. Q. What are your duties ? A. At present I am assistant physician on the north side, of the house — the men's side. Q. Please state more specifically in Avhat your duties consist ? A. My duties consist in assisting the physician who has charge of the north side, assisting in the Avards, keeping the books containing histories of the cases, and the getting out of statistics; I also have charge of the amusements of the Asylum. Q. How often do you visit the patients? A. Always twice a day and sometimes more. Q. How many wards do you have to visit ? A. Twelve wards. Q. How many physicians are associated with you in visiting those waids ? A. One, Dr. Pilgrim ; and Dr. Gray, the superintendent, of course. Q. How many patients are there ? A. There were three hundred and twenty-one this morning. Q. Do your duties extend over all classes of patients in those wards ? . A. Yes, sir. Q. How many of those wards are known as violent wards ? A. Two, really; one is known as the disturbed ward, and the other is a semi-disturbed ward. Q. About how many patients are there in the disturbed ward ? A. I should say twenty-seven or twenty-eight on ward four; it 241 will vary daily ; sometimes there may be twenty-nine, and some- times only twenty-six. Q. What causes such variations ? A. When a patient is quiet and not noisy, at night specially, and in a condition to be removed from among the class of patients who are on Avard four, he is changed and sent to some other ward. Q. Are yon familiar with the case of Mr. Hughes, avIio died in the Asylum ? A. Yes, sir. Q. When was your attention first drawn to his case ? A. I met Avith the case first on the 25th day of January, at about half-past eleven in the morning ; between half-past eleven and twelve. Q. Is that the day he Avas brought to the Asylum ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What attention did you then give to the case ? A. I took the history of the case from the son ; examined the patient and sent him on to the ward. Q, What ward did you send him on to ? A. The ninth ward. Q. When did you next see him ? A. I next saw him that afternoon about five o'clock. Q. Where did you see him at that time ? A. On the ninth ward. Q. What was his condition and appearance at that time ? A. He was'sitting quietly in a chair; I spoke to him and he ap- peared to be depressed at that time. Q. Were you aware that he had been in the Asylum previously ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Were you aAvare of his condition during his previous stay in the Asylum ? A. At that time I was not. Q. Was there any thing said to you by his son in regard to his being previously an inmate of the Asylum ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What did he say ? A. I cannot recollect it in the words that were used, but in sub- stance it Avas that his father Avas there before ; and we Avere talking generally on the subject of the Asylum, as to howr his father Avould be treated, he hoped that his father Avould make as good a recovery this time as he did before wdien he Avas admitted, in 1878. Q. What was the nature of Mr. Hughes derangement as you understood it from his son ? A. It was a case of melancholia with suicidal tendencies. Q. Did you ask if he Avere violent ? A. I can't recollect whether I asked the question; I presume I did. Q. Did his son say any thing in regard to that subject to you ? A. I can only state that I took the notes of the case in lead pencil as his son gave them to me, and in the notes there is no statement whatever of the man's being violent. 31 U 242 Q. You say you next saw him about five o'clock in the afternoon and that he was then quiet ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you prescribe for him at that time ? A. Not at that time. Q. Did you give any special direction to the attendant concerning him at that time ? A. No, sir. Q. When did you next see him ? A. I saw him about ten o'clock the next morning. Q. In what ward ? A. He was then — well it was after ten, allow me to change that; it was then after that he was moved, and he Avas on the fourth ward. Q. Do you know by whose order he was removed ? A. Yes. Q. By whose ? A. My own. Q. Upon what statement? A. Upon the statement of the supervisor that he had become violent and Avas striking the patients. Q. What supervisor ? A. Supervisor Jones, second department. Q. When was such statement made to you ? A. It was made about ten o'clock. Q. The same morning ? A. Yes, sir; it might have been a little before ten. Q. Was any report made to you during the night, of his condition? A. Yes, sir. Q. At Avhat hour ? A. About twelve o'clock. Q. What was the report ? A. The report was that Mr. Hughes Avas restless, and that he would not stay in bed, or Avould not stop in bed, as the night-watch expressed it; he was reported as sleepless and I sent him a little chloral and tincture of hyoscyamns. Q. Is that the usual draught given to restless patients ? A. That is the usual draught, yes, sir. Q. Does it vary very much from time to time, according to the character of the patient ? A. Not very much. Q. If it varies, in what respect does it vary ? A. It would vary in the dose, Avhich is either increased or dimin- ished. Q. What influences you in deciding the size of the dose that is given to the patient ? A. Our knoAvledge of the patient. Q. How large a dose did you give this patient ? Q. I gave him, I think, fifteen grains of chloral,, and tAvo drams of the tincture of hyoscyamns ? 243 A. That is a medium dose. Q. Did you see that patient during the night ? A. No sir. Q. Why did not you visit him yourself ? A. Because he was simply noisy and restless. Q. Where was he at that time '? A. On the ninth ward. Q. Was he in the dormitory ? A. Yes, sir; we have no single rooms on that ward, they are all dormitory. ' Q. How many are there in the same room ? A. I think there are seven or eight beds in the dormitory. Q. Was any other report brought to you during the night? A. No, sir. Q. What information did you receive as to the effect of this dose? A. None whatever. Q. What do you believe was the effect of it ? A. I believe — I kneAV the man took it because Mr. Summers, our night watch, did not report; if the man had refused to take the medicine, or had continued restless, he would have reported; he did not report and I heard nothing more about it. Q. When did the man first become restless again ? A. I believe somewhere about nine o'clock, to the best of my knowledge; it was in the morning, it was after breakfast, after they were dressed. Q. And was the report of his condition then brought to you ? A. Yes, sir ; it was brought to me in the office. Q. By Avhom ? A. By supervisor Jones. Q. What did you do then ? A. I was just about to go on the wards ; I told him to take Mr. Hughes to Avard number four. Q. Who was charged Avith that duty ? A. Mr. Jones. Q. Alone? A. Well, of course he was charged with it, but he would take another attendant Avho was in the department. Q. Then you say you went on to the fourth ward yourself? A. Yes, sir; that is, I Avent through wards one, two and three, and then down to ward four. Q. What Avas his condition when you saw him on Avard four ? A. I found Mr. Hughes in the day room walking up and down, this Avay —with his arms folded across his breast, and his head down, in that way (indicating); I went up to him, put my hand on his shoulder and I said to him, "Mr. Hughes,-what is the matter? what makes you so disturbed this morning?" He did not answer but he Avalked off, and I followed him and repeated my question to him, but I did not get any answer; so I asked him the third time; by 244 this time he had walked across the day room and he turned round on me and muttered something that, sounded like Welsh; 1 could not swear it was Welsh; but I saw I was only disturbing him, and I concluded it was better to let him alone for the present. Q. How long did you remain there with him at that time i A. I do not suppose 1 was there more than — ; Q. (Interrupting.) On the occasion of that interview, talking with him ? , A I do not suppose I talked with him more than two or three minutes personally; I was on the ward for some time; I saw I was annoying him, and that he was getting restless and nervous, and I concluded it was better not to disturb him. Q. And you then left him ? ^ A. Yes, sir ; I then left him. Q. When did you next see him ? A. I Avent on through the house on my rounds through the eight other wards, and while on the tAvelfth Avard, that is the last Avard in the house we visit, supervisor Barrisdale, of the first department, came up and said that Mr. Hughes was very bad, that was his ex- pression, and asked me what we were going to do with him ; I asked him what was the matter; he said he was thrashing around him and that they did not know what to do ; I said I will go and seehim, and I went immediately to the ward and found Mr. Hughes _ sitting in the strong chair, the second from the door ; the chair Avhich you saw when you were in the Asylum visiting the Avards ; he had the belt round him, there was blood on the floor, a little blood on his lip, a few drops of blood on his coat; blood on the floor_— I will state about that, I should have said that the floor gave evidence of having been mopped up, there had been blood there, but there Avas only one or two drops of blood perhaps then on the floor; I went up and asked what was the matter Avith him ; I said to the attend- ants : " How did this happen ?" and I think some one made some answer ; I was so taken up with the patient, I thought it better to investigate the matter afterward and not stop to do it then ; I put my hand in his mouth, found there was a fracture of the lower jaw. Q. Whereabouts was the jaw fractured ? A. The fracture was a little to the right of the center; about here (indicating); it was a complete fracture; the attendants said " look out, he will bite you, he is a very, dangerous man ;" but he was perfectly quiet then, and he did not offer any resistance, and he seemed very glad to see me ; I then Avent to the office ; he then had the waist belt around him in the chair; I thought I had better report the matter at once; I went to the office and there I saw Dr. Pilgrim and I reported the matter to him; we saw Dr. Brush and reported to him; then I went immediately and reported it to the superintendent, Dr. Gray ; I reported the whole of the circum- stances of the case ; he asked me how it happened, and I told him I had not investigated it at all, that I thought I had better report the matter first; Dr. Brush, Dr. Pilgrim and myself then went to 245 the wrard to see the patient; we found him there in the same posi- tion, and the waist belt Avas removed; I noticed the man winced a little when he was moved, and I suspected there might be a fracture of the ribs ; he was taken to an attendant's room just off from the ward ; his clothing was removed, his shirt was remoA^ed ; Dr. Brush put his hand there and said "Yes," and I knew what he meant; Dr. Pilgrim did the same; then I did the same, and I felt the crepitus. Q. Explain what you mean by the crepitus ? A. By crepitus, I mean the grating sound that is produced when broken bones are rubbed together ; it is unmistakable ; there was a bruise here on the side, a little bruise; Mr. Hughes was in a very weak condition, and Dr. Brush said we had better put him to bed at once ; I said " I will go and get a single room ready for him on ward eight; we have one there ; " and I went to see that the room was prepared ; that Avould be the best ward to take him to; I went up and got the room ready, the bedding changed, etc. ; and shortly afterwards Mr. Hughes came up with the physicians; we put him to bed and administered some stimulants in the shape of brandy or whisky, and carbonate of ammonia; then we dressed his side; that is, fixed his chest. Q. Did you ascertain, before you treated him, how many ribs were broken ? A. It Avas not necessary in order to properly treat him to find out at that time if one rib or more than one was broken; the treatment would have been the same if it had been one rib or five ribs broken. Q. What inquiries did you make as to the cause of the injuries at that time ? A. I remember asking how did this happen. Q. Of whom did you ask that ? A. I could not say, now. Q. Was it one of the attendants ? A. It Avas one of the attendants ; I was taken up with the patient and his condition, and did not pay any attention to the matter then ; I thought it could all be investigated afterAvard and that my first duty was with the patient, I did not care how it happened at the time, I thought that could wait and the patient could not; his case demanded immediate attention. Q. When you say you did not " care how it happened," you mean that you considered your first duty was to the patient ? A. Yes, sir. Q. That the cause of his injury was most important, and who was to blame about it, Avas secondary in importance ? A. Yes, sir ; that is what I mean ; I did not mean that it was a matter of indifference to me how it happened. Q. Who conducted the inquiry as to the cause of these injuries ? A. Dr. Gray ordered the inquiry; it was conducted by Dr. Pil- grim and by Dr. Brush, I think; I am not positive about that. 24* Q. And yon took no special part in the inquiry as to the cause of the injuries ? A. No, sir. Q. Dr. Pilgrim has charge of the men's side and it would be his duty in such a case, I suppose ? A. Yes, sir ; he is the principal physician on the men's side ; be- sides, Dr. Gray assigned him to do it; and Dr. Gray investigated personally. Q. What is your present belief as to the cause of those injuries? A. Taking the statements that have been made ? Q. Yes. A. I think, in my opinion, that that injury was caused by the patient falling down over the arm of the chair, and an attendant fall- ing on him, and that his jaw was fractured when he struck the floor ; that is my opinion. Q. Could not such an injury to the jaw have been caused by a blow from an attendant ? A. Yes, sir; but it would have been a very severe blow, I think. Q. Has your attention ever been called to the frequency of bruises and black eyes on patients in that w^ard during your presence there? A. Yes, sir ; I think —Avell I will not say frequently, but my attention has been called to it, and I have seen a great many black eyes; I have been on the north side tAvo months ; I was on the women's side previous to that, but the last two months I have been on the men's side, and am still in that department; Avhile on my rounds on the fourth ward I have noticed these black eyes, and have been told about them by the attendants, and I have investigated how they have happened. Q. What have attendants told you about them ? A. It would depend upon the nature of the accident. Q. What is the general nature of their story ? A. There are violent patients there, and a man frequently makes attacks on other patients and also on attendants ; sometimes when he makes attacks on other patients he gets it back, and gets a black eye. A short time ago we had one man tried to kiss another, the man did not like it and wanted him to desist, but the felloAV in- sisted upon doing it, and he struck him a severe blow, and gave him a black eye ; there are instances of that kind. Q. Have you ever knoAvn a case where an attendant struck a pa- tient and gave him a black eye? A. No, sir ; and I may add that I never kneAv since I have been in the institution of an attendant striking a patient. Q. When an explanation is given as to the cause of a black eye, received by a patient, whose statements do you receive ? A. The attendant generally reports it first that Mr. so and so was hurt by Mr. so and so, or something of that kind —Mr. Jones was hurt by Mr. Smith for instance. I'then inquire particularly of the attendants ; I also see the patient, and if their stories all agree and the injuries are not severe, I dismiss the matter from my mind, 247 Q. Have the patients ever complained to you that they have been struck by attendants? A. No, sir, I never had such a complaint as that. Q. As a general thing, do you not accept the statement of the attendant as to the cause of the injury ? A. That would depend upon who the patient was; if it was from a patient whose testimony we should consider reliable, I should ac- cept his word; in some cases I should hold the word of the patient as equal to that of the attendant; but it depends upon the patient that is what I mean. Q. Do you consider the patients in the fourth ward reliable in this respect ? A. No, sir, I do not. Q. Then did you frequently consult the patients in the fourth ward as to any such injuries ? A. Well, injuries do not frequently happen. Q. When they do happen, did you inquire of the patients about the matter ? A. As a rule, I have accepted the attendants' statements on the fourth hall. Q. As a rule, are not most of the injuries received on the fourth ward ? A. There are more injuries, perhaps, on that fourth ward, in com- parison with the number of patients. Of course I am only speaking of the last two months; I have only been there on that side two months. Q. What is the comparative frequency of such cases of black eyes and injuries on the women's side compared with the same on the men's side. A. I do not think there are as many black eyes on the women's side, there are more scratches; they scratch more there; that is my impression. Q. What are the attendants on the women's ward, men or women ? A. Women. Q. Do you know Avhat wages the attendants receive on the women's side ? A. No, sir; not positively. I know they receive from twenty ' dollars a month up, that is on the men's side, and the female at- tendants, I believe, begin at ten dollars; I cannot be positive about that; the assistant physicians have nothing to do Avith that matter. Q. And what hours do those attendants serve during the day ? A. It depends upon the season, fourteen to sixteen hours a day. Sometimes they are required to stay up all night if the physicians so require. Their whole time is devoted to the Asylum. Q. In your opinion do you think that the wages paid to these attendants are sufficient ? A. I do not care to give an opinion about that. Q. Do you think that the grade of attendants_could be improved by shortening the hours, or increasing the wages, or both ? 248 A. I think that the higher the wages paid the better class of attend- ants we might procure—a better class than we have, perhaps. Q. Do you think a better class of attendants is desirable? A. Of course we would like to have ideal attendants if we could get them. Q. Are those attendants as good as they ought to be, in your opinion ? A. I do not think any of us are as good as we ought to be. Q. Do you think the grade of attendants employed by the Asylum authorities is high enough to secure intelligent and considerate treat- ment of the patients ? A. Yes, sir; I think our attendants as a class are intelligent, kind hearted, and try to perform their duty to the best of their ability. Q. Then you have no fault to find with the average character of the attendant ? A. No, sir. Q. Have you ever observed any attendants under the influence of liquor at any time while on duty ? A. No, sir ; I have not. Q. Is there any difference in the grade of attendants betAveen the male and female wards. A. No, sir; I don't think so; they are all about the same class; we have a good many attendants out of the same family; that is the sisters are on the women's side and the brothers on the men's side. Q. How often does Dr. Gray visit the wards ? A. That depends upon circumstances ; I have seen him in the ward as often as three times a wreek, and then again it will be some little time before he goes on. Q, How often does he make a regular visitation of each ward? A. Well, Dr. Gray goes on the wards, at least I have heard of him being on the wards when none of the staff were with him, and it would be very hard to state how often he does go on ; I could not tell you. Q. How many times have you seen Dr. Gray on the Avards since you have been on the men's side in tAvo months ? A. I would have to give that approximately; I can recall seven times. Q. Do you think that about represents the amount of times you have seen him ? A. I _ think that represents the number of times; I can recollect seven times, and there may have been more. Q. How often did you see him during the previous four months in the female wards; about what was the frequency of his visits ? A. He would go on the ward occasionally ; I should think—well, that is a pretty hard question to answer. Q. You can say whether he was there once a week ? A. No, sir; he was not there once a week. I 249 Q. Was he there once a fortnight ? A. To my knowledge ? Q. Yes, that you saw him there ? A. I do not think it would average that. Q. Do you know whether he was away from the institution during any part of that time ? A. Yes, sir; he was away. Q. About how long was he away ? A.I should think he was away — these questions I cannot answer positively. , Q." Was he away a month during the time you were there? A. When I first came doAvn here Dr. Gray went away to New- port, and I think he was gone ten days; I am not positive, but somewhere about there; then he went away again and went up to Buffalo in the Fillmore will case. Q. And was absent how long ? A. It could not have been over three or four days. Q. Do you know of any other absences ? A. Then he went down to Albany at the meeting of the Alumni Association, or to deliver an address before the Albany Medical College. Q. And was away how long ? A. I think about a day, to the best of my recollection. Q. How long altogether would you say he had been away during the past six months —about how many weeks or days? A. I did not keep a record of it; those are questions I cannot answer. By Mr. Haskell : Q. Tell me which two months it is that you say you recollect having seen Dr. Gray seven times on the wards ? A. The past two months. Q. Will you specify briefly the seven times that you refer to? A. It may be difficult for me to give the dates; I knoAV Dr. Gray was through the wards some time in the early part of January ; I cannot remember the dates; Avhen Mr. Hughes was injured, Dr. Gray saAv him; he saw him a good many times; he went up with me one night at twelve o'clock ; in the early part of January, the day that Mr. Hughes Avas hurt, he went up that night to see Mr. Ilughes; he went up the next day to see Mr. Hughes; it was on Tuesday night that Dr. Gray went up wdth me at tAvelve o'clock to see him ; he has been on the Avard the last Aveek four or five times to see a Mr. IV Avho has been very ill ; he went up also to see another patient who was very sick ; he was very attentive to Mr. Ilughes; it is more than seven times, really. Q. Then these times that you have referred to, when Dr. <^ray was on the wards, it was in reference to some special case ? A. Yes, sir. 32 U 250 Q. Rather than being an extended and thorough inspection of the Avards ? A. Yes, sir. Q. You do not mean that you recollect seven distinct times within the last two months that he had made an entire inspection of the institution ? A. No, sir. Q. You mean simply that he had been there — A. (Interrupting) Yes, sir ; he had been there to see some special cases. Q. You were at the institution when Evan D. Hughes was brought there by his son ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Where were you when he came in? A. I was sitting in the office, and the papers Avere brought in to me, and I went in and saw Mr. Hughes. Q. Where was Mr. Hughes and his son taken ? A. Into the middle office. Q. That is the one to the right, inside, as we go into the main hall* A. Well, Mr. Hughes was taken in first into the key office, as it is knoAvn — the first office — then there is a central office known as the middle office, and then Dr. Gray's office, and our offices are on the other side, where the library is, that is the general office. Q. Where did you see him first ? A. In the key office; I then took them into the center office. Q. Took them all in ? A. Yes, sir ; to my recollection ; there were two gentlemen, Mr. Hughes and the friends who came with him ; to the best of my recollection, I left those friends with Mr. Hughes in that office, and I took the history of the former case into the key office. Q. Mr. Hughes was brought there by his son and two or three gentlemen, was he not ? A. No, sir ; one other, I think. Q. Do you desire to put that so strong as a positive assertion, that there was only one ? A. I only recollect seeing one. Q. You commenced to talk to the young man about the condition of his father in the presence of his father ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And then did yon not make the suggestion that it might worry him or disturb him ? A. Yes, sir, I think I did, and we went into the key office. Q. You and the son ? A. Yes, sir ; we went into that office ? Q. Will you give me, as you recollect it, Avhat the conversation was that passed between you and the son ? A. Mr. Hughes Avas quite agitated ; his eyes Avere filled with tears /I refer to the son); I sat at the key office desk with the history book 251 and my blank-paper pad and lead pencil, and Mr. Hughes sat there, and we talked about the case ; I asked him particularly about it, and he gave me the answers, and I put them right down in lead pencil upon this pad ; he gave me a history of the case ; that about a week previous to this tune his father had become very much depressed; imagining that people Avere trying to make away with him ; that his Avife wanted to kill him ; that at one time he had asked for a knife in order to kill himself; that this thing was probably brought on by an unfortunate business transaction, which he went on and explained — something about pigs, and something about their put- ting him out of the church ; something of that kind ; I don't remem- ber just what it was; it Avas anxiety and Avorry over this affair which brought on the present attack ; that is about the substance of it. Q. Is that all you now recollect about the matter? A. Yes, sir; I have it in the case book. Q. Were you made acquainted with the fact that his father had been in the Insane Asylum before? A. Yes, sir ; we had a conversation about that. Q. Was something said to what his father had said in regard to his treatment ? A. Yes, sir ; I remember that he said something about his father ; I told him that his father would be treated very kindly, and I tried to comfort the fellow — he felt very bad; I remember his saying that his father complained of ill treatment Avhile there before, and I said I thought that must be a mistake, something to that effect. Q. And he asked you to see that his father was treated kindly, did he not ? A. Yes, sir; and I promised to do the best I could. Q. And it was in connection with his father making the com- plaints of ill treatment the last time that he was there ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did he not tell you that the immediate cause of this disorder was that it grew out of a lawsuit in regard to some pigs, followed up by charges made against him in the church, that his father had sworn falsely, and that it was the church difficulty that troubled him? A. Yes, sir; substantially. Q. And he told you in regard to his father trying to get an ax or a knife to cut himself ? A. He told me that his father had asked for a knife; I do not recollect any thing about the ax. Q. Did he also tell you about the number of men that he had there to Avatch his father ? A. No, sir, I never heard of it until afterward. Q. And he did not tell you about his father being watched by tAvo men and getting aAvay from them, and the two other men that had been helping to take care of him stopped him before he got out of the house 1 A. No, sir, I don't recollect that. 252 _ Q. And you do not recollect of his saying any thing in regard to his father having been violent at all ? A. No, sir. Q. All that you recollect was in regard to his father being de- spondent ? I A. Yes, sir, despondent and depressed; it was a case of melan- cholia with suicidal tendencies. Q. How many times since then have you read over or looked at the minutes that you made at that conversation ? A. I think I have read them over once ; perhaps tAvice. Q. When was the last time ? A. I read them once before the coroner's jury; I read them once before that; I do not think I have read them over since the coroner's investigation ; of course it is in the case book, and I have seen the name of Evan D. Hughes. Q. Are you not testifying more of what took place between the son and yourself, from what appears in that case book, than you are from actual recollection of wdiat really did occur between you and Mr. Hughes? A. As I told you before, we have a great many cases come into the Asylum, to keep every history and knoAV about every patient, and keep them in your mind; we have 321 cases there, and you can- not remember all the small points ; you have got to generalize. Q. Do you not then depend more in your recollection of what occurred at that interview, upon what appears in the minutes than from actual recollection? A. We depend more on the minutes, that is what they are for. Q. And it is because there is nothing appears in your case book in regard to Evan D. Hughes being violent that you do not think any conversation of that character occurred between you and the son \ A. Not of that kind, because if there had been I Avould have rec- ollected it; I should have put it down. Q. And because it does not appear — A. (Interrupting) That only strengthens my belief. Q. And that is one reason why you think it did not occur be- tAveen you and Mr. Hughes ? A. It strengthens my belief ; I do not state that as a reason, but it strengthens my belief. Q. Did you read the minutes of what appeared in the case book in regard to Mr. Hughes first being in the Asylum in 1878? Did you first read the minutes of his case then ? A. I read them over as soon as I heard he was injured; he was admitted Friday afternoon and was injured Saturday morning; I read them over Saturday morning after he was injured ; when I say I did not read them over, — I read part of them to Mr. Hughes, that he was discharged on such a day. I got the case book, as it is always customary to do in a case of re-admittance, and I stated on the margin, on the side, the fact of his re-admittance where the entry is made with reference to the re-admission. See case book so and so. 253 Q. If you had read the history of that case, you Avould have dis- covered that the form of his insanity'was violent in character? A. Yes, sir; I should have seen that he had been violent, but not any more so than a great many patients. Q. He was not more violent, as far as you knoAV, on the second admission to the asylum than any other patients. Now do you claim that it made any difference with Mr. Hughes' treatment and dispo- sition so far as it affected the subsequent injury to him—the fact that your attention was not called to the violent form of his insanity? A. I can state that in this way : That even if Mr. Hughes' son had given me the history that his father had required four men to restrain him, he would have been sent to ward nine in the condition he was, Avhile in the office, he Avould have been sent to the ninth ward, and when he became violent, he Avould have been transferred to the fourth ward ; his condition was one of melancholia with frenzy; while in this condition of melancholia and suicidal, a frenzy comes on, he loses the suicidal tendency and becomes violent ; then the frenzy passes off in a moment, and he becomes suicidal again. Q. And, in your judgment, you would have done just the same, Avould you ? A. Yes, sir ; I should have done jnst the same. Q. Do you recollect his son notifying you that he Avas under the influence of chloral at the time he was brought to the institution, bringing you a message from Dr. Chase, of Morrisville, the physician who attended him, to that effect ? A. Yes, sir; uoav that you refresh my mind, I believe he did say something about his being under the influence of chloral. Q. Do yon recollect whether your minutes show that or not ? A. My impression is that they do not; I do not think they do. Q. You did not take down every thing that was said ? A. Oh, no. Q. But you merely took down those parts that impressed you as essential and that were proper to put down? A. Yes, sir. Q. State whether you have any suggestions to make as to how affairs of this kind might be guarded against in the future, and what possibly might have been done to avoid it in the past ? A. If Mr. Hughes, A\hen he Avas admitted to the Asylum, had been put into a camisole or muff', restraint, in other words, he could not have hurt himself or others ; or if you have a great many attendants — suppose you have an attendant to each patient, probably those in- juries would not occur ; but you take a lunatic, and if you are going to keep him from hurting himself or others, you either must have plenty of attendance, that is, a great many more than the State would want to employ, or you have to put them in restraint. Q. Then you think that one of the causes that led to this injury to Mr. Hughes was the fact that there was too little physical re- straint used; that is, that there should have been more physical re- straint, or that the number of attendants should have been increased ? 254 A. I think that if we had more attendants on the ward it would lessen the danger of such accidents. Q. That is, that there should be more physical restraint used on the violent patients? A. Mechanical restraints. Q. Do you understand the word " mechanical" the same as I used the word "physical " ? * A. That is the sense I used it; if that were used, it would also lessen the danger. Q. I asked you Avhether there is too little mechanical restraint u. ed upon violent patients in proportion to the small number of the attendants ? A. I do not think there is too little restraint used, Avhen you take the object into consideration— that question cannot be answered by a direct answer. Q. State whether or not, in your opinion, the absence of mechani- cal restraint led to violence, there being so few attendants to the number of violent patients ? A. Of course, if we had restrained Mr. Hughes, he Avould not have been hurt; I do not want to answer your question, because I do not know what you mean ; I must say that plainly. Q. What do you think of the number of accidents—black eyes and other injuries that occur, especially in the fourth ward, and have during the last six months ; do they strike you as large ? A. No, sir, they do not; I am surprised there are so few. Q. Do you think that the best interests of the patients are pre- served by their being so kept, and that so many injuries do happen? A. Yes, sir, I do; I think the best interests of the patients are consulted ; they make a better cure. Q. Do you think the injuries assist and aid in the cure ? A. No, sir; I do not know about that; I think the injuries are bad enough, but an occasional black eye, one patient giving another a black eye, it is not very frequent, Ave only had fifty-eight black eyes in one year in the whole house, and most of those were the result of men falling doAvn and hurting themselves; we only had fifty-six or fifty-eight cases of that kind in a year, and it is a good deal better to let fifty-six or fifty-eight men get a scratch than it is to go through the Avard, and have them all bound up, in my opinion ; of course an accident like Mr. Hughes' has happened, and it was very bad —well it was very unfortunate, to say the least, a very sad occurrence, but it was an accident; it is the first one in the history of the institution, and there have been fifteen thousand lunatics there, the first accident of that kind, except where one patient has killed another. Q. Are you aware of the case of B. ? A. Yes, sir; that case Avas pretty well proved that it was fractured before he was brought there. Q. In your judgment, Dr. Backus, is there sufficient mechanical restraint imposed upon the patients in the violent wards at the present time? 255 ^ A. At present, yes, sir, that is — taking every thing into con- sideration, yes, I think there-is sufficient restraint employed. Q. Is there not too much restraint, in your judgment? A. No, sir. Q. In regard to the inconvenience to the patients by such mechanical restraints, what supervision is there by the physicians to determine whether the patients are not confined too long at any one time? A. The restraint is never applied Avithout an order from the physician, and it remains on until he gives directions for it being removed. Q. How long may such restraint be on a patient at one time? A. How long may it be there? Q. Yes? A. It depends a great deal on the patient; I have known a girl to wear a camisole for a Aveek at a time, and only have it taken off once or twice to change her clothing, or something of that kind. Q. Do they eArer wear'such restraints at night ? A. \ es, sir, I have known them to sleep in camisoles. By Mr. Rice : Q. In a covered bed ? A. Yes, sir; Avhere a patient strikes at themselves, or a patient avIio tears out her hair ; last week I had to put a muff on to a man to restrain him from self-mutilation. Q. In your judgment, does not such restraint tend to irritate the patient ? A. I think restraint does tend to irritate the patieuts; that is why I do not like it. Q. Is there not a tendency among the physicians to watch such restraint and use it as little as possible ? A. Yes, sir, as little as possible. Q. Does a physician consider that", Avhen he has given an order to restrain a patient by such mechanical appliances, that he is responsi- ble for the continuance of such restraints, until he gives the order to remove them ? A. Until he or one of the staff do. Q. Do the attendants ever remove such restraints without order from one of the physicians ? A. Not to my knowledge. Q. Are they permitted to do so ? A. No, sir ; not unless they are directed to specially. Q. How many are there under restraint at one time in the insti- tution usually ? A. lean only ansAver as to one side of the Asylum — the men's side of the house; this morning there were four in restraint. Q. What sort of restraint had they ? 256 A. One man had a belt around him, and had wristlets on his hands, confining his hands to his sides, so that he could not strike another patient; another man is very suicidal and very noisy, and disturbs patients very much on the ninth ward ; to keep him from committing suicide, we let him sleep in restraint, and the restraint in his case is simply a waist-belt and wristlets ; we have another man, a paretic, who is also very noisy, and he sleeps in restraint in a cov- ered bed with a waist-belt and wristlets; we have three in restraint, sleeping in restraint; that is, they were last night, and one man during the day. Then we have another patient there avIio is in the last stage of general paretis ; he is apt to strike people; we are afraid if he does strike some one they will hit him back and injure him, therefore most of the time he stays in this chair, with a simple belt to prevent him from getting up; that is all the restraint in the north side. Q. What would you say would be a fair average of the number of patients restrained on the men's side from day to day ? A. Last year it was three-tenths of one cent, I belieA7e. Q. Of all the patients on the men's side ? A. Of the patients on the men's side. Q. Do you know what per cent of patients it was in ward four? A. No, sir, I could not tell you. Q. Most of the violence is among the patients on ward four, is it not? A. Yes, sir. Q. Of course the percentage must be very much greater among the patients on ward four than the figure you have made ? A. Well, during the day time the percentage on ward four of violence is greater. Q. What would be the average among the twenty-five or thirty patients on that ward ? A. Only one in restraint in the day time ; they would not average that the year round, from my knowledge. Q. Hoav long have you been a member of the profession ? A. I graduated the first of April, 1883. Q. Last year ? A. Yes, sir. Q. From what college did you graduate ? A. The University of Pennsylvania. Q.' Have you had any other experience in the treatment of the insane ? A. I have; I was at Brigham Hall, Canandaigua, during my medical studies; I commenced my studies in 1879 ; I was a resident of the county hospital, Rochester, before I graduated, for two sum- mers; next to that I was in the Monroe County Insane Asylum, Avhere they have two hundred and fifty to three hundred patients; I was over there quite a good deal myself and saw more or less of the insane at that institution. Q. From your observation of the system at Utica and at the other 257 institutions named by you, are you able to suggest any changes in the treatment of the patients ? * A. No, sir, I cannot; I think that every thing is done for them that can be done. Q. Is there any difference between the treatment of the pauper patients and the pay patients to your knowledge ? A. Not in the least. Q. How do you distinguish them ? A. They are simply distinguished by looking on the books of the institution ; the attendants themselves do not know which patients are pay patients ; some apparently private patients, as they think, are really on the county. Q. It has been testified before the committee that some patients pay $6 per week, and some pay $10; is there any difference in the treatment of the patients aaTlo are paying such a difference in prices to your knoAvledge ? A. No, sir ; no difference in the treatment of those patients, except that a case comes in in which the patient would require a great deal of attention, for instance, has to be fed three or four times a day with a stomach tube ; some require attention of that kind, and that is charged extra; of course Ave have nothing to do with the matter of charging. Q. And you are not familiar with that portion of the affairs of the institution ? A. No, sir; persons come and ask what the charges are and we say from $6 a Aveek up. Q. You speak of feeding patients with a stomach tube ? A. Y'es, sir. Q. Now, under Avhat circumstances are patients so fed ? A. Very frequently Ave have patients Avho refuse all food. They come into the institution almost staged to death; they have got to be fed and sometimes we give them nutritious enemas, and they Avould expel them, and the food has to be introduced into the stomach; I have fed as many as eight women twice a day, and one of them three times a day; there is more feeding to be done on the women's si^Je of the house than on the men's; it consists in placing a patient in a chair, or she is in bed, an attendant holds her hands, or if she resists very much, is confined at the Avaist with a belt; a Avedge is introduced to open the mouth and one finger is passed into the mouth, depressing the tongue, then a very flexible tube, well lubricated with cosmoline, or \rasseline, is passed in and doAvn into the stomach ; at the other and outer end of this tube is a funnel and into that is poured a certain quantit}7 of milk or eggs, or any thing of that kind into the stomach. J have fed as many as eight twice a day and sometimes more. Q. Of what are these tubes made ? A. The tubes are many of them made of silk, covered Avith shellac. 33 U 258 Q. What other substance are they made of ? A. I think some of them are made of a composition, that as soon as the tube is wanned it becomes very flexible and soft; holding it in the hand will warm it, and that is put doAvn into the oesophagus. Q. A patient that could eat and would hot eat, does it not usually bring them round to eat ? A. I have fed one patient four months twice a day, and she could eat if she wanted to but she will not; some patients will be fed by the tube, and then the next meal they will eat and will eat two or three meals, and then again they will have to be fed two or three days, and they will begin and eat again ; I have one patient Avho will come to a chair, sit down, open her mouth and let me pass the tube down and feed her; she does that under the delusion that she is taking medicine, but of course she must be fed. Q. Does it usually have the effect of bringing a contumacious patient round to eating? A. No, sir; we do not do it for that reason. Q. Does it usually have that effect ? A. A patient begins to eat, whether he does it on account of the stomach tube, or whether he does it because he gets rid of his delu- sion, I cannot say; that is an aberration of the"mind of the indi- vidual that I cannot go into and about which I have formed no opinion. Q. Do the patients ever complain of the use of this tube or of its hurting them? A. They complain of its gagging them at first, but after they get used to it they do not mind; as soon as you introduce any thing into the oesophagus there is a tendency for the stomach to heave. DWIGHT D. WINSTON, Who appeared in answer to a subpoena duces tecum, Avas then swTorn and examined, and testified as follows : By the Chairman : • Q. What is your age? A. Fifty-six. Q. What is your residence ? A. Utica. \ Q. What is your business? A. Merchant, wholesale grocer ; grain and groceries.- Q. What relation do you hold to theHJtica Asylum ? A. 1 am one of the managers. Q. How long have you held that position ? A. Since last March ; my appointment was made then. Q. And it runs over three years ? A. Yes, sir. 259 Q. How much time do yon spend at the Asylum with reference to your duties as manager ? A. I do not spend a very large amount of time at the Asylum; I go there as often as it seems to me my services are required. Q. How many meetings of the board are there held during the year ? A. I think about twelve regular meetings of the board. Q. Do you now refer to the full board of managers, or to the au- diting committee? A. No, sir, I refer to the board of managers. Q. Those meetings are the only meetings ? A. No, sir; we have an annual meeting in December, then we have usually met about once a month since I came in. Q. Including the usual quarterly meetings? A. Yes, sir. Q. In addition to those you hold monthly meetings ? A. Yes, sir; we go up there once a month, and have been since my term of office commenced. Q. Those are the regular meetings of the board ? c? A. It seems to be. Q. Are you a member of the auditing committee ? A. Yes, sir; I am. Q. That is the only standing committee of the board ? A. lres, sir. Q. And you say that the auditing committee holds meetings in addition to the meetings of the board ? A. If there is any thing for them to do especially, we are called together if there is any thing that requires action, we are called together by the chairman. Q. How many members of the board compose an auditing com- mittee ? A. Three. Q. Hoav many members of the board are usually present at the monthly meetings ? A. They are nearly all there; they have been there Avith the ex- ception of Mr Lawrence who is now in Florida, and he is there a good deal of the time ; I think they have been there ; pretty much the entire board. Q. Hoav often does the board of managers visit the Avards ? A. It is not regular, Ave have not visited it regularly since my term commenced; I do not think Ave have been through the different wards more than three or four times, Avhen we have been up there Ave have had so much business to do that it would take us so late in the afternoon that we would not have time, something required us to be " in the office attending to the different kinds of business that Ave had on hand, and Ave could not haA'e a chance to go through, and we would sav that we would come up in a few days and go through; I don't think I have been there three or four times since my term com- menced. 260 Q. That was about hoAV long ago ? A. Well, I have not been through the Asylum within the last three months, I think. Q. Is there any regular inspection of the Asylum provided for by the board of managers or by its members ? A. No; there are rules that govern the managers, and I think those rules state that the managers should go through the institution as often as they can make it convenient, or something of that kind; it seems to be understood by the managers, each and every one of them, that they ought to go through oftener than they do. Q. Is it, in your judgment, desirable that the managers should visit the wards frequently ? A. Well, so far as my observation has gone, it never has seemed to do any harm, and the physicians tell us that it does not. Q. How frequently would you regard it as desirable that the wards should be inspected by some one or more members of the board of management ? A. I should think they ought to go through at least once a month; and I think it would be better if they would all go through, or as man}7 as could, if they could not all go. Q. Do you think that is a sufficient inspection of the wards on behalf of the managers ? A. We might make those visits oftener, perhaps without any det- riment to the patients, but it is a hard matter to get the managers to be able to give the time ; they are all business or professional men, and not men of leisure, and it is hard to get the time to go oftener than that; to answer your question as you put it, I reply that it would be better if they could go through oftener; I certainly Avould myself; I was invited very frequently by the superintendent to come and go through the Asylum at any time I could make it convenient, myself or with any other member; I certainly should do so, but my engagements at home have prevented me and I have not done it as often as I Avould like to. Q. You Avould regard it as desirable to have a regular weekly in- spection of every ward of the Asylum by at least one member of the board ? A. I think it Avould be a good plan. Q. Do you not think that such regular inspection would better familiarize the board of managers Avith the wants of the institution? A. It could not but be so. Q. Would they not be better informed as to the treatment and condition of the patients ? A. I should think they would most certainly. Q. Do you not think that the board of managers should have such information as to the domestic management of the institution ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And of the actual condition of the patients from time to time? A. Yes, sir; I should think it would be beneficial to any in- 261 stitution of this kind to have some part of the managers .go as often as it could be convenient, and if it could be done once a week it certainly should be done; it Avould tend to more efficiency in the administration of the whole institution I should say. Q. What knowledge have you as to the pay of the attendants at this institution ? A. Well, mostly from the reports of the superintendent and from looking over the books. Q. What are the attendants paid? A. The attendants are paid — I think from $20 to $28 a month. Q. Do you know what hours a day the attendants are on duty regularly ? A. I think it is twelve hours a day. Q. Do you not think it is longer than that? A. In certain cases perhaps it is; I think they are subject to the call of the superintendent or physicians to serve a longer time if their services are required ; I cannot give you the details about that, for I have not become thoroughly acquainted Avith it yet. Q. It has been stated that the hours of work of the attendants vary from fourteen to sixteen hours a day ; do you consider such hours too long or otherwise ? A. I should not think that would be conducive to good service ; that it was too long for any attendant to be on duty from fourteen to sixteen hours; I think any one who is compelled to work as long as that Avould get lax in their duties; it Avould seem to me so. Q. Would you recommend that the number of hours of duty be shortened for each attendant ? A. If they are over twelve hours I should, certainly. Q. Do you think the pay of the attendants is sufficient, consider- ing the nature of their duties and their hours of labor? A. I do not think it any too much, although I have expressed myself frequently in the board that I thought, particularly in the women's department, they were not paid high enough. Q. How much are they paid in the Avomen's department? A. I think they are paid from twelve to sixteen dollars a month. Q. And you Avould recommend that the hours be reduced and the pay increased ? A. I should. Do I understand that that is the fact, the hours of service are from twelve to fourteen ? Q. It has appeared in testimony that the hours are from fourteen to sixteen? A. I should, because I think it is too long a time, and I think their salaries are too low, and I have so expressed myself in the board. Q. Then you were not aware that the attendants had such long hours as from fourteen to sixteen hours a day ? A> No, sir; I wTas not aware of that. Q. And this is the first that you have been so informed? A. Yes, sir ; I do not recollect hoav that that question has ever come up in our board, or that it has been brought to my attention. 262 Q. From your personal knowledge, what attention does Dr. Gray give personally to the patients ? A. My ideas are, from what I learn from the attendants with whom I'have talked, and the doctors that 1 have conversed with, that the doctor goes through the institution quite frequently; I do not think that he has a regular time to go through, but that he goes through some of the departments, I have so heard from attendants, and Avhere he thinks his services may be required the most. Q. Have you any idea how frequently he makes an inspection of the wards? A. No, sir, I have not. Q. How frequently do you suppose or believe that he visits each ward ? A. I should think that he goes through there four times a week, Q. Through each ward ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And you now refer to the twelve male wards and the twelve female wards ? A. Y"es, sir ; I refer to all the wards. Q. Has the doctor been absent from the Asylum during the period in which you have been manager, for any extent ? A. Not for any length of time; he was aAvay last summer some time during the month of August, I should think he Avas away pretty near the Avhole of the month of August. Q. Has he been aAvay on any other occasion since to your knowl- edge ? A. I do not think he has, for any length of time. Q. He may have been away for two or three days at a time with- out your knowledge ? A. Yes, sir; possibly he ma}7 and I not have knoAvn it. Q. Are you aAvare that the doctor has to a certain extent been employed as an expert in diseases of the mind ? A. Outside of the Asylum? a Q. Yes. A. I hear of his being called frequently to different places to examine such cases, but not very frequently have I heard of his being out of toAvn. Q. Are you aAvare that he lectures regularly at Bellevue Medical College on the treatment of the insane ? A. No, sir ; I have heard of his lecturing there, I think, and in Albany, but I Avas not aAvare that he delivered regularlecturesat stated periods. Q. Do you regard such outside practice or employment as con- sistent with the duties of the Asylum ? A. I do not; I have always thought, if I may state, I have always thought that with the number of patients that there is there, so iiany very severe cases of insanity, that it required the presence of the superintendent all the time that he has ; there are cases Avhere he is 263 called upon by the officials of the State to visit some person or place, perhaps it is just as proper as for him to stay there, and excepting such cases, I should say that his duties should be there at the Asylum. Q. Where are the supplies for the institution purchased ? A. They are mostly purchased in Utica, the greater part of them ; they go out sometimes in buying certain articles, to Boston, or Gloucester for their fish, for instance. Q. What supervision in the purchase of such supplies is made by the board or any of the members thereof. A. Nothing further than auditing the bills. Q. So that the board are unable to say Avhetber such purchases, AA'hen made, are made to the best advantage or not? A. No, sir; they cannot say that intelligently. Q. They depend upon the faithfulness of the steward? A. Yes, sir, that is it; and the direction given by the superin- tendent as to the purchases. f ""•<« Q. In other Avords, that is left entirely to the superintendent and the steward ? A. Yes, sir. , Q. Among how many people in the city of Utica (roughly speaking) are the purchases distributed so far as you know ? A. IhaveknoAvn Iioav many there Avere in Utica that we pur- chased of; I should think in the vicinity of ahundred, I don't know any more than that; if I had thought of it I might have .made a closer examination of the bills and I could have told very readily, if not exactly ; I gave a little more attention, in our last ex- amination of the accounts, to that matter than has been given in a long time, I think; I gave more attention to it; they claimed that I Avas the most practical member of that board for examining into .that matter, and urged me to do so; of course a large quantity of the supplies of the institution are in our line; the most expensive part of them are in bur line — that is the groceries and provisions. Q. Doesyour house furnish the institution Avith any such goods ? A. A very little; Ave never have supplied but very little; indeed .we have almost felt that we did not supply as much as Ave ought to because AAre have thought that Ave could sell goods to better advantage than they have been buying them ; but as I said it was a delicate position for me to be in, being a member of the auditing board, to find fault with the prices of that, class of purchases ; that is, purchases in our line; it Avas a delicate thing for me to speak of, because it would naturally be thought that I was jealous that the goods Avere not bought of us; Ave handle groceries on a large scale ; there are only ;wo more concerns in our city that are about the same, in extent, as nirs; those are Crouse Bros, and Comstock Bros.; they are large lealers for a place like ours ; they buy and sell in large quantities ; the Whim has been in the habit of buying that kind of goods that they deal in, in Utica. Q. What do you say as to the purchases being to the best advantage o the Asylum ? 264 A. I understand that some of the purchases have been made of certain goods, at the same place for twenty-five or thirty years, under the same arrangement that was made that length of time ago, or ever since Dr. Gray has been superintendent; in answer to your question, I think there'are some goods that might be purchased to better advantage; I think they should purchase at wholesale. Q. State what class of goods yon think can be purchased to better advantage? A. Sugar, tea, coffee, and molasses, and goods in the grocery line; I think they could perhaps do better in purchasing such articles of a Avholesale house. Q. Where are they purchased now for the most part? A. Butler & Hamilton's, of Utica. Q. Most of the supplies above enumerated are all bought of that concern ? A. Yes. sir. Q. And they comprise the bulk of supplies in that line of grocer- ies that are bought for the Asylum ? A. Yes, sir. Q. You have stated that you were a little surprised that the pur- chases were made of a retail house ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Instead of from one of the three wholesale houses referred to? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do I understand you to say that you, from your knowledge of prices, have observed any difference in the prices that are charged by this concern as against the Avholesale prices for those articles ? A. I have said very frequently that the articles could be sold to the Asylum to better advantage than they were getting them ; and when I came to audit the bills I saw that a great part of those goods could be obtained at a good deal less money. Q. That is, that they could be supplied to the institution by whole- sale houses to better advantage ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do yon think the Asylum could buy to better advantage, buy- ing such articles by wholesale ? A. I am satisfied of it; I have so stated to the board and to the superintendent. Q. Have you suggested to the superintendent that such purchases should be made elsewhere ? ; A. I have, so far as I could do it in my position; of course I labored under the disadA7antage I mentioned. Q. That you were in the same business and did not care to make the suggestion ? A. No, sir, I did not care to put it very strongly ; I think they could see that themselves ; that board Avere men \v-ho had been there a great many years ; I didn't want to make them think that I wanted5! the trade to come to our firm, so I said very little about it; I carried some bills back that were spoken about by me. 265 Q. Have you ever had occasion to criticise any bills for groceries that have come before your audit? If so, state Avhat bills? A. I have ; certain bills of Butler & Hamilton's. Q. Upon what occasion was your attention directed to the charges in such bills ? A. At the last meeting of the auditing committee. Q. When was that ? A. That was the last of November, or about the 1st of December, 188:5. just before the annual meeting. Q. Who Avas present at the -meeting ? A. General McQuaid and Mr. SAvan. Q. What bills did you then criticise ? A. The bills that I have just referred to of Butler 6z Hamilton's, mostly. Q. Have you brought any of those bills? A. Yres, sir; a bill from March 12, 1883, to May 23, 1883. Q. Will you please produce those bills ? A. Yes, sir. (The bills were then produced and marked " Exhibits ' 10 ' and ' 11,' J. H. M., " respectively.) Q. From your knoAvledge of prices, and of the business, did you notice any charges in those bills Avhich you criticised as being too large ? A. I did. Q. Will you please to state generally Avhat particular items on those bills haAre been brought to your attention and to the attention di the auditing committee ? A. There are several articles on them; articles in large amounts — sugars — they were too high ; there are some articles on that bill that are sold as Ioav as any one else would sell them, and as Ioav as any Avholesale house could possibly sell them; there are others that there should be a large profit on, to aity one who buys their goods at the right prices, and'as low as they should be bought. Q. And in those bills are any of the articles sold at a higher price than Avhat would yield a fair profit ? A. At a higher price than Avould yield what Ave call a legitimate profit for a Avholesale dealer. Q. Will you further specify the difference in prices to which you refer? [The witness then read from the Exhibits referred to — "Ex- hibit 10" particularly.] I refer to the item of " tea," the first item on the bill; the item on the bill is " two chests of green tea at sixty cents" ; there is no percentage added to that; that is one item :o Avhich I refer. By Mr. Bkown : Q. Do you not think the prices charged for some oj the articles tre very excessive ? A. I think some of them are excessive ; we buy good tea, as nice 34 U 266 tea as ffio merchants throughout the country want, and I think we have no tea that they ask such prices tor. Q. At what prices are good teas sold . A. We have sold for the last two or three vear; best P« ta that we buy at not over fifty cents, and from that down to toityand thirty-five cents. ... „ Q. What is the price charged on the bill i Q." I^fatTpparently bought in a quantity large enough for the patients, or may it not be tea for the table of the, pkysician^ , A. I am inclined to think that the physicians do use this tea, I think, perhaps, this is for the physicians' table Q. Do you regard the price as high tor that grade of tea A. Yes, sir ; we don't get much grade of tea as high a, that? By Mr. Olin : • 'q. Would they be likely to buy two chests for the physicians' ' A. It would be a large quantity, I should think Q. Specify any other items on that bill that you think are charged 'hiodier than they' should be? . A The next thing that I should call attention to is the n e __« four barrels of rice"— that is so indefinite that it is a little difficult to get at that; this may be a rice that is worth that money; if it were Carolina rice, for instance, we could tell about what the price should be, but we cannot tell by that entry what grade of rice Q Is there any commission added to that article? A*. To that there is five per cent added ; that is supposed to be the commission. ✓ Q. It is the wholesale price with five per cent added « A. Y"es, sir. , Q. You are unable to say, in the absence of the specified grades, Avhether that is a reasonable price or not ? A. I could not say that unless I knew the grade ; I don t know but it may be a rice' worth that; but in the case of tea, Ave should call fifty cents to fifty-five cents Avholesale price, very good tea. Q. Is the five per cent advance a fair or reasonable amount .■ A. It Avould be a fair commission on that class of goods. Q. In your opinion could the Asylum purchase to better advantage by procuring such goods from wholesale houses \ A. Yes, sir. , Q. That is, to make their purchases from wholesale houses directiji instead of from a retail establishment ? A. Yres, sir. . Q. Can vou specify any other items in that account, which, in your opinion, are charged at a higher price than similar articles would be purchased for elsewhere? A. I will call attention to this item: " One hundred ana a* pounds of coffee ;" it does not say what kind of coffee that is, 267 it is undoubtedly Kio coffee, and, if that is so, I cannot say that it is much out of the Avay, but it is very indefinite; if it is a good, fair, roasted Rio, I should think it Avas reasonable, but they add five per cent to that. Q. Any other item on the bill ? A. Yes, sir. Q. State Avhat ? A. " One barrel of syrup, fifty gallons, at fifty-five cents;" that is very indefinite, because we cannot learn from the bill Avhat kind of syrup it is, but it takes a very fine syrup to be Avorth fifty-five cents. Q. What could a good grade of syrup be purchased, for suitable for Asylum uses? A. Forty-five cents or fifty cents at the outside. Q. If there are any other items on the bill, please call the atten- tion of the committee to those items ? A. Four barrels of sugar is the next item — one thousand tAvo hundred and thirty pounds, at eight and forty-four one hundredths cents per pound. Q. What, in your opinion, could such a sugar be purchased for ? A. The price that is charged for that may be just what it cost them in New York Avith the freight to Utica, but there is five per cent added ; any wholesale firm — either our firm or the other two firms that I have referred to —could sell it at tAvo and a half per cent added. By Mr. Brown : Q. Do you not think that two and a half per cent is a very good margin, and sufficient to pay for handling? A. Yes, sir; it is more than is made on the average ; Ave should be satisfied to sell to dealers at tAAro per cent added ; and that is what Ave are selling at — from two to two and a half per cent profit — that is what Ave are selling at all the time. Then there is an item on this bill of four chests of tea at thirty-five cents, Avith five per cent added; a very good black tea should be bought at thirty or thirty-two cents ; a very good tea should be bought for that. Q. Is there any thing else on the bill ? , A. The next thing is " poAvdered sugar, one barrel"; there is no percentage added to that; that is put doAvn on the bill at net; Avhen Ave presented our report, the auditing committee, I inquired why it Avas that they made a difference in sugars — why one Avas charged a certain percentage and another Avas not; the only reply they could give Avas that it had been a custom from time immemorial; I said I could not see any reason for that myself. Q. At what price is that item charged ? A. Nine and a half cents; that would be about the right price at that time, I should think. Q. To Avhom did you speak about that matter? Did you call the attention of the steAA7ard to it ? 268 A. No, sir; Dr. Gray ; it was an open meeting of the board. Q. Was the steward present at the meeting? A. No, sir; he was not there ; Dr. Gray Avas there. Q. And did Dr. Gray say that it had been the custom from time immemorial ? A. Yes, sir; that it Avas so when he came into the establishment. Q. Did they buy from the same firm for all these years? A. Yes, sir; they always dealt with that firm ever since Dr. Gray has been there. Q. Y^ou have called the attention of the committee to certain speci- fied items upon the bills before you. Does the same criticism apply to the same items on all the bills? A. What I have said with reference to the charge for a certain article applies to the repetitions charged for the same article on the other bills. " Item: Two chests of gunpowder," thdre is no per- centage added to this; that is charged at fifty-five cents. Then there is an item here "snow-flake crackers, one box five and three-quarter pounds at fifteen cents"; that seems to me to be too high, but we do not handle those goods, so that I could not say about that; I should not be a good authority. One sack of Ashton salt, $3.25; that is a very high price — it is half a dollar too high ; it could be bought at §2.65. Q. Do you mean that it could be bought by the Asylum \ A. Yes, sir. Q. What could the Asylum buy it for? A. Two dollars and seventy-five cents would be all that anybody AArould charge them, and they would get a good profit out of it; "eight boxes of cheese — 460 lbs. at 14£ —14 cents;" that would be at that time a fair price for that; there is no commission added to that; "one hogshead of molasses — 110 gals.—52 cents;" it does not say whether it is Porto Rico or NeAV "Orleans. Q. The Porto Rico does not come in hogsheads, does it ? A. No, sir, it does not; that is high. Q. Do you think fifty-tAvo cents is too much ? A. Yres, sir, I do. ^ Q. And upon that they also charge five cents commission ? \ A. Yes, sir. ! Q. And that do you consider excessive? ;'*A. Yes, sir, I should think it was; if that amount — fiftv-two. cents — Avere the cost price, the five per cent would not be out of. the way ; but I cannot tell what the grade is; it appears from that bill that goods which sell at close rates are charged a commission of five per cent, and tjiat goods upon which it is" customary to make larger profits there is no percentage added. Q. What inference do you draw from that — as to the profits made; does that not indicate to you that the profits made upon the goods, where no commission is charged, is greater than the profit they would realize with a commission of five per cent added? 269 A. It would seem so. Q. And do you not think those articles could be purchased to better advantage of AATholesale houses ? A. I do. Q. Then, in reality, the Asylum are paying retail profits on those articles ? A. No, sir; perhaps not retail profits, but I think they are pay- ing larger profits than they ought to pa}7. Q. What is the total amount of that bill Avhich you hold in your hand for three months ? A. One thousand nine hundred and ninety dollars and twenty- four cents. Q. In your judgment— roughly speaking — what per cent could that bill have been diminished, if the articles referred to had been purchased at Avholesale? A. I think that bill could have been reduced fiv7e per cent at least. Q. Do you mean by taking an average of all the articles ? A. Yes, sir, right through. Q. Now, as to " Exhibit 11 " — being the bill for the succeeding ' three months '■— have you examined the items upon that bill in the same way ? A. I have. Q. And do you find the same difference in prices ? A. Yes, sir, the same state of things in both the bills. Q. And, in your judgment, the same high prices? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did I understand you to say that General McQuaid agreed Avith you that the charges Avere high from his examination of them at the meeting of the auditing committee? A. Well, the General was very careful ; he said to me that if I thought there Ave re a good many things on the bill charged with a higher price than they ought to be, that I understood it perfectly and he did not; and he thought it was the best thing to have the matter reported to the board ; the bills were taken out and left Avith me to look over particularly. We reported that we considered the articles on those bills were paid for at too high a price, and higher than they could be bought for; wTe made that report to the board of managers at our meeting. Q. AVhat did the board do in regard to your report ? A. I think they recommended that Ave should look into the matter a little more particularly, and see at what rates such articles could be bought. Q. What Avas done Avith reference to these particular bills? Were they ordered to be paid? A. They had been paid before; they Avere paid at that time Avhen Ave saAv them. Q. Paid before they Avere received for audita A. Yes, sir. 270 Q. So that the bills are paid and then the checks and the bills are examined together? A. Yes, sir. Q. Merely to test the fact of payment ? A. That is all it seems to be. Q. And not to test the propriety of payment by the board ? A. No, sir. Q. But merely to attest the fact that such payment has been made, and to compare the checks with the bills — which are the vouchers? A. Y"es, sir. Q. Y'ou say that the board recommended that you should make further inquiries. Have you made further inquiry ? A. We have talked it over, the auditing board, particularly Mr. McQuaid, once or tAvice since that, and the effect of it has not been obvious upon the superintendent. There has been no change in the purchasing of the things, they go along just as they have been going: it seems as though they got into a groove, and did not knoAV how to get out. Q. Have you made any suggestions to the superintendent ( A. I have ; 1 have said to him I wanted to see him upon this spe- cial business, and I should have croAvded the thing more myself, but for the delicate position I occupied ; I did not want them to think that I was crowding the thing to have them buy of us, because that Avas not my intention at all. I considered it Avithin the line of my duty as manager to call attention to the fact that the Asylum Avas paying a higher price for its commodities than it ought to pay. Q. What answer Avould the superintendent make to those sugges- tions bv the auditing committee? A. lie rather assented to them, and agreed that Avhatever could be done in the way of saving the institution money that he should be glad to do it. Q. Did you say that Mr. McQuaid and you had not seen any compliance Avith your suggestions heretofore ? A. No, sir. Q. Have any other members of the board spoken together with you about it ? A. Yes, sir, Mr. Lowery has. Q. Any other member of the board ? A. I think Mr. Rogers and I have talked the matter over. Q. It has then been a matter of discussion between you ? A. Yes, sir; not in the board particularly, but among the mem- bers of the board when Ave haA7e met together. Q. Do I understand that Dr. Gray is himself a member of that board ? A. No, sir, he is not. Q. Does he attend the meetings of the board \ A. Yes, sir, always. Q. So that this subject has been talked up privately, apart from Dr. Gray ?, 271 A. Yres, sir. Q. And it has not been discussed in the board ? A. It never has been discussed in particular, except this once ; and when Ave rendered our report, Mr. McQuaid called upon me to give a little explanation of this thing ; I did so, and the doctors seemed to be willing to change any thing that Avould be for the benefit of the institution. Q. This Avas at some of the meetings ? A. Yes, sir. Q. But to your knoAvledge no change has been made ? A. No, sir ; they are buying just the same as they have been. Q. Are any other members of the board of management business men ? A. There are several of them, but none of them in the mercantile line. Q. That is to say none avTio would be likely to sell goods to the Asylum themselves? A. No sir; I think Mr. Campbell has sometimes sold goods to the Asylum, goods from his cotton mill, which would be to as good advantage or better than they could get anywhere else, for he lets them have it at Avholesale prices. Q. I think you said that your oAvn firm do not supply goods to the Asylum ? A. I stated that Ave sold very little. Q. Hoav has that been since you have been manager ? A. I have sold no more since I have been manager than I have during the years before ; it has seemed to us that they have only purchased of our firm Avhen they could not get certain things else- Avhere ; but apart from business matters we have always been upon a good standing, socially ; the steward is a particular friend of ours. Q. Socially your relations have been pleasant with the Asylum people? A. Yes, sir, Avitb the doctors, the superintendent and the steAvard. Q. About Avhat amount would the sales made by your establish- ment to the Asylum average from year to year before you Avere ap- pointed ? A. Perhaps $500 ; not any more than that in a year. Q. And you say that they are about the same now ? A. Yes, sir ; no more than that. Q. Why did not the board at once direct the steward to purchase at wholesale houses all such supplies as far as possible ? A. I cannot tell you. Q. Have they held any meeting since this December meeting ? A. YTes, sir, I guess Ave have been there twice. Q. And you say that Dr. Gray has always been present at such meetings ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do you suppose that any kind of delicacy of feeling toAvard Dr. Gray has prevented the bringing up of this subject? A. It may be so. . 272 Q. Do you think it likely that it has been so? - A. I should think very'likely that the members of the board might, perhaps, feel rather diffident bringing up such a matter before Dr. Gray. Q. As being, to a certain extent, a reflection upon his manage- ment ?' A. Yes, sir. Q. What is your opinion as to the duty of the board in the premises ? A. My opinion always has been that they should look after those ' matters a little closer, and see in regard to the purchases by the steAArard, and if they see at any time Avhere they can make any recommendations that they think would be favorable to the institu- tion, I think it is Avithin their province to make such recommenda- tions ; they Avould naturally go to the superintendent, of course. Q. But at present they do not interfere at all ? A. No, sir. Q. And the matter is entirely in the hands of the superintendent and the steward ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Would you recommend that the bills be inspected by the auditing committee before payment is made by the steward ? A. It seems to me as it should be so. Q. Do you not think it Avould be wise to have a regular inspec- tion and auditing of the bills monthly before their paA'ment ? A. It certainly seems as if that Avould be a better plan. Q. But Avould you recommend that such inspection should be done at a full meeting of the board, or by a sub-committee ? A. I should think that it would hardly be necessary to bring the board together for any thing of that kind ; it might be left in the hands of an auditing committee, or a sub-committee, as you call it. 1 And there should be a direction from the board that such bills should be audited once a mouth. Q. Do you think it Avould be well that each bill should receive \ the approval of at least tAvo or three members of the board i A. Yes, sir, or of all the members of the board. Q. And that some proper official should attach his signature or some other mark of approval before the bill is paid by the treasurer? i A. I should think that would be the best Avay. i Q. Who appoints the steAvard ? . A. The superintendent. m Q. And the purchasing department is in the hands of the super* M indent and the steAvard? J A. Yes, sir. Q. Do you, or do you not, think it would be wise to separate the purchasing department from the executive part or government of the institution, now in the hands of the superintendent ? ' A. I have always said that when I have talked on the subject; I have always expressed myself very freely that I thought these'should 273 be separated ; that the duties of the superintendent should be to take charge of the medical department and of the humanitarian and sanitarian department, and that the business part—the farm, the garden, the purchasing of supplies, etc. — should be in the hands of another person who should not be responsible to him, the superin- tendent; I have always expressed myself freely in that way; I may not have said it to Dr. Gray, for he is very tender on that point, and I have avoided any thing that might precipitate a controversy Avith him on that subject. Q. You say he is tender on that point; do you mean on the ques- tion of his supremacy in the institution ? A. He thinks, from what I have heard him say, that the institu- tion can be better carried on and more efficiently managed by having the two under one head, and there is a fair chance for a difference of opinion upon that ; I am simply of opinion that there should be some one outside of the medical department to take care of the outside business of the institution. Q. You then would suggest that a change should be made in the present system in that respect ? A. My idea is that there should be some one there to do the busi- ness of the institution; I do not think it could be done by a person appointed to do that sort of business for the institution, but I think a person should be there on the sput to attend to all the business of the farm, etc.; there are several hundred acres of land, cattle, horses, sheep, hogs, etc., poultry on the grounds, etc., to take care of; in addition to that care of the farm and stock there is the purchasing of supplies, and I think that should be in the hands of a resident' manager. Q. How should such a manager be appointed in your opinion ? A. That I have never thought of, Avhether by the board of nanagers or otherwise ; I should think it could be made more 3ffieiently if it were by appointment from the board of managers. Q. A£distinguished from an appointment by the superintendent? A. Yes, sir. Q. Would you then have such manager account only to the board 'or the expenditures of the institution ? A. My opinion would be that that would be the most direct way, hat his responsibility should be immediately to the board, and that he board should report to the State. Q. Have you any knowledge as to the prices paid for other articles applied to the institution except those that have been previously numerated by you ? A. I could not say, although I looked over a great many of the ills after the matter was brought up in the meeting of the board; tried to use all the care I could ; I used to be in the dry goods usiness, so that I kneAv something about that, and I endeavored to s as conscientious as possible in looking over the bills. Q. Are there a great many dry goods purchased by the Asylum '( A. Yes, sir. 35 U ~1 274. Q. What can you say with reference to the prices paid for such goods ? A. In respect to the dry goods I should say the prices paid were fair as far as I could see ; there are a great many ready made cloth- ing, sheets, etc., shirts, etc. Q. Do I understand you that you do not feel competent to pass fully upon those goods ? A. No, sir. Q. Do you know any thing about prices paid for medicines '. A. No, sir, I do not. | • Q. Do you know where such articles are purchased ? A. I see that some of them are purchased in our own city, some in Xew York and some in Philadelphia. Q. Do they appear to be principally purchased in Utica? A. Most of them, I think, are purchased of our druggists in [Ttica; they are purchased of parties in Avhom I should have every confi- dence would do the fair thing if left to themseh'es, but it is sup- posed to be important for those bu}dng them to knoAV Avhat theyare worth, and what they can purchase them for in Utica, as compared ; with other places, of course. Q. Would you not suppose that such articles as drugs could be better purchased at Avholesale from the manufacturers or importers ' in New York or Philadelphia? A. That would be the reasonable conclusion, and in investigating ' that matter, there was one very high priced drug that came to my ' attention ; it was purchased of one of our druggists ; it Avas so high priced that one day I went in and asked him: " What is the highest priced drug that you have in your store ? " and he named this very thing. He Avas a man who thoroughly understood his business, and he did not know what I Avas getting at. I said "What is it Avorth?" and he gave me the price that Avas charged, and he told me at that time that there Avas not as much as five per cent made on that par- ticular drug ; it was something that costs $20 an ounce, or over, but I cannot recall the name of the drug. Q. It has been stated that the State Board of Charities has re- quested from all the asylums and other charitable institutions sub- ject to their visitations, an inventory of their property, etc. It has also been stated that the Utica Asylum, and the Asylum at Buffalo, are the only institutions in the State Avhieh have declined to furnish such inventories. Do you know whether that matter has been laid before your board ? A. It has not, to my knowledge; never while I have been in the board. Q. Do you know of any request made of the board by the State Board of Charities for information, since you have been a membaM of the board I W A. No, sir; I do not. , ■ Q. How long have you been in the board ? A. Nearly a year. 275 Q. Then if the board has made a refusal to grant such a request it has been prior to your term of office ? . A. Yes, sir; I have never heard of any thing of that kind. Q. Do you know whether Dr. Gray has laid any thing of that kind before the board for its action ? A.I never heard of any such question. Q. Have you been present at all the meetings of the board ? A. All except one; I so reported bare to Governor Cleveland; I think that was in the month of July ; I was out of town at that time. Q. Is this the first time that you have ever heard of any such request ? A. Yes, sir: I should think it was. And I think that the board of managers, as constituted at present, would-be in favor of doing it in a moment if they were asked. Q. Are there any suggestions you can make, other than those you have already made, Avhich, in your judgment, would improA7e the management of the institution ? A. I think we have gone pretty thoroughly over the ground; that is all that has come under my observation that I would give an opinion upon intelligently. I think, in going over the building the other day you must be convinced that the inside of the institution is well taken care of, and that every thing is in good condition in a sanitary point of view. Q. Are you aware that there are certain books kept in the institu- tion called "injury books'V A. No, sir; I have never heard name of them, that I recollect. Q. Do you know of a book called " the case book," containing a history of all the cases ? A. Y'es, sir. Q. But you do not know that they use some small books on the wards that are called "injury books"? A. No, sir. [Injury Books—Exhibits Nos. 4 to 9, inclusive, shown to the witness.] Q. Have you ever seen those books before ? A. No, sir ; never. By Mr. Haskell : ,Q. Have you any idea hi regard to the number of injuries to the patients in the institution? A. It has only come to my knowledge from the attendants and doctors that there are very feAV, considering the number of patients in the Asylum ; but of my own knowledge I could not say. Q. Your attention has never been called to that feature of the institution at all ? A. No, sir. Q. In regard to the gas bills of the institution have you ever in- vestigated that matter ? 276i A. I looked at the gas bills and they seemed to me to be pretty large, but perhaps it would be presumption on my part to state about that without possessing more knowledge than 1 have upon the subject. , . Q. Are yon aware that the original contract was made between the Insane Asylum, and the gas company when the mains were laid up at the Asylum ? A. I cannot say that I am. Adjourned until to-morrow at 3 o'clock, p. m. 277 Room " B," New Capitol, ) Albany, N. Y., February 27, 1884. j At 3:30 o'clock, p. m., the committee reconvened, and continued the investigation as under : SAMUEL S. LOWERY, Sworn and examined, testified as follows By the Chairman : Q. What is your age ? A. Fifty-three. Q. And your residence ?j A. Utica. Q. Your business ? A. Manufacturer of woolen goods. Q. Your relation to the Asylum? A. Manager. Q. When were you appointed ? A. I think my commission bears date the 23d of last March. Q. And runs for three years ? ,,„w A. Yes, sir. Q. Please state what attention you have given to the management of the Asylum since your appointment? A. I think I have met with the full board six or eight times; I have been up there with Mr. Winston and one or tAvo others when the full board were not present; since this accident perhaps I have been four or five times ; the books will show how many times I have been there — but since my appointment I think I have been there twelve or fifteen times. Q. That is you think you have made twelve or fifteen visits to the Asylum during the past eleven months? A. Yes, sir, about that number. Q. How often does the board have its regular meetings ? A. They have regular meetings once a quarter; we meet oftenei than that when something comes up ; and any tAvo members can call a meeting of the full board. Q. As a matter of fact, hoAV many meetings have there been since your appointment ? A. It would ouly be from memory, Mr. Chairman ; I should say, meetings of the full board about five or six times, possibly six times; 1 may be mistaken, but I should say as many as that. Q. Are there any standing committees of the board I A. Yes, sir; an auditing committee, consisting of three, General McQuaid, Mr. Swan, and Mr. Winston. 1 278 Q. Any other standing committee ? A. I think the committee of Legislature is considered a standing ,' committee; I think, I am not sure, there is such a committee ap- pointed by the board. Q. What are their duties? A. Any thing necessary to be done here at Albany, any explana- tions to be made in regard to the annual report or in regard to the appropriations wanted ; this committee is supposed to make it their business to see to it. Q. Are there any other standing committees that you now recol- lect ? A. No, sir; there are special committees. Q. Are special committees appointed from time to time ? A. Yes, sir; for purposes; there is a special committee now on water supply. Q. And any other during your term of office? A. I think not; there has been a special committee to see to the erection of an addition to a new building, and that committee is still in existence, I think. ' Q. How often have you personally visited the Avards of the insti- tution ? A. I think I made a thorough inspection about five times during the last ten months; I have been through all the Avards, I think; I understood that I passed through them all. Q. How many wards are there in the institution ( A. I cannot tell exactly ; I have forgotten. Q. Y^ou Are aware that the .institution is divided into two departments, male and female ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Hoav many Avards should you say there are in each depart ment; into Iioav many wards is each department divided, as near as you can judge? A. My recollection Avould be about eight or nine in each depart- ment ; there are three supervisors, and I think each supervisor has three departments to see to — that is, three supervisors in each of the departments, male and female. Q. In addition to these thorough inspections you have referred to, have you visited the wards on any other occasions — that is, any of the Avards ? A. I have. < Q. To what extent? A. I was in two or three of the female Avards not alone a«m with , a view of finding out the condition of tAvo or three patients to Avhom 1 my attention had been called. 1 Q. Hoav frequently have you made such partial visits to the Avards? ■ A. About three times. Q. Or visits to a portion of the Avards ?. A. I think three times since my appointment I have partially sits to the wards. 279 Q. Is there any regular visitation of the wards by the board of managers ? A. Yes, sir ; the rules say that—my recollection is that the rules say that — Ave shall make a thorough examination or visitation during each quarterly meeting ; that is my recollection ; I may be mistaken ; I knoAV we have such a rule and Ave do that. Q. Have you been present at a quarterly meeting during vour in- cumbency ; have you, in company Avith the board, made a thorough inspection ? A. Once Ave did. Q. On what occasion ? A. I think it was in October when Ave Avere getting up our annual report. i Q. On that occasion you did not visit the Avards ? A. Not thoroughly ; Ave Avent through some of the Avards and we looked at the books. Q. Were there some members of the board avIio Avent through, as far as you know ? A. I do not think there Avere any that passed through the whole building at that time. Q. Did any pass through a portion of the wards at that time ? A. Yes, sir. Q. You have no knowledge to AAdiat extent ? A. No, sir. Q. Did you know avIio they Avere ? A. Mr. I). Y. Rogers, and my recollection is, that the chairman, Mr. Campbell, passed through the same ward. Q. Is Dr. Gray present at the meetings of the board ? A. Y"es, sir. Q. Does he take part in the discussions? A. He is obliged to take part Avith a view to giving information. Q. Does the board ever hold meetings in execute session in Avliieh Dr. Gray is not present ? • » A. They never have, since my connection Avith it. Q. Has your attention ever been called during your visits to the Asylum, or otherAvise, to the character of the attendants as to their fitness for the place ? A. Upon two or three different occasions Ave have talkad over the fitness of attendants. Q. What has been the nature of such discussions? A. Upon one occasion the superintendent informed the board that a number of the attendants had sent him a paper asking for an increase of pay ; I think Ave discussed the fitness of some of the at- tendants ; of course Ave received most of our information from the doctor as to their fitness ; Ave come very little in contact with the at- tendants in a conversational way. Q. By whom are they appointed ? A. By the superintendent entirely; the by-laws say by the rec- I 280 ommendation of the managers, but it is usually left with the super- intendent. Q Entirely with the superintendent ? A. Y"es, sir; it is really under the management of the board. Q. Upon this occasion of the request for an increase of salary, what did the board do ? A. After discussing the question, I think the majority of the board were of the opinion ("that is referring more particularly to the male department)— I think the majority of the board decided that they were being paid relatively more than the females, and if there was to be a raise, the females should get more pay. Q. What Avas Dr. Gray's opinion on that subject ? A. He seemed to coincide with our views; I think those vieAvs were advanced by the managers before, but the doctor took part in the discussion. Q. What is your oavii opinion as to their pay? A. My OAvn opinion is that the pay is rather low. Q. Do you know the hours of their employment ? A. They are employed — their time is hardly ever their oavii, except about once a week they get out. Q. What are their daily hours of employment ? A. My recollection is they have to be up at six o'clock in the morning and are upon duty, I think, until nine o'clock; I Avould not . sAvear positively to that; I have not posted myself fully as to hoAV of- ten the men are changed, but that is my recollection. Q. Have the Avomen attendants the same hours ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What are the wages on the men's side for attendants ' " A. From $23 to $28, I believe, per month. Q. Do you mean $23 is the lowest amount paid ? A. With a new attendant — they start on that basis, and after having been there six months they are put up from $1 to $2 a month. Q. Do*you know hoAV much a month they start on 2 A. I think it is $23. Q. And you say that is too low considering the hours and duties of the attendants ? A. I do. Q. Did you express yourself when this subject was before you upon this petition ? A. I expressed myself that I thought the wages Mere low, but,as compared with the services rendered and pay received by the femalVs, high enough, and until the wages of the female attendants were put up very materially, we ought not to raise the wages of the men, there was too much difference between the two, I 'thought for the same services. Q. Are you familiar with the duties of such attendants ? A. Yxes, sir. Q. Please state what they are requested to do ? A. Those attendants are required to see to the patients, wash them i 281 comb their hair and keep them in proper shape, Avatch and care for them during the day, and see that they are not allowed to injure themselves in any Avay. Q. Are not the attendants kept there for a long while, or are there occasional or frequent changes ? A. Some attendants are kept for a long time; if after a while the attendant does not seem to be suited to the work, a change is made, and changes are made very often because of that; and a great many attendants are not calculated for that work; attendants stay five or six years frequently. Q. How many attendants are in the house altogether? A. About fifty, I think, including supervisors. Q. And including both departments, male and female ? A. Ytes, I think there is about one attendant to eight patients on an average. Q. How many physicians are there '. A. Five, I think, including the pathologist, Dr. Beeke. Q. What is the salary of the physicians ? A. I do not know exactly Avhat the assistants now get; the doc- tor rather regulates that; I believe it runs from $1,200 to $2,000 per year; I think the superintendent regulates the salary of the assistant physician, that is, he recommends, and the board coufirms those recommendations as to the services of the physicians and their remuneration; the doctor himself—I think his salary is $5,000. Q. Do you know Avhat the duties of the physicians are, and the nature and extent of their services ? A. The physicians have to attend on their different departments, and they are expected at all hours to be ready to respond to any call, even in the night; they are expected to respond to the call of the supervisor in case there is any necessity for them to get up; they all must reside in the Asylum. • Q. Do you know how much attention Dr. Gray personally gives to the patients ? A. I do not knoAV, but I am under the impression that he cannot personally devote a very great deal of attention to the patients per- sonally. Q. For what reason ? A. For the reason of having too much work to see to. Q. Of what nature i A. Responding to parties who come there to call and see patients; it requires pretty much all his time in his own office. Q. Do you think that those duties take most of his time ? A. I think they are calculated to take most of his time; I think; the doctor knoAATs\vhat is going on in the Asylum from the reports of his assistants. Q. So it is your belief that he does not personally give much attention to the patients themselves ? A. It is my belief that he cannot personally give very much attention to patients from the nature of his engagements. 36 U 282 Q. How often do you suppose he goes upon the wards of the institution ? A. That would be a question I could not answer; he gives the board to understand that he frequently goes upon the wards, but I do not knoAV of my own knowledge. Q. What do you understand by frequently ? A. Once in two or three Aveeks ; I am under the impression'that he trusts very much to his assistants for the attention to the patients — that is, his knowledge of the condition of the patients. Q. Are you aware that he has sometimes been away from the institution on private and professional employment? A. I am not aware that he has been away on private and profes- sional callings, of my own knowledge. Q. Have you heard that he had been away as an expert witness? A. Yres, sir. Q. In the case of Mrs. Fillmore's will, at Buffalo, for instance? A. Yes, sir ; I so understood it. Q. Are you aware that he regularly lectures, during the Avinter, at Bellevue Hospital Medical College in the city of NeAV York? A. I have understood he does. Q. How much, during the term of your office, has he been aAvay from the institution ? A. My impression Avould be five or six Aveeks ; I think he Avasat Newport last year, at Newport six weeks; it is fair to state, Mr. Howe, that the board understood his health required his absence at that time. Q. Would you regard his acceptance of fees for private profes- sional employment, which requires his absence from the institution, to be an interruption of his duties at the institution ? A. Yres, sir ; if it-required the interruption of his duties at the' institution I think the board would consider it Avrong ; I would. Q. Would you consider it Avise for Dr. Gray to refrain from accepting such outside professional employment if the effect of it were to take him away from the institution ? A. 1 think it would be wise for him to refrain from taking such employment, if that Avere the result — especially if the institution required his services, but I knoAV there have been times aa hen the doctor has been compelled to go away by the Governor and by the State authorities, and the institution might perhaps suffer in conse- j quence of these orders, but the State also feels that they have the right to command the doctor's services, and I believe they have usually also recognized the right of the State to pay him extra for such services, and on some occasions I have voted in the Senate myself to alloAv extra compensation, because it was the judgment of the State officers that he ought to have it. Q But that does not apply to his employment in private cases?, A. No, sir; I believe that the head of a great institution \ike that—' the head of the medical department — should be required to devote his entire attention to that department; I have a very high opinion, of 283 Doctor Gray in some respects ; I think he is a man of wonderful executive ability, and it seems to me that the State is fortunate in having him at the head of the medical department of that institution. Q. Do yon knoAV Avhat other duties occupy his time besides that, irrespective of visitors, hearing their statements and consultations with physicians in charge of the hospital ? A. Yes, sir. Q. For example, Avhat other duties? A. His duties as superintendent of the institution gives him entire charge of the farm, the running of the farm and the purchasing of supplies for the institution —-'in a word, he has charge of the finan- cial and the medical department, subject to the orders of the board of managers. Q. To what extent does he purchase the supplies for the institution ? A. He has a steward avIio makes the purchases by his orders. Q. Where are the purchases generally made ? A. Mostly in Utica —stock and animals — beef is bought outside of Utica, but the principal supplies of the Asylum, groceries, etc., I think it is fair to say are purchased in Utica. Q. Are they purchased at wholesale ? A. Not all of them. Q. Are they purchased at Avholesale or retail ? A. Some of them are purchased at Avholesale stores, and some at retail stores. Q. Where are the groceries purchased ? A. I think Butler & Hamilton supply the groceries. Q. Does the Asylum have any understanding with that firm in regard to prices? A. Ytes, sir. Q. Please state Avhat ? A. Oh, certain things; the Asylum makes the purchase, or the goods are sold to the Asylum by adding five per cent to invoice prices; that is an understanding between the managers of the Asylum and Butler & Hamilton. Q. What articles does that understanding cover ? A. I never saAV the contract; I have seen a bill, and my best recollection is, that it included coffees, teas, spices, and such things. Q. Is it regulated by any agreement, in Avriting? A. I so understand it, but I have never seen the agreement. Q. In whose custody Avould the agreement be? A. I should think it would be Avith the treasurer, for he keeps most of the papers of the institution. Q. Does the board audit the bills of Butler & Hamilton ? ' A. The auditing committee look them over, and if they are satis- Sed, they submit them to the board. ■ Q. Do they check them over before they are paid i ; A. No, sir; not always, not before they are paid. 284 Q. Or do they compare them with the checks for which they are vouchers? A. They are supposed to do so. Q. What isthe usual method of auditing such bills? A. The ordinary method is by looking over the bills after they liave been paid; 1 have heard the reasons for that stated why — Q. Please state your opinion of this method or practice of audit- ing them after the bills are paid ? A. I took occasion to raise the question that they ought to be audited before being paid, and the explanation was that they could not always get the committee together, and the people who sold goods could not Avait two or three months for their pay ; that they Avere dealing with honorable merchants who would make any thing right that Avas discovered to be wrong, and that it would not be practicable to audit the bills before they Avere paid. Q. Are you connected with any other institution as a director or manager ? A. I am connected Avith the Utica Mechanics' Association, and I have been manager and president for the last sixteen or seventeen years, and president five or six years. Q. What method of auditing bills is there practiced ? A. We always insist upon having the bills audited before being paid either by the finance committee or otherAvise ; I think that it would be well to have such a practice in this institution. Q. Has there been any inconvenience resulting to those associa- tions from practicing that method you refer to ? A. No, sir. Q. Is it, in your opinion, a better way of examining the accounts of the institution by the bills being compared by some member thereof '. prior to payment'. A. Yes. Q. Would you recommend that there should be a change in that > respect at the Asylum; has such recommendation been made by you to the board ? A. My recollection is that I was the first to suggest that we should audit the bills; possibly some other manager may have first men- tioned it. Q. But you say that it was objected to as being practically incon- venient ? A. That Avas the reason given for having the bills audited in that way, and I was somewhat surprised that the bills Avere paid in that way before audit. Q. Who raised that objection ? A. I cannot say positively, but I think it was a member of the auditing committee. Q. Was Dr. Gray present during the discussion ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What were his views on the subject ? A. I think he did not take part in the discussion. 285 Q. Have you had reason to criticise any bills paid by the institu- tion since your membership ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What bills have you ever criticised ? A. I criticised a bill that was shoAvn me of Butler & Hamilton's. Q. Have you had any occasion to criticise the bills of any other firm or dealer ? A. I think not. Q. Have you examined the bills of any other firm or dealer? A. I think not. Q. Can you give the names of any other dealer from whom the Asylum purchased their supplies? A. Y7es, sir. ' Q. Please name several ? A. The}7 made some purchases at Head A: Winston, purchases of flour; occasionally at Mr. Owen's, of Utica, on Liberty street; there are about one hundred and tAventy-four names in Utica with whom the Asylum trades. Q. Is Mr. Winston, of Head & Winston, a member of the board ? A. Yes, sir. Q. To what extent are purchases made of his establishment ? A. I think to a very small extent only. Q. HaAre you any idea to what amount? A. I have not. Q. Do you know whether purchases are made at the establish- ments of any other members of the board ? A. I think I should say not; I think Mr. Winston is the only manager who is in the business where supplies could be furnished to the Asylum. Q. Have you ever furnished any supplies to the Asylum ? A. I have sold small bills, $20 or $25, to the Asylum. Q. But since your membership in the board '. A. No, sir. Q. What is your business ? A. Manufacturer of underwear and knit goods. Q. To return to the bill of Butler & Hamilton ; what criticism have you made on that bill ? A. My criticism was from information gained from a member of the auditing committee. Q. What member ? A. Mr. Winston, avIio is supposed to be an expert in the knoAvl- edge of that kind of goods. Q. Did you then examine the bill with him ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do you know what time the bill covered ? A. I think three months, and I think it was about $4,000 in amount, Q. Was it three or four months occurring during your member- ship of the board I A. I think this bill began before I became a member of the bo ard; \- 286 it was a bill that has been audited within a feAv months ; I think it was five or six months since my attention Avas called to it. Q. The two bills now shown'vou (Exhibits 10, 11) are for a period of six months, showing a total "of about $4,000; is that to what you refer? Were those the accounts to which you referred ? A. Without having marked them my impression would be that they are. Q. From your own observations of these bills what conclusion have you reached as to the prices charged the Asylum ? A. From my own observation 1 Avas not able to reach a correct conclusion. Q. But from the information given you by Mr. Winston, Avhat was your conclusion of the prices charged ? A. That they might have been duplicated for from $200 to $250 lsss from the aggregate of the two bills of $4,000, at some other establishments; I arrived at my conclusions from the informa- tion received from Mr. Winston, whom I considered an exper in that line of— Q. When was your attention first called to these bills ? A. I think about three months ago, yet I must say it is only from recollection. Q. AYas it at a meeting of the board or privately ? A. Privately. Q. What steps did you take in reference to the matter \ A. I advised that Mr. Winston call the attention of the full board to the bill at our next meeting— at our next meeting to be held. Q. Was such advice followed? A. Mr. Winston mentioned something at the next meeting of the board that were charged too much for in his opinion. Q. What action did the board take upon this statement ? A. The board passed a resolution instructing the auditing com- mittee to take the whole matter of purchases into consideration and show to the next meeting of the board — the next full meeting — any changes which they, in their judgment, may think best. Q. At what meeting was that when this discussion Avas had ? A. My impression wronld be that it was in September last — I may be mistaken ; I think it was not at the regular quarterly meet- ing; I think it was at a special meeting that was called. Q. Was Dr. Gray present at such discussion ? A. He was. Q. Did he make any remarks upon the subject ? A. I think he did. Q. Can you recollect Avhat position he took in the matter ? A. The doctor's position is that by buying some things in small quantities they have them fresh at the Asylum ; such *as roasted coffee and some things which, perhaps, are perishable if bought in large quantities; a portion of the commodities might spoil before being used up; and that it was better for the patients; and that we lost no money in buying some things in small quantities, coffee, par- 287 ticularly, he mentioned ; some of us thought that it might be pur- chased at first hand in larger quantities, and Ave favored competition among dealers, allowing dealers to compete for the sale of flour, for instance, Avhich Ave buy in large quantities, a hundred barrels a month, I think, is about our consumption. It was the judgment of some of the members of the board that we could save money by alloAving competition ; I think as soon as that discussion that the purchases have been distributed more than they were. Q. If this meeting was September, the board has held several meetings since? A. Yes, sir. Q. Has the subject been renewed at any of those meetings ? A. No, sir; it is in the hands of the auditing committee; the chairman of that committee has been away some time, and is now away I think; Avas quite ill part of the time; that is General McQuaid, and Ave are waiting for that report. Q. Is it not the general opinion of the board that a change would be desirable ? A. The members did not all express their opinion, but I think that every member of the board is very desirous of saving money in purchases; I think the majority will be guided by the recom- mendation of the auditing committee as to any change that they may think best to be made. Q. Have the members of the board any personal knoAvledge from time to time connected with the purchasing of supplies ? A. Not necessarily. Q. Who makes these purchases usually ? A. The steAvard, Dr. Dryer. Q. Is there any supervision whatever by the board over those pur- chases, or is it left to him ? A. It is left to him through the superintendent. Q. Who appoints the steAvard ? A. The board of managers on the recommendation of the super- intendent. Q. Has Dr. Gray at any time during the membership on the board made any recommendations concerning any change or improvement in the business and domestic management of the institution as dis- tinguished from the scientific management? A. I have no recollection of any. ,Q. Have you any information as to a request made of your board by the State Hoard of Charities for information concerning the property of the institution ? A. Ihave information that such a request was made three or four years ago ; I have seen a blank which they sent up to the Asylum. Q. What was the nature of the information desired by them i A. The nature of the information' was that we should classify all purchases, and it seems to me that they wanted to know7 exactly what each patient was paying, who he was, and the names of all the patients and all that; I was not a member of the board at the time. 288 Q. Did they make any inquiries as to the manner of purchasing supplies ? A. Not since my time. Q. On this occasion, did the information asked for cover that point? A. Yes, sir ; I read the blank the other day that covered those matters. Q. As to the purchase of supplies ? A. Yes, sir; very fully. Q. What kind of supplies and how much ? A. It Avas very full, I noticed, very full indeed. Q. What ansAver was made by the institution to such inquiries? Was the information given ? A. No, sir; I believe not. Q. Do you knoAV for what reason it Avas withheld ? A. One of the reasons given, or one of the reasons is, as I under- stand it, that it was not considered wise to have in a public document the names of parties who Avere so afflicted ; that there Avas some in- formation asked for which it would not be for the best interest of the institution to have known publicly. Q. Does that apply to the inquiries as to the purchasing of sup- plies ? A. I think not. Q. Do you think such information should be given ? A. I think it would be well enough to give it. Q. Are you willing that the board should now give it to the State Board of Charities? A. I am willing that the board should give any information to any party authorized to receive it; any information which Avill not have a tendency to injure the Asylum or the patients intrusted to the care of the management, or to wound the feelings of the relatives. Q. Are you willing to give to the State Board of Charities full in- formation concerning the matter of purchase and supplies for the institution their cost and character ? A. Speaking for myself I should be perfectly willing ; I do not think there would be any objection to that. Q. Are you aAvare that such information is generally given by other institutions upon the request of the State Board of Charities 1 A. I have been so informed that some of the charitable institu- tions haA7e furnished such information ; it is only by hearsay. Q. Are you aware that it has been publicly stated that the only two institutions in the State Avhich have declined to ansAver any such inquiries are the State Lunatic Asylum at Utica, and the Asylum at Buffalo ? A. I have heard it so stated. Q. Have you any reason to doubt the correctness of that state- ment? A. No, sir. Q. Can you suggest any reason Avhy such information should not be given by the Utica Asylum ? 289 r A. I can see no reason for not giving the information concerning the purchase of supplies. Q. Has this matter been a subject of discussion with any of the members of the board 'since your membership of it ? A. It has been casually alluded "to since this investigation, but has not been discussed ; it was a thing that came up long before my connection with the Asylum. Q. Do you know whether the inquiry has been repeated by the State Board of Charities to the Asylum since your membership ? ,. A. Not to my own knowledge. Q. Do you know what the views of Dr. Gray are on the subject ? A. I think he is opposed to giving all the information that is asked for; that is my impression. Q. Does that objection extend to the matter of supplies ? A. I think not; of course he can state that for himself better than I can. Q. Have you had any conversation with the doctor upon the subject ? A. No, sir ; not directly. Q. Have you been informed as to his views on the subject? A. Partially. Q. By whom ? A. Some members of the board. Q. Will you name them ? A. It has been discussed informally by Senator Campbell, Mr. Swan, and I think I read a letter that Senator Campbell wrote to the chairman of the State Board of Charities, giAdng his reasons for declining to give the information required ; the reasons of the board for declining it; the date of that letter I am not able to give, but I think it Avas about 1882, possibly 1881 ; we have a copy of the letter at the Asylum. Q. Have yon made any examination of the books and records kept in the Asylum concerning the treatment of the cases ? A. Yes, sir. Q. To what extent have yon familiarized yourself with it? A. Not to any great extent ; I have read a number of cases over to see Iioav the doctors keep the history of the cases, from the entrance of a patient until he is discharged, perhaps clear through half a dozen cases, with a vieAV of getting that information. Q. Do yon know certain books known as " injury books?" A. I think there are such books. Q. Small books kept on the Avards by the supervisors ? A. There are such books, and I have seen them, but I have not examined them with any care. By Mr. Haskell. Q. As I understand it you have not given any personal attention to the care of the patients in the institution ? 37 U 290 A. No more than as my attention has been called to patients by their friends, I sometimes look them up and talk with them ; of course casually passing through, we cannot make any prolonged ex- amination. Q. Y^ou make no personal examination yourself ? A. Oh yes, I have been through a great many times during my membership. Q. With a view of ascertaining how the members were treated? A. Yes, sir; and with a view of seeing how the patients are cared for generally ; how the beds are and the rooms, etc.; Iioav many pa- tients are confined and all that, but it is impossible for eight or nine gentlemen who have businesses — a daily business — to give very much attention to a public institution of that kind ; we know by hearsay, frequently, wrhat is going on. Q. When did you learn of the injury to Mr. Hughes ? A. I think I learned of it the next day. Q. After he was injured, or after he died ? A. My impression is that he was dead before I heard of it; some of the managers were advised immediately ; I AAras not, and I am not sure but I was out of town, in New York city. Q. And you did not learn of the case until after the death ? A. No, sir. Q. What, if any, action w7as taken by you as a member of the board of managers in reference to the case ? A. I telephoned Dr. Gray and I AA7ent up and made some in- quiries, I think, in the afternoon of the same day; I asked Dr. Gray to come down street and meet me at Mr. Winston's office ; I insisted that these three men must be immediately discharged from the Asylum. Q. You so insisted ? A. Yes, sir; and Mr. Winston also insisted so, and I presume other of the managers ; it was an informal meeting, composed of Dr. Gray, Mr. Winston and myself. Q'. And what day was that with reference to the death of Mr. Hughes ? A. It may have been a couple of days after the death of Mr. Hughes; I am not sure, but very soon. Q. How long w7as it before the men were discharged ? A. They were discharged in the afternoon of that day, on the meeting in Mr. Winston's office ; my present impression is that they held their places until after the result of the coroner's investio-ation and the day after that result — the day that we first knew of the findings of the coroner's jury, that this informal meeting was held to which I have referred, and then the men were discharged. Q. When do you now say this meeting was held with reference to your being informed of knowing of the injury to Mr. Hm-hes? A. My recollection is that it was held the next day after the find- ing of the coroner's jury. Q. Yxou said it was a few days after his death ? 291 A. Yes, sir; I think I heard of his death immediately after the newspaper came out. Q. Then I ask you what action did you take as a member of the board of managers, on learning of the death of Mr. Hughes ? A. With one or two of the other managers I attended to the sit- tings of the coroner's jury and listened to the evidence; and Ithink I ventured to ask the coroner to let me say a word upon one occa- sion,* and I stated the position of the managers. Q. Did yon go to the Asylum Avith reference to this matter your self? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you make any inquiries yourself with regard to that matter ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Of the attendants ? A. Y^es, sir; I inquired of them. Q. Before the inquest? A. Yes, sir; and during that time. Q. Do you know why these three men were allowed to remain in the institution as attendants from the date of the injury to Mr. Hughes until after the verdict of the coroner's jury ? A. I should give as reason that there was no positive evidence that those men had inflicted the injuries until the sitting of the coroner's jury, or until they confessed; one man, Brown, confessed himself that he struck the man — fell upon him — that was the first we kneAv that they had inflicted the injuries. Q. Are you aware that Mr. Brown informed the supervisor of that department and one of the physicians within two days after the occur- rence to Mr. Hughes, and his being injured, that he—Brown —had struck the patient ? A. My recollection is that I heard Mr. Browu's evidence that he said so. Q. You do not know it as a fact ? A. No. Q. And that is the only reason that you know how that these men were retained in the institution as long as they were, is that there Avas no positive evidence of their-having done any thing out of the way ? A. That is the only reason. Q. Noav you say that, at the meeting at Mr. Winston's office, you insisted upon the discharge of these men — was there any opposition ? A. No, sir; no opposition there. Q. Dr. Gray did not take any position against the matter ? A. No, sir; I think he told me then that their pay-roll'was made out. Q. Was there any meeting of the board called at the time of the injuries to Mr. Hughes, or immediately upon his death, to consider the matter ; or was there any such meeting ? A. My impression is that there was. 292 Q. Did you attend that ? A. I think I was not at home ; the record will show ; I think that there was a meeting called immediately; if it was not called, there was an informal meeting of the managers. Q. And not being present, of course you do not know what action was taken ? A. No, sir, I do not. By Mr. Olin : Q. This meeting at Mr. Winston's office was where you had the first conversation with Dr. Gray about the discharge of these men — BroAvn, Bills and Weir ? A. Yes, sir, the first conversation ; I may have outlined to the doctor my views before seeing him; I think possibly I did. Q. You inquired of him why he did not discharge them, did you not? A. No, sir, I did not inquire ; I said,," these men must be dis- charged promptly; they have violated the rules of the institution, and must be discharged at once." Q. Did he make any claim that they ought to stay, or explain why they had stayed since the occurrence ? A. No, sir; my recollection is that the doctor said that their pay-roll was all made out; I think the only reason why these men were kept so long after the death of Mr. Hughes was that there was no positive evidence until after the finding of the coroner's jury, or after they had given evidence themselves. Q. Do you think the doctor stated that as a reason ? A. I don't know ; I never Ireard it. Q. You never heard the doctor state any reason why he kept them there ? A. No, sir. By Mr. Haskell : Q. And I understand you did not inquire of the doctor why he had kept them as long as he had ? A. No. Q. Were you surprised at their being retained as long as they were ? A. No, sir; I thought it was fair to them. Q. Fair to who — the attendants or the patients ? A. I think it was fair to the attendants to wait until an investi- gation was made; I understood the attendants denied having struck the man until they Avere put under oath, then they confessed to striking Mr. Hughes, and unttt we had positive evidence of that I did not think we would be justified in discharging them. By Mr. 1 vice : Q. You received no pay as a member of the institution % A. No, sir. 293 Q. How was your appointment brought about, upon whose rec- ommendation did you go ? A. I do not know ; I asked Governor Cleveland's private secretary while I was calling upon the Governor to thank him for the courtesy of my appointment; I certainly did not want the position, and I cer- tainly knew of no friends who had asked the Governor to appoint me; I asked the private secretary of the Governor and he told me that I was indebted to the Governor; it was a surprise to me, being a pretty strong Republican. Q. I supposed that your name had been recommended to the Governor ? ,^ A. I do not know that it ever was. Q. You have no knoAvledge of that kind ? A. No, sir; I asked Senator Kernan if he recommended me, and he said no; the first intimation that I had of the appointment was through the newspaper when I saw that I had been appointed; that was the first intelligence I had about it. CHARLES W. PILGRIM, SAA7orn and examined, testified as folloAvs : By the Chairman : Q. What is your age ? A. Twenty-nine. Q. What is your residence, apart from the Asylum ? A. I have sisters living in Jersey City, but I haA7e no other resi- dence. Q. What is your position in the Asylum ? A. I am now acting second assistant physician. Q. What other positions have you held there ? A. I have been fourth assistant, and I am really third now; the second assistant physician, Dr. Bloomer, is absent in Europe. Q. How long have you been connected with the institution ? A. Since the 1st of December, 1882. Q. What are your present duties? A. I now have charge of the male side of the house. Q. Please state more specifically the nature of your daily duties ? A. I generally begin my rounds about 10 o'clock in the morning, and I go through the house at least once a day and generally tAvice; after finishing the rounds, some time during the morning, I then attend to the visitors — the friends of the patients, the admitting of patients and the Avriting of letters about the condition of the patients, etc., until about 4 o'clock, then I generally go into the wards ao-ain, although I do not always go on tAvice a day, but as a general thing 1 do. 294 Q. With which department are you specially connected ? A. The men's department. Q. And you have general charge at present of the male wards of the institution ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How many in number ? A. Twelve. Q. And containing how many patients ? A. Three hundred and thirty-four, I think. Q. How frequently are you called to attend the patients at night? A. That varies of course; sometimes I have as many as three calls a night, or four; I do not know but I have had more than that; the night watchman ahvays reports either to Doctor Backus or myself at ten o'clock ; night watcliman begins his work at eight o'clock, and about ten o'clock he comes and reports the condition of the patients and those who are noisy or who need special attention. Q. Does he report verbally ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do you make any memorandum of that ? A. No, sir; he keeps a book of his own, and then, after that, I am frequently called two or three times, between twelve o'clock at night and morning. Q. What is your practice upon receiving such calls, do you visit the patient ? A. If it is necessary, yes, sir. Q. If it is not necessary, how is it ? A. If not, I send medicine ; if they are merely noisy or restless. Q. Hoav do yon determine as to the necessity ? A. I keep thoroughly posted as to the condition of the patients; I have to make such frequent visits that I have a very good knowl- edge of what condition they are in. Q. What is your observation concerning the character of the attendants, as to their fitness and adaptability to their positions? A. As a general thing, I think they perform their duties satisfac-' torily; of course occasionally we have one who does not. Q. What is the pay of the attendants? A. I think the male attendants begin at $20 a month, the females at $12. Q. And what are their hours ? A. They are supposed to be on duty all the time. Q. From what time in the morning until what time at night? A. It varies at different seasons of course; in the summer" I think they get up about half-past five, and they have two evenings off a week and a half a day a month and every third Sunday, but they are there in the wards continually Avith that exception, unless they may be out by special permission. Q. Do you think that the average attendants of those trades are men who are sufficiently intelligent and capable of performing their duties ? 295 A. I think the majority are. Q. Do you think that an increase in pay as a diminution in the hours of Avork would have a tendency to produce a better grade of men for such purposes ? A. I think an increase of pay Avould; I think that if more and better inducements were offered that Ave could get a better class of attendants. Q. Do you think a better class would be desirable ? A. Well with few exceptions we have very good attendants. Q. What knoAAdedge haA7e you of the case of Mr. Hughes, who was injured there? A. I did not see him until after he was injured. Q. Where did you then see him ? A. On the fourth ward. Q. What was his condition ? A. He was sitting in a chair with a strap around him; and his pulse was Aveak. . Q. Who w7as there with him ? J A. Attendants Brown and Weir. Q. Was any other physician present? A. Dr. Brush and Dr. Backus folloAved me in; they Avere a few steps behind me; not more than a second or two. Q. What did you do about it ? A. We Avere all together, and I do not knoAV that I can tell you Avhat I did personally ; wre had the strap removed, and he was taken into an attendant's room which Avas quite near, and his shirts Avere lifted and we discovered the nature of his injuries; Dr. Backus re- ported at first at the office, and Dr. Brush and I went in imme- diately, or just as soon as Dr. Gray was informed. Q. What opinion did you form then as to the cause of the injuries and as to how the accident happened ? A. I did not form any opinion immediately; I asked Weir: ''How did this happen ? " and he replied, " I don't know, doctor;'' and I made no further inquiry then at that time, because the patient's condition Avas such that it demanded our instant attention and I thought the inquiry could wait until Ave had done what Ave could to Irelieve Mr. Hughes. Q. What is your present opinion as to the cause of the injury ? A. I have no further knoAvledge than that obtained by the coroner's jury. Q. Have you conversed with the-attendants about it ? A. I did ; and the conversation that I had Avith them that after- noon AVas reduced to Avriting by a stenographer, and it was put in as 'evidence before the coroner's jury. Q. What impression did the story told by the attendants make upon you as to its probable truthfulness ? A. At the time ? Q. Yes. A. Well, an explanation was not necessary at the time. 296 Q. Did you suspect any of them of manufacturing an untruthful account of the occurrence ? A. I suspected that they had not told all. Q. Did you subsequently learn any thing to confirm that impres- sion ? A. Yes, sir; that they did not tell me all at that examination of Saturday afternoon ; the examination which was afterward con- ducted by'Dr. Gray revealed some additional facts, and the same things w'ere also told me by attendant Brown afterward ; either afterward or before, I cannot remember when it Avas. ^ Q. What is your present impression as to Iioav the injuries could have occurred ? A. I think they occurred in a struggle between the patient and an attendant or attendants. Q. Do you, or do.you not, believe that the patient was struck by one or more of the attendants at that time ? A. Yes, sir; I do believe it; and they have so testified. Q. And your present belief is that the injuries which led to the' death of Mr. Hughes were caused in part by such bloAvs ? A. No, sir; I do not know7 that the Uoavs had any thing to do with it. Q. Do you still believe that the injuries to his ribs were caused by the fall ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How about the injuries to the jaAv ? A. I cannot account for the injuries to the jaw, unless his face struck the chair as he fell; it might have been produced by a blow, although judging from the testimony given in regard to the bloAvs, I do not think they were sufficient to produce it; but as to the ribs, I do not think they could have been produced by a blow. By Mr. Rice : Q. Could they have been the result of a kick ? A. I do not think they could have, but I think they could have been caused by an attendant falling upon him ; of course a fractured rib might be occasioned by a kick, but one kick Avould not have fractured so many ribs. Q. In your visits to the wards have you ever observed patients with bruises or other injuries ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Are those a matter of frequent occurrence ? A. Well, not frequent, taking into consideration the number of patients we have, and the character of the patients. Q. Is it not a somewhat usual occurrence ? A. No, sir; on an average, the highest number of black eyes in the past five years has been tAventy-five in any one year, and they have been caused by blows from patients in a great majority of in- stances. 297 Q. How do you know they have been blows from patients? A. From investigation at the time. Q. What kind of investigation did you make ? A. I inquired of the attendants and the patient avIio was so in- jured, and also of the patient who is accused of having struck the blow, and of any patient avIio may have seen it. Q. Do the patients at times charge that they have been struck by an attendant ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What weight do you give to such charges ? A. It depends upon the mental condition of the patient; some patients are reliable while others are wholly untrustworthy. Q. Have you ever received such statements that you doubted the reliability of ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And what have you done in such instances ? Have you ever received such statements from patients that you did rely on ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And what have you done in cases of that kind ? A. The attendant has been discharged. Q. How many attendants have been so discharged within your present recollection during the time you have been there ? A. Up to the first of October I was on the female side of the house, and of course they are not so frequent there ; I can now only recall one instance on the female side ; I have only been on the male »side of the institution since the first of October. Q. Have you had any confplaints on the female side ? A. Yes, sir, there have been complaints. Q. From patients as to bad treatment by attendants? A. Yes, sir. Q. What has been the nature of the complaints on that side ? A. Well, they are various, such as taking hold of them by the wrists and causing them black and blue marks, and things of that kind. Q. Do they ever complain that they have been scratched by attend- ants? A. Y"es, sir; but the attendants are scratched much more fre- quently than the patients. Q. Are there women attendants on the female side of the institu- tion ? A. Yes, sir; I have seen much more abuse given by patients to attendants and physicians than I have ever seen givien by attendants to patients. Q. What are the ages of the attendants on the female side; about how do they run ? A. The majority are above twenty. Q. Can you state how they run on the male side as to age ? A. I think the majority are about twenty-five on that side. Q. Have you ever had occasion to inquire as to black eyes or other 38 D" 298 injuries, and found that the testimony to be obtained was that of attendants only? A. Usually there is somebody who has seen it. Q. And in that case you always ask the patient ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How is it aboiit reports made by attendants when a patient is found in bed in the morning with a black eye, or when an attendant said the black eye was caused by tumbling out of bed ? Do you know of any such reports being made ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What do you do in those cases? A. Those reports are concerning patients who are too much demented to know any thing about their injuries, feeble and demented patients; if the patient is in a condition to know, it is always inves- tigated, but the majority of those cases are of old and feeble patients, so demented that they cannot answer any thing; patients who sit around all day with arms folded and head down, who do not pay attention to any thing, and with such patients it would be A7ery dif- ficult to investigate a case of that kind. Q. Might not injuries be caused in such cases by the attendants striking them ? A. They might, but I cannot conceive of any reason for striking a patient in that condition. Q. From your knowledge of attendants, do you think it is unlikely ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Have you ever had occasion to suspect an attendant of striking a patient ? A. Yes, sir ; one case on the female side I remember Avhich occur- red last summer; that is the only one I now recollect aside from the case of Mr. Hughes. Q. How often do you see the injury books ? A. We have something now w7hich takes the place of the injury books — a morning report which gives the statistics. The attendants who are to be out; the patients who are found wet, or dirty during the night; the accident which may have occurred, and the repairs that are desired upon those wards. Q. How long has that series of reports been made? A. More than a year; ever since I have been there. Q. Prior to that time, did you obtain your knowledge as to the cause of such injuries from the attendants personally, or from that book ? A. Ever since I have been there these reports have been in vogue. Q. Have you any suggestions to offer or recommendations to make which in your judgment would improve the condition of affairs at the Asylum in any respect ? A. No, sir ; I don't know that I have, except that already spoken of as to the amount of compensation, etc. Q^. How often does Dr. Gray visit the wards ? 299 A. I don't know as I could tell you. Q. How often have you seen him on the wards during the time you have been connected with the institution ? A. I do not think I can answer that question satisfactorily, be- cause he goes on alone at times, and I have seen him on the wards when I have not been with him, and on some occasions I have gone on to the wards to see him. Q. Does he make any regular and thorough visitation at fixed times ? A. I do not think so; he has gone through the whole of the house with me. Q. But he makes no visits at regular periods ? A. Not that I know of, but he is consulted daily a number of times in regard to patients, and he has a thorough knowledge of them in every way. Q. How long has Dr. Gray been absent during your connection with the Asylum 1 A. I do not know that I could tell that. Q. Would you notice his absence if he Avere away ? A. Ytes, sir; but I could not tell how many times he was absent during the summer, and he has been absent three or four times since for a short period ; there is a record kept of all that, which you could obtain ; we have a " weather book," showing the absences of the doctors, who goes away and what for, and of visitors at the Asylum— visitors of importance — such as the State Commissioner in Lunacy, etc.; that would be more reliable than any information I can give yon. Q. How often does the State Commissioner in Lunacy visit the Asylum ? A. Three or four times a year. Q. Hoav extensive an investigation does he make ? A. He visits all the wards during the night and day; he sees any patients who have complaints to make; I think his visits are very thorough. Q. Do you know whether he has suggested any changes or im- provements ? A. I do not; his last year's report I have not read thoroughly, I have glanced over it, I do not think he recommends any thing in regard to the Utica Asylum. Q. Do you know whether the State Board of Charities have made any examination of the Asylum during your term of office? A. Yes, sir; some of the members have been there. Q. Have they gone over the wards ? A. Yes, sir ; I think so. Q. Do you know any thing about the method of purchasing medi- cines for the institution ? A. No, sir. Q. How do you obtain such drugs as you may need ? A. I suppose they are purchased by the steward ; I do not know ; 300 the apothecary attends to that, he makes out a list monthly, and pre- sents it to Dr. Gray for his approA7al. Q. What is his name ? , . ^ . , A. John M. Semple ; I know very little about the financial man- agement of the institution. . . . Q. Do you ever see any of the managers there in the institution? A. Yes, sir. Q. In the office ? A. Yes, sir. Q. On the wards ? A. Yes, sir. Q. To what extent ? . A. They generally go on to the wards after their quarterly meet- ing, and sometimes in the intervening period, some of them, not all of them. Q. Is there any regular visitation of the wards by any of them 1 A. Not that I know of, except at their quarterly meetings. Q. Who comes to the Asylum most frequently among the man- agers, as you recollect ? A. I think probably I have seen the president there oftener than anybody else. Q. Upon what occasions does he come there ? A. I do not know, I see him there. Q. Does he come there on Sundays ? A. He has been there on Sundays. Q. Do you know whether he comes regularly on Sundays or not? A. No, sir; I do not think he comes regularly on Sundays; I have seen him there on Sunday, probably not more than one Sunday, but it may have been more. Q. Would you be likely to see him if he Avas there ? A. I might see him and I might not; I might be in the office or on the Avards, or anywhere else, and might not see him ; it often has happened that they have been here and I have not seen them. By Mr. Haskell : Q. You made an investigation at the time of the injury to Mr Hughes, at the request of Dr. Gray ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And conducted it on the day of the injury ? A. YTes, sir. Q. Do I understand you to say that the answers the attendants made to your inquiries were not satisfactory? A. I mean at the time of the injury, Avhen we first commenced the examination of Mr. Hughes. Q. The conversation in regard to it Avas this: I said to Mr. Weir, how did this happen, and he said, " Doctor, I don't knoAV." Q. But you made a formal examination after that ? A. Yes, after we had taken care of the patient; then I took the stenographer in and made as thorough an examination as I could. 301 Q. Of whom ? A. Mr. Weir, Mr. Brown and Mr. Bills, and one or two of the patients. Q. And what conclusion did you come to from that investigation ? A. I concluded that he had been injured in a struggle. Q. Did you attach any blame to the attendants, in your mind ? A. I cannot say that I did at that time on Saturday. Q. Did you report the result of your inquiries to Dr. Gray ? ■ A. Yes, sir. Q. And did you report to him in writing, or verbally ? A. In writing ; the stenographer transcribed the notes. Q. Did you make any other reports except the transcription of me notes ? A. I would like to correct that; I do not know whether the stenog- rapher transcribed my notes or whether he read his own notes, that is, his shorthand notes; but Dr. Gray himself made another examina- tion, which was more complete and in which some additional facts were elicited. Q. When did he make his examination ? A. A day or two afterward, I don't remember the exact date. Q. Do I understand you that you made a written report of your iudgment or conclusions from the investigation ? A. No, sir, merely the facts. Q. As you elicited them ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you give Dr. Gray your opinion as to whether or not the ttendants were to blame or not ? A. No, sir. Q. After this did you have a further conversation with either of die attendants ? A. Yres, sir, I did, with Mr. Brown. Q. Was that reduced to writing? A. No, sir ; not that I know of. Q. You did not reduce it to writing at the time ? A. No, sir. Q. Give me the conversation briefly ? A. I felt that all had not been told, and about three days after the injury, when I was pretty well satisfied as to how the case would terminate, I saw Mr. Brown and asked him if he had told all, and he said, " yes, sir, I think I have ;" I said, "in case this man should die, are you willing-that your testimony should stand as it is ? " he said, '" no; if he should die I have something to add, because I can easily clear myself;" I said, " what do you mean; was the patient struck ? " and he said, " yes, sir ; " and then I questioned him further, and learned more ; I said, " was the patient struck ? " and he said, "yes, sir ; " I said, " by Avhom ? " and he said, '• by Mr. Weir ; " I said, " did yon strike him yourself ? " and he said, '"yes, sir; I struck him in the stomach ;" I said, " what do you mean "by the stomach ? " and he pointed down here to the lower part of the abdomen;- then I said, " w7as that before he fell ? " and he s^id, " yes, sir ; " then I 302 said, " are you sure that when he fell your knees did not strike him; that you did not fall upon him with your knees ? " and he said, k( I am quite sure of it; " that is the substance of the whole conversa- tion. Q. Mr. Weir Avas the other attendant ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did he say any thing else ? A. He said nothing about anybody else striking him but himself and Weir ; that was all. Q. Did you have any conversation with Mr. Weir as to his strik- ing him ? A. No, sir. Q. When did you inform Dr. Gray, if at all, what Brown had told you ? A. Yes, sir, I did inform Dr. Gray. Q. When did you inform him ; immediately, the same day ? A. I think it was shortly afterward : this was at night, the con- versation with Brown, and the next morning, I think, or sometime during the next day, I told Dr. Gray. Q. Now, as near as you can fix it, give me the day, as near as you can, that this conversation Avith Brown occurred upon ? A. It was about the middle of the following Aveek after Mr, Hughes was injured on Saturday ; perhaps it was on Wednesday or Thursday in the middle or latter part of the next Aveek. Q. When did you make up your mind, or decide in your own mind, that the injuries to Mr. Hughes would prove fatal ? A. I knew from the beginning that the injuries Avere serious. Q. When did you come to the conclusion that they would prove fatal? Q. I don't know as I could tell you ; the case was very serious from the beginning, and he kept failing; I regarded it as a very serious case. Q. Y'ou ascertained immediately that the ribs had punctured the lungs ? A. Well, that one had; the puncture of the lungs'by one rib would have produced the same physical symptoms as if the lung were punctured by more than one rib; we discovered by feeling that there was what is known as crepitation, and at the time we were I satisfied that the lung had been penetrated. ' Q. You immediately made an examination and found that some of the ribs were broken ? "A. Yes, sir. Q. Was there any examination made after that to ascertain how many ? A. No, sir; he was immediately put under treatment, that is, his chest was strapped and surrounded by adhesive plasters, to keep the chest immovable, or nearly so. Q. Was there any examination made at the Asylum after his death to ascertain hov? many ribs Avere broken ? A. Not that I am aware of. 303 Q. So that you do not know from any personal examination of the "Sody how many ribs were broken ? A. No, sir; I made no examination except at that time; the treatment would have been the same any way, so that it was not a matter of very great importance to ascertain as to the number. Q. Describe what bruises or marks indicating any injury or violence appeared on any portion of Mr. Hughes ? A. Aside from the fractured jaw and broken ribs,there were one or two scratches on the right temple ; there was a small lump behind one of the ears ; and there was some bruises about the chest or the side of the fractured ribs. Q. The lump on the back of the head, was it a swelling? A. A very small swelling. Q. Caused by contusion ? A. Y^es, sir, I should think so. Q. Yon discovered no other marks? A. No, sir. Q. Did yon examine the face for other bruises ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And found none ? A. Found none ; he had a beard which might have hidden some little bruises. Q. Was there any examination made of the body, either before or after he died, to discover any other marks ? A. Not that I know of. Q. You made none? t A. No, sir. Q. Will you state to me whereabouts, as near as you can, where those ribs were fractured ? A. They were on the left side; they were about the seventh, eighth and ninth. Q. And the fracture occurred half way betAveen the spine and the sternum ? A. Yes, sir, right at the side, about half wTay. Q. And they were crushed in, Avere they ? A. Of course, that would be impossible ; we felt that they were broken, and there was air in the tissues, which could only have occurred by a rib having punctured the lung. Q. You say this injury could not have been caused by a single kick. Could it have been caused by several kicks? A. I don't think it could and leave no more bruises than there were upon the body ; my impression is that no kicks or blows had any thing to do with the fractured ribs, but that is only an im- pression. Q. It might have been so caused ? A. Well, to the best of my knowledge and belief I do not believe they were. Q. Might it have been so caused ? 304 A. The ribs could have been fractured by kicks, but, as I said, there would have been more external evidence of it, 1 should say. Q. How soon after the injury were the plasters put on i A. Within an hour and a half, I think. Q. And those plasters remained on ? A. Yes, sir, until the time of his death; I do not know whether they were left on after his body was removed or not. _ Q. So that you could hardly tell how much evidence of bruises would ultimately have developed there ? A. No, sir; there might have been discoloration taken place afterward. . Q. It was too short a time for very much discoloration to have taken place ? . A. Yes, sir ; but scratches would have shown ; it there had been scratches from a kick or any thing of the kind they w7ould have shown ; it takes some time for a discoloration to take place . Q. Have you authority to discharge attendants ? A No, sir ; I have no authority except to recommend their dis- charge. Q. After your investigation into the causes which led to Mr. Hughes' injury, did you recommend the discharge of those attend- ants, or either of them ? A. I don't know that I did. Q. Do you know whether you did or not make such a recom- mendation to Dr. Gray ? A. I don't think I did to him. Q. Did you to anybody else ? A. I think I did to Dr. Brush. Q. Dr. Brush had no more authority to discharge than you had? A. No, sir ; he is the first assistant superintendent. Q. You did not recommend their discharge ? A. No, sir ; Dr. Gray knew all about the case and I did not think any such recommendation called for; Dr. Gray knew all about it, and it would have been presumptuous on my part to have recom- mended any course for him to pursue; I had no doubt but what he would do what was best. Q. Is that the reason why you did not recommend the immediate discharge of those men ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you then think they should have been discharged ? A. Yres, sir ; I thought that they would and felt that they would. Q. Did you, subsequently to making this examination, at any time, recommend their discharge ? A. No, sir ; for the same reason. By Mr. Rice : Q. Do you see these injury books from time to time ? a Ho sir ; not since the daily report has taken the place of the 305 injury books ; we have a daily report and the injuries are reported in those daily reports ; the daily reports come in early in the morning. Q. Do you mean to say that no injury book is kept now? A. Yes, sir ; the injury book is kept. Q. What for? A. I don't know, unless it is to have a more permanent record Avhere the injuries can be easily got at without looking over the daily reports. Q. The daily reports are made by the supervisors ? A. Yes, sir; they make a written daily report. Q. Does that report show the injuries that happen to patients? A. Yes, sir; there is a place on the back for injuries ; Dr. Brush introduced those reports. Q. Why do they keep up the injury books ? A. I don't know, unless it is that they can the more easily get at the injuries by looking through the injury books than by hunting over 365 reports for each department, making 2,000 reports. Q. These reports are made by the supervisors ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And they detail all the injuries received by the patients ? A. Y^es, sir. Q. And that is accepted by you ordinarily as a true condition of affairs ? A. Well, theyare always investigated afterward, that is, more especially to call our attention to the fact that an injury has occurred. Q. And then do you, in each case, make an investigation as to the cause of the injury ? A. Yes, sir; I ahvays inquire as to how it occurred. Q. Of whom do you inquire — patients or attendants ? A. Of patients who may have seen it. Q. Were there any patients present at the time of the injury to Mr. Hughes ? A. Yes, eir; I think there must have been a dozen or more. Q. Were they in such a mental condition as to make their testi- mony of any value? A. I do not know ; I tried to obtain statements from some of them, but they were very contradictory. By the Chairman : Q. As to the duties of the attendants and their efficiency whether, in your judgment, it Avould be desirable to have attendants charged solely with the duty of attending to the patients, and have the menial duties about the Avards performed by another set of servants ? A. I do not think that would be any advantage. Q. Would it not relieve the attendants from much work that must necessarily keep them from their supervision over the patients ? A. Yes, sir, it probably would; it would very greatly increase the expense though to the State ? 39 U 306 Q. Would it not, in your opinion, improve the grade of attend- A. I think it probably would, if inducements enough were offered. Q. That is to say a separation of their duties ? A. XGS Sll* Q. Yrou think you would get a better grade of attendants ? A. Yes, sir ; I think there is some part of the work that could be done by persons less skilled. • By Mr. Olin : Q. State whether you know of any ribs having been broken in that Asylum besides this case of Mr. Ilughes ? A. Yes, sir; there Avas a rib broken last summer by another patient; a patient broke another patient's rib, but I did not have charge of that side of the house at that time. Q. Was it a male patient? a. Yes, sir ; his name was J. S. Q. Did you know any one named McF. being in there ? A. I know7 it by hearsay that there was such a patient. Q. He had some loose ribs, did he not ? A. I don't know about that from my own knowledge, only from the testimony of last year's investigation. By the Chairman : Q. Have you any statement concerning this investigation other than you have testified that y7ou may wdsh to volunteer? A. No ; only as to the condition of the patient Hughes ; Avhen he was admitted, I did not see him ; at the time of his admission I was aAvay preparing the medicines and taking the place of the apothe- cary ; I did not see him until after his injury, bnt the statement of his condition, as I understand it, was not full ; the history of his case Avas not a reliable and correct one ; I do not state this of my own knoAvledge, because I Avas not present, but the history Avhich Dr. Backus obtained was not a complete one. Q. In what respect was it incomplete ? A. In respect to the patient's violence. By Mr. Haskell : Q. From whom did you learn this ? A. From the testimony of the son after the injury, or the state- ments of the son. Q. And what Dr. Backus told you also ? A. I haveread the case ; yes, sir; Dr. Backus said that was all the information he got, and there was no mention of any extreme violence made by the son. Q. Did you understand from Dr. Backus that the failure to give him the information in regard to the violent tendencies of Mr. 307 Hughes at all contributed to the unfortunate results, or to the dis- position of the patient ? A. No, sir; I do not mean to say it had any direct connection with the result. Q. Does it have any connection with the disposition of the patient, as yon understand it ? A. You can readily see that it would, as just as soon as the patient's violent condition was made knoAvn he was sent to another ward. Q. What idea do you desire or intend to convey in making the statement you have just made ? A. Simply that the friends did Avrong in concealing his true con- dition. Q. And thereby rendered the subsequent injury more liable ? A. No, sir, I don't know that it did that, but if we had known, we could have been on our guard and put the attendants on their guard ; biit I do not mean to say that the injury would not have occurred even if we had known it; Dr. Backus put the patient where any of us Avould have sent him under the circumstances. Q. In sending him where ? A. On to the ninth ward. . Q. His being sent to the ninth ward, did that in any way con- tribute to his subsequent injuries, do you think ? A. No. sir; but some of the newspapers have commented upon the removal of the patient from the ninth ward to the fourth. Q. Do you understand that he would have been sent to the ninth ward any way, even if it had been disclosed to Dr. Backus the fact that he had violent tendencies? A. If the fact were knoAvn that he-had violent tendencies — homicidal tendencies— which Avere greater than his suicidal tenden- cies, he would not have been sent there. Q. Do you not understand that he would have been sent there any Avay ? A. If his true condition had been made known — Q. Can you not ansAver that "yes ""or " no " ? A. I cannot, because you will not give me a chance to explain ; if you will let me explain I will try and make it as clear as I can. Q. You either understand that he would or would not have been sent there ? A. Have I not answered the question ? Had it been known that his homicidal tendencies — Q. (Interrupting) If the fact that he had violent tendencies had been disclosed to Dr. Backus, in your judgment, he would not have been sent to the ninth Avard ? A. If it had been known that he was as violent as he was he would not have been sent to the ninth ward; but that had nothing to do with his injury; Dr. Backus did as any one would have done under the circumstances. Q. You testified that you did not make any suggestion to Dr. 308 Gray in regard to the discharge of those attendants on the score of delicacy, is that so ? A. Yes, sir, and because I knew that the proper course would be pursued by Dr. Gray. Q. Are you restrained by that same sense of delicacy m making any other suggestion in regard to the conduct of the institution ? A. No, sir. Q. Is that the only instance, since you have been there, where you have refrained from making any suggestion that you deemed wise ? A. Yes, sir; and that case was of such magnitude that I knew ■ the proper course would be pursued by the authorities. Adjourned to meet at Baggs' Hotel, Utica, to-morrow evening at 8 o'clock, p. m. 309 Utica, February 28, 1884. ■ At 7:30 this p. m., the committee went into executive session in their room "48," Baggs' Hotel, all the members being present. A question arising as to the propriety of allowing a representative of the Asylum to be present, together with one or more of the physicians, or officers of the Asylum, for the purpose of cross- examination, it was moved that a manager of the association, mem- ber of the board of managers of the Asylum, or some representative to be named by them, be alone admitted, to hear all the testimony taken, to make suggestions to the committee as to questions to be put, Avithout the presence of any of the physicians of the Asylum ; and that such representative of the Asylum shall be further permit- ted to suggest to the committee the names of Avitiiesses Avliom it is desired to call on behalf of the Asylum, for the purposes of rebutting or explaining any testimony taken by the committee, ifbeing under- stood that this motion is intended to apply to testimony other than that of the physicians, servants,^' attendants of the Asylum. Mr. Haskell — I vote no, and will briefly say that I do so be- cause I believe that, in regard to the evidence coArered by this motion, the Asylum and the public should both have the fullest possible opportunity of knowing Avhat is taking place before the committee to the end that all evidence may be given, and witnesses heard by the committee, that may throw any light upon the affairs and manage- ment of the Utica Insane Asylum, and that the doors should be open both to the Asylum authorities and the public. Mr. Olin— I am in favor of the motion ; I do not care to state my reasons now. Mr. Rice — I vote aye. Mr. Brown — I vote aye. Mr. Chairman — I vote no ; only for the reason that inasmuch as a representative of the Asylum has requested that he might have the attendance of one of the physicians to guide him, and that he desires to cross-examine witnesses ; I think the request is not unreasonable and should be granted. I am in favor, as a matter of justice to the Asylum, however, that the investigation should be continued Avith- out the presence of the public, so that the testimony, when concluded, may go before the public as a whole at one time. ■ Motion carried. It was also further moved that inasmuch as the testimony has heretofore been taken privately, that it is the judgment of the com- mittee that it would be fairer to both the public and the Asylum that it should continue to be so taken and go to the public with the report of the committee. Mr. Haskell — I vote no, for the reasons stated to the other mo- tion, and because I believe that the reason for closed doors ceases the moment we commence to take other testimony than that of the officers of the Asylum. Messrs. Olin, Rice, and Brown, and Mr. Chairman, voted aye, and the motion was carried. 310 n JOHN CHARLES HUGHES, Sworn and examined, testified as follows: By Mr. Haskell : Q. Where do you reside ? A. Nelson, Madison county. Q. And you are a son of Evan D. Hughes wdio met his death recently from injuries received at Utica Insane Asylum ? A. Yes, sir. Q. State your age ? A. Twenty-four years. Q. State Avhat your father's age was ? A. Fifty-four. Q. Did you reside with your father, and he with you? Q. Yes, sir. Q. State how long before he was brought to the Asylum, it was that you discovered, or that the family discovered, any thing the mat- ter with his mind ? A. On Monday previous to the Friday that he was brought here to Utica. Q. You may state briefly your father's condition from the Thurs- day until you started with him for the Asylum ? A. Six o'clock Monday evening we discovered something Avas the matter, that Avas the first time that we found out that any thing Avas Avrong ; at that time in the house he said that some thing was going to happen before the morning. I asked him what; he said that he was going to die, and on Tuesday, or during that night, he was rest- less and did not sleep any, and kept talking with mother all night. Tuesday afternoon he was more violent and cross, and he attempted to leave the house. Tuesday night we had Avatchers in the night; they Avere watching father in the house. Q. Who were they, and how many of them ? A. There was one of the neighbors. Q. Who was that ? A. David H. Howell. Q. How did he pass the night ? A. He was quiet during the night, but did not sleep much, if he did any. Q. Had you up to this time had a physician ? ' A. On Tuesday I went down to Morrisville to consult with the doctor. Q. When did the doctor come, if he came at all? A. The doctor came there on Thursday. Q. Previous to this, your father had had an attack of insanity; state about how long before? A. It was in the year 1878. Q. And he was sent away to the Utica Insane Asylum? 311 A. Yes, sir. Q. State how long ?. A. He was brought here on the 25th of July, and was taken away the 25th day of October. Q. Was lie discharged as cured ? A. Yres, sir. Q. Noav that brings yon down to Wednesday morning ; state in regard to Wednesday. A. On Wednesday I went to Cazenovia. Q. You may state who composed your family at this time. A. Of the family there was my mother, myself, and father; on Wednesday I went after my brother; he was at school at Cazenovia; during Wednesday Ave had one of our neighbors, a son of Mr. Howell's; he came there and I think father showed signs of violence on Wednesday, and mother was very much frightened at that, and from that hour Ave had two persons in the house with father. Q. From Wednesday evening ? A. Yes, sir; two watchers through Wednesday night. Q. Who Avere the two watchers that you had on Wednesday night ? A. I don't know that I#can tell, but they were — they were neighbors. Q. Now state as to Thursday. A. On Thursday there were four men in the house ; on Wednes- day night we had four watchers there. Q. Who were they ? A. They Avere our neighbors ; I cannot recollect their names. Q. You say that the doctor came there on Thursday ? A. Yes, sir ; and he gave father some chloral. Q. When were the papers made out for sending your father back to the Asylum ? A. They were made out on Friday evening. Q. Did the doctor bring them to you ? A. The doctor came up there ; he had seen father on Monday ; he said that from what he had noticed of him that there was sufficient evidence to him that he was not right. Q. Then your father was seen on Monday by Dr. Mead ? A. Yes; sir. Q. Did Dr. Chase bring you the papers ? A. No, sir ; he never brought any papers. Q. When did you make application for the papers to send your father to the Asylum? A. I think with Dr. Chase on Tuesday, he said that a patient who had been in the Asylum, that it Avas not likely that he would get well without going through the same treatment. Q. So the arrangement Avas made on Tuesday for sending him to the Asylum ? A. Yes, sir. Q. When did you start to bring your father to the Asylum ? 312 A. Dr. Chase gave me the letter to show that the papers would be sent here all right; they were not ready and they were not ^sent there and I did not bring them with me ; he gave me that order on Friday morning. . Q. Give us a brief description of your father's condition Thurs- day and Thursday night ? A. On Thursday night I think he was, I don't know whether he was violent that night or not ; I know that Dr. Chase gave him some chloral, I cannot remember positively whether he was under the effects of it or not, but on Friday he w7as and was quiet. Q. When was the time your father started to go out of the house and they stopped him ? A. That was either on Wednesday night or Thursday night. Q. Is that the time that he got up out of the bed ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Describe that incident ? A. I was not in the room at the time, I was only told of that. Q. Who were you told by ? A. By one of the watchers ; I do not recollect who told me; I was told by one or all of them at different times. Q. The matter was spoken about by th#m ? A. Yres, sir. Q. What information was it you had, and what did they tell you? A. They told me that father was lying on the bed, and that he had been trying to get up, and that two of them Avent one on each side of him, that is, one on each side of the bed and held father by the arm, one had hold of each arm, then father all of a sudden closed his eyes and laid down on the side of the bed, and after he closed his eyes long enough to deceive them he jumped right up and got away from them and got out of the bedroom, and if it had not been for those two men in the other room he would have got out of the house; they grabbed him and the tAvo men from the bedroni came in, and then the four men carried him back to bed. Q. When was it he talked about the axe, or something of that kind? A. That was on Wednesday ; he said : " Y^ou have kept the axe, and the razor, and knives, and every thing;" says he: "If Iliad them, I would cut myself." That was on Wednesday, I think. Q. Do you recollect that your father was reasonably quiet after the doctor gave him medicine on Thursday and during Thursday night ? A. I cannot be positive whether he Avas quiet or not; I Avas not with him either of those nights. Q. Friday morning you started to take your father to the Utica Insane Asylum ? A. Yes, sir; I Avas along Avith father, and went with him to the Asylum, and two of our neighbors went with me. Q. Who were they ? A. D. H. Howell and A. N. Hickox. 313 Q. You stopped at Morrisville and got an order from Dr. Chase? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did he then see your father ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did he give him any medicine of any kind then ? A. No, sir. Q. When was the last time your father took medicine before starting to the Asylum ? A. 1 think it Avas on Friday morning; I think they gave him medicine ; I did not give him any myself. Q. You understood it to be chloral ; the same as Dr. Chase gave to him on Thursday ? A. Yres, sir ; it was most night when Dr. Chase came to our house on Thursday; it was late in the afternoon. Q. How did you come aAvay ? A. With the train, from Bootyille. Q. And you drove from your house in Nelson to Boutville? A. Yes, sir. Q. About hoAV many miles is that ? A. It is four miles from our house to Morrisville and it is about nine miles from there to Boutville. Q. You got y7our father here and took him to the Asylum ? A. Y"es, sir. Q. Three of you ? A. Yes,, sir. Q. After you got to the Asylum who did you see ? A. There Avas a young man who came and opened the door and admitted us into the office, and then Dr. Backus came in. Q. Give me your conversation with Dr. Backus and carefully re- late AA7hat took place betAveen you and Dr. Backus ; give all that was said between you ? A. In the first place Dr. Backus entered father's name as a patient, taking his age and all that they do take in this book that they make the entries in ; then Dr. Backus began to question me as to what father's actions were before w7e brought him here, and at the same time says he, " Ave had better step into the other room, it may not be very pleasant for your father here." Q. Who Avas present at that time? A. The stenographer, he was in the room, and Mr. Hickox and Mr. Howell and father, that was in the first room, we were all to- gether there. Q. And Dr. Backus and yourself ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you at this time give Doctor Backus the order from Dr. Chase ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And Dr. Backus went into another room ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Alone? 40 U 314 A iGS sir Q. Now go on and state what occurred between you and Dr. Backus, giving his questions and your answers as nearly as you can recollect them ? A. Dr. Backus asked me how long father had been so, and how long it was since I noticed any thing out of the way. I told him since Monday. He asked me how he acted and Avhat he had done, and I told him, as near as I could remember, as I have told you. Q. State wdiat you do recollect that you told him ? A. I told him that father was violent and I told him that he had tried to leave the house; I told him that he had said that if he had an axe or a knife, or a razor, that he would cut himself, and Dr. Backus asked me if he tried to hurt others, and I told him that he was trying to kick at others avIio had tried to hold him, and that he had tried to strike, and that when they held his hands and feet that he would spit at them. Doctor Backus said he was very sorry to hear that, and that they would have to put him on the ward with suicides, and watch him. I told Dr. Backus that we Avere advised by Dr. Chase to bring him there that day, as he was under the effects of chloral because if we had waited long, the medicine would lose its effect and he would become more violent, and I do not re- member any more. Yes, I do. I told Dr. Backus that I thought father had been ill-treated some or misused when he was here the other time, and that he remembered a great many things that had happened. Dr. Backus moved up to me at that, nearer in his chair, and said to me : " What do they remember? I would like to hear what patients do say after they go away from here." I can- not give the words just as they came, but that is as near as I can give them, it has passed off from my mind. I never told Dr. Backus what father did say after he came home the first time. .^r Q. Why did you- not tell him 1 A. It came to my mind that Dr. Backus Avas very anxious to hear about that, and I thought it might hurt father in one sense,Jso I stopped and did not say any more. Q. State what had occurred between your father and you, if any thing, in regard to that very subject ? A. Of his ill-treatment the first time ? Q. Yes; state what he said in regard to the Asylum, if he said any thing about it ? A. One thing he said was this: " 1 would much rather die than be compelled to go back to that institution and suffer what I have suffered;" and he said " I have not told you all; " says he " what I have been through, and if I had told you,'you would be surprised." Q. What else did he tell, if airy thing ' . A. He told me at one time, " they used to put me in the bath- tub and hold me there until I Avould think that I would be 'drownded ;'" he told me that at one time. Q. That is, held his head under the water ? 315 A. He didn't say held his head under the water, but, "held me there until I thought I Avould be ' drownded.' " Q. What else did he say, if any thing ? A. I don't remember that he said any thing else what had hap- pened, only that he referred to that matter. Q. What did he say, if any thing, about not giving you more particulars ? A. He said, " I don't think it is best," says he, " to tell many things for fear it might get out of the family," and he thought if it got out of the family that it might get back to the institution ; he said if it should get out of the.family it might get back to the in- stitution, and if I am ever taken back there, they may revenge on me," he says, and that was his excuse for not telling more. Q. State as to whether that Avas the reason you did not go into more particulars with Dr. Backus, that your father had made that « suggestion to you ? A. Yes, sir, it Avas ; it came into my mind what father had said, and I noticed that Dr. Backus was very anxious to hear, and so I dropped the thing. Q. That is it came into your mind Avhat your father had said ? A. Yfes, sir, that they would hear in the institution that he had said he had been maltreated there. Q. And that it would make a difference in his treatment if he ever went back ? A. Yes, sir. Q. State Avhy yon allowed your father to go back to the institu- tion after hearing this complaint in that respect ? A. In the first place I consulted Dr. Chase, and he said patients after they had been in the institution, that there Avas no hopes for their recovery without their going through as they had been through, and our faith was such in the institution that he had been cured in so short a time the other time that Ave would almost rather that he should go through some things and be cured than to keep him at home, and feel that he would be out of his mind ahvays. Q. Have you now given all that passed between you and Dr. Backus at that time ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Was the stenographer present, or any other person present, during this interview between you and Dr. Backus ? A. No, sir. Q. You may state whether any thing was said between Dr. Backus and yourself as to your father having been in the institution preA7i- ously — his having been there before ? A. There Avas no more said than I have stated in the evidence that I have given here. Q. Did you tell Dr. Backus, or did Dr. Backus say any thing about your father having been in the institution before ? A. Yes, sir; in this first office where he entered father's name he asked if he had been in there before, and I told him, and he Avent and looked in the old book where his name was entered before. 316 Q. What was said about your father having been in the institu- tion before; what took place before you and Dr. Backus went into the little room, except so far as you have stated k A. He did not ask me any questions, but he opened the book at the page where it was recorded when father was m before —the old book that had the entry in when father was there before. Q. Was that before you went into the little room i A. It was before we went in by ourselves. Q. Did he take this book into the room ? A. No, sir, he did not take any thing into the room. Q. Did he have any paper with him, and did he make any minutes of your conversation while in the little room ? A. He began to, but he left it off. Q. You may state as fully as you can Avhat yon told Dr. backus; I call your attention particularly to what you told him in regard to your father's being violent at all ? A. I told hin/that father was violent at home; that we were afraid, and afraid ihat something A\ould happen to him, and that he might injure others; and for his safety and our safety Ave made up our minds to bring him there. Q. Did you mention to him the incident of his lying on "the bed, and getting away from the two men ? A. Yes, sir. Q. State about that, and Avhat you told him in regard to that ? A. I told him that father was violent, trying to get aAvay, and about his lying still and closing his eyes to deceive those with him. Q. Did you tell how many Avere with him ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What about that ? A. I told Dr. Backus there were two men in the room — one each side of him — having hold of father, and that they had hold of father, and that then he closed his eyes to deceive them, and all of a sudden that he jumped up away from them, and out of bed and out of the room, and these other two men grabbed hold of him ; then the tAvo men in the bedroom took hold of him, and the four men took him back into the room. Q. Did you state to Dr. Backus any thing about the causes that you thought led to your father's insanity ? A. Y es, sir. Q. In this little room ? A. Yes, sir; by ourselves. Q. State what you told in regard to that? A. Dr. Backus asked me what was the cause of this insanity; I told him it Avas business trouble; I told him w7e had had a lawsuit, and that Ave Avere beat, and that Ave persuaded father to settle, rather than carry it up, and then it went into the church, and this other man took the advantage of settling the law suit, and told father that he had a right to put him into State's prison for sAvcaring falsely, f°r committing perjury, and father Avas so affected by that, that he 317 thought they were trying to break his word, andjhe took it so badly that it worried him considerably. Q. What did you tell Dr. Backus about "taking it into the church"? A. I told* him what I stated to you just now. Q. Have you stated to us now all that yon told him about taking it into the church ? A. Yes, sir. Q. After having this conversation with Dr. Backus, what was done? A. I asked Dr. Backus if he would call Mr. J. R. Jones to take father on to the Avard. Q. You went back Avhere your father was after you had this conver- sation about your father Avith Dr. Backus — did you and Dr. Backus go back into the room where your father was? A. I don't know wdiether we went back, but father and our neigh- bors came into the room Avhere Ave Avere, and supervisor Jones came in, I think, and asked father to go with him, and father refused to go ; finally Mr. J. R. Jones came in. (). State whether he was a man that you knew ? A. Y7es, sir; he was one of our neighbors. Q. You say J. R. Jones came in ? A. Yes, sir; and father was going out of the room ; Dr. Gray came in and shook hands with father; and Dr. Gray asked me, " Iioav long has your father been in this condition ?" says I, " since last Monday." "" Is that all," says he ? " yes, says I." "Well," says he, " I am glad of it." " Do you think that he will be cured," says I ? " why, we cannot tell, " says Dr. Gray ; " his age is a little against him ;" that was all that was said, and father was taken out i of my sight, and I left the institution with these twTo men. Q. Youi father Avent willingly with J. R. Jones ? A. Yes, sir. Q. State, if you will, of your father's height, general build, and ' weight, if you can. A. I think he was" a man about five feet nine in height, and in weight, about one hundred and sixty pounds; Q. State what you next heard about your father ? A. The next we heard was on the following Monday; we had a dispatch from Morrisville; it came from the Asylum to Morrisville and was sent to us from there. Q. And it was sent from Morrisville to your place? A. Yes, sir; and the dispatch read: "Your father very low; come at once ;" and I went and came to Morrisville with Mr. B.; and he brought up the dispatch. Q. Who was the dispatch signed by? A. I forget; I could not tell who signed the dispatch. Q. Hoav did you knoAv it was from the Asylum? A. It had " State Lunatic Asylum " on it. Q. That is Avhere it Avas dated ? A. Yes, sir. Q. This, yon say, was on Monday ? A. Yes, sir. 31$ Q. When did you get to Utica ? A. I think I arrived at the Asylum about 6:30 p. m. Q. Where did you find your father ? A. I was called into Dr.' Gray's office before I saw father. Q. State if you had any conversation with Dr. Gray T A. Yes, sir. Q. Give us the conversation with Dr. Gray ? A. Dr. Gray told me what father's injuries were. " Q. Try and give us, as near as you can, Dr. Gray's language? A. Dr. Gray talked so long and went around so much that it would be very difficult for me to tell what he did say ; he said so much that I was very anxious to come to the matter about my father, which he did not seem to want to do. By Mr. Rice : Q. State it as near as you can ? A. He said that father and the attendants had had a scuffle and, from what he could find, they fell, to the floor ; one or two patients he said, and making in all four, and that the four fell to the floor, and in this fall Dr. Gray, from what he could learn, he said father received his injuries, but how he could not tell ; that he had exam- ined the attendants and patients and had no satisfaction ; he said his jaw was fractured, and that there was three of his ribs fractured; I asked if the injuries were fatal, and he said he could not tell at the time ; and the rest I don't think would amount to any thing that Ik said. Q. Tell any thing you recollect ? A. I don't recollect any thing else; one of the attendants came in and escorted me to a room that father was in. Q. Did he tell you that one or more of the fractured ribs had punctured the lungs ? A. No, sir, he never said they Avere broken, anymore than that they were fractured. Q. And there was ngthing said about your father's lungs? A. No, sir. Q. Or that one or more of the ribs had punctured the lungs ? A. No, sir. Q. You say that then an attendant came in and you were taken to your father's bedside ? A. Yes, sir. Q. You may state what occurred at the bedside ? ^ A. Father was lying back in bed, and his mouth was open, and his lower jaw turned to one side, and his lower lip was drawn over his teeth ; I could not see ; I did not notice that the jaw had been fractured, because I could not see where the fracture had taken place; father, he did not notice me at the time ; he was talking; seemed to be talking most of the time. Q. Could you understand what your father said ? A. Y"es, sir ; but he said nothing rational. Q. What did he say ? A. I did not pay any attention to what he did say, that is to re- member it j it was not rational talk. 319 Q. Was he talking in English or Welsh ? A. Sometimes in English, sometimes in Welsh. Q. Do you understand Welsh ? A. Yes, sir ; I do. Q. Did you try to talk with your father ? A. Yes, sir. Q. With what success ? A. I asked him if he was hurt first, and he said yes ; I asked him how, and he said he did not know7; then I asked him if he Avas thrown down, and he said yes ; I did not ask him any more questions then. Q. Did he know you ? A. He did not seem to know me at the time ; Dr. Backus came in durino; the evening and said : Mr. Hughes, do voii knoAV who this young man is, and father took my hand at that time and said, yes, this is Johnnie's hand. Q. So that he did know you were there ? A. YTes, sir ; he must have known from what he said. Q. Was that the first time that yon discovered that he knew you were present? A. Y'es, sir. Q. Were you, at any time, able to have any conversation with your father in regard to how the injury happened ? A. No, sir ; nothing further than that. Q. And Avas there any other evidence after that that led you to believe that your father knew you were present? A. No, sir ; not that I know of. Q. Did you'stay in the Asylum until your father died ? A. I went home on Thursday, in the morning, and returned in the evening ; with that exception I was there about the Asylum and slept in the Asylum. Q. And you were with your father as much as possible? A. Y^es, sir; Tuesday morning he opened his mouth a little wider, and his lip came back, and I could see his teeth, and at that time I put my finger on his lip and pushed it down a little, and I saAV his jaw was broken, and the bone Avas separted. I should think from the iips so that any one could put their finger down upon the bone. Q. Was the flesh separated ; describe what you mean by your last answer ? A. What I mean is that the teeth were all there, but the bone and the teeth were separated, so that, taking from the top of the teeth doAvn, you could put your finger right in there. Q. Describe ay hat part of the jaAV that Avas? A. It Avas here (indicating); it was a little to the right of the center. Q. Hoav far from the center of the jaw Avas it ? . A. About tAvo teeth from the center ; I could not be certain about the matter, but it was one or two teeth from the center ; I should not think it would be more than two teeth. 320 Q. When did your father die ? A. He died at 8:40 o'clock on Friday evening, February the first. Q. What other conversations did you have with Dr. Gray or any of the physicians in regard to the matter of your father's injuries, than what you have stated you had with Dr. Gray on the first night J A. On Friday evening at seven o'clock I had a conversation with Dr. Gray. Q. Go on and state that conversation ? A. I had found out for certain that father would die soon ; about tour o'clock he changed. Q. Hoav did you find that out ? A. By the doctors that had been up there ; I think Dr. Gray had been up to see him about three or four o'clock, and he said in his room, it is just as I expected, yon can see the veins on his forehead; and AA7e kneAv from that that the change was for the worse; I was called into Dr. Gray's office at seven o'clock in the evening; I asked him Iioav long patients in that condition lived ; he said he had seen them live six, twelve, forty-eight, and even seventy-two hours; I said: Do you think father Avill die soon, says I, right away ? Well, no, says he, I don't knoAV that he wrill die very soon, says he, we may look for a change about two o'clock in the morning, or four o'clock; doctor, says I, are you certain there are only7 three ribs broken ; well, says he, I cannot be certain about that, but we will have an examina- tion that will give you satisfaction. Q. What time did your father die, with reference to the time of this talk ? A. This was about seven o'clock in the evening; I stayed there with Dr. Gray until 9:30, and father died at 8:40, Ithink it was. Q. Is that all the conversation that took place betAveen you and Dr. Gray at seven o'clock ? A. Yes, sir; and at eleven o'clock we had another conversation. Q. Now give the conversation that took place at eleven o'clock. A. Dr. Gray asked me if I thought it was best to have an inquest, and before I could answer the question he said he would call the coroner in the morning and see what was best to be done. Q. This conversation at eleven o'clock, was that after your father died that night ? A. Yes, sir; and the conversation in regard to father, I think we began to talk about the undertaker and taking the remains home ; I told Dr. Gray that I wanted to leave as soon as possible in the morn- ing with the remains, as it was Saturday, so as to be home before night for them to have an inquest ; says Dr. Gray we will have it early in the morning and have it so that you can leave to-morrow, and with regard to the undertaker, he said, he Avould advise me to go to Whitney's; at that time I was with Dr. Gray ; and I went with Dr. Brush doAvn.to Whitney's undertaking rooms. Q. That night? A. Y"es, sir; and there was nothing more said. 321 Q. When was the first time that Dr. Gray told you he did not think your father would recover ? A. He told me on Monday evening, when I first saw him, that if he was a sane man that the injuries he had received Avould be noth- ing ; that he would be willing —that there would not have been any doubt about it whatever. Q. About what ? A. About his injuries as to their being fatal or not; he said that he was an insane person, had acute mania, a disease which of itself was liable to kill a person, and in addition to that he had these in- juries— these fractured ribs ; that he might have infusion of blood on the brain or to the brain which Avould cause his death. Q. Do you mean to say that the doctor told you that if your father had been a sane man, there would be no doubt about his re- covery ? A. Yes, sir; that there was no doubt he would recover. Q. Is that all that you recollect in regard to the Monday evening conversation, besides Avhat you have already given us*? A. I think that is all. Q. What other talk that Monday evening and before Friday even- ing did you have with Dr. Gray about your father's injuries? A. Not any. Q. Did you have any talk at the bedside of your father with Dr. Gray about your father's injuries ? A. I asked him how father Avas, and he said : " your father is a very sick man; " several times he said that to me. Q. What talk did you have with Dr. Gray in regard to the fracture of your father's jaAv ? A. Friday evening at seven o'clock I did. Q. Now state that conversation and tell us Avhat Dr. Gray said ? A. I said to Dr. Gray, "there is a great mystery about father hav- ing his jaAv fractured ; how could it have happened ? " " well," said he, "it could have happened in many ways, he might have fallen against "a chair, or even against a door, or he mighthaATe had a blow ;" says I, " if he had fallen against a-chair or a door, or had a blow there would naturally have been a bruise on the outside to indicate it, and I have not seen any such bruise ; "well," says he," if he had received a blow the bruise would naturally be on the other side; " I said, " here there is no bruise on the opposite side ; " Dr. Gray spoke up and says: " did you notice that there was a bruise on his left temple, here; " I said "yes; " well, he might have struck there," says he; I said "he would not be very apt to fracture his jaw by having a oIoav on the temple ;" I felt as though Dr. Gray was at that time trying to get me off Avith simply no explanation at all. Q. If there was any thing more said at that time about your father's injuries please state Avhat it Avas ? 41 U 322 A. Dr. Gray tried to explain to me how he might have had his ribs broken by an attendant holding him in a chair. Q. Go on and state what he said, and give us all that he said, that is what we want to know, and give us his language as near as you can ? A. He said that father sat in a chair with arms to it, and the attendant had to hold him there, and he might have got down one side and in some way hurt his ribs, that he might have gotten down in this way (indicating) ; I do not knoAV as I remember any thing else that w7as said at that time. Q. Did Dr. Gray say any thing at that time as to whether or not it might have been caused by an attendant falling on to your father? A. Yes, sir, I think he did ; I think he said that they might have gone down, and one have fallen on to the top of the other, that they might have fallen down on to the floor with father the lowest^ aDd the attendant on top, and that the fracture might have been caused in that way. Q. Do you recollect any thing more that Dr. Gray said to you as to the manner in which he thought your father had received his in- juries ? • A. I do not recall any thing further now. Q. Do you think you have now given all that Dr. Gray said to you about your father's injuries at any time, and at all the conversations you had with him ? A. I think I have. Q. Did you have any talk with Dr. Backus as to how your father got hurt ? A. No, sir; I did not have any talk with Dr. Backus about the matter. Q. Did you have any conversation about the matter with either Dr. Pilgrim or Dr. Brush ? A. No, sir, I did not. Q. Did you yourself make any inquiries of either of the attend- ants as to how your father .got hurt ? A. No, sir ; I did not see either of the attendants off from the ward where father Avas hurt. Q. What was the first you ever saw of either Mr. Weir, Bills or Brown ? A. In Baggs' hotel last Saturday. Q. The other day when you Avere here before us ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Then, as I understand you, all the talk of any account that yon had with any person about your father's injuries, and how he received them, was with Dr. Gray ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did Dr. Gray at any time tell you that the attendants, oi either of them, had confessed to striking your father ? A. No, sir. 323 Q. Did you make any inquiries of him as to whether they had struck your father any blows ? A. No, sir; I don't think I did. Q. And you now think that you have given us all that Dr. Gray said ? . A. I think I have. Q. Did Dr. Gray tell you, either before or after your father died, in regard to the ribs having punctured the lung? A. He did not. Q. Did any of the physicians tell you that ? A. No, sir. Q. You may state as to whether there was an occurrence in regard to your father spitting blood ; state whether' or not there was any such tiling as that ? A. Yes; Monday evening or Tuesday evening after I went there, Dr. Pilgrim and Dr. Backus Avere in the.room examining father, and he AA'as trying to throw up some matter, and after making many efforts he succeeded in getting something into his mouth from his throat; and it seemed to me to come from his stomach or down in his lungs; and the doctor told him to spit into the toAvel, and just as the towel was passed back to the doctor I saw it, and that matter on that towel was dark, thick blood, and Dr. Pilgrim, as I Avas looking at it, he kind of threw the toAvel over, and I did not see any more of it. Q. Did the physicians look at it and have any talk over the char- acter of Avhat your father had spit up from his mouth ? A. No, sir, not in that room ; I don't know what they did away from there ; they talked very little in my hearing about the case. Q. Was any thing said by you to them about the blood ? A. YTes, sir. Q. State what it was ? A. I told them that I believed father Avas injured very much inside from what he was throwing up; Oh! that comes from his mouth says the doctor — from his mouth. Q. Did you make any objection to there being an inquest held upon the body of your father ? A. I did not. Q. Have you told us all that Avas said about taking your father's body home ? A. I think I have. Q. What, if any, objections were made to your taking the body home ? A. Dr. Gray told me that — in the first place I asked Dr. Gray if I could have the remains to go with on the 8:30 train in the morning on the Central; he said that would be too soon, on account of cooling the body gradually; it ahvays took so long a time for the remains to cool gradually, and that the time Avas too short. Q. When did you take the body aAvay from Utica ? 324 A. I think I left very early in the morning of Saturday, about two or three o'clock in the morning. Q. Were you present at the inquest ? A. I Avas present on Saturday, at the beginning of the inquest; after that time I was sick and unable to attend. Q. State what was done when you were there ? A. They told me that the inquest was to begin at twelve o'clock, but they began it sooner, and by the time I got in there Dr. Backus was almost through giving his testimony. Q. Were you there when the jury viewed your father's remains? A. No, sir; they had done that'; 1 went to the Asylum, and I saw Dr. Brush ; I asked him if they had begun the inquest; he said yes, and he told me to wait a few7 moments. Q. Did Dr. Gray say to yon : Mr. Hughes, Ave have been very frank Avith you and concealed nothing, and notified you as soon as possible of the injury, and we Avant equal frankness from you ? Did he tell you that, or that in substance, on Friday evening ? A. He told me the beginning of that, but not the last. Q. What did he tell you ; please state ? A. He told me that they had been frank and concealed nothing; they wanted that Ave should know,the whole of the matter from be- ginning to the end. Q. Did you say that you did not blame the doctors, but did blame the attendants? A. I do not know whether I said that or not — to Dr. Gray do you mean ? . Q. Yes; on this Friday evening after your father's death ? A. I do not remember telling him that; I might have said that and I might not; I do not remember. Q. Did Dr. Gray tell you they found the condition of your father very different from what you first stated in regard to his being violent ? A. I do not remember that he said any thing to that effect. Q. Did he tell you that you had not told Dr. Backus the true condition of your father? A. He did not ; I am quite positive he did not say any thing like that to me. Q. Was there any conversation between you and Dr. Gray this Friday evening in regard to w7hat you told Dr. Backus in regard to the condition of your father ? A. I do not remember of any. Q. Can you say whether Dr. Gray at that time found fault with you for not having told Dr. Backus that your father was violent \ A. I think Dr. Gray found no fault about that; he never mentioned the matter to me. Q. Then you say that nothing was said between you and Dr. Gray on this Friday evening in regard to this statement by you about your father at the time you brought him to the asylum ?" * A. I did not. 325 Q. I also understand you to say that when you left the Asylum with your father's remains at three o'clock that you then knew nothing of the fact that the ribs had punctured the lungs? A. The inquest so disclosed it, but I Avent to one of the jurors after it was adjourned; says I, do you ascertain to know what the injuries are; he said, no, sir; w7e did not; we only viewed the re- mains. Q. Whether you had been informed by Dr. Gray or any person connected Avith the institution that the broken ribs, or any one of them, had punctured your father's lungs? A. No, sir; no one ever mentioned that matter to me. Q. State what was done Avith the body when you got it home ? A. It was taken into the house, and on Saturday night 1 told our neighbors Iioav the inquest had been begun here at Utica and how the doctors said the injuries Avere ; what they said about them, and that Dr. Gray said three of the ribs Avere fractured, and that Dr. Backus gave in his evidence that two or more had been fractured, but he did not know Iioav many; and they said that they should see the coroner on Sunday morning, and Mr. A. N. Hickox went to see the coroner on Monday morning — Coroner Ransom. Q. When you saAV your father on Monday, whether or not you observed any marks upon his head, and if so, state what you noticed in that respect ? A. Yes, sir; I first noticed that over his left temple, or on the bone here — the cheek bone — there was a large black and blue bruise, and a large one on his forehead here; on the top of his head there were three or four scratches, the skin had not been broken, but it seemed to have been bruised; the scratch was severe enough to turn the color of the skin without cutting it; it was bald Avhere this was; father Avas bald on that side, Avhere the scratches were. Q. What do you mean by " scratches" ? A. I have not just the right word, I suppose ; I mean that it had been bruised, like, on his head, and that there were long marks on his scalp, and the marks were of such character that the skin was turned in color. Q. How many of those marks were there ? A. Three or four. Q. Did you notice any other marks ? A. Yes, sir; on his right leg there was a black and blue spot. Q. Whereabouts on his leg ? A. Between his knee and ankle. Q. When did you notice this mark on his leg ? A. I think I noticed that either on Tuesday or Wednesday. Q. Here at the Asylum ? A. Yres, sir. Q. Did you notice any marks of violence on the back of your father's head ? A. No, sir; I never examined the back of his head ; he laid on 326 his back from the moment I saw him until I left him, and until he died. Q. State briefly what occurred in our county (Madison) now i A. The coroner came on Monday forenoon ; Dr. Chase also came. Q. Who sent for Dr. Chase ? A. Some of the neighbors. Q. State what was done ; did they have an inquest ? A. No, sir ; not then. Q. Did they summon a jury ? A. No, sir; not on Monday. Q. Did Dr. Chase then make an examination of your father s in- juries ? A. No, sir ; not on Monday ; they made an arrangement to have an investigation on Tuesday morning, before the funeral; they were to meet in our house on'Tuesday morning before the funeral, at eight o'clock ; they impaneled a jury; they notified a certain num- ber of men the day before to be there at that time. Q. Did the doctors make a, post mortem examination ? A. Drs. Chase and Ransom. Q. Whether, after the making of this examination, you were in- formed that your father's lungs had been penetrated by these broken ribs ? A. Yes, sir ; I was informed by Dr. Chase. Q. Was that the first information that you had received of that fact? A. It was; Dr. Chase told me that the rib had punctured the lung, and that that w7as sufficient cause for his death ; he also told me that three of the large ribs had been broken and all the small ones on the left side. I Avas also told that on his back, from his shoulder blade down, he Avas bruised and his skin was discolored. Q. After the doctors had made an examination and the jury had viewed your father's remains, was any evidence taken ? A. I could not tell you ; I was sick in bed at that time. Q. And the funeral took place on Tuesday as you have stated? A. Yes, sir. Q. Is there any thing else about this matter that you desire to state to the committee ? A. Do you mean about when father was first in the Asylum ? Q. You stated that in July, 1878, your father was sent to the Asylum ? A. Yes, sir. Q. State briefly in regard to his form of insanity at that time? A. He was very violent at that time as he was this, something of the very same nature, and very much the same thing brought it on, a little trouble and excitement at home, and he worried about it until he became insane and violent, so violent that we could not control him at home any more than we could this time, and so Ave took him there; after he was taken there I would write letters to Dr. Gray, and the first letter from Dr. Gray stated that father was a very sick and feeble man. 327 Q. That was the first time ? A. Yres, sir, the first time he was in the Asylum ; this is the first letter I received, on the 23d July ; I wrote to him asking if Ave could come and see father, and he advised against any visit ; I wrote him again and he still advised against any visit; and the third time I received a letter I do not know whether Dr. Gray authorized the writing of it, but it said in substance : " Your father a very sick and feeble man, and advise against a visit at this time." That is the substance of it. On August 30th, Dr. Gray advised against a visit; on August, father Avrites a letter home; he Avas taken there the 15th July, and on the 25th August, he wrote a letter; he says in this letter, substantially : " It is difficult to write; I have many things to tell you ;" he does not say any thing about his treatment, but he told me afterward that the letters Avere examined before they went out, and he was not allowed to put any thing in about how he was treated ; " I Avould give all I have for coming home," he says in that letter; he was there three months at that time ; Ave had a friend here in the city of Utica, Robert R. Jones, a former resident of Nelson; Ave requested him to call at the Asylum and see father and see how he AA7as doing, and on September 12th, Mr. Jones writes us a letter and tells us that he has been to the Asylum and was not permitted to see father; and the excuse made to him was that we had been there a day or tAvo before that. Q, When did you first see your father, Avhen he was there the first time ? A. About the last of July. Q. Did you go alone at that time, the last of July, to see your father ? A. Yes, sir ;■ mother and I Avent; Mr. Jones says in his letter, "I have not seen your father once; I called twice ; the excuses were the last time, that the doctor Avas too busy to talk Avith me, and he said that he had \rery hard work not to feel hard against the doctor, since he had made such an effort to see father, and after the doctor had turned him off Avith so little notice." The letter is in Welsh. September 12, of that year, father A\Trites: "It is a very strange place in this institution." Previous to October 10, he Avrites a letter and says: " My voice is better to-day and yesterday." Something happened to his voice in the institution, and after he Avas there he was never able to speak as plain as he did before he went into the Asylum ; Ave questioned him many times about it, and he told us about how they forced this tube down his throat, into his stomach, with food; they locked him in a room he said, and Avould not give him any medicine, and he would be kept in the room quite a long time, and he would holler and scream in there; he said he could remember how he was hollering ; Avhen he came to himself he could remember it; he said he thought, too, that he hurt his voice a good deal in that institution by calling and yelling so much ; father found fault with them in not quieting him at the time, so that he would not hurt his voice; he thought also that his voice was hurt by the tube. In another letter he says : " Keep my letters if you are so brutal as \ 328 to keep me here long," and he describes the attendants of the Asylum. He says : " Why did you send me so far among mean, uncivilized men."' On October 3, he Avrites a letter and says that he is removed on to a better hall, and on a good hall, and he says that he receives good care, that they are very kind to him, and his room is well fur- nished ; he says t'here are two chairs in there, and a bureau and looking-glass, and every thing is comfortable. By Mr. Moegan : Q. Does he say on what ward he was when he wrote that letter ? A. No, sir; at another date in October he writes " to come home is best for many reasons, I will not write down ; I take only one pill after meals, three times a day." October 18, he says: "My voice remains quite weak, but I am in a good hall." Q. Hoav many times do you say any one visited your father when he was at the Asylum ? A. Three times; the last of July we called at the Asylum and visited father ; I think that they Avere against our seeing him at that time, but I insisted upon seeing him ; they said "if you must see your father"—I do not remember who it was I talked with at that time ; I do not think it was Dr. Gray ; I do not remember talking with Dr. Gray at the time my father Avas in there the first time; I do not remember seeing him there at all during that time. Q. It was one of the physicians that you saAv and talked with ? A. Yes, sir; I saw Dr. Andrews, I think, several times, and Dr. Brush ; I talked with Dr. Brush more at that time than I have at this; at the time that I speak of Avhen Ave went to visit father, Ave went there in the morning and had to wait nearly all day ; it was not until three o'clock in the afternoon before we were alloAved to see father, and then an attendant escorted us into the sleeping-room and father Avas sitting in a chair ; he looked Aery Aveak and feeble, and he looked so sleepy; he looked as though he had not slept in a week, and he did not want to talk to us ; he looked stupid and looked as if he was going to faint; and eAer since Ave have been under the impression that that man had been drugged in there, and that he was under the effects of that when Ave saw him, and that has been my impression ever since. Q. Do you know whether at that time he AA'as upon the same ward as he was placed upon this time ? A. No, sir; I do not know about that. Q. You did not go upon the Avard ? A. No, sir ; I do not remember of being on the wards and seeing father on the ward, he was brought into the sleeping-room. Q. Did your father make any complaint to you at that time ? A. As I say, he was so sleepy that he could not complain of any thing if he had wanted to. Q. Was he able to talk to you ? A. He talked very little, if I remember right. 329 Q. How long were you with him upon that occasion ? A. Fifteen minutes; I made a note of it in my book. Q. 'When did you next see your father ? A. I think it was not until some time in September that I saw him again. Q. Did you go alone ? A. My brother and I w7ent down. Q. And who did you see at that time when you went to the Asylum ? A. I don't remember avIio I saw then ; I remember that father Avas very glad to see us, and he said that he could not tell exactly how he came in there or for what reason ; he asked us that question — what was the reason that he was brought there to the Asylum, and when and who brought him. Q. Then he appeared very different at this time than what he did in July ? A. Y^es, sir, very different. Q. Did he make any complaint at that time about the treatment he had received at the Asylum? A. I don't remember that he did at that time. Q. How long an interview did you have at that time ? A. I cannot tell you, it was a short visit. Q. Was it as long as an hour, do you think ? A. No, sir; I don't think it was an hour. Q. Did you see Dr. Brush or Dr. Pilgrim or Dr. Backus at that time ? A. I don't remember seeing them ; I don't remember of knowing Dr. Pilgrim the first time that father Avas in the Asylum. Q. Or Dr. Backus ? A. No, sir ; 1 do not remember seeing him either, at that time. Q. Or Dr. Andrews ? A. No, sir, I do not recollect him, in particular. Q. When did you next go to the Asylum ? A. I could not tell, it was between that time and the 25th of October. Q. Who brought your father home the first time he was at the Asylum ? A. I brought him home myself. Q. Y^ou went to get him home at that time ? A. Ytes, sir; that is what I went for on that occasion. Q. Did you go alone on that visit? A. No ; mother and I went. Q. In the second visit Avere you kept waiting any length of time before you saAv your father ? A. No, sir; as I stated, we Avent three times to visit him, but I do not remember about the third visit; there were three visits, and I think that mother was one of the parties who went down, and I think I was the other one. Q. Have you told us all of the things about which your father 37 U 330 complained as to his treatment during the first time he was in the institution ? A He has told us of things he had seen there, not happening to himself, and what he had to do in there ; he said that one day he saw in the hall a violent patient, and there was only one attendant on the hall at the time, and the attendant tried to quiet this patient, but he was violent all the time, and the attendant went up behind him and struck him back of the head ; I do not remember whether father said he fell to the floor, or whether the attendant got the patient on his back on the floor, but any way the patient was on the floor, and that then the attendant choked him until he was black in the face; father said he thought he had killed him, and he called on father to assist him carry the patient into another room, and he told me at other times that he had often seen patients struck there if they did not behave; that they had a habit of striking them in the head. Mr. Swan — I would like the privilege of asking a few questions of this witness ? The Chairman — Certainly. By Mr. Swan : Q. When did they first employ two men to take care of your father at home ? A. I think it was on Wednesday evening ; Wednesday night we had two men stay in the house. Q. Why did you employ those two men ? A. For fear that these spells might come on. Q. What spells ? A. They were violent, when he wanted to get up, and when he was not allowed — Q. What did he do ? A. If they would restrain him —hold his arms he would — Q. Suppose you had not restrained him — what were you afraid of? A. We did not know what he might do, we guarded against him all the time, we knew what he did do when he was restrained; we had tAvo persons to take care of him all the time he was there. Q. What acts of violence did he use that caused you to have four men to take care of him ? A. In the first place we did not want to have father leave the house. Q. Any thing else besides that ? A. Yes, sir; we did not know but if one of us had undertaken to keep him in the house he might turn upon us as he did if we did restrain him. Q. What did he -do in the way of showing his violence ? A. While he was in the bed I have stated that he got up, and got away suddenly from the two watchers, and got out into the other 331 room, and the other two men wrere there, and they grabbed him and the four men took him back. Q. Did four men stay with him ? A. At times they did. Q. And you considered it necessary at that time to have four men watching your father ? A. No, sir, we did not consider it was necessary to have four men, but Ave considered it necessary to have some one in the house, the four men happened to be in the house for fear something might come up. There Avere; only two men Avith father, but they changed round ; when the tAvo got tired the other tAvo would go in there ; when his hands and feet were both held, the only thing he could do was to spit at them. Q. Y"ou say that when your father was taken to the Asylum you told Dr. Backus about your father's violence ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you testify before the coroner's jury ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you say any thing about that there ? A. I think I did. Q. Do you recollect whether you did or not? A. I am quite certain that I did. Q. At the coroner's inquest you said that you told Dr. Backus about your father's violence ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How often was chloral given to your father before going there ? A. I think it was given — I can't be certain how often it was given. Q. How often as near as you can recollect ? A. It struck me that it Avas every half hour, but now it comes to my mind that it was every two hours ; I cannot really tell how of- ten it Avas, but it was between half an hour and two hours. Q. Did he tell you how much to give? A. Y"es, sir; but I do not remember now what it was. Q. Do you know Iioav much of your conversation Dr. Backus took doAvn when you and he Avere alone ? A. I know he took down only a very little in the beginning. Q. Do you knoAV what he took down ? A. I know Avhen I said to Dr. Backus about what father said about the axe that he had said you take the axe, and knife, and razor away from me ; I Avas telling him that, and — " that is no matter," said he, and he put his paper by and used those words : He had one of those1 pads, and he Avrote about two lines, no more, and he had begun on the third ; that is the best of my recollection. Q. When did you have this conversation 'with your father in which he told you not to say any thing about his treatment in the Asylum, because in case if he ever went back there, etc. — A. That' thev might be revenged on him — yes, sir; that was 332 soon after he came back from the Asylum the first time he was there ; he did not w7ant the family to know much. Q. For fear that he would be sent back? A. For fear that he might some time have another attack and be sent back there. Q. Was your father a pay patient- or a pauper patient ? A. He was.a pay patient the first time he was there ; the second time he Avas brought in by the county superintendent's arrangement that we should pay the county. By Mr. Morgan : Q. You say that the second time that your father Avent there you thought it was in consequence of a lawsuit; Avhat was the cause of his first insanity ? A. I do not think the lawsuit itself brought on the insanity, hut it was thought that this man was going to break his word and make it a church matter. Q. What was the immediate cause of his insanity in 1878 ? A. I could not tell you. Q. Did he have any trouble then ? A. No, sir, he had no business trouble at that time ; I stated be- fore that it was some trouble; it was some excitement that brought it on the other time. Q. Do you know what that was ? A. No, sir, I don't remember. Q. What was your father's physical strength, as to whether he was a powerful man, or otherwise, Avhen he came the second time to the Asylum ? A. He was a healthy man; he came, as you may say, from his work ; he had worked every day. Q. What as to his being a powerful, strong man ; how was it in that respect ? A. He was quite strong. Q. He was a heaAder man than you, considerably ? A. Yes, sir, and he had a good constitution. [The weight of the witness would be about one hundred and forty-three pounds.] Q. In his work was he a powerful man in lifting ? A. No, sir, he was not. Q. Did you ever see him have scuffles to see what his ability was to handle other persons ? A. No, sir. Q. Did you see him have the scuffle with the four men in your house? A. No, sir. Q. When you went into the Asylum the last time^with your father, you said you went into a room and you and Dr. Backus went in together? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you go into the room at the left or right ? 333 A. We went into the Asylum ; we went to our right, then turned again on our right to the office. Q. When you and Dr. Backus went out together where did you go ? A. We went through the first office, into the further office where the stenographer is ; the little room between the reception room— Q. And Dr. Gray's office? A. Yes, sir. Q. And your father and the neighbors Avere in the room next to Dr. Gray's? A. Yes, sir, and there was a door between us. Q. Did your father at any time complain of your treatment of him while he was insane at home ; that you were too harsh w7ith him ? A. No, sir. Q. Did he complain that those neighbors avIio were watching him, that they treated him harshly ? A. No, sir. Recess until to-morrow morning. 334 Friday, 9 o'clock, a. m., Feb. 29, 1884. Present — The whole committee. Proceedings continued, as follows : Mr. Morgan suggested to the committee that he Avas desirous of taking the testimony of the three attendants Weir, Btoavii and Bills. Ex-Senator Goodwin, of Utica, appeared for Mr. Weir, and made the following statement: Gentlemen of the Committee — I desire to interpose an objection to the examination of Mr. Weir. Mr. Weir together with his associate attendants — Brown and Bills—stands here under the charge of a crime—murder in the second degree; I think any examination of these men by this committee might affect their interests on trial if they should be indicted and brought to trial upon the charge against them; it has been suggested that these men will not be examined upon the specific charges touching the death of Mr. Hughes, and that they will only be inquired of as to the general management of the Asylum, as far as their observation and experience enables them to say any thing about the matter. It seems to me that any light the committee desire to obtain upon that subject can better be obtained' from the ninety odd additional attendant's and employees, who have been there more less for a considerable time. Now I appeal to the committee under the circumstances that even upon that branch of the institution investigation it is placing these men in a very peculiar, and it may be, unfavorable position ; some testimony may come out that might be used to the disadvantage of these men by the prosecution. These men are now discharged employees of the Asylum, and without going further into the matter it seems to me that neither public justice nor the facts to be investigated by this legislative committee would require this examination, and therefore I submit that under the circumstances they ought not to be required to be sworn, or to give any evidence whatever upon this matter. I will only add that with regard to the matters touching the death, of Mr. Hughes, these men may avail themselves of their privilege to decline to answer any questions upon that subject. Mr. Morgan — Let me ask Mr. Weir one question. Mr. Morgan—Mr. Weir, suppose we examine you in reference to the general management of the Asylum, the surplusage or short- age of help, the labor required of attendants, their hours, etc., without touching at all upon the case of Mr. Hughes, are you will- ing to give us, under oath, such statements? Mr. Weir — Yes, sir, I am. Mr. Morgan — Leaving out the Hughes matter entirely ? Mr. Weir — Yes, sir. The Chairman — I will say that the committee last night con- sidered this question and recognized the force of the objection that is now raised by Mr. Goodwin. In regard to the matters suggested 335 by Mr. Morgan, about which the witness expresses his willingness to answer, we think there can be no impropriety in such line of inquiry. The examination may proceed, and' if during its progress any question is asked that touches the privileged ground of the Avitness, an objection can be made and the committee will pass upon such objections specifically. In vieAV of the position taken by the counsel, the committee will ask the witness no questions con- cerning the injuries or death of Mr. Hughes. Thereupon — A. G. WEIR Was sworn and examined, and testified as follows : By Mr. Morgan : Q. What is your age ? A. Forty-seven. Q. Where were you born ? A. Nova Scotia. Q. When did you come to this country ? A. When I was nine years of age. Q. Did you come to New York State ? A. No, sir, I came to Massachusetts. Q. From Massachusetts where did you go ? A. In the army. Q. When did you enlist ? A. April, 1861. Q. At the outbreak of the war ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How long were you in the army ? A. Three years. Q. Were you honorably discharged from the army ? A. I was. Q. Did you ever re-enlist ? A. No, sir, I did not. Q. From the army where did you go ? A. I came to Oneida county. Q. Have you remained in Oneida county ever since. A. Not ail the time. Q. Where else have you resided other than in Oneida county ? A. 1 worked in Chenango county, and also in Pennsylvania. Q. When did you return to Oneida county ? A. In 1880. Q. You have since then resided in Oneida county ? A. I have. Q. What business did you go into when you came to Oneida county in 1880 % 336 A. The business that I went into was into the Asylum. Q. When did you enter the Asylum ? A. I entered the Asylum September 3, 1881. Q. In what capacity ? A. Employee. Q. Did you go into the Asylum then ? A, Yes, into the Asylum. Q. What was your business in the Asylum ? A. I was given a rule-book, and I was placed on the ward where I always remained. A book of instructions was given to me, and in that rule-book also blanks for writing out cases, making a memo- randum of cases. Q. Who interceded for you to get a situation there? A. Mr. John B. Orendorf; he is now an employee in the Asylum. Q. What examination did you pass through before being employed in the Asylum, by the authorities of the Asylum in reference to your qualifications or ability to fill the position ? A. When I Avent to the Asylum for employment, I had a letter from Mr. Dwyer to the doctors ; I came into the sitting-room, Mr. Dwyer talked with me a while — two of the doctors came in. Q. What two doctors ? A. Dr. Russell and Dr. Josselyn. Q. And what inquiries did they make to }7ou in reference to your former business or qualifications ? A. I could not tell just now the conversation that passeo. Q. Give us the substance of it ? A. I showed them a writing that I had from a man I was em- ployed with five years, as superintendent of his tannery; that was in Pennsylvania. Q. And you gave them a letter — a recommend that you received from the proprietor of that tannery ? A. Yes, sir, Mr. William B. Guile of Susquehanna county, Penn. Q. You Avere in Mr. Guile's employ for six years ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And the letter from him you gave to the physicians at the time they examined you, or did you give them to Mr. Dryer ? A. To Mr. Dryer. Q. How much were you to have a month ? A. Twenty dollars. Q. And any arrangement by which that was to be increased ? A. There was. Q. What increase was there to be made of the wages ? A. In the first six months, two dollars a month. Q. During your time there, were your wages advanced beyond the twenty-two dollars ? A. Yes, sir ; it was. Q. And what amount was it advanced ? A. After I was there I was given charge of the Avard, and in creased to twenty-eight dollars. 337 Q. Of wThat ward were you given the charge ? A. Ward four. Q. Do you mean you Avere supervisor of that ward ? A. No, sir ; I was head attendant. Q. When did you take the position of head attendant ? A. First of April, 1882. Q. What attendants did you have under you ? A. I had three others. Q. Who were they ? A. I do not know as I can call the names now, because we had so many changes. Q. Who were the attendants under you on the first of January, 1884? A. Mr. BroAvn, Mr. Bills, and Mr. Hoffman. Q. On what ward was that ? A. On ward four. Q. Will you state the number of attendants that you had upon that ward, the time that you were required to go on to work in the morning, and the time you were permitted to retire from duty, and what Avas required of you between the time of retiring from active duty till you go on in the morning, and the amount of work that you had to do, and the number of patients that that ward averaged ? A. The accommodations for the number of patients is twenty-two, and I had on twenty-nine when I was relieved from the institution. Q. What time in the morning were you required to go on duty? A. In the summer at five o'clock. Q. What time in the AA7inter? A. Six o'clock. Q. Before going on duty, did you have your breakfast ? A. No, sir. Q. At Avhat time did you have your breakfast? A. Seven o'clock. Q. While you are at breakfast, who takes your place ? A. Not anybody in particular. Q. The attendants under you, do they take breakfast at the same time as you do ? A. They did Avhen the patients were all suitable to go down stairs into the dining-room. Q. Did you and the attendants eat at the same table with the patients ? A. We did not. Q. In the same room ? A. Yes, sir. Q. If the patients were all in condition to go into the dining-room, ' they were marched in, and you all took your breakfast at the same time '■ A. Yes, sir. Q. Suppose there were patients that could not be taken to the dining-room. Did that occur occasionally ? 43 U 338 A. Yes, sir. Q. What was done ? A. One attendant was left to see to them. Q. At what time in the day did you have your dinner? A. TAvelve o'clock. Q. And the rule was the same in reference to your dinner and breakfast ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What time did you have supper ? A. Six o'clock. Q. Was there any given number of minutes' time that you were to be allowed in which to take your meals ? A. Oh, no. Q. You had your supper at six o'clock, and the same rule applied to the breakfast and dinner ? A. Yes, sir. Q. At what time in the evening were you to be relieved from active duty ? A. Never relieved, with the exception of two nights in the week, from half-past six to ten, that was the evening out. Q. From half-past six to ten o'clock you were permitted to leave the institution ? A. Yes, sir. Q. I suppose there is an hour in which you are permitted to retire to bed ? A. Well, about nine o'clock. Q. Then, what are your duties during the night ? A. We are held subject to orders to take care of patients any hour in the night that they may come out on the ward. Q. Do you mean by coming out on the ward, leaving their rooms and coming out ? A. Ytes, sir ; disturbed patients coming out, or new patients being admitted ; the patients sometimes come out into the ward. Q. Do they take patients in as late as nine o'clock at night ? A. Yes, sir, at all hours. Q. Whenever they reached there ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Describe generally your duties during the time yoli are on the ward? A. At any time during the night, there were very few nights that we could remain in bed all night; on frequent occasions we would have to get up and keep violent patients from breaking the doors and windoAvs; they would keep us awake all night until Ave would be so sleepy sometimes in the day time — or so sleepy that, if the building was afire all around us, Ave should have to sleep, because we were so tired. Q. In cases where you are called up in the night, and spend a great deal of the night in attendance upon patients, are there any arrangements by which you can be relieved during the day time? 339 A. Not any. Q. No one to take your place to give you a sleep during the day, or rest ? A. No, sir. Q. And was that the same with the other attendants in that ward ? A. It Avas. Q. What were your duties during the day time? A. In the summer time Ave had orders to get out sharp at eight o'clock to work. Q. Out where? A. Out on the farm and in the garden. Q. That was, to go out yourself ; and who with you? A. Take the patients — all them that was able to work — out Avith us. Q. Now what did you have to do upon the farm ? A. Did the work in the garden and set the patients to work. Q. Did you have to use the hoe yourself; that is, the attendants? A. Yes, sir. Q. And at the same time look after the patients ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Take it during the past summer, how many would the average be of patients that came out on to the farm or garden to work, from your ward ? A. They would average about five off my ward. Q. When the five were out, that would leave an average of twenty on the ward ? A. It was about eighteen or twenty — not on the ward, they would go out into the exercise yard. Q. Would there be some who could not go out to exercise ? A. Yxes, sir ; once in a while one would be sick a bed. Q. When you were out on the farm, and a portion of the patients out exercising, and others that did not go out, then how were the at- tendants distributed among them ? A. There was one put in the exercise yard, and one or two had to stay in the ward and take care of the sick; I had to do that myself, or some one else had to, and the others would go out on to the farm, or into the garden with those that were able to go out to work there. Q. At eight o'clock in the morning you had to go out? A. Yes, sir. Q. And Avhen would they be brought back into the Asylum ? A. At eleven o'clock, when the bell rang. Q. And remained how long ? A. Until one o'clock. Q. And then you go out again in the same way? A. Yes, sir. Q. And remained until what time ? A. Five o'clock. Q. The ringing of the bell ? 340 A. Yes, sir. .., ,, Q. In cases of storm, then I suppose you did not go out i A. No, sir ; remained on the ward. Q In your own way, describe to the committee the labor that you had to perform in taking care of these patients; the conduct of the attendants toward the patients, and of the patients toward the attendants, down to the 15th of January - that is, as to the violence of the patients; how much labor it was to take care of them, and how much strength was required in taking care of them. A There were some patients on that ward who were very easily managed without much trouble, and others were difficult to manage; sometimes it was all that four of us could do for to manage them; of course we were not allowed to use any mechanical restraint, and of course we had to use physical. . Q. Were you permitted to put restraints upon the patients with- out first reporting and getting authority to do it from the physicians? A. Once in a while we put on a restraint, and at once reported it. Q. When you reported that you had been compelled to put on restraint without first getting permission, Avhat would be done; you reported to the physician, did you not ? A. To the supervisor. Q. And he to the physician ? A. Yes, sir. ' Q. After you had reported to the physician what Avould you do with regard to the restraint ? A. The restraint would be left on till the physician would come on and make his round. Q. Then what would he do in the way of giving directions? A. Sometimes he would order them to remain on, and at others he wTould order them to be taken off. Q. Now you describe, in your own way, the different restraints that Avere used ? A. Of the different restraints we have what is called a straight jacket. Q. Describe them ? A. The straight jacket was made of canvas, laced up behind, and the arms fastened together in the center. Q. Something like what they call a camisole ? A. Yes, sir;' and a belt put around them so that it fastens the hands in this position (indicating by crossing the hands in front of the stomach); the next was a strap with wristlets put on ; it was a common strap, put through and buckled behind. Q. With a ring to the strap that Avent around them, and that ring went into the strap on the arm ? A. Yes, sir. Q. So that they could move their arms in this way (indicating). A\ Yes, sir. Q. And could the patient hurt himself with that on ? A. No, sir; he could not. Q. Something has been said here in reference to the ca '341 wont you describe it more fully ; its construction, and the manner in which the patient is confined or restrained, and also the tendency that it would have to injure the patient ? A. I should say the camisole was a very nice restraint for to use — very good indeed ; it is just the same as if the sleeves of the coat were sewn together and the straps put around them in here, that is, round the wrist — the camisole at the wrist—then the strap through on this other side, and then it is buckled behind. Q. Describe that buckle behind? A. The tAvo ends of the strap — it was an ordinary buckle with a lock on it so that it can lock the strap when necessary. Q. So that another patient could not take it off ? A. No, sir; could not release them. Q. How is the back protected from that buckle, so that that buckle shall not injure the back ? A. It fits on the outside of the camisole. Q. Then the canvas cloth protects it? A. Yes, sir ; heavy canvas cloth. Q. And the buckle is between that and the clothing of the skin? A. Yes, sir; and also his shirt is between. Q. Have you ever known of a case where that buckle shifted to the back of the patient, so as to injure him ? A. No, sir ; not in any respect. Q. Have you ever known of any complaint by any patient of the buckle injuring their back ? A. No, sir. Q. How about the hands, are they not draAvn in toward the stomach, so as to make it very uncomfortable ? A. We put on that restraint to see how tight it is, and we will make it comfortable for them ; that used to be my wray of doing; and it was so loose that he could move his hands inside. Q. Was there any danger of the hands being turned in toward the stomach, and pressing against the stomach, so as to injure or make it uncomfortable to the patient ? A. No, sir; there was six or eight inches space between the two hands. Q. What complaint do the patients make, if any, when they are in the camisole ? A. They do not seem to make any complaint. Q. Have you ever known an instance of any patients complaining of the camisole injuring them, or of confining their hands and arms so as to injure them ? A. I have not. Q. Or so as to be uncomfortable for them ? &?A. No, sir; I have not; I Avould hear them say that they would like to have it taken off, but it ought to be on under the circum- stances of their case. 342 By Mr. Haskell : Q. When the strap is put round in addition to the camisole, and is drawn as tight as you have ever drawn it, how much freedom could the patient's hands have ; would it draw the hands snug together? A. No, sir; it would leave them out that far from the body (indi- cating). Q. About four inches ? A. Yes, sir ; four or six inches from the body. Q. Upon what class of patients do they place the camisole?_ A. Them that are very violent and destructive — destructive in their clothing. Q. State whether or not, in your judgment, it was necessary to use that restraint upon many of the patients ? A. It was, and a great many more ought to have it on than do have. Q. You think they do not resort to that treatment in as many cases as they ought to do ? A. T do. Q. If it is necessary, why do you not place the camisole upon others ? A. Because we do not want to be found fault with. Q. Name an instance where fault was found with you for pacing a camisole upon a patient, if you can give the name of one. [Objected to by Mr. Goodwdn.] _ ... Q. That is before the 15th of January? [Objected to.] The Chairman — Do you put that objection upon the ground of the privilege of the witness ? Mr. Goodwin — Yes, sir; I do. The Chairman — Then the objection is sustained. Q. You may describe the strap and the wristlet a little more fully ? A. The strap and wristlets is used when patients come in that are very violent and struggling and striking the attendants and the other patients, then we have to use that. Q. Hoav is that in reference to the liability of its injuring a pa- tient, if there is any such liability ? A. The patient cannot be injured ; it is a very easy mechanical restraint. Q. Did you know the patient P. ? A. Yes, sir; I did, very well. Q. Was he in the habit of wearing that strap and wristlet ? A. After he killed Mr. B., he wore it for one year, and he wears it now, I believe. Q. Did you ever know of a patient's being injured by that re- straint ? A. I never did. Q. I think you said you knew of no instance where a patient was injured by the camisole ? 343 A. No injury that I remember; I do not think they could be in- jured by it. Q. What other restraints did they use on the patients ? A. They use a kind of glove called the "muff; " that is made out of strong leather, and the Avristlets is put on first, and then the muff is put over the hands so that they are in this shape (indicating) in front of the stomach; the fingers are nearly together, but not touching each other ; then the strap is put on, and the leather covers the hands, and the arms are put in this position, that is, at about right angles. Q. Bringing the arms about the Avaist ? A. Yes, sir. Q. In that muff patients do not have the use of their hands then? A. No, sir, they do not. Q. In what cases do they use the muff ? A. In patients that are very violent and dangerous they use the muff upon. Q. And that strap fastened to the back is very much like the other strap that you described, only that it goes around the wrist ? A. The straps are all the same and are all fastened Avith a buckle, and locked, if it is necessary to be locked. Q. Have you ever known of an instance of a patient's being in- jured by the muff? A. No, sir, I have not. Q. Can you see any way in which they could be injured by it ? A. They could not be injured by any restraint that is used, if it was put on properly ; sometimes it might be put on a little tight if the man did not look close to see, and it would be a little incon- venient, but it could not injure a patient in any way. Q. Describe the difference betAveen the patients as to their vio- lence ; which requires #the different restraints — that is, the camisole, the muff, and the straps; state first what class of patients take the camisole ?, A. Some of the violent patients ; the camisole is used for differ- ent purposes; sometimes when patients are very violent, and cannot be controlled Avithout restraint, it is used, and at other times when it is thought best to keep their hands in control, or they would badly abuse themselves. Q. What class of patients are strapped around theAvrists with the ring in the straps that go round the Avrists ? A. The violent patients. Q. The same class of patients ? A. Yes, sir; something similar. Q. And the muff, what class of patients take that ? A. The same class; the reason why they use the different ones is that they do not ahvays have a camisole to put on when necessary; sometimes" it is not necessary to use it. Q. What other restraints are used, if you remember of any others ? A. Not any. 344 Q. Do they restrain the feet in any cases ? A. No, sir. Q. How about putting patients in a chair, how is that done ? A. By using the waist buckle, put around their waist and buckled round the back of a chair. Q. When that is done can the patient get out of the chair ? A. He cannot. Q. Describe that a little more fully, whether it is liable to injure a patient, or whether it is not so liable ? [Objected to by counsel for Weir.] Q. Before the first of January last ? [Same objection.] The Chairman — Suppose you ask him if any patient^ was in- jured, suffered any injury from being fastened in a chair prior to the 15th of January, within his knowledge? A. I have never known any to be injured in that Avay. Mr. Goodwin-—I object to this testimony. The Chairman — Do you put it upon the ground of the privilege of the witness ? Mr. Goodwin — Y"es, sir, I put it upon that ground. The Chairman — Then it must be excluded. Mr. Morgan — I propose to acquit mj7self fully in this respect, it has been charged by one of the papers of this city with being favorable to the interests of the Asylum ; I want it to go on record, that I claim it cannot possibly reach the case in question, for the reason that Mr. Hughes was not an inmate at the time the question refers to; nor is it charged that he had any such restraint upon him when in- jured ; it seems to me that this committee should be put in posses- sion of evidence, that they may pass upon the question of restraint and its liability to injure patients. The Chairman — The committee consider .that the testimony now sought can be obtained from other witnesses, and for that reason and in view of the objection, they will exclude the testimony upon this matter. The objection is sustained. Q. State as to the number of attendants in the institution com- f pared to what, in your judgment, the necesssity of the case demands \ A. On a hall of that kind where there are so many disturbed patients there ought to be four attendants on the ward at least. Q. State whether at any time while you Avere there you asked for more help ? A. I have, several times. Q. And what answer would be made to your request ? A. Sometimes they would ansAver, we expect one soon. Q. Take it before the 15th of January can you name any time Avhen you called for more help and what the result was ? A. On different occasions when an attendant would give notice to leave we would be for several days short. Q. Can you name any other instance ? 345 A. I know one instance when we were two weeks short of help. Q. Short of the usual amount of help do you mean ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do you remember any instance when you were short of help prior to the 15th of January ? A. Yes, sir, I do, but I could not give the dates when the attend- ants left. Q. Can you state about when it was ? A. In July, 1883, I think. Q. Was that on ward four ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How many attendants do you have upon ward four ? A. Our usual number was four. Q. How many did you have when you were short ? A. Only three. Q. And in your judgment that was not sufficient help to control and care for the number of patients on the ward at the time ? A. No, sir ; I say so. Q. Through what time did it extend when you were short of help, in July ? A. Several days; I could not tell the number; we had quite a number of changes of attendants that left, and then we would always be short a few days after they went away. Q. Is it not the rule there that an attendant who desires to leave must give notice a certain number of days in advance of leaving ? A. There is such a rule. Q. And would attendants leave without giving that notice ? A. No, sir ; they must always give that notice. Q. And when the time of the notice expired and they left their places had not yet been filled ? A. Yes, sir; they were not filled ; in many instances attendants were discharged ; it would be several days before we got another. Q. When a discharge occurs it is without any notice ? A. Yes. Q. And it leaves the wards short of attendants ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Who were the physicians in charge of ward four for the last six months prior to the 15th of January ? A. Dr. Josselyn, Dr. Pilgrim and Dr. Backus, prior to the 15th of January. Q. How often did the physicians visit ward four? A. Mostly twice a day, with a few exceptions. Q. And which physician was in the habit of making a visit to the ward twice a day ? A. Sometimes Dr. Josselyn and Dr. Pilgrim both, and sometimes Dr. Pilgrim. Q. When upon that Avard, what did they do when they were visit ing the ward ? What did they do and what inquiries did they make? A. They would go on to the ward and walk through and ask how 44 U 346 things was generally, and go off again in the course of five or ten minutes ; if there was a patient sick in bed they would look at him or I w7ould report his condition to them. Q. How often was Dr. Gray upon that ward i A. During my stay there ? Q. Yes, down to the 15th of January ? A. I think five times. Q. Did you go there in 1881 ? A. Yres, sir, in September. Q. Between September, 1881, and the 15th of January last, he was on there five times you say ; was that all he was there, was that the full number of times ? A. I could not say as to that, he mighUiave been there once when I was away. Q. But'that was all when you were on duty? A Yes. q! When you had patients out at work, did the physicians make a practice of coining out and looking after them any ? A. They did. Q. When out on exercise, how was it then about the physicians coming then ? A. They would come out and walk through the yard and talk to them. Q. How about Dr. Gray, did he come out and look them over when they were out there ? A. I have never seen him do so but once. Q. You had a habit of taking them out in the yard for exercise- out for a walk in the winter time, they were taken out into the city, but not in the summer time ? A. Yes, sir; them that could go they Avent out walking in the winter time. Q. And sometimes they wrere taken out for a ride ? A. Yres, sir; once during the winter season. Q. Do you know of any instance of a patient's getting injured when they were out for a w7alk and out for exercise? A. 1 have. Q. How would that occur? A. By a violent patient striking a milder patient Avith their fists or with stones. Q. Describe some of the instances Avhere one patient has thus i.. injured another patient ? A. When a man is very violent, and you can't control him with- out your holding him he is liable to strike the first man that is near him ; or, to run up to a man and strike him; you can't tell what they are going to do; it may be that after one of them has run round a little while, and then may be he will come up and strike one of the other patients, or perhaps strikes an attendant with his fist or with a stone. Q. Does that occur when they are out taking a walk or taking exercise ? 347 A. It occurs when they are in the yard. Q. How is it when they are out taking a walk in the winter? A. There is none of Idie violent ones that is allowed to go out, it is the convalescents that go out; they will not run away or get into trouble outside. Q. Did you go out with patients on the walk outside of the inclos- ure at any time ? A. In the winter of 1883, I did. ■ Q. Do yon knoAV any rule required to be observed for prohibiting the patients from looking over into the yards of the people who live in the streets where the patients are walking ? A. No, sir; I do not. Q. Do you know any <>f#the managers of the Asylum? A. I know some of them by sight. Q. Can you name some of them that you know by sight ? A. Mr. Winston, Mr. Lowrery and Mr. Campbell. Q. Mr. Campbell is the president of the board of managers ? A. Yes, sir ; and Mr. Swan ; I have seen him quite often without knowing who he was, but I learned this morning that he was Mr. Sav an ; I learned it when he came in here to the hotel. Q. How often has Mr. Campbell, the president of the board, been in the habit of visiting the institution ? A. I could not tell you. Q. How often have you seen him upon ward four ? A. I think I have seen him there on one or two occasions with the board of managers, when they have gone through the Asylum. Q. Of course he could be there in the institution and you not know it, unless he came upon your ward ? A. Yes, sir ; he might. Q. How often was Mr. Winston there ? Hoav many times have you seen him there since you have been there? A. That I could not answer; I could not say when they came through, as I was not acquainted with them, but after hearing their names, I knew who they were by hearing them spoken of ; they gen- erally came through when they met there. Q. Do you know about how often that was ? A. I think twice a year. Q. When the managers passed through your ward and you saw them, did they ever make their business known to you ? A. No, sir ; they did not. Q. Did they ever talk with you about the management or affairs of the institution ? A. No, sir; they did not. Q. Or make any inquiries of you about the condition of the pa- tient ? A. No, sir. Q. Or at any time ask you if you could suggest any thing in the way of improvements ? A. Never. 348 Q. On any occasion while you were there down to the 15th of January last, did either one of the managers ever make any in- quiry of you in reference to the management of the institution, or the treatment of the patients; or in reference to the patients any way ? A. The physicians are with them generally when they come through, they done the talking. Q. Did the physicians at any time make any inquiry of you for the purpose of getting any suggestions of you, as to any improve- ments that might be made in the way of treating or managing the patients ? A. No, sir; they did not. Q. Has Dr. Gray at any time made ajiy such inquiry ? A. No, sir. Q. During the time that you were there, and down to the 15th of January last, were you ever called into Dr. Gray's office ? A. Ytes, sir, I was. Q. What would be the object of that ? A. In regard to the abuse of patients. Q. Did he make inquiries as to the treatment of patients ? A. Yes, in regard to the abuse of them. Q. Taking it back of the 15th of January, can you name any in- stance ? A. I can. Mr. Goodwin — This is pretty close to the line. Mr. Morgan —Do you object to my pursuing it any further? Mr. Goodwin — Yes, sir, I object to that. The Chairman — For the same reason ? Mr. Goodwin — Yes, sir. The Chairman — Then the objection is sustained. Q. Do you know of any other attendants having been called into Dr. Gray's office within the period mentioned, other than your self? | A I do. Q. Without asking why they were called there, can you give the names of any other attendants that were called into Dr. Gray's office for the same purpose; I will not ask the purpose ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Name the attendant ? A. John House. Q. Do you know for what purpose John House was called in ? A. I do. Q. John H. House is a resident of Miller's Mills, Herkimer county? A. He is. Q. What was he called before Dr. Gray for ? A. For to tell in regard to the patients that came on to my ward, that had been misused before they came there on to my ward. Q. Do you know who the patient was that it was claimed was misused ? A. I do; it was G. W. B. 349 Q. Where was he from ? A. Somewhere near G., somewhere back of G. Q. Is he in the Asylum at the present time ? A. Yes, sir, he is. Q. Was it reported that he had been misused on some other ward ? A. Yes, sir. Q. On some other ward than yours ? A. Yes, sir. Q. On which ward ? A. On the twelfth ward. Q. Who were the attendants on ward twelve ? A. Dr. John Sage was head attendant at the time. Q. Who were the under attendants ? Was House on ward twelve? A. No, sir; he was on "ward four. Q. Of course what took place between him and Dr. Gray yon don't know only by report ? A. That is all. Q. When the patient came on to your ward what was his con- dition? A. He had been very badly misused. Q. Describe his condition ? A. It was black and blue from his hips up to under his arms, all the way round. Q. How could you account for that ? A. I think it was because he had been roughly handled. Q. State whether or not he Avas apparently lame in consequence of the bruises ? A. He was a very crazy, sick man, and could not give any account of it himself. Q. Did.you learn from any of the attendants onward twelve how he came by his injuries, and if so, give us the name of the attend- ant who informed you ? A. I did; it was Mr. Quine ; he is now in the Isle of Man in the old country. Q. Was he discharged from the Asylum ? A. He was not. Q. How long did he remain in the employ of the Asylum after this injury occurred ? A. I think about five or six months. Q. Do you know of any other circumstances that were reported to you of injuries to patients ? A. Yres, sir. Q. What other? A. It was what I see in regard to the conditions of the patients when they came on to my Avard ? Q. To whom did Quine report, of his having inflicted the injury ? A. Mr. Sage. Q. The attendant on ward number twelve ? A. Yes, sir. \ 350 Q. Where does Sage now reside ? A. I think here in the city. Q. Do you know his given name ? A. John. Q. Where is he now ? A. In Cory, Pennsylvania. Q. How long did Mr. Sage remain as an attendant there after this injury was reported ? A. Tie remained until about the 1st of February, 1884. Q. And when were these injuries inflicted, or about when ? A. In April, 1883. Q. Do you know whether there was any investigation instituted by the authorities of the Asylum as to the manner in which the patient received those injuries ? A. There was. Q. And were you called upon to make any statement in reference to the condition in which you found him when he came upon your ward ? A. Yes, sir; I was called, and so were others. Q. Do you know Avhat the result of that investigation Avas? A. I never heard. Q. Who was the investigation conducted by ? A. It was conducted — Dr. Bloomer called me into his office to make a statement as to how I found the patient, and Dr. Gray at another time ; I was in there several times. Q. Give the manner in which that would be done; were you called into the doctor's office to state the condition of this patient when he came upon your ward ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you inform the doctor of what Mr. Quine had said to you in reference to the manner in which this man was injured ? A. I did. Q. State generally, as near as you can remember, the extent of that investigation ; state what was said by the doctors; the questions put to you and your answers; give it alias you remeniuer it ? A. I could not give the dates. Q. State the particulars as near as you can ? A. When patients came on to my ward I always examined them to see if there were any injuries upon them any way. Q. When you found any injuries upon them Avhat did you do? A. I Avould report it, if I durst, as far as I dared to. Q. Would you report to the supervisor of the ward ? A. To the doctor. Q. Is there any rule that you are to report to the supervisor? A. I could report to the doctor or to the supervisor. Q. Would you report and show him the man ? A. Yes, sir. Q. You say you would report as far as you durst; what do you mean by that ? 351 A. Well, I will state in this way : that I expected to be discharged for making such reports. Q. What caused you to think you would be discharged for mak- ing a truthful report ? - A. When I would report I perceived the actions were such that I did not think it was right toward me for making the report. Q. That is, the actions of the doctors, do you mean? A. From the physicians; yes, sir. Q. Would they appear to be displeased at the report you would make? A. He Avould. Q. What physician appeared to be displeased at the reports so made ? A. Dr. Josselyn. Q. What remark would be made, if any, if you could remember, to you by the physician when you made such reports ? A. Well, it Avas as though my word was not reliable ; I said to the doctor in this case of Mr. House, I said : " Is not he reliable ? Is not Mr. Roberts another reliable man? and as good attendants as there are in the house ? " Well, he thought they were reliable, but he says: "They did not see the injury done ; they were not on the ward.". Q. Mr. House is a very reliable man in your opinion ? A. Yes, sir, very; he was one of my best attendants at the time ; Mr. House has said to me before: "Mr. Weir, there ought to be something done to abate this cruelty to patients, but he did not durst report it, because there Avere some things it Avas of no use to men- tion." Q. You mean cruelty by the attendants toward the patients ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Any other instance you can remember where the physician seemed to doubt the report that you made of injuries or unkind treat- ment of patients by attendants ? A. There was the case of Mr. S. he came on to my ward very badly injured ; he came from the same ward — twelve. Q. Describe his injuries ? A. His chest Avas in a very bad condition; he was spitting blood he Avas a patient that had fits and when he Avas over the fits he could talk very rationally. Q. And you say he Avas a patient that was brought to your ward from the twelfth ward ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What is the character of ward twelve as compared with the other wards, and what class of patients are on that ward ? A. The disturbed X class. Q. And when he came on to your ward, who brought him there ? A. The supervisor. Q. The supervisor of what ward — of your Avard ? A. No, of the third department. Q. What report was made in reference to that patient? A. When he was fetched on to the ward ? 352 Q. Yes. A. Not any that I recollect of. Q. Did you ascertain how he got injured ? A. I did. Q. How did you ascertain that — from what source i A. I asked him how it was done. Q. Asked the patient ? At that time did the patient appear to be rational ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What did he say ? A. He said that Mr. Sage had put him into the bath tub and had jumped on to his chest while he was in the bath tub. Q. Any further description did he give you as to the manner in which the injuries were inflicted ? A. Ytes, sir ; he said that his chest troubled him very much, that he was very sore. Q. How long did the patient seem to belaboring under the effects of his injury % A. He was laboring under that injury until he went to Ovid, he lived a week after he went there, he labored under that difficulty all the time he Avas with me. Q. Do you know where that patient was from ? A. Not far from Constableville, somewhere in that direction, somewhere up there. Q. Can you give about the time when this occurred ? A. It Avas in April or May, 1883. Q. About what time was the patient sent to Ovid ? A. In September. Q. Can you give any other instance of a patient being brought to your ward who had the appearanceNff being injured ? A. I can — the case of Mr. G., his initials are C. O. Q. What appeared to be the difficulty with him ? A. I should say that one of his ribs were broken. Q. Can you tell upon AATiich side ? A. Yes, sir, on the left side. Q. Describe a little more fully the injury to the patient when he came on to your ward ? A. When he came on to my ward, before he went to bed that night I had him take off his clothes and called my attendants to help examine him to see his injuries; I had known previously of his having some before he came there, and we found a bunch about the size of a hen's egg, I should think, on his second or third rib on the left side. Q. Did the patient appear to be sufficiently rational to talk about it himself ? A. He was. Q. What did he say in reference to the injury ? A. He told me how it was done, and the man who done it. Q. State what he told you ? 353 A. He stated that he had been stamped on by Mr. Sage. That he stamped on him and broke that rib. Q. That was the same man that had handled the othdr patient ? A. Yes, sir. . .^y- Q. What did you do in reference to that injury ? A. There Avas nothing that could be done for it at that time; there merely seemed to be a hard lump there at that time ; I did not think there could be any thing done about him. Q. Did yon report the injury to the physician in charge ? A. Yes, sir; I made a statement to the physician in charge. ! Q. Do you know whether he examined the man or not? A. I think he was taken to the office and made a statement him- self ; I think he was examined down there. Q. What office was he taken to, the doctor's or superintendent's ? A. It was down to the doctor's office. Q. You did not go down with him ? A. No, sir. Q. What was done, if any thing, by the doctor for this injury? A. There was nothing done for him until after he came on to my ward. Q. Do they not sometimes put on a bandage or something around them in case of a broken rib? A. I believe they do. Q. Was there any thing of that kind done for him ? A. No, sir, not after he came out of my ward. Q. How long did he remain on your ward ? A. lie remained there several months. Q. Do you know what became of him ? A. He Avas put on to a quiet ward, and he is in the building noAv ; 1 he was on Avard four Avlien I was there a feAV days ago; he came on ; there about a Aveek before I was relieved. Q. Do you know yourself whether or not Mr. Sage was called upon to account for that injury ? A. He Avas to the office. Q. Do }7ou know what the result was ? A. No, sir, I do not. Q. Do you remember any other case of a patient's being brought to your ward who bore the evidences of injuries received before i coining on to your ward ? A. That is all. Q. Hoav was it as to seeing-patients with black eyes and bruises upon their faces ? A. That is very frequently the case, and it cannot be any other- wise. Q. How do yon account for those ? A. They strike each other. Q. And sometimes it occurs, I suppose, by their injuring them- selves ? A. Yes, sir. 45 U 354 Q. Did you ever see a patient walk up to the wall and pound his head pretty severely ? A. I have, and have strapped him to a chair. Q. And what other actions have you seen, if any, whereby a patient would injure himself? A. They wouid not injure themselves when strapped in a chair. Q, Is there any way that a patient can injure himself when strapped in that chair, that you know of? A. Not very easily. Q. The chair is set far enough from the wall so that they cannot strike themselves on the wall ? A. Yres, sir, it is. Q. Have you ever known of a case where a patient strapped in the chair has been injured by another patient striking him? A. I have. Q. Sometimes a patient will redress an imaginary grievance by setting on to another patient ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Attached to your wards were there any covered beds ? A. Yes, there were four covered beds. Q. What class of patients are put into the covered bed ? A. The class of patients that cannot be controlled on the wards. Q. Do you knoAV of any instance where a patient has been put into a covered bed where you did not think it necessary that he should be placed ? A. 1 never knew of any case but wdiat it was necessary. Q. You never knew of any case of any patient being put into the covered bed, but what it Avas absolutely necessary for him to be put there either for his own protection or for the protection of the other patients ? A. For his own benefit. Q. Have you ever known of a patient injuring himself in the covered bed ? A. Slightly ; not very seriously ; perhaps he might knock the skin off his hands or off of his elbo\Ars, but only such slight injuries. at that. Q. How long have you knoAvn of a patient to be kept in a covered bed without being taken out; how long is the greatest length of time that you know of between the time of putting a patient into the covered bed and taking him out of it ? A. They are taken out half a dozen times a day; every time it is necessary to change them they are taken out for such purposes. Q. Have you ever known of an instance of a patient being kept in the covered bed as long as twenty-four hours — without being taken out, I mean ? A. No, sir; I have not. Q. Your opinion is that patients have not been kept longer in the covered bed than it was necessary, in your judgment, to keep him there ? 355 A. No, sir; I have known of a good many 'who ought to have been kept there a little longer for our benefit and their ow7n. Q. By your benefit, or " our " benefit, whom do you refer to? A. Because, when begot up, in the condition he Avas in, we would have to hold him to keep him there from injuring other patients, or other patients from injuring him ; and if he had been left in bed a little longer, in my judgment, it would have been better for him. /. Q When'he, AA*as taken out of bed, at whose orders was he taken out in such case ? A. The doctor would order him out. Q. Usually, in the bed, they are undressed, I suppose ? A. Yes, sir; in all cases. Q. And when, taken out and dressed, what was the practice in reference to bathing them ? A. The general rule was to bathe the patients once a Aveek, and then keep them bathed as often as necessary; some of them Ave had to wash tAvo or three times a day. Q. In consequence of their filthiness ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Now, have you known of any cases where attendants have been injured by patients ? A. I have ; very severely. Mr. Morgan — Is there any objection to his stating about the attendants having being injured by patients prior to the 15th January ? Mr. Goodwin— Yes ; I shall object to that; I do not think it is material one way or the other, but I shall object to it. The Chairman — What can be the objection to that ? Mr. Goodwin — The question might arise as to what he did in the case of Mr. Hughes, if any thing, in view of the fact of his knoAvledge that attendants had been injured by patients. The Chairman — And do you think that could affect his defense any way ? , Mr. Goodwin — Yes, sir. The Chairman — Do you put your objection upon the same ground ? That of the privilege of the Avitness ? Mr. Goodwin—I do. The Chairman — In accordance with the previous ruling, then the evidence .will be excluded. Q. Have you known of any instances of the doctors in charge being injured by any of the patients, prior to the 15th of January ? A. I have. Q. What doctor ? A. Dr. Josselyn for one. Q. What other doctor, if any ? A. Dr. Bloomer; I have known of his being injured in that way. Q. How did that occur? A. He was walking down the hall Avhen a patient came toward him, and just when he got about to him he struck him so that he was laid in bed for three days. 356 Q. Struck whom ? A. Struck Dr. Josselyn, the patient did. Q. Any other instance ? What was the cause of Dr. Bloomer's injury ? A. A patient kicked him. Q. Where? A. In the privates. Q. Do you know the name of the patient ? A. Yes, sir, it was Mr. W. Q. Is he there now ? A. No, sir, he is at home ; he went home discharged. Q. Where was he from ? A. I think he was from Fort Edward. Q. Hoav serious was the injury to Dr. Bloomer ? A. Well, not very serious, because he was a little out qf his reach, but he felt it for several days ; if he had been three or four inches nearer he would have received more severe — perhaps very severe — injuries. Q. Describe the manner in which you have to keep yourself guarded against assaults from patients there ? A. When patients come on there violent, and it takes five or six men to bring them on to the ward, Ave have to do the best Ave can if they tackle us. Q. Well, is it necessary to keep yourself watchful all the time so that you are not attacked unaAvares, and thus get injured ? A. Yes, sir, we have to keep a watch all the time. Q. Have you knoAvn of any instances where it took fiVe or six men to bring a patient on to your ward i A. I haA7e. Q. And a severe struggle to get him there ? A. Yres, sir. Q. And when that was done Jhe wras left with the other patients on the ward? A. Yes, sir. Q. How many attendants would there be on the ward to take , care of him ? A. There would be four attendants, but they could not always be there, all of them, one might be in the dining-room and would be i gone perhaps an hour and a half three times a day. Q. Three times a day you had to detail one of the attendants to be in on duty at the dining-room? A. Yes, sir. Q. And at that time there Avould not be to exceed three men in charge of the ward ? A. Sometimes not three, one would sometimes have to go out and get in the clothes of the ward — the washing, and that would only leave but tAvo on the ward. Q. Were two attendants sufficient to take charge of the number i of patients you had on the ward ? 357 A. They were not. Q. And ordinarily would three be sufficient ? A. It would be if they could all be three together at a time, but they were not. Q. But you think that three attendants actually on duty would be sufficient for all practical purposes ? A. Sometimes it would take three or four patients to control them, sometimes four. Q. What do you say in regard to the hours an attendant is re- quired to be on duty — as to whether or not they are overworked ? A. There is no time at all that they can call their own, except two evenings they are out in the week, and every third Sunday in the month, and one-half day ; the other times they are locked right in there the same as the patients. Q. What effect does it have upon the attendants to perform that amount of labor and be upon duty that length of time ? A. It is very injurious to them. Q. Whether an attendant is liable to get nervous ? A. There has been several cases that went out that was very ill, and had to be relieved, it affected their heads so. Q. What suggestions, if any, would you make in reference to remedying that difficulty ? A. I would suggest that they have more help and more restraint used for to control these violent patients, either by using mechanical restraints or having a room to put them into when they are so very violent, by so doing, many times a patient would not get injured, and the attendants would not receive injuries. Q. Would you suggest that the help be increased so as to relieve those who are on duty more often and with a longer relief ? A. Yres, sir, a longer relief. Q. Give them more time to rest ? A. Yes, sir, more time to themselves. Q. Would there not be danger in putting a violent patient into a room by himself without restraint; would there not be danger of that patient injuring himself in that room ? A. Not if the room was suitably prepared; in that case it might not be necessary to put on any restraint — suppose it was a well padded room. Q. Suppose he were put into a room where it was solid walls, would not the patient be apt to injure himself? A. In some instances they have rooms purposely for that thing, then they can be on the wards with quieter patients. Q. Have you known of instances of patients having been kept in restraint when they ought not to be ? A. Never. Q. And that you said you neA7er knew, and I think you stated that you never knew where it had been kept too long, but you did of instances Avhere you thought they ought to have been retained longer ? 358 A. Yes, sir; no one has abetter chance to know about taking care of patients, and what is wanted than those who are with them all the time. Q. You think that there ought to be more discretionary power lodged with the attendants in reference to the use of restraint on the CD patients ? A. Yes. sir, I do. Q. Do you think such a man as this Sage that you spoke of would be a proper man to lodge discretion in ? A. Well, he was a man that never ought to have been allowed there at all. Q. What was your judgment about Sage as an attendant there? A. He was very brutal and a man of poor judgment, not a fit man to take care of sick men. Q. Was he a very passionate man ? ; A. Y'es, sir ; known to be so. 'Q. Do you say that he was known as a violent and passionate ; man ? A. Yes, sir, I do. Q. And was he retained there at the Asylum after that reputation became known ? A.. Yes, sir. t Q. For how long was he so retained ? A. He was retained up to about the 1st of February. Q. IIoav many months after it was knoAvn ? A. When I made the matter knoAvn that a patient was so badly misused, he Avas kept there from April, 1883, until February 1,1884. Q. Do you know of any other injuries having been inflicted on patients by this Sage, except the cases you have mentioned ? A. I know those cases that came on to my ward. Q. Did you learn of any that did not come on to your ward? A. I did. Q. State what cases came to your knoAvledge that did not come on to your ward; state the names of the patients, and give the particu- lars as far as you can ? A. The first one was a patient that Avent from my ward to his. Q. Who was he ? A. IT. C----.; he belonged in Canada, but I think he was fetched here from Syracuse to this Asylum. Q. Do you know whether he is there now or not ? A. I think he is in Binghamton now; that he has been trans- i ferred. Q. What did yon learn in reference to him after he left your , ward ? 1 A. I saw him the next day when he came out into the yard; , he looked as though he had Avent through a mill. Q. Describe his condition ? A. I see him Avith his clothes on in the yard, and his eyes Avere | black, and the difference between him and the time he left the day before— when he left my ward — there was quite a difference in his appearance and actions. 359 Q. Did he have the appearance of having been severely injured ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you talk with him ? A. I did. Q. What did he say about the matter to you ? A. He was so disturbed that he did not give much account of it. Q. Y^ou did not regard him as sufficiently rational to give a satis- factory account? A. No, sir. Q. Mr. Giles Penny left the Asylum before the time you com- menced your services there, did he not? A. Yes, sir; he left before I came there. Q. You did not know him as a patient? A. No, sir. Q. Is there any thing further that you can describe about this last case mentioned? A. No, sir. By Mr. Olin : Q. The ward that this patient C. went on was a quieter ward than yours ? A. Yes, sir. Q. But it was the Avard that Sage was attendant on ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What do you mean by saying that patient was "disturbed" when you saw him in the yard ? A. I mean excited. Q. Unusually excited ? A. Yes, sir, quite excited. By the Chairman : Q. State Avhether or not you learned if those injuries were self- inflicted or inflicted by some one else ? A. I ascertained that they were inflicted by somebody else. Q. How did you ascertain that ? A. When I see a patient abused or had marks of violence about him, I would pm-ately make inquiry about him. Q. Of Avliom did you make inquiries in this case? A. Of some of the attendants on that department. I do not knoAV as I could tell the names, who they were. Q. What did the attendants say to you in answer to such inquiry? A. They stated that they had trouble with him; had a fight and received the injuries. Q. How did they state the injuries Avere given ? A. I don't know as I could use the language that was passed. Q. I only Avant the fact as to Avhat was stated, about who inflicted them ? A. Mr. Sage. 360 Q. What did they say he did ? A. Maltreated him. Q. In what manner ? . A. I suppose with his feet or hands; I suppose he used either his feet or hands. . . . . Q. Was his appearance such as to clearly indicate that his injuries were not self inflicted ? A. Yes, sir, they were; knowing the patient well. Q. Are patients liable to give themselves black eyes ? A. In some cases they are liable to do so. Q. Are they liable to blacken both their eyes ? A. Not very often ; I don't know as I have ever seen them make both eyes black, it depends upon where a patient strikes; if they strike in the center, why very often both eyes are blackened. By Mr. Rice : { Q. What is your height % A. Five feet eleven inches in my stocking feet. Q. What is your weight ? A. One hundred and seventy-five pounds. Q. And what is your chest measure ? - A. Forty-two inches. By Mr. Morgan : Q. In other words you are a pretty solid fellow ? A. I used to be ; I aint now as much ; my confinement has not improved me any. Q. You say you reported to Dr. Josselyn as to injuries received by a patient, and that he (Dr. Josselyn) appeared displeased at your reports ? A. I should take it that way by his actions ? Q. What other physicians did you make reports to Avhere you ob- served the same thing, if any others ? A. Dr. Bloomer. Q. And any person else but Dr. Josselyn and Dr. Bloomer? A. That is all; those two are the only ones. Q. Yrou say you talked to certain of the attendants in regard to the cruelties practiced upon the patients there — with what attend- ants did you have such conversation ? A. With attendants on my ward, and with others who came there occasionally. Q. Will you give the names of all you recollect with whom you had such conversation ? A. Mr. House, Mr. Quine, Mr. Roberts: he is in the institution now, Roberts is ; I do not know his initials, that is, I do not recol- lect them now ; then there is Mr. David Linn ; he is there now in the institution, Mr. Linn is ; those were attendants that I called to examine patients that came on to my ward. 361 Q. Those are all the names you can recohect now ? A. Yes. Q. Were there any others with whom you had such conversation - that yon do not recollect the names of now ? A. Yes, sir ; there were others. Q. Will you state the occasions or reasons for such conversations, other than those you have specified, other than the four cases that yon have mentioned ? A. We would occasionally hear of a case where a patient received injuries that would be talked over, bnt we could not tell when it was done, or any thing of that kind, only it was talked over that such a thing occurred. Q. Hoav frequently did you have such conversations ? A. Very frequently. Q. From what time, down to what time ? A. Down to July, 1883. Q. Have you had any such conversations after July, 1883? A. I do not think I have in particular. Q. Do you recollect whether you have or not? A. I might have had, but I do not recollect in particular now. Q. Do you recollect what was the occasion, and with whom you had the conversation that you have last had ? A. With some of the attendants of the ward. Q. In regard to what case ? A. In the case of Mr. M. Q. Can you specify the particulars of that case ? A. Mr. M. complained of being misused and spoke to the doctors in the yard about ft. Q. Describe what there was to that ? A. My attendant was there when Mr. M.'s clothes were taken off, and he saAV that Mr. M. showed marks of violence on his body, but I cannot tell just on what parts of his body, and I do not know that it was told me just what parts. Q. Where they injuries inflicted by an attendant? A. YTes, sir. Q. By what attendant ? A. I do not know that. Q. And when was this occurrence ? A. December. Q. Of what year ? A. Last year — a year ago. Q. In which ward was Mr. M. at that time ? A. The twelfth. Q. Are there any other cases that you can now think of? A. No, sir; I do not recollect any others just now — yes I do, there was one particular case, but I do not want his name to go into print. Q. His name will not go into print, only the initials of his name, 46 U 362 but you may describe him in any way that you desire to —you may simple designate him as " a patient" ? A. He is there now. . . Q. Describe what there was to his case, and as to his injury i A. He received an injury from Avhich he was laid up for several weeks. Q. Describe the injury ? , A. I could not exactly. . Q. You can give some idea of how the injury happened or of what it consisted ? A. One of his limbs was injured. Q. State about when it was ? What time ? A. It was in December, 1882. Q. Was he on one of the wards at the time he was injured ? A. Yes, sir. Q. On which ward ? A. On ward eight. Q. And was he injured by an attendant ? A. I could not state so. Q. Canyou give me the attendant's name? A. No,'sir ; I think not. Q. Is the attendant still in the institution ? A. They are not. Q. Was there more than one ? A. There were three. Q. Three of them implicated in it. A. There were three of them on the ward at the time. Q. Is there any other instance that you can recollect now? A. No, sir ; I have a case that I do not want to go on record, but I will give the names so that yon can inquire about it. [The witness then detailed some facts and names to the committee.] By Mr. Haskell : Q. You say that you think Dr. Pilgrim is doing Avhat he can for the patients J A. Yes, sir; I think he does. Q. You spoke just now about Dr. Pilgrim's hands being tied and tlmt he could not do as much as he otherwise would ; what do you mean by that expression? A. In cases ; in one case I remember in regard to patient P.; I took the doctor into the room and almost begged him to have some- thing done, that something had to be done about it, that P. came very near killing me, which was a fact that he did nearly kill me, he tore my clothes off ; when I saw Dr. Pilgrim, he says to me: I must see Dr. Gray about it; but nothing was ever done about the matter; that is why I think his hands are tied ; I think if he had the power to do so he would have restrained that man right off ; that man P. has •killed one man there. Q. Then you mean, in saying that Dr. Pilgrim's hands are tied, that he is not allowed to exercise his own judgment by Dr. Gray? r363 A. Well, I think he would do more than he does if he had the power so to do. Q. What prevents him from having the power ? A. He has to take his orders from head-quarters. Q. From Dr. Gray ? A. Yes, sir; from Dr. Gray, of course. Q. Can you give us any other instances of patients receiving hard usage in the institution ? A. No, sir : I don't think I can. Q. Have other cases, than those you have specified, come to your knowledge which you cannot now give us specific circumstances of ? A. There are cases that I cannot call up particularly to the point, that is as to days or dates; there are some that I think could have been avoided. Q. Is there then, in your judgment, considerable unnecessary cru- elty toAvard patients ? A. Yes, sir; I know there is. Q. Does that occur upon all the wards, or is it only on some of the wards where there is unnecessary cruelty ? A. Mostly it is on the disturbed wards; it is not necessary with quiet patients; 'of course the patients are classed according to their condition. Q. I mean in regard to the way that attendants treat them, as to whether it is on violent wards or convalescent wards that the cruelty treatment exists? A. On the disturbed Avards. Q. Y"ou have spoken frequently of the removals from one ward to another. YTou may state why patients are removed from one ward to another. A. Well, they are on a quiet ward and they become disturbed and violent, they are then put on to the disturbed Avard ; if they are very bad they go on to ward four, that is the worst. Q. Is there a regular system in regard to the removal of patients from one ward to another; and has that system ever, to your knowledge, been broken ; and are patients sometimes arbitrarily re- . moved by way of punishment ? A. Yres, sir, I think they are. Q. Can you give any instances where patients have been removed, not because of their condition, but by way of punishment? A. YTes, when a patient is convalescent, and refuses to go out into the garden and work, for instance for some reason, when he refuses he is put in a disturbed ward again, put back for refusing, that is, he is put back again with the most violent patients for a punishment. Q. How many instances of removal for punishment have come to your knowledge, approximately, during the past year ? A. Almost too numerous to mention, they are; it is so frequent. Q. I would rather have you give us a better idea than that. Would you say that there have been as many as ten instances that have come to your knowledge, personally ? 364 A. Yes, sir; more than ten. Q. How many would you think ; state some number that you can be sure about, in round numbers ? A. I should say twenty-five. Q. Have all of those cases been where they were removed to your ward ? A. In all cases they would not be removed to my ward. Q. But you think it has been twenty-five cases of removal as a punishment, that have come to your knowledge ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Y^ou may describe if you please the fourth ward — Iioav many different halls or rooms are there comprised on that ward ? A. There is five — the little hall on the further end where there is five beds and the attendants-room, then there is a large day room, then out of this main hall there is a short hall with three beds, then there is a short passage-way that leads from the hall just mentioned to the hall on the north side. Q. This ward is not a continuous straight ward ? A. No, sir. Q. But is it in the shape of a letter " L ?" A. Yes. Q. You spoke of the accommodation on the four wards being for twenty-two patients ? A. Y"es, sir; I mean that there is twenty-two sleeping-rooms on that ward. Q. And for how long a time have the average number of patients on that Avard been tAventy-nine? A. For about a month or two. Q. How was it prior to that ? A. Not quite as many; we generally had one or tAvo over, some- times as many as four over; it got up to about tAventy-nine some- Avhere about the 15th of February. mt Q. And it had continued about twenty-nine for the two months ! previous to that ? A. Yes, sir. -, Q. Do you recollect any time that you have been on the fourth ward that there have been more than twenty-nine patients, or is that the highest number you remember of? A. That is the highest number I should say. Q. When there are as many as twenty-nine, which number is more than you have rooms for — how are they all cared for ? A. There is one that sleeps on the floor, a number of the patients , on that ward were suicidal and were sent on to the ward nine, they i are sent on to ward nine to sleep, some of them; they are only on the ward in the day time; I have had only twenty-three in my ward at night. Q. You say that one of them sleeps on the floor, what do you mean by that? 365 A. We make up a bed on the floor and generally put a quiet patient into it. Q. And he sleeps out in the hall ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Is there any thing further that you desire to give us in regard to the Asylum and its management in addition to what you have given us here ? A. Yes, sir, I think there is a little. Q. Please gi\7e it ? A. I think on the disturbed wards that the attendants have to work too long hours; theyare too much confined and do not re- ceive compensation enough for the responsibility that is placed on them. Q. Is that all you wish to state ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Is there any thing which you desire to give us in explanation of the evidence given by you at the coroner's inquest ? Mr. Goodwin — That I object to and upon the same ground. The Chairman — The objection is sustained. FRANKLIN P. BILLS, sworn : Mr. Fred. B. Spriggs, counsel for Mr. Bills, appeared to represent Mr. Bills, and said: I desire, on behalf of Mr. Bills, to make the same objection that was made by Mr. Goodwin. Mr. Morgan — I Avill ask Mr. Bills the same question I asked Mr. Weir, provided we do not go later than January 15 — the time Mr. Hughes entered the Asylum; are you willing to give, under oath, a statement to the committee as to the management of the Asylum, the treatment of the patients, as far as it came under your observation, provided we do not touch upon the case of Mr. Hughes; are you willing to comply with that ? Mr. Bills — Yes, sir. Thereupon Mr. Bills was examined and testified as follows : By Mr. Morgan : Q. What is your age ? A. Thirty. Q. Where were you born ? A. Oneida county. Q. What was your business or occupation before you went into the Asylum as attendant ? A. Farming. Q. Who employed you when you went to the Asylum? A. Mr. Dryer. Q. Did you take testimonials with you, or by whose recommenda- tion were j;;you employed ? 366 A. My uncle recommended me ; Wm. Mahew recommended me tllGI*6 Q." What other examination did they give you as to your qualifi- cations and ability to discharge the duties of an attendant ? A. They read the rules to me. Q. What examination or inquiries, if any, did they make of yon in reference to your ability to discharge the duties ? A. Nothing in particular; they asked me what my business had been, but that is all. Q. When did you enter the Asylum as an attendant ? The four- teenth of last February ? A. A year ago last February ? Q. What department were you put in ? A. Fourth ward. Q. Who was supervisor of that ward? A. Mr. Dillon. Q. And who the head attendant ? A. Mr. Weir. Q. How many other attendants when you went there \ A. Mr. Cline and Mr. House. Q. Did you remain on the fourth ward all the time you were there? •! A. Yes, sir. Q. What time were you required to be on duty in the morning ? A. Five o'clock in the summer time, and half-past five in the fall and spring and summer months, and six o'clock in the winter ' time. Q. What were your duties upon the ward ? A. My duties were to see that the patients Avere took care of and do my part; each one had their particular part to take care of. Q. What was your part ? A. My part was to take care of the day room and five single rooms down at the lower end of the ward. Q. And what in reference to looking after patient ? A. To be in the day room and see that they were cared for. Q. Was that all, to simply see that they were cared for? A. Yes, sir. Q. Was it also to assist in seeing it done. A. Yes, sir. Q. There was no part of the ward that you were to look after the patients on ? A. No, sir; I was to look after the patients in any part of the ward ? Q. What was the greatest number of attendants on that ward when you were there ? A. Four. Q. And the least number at any time ? A. Three, I think. Q. How many patients had they upon your ward ? 367 A. Sometimes twenty-two ; from twenty-two to twenty-eight or twenty-nine ; twenty-nine was the most, 1 think, I ever saw on the ward. Q. Is that the most disturbed ward in the Asylum ? A. Yes, sir, they call it so. Q. While you were there and about the 15th January, how often were new patients put upon the ward ? A. Sometimes every day a new patient; at other ,times it Avould run a Aveek or two. Q. How was it about transferring patients from that ward to other wards ? A. Soon as they got quiet they would take them off to other wards. Q. Is there ever a patient gets his discharge from the Asylum from that ward ? A. No, sir, not while I was there. Q. They have to go to Other wards less disturbed ? A. Yes, sir. Q. During the time you w7ere there were patients taken out to work? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you go out with them to work ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What were your duties with reference to patients going out into the field or garden ? A. To see that they did not run away or hurt others, and to Avork some. Q. I suppose you had to see that they did not hurt one another ? A. Yes, sir. Q. There was more danger when out in the yard of one patient hurting another, than of a patient hurting himself ? A. Yes, sir. Q. State what the danger was of their injuring themselves ; ^hat is, the manner in which it would occur when out in the field ? A. Some of them had tools sometimes that they could hurt them- selves with ; and we had to watch them and see that they did not injure themselves ; and to see that they did not get fighting between themselves, Avhich they did sometimes; sometimes they would pick sones up and be liable to throw them. Q. During the time that you were out in the field, or garden, did you work or not yourselves ? A. Sometimes Ave would. Q. What work did you have to do ? A. Hoeing or pulling up weeds, or something like that. Q. Under whose authority did you go to the garden, or field, with the patients ? A. The official's. Q. Who was the official who directed you to go to the field or garden to Avork last summer ? A. Dr. Josselyn, Dr. Bloomer or the supervisor, they would tell him, and he told us. Q. Your authority came from the supervisor ? 368 •" • 1CD) all. Q. What time in the morning did you go to the field to work? ' A. Between eight and nine o clock. Q. And what time came in ? A. Eleven in the forenoon. Q. That was for dinner ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Came out at what time ? A. At half-past one and retnrned at five. Q. What time in the evening were you relieved from active duty? A. Patients went to bed generally at about half-past six or seven o'clock, then we stayed up until the medicine came around, at half- past seven. Q. Who brought the medicine ? A. The supervisor, he would deliver it to us, and we Avould give it to the patients. Q. And after you had given the medicine to the patients what were your duties ? A. Generally there were some patients that used to go up on nine, the suicidal ward, and did not go until eight o'clock in the eve- ning, we took them up and then after that we could go to bed, some- ; times Ave had to sit up later. Q. Any time in the week after you were relieved from duty ? A. We used to go out every third evening and go away at six o'clock and get back at ten. Q. Two evenings in the week ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Was there any part of the day that you were relieved ? A. No, sir, only half a day every month. Q. Who designated half day that you would have ? A. The supervisor Avould tell us whether we could go or not. Q. When you were absent who took your place ? A. Sometimes they would send down a man fron another ward , to take our place, sometimes they Avould not, sometimes the ward v would be with three men on Avhen there was one man away. Q. Were you sick any time you were there ? A. No, sir, not to be laid up. Q. What did they do if a man was sick for a day or two ? A. Generally send another man down in his place. Q. From some other ward ? A. Yes, sir. Q. During the time you were an attendant there, how often did you see Dr Gray on the ward ? A. I did not see him on the ward only three times when I was there. Q. How often did the physicians having charge of that ward '■■ come upon the w7ard ? A. Generally, twice a day, and some days not but once. 369 Q. Suppose a man became badly disturbed, what would you do ? A. I would report him to the head attendant, and it was his place to report to the supervisor, then the doctors would send word by the supervisor what to do with him. Q. Do you remember of any case of that kind where the doctor came himself to see to it ? A. I think I do. Q. Was it a frequent occurrence, in case of severe disturbance, that a doctor would come himself ? A. No, sir. Q. When a case was reported to the doctor, did the supervisor sometimes come with medicine? A. Sometimes with medicine. Q. What was the medicine usually brought ? A. To quiet the patient, generally. Q. Do you know what it was ? A. I cannot give the names. Q. The quantity to be given was always put on to the bottle or phial ? A. On to the phial, yes, sir. Q. Did you have any difficulty in giving medicine to a patient ? A. No, sir; not very often; sometimes new patients would re- fuse to take medicine. Q. What was the rule in reference to ^the care of patients during the night ? A. The night watchman used to see to them during the night, sometimes used to call up any attendants to assist him, he would sometimes call up an attendant if it was necessary. A. Did you ever know an attendant to refuse to give any assist- ance ? A. No,'sir, I never did. Q. How many night watchmen are there on ward four ? A. One night watchman goes through two wards, and one on the •enter goes through once or twice during the night. Q. Is there any stationary watchman ? A. No, sir. Q. Do you know of patients having been brought on to that ward with the appearance of having received injuries ? A. Yes, sir. Q. From what ward were they brought ? A. Twelfth ward, I think. Q. Do you know the name of any patients having been so brought there ? A. I cannot say as I do remember any names now. Q. Do you remember any particular case where patients were brought from that Avard Avith an appearance of injury? A. No, sir. Q. Or remember what the injury was ? _ 47.U 1 370 A. I remember them being marked up 'soma; one of the eyes black for instance. Q. When a man came from ward twelve to ward four with an appearance of injury, what investigation AA'as made to ascertain how y. that injury occurred ? A. Most of us see it on bathing day generally. Q. What investigation was made to ascertain how that .injury occurred ? A. The attendant always wrote down what marks were on him, ' and he gave it to the supervisor, and he took it to the physician. Q. What did the physician do Avhen it was reported to him ? A. Examined the patient to see. Q. Would he go to the ward or take the patient to the office? A. Go to the ward generally. Q. Do you know7 of any instance where the patient was taken to the office ? A. No, sir ; I don't. Q. Was that examination made in your presence by the physicians? A. Not generally made in my presence, they would most ahvays .• take them into a room, and the head attendant would go in with '; him ; I don't know as I ever went in with him. Q. Do you know of any instance in which the patient Avas injured by wearing the camisole ? A. No, sir, I don't. Q. Do you know of any case where a patient complained of in- jury — I suppose they complained of having it on, but would they complain of its bruising them any? A. I have heard them complain of wearing it. Q. But that it hurt them ; did you ever hear them complain of that ? A. No, sir. Q. Do you know of any case where a patient complained of in- jury from the strap and wristlets ? A. No, sir. Q. Do you know of any case where a patient complained of any injury by the muff ? A. No, sir, I don't. . Q. Have you at any time seen sores upon the patient, apparently;, j done by the buckle of the camisole, or strap? 1 A. No, sir. j Q. Do you know of any instance where patients have severely'1 injured themselves while upon the ward? 'm A. Yes, sir, I think I do. "1 Q. Give the name of the patient, and what the injury was? A. Mr. C, he used to strike himself, would hammer himself side of the head, and bruise himself very bad. * Q. In that case what did you do ? A. We stopped him, and quieted him doAvn, if we could.; ne would have these spells for a few months perhaps. Q. Quieted him down by talking to him I suppose you mean? 371 A. Yes, sir. Q. What did you do if you could not quiet him down by talking to him ? A. Reported to the supervisors. Q. Then what was done? A. They would say they could not do any thing with him. Q. In these cases did they put restraints on them ? A. No, sir. Q. Do you knoAV of any case where a man did injury to himself severely and they did not put restraint on him; the patient you speak of as pounding his head, did they ever put restraints on him ? A. No, sir; not in my presence. Q. Do you know of any case where a patient was injured in the covered bed or where he injured himself in the covered bed ? A. I cannot say that I do. A. Do you know of any patients being injured by being put into the covered bed ? A. No, sir. Q. Do you think that there was attendants enough on ward four ; for instance how many attendants should you say ward four required, in order to have the work well done, and a proper attention given to the patients ? A. Five I should say. Q. And how long should you say they should be kept upon the ward, that is the attendant, how long should he continue on duty ? A. They should'be on the Avard from the time the patients get up in the morning until they Avent to bed ; while the patients were on the ward. Q. Suppose a patient was taken sick in the night, did that some- times occur ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What was done then ? A. Generally one of the attendants got up and sat up with him. Q. Was that all that Avas done about it? A. The night watchman would inform the doctor, and then would send him some medicine and sometimes cVune down and see him. Q. In occasions of sickness what would be done, sickness in the night ? A. The night watchman would report to the doctor, sometimes the doctor would come and sometimes he would send medicine. Q. Can you name an instance where a patient was taken violently , sick in the night Avhen a doctor did not come in person ? A. I have knoAvn of a patient being sick and the night watchman reporting him, and he got medicine, and could not give it alone and he would call up an attendant to give it to him. Q. Can you name patients where that occurred? A. Mr. McE. Q. What Avas the apparent difficulty with Mr. McE.; what was bis appearance — whether he appeared to be in great pain and suf- fering ? 372 A. Yes, sir. Q. And the physician did not come himself ? A. No, sir, not that I know of. Q. How would the physician in that case know what medicine to send the man ? A. The night watchman would tell him how he was as soon as he could. Q. The night watchmen are not physicians nor experts in cases of sickness are they ? A. No, sir. Q. Do you know of cases of patients being injured on your ward prior to January 15th, either by attendants or patients ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Name one? A. Mr. S. kicked Mr. McE. Q. How was Mr. McE. injured ? A. They got fighting and got injured before we could stop them. Q. Was that in your presence ? A. Yes, sir. Q. When you saw two patients getting to fighting what did you do ? A. I tried to part them as well as I could, sometimes I would be alone and sometimes there would be another attendant with me. Q. And in that case have you sometimes got injured ? £, A. Yes, sir, you could not help it. Q. Do you know of any case where a patient was injured by an attendant ? A. No, sir, I don't. F Q. Did you learn of any case where it was charged that an attend- ant injured a patient ? A. No, sir. Q. And sometimes did patients come down from ward twelve to the fourth ward and report that they had been injured by an attend- ant on the twelfth ward ? A. No, sir; I cannot say that they did. g?Q. Did you know Sage f A. Yes, sir. Q. He was on ward twelve ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you learn of any injuries inflicted by him on patients, and then that he would have them sent down to your ward ? A. I have heard patients say he injured them. Q. Have you ever heard mention of any patient who came into ward four apparently severely injured and complaining that Sage inflicted the injury ; if so, please give the name of the patient and the injury you discovered ? A. Mr. S. was one. B Q. What was his injury ? , A. He said he had been kicked. 373 vj. Who did he say kicked him ? A. Mr. Sage. Q. Did you examine him to see whether he had received injury? A. Yes, sir. Q. What did you find ? A. Found his side was bruised, and some black and blue round his body, and, I think, he had one black eye when he came to ward four. Q. What was done in his case ? A. What did the doctors do ? Q. Y^es ; what was done to investigate the truth of the charge « A. I don't think there was any thing done in particular ; it Was reported to the supervisor. Q. Do you know what the supervisor did ? A. No, sir; I don't. Q. Do you know of any other case ? A. No, sir ; I don't; not that I can remember now; such things slip anybody's mind, there was so much of it. Q. Do you know of any case where a patient was injured on ward four, and then sent to some other w7ard ? A. No, sir; I don't. Q. Do you know of any other case of injury on ward four where it was inflicted by an attendant ? A. No, sir. Q. Prior to January 15 did you see Mr. Weir inflict punishment on any patient ? [Objection raised. Objection sustained.] The Chairman — State the ground of the objection. We would alloAv any other witness to state what was done by Weir, but as I think these men are all in the same condition, it may affect their trial, perhaps, and as an objection is interposed, I think it is only fair to give them the benefit of it. [Objection sustained.] Mr. Morgan — I will ask the witness whether he was sworn before the coroner's jury? [Same objection ; upon the ground of privilege. Objection sus- t ained.] JAMES BROWN Sworn: [Counsel for Mr. Brown raised the same objection as had been made on behalf of the other two attendants ; but subject to the same restriction as to testimony; Mr. Brown consented to be, and was, examined as follows:] £■; 374 By the Chairman : Q. How long were you connected with the Utica Insane Asylum? A. Six months. Q. What position did you hold there ? A. An attendant. Q. Where were you stationed ? A. Fourth ward. Q. During the whole time that you were there? A. Yes, sir. Q. What were your duties ? A. To take care of the patients. Q. How many patients were you in charge of ? A. Twenty-four to twenty-seven. Q. Who was with you on that ward? A. Mr. Weir, Mr. Bills and Mr. Hoffman. Q. Have you ever seen patients on that ward showing marks of injuries ? A. I have. Q. Have you ever seen patients injured on that ward prior to the 15th of January ? A. I have. Q. Will you please state the names of any you now remember? A. McE. Q. Specify as to the circumstances attending that injury ? A. I saw another patient hit him. Q. What did you do ? A. I came as quick as I could to protect him from further im juries. j Q. Was he severely injured ? /._TlJ A. Not very, no, sir. ,- Q. Have you not seen any other patients injured on there? A. Not injured, I have seen them try to injure each other. Q. Have you seen patients there with black eyes ? A. I have. Q. Frequently? A. Not frequently. Q. Is it an unusual occurrence ? ' ' ' '„■ A. It is. Q. What do you mean by unusual ? A. Not very often. Q. Is there apt to be a patient or so with a black eye most of the time out of the twenty seven ? A. I do not understand that. Q. Did you see a man with one black eye a day on that ward ? A. No, sir. Q. Have you seen patients brought into that ward injured ? A. I have. Q. Or bruised ? 1 375 A. Well, injured in the face. Q. Can you name any at present *-. A. I cannot, I forget the names. Q. Have such patients been brought in'from other wards or direotly into the institution ? A. Well, directly into the institution. Q. Have you never seen patients brought in from other wards, bruised or injured ? A. Not that I can say. Q. But you have seen them brought in directly into the institu- tion \ A I. have. Q, Please name any that you have so seen. A. I don't believe I can name them Q. How many such have you seen ? A. Two. Q. How were they injured? A. The factf that appeared that they were on the ward Avhen they were injured, so the patient told us afterward. Q. Do you happen to remember the names of the patients? A. No, sir ; I do not. Q. Have you ever seen patients injured by attendants prior to the 15th of January ? A. I have. Q. Can you specify any instances? A. Why, no particular occasion. Q. Can you name any attendant who has been so injured ? A. Mr. Weir. Q. More than once ? A. He has been more than once, but I haven't seen him but once. Q. Please state the circumstances of that occasion as to how he was injured ? A. The patient was in his room, and the patient was mopping the room, and Mr. Weir told him not to until it was swept out, and he took the mop and hit Mr. Weir. Q. What did Weir do ? A. I guess he whistled for more help Q. Who came ? A. I did. Q. Any others? A. Mr. Hoffman. Q. What did you then do ? A. Tried to keep him from hurting Mr. Weir. Q. Did you put any restraint upon him ? A. I did not. Q. Did the patient make any further attempt to strike Mr. Weir? A. Afterward he did. Q. Did he attempt to strike any of the others ? A. He attempted to*strike Mr. Bills but not the same day. 376 Q. I mean on the occasion you had of restraining him ? A. No, sir; not on that occasion ; sometime afterward. Q. Do yon know of any other instances of patients striking attend- ants? A. I do. Q. Can you name them ? A. I was down at dinner one day, Mr. Bills told a patient to keep quiet; he was making a good deal of noise; Mr. P. got up and went for him. Q. Do you recollect any other ? A. No, sir. Q. Now about attendance of physicians; how often do the physi- cians come on ward four ? A. Sometimes twice and sometimes once a day. Q. Do they come at regular hours ? A. They do not. Q. About what hours do they generally come ? A. From ten to eleven in the forenoon and four to five in the afternoon. Q. Are these all the usual hours of their attendance ? * A. They are. Q. Is it usual for- them to call in those hours ? A. Sometimes they do. Q. They do come sometimes on other hours ? A. Yes, sir. Q. About what times do they come generally ? A. From ten to eleven o'clock in the forenoon and four or five in the afternoon. Q. So that you expect them between ten and eleven, and between four and five o'clock ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And at other times you don't expect them A. No, sir, I don't. Q. Do you know when they Avill come ? A. Yres, sir, we expect them. Q. What physicians do you refer to now ? A. Dr. Pilgrim and Dr. Backus. Q. Does Dr. Gray come sometimes ? A. Yes, sir, sometimes. Q. Does he come frequently ? A. No, sir, he does not. Q. How many times should you say you had seen him there on ward four since you were in the institution ? A. Two or three times. Q. Do you think that is all ? ^ A. I think that is all; I heard that he had been, bnt I did not see him. Q. Do you know any of the managers by sight ? 377 Q. Please state who you know by sight ? A. That is since this occurrence ? Q. No, at any time ? A. Mr. Lowery, Mr. Winston, Mr. Martin. / Q. Do you know Senator Campbell ? A. No,' sir, I don't. Q. Have you ever seen him ? A. Not as I know of. Q. Have you ever seen any of the managers you have named on Avard four ? A. I cannot say. Q. Is he the only manager that yon have seen on that ward ? A. Well, they may be there and I not know it. Q. But he is the only one that you have known to be a manager, and Avliom you have seen on that ward ? A. That is all, sir. Q. What are your hours of duty ? A. From six in the morning until eight or nine at night. Q. Where do you then go ? A. We have to go into our room then. Q. Are you then on duty or liable to be called on duty during the night ? A. Liable to be called at most any time. Q. Are you frequently called up in the night ? A. Yes, sir, quite often. Q. Is it your opinion that these hours of duty are too long ? A. I think they are. Q. So far as you know is a subject of comment among the attend- ants as to the length of hours? A. Yes, sir; they say it is too, and too long hours, and no privi- lege to get out. Q. Were you examined by the coroner's jury ? [Objection raised upon the ground that it is a privileged question; objection sustained. I Q Have you any complaint to make; or any statement concern- ing matters in the Asylum, that you think should be corrected ? A. Well, about having more help, I think they need more help there. Q. Of what kind? A. Attendants; and I think they should have more pay. Q. Do you wish to add to or qualify the testimony you have giVen before the coroner? [Objection raised upon the ground that it is privileged ; objection sustained.] By Mr. Rice : Q. How old are you ? A. Twenty-six. 48U 378 Q. What employment did occupy your time before going to~the Asylum ? . A. I was employed by Mr. Buckingham, here in the city. Q, What to do ? A. To take care of a team and deliver pianos round the city. v Q. How much do you weigh ? A. About two hundred pounds. Q. How tall are you ? A. Five feet ten or eleven. WM. T. GIBSON Sworn and examined, testified as follows : Examined by Mr. Morgan : Q. What is your age ? A. Sixty-one. Q. What is your calling ? A. Clergyman. Q. How long have you been for ? A. I was ordained in December, 1853. Q. Where do you reside ? A. In this city. Q. Are you chaplain of the Asylum ? - A. I hold that position. Q. For how long have you ? A. Since 1865. Q. From whom did you get your appointment ? A. From the board of managers, as I understand it. Q. What is your salary ? A. I commenced and for the largest portion of my time until a year ago at $100 a quarter ; a year ago last January I gave up all other parochial Avorks; gave up charge of a church ; I had to devote myself to this chiefly ; since then my compensation has been $200 a quarter. Q. Eight hundred dollars a year ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How often do you visit the Asylum, and Iioav often have you for the last four years ? A. I have service there every Sunday, every Lord's day, and I make occasional visits during the week, I might make a visit some- times one day, sometimes two or three days in the Aveek. Q. So that you visited it every week during the week days? A. Y'es, sir. Q. And in addition to that on the Sabbath ? A. YTes, sir. Q. When you are there on the Sabbath hoAV much time do you occupy ? 379 A. in the afternoon, usually, I go up at two o'clock and am there until five o'clock. Q. Your services are held in the church ? A. Yes, sir. Q. During the week day what is the time of your visit ? A. I generally go up some time during the afternoon ; there is no direct communication from my residence ; I go down towm by one line of street cars, and I usually take another to go to the Asylum. Q. What is the nature of your call; when you get there what do you do? A. I go through the Avards and find out if there are any sick per- sons who desire to see me especially, or if there has been any special inquiry for the purpose of conversing with a clergyman or minister; but I usually go through whether there is any such special call or not; I go through during the afternoon alone. Q. AVhat Avards do you usually visit ? A. I visit all the wards, except perhaps the most disturbed ones; I have been in all of the wards of course; I have been in No. 4; I do not visit it as frequently as I do the Avards where they are more amenable to conversation ; 1 have recently made up my mind that the most disturbed wards I should not visit as often as I have, if I find it seems to do them no good ; they are thoroughly incoherent, and utterly unable to folloAV any train of thought or ideas or conver- sation, or receive any such thing as comfort; I cannot reason with them to any extent, and I find that Avhen I come out they seem to ' think that because I am chaplain, and they think I do not reside there, and think I have some means of taking them away, and they are'very persistent in trying to go out with me and occasionally there will be a little disturbance or tussle or struggle after I go out; that is more particularly so on the women's side of the institution. Q. Do you become acquainted with the patients somewhat ? A. Yes, sir. Q. On ward two, who are you acquainted with on the men's side? A. W., R., C, and quite a number of others; I have been in the habit of identifying patients with the particular number of wards until quite a recent period. Q. When you go in there, do you talk Avith nearly all the patients in the various wards ? A. Not all, perhaps, but nearly all. Q. You pass a Avord with most of them ; merely time of day, I suppose ? A. YTes, sir. Q. And some you talk with ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Have you often met any there that were injured or that had the appearance of injury ? A. Of being hurt'? Q. Yes, sir ? A. Bodily ? 380 Q. Yes? * A. Occasionally I find persons that would seem to have sores or bruises on their faces'or head. Q. Black eyes ? A. I don't recollect now whether I have ever seen one with black eyes; I think I must have though. Q. Have you seen them with severe cuts on the head or face ? A. No, sir; I don't know that I ever saw that. Q. Have you had them complain to you of injuries? A. I don't recollect any particular case; I often hear a good many complain, but not of maltreatment, that is of bodily injuries. Q. What is the principal complaint they make? A. The general run of complaint they make is against the cruelty or Avrong-doing of some one in placing them there, and that they are being detained there wrongfully. Q. Do von know any of those there who are satisfied they ought to be ? A. Yes, sir.. Q. Then the number that think they ought not to be are much in excess of those who think they should be ? A. Yres, sir; the majority think they are unjustly confined. Q. Since you have been chaplain of the institution, have you heard patients complain that they have been misused by the attendants or received injuries from the attendants? A. I have heard them complain of being misused, ill-treated and • all that, but never heard them say any thing of having suffered bodily injuries or Uoavs ; I don't remember noAv of any thing; of that I am positive ; 1 have heard —if I stayed to think long enough to recollect some particular case—I have a distinct recollection, some three months ago of asking a patient that I always deemed a comparatively reasonable and intelligent man, whether he had ever observed any sugh thing, and Avanted him to tell me confidentially if he had ever seen any cruelty or maltreatment on the part of patients; he said " no ;" he said, " but I will tell you Avhere there is cruelty to patients, it is before they are brought here ;" he said, " I have seen them." Q. Have you seen patients put in restraint there? A. YTes, sir. Q. Have you at any time noticed that the restraint Avas so severe, and for instance, the jacket so tight, or the belt as to injure the patient, so that they would complain it hurt them ? A. No, sir; I don't remember any such case of that kind. Q. Do you remember seeing patients in the " camisole ? " A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you ever have a patient complain to you that it hurt them? A. No, sir. Q. Or complain of the buckle in the back injuring them ? A. JN'o, sir. 381 Q. Or that their hands were thrown or tied across them, as to hurt them ? A. No, sir ; I don't remember any such thing. Q. Have you at any time attempted to talk with the patient who was in the camisole ? A. Yes, sir, and it seems they are apt to be persons in that con- dition, who are apt to be so disturbed that you got no"coherent ansAver and I dare say, if the apparatus Avere painful or bruising them they would hardly be conscious of it. Q. Have you seen men, from your OAvn examination, any time, that indicated to you that they were being injured by the restraint? A. No, sir; I never have. Q. Yrou have seen the strap that they put around them; a strap they put around the wrists ? A. Yres, sir; "muffs" they call them. Q. And have you seen the strap around the waisf and wrists? A. Yes, sir. Q. With the hands at liberty ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Have you ever seen such cases, when you thought the patient was being injured ? A. No, sir, I don't think I have. Q. Is there any thing about the motion that would be likely to injure the patient? A. No, sir; I never looked at the inside of the construction of one of these things to see. but I have seen them on the patients; and not so much of late years as formerly ; there has been a steady diminution in that respect; occasions are much rarer now. Q. They did not use such restraints as these a few years ago ? A. No, sir; there seems to have been a decrease in that respect. Q. They have another restraint termed the straight jacket, pants, coat, and vest and all in one ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And fastened back of the neck ; you have seen those ? A. Yres, sir; I don't think I have seen more than two or three since I have been there. Q. They haven't used these of late years much, have they ? A. No, sir; I have seen them on disturbed women in the rear wards ; I recollect a case of Mrs. S. she suffered from maniacal tend- encies and would denude herself in spite of every thing ; would de- stroy her clothing and she had to wear one of these; I have seen her in the airing court in the rear; Avhere they are not visible of course to the neighborhood; I never heard any complaint of them, though — Q. Do you think the discontinuance of the restraint is beneficial ? A. You ask me my opinion ? Q. Yes. A. The matter has been very much discussed in our psychological journals, both in Europe and in this country; I have had occasion to investigate the question a good deal as the result of discussions in 382 the French and German associations on the subject; they do not go so far as the English physicians; the English physicians and specialists seem to wish to get rid otf the restraint entirely, to abolish it, and that has had its effect in this country; there is no doubt the medical men in this country are seeking to reduce the restraint to a minimum. Our institutions here haAren't got aboAre it altogether; they take the ground that restraint enough should be used when necessary, bnt they agree that it should be dispensed with if possible; if it is possible to get along without it. There is a great deal of dif- ference of opinion in that respect. From my observation of a good many years, I have considered that restraint Avas jjreferable to another alternative that Avas likely to be substituted for it : there are many alternatives such as the use of drugs, and the use of seclu- sion, secluding them in a room, but for myself, I think that is very much more cruel and undesirable than any restraint. Q. You think* that shutting a patient in a room by themselves is less desirable than any other form ? A. Yes, sir, I think it is a form of punishment that is objec- tionable. Q. Do you now recollect any instance in which you think that the restraint has been applied where it would have been better to have left it off? A. No, sir, I don't recollect any instance now; I cannot remem- ber of any case in which I think it would have been better — I can remember some occasion in which I think it would have been better to have used it than it would be to depend upon mere manual strength, physical appliance. Q. In the absence of restraint or close confinement the physical force must be sufficient to restrain them ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And in using that physical appliance what is the danger, if any ? A. The danger is that it cannot be uniform; it cannot be steadv, it is apt to be spasmodic; it is liable to get the better of a person s judgment and temper, unless they are very well-disciplined persons indeed; and then again I think the personal handling and force applied to a patient is more resented by them, so far as my inter- course with them goes; it is very difficult for them to realize that they are in any condition requiring to be put under other persons. Q. Has a patient ever made any demonstration against you when you have been in there — or attempted any violence upon you ? A. I have never been on very friendly terms with the patients, and for that reason I think they have always treated me with a great deal of deference and every respect. Q. (Repeated.) A. No, sir; one case in ward four, a man came up to me, claim- ing to be the devil, and he wanted to enter into a conflict there and then with me, as a minister, and he was going to suit the action to the word; he said the devil could knock me through my pulpit quicker than I could say Jack Robinson; I think he intended to 383 make an onslaughter on me, but a number of the patients took hold of him, and the impulse passed off in a moment. That is the only case I remember in the institution ; at another time a patient once jumped up in the rear of the chapel, and ran doAvn the aisle with all his might, with the intention of committing an assault upon me in the pulpit, but just before he reached the pulpit, and at the edge of the aisle, one of the other patients put his foot out and tripped him and he fell to the floors then the attendants came up and took him, and carried him out. Q. Did he get injured with the fall ? A. No, sir, I don't think so. Q. How often have you seen Dr. Gray among the patients in the wards ? A. I very seldom happened to meet him, I have met him in the halls occasionally, and I have been with him with boards of super- visors, and other officers visiting the institution; last week I went to see a dying man on the number ten —an attendant told me he was dying; I found Dr. Gray there then holding his hands, and the father of the young man Avas present. Q. Do you remember who the young man was that was dying ? A. Mr. B. Q. How is it about the other physicians ? A. They came through the halls in the forenoon ; I generally go alone in the afternoon. Q. When you go there do you have a key to go Avhere you wish? A. Yes, sir, I get a key in the front office. Q. Do you know of any abuses as between the attendants or phy- sicians and the patients ? A. No, sir, I do not know of any, I have never seen any." By the Chairman : Q. If there were any abuses in that Asylum by the attendants of the patients, would you be likely to Iciioav it ? A. I don't think it Avould folloAV that I should know it, there may be and I not know it; they never know when I am coming or Avhat day I am coming, I may come at different hours of the day to dif- ferent wards, so that it would seem I should be likely to run upon something if it occured. Q/ Hoav long do you stay on each visit ? A. All the afternoon until evening after tea. Q. How much time have you spent on the violent ward — four? A. Yery little ; I have passed through ; in the summer the patients frequently find it pleasant Aveather and are out in the yard. Q. Hoav often have you seen Dr. Gray on any of the wards? A. I cannot tell you Iioav often ; it is not very often. Q. Hoav often have you seen him there during the last year? A. That is since his sickness. Q. Yes? A. I think that his duties have been a great deal interrupted since \ 384 that shock ; I cannot say but what he has been off on meetings of the National Association of Medical Superintendents of Asylums; they met at Newport last year, I think; but I haven't kept track of his absences. Q. Hoav often have you seen him at the institution on the wards during the past year ? A. I do not believe I can tell you that. Q. Hoav often have you met him in your walks through the Avards during the past year ? A. I cannot say how many times. Q. Have you met him on the wards during the.past year at all, outside of the office and in the wards ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do you recollect any wards that you have seen him on ? A. I havs seen him on the first ward. Q. Any others ? A. I have seen him on the sixth and tenth wards, I think ; and I think I have seen him over on the fourth ward, on the south side, but it is not very often ; it was on a few occasions. Q. Three or four times ? A. Y es, sir ; I should say three or four times, and probably half a dozen times. Q. Have you seen any of the other doctors on the Avard, more frequently ? A. Yes, sir; they come at their regular hours in the forenoon, but they often slip through in the afternoon. Q. Has your attention ever been called to the number of hours that the attendants are on duty in the Asylum ? A. No, sir ; I have seen blank reports filled out, which shows it though. Q. Do you know what hours of duty they have ? A. No, sir. Q. Have you any idea ? A. They only have special leave occasionally, in the evening from six until ten ; but that is only occasionally ; I think. Q. As often as once a week ? A. They have every other Sunday off and an evening in every week. Q. How long are they on duty ; as near as you know ? A. Every day ; I should think the whole day. Q. What do you call a whole day; from what hour in the morn- ing, until what hour in the evening ? A. From six o'clock in the morning until the same hour at night? Q. Are they not later in the evening ? A. Well, they have special changes, and alternations ; I confess I don't know much about that. Q. What is your judgment of the character of the attendants employed there ? / 385 A. Those who have been there a great length of time, are of a very superior character; I think as good as can be obtained. Q. Hoav about those who are more recently employed ? A. They don't seem to be quite as accustomed to the place, and are not up to the work as those who have been there a great length of time. Q. If you knew Avhen the attendants were on duty fourteen hours a day would you regard that as excessive ? A. I should think it a very severe tax. Q. Would you recommend any change in that regard ? A. I have never heard any thing said on the subject, and I do not know that my attention has been called to it at any time;-! should want to make comparisons of the present state of things, and know exactly what the figures are ; I think fourteen hours a day is hard work, especially on the disturbed Avards, and yet it might not be on the others — the quiet and convalescent w7ards and the hospital; it would not be; but on the disturbed wards, I think, it would be too much, I should say. Q. And if you were informed that, after fourteen hours' duty, day time, they had to get up frequently to care for them during the night, Avould you think that the duties Were excessive? A. I think I should; think it would soon result in disturbing their oavii nervous system. Q. Are you acquainted with members of the board of manage- ment ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do you see them on the wards frequently ? A. No, sir. Q. Do you see them occasionally ? A. Yes, sir, occasionally, that is when they are on meeting. Q. Do you ever see any of them on any of the wards, and can you name any member of the board that you have seen on the wards alone during the past year ? A. I don't recollect any case. Q. Not a single one ? A. There may have been, but I haven't happened to meet them. Q. Have you been there as often as three times a w7eek during the past year ? A. I don't think it would average that, some weeks I have been there every day. Q. But it would hardly average three times a week ? A. No, sir, twice it Avould average, and perhaps a little over; my A-isits extended there almost the whole of the afternoon and the last part of the forenoon sometimes. [A paper produced by fiie witness and handed to counsel.] Q. Yrou produce some suggestions of your own for changes in the institution ? A. Well, changes in the system — some changes. Q. Do they go to changes in the management of this particular institution ? 49U 386 A. They wojld of course affect this and-others too. Q. Do you re jommend any changes in this institution ? A. I would recommend changes in the law, which would effect changes here too. Q. Do you think any improvement is possible in this institution under the existing law ? A. Yes, sir, I do. Q. Suggest any change that occurs to you, that you would recom- mend. A. There are cases of persons who are con\7alescent, and it is very difficult to determine the precise point at which they ought to be allowed to go home ; it seems to me that we ought to have the pro- vision of the English law here, allowing them to go on trial and leave of absence, otherAvise there is a great tendency or temptation to detain persons until they were beyond all dispute ; well, and this I think should not be done. Q. There is one suggestion here that I will call .your attention to: Have you any suggestions to make as to putting the employees of the Asylum and attendants into uniform ? A. Yes, sir; I think there are those in the Asylum, as I said a few minutes ago, many persons who have been their oavu masters and are very slow to learn that any persons have any right to med- dle or interfere with them much more to direct them, and it seems to me to be* a prolific source of trouble between patients and attendants; it would be done away with to a great extent if the attendants were put in uniform; a simple uniform, I think, the greater number of patients would recognize the authority of the Asylum in a uniform on the attendants. ALBERT SPENCER ( Sworn. Examined by Mr. R. Q. You are one of the coroners of the county ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What is your age ? A. Sixty-four. Q. How long have you been coroner ? A. One year the first of last January. Q. Since you have held that office, how many times have you been called to the Asylum in an official caoacity ? A. Three times. Q. What w7as the first ? A. The first was the case of a man working on a farm, a case of sunstroke. Q. Do you remember his name ? 387 A. Yes, sir; S. Q. Was he a patient ? A. No, sir; he Avas working on a farm, by the day, in the hoeing season ; the second case was a patient escaped from the grounds who droAvned himself in the Erie canal; that was last summer some time. Q. Upon an examination of that case did you learn how he effected his escape ? A. I think he was with the attendants in the grounds somewhere in the rear of the Asylum, and the gates being open he got away from them, and ran out of the grounds, and out down to the canal and jumped in. Q. In the examination of that case was there any blame resting upon the attendants ? A. There did not appear to be any shown. Q. Do you recollect the case of Mr. Hughes ? A. Yes, sir. Q. When where you first notified of the death of Hughes ? A. 1 can tell by referring to my minutes February 2, 1884. Q. Who called upon and gave you notice of the death of Hughes ? A. Dr. Gray sent me notice. Q. By letter? A. Yes, sir. Q. And by hand of some messenger ? A. By his OAvn handwriting and signed by himself ; it was sent by an attendant or attache of the institution. Q. What time in the day or night did you first arrive at the Asylum ? A. Between eight and nine o'clock in the morning of Saturday. Q. What did you do ? A. The inquest commenced the taking of evidence. Q. Did the jury and yourself view the body ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you have a physician other than one from the Asylum to examine the body ? A. i\o, sir, I did not. Q. Who made the post mortem f A. Dr. Backus made the examination. Q. Was there a post mortem f A. No, sir, not at the Asylum. Q. When did the inquest close ? A. Thirteenth of February. Q. Have you a copy of the evidence ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Have you a separate copy of evidence ? A. No, sir, I have not; I have the evidence taken up to the time that Mr. Matteson Avas in attendance there, and Avas taken by a stenographer and I could not follow it. Q. Have the stenographer's minutes been transcribed ? A. No, sir, I think not; I don't know but they were delivered to the district-attorney. 388 Q. And the evidence that was taken by the coroner has not been taken off with a type-writer ? A. No, sir; it was to have been done, but I guess they did not finish it. i By Mr. Haskell : . Q. You say you were sent for by Dr. Gray the same evening? A. No, sir, the next morning after it happened, but I think the letter was written the same evening, and I understood Dr. Gray to say that. Q. When did you see Dr. Gray, to have a conversation with him about the matter ? A. Between eight and nine o'clock Saturday morning after the man died. Q. What did he say in regard to his death ? A. He said the man had died from some injury he supposed, he did not knoAV ; he was desirous that I should make a thorough in- vestigation of the matter; he had sent for General McQuaid, and General McQuaid came in and also made investigation. Q. What account did Dr. Gray give you in regard to the injuries received by you ? A. None. Q. What examination was made of the body to ascertain the ex- tent of the injuries ? j A. I have the testimony or Dr. Backus in regard to that. Q. There was no post mortem f A. No, sir. Q. And the body was removed on Saturday ? A. Y es, sir; on Saturday afternoon after the jury viewed the body. Q. State why there was no post mortem examination of the body? A. I didn't deem it necessary at the time, for I did not know what the man died of or what injuries he had received, or any thing about it. . Q. That was the reason why you didn't think it necessary ? A. That was the reason. Q. Did Dr. Gray or any one on behalf of the institution suggest the necessity of a post mortem f A. No, sir. By Mr. Morgan : Q. Had yon been familiar with any of the facts as-disclosed by the evidence, would you have permitted that body to have been taken away until there had been a post mortem ? A. I think not. Q. In order that you might have become entirely familiar with the condition of the body ? 389 A. Yes, sir; we became more familiar after the evidence. Q. And of the cause of the death ? A. Yes, sir. Q. But at the time yon permitted the body to be taken away, you had not been apprised by Dr. Gray or any other person, of the extent of the injuries? A. I had not been informed of the amount of the injuries, in fact I had not been there at the time the body was taken away; I did not know what injuries the man had received, until Dr. Backus was sworn on the stand. [It is understood that this witness is to furnish to the committee a copy of evidence taken before him, as coroner.] THEODORE POMEROY, Sworn and examined, testified as follows : By the Chairman : Q. Where do you reside ? A. Utica. Q. What is your age ? A. Sixty-four ; I was born in 1820. Q. What is your business ? A. Oil cloth manufacturer. Q. What position do yon occupy Avith relation to the Utica In- sane Asylum ? A. I am one of the board of managers. Q. How long have you been one of the managers? A. Since 1872. Q. How often have you attended the meetings of the board ? A. I was looking over that matter ; I supposed you would ask me that; I have attended all the meetings but four since I have been a manager — all the meetings special and regular. Q. How many special meetings have there been in any one year ? A. Well, there have been sixty-nine meetings in all, and there are four regular ones in the year. Q. Who made your appointment ? A. Governor Hoffman, I think. Q. How did you come to be appointed ? A. I presume I was appointed on the recommendation of Senator LoAvery who was then in the Senate ; I think I am indebted to him without my knowledge or consent. Q. Did you make any application for the appointment ? A. No, sir; I knew nothing about it until I saAv it in the paper, : and I have always been sorry that I was appointed ; I had no idea ( of it. 390 Q. How much visitation have you made to the asylum ? _ A We have generally at the quarterly meetings visited it; more or less of the board have visited portions of the asylum, perhaps not all of the wards at once, but we have always made a thorough visita- tion once a year, occupying two or three hours, and, as I have said, at all of the' quarterly meetings more or less of the wards. Q. Have you yourself visited the wards from time to time i A. Not very often. Q. Hoav often in a, year ? A. Perhaps I have been there once or twice? Q. On those occasions have you ever gone all through ? A. No, sir, except at the annual meetings. Q. On these extra occasions about how many wards have you gone through at a time? Q Usually we have gone through sometimes for the purpose of examining work that has been in progress in the way of repairs or additions. Q. Mechanical work ? A. Yes, sir ; those things have been looked after as they pro- gressed, pretty ^generally. Q. Have you made any examination from time to time as to the condition of the patients ? A. I should not feel qualified to make any examination any fur- ther than to inquire of the medical men. Q. Have you ever made inquiries as to the general comfort, etc., of the patients ? A. I have in a general way. Q. Of the patients themselves ? A. Yes, sir ; I have often conversed with the patients themselves, and almost always talked with more or less of the patients as I would go through. Q. Into what wards have you usually gone ? A. Usually into the more quiet wards, except on the occasion of a thorough visitation. Q. Have you asked the patients at any time if they had any com- plaints to make? A. They generally make them ; we do not have to ask them much. Q. Of what do they usually complain ? A. Most generally that they ought not to be detained there. Q. That they are sane ? A. Yes, sir; and they have complained generally. Q. Do they ever complain of the attendants ? Q. I have never heard any complaints made by them of the attendants. Q. Have you ever heard any complaint from a patient of being struck by an attendant, or that an attendant had struck another patient ? A. No, sir; I never heard one of them say that, or complain of any ill-treatment; I do not remember that any of them have ever 391 spoken i^ me of ill-treatment, further than they have made com- plaints of the food. Q. What attention does Dr. Gray give to the patients personally to your knoAvledge ? A. I do not think I should be able to answer very satisfactory on that point, not being there but seldom myself ; I notice, however, that whenever Dr. Gray goes, as I have often been through Avith him, the patients seemed to be very familiar Avith him, and treat him Avith a great deal of consideration. Q. Hoav often do you think Dr. Gray visits the wards ? A. Well, I suppose Dr. Gray goes whenever it is necessary for him to give personal attention to auy thing; I think I could say that much. Q. Hoav frequently, in point of time, do you suppose he would go there ? A. That, of course, would depend upon his own judgment as to the necessity of the case, very likely. Q. What is your present impression as to about how often he Avould be likely to go there through the wards ? A. I do not believe the doctor Avould neglect any duty, that is all; I think he is a very conscientious man in the discharge of his duty, that is my experience from my knowledge of him and a long acquaintance. Q. You really have no idea then, as to hoAV often he goes into the Avards ? A. No, sir ; I have nothing to base an ansAver upon ; I do not know; I could not tell you with any accuracy. Q. How are the supplies for the institution purchased ? A. A bill is made out for the ordinary wants of the institution, and Mr. Dryer sees that they are purchased, I think they are made out by Dr. Gray himself mainly, but I don't know for certain. Q. Where were the supplies for the institution usually purchased ? A. I think there are more than a hundred different places in the the city (Utica), I think I have heard that there were one hundred and twenty places in town ; more than I supposed until I made special inquiry. Q. Where are the bulk of the supplies purchased ? A. I suppose the larger bills are purchased of Butler & Hamilton, more than elsewhere, that is my supposition about it. Q. How long have they purchased of that firm ? A. All the time that I have been there, and I do not know how much longer. Q. They are retail grocers? A. Yes, sir; I think they are — they may wholesale to some extent. Q. Have you ever visited their establishment yourself? A. Yes, sir ; I haA7e been there. Q. On behalf of the Asylum ? A. No, sir. 392 Q. That you have never interfered with? A. No, sir; it was a contract in operation when I went there; I think I never have seen any thing to lead me think, or feel that it was not faithfully carried out. Q. Have you ever seen the contract ? A. I have not read the contract. Q. Have you ever seen it ? A. No, sir. Q. Have you any idea of its nature or contents ? A. I know there is a live per cent commission; it has been fre- quently talked of in the board. Q. What is this five per cent commission upon —what class of roods? A. I do not think it covers every thing, I am quite sure it does not. Q. Generally speaking, what does it cover to your recollection? A. I think it covers some kinds of sugar and molasses, and some of the more staple of the articles, those that are most used. Q. And as to the other articles of goods in their line — what arrangement is there between the asylum and th«t firm on such other goods ? A. I do not think the five per cent covers every thing, but some of the specific articles that I have named.. Q. Except those is there any arrangement to your knowledge ? A. No, sir ; not to my knowledge. Q. What is the basis of the prices ; simply a question of reasona- ble charge, or market price, or what ? A. Well, do you mean in regard to those not included in the — under the five per cent commission ? Q. Yes. A. I think that they are charged at about the ordinary market prices. Q. The ordinary wholesale or retail market prices do you mean? A. They are not wholesale dealers. Q. Would you, therefore, infer that the prices are retail ? A. I should infer that they were; I think that they would be very likely to be, but they would make them at a reasonable charge of profit, probably more than five per cent. Q. But less than the ordinary retail profits ? A. I should think they would. Q. Have you ever examined to see? A. I have never been in that position, it has not come under my especial duty. Q. Has it ever been a subject of inquiry by the board as to the method of purchasing? A. Yes; they have talked about it a good deal. Q. What steps have you taken to inform \7ourselves as to the closeness of prices and economy in purchasing? A. The matter, I think, has been in the hands of the steward, 393 and I do not know that there have been ; whether he goes round and ascertains about prices, I do not know. Q. Then the board, so far as you know, have taken no steps to » ascertain how close prices are obtained? A. The auditing committee has that matter in charge, and they go over all these bills; and we expect the auditing committee, if they see any thing irregular that requires attention, that they will report it to the board. Q. Then, so far as you know, none of the board, outside of the auditing committee, feel any responsibility about it? A. I would not say that. Q. So far as you know have any members of the board taken steps to ascertain whether the goods are purchased closely and economi- cally or not ? A. I understand that they have; it has been a matter in which several of the members of the board have personally taken steps. Q. Can you name those members of the board who have taken such steps? A. I think that General McQuaid was one; I have talked with him on the subject myself more than once; I do not remember any others now. Q. He is the only one ? A. Yes, sir; that I remember of. Q. What time w7as it that he spoke on the subject when it has been up before the board ? A. At various times. Q. Have von ever examined any of the bills of Butler & Ham- ilton ? A. Well, I have examined them with the other members of the board.; I have examined them Avith all the care I could ; I have also had the books of the treasurer and seen that they have tallied with the checks. Q. Were such bills examined by the auditing committee before or after they were paid ? A. After they were paid; they do not come into the hands of the auditing committee until after they have been paid and have been through the secretary and treasurer's office. Q. Then the auditing is not so much of the bills themselves as it is of the treasurer's accounts? A. Yes; that is the truth about it; we wanted to see if they tallied ; if the invoices tallied and to see that the business was done correctly. Q. If yon found that the prices charged Avere higher than the ordinary prices for the same articles at other stores, what would you do Avith regard to such items on the bills ? A. If they were charged at a higher price at Butler & Hamil- ton's thau at any other store, do you mean ? Q. Yes? 50 U 394 A. I should buy them where I could buy at the lowest price, pro- vided the quality was equal in both cases. Q. Did you ever notice any such difference in price in their bills? A. i do not remember ; when I was a member of the- auditing committee, I have questioned, biit not on their bills so much as on one or two other bills; I have never thought that Butler & Hamilton overcharged; 1 had confidence in them; I supposed the rule was fixed and that the commission w7as little enough, as little as any body could afford to do the business upon. Q. Has the board ever thought it expedient to make purchases of such staple articles themselves at wholesale? A. No, sir; I do not think that they have; not to my know- ledge. Q. How much flour do they use there in a month ? A. I don't know that I could tell you ; I have heard but it is out of my mind now Q. Have you any idea? A. I would not undertake to say from recollection, for I can- not remember. Q. Could you say how many barrels of sugar they used in a year? A. No, sir. Q. Or hoAV many boxes of tea ? A. No, sir. Q. Have you any idea at all as to the amount of supplies ? A. I knew7 aboutjthe average cost in the year; our report shows the amount expended for provisions, etc.; I refer to the annual re- port. Q. How much would you say was expended for provisions in the year ? A. My memory of figures is pretty poor; I have been looking over the reports recently but I could not remember them. Q. Have you any idea how much is spent by the institution in the year in the way of provisions alone ? A. It must be over a hundred and---- well, I would not say; I have not charged myself with remembering those things. Q. So that you have no idea of how much has been spent amiu- nually for provisions? A. I would not undertake to tell you, no, sir. Q. How are the drugs and medicines purchased ? A. By the medical authorities there ; they Avould naturally do so. Q. Are those bills audited in the same way? A. Yes, sir. Q. Where are the drugs purchased ? A. Largely in New Y'ork, Ithink ; that is my impression about it. Q. Do you .know whether they are purchased at all in Utica? A. I could not tell you. Q. Do yon know* where they would be purchased in Utica if any were purchased there ? A. Ithink they would be purchased generally, some, I think, at 395 Kilgore's and, possibly, Blackie's; those two firms would furnish the larger proportion, and I rather think they do. Q. So that you believe the drugs are purchased in Utica, some of them, at least ? A. Yes, sir; some of them are undoubtedly purchased here. Q. Are you satisfied with the present system of purchasing sup- plies ; do you think entirely by Dr. Gray and the steward the proper method of purchasing ? A. I have never doubted it but what it was, and yet I would not say that it could not be improved upon, especially in view of the general impression, if it be so, that there is looseness there. Q. Is it your impression that there is looseness there ? A. No, sir, it is not ; I have been there long enough, and. watched it close enough to feel very well satisfied that it is a remark ably well managed institution, and Avell conducted. Q. By that you refer to Dr. Gray's executive management ? A. I have a very good opinion of that. Q. And the institution is largely controlled by him? A. Why, certainly; and it should be—he is the responsible head of it. Q Are you satisfied that it is wise that the duty of purchasing supplies and generally managing the domestic branch of the institu- tion should be intrusted to Dr. Gra}7? A. I think if a man can be found who is capable of doing it ad- mirably, all through, that such a man should do it. Q. Do you think he is capable of transacting that as well as con- ducting the scientific part of the institution a A. I think so; I do ; I may overrate him, but I have a very great confidence in his ability in all directions where he puts it forth. Q. Do you not think that his time could be more profitably em- ployed in the scientific department of the asylum — the professional part? A. Well, it depends altogether upon how much time he would give to those details ; I don't think it is necessary for one to give the time that would interfere with other and more important duties. Q. That is to say, that you think that the purchases and super- vision of the supplies would not take a great deal of time? A. Well, there is a routine about that business, and it Avould not seem to me to be very difficult or take up a great deal of time of the doctor. Q. Do you think his supervision of the farm and other outside work on the estate takes much of his time ? A. I should not think it did ; I think heTias got on well in good skillful management, and it seems to me to be a protective and valu- able help. Q. If you found that he did not very often visit the patients, and that it Avas urged in excuse that his time was much taken up with the executive management of the institution in other branches, 396 would you then think it was wise to release him from such outside work? A. I think that the chief place for his active work is in the medi- cal department of the institution. Q. Would you be disposed to recommend that he be confined substantially to that branch of the asylum? A. I would if the other branch did not suffer in consequence. Q. Do you think that the managers could profitably spend more time in visiting the asylum itself ? A. I have not thought so. Q. Have you preferred to leave that to the superintendent ? A. I may have erroneous notions about that, but I have noticed frequently that it produced great disturbance in many ways, and the patients it seems to me are injured by the excitement of members going through, you would say so yourself if you were there to see so much of it as I have. Q. Would you think it would be unwise to have a single member of the board go through at intervals ? A. No, sir ; but I don't think a single member would accomplish the result that a number would. Q. Do you not think it would be wise to establish some such practice and regular form of visitation in each and every ward in the building by some member of the board? A. It would be if any of the board were physicians, but where they are business men, I should say it would not as far as the patients are concerned ; I never thought I was any help any more than the impression I got through my eyes and ears ; I do think however that it would be probably an advantage and be very useful for the managers to visit the institution frequently. Q. Do you think they are visited frequently enough at present? A. I should not feel that there Avas any lack of duty so far as I have observed. Q. Were you before the committee last year ? A. No, sir. ' 397 PUBLIUS Y. ROGERS: Sworn and examined, testified as follows: By the Chairman : Q. Wat is your age ? A. Fifty-nine. Q. What is your business ? A. Banker ; I am presb ent of the first national bank. Q. What position do you hold with reference to the Asylum ? A. Manager. Q. How long have you been a manager ? A. Since December, 1881. Q. By whom were you appointed ? A. Governor Cornell. ' Q. Please state the circumstances attending your appointment« A. I was appointed to take the place of George B. Anderson who resigned. Q. Did you ask for the place ? A. No, sir; and I did not know I was in nomination for it until I found my name sent in, in the spring of 1881. _ Q. How many meetings did they have at the asylum in that par- ticular period ? r A. Regular meetings ? four each year. Q. How frequentlydid they hold special meetings ? A. It is irregnlar; sometimes, I think, there have been half a dozen at my office. Q. Roughly, how many meetings are there ? A. I think I have attended eighteen, regular and special, at the Asylum, not counting the half a dozen at my office. Q. Since your appointment ? A. Yes, sir; in December, 1881. Q. Hoav often have you visited the Asylum for the purpose of in- specting the wards ? A. That would be impossible to state correctly ; some of the time during the last summerl was there a good many times, growing out of the fact that I was on special committee connected with the building of an addition. Q. On those occasions did you go about the wards pretty gene- A Not through all of them, but I took occasion to visit portions of them, and another portion afterward. Q. So that in the course of a few visits you would go over the whole Asylum, in a few wards at the time ?' A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you go over the whole Asylum by such visit ? A. Yes, sir. 398 ' Q. How many times did you visit each ward during the whole year? A Take the whole Asylum right through, probably not over six or seven times, perhaps seven. Q. You have visited each ward in the Asylum as much as six or seven times during the past year ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Are yon familiar with the duties of the attendants and servants in the Asylum ? A. No, sir, not perfectly. Q. Do you know about what hours of service or duty they have each day ? A. The attendants have fifteen hours, I think. Q. And are liable to be called on for duty at night besides? A. Yes, sir. Q. What pay do they get? A. Their pay is regulated on the men's side. Q. What is the lowest ? A. Twenty dollars, and I think it increased some two dollars Q. By that do yon mean financial? A. Yes, sir; I have been on special committees and I have been on the committee of water supply, which has taken a jjreat deal of time. £ 405 Q. As to the purchase of supplies, is it your belief that the asylum makes its purchases as closely and economically as -possible ? A. That is a difficult question to answer, for I have not scanned these bills Avith care myself; so far as I am informed, their goods are bought with due regard to economy. Q. Then, as I understand, that is entirely left to the board of managers to the auditing committee ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And so far as you know, the practical work is really done by Dr. Gray and the steward ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And that no attempt is made to interfere with their purchases or regulate them on behalf of the manager ? A. I should say that that is not quite true, that I have heard sug- gestions made with the board of managers at their meeting to en- quire whether flour, for example, might not be bought directly from the mills, and they have received no reply yet; this particular subject can be dealt with by business men on the board, who are more familiar with the matter, and they can suggest methods to be adopted in purchasing; and they have made suggestions to the full board. Q. What action has been taken upon such suggestions ? A. I don't think the board have acted upon it yet. Q. Was Dr. Gray present when the suggestions were made? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did he reply that in his judgment purchases were made to the best advantage at the present time? A. I don't recollect. Q. Do you remember whether Dr. Gray took any part in the dis- cussion about prices ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did he suggest that a change should be made? A. I don't think that he suggested it, but said that there was no objection to the effort to obtain supplies elseAvhere, he had no objec- tion. Q. Did he seem to think they were bought to good advantage at present, or that there was no occasion for a change ? A. He did not express himself with any positiveness about it, that is according to my recollection. Q. I understand you to say that the board, in such discussion, took no further action ? A. No, sir ; not at that time. Q. About what time was that? A. Last April, I should think. Q. April, 1883 ? A. Yes, sir. , Q. Was the question raised on any other occasion ? A. I don't remember it on any other occasion. Q. Who raised the question at the board meeting? 406 A. I think it may have been Mr. Winston. Q. Has any other member of the board raised the question of a change in the making of purchase ? A. I recollect none now. Q. Has any member of the board made any suggestion toward a change in the duties and responsibilities of Dr. Gray ? A. No, sir, not that I know of. Q. Has any recommendation been made by any member of the board whether the steward should take a more direct control of the purchases, and leave Dr. Gray to the management of the medical department of the Asylum? A. I don't know that I recollect any suggestions at the meetings of the managers. Q. Has any suggestion been informally made by any members of the board ? A. I have made a suggestion that possibly an assistant to the steward would give the steward more time for canvassing the mar- ket as to values; most of my work has been in connection with this Avater supply, a special committee; I feel at liberty to leave other things to a special committee. Q. About the supply of gas, where does the institution obtain its gas ? A. Utica gas light company. Q. What rate do they pay a thousand ? A. One dollar and seventy-five cents. Q. What is the rate for retail consumers ? A. One dollar and ninety-five cents, after all the deductions are made ? Q. What is the rate for mills, etc. ? A. The same as the Asylum. Q. Do you believe the Asylum gets it as low as it is furnished any- where in Utica ? A. Yes, sir. Q. There w7as some trouble about that some years ago, was there not, when it was thought that the Asylum was paying more for gas than they should ? A. Not in my recollection. Q. Has there been any reduction in the price of gas since you have been a member of the board ? A. I think a contract has been made reducing its price to $1.75. Q. When was this contract made ? A. I should say it was about a year ago ; the charges for gas have been charged to the private consumers by a reduction'of twenty-nVe per cent it is $2.25, which is less by thirty cents a thousand. Q. What has caused that reduction ; the water gas company being here? . 5 k j « A. That is all used by the same company; water gas and coal gas; the gas company generally in the city of Utica has been in ad- vance of the demand of its supply for a reduction. 407 Q. Do you know, as a fact, that the price of gas was lower to public buildings and hotels, etc., than the asylum? A. Yes, sir. Q. Are you connected with the Utica Gas Company? A. Yes, sir. Q. What are you ? A. 1 am a trustee and director. Q.'Was there any other gas company in Utica I A. No, sir. Q. How long have you been trustee in the company ? A. Six or seven years. Q. As trustee of the gas company, are you satisfied with the rate paid by the Asylum to the gas company? A. Yes, sir. Q. As a member of the board of managers of the Asylun_, are you satisfied the gas as furnished is as Ioav as it can be obtained from the gas company ? A. Yes, sir. Q. You are satisfied it is as low as it should be? A. Yes, I am. Q. Do you know, as a fact, whether or not the Asylum Avas pay- ing $2.50? ^J A. No, sir, I don't; 1 said two years ago that the reduction was made; my impression is that I may be Avrong about that. Q. About how much do the gas bills amount to annually ? A. I don't know. Q. Would you hazard a guess ? A. It is a large consumption. Q. What do you mean by large ? A. I mean several thousand dollars, two or three thousand dol- lars, it may be twice that, I don't know. Q. Have efforts been made to examine in the institution ? A. I don't know. Q. Are you aware that comparisons Avere made a feAv years a»o, as to the amount of gas used in this institution, with the amount of gas used in other institutions, and that it appeared that this institu- tion used a larger amount of gas than other institutions of a similar character ? A. I never heard that until hoav. Q. State if, in your judgment, there cannot be a reduction in the amount of gas used in the institution? A. I know nothing about it; I cannot tell their requirements. Q. As to lighting of the halls or different parts of the institution ? A. I have never been there in the evening since 1 have been a manager. Q. What kind of gas is furnished to the institution ? A. Up to a very recent period there has been coal gas; it is now coal and Avater gas combined. Q. Are you aware that a request was made to your institution by 408 the State Board of Charities several years ago to furnish an inven- tory of the property of the institution ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Was such request complied with ? A. As far as I know it has not been. Q. Do you know why it has not been ? A. It was given to the auditing committee to report upon^and, so far as I know, they have made no report. Q. In your judgment should or should not such a report be made to the State Board of Charities? A. I don't know the law under which they Avere acting. Q. What is Dr. Gray's view on the subject ? A. I think he regards it as an unnecessary requirement. Q. If you were informed that every similar charitable institution, •subject to their supervision, except this Asylum and Buffalo, had complied with the request, what would you say as to the probable reasonableness of the request ? A. I had it told me they could not furnish it without months of labor. Q. Is it your impression that the institution could not furnish the request without months of labor? A. In looking over the lists of requirements, it seems to me it would be a very great labor. Q. Have you ever signified your willingness to comply with any particular request ? A. I don't know that it has been before me. Q. Has the board ever made any effort to induce the State Board of Charities to modify its request ? A I do not know that I can say any thing on this subject; I recollect nothing. Q. Has the State Board of Charities ever taken any action on the subject, except referring it to the auditing committee? A. Not to my knowledge. Q. Or asked that committee to report ? A. I don't recollect any thing ; in fact, it has been generally un- derstood that the subject was laid on the table ; it is in the hands of the auditing committee. Q. What would you, at the present, recommend in regard to such reports, after hearing that other similar institutions have complied? A. I should recommend if it was put to me- I should ask to be excused from serving on the committee. Q. Why? A. The labor is so considerable, I think. Q. Could not the labor be done by some employees of the insti- tution \ A. It might be. Q. Should it not be ? A. Clerks might be obtained, I suppose. 409 By Mr. Haskell : co^aUe law60''0" J°U ^ t0 ""P1* that il ™']d *» A. I have no objection other than that. Q. Is there not a reluctance on the part of the board of managers to furnish any information to the State Board of Charities as to the domestic arrangements of the Utica Asylum? A. I am not aware of it. Q. Are you willing to furnish such information to the State Board of Charities as can be complied with by the institution without the emyloyment of additional clerks? that I know oT ^^ ^ feelingabont that"5 1 have no unwillingness • Q. Or any Avillingness, specially ? A. I haven't any special willingness. Q Are you aAvare that the refusal of the board of managers of this Asylum to comply with the request of the State Board of Chari- ties has been made a subject of criticism of the Board ? A. Y es, sir, I have been told so. Q. Were you before the committee last winter ? A. No, sir; I was in Florida last winter. 52 U 410 Saturday, March 1, 9:30 a. m. Proceedings continued as follows: MISS LUCY PECK, Sworn and examined, testified as follows. By the Chairman : Q. What is your age, madam ? A. I was born in 1869, on election day. Q. How old were you in November, 1869 ? A. Oh, did I say 1869 ? That was a mistake ; I should have said 1839. Q. Please state if you were ever an inmate of' the Utica Insane Asylum ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And about when and for how long a time ? A. I think it was December 6, 1869, that I entered as a patient. Q. How long did you stay there ? A. At that time I stayed there until the last of September, 1870, or the first of October; I think it was the last of September. Q. Thirteen months ? A. No, sir, about eight or nine months. Q. Did you again go there ? A. I did. Q. Please state about the time ? A. October, 1871. Q. How long did you then stay there ? A. Until, I think, it was May ; the last of May ; I am not sure whether it w7as the first of May, or. the last of April ; it was 1875. Q. How long in all ? A. Three and a half or four years. Q. Is that the last time you were there ? A. To stay, yes. Q. Please explain under what circumstances you were there the last time ; were you assisting, as well as a patient ? A. Not more than any others ; I was not officially called there, but I worked with the rest as they did. Q. State to the committee what are your impressions about the manner of the treatment of the patients there ? A. Well, I have been twice among the colored people of the south, and my impression was that at the Asylum they were treated worse than the slaveholders treated the negroes. Q. Were you south before the war? A. No, sir; since the war; I Avas there south as a teacher of the American Missionary Association. • 411 Q. Are you hoav teaching? A. Y es, sir; I closed my school yesterday in Deansville ; I have been there four months; I Avas a teacher in Deansville Academy be- fore the graded school was started. Q. Have you regularly been employed as a teacher since leaving the Asylum ? A. I was three times in the town of New Hartford — it was above New Hartford on the hill; I had been sick a long time and had eaten very little, which is always the preliminary of insanity; my condition was a brain trouble, but it seemed to be more like in- toxication than insanity; I insisted it -was not insanity, but they said it Avas. Q. Did you have any delusions ? A. I think I had a great many, and I think there are very few people who ha\7e not some kind of delusion ; no physician saw me prior to my entrance into the Asylum; I asked my friends to take me there and they thought best to take me. Q. So that your entrance was entirely voluntary with the ap- proval of your friends ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Please state what was paid for you per week at the Asylum ? A. It Avas paid by the county. Q. Please state your impressions as to the treatment of the pa- tients by the attendants and officers of the institution ? A. My impression is that the treatment by the superintendent was about the same as that of a slaveholder of his slaves ; a person in the Asjdum has no name ; as soon as a person enters that Asy- lum, they cease to be an individual; the doctor will come through, and he will say to any one with him : " this is a case of so and so," as though the patient were a stick or a geological specimen. Q. Was there any unkind treatment of patients by attendants within vour knoAvledsre? A. i es, sir ; a great deal of it. Q. Can you specify any instances ? A. I can, hundreds of them. Q. What was the nature of them — in what did they consist ? A. Consisted in what I have stated, that the patients ceased to be individuals. Q. Can you recollect any instances of harsh treatment of patients by attendants ? A. What led me to go to the back wards Avas to get where I could see what Avas going on ; once, Avhen I was going up stairs, Miss Sayles, the oldest attendant of the house — I was going up stairs as fast as I could, and she gave me a push or a pull or something, I won't say just what, to hurry me up or something; as they say there, the first thing to do is to break your will, and I suppose that was the beginning of it. Q. Did you ever see any occasions of unkind or harsh treatment of any other patients by attendants? 412 A. Oh, yes. Q. Describe any such treatment that you' saw ; what did they do? A. In the first' place, I found large numbers of what they call "outside patients," if you know what those are; they were kept with insufficient food; those avIio could come to the table help them- selves to the food such as it was. Q. Did the outside patients complain ? A. They cannot complain ; and it is those suffer the most who cannot speak or complain. Q. Do you mean that they are so much deranged that they can- not tell ? A. Yes, sir; they cannot tell; they do not go to the table to eat, their food is taken to them ; sometimes they find other patients who will feed them. Q. Do you state the fact, that their food has been insufficient ' from your own observation of the nature of the meals taken out to them ? A. It seemed to me very insufficient on No. 6 ; you see them more on No. 6, because that is the idiotic Avard ; but I Avas kept most of the time in a private room, as an attendant put me in there she said she had no pity for any one who was big fool enough to come in here; the mess that was given to some of them to eat was not fit for a pig to eat. Q. You have stated that you have seen instances of harsh and un- kind treatment of patients — can you specify any instances of harsh treatment ? A. I saw a good many that were pulled and pushed around a good deal, and knocked doAvn ; sdmetimes I would see them dowD, and not know how they came down, for I have such a horror of fighting, that I always looked the other way, but I have seen them bruised, and with their arms broken — at least one. Q. Do you happen to remember the name of the patient who had her arm broken ? A. Her name was Mary, I am not sure whether it was Kelly or not, but there Avas a Miss Lasker who had her arm broken ; I am not sure whether it was Kelly or Parker, but it was one of those two names. Q. Do you knoAV how the injury occurred ? A. I don't know. Q. Was it in a controversy with another patient or an attendant? A. I did not know her arm was broken until she told me ; I com- plained because they kept her in the crib all the time, but they said it was necessary, that her arm was protected ; I saw her there and talked with her, and as she did not say that it was a patient that did it, I concluded that it was done in a scuffle with an attendant, Q. But you are unable to say whether it Avas done by an attend- ant ? A. I am unable to say for certain. Q. It may ha*ve been by accident ? A. Yes, sir, it may have been. 413 Q. Did you ever see an attendant strike a patient ? A. I have, but I don't remember seeing one strike a patient very hard. Q. Was it a frequent occurrence ; the striking of patients by at- tendants ? A. Whenever a patient was to be u disciplined " as they call it, they Avere taken into another room ; they Avere pulled in to a little room Avhen they were going to do any thing, so that we did not see the affair, we only saw the result of it. Q. What were the results ? A. In one case I saw a patient terribly bruised so that she did not look like a human being on one side of her face; her name Avas W. K.; it was in this way, she did not want to go out into the back yard, they said that she must; so she saw the doctor and got his permission to stay; Dr. Kempster told her that, but we had another doctor there and he made a change in the orders; so the attendants said she must go out, but she relied on the promise of the other doctor and thought she Avas doing right in refusing to go out into the barn-yard; she Avas willing to obey orders, but thought she had permission to stay in ; and when she refused to go they " disciplined " her. Q. Did you see her disciplined ? A. Yes, sir; I was on the wrard. Q. Had she been violent at all ? A. Never; she ran away once. Q. From the Asylum ? A. Yes, sir ; but she was very quiet and lady-like ; a well-behaved woman at all times as far as I knew ; she went the first night as far as she could walk ; she said the people where she went took her in. Q. Was that just about the time you speak of when she was dis- ciplined ? A. It was about a month before. Q. State the circumstances about her being disciplined ? A. It was time to go out on to the yard and she would not go: when she did come out on to the yard with the attendants, one side of her face Avas so black that I would not have known who she was. Q. How was it caused ? A. I don't know ; I only know that when we went on to the yard I saAv that there was going to be a fight, I knew she was going to resist, and I kneAV that the attendants would insist upon her going out, and soon afterward she came out as I have described. Q. Can you give the names of the attendants? A. Mary Haynes ; she had charge of the ward. Q. When this patient came out on to the yard, did she make any complaint? A. I do not remember ; her complaint was self-evident. Q. Do you know whether these injuries were the result of acci- dent or of intentional injury by the attendant ? 414 A. I do not think they intended — I think in making her go out in the yard they bruised her in that way. Q. She may have struck her head against a door or upon the floor in falling? A. Well, I don't think any one striking would have produced such injuries as that. Q. Do you think the bruises Avere the results of blows ? A. I do not knoAV enough about such things to know what the effect would be Q. What did yon believe was the cause of her injury when she came out into the yard ? A. I believed the attendants struck her and that they had had a fight. Q. What made you think she had been badly treated by the at- tendants ? A. Because I knew she would not go out unless forced to. and they went after some other girls to help force her before I left the ward ; Miss Haynes lives in the city and I think is a truthful per- son. Q. Can you remember the names of any of the other girls ? A. I can think them up; if I can look at that "paper " with the names of the attendants on, I can tell ; there was Delia Sherman, but I cannot tell whether she was on the ward at the time of this occurrence. Q. Do yon know of any other occasions Avhere patients were bruised or injured by an attendant ? A. I had a sore on my own arm a long time from wearing a muff. Q. What was the muff put on for, do you recollect ? A. I think it AA'as because I unstrapped a patient; I did so be- cause I was so tired of seeing her strapped up in that way. Q. How long had she been strapped ? A. From the time I went on the ward until I left the ward; all day and all night, and they were not allowed to change their cloth- ing. Q. Were they not violent patients who were so confined? A. You could not tell because they were always kept strapped; they were not tried ; the patients themselves said they did not know what they were kept strapped for; she said she did not need that camisole any more than I did, and in one case where it was taken off the patient was perfectly quiet after it was taken off. Q. Did yon ever speak to the doctors about any such patients ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And what did they say ? A. I guess they said it was necessary—I do not remember what they did say. Q. They probably said it was necessary, is that it ? A. Yes, sir; I heard Dr. Kempster and Dr. Andrews talking with the attendants and urging them to try them. 415 Q. As a rule were the physicians kind to the patients ? A. Do you call it kind of Dr. Gray to serve you as if you were only a stick or a stone ? Q. Explain what you mean by that ? A. I mean that I do not think it is kind to treat one—even if they are a little insane—to treat them as if they had ceased to be an individual. Q. How did he speak to the patients ? A. In different manners ; sometimes if they spoke to him he would answer them and sometimes he would not; sometimes he would be very pleasant indeed; the first time I was there I really had quite a high opinion of Dr. Gray ; and he came on to the wards at that time often—as often as once in four or six weeks. Q. That Avas during the first time you were there ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did he not come oftener than once in four weeks? A. Well, I could not be positive about that; I know that the last time I Avas there I did not see him once in four months. Q. Months or weeks do you mean ? A. Months ; I did not see him as often as once in four months ? Q. How often did the physicians come on to the wards? A. Every day ; at that time they did not come more than once a day but I think they come now twice. Q. Did they come at a regular time during the day ? A. Generally ; it varied, but they came about ten .o'clock or eleven o'clock in the morning. Q. And how long did they stay on the ward ? A. Not very long; they would pass through and speak to the patients. Q. Did the patients ever speak to the doctors about their restraint? A. Most of the patients who are so restrained cannot make an intelligent complaint; about Dr. Gray coming there, I would say that an attendant there said she did not knoAV Dr. Gray and had never seen him—her name was Ella Smart, Sangerfield Centre. Q. Have you any complaints to make of the doctors? A. Yes, sir; I have a complaint to make of Dr. Gray that he is not there much. Q. Did the other doctors perform their duties with consideration for the patients ? A. The doctors' characters were different; I think that Doctors Kellog, Andrews and Kempster had a great deal of feeling for the patients, but those doctors that seemed to have most feeling seemed to be fettered in their poAvers, while some of the others had almost unlimited powers ; Dr. Kitchener, for instance, had ; he would come on and say to a whole ward at a time " you can't go to chapel to-day ; " sometimes a doctor would tell a single patient they couid not go, but never a Avhole Avard ; he (Dr. Kitchener) seemed to have more power than any of the other doctors who had more feeling for the patients. • 416 Q. Did the attendants behave any differently toward the patients when the doctors were Way than they did when the doctors were present? A. Some of them did and some of them did not. Q. Can you recollect any instance where some of them did behave differently? A. Well, one of their favorite restoratives there was smothering with wet sheets, but I think they never did that in the presence of any doctor. Q. Explain what you mean by that ? A Well, they took a sheet — an ordinary sheet from the bed — and wet it thoroughly ; now you know, through a dry sheet you can get a little air, but you can't breathe through a wet sheet; they would wet it and double it up and put it over the patient's head and twist it around the throat, so that yon could not breathe. Q. Do you say that was done sometimes ? A. Yes, sir; very frequently. Q. For what purpose ? A. For punishment; I remember very well the first time I was subjected to such treatment as that ; it was one Sunday I wanted to go to chapel; I asked the attendant if I could go to chapel; she said no I could not; well, sometimes it would happen that an attendant would say that you could not go to chapel and af terAvard the supervisor would come through and would say that yon might go ; on this occasion I thought in, some way that I should be allowed to go and so I said I shall go, and I went into the room and started to get ready; I was combing my hair and preparing myself to get ready for chapel, the attendant came into the room and closed the door, I guess some one was with her, and they smothered me with a wet sheet; at another time when I was treated in the same way I think it was be- cause I had unstrapped a patient. Q. Then what did they do? A. Smothered me the same as they did at this time; another time that I was smothered it was for reading ; I was fond of read- ing and I had found something to read, it was a piece of an old book; you know that there are windows over the doors; we were put to bed directly after supper, which was at six o'clock ? Q. At what time in the year do you go to bed at six o'clock. A. All the year; I thought I did not care to sleep so long; I thought I would read ; so 1 pushed a wash-stand or bureau against the door and sat on that with my book so placed that I could see to read by the light from outside through the window over the top of the door; there was a bureau in the room that contained some clothes belonging to an attendant -^Barbara Bisikel — she lives here in Utica; I don't want to say any thing about some of these at- tendants because Barbara is quite a good friend of mine, and I think they did not do more than most girls would do under all the cir- cumstances; well, she came in for some clothes and found I was 417 reading; she went out and came back with a sheet and smothered me. Q. What did she say when she came into the room ? A. I do not remember. Q. Did she complain of your being up reading ? A. I do not remember about that. Q. Did she go out and bring in the sheet wet ? A. Yes; I think it Avas right in the room that I was smothered. Q. Did she do it alone, or did she have some one to assist her? A. I think she did it alone, but I am not positive ; I was not at all strong at the time, and one attendant — any one attended in the house could easily master me. I am not sure that any one was with her. Q. Were you ever smothered at any other times than those ? A. Not that I remember of. Q. Did you ever see any other patient smothered ? A. I did not see any others smothered, but I saw them taking wet sheets and go into different rooms sometimes; Miss C. W----, of New Hartford, told me on one occasion that an attendant was passing her door, she did not laugh, but she made a face at her, and for that the attendant Avent and got a wet sheet and smothered her. Q. In wdiat other way or Avays did attendants control patients ? A. Largely by mechanical restraints. Q. How long did they keep these sheets on ? A. In many cases they kept them on a long time; I nearly died the first time they put it on me, and still nearer the second, and I thought I never could live through a third. Q. Did they keep it on until you became unconscious? A. I do not think I was wholly unconscious. Q. About how many minutes would you say they kept on the wet sheet ? A. 1 do not think I could estimate the time. Q. Did it absolutely stop your breath? A. I could not tell. If you would like to know, I would like to have you try it; Mrs. Kast, an attendant, had it tried on her for an experiment; she tried all the restraints, Avas strapped down, and was fed with a tube, she wanted to see hoAV the things were; she is in luvhoter now, and is not in the institution. Q. What is her full name? A. I think it is B. C. Kast, that is the name of her husband, 21 • Hamilton place, Rochester; she wrote to me last year during the time Dr. Gray testified. Q. When was Mrs. Kast there ? A. She went there in 1870; I think she was there tAvice during the time I was there. Q. Were you there when the experiments Avere tried on her ? A. No. sir. Q. Then hoAV do you know that they were tried on her? A. By statements made by herself to me and to my sisters. 53 U 418 Q. Were there any other complaints that you could speak of at the— that time made against attendants ? A. Well, about the cribs; I think they kept patients too long in the cribs ; they are uncomfortable but perhaps necessary, sometimes they were in the habit of putting patients in before supper, and keeping them there until six or seven o'clock in the morning, which would make thirteen hours; I presume the same thing is done now. Q. In the covered beds, how much space would there be between the mattress and the top of the cover — enoguh for a patient to sit up? ,..| A. No, sir ; I think not. Q. Was it enough for them to turn over easily ? A. I could not say, although I slept in one once voluntarily. Q. Did you ever know of a patient being injured in the covered bed? A. I think it injures one to stay there so many hours at a time; it is very uncomfortable. Q. Any thing more than being compelled to be in one position? A. No, sir ; not only that ; but the air canuot be admitted as Avell; I do not know as I can exactly describe it, but I know it was very uncomfortable. Q. Can you not turn round or turn over easily ? A. I do not remember about that. Q. Can you rise up easily in them ? A. I don't remember about that now. Q. Have you any other causes of complaint against the insutution \ A. There is a great number of pitients there Avho are weak and feeble and they get tired and would like to lie down ; but I was told there that it was against the rules of the institution to lie down; we became so tired that we could not really sit up; once I was so tired and wanted to lie down so much that I laid on the floor, and I know a minister's wife there who did the same thing. Q. Did you ever ask permission to lie dowm ? A. Yes, sir ; some times the doctors would say about a certain patient " let her lie down," and once when I had permission to go and lie doAvn from the doctor, I told the attendant so, but they said they did not care, and would not let me. Q. You now refer to the day time ? A. Yes, sir ; lying down in the day time; and to prevent their flying down in the rooms, the doors were alw7ays kept locked, so that you could not get into any room where there w7as a bed; when General Barlow passed through the wards on his inspection he noticed that the doors were all closed and locked ; he said, Avhat are these doors kept locked for ; and they said to him ; "oh, if we did not lock them the patients might get in and lie down ; " and he said, what if they did. Q. Did you hear him say that? A. No, sir ; I did not hear it myself. Q. We must ask you to state only what you heard yourself? 419 A. Well, Mrs. Kast came once, and it seemed like a present; she said what are those doors locked for; they said that the patients might get in there and lie down or something; she said, " I don't care, I will open those doors if they raise the devil;" 1 heard her say that myself ; I had been acquainted with her for about ten or fifteen years and I never heard her make any such expression before except then ; on No. 7, the doors Avere alw7ays kept Rocked, and on No. 9, some of them, and on No. 6, I think all of them. Q. What Avard were you on most of the time? A. I managed to get on all the back wards; those that are not called good wards are situated in the back part of the building. Q. What cases are those on the back wards ? A. I think that the murderers, those that came with a diploma from the State prison or on an indictment from some court are stationed on the front w7ards; I think now of one, a Mrs. J., who roasted her own child because she would not buy liquor for her ; she is on number two. Q. What are the character of patients on the back wards? A. There are those that protest against murder, either in the Asylum or out; that was like a girl that I saw, she said " I will stay here in this house until I see law here." Q. Were they noisy patients on the back wards ? A. Yes — no, sir; not all noisy. Q. Were they restless and violent ? A. Yes, sir; restless and violent patients, and a great many quiet ones. Q. Have you any other matters to speak of? A. Yres, sir ; I have ; there was one great and universal cause of suffering on ward 10 ; I was on ward 10 once. Q. What was the subject of complaint there? A. There was a great deal of suffering there; they suffered a great deal with cold ; there was a Miss S.; I remember one New Year's day, Avhen the fire was not out in the ironing-room, that she Avent to it and she kept saying " this is grand," " this is grand ; " I have heard her say it as much as ten times. Q. Was it always cold in that ward ? A. In cold weather it was. Q. Was there not any heat there ? A. There was a Avater-closet that was warmed, and there was a little room that they kept the swill pail in, that was warmed ; it had a register in but most of the time it was locked. Q. Was there any register in the Avard itself? A. I could not say ; it was^so cold that the doctors would come down and would say, " why, you have got a window up some — wheres," but there would not be any Avindow up; I have heard the fireman, Mr. Graham, come up there and say it was cold, and he could not understand why that ward should be cold at all, because it was nearest to the engine-room ; but he said, "it is no use to say any thing to Dr. Gray about;" I heard him say that. 420 Q. Was there any other cause of complaint in that ward ? A. Yres, sir. Q. What other cause of complaint was there in that ward ? A. The ward was the darkest ward in the house; there were blinds nailed on to the lower part of the windows — of course they were nailed so that we could not open them and let the sunlight in there ; so that it made it very dark ; I finally took the slats out of all the blinds on the ward and they remained so for some time. Q. Hoav long a time— some weeks ? A. I am pretty positive that when 1 visited the Asylum after I was out, a year after it was done, the blinds were still there, but the slats were out. Q. What did you do with the slats ? A. Threw them out of the window. Q. Did the attendants ever make any complaint of the cold in No. 10 ward ? A. Actions speak louder than words; I remember once that an attendant, they called her "Rebel " Cameron, because she rebelled Against the rules of the house, she said once " as soon as the doctors go, you can all go to bed and Avar in yourselves;" some of the attendants would not let us go to bed. , Q. Was it a common occurrence to go to bed in the day time? A. Dr. Kitchener came one day and we were abed, and he wanted to know if we were abed to keep warm, and the attendant said that we were. Q. What did the doctor say ? A. I don't remember. Q. What was done, if any thing, to make it more comfortable? A. Some time afterward, about the time I came home, I cannot say whether it was the last Avinter or next to the last, Dr. Andrews came on to the Avard one day, and one of the patients went to him— one that had been there a long time, and said to him " I am almost froze to death ;" he turned around then and asked others about if they were cold, and they said they were; and then, very soon after that, they put in some new registers. Q. So that the evil was finally remedied ? A. Considerably ; I saw the other day in the papers that the ward was being rebuilt or reconstructed ; you asked me about the attendants complaining of cold, and I was going to say, in' answer to that question, that several came there apparently strong, healthy girls, and of course while they were working they would not feel the cold, but when they got through Avith their work they would feel it more than the patients who had not been doing any thing; a good many of them died and I believe their colds were caused by that told ward — I think their death was hastened by the cold of that ward. ggQ. Hoav do you know they have died since ? A. Rhoda Parks left the house and died in St. Luke's Hospital; Mary Comstock died ; I visited her friends; Cecilia Deese, she has 421 died since, I saw some one going to her funeral; and Nelly Cam- pion, and Annie Roscoe, they both died in the Asylum about a year ago. Q. Do you knoAV where this " rebel " Cameron is now ? A. No, sir; she went west and was married; I have tried to find out her address, she had a brother in the city but he is dead. Q. Yon have mentioned several methods of ill treatment' by the attendants; does any thing else occur to you now that you can men- tion ? A. I do not know ; I will look at my paper here (refers to a paper); yes, sir; I want to find fault'with the matter of corre- spondence of the patients. Q. Have you any complaint to make about that ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What is it — please state it ? A. They are not allowed to communicate with their friends which I think is very wrong. Q. How do you knoAV that they are not allowed that privilege ? A. Because I tried it; the first time I was there I was unable to get a syllable out. Q. Did you write to your friends ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you get any answer ? A. No, sir; I did not get any because my letters were not sent ? Q. Did they give you the letters your friends wrote you ? A. I think they did. Q. Did your friends acknowledge receipt of letters from you ? A. Yes, sir; the second time I w7as there, some of my letters were sent; the first time I was there none of them were sent. Q. Did your friends make any inquiries of you at the time whether or not you had written to them ? A. I do not know whether or not they wrote to me the first time; they came to see me very often ; I was 'in there about nine months the first time Q. And your friends came to see you very often — about how often ? A. I could not say exactly. Q. Once a month ? A. No, sir. Q. Meanwhile you endeavored to write to them ? A. Yes. Q. And when your friends visited yon, as yon say they did, did you ever ask them if they had received your letters? A. Yes, sir. Q. And Avhat did they say to you in reply to that ? A. They said that they had not. Q. Did you make any complaints to the physicians about your letters not being mailed for you ? A. Yes, sir. 422 Q. To whom did you complain — can yon give us the name of any physician to whom you complained? A. Dr. Keeler; and the second time I was there I was writing a letter to my mother; Dr. Kitchener came on to the ward and he said to the attendant, Miss Sarah Sterling, Avho is now in the house, " Take that aAvay from her ; " she did not do it, however. And I know of a case, a Miss B. ; she wrote a letter to her father and sent it out secretly, and for that she was placed in a room in soli- tary confinement ';* I don't know how long it was kept up, but I think she was there about six weeks or two months to the best of my recollection ? Q. Did you eA7er see her in that room? A. No, sir. Q. How do you know she was there during that time ? A. She wrote to me during the time and slipped her letter under the door, and Mrs. D. H., at that time, but now Mrs. M., on Ba- rack street, brought me the letter. Q. Have you that letter ? A. I have not. I have letters from Mrs. B. ; she is now out of the Asylum ; I had a letter from her this week ; she is now in an asylum in California ; I heard from her this week. I would like to say some more about my experience and observation, because our Asylum here at Utica is said to be the base of all similar institu- tions in this country ; with regard to this last case, I can only say that the report was that she was put in that room for sending that letter; she was kept in confinement a good deal because she tried to get the keys, but she never was kept so closely before ; I saw her attempt to snatch the keys once. Q. From whom ? A. From attendants ; she would try hard to get the keys and would scuffle, but she was not noisy nor violent, but she Avas not bad, because I had no trouble Avith her; I could take her and hold her. Q. Do you know whether she Avas sleepless or not ? A. I think she slept pretty Avell ; she slept in the same Avard that I did some of the time. Q. And during the time that she was in this room were you in the habit of passing by the room yourself ? A. No, sir. Q. Was it on another ward ? A. Yes, sir. I can give you the names of the girls that were on the ward, who took her there by the doctor's orders. Q. Please give their names ? A. Frankie Davis had charge of the ward ; she is in Utica, dress- making Avith another girl who was also an attendant; she is on De- borah street, Avith Miss F. Q. What other attendants Avere there ? A. I am not positive who were the other attendants at the time, but she could tell you 423 Q. For all you know, the seclusion in this dark room may have been on account of the necessities of her case, according to the iudff- ment of the doctors? •' ft A. Well she was there three years and was never so Avholly secluded but what she was allowed to come out on to the Avards and get warm but she did not even have a chair there to sit down on fshe was never treated so severely at any time excepting for sending this letter; the doctors knew of her seclusion because they ordered it, and I was told that it was ordered because she sent that letter Q. Who told you ? A. I guess she told me herself, but I would not say, Q. Did you ever speak to any of the doctors about' it? A. No, sir. Q. Did you ever make any remonstrance to anybody about her seclusion ? A. one be quiet be quiet about such things. Q. What did he mean by putting you on the first ward ? is that a noisy or a quiet ward ? A. A quiet ward. Q. And if you would be quiet he would put you on that ward as a favor ? A. Yes, sir; I suppose so. Q. Was it generally regarded as a favor to get on to a quiet ward ? A. I think it was ; of course the rooms are pleasanter. Q. Are there any other complaints that you have to make against the institution'( A. \ es, sir. (Referring to a memorandum.) Q. Please state Avhat they are ? A. Y es, sir; patients were locked up in what they call " sitting- rooms " and, of course, there Avas less variety than if they had the range of the wards, and in those rooms the time seemed double as long as it Avould if they had more variety. Q. What were they locked up there for; were they noisy pa- tients ? A. Some were noisy and some were not. Q. Why were they locked up in the sitting-room ? A. My idea of the matter was it was to get them out of the way. Q. Did the patients have any means of amusement or occupation i A. That is what I Avas going to say next ;■ the patients — a good many of them— would be glad of a little something to do. Q. Are they alloAved to sewT ? A. Yery little; one time I went up with an attendant into the garret where there Avere some pieces of tissue paper and old cloth — odds and ends — we were coming down with these things; we were on No. 6 ; the attendant said, " Run in there quick, Miss Sayles is 424 coming, and she does not allow that; she does not allow the pa- tients on her ward to work, and if you go through her ward you Avill see very little work of the kind going on." Q. Were you allowed to read ? A. There was no objection, I suppose, but we were not permitted to have books, so we did not have any thing to read ; I was not al- lowed to have my own Bible even. Q. Did you ever get any books out of the library of the institu- tion ? A. I did not know that there was a library when I went there. By Mr. Olin : Q. Did you come back the second time to the Asylum or did your people bring you ? A. I came'on foot in the night; that is, I arrived there by day- light, of course, but I came in the night. Q. Did you decide that you ought to come back ? A. No, sir. Q. How came you to come back here then ? A. I had made some promises there that I could not have fulfilled without going back and I wanted to go back. Q. How long a time elapsed between the time you left and the time }7ou came back ? A. Over a year; if I cannot at any time do as I agree,I Avant, at any rate, to make an explanation and say avIiv I cannot do it, so I came back thinking I would make some explanations ; one thing I had agreed to do was to inform the friends of some of the patients- how they were. Q. So you came back to get into the institution to tell them ? A. No, sir, not wholly that; another thing was that Avhen I was there, as I was going away, Dr. AndreAArs says to me, "you won't forget us," and I says no; some one else said, "when people go aAvay from here they soon forget us," and I said, " 1 will not; I will come and see you." I begged my friends to bring me to visit here, but they would not, and I thought I would come, any way; but I did not expect to be put in as an inmate of the Asylum again. Q. As I understand you, you tried, while you were in there, to get into these back wrards ? A. Yes, sir, I did. Q. What ward were you put into when you first went there? """A. Into No. 3. Q. Was that a quiet ward % A. Yes, sir. Q. What was your object in getting into those back wards—what did yon want to get there for ? A. Well, one of the prominent men of Oneida county said to me, a few days before 1 came to the Asylum, " when you come out you can tell us all about it; " I thought that if there was the state of oppression here that there is in the south, the time would come 425 when the same thing would come again ; that is, I thought if there had been any wrong there, that it would be there again, in the Asylum, I mean ; I was an obscure person ; no person in the Asylum knew me, and I thought I could find out a good many things that other people could not find out. Q. So that your object was to find out the things that went on there ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Were you on all the wards in the institution on the south side ? _ A. I was placed on every ward except twelve and eleven ; some- times when the wards were croAvded and there was not enough room, I asked the girls to let me go down on to ward No. 10; and I was down there daytimes sometimes, but it was so cold down there, that is the very cold ward about which I spoke, I went, from there to get warm sometimes, so that I was on that ward several nights and days. Q. How did you get from one ward to another — suppose you were on ward 8 and wanted to get on to ward 4, for instance — how did you manage it ? A. We were changed around. Q. Who changed yon around ? A. The doctors; the way I got changed was that I managed one day to do something; if you would like to know how I managed it, I will tell you. Q. Yes, I would like to know ? A. I inquired when I got up stairs when I got out of Mrs. Sayles' reach, how I could get on to the back wards; they said if you make a noise — are noisy, they will put you there ; so I noised around considerably. Q. And your object was to get there and find out how things went ? 8 A. 1 es, sir; I had been teaching and taking classes through the higher mathematics — through trigonometry — and they, some of them, asked me to go further and take them out surveying ; I did not do that with my classes, but when I got into the Asylum, I thought there was some " surveying" to be done there, but of rather a different kind that, perhaps I could do. Q. And it took you about three years to get through with it ? A. Yes, sir, it took about that time. Q- In your going to the Asylum the last time, you must have come away without your people knowing? A. lres, sir, I did. Q. Did you try to get them to bring you and they decline — is that what you said ? ' t A. I tried to get them to brine: me for a visit; I did not come intending or expecting to stay; I liad been pronounced all right the year I was home and T did not knoAv as they would put me in. Q. But they found you there in the morning and thought you belonged in there ; is that it ? A. No, sir; they did not. 54 U 426 By Mr. Swan ? Q. Did you escape at any time from the Asylum ? A. Yes, sir ; that was the first time I w7as there. Q. How long were you gone? A. Over a year. Q. They did not find you and take you back when you escaped \ A. No, sir ; I went there voluntarily ; my friends would not have put me there. Q. Did you not go back with your mother ? A. No, sir; I came back alone in the night. By Mr. Haskell : Q. Is there any other abuses or complaints of patients — or causes of complaint than you have now specified — please state them; or have you stated all now ? A. If you were there at the hour they put patients to bed you Avould see that they are left in those cribs or covered beds thirteen hours ; if you could be there you would find that out; then, if you visit the wards, I would like you to please notice and see how many of the women patients are engaged on any kind of work — needle- work, I mean ; you cannot realize how a little work of that kind enlivens the time and shortens it; patients avIio have been confined there, who are there now, wrill tell you that it shortens the time wonderfully. Q. I am asking you if there was any thing you saw that you think should be complained of? A. I am stating a ground of complaint; patients were not allowed to keep their embroidery work ; when they came they would bring some such work to keep them out of idleness, and it would be taken away from them; some of the attendants would allow that to be done — would allow them to do such work, and even in some cases furnish the work, or furnish the things, but the head attendant, Miss Sayles, would not do so, as she was opposed to it. Q. Is Miss Sayles there now ? A. Yes, sir; and it was in her department that I saw most abuse; hers was the third department, No. 3 and No. 6 ; I referred to the " outside patients" avIio did not leave the wards to go to the dining- room ; I watched a good many months and I never saw those out- side patients have a Avarm meal. Q. How do you know that their meals were not warm? > A. Ijsaw it given to them ; they would put some milk into some cold coffee, and some crackers into it, and that is all I ever saw them have from morning till night. Q. Do you knoAV as a fact that they did not have any other food? A. Yes, sir; because I often took their meals out to them. Q. For several consecutive days ? A. Yes, sir. 427 Q. On what ward did yon ever feed any patient for several con- secutive days all the food they ate? A. On number eight; I fed Mrs. L. with all the food she had for several consecutive days ; that was during the second time I was there. Q. Where is she now ? A. I do not know; but she would be wholly unable to testify if you conld find her. Q. What was her condition ? A. Yery sad ; when I first saw Mrs. L. I met her in the back yard, a very nice looking young lady, and very tastily dressed ; she was from Allegany county, she said ; she had a husband and one child, and she told me a good many things about her husband and child ; I talked with her some time and she seemed to be a nice appearing young lady ; I asked her if she would not like to see a newspaper; I used to come doAvn to the kitchen and through their kindness there I used to get a paper at times; I asked this Mrs. L. if she would not like to see a paper from Allegany county ; she said that she would, and I got and gave her a paper from Alle- gany' county — from Andover; 'she took it and looked it over, and all in a moment, suddenly, I thought she had another kind of '■ Andover ; " she started away and climbed up the high fence ; she went up like a squirrel ; she did not read the paper; she looked at it; I saw her climb up over the fence ; she went up as I said like a squirrel ; but she was caught; the next day she did not come out in the yard, and I inquired of her, about her. Q. Did she get clear over the fence and out of sight ? A. Y es ; I think she did. Q. Did you see her when she was brought into the institution ? A. No, sir; I only saw her at that time to talk with her, because that Avas the only time she could talk; she was not allowed to go out into the fresh air any more, and the next time I saw her was on Avard eight; I did not recognize her as the same person ; I slept in the same room with her for some months. Q. What change was there in her mental condition ? A. She Avas kept in strong dresses and strapped down and never spoke an intelligible sentence. Q. What do you mean by strapped down ? A. Kept strapped to a chair. Q. AH the time ? A. Well she might have been led to the water-closet perhaps. Q. And for how long a time did you feed her all that she received ? A. I presume it was a month. Q. What kind of food did she receive during that period ? A. She had some of the same food from the table. Q. Then she Avas sufficiently fed ? A. She was not properly fed, for she had a disease about her that her food did not agree with her, and she did not have such food as a person of her disease needed. 428 Q. Did she have as good food as the other patients ? A. I would not be positive whether she had the same or not, but in many cases it was cold even if it was the same food. Q. Was hers cold, that she received? A. I could not tell you positively. Q. Is there any other specific thing that yon want to call our attention to in regard to the Asylum ? A. Yes, sir, there are; for instance, on one ward there wa6 a patient that Avas very lousy : it Avas on number 12. Q. How did you know that the patient was lousy ? A. She came'to the ironing-room where I was sorting clothes, and as patients or attendants came near her they were liable to catch the vermin. Q. Lice in her hair or body lice ? A. Lice in her hair; she was thoroughly lousy and was from Flushing, Long Island; she had been in the institution ; been in there about tAvo years, and she was in that lousy condition for some months. Q. Do you know that of your own knowledge ? A. Y es, sir ; I tried to comb thorn out once; a great many of the others got lousy, and so did I myself. Q. Is that all you have to state, or is there any thing else? A. Yes, sir ; the indifference in regard to life and limb ; now, on ward 9 the beds were so made up, A\7ith a rise in the middle, thai feeble patients would fall off, would roll off like a log; I protested that it was not safe to put feeble women on those rounding beds; I know of two cases Avhere tbey fell out; one was a woman avIio had been there but a short time ; she fell off and died from her injuries, or I should say, from her injuries ; she was so injured that I think she died the same night; it Avas common report on the Avard ; I think Miss N. M. told me ; another case was Mrs. J., an old lady; she laid in the next room to me ; one morning she told me her leg was broken ; they told her it was not; she insisted that it was, and upon examination it Avas found to be so that her leg was broken. Q. How do you know.it was? A. I saw her sometime afterward; she finally died ; they told her she never would get well, and she never did ; a great many of the patients are taken away to Ovid or to Rome, to other asy- lums, and tbey have a horror of being taken to institutions for the chronic insane, and they are taken away without being allowed to notify their friends of the intention to remove them. Q. How do you know that ? A. In this city there is a music teacher, Miss Mary S., who has a friend in there; she told me that she asked Dr. Gray to notify her about it, as she wanted to see her friend before she was re- moved, but she never was notified, and she Avas removed. Q. All you knoAV in regard to the removal of chronic cases with- out notifying their friends is from what some one told you? 429 A. Yes, sir, that is all; but you can ask those persons, and you will find that they will say it is so; for my own part, I know they have been taken away suddenly when they themselves — the pa- tients— did not know that they were going to be taken away ; that is, they were never notified. Q. Is there any other matter you desire to call our attention to ? A. Yes, sir ; the fact that the clase of patients there who seem to receive the most favors there, and were allowed to have the most influence in demoralizing patients by contact, were the murderers and insane criminals ; such patients, several of them, were allowed more general range among the patients than any others ; I know it was demoralizing to the patients and to the attendants. Q. You mean their moral influence ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What particular privilege do you refer to as being granted to them that was not accorded to any other patients of the same men- tal condition ? A. Well, perhaps I am not a good judge as to whether they were of the same mental condition ; they were on the same ward. Q. You mean that inmates who have been sent there after having committed some crime ought not to be put with a class who are not in the same category, and have not been guilty of any offenses? A. I think they ought not to be allowed special privileges; there ought not to be a premium put upon murder. Q. What special privileges do they have that is not accorded to other patients of substantially the same mental condition ? A. Well, about the same mental condition, perhaps I could not say that they were that. Q. What privileges were accorded to them that were not accorded to other patients on the same Avards ? A. Well, take ward 9; I Avas on that ward ; there was only one carpeted room, comfortably furnished, and that given to a patient from Sing Sing; her name is A. H. Q. Was she there as a pay patient? A. No, sir ; she was a poor girl. Q. Is that a fair sample of the privileges accorded to those you mention? A. Yes. Q. Do you know7 Avhy she was in that room ? A. No, sir; but if any patient should complain they would be punished ; I once heard Dr. Kitchener say to a patient, " you are kept here for talking against the institution," and he said to the same patient on another occasion, very soon after, "you can write to your friends that I think you are well enough to go home;" her name Avas Maggie K., she lived in Harlem or New York city. Q. Is there any thing else that you want to call our attention to ? A. Yes; some matters that should be attended to by the Asylum authorities is done by others; this Miss. M., that I mentioned, she has put some of her own clothes on to patients and taken them 430 to chapel, and where some would take one or two patients she would take ten or eleven ; her father was a lawyer. Q. Was she an attendant or a patient? A. An attendant; Nettie Munross, she was very kind and atten- tive to the patients, but when there was to be any promotion or higher pay it was given to some other attendant who Avas not so kind to the patients; Miss Munross is dead now. Q. Then, as a rule, you do not think they promoted the attend- ants on account of real merit ? A. No, sir. Q. How was it with the physicians as to being kind and attentive to the patients ? A. Some of them were and some were not; Dr. Kitchener was not; he was a State's prison character, as yon probably know. Q. Do you mean Dr. Kitchener? A. Didn't he leave Binghamton Asylum for embezzling funds there, and drinking; I was told he was in the State's prison in Cali- fornia ; he was last seen with a chain gang going through the streets; I was so told by the Avife of the chaplain of the Binghamton Inebriate Asylum ; I don't know it of my own knoAvledge ; one of the wards was, for a long time, in charge of an attendant who had been an inmate of an asylum herself, and she was as insane as any of the patients ; her name was Mary Pullman. Q. You do not know whether she was iusane or not, do yon ? A. She was taken to the Asylum as insane, in the first place, then she Avas employed and kept there as an attendant; she Avas put on another ward while her ward was undergoing some repairs, but she got into a quarrel Avith another attendant and said she Avould leave until her own ward was finished; then she came back and Dr. Andrews told her she could not have her place and she was after- ward brought back a patient; she was removed to Rome, finally, and there she died. Q. Is there any thing else yon desire to call our attention to 1 A. As a rule, the general tone of the authorities to the patients is not what it should be; Dr. Andrews, Dr. Kelly and Dr. Kemp- ster seemed to do the best they could for the patients ; one time when I was on Mrs. Sayles' ward she put me off the ward without consulting any doctor ; there was a lady from Madison county — to Mr. Haskell: you are from Madison county, I believe — she was from Brookfield ; one Sunday morning I thought I could get her mind off something; I says, " is not Brookfield a dilapidated, broken- down, out-at the-elbows kind of a place V\ they said, "oh, no, Brookfield isa nice town ;" I turned round and'said, "are you all from Brookfield, too," and they said, " no, but we are from Madi- son county;" and we counted seven that Avere from Madison county; I walked quietly along the ward, and jokingly said to Sarah, " iioav, this thing has got to be stopped ; we cannot have all Madi- son county dumped down in the Utica Insane Asylum;" Miss 431 Sayles came up to me, took hold of me, and stopped me, and I was put on to ward six. In regard to the patients in the back wards I want to say that they do not get water to drink ; I could sometimes hear the cries of the patients for water ; they could not get it no one would take it to them ; they were kept like that all day long and, of course, at meal times they would get a little. Q. Did they have none except they had it at meal times? 4" -?0' sir '■> tne fact tllat patients cannot communicate with their friends enhances the opportunities of the attendants to ill-treat them, because they cannot be complained of in a quarter where probably, their complaints would be heeded. Q. Were you ever prevented from communicating freely with your friends ? A. Yes, sir, I was, and others were also; after I had been there over a year, I say I could not leave there; I thought of what Dr Hopkins, of this city, said to me; he said, " if they put him there he should act so bad that they would not keep liim there;" and when I saw the privileges of those who acted badly, I made'up my mind that I would act very badly. At the conclusion of the testimony of the last wdtness, the com- mittee went to the Asylum and made an inspection of all the wards on the south side — female department. The committee then adjourned to meet in room B, Monday after- noon, March 3. 432 Albany, N. Y., March 3, 1884, ) Room B, New Capitol. \ The committee met at 3 p. m. Proceedings continued as follows : GEORGE BARNARD, Sworn and examined, testified as follows: By the Chairman: Q. What is your age ? A. Fifty. Q. Where do you reside ? A. Rome, Oneida county. Q. What is your business ? A. Cashier of the Fort Stanwix National Bank. Q. What relation do you sustain to the Utica Insane Asylum ? A. I am one of the managers. Q. When were you appointed ? A. This last spring; this is my first year. Q. Please state what meetings of the board you have attended ? A. All that have been called, except one special meeting called at the First National Bank of Utica, along in the first of January; that I was unable to attend on.account of some business. Q. On what occasions have you visited the Asylum, except on the occasion of the meetings ? A. Not any; not since I have been manager. Q. What occasion of these meetings have you gone over the wards ? A. All, except one meeting; w7e visited the wards every time, ex- cept one meeting. Q. On such occasions, did you visit each of the wards, or only a few of them ? A. Only a portion of them. Q. Have you, at any time, visited as many as all the wards in the institution ? A. Yes, sir. Q. About how many meetings have been at the Asylum ? A. I should say four since my appointment. Q. Was Dr. Gray present at all of these meetings 3 A: He was. Q. Did he go through the wards with you ? A. He did ; I think thrice. Q. How about the three times ? A. I think he went through one, and then we went through the day-rooms with some of the doctors ; that is mv impression 433 Q. Are you a member of the auditing committee ? A. No, sir; I am not. Q. Are you acquainted with the financial operations of the Asy- lum ? A. No more than through the report of the treasurer; I saw that. Q. Do you know where the supplies for the institution are pur- chased ? A. No, sir ; I don't. Q. Have you had occasion to examine the accounts at all to ascer- tain as to the prices paid? A. No, sir. Q. By what authority are purchases made at present? A. Through the steward, I understand. Q. Does any member of the board supervise these prices or pur- chases ? A. No, only the auditing committee do so. Q. Do you know whether the auditing committee examined the bills before payment or after? A. It is my impression, after payment, but I may be mistaken about that. Q Are you familiar with the duties of the superintendent, Dr. Gray, any more than that he has the general management of the asylum ; please state, so far as you know, what his duties are ? A. As I understand, it is to take a general oversight of the whole asylum ; that is, the admittance of the insane and their discharge when they are cured, and also the purchases; that is, it is all under his management. Q. That is to say the business part of the asylum is also under his direction ? A. So I understand, yes, sir. Q. Does that include also the supervision of the farm and the grounds, and outside matters ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Who employs the attendants? A. I think Dr. Gray hires them. Q. Whether in your judgment there is or is not too much labor imposed upon Dr."Gray? A. I think myself he has a great deal of labor to perforin. Q. Would you not regard it as desirable to separate the business and professional duties, so that the superintendent should be mainly responsible for the care of the patients? A. I think myself it would be an advantage. Q. Would you or Avould you not think it desirable whether there should be frequent and regular visitations of the Asylum by mem- bers of the board ? A. I think there should be Q. Are you aware to what extent it is now visited by members of the board ? 55 U 434 A. No, sir, I am not; no more than at these meetings, that is all. Q. Do you know how many physicians there are ? A. I think there are four assistants. Q. Do you know how many attendants there are? A. No, sir, I do not. Q. Some wards have two, some three, some four ? A. I do not know. Q. Do you know Avhat the pay of attendants is ? A. I think it is something like twenty-two or twenty-five dollars, something like that. Q. Do you know what the hours of duty are of the attendants from day to day ? A. I am not positive, bnt my impression is that they quit at eight o'clock. Q. Do you know when they come on in the morning ? A. No, sir, I do not. Q. Have you no idea ? A. I cannot tell you from memory. Q. Are you aware they are also liable to be called upon and are frequently called upon at night to attend patients ? A. I have been so informed. Q. If it were true that the attendants are on duty about fourteen hours a day and Avere then liable to be called up during the night to attend patients, would you or would you not consider such hours of duty excessive? A. I wrould. Q. Have you any recommendation to make in regard to any relief of the attendants in that respect? A. I have not. Q. What do the purchases for food and other supplies of the institution amount to annually? A. That I am unable to state. Q. Have you any idea? A. I looked over the report, but I don't carry it in my mind, therefore I cannot state the amount; I am unable to state the amount. Q. Do you know whether Dr. Gray occasionally attends to pri- vate professional employment, as expert on diseases of the brain, ontside of the institution ? A. Only as I have seen it reported in the papers. Q. Do you know how much of his time that takes ? A. No, sir; 1 do not. Q. Do you know how much he has been away from the institu- tion during the past year ? A. No, sir, I don't. Q. Do yon or do you not consider that absence on such employ- ment might clash with the performance of his duties at the institu- tion? 435 A. If he were away considerable time, of course it would have to take considerable of his time. Q. Do you or do you not consider it objectionable that Dr. Gray should accept such private professional employment, away from the institution ? A. If carried to any extent I do consider it objectionable. Q. What Avould you consider an objectionable'extent? A. A number of times a month. Q. How many ? A. Eight or ten times a month. Q. What would you think his absences would have to amount to to be considered objectionable ? A. I am taking into consideration the time it takes to do it, if he were only aAvay an hour or so, no; but if called away from the Asy- lum for a length of time, then it would be. Q. Would you consider an absence of several days at a time ob- , jectionable? A. I should if it "were repeated a number of times. Q. Are you aware that a request has been made of the Asylum authorities to f usnish to the State Board of Charities an inventory of the property of the institution ? A. I am not aware of it. Q. Are you aware that another request has been made of the in- stitution by the State Board of Charities of any statement of its affairs ? A. At one time, I remember, Dr. Gray showed me a schedule that he said some one wanted prepared for them ; whether that is what yon refer to or not, I don't know ; it was a schedule in which the number of clothing, the different kinds of clothing that was made for the insane, etc.; whether that is what you mean or not, I don't, or as he told me Avhere it came from or who made the in- quiry. Q. What other items were called for beside clothing, as you re- member ? A. The number of crockery that was used in the Asylum, and I don't know whether provisions were mentioned or not; there was a long tabular statement which covered a sheet of paper three feet long, I should judge, and with different headings; I think it was written ; that is my impression. Q. A tabular statement to which answers were required? A. Y es, sir; I think it required an answer in figures. Q. It was in blank and ansAvers were required to the questions upon it ? A. Yes, sir; that is the way I understood it. Q. About what time was that ? A. I think some time this last fall. Q. Whatdid Dr. Gray say when he showed it to you ? A. That is all he said; it was something that some one required 436 him to make out; I happened to be the first at the meeting, then the others came in and then it was dropped. Q. Was any thing said about it at the meeting ? A. No, sir. Q. Did not Dr. Gray lay it before the board ? A. No, sir. Q. Have you conversed with members of the board concerning the propriety of furnishing such information ? A. No, sir. Q. Would you have any objections to furnish to the State Board of Charities any information relating to the institution ? A. No, sir; not as far as I can come at. Q. Are there any criticisms whatever, that you can make touch- ing the management af the Utica Asylum ? A. Not any. Q. Are there any recommendations that you can make ? A. No, sir. FRED C. SMITH. Sworn and examined, testified as follows : By the Chairman : Q. What is your age? , A. Twenty-four. Q. Where do you reside, when you are not at the Asylum ? A. Holland Patent. Q. What is your post-office address at home? A. 1 have made it my home at Holland Patent. Q. What position do you hold at the Asylum ? A. Snpervisor. , Q. In what ward ? A. Third department. Q. What wards does that comprise ? A. Ten, eleven and twelve. Q. How long have you held that position ? A. Since the middle of June. Q. What position did you previously occupy there? A. An attendant. Q. How long had you been an attendant ? A. Until the middle of last June. I was there three years last November. Q. What are your duties as supervisor ? A. To take charge of the third department, and see that the department is kept in order, to look after the patients and to see if a patient dies, to see that he is properly laid out. Q. What were your duties as attendant ? A. To take care of the patients. Q. In what wards were you stationed when attendant ? A. Fourth ward and first ward. 437 Q. How long were you on the fourth ward ? A. About sixteen months. Q. What attendants Avere then with you ? A. Daniel Torpey and Charles Travers, Richard Jones and Richard Evans. Q. Who was then supervisor of that ward ? A. Mr. Evans. Q. Is he now in the institution ? A. No, sir. Q. Do you know why he left ? A. No, sir ; I think he bought a farm, or he went to a farm. Q. While you were on the fourth ward w7ere any patients injured there ? A. No, sir. Q. None at all ? A. Not that I know of ; I cannot recollect any. Q. Will you state more precisely the period by dates that you were on that ward ? A. I cannot now. Q. Can you state about what month you went on the fourth ward? A. When I first went there, three years ago last November, and was thereabout sixteen months on that ward;.from November, 1880 to March, 1882 ; I was then on the first ward and then about June, 1883, that I.was appointed supervisor, which position I now hold. Q. You have said that no injuries were suffered by any patient while you were on the fourth ward ? A. I cannot recollect any just now. Q. Did patients during that time ever receive black eyes ? A. I cannot recollect any now. Q. If any had been you would likely to have known it, while you were attendant ? A. Yes, sir ; I think I would have known it. Q. Did you ever see the patients with bruised noses, or other bruises about their persons ? A. I have seen some in a fit fall on the floor. Q. Were you ever asked by any of the physicians in regard to bruises or black eyes suffered by patients, during the time you were on that ward ? A. I don't remember any now. Q. If you had been so asked, do you think you would have been likely to remember it? A. I might; yes, sir. Can you not on reflection recall any such instances? A. No, sir. Q. Have you ever seen an attendant strike a patient on that ward? A. No, sir. Q. Never ? A. No, sir. 438 Q. Are you quite clear about that ? A. Y es, sir. Q. Have you, yourself, ever struck a patient ? A. No, sir. Q. If an attendant struck a patient on that ward in your presence, would you or would you not consider it your duty to report the fact to a physician ? A. I should report it immediately. Q. Do you know of patients while you were on that fourth ward who were injured at night in their rooms, so as to have black eye, or other bruises about their head or body ? A. Well, I cannot recollect any now. Q. How often has Dr. Gray visited the wards in which yon have been ? A. I do not know. Q. Does he visit them frequently ? A. I don't know. By Mr. Rice: Q. Why don't you know ? A. Well, he might visit them, when I was not there; I do not know how often he goes there. Q. If Dr. Gray did visit that ward while yon were there, you would be likely to see him, would you not ? A. If I was on the ward ? Q. If yon were on duty ? A. Yes, sir. Q. About what hours were you on duty while you were an attend- ant on the fourth ward ? A. In some parts of the season, from five until eight o'clock in the evening, and other seasons I would not be on quite so early in the morning. Q. Did you have many vacations ? A. No, sir. Q. Were you usually on duty. A. Y7es, sir. Q. How many days were yon absent from duty during the six- teen months you were on the fourth ward ? A. I think I was aAvay a week. Q. In sixteen months ? A. Yes, sir. Q. I now ask you again, how frequently Dr. Gray visited that ward while you were an attendant there ? A. I don't know how often he did. Q. Did you ever see him there ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Can you not state how often you saw him there ? A. No, sir; I cannot. 439 Q. Did you see him there more than once during that sixteen months ? A. Well, I think I did, yes, sir. Q. Can you recollect more than one occasion when you saw him ? A. I think he came there with the managers once, and came down to see a sick patient once. Q. Can you recollect any other occasions ? A. No, sir ; I cannot now. Q. Are you willing to say that you have not seen him there more than twice on that ward ? A. I may have seen him three, but I cannot recollect three now. Q. Then to the best of your recollection, how many times will you say that Dr. Gray was on that ward, while you were an attend- ant there, that you saw him? A. I can't recollect in all those. Q. When you went to the first ward, how often did you see Dr. « Gray? A. Quite frequently on the first ward. Q. How frequently would you say? A. I cannot say as to that. Q. As often as once a month ? A. Yes, sir; I think I did. Q. Oftener than that ? A. I cannot say as to that. Q. Flow many months were you on that ward ? A. About fifteen months. Q. About how many times during that fifteen months, as near as you can recollect, did you see Dr. Gray on that ward ? A. I don't know how many ; I didn't see him there. Q. How often are you willing to say that you think you saw him there ? A. I don't know as I could state. Q. You have stated that you think he was there once a month ; are you AA'illing to say whether that fairly represents the frequency of his visits ? A. I do not know as to that. Q. How often, since you have been supervisor of those wards ten, eleven and tw7elve, have you seen Dr. Gray on those wards? A. I do not know. Q. Can you make any estimate generally as to the frequency of his visits? A. No, sir; I cannot. Q. Has he been on them at all to your knowledge? A. Y es, sir. Q. Can you recollect any occasion when he has been there? A. The first day he went through with you he was there. Q. The day he went through with the committee? A. Yes, sir. Q. Can you recall any other occasion ? 440 A. He has been there to see patients ; and to see about the work there, when they were repairing the wards. Q. How many times will you say that you have seen him there 1 A. 1 cannot state. Q. How often has he been there, as often as once a month ? A. I cannot say. Q. Are you prepared to say, then, that he comes there very infre- quently ? A. No, sir. Q. You are not prepared to state that ? A. No, sir. Q. State whether you had any conversation with any one con- nected with the institution concerning your expected examination before this committee ? A. No, sir. Q. Has no one said any thing to you of it ? A. No, sir. Q. Are you ready and willing to answer all questions fairly and fully that are put to you ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What physician was in the fourth ward when you were there? A. Dr. Russell. Q. Where is he now ? A. In Europe, now. Q. How frequently did he attend on that ward ? A. He came there twice a day. Q. About Avhat hours in the day ? A. About nine in the morning and five in the afternoon. Q. Were those his regular hours ? A. Well, he didn't come through exactly at that hour every day. Q. But those were about his usual hours ? A. Well, about that time. Q. When he had made his regular visits, was it unusual for him again to appear the same day ? A. Yes, sir; I have seen him come through. Q. Frequently ? A. Yes, sir; quite frequently. By Mr. Olin : Q. The third time in a day ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Who is now the physician of the wards in which you are now supervisor ? A. Dr. Pilgrim has charge and Dr. Backus under him. Q. What visits do they make to the wards ? A. Twice a day. Q. Do they come at other times ? A. Yes, sir. 441 Q. How frequently ? A. Quite frequently. Q. What do you mean by that ? A. I mean they come there oftener than twice a day. Q. Every day do th£y come twice or three times ? A* No, sir ; not every day. Q. How frequently do you have to summon the physicians at night ? - A. Well, I cannot state as to that; the night watch has charge of that. Q. Are you ever summoned at night? A. Yes, sir. Q. By whom ? A. The attendants; if I heard any disturbance in the ward I would get up and see what was the matter. Q. Is your sleeping-room adjoining the ward ? A. Yes, sir; right on the ward. Q. Then you can hear any disturbance that takes place ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What is the practice of the doctors when coming to visit pa- tients at night; do they always come, or do they ahvays send medi- cine ? A. It depends upon the condition of the patient. Q. What do they most commonly do, come or send medicine ? A. Sometimes they come and sometimes they send medicine. Q. Have you ever seen patients struck in any other ward but the fourth ward ? A. No, sir. Q. Have you ever seen a patient struck since you have been in the institution by an attendant ? A. No, sir; not by an attendant. Q. Have you ever heard of patients being struck by attendants while you have been there ? A. 1 cannot recollect any now. Q. Have yon ever heard of attendants being discharged for that reason, since you have been in the institution ? A. I suppose there has been, but I don't recollect. Q. You don't recollect any instance ? A. No, sir; I don't know. Q. Do you know any of the managers of the institution by sight ? A. Some. , Q. Please state whom you know by sight ? A. Mr. Campbell, Mr. Winston and Mr. Swan. Q. Do you know Mr. Rogers by sight ? A. No, sir. Q. Do you know Mr. Barnard by sight ? A. I do now. Q. Why do you know him now ? A. I saw him to-day. 56 U 442 Q. Was that the first time ? A. Yes, sir; that is the first time I can recollect. Q. Do you know Mr. Pomeory by sight ? • * A. Yes, sir. , Q. Do you know Mr. Lowery by sight ? A. No, sir. Q. Da you know General McQuaid by sight ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How often have you seen General McQuaid on the wards since you have been in the institution % A. I do not know. Q. Have you any idea ? A. No, sir, I haven't. Q. Have you seen him more than once ? A.. I have seen him together with the rest of the managers. Q. Have you ever seen him there without any other manager ? A. I cannot recollect. , Q. Have you seen any of the managers alone, except at the time that the managers have been going through ? A. Yes, sir ; I think I have. Q. Can you name any ? A. Only Mr. Swan, I have seen him there. Q. Where have you eeen him, in the office or in the wards? A. In the office. Q. Have you ever seen him in the wards ? A. I have seen him go through with the rest of the managers. Q. I ask you if yon have never seen him coming through alone, or with the doctors. A. I cannot recollect any times. Q. Can you recollect a case of seeing a manager come through except where the board have gone through altogether? A. I think I saw Mr. Campbell. Q. How often have,you seen Mr. Campbell go through ? A. Once. Q. Any oftener ? A. I cannot recollect any. Q. Which part of the building was that once? A. The men's side. Q. Which ward ? A. He was on the tenth ward when I saw him. Q. Do you recollect the occasion ? A. It was on Sunday afternoon and there had been a patient- had a fainting spell in the chapel and was fetched on to the ward, and he came down to see him, he was attending chapel at the time. Q. How long ago was that ? A. It was a while after I was promoted to be supervisor. Q. How did you come to be employed at the Asylum ? A. I went there and asked if they had a vacancy ; I sent my name to Mr. Dryer, about a year before this. 443 Q. Had you any recommendations ? A. Yes, sir. Q. From whom ? A. Dr. Crane of Holland Patent. Q. Any other ? A. No, sir. Q. Was that the only letter you took ? A. Yes, sir; I could have had others if I wished. Q. What did Mr. Dryer say to you, when you visited the Asylum ? A. He said he had no vacancies then but would give me the first chance. Q. When you next went to the Asylum, what did Mr. Dryer say ? A. He told me to come to work. Q. Did he ask you any questions? A. I don't exactly remember now. Q. Don't you remember whether he asked you what your qualifi- cations were ? A. No, sir; I don't think he did. Q. Don't you remember whether he asked you what you had previously worked at? A. No, sir. Q. Do you think he did not ask you any such questions ? A. No, sir ; I don't. Q. What were you employed at before going to the Asylum ? A. Farming, farmed it for a few years, then I was at Avork for Dr. Crane, a little over a year. Q. In what capacity did you serve Dr. Crane ? A. Seeing to his farm and taking care of his horses and flower garden. Q. The general work of his place ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Where did you work farming? A. Holland Patent. Q. What wages do you get at the institution ? A. Thirty-five dollars per month. Q. How long have you received such wages ? A. Since I was made supervisor. Q. What did yon previously receive ? A. TAventy-six dollars; I started in on tAventy dollars aud they raised every six months until you were there a year. Q. Do you know whether any complaints have ever been made against yon since you have been at the institution? A. No, sir; I cannot recollect any now. Q. Have you had occasion to m^ke any complaints yourself? A. Yes, sir. Q. To whom ? A. Some of the attendants. Q. Can you name any of them ? A. Yes, sir ; I have; of Mr. J. A. Hensel. 444 Q. Any others ? A. Mr. Geo. Morris. Q. What was he? A. He was an attendant. Q. Any others ? A. I do not recollect now. Q. Of what did you complain of him ? A. That he was slack in his work and duties. Q. What was done with Hensel upon such complaint ? A. He was removed on to another ward. Q. Of what did you complain against Morris ? A. Slack in his work; did not attend to his duties. Q. What was done with him ? A. I think he was discharged ; I cannot say for certain ; he went away from the building three days after 1 complained of him; I cannot say whether he was discharged or not? Q. Is Hensel still in the institution now ? [ A. Yes, sir. Q. Were not three of these attendants complained of for striking or maltreating patients ? A. No, sir. Q. You have stated that you have never seen any patient suffer- ing from bruises or other injuries since you have been at the Asylum? A. I cannot recollect any now. Q. Have there not been patients bruised, or kicked, or injured by accident, or otherwise, since you have been supervisor ? A. There might, but 1 cannot recollect now ; I might from the book there that you have. Q. The injury books now being before you, I ask you if you can identify your own writing in the injury book [handing the book to the witness] after inspecting it? A. Yes, sir (handing it back). Q. Had you dates at the commencement ? A. January 16 when the entry of F. Camp came. Q. Does it continue in your own writing through the book \ A. Yes, sir. By Mr. Haskell : Q. Did you have charge of the fourth ward while you were there ? A. No, sir. Q. What position were you in ? A. I was as an attendant. Q. A general attendant? A. Yes, sir. Q. During the time you were in the fourth ward, who had charge of it, one man all the while? A. Yes, sir; Daniel Torpey. 445 Q. While you were in the fourth ward was a patient by the name of Giles Penny on your ward ? A. No, sir ; he was in the building at the time. Q. At any time while he was in the building did you have charge of him at all? A. No, sir. Q. How came you to be removed from the fourth ward to the first ward ? A. I don't know as I can answrer that; the doctors removed me there. Q. Without provocation? A. Yes, sir. Q. Something that you asked for ? A. No, sir, I did not ask for it. Q. But it was a promotion ? A. Y es, sir. Q. And increased wages—were they increased when you went on to the first ward ? A. No, sir; not at the time I went there. Q. What wages were you receiving at the time you were trans- ferred ? A. Twenty-four dollars. Q. And soon after you were transferred were they raised ? A. I don't know as I can say exactly the time. Q. But very soon ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And then they terminated at twenty-six dollars, until you were made supervisor of the third department ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Since that time you received thirty-five dollars ? A. Yres, sir. Q. Do you know how you came to be made supervisor of the third department ? A. No, sir, but I suppose it was by the doctor's advice. Q. It was a promotion ? A. Yes, sir. Q. As you understand, for good conduct? A. Yes, sir. Q. Was it before or after you were made supervisor that you complained to the men you have spoken of ? A. After I was made supervisor. Q. The first ward is a ward where more visitors come than any other in the institution, is it not ? A. Yes, sir. Q4 It is visited more frequently ? A. Yes, sir. Q. You may state, if you recollect, what class of patients are on the first ward ? 446 A. Convalescents. Q. Patients nearly cured ? A. Yes, sir. Q. More ready for discharge ? r A. Yes, sir. Q. State how much Dr. Gray gave to the patients generally when you were on that ward, was it considerable attention ? A. I don't know as to that. Q. Would you see him there to see some one patient nearly every day during the time you were there ? A. No, sir. Q. About how often, as near as you can put it, would he come to see some one patient that he was taking particular interest in ? A. I do not know as I can state. Q. Yon know more about it than I do ? A. I would not want to make a rough guess. Q. Have you any recollection whatever ? A. No, sir. Q. Is your recollection very poor- about every thing ? A. Well, not very. Q. Who were the attending physicians on the male department of the institution while you were on the first ward ? A. There was Dr. Russell, Dr. Josselyn and Dr. Bloomer. Q. How often would you see them on the first ward ? A. Quite frequently ; they went through most generally twice a day. Q. Would you see them in addition to their twice a day visit \ A. Yes, sir. Q. Would they average as much as one additional visit a day? A. Yes, sir; I think more than that on the first ward. Q. Recollecting so distinctly about that, cannot you recollect more distinctly in regard to Dr. Gray ? A. No, sir. Q. Was he not there at all ? (not answered.) Q. Do you mean to say that the first ward Avas left to his disposal entirely, and Dr. Gray gave no additional activity at all ? A. I cannot say as to that. Q. Can you say whether he was there as often as once a month? A. He might be and might not be, I cannot say. Q. Do you know whether he was there during the whole time you were on the first ward ? A. He might have been, but I cannot recall now. Q. Where were you subpoenaed on Saturday ? A. In the doctor's office. Q. In the library ? A. Yes, sir. Q. The medical library ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How came you to come there \ r447 A. The doctor whistled up through the pipe to me. Q. And told you to come to the office ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did he say what for ? A. No, sir. Q. You say that you have spoken — that you immediately went back to your work after the subpoena was served on you ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And there was nothing more said by the authorities of the institution to you since then, except what you said to Dr. Pilgrim ? A. No, sir Q. Noav, what time did yon leave the institution this morning ? A. About ten, I think. Q. Who did yon notify before you left ? A. Dr. Pilgrim. Q. What did you say to him ? * A. Says I, " I suppose I will have to go now," and says he, " All right; you will be back to-night, will you ?" I says, " I will if I can ; I don't know how long I will be kept there." Q. And that is the only thing that has passed between you and any of the authorities ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How did you go doAvn to the depot when you came down, did you come down alone ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Where did you meet Orendorf? A. At the depot; I was about to come. Q. Do you know how he got there ? A. No, sir; I cannot say. Q. Did any one furnish you with any money to pay your ex- penses here ? A. No, sir. Q. And you and Orendorf came down together on the train — from the depot ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you see any of the managers of the institution before you left Utica? A. No, sir; I met Mr. Barnard on the train between here and Utica. Q. How did you know it was Barnard ? A. Mr. Orendorf came into the car and said, "Mr. Barnard, one of the managers, is in the other car; come in and I Avill introduce you." Q. Had he been talking with Mr. Barnard before you saw him ? A. I do not kn >w. Q. You were introduced to Mr. Barnard ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And all three of you came down here together ? A. Yes, sir. 448 Q. Did you and Mr. Orendorf have any conversation in regard to what you were coming down here for ? A. Yes, sir, I think we did. " Q. Did you talk together about what questions would be asked « you ? A. No, sir. Q. Was it talked over before Mr. Barnard what you were coming down here for ? A. No, sir. Q. There was nothing said between you two and Mr. Barnard, or before Mr. Barnard, what you were coming down for ? A. No, sir; I just said : How do you do, Mr. Barnard, and happy to meet you, and that is all I said to him until we got here to Albany. J JOHN B. ORENDORF, Sworn and examined, testified as follows: By the Chairman: Q How old are you ? A. Forty-six. Q. What is your residence apart from the Asylum ? A. I have none. Q. What is your position in the Asylum ? A. General attendant on No. 9, that is the suicidal and hospital ward. Q. How long have you been connected with the institution? A. I have been off and on since April, 1863, and went there April, 1863, and severed my connection on 7th June, 1868, and re- turned on 2d of May, 1877. Q. What position have you held there ? A. In 1863, when I went there, and had charge of the dining- room on April 3, until I went away. Q. What was your salary when you entered ? A. Sixteen dollars a month. Q. What is your salary at present ? A. Twenty-six dollars since I had charge of the ward. Q. What wards have you served from time to time ? A No. 3, No. 1 and No. 9. Q. What is the character of patients on No. 3 ? A. At the time I was there in 1863 they were considered conva- lescent — quiet. Q. Whatis the character of the patients on number one? A. That is the hall on which they are considered almost fit to go away. V 449 Q. How about number nine ? A. Suicidal and sick. Q. What are your duties at present ? A. Having charge of the ward, which is being over two other at- tendants and sometimes three ; we have ten or tAvelve — these men in bed are filthy men— then I have three men under me. Q. How many patients are in your care at the present time ? A. Thirty-one. Q. With about how many attendants? A At the present time I have three. Q. How7 frequently does Dr. Gray visit your ward ? A. Quite frequently. Q. What do you mean by quite frequently ? A. Because it was the hospital ward — sometimes he was there once or twice a week. Q. How frequently has he visited the wards] that you have been connected with, prior to this? A. When I was on number ten he used to come there every day ; that was before we had the assistant ; he used to come through with his book, the same as the under physician ; and when I was on ward one he came. Q. During what years was that ? A. From 1863 to 1868, and when I was on the first ward it was in 1867; I was there one month. Q. Does he go through the institution noAv as frequently as formerly ? A. I cannot say, with the exception of my own ward. Q. What physician had charge over your ward? A. Dr. Pilgrim. Q. How often did he visit ? A. Thursday. Q. Any other times? A. Oh, yes, sir; he comes, being on hospital, he is called, some- times he is there probably half a dozen times, and then again a dozen ; but he comes regularly Thursday. Q. Are patients brought to the hospital for injuries as well as for diseases ? A. I never had but one case that was brought for injuries, and that Avas recently, since the committee went into the Asylum. Q. What case was that ? A. S. H. Q. What was the nature of his injuries? A. Dislocation of his hip. Q. Do you know how the injury occurred ? A. Only from what Dr. Pilgrim told me that a patient by the name of C. L. knocked him down on ward e:ight. Q. When did that occur? A. I really could not say, he was transferred to my ward, about two weeks ago. 57 U 450 Q. The injury occurred a day or two before that; is it a serious injury ? y A. I think not; he is improving. Q. During your connection with the institution do you know of patients who have been injured ? A. I don't, with the exception of this old gentleman. Q. This is the first case of injury you have heard of ? A. And Mr. Hughes. Q. And you have never heard of any other cases of injury in the institution ? A. Well, I heard of something a year ago, and what I read in the papers ? Q. But you heard of nothing in the institution ? A. No, sir. Q. Of what injuries did you hear a year ago ? A. I think it was of Mr. G. the papers spoke of. Q. And you never heard of that case until it was spoken in the papers ? . ! A. No, sir; I heard of it in the papers, during the investigation, j Q. You did hear that of some patients having black eyes, didn't you ? A. I did not because we never have any such cases happen on our ward, it is a quite ward — hospital ward. Q. Have you ever been in the fourth ward ? A. I have been frequently, but not of late. Q. How long since you have been ? A. It was in the fall, and I was in the ward, I went in to see the sitting-room. Q. Have you ever seen men there with bruised faces I A. No, sir. Q. Ever heard attendants speak of patients having such injuries \ . A. No, sir. Q. Did you ever hear of attendants striking the patients in the institution ? A. Yes, sir; the case of Mr. G. Avas the only case. Q What became of the attendant in the case ? \ A. I think it was i:i Mr. Weir testimony; I think he testified jj that it was John Sage. 1 Q. W hat became of John Sage ? A. He was discharged from the Asylum two months ago. Q. Hoav long after Mr. G. received his injuries? A. That was previous to the last investigation, previous to last winter, a year ago, it was testified in the investigation a year ago; Mr. Weir testified of it. Q. It was there testified to, that Sage had struck G. ? i A. I think from reading the testimony that Mr. Weir testified, f that the patient was transferred from his ward to Weir's Avard, and he found him with black and blue marks on him. 451 Q. Was there any testimony to the effect that Sage had struck G. that you recollect ? A. I think the testimony was, that Mr. Weir asked Mr. G. and G. said Sage struck him. Q. And you say Sage w7as not discharged until two months ao-o ? A. It is all of two months ago, that he was discharged. Q. That is about a year after the investigation ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Was he discharged before the accident to Mr. Hughes, or afterward ? A. It was before that. Q. Have you any recollection of seeing any patient about the institution, or about the ward, or going out for walks with black eyes or faces bruised ? A No, sir. Q. How often did you visit the fourth ward during the seven- teen years of your employment there ? A. I cannot say ; our rules are very strict; we are not allowed to visit from ward to ward, and if we d'id, of course we should stand a chance of being discharged ; we have strict discipline there. Q. Have you opportunity from to time to form acquaintance with attendants on their wards ? A. No, sir. Q. Was that as a matter of fact ? A. There is little communication between attendants from their wards; there is no way only when we meet them down street. Q. Only when you meet them in the town ? A. No,' sir. Q. As a matter of fact, do attendants stay some time without being acquainted with each other ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Have you ever hear attendants speak of injuries inflicted upon patients by attendants? A. No, sir. Q. Have you ever heard them speak of injuries inflicted by patients by each other ? A. No, sir. Q. Is it ever a matter of conversation between the attendants as to the condition or appearance of patients ? A. Not in the ward I have charge of. Q. Don't you compare notes, from time to time, touching the condition of patients in your charge ? A. I would if I found them in any suspicious — found any thing about them — any marks or any thing that would cause suspicion, and I should — Q. Suspicion of whom ? A. Why, if I had a patient sent to my ward and I found black marks on him, I should report it to the supervisor immediately. Q. Did you not ever speak with the attendants on your ward, 452 touching the condition of patients from time to time — their genera] condition? A. Our own patients ? Q. Yres. A. Yes, sir ; we do our own patients. Q. So that the attendants in any one ward are familiar with the condition of patients, both from their own knoAvledge and by com- parison of views with other attendants on the same w7ard ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do you say again that you don't know of any patients,during the whole time you have been in the institution, that you have not seen with black eyes ? A. I never had but one case since I have had charge of the ward, of black eyes ; that was a patient that came from ward four, whose name was C. ; that was the only case. Q. Did he have any other bruise or injury ? A. No, sir. Q. What inquiry did you make about that ? A. I reported it to the supervisor. Q. What was done? A. He investigated it and told me it was inflicted by a patient on (the fourth ward ; he told me his name ; that was supervisor Jones that investigated it. Q. Do you ever see patients out in the exercise yard ? A. I do not, only as I see them from the windows in the summer time; I do not go out with them, because my duties are such that I stay on the wards with the sick. Q. Do you know any of the board of managers by sight ? A. I know Senator Campbell, General McQuaid and Mr. Swan; I did not know Mr. Barnard until I met him out on the train; I was told that he was going down ; that is the only three. Q. Do you know Mr. Swan ? A. By sight. Q. Do you know Mr. Pomeroy by sight ? A. No, sir. Q. Or Mr. Rogers by sight? A. No, sir. Q. Mr. Winston ? - A. No, sir. . "Q. How often do you see the board of managers on the wards? A The second Tuesday in December is tbeir annual meeting; and I have seen them at other times ; but they did not come as a body, but one or two would come on the ward together. Q. How often have you seen Mr. Campbell there on the Avard? A. I do not know as 1 ever saw Mr. Campbell on the Avards ex- cept at the annual meeting; I have seen him at the Center, at the executive department of the institution. Q. Have you seen John McQuaid on the wards ? A. Yes, sir. 453 . Q. How often ? A. I should think, from memory, two or three times a year. Q. How about the authorities; have you seen any of the authori- ties except at the annual meeting? A. I have seen Mr. Swan once or twice. Q. How often did you see one of the managers on the wards ? A. It was not an unusual thing to see them. Q. How often do yon see them there ? A. Those that I have seen, of Mr. McQuade two or three times in the course of a year coming round with the visitations,' and Mr. Swan ; I cannot speak as to others except at the annual meeting of the managers. Q. Did you see the patient Hughes while he was at the Asylum? A. He was sent into my charge as soon as ever the case was taken. Q. Where was that ? A. In the suicidal ward. Q. What was his condition when he was received ? A. I should judge it was a case of melancholia. Q. Was he under the influence of chloral at that time, in your judgment ? A. No, sir. Q. Did any conversation pass between you and him when he was put there ? A. When he came in he shook hands with me and said, " Well, Orendorf, 1 am crazy again." Q. What did you say ? A. I said, "I am sorry to see you back, Mr. Hughes;" I gave him his dinner. Q. In the ward or in the dining-room ? A. In the dining-room. Q. At what hour was this? A. Might have been twenty minutes after one when we were through dinner. Q. Please state, as near as you can recollect, how he behaved dur- ing the afternoon ? A. After I bathed him — I did that as soon as he had dinner, that is what we always do — I found him free from any marks, in very good condition, weighing about 170 pounds, I should judge ; he talked with me quite a while in the afternoon, but still he seemed to be depressed, worrying about his farm and the losses he had been having, he said, beginning with loss of sleep, and these losses had upset his mind; he was quiet, but did not want to sit down but wanted to be walking; he was in that condition from the time he came in at one o'clock until when I went out at six o'clock for my evening; he had a good supper; I was out until eleven o'clock on leave of absence ; when I returned I found him in the ten-bedded dormitory in his night-clothes; Mr. Mulheron, the night Avatchman, said he could not prevail on him to lie down; I came in with my overcoat .454 on and put him to bed and covered him up, and said, " Now lay quiet, Mr. Hughes, and get a little rest," but he kept jabbering in Welsh ; I started for my room and Mr. Mulheron says, " He is out of bed again;" I went to bed and, in the morning at six o'clock, Mr. Mulheron says, "We were obliged to put Mr. Hughes into a covered bed." Q. On the same ward ? A. Yes, sir ; I went down to the crib-room and he was jabbering in Welsh, and Mr. John M. Jones, and myself went in and opened the crib; I opened the crib ; Mr. Jones could talk Welsh and they conversed in Welsh; Mr. Hughes came out and dressed himself without assistance ; but he seemed to be more disturbed than he was when he came in. Q. Had he had any quietive medicine during the night? A. I didn't hear that he had. Q. Did you administer any during the afternoon? A. No, sir. Q. What instructions did the doctor give you concerning him, upon his entry to your ward? A. When the supervisor brought him on to the ward, he says, " give Mr. Hughes his dinner and bathe him, and I will be over if he needs any medicine ; I will go and see the doctor ; " but he did not require any medicine in the afternoon. Q. You say he didn't require any medicine during the afternoon? A. No, sir. Q. Did you send for the supervisor then ? A. He came over in the course of twenty minutes. Q. What did the supervisor then say ? A. He says, " I don't think Mr. Hughes,is as bad as he was when he came here before, do you " ; ? and I says, " I don't; I don't think he is as disturbed as he was, when he came before ; " the supervisor assisted me in bathing him. Q. Did the doctor come there that afternoon ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did he see Mr. Hughes ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did he prescribe for him ? A. I cannot say ; I was with the doctor; it was Dr. Backus. Q. Did you receive any instructions from the doctor concerning Hughes' treatment ? A. No, sir. Q. Would the doctor have given his instructions to you or to the supervisor ? A. The supervisor. Q. Do you know whether he gave any instructions to the super- visor that afternoon ? A. I do not. Q. Did the supervisor give you any instructions concerning him after the doctor's visit ? 455 A. No, sir, he was quiet; he didn't require any. Q. You have brought his condition down to the morning when he dressed himself— what was then done with him ? A. Breakfast bell rang, and I said, come Mr. Hughes, come down to breakfast; he stood in this way (indicating, holding his hands up and looking up) and seemed to be praying ii/Welsh ; I said, " come Mr. Hughes, come down to breakfast," he came quietly, 'but ate very little breakfast; after breakfast, he Avalked about half Avay down the north corridor and stood in this attitude (indicating) with his hands raised over his head, hands open, extended, with his eyes raised and his head back, praying in Welsh; after he had stood there ior about ten or fifteen minutes, I went and got a chair and put him into the chair, and I had hardly taken my hands off from him before he was up again, and I tried two or three times to have him sit down ; I thought he Avould get tired out standing in such a position ; finally Mr. Jones and I made a basket of our hands and carried him down to the sitting room, and sat him down into a seat, and instead of sitting doAvn as Ave Avould put him, his back seemed to be rigid and he kept slipping down this way (indicating) with his hands in this way (indicating) still looking up all the time ; we tried two or three times to make him sit up in a seat so that he would rest, but he would not, and about half-past nine o'clock I re- ceived an order from Dr. Backus to go to the theater in the building (I have charge of the theater and stage and properties, and have had for a number of years) and select properties for a play that our Asylum dramatic corps was going to give at VVhitestown, and I think I Avas off the ward about not to exceed twenty-five minutes, and Avhen I came back, supervisor Jones was on the ward, and he says, "Mr. Hughes has become violent, and now you have come, I want you to stay down beside him, and help to hold him in the seat, until I go and report him," so I sat down beside him and put my hand on his shoulder and I sat on the left side of him, and he tried to bite me and spit in my face, and tried to kick me, and the froth Avas running out of his mouth. The supervisor was gone probably eight or ten minutes, he came back and says, " we'll take Mr. Hughes to number four." Mr. Jones, the supervisor, an J Mr. Morris Mahoney took Mr. Hughes down to num- ber four ; and that was all I knew of Mr Hughes at that time. Q. Did you go with1 them to number four ? A. I did not, that would have left the hall alone, Q. Where did you next see Mr. Hughes ? A. That same evening, going through number eight with the su- pervisor to number six ; I says, " where is Mr. Hughes, what room is he in, " and they told me, and I stood in the door and looked in, I didn't go into the room. Q. Did you see Mr. Hughes there ? A. I did from the door. Q. Was he lying down ? A. He was lying on his back, breathing heavily, his eyes closed ? 456 Q. Could you see any portion of his body ? A. No, sir ; only his face. Q. What was the appearance of his face ? A. He looked as though he was suffering, and from the manner of his breathing I thought he was pretty sick. Q. Did you "then know of his injuries ? A Mr. Linn, who had charge of number eight, told me ; he says as I went'through the ward. " Mr. Hughes was put on this ward now;" I says^what is the matter with Mr. Hughes? He says, " didn't you hear about his getting injured on Avard four ; " I said I didn't. Q. Did he state to you how the injury occurred i A. No, sir. Q. Did you ask him ? A. I didn't at that time. Q. Did he state Avhat the injuries were ? A. I asked the supervisor when I got over to his ward number six, John Wilson Jones had charge of the second department, and that includes number six, seven, eight and nine. Q. What did the supervisor tell you ? A. He told ihe that Mr. Hughes' jaw was dislocated or broken, and that something was the matter in the neighborhood of his ribs as far as he could judge. Q. Any thing else ? A. That was all; then I asked him who done it, and he says, " some of the attendants on ward four;" he was transferred to ward four about ten o'clock on that morning, and I don't know what time he was transferred to number eight. Q. When did you next see Mr. Hughes? * A. I think it was early in the next week one evening; I was coming through number eight and his son invited me into the room. Q. And what was his condition at the time? A. About as he was when I first saw him ; sleeping. Q. Was he conscious ? A. I cannot say, he was sleeping. Q. How long did you stay in the room at that time ? A. Not to exceed five minutes. Q. What passed between you and his son at that time ? A. I says, "how does your father seem to-night?" He says, "he is resting." It was in whisper, of course, we did not talk loud; that is about all that was said. Q. When did you next see Mr. Hughes ? A. I don't think 1 saw him again. Q. Did you see him after he had died ? A. No, sir. Q. Were you present at the inquest ? A. I testified — gave my testimony before the coroner and jury. 457 By Mr. Haskell : Q. In the morning how was he? A. He would not stay in his chair and was restless. Q. Why did not you report his condition to the doctor as soon as he became in the way you have stated ? A. I did ; I told the supervisor. Q. Was it the supervisor who was with you when vou made a basket of your hands and carried hjin ? A. No, sir ; John M. Jones that was. Q. When was it you first informed the supervisor of his condition ? A. I should think it was before nine o'clock in the morning- Mr Jones was on the ward and said, " Mr. Hughes won't sit down and we cannot make him sit down." Q. Did the supervisor remain with you then until you went away to the property-room of the theater ? A No, sir ; the supervisor came over with — I don't know what, but he came over for he is on the ward, and came many times in the course of the day to see to the sick men. Q. Did the supervisor remain with you then until you went away to the property-room of the theater ? A. No, sir. t Q. Did he go over the ward ? A. He went back to his department. Q. When did you next see the supervisor ? A. When I came back from the theater. Q. Didn't Mr. Hughes apparently grow worse from the time yon spoke to the supervisor until you went to the theater? A. No, sir; just about the same condition. Q. And the only report you have made was that you have stated? A. les, sir; all. Q. For how long a time have you received twenty-six dollars? A Since the 14th November, 1870; since I took charge of the ward. ° Q. And you have remained in charge of that ward ever since ? A. 1 es, sir. Q. Explain to us the system of promotions in the institution as you understand them ? A. I can only state in my own case; I had charge of the dining- room on this same ward from the 2d of May to the 14th of Novem- ber, 1870. , J Q. Have you always been in this same ward ? A. Since the 2d of May, 1870; since I returned. <4. Do you know why Smith, the witness preceding you, coming atter you did, should be promoted to be supervisor of a department before you were? A. I do not: it was rather humiliating to me, after beW there so many years. Q. Then you don't understand the system by which promotions were made in the institution ? 58 U 458 A. No, sir; I don't, . -,..,, Q Since you were subpoenaed on Saturday morning last, with what authorities of the institution have you conversed in regard to your coming here as a witness? A. Dr. Pilgrim is the only one. Q. "W hen was that ? A About five or ten minutes after I was subpoenaed 1 went down to Dr Pilgrim to ask him if I was to be at my own expense, and he told me, "°no; yon will get mileage;" that is all the conversation. 11Q. And then you went back to your duties ? I' A. Yes, sir. . ' Q. Were you aware that you were to be examined by us, as a witness, at trie suggestion of Dr. Gray and Dr. Brush ?_ A. No, sir; I was thinking it was because I was a witness on the coroner's inquest; that was my idea. Q. Who made the arrangement to have your place filled while yon were away to-day ? "A. I don't know as it is filled. Q. What time did you leave the institution ? A. Just one hour previous to train time. Q. How did you go to the depot ? A. Walked ; I left at half-p%st ten. Q.' And w7here did you meet Smith ? A. At the depot. Q. Have you had any conversation with Smith since you were subpoenaed, 'and before you left the institution in regard to coming down here? A. All the conversation with Smith was when I started back to my ward with my subpoena; he stayed in the corridor waiting for m'e to come; he says, do yon suppose Ave have got to pay our own expenses? I said,I didn't know. He says, Avell either you or I ought to see about it; and then I went to see Dr. Pilgrim. Q. Did you see Smith after that talk with him on any subject, until you met him at the depot ? A. No, sir. Q. I ^suppose you had a conversation about this matter on the way down'/ A. We had not. Q. And have not since you got there ? A. No, sir; we have not beeai together since we — we walked up from the depot and we took a walk round the block and finished our cigars ; and went up through the building, the Court of Appeals room, and different places. Q. And during the occasion of that time you say you did not converse upon your examination at all ? A. No, sir. Q. Or what it would probably be ? ? A. No, sir; no such conversation Q. Or as to what questions would probably be asked you ? A. No, sir; I visited most of the time, coming down, with a Mr. Martin, a friend of mine. 459 * By Mr. Rice : Q. How did you get acquainted with Smith, the last witness? A. I got acquainted with Mr. Smith at a Pythian party. Q. Is there an attendant in the institution, who has been there, that you are not acquainted with ? A. Yes, sir; there is quite a number I am not acquainted with__ I haVe had introductions to every one, I guess, that is there. Q. Do you know all, on both sides, male and female? A. Well, on the female side there is a barrier; I know the ladies that have taken part in theatricals and the supervisors, Mrs. Sayles and Mrs. Thomas. Q. Are you a married man ? A. No, sir; I am not. Q. Whether or not your continuance in the Asylum has affected your health in any way — is your health better or worse since you went in there ? A. It is better. Q. What are your hours ? A. From six in the morning to eight in the evening. Q. Do you find those hours tedious ? A. Of course ; I have charge of the sick. Q. What do you say as to whether you are able to perform the duties of your position fourteen hours ?' A. Yes, sir. Q. You think the hours are not too long ? A. No, sir ; I do not think so. By Mr. Olin : Q. How did you know that Mr. Barnard was on the train ? A. I think — Dr. Pilgrim told me yesterday on the Avard that he believed that Mr. George Barnard, of' Rome, was subpoenaed to go down to-day. Q. How came he to tell you that ? A. I asked him if there was any one besides Mrs. Smith and myself who were subpoenaed ? Q. What did he tell you ? A. He said he believed that Mr. George Barnard, one of the managers, was subpoenaed. Q. Did you testify in the inquest in the Hughes case ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you testify before the committee last year ? A. No, sir. Q. HaA7e you ever testified in any of the investigations that have been held here ? A. No, sir; I never was sworn until the inquest on Mr. Hughes in my life; I never was a witness before. Adjourned. 460 Room B, New Capitol, ) Albany, N. Y., March 4, 1884. f The committee met at 3:30 p. m. Mr. Joseph Swan, Jr., one of the managers of the Asylum, said: I have a matter I desire to bring to the attention of the com- mittee. The board of managers had a meeting yesterday, and I ex- plained to them, as I did to some members of the committee, that it would be impossible for me, on account of my personal engage- ments, and in view of the amount of time required in this investi- gation, that it would be impossible for me to attend to it in the interest of the Asylum and the board of managers. In view of the fact that the committee decided Ave could be present at the hearings, the board, at their meeting, passed the following resolution, which I will read : "At a special meeting of the board of managers of the New York State Lunatic Asylum, held March 3, 1884, at which were present Messrs. Rogers, Swan, Lowery, Winston and Pomeroy : The investigating committee of the Assembly having decided that Avhile witnesses called and examined by the committee are being examined, the board of managers shall have a representative before the committee. Resolved, That Hon. Alexander T. Goodwin be appointed to repre- sent the board of managers before said committee, and during the investigation. THEO. POMEROY, Secretary:' I also reported to the board of managers the mode of examination that I understood was taken by the committee, and it seems to me well that some record should be made of it also, if no record has been made. I submitted to writing my understanding of the pro- ceeding in the committee-room at Utica, when the mode of exami- nation was decided upon. I put it in the form of a report which 1 submitted to the board of managers, and it is as follows : February28, 1884. Mr. Sw7an appeared on behalf of the board of managers of the Asylum, accompanied by Dr. Brush, the first assistant physician. Some of the committee objected to the presence of any officer of the Asylum, in company with Mr. SAvan, during the examination of witnesses by the committee. Mr. Swan urged that some officer of the Asylum should be present with him, in order that he might in- telligently cross-examine the witnesses produced and examined by the committee. The committee went into executive session, and afterward an- nounced its determination as follows: That while witnesses, not officers, attendants or employees, called and examined by the com- mittee, are being examined, the board'of managers shall haAre a 461 representative before the committee.which representative shall be the same person during the continuance of the examination ; that such representative shall have the right to suggest questions to the com- mittee with which to interrogate such witnesses, but not the right to cross-examine, except for special reason ; that no part of the evi- dence shall be made public until the whole evidence to be taken be- fore the committee shall be concluded; that after the evidence of witnesses to be called by the committee shall be completed, the whole of it shall be submitted to the representative of the board of managers ; that the board of managers and officers of the Asylum may then produce such Avitiiesses and eAndence before the committee as shall by them and the committee be deemed proper or necessary, in order to give the committee a full understanding of the subject under investigation, and said committee will, upon request, recall any witnesses called and examined by the committee for cross-exam- ination. February 29, 1884. The committee having determined what witnesses they would call on Tuesday of the folloAving week, Mr. Swan requested their names and the committee declined. That is the report I made and I believe it is correct. The Chairman — Substantially. Mr. Sav an — Mr. Goodwin is here, and will attend your hearings on behalf of the Asylum authorities. The Chairman- -That is quite acceptable to the committee. ALBERT CRAMPTON, Sworn and examined, testified as follows : By Mr. Haskell : Q. Where do you reside ? A. Green Island. Q. What is your business ? A. Drawers and blind manufacturer, and lumber dealer. Q. State whether yon were acquainted with a Mr. Brown, and, if so, give the circumstances connected with him some time during the past few years ? A. He was a minister in the State street church. Q. State street, Troy ? A. Yes, sir ; he» was there three years ; his name was George J. BroAvn ; he was there three years, and was not on actual duty on account of ill health — his health would not permit him to attend to his dnties; but I told him he could stay with me until he had rested a little and got better, and could make it his home with me, and he did so ; he was there about six months ; while he Avas there we went down to Ocean Grove ; that was in 1880; when we came to go away he wanted to stay there a little longer. 462 Q. What time during the season was that ? A. I think that was in August; it was in the summer time ; he thought he would stay there a while, and so we left him there; and the first I knew he became raving, and he was brought back to Troy, and brought to our house, and taken from thereto the Utica Asylum; I was in Canada at the time ; we went out to visit him while he was there at Utica; he was taken there in August, and some time in September, I think, we went to see him ; when we called on him he was apparently as rational as I am. Q. Whereabouts in the institution did you see him when you visited it ? A. I cannot tell you the room; the attendants came with him when we saw him, and he seemed to be afraid ; he looked around as if he wras afraid. Q. That is, his general demeanor was one of fear ? A. Yes, sir ; it seemed to be. » Q. Did you see him in the hall with any of the other patients ? A. No, sir; he was alone with his attendant when I saw him. Q. Do you know the attendant's name ? A. No, sir; I do not remember it now. Q. Do you remember what floor it was on that y7ou saw him I A. I do not remember now. Q. Did they bring him down to the reception-room ? A. No, sir; he was not brought down to the reception-room, but it was in another room off of that. Q. Did you go up through any part of the Asylum, and then have him come to a room ? A. We went to another part of the Asylum, but I do not remember whether it was up stairs or not. Q. But it was not in the reception-room ? A. No, sir; it was not in the reception-room. Q. Describe the interview that you had with Mr. Brown? A. I expected then that in a short time he would be out again; he appeared to be a little afraid of what he said, and he talked with me as though he was under a little fear. Q. What did he say ? A. If he said any thing (and I do not remember just what he said) but I think lie said that he was very glad he had not harmed any one of his friends when he was in that way. Q. Before he was taken from your house Avas he rational or in- sane ? A. I was not there at the time he was taken away; I was in Can- ada at that time, and he was brought there to my house, and taken from there to the Asylum. Q. How long did your interview last ? A. I should think, perhaps, half an hour, and perhaps longer — twenty minutes I think we were allowed. I think, it was in the neighborhood of half an hour. ,463 ~> - ~ Q. Describe his general appearance ? A. What do you mean by that ? Q. His general appearance. A. He was quite fleshy. Q. What would you call his approximate weight « A. I should think he would Aveigh perhaps 160 pounds. Q. How high was he ? A I should think he was not over five feet four—he was less than five feet and a half, I should say about five feet four. Q. What do you say his age was ? A I did know what his age was, bnt I have forgotten it; but I - should think he was about thirty years old — well," he must have been a little older than that. Q. Somewhere between thirty and forty years old, should vou think ? J A. Yes, sir; about between those ages. Q. Was your wife with you at this intervieAV ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you recollect any thing particularly about the conversation that you had with him ? _ A. Well, not much of it; I do not think there was any thing very important, only he seemed to be very glad that he had not injured anybody while in that way. Q. Did he make any complaint to you in any w7ay in regard to his treatment in the Asylum ? A. No, sir; I do not recollect that he did. Q. The attendant was with him all the while? A. Yes, sir. Q, Do you remember which one of the physicians you saw Avhen you went to the institution ? A. Dr. Russell. Q. Did you see Dr. Gray ? A. Not at that time. ' *" # Q. When did you see or hear from Mr. Brown after this interview m September? A. I should think it was less than six months. Q. What did you see of him, or what did you hear from him ? A. We heard that he was dead. Q. How did you receive that information ? A. We heard by way of his folks, that was the first that I heard of it — that is from Mr. Brown's people. That is my impression about it now. Q. Can you name the person who informed you ? A. I do not know as I could. Q. What did you do, if any thing, upon hearing it ? A. Well, Mr. Brown's brother came up there. Q. To your place ? A. Yes, sir ; and then I went to Utica after the remains. Q. Do you know what day it was that you went to Utica, with reference to the day of Mr. Brown's death ? 464 A. No, sir; 1 could not tell you. Q. Who did you see when you got to the Asylum ? A. I saw Dr. Russell — Dr. Russell came into the reception-room and saw me, and I gave my name there ; he was the one I think that came in, and I believe there Avas a man by the name of Dryer came in and talked to me. Q. The steward ? A. I am not positive whether or not he was the steAvard, but I think that w7as his position ; it was a Mr. Dryer. Q. Some one connected Avith the institution ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How long had Mr. Brown been dead, as you understood it, when you got to the institution ? A. I do not know as I remember now how many days it was. Q. It was not a very long period ? A. No, sir, only two or three days after he was said to have died; I do not remember just how long it was. Q. Did you see Dr. Gray at this visit ? A. Mr. Russell told me — he sat down and talked with me a few minutes and he said that Dr. Gray Avould like to see me. Q. State what occurred at that time ? A. Mr. Russell made a few remarks and said that Mr. Brown had died of apoplexy, and that he had tAvo sores on his face —abscesses — on his neck, I think, and one on his face, he said ; he made a few remarks to that effect, and soon after Dr. Gray came in ; do you want I should go'on, and state what he said ? Q. Yes. A. He thought the only way was to leave the remains there until Monday. Q. What day were you there, with reference to Monday ? A. What day of the week ? I was there, I think, on Friday. Q. Did you tell Dr. Gray what you came there for ? A. Yes, sir; I told him I came for the remains ; he said it would not answer to move the remains at all; and said if they were dis- turbed in the least, that they Avould not be able to see the remains at the funeral at all; he said he had died of apoplexy, and he said it would not do at all; I told him it would be all right, to bring the remains down ; I told him that the undertaker had said so to me; he said he knew more about it than the undertaker, and he said the best way was — he advised me to leave the remains there, and have them sent down Monday morning; I told him I thought there was no train going Monday morning, that the remains could get there in time for the funeral; well, he said, they could go down on Sunday. Q. Had the funeral been fixed for Monday ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you see in that time Dr. Gray ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What time on Monday was it ? 465 A. I do not remember the hour now. Q. Go on with your statement ? A. It was a little earlier than usual, because the remains were to be taken home, and they had to be taken on a certain train ; my im- pression is it Avas ten o'clock, but I don't remember now. Q. Go on, and state what occurred between you and Dr. Gray ? A. I told him I thought there Avas no train that would bring the remains doAvn on Monday morning, and he said they could be brought down on Sunday, and left over Sunday night; I think he said they could be left in the depot, and taken right to the church; I told him that he (Brown) had not got any clothes there at Utica, and that he had some better clothes at my house, and I thought his friends would not like to have him laid out in the clothes that he had there ; Dr. Gray said that he had a suit there that was plenty good enough; I told him I thought there was no train going down Sunday night. Q. Did you ask to see the remains ? A. Yes, sir, I did ask to see the remains; I did not ask Dr. Gray to see the remains ; but he sent me to the undertaker's about a mile, * should think, in that neighborhood further. Q. Where were the remains at that time ? A. They were at an undertaker's down town in the city. Q. Did you make a final arrangement with Dr. Gray when the remains were to be sent ? A. I said, of course, that I did not really want to take the respon- sibility, against his protest, of bringing the remains away under the circumstances; but I would go home, and then I would inform him by telegraph what I would do. Q. What did Dr. Gray tell you, if any thing, in regard to Mr. Brown's death ? A. He told me that he died of the apoplexy; he said that he was in there a few minutes before he died. Q. Did he give you any description of tlve body at all ? A. He said to me that the body was discolored very much on account of his dying with the apoplexy. Q. State whether or not he mentioned any thing about any sores on the man? A. I wont be positive whether he spoke of- the two abscesses; Dr. Russell did any way, and I don't know but Dr. Gray did; but as to that I don't remember particularly ; I asked-to see the remains, and he said they were at the undertaker's — Dr. Gray did. Q. Do you remember the undertaker's name? A. No, sir, I don't; it Avas in the city of Utica; I went doAvn there and I met Mr. Dryer; I met him coming out of the undertaker's room ; I had met him before and had a conversation with him at the Asylum. Q. Y7ou met him coming out of the undertaker's room, did you say? A. Yes, sir. 59 U 466 Q. Did you have any conversation Avith him at the undertaker's room ? A. No, sir; not with him at that time. Q. State what occurred at the undertaker's room ? A. I went in there and called for the undertaker; there was an attendant there, and he said that the remains were in the next room behind the screen; that I could see them through an open door there, but he did not want to let me see them; he wanted I should wait for the undertaker; he said he would be in in a few minutes; there was a man there who was an attendant of the undertaker. Q. He did not want you to see the remains until the undertaker came ? A. No, sir; he did not want to take the responsibility, I suppose; but I did not want to wait until the undertaker came ; I wanted to take the train and go home ; an attendant came in there at that time that seemed to have something to do with the business there; but nothing to do, but I must wait until the undertaker came in. Q. They would not allow you to see the remains until the under- taker came in ? A. No, sir. Q. Was any reason given for that ? A. They thought it was not best to disturb the remains in some way; it seemed to me that they did not Avant to take the responsi- bility of it. Q. And you did not see the remains at all ? A. No, sir. Q. Y"ou and Mr. Brown's brother came home then ? A. Yes, sir. Q. State what you did ? A. I got home and went and had a talk with the undertaker and asked him what he thought about it; and he thought it was just as well that the body should be brought here as not; he thought there would be no trouble, but what the remains could be seen at the funeral if he was brought home. Q. What was the name of the undertaker ? A. Arnold, his name was. Q. Did you send the undertaker after the remains ? A. Yres, sir, I did ; I had my suspicions aroused there at Utica; the circumstances of the case seemed to indicate that there was some- thing wrong, so I sent the undertaker right after the remains, and told him to keep his eyes open and see if he discovered any thing wrong, and to see what condition the remains were in, etc. Q. When did the undertaker go, do you remember ? A. I think he went on Saturday, but I don't know but he went that same night; I am not positive now ; I don't remember. Q. You don't know whether he went on Friday night or Saturday morning ? A. No, sir, I don't know. Q. Did you telegraph Dr. Gray ? 467 A. Yes, sir; I telegraphed, I think, to Dr. Gray that the under- taker would be there after the remains. Q. When did you see the body ? A. When it was brought to my house. Q. What day ? A. Saturday, I think it was. Q. Will you describe what, if any thing, you noticed in regard to the body ? A. I noticed that it looked as if it were pretty badly bruised up. Q. What marks of violence did you discover ? A. There was a mark on him that looked as though he had.been struck with some blunt instrument, rather a bad place over the right eye. Q. Would you be positive about its being his right eye? A. I think I would; I think 1 am positive that it was his right eye. Q. What other marks, if any, did you discover upon his body ? A. On one side of his head, around his ear, it was unusually black, as though there had been some concussion or blow, or something that struck him on that side; it was darker than the other side, at least. Q. Did you notice any swelling, or was there just a black and blue mark. A. Y es, if my memory serves me right, it was swollen somewhat on this side — that is, on the right side ; I have nearly forgotten which side of the head it was that was swollen, but there was a mark as though there had been a blow ; then under the chin, here on the throat, there was a piece of court-plaster there, and the throat had the appearance as though it had been ciit on something; it looked, apparently, as though there was a gash there. Q. What made you think there was a gash there ? A. That is how it appeared. Q. Was it because there was a piece of court-plaster there ? A. No, sir; it showed that there was an abrasion there; an abrasion of the skin. Q. How far round the neck did those marks appear? A. I should think perhaps — to guess at it I should say, perhaps, an inch and a half long right in the front of the neck, nearly in front at least. Q. What, if any, other marks did you notice ? A. Somewheres about here (indicating right side of the nostril); there Avas a mark I think on one of his lips, looked as though it had been bit through, as though he might have bit it through in agony, or something of that sort, I don't know what; it looked as though it might have been done with his teeth ; and on one of his fingers there was a lump out of it, a piece of flesh which was right out clear into the cords there ; I didn't see the bone, but I know it was cut deep in; quite a chunk of flesh out of one of his fingers. Q. Any other marks of violence about his body in particular? 468 A. I don't think now of any that I noticed in particular. Q. I suppose the body was buried from your house ? A. It was taken from our house to State street church, and the funeral was at that church ? Q. Did you ever make any investigation, or take any means to ascertain about his injuries ? A. No, sir. Q. Or did any one else, to your knowledge ? A. There was there at the time on the Sabbath day Mr Yan Alstyne, who was a little distantly related to him ; he was over there and I told him what I knew about the circumstances, one thing and another; and I thought that if he didn't^feel disposed to have any thing done about it, why I would not. Q. You called the attention of one of the relatives of the deceased as to what you had seen ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And that is all you did in regard to it ? A. Yes, sir, that is all I done; I mentioned it to some of the official brethren in State street church ; to one or two of them, but no one seemed to take any action in it, and, therefore, I did not. Cross-examined by Mr. Goodwin : Q. I would like to have the witness state why his suspicions were aroused as to there being any unfair play there ? A. In the first place I had been there before, and there was not near so much notice taken of me as there was at that time; there was all the officials there — I did not see all, but three of them, and they Avere all over-nice, and then he objected so strongly to having the remains moved in the first place until Monday, and then taken right direct to the church; and another thing, the remains taken doAvn to the undertaker's down town, was another reason why. By Mr. Haskell : Q. When you say he, you mean Dr. Gray ? A. Yes, sir; I had most of the talk with Dr. Gray; I talked with Dr. Russell and Dr. Dryer as well. Q. Any other reason ? A. At the time I thought he must have known more about the trains than what he showed that he did know afterward how the trains run. Q. Any other reason ? A. I don't know as there was any thing in particular. Q. You have given the committee all the reasons why you thought things Avere suspicious at Utica before yon came down? A. Well, the conversation generally led me to believe thatheAvas — that there was something wrong somewhere ; so much so at least that 1 told the undertaker to take particular notice of every thing. Q. Yrou have given the substance of that conversation to the com- mittee, have you ? 469 A. There was probably a great deal more. Q. But the conversation that led you to have these suspicions? A. Yes, sir; it was a conversation with him, that I had with him. Q. You have given the substance of that conversation here? A. Yes, sir. Q. No other conversation except that you have related ? A. Oh, yes, sir ; there Avas other conversations. Q. But the conversation that led to your suspicion I mean ? A. I think I have, nearly the whole; there might have been some other things at the time that I don't remember now. Q. Who subpoenaed you here ? A. I think he said he was sergeant-at-arms. Q. Had you written to the committee ? A. No, sir; I didn't know as the committee was meeting. Q. Who did you last talk to about this matter before you were subpoenaed ? A. I don't know as I have mentioned it before in two years-; I don't know as I have"; I might have done with some acquaintance, some casual conversation, but nothing to amount to much in the last two years. Q. You do not know how you came to be subpoenaed ? A. No, sir ; I say I didn't — the sergeant-at-arms said that we was represented as prominent citizens of Green Island, and it would do well enough to call on us as witnesses; that is all I knoAV about it. Q. You said something about a cut on the throat — do you know whether that was a cut or an abrasion of the skin ? A. It might have been done with a strap or a sharp instrument; it was an abrasion of the skin. Q. You don't know hoAV deep it was? A. No, sir. Q. You did not remove the plaster? A. No, sir; I didn't remove it to examine it; it was not entirely covered — the abrasion with the plaster. Q. Did you inform Dr. Gray, or any physician at the Asylum, of your suspicions in regard to this man ? A. No, sir. Q. You didn't name any thing of that at the time ? A. No, sir. By Mr. Olin : Q. You didn't see Dr. Gray after you saw the body, did you ? '■' A. I don't know as I have ever seen him since ; I don't know as I saw him Avhen I was out there ; I didn't see him to speak to him; I cannot say that I have ever seen him since then. Q. Have you been at the Asylum since you went at that time ? A. No, sir. _, Q. Was this George Brown a married or a single man ? A. A single man. Q. He was your pastor when he was taken insane ? 470 A. He had been, but was not at that time; he was laid off at that time on account of ill health. Q. And he was only up there from August until — what time did he die ? A. September, I think; no, it was in September that I went out. Q. When did he die ? A. I don't think I can tell you the date. Mrs. LOUISA CRAMPTON: Sworn and examined, testified as follows : By Mr. Haskell : Q. You are the wife of the last witness ? A. Yes, sir. ' . Q. And you are a relative of Mr. Brown mentioned by yourhus band? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do you recollect the fact of his having been taken insane and being sent to the Insane Asylum ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Were you at home when he was sent from your house? A. Yes, sir. Q. About what time was he sent from your house to the Insane Asylum, Utica? A. He went there the 18th August, and we went to see him in September. Q. What was his condition at the time he went from your house? A. He seemed perfectly well at the time we saw him there; at the time he lived at our house he Avas violent most of the time. Q. Was he rational ? A. No, sir; not all the time, he was very violent most of the time. Q. Did you hear any thing from him, from the time he was sent to the Asylum ? A. We heard every week from Dr. Brush*, and different ones; Dr. Gray's name was signed, but generally Dr. Brush; and also telegrams once a Aveek, while he Avas there. Q. What time in September did you visit him ? A. The 18th of September. Q. You and your husband ? A. Yes, sir; both of us. Q. What was his condition Avhen you saw him in September ? A. He seemed very well indeed ; I hadn't seen him for about four weeks ; since he left our house; he was in such a condition, of course he seemed very well, during the few minutes we saw him. 471 [ Q. So that he would talk rationally ? A. Nothing that would indicate that he had ever been insane; and his conversation was general, just of topics of home and what' had transpired. Q. Was there any thing said to him in regard to how he was treated at the Asylum ? A. Not at all; not a word. Q. Nothing was said by him in regard to his treatment there« A. No, sir. Q. Was there nothing peculiar about his condition that impressed you ? A. Nothing only his rapid improvement made in a few weeks ? Q. How long did your interview last? A. We were there not over twenty minutes, and right about that time he seemed very uneasy. Q. Did you and your husband see him alone ? A. The attendant was in the same room. Q. Did you hear the attendant's name ? A. His name was Jones ; Mr. Brown introduced him to us as Mr. Jones; I don't know his first name. Q. Did you understand he was one of the attendants ? A. He told us he was his attendant; he introduced him as his attendant — Brown did. Q. And there Avas nothing, as I understand you, that particularly impressed you in that interview, except his improvement ? A. Nothing special at all; he seemed Avell at the time, but very sad. ; we asked him if he thought it was wrong his going there, he said it Avas all perfectly right, that he had realized it for some time. Q. When did you next hear any thing in particular in regard to him ? A. We heard, I think it Avas five or six days later, and next week we heard from him again that he was worse. Q. From one of the members ? A. Yes, sir; we wrote to see how he was, and they wrote back that he Avas very much worse, that there had been a very great change. Q. What next was there of importance that occurred, if any thing? A. There was nothing special, except, as we heard occasionally, that he remained the same, but they didn't say that he Avas so, but that they expected, and thought and hoped that he would get up again ; they didn't inform usof his real condition, just as it was. Q. When did you learn of his death ? A. He died the first day of December. Q. Eighteen hundred and eighty ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And from whom, did you learn that he was dead ? A. We learned from our physician ; they telegraphed to our physician in Troy. 472 Q. Who telegraphed ? A. Dr. Russell; that he was dead, and our physician came about seven o'clock in the morning and told us; his name is Dr. M. Felter; his residence is 106 Fifth street, Troy. Q. Y^ou had no direct knowledge from the Asylum of his death ? A. Not at all; and they were told to keep us posted especially. Q. And did they keep you posted down to that time ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do you recollect how long it was before his death that you had heard from the Asylum directly ? A. It w7as over a week. Q. Now, you didn't go to the Asylum yourself ? A. Not for the remains. Q. Did you see the body after it was brought to your house ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And did you make any examination ? A. Y es, sir; the undertaker brought him in; he was brought Sunday morning about three o'clock to our house ; they went after him Saturday, and trains were delayed and it was in the morning at half-past two or three o'clock that the remains came. Q. When did you examine the remains ? A. Shortly after he was brought in, and they had him laid out? Q. At your house ? A. Yes, sir. .- ..v~-^ Q. State what, if any, marks there were about the remains that attracted your attention ? A. The first was his looks; he didn't look natural; ne was olack, just as black as he could-be. Q. His face ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And then those marks — describe them ? A. Most of the things — I am not positive — was on the right side; the mark that my husband spoke of, the mark on his temple, was on the opposite side, and it was his right ear, and right side of his head, that looked as though it was bruised ; there was another mark here (indicating the right side of the nostril); that was stuck over with court plaster. Q. How long a mark ? A. I should think it was an inch long. Q. Any other mark about the face or head? A. The lip looked as though it Avas bitteu through with his teeth, pieces bitten out, and this mark in his neck I should have said it was as much as four inches one way, and court plaster which was on it one piece this way, and another this way (indicating), that is, the pieces were crossed. Q. What was the appearance of his neck? A. Something of an abrasion, of course, I cannot say, but I sup- posed it to be a cut. 413 Q. A cut Avith any kind of instrument, blunt or sharp! A. Of course I cannot say about that, but I should think it likely it might have been something sharp, but of course I don't know. Q. And you think the mark on the neck was four inches lono- ? A. About four inches across this way (indicating horizontally) and an inch the other way (vertically). Q. Was there any thing else youfnoticed ? A. Nothing, except the finger of "the left hand; there was a piece out in that direction (indicating laterally); that was taken out seemingly to the bone; that was the first thing I discovered about it; the middle finger of the left hand. Q. Any thing else? A. That is all we discovered of importance. Q. When did the funeral take place ? A. At ten o'clock Monday morning at our house, and at eleven o'clock at the church. Q. Who,if any person, did you call attention to about the body? A. Nothing was said, except to the undertaker and between our- selves. Q. You yourself did not talk to anybody else ? A. No, sir; no one outside until after the funeral. Q. Do you kuow whether your husband did, or did you yourself call the attention of any relatives of the deceased to it ? A. No, sir, there was no one there; Mr. Yan Alstyne is not a relative of Mr. BroAvn's, he was a friend only. Q. His attention was called to it afterward ? A. He was there on Sunday, and he talked with the undertaker about it. By the Chairman : Q. Did the doctor see the body ? A. Dr. Felter did not see him at all; I testified so of Mr. Brown's death, that was all. Q. Do you know any other persons who saAV those wounds ? A. My brother, Mr. Baldwin and Mr. Wilson Baldwin; Mr. Emerson BaldAvin, he liAres on Green Island. Q. What is his occupation ? A. Door and blind maker witli Mr. Crampton, in partnership. Q. Did any other person see them to your knowledge ? A. Yes, sir; there were two ladies from Troy, I don't know whether it would be necessary to give their names ; A. Mrs. D. of Troy, avIio Avas there in the evening at our house, Avas one of them. Q. What Avas the other name ? A. I don't know that; C. D. I think, she is a widow, I don't know her address ; the other lady's name was Mrs. T., I don't know her Christian name, but she resides in Troy, she boards and she is a young lady. 60 U 474 By Mr. Olin : Q. Was Mr. BroAvn laid out in a dead suit of clothes from what he had at first at the Asylum ? A. Yes, sir; the undertaker is here who got them and can tell you about that. Cross-examined by Mr. Goodwin : Q. When Mr. Brown was brought from the Asylum to your house was he crazy ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Who examined him then ? what doctor, if anybody ? A. We had Dr. Felter and Dr. Steinberg also ; they prescribed for him, gave him remedies, gave him quieting medicines, I believe it was. Q. Do you know whether they committed him to the Asylum on their own certificates'( A. Yes, sir. Q. Y"ou talked with your husband when he came back from Utica, and he gave you his suspicions, didn't he ? A. Yes, sir, he did. Q. That was before you saw the body ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did anybody suggest to you that you had better send for the family physician to see the corpse ? A. No, sir. Q. Did you think of it yourself ? A. Y es, sir; we thought of it but we did not know how it would be. Q. Why didn't you do it ? A. We did not think of doing it; of course, we did not know how far we might go, and Ave could not prove any thing of course, but it was spoken of and that was all; there was only one day. Q. You did not think then that what you saw was of sufficient significance to send for a physician ? A. We thought if it had been our own we should have done so, and we have regretted it a good many times that we did not do something any way. Q. You did not think then that what you saw was of sufficient significance to send for a physician ? A. We did think it was sufficient to send for the physician, and we did not send for one as we should have done if he had been one of our own family ; we did not do it. Q. Was that the reason you gave to the committee ? A. No, sir; I should not like to state that Avas the reason, but we thought of it. Q. But did not do it ? A. No, sir. Q. And you gave your reason why you did not do it to the com- mittee ? 475 A. Only that we thought perhaps it would be best not to, that is all. Q. You made no examination of the body at all ? A. No, sir. Q. And you did not know what his condition was when brought to your house, before he was taken to the Asylum, in regard to wounds or bruises ? A. No, sir, not really ; of course I saw him there the two days and nights he was there. Q. He had no bruises then on his face or throat in any way ? A. No, sir ; only what has been stated about. CHARLES W- ARNOLD, Sworn and examined, testified as follows : By Mr. Haskell : Q. What is your occupation ? A. I am an undertaker. Q. You may state if in the fall of 1880 you were spoken to by Mr. Crampton in regard to going to Utica to get the remains of the Rev. Mr. Brown who died at the Asylum ? A. I was. Q. Were you previously acquainted with Mr. Brown ? A. I was. Q. Were you an attendant of his church ? A. No, sir. Q. But you had known him ? A. Yes, sir; I knew who he was. Q. Upon what day of the week did you go to Utica ? A. On Saturday. Q. State what you saw there ? A. I went up to Utica and went to Mr. Daniels, the undertaker, where the remains were, and I left him still there and went up to the Asylum. Q. Did you see the remains before you went to the Asylum ? A. It strikes me that I did — I think I did, and went into the back room where they were alone and uncovered them and looked at the face, and then went to the Asylum ; Dr. Russell, I think, was in the office, and what conversation I had there I had with him, but nothing much relating to Mr. Brown; something was talked about, but just what I don't remember; I told him I was after Brown's effects, Avhatever they were, that was there ; and after talking to me something about Mr. Meredith's people, that I was acquainted with, he sent me the clothes. Q. Did you see Dr. Gray at the Asylum ? 476] A. I did not. Q. Did you have any talk with Dr. Russell in regard to Mr. Brown's death or the condition of his body ? A. I did not; I cannot state what our conversation was, but I think he told me how he died, but talked something about Mr. Brown ; just what I cannot state now. Q, Did you see Dr. Gray that day at all ? A.' No, sir, 1 did not. Q. Then after getting the facts of the decease you went to the undertaker's ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And had you brought with you from Green Island any cloth- ing to dress the body in ? A. No, sir. Q. Now you may state w7hat you did with the undertaker in ref- erence to the body, and any thing you noticed about the body ? A. I went around to Mr. Daniels, and saw his assistant, I don't know what his name was, and told him I w7ould like to strip the body and change its clothing; well, he thought it was unnecessary as his clothing was all right, and they washed him and dressed him, and I went into the room where Mr. Brown's remains lay ; it was a warm room, and there was an ice chest over the trunk of his body filled with, ice; but his head was exposed to the heat of the warm room. Q. Any cover over the head ? A. There was a cloth over the face. Q. Dry -or wet ? A. I think it was dry, and there was some blood oozing from his nostrils, and some marks ; as I unbuttoned his shirt I saw some marks on the chin here (indicating), and his lip looked as though a chunk had been bitten out of it, about here (indicating), and that was covered Avith court plaster on the lower lip; and the finger, it looked as though a piece of flesh had been bitten or cut out nearly to the bone; I spoke of these things to this young man; I said I guess that they had pretty rough treatment at the Asylum sometimes; well, he said he thought so; he didn't seem inclined to talk much about it; I stripped the body there; I didn't find any marks on the body at all, except a little scratch here (indicating), right below the knee; but there Avas nothing uncommon in that at all, we might any of us have such a mark as that, but the rest of the body was fair ; he said he died with a fit of apoplexy ; I said I thought it Avas singular, I never had seen a case like it; I said that after death from strangu- lation the blood generally settles back into the body, and the feat- ures become natural again ; in this case the features were black, and had not become natural at all, and his body looked very fair and nice; I spoke of these things, and talked about them ; I dressed him and put clean clothes on, and brought him home. Q. Did you notice any marks on the side of his head ? A. No, sir, I did not. Q. Or any thing upon his face near his nostril ? 477 A. Yes, sir, I think there was a scratch, I don't know but what it was upon the nostril, near the nostril ; he had a little light mustache; it was covered with court-plaster, on the scratch upon his face ; there was this mark upon his face, and that court-plaster I think was on the under lip, I won't be positive, but it strikes me that it was. Q. Describe the marks upon the neck ? A. It looked to me as though a strap had been drawn tight round under the jaw. Q. How long was the mark ? A. It was pressed in as though like a cloth after a body has died, sometimes they put a handkerchief under the chin, and it left an impression as something of that kind would do. Q. Was the skin broken ? A. It Avas bruised, the skin was. Q. Was there any court-plaster round the neck at that time ? A. No, sir, no court-plaster. Q. Did you put any on ? A. No, sir; it was not seen, this place under the chin, unless you handled the body, and attention Avas called to the body; it looked as though he might have been strangled, and was found cold and stiff, and the blood of course was all collected and did not settle. Q. What do you say in regard to the treatment of the body ? Have you taken care of bodies in cases where they have died'of apoplexy ? A. I have, in several instances. Q. Did this body present to you an appearance of having died of apoplexy ? A. No, sir; it did not here on the chest. Q. What Avere the distinguishing marks between this body and other bodies that you have taken care of where they have died of apoplexy? A. Generally you find black places running up here, and the chest and face would become spotted instead of being so black and discolored, I didn't find much of that — of these spots on the chest my experience has been, that after a while the blood will settle back and the features will become quite natural. Q. Describe if you will, these appearances of his lower lip, where it had been apparently bitten ? A. It was swollen somewhat. Q. Was there a piece bitten out ? A. I should think it looked as through his teeth had done it. Q. Was it taken clean out of the lip ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And was not torn at all ? A. No, sir; some of these* marks were seen by Mr. and Mrs. Crampton and others; I remember speaking to them about it at the time. Q. You have described to us all that you noticed in regard to the body, at •Utica? 478 A. Yes, sir; I think all that I know. • Q. Did you ever see the body of a person who had been killed by strangulation ? A. No, sir; not with a rope or any thing of that kind. Q. You may state whether the treatment of the body as you saw it at the undertaker's was such as to restore the natural condition of the features or to prevent putrefaction ? A. It would produce putrefaction—it could not produce any thing else, that treatment of the body. Q. Why? A. Because it was left exposed to the heat, the face was, and the blood could not settle, from the fact that they were chilling the body. The face A\ras exposed to the heat, and the blood had begun to work and ferment and so produce just that effect; it was beginning to putrefy and in twelve hours more it would not be presentable, it would have been repulsive in my opinion. Q. You brought the body to the house of Mr. Crampton of Green Island ? A. Yes, sir. 1 Q. And took charge of the funeral ? A. I did. Q. Did you change the treatment of the body after you took charge of the body ? A. Yes, sir; I put it into a cold room and took some embalming fluids and put on the face and kept it wet. Q. And reduced the temperature of the rest of the body ? A. No, sir; I left the temperature all the same; it was in a cold room. I did not put him into a freezer or any thing of the kind; it was not necessary ; it was in December, and was very cold. Q. Were there any change in the condition of the face after you took charge of the body, or did it simply arrest the progress of decay \ A. There was a little change for the better I think. Q. Do you know how long Mr. Brown had been dead when you went there? ' A. I did not; I think he died Friday and this was Saturday, that is my recollection. Q. Was there any thing more that you can state in regard to the condition of the body, or any thing in regard to the matter —any thing that made you think about as to how he came by his death ? A. Nothing that I can state. Cross-examined by Mr. Goodwin : Q. You saw no court-plaster on the throat at all ? A. No, sir. Q. And in your opinion, a man dying of apoplexy, his face does not discolor and remain permanently so ? A. It does when they die, but does not remain so ; at least I never had a case that did. Q. How long have you been an undertaker ? A. Ten years. 479 Q. Who did you tell about the condition of this body ; if anybody ? A. I talked it over Avith Mr. Brown's friends; some of them. Q. Who did you talk with about it? A. Mr. Crampton and Mrs. Crampton and Mr. and Mrs. Baldwin and Dr. Felter. I could not tell who spoke to them about it; I de- scribed to them the conditions. 5 Q. Wlien did you tell this to Dr. Felter ? A. I think it was on the Sabbath day. Q. Before the'funeral ? A. I think it was then, but I am not positive ; I know I had a conversation with him about it, but whether before or since I can- not state. Q. Who subpoenaed you ? A. This committee I suppose. Q. Who have you talked with upon "this subject last? A. Before being subpoenaed I have talked with nobody until I got this subpoena; I talked with Mrs. and Mr. Crampton about it some time ago. Q. Since when w7as the last conversation you had previous to being subpoenaed ? A. I cannot tell you; it has been a great while since any thing has been said about it ? Q. Was the condition of the atmosphere of the room in which you put the body — was it such as to interfere with the condition of the body ? A. With the face do you mean ? Q. Yes? A. It would in time. Q. Would it have any effect on the face ? A. Yes, sir; it would have a bad effect. Q. What effect? A. It Avould cause the body to go to decay and the blood would rush into the head. By Mr. Haskell : Q. Would the simple fact of the body being in a room of the temperature in which this body was, with ice upon the trunk and the face left exposed, cause the black appearance that was on the face ? A. Not in so short a time. . Q. You say you think there was no court-plaster on the neck of the body ? A. That would be my memory now ; I am not positive about it, I have seen so many bodies I cannot recollect about it. Re-examined by Mr. Goodwin : Q. Yrou spoke of a depression round the neck, which might have come from either a strap or from a piece of cloth being tied around it; could have come from either < 480 A. Oh, yes, sir; I should think it might have been either cause. Q. Could it come from a piece of cloth used to keep the jaw up ? A. No, sir ; I think not. Q. Was it such mark as might have been caused by the deceased person hanging himself ? A. Yes, sir, that is what I thought perhaps it was. s By Mr. Haskell Q. Did Mr. Crampton, when he sent you after the remains, give you instructions in regard to any examination of the body? A. Yes, sir, he told me to look at the body. HENRY HINDMAN, Sworn and examined, testified as follows : By Mr. Haskell : Q. Where do you reside ? A. Albany. Q. What is your business ? A. Lumber inspector. Q. Are you a married man ? A. No, sir. Q. Who do you live with ? A. My father and mother. Q. How old are you ? A. Thirty-three. Q. Were you ever an inmate at the Utica Insane Asylum as a pa- tient ? A. I was. Q. When were you there ? A. 1881. Q. From when until when ? A. From some time in January —■ about the middle of January, until the middle of April. Q. Who sent you there, or caused you to be sent, your parents? A. I presume so. Q. Why? A. I presume because I w7as out of my head. Q. From what cause? A. I am incompetent to answer that properly. Q. Don't you know ? A. I may have a general idea. Q. Give us your best general idea ? A. I think it wras dissipation. Q. Do you recollect the fact of your going to the Asylum ? A. I do remember it very distinctly. Q. Were you sent on the certificate of some physician ? 481 A. I presume so, I don't remember, I had a physician attend me when I was at home. Q. Who wTent with you to the Asylum ? A. There Avas a Dr. Stonehouse of this city. Q. Did anybody else accompany you to the Asylum ? A. Yres, sir, a friend of the family, Charles W., who lives in the city ; he is a dock master of Albany in the lumber district. Q. Do you recollect avIio you saw when you went to the Asylum ? A. When I first entered there ? Q. Yes, sir? A. I remember seeing Dr. Gray in the office. Q. And do you recollect what ward you were first placed upon — what ward it was ? A. Fourth ward. Q. Who had charge over that ward when you were there? A. A man named Torpey — Dan Torpey. Q. Do you recollect the names of any other attendants ? A. No, sir; I don't. Q. Do you remember distinctly and clearly what occurred and who you saw Avhen you first Avent to the Asylum ? A. When I first entered there? Q. Yes, sir? A. Yes, sir; I recollect what occurred. Q. While you were in the fourth ward, how long did you remain there ? A. I cannot state precisely how long. Q. Can you give the names of any other attendants on the Avard ? A. No, sir, I cannot; I never learned their names. Q. How long were you on the fourth Avard ? A. I cannot say precisely, but I should think at least two weeks. Q. While you were in the fourth ward, how were you treated by the attendants ? A. I don't understand the question exactly ; I was well fed and well housed, had a good bed and plenty to eat, if that is the treat- ment you refer to. Q. Was there any other treatment you received besides being well used and Avell fed ? A. I remember having an encounter with an attendant — the head attendant, Mr. Torpey. Q. How long Avas that after you entered the institution? A. I cannot say how long it was, probably a week after I entered there. Q. Describe the encounter ? A. I can recollect that there was a patient there that I took a fancy to, and he became very violent. Q. Do yon remember his name ? A. No, sir : I don't; and in consequence of his being so violent they put him in the crib, as they called it — that is a bed with a cover over the top — and confined him there night and day. 61 U 482 Q. How long did they keep him in the Crib ? A. I can only recollect that they kept him there two or three days I should say, and I thought in my mind that it was wrong to keep him there; and he kept tossing about in the bed, and trying to get out, butting at the boards, and I interceded with the keeper to let him out, and he told me to mind my own business ; several times I asked this Torpey to let him out; he used to bring his meals to him and give them to him in the crib and then lock him up again ; the crib Avas open at the top, then shut down and locked; Avelb one day, the second or third day, when he was bringing his dinner through the hall from the, dining-room, when he Avas at the other end of the hall, I remember that I was walking in the hall at the time, and I passed him, and I asked him whether he was going to let this felloyr out; I cannot recollect his name; he made no reply, to the best of my recollection ; it is three years ago; I cannot recol- lect every circumstance, but anyway I hauled off and made a crack at him, and with that he dropped the dinner and jumped on to me; he was a very strong man, but he called for another attendant, and the other attendant ran from the third ward, halloed, and then both fot at me ; I Avas thrown on the floor by this other attendant and 'orpey ; I can recollect this distinctly ; he took hold of me by the head and pounded my head on the floor, and the other fellow jumped on my breast; this Torpey, with his knees, he jumped, on my breast and stomach ; I was marked with it I know, because when I was made to take a bath that afternoon, I know I was marked all over from the effects of the thumping of his knees ; this occurred about tAvelve o'clock; after a while they both of them let me up from the floor; the wind Avas knocked out of me, and they ordered me doAvn to dinner; the dining-room was down below the hall, a few steps down in the basement, and I can distinctly remember that this Torpey gave me a blow in the chest with his fist and knocked me up in the corner. Q. How seriously were you injured, if at all ? A. I was not seriously injured, I presume, I was a pretty tough subject; I was not injured very seriously, I was in good health and could stand a pounding., Q. How was it commenced, by your striking at Mr. Torpey ? A. Yes. Q. Did you hit him ? A. I think the blow that I made at him he dodged his head and it glanced off; I think I did strike him on the head slightly. Q. Did you make any report to the physicians in regard to it ? A. I did not. Q. Was that all the violent treatment that you received while you were on that ward ? A. Do vou mean was that the only blow that Avas struck me ? Q. Yes? A. No, sir; I can recollect receiving two distinct kicks in the stomach before that from Torpey; in the first place when I went 483 there, the first day that I went there, it was a custom when a patient is first received, he is taken to the bath-room for a bath : I recollect when I Avas taken to the bath-room I objected to undress myself be- fore this attendant and wanted him to go out of the bath-room and I would undress and take the bath ; he told me to strip— and I had to strip right before him, and I believe —I don't know whether I made any attempt to strike him then, but the first thing I know, I got a kick in the stomach, that sent me to the other end of the bath- room, and that brought me to time then. Q. Were you stripped? A. Yes, sir, I took a bath then. Q. What was the occasion of your being kicked in the stomach the other time ? A. That was the same afternoon with another attendant, I cannot recollect his name ; he was a younger man than Torpey ; I recollect I did not get in time for dinner, and because I didn't have my dinner, I believe, he brought me up a tin can full of rice and milk and I objected to eating that, and I got to jawing with him and he gave me a kick in the stomach, I remember falling back into a chair ; that is a favorite w7ay with the attendants up there of fetching unruly patients to time with a kick in the belly. Q. Did you ever see any other person kicked in the stomach or badly used, aside from these two occasions when you received kicks yourself ? A. I cannot recollect of any particular occasion that I ever saw any other patient kicked that way. Q. Why do you say it is a favorite way of bringing patients to time ? A. Well, the reason I said so was, because thev seem so expert in the way of kicking. Q. Do you think so ? A. \es, sir; it struck me at the time and has since, that is the impression made on my mind, that it was a usual way with them. Q. But you didn't hear of any other patient being kicked in that way ? A. I cannot recollect any other circumstance. Q. Do you remember seeing any action of violence toAvard any other patients than yourself while you were on that ward? A.I can only recollect one instance, that was a patient that slept in the opposite room from mine on the fourth ward; he was very troublesome, particularly with the keepers, and he would not undress himself at any time without a great deal of trouble; and I remember seeing this Torpey haul off and strike him behind the ear, I think it was, he struck him from behind any way. Q. What was the effect of the blow on him ? A. It didn't knock him down, merely made him cry out—the patient — it made him cry out. Q. Did you report to anv of the physicians in regard to vour being kicked ? 484 A. I never did. Q. Why didn't you ? A. Because I think it would only fetch more ill treatment on me; I was afraid to. Q. Did you see any thing else besides this bloAv, and what you have narrated, and this patient being kept in the covered bed, that seemed to you wrong or improper in the treatment of patients, while you were on that ward? 1 A. No, sir; I cannot say that I did. Q. Do you know how you came to be changed from the fourth ward to some other ? A. I recollect being taken up stairs by Torpey, up to the eighth hall. Q. Do you know Avhy you were changed; were you informed why you were changed, or that you were to be ? ^ A. No, sir. Q. How long did you remain in the eighth ward ? A. I think it was only a few days. Q. What kind of treatment did you receive on that ward ? A. I cannot say positively it was the eighth ward, I havejor- gotten the number, but I believe it was the eighth ward; I was only there a few days after leaving the fourth ward. Q. What kind of treatment did you receive on that ward ? A. I'was not ill treated there ; I received very good treatment there. Q. Did you see any of the other patients ill treated in any way on that ward ? A. I did not. Q. From there do you remember Avhat ward you went to ? A. I think it was on the seventh ward ; I went to the third hall after I went up. Q. How long did you remain there ? A. I cannot say; it is too long ago to recollect exactly. Q. Yrou were changed then from one ward to another until you came to the first ward ? A. Yes, sir; I was in six halls altogether, including the first ward. Q. And upon any other ward than the fourth ward did you re- ceive from the attendants any ill treatment ? A. Not at all. Q. And upon any other ward than the fourth ward did you see any patients ill treated in any manner there ? A. No, sir ; I did not. Q. But upon what other ward than the fourth ward ; you say the attendants were particularly kind and attentive to you ? A. Well, uoav, I made a statement there when 1 said I didn't see any ill treatment on any other halls ; I beg to recall that ansAver; I say that there was a patient on one of the halls that I went on immediately after leaving the fourth hall that I think they used pretty rough. 485 Q. Describe that ? A. 1 think it was on the eighth hall, I would not be positive; they used to keep him strapped on a chair like this chair here (indicating) only it had arms to, and they strapped across the chest, I think it Avas. Q. What kind of a strap? A. A leather strap, I think. Q. How wide was it ? , A. I should judge it was a couple of inches wide ; I think I was only on that ward a few days, but I used to pity that poor fellow when they used to bring him out his food, and the attendants used to stand behind him and feed him ; once in a while they allowed him liberty to get up from the chair and walk round, but lie used to be so unruly that they used almost invariably to put him in the chair again, and I saw that they used unnecessary violence in putting him in the chair ; all of them used to get hold of him and fire him° into the chair and strap him doAvn, but I don't know as they ever struck him; and then again about the feeding of the patients, there was some patients that went to the hall I was in, I forget what hall it was that the attendants used to feed, I believe they refused to feed themselves, and they used to feed them with a spoon, oat meal and rice, well, they used to stand behind a patient, this attendant did, I cannot think of his name hoav, he used to stand behind them, and if a patient objected he would throw one arm, his left arm, round the neck, and he would shovel that rice or oat meal down his throat, why, it Avas terrible, the way he would shovel that down his throat' the man could hardly swallow it; I recollect distinctly speaking to the doctor about it. Q. Which doctor was it ? A. Doctor —well I cannot think of the doctor's name. Q. Was it Russell ? A. It was Dr. Josselyn, I think; a big man with a big bushy beard. Q. What did he say when you called his attention to it ? A. The reason I called his attention to it was, this attendant on tins hall used to object because I would not eat, he seemed to think I didn't eat enough, and he used to say he would have to feed me, and on one occasion, one afternoon, while I Avas talking with the doctor, he came up, this attendant did, and I believe he told the doctor — anyhow there was something said about me" not eating enough, and I told the doctor that the great trouble on that ward was, they were feeding the patients too much, and that—well, I don't know as I complained about the manner of feeding, but I said I thought they feed them too much, what I meant was, the manner of feeding them, though. Q. Was there any change made in the way these patients were fed afterward while you remained on the ward ? A. Not that 1 recollect noAV; I was transferred A7ery soon after that. • J 486 Q. Were the patient you have spoken of as being fed in' tms manner, was he hurt or injured physically wdiile being fed ? A. I should judge it would hurt their digestive parts considerably, to shovel food down the throat the way they used to ; I remember one poor fellow there I use to try and eat half his mush in order that he should not have to eat it; but it was merely out of sympathy for the poor fellow. Q. Did you see any thing else on this ward that was out of place or in the institution that you did not think Avas right, apart from what you have told us? A. I cannot recollect of any thing; no, sir. Q. During the three months that you were in the institution how often did you see Dr. Gray? A. I think I saw him twice after leaAring the office after entering the place. Q. What AA7ere the occasions of your seeing him then, and where i did you see him ? A. I saw him at one time passing through the hall, one of the halls, the second hall. Q. That was how long after you had been in the institution? A. That was probably two months after, or a month and a half at least. Q. What was he doing? A. Merely passing through at the time. Q. When was the next time you saw him? A. The next time I saAv him was during the last month I was there, riding out in his carriage ; I was out that day ; I Avas helping the gardener. Q. So that during the two months that you were in the institu- tion you only saw him once, and then he passed through the ward you were in ? A. Yes, sir, that was all. Q. In regard to the physicians, who were the attendant physicians that took charge of the wards you were in, while you were there? Vj A. Dr. Russell and Dr. Josselyn. Q. Hoav frequently did they come into the wards to look after the patients ? A. 1 think it was the custom to come twice a day. Q. Generally once ? A. It seems to me they both came tAvice a day. Q. Four visits a day from the physicians ? A. No, it seemed to me as if Dr.'Russell had charge of some of the patients, and Dr. Josselyn had charge of others; now Dr. Bus- sell always inquired of me how I was getting along, and as to my health, and Dr. Josselyn'didn't, so I inferred from that that he had other patients. Q. That is one had charge of certain patients and the other of other certain patients, or that one had charge of certain wards, and the other of certain other wards ? / 487 A. It was my idea that they both came on the same ward, but had a division of the riatients on the same wards ; but I may be'mis- taken about that; that is only an impression. Q. Were the physicians attentive to the wants of the patients, as far as you could see and judge? A. I should think so, yes, sir, as far as I could judge. Q. You were Avell treated by the physicians ? A. Yes, sir ; Avell treated by the doctors. Q. And you were Avell treated while in the institution except what you received in the fourth w7ard ? A. Y es, sir. Q. Now in regard to this patient that was kept in the covered bed for several days that you spoke of, was he kept there during the day time ? A. Yes, sir. Q. As well as night time ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And not allowed out of bed at all ? A. Not during at least two days ; I won't say positively that he was kept there for two days. Q. When it Avas necessary to attend the calls of nature Avhat was done ? A. He Avas brought out by the keepers. Q. Then he was taken out for this purpose ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Then he Avas placed back in bed ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you notice, Avhile in the covered bed, he injured himself any by butting himself against the side of,the bed? A. No, sir; I did not notice that he did. Q. Was the bed so that he could turn over easily in the bed ? A. Y es, sir; he could turn over; it was at least that wide (indicat- ing) ; three feet wide, at least. Q. How far was there between the cover and mattress upon which the patient lay ? A. Tavo feet. Q. Plenty of room to turn over ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Was there any thing especially uncomfortable about his being kept in the bed except that he could not get out ? A. Except his confinement. Q. Do you knoAv whether the physicians saw him while in that bed? A. I knoAV that they did ; yes, sir. Q. Was that their direction that he was kept in the bed ? A. I presume so. Q. So that the attendants could not let him out of the bed if they so desired, as you understand it, or how do you understand it ? 488 A. Well as I understood it at the time, the attendants could have ret him out. Q. And that is the reason you spoke togMr. Torpey about it ? A. Yes, sir ; that was it. ?} $ Q. What was the mental condition of this patient, could he talk and converse so as to be understood'? A. No, sir; he was not rational; he had no sense about him. Q. Do you know why he was put in the covered bed ? A. J judge it was because he caused extra tiouble to them and was violent; I remember distinctly one time, in order to get him out, I told Torpey that I would take care of him and keep him quiet. Q. He didn't let him come out ? A. No,.sir; he told me to mind my own business; it Avas none of my business. Q. While you were on the fourth ward what other restraints were applied to the patients on that ward ? A. That was all, I believe, sleeping in the crib. Q. And that was the only patient kept in the crib during the day time ? A. That was all. Q. Do you remember Iioav many patients were upon the ward at the time you were there ? A. On the fourth ward do you mean ? Q. Yes ; at a time ? A. I should judge there was somewheres about fifteen or sixteen. Q. In the entire ward? A. From fifteen to twenty. Q. Have you any suggestions to make as to how the cases of cruelty that you specify should be prevented from occurring again — cruelty or violence of attendants toward patients ? A. No, I don't know, except that they ought to have a better class of attendants, and pay them more and get a better class of men. Q. Do you recollect whether, while you were in the institution, yon saw any black eyes, or other bruises, or marks of violence upon any of the patients? A. No, sir, I don't. Q. As to any thing else that you think of that occurred, while you were in the institution, or that you saw, or that you think you should state or inform us in regard to ? A. No, sir; nothing that I can remember now. Cross-examined by Mr. Goodwin : Q. Do you have any recollection hoav of your mental condition when you were taken to the.fourth ward? A. I have a recollection of being taken to the fourth Avard. Q. Do you know what condition you were in then, mentally; whether you were excitable or laboring under a delusion ? 489 A. Yes, sir; I recollect that I was laboring under a delusion ; what I consider now was a delusion. Q. Were you violent ? A. I believe I was. Q. You recollect that ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And how long did you continue so after being put upon the ward, violent, etc. V A. Probably a week, or perhaps three or four days, possibly. Q. Now, did this striking occur after or before you came out of that maniacal or violent state ? A. That is the encounter I had with the attendant ? Q. Yes, sir. A. Of course it must have occurred afterward. Q. You were not violent then Avhen it occurred ? A. I don't think I was— well I might have been violent to make a pass at the keeper, but I did it with a sane object, at least; I had a difference with him about this patient being kept in that confine- ment ; I can recollect that very well; I did it with a sane intention. Q. Do you remember whether you were quiet at the time you went in there ? A. Do I remember that I was quiet ? Q. Yes, sir; in your mind ? A. No, sir ; I don't think I was. Q. What do you think was the condition of your mind'then! A. I think my mind was all topsy-turvy. Q. That you were violent ? A. Y es, sir ; I was probably violent at times. Q. Do you remember your delusion ? A. Yes, sir ; I know what it was. Q. What was it % A. I decline to answer tdiat; it is not necessary. Q. You said to the committee the reason that you didn't report these occasions of violence to the physicians was because you were •afraid to? A. I thought the better mode would be to let it. pass. Q. Who made that suggestion to you, anybody? A. No, sir. Q. Y ou thought it over and came to that conclusion ? A. Yes, sir. Q. It was not made ? _ A. No, sir; I thought I would get square with the fellow some- time when I met him outside. 62 U 490 JOHN J. HALPIN, Sworn and examined, testified as follows: By Mr. Morgan : Q. Where do you reside? A. Maynard, 'Oneida county. Q. What is your age ? A. Thirty. Q. What countryman are you ? A. An American born, Irish descent. Q. Born in this country ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How long have-you lived in Oneida county? A. I was born in Oneida county and have lived here off and on for the last thirty years, I might say. Q. Were you'ever an attendant in the State Lunatic Asylum here '* A. Yes, sir. _ Q. When did you go into the Asylum as an attendant? A. The 1st of January, 1874, Q. And remained until Avhen ? A. The first day of the year 1878. Q. What had been your occupation just immediately beforeyour going into the Asylum? A. I was hired on a farm and wrorked there. Q. Had your business been on a farm before that time ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And had you had any experience in a lunatic asylum? A. Never before I went in there. Q. Through what means did yon obtain a situation in the Asylum? A. By going up to see the steward. Q. Who, if any one, interceded in your behalf. A. My mother lived there before me and Mr. Dryer knew me; she had been an attendant or laundry woman there. Q. She had been a helper there ? A. Yes, sir; she worked for Dr. Gray. Q. How long did she work in the laundry ? A. Six or seven years; someAvhere in that neighborhood. Q. Had you any conversation with Dr. Gray when you went there to get employment ? A. No, sir. Q. Who informed you ? A. Mr. Dryer. Q. Had you any conversation with him when you went there? A. No, sir; I told him who I w7as; that is all the conversation I had with him. Q. You went and introduced yourself? 491 A. Yes, sir. Q. Did any one go with you ? A. No, sir. Q. Did you take any letter from any person recommending you ? A. No, sir. Q. Just briefly state what occurred * when you made the bargain for your services? A. I went up to ask him if they were in want of an attendant; he told me that they would on the first of the month ; this was about the middle of the month previous to the time I went there; I went to see him about the middle of May; he said he did not know of any at present but to come about the first of the month and that there would be a vacancy' about that time ; I came about the first of the month and procured the situation. Q. What was said Avhen you procured the situation? A. I asked him if there was a vacancy; he told me there was and told me to go in and see the bookkeeper and sign my name, and then I went on to the ward. Q. You went to see the book-keeper ? A. Yes, sir; to give him my name and sign it. Q. Your age? A. Yes, sir. Q. Your occupation and residence? A. Yes, sir, I think I did. Q. What was it you signed ? A. I signed my name. Q. Simply wrote your name in a book ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you read what was there ? A. Yes, sir, I read it. Q. What did you read that was entered there Avhen you signed ? A. I cannot state now ; I know they gave me rules to read. Q When you did that, what did they do? A. Sent for the supervisor. Q. What supervisor ? A. Supervisor Jones. Q. What ward were you taken upon ? A. No. 6, and I remained there a couple of days. Q. What inquiries, if any, were made about you by Mr. Dryer or any other person after they hired you and sent you on the ward ? A. I can recollect Mr. Dryer asked me if I was of age — and I was not quite of age then. Q. Did he inquire about any thing in reference to your habits ? A. I think he asked me if I was steady, that was all. Q. You told him yon were ? A. Yes, sir. Q. When you came upon the ward what were you directed to do, and who directed you ? A. The supervisor resided on the ward with us, and he was the 492 one; I don't know as rthere was any particular directions given when I came on to the ward ; only to go in and see what the rest was doing; I came on at'half-past or ten o'clock in the morning. Q. What was done then ? A. The first thing I done w7as along in the afternoon, I took the spreads for the beds and folded them up, and then there was noth- ing to be done until next morning more than to be there in the room and lock the door. Q. There is an outer spread that is ^aken off and laid away dur- ing the time when the bed is occupied? A. Yes, sir. Q. When that Avas done, what did you do? A. When a man Avent to bec\ he locked the rooms, went around and tried the doors, and that was about all that there was to be done that day. Q. Did you go to bed that night ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Where AA7as your room? • A. No. 24, I think. Q. Did anybody else occupy the room with }7ou ? A. No, sir. Q. Was there any disturbance in the ward that night, that called you up ? A. No, sir. Q. Next morning what did you do I A. Go around and open doors, went in and let the men out and helped him air the beds, and sweep out the rooms on the hall, or helped at it at least. Q. How long did you remain on A\7ard 6 ? A. I rather think it was two days. Q. Then what ward did you go to ? A. I went on to No. 10. Q. Hoav was it that you wrere changed from six to ten ? A. It seems to me they change you as they take a notion to ; when the doctor came around, he thought there were attendants enough on that ward. Q. Who was the supervisor on ward 10 ? A. Supervisor Barrisdale. Q. Is that the violent ward ? A. It is not particularly so ; I think they have patients on it that are sometimes violent. Q. Now, Avhat did you do on w7ard 10? A. It is just the same as on the ward below, and first thing in the morning it is to let patients out and help him through Avith the beds, and sweep out their rooms and sweep the hall. Q. Any duty in reference to the cleanliness of the patients ? A. Yes, sir; if any of them are filthy, to clean them. Q. Did you have to see to it, that the patients who would not wash themselves were washed ? 493 A. Yes, sir.. Q. Did you do that ? A. Yes, sir, I helped to do it. Q. On ward 10 ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you know of any patient being injured while you were on ward 6 ? A. No,sir. , Q. Was there any disturbance or difficulty on ward ,6 while you were there ? A. No, sir. Q. You went on ward 10; how long did you remain on ward 10 ? A. I cannot remember exactly the number of months, but I should judge it, was near two years; I did not make a minute of it at the time. Q. During the time you were on ward ten, was there any patient that receiA7ed injuries ? A. I know one patient that committed suicide there ; he was brought out to the dead house, and that Avas the last I heard of him ; I have seen others struck there frequently. Q. How did he commit suicide ? A. He got one of the case knives out of the dining-room and he was in the dormitory, and he cut his throat. By Mr. Rice : Q. Did you see that done ? A. No, sir; it was done during the night; I saw him next morn- ing- Q. Was he on your ward ? A. Yes, sir; on number ten. Q. How was it he obtained that knife Avithout you discovering it ? A. That is the dining-room men's places to see they don't! ever -get knives, and I guess he got it out through carelessness in not counting the'knives — as near as I can get at it; they let the men ■ out before the knives were counted. Q. The rule was that the knives and forks • are gathered before the patients leave the table ? A. Y es, sir. Q. On this occasion you say they were permitted to leave the table before the knives were gathered and counted ? A. No, sir, they gathered them and counted them; but after the bulk of the men are let go, they keep in eight or ten patients to help them, and it seems that the door was left open before they were counted a second time, and this man happened to be one o"f them in there to help — that remained behind to help. Q. Was it not a portion of your duty to see to it that the patients did not have any thing left about them with which they could in- jure themselves or anybody else? 494 A. Yes, sir; but the men on the hall cannot tell when they have .j a knife, and would not search them unless they were told^. Q. If you had been told that there was a knife missing, you would have searched tfiem ? A. Yes, sir; of course I should. Q. Who was the dining-room man at that time ? A. Mr. Morgan. Q. Yrou say the patient cut his throat in the night ? A. Y es, sir. Q. Were you aware of the fact that he had chine so until morn- ing ? A. No, sir; we discovered it in the morning. Q. Did you open the door and unlock it ? A. I think I did. Q. What did you find when you unlocked the door ? A. I found the knife alongside of him, and his head out of the bed and blood all over the floor ; and he was dead and Avas carried j to the dead-house ; I saw no more of him. ) Q. Was there any inquest ? A. Well, if there had been any inquest held on him we should j have heard of it, I think; I don't know as there was any inquest; * I was not called as a witness ; to the best of my information there 1 was no inquest. 1 Q. You were not called before the coroner ? A. No, sir. | Q. What was the man's name that cut his throat ? A. P. Q. Where from ? A. I cannot tell you. Q. When did that occur, what year? A. I think it was in the latter end of the month of April, 1876; we never make any minute of any such thing ; it was in '76 or '77. Q. You never heard any thing more from him after he was taken out of the dead-house ? A. No, sir. , Q. Is there not a .small cemetery or burying ground connected j with the Asylum ? A. I believe all that come, afford to take them a'way. Q. Is there a small cemetery or burying ground attached to the Asylum ? A. No, sir, not any, on the grounds. Q. Do you know where they bury their dead that are not taken ij away by friends for the purpose ? [ A. They are buried in the potter's field. By Mr. Olin : Q. Was P. a pauper or not ? A. I cannot say whether he was or not. 495 Q. Was there ever an inquiry made about it by any of the friends of the man ? A. No, sir, I never heard any thing more about it. Q. Any other injury to patients by patients themselves, or bv at- tendants, or from any other patient ? A. I have seen attendants going to the room when a man would be making a noise and go and strike him in the pit of the stomach with his fist. Q. Give us the names of the patients and attendant ? A. 1 cannot remember the patient's name; the attendant's name I can give. Q. Do you know what room ? A. I don't remember. Q. What was the attendant's name ? A. He Avas a Welshman ; that is all I can tell about him ; I think his name was David Williams. Q. Do you know where Williams resided ? A. No, sir; he was a foreigner, I think. Q. Describe to the committee just what you saAv ? A. I think he came in and struck this man in the pit of the stomach ; I told brm it was not right for him to do it; I asked him how he Avould like it if any one done that to him. Q. When did thart occur ? A. Some where along in 1876 or 1877. Q. Now, go on and state the conversation you had with Williams? A. I told him at the time it was not right to strike a man there; if he struck bim at all, that he ought not to hit him in the stomach, he was liable to rupture him or something of that sort, that he would not get over ; he went on and said, Avell, it was good enough for him. ^Q. Was the patient ATiolent ? A. No, sir, he Avas noisy, not violent. Q. Was the blow struck apparently a very severe one ? A. Yres, sir, it was a heavy blow. Q. Did the patient complain ? A. Well, he groaned, but didn't make any complaint then. Q. What time in the night was that? A. About half-past eight o'clock. Q. Soon as the patient had gone to bed ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you see the patient next morning ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did he make any complaint ? A. Yes, sir, he said he was sore in the stomach. Q. And was that all he said? A. That was about all he said ; it Avas best for him not to say any thing more. Q. When did you first report that circumstance ? A. I didn't report it at all. Q. Why didn't you report Williams to the supervisor? - 496 A. The attendants do not make a rule of reporting one another; if they are going to stay there any length of time they do not report such things. Q. There is a rule that attendants should report all injuries? A. Yres, sir, but that rule is not carried out. Q. It is not obeyed ? A. No, sir, it is not. Q. But did it become known to the supervisor that the man was struck by Williams? A. No, sir, I don't think it ever did. Q. Y'on never reported it ? A. No, sir, I never reported. Q. After the first morning did you hear the patient complain? A. I asked him the next morning if he felt sore; he said, yes,sir, he felt very sore in the pit of his stomach ; the next day I told him he must try to be quiet when he got to bed so as not to have it occur again. Q. Did you hear him report it to the head attendant ? A. No, sir, I did not. Q. Did you hear the patient complain to any member? A. No, sir ; it has got to be a knowing patient that will report things, unless it is one who knows more than the rest of them and knOw7s where he can get a little justice done to them. Q. So then you know that injury Avas not reported to any physician ? A. No, sir, I never heard of it. Q. Did you not think when yon failed to report that to the super- visor, or head attendant, that you were violating a rule ? A. It was no matter of mine ; I was making a living there,' I know I was violating a rule ; well, nobody ever told me to report such things, and it is not a rule among the attendants to report such things as that; this book of rules is laid aside; they are not car- ried out at all. Q. Your book of rules did have in a rule that you must report all cases of injury to a patient, did it not ? A. I won't swear positive av nether it did or not; I never read the book much and I don't suppose any of the rest of them ever did; it might read to that effect but I don't know that it does; I knew I was violating a rule to this extent; I know it not to be right to do these things; I have common sense enough for that. Q. The next injury that you remember of being received by patient at the hands of an attendant, Avhen was it ? A. Have seen them take them in from the open yard — but it don't do to touch a patient out there because you cannot tell who is looking out of the window — but I have seen men bring a patient in from there into the ward and threw him down and jumped on to him. Q. Give us the name of the patient? A. I can not remember it. Q. Give us the name of the attendant ? 497 A. Redner. Q. When was that ? A. It might be in 1875 ; his name was Isaac Redner. Q. How long was Redner there, dp you know \ A. I think between two and three years. Q. Describe to the committee how he threw the patient doAvn ? A. He knocked his feet out from under him, then of course he laid on the floor. Q. Knocked him off of his feet? A. Yes, sir. Q. What did he do after he jumped on him ? A. Of course when he got through he let him up; the patient went up stairs and went into his room. Mr. Haskell (reading from list) — "Isaac M. Redner, May 11, 1874, to March 31, 1875." Q. What part of his person did lie jump on ? A. On his stomach. Q. Did you hear any outcry by the patient ? A. He hollered a little, but the rest was going up stairs it would not be heard; they have shoes on in going out on the yard ; this patient, for some reason or other, did not come in — he sneaked round a fence, and when he did come in he gave him this treatment. Q. How near were you to Redner Avhen he knocked the man down? A. I was right beside him. Q. What did you say to Redner ? A. I did not say any thing to him. Q. You did not say any thing to him ? A. No, sir. Q. Why did you not remonstrate ? A. I said to you that it was not the rule for the attendants to in- terfere with one another in such matter as that, for if they did they would not stay long in the Asylum; it is riot alloAvable, if they want to keep their places there; it would not be my place to go and report him anyway. Q. If an attendant should kill a patient, do you think it would not be your duty to report it? A. No, sir; I should not, not if I intended to stay there; of course, for my duty, it would be right to do it. Q. Do you know of any case where an attendant Avas discharged for reporting a misconduct on another attendant ? A. No, sir; they will not discharge for that, but if he reports, he is watched and the other attendants are all down on him, and re- port him for something, and he is soon discharged for some reason. Q. There is some sort of federation with you that yon are not to report on one another? A. No, sir; unless they're cornered, and to help himself out he will report in the morning, if he is going to get discharged for it. Q. Did you see the patient afterward 'i 63 U 1 498 A. No, sir; he wasn't on my ward. Q. So you didn't report the injury inflicted by Redner on the patient ? A. No, sir. Q. So you don't know the result ? A. No, sir. Q. Do you know of any other injury being inflicted, while you were on ward ten ? A. Not as far as I know, sir, except as far as striking a patient is concerned ; that is an every-day occurrence. Q. For the attendants to strike patients ? A. Yes, sir, it was when I was there ; I don't know wdiat it may be now. Q. And did they strike them severe blows ? i A. It would depend a great deal on the patient, and what he i done; if he showed fight to the "attendant, he Avould always get the worst of it — the patient would. Q. The attendant would get in the first bloAv ? A. Well, the patients never got the best of the attendants. Q. Can you name any instance where you saw an attendant strike a patient, and give the patient'js name, or the the attendant's alone? A. So far as striking a patient, I have done that there frequently i myself, but I cannot name the patient. 1 Q. You can name Halpin ? 1 A. Yes, sir. 1 Q. Where did you go to from ward teu ? A. I think I was on ward eleven a while. Q. While on ward eleven, did you see any patient injured by an j attendant ? I A. No, sir; I did not see them, but I have heard of them. Q. From what source did you get your information of their being injured ? A. From being told .that such a one as they are called there, had j "gone over," that is when a patient gets a pretty good mauling; that j is wThat they call it. 'Q. Who told you about a patient getting badly mauled? A. An attendant that was on there, and before I go on any fur- ther on eleventh ward —I remember a patient brought over from ,1 twelve ; he belonged at Albany ; I cannot remember his name, but he and his brother were hatters at Albany, in the hat business; he had a notion of letting up and down the Avindow, occasionally and the attendants sat him doAvn a nnmber of times ; finally he got up again and he was struck in the ribs, or along in the side there, and on the back so that it hurt his water passage, his urine ; he could not draw it himself and he was brought over to No. ten ; I took \ care of him there ; I saw that patient struck one time; I think the < attendant's name was Evans, but I won't be positive about the a* j tendant who struck him. Q. And the patient was brought on to your ward ? 499 A. Yes, sir. Q. What was his condition when brought to your ward ? A. He Avas so bad he had to be put to bed. Q. Described the injury he received ? A. He was struck in the side; that man died in the Asylum and the Albany paper came out and gave the name of the disease that he died of; I cannot giA7e you the name ; it was a long name ; I don't know what the disease was called, but I know that he died of it. Q. That was on the twelfth ward ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did he die on your ward? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do you remember his name ? A. That I cannot, but the man, just before he died talked as rationally as I can or as any one in this room ; he said he didn't like to make any trouble for the attendants, but he told the cause of his death ; he said it was from being struck in the side. Q. Did he tell you who struck him ? A. I don't believe he was on the ward long enough to remember the attendant's name ; 1 don't think he knew their names ; he told me he and his brother was in the hat business at Albany ; I don't think it Avas entered on the injury book, because I saw it come out in the Albany paper. Q. Did you occasionally see the injury book in the supervisor's possession ? A. No, sir; I never got that in my hand; I think it came out in the Albany paper after that and stated about him being there and what the disease was that he died of. By Mr. Morgan : Q. And it was some disease other than the injury ? A. Y es, sir ; it did not speak of the injury whatsoever. Q. Or of its being the result of any injury ? A. No, sir. Q. Did you report that case to the supervisor of the ward ? A. No, sir. I did not. Q. Why didn't'you ? A. I gave you the reasons before. Q. This man that injured him so on number twelve, was not on your ward ? A. If he was on number four, the farthest ward away from me, we should not make a practice of doing any thing of that kind as the telling of it. N Q* You regarded that as a violation of the rules? A. No, sir ; 1 never regarded it as such, although it was against the rules. 500 Q. You took it as being a matter of course, it was so often violated ? A. Yes, sir ; we never reported these things. Q. Who carried the body out of your ward ? A. I helped to carry it; he was carried to the dead house. Q. Did you hear-any more about it except the account you saw in the paper? A. No, sir; I took it for granted that his folks came for him from Albany. Q. How iong Avas he confined to his bed before he died ? A. Quite for a Aveek or ten days ; he went through an operation. Q. Who performed the operation ? ' A. Doctor Smith. Q. What was the operation ? A. In the first place I was a private attendant for the patient at the time; looked after his interests altogether. Q. He was a paying patient ? A. Y es, sir ; but then we are not supposed to know; as attend- ants we generally judge from the patients ; 1 took him down to the bath tub ; got him a warm Avater bath, as Avarm as he could stand it, ! to draw the water from him ; it didn't have any effect; the doctor 1 got a silver wire and ran that up in his penus, and his water could ' J not be draAvn from him, so consequently the man died. j Q. Did you learn from him Avhether he had ever been troubled I with any such difficulty ? ;:1 A. He said not ; he said it was the first time it ever occurred. ■< Q. And tell us as far as you know that injury was not reported •; or mentioned to the physicians of the Asylum ? A. No, sir, I don't think it was; never to my knowledge anyway ; By Mr. Rice : Q. For how long a time had you been attending to this man ? A. From the first time he was there, a week or eight days, per- ' haps. ! Q. Before the injury ? A. Before the injury I was not an attendant for him until he was j brought to the ward after the injury. Q. And you became a private'attendant after this injury ? A. Yes, sir; I made his bed and brought his meals and such like. Q. Do you know whether he had any difficulty in passing urine before that ? A. He said not. Q. Do you know any thing about it ? A. That I don't know. Q. Were^ there any bruises or marks upon his body ? j A. No, sir ; I could not see any along the side, any more than he i said it was very sore when I lifted him up to make his bed. 501 Q. Did you see him after this ? A. Yes, sir. Q Did you make an examination to see if there was a bruise or not? A. No, sir ; no more than a mark; I could not see anything from the outside ; but a man could get a blowT in the side or stomach and not mark him. Q. Was there quite a black or blue spot on his side i A. No, sir; I could not see any. Q. And you wTould say from the body that an attendant inflicted this injury with his feet ? A. No, sir ; with his fist he struck him in the side. Q. Did the man immediately go to bed — take to his bed ? A. No, sir ; I think he did not go that day. Q. Hoav long Avas he about ? A. I think he was put in bed the next day. Q. And after that he never got out? A. No, sir ; he died there. Q. And from that time you became his private attendant ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How soon after the injury was he brought over in number ten ? A. I think it was a couple of days. Q. Had he taken to his bed in number tAvelve before he was ■ brought to number ten. A. Yes, sir ; he was carried over to my ward. Q. And from that time you were his attendant? A. Yes, sir. Q. And with him all the time? A. Yes, sir ; day time I was there. Q. And who was Avith him nights ? A. Nobody at night. Q. You saw the physicians attending him ? A. Yes, sir. , Q. You were there when they came in to prescribe for him ? A. Yes, sir, of course I saw the doctor come in. Q. What physician attended him ? A. Dr. Smith was one, and I think the other Avas Kendrick; I re- member Smith because he performed the operation on him. Q. Dr. Gray ? A. No, sir; I only saw him tAvo or three times a year up there. Q. He didn't attend upon the man? A. No, sir. Q. Where is Dr. Smith now ? A. Morristown, N J. That is the last I heard of him. Q. In the asylum there ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Now you say this man was pretty rational ? A. Yes, sir. 502 Q. Seemed to understand himself and any thing he was talking about ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did he appreciate the fact that he was going to die? A. Yes, sir, he told me he was going to die. Q. And he understood all that you said to him ? A. Yes, sir. Q. You were there when the doctors came to see him ? A. Some of the time I remained up in the room with him, some- times not. Q. Did you ever hear him say any thing to the doctors about the injury ? A. He told me he did not want to make any trouble. Q. (Repeated)? A. No, sir, I never heard him talk to the doctor. Q. ,Did you ever hear him give the doctor any reason or cause for his trouble? A. No, sir; I never heard him give any. Q. Do you know then whether the doctor was ever told that he had received this injury? A. I rather think he never was. Q. Are you able uoav to give any reason Avhy a man so injured that he was dying, and having received a wound which he knew must result in his death, should not have told the doctor of it ? A. I would not swear positively that he did not tell, but I never heard him. if Q. Did he tell you that he never told the doctor ? A. He told me a few days before that he, thought, he didn't want to make any trouble for the attendants, and I never knew him to tell it. Q. Do you know of any reason why a man who has received a wound that would result in death would not have told the doctor? A. No, sir ; I don't know of any reason. By Mr. Morgan : Q. Who detailed you as private attendant upon this man? A. The supervisor I suppose, he told me. Q. To take care of this man ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Who was the supervisor ? A. Barrisdale (Alexander). Q. He is there now ? A. Yes, sir. . Q. You attended to the care of him until he died ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Would not you say it was your duty to have reported this to the supervisor or the doctor what this man had said to you about the injury ? 503 A. As I told yon I suppose it was my duty but it was not ruleable among the attendants to do any thing of the kind, it would not help the man's case along at all, and it might get that patient discharged, and it might not. Q. You understood that the only way that the asylum could be relieved of that kind of attendants was that they should be reported in order that the superintendent or steward might discharge them? _ A. Yes, sir; well, that is the only way, of conrse there is occa- sions where they cannot get out of it. Q. I am taking that very case; yon kneAV that the only way the Asylum could be relieved from that kind of attendant, that you stated the man is, was to report it and he would be discharged ? A. He might be, and he might not. Q. There was no way of their learning of this injury except that it should be reported by an attendant? A Not unless the patient reported him, that is about the only way. Q. A patient did tell you on this occasion ? A. Yes, sir; I could not swear that he did not tell the doctor, I am not positive about it; if he told him I never heard of it. Q. Was there any other injury that came to your knoAvledge while you were on Avard ten ? A. That I have seen marks on patients? Q. That came to your knowledge ? A. I saw this man struck. Q. Well, any thing that came to your knowledge reported to you by the patient? A. I saw them carry a man out to the dead house this same night; he Avas a man who went up stairs with the attendant, and went and got into the reservoir up there, or cistern, and got drowned. Q. That was the case where the patient got in and got drowned ? A. Yes, sir ; the attendant took up four or five to do some work in the attic. Q. Yon didn't understand that the attendant put him in the reservoir ? A. Oh, no, sir; I did not insinuate any thing of the kind; the patient jumped in himself. Q. Was there any other case that you remember, that a patient was injured by an employee ? A. Yes, sir; I kneAV a patient named C.; this was on the fourth ward, I don't know his first name, he got such a kicking that when I took him out three months afterwards, in place of "bending his back, he would bend his knees if he had to pick any thing up; he was injured in the back by being kicked. Q. What information did you have or knowledge that he was kicked ? A. The knowledge I had was seeing it done. Q. Did you see him kicked ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Who kicked himj? 504 A. An attendant. Q. Who wa8 the attendant ? A. I won't be positive, I think his name was Roberts- I think his name was John. Q. When did that occur? A. I think it was in 1877. Q. Where was the patient when Roberts struck or kicked him? A. On the floor of the ward. Q. On ward four ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Down upon the floor ? A. Yes, sir; he was a powerful man, he could stand a great deal of punishment without injuring him; more than the general run of men. Q. What did Roberts say and do to him ? A. This was a patient that showed fight; he took a notion he Avould strike him. Q. What did Roberts say and do to him ? • A. He kicked the patient on the floor; he did not say much to the patient. Q. What did Roberts say and do to him ? A. I Don't suppose he said any thing. Q. Did he ask him to go up ? A. No, sir. Q. But kicked him ? A. Yes, sir Q. How did the patient lie on the floor ? A. Longwise; he lay on his side, I think. Q. And Roberts kicked him in the back ? A. Y es, sir. Q. About what portion of the back ? A. About the center of the back. Q. More than once did he kick him ? A. Yes, sir; half a dozen times or more for that matter. Q. Where Avere you when he was kicking him ? A. On the ward. Q. Did you say or do any thing when you saw him kicking this man ? A. No, sir; I did not interfere. Q. Was this man the attendant on an equal grade with yousrelf ? A. He was a stronger and and a bigger man than I am. Q. He was not the head attendant ? A. Yes, sir ; he w7as. 'a Q. If yon saw a man lying on the floor and the head attendant , ] walk up and kicked him half a dozen times, didn't you think it was your duty to interfere and prevent him ? A. No, sir; it was my duty to report it perhaps, but it was not ruleable to do so. 505 Q. Could you not have interfered and prevented the patient from being injured ? A. I had not been there long enough to dictate to him, it was for him to dictate to me. Q. You think you were justified in standing there and seeing that man kicked half a dozen times without in any way remonstrating or interfering? A. It .Avould not do any good if I had interfered ; if I had re- ported it, I should soon have been discharged, some fault would be found by the other attendants and I should be discharged for some- thing I didn't do; they did not report one another there and I told you why. < Q. And even such an extensive injury was not 'i A. No, sir. Q. Did that man complain when the doctor came or not ? A. There were three da«ys the doctor did not see him at all. Q. Where was he ? A. In his room, I suppose; when the doctor came down one side of the hall he would step into the rooms and see that patients in that room ; and while he was in some of the rooms, having passed this room we would take him from the room on this side and put him over on the other into a room that the doctor had passed. Q. And that ran along for two or three days ? A. Yes, sir; until the man could stir round. Q. Was the patient satisfied to do that ? A. He was one of this kind he would never report; you might kill him and he would never give in. Q. And he did not make any disturbance becuase you cheated the doctor ? A. No, sir ; I don't suppose he knew any thing about that. Q. He Avould be transferred from one room to another, taken across the hall and have no suspicion that you were trying to keep him from the sight of the doctor ? A. No, sir. Q. Who helped you move him across ? A. Well, he could nove himself he could Avalk ; I would move him sometimes. Q. Did the head attendant tell you to do it? A. I don't know as he did me; I would not; I Avould knoAV enough to do that myself. Q. You Avas doing that so that the doctor would not learn of the injury and thereby have the head attendant exposed? A. Yes, sir; that Avas it. Q. That was the object ? A. Y es, sir. Q. Were you on ward four in 1877? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do yon remember two patients — a patient by the name of J. L.? A. Yes, sir; I think I do. 64 U " 506 Q. Do you remember a patient of that ward by the name of D. W.? A Yos sir Q.' Do 'you recollect either of these men being severely injured when you were on the ward ? A. Yes, sir; W. was a man all the while doing something or other and he got a good many thumpings from one and another. By Mr. Howe : , Q. Attendants or patients ? A. Attendants. By Mr. Haskell : Q. Do you recollect any instance when W. was hurt seriously ? • A. I think the man was hurt, and the time it was set that the patients got quarreling, and that Avas the cause. Q. Is that a customary excuse that injuries resulted from the attendants ? A. Yes, sir; if it can be put off in that way ; it is done. Q. Do you recollect what kind of injury it was to W.? A. No, sir; I cannot swear positively what it was. Q. Do you think you recollect such an occurrence? A. Yesj sir; I recollect W. being in bed for awhile. . Q. Do you think it was reported as a quarrel between him and another patient? A. Yes, sir; I think so ; that is the best of my opfnion ; this W., he made a great deal of trouble for the attendants and when he Avent too far, of course they had to subdue him. By Mr. .Rice : Q. That was to curb him a little ? A. Yes, sir. By Mr. Haskell : Q. When you were on the fourth ward was R. McCormick and J. E. Rickard? A. I think Mr. McCormick went off as I went on, and I know Rickard but I was not on the ward with them two. 5y Mr. Morgan : Q. How long did this man remain disabled in consequence of this matter that you have spoken of? A. He was disabled when I came away from there. Q. How long was that after the injury ? A. That I cannot swear positively how long it was I took the men out to air, and three or four months after that I looked at the man, and I pitied him, to see a strong, able bodied man have to stoop by 507 bending his knees instead of his back, which he could not bend in consequence of this injury. Q. How long after that injury did you remain in the Asylum ? A. That I cannot say, six or seven months. Q. AYas that man then laboring under this injury ? A. The last I know of him he was. Q. Was he in your ward when yon left ? A. On ward four. Q. You think he became rational ? A. Yes, sir; he got so he could talk quite rationally. Q. Did you ever hear him complain to any attending physician? A. No, sir; I don't believe he ever spoke to them; he was one of those kind of independent men that would not speak unless spoken to ; I never saw them ask him. Q. Did you ever hear the physician make any inquiry as to what the trouble with this man was ? A. No, sir; I never did. Q. Did he ever give you his history; tell you Avhy he was there, or where he came from ? A. No, sir; I don't think he did; I had him out to work on several occasions and I Avould see — Q. What do you think he would weigh ? A. One hundred and seventy pounds; he w7as a deceiving man, bony, he was taller than I am. Q. What was the next case of injury to a patient, that came to your knowedge ? A. I don't know of any Other serious injuries, but I know of a case where an attendant came in there, or a patient rather, and I rather think he Avas a private patient, he had been in the habit of wearing his flannels all the year round ; I called him by name, but I cannot remember him now ; he Avas a very gentlemanly sort of man; he told me he would like to wear his flannels, as he had worn them all the year round ; he was told it was the rule to change the flannels in the spring ; he said, " for God's sake don't take them ;" he would miss them ; I spoke to the " super/' whether he would let him have his flannels or not; he said, "no, he must do as the rest did, change the flannels;" a few days after that he came into the yard and was shivering and shaking, he told me to give him his flannels, for God's sake, or he would die of cold ; I told him I would do what I could to get his flannels ; I spoke to the supervisor, I did not get them, and the man caught cold and he took to his bed and he died. Q. Died in the Asylum ? A. Yes, sir. Q. When did he die ? A. I cannot give you dates at all, Q. Do you know where he was from ? A. No, sir. Q. In what season did he die ? 508 A" A. It was in the spring. Q. In the month of May or April ? A. No, sir; I think it was May. - ^ Q. Was there any talk in the Asylum about the man s death i A. No, sir; they don't make any talk about a man dying there ; it is'a frequent thing about their dying ; they put them in a tub and wash them, and carry them to the dead-house ; that is all that is done about it. , . Q. Did you learn any thing of the body after this man wa washed, and then taken to the dead-house ? A. No, sir. Q. He was buried after that ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How old a man was he ? A. I should say about thirty-two; between thirty and thirty-two; a young man. Q. Who kneAV of this man's complaining of not being permitted to have his flannels; who knew of that beside yourself? A. I spoke to the supervisor. Q. Who was the supervisor ? L:L! ..-_ A. Barrisdale. Q. And he said it was against the rules ? A. Yres, sir. Q. Was it against the rules to allow patients to wear flannels in the summer ? A. There are some there who do wear them. (Question repeated.) A. It is the rule for them to change their flannels." Q. If they have not got a change, how is it? A. This man had changes; he told me his folks would furnish him with more flannels Avhen they were worn out; it saves washing. 4 Q. Were there any other cases of injury on ward ten, while you were there ? A. No, sir; I don't remember any more quarrels, that is, with patients; as far as attendants striking patients, that was an every day occurrence. ■■ Q. Do you know of one being struck, or that he was injured in accident? A. No, sir; that is about all the cases I know of. > Q. How long did you remain on No. 10 after this man died? A. It would be about five or six months, I cannot remember as to dates. Q. Did you go A. It is the rules to discharge him when such charges are made; \ but I think there have been very few from that cause ; I think it is more from voluntary leaving; I think the number discharged for cause is very few. Q. Upon what do you base that opinion? A. Because I think I should hear if there was such a thing; I see the same attendants there for some length of time; I haA-e no rea- , son to suppose but what very few of them are so managed as not to be removed. Q. In your examination of the Asylum, when you make these 557 visits to the wards, do you sometimes miss an attendant from their position on that ward ? A. No, sir ; they are there generally. Q. Have you at any time missed an attendant? A. No, sir; I do not remember of being there without some at- tendants present. Q. But have you missed an attendant that you knew was form- erly there ? A. I may have, but I can't recall any case. Q. You do not remember any case now ? A. No, sir; I can't recall any at this time. Q. Then you would not know whether they had been discharged or not ? A. I might not know that. Q. You go into the ward and you find about two or three attend- ants, do you not? A. I find attendants in the wards when I go in. Q. Do you ( istinguish between those that have recently come there and those that have been there for any length of time ? A. It is possible I might, but I do not think I do; it is a matter that I do not remember about. Q. Then an attendant might be discharged, or leave, and new attendants come in, and you might not discover it? A. Yes, sir ; that might be so, of course. Q. What other member of the board of managers have visited the institution and gone upon the Avards with you within the last, year? A. I think most of them probably ; I could not say; I could not put that thing entirely correct if I should try ; there has been — Ave have gone along in all together. Q. You have all gone in at once, I suppose ; but name any one of the board of managers who has gone through w7ith you during the last year ? A. Yres, sir; the present board ; if you want me to name them I can do so. Q. Name the one member of the board who has goue? A. There is Mr. Winston ; he has gone. Q. AY hen did he go through Avith you ? A. I think at the last quarterly meeting. Q. Wheu was the last quarterly meeting? A. I could not name the time exactly7. Q. Was it since this investigation began ? A. No. sir; it was before that time. Q. Do you think it Avas before this investigation ? A. I think so, I will not be very certain] these are things that it is impossible for me to speak correctly about ; they are questions I never dreamed of being asked about it again ; it has been a matter of so little importance who it was that was with me ; the board of 558 managers goes through quarterly, one meeting is in April and one in December, so you can divide the rest ; it is a common thing to do. Q. Do you remember of hearing any other manager who has passed through there wdth you making any inquiries of the patients as to the manner in which they are treated by the attendants? A. No, sir, I don't know that I have ; they generally go along with a number of the doctors, and they talk about the patients in general! Q. Have you heard any member of the board of managers in- quire of patients as to the faithful manner in which the attendants discharged their duties? A. I should think not, I remember none. Q. Have you heard any member of the board of managers in- quire of the patients as to how faithfully the physicians attend to their duties ? A. I should ansA\7er the same ; I think not. Q. Or as to the superintendent — Dr. Gray ? A. No, sir ; nor of him either. Q. Have you in visiting the male department at any time found any person serving as an attendant Avhom you considered was not a fit person to discharge the duties of that office — of attendant ? A. I cannot say that I ever have. Q. Have you on the female department ? A. No, sir. Q. I think I inquired about the male department as to injuries; have you at any time discovered any evidences of injuries on the patients on the female side of the institution, to any one of the female patients ? A. I haA7e not, no, sir; you asked me that before; I said no. Q. So far then, as your observation and investigation has gone, the patients have been entirely free from injury,of any kind? A. As far as I know, they have. Q. And you have been in there when there are patients in there who were apparently sick ? A. Yes, sir ; I have seen some that seemed sick. Q. Do you inquire of them what the difficulty is? A. No, sir; I do not inquire of the patients at all; I inquire of the doctors. Q. And you are content Avith what the doctors say? A. Yes, sir; I do not expect to get a reasonable ansAver from a lunatic. Q. But you said that you got a truthful and rational answer from many ? A. With those that are convalescent and some that are not so bad, but they have mind enough left to give satisfactory ansAvers, but it is not always the case — very rarely. Q. Have you at any time specially investigated the temperature of the various wards in the Asylum ? 559 A. Yes, sir; and I know it to be excellent. Q. Have you found some wards where it was very cold ? A. No, sir,.I have not. Q. Are there any wards there where patients are kept that it is uncomfortably cold in cold weather ? A. Not that I know of; in the rear part it is not as comfortable as it ought to be, I admit that, but there is nothing that would war- rant the idea that the patients were not properly cared for as far as possible, or that they were unnecessarily cold. Q. Wherein does the lack of comfort come ? A. It is worn out; the building is in bad repair ; the rear part has gone further than it ought to have been allowed to go, on ac- count of the crowd of patients; the whole institution has been regenerated, and that part has not been as well done as it ought to have been. Q. Who has charge of the repairs of the Asylum buildings ? A. Dr. Gray with the board of managers ; we pass on it "and giA7e our opinion — have more frequently than anybody else—what is best to be done in improving the building. Q. And then who takes the laboring oar and sees that the repairs are done ? A. The superintendent takes the most of it on his shoulders, and he is the most competent man to do so, but there is a building com- mittee, and we go through and see that it is properly done; noAv there is something going now in that direction ; I am on that com- mittee, to procure materials at the cheapest rate we can get them. Q. Do you procure the material ? A. Yes, sir. Q. When did you procure the material for these repairs ? '* A. Well, I procured brick not long since for the erections pro- gressing at present; it was between I and another member of the board. Q. I am talking about what you have done yourself? A. You want to get at the truth, and I will tell you how it hap- pened ; I had been buying brick and could get them at a lower pgure than the market price, and I put these brick for the Asylum m at the same time; and at the same time or about that time anothermember of the board of managers spoke to the same person, so that it was between the two of us. Q. State when yon have personally purchased any material for repairs? J A. So far as that is concerned, it was this last fall. Q. What did you purchase personally, this last fall ? A I am speaking of that brick for one thing, and lumber for another thing that we got from Kelloggs. Q. Did you purchase the lumber? A. No, sir; I did not, personally. Q. Confine yourself please to your individual acts ; vou purchased this brick last fall ? " r .- 560 A. Yes, sir; but the other man took it; I arranged for the price; he got them from the same party ; that Avas Mr. Rogers. Q. When did you examine the bills for repairs done in the insti- tution ? A. I never have done that. Q'. Do you make yourself familiar with the expense of repairing the building ? *.■..*£■ A. Yes, sir; somewhat. J Q. Do you know what amount of money was expended in the way of repairs to the institution in the year 1883 ? A. No, sir; I do not ; I could not tell you. Q. Can you give us an approximation to it ? A. I could not; in the fall of 1883 there was an appropriation, but 1 do not remember the amount of it. Q. You have been for some time on the building committee ? A. Yes, sir; I have been on it generally. Q. For how long have you been a member of that committee? A. It is composed of Mr. Rogers and myself, and I forget avIio else. Q. For how many years have you been on it ? A. Well, call it----; I cannot tell you the number of years; I could not give it. Q. Have yon been on that committee for ten years ? A. I could not say; I have been on that committee most of the time that the building was going on. Q. As a member of that committee have you at any time investi- gated or become familiar with the expense of the repairs that have been put upon the institution ? A. I have been familiar with the cost of repairs at the time, hut I have not followed the thing closely up ; I did not audit the bills at all. Q. So that you are unable to say whether the expense has been extravagant or not ? A. I can ; I say it has not been in my judgment. Q. How do you knoAV it has not ? A. I know that the materials are bought economically, the work done economically, and a good deal of the work done by the patients. Q. But you do not know how much has been paid for it ? A. Why, no, I could not give you the items. Q. Can you give the sum total ? A. No, sir, I cannot, but it is within the appropriation. Q. How many horses are owned by the State and kept upon the premises ? A. I do not remember Iioav many there are. Q. Have you any idea ? A. No, sir, I have not. i":: Q. Do you know Avhether the horses kept are owned by the State or by others ? A. I could not give you any idea. 561 Q. Do you know any necessity for any doctor employed in that institution to own or keep a horse there ? A. Yes, I should say so. Q. For what purpose? A. For going down to the city or going off anywhere, at any time. Q. So far as the State is concerned, the doctors' duties are all con- fined to that institution, are they not? A. Not exactly ; no, sir. Q. What other duties have the doctors there elsewhere than in the institution ? A. He goes down to the city frequently. Q. In what capacity ? A. I cannot tell you ; possibly buying some medicines ; or what-* ever it may be, I cannot tell you the reason, but such i8 the fact, I know that. Q. Do the doctors buy the medicines ? A. I think probably Dr. Gray has more to do with that than any- body else. Q. What other doctor in that institution, in your judgment, should keep a horse there in order to properly discharge his duties to the State ? A. That question is a singular one ; what doctor should keep a horse, is that it ? Q. Y es ; as president of the board of managers of this institution what doctor, in your judgment, requires a horse in order to discharge his duties there ? A. I think Dr. Gray does for one ; I do not know that any of the others have horses; you are getting into a ground that I do not know much about. Q. Who makes the purchases of the horses and carriages? A. I cannot tell you, unless it is the steward; I cannot tell; he makes most of the purchases ; the steward has a horse for instance. Q Does he have a horse separate from the Asylum team ? A. A horse for his own use. Q. And that horse is kept from the Asylum, or State feed, is it not ? A. Yes, sir, I suppose it is. Q. There is a team that is kept there for the purpose of coming to the city -- a covered wagon or covered sleigh—-to come to the city to make purchases ? A. Whether to make purchases or not I don't know; they are kept there. Q. All the purchases or packages are transported from the city to the Asylum Avith that team and in that sleigh and wagon as you understand it, are they not? A. I don't know about that. Q. HaAij you ever seen a large oil-cloth or canvas-covered sleigh that is used here for transporting the goods and city purchases to the Asylum ? 71 U 562 A. I cannot say that I have. Q. Do you know how the supplies for the Asylum are trans- ported to the Asylum ? A. My inference Avas that they Avere brought by those from whom they purchased the goods, but I'may be mistaken. Q. As you understand it there are plenty of teams there to do the transporting; are there not? A. I don't know but there may be; I cannot tell how many teams there are there, and whether or not they have the transport- ing to do or not, I can't say. Q. Have you at any time iiiA7estigated the expense of the keeping and caring for the stock of horses kept there ? • A. No, sir, not exactly. Q. Have you ever made any investigation ? A. Yes, sir'; there is one team, for instance, engaged to carry the doctors to church in Utica. Q. Have you investigated the expense of maintaining the horses there that are kept at the Asylum ? A. No, sir; I cannot tell you that. Q. You have neither investigated the number nor the expense of keeping ? ip- A. No, sir ; I have not investigated that matter. Q. Do you know how many horses Dr. Gray keeps for his own private use ? A. No, sir, I do not; I can't tell you. Q. Have you at any time investigated the cost of the supplies of the Asylum ? A. Yes, I have inquired into it somewhat. Q. So as to become familiar with it ? W* A. Well, so as to have an opinion in regard to the merits of the thing. Q. I mean as to their amount ? A. I could not give any idea as to their amount. ' Q. Do you knoAV how many men are employed outside the Asy- lum, upon the farm, at the barns and out-buildings ? A. I have a memorandum Avith me that will give it, that gives the number; I cannot repeat it. Q. Give us the number from your memorandum ? [The Avitness then produced a copy of the "Utica Herald" of April 23, 1883.] And said : " I had a calculation made a year ago in relation to this thing ; it gives 590 in five years ; now, if you divide that by five, you get it very nearly, 120." Q. One hundred and twenty employees, in and out ? A. Yes, sir. Q. There are from eighty to eighty-five employees in the institu- tion, are there not ? A. That I could not say ; in this paper (the " Utica Herald" 563 there is also a calculation about the cost of feeding ; the average cost is twenty-one cents a day ; that is, six cents for breakfast, ten cents for dinner, and six cents for supper for each patient. Q. Have you ever made any personal examination into the prices paid for supplies for the Asylum ? A. I might say not personally ; I know of it and know the ar- rangement that exists ; for instance, Mr. Dryer does the purchasing and I have no doubt that he does it as economically as possible. Q. Where does he purchase ? A. At this city — Utica. Q. Where does he make his principal purchases ? A. At a number of places; 1 cannot name them. Q. Are not the heft of the groceries purchased at Butler & Ham- ilton's ? A. A large part of them, yes, sir. Q. Y'ou do not understand that they advertise or in any way in- vite competition in the furnishing of the supplies, do you ? A. Yes, sir, I do; and this is the result of a competition. Q. That is, the various dealers in the city are alloAved to put in bids and offers ? A. They have had the opportunity again and again. Q. How long ago have they had it ? A. It is constant, I might say. Q. Do you know of any bids that were put in there, than Butler & Hamilton? A. There were none that were any lower. Q. Do you knoAV any others that were put in ? A. I cannot remember any ; I have understood Mr. McQuade — he is not here now — but I understood he has gone and tried to get them lower, but he could not get them loAver. Q. Can yon give any date that those bids Avere put in or invited ? A. I could not give the date; it has been^running for some time — for some years, I know. Q. Can you give a date — anytime that that was done; any time Avithin the last four years? A. I know it has been talked of in the board. Q. Can you give the date that that has actually been done, within four years; the inviting of bids, I mean? , A. No, sir; I cannot do that. Q. Can you say that it has been done ? A. I can say this, if you will permit me to give you what is actually my belief — that it has been talked of before the board, and some members have folloAved it up to see if they could get it for any thing less. Q. Do you know of an instance Avhere bids have been invited in four years, that the merchants of the city of Utica have been per- mitted to put in a bid ? A. Not if you take it in the true sense of the Avord; I have not done it, but I understand another of the committee has done it; 564 now if I heard one of the other managers say he done so and so, have I a right to believe him or not ? Q. Do you knoAV of any time in four years that the board of managers or the officers of the institution have compared bids for supplies and made an award ? A. No, sir; I cannot tell any time it was done. Q. Do you know of that having been done since you have been a member of the board ? A. I know it was done so originally; I was not a party to it but I so understood it. Q. Do yon know of your own knowledge where the bids have been received and examined, and the award made? A. No, sir. Q. In your judgment, the supplies of that institution should be purchased through a competition of the dealers, should they not? A. Yes, sir; when you can get qualities considered. Q. I suppose if they were to advertise for bids — solicit bids for a certain quality of goods, then the lowest bidder should be awarded the contract of furnishing the Asylum, should he not? A. It might be and might not be ; it would depend a great deal upon the responsibility of the party and the quality of the goods he held, there is a great deal in that. Q. Now, I suppose, if you call for a specific quality you would expect that the party who bid would supply that quality as he agreed to furnish ? A. I have known cases where. Q. You would expect that, would you not ? A. Why, I should have the right to expect it if the man had the ability to do it. Q. And if he had not it would be a prudent thing on the part of the officers of the Asylum when the contract was awarded to him, to give a bond that he .would do it? A. That would be natural I should say. Q. Do you know of any instance that a bond has been required from the parties furnishing supplies to the institution ? A. No, sir; not that I know of. Q. Do you know where the liquors used in the Asylum are pur- chased ? A. No, sir ; I could not tell you that. Q. Do you know of any instance where competition has been in- vited in the furnishing of liquors to the Asylum—of your own knowledge ? A. No, sir; I am not acquainted with any of those circumstances. Q. Have you at any time investigated so as to become familiar with the particular kind of liquors used in that institution ? A. I have not, except by the reports. Q. By the report as published you find some ve ry costly liquors, do you not ? A. Yery likely. 565 Q. Yery expensive, are they not ? A. I cannot answer that knowingly. Q. Do yon know what use is made of the most expensive liquors that are purchased for that institution ? A. I suppose it is used as a medicine ; I should think so. Q. The State pays for— or furnishes to Dr. Gray and his family their provisions ? A. I suppose that is so. Q. Do you know whether those liquors are purchased for the family use of Dr. Gray ? A. I do not know any thing about that. Q. Have you ever inquired to see ? A. I have not as I remember of ; I do not know ; my impression is that it is not so but 1 might be mistaken. Q. With your understanding of Dr. Gray's employment, should you think that the State should furnish him liquors for his private use? A. No, sir; I should think not. Q. And if that had been done, in your judgment that Avould be a violation of the rule, would it not ? A. I don't knoAV that there is any rule about it; but I do not know that it would be expected that the State should furnish liquors foi the table. Q. Do you knoAV the McQuaid Brothers of Utica? A. I know of them. Q. Have you any personal acquaintance with the liquor firm of McQuaid Brothers of Utica? A. No, sir. Q. Do you know whether the liquors used iu the Asylum or any part of them are purchased of that firm ? A. 1 do not know ; I could not tell you. Q. The Asylum fund is used now to pay for the domestic help in Dr. Gray's family ? A. I think so. Q. Do you know the terms of employment of Dr. Gray as super- intendent of that institution ? A. I do not understand that. Q. Do you know the terms under which Dr. Gray is employed, or has his appointment in the institution ? A. I suppose I do; he is employed as superintendent of the Asy- lum, and the rules are laid doAvn as to what shall be his business; he is the head, and I might say the responsible person in all cases, employed by the managers — Q. That covers a portion of the question ; but as to the mainte- nance of the doctor and his family ; what proA7ision is made in ref- erence to that ? A. I don't know of any special provision in that respect at all. Q. Do you know any thing about how many private servants the doctor has for himself and family ? 566 A. I do not know that. Q. Have you ever made the inquiry ? A. No, sir, I never have inquired. Q. Do you understand that by the terms of Dr. Gray's appoint- ment the State is to furnish all the domestics for his family that he or his family may think they need or require? A. I do not know; I should infer such Avas the fact; I do not un- derstand your question exactly. Q. Do yon know who made the contract with Dr. Gray for his appointment there ? A. Well, the managers do ; he is employed by the managers, but it is so long since that regards any part of the contract, I cannot say any thing about it now. Q. Do you know whether the contract is reduced to writing ? A. No, sir; I do not knoAV that it is; I can't say. Q. You would regard it as a very dangerous method to employ him, and he to judge of all the servants and attendants that he might Avant.for his family use ? A. No, sir, I should think not; we think we know the man that we are employing. Q. And I suppose included in this furnishing of the doctor's household is all the luxuries that he sees fit to have, is there not? A. I cannot tell whether you are correct in your supposition or not. Q. You do not know whether the arrangement covers those ex- penses or not ? A. If you know it, I do not. Q. I ask you do you know what the provisions of the employ- ment are in reference to luxuries ? A. No, sir; I do not know of any ; I think Dr. Gray was em- ployed there as superintendent before I was appointed manager and he has been continued there without any formality. Q And you have never investigated to ascertain the terms of his employment, have you ? A. I have not investigated the matter and it does not require in- vestigation ; it is open to everybody who knows it. Q. Do you knoAV whether there has been any change in the terms of his employment ? A. I do not know of any. Q. Do you know w7hat his annual salary is ? A. I think there is $15,000 ; I think it must be $4,000. Q. Do you know what Dr. Gray's compensation is per year? A. I have known but I only speak from my memory; I think it- was $4,000; I will not be certain. Q. And do you knoAV what is the salary of the first assistant phy- sician ? A. That I have forgotten ; I did know the division of the $15,- 000, but I cannot remember now ; it is divided between the doc- tors, the matron and the treasurer. 567 Mr. Morgan — And the steward. Q. Yon do not know what the yearly salary of either of the assistant physicians or of the matron is ? A. I haA7e forgotten ; I did knoAvbut it is not in my memory now. Q. Do you know what the yearly salary of the steward is ? A. I do not remember; that is easily found out at the Asylum. Q. How often do the three members of the building committee meet ? A. They have no stated time that I know of ; we have a call if there is any occasion arises; then we get together by a special meeting. Q. Is it not true, Senator, that the board of managers rely very largely upon Avhat Dr. Gray says and does in reference to the matter of repairs ? '■ A. A good deal depends upon his judgment, for in my opinion there is none better. Q. And on his doing ? A. Yes, and he does right, I think, as a general thing. Q. And you have the utmost confidence in Dr. Gray, have you not? A. Yes, sir; I have every confidence in him. Q. And that confidence leads you to take his figures and his man- agement without making any investigation yourself that you other- wise Avould make — is not that so ? A. When you speak about ''figures," explain what you mean ; I do not take his figures for any thing. Q. I refer to the amounts he gives you as the expense of the various departments ? A. Why, it is all down in black and white. Q. Well, you take the figures that he has so put down, do you not? A. No, sir ; I take the figures from those that have charge of that matter; we have a book-keeper there and he has charge of that matter — the keeping of the books ; he makes the report; AA-e can always have all the accounts before us. Q. Noav come to the matters of building and repairs — who had the principal part of the directing about those matters, do you know — did not Dr. Gray ? A. No ; not entirely ; of course Ave rely very largely upon his judgment. Q. And upon his acts? A Yes, sir ; if I understand Avhat yon mean by that. Q. Well, I mean as to his hiring work and saying how it should be done ? A. Well, we have our general workmen that we employ to do such things as that. Q. State who the boss workman is upon the building? A. I cannot remember his name, it is a mason that generally does such work in the institution. 568 Q. Who is the boss workman that was engaged there last summer and superintended the repairs being made ? A. I could not tell you his name ; I don't remember it. Q. Did you make any contract with him yourself? A. No, sir;"! did not. Q. Did you understand that Dr. Gray made that? A. No, sir; 1 think he was paid by the day. Q. Did not Dr. Gray employ him ? A. He Avas paid by the day. Q. Was he employed by Dr. Gray ? A. Well, yes ; he is employed pretty much all the time whenever they have such repairs — the general repairs of the place. Q. Does not Dr. Gray do the general employing? A. Yes, sir; I think he does. Q. And it is your confidence in him that satisfies you that it is all right ? A. Yes, sir; and of. course I can see that it is done too ; I think I have some knowledge of those things myself, and am not apt to be deceived in such matters. By the Chairman : Q. Do you remember a request made to the board of managers by the State Board of Charities to furnish them an inventory of the materials and property on hand belonging to the Asylum ? A. I think I know what you mean — an itemized statement — is that it, a printed form to be filled in. Q. Yes, I presume that is it; some of the managers have called it an inventory ? A. I will show yon what it is, I have a copy with me; this is it (producing a paper and handing it to the chairman). Said paper was marked " Exhibit No. 12, J. H. M." (See appendix.) The Witness (continuing) — It is a thing they want filled up but it is next to impossible to do it. Q. When was that received by the Asylum authorities? A. It was sent to me individually, I think, or at least I had one sent to me; but there have been more than .that sent, they were sent by Mr. Yan Antwerp — John H. Yan Antwerp of Albany ; he is one of the members of the State Board of Charities; I have here his letter to us, requesting us to fill in and send the blank to his board. Q. Will you please produce that letter ? ' A. Y es, sir ; here it is (producing the same)"; I will ask Senator Goodwin to read it for me ; Mr. Goodwin then read the letter, as follows: " STATE OF NEW YORK: Office of the State Board of Charities, i Albany, February 2,1.882. j Dear Sir — I had, accidentally, the pleasure of meeting Dr. 56i> Gray yesterday, and in the agreeable conversation we had, I under- stood him to say, that the board of managers of the State Lunatic Asylum had not specifically voted or acted on the question of fur- nishing the itemized report, called for by the State Board of Charities from the twelve charitable institutions, yours included, nine]? of which have furnished such reports. As Dr. Gray said, also that the next regular meeting of your board would not be held until April, may I ask if a special meeting of it could not be soon called to con- sider and decide the questi6n as a board; for Ave have some reasons for thinking that there are some of your managers Avho are not in accord with the present position of the State Lunatic Asylum in refusing to furnish the repprt asked by the board. The managers could also then examine the blank for the report, sent from the office of this board, and see that it is not formidable, and one as easily made by your institution as by others having, in several instances, a much larger number of inmates than the Utica Asylum. Yery respectfully yours, J. H. YAN ANTWERP, Chairman, etc. Hon. Samuel Campbell, /^resident Board of Managers, State Lunatic Asylum, Utica. The favor of an,early ansAver is solicited." Q. What, if any, reply was made by the board of managers to that letter? A. I had it replied to; here is my reply to it. ' The witness then produced another letter, which was read by Mr. Goodwin, as folloAvs: "New York Mills, N. Y., February 6, 1882. Dkar Sir.— Y^our favor of the 2d inst. received, also the printed schedule. I hardly think it necessary to call a special meeting of the board of managers for the purpose which you mention. It would incur some inconvenience and needless expense to those living at a distance, and if the board should meet, notAvithstanding your reasons for thinking that some of"" our managers are not in accord with the present position of the board, I desire to say this, you may know, I do not, and do not pretend to controvert your presumption. I do not see Avhat they could do in the matter more than has been done. I believe it is iioav a question of laAV and had better be de- termined by the proper authority. You have put the employees of the Asylum to some inconvenience by interdicting their payment of wages past due, which we believe to be a gratuitous encroachment on our rights and authority. If you believe the managers of the Asylum are remiss and incom- petent to serve two masters, why not have them turned out ? You 6eein to have the ear of the Governor, judging from his message, he may think well of replacing the present managers by the appoint- 72 U 570 ment of your board instead. To be relieA7ed from an unsought duty would save me valuable time. I beg leave to say courteously your excessive importunity from time to time to enlarge your bounds and to obtain an increase of power for your board i's, to my mind, a rather singular, silly piece of arrogance, indicating more fatuity than Avisdom. I am pleased you met with Dr. Gray in Albany. I advised his going to look after matters connected Aviththe annual report and also with a view of getting more light with regard to your intrusive course of action. Yours, very respectfully, S. CAMBPELL, President Board of Managers. Hon. J. H. Yan Antwerp, Chairman, etcP Q. Was there any reply received from that letter from the State Board of Charities in answer to your letter? A. No, sir ; but it brought up a discussion, and that brought a letter from Mr. Russell, the Attorney-General. Q. This letter which has just been read by Mr. Goodwin, was that submitted to the board ? A. No, sir; it was addressed to me and not to the board. Q. Was the ccirespondence afterward read by the board? A. Oh, yes, sir. Q. When was Mr. Yan Antwerp's letter shown to the board, be- fore or after your reply ? A. After I received it; probably the first time' that Ave met after that. Q. Was it shown to the board before or after your reply to it ? A. It would be after my reply undoubtedly, because he wanted an early answer. Q. So that both the letters went to the board at the same time — the letter from Mr. Yan Antwerp and your reply? % A. Quite likely, although that fact I do not remember. Q. It was not submitted to the board before action was taken on it ? A. No ; he wanted an early reply. Q. Do you remember what action your board took concerning- the correspondence Avith Mr. Yan AntAverp? A. No, sir; I don't think there was any action taken particu- larly. Q. Was it approved or disapproved by the board ? A. I think it Avas not disapproved, sir. Q. What action did the board take on that question ? A. They thought they had no right to. Q. What action did they take ? " A. They reasoned the matter over with the Attorney-General and with the Comptroller; he wanted light on the subject'before he would pay it. 571 Q. Did the board request an opinion from the Attorney-General? A. He gave them an opinion. Q. Have you a copy of that opinion with you ? A. I have a copy of the opinions sent to the Attorney-General, and of the letter sent to him. Q. Will you please produce those papers ? A. Yes, sir. [The witness then produced the, following, which were read by Mr. G^odAvin] New York Mills, January 31, 1882. Honorable Leslie W. Russell, Attorney-General: Dear Sir- -Your communication of the 25th inst. is received and will be submitted to the full board of managers at the earliest op- portune }r. The unsought duty of a manager has been imposed on me for many years. During my experience I can say with confidence that the managers and superintendent have duly and faithfully and com- prehensively made all reports as they believed required by law, and in all things have endeavored to conduct the affairs of the Asy- lum to its highest interests. I am not a lawyer, but am led to believe we are subordinate to the proper authorities, but not to the State Board of Charities. I am well aware that they desire to have it so ; since their failure to induce the Legislature to enlarge their powers, and failing to legislate themselves into the office of the State Commissioner iu Lunacy, they have assumed such authority. In my opinion, the interrogations they have made are without merit, diffuse, meddlesome and needless, and with an intermixed and di- vided authority7 Avould prove inimical to the best interests of the Asylum. I have requested the opinion of two legal gentlemen, now managers in the Asylum board, Avhich thej7 have kindly sent . me, and I have the pleasure of inclosing them to you. I hope in the revision of the law you will be able to so frame it and so clearly to define the duties and responsibilities of both interests that there Avill be no further difficulty. Yours very truly, SAMUEL CAMPBELL. To Hon. Samuel Campbell, President of the Board of Managers: My opinion is asked as to the construction of the laws out of which has grown the differences betAveen the officers of the State Asylum, and the State Board of Charities. The State Board of Charities claims the officers of the State Luna- tic Asylum have not made the reports required of them by law, and has notified the Comptroller of the State not to issue his warrants to them for the salaries they have earned. Section 4, LaAvs of 1867, chapter 951, in substance provides that 572 all persons now or hereafter connected with the institutions which the Commissioners of the State Board of Charitiesjare authorized to visit, are directed and required to give such information and afford such facilities for inspection as the said Commissioners may require, and any neglect or refusal on the part of such officer shall subject the offender to a penalty of tAvo hundred and fifty dollars. . Section 6, Laws of 1873, chapter 571, provides said board of chari- ties shall have authority to require from the managers and from the officers in charge of any institution it is authorized to visit, any in- formation which said board may require in the dischargee of its duties, and may prepare regulations according to which, and pro- vide blanks upon which said information shall be furnished by any such officers and managers in a clear, uniform and prompt manner, for use by such board. Section 1, Laws of 1873, chapter 571, provides it (the State Board of Charities) shall have power to make and use an official seal and alter the same at pleasure, and its proceedings and copies of all papers and documents in its possession or custody may be au- thenticated in the usual form, under its official seal, and the signa- ture of its president and secretary. Section 5, chapter 440, Laws of 1874, provides that the managers of the State Asylum shall from time to time determine the annual salaries and allowance of the treasurer and resident officers of the Asylum who have been, or may hereafter be, appointed, subject to the approval of the Governor, Secretary of State and the Comp- troller, provided that such salaries do not exceed in the aggregate fifteen thousand dollars for one year. Laws of 1881, chapter 185, provides after appropriating "for the officers of the State Asylum for Lunatics for salaries fifteen thousand dollars. * * The amounts herein appro- priated shall be paid by the treasurer from the respective funds, as specified, and the salaries named shall be established and fixed by this act for the several officers for whom they are designed, but the Comptroller shall not draw his Avarrant for the payment of the sev- eral amounts heretofore named, except for salaries and other ex- penditures and appropriations, the amounts of which are duly es- tablished and fixed by law, until the persons demanding them shall present to him a detailed statement thereof ; and shall have made all reports required of them by laAv ; and if such accounts shall be for services, they must show Avhen, where, and under what authority they Avere rendered." ***** The cUim of the Board of Charities is that it has required in- formation from the superintendent of the State Asylum which has not been given, and therefore the officers of the State Asylum have not made all the reports required by law. Firstr The State Board of Charities has required no information from either the managers or officers of the State Lunatic Asylum. The Board of Charities can only act by personal visitation of its members, or by a resolution of the board. It can only communi. 573 cate such resolution to a third person, unless such person is person- ally cognizant of the fact through some officer or agent, duly authorized, with the resolution duly attested under the seal of the board. Especially is this rule correct when it is sought to inflict a penalty on such third person for disobeying such resolution. The proceedings of the Board of Charities before the Comptroller seem analgoous to proceedings to punish for contempt for disobeying an order of the court. In order to found such proceedings either the original order, alleged to have been violated, must have been shoAvn the offender, or a certified copy under the seal of the court. No resolution of the Board of Charities, attested or unattested has ever been produced to the board of managers or any officers of the State Asylum. The communication,with blanks purporting to come from the State Board of Charities, is annexed, but whether it is a work of supererogation by some over zealous subordinate, or Avhether the gentleman signing his name assistant secretary is a sub- ordinate of the State Board of Charities, neither the officers nor managers have any personal knowledge. Second. The board of managers and officers of the State Asylum have made all reports required of them by law. The " informa- tion " which the Board of Charities might demand is not informa- tion required by law, but information required Avhen desired by the board; information which the laAv authorizes the board to require. Section 12, LaAvs of 1842, chapter 135, requires the managers to make an annual report in the month of January, each year ; that is the only report required by law, and that report has been made. The salaries of the officers of the State Asylum were expressly excepted in the appropriation of 1881, from the prohibition laid upon the Comptroller not to draw his warrant unless they had made the reports required by law. That act says: u The salaries named (among others the salaries of the officers of the State Asylum) shall be established and fixed by this act," and then provides, "The Comptroller shall not draw his warrant for the payment of the several amounts heretofore named except for salaries. * * * The amounts of wdiich are duly es- tablished and fixed by law until the persons demanding them * * shall have made all reports required of them by law;" that is, all salaries named in that act were expressly excepted from that prohibi- tion and also all other expenditures and appropriations the amounts of which were duly established and fixed by law ^ but before this act was passed, it may well be claimed that the salaries were fixed by law; the board of managers were authorized by the act of 1874 to fix the amount of salaries with the approval of the Governor, Sec- retary of State and Comptroller; this, under that provision of law, they did. If it is true, as claimed by the State Board of Charities, that when the law authorizes it to require information and it does re- quire information, it is information required by law, the necessary and logical conclusion folloAvs that when the law authorizes the board of managers to fix the salaries, and the board does fix the 574 salaries, the salaries are fixed by law ; under that view the salaries of the officers come under the exception.. Fourth. It is not claimed that information has been sought from any one but the superintendent, yet the salaries of all the officers of the Asylum, the State Board of Charities claim, should be stopped. Bv no possible construction of the statutes should the salaries of the matron, the steward and the assistant physicians, from whom no information has been sought, be suspended. Fifth. It is preposterous to suppose the Legislature intended to put it into the power of the State Board of Charities to suspend the salaries of all the officers of charitable institutions they are author- ized to visit, simply by making unreasonable demands for informa- tion. Sixth. Another most serious question Avould arise under the con- struction given by the State Board of Charities to the provisions of !aAV. Unless the charitable institutions give all the information re- quired by its construction, they would not have given the report required by law, and the Comptroller should not then issue his war- rant for the salaries. On the part of the institution it may be claimed no information has been required. All the information re- quired has been given and all the information in possession of the officer called upon has been given. Each of these propositions may be denied by the State Board of Charities. Is the Comptroller to be constituted a judicial officer to decide these questions? Has he poAver to take evidence and administer oaths in order to decide these issues ? The construction given by the State Board of Charities becomes absurd and the only practical conclusion to be reached is that reports required by law are reports fixed and designated in terms by the law and not information required by irresponsible boards or organizations. Seventh. I'he law fixes the penalty for its breach by a penalty of two lfiindred and fifty dollars. It was not the intention of the Leg- islature to fix another penalty. Upon each of the seven foregoing grounds I am of the opinion that the State Board of Charities has no right to interfere with the issuing of the warrants of the Comptroller to pay the salaries of the officers of the State Lunatic Asylum and that such warrants should be issned. J. R. SWAN, Jr. Utioa, January 30, 1882. (Copy.) Uttoa, January 30, 1882. To the Hon. Samuel Campbell, President of the Board of Mana- gers of the State Lunatic Asylum : Dear Sir—In answer to your request, that I express an opinion on the legal questions and other propositions suggested in the com- munication of the Attorney-General and State Commissioner in 575 Lunacy, to you, I have to say, that I have been unable to devote to the subject the careful attention which its importance demands, but I present herewith the result of such thought and labor as the brief time at my disposal permits. The State Board of Charities has filed Avith the Comptroller a resolution in the nature of a protest against paying any appropria- tions to the Utica Asylum until certain reports, alleged by that board to be required by laAv, shall be filed. Since the protest, and pending a reply from our board of managers, the Comptroller has withheld the salaries of the medical superintendent, assistant phy- sicians and other officers of the Asylum. I am of the opinion that the protest of the State Board of Charities was not authorized by law, and that the appropriation bill of last winter, under Avhich the protest was filed, does not apply, and Avas not intended to apply to the officers of the Asylum. 1 ani sustained in this view of the statute by the opinion of the late Attorney- General, when, in October last, a similar protest was made, and also by every member of the profession with whom I have conversed on the subject. My reasons are —■ , 1. Assuming that the act creating the State Board of Charities authorizes that body to compel the board of managers of the Asylum to furnish it with a report itemized infinitesimally—a proposition which may well be doubted—it certainly does not require the medical superintendent or assistant physicians, who are the employees of the board of managers and under its control, to make such a report. Their powers and duties are clearly and Avell defined, and their alleged requirement will not be found among them ; they have no power and no right to report ; and yet these are the persons whose pay it is proposed to stop. It avouIcI be analogous to insist that the clerks in the Comptroller's office should not receive their salaries because of some fancied dereliction on the part of the Superintendent of Insurance. 2. The section of the law upon which it is supposed the right to demand an itemized report is based (§ 951, Laws of 1867), expressly states what the penalty shall be for a failure to comply wit hits terms, and it certainly does not provide such punishment as is here sought to be visited on those who in any event are innocent of blame. 3. The act of 1881 (chapter 185) expressly and in terms exempts from its operation, " all salaries and other expenditures and appro- priations, the amounts of which are duly established and fixed by law." The amount of the salaries ot the Asylum officers is fixed by law in a gross sum in the act itself, and in detail, pursuant to the pro- visions of section 5, chapter '46, Laws of 1874. In other words, if each officer of the Asylum was required to make a separate report, and he had wholly neglected ta do so, there is no power given the Comptroller, under the act of 1881, to withhold his salary. Regarding the main "differences of opinion," I may say that i 576 the policy of our board to maintain its independence of the censor- ship and control of the State Board of Charities, was fixed, if I am correctly informed, long before I entered it, two years ago, and is founded upon the deep-seated and long-entertained conviction on the part of the more experienced members of the board, of the rec- titude of that position. There are, it seems, two antagonistic and irreconcilable theories of Asylum management. The advocates of one theory maintain that the affairs of each Asylum are safer under the control of a body of gentlemeu living in the immediate vicinity, knowing its wants and constantly looking after its interests, that under the control of one central organization, no matter how ably it may be conducted. The difficulty heretofore has been, that it w7as supposed possible to conduct the affairs of the Asylums under the supervision and con- trol of both these authorities at once. This, in my judgment, can- not be successfully accomplished ; the power and responsibility should be lodged somewhere and not divided between tAvo separate, independent and antagonistic organizations. I am glad the revision referred to by the Attorney-General is to take place, and I sincerely hope that the revisers will recognize the fact, that one or the other of the systems referred to must be adopted, and thus avoid the constantjirritation, clashing of authority, and periodical accusations which have proceeded to such an extent that men hesitate to enter the boards of management of the vari- ous asylums with the certainty of receiving little but censure and abuse for labors which are both arduous and painful, but Avhich are freely given to the State. If it is thought best to abolish the separate boards and place the asylums under one central authority, let that be done; if, on the contrary, it is preferable to continue the present system, which Avas established in 1842, and is iioav represented in nearly every State of the Union, and attempt no new and dangerous experiments, I think the various boards should be emancipated from the dictation, cen- sorship and control of the State Board of Charities, and rendered amenable only to the authority Avhich created them. Respectfully, A. C. COXE. (Copy.) Q. You have stated that the Attorney-General was communi- cated with ( A. Yes, sir ; he was written to ; he communicated with me. Q. To what effect ? A. That I cannot recollect, I cannot find that letter. Q. Do you recollect the general effect of his letter ? A., I think it was in relation to this difficulty. Q. And which side of the controversy did he take ? A. That I could not say ; I think probably he was consulted by 577 the Comptroller and induced to write a letter to me and that letter I cannot get my hands upon. Q. As a result of the controversy what was done in relation to the payment of salaries? A. They were paid. Q. Why did the board of managers decline in the first instance to furnish the information requested by the State Board of Chari- ties? A. The reason Avas that it was —we deemed it hardly practicable for us to do it, it would require months of labor for any one to Avork up; and we do not think we are called upon to do it, any way. Q. Did yon make any offer to them to furnish any portion of what they asked, or of.the information desired? A. They have the opportunity of coining here at any or all times, but that they do not do; they have the opportunity of coming here and ascertaining all that they seek to know by this printed blank ; they can find out the Avhole thing for themselves, they have an op- portunity of doing that, and why don't they do it? Q. Did you offer to furnish any of the information to them? A. No, sir ; not any of it, in particular, that I remember of. Q. Would you not object to furnishing such information ? A. Yres, sir; I should object very strongly. Q. Why? A. Because I do not think they have any right to ask for the in- formation. Q. Are there any other reasons ? A. That is a very good one, I think; and for this reason, it is an immense sight of trouble to give these items ; it is something which changes daily, it might be right to-day and wr^ong to-morrow, it is going on all the time and it changes continually; it is hardly a practicable thing. Q. Are you aware that similar institutions have furnished such information to the State Board of Charities ? A. I only know from what I have heard them say ; there is al- ready a full report of the same thing, only they want it itemized; you look at that paper and vou will see how impracticable it is (re- ferring to Exhibit No. 12)." Q. Did the managers of the Utica Asylum have any correspond- ence with any persons connected with the asylum at Buffalo, with reference .to this subject of the refusal to furnish the information required by the State Board of Charities? A. No, not that I know of; still, you understand this, that the managers of the Buffalo Asylum and of this Asylum are quite friendly, and of course there is a natural correspondence between the tAvo, that is, betAveen the superintendent here and at Buffalo ; the superintendent at Buffalo Avas once here with Dr. Gray, in this Asylum. Q. By that you mean that they frequently correspond? A. Yes, I think there is a frequent correspondence, and I under- stand further, that Dr. Gray is one of the managers of that asylum. 73 U 578 Q. Of what asylum — at Buffalo ? A. Yes, sir; that is, he was at the time when the correspondence was had about this matter, but he is not now; he was the principal man in getting up these plans, etc. Q. Has the request for this information been since renewed by the State Board of Charities ? A. No, sir ; not that I know of. By Mr. Haskell : Q. I would like to ask you, Senator Campbell, whether as a mat- ter of fact an inventory is ever taken in the institution to find out what property there is on hand belonging to the State, and its con- dition, etc. ? A. I cannot say whether there is or not; I do not know what you mean exactly;. I do not know whether there is or not; an in- ventory could be easily gotten up. By the Chairman (resuming): Q. I now ask yon whether you would object to the State Board of Charities being clothed with the power to require such statements from your board ? A. Yes, sir; I should not serve under such an arrangement; I think one master is enough ; I take a position like this— a position of this kind, and I spend my valuable time, which I would not do under any other circumstances, only because it is a charitable insti- tution ; it has been imposed upon me, I never have sought the posi- tion ; now, sir, if I cannot be trusted—if I cannot act without being under the State Board of Charities, I ought not to be a mem- ber of this board, and I won't be. Q. Do you object to the visitation of the Asylum by an independ^ ent board? A. No, sir; not by the Board of Charities even; they are wel- come to come there at any time, and why don't they ? Q. Do you object to recommendations being made by such board? A. I don't know but they are well enough, but if tliey impose on us this duty we do; if they can give us a recommendation of value we should be glad to adopt it. Q. Do you object to being supervised by any board having the power to require changes to be made by your board ? A. Yes, sir; we are either an independent board, or we are not. Q. How often does the State Commissioner in Lunacy visit the Asylum ? A. I have not seen him there more than once in a year. Q. Are his visits more than once or tAvice a year ? A. I think they are regular; I really could not answer; I only speak of what I know in that particular; I only recollect of seeing 579 him but once, though I may have seen him there oftener, but I do not remember. Q. Has he ever made any recommendation to your board of changes or improvements in the Asylum ? A. Not that I recollect of. Q. Has the State Board of Charities ever made any recommenda- tions for changes or improvements in the condition of affairs at the Asylum ? A. I am not certain; but I had a very familiar talk at one time with a member of the Board of Charities, with Mr. Anderson, when he Avas there, with him and Mr. Forster; I think there were'some things talked of at that time. Q. What recommendations were made by them ? A. I would not say that exactly, that they were recommenda- tions, it was some suggestions of some things that were very agree- able to us, and my impression is, that there Avere some things sug- gested by them that we adopted, if I recollect right; it is a good while since they were there. Q. Now, in regard to the duties of the superintendent; are you satisfied with the present scope of his duties ? A. Yes, sir; I am quite satisfied as they are — Q. Are yon of the opinion — A. (Interrupting.) And 1 will give you my reason; I would rather have Dr. Gray for an hour than most any man that I know of for half a year; that is wherein the merit of the man — he knows what he is about. Q. Do you believe that his time is profitably employed in the business management of the institution ? A. Yes, sir ; I do think so, certainly. Q. Do you not believe that it would be wise to relieve Dr. Gray from all such outside duties, except those of a professional character in the institution — relating to the treatment of the inmates? A. That is a question that is pretty broad ; let me ansAver it as I understand it; 1 should say the Asylum would suffer if it was con- fined to that. Q. In what respect would it suffer, in your opinion ? A. In this respect: the building itself—the ventilation—a great man}7 things that pertains to the management; most of the changes that have been made in that institution he has been mainly the author of ; when you visit the Asylum yon will see those sun rooms, which I think is a vast improvement; it originated with Dr. Gray so far as I know ; and a great many other things that he seems capable of; it seems to be natural to him to make those improve- ments ; I KneAV the Asylum when it was first built, when Dr. Brig ham wras there, and I have been through it with him ; I know the difference in it now from Avhat it Avas then; from time to time it has been very much improved, and all the improvements are due to Dr. Gray ; that is what I want to say. 580 Q. Do you think that Dr. Gray should be charged with the re- sponsibility of supervising the purchasing of supplies for the institu- tion ? A. Yes, sir ; I think he should be. Q. Do you not think that his time could be more profitably employed upon the medical branch of the institution entirely? A. The law makes it his.duty to do certain things; you want a change in the law ; is that it ? Q. This is the question; whether in your judgment you think a change in that respect would be desirable ? A. No, sir; I do not think a change would be desirable. Q. Then you are satisfied that Dr. Gray does not have too many different things to attend to — too many duties imposed upon him ? A. No, sir ; I do not think he has, with the assistance he has got under him. Q. Noav, about the purchase of supplies; is there any inspection or criticism of the bills prior to their being paid? A. I should say not; there is wherein there is probably a misno- mer in our method of doing things; we have what we call an audit- ing committee, but it is hardly an auditing committee; it has to examine the accounts and see that they are correct, so that the former proposition that you mentioned does not come in. Q. So that strictly speaking it is not an auditing committee at all? A. No, sir; you are right about that; I would like, in fliis con- nection, if it is permissible, to state my views about this matter of purchasing of the supplies, and about the present method of doing it. By the Chairman : Q. We shall be pleased to have you give them ? A. It is understood that it has been found fault with a good deal; now, I noticed in the Governor's message, for instance, and that draws my attention to it ; he speaks of the expenses of the Asylum, for instance, as against the expenses at other places ; and in that he takes the liberty of making this institution the target of all the others, being the patent affair, that is the practice; the Governor, at page 27, says: " A suspicion may well be entertained that in the localities where these institutions are situate, the privilege of furnishing the supplies and materials is granted from motives of friendliness or a desire to patronize home trade, resulting in bargains disadvantageous to the institutions and the State; in seeking to better the condition of affair?, we cannot fail to be reminded of the experience of the State in relation to prison management ; during the year ending the 30th day of September, 1876, there was paid from the treasury for the maintenance of these institutions, above their earnings, the sum of $704,379.85; by an amendment to the Constitution adopted in November of that year the superintendence, management and control of the State prisons were vested in a super- 581 intendent, who entered upon the discharge of his duties in Feb- ruary, 1877; on the 30th day of September following, or in less than nine months, under the new management the deficiency of ex- penditure was reduced to $369,688.08.; this deficiency steadily de- creased until the 30th of September, 1881, when a surplus of $564.35 Avas reported, which has annually increased until at the close of the last,year it reached $9,10P>.23 ; there seems to be no good reason why similarly favorable results cannot be obtained by the applica- tion of a like system to the control and management of the busi- ness affairs of our charitable institutions; it accords with the plan adopted where large private interests are involved; it has the ad^ vantage of concentrated responsibility; the Legislature and the Execu- tive should, under such a system, be satisfactorily informed of the actual needs of the different institutions and the necessary appro- priations should be cheerfully made; the time of the superintend- ents could be devoted to their legitimate and proper duties ; the detection and prevention of abuses and neglect could be reasonably exacted ; a very large saving should be effected in the wholesale purchase of supplies of uniform grade, for all the institutions, and the advantages consequent upon a correct application of business methods would be secured to the people of the State ;" that is what I have reference to ; at the first idea you Avould think that was cor- rect, but it is not correct in my judgment. Q. In what respect is that portion of the Governor's message in- correct ? A. We can buy our supplies as we want them at five per cent profit on the bills as originally purchased. Q. Five per cent on the wholesale prices ? A. Yes ; we do not consequently have a great deal on hand ; if we bought larger quantities and kept them on hand, they would lose more in \7alue than the five per cent; lose it in decay and injury ; very many of the supplies are of a nature that wont keep. Q. What supplies are included under that five per cent arrange- ment ? A. Groceries of different kinds. Q. What kind of groceries, can you state ? A. Oh, all sorts of groceries. Q. Do you mean that all the grocery supplies purchased by the institution are purchased upon that basis ? A. No, sir; not all of them ; I suppose for instance that eggs are bought of the farmers, and butter is bought of the farmers; meats are bought from the farmers — the stock — and is killed on the ground ; all that is brought into that five per cent basis is com- prised under that head — it is groceries, many things that are perishable in their nature ; there is more than five per cent saved by buying in small quantities, so that they can be used up before they are damaged by being kept on hand. Q. Do you understand that all groceries purchased from Butler & Hamilton, for example,are purchased upon that five per cent basis? 582 A. All, so far as I know ; there may be some exceptions that is not comprehended in the purchase under that arrangement, that are bought outside. Q. But so far as the purchases of Butler & Hamilton are con- cerned, is it all under that five per cent arrangement ? A. Most of them I believe are. Q. Is it your understanding that the supplies furnished by them to the institution are upon the basis of five per cent profit upon the wholesale rates ? A. Yes, sir ; that is as I understand. Q. And that that applies to all purchases made from them ? A. Yes, sir; that is the way I understand it. By Mr. Brown : Q. Don't you think, that in your judgment the Asylum authori- ties ought to buy goods as cheaply as a retail concern who retails, in an aggregate amount in the whole year, about half of the amount that is used at the Asylum ? A. I should think they ought to be able to buy them as cheap, and I think we do. Q. You think yon ought to purchase them as cheaply and you think you do ? A. Yes, sir ; I think so ; and I have given a reason why I think it is a great economy to purchase as we have been buying. Q. If it appears that they are not bought so cheaply, what action do you think the board should take toward effecting a change in the mode of purchasing ? A. I should try; it would be our duty of course to have a change in some way to accomplish the result; that is our duty undoubtedly; the steward would be the best man to know it, and as soon as the board of managers knew it they Avould change the arrangement very quickly ; what is done at present is so done because Avedeemit to be to the best advantage of the institution that it should be so done. Mr. Brown — Mr. Chairman, I suggest that you ask Mr. Camp- bell as to whether or not he possesses any knowledgeof the purchase of any high-priced blooded stock, and if so, what he thinks of the propriety of such a purchase. The Chairman — I will ask him that question ; there are a few more questions about this matter of supplies. Has any member of the board of managers made any criticism upon the method of buy- ing supplies? A. We have talked the matter over occasionally, perhaps you might call it criticism, as to whether the system could be bettered or not; we have talked about it at our meetings. Q. Has any suggestion been made toward any change? A. No, sir, not that I recollect of now. Q. Has Mr. Winston made any complaint of that matter? A. I have heard that he has to your committee, but that is all. 583 Q. Did he make any suggestion or complaint in the board ? A. Well, he may have suggested something like this, an expres- sion which 1 suppose possible, " yon might do better ; " if so, we simply want to bring him right down to it and we will do so ; we will see whether he can furnish any better or not, if he can, we shall know what to do; I know that others have tried and failed; he is a new member of the board, and it is but recently that I have heard any opinion expressed by any one since the board met. As to the facts of the case, I cannot venture to state them at all. Q. Are yon satisfied, then, that the supplies are purchased as cheaply and as economically as possible ? A. Yes, sir; I am satisfied, so far. Q. And at as Ioav prices as can be obtained ? A. As far as I know, they are ; I have no reason to doubt it now ; if any new offers or new openings take place, by which Ave can get them cheaper, we will attend to it; but I know of none noAv. Q. What do you know concerning the character of the cattle or stock upon the Asylum farm ? A. I do not know very much about it now. Q. How much stock do they keep on the property ? A. Well, quite a lot of cows and hogs; at one time they had a very fine lot of hogs, and I used to take a great deal of pleasure in hearing that man there explain all about them and their pedigrees, etc. ; that was a man on the farm ; he is dead now. As regards the cattle, they are common cattle, common farm cows, so far as I know. Q. A re you aware of the possession by the Asylum of any blooded stock ? A. I do not; not blooded, strictly speaking. Q. Do you knoAV whether or not they have any Holstein cattle there ? A. I don't know ; if they have, I should think it Avas a bad move. By Mr. Brown : Q. As president of the board of managers, what do you say as to the propriety of paying out $1,350 for two cows and a bull for the Utica Asylum — would you consider that in keeping with the good management of the institution? A. No, sir, I should not; I have never heard of such a thing ; I know of no such animals there. Q. Is there any such animals there, purchased at so high a price— would you regard that as too high a price to pay for cattle for the use of the institution ? A. Yes, sir, I should say it was. Q. That kind is not what you mean by "common stock " ? A. No, sir, I should think not ; what I mean by common stock is common dairy cows. Q. State whether you do or do not consider it advisable to have a 584 regular inspection of the Asylum weekly by one or more of the members of the board of managers ? A. That is the intention now — that is the rule, in fact. Q. Do I understand you to say that the present rule is that one or more of the members of the board shall visit and go over all the Asylum weekly ? A. I think they expect to visit the Asylum w7eekly ; it is expected of them; I have gone every Aveek, and oftener; it depends a little upon circumstances ; there are times that I think it is necessary to go. Q. The question is Avhether you would think it advisable to have a weekly inspection of all the wards by one or more members of the board ? A. No harm would be from it, I should think. Q. I do not understand you to say that it is now done? A. No, sir;' it is not, I think; I do not think we perform as many duties as we are expected to. The Chairman — I think that is all. Mr. Goodwin— Mr. Chairman, I suggest that you ask Mr. Camp- bell as to the extent of his business; the number of employees, etc. By the Chairman : Q. You may state what is your business, Senator? A. Our business is the manufacturing of cotton goods. Q. How many hands do you employ ? A. I don't know exactly; if I should call it a thousand I would not be far Avrong; I used to be able to go through and call the employees by name; but of late years I have not done that; it is a corporation now. GEORGE D. JOSSELYN, Sworn and examined, testified as follows : By Mr. Morgan : Q. Where do you reside and what is your age ? A. I live at Schuyler's Lake; my age is twenty-three years. Q. What was your business prior to 1882? A. I Avas a farmer; Avorked on a farm ; I was born and brought up on a farm. Q. In the year 1882 did you make an engagement as an attendant at the Utica Insane Asylum ? A. Yes, sir; it was in that year. Mr. Morgan (referring to the employee roll) — It was January 17, 1882, that you went there, and you left August 19, 1882. Q. Did you make an engagement there in January, 1882, as an attendant ? 585 A. I believe it was, in 1881 that I left my name there. Q. When did you first apply to the authorities of the Asylum .for a situation % A. It was about a year before I went there. Q. State what you done in the way of making application ; when you Avent there, what did you do ? A. When I went there I called on an attendant that I was acquainted with, and I talked with him a spell; his name was Brown- ell ; 1 talked to him a spell about it, and the first thing I knew Dr. Josselyn came in there and asked me if I would like a situation there; I told him that I would; and with that the steward came in and asked me if I Avanted my name put down ; and I told him I would like to have it put doAvn ; I just told him that! would like to, and that was all that was said about the matter at that time. Q. He put your name down as an applicant for a situation ? A. Yes, sir; that is what it was for. Q. And then you returned home ? A. Yes, sir ; that is all at that time. Q. Was there any further inquiries made of you except if you wanted a situation ? A. Not that I know of at that time. Q. What was the next thing you heard in reference to a situation at the Asylum ? A. I had a letter from the steward to come and work ; a letter saying that I could come and go to work if I wished. Q. What did you do in response to that letter ? A. I came out here and talked with Mr. Dryer about it and went back home. Q. What inquiries, if any, did Mr. Dryer make of you at that time ? A. He didn't make any, only he asked me in regard to the rules and one thing and another; then I returned home. Q. How long did you remain at home at that time ? A. I only just went home ; I returned the next morning on the train and went to Avork there. Q. Was there any further inquiry made of you ? A. No, sir; only the doctors asked what ward I should go on to; that is, they asked one another; I can't tell their names; I was then sent on to ward one. Q. Who was the supervisor of that ward at that time? A. Mr. Jones, I believe his name was. Q. How many attendants were there on that ward, including yourself ? A. One, I believe, besides myself; there was one supervisor and myself and another attendant. Q. Had yon before that time ever had any experience in any hospital or any similar institution? A. No, sir, that was the first experience. Q. You had always been a farmer before that ? 74 U 586 A. Yes, sir, I had worked on a farm mostly. Q. What were your duties on that ward — what did you have to do? A. I had charge of the dining-room when I went there. Q. How long did you remain on ward number one ? A. I was on that ward about two weeks. Q. Did you have any thing to do with the care of the patients during that time, except to work in the dining-room ? A. When I was not at work in the dining-room, I was on the ward with the patients. Q. What did you have to do then, on the Avard ? A. Answer trie whistle when the head attendant was not there; the speaking tube that conies up from the office, when visitors were going through. Q. Then you went from ward one, where to ? A. On to ward nine. Q. Who was the supervisor of ward nine when you went on there ? A, I think his name was Jones, too. Q. State what were your duties on ward number nine ? A. I had charge of the dining-room there, too. Q. And out of dining-room hours, what were your duties ? A. I " overseed " the patients; took care of them. Q. How many patients were there at that time on ward four ? A. I can't tell exactly, twenty-two, three or four; there were two attendants there, another one beside myself, and there was the su- pervisor as well. Q. What was the general character of the patients on ward nine? A. Yery good, I should say. Q. Whether or not they were quiet patients ? A. Yes, sir, they were quiet patients — very quiet. Q. Hoav long did you remain on ward number nine? A. I can't state exactly how long I was there ; it Avas about five or six months I should think; somewhere about that. Q. Were you then transferred to any other ward ? A. I left the Asylum then ; I was on ward nine when I left on the 19th August. Q. While you were there in the institution, state if at any time you saw any of the attendants punishing or correcting the patients in any way ? A. I see 'em make the patients mind ; asking them if they would sit down, and they would give some slang back, you know, aiid keep on making a noise, and the attendant would kick their feet from under them, and down they would go. > Q. That is to say, the attendants Avould kick the feet of the pa- tients from under them, and the patients Avould fall down? A. Yes, sir ; and the result Avould be that he would fall on to the floor, and he would act as though it had hurt him very much, some- times ; of course I can't tell how much it hurt him, you know. 587 Q. Can you give us the names of any attendant that you saw do that? A. No, sir, I can't now; I don't remember the names. Q. What other, if any, punishment did you see the attendants inflict upon the patients ? Q. This was not on ward nine that I see that. Q. Was it on ward one that occurred ? A. No, sir, it was on ward eight ; that was not my ward. Q. What other punishment did you see inflicted upon patients by attendants, if any ? A. I don't know of any others. Q. What punishment, if any, Avas inflicted by the doctors or by the officers upon patients ? A. By sending them on to rough wards. Q. When a patient had done something that was regarded as wrong, what was the custom in the way of the officers punishing the patients ? A. They would send him back on to a rough ward. Q. Y^ou mean by that, wards that are greatly[disturbed, do you ? A. Yes, sir. Q. From what ward to what ward do you know of a patient eve being sent as a punishment ? A. I know of them sending patients from ward ten to ward twelve. / Q. Is twelve a more disturbed ward than ten ? A. Yes, sir. Q. From your experience in the asylum, and acquaintance with the patients there, what was the effect upon the patient in sending them on to a more disturbed ward ? A. I could not tell; I did not see him after he was sent, only in one case. Q. In your opinion would it tend to make the patient more disturbed to send him on to those rougher wards ? A. I suppose so, but I can't tell. Q. How often did you see Dr. Gray on ward one while you were upon that ward ? A. I did not see him at all while 1 was on that Avard. Q. After yon went to ward nine how often did you see Dr. Gray on that ward ? A. I saw him once on that ward. Q. And you were on that ward how long ? A I was on there nearly six months. Q. Who had charge of ward nine when you were there? A. Dr. Russell, I believe. Q. How often did Dr. Russell visit ward nine ? A. I could not say how often he visited it; he would not come on to the ward all the while ; his assistant might come sometimes ; he had charge of the ward, and his assistant was Dr. Josselyn ; he came on the ward every day, Josselyn did. 588 Q. Whenever a patient complained of being sick what was the manner of procuring and giving medicine to the patient; if a pa- tient complained of being sick, what was done in that case? A. The doctor would take it down in his book, if the doctor was in the ward at the time, and then he would send up medicine. Q. Suppose the doctor was not in the ward, how would it be in that case ? A. Then the attendant would have to report to the supervisor, and the supervisor would go and report to the doctor, I suppose. Q. Then through what source w76uld the patient get the medicine ? A. The supervisor brings medicine three times a day. Q. Then instead of the doctor coining to see the patient, the supervisor would bring the medicine? A. Yes, the doctor would come up and see the patient if he was very bad. Q. On how many occasions did you see patients' feet kuocked from under them so that they Avould fall to the floor? A. I saw that done once. Q. State whether to your knoAvledge there was any report made of that case ? A. I did not make any, and I don't know if any was made. Q. Did the patient complain of being injured by the fall ? A. Not that I know of. Q. Then how did you judge that it hurt them badly ? A. By his catching hold of his arm by the other hand. By Mr. Rice : Q. Have you ever seen any abnses in the Asylum on the part of attendants toward patients, except such as you have named? A. No, sir; I don't remember any. Q. None at all? A. No, sir ; I don't remember of any. Q. What do you say as to the restraint used in the Asylum; have you ever seen any restraint used? A. Yes, sir; I have seen them in restraint. Q. How long a time have you seen a patient under restraint, successively ? A. I could not say how long at a time; I could not say whether it would be all day or not. Q. Have you ever seen a man strapped in his chair all day ? A. No, sir ; I don't remember that I have. Q. Are there men there in restraint nearly all the time ? A. I could not say as to that. Q. Were you ever on a bad ward ? A. No, sir; I never was on one of the bad wards, only in passing through them whenever I was sent; I was never an attendant on one of those wards ; I have been through them, but that is all. Q. Do you recollect any men on the wards where you were an 589 attendant who had to have their food brought to them, or did all the patients go to the table ? A. Yes, sir ; they all went to the table. Q. Were any restraints used in any of the wards where you were? A. No, sir; no restraints of any kind. Cross-examined by Mr. Goodwin : ' Q. What Avere you doing on ward eight when you saw what you have stated about this kicking ? A. I was carrying the clothes that came in from number six from the wash-house on to that ward by mistake and I carried them over on to number six. Q. Do you know Avho the attendant was who did it ? A. No, sir; I did not know his name at the time of it, but there were so many changes that I cannot remember now. Q. What were you doing on Avard ten when yon saw the patient transferred to ward tAvelve ? A. I was carrying clothes. Q. Hoav do you knoAV that they were transferred to twelve ? A Because I saw the patient there. Q. When you were on ward ten, state to the committee how this man was transferred ? A. I do not understand your question. Q. What conversation did yon hear between any persons on that ward with reference to the transferring of the patient from one ward to another? A. He got out of the Asylum ; what caused him to be put on ward twelve was that he run away or got out somehow, and they caught him and took him back and put him on No. 12. Q. Did you hear of his escape from the Asylum previous to going on ward ten ? A. Yes, sir ; I had heard of it. Q. Leave that out then, and go to the conversation that occurred in your hearing on ward ten previous to his transfer to ward twelve as a punishment ? A. I supposed by his being there, that they had sent him back in that way. I did not hear any thing in the ward about it; I did not see him taken to the ward, but I saw him there; I had seen him on one ward, and then I saw him on the other. Q. Then you did not see him taken from ward ten to ward tAvelve ? A. No, sir; I saw him on ten, and after he got caught then I 6aav him on twelve. Q. And that is the only reason you have for saying that the patient was punished by being removed from one Avard to another? A. Only that, and what I have heard the attendants say. Q. And that is all you know about it of your own knowledge i A. Yes, sir ; that is what I know about it. Q. In ward nine you have stated that the patients were quiet ? A. Yes, sir. 590 * Q. Do they walk out ? T-XA. Yres, sir; they did, in pleasant weather. Q. Did you ever go Avith them ? A. Yes, sir; I have been with them. Q. At such times how long did you remain out ? A. About an hour it would take to walk round with them in the winter time. Q. And how long would you be out in the summer ? A. We went out into the garden in the summer time. Q. And how long would you remain out then ? A. Until twelve o'clock, from a quarter to eleven. Q. When you went out in the garden were any patients left in the Avard ? A. Not unless there was an attendant with them. Q. But patients have been left therewith an attendant on the Avard when you have been out with patients ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do you know whether on such occasions, of your own knowl- edge, whether Dr. Gray at those times ever visited the wards ? A. No, sir ; I do not know. By Mr. Haskell : Q. You say you heard that the patients were sent back as a punishment ? A. Yres, sir. Q. From whom did you learn that fact ? A. From'different attendants; old attendants, that had been there. FRANCIS A. EASTMAN, Sworn and examined, testified as follows : By Mr. Morgan : Q. You reside in Utica ? A. Yes, sir. Q.. And have, for how long ? A. Since last June. Q. Are you the editor-in-chief of a daily paper in Utica, called the " Utica Daily Press " ? A. I am. Q. Have you any acquaintance with Dr. Gray? A. Yes, sir; slight. Q. Have you ever visited the Asylum ? A. No, sir. Q. Are you acquainted with the first assistant, second and third assistant physicians, or either of them ? A. I have been introduced to one or more of the physicians at the Asylum. 591 Q. Which ones have you been introduced to? A. I don't think I can give their names, I simply met them cas ually. Q. Are you acquainted with any patients that are in the Asylum? A. No, sir. Q. Are you acquainted with any attendants in the Asylum ? A. No sir. Q. Have you any acquaintance with any ex-attendant ? A. No, sir. Q. I hand the witness the " Daily Press " of Saturday morning, February 16, 1884. Will you tell the committee who wrote the com munication that I show in the " Press " of the 16th ? A. I cannot, I believe, at this moment give his name. The man himself handed me the communication. « Q. Have you got the original manuscript? A. No, sir. Q. What has become of that ? A. I don't know ; it has gone where all manuscript is liable to go. Q. Didn't you write that yourself? A. No, sir. Q. Didn't you tell me in your printing office in the presence of one of your men, that a man came into your office, and made a statement about it, and you wrote that yourself ? A. No, sir. Q. Do you know the man who did write that ? A. I never saw him before ; I have seen him once since ; I had another communication from him, which I declined to print; he is a large Irishman and lives in East Utica. Q. Will you furnish us with the name of the man who wrote that communication? A. Yes, sir; when you called at the office I told you I could get the name. Q. You say the same man has furnished another communication ? A. He brought another communication there ;* it was not printed. Q. Have you that ? A. No, sir. Q. You cannot furnish us with that, either? A. No, sir. Q. Did you show me the communication I called on yon for ? A. No, sir. Q. I Avent to your office and civilly asked you to furnish the com- mittee with the name of the author of that correspondence, did I not? A. Yes, sir. Q. I did it civilly, did I not ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And you did not furnish it? A. I gave you one name, Mr. Halpin. Q. He didn' t write this article ? A. No, sir. 592 Q. Did you give me the name of the writer of that communication ? A. No, sir, and I told you why; because I did not know him, bnt I told him our telegraph operator, Mr. McCauley, knew the person and would give him the name. Q. Was not Mr. McCauley right close by ? A. No, sir. Q. He was the young man right by at the time ? A. I don't remember; Mr. McCauley is only there nights. Q. This communication was published on Saturday, was it not? A. If that is the date of the paper; I don't know when it was published (looks at the paper).; this is the paper of Saturday morn- ing; it is very likely I did with this communication as I frequently do, I make alterations in them and copy them if they are not well written; Ldon't know whether I copied that or not. Q. I was in your office following the issue of that paper on Mon- day, wasn't I? A. I don't remember the day you were there. Q. Did you have the original communication? A. Not that I am aware of; communications are usually dis- tributed, either in the composing-room or outside. Q. Do you publish communications that have not the Avriter's name upon them, without having the writer's name furnished to you ? A. Sometimes we do. Q. You expressly say in that issue of the paper that you won't do it? A. Yes, sir. Q. You say thus, " We cannot promise to publish any of these communications that have not the signature of the writers attached ?" A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you publish these communications that have not the sig- nature of the writer attached ? A. Yes, sir; I did. Q. Did you publish it without knowing who the man was who furnished it ? A. I know in a general way who he was ; I saw the man and his name was given in my presence, but I know nothing of the man. Q. Can you give that name now ? A. No, sir. Q. Can yon give the street or number where he lives? A. No, sir; I was told he lives in East Utica. Q. Whowas present Avhen the name was given? A. I think another man came Avith him ; I Avas , told he was known in the office ; Mr. McCauley kneAV him, and a man named Perry knew him. Q. If the writer of this could be known, vou would regard it as very important evidence for the committee,"if this statement is true, and we could get the man ? A. I suppose so. 593 Q. Yet you don't know what has become of the original com- munication ? A. I do not. Q. And you can give the committee no further light on the sub- ject, except you think he was a large Irishman living in East Utica? A. I think I can probably furnish you with the man. Q. Can you furnish the copy you made of it yourself? A. No, sir ; I cannot do it. Q. How many letters have you received upon the subject of this investigation ? A. Several; I don't know exactly how many. Q. You showed me or gave me the name of Mr. Halpin as the author of one letter ? ' A. Yes, sir. Q. You took the Jetter out of your drawer ? A. Yes, sir ; out of the pigeon-hole. Q. You have never published his letter? A. No, sir. Q. Did you know Mr. Halpin ? A. No, sir. Q. Did he come to your office with it ? A. No, sir. Q. Why didn't you publish his letter. ? A. Because I thought enough had been said on the subject by correspondence ; it didn't seem to have any point in it. Q. Halpin's letter ? A. Yes, sir. Q. This letter you thought had a point in it ? A. Yes, sir; I thought it did. . '. > '"" Q. And still you didn't retain the letter? A. We never do; it is not the custom in the printing office to retain manuscript; they are destroyed the same day they are used. Q. What is the object of having the name of the writer; as a voucher for its good faith ? A. It is some little guarstitee for the man's sincerity. Q. It must be a very little if you so soon destroy the evidence? A. Sometimes a very little, sometimes a great deal. Q. Do you regard this as being of any great importance, this letter ? A. No, sir; it was simply the production of a writing of a matter that the air Avas full of in the community. Q. If we could have this big Irishman as a witness, and he would substantiate that letter under oath, you would regard it as a very important evidence, would you not? A. I don't know whether I Avould or not; I haven't looked at it as a lawyer would ; I don't know whether it has any pertinency in it or not. Q. Have you, in your possession, any letters from any person 75 U 594 who, from their knowledge, should be produced as a witness before this committee? A. I don't think I have; I know I have not. Q. Have yon any personal knowledge of the management of the Asylum or the treatment of the patient that you can give to this committee ? A. None whatever. Q. Can you give the committee the name of any person who can furnish or give evidence of misconduct or mismanagement in the Asylum ? A. I cannot. Q. You cannot give any ? A. No, sir. By the Chairman : . Q. Did you say Mr. McCauley, the telegraph operator, can give the name of this Irishman ? A. Yes, sir ; I think so. Q. Do you now believe that he now knows the name of this Irishman ? A. I have reason to believe so ; I was told he knew it. Q. Is he now connected with your paper ? A. Yes, sir. Q. In a subsequent issue of the " Utica Press " appeared, I believe, an editorial address to this committee, calling their attention to the letter of this "ex-attendant," and suggesting to the committee that such ex-attendant should be called, do you recall that ? A. I do not. , Q. State whether this ex-attendant was known to any other person in your office except Mr. McCauley ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Were they present at the time he called ? A. I^don't know whether they saw him; they were probably in the office. ^ Q. Were they aware of his being there? ; A. Yes, sir; I think they were aware of his bringing a communi- cation. ■ Q. Will you name any other person ? A. I think a Mr. Perry, in my office; he is a reporter. Q. Any other person ? A. I don't know of any other; I think they all knew him; he was a man well known in the town. Q. Will you endeavor to ascertain,' from some person connected with the office, the name of such ex-attendant ? A. I will. Q. And communicate the same to this committee ? A. I will, this afternoon. 595 By Mr. Morgan : Q. Have yon read over this communication since you have been in the room ? A. Not all of it; I have most of it. Q. Do you think that is the language used by an Irishman ? A. Yes, sir; as I have said it may have been corrected and revised. Q. Y~ou think it is the language used in the article furnished ? A. Yres, sir ; we have sometimes to correct the grammar in such things. Q. Who did that in this case ? A. I did, I think; yes, sir. Q. And it was set up from your manuscript? A. I think it was. Q. Then the truth is that you wrote out the article that was published ? A. I copied the article, making grammatical corrections. Q. You are sure you made no additions and left out nothing ? A. No, sir, nothing that was material. Q. I suppose yon have in your rooms a spindle on which the manuscript is put after it is set up in type, have you not ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Haven't you got your original manuscript that it was set from ? A. No, sir, every thing is cleaned out every morning after the type is set up. Q. Have you looked to see if it was there ? A. No, sir. Q. Will you please look in your office and see if it is there ? A. I will; there is no trouble in having the man as I told you when you called. Q. Can you give any reason why this was destroyed and the Halpin letter was not ? A. The Halpin letter had not been used, it is in my pigeon-hole yet. Q. The Halpin letter was sent on Friday, was it not ? A. Yes, sir. Q. So that you had the Halpin letter before you published this? A. Yes, sir. Q. And you retained the first that was not published and de- stroyed that which was published ? A. I had two letters in the paper, once before I said in an editorial in the paper that I would not publish papers unless the name of the writer accompanied it; the next day in came the same letter with the name attached. Q. The first letter you got from Halpin was there on Wednesday ? A. I don't remember the date. Q. And the letter with his name to it was on Friday ? A. I don't remember. 596 Q. The one you sent to me was on Friday, wasn't it; that is the one you took out of the pigeon-hole ? A. I don't know what the date was. Q. Explain to the committee why it was you destroyed the letter you published, and retained one that you did not publish? A. I thought perhaps I would publish it; I laid it aside for con- sideration. Q. I told you I had a letter from Halpin, did I not ? A. I don't remember whether you did or not. Q. And that we had his name and could produce him, and th t we hadn't the name of the man that wrote this letter ? A. I don't remember any such thing. OWEN J. MoCAULEY, Sworn and examined, testified as follows: By Mr. Morgan. Q. You are a telegraph operator in the Utica Press office ? A. Yes, sir. [Handing a copy of the Utica Press to witness.] By the Chairman : Q. Have you ever seen that article before signed "ex-Attendant," in that paper ? A. I have seen this article. Q. Have you any information as to who wrote it ? A. I could not say as to who wrote the article. Q. Do you know who brought that article to the office ? A. I cannot say as to who brought the article to the office. Q. Have you any information about the article whatever? A. I have heard a conversation. Q. Between whom ? A. Between Colonel Eastman and I believe two gentlemen. Q. Who were they? A. One gentleman I don't know, the other gentleman I have been introduced to but cannot remember his name. Q. Then you don't know the other gentleman ? A. I don't. Q. Was either of them ex-attendants of the institution to your knowledge ? A. Not to my knowledge. Q. Do you know any ex-attendant of the institution who has been in your office ? (Not answered.) 597 Q. Can you make any such statement ? A. No, sir; I cannot. By Mr. Morgan : Q. Did you see any man deliver the original manuscript of that communication, or what purports to be a Communication ? A. I didn't see the gentleman deliver it. Q. Did you see the man himself ? A. I did. Q. Describe him ? A. About thirty-five years of age, five feet ten inches in height, dark complexioned, weight about 190 pounds. By Mr. Rice : Q. What nationality ? A. Irish, I should think. Q. You think he was an Irishman ? A. To the best of my belief. Q. You had never had any acquaintance with the man ? A. Only that I met him. Q. Did he make any representation that he was an ex-attendant of the Asylum ? A. I don't know what representations he made to Colonel East- man. Q. Did you hear him make any representations, any such repre- sentation ? A. I cannot say distinctly about that. Q. Did yon know the subject of his interview with the editor ? A. It was in regard to the Insane Asylum ; I overheard it. Q. W hat was it he said ? A. I heard him say to Colonel Eastman that he believed that it was proper that the people should know the facts of the manage- ment of the Insane Asylum. Q. Did he pretend to state there that there Avas any abuse at the Asylum, did he pretend to state that, in that interview ? A. I cannot say. Q. You say that he said it was proper this investigation came on ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What reason did he give for that ? A. I cannot remember of any particular reason that he gave for it, owing to the position I was in, in being separated from the con- versation by a partition. Q. Did Col. Eastman ask you there if you knew this man? A. Yes, sir. Q. You said, "Yes, sir." A. Yes, sir. Q. You said he was a reliable man ? A. Yes, sir. 598 Q. Why didn't yon tell his name? A. Well, owing to the failing I have of remembering people's names. Q. He was a man you knew well enough to recommend as a reliable man ? A. I remember that by being told about it by the gentleman who introduced me to him ; I remember of that speaking to Col. East- man and telling him I had heard that by being introduced to him by a gentleman who told me he was a representative man of East Utica. Q. Who was the gentleman who told you he was a representative man of East Utica ? , A. Mr. A. Y. Lynch. Q. Where does he live ? A. His business is at 106 Genesee street. Q. When did he introduce you to this man ? A. About two months before this interview at the printing office. Q. Where were you at the time of the introduction ? A. In Mr. Lynch's store. Q. Did you have a conversation with this man at the time of the introduction ? A. No more than a general conversation of one or two minutes. Q. After the introduction, and prior to the interview at the office, had you seen the man ? A. Yes, sir. Q. So as to be acquainted with him ? A. Not any more than to become acquainted with his features. Q. Did you talk with him during the mean time? A. I did not. Q. Or spoken with him at all ? A. No, sir. Q. Were you able to give his name the morning he came into the printing office ? (Not answered.) Q. How was his name found out by Mr. Eastman ? A. I believe I told his name. Q. Then you did remember his name when he came m that morn- ing? A. I remembered his name to the best of my recollection on the introduction. Q. When he came to the " Press " office on that occasion, you re- membered his name as given to you at the time of his introduction by Mr. Lynch ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How long is it since that interview was held at the " Press" office? (Not answered.) Q. It is not long, is it ? A. It was since the trouble at the Asylum. Q. Within a few weeks ? 599 A. Yes, sir. '^ Q. Now, can't you recollect the man's name ? A. I think his name is Buckley. Q. What is his first name ? A. I could not swear as to ever hearing his first name. Q. Who else was in the " Press " office on this occasion ? A. My memory is not clear as to that. Q. Was there more than Mr. Eastman, Buckley and yourself ? A. Yes, sir ; three or four others. Q. Some one came in with Buckley, didn't they? A. Yes, sir ; some gentleman, a stranger; I was not introduced to him. Q. How did the conversation commence that morning; who was first addressed by Buckley after he came into the office ? A. I don't remember. Q. He was not known to Mr. Eastman, was he ? A. I cannot say. Q. Didn't you introduce him to Mr. Eastman ? A. 1 mentioned his name to Colonel Eastman. Q. Before they had any talk at all ? A. I don't think I did. Q. Describe a little, if you please, the location of this printing office and the editor's room ; was it in the editor's room that this interview was had ? A. Y es, sir. Q. Yreu were there when these two men entered? A. I passed from the proof-reading room through the telegraph editor's office to my office as the gentlemen entered the door, and they entered Mr. Eastman's office and engaged in conversation. Q. Where were you at the time they entered Mr. Eastman's of- fice ? A. I was then passing through the telegraph editor's office, on my way from the proof-reading room to the telegraph office. Q. Were you within hearing of what took place in the editor's room ? A. I was. ^ ^ j Q. Who spoke first ? A. I cannot remember. Q. What Avas the first thing said, any way ? A. That I cannot remember. Q. What was the first thing yon heard said, that you now remem- ber ? A. I cannot repeat the words as they were spoken by these gen- tlemen, but their purport was, that this was an article that should be printed, as it was proper for the people to know of the manage- ment. Q. Did this man have an article with him written out ? A. I should judge so. Q. Did you see it ? 600 A. I did not. Q. Hoav soon did you go to the editor's room ? A. About three minutes after these gentlemen entered. Q. Did you remain in there until Buckley left ? A. No, sir ; I remained in there possibly half a moment. Q. Did you speak to Buckley ?. A. I merely nodded my head and said, " Good evening." Q. Did you shake hands with him ? A. No, sir. Q. Did you return again before he left ? A. I do not think 1 did. Q. Tell me all you said during the half moment you were in the room ? (Not answered.) Q. Tell me what you said during the time you were in that room? A. Well, I cannot remember. Q. Do you remember any thing? A. I remember bidding good evening to this gentleman, Mr. Buckley. Q. Then your greeting and "good evening" was all within half a moment ? A. Yres, sir. Q. Cannot you remember any thing that you said ? (Not answered.) Q. What was said to you ? A. Well — Q* Come, witness, reply ? A. I remember Colonel Eastman saying to me, " Do you know this man?" I replied, " Yes, sir." I further stated that he was one of the representative men of East Utica. Q. Go on — A. And then followed a general conversation in regard to it, that I cannot remember the particulars of. Q. Cannot yon remember any thing after ? A. I cannot without having something to recall it. Q. What would recall it to you ? A. If I were to be asked by either gentleman, if I could remember such and such things, I possibly could remember. Q. Cannot you remember any thing that occurred during that interview ; give it in a general way ? (Not answered.) Q. That is a comparatively recent date and upon an important subject ? A. I understand that he — Q. Give us in a general way what happened while you were in the office ? (Not answered.) Q. What was the topic of conversation while you were in there ? A. About the recent abuses at the Insane Asylum. 601 Q. By whom was that topic spoken of ? ^ (Not answered.) Q. Now, who spoke about it to these persons present there ? A. Well it is a pretty hard matter for one to recollect, seeing I was engaged in my other duties. Q. You say the subject of abuses at the Asylum was the subject of conversation ; now which one spoke about it ? A. I cannot remember. Q. Did Buckley say any thing about it ? A. I would not care to state upon my oath, that he said any thing about it. Q. Did Mr. Eastman ? A. I would not care to state that either. Q. Did yon sa}7 any thing about it ? A. I didn't speak particularly of the abuses at the Insane Asylum. Q. What did you speak of? A. I spoke " good evening " to these gentlemen, and I stopped for possibly half a moment, and then left and went to my own office. Q. Where were you when you said to Colonel Eastman this Avas a reliable gentleman, and a representative man ? A- I was in his office. Q. What else did you say while you were in there? (Not answered.) Q. Witness, how did you know what the subject of that inter- view was ? A. From overhearing the conversation. Q. Where were you when you overheard the conversation ? A. In my office. Q. How far is that from the editor's office ? A. About ten feet. -_. Q. Are they adjoining rooms ? A. There is one room between. Q. Were the doors open ? A. Y es, sir. Q. Could you hear, distinctly, what was going on in there ? A. Not only when the voices were raised. Q. How are the rooms divided from each other ? A. By a board partition or rails, I should judge, seven feet high. Q. Not to the ceiling ? A. W ithin about four feet of the ceiling. Q. And the doors were open between the rooms? A. The door was open between my room and the telegraph editor's room, and it was closed between the telegraph editor's room and Mr. Eastman's room. Q. Was that door closed before you went in there or after? A. That I could not say. Q. What time of day was this interview? (Not answered.) 76 U 602 Q. Was it morning, noon or night, come? A. It was in the evening. Q. At what hour ? A. My recollection is not clear enough to give the hour. Q. Was it dark ? A. I think it was. Q. Was the gas lighted ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How long did Buckley stay in the office ? A. I should think twenty minutes. Q. You have no doubt now that his name is Buckley, have you ? A. Well, I could not state upon my oath that his name was Buckley. Q. I say you have no doubt of it, have you ? A. I have not. Q. What is his business? A. 1 believe he is a groceryman. Q. What is his street and number ? A. I don't know. Q. Do yon know his residence ? A. No, sir ; I don't. Q. When did you last see Colonel Eastman — have yon see him to-day ? A. Not fifteen minutes ago. Q. Where? A. On the steps of the hotel. Q. .Did you have con vers ition with him ? A. I bade him good afternoon. Q. Nothing else ? A. 1 cannot remember. Q. Not a conversation held fifteen minutes ago ? A. I cannot remember exactly the conversation ; I can give the Bubstance of it. Q. Give us that ? A. He wished to know if I kneAV that gentleman's name who was in the office — what that gentleman's name was ? I told him I thought it was Buckley. Q. What else? A. That was all. Q. Did he suggest to you that that was his name ? A. He did not. By Mr. Morgan : Q. State if you told Mr. Eastman down on the hotel steps that you thought his name was Buckley — why was you so long in re- membering his name here ? A. Well, I was trying to—to—to tell you—to the best of my ability, without a doubt, what his name was. 603 Q. I asked you his name ? A. Yes, sir ; but if yon recollect, I was on my oath. Q. Mr. Howe, the Chairman, asked you his name, and Mr. Rice, and it Avas a very long time before you could even guess that it was Mr. Buckley, was it not ? A. No, sir ; it was not a long time ; I gaATe it. Q. Yrou are sure that this Avas the communication that the man Buckley handed in, are yon not? (Not answered.) Q. Are you sure that the communication you looked at in the paper of the 16th is the communication handed in there, or that the man Buckley gave — are you sure of that ? A. In my mind I am sure, but I could not say so on oath. Q. Did you read the communication ? A. I sketched the communication in the office. Q. Where were you when you sketched it ? A. I was in Colonel Eastman's office. Q. Why didn't you tell Mr. Rice on his through examination that you sketched that communication in Colonel Eastman's office ? A. Did you ask me that question, Mr. Rice? Mr. Rice — No. sir; bnt I asked you how1 long you were in there ; you said half a minute ; now you can state how much sketch- ing you did in half a minute? A. After the communication was left upon the editor's table; after he had left the room, as I did on every day a hundred times an evening; I saw the manuscript lying there, and just tossed the leaves over to see how lengthy it was ; I gave it a mere casual glance. Q. Is that what yon call " sketching?" A. Yes, sir. Q. In printer's language, the tossing the leaves over to see how long it is ; is that called in a printer's office, " sketching ?" A. Some persons Avho are acquainted with printer's establish- ment might not call it " sketching," but I do. Q. How long have you been engaged in a printing office ? A. About a year. Q. Did you ever hear the term applied, " sketching " ; that it was simply looking at a communication ? A. I cannot say that I have. Q. Didn't you use the term " sketching," here, without the thought that you had said to Mr. Rice that you were not in there over half a minute ? A. No, sir; I did not. Q. What yon saw on the table, Avas not that in Colonel Eastman's handwriting ? A. (After a long pause.) The article that I sketched over on the table was not in Colonel Eastman's handwriting ; I am positive of that. Q. Why didn't you answer me right off ; readily ? 604 "' A. Permit me to state, that on the editor's table there is possibly twenty files of manuscript. Q. Usually ; was there then at that time ? A. There was a number. Q. Did you look them all over ? A. No, sir. Q. Hoav was it you looked this one over? Q. Because to the best of my recollection, it was an article that was in Mr. Buckley's hands, and I saw him engaged in conversation with Colonel Eastman, and my curiosity to see how much of a doc- ument it would make prompted me to sketch it. By Mr. Rice : Q. Did you tell me you saw Buckley have nothing of that kind ? A. I didn't. Q. You didn't ? A. I don't think I did. By Mr. Morgan : |p!$ Q. You say you did not tell Mr. Rice that you didn't see Buck- ley have any communication in his hands, but heard him talking about it; what day was it when the man you call Buckley was in the office ? A. I cannot remember the day of the week or the day of the month, but I remember it was a day very shortly after the alleged abuses at the Asylum were being made public. Q. Was this the first communication that purported to be from " ex-attendant," that yon published ? A. That I cannot say, because I don't know. Q. Don't you read the paper; let me ask you ; you didn't hear Colonel Eastman's testimony ? A. No, sir. Q. Look at that and see if that is the communication that Mr. Buckley brought (showing witness) or another communication ? A. This communication that you now show me is not the one that I read on Colonel Eastman's desk. Q. How do you know ? A. By the reading of both articles. Q. Then you read that article through ? A. I read the article through and the other one; I have read both of them through ; and this article you now give me last does not correspond in any way with the article I read, that laid on Colonel Eastman's desk. Q. Then you read it ? A. I sketched it through as you would barely turn it over, and in that manner read half a sentence perhaps, and figured up how much it would make on a page. 605 Q. Then you say you read the Buckley communication ? A. If you will accept my statement of that. Q. Do you say now that you read a part of the Buckley commu- nication ? A. I read a part of it, yes, sir; several parts of it. Q. A little while ago you said you sketched it, then you said that you turned the leaves over, simply, to see how much there was of it, and how much it would make, didn't you? A. I said that. Q. Now you say that you read a portion of it ? A. I do. Q. Did you correct any part of the Buckley communication ? A. I did not. Q. Did you see it again after you say you saw it alone on the editor's table ? A. Do yon mean did I see the manuscript ? Q. Yes, sir ; did you see the manuscript again after you saw it on Colonel Eastman's table ? A. I did not. Q. Did you know that Colonel Eastman copied that communica- tion? A. I don't. Q. Do you know whether he did or not ? A. I don't. Q. What is done with communications of that character — with the original manuscript? A. The original manuscript, it is, unless by some particular re- quest, it is generally destroyed as it passes from the proof-reader's hands for the last time. Q. Was the article that you saw, the Buckley article sent by Buckley, was that signed " ex-attendant " ? A. That I could not say. Q. You read a part of the article ? A. Yes, sir. Q. But don't recollect seeing who the writer was ? A. I don't. Q. In turning it over, as you state, you turned it through to the last page, did you not ? A. I cannot remember whether I turned to the last page or one or two off the last. Q. If you wanted to see how much there was after, or how much it Avould make, you would turn to see all the pages, wouldn't you ? A. Not necessarily so. Q. When you met Colonel Eastman on the steps, he asked you if you remembered the man who gave that communication ? A. Colonel Eastman asked me — Q. Give me'what he said to you when yon met him on the hotel steps a short time ago ? A. I cannot remember wether he said, " What is that man's 606 name;" or, " What did you say that man's name is that was in the office there;" I believe, and to the best of my recollection, I an- swered Mr. Buckley ; there was some gentleman here with him who subpoenaed him, Mr. Henderson. Q. What did Colonel Eastman say ? A. That was all he said. Q. There is a man by the name of Buckley, who is a private watcliman on Catharine street ? A. I believe he is a watchman of different streets, an entire block ? Q. His name is Buckley ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And he is a large Irishman, isn't he; was he the man that handed that in ? A. He wasn't. Q. Have you seen the other Buckley since the time he was in the printing office ? A. I have seen him on the street once or twice. Q. How did you know that man was a representative man of East Utica? A. From the introduction I was given to him by Mr. Lynch; in speaking of the gentleman after he went out, I mentioned the fact of the gentleman's prepossessing appearance ; Mr. Lynch said "yes, he is quite a gentleman, he is one of the representative men of East Utica;" that was all that passed. By Mr. Howe : Q. Did you ask where he lived ? A. I didn't. Q. Do you know now where he lives ? A. To say positively where he lives, I don't know ; but it was in that locality, East Utica. Q. Where would yon go to find him, if you wanted to ? A. I should go over in the district that is surrounding Bleeker street, and in that neighborhood. Q. Then how would you go to work to find him ? A. Make inquiries round there in that locality. Q. Of Avhom? A. Of the people who lived there and in business there. Q Is he a wholesale or a retail grocer? A. I cannot tell you. Q. Have you spoken to Mr. Lynch about him since ? A. I have not. Q. When did you first ascertain that he was an ex-attendant of the Asylum ? A. I believe my first and only knowledge of his being an ex-at- tendant was from overhearing the conversation that passed between ' him and Colonel Eastman. _ ,—*. Q. Have you any idea what time he was attendant there ? 607 A. If you will permit me to explain to you the position you will see why I should not overhear the conversation ; my business is a press operator; a report comes in and I take it from the instrument, which makes a loud and distinct sound; I have to pay almost my particular attention to the report; I am engaged in copying, unless it happens to be something in the general run of business,' where your mind is relaxed for a moment, of course then you hear the conversation going on around you ; but if yon are busily engaged in taking special matter from the instrument you may hear this conversation, but it will pass through your head so quickly that you cannot have any recollection of it, unless it be something unusual, like violent language or something that would disturb you. Q. Was there any thing said in the course of conversation that you did hear about the time that this Buckley was in the Asylum? A. I don't believe that there was. Q. Did you hear him say what his duties were ? A. No, sir. Q. Or what he was doing in the Asylum ? A. No, sir, I did not. Q. Did Mr. Eastman ask him any questions about that, that you heard ? A. I did not hear any such thing. Q. Did you hear him pass any criticism upon the Asylum ? A. I overheard him say that the article should be published — that it was a proper thing. Q. Did you hear him say any thing in criticism of the Asylum. A. .Nothing more than that conversation. Q. How long did that conversation last — that is, what was the whole time that Buckley was in the office ? A. It is almost impossible for me to answer that question, because the conversation lasted possibly tAventy minutes. Q. It lasted twenty minutes, and you have stated all that you heard of that conversation ? A. Yes, sir; I have to the best of my recollection. 608] ANTHONY Y. LYNCH, Sworn and examined, testified as follows : By the Chairman : Q. What is your business and residence ? A. Utica ; in the hat and men's furnishing business. Q. Do you knoAV this Mr. McCauley, who has just left the room? A. I do know a man of that name. Q. Do you recollect introducing him to any person in your place of business tAvo or three months ago ? A. I have introduced him to several persons in my store. Q. Can you recollect the name of any person to whom you intro- duced him withiu two or three months? A. I have introduced him to A. R. Mahar and to Mr. Edward Martin, but I would not say whether it was within two or three month's time. Q. Can yon now think of any others to whom you introduced him \ A. Yes, sir; there are several others whose names I cannot recall at present; I have introduced him to quite a number. Q. Do you recollect an occasion when yon introduced him to a gentleman who shortly after the introduction, went out, and that then you and McCauley had some conversation about the gentle- man Avho had just gone out ? A. No, sir, I don't remember any particular occasion like that. Q. Do you know a man by the name of Buckley, of East Utica? A. Yes, sir, I know him. Q. What is his business ? A. A grocer. Q. Where does he live ? A. On the corner of Bleecker and Sumpter street. Q. What is his first name? A. Daniel. Q. Have you any idea how long he has been engaged in that business — grocer ? A. He has been in that business two or three years. Q. What was his business before he was a grocer ? A. I have heard him speak about being at the Asylum as an at- tendant. Q. Has Mr. Buckley ever spoken to you about the Asylum ? A. Yes, he has ; I think it is since there has some trouble arose there recently. Q. Has he made any complaints to you ? A. I think he has remarked that things might be managed differ- ently there. Q. Do you recollect of introducing Mr. Buckley to Mr. McCau- 609 A. I think I remember that, yes, sir; there Avas another gentle- man Avitti Mr. Buckley at the time ; Mr. Buckley introduced me to him, and I introdued Mr. McCauley to him, the gentleman with Mr. . Buckley. Q. How long is that ago ? A. It is two or three weeks, I should think; it was in the back part of my store that the introduction occurred. Q. Do you recollect what passed at that time between you tAvo ? A. There was a general talk about the management of the Asy- lum. Q. And did Mr. Buckley then make the statements that you have referred to ? A. He said, in substance, that he thought the management might be different for the benefit of all concerned. Q. What did Mr. McCauley say upon that occasion ? A. I do not remember what he said in regard to it. Q. You are sure it was not more than three weeks ago ? A. It was between three and four weeks ago, I should say. Q. How long did the conversation in your place of business last ? A. I don't remember whether Mr. McCauley stayed as long as Mr. Buckley or not; but I think he did not. Q. Y^ou think that Mr. McCauley left before the other gentle- men ? A. Yes, sir; he stayed there about twenty minutes; that is, Buckley did. Q. After McCauley had gone did you continue the conversation Avith Mr. Buckley? A. Yes, sir; we conversed somewhat more. Q. Upon the same general subject ? A. It was not all on the same subject. Q. But you did resume your talk, after McCauley left, in regard to'the Asylum? A. Yes, sir, I think we did; but that I would not swear to posi- tively about Mr. McCauley not being there the Avhole time, but it seems to me that he did not stay there as long as Mr. Buckley did. Q. Wheu Mr. Buckley went out did his friend go with him ? * A. Yes. Q. State your best recollection as to whether McCauley had gone at that time, or whether he remained with you? A. I think he left before Mr. Buckley; that is my impression about it; and that Mr. Buckley and his friend stayed there longer and talked about different subjects. Q. Are you quite positive that McCauley left first ? A. It seems to me that McCauley left before Mr. Buckley did ; that is my impression about that matter. Q. In introducing McCauley to Buckley, did you state any cir- cumstances about Mr. Buckley to McCauley? A. No, sir, not that I now recollect. 77 U 610 Q. Did you say any thing as to what be was or where he came from ? ||A. No, sir, I think I did not. Q. As near as you can recollect it Avas a simple introduction ? A. That is all it was as I recollect. Q. Have you spoken to Mr. McCauley about Mr. Buckley since? A. No, sir; not to my knowledge. By Mr. Olin : Q. Did you tell this man — McCauley — any thing about this man Buckley's standing or position? A. No, sir. Q. You did not say to him that he was a representative man of East Utica? A. No, sir; I do not think I did. >,>. : By Mr. Rice : . Q. Was any thing said at the time of this introduction, or at the conversation that ensued, about a communication that had been pub- lished in the Utica Press, signed by an "ex-attendant"? A. Yes, sir; I think there was. Q. What was said about it; give us your best recollection ? A. I think there was something said regarding it, but I cannot state who it was that broached that part of the subject first, but Mr. Buckley said that that struck pretty near the point, or words to that effect. Q. Said that what did ? A. That article, or letter ; I don't remember reading the article myself. Q. Did yon understand from what was said on that occasion that there had been an article written ? A. Yes, it was about that article. Q. Was any thing said as to who had written it? A. No, sir; I don't think there was any thing said as to who it was. Q. Did you understand from what was said there that Mr. Buck- ley's experience and knowledge of the affairs of the Asylum had- been put in print? A. No, sir; I did not understand so. By Mr. Morgan : Q. Did you understand that an article signed "ex-attendant' had been put in print, and that they Avere talking about it ? A. Yes, sir; they talked about the article. By the Chairman : Q. And that article was in the Daily Press ? A. Yes, sir. 611 Q. Do you know how long it was after this article was published that this conversation occurred'i A. Three or four days I should say ; it Avas a recent publication. By Mr. Morgan : Q. And the introduction was after the publication, as you under- stood from the talk ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And these men did not know each other before'' you intro- duced them — that is, Buckley and McCauley ? A. No, sir; I think not; they were strangers, I think. FRANCIS A. EASTMAN, \, \f] Recalled: -^ ..^; By Mr. Haskell : Q. I call your attention to an article — an editorial — published in your paper February 22, 1884, in which you call-the attention of the committee to a communication in your paper addressed to Mr. Morgan ? A. Yes, sir ; it simply repeats questions published in a former article; I understand to-day that he says I did make those state- ments to him ; if I did, those questions are answered. Q. I also call your attention to an editorial in your issue of Feb- ruary 21 ? A. I say I felt justified from the remarks that were current in our office that Morgan had made the statement that he now makes; I asked him publicly whether he made that statement or not. Mr. Morgan — Who told you that I had made such a statement in a railroad car? A. I did not say so ; I asked you whether you did or not. Mr. Morgan—1 ask" yon did any one tell you that I did make such a statement in a railroad car? A. I decline to answer it. Mr. Morgan — Do you decline upon the ground that it would criminate or disgrace you ? A. No, sir; not at all; I base those questions upon remarks that were current among our reporters that you had there made the statement which you now repeat; I wanted to find out whether you had made such a statement or not; and I wanted to brand it as false, which I do now. By Mr. Haskell (resuming): Q. To what do you refer in the editorial in your issue of Feb- ruary 25 ? 612 A. 1 had reference to remarks that were current; that was a matter strictly between Mr. Morgan and myself, it does not concern the committee. Mr. Rice — It does not seem proper or profitable to go into any personal difficulty between the counsel of this committee and this witness. Cross-examined by Mr. Goodwin : Q. I understood you to answer Mr. Morgan that you had not been a resident of Utica very long ? A. I have not been very long. Q. And that you had no personal knowledge of the management of the Asylum ? A. None •whatever ; I have merely met Dr. Gray at the club. Q. Do you know any of the assistant physicians ? A. I had'been introduced to them last summer at the dining- room of the Butterfield House. Q. Have you written any editorials in your paper in regard to the management of the Asylum, during the past month ? A. I think I have. Q. Will you give to the committee the names of the persons from whom you obtained information about that matter? A. I do not think I obtained information from any source; I gathered it up from what Avas " in the air; " I had no conversation with any person upon the matter that would furnish matter for articles ; I got my first information from the examination of the men that killed Mr. Hughes. Q. Any other sources of information ? A. I cannot say that I have had any definite information from any other source, simply conversation ; I suppose I have con- versed with almost every man in town of any importance whom I knew — that is, every man I have met. Q. And your editorials are based upon the information that you received from the coroner's inquest and the conversations yon have had? A. Yes, sir; the stimulating effect of the conversations in regard to this whole matter have given birth to the editorials. Q. What do yon mean by the " stimulating effect " ? A. The excitement going on in the community : I wrote upon a subject about which people w7ere talking, and as I thought, in the way they were talking. Q. Were you giving the voice of the people in your editorials^ A. I supposed I was, a large majority of the community. . Q. Be kind enough to state, if you can, who in the community, you have talked with about the matter ? A. With Mr. Armstrong, of the internal revenue office; Mr. Eaton, Mr. Doolittle, the late mayor—and I found him rather neu- tral ; and 1 have talked with Mr. Capron who lives at Whitestown; 613 and with Mr. Dennison, Mr. Lewis, Mr. John Buckley, a merchant; and various.other persons. Q. Were those editorials based upon information received from them ? A. No, sir; I cannot say that they were. ^ Q. Was your judgment or opinion influenced by your conversa- tions with them ? A. Certainly, but not fixed; the people seemed to sympathize with my view of it. Q. Do you know who wrote the article that appeared in your paper of February 15, signed " ex-attendant" ? A. I think I know who handed it into the office. Q. Will you give the name of that person to the committee? A. It was Dr. Tourtelot, I think. Q. Are you familiar with the doctor's handwriting? A. If that was bis handwriting it Avas the first time I eA7er saw it, I never saw it before. A. Have you ever conversed with Dr. Tourtelot upon this sub- ject ? A. Yes, sir; but the only conversation.that I ever had Avith him of importance was with reference to a pamphlet containing the pro- ceedings of a former investigation. Q. Can you give to this committee the name of any person who has written to your paper any article in reference to the Asylum management which you did not publish ? A. No, sir, I cannot give the name of any except this Mr. Hal- pin ; I have torn up a great many communications that were sent in ; a great many of them are not signed. Q. All the communications you received from persons on this subject were anonymous, except Mr. Halpin's ? A. Yes, sir, and this man who brought his in that night, of which 1 haA7e spoken, he appeared in person and brought it. Q. Was this communication in your issue of the 15th February, 1884, signed by the writer's name ? A. I say I knoAV who handed it to me ; I do not know who wrote it. By the Chairman : Q. Did Dr. Tourtelot represent that that was his oAvn communi cation ? A. No, sir, he did not. Q. Did he state hoAV he obtained it ? A. No, sir. Q. What impression did you have at the time as to the author- ship of the communication ? A. I don't knoAV that I had any impression ; it Avas brought in there late at night ; I took it-and gave it to the printers. a Q. He gave yon no indication that he had written it? A. No, sir ; none whatever. 614 Q. Was any inquiry made of him as to its credibility, or whether he would vouch for it? A. I assumed so because he brought it himself; I took that as a sufficient evidence of its reliability. CLARA AMELIA FULFORD, Sworn and examined, testified as follows : By Mr. Morgan : Q. Where do you reside ? A. Florence, Oneida county. Q. What is your age ? A. Fifty-seven. Q. What is your husband's name ? A. Daniel Fulford ; he is pastor of the Methodist church there at Florence ; this is the close of our second year there ; at the close of this conference year it will be two years come the 9th of April. Q. Were you formerly an inmate of the State Lunatic Asylum? A. 1 have been an inmate at three different times. Q. Wlien did vou go there first ? A. In March, 1848. Q. Were you then married ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Where did you reside tfien ? A. I think Chittenango, Madison county; that was before my husband joined the conference; he was a teacher in the public school there; he and I both taught. Q. How long had you been married when you Avent there ? A. Nearly four years. Q. What time in the year did yon go to the Asylum ? A. The 10th of March, 1848; the Asylum was then under the control of Dr. Brigham. Q. Do you know by virtue of what process yon were taken there? A. Yes,sir ; it is very distinct in my mind; I was confined with my first child. Q. Whether it was upon the certificate of physicians and of the county judge and of the superintendent of the poor? A.^ Yes, sir; it was upon the certificate of the county judge at ' Morrisville. Q. Was the child taken with yon ? A. No, sir ; it was five weeks old when I went there. Q. Do you now recollect what the difficulty was with you? A. I Avas very sick at the time and there ' was two or three days and nights that I did not sleep. Then the doctor commenced giv- 615 ing me morphine, our family doctor, and that seemed to make me wild. Then he gave me opium and asafcetida and every thing was used almost for anodynes, and it had an opposite effect upon me. There was about tAvo weeks that I did not sleep at all and we had a great deal of company there, as we lived in the village, and I ought to have been kept quiet. Q. Upon Avhat Avard were you placed ? A. The second ward ; each time I went there I Avas placed on> the second Avard. The first time I was there I was there one Aveek and wras then taken to the fourth Avard and I Avas there one Aveek, and the remainder of the time, three months, I Avas on the first ward. Q. That Avas the first time you were there in the Asylum ? A. Yes, sir ; Dr. Brigham's niece was the supervisor. Q. Taking the first time you were at the Asylum can you now give to the committee any ill-treatment that you received? A. No, sir ; nothing occurred the first time. Q. Or any misconduct on the part of the attendants ? A. No, sir; I never saAv any ; the first time I had a very high opinion of the Asylum ; I told my7 husband on my return home that if I Avas ever left to depend on my own resources I thought I would go there as an attendant. Q. Hoav long did you remain in the Asylum ? A. Three months and a half. Q. And were theit discharged as recovered ? A. Yes, sir; I do not think Dr. Brigham considered me a luna tic. Q. Yren Avere discharged as recovered ? A. Yes, sir ; he said I had been a martyr to quackery, and when I left there he came out on the steps, and as I got out into the hack the last Avords he said to me Avere: " Mrs. Fulford, be sure and get your natural sleep, and you will never come to this Asylum again." Q.'And then you returned home ; Avere you keeping house ? A. Yes, sir; when I was taken to the Asylum Ave were' keeping house ; Avhen I returned home I found my husband had put out the child and had gone to his home at Chittenango with his people. Q. Hoav long did you remain at that time before you returned to the Asylum ? A. I went there again in 1872. Q. Hoav long did you remain that time ? A. Eight months and a half. Q. Who was the superintendent when you went the second time? A. Dr. Gray. Q. Upon Avhat w7ard were you placed the second time ? A. On the second ward ; I was, I think, about two weeks there, and Avas then sent up to three, and I was there— I don't remember just how many weeks — but it was in February when I went to the Asylum— I think it was about the 15th of February — and I think it Avas in March when I was sent from the second ward to the twelfth, 616 and remained there until I was discharged from the Asylum, and it Avas through the false report of the dining-room girl that I was sent there. Q. Why was yon sent there ? A. There was a poor Avoman from Otsego, and she seemed to think a great deal of me from the first she saAV me ; she Avas on the third ward, and had been in the Asylum a number of years, and had been on the back wards, and had been treated very unkindly; she said as soon as she saw me she thought I was going to help her, and she never had been to chapel, and Avanted to go; I fixed over her clothing ; it never had been fixed for her since she came there, and she went to chapel; she Avorked very hard in the dining-room, and one day I was helping ; it was after breakfast, and the dining room girl—a Mrs. Burton — began finding fault with me; I said the lady helps you so much I think you ought not to speak so harshly to her; she went and told the supervisor I was minding what did not belong to me, and the supervisor, Miss Sayles, of the third department, she went doAvn to the office and reported me ; after I got through I went up and was helping the woman who had charge of the sewing- room on three ; we were talking very quietly there when Miss Sayles came in, and she says I want you to come down to your room ; you are going on to twelve; I asked her what for, and she said she was not going to ansAver any questions ; and so I went on to twelve. Q. As you view it you were sent on 10 twelve as a punishment • for your friendship to the Otsego lady ? A. Y es, sir. Q. And did you learn there what they regarded as offenses that the punishment was to be sending on to a more disturbed ward ? A. Yes, sir ; if the patients did not work as much as some of the attendants thought they ought to, they were very often threatened with the back wards; they would report to the doctors, and the doctors never inquired of the patients in regard to this. , Q. When you were taken on to the ward for punishment it was on the twelfth ward ? A. Y es, sir. Q. Was that ward a more disturbed ward than the one you left? A. Yes, sir; but it is not considered as bad as seven or eight. Q. And it was more disturbed than the one you left ? A. Yes, sir; some of the patients on that ward did not even know their OAvn names. Q. What effect did it have upon you transferring you to that ward ? A. I felt very much hurt to be transferred without knowing the reason why. Q. Did it in any way affect your health or your condition ? A. I don't know, only it kept me awake nights; the ward under- neath eleven and twelve — there were some patients very noisy underneath, it kept me awake nights. Q. How Ions- did they keep you on ward twelve ? 617 A. Twelve weeks and a half, and then I went home from that ward. Q. Did you at any time while on that ward request to be removed to some more quiet Avard ? • A. Yes, sir ; I spoke to Dr. Gray when he passed through one Sunday; he said he thought I ought to be willing to stay where I could be useful ; he said he thought I ought to be useful to those poor creatures who were there. Q. How many times did you request the officers in charge to re- move you back to your former ward or take you away from number twelve? A. I requested them to let me go home a number of times. Q. Did you more than once request them to remove you ? A. Yes, sir ; I talked to Dr. Kitchen about it; he was the attend- ing physician ; he had charge of the ladies' department when I was there. Q. What reply did he make? A. Sometimes he Avould laugh, and he promised my brother — this brother who has been with me this afternoon here — he had been there about a month after I Avas there, and he promised him frequently that he would change me. Q. But they continued you there until you were discharged ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And you were there eight months and a half? A. Yes, sir. Q. And then did you return home ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you return to Chittenango ? A. No, sir; my husband was not there then. Q. Where were you living? A. In De Kalb, St. Lawrence county ; Avhen I went there tne second time he was a member of the Northern New York Confer- ence, and has been a member for tAventy-eight years — I mean my husband—and he had exchanged from De Kalb to Champion during the time I was at the Asylum. Q. Did you go directly to his house ? A. I went to visit with a brother of mine ; my husband came to the Asylum and made arrangement for my release, then my sister came and met me and I Avent to stay with her at Fayetteville, and then to my brother's at Syracuse, and from there to Champion Avhere my husband was at the time. Q. What w»s the cause of your second trouble? A. We were burned out in 1872 and lost every thing we had ; I worked very hard at the time of the fire, and then afterward I had one daughter, then her health was poor, and in the fall — it was July that our fire occurred —our horse had the epizootic and I took care of that horse ; our son was away at school, my husband 'was Iaway and I took care of the horse and I took the disease and was suffering from it when I came to the Asylum; I could not sleep s, nights, and had no appetite. \ 78 U 618 Q. When were you taken to the Asylum the third time? A. It was in 1882, the 16th of June; our daughter died then; we were living in Florence then ; our daughter died the second day of» June, and on the sixteenth day I came here ; I had the care of her ; she was sick a long time; I had the care of her day and night, and I got so I could not sleep, I had been broken of my rest so much. Q. Who went with you to the Asylum on that occasion ? A. My son. Q. How old is your son ? A. He Avas thirty last July; he is a physician; he resides in Henderson, Jefferson county. Q. Did they have an examination made of you by physicians? A. I suppose they did; the night before I came I was at my son's; my daughter had been with him while we were removing, and her piano and other things were there; I Avent up alter her death to see about her things, and the night before I came away I was making preparations to go home the next morning, and two doctors from Mexico — my son was then in New Haven, Oswego county — and these two doctors came to my son's house; I was acquainted with one of them, the other was the superintendent at that time; I don't Avhether he is now or not, but at that time was superintendent of the county house ; they asked me a number of questions but I did not knoAV whether they had any motive in it; I suppose I went there on their certificates. Q. What time was that? A. The 16th of June, 1882. Q. How long did you remain at that time? A. Until December; I think it was the 21st, of that same year. Q. On what ward were you taken then ? A. On the second ward ; I was examined by the doctor; the new Commissioner in Lunacy, Dr. Smith, had been appointed and they were having a meeting in the Asylum, and Dr. Brush came in and excused himself, and he introduced me to a doctor that had charge of the gentlemen's department; I do not remember, but I think I was examined by Dr. Josselyn. Q. You were placed on ward two then ? A. Yes, sir. Q. That is a quiet ward ? A. Yes, sir, though some of the patients there Avere quite excit- able, but they are considered quiet as a general thing. Q. How long did you remain on ward tAvo? A. I was there six days; I went there on Friday, and the next Thursday I was changed from there to ward twelve! Q. Give us the reason of that change? A. The day before I was changed, Dr. Gibson, the chaplain,came on to the ward and told Mrs. Bennett, a member of his church, that he was coming the next day to have communion service, and he spoke to her about speaking to some patients about it, and there was a young 619 lady there from Chittenango, and Ave were quite intimate when I learned where she was from, because she was acquainted Avith so many people that I knew, and particularly Avith Elder Erwin, our presiding elder for four years ; I presume the supervisor, not knowing the rea- son of our intimacy, thought we were too much intimate; this young lady had been confirmed and expected to be received into the church in a few days by Dr. Gibson ; I told her to go and ask Miss Sterling, the supervisor, if I could go to the communion service; we have communed in some places with the Episcopals and they with us; she\A7ent and asked her if I could go and Miss Sterling refused ; I stood by and I saw this young lady Avas very much excited ; she called Miss Sterling a devil, and I left her and went doAvn to the verandah, and as I was passing a room where there was a patient Avho Avas sick, this patient called me into her room, and, as I was going in, I noticed Miss Sterling and this lady that I spoke of coming doAvn the hall, she and this lady from Chittenango, and they took her into her room. I saw they were very much excited; I went into the ,bath-room and closed the door and the first I heard was a cry of " murder," but I don't know whether it was the patient or the supervisor that made the cry; I opened the door and I saAva number of at tendants and patients rushing into the room, but it excited me so much that I Avent back to where this lady was sick, and in the after- noon Dr. Brush came on to the hall; I supposed the supervisor had locked this lady in her room and I did not see her again until we were about half through tea and then I saw her coming into the dining-room ; I did not speak to her after that; I thought I would keep entirely out of any difficulty ; in the afternoon Dr. Brush came on to the.hall with Dr. Blutner; he had been absent and had got home the night before ; he came up to me and said, " Y on are making a great deal of disturbance on this ward ;" Dr. Brush did ; he said, " That was your character when you Avere here before;" I said, ''It is a wrong impression you have, if you have that im- pression of me, and I think I can bring testimony to convince yon that you are mistaken and that there has been wrong reports made ;" he said, '• I shall put you on Avard twelve if you are not careful ;" I said, " You can do so if you wish, but you ought to let me know what charges are brought against me," but he did not say any more and I Avent on to the verandah and commenced sewing, and an hour or two after that the second one in authority on the hall came to me, Fraukie Davies her name Avas, and she said, "Mrs. Fulford, if you have any things in your room go and get them for you are going on to another ward ;" I asked what ward; she would not tell me ; I went and got my things I went on to ward twelve; I knew where I Avas, for the first things; I saw was one of the same attendants that Avas there before; Miss Frankie Davies went with me on to twelve, and Ann Burns had charge of the hall; she was the second attendant when I was there before; I saw her treat pa- tients so cruelly that I had a dread of her; I was very weak at that time; I had become reduced; Ann Burns had charge of the hall at this time. 620 Q. How long did you remain there ? A. That was in June, I think ; I Avent there the 16th ; this was six days after I went there, on Friday, and I was there until some time in August; I was on that ward until some time in August; then I was sent to ten. Q. What is ten compared with twelve; what is tho character of it? A. The patients there are very much demented. Q. Idiotic? A. Well, not really idiotic, but most of them have been there a long time. Q. Why Avere you sent to ward ten; do you know ? A. I don't know ; this Ann Burns went with me; I supposed I was going—she came to my room and said, "if you have any thing, you had better get your things ready, you are going to another ward ;" I asked her " what," and she said, " you are going on to a better ward ;" I supposed I was until we got to the door of number ten, and then I says, " why, what does this mean?" she says, "they are going to put you here so that you won't see com- pany ;" sometimes visitors had stopped and talked with me and conversed, and some asked me questions; they thought I was an attendant, for I was generally at work when I came there, and I did most of the seAving on ward tAvelve, and I would answer their questions. Q. Hoav long did you remain on ward ten? A. A little over tAvo Aveeks, and then Dr. Blumer came on to the hall Monday morning and says, " Mrs. Fulford, I am going to send you on to three ;" I told him I did not wish to go on to three; I told him I had been in Miss Sayles' ward and that she had given a false report of me at the doctor's office, and it was the means of my being kept twelve and a half Aveeks on Avard twelve, and I did not Avish to go on to her ward; and he Avent and told the lady in charge of the hall to take me on to six. Q. What Avas six in comparison with ten ? A. It was very much improved ; it avus a pleasant ward aud some of the patients were very nice; I think I Avas on Avard six nine weeks, and six weeks of that time I was not permitted to go out of doors. Q. Who was the attendant and supervisor on that ward ? A. Mrs. Pride; she was a widow. Q. Why wouldn't they let you out ? A. It is rather a delicate matter to speak of, but this Ann Burns that I spoke to you of, who had charge of tAvelve, there was a patient that saw a transaction that was not very proper between her aud the — well — I think his name was Jones; he had charge of fixing the windows; he came in and loAvered the window so that they would have more air in the hall that leads from the dining-room — you know that hall — it is divided into two departments; this lady patient who saw the transaction did not like to go out with the 621 patients when it was hot; she av as thrown from a carriage in Syra- cuse and her head was hurt; she said it made her headache to go out in the hot sun, and she hid under the bed because she did not Avant to go out, and she saw this man Jones come in ; the rest of the patients, except myself, used to go out; I didn't go out much into the yard myself; this young lady Avas hiding under the bed and she had told of all that occurred that she saAV ; she told of it right before several attendants and patients out there in the yard, and they dragged her away and she Avas very much excited over it; there Avas a lady from Schoharie county, a member of the same church that I am, and she was quite interested in me ; Ave met out in the yard fre- quently and she had heard of this occurrence, and she knew Iioav I had been treated ; she sawr me when I Avas dragged out in the yard, one time by this Ann Burns, and she came up to me, it Avas out in the front yard and wanted to knoAV about it; if I had heard of what this lady had seen and I told herAvhat this patient had told me; well, there was an attendant from the third hall, and this attendant Avas standing right be- hind me and she heard Avhat I had said about the occurrence and about Miss Burns, and Avent and reported to Miss Sayles, and Miss Sayles reported it to the office that I had been talking about Ann Burns, and I suppose she related the conversation as I had related it; the next day Ave were all going out into the yard, Mrs. Pride came and said, "ladies, prepare to go out into the yard," and I had my hat on ready to go out into the yard ; she turned to me and said, "Mrs. Fulford, the doctor says you can't go out into the yard, that you are not to go ;" I said, " Avhy ?" She said, " you have been talking about Miss Burns," so I put away my things ; I supposed it was just for the time being that I could not go, and the next week, when they Avere going out, I made preparations to go and she gave me the same Avord, so then I never said any thing more about going out; I did not make any demand to go out, but I thought I would wait until they gave me orders to go before I wrent again, so that for six Aveeks I did not go out into the yard. Q. What month in the year was that? A. It Avas about the last of August that I went on to ward six, and this Avas, I think — I w7ent on a Tuesday, this was on Friday that this conversation with the patient occurred; I think it was the next Saturday after I Avent on to theAvard Avhen Ave Avere going out. Q. So that you were confined there all through September ? A. Yres, sir; and it Avas late in October before I Avent out; one of the attendants said to me " Mrs. Fulford, wouldn't yon like to go out and get some fresh air and gather some leaves ?" and I told her I would ; it Avas so long since I had been out that I would like to, so Ave went out and gathered some leaves for pressing. Q. What time did you leave the Asylum ? A. The 21st of December. Q. And your husband was then at Florence? A. Yes, sir. Q. And you went home with him ? 622 A. Yes, sir. Q. Hoav long did you remain on ward six? A. I think I Avas there about nine weeks; but I have not got the dates. Q. What ward Avere you then taken to? A. Four. Q. What is four compared with six ? A. I liked four very much ; I think there was most pains taken there to make it pleasant. Q. A'VTas'it a quiet ward ? A. Yes, sir ; it is just about the same as number one; some of the patients prefer it to number one ; things were quiet and orderly at the table and our food was very much improved over Avhat it had been, and the attendants took pains to entertain, they had readings, etc., and then I had access to the library, but I was not permitted to have access to the library until I went to four; I spoke to Dr. Blumer about it; there Avere several books that I had seen when I had been there before, that I would like to read; he did not refuse me but he would laugh at me and Avould not say any thing; then Mr. Fulford had ordered sent to me The Northern Advocate, which is published at Syracuse ; he ordered that to be sent to me but they refused to let me have these papers, even the paper that contained the obituary notice of my daughter, and I was just as capable of reading them as 1 ever was in my life. Q. On the first occasion you say you saw nothing Avrong i A. No, sir. Q. And on the second occasion that you were at the Asylum state what occurred as to mismanagement or cruelty? A. This Miss Burns that I was speaking of was cruel; one day there Avas a patient, I thought by her appearance that she had had the small pox not long before, she came into the Asylum ; her face was very red and very much pitted, and her head seemed to be very tender and she was quite deranged ; one day she Avas sitting near me and I was sewing, and this Ann Burns she seemed to like to tease, it seems to be a propensity of hers; I cannot remember the name of this lady but she never would talk with me although I had tried to talk with her several times, so I canuot give you her name; she came up to her and kind of put out her hand to her and the lady did not take notice of it; then she struck her slightly in the face ; then the patient struck back ; then Ann Burns took a bunch of keys and struck her on the head very hard ; then they had quite a tussle and Ann Burns called on the other attendants, and theyare obliged to go whether they Avere Avilling or not, they are expected to go in assistance in such a case as that; and they had quite a serious time, aud she Avas strapped doAvn and the camisoles Avere put on to her before they got through ; that patient came on to three from the Tuesday when 1 was there ; then there Avas a lady from St. Lawrence county, from Heuvelton, I can't remember the lady's name — 623 Q. Wait a minute ; have you described all the injuries that were inflicted upon this patient with the keys ? A. She was taken into the room and after that I didn't know any thing more about her. Q. Did you see whether the keys lacerated her head ? A. Yes, sir, they did. Q. So that the blood ran ? A. It started the blood ; I don't think it ran ; I don't remember seeing it; there were a great many that things I saw in her, Ann Burns, when I was there, when I was taken there the last time on ward 12, and I had a perfect horror of her. Q. Of Ann Burns ? A. Yes, sir ; she did not have charge of the hall when I was there before in 1872; I was going to speak of this lady from St. Lawrence county; she was a consumptive and frequently Ann Burns would keep her from the table; I can't tell her name bnt I could get it; she was a member of Brother Bates' church when he was pastor there; perhaps you (Mr. Olin) Avill know who he is; after I went on to that ward I was put into a room where there were eight beds; this was in 1872, and this woman — the Asylum was so crowded at the time that some of the patients had to sleep on the floor — she was put into a bed under a window where there was a draught; I spoke to the attendant two or three times; I thought it was a very bad place to put her because she coughed all the time in the night, bnt the attendants did not pay any attention to it; there was some patients in that room who were very violent and there was a lady from Syracuse, she was noisy and violent, and she took her vessel and dashed at another patient and broke it all to pieces, and so they Avere in the habit of locking them in the room ; they kept her without food very often and would not allow her to go to the table, but they put her in this bed under the window ; there was but one window in the room and it was kept open ; there was eight beds in the room and her bed wras made up on the floor right under the window, and very often there would be a heavy fog settling jn the morning, that we would see Avhen we got up, even in the summer time. Q. Did'that seem to affect this woman ? A. Yes, sir ; when I left the hall she was in a bad condition, but there Avas nothing done for her; the doctor would inquire of Miss Hennessy who had charge of the ward, Mary Hen nessy—she is married now; I am speaking of the second time I was there, noAv ; this Ann Burns Avas under her, but when I was there the last time she had charge of the hall herself. Q. Did she have any thing to eat on this hall, this patient that you refer to ? • A. Sometimes she had things taken on to the hall and sometimes she did not have; she used to complain of hunger to me, and I spoke to the attendants two or three times about it at that time, but I did not dare to speak about it much. 624 Q. What did the attendants say when you spoke to them? A. They gave me to understand that it was none of my business. Q. Did any thing occur during the second time you Avere there? A. A great many things occurred there. Q. State them ? A. I never had any personal violence inflicted upon me during the first time or second that I was there. Q. Did you see it inflicted on others ? A. Yes, sir; frequently. Q Describe it ? A. I saw them pounded, and once I saw a lady out in the yard ; she had long curls; she was from New York ; she was brought there with brain fever and she was on ward nine ; when she received the treatment that I am about to speak of, her hair, here (indicating in front), was all pulled out ; she was pretty well when I made her acquaintance and I asked her how her hair came to be out; she said that two of the attendants — I can't think of their names, but one had charge of No. 9, and she was a very tall Irish girl, she was not there the last time I was there; and another girl, that these two girls took her by her hair and dragged her from one end of the hall to another because she did not Avant to go to bed. They had a habit of making them go to bed right after supper, because they wanted to go down to the city. Those on the back wards were locked into their rooms. Q. Did the patient who told you appear to be sufficiently rational to describe it, or did it strike you as being truthful ? A. Yes, sir ; the lady was from Ilion who told me about it; she was a very intelligent woman. Q. Don't you remember the Ilion lady's name ? A. I can't remember her name, and it is familiar too, but she was a member of the Baptist church at Ilion. Q. Name some other instance where you saAV the ill-treatment of patients during the second time you were there? A. I saw them pounded during the time I was there then. Q. Whom did you see pounded, and who pounded them ? A. I can't remember the names of the patients on No. 12, but I saw Ann Burns, Mary Hennessey ; there were three attendants, these two and the dining-room girl, Miss Roberts; she was from Copenhagen, and she was very kind to the patients. Q. What did you see the attendants do ; and give the names of the attendants ? A. Miss Hennessey and Miss Burns ; they would strike them and throAv them down and tear their clothes and'then they would go and report to the doctors that they tore their own clothes; I saw that done frequently. Q. How do you know that it was reported to the doctors? A. Because every thing of the kind got reported. Q. Did you say the attendants tore the clothes of the patients? A. Yes, sir. 625 Q. Then did you hear them make any reports to the doctors about it ? A. Of course they did not tell me every thing of that kind, of every unusual occurrence — but I heard — Q. Well, it would hardly be fair to take that; you can state what you saw. A. Of course the doctors would not tell the patients, but all heard Miss Burns say frequently to the patients, " I shall tall the doctor now about your tearing your clothes." Q. After she had torn them herself ? A. Yes, sir; I fixed over a great many dresses that had been torn to pieces by attendants. Q. How do you know that ? A. She tore it; they took them in this way (indicating) by the neck of the dress and dragged them ; and I saw new dresses all torn to pieces ; and I saw more than this the last time I was there. Q. Confine yourself to the second time at present ? A. The second time I was there I was not on Avard six or ten. Q. Was this dragging of the patients during the second time you were there? A. I saw considerable of it, but not so much at that time. Q. Did you see considerable of the tearing of the^patients' dresses by attendants the second time you were there? A. Yes, sir. Q. And on what ward was that done ? A. On ward twelve ; there is very little of that done on the third department. Q. What else did you see on ward twelve in the way of unkind treatment? A. When the patients Avere sick there Avas scarcely any attention paid to them ; I was sick myself and I know. Q. Whose duty was it to take care of you when you^were sick ? A. it was the duty of the one that had charge of the hall? Q. Of the attendants there ? A. Yes, sir; Mary Hennnessey; it was her duty to see that I had care. Q. What was your peculiar sickness ? A. I was at that time very much subject to sick headache and " neuralgy." Q. In what way were you neglected ? A. By not providing food for me, and not letting the doctor know I was sick. Q. Did they do any thing in the way of giving you medicine? A. Yes, sir ; Dr. Kitchen found that 1 was in a bad condition one day and he sent me some physic ; but I was there some time before any medicine Avas sent; he sent me some chloral and I took it the first time he sent it; it was Sunday night and I was reading the papers ; I am not a very sound sleeper and I never go to sleep in ' my chair; I was sitting at my window reading, and I got right to 79 U 626 sleep and I didn't know what time it was ; but I was awakened in the night by the attendant's coming in, and I was surprised; I undressed and went to bed, and I didn't wake up the next morning until between seven and eight, and I am a very early riser generally; I told Miss Sayles I didn't like to take any more of that medicine, it made my head feel very bad ; that I did not like opium or any thing of that kind, and she said " speak to the doctor about it your- self ; " • I had asked her to speak to the doctor; she told me to speak to him about it myself; so when Dr. Kitchen came on to the ward I spoke to him, and he did not make any reply; he laughed, and that was all, and he sent me the same medicine that same night. Q. Chloral? A. Yes, sir; I spoke to Miss Sayles about it, and I said I did not like to take that medicine; she said, " well, he has sent it, and you can take a little of it and throw the rest away," and I continued to do so until I went on to ward tAvelve; I don't know w7hy he sent me chloral; I could sleep when it was all quiet; and I told him that my friends Avould be opposed to my taking any thing of that kind because they knew that it did not agree with me; but he con- tinued to send that along, and I think it was in August before it was stopped. Q. Was there any thing else occurred the second time you were there in the way of cruelty or neglect? A. There are a great many things that came to my knowledge, but I did not see them ? Q. What was told you by patients ? A. Yes, sir ; it was by patients who I thought competent to tell the truth and to know what they were saying and to state hoAV it AA7as. Q. Without stating all they said, what did they complain of generally ? A. There was a lady from St. LaAvrence county and this lady from Otsego county, both of them said they Averepnt into cribs; that they would throw wet sheets around them and put them over them and tAvist them around their necks and then throw them into the cribs and then put fastenings on to their feet and put the covers down and they felt as if they were more dead than alive when they were placed in that position ; the lady from Otsego county was kept in one a long time; I think it was on No. 12 ; it was on No. 3 when I first became acquainted with her I think; I learn that they have given up using these wet sheets now ; I never saw it in my own case for I was not on the ward where they used such things so much. Q. What occurred in 1882 when you were there? A. I told you about Dr. Brush coming on and sending me back to ward 12; that occurred when I was there on that occasion ; I was given a single room on No. 12 ; something occurred during the time I was there that I thought I would speak of, and my husband wished me to speak of it ; it was this: I went to the chapel one afternoon — I was quite poorly when I went to the Asylum for I 627 had been broken of my rest; there was a German lady from down near Albany ; she wanted I should read to her in the recess and several patients came around while I was reading to them, and after a Avhile she came up to me and said "I Avant you to sino- to me " and brought me a singing book ; there was a Mrs. S. o*f Otsego county; she said "Mrs. Fulford, don't try to sing, you look so tired ; " that excited this German lady so she took this singino- book and gave me a hard bloAv on the side of the face and my head^began to ache very hard ; I had had two or three slight attacks of paralysis in consequence of overdoing, and my limbs began to be numb and my heart beat so I could hardly speak, and this Mrs. S. of Otsego county took me back up to my room ; she said " Avhat shall I do for you ; " I told her to get me a bowl of hot water and put my feet in it; I thought that would relieve me for I felt very cold; Mrs. S. Avas a patient; pretty soon the supervisor, Miss Sterling^ came along up and she saw me with my feet in the hot Avater; she told me to take them out ; I tried to raise them but I could not, and she sent one or two others and she pulled me right out and tried to sit me on my feet, but I fell down again ; then they dragged me to the room where I slept; I can't tell the number but they took me there ; she told me to undress and I could not for I had not the power ; then this Frank Davies came in and they got off my clothes and some patients came in and they finally took off my clothes and put me to bed and then Dr. Brush came up to see me and he fetched" me some pills, and after a while Miss Davies came with some medicine for me and that was all the care I had that night; my head pained me very hard and I did not sleep; this was Sunday night before I was sent back on Thursday to twelve. Q Hoav did you remain from Sunday until Thursday? A. I Avas not Avell at all. Q. Did you improve ou Thursday ? A. My head felt better. Q. Then they placed you on twelve ? A. Yes, sir; and I have told you the reason for that. Q. Noav state what occurred on tAvelve ? A. This Miss Burns I told you was one the that had charge of the Q. Where was it that this occurrence Avith Mrs. S. happened? A. That Avas on ward tAvo. Q. What occurred on ward twelve? A. I did not meet with any personal abuse until I had been there some weeks; niy brother that was here this afternoon with me came ■ there, I met him in the reception room on number four; he came in the afternoon ; the bell rang for tea aid Miss Bums came over for me to go to my supper, and my brother gave me some money as he ahvays did during the time I was there before, so that if I wanted any thing I could have it; he says, "keep that and if you want to get any thing you can get it; " Ann Burns saw him give it to me 628 and as Ave w7ere going back she said, "you had better give me that money ;" I said, "oh, no, I can take charge of it, and my brother told me to keep it, and if I wanted any thing that I could send to the matron and have her get it forme ; " she said, "well, if you lose it you must not think that any one is to blame ;" I said, " no, if I lose any thing that is in my care I did not blame any one ; I had a purse with me and I put it in my pocket; in about two weeks after that my husband came to see me and he said he intended to leave me some money but he did not think of it until after he was gone; Miss Burns knew that my husband had been there and I think she thought he had left me some money ; I kept my clothes in my room and I had a bureau there; this money Avas in the pocket of my dress and my dress was folded up and put in there and the next morning I had been cutting patterns for one of the attendants who requested me to do so and these patterns lay on the bed; as I cut them I put them there; the patients had gone out in the yard, but I did not go; I stayed on the ward ; they told me when I first went on to the ward—I Avas afraid of the excitable patients and did not dare to go out into the yard—they said I could go out in the morning or evening and not go with the patients ; and after the patients had gone out into the yard, Ann Burns came in there and spoke- to me and says " what a looking room ; " I said that I was cutting patterns for Miss Simmons, the other attendant, and w7ould have them all done up pretty soon ; she says, " I w7ant you to go out of this room ;" I had just then commenced combing my hair; she says, "if you don't go out I shall get help and take you out;" I kept on combing my hair and did not go, and she called on other attendants, and Avent on to number eight and called tAvo attendants from there ; one of them was a great large Dutch girl; they came in and took hold of me and dragged me out into the hall anal locked my door; she said, " now7 you have got to go out with the rest of them ; " I said, " let me get my bat," and she said, " no, you have got to go just as you are ;" and they took hold of me and dragged me through that hall and through the dining-room, down the stairs through the number ten dining-room, and through eleven into the lunatic yard, as they . call it; some of the patients were surprised, because I generally kept my hair well; they came up and wanted to know what wa6 the matter ; she said, " now you have got to stay until the rest of the patients come up ; " my head was aching very hard, and my heart beat very violently, and I came very near having a stroke then and there under the treatment; Avhen I came back I wrote a note- one of the patients had a pencil and paper — she says to me, "I want you to write to the doctor at once and tell him of the treat- ment you have received from Miss Burns;" I Avrote it, and when Dr. Bloomer came I handed him this note ; I did not want to say any thing about it to the patients ; he took the note, and the next day when he came up on to the wards I was sick a bed, and I was sick for several days ; that afternoon the matron came over and was there quite a while ; when 1 came back to my room from the yard 629 I found the room in a terrible condition ; every thing had been ransacked over, every thing taken out of my drawers; my husband had giA7en me some paper and envelopes and some postals, and they were all gone, and even the letters he had written, and that my son had written, were all gone ; I did not say any thing about it; I did not mention it; I did not ask her the reason of it; the money was gone as well ; it AA7as in my dress pocket folded in the bureau ; Avhen I got so that I was able to go to the table again, a week from the next Sunday, I asked for my dress which had been taken out of the drawer at the time ; the dress Avas brought to me, and when I put it on, I looked of course for the money Avhich I had folded up in the pocket of this dress; I felt in the the pocket for the money, but it was gone; the dress was brought back to me by Ann Burns ; I asked her Avhere that money w7as and she said to me that she had taken it to the matron's room. Q. How much money Avas there in the pocket of your dress? A. There was ten shillings in the pocket of that dress, that is the money that my brother gave me when he called to see me. Q. What time was it that this money was taken out of the pocket of your dress as you have stated ? A. It was in July, 1882. Q. Did she tell you that she had given the money to the matron ? A. Yes, sir ; but I do not think she gave it to the matron until,a long time after I spoke to her about it; I spoke to the matron about the money. Q. When you spoke to the matron about the matter, what did she say? A. She said she had it, but I think it was some time before she did have it. Q. What makes you think it was some time before she did have A. Because I had sent for things to the matron and did not have them ; generally Avhen patients sent to the matron for things in that manner, and had money on deposit with the matron the things came. Q. What did the matron say about your money ? A. When I came away she gave me a bill of the things I had had that she had got for me ; if I Avanted such things as lemons or oranges for myself or the other patients she would get them for me and they Avould be charged to me. Q. Was there any balance coming to you when you came away ? A: My brother left me money afterward and so did my hus- band ; I think I was OAving her eleven cents when I came away from the Asylum, that is, that AAras the balance due to her at the time I was ready to leave. Q. So that the ten shillings Avas finally accounted for? A. Yes, sir; but I do not think she had any right to come in there like that and take my things away; I used to keep my room and my bureau in perfect order; when Mr. Smith came there he found my room in better order than he did the rooms of either of those attendants. 630 Q. What else, if any thing, occurred in reference to your ill-treat- ment during the time you Avere there in 1882? A. There was a patient thereby the name of Mrs. G----.; she AA-as a young lady, and I was quite interested in her; she did notdo very much, but I got her so that she did considerable; that was on ward twelve; well, she had not been to chapel since I had been there and one day the Jubilee singers came there; they came there to sing; they came up to me and said I could go up to the chapel if I Avished, I asked Miss Burns if Mrs. G----could go with me, she said " it is so much trouble to dress her;" I said that I Avould dress her and get her ready to go, and see that she Avas returned in safety, and finally she consented to let me take Mrs. G---.; I got her ready for the concert, and she Avorea very nice dress, it was new ; this was on Saturday so she kept the dress out and put it on Sunday morn- ing ; and afterward they let her go to chapel with ine ; she went to hear these Jubilee singers, with me, and she seemed to enjoy the singing very much. Just as she Avas going into her room to go to bed Ann Burns saw her, she stood right near by, she kind of struck at Mrs. G. and Mrs. G. at first did not notice it; so she did so again : that is, Ann Burns did so again, and then Mrs. G. struck back at Burns; then Miss Burns called for more attend- ants and they came; they threw her down on the hall floor,she was rather a small woman, but they sent for two attendants on number eight, and they came down and I Avent into my room, for I could not bear to see it; but I saw they were hurting her very much; there was a crib-room, the second room from mine, on that hall, and they dragged her through, and I saw that that new dress was all torn to pieces; I sa.v her as they dragged her past my room and into the room beyond ; I heard them take her in there and put her in the crib, and she remained there all night; I never saw that dress afterward ; I used to fix up the dresses, and one day I said to Ann Burns, I spoke to her and said that if she would get" Mrs. G.'s dress that I Avould fix it up, as I used to fix the patients' dresses; 1 told Mrs. Barker, the matron, about it the day I left; she asked me Avhat I had seen and so I told her about that occurrence. Q. Describe this Ann Burns i A. She is Irish ; not very tall ; she is rather thin, of slight build and she has very dark hair. Q. About how old is she, should you think ? A. She said she Avas not but twenty-tour, but she Avas an attend- ant when I was there before, and she had been there fourteen years; and I think she was older than that. Q. Did you see this lady's dress again? A. No, sir ; not after that; I never saw it afterAvard. Q. Is there any thing else that occurred during the time that you were there ? A. Yes, sir, there was a Mrs. A. there, she was from Auburn; she was a very quiet patient; but one day when Ave were eating dinner in the dining-room, something was said to her that excited 631 her very much ; she was a very large woman ; she became excited, and this Ann Burns got in five attendants; but before they did any thing Ann Burns came to me — she knew that I had a perfect horror of seeing such things — she came to me and said: "We are going to drag Mrs. A. through and put her into the crib-room, and if you do¬ want to see it done you had better go into your own room," so I did so; just before I went into my room I saw two attendants jump on to her stomach; I think they were afraid she Avere getting the mastery of them — they had her down then on the floor; they dragged her through the hall that leads right straight from twelve, they dragged her from that into the dining-room, and through there, and dragged her into the crib-room — the one next to the clothes-room, that is the room that they put her in ; this occurred right aAvay after dinner, about tAvo o'clock ; they put her in there and strapped her down ; Ann Burns came to me then, and said it was a bad time for any thing like that to occur, that'visitors were ex- pected, that they Avere coming on the hall, and that this Mrs. A. was sAvearing and calling the attendants names, and she said to me "I Avant you should go in there and convert Mrs. A., as com- pany will be along pretty soon ;" I said " Miss Burns, that is not in my power, to convert her," but I said I was willing to do-what I could for her; she said, "Well, you can quiet her better than we can, you will have more effect with her ; " she said " if you will go in there where she is, I will let you in ;" I said I was willing to do what I could, and that I would go and try and quiet her ; I went in there where she was, and she wanted I should let her haveahair pin, so that she could turn the lock of the strap— that was locked — I told her no; that I hadn't any right to do that; she said " I must get out from- here, I can't stay here any longer;" she was strapped in this chair ; says I "if you will promise me that you will be quiet I will go and see the attendants and I will persuade them to take it off, but I have not any right to release you myself," I tried always while I was there not to infringe upon their rules in any way, so I Avent to Miss Burns, and I says—and this Miss A — she had a very nice dress that was all torn to pieces in this struggle — I went to Miss Burns and I asked her about it and told her that Miss A. had promised to be quiet if she was released, and she Avent and let her out and she was quiet the rest of the afternoon ; they had several attacks upon her at different times, she was a very large, strong woman. Q. State whether or not she made any complaints after this jump- ing on her stomach ? A. Yes, sir; she had to get some medicine from the doctor ; then there was a Miss S. from Auburn, I did not witness the act of violence on her ; I took care of her after she came on to number six ; she had the camisoles on, and the buckle tcame right behind ; and there was a Mary Finnerty, from Florence, Avhere we resided, she had charge of the hall ; this Mrs. S. as on number two, when I was there and was always very neat about her person —always kept her 632 hair very nice, and was proud about her clothing ; they kept this camisole on her and she could not wash herself; she said that she went into the bath-room and let the wrater run on one side of her face, and then on to the other side, and she would ^drink water in that way ; Miss Finnerty came and ordered her out of the bath- room, she said to her " this water feels so cool her, please let me be here " — Q. Did you hear her say that ? A. No, sir; that is what she told me; but I saw her afterward ; I saw her when she came on our ward. Q. What condition was she in when she came on to your Avard? A. Her back was in a bad condition ; she complained of her back, it was hurt where she was thrown down, and this buckle of the cami sole had hurt her also — had made it quite sore; when they dragged her the buckle went into her back, and it was very sore; I had vasseline in my room and I bathed her back with that ; she was finally confined to the bed, it affected her head; she said she felt so strong and well before she had received that treatment ; but I did not think the woman would, ever recover ; she was on number five, and I saAV her the day I came away; she said her back troubled her very much ; Dr. Pilgrim gave me permission to go and see some of the patients before I left — Dr. Pilgrim had just come there then, and so I went to see her before I left the A sylum. Q. Did this woman have the appearance of having been severely injured I A. Yres, sir; she told Dr. Brush about it in my room one day; I heard her tell him. Q. What was this lady's name who lived at Florence ? A. Miss Mary Finnerty. Q. Does she live at Florence now ? A. No, sir; not that I knoAV of ; she was in the Asylum the last I knew of her. Q. Was there any more such treatment that you saw yourself? A. Yes, sir; I saw a great Meal, I could Avrite a book about it; there was one woman whose death was caused, as I believe, by being put into a bath-tub ; her name was S. from Watertown; I had met her before that time, at Loraine, before I came to the Asylum — she wanted to write a letter to her brother to come after her as they told her she was quite well ; Dr. Brush told her that; she wrote a letter and brought it in for me to look over, she wanted to knoAV if it Avas all correct, because they look at the letters as they go out of the Asylum; she brought the letter to me, and it was all right —the grammar was quite correct; but her brother did not come, and she was put back on number five, I think ; in the first place I met her out in the yard and I Avas surprised to see her changed appearance ; she looked so differently from what I had seen her before ; I asked her what was the matter', and she said oh! lain ruined, my friends have forsaken me, I shall become a raving maniac and wont know any thing; she said to me, if you go away from 633 here, write to my husband to come after me, and put me into the Watertown Asylum ; she gave me her address, and the next I heard of her she was dead ; she Avas put on to seven and they wanted to have her take a bath — although I do not know about that person- ally — the attendant told me about it, and so did two of the patients. Q. What did the attendants tell you ? A. About her being put into the bath-tub ; she told me that the doctor said to her — the attendants — put her in there and keep her in there two hours ; she said that the doctor told her so. Q. What was the name of that attendant? A. It was one that had charge of the ironing-room ; her husband's parents resided in the city here ; I think I can recall her name soon, but I do not recall it at this moment. Q. Any other instances that came under your observation ? l^A. I frequently saw patients compelled to go into the bath-tub Avhen they ought not to have gone, by reason of their then condi- tion, and I think a great many Avere injured. Q. Whose business was it to put them into the bath-tub? A. It was the business of the one that had charge of the hall ? Q. The supervisor or attendant, do you mean ? A. The supervisor does not generally have much to do with the ward, or about a matter like that, she has the general supervision. Q. State what other thing you saw while you were there, if there is any thing else ? A. I saw a good many things wrong ; I saAV a great many pa- tients have their hair pulled, and a great many that were dragged, and some Avere pulled by the hair. •Q. Can you giA^e the names of any attendants who 60 dragged them or pulled their hair ? A. On number twelve there was Miss Simmons, Miss Burns and Mrs. Wood, avIio Avas in the dining-room, but she was an unAvilling assistant; she was compelled to take part under the rule that the one who has charge of the hall can call for assistance, and the at- tendants have to go and assist; the one that has charge of a hall has a right to call on any one in the building; that is, any attendant in the building to assist them, and whether they are Avilling or not, they have to go ; this Mrs, Woods left the Asylum because she was not willing to do it ; her name Avas Mrs. Augusta Woods ; she has left the Asylum; she was not there but a feAv weeks: she would not stay there because she said she would not be an unwilling helper in such cases of cruelty ; she was from Canajoharie ; she was there the last time I knew any thing of her; she was a Avidow lady, a very nice person ; her daughter lived in this city — Utica —and boarded Avith Mr. Roberts' people here ; then there was a Miss Yan, some- thing, on ward eight, Yanderburg, or something like that; she Avas a Dutch girl, and was frequently called upon to assist in such mat- ters. Q. Do you knoAV whether she is in the Asylum now ? A. I do not know ; I can't tell whether she is or not; there were 80 U 634 two sisters of them ; one had charge of the dining-room on four and the other was on eight as an attendant. Q. Are there any other cases of dragging the patients, or other- wise ill-treating them ? A. I knew of a good many patients sick Avho did not have the care bestowed upon them that they should have had in my judgment; the only care they had was such as the patients would give them. Q. Do you mean by that that the attendants would not care for them as sick persons should be cared for ? A. No, sir; with a fmv exceptions. Q. Can you name any patients who Avere sick and were neg- lected ? A. There was a Mrs. C----r, or C----s, or C----1 ; I do not remember the exact name; an Irish lady, she died on six Avhile I was there; her room was an inside room next to mine ; she Ava6 sick for quite a while, and the last time I saw her out in the hall was when she was put in the bath-tub and she was kept there quite a while — quite a long time. By Mr. Olin : Q* Was the name of the Dutch girl you mentioned, Yanderhoof? A. Yes, sir, that was it; there Avere tAvo of them ; the one that Avas on four was very kind ; the attendants all went by the name of u Miss " there, so that I could not tell yon the first names of either of these Yanderhoof girls; I referred to the one on eight; she was a large girl and was frequently called upon in cases like I bave men- tioned — these dragging operations ; she Avas obliged to respond, of course; she came in and helped drag me; she had charge of the dining-room of number eight; she assisted to drag me down to the yard on the occasion I spoke of, but I did not consider her responsi- ble, because she acted according to the rules. Q. During the times you were there, the second and third times, did you ever see any acts of immorality practiced there, other than the incident you have spoken of about the young lady avIio got under the bed ? A. I did not see any case; of course gentlemen are not admitted, unless it is some one who comes in there like that to do work on the halls. Q. Did you personally know of any cases of immorality other than this one you mentioned ? A. No, sir ; I used to see that some of the attendants Avere very free with this man who came on to the hall to do the work. Q. What did you ever see in the way of familiarity between him and any of the attendants there? A. I would not like to repeat. 635 By the Chairman : Q. Did you see any thing that you regarded as immoral take place between them ? A. No, sir ; I did not have the opportunity; but there were dif- ferent times that Mr. Jones came on to the hall before this occur- rence; he came and painted the bath-tub and the patients would'be out at the time; they go out in the morning and afternoon. Q. Who would be left in on the wards — any of the attendants ? A. Yes, sir; this Ann Burns would be there, she was not obliged to go out, and could stay on the ward, and generally did stay in. Q. Did you see any familiarities between this man Jones and Ann Burns ? A. They used to be in the bath-room sometime, laughing and joking considerably together; I did not go into the bath room where they were, so that i could not say what occurred in there ; as you go into the bath-room there is a closet like, just as you step out of tlje hall, and the bath-room is on beyond that, so that I could not see from my room Avhat transpired in the bath-room ; when they went in they shut the door of the bath-room. Q. Was Jones at the Asylum when you left there? A. Yes, sir; I believe he was still there; I saw him.pass the yard frequently after that. Q. He was employed to do odd jobs about the Asylum? A. Yes, sir ; that is what I understand about it ; he was a kind of a mechanic about the place. Q. He was not an attendant ? A. No, sir; not that I know of ; I think not. Q. Do you know whether he was a night watchman ? A. I don't think he was ; I think that is a separate tiling by it- self; there was a night watchman on the other side, but there were lady watchers on the woman's side ; Mrs. Stirling's sister was one of night watches ; and Mrs. Hannah, something — it was a short name, but I can't remember it now ; she was there a short time. Q. Do you know whether any of the men night watchmen could get access to the women's side of the Asylum ? A. Of course they could, they had keys, every attendant had keys; and this Mr. Jones had keys, he could go into any room, he would go into the rooms if there was any little repairing to be done. Q. Do the night watchmen have keys that will fit both sides of the Asylum. A. I could not tell you as for that. Q. Have you ever seen a man on that side of the house at night ? A. Only in case of a death or something like that; this Mrs. C—r or C—s died in the night and I heard them; I Avas Avakened about twelve, the clock struck twelve soon afterward ; I heard these men on the hall; I knew that she was very low ; I was in to see her during the day, and I Avent in that evening and she could not speak; but she did not have no care or attention ; the attendants 636 went down to the city that night; there were four on that hall; when they came home, they were dancing up and down, the at- tendants were. Q. Did you speak to the attendants about this sick patient ? A. Yes, sir, I did; but they said, " Oh, well, they could not pay any attention to her;" I was in to see her but she could not speak; I tried to talk to her; she Avas very low; I think it was the con- sumption that was the matter with her. Q. Did the doctors see her during that day to your knowledge? A. The doctor went in and looked at her, Dr. Bloomer was just in to look at her. Q. Was any one with her when she died ? A. No, sir; she was locked in her room alone ; Mrs. Pride, wdio had charge of the ward, did not know that she Avas dead until the morning ; Mrs. Sayles was the supervisor, and she says to Mrs. Pride, " Miss C. is dead ; " that night Mrs. Pride was down in the city, they had a Catholic fair going on ; when the night-watch came along that night she found that Miss C. was dead; I heard the men on the hall when they came up for the body, and so I knew she was dead, and it was the next morning after that that I heard Miss Sayles, the supervisor, telling the attendant, Mrs. Pride, that she was dead. Q. How did it happen that these men came on to the ward? A. They came to carry her to the dead room ; I looked out of my window and I could see them carrying the body in the long basket that they used to put remains in, taking it to the dead-house; they had their lanterns with them ; my window overlooked what they call the "court-yard"; the next morning as I passed by the room that this patient had been in I saw it was empty, the bed was gone and there were the springs on the bedstead visible. Q. Have you ever, on any occasion, heard a man on that floor at night ? A. No, sir; only on occasions like that; the attendants are out sometimes quite late; I have heard them come in as late as eleven o'clock; they would make a noise when they came in at night, talk- ing loud and like that. Q. Can you name any other instances of injuries inflicted on patients by attendants? A. No,, sir; not in my presence, but I have heard of patients having broken limbs; I have known of a good many cases, but I never saw one Avhen they had their limbs broken, that is I did not see it done. Q. Have you seen any other instances than those you have called the attention of the committee to? -s A. Yes, sir; I think Frank Davis treated the patients badly; I have seen her assist Miss Burns, they were very intimate, she would help to drag the patients. Q. Did you ever see this Frankie Davis strike a patient ? A. I don't know that I ever did, but I have seen a great many 637 of the attendants strike patients; I don't think that the doctors know all that is done there; the attendants tell the patients that the doctors will not believe them, and, as a rule, they do not pay much attention to what the patients tell them, the doctors do not; the doctors would not believe any thing that a patient said against an attendant, and the attendants tell the patients so. Q. Did you ever hear an attendant say that ? A. Yes, sir; I have heard them tell patients; and in my own case, when I told Ann Burns that I should complain to the doctor, she said " I shall inform the doctor myself first, and he won't be- lieve a word that you say, he won't take the word of a patient," but I told her I should tell him all the same. Q. Have you had occasion to make complaints to the doctors? A. Yes, sir ; I did it by writing, I wrote to him, I did not make personal complaints, but I wrote; I have written several notes, I did so Avhen I was on six; finally Dr. Bloomer took my pencil away, it was on the bureau when he came into the room and he took it away ; he took it away so that I should not Avrite, he refused to let me have it, and refused me paper, and he refused to let me have papers that were sent to me. Q. Did he make any response to you about those notes that yon wrote ? A. The last note I handed to him he asked me where I got my pencil, I told him that Mrs. Wood gave it to me, the lady that lei't the institution because she' would not abuse the patients. By Mr. Morgan : Q. How many times was Dr. Gray on the wards while you were there — during the first time you were there? A. The first time I was there under Dr. Gray, he made a prac- tice of coming on the ward once a month —I mean the second time I was there, bnt the first time since Dr. Gray were there. Q. How was it the third time you were there— the last time-— second time under Dr. Gray ? A. I went there the 16th of June, and I think the first time,I Baw him after I went there that time, was some time in October ; I frequently sent him notes saying that I would like to see him, and after that I saw him in the chapel, the Welsh Club of this city (Utica) gave a concert for the benefit of the patients and I saw him there. Q. Did you see him on the ward before that ? A. Yes; he passed through once with the county supervisors when they were there, I only saw him once to have a conversation with him until the time of this concert, and then he sat next to me. Q. Did you see him in all more than twice on the wards the last time you were there ? A. No, sir; I went there the 16th June and it was not until October that I saw him ; then I saw him the next time going through with the county supervisors; when I saw him at the concert I told 638 him that I would like to go home; I sent several notes to him and told him that I would like to see him and have a conversation with him, but he did not respond; he came on the hall with Dr. Bloomer one Sunday ; I wanted to see him, for I thought if I could see him he would arrange about my going home; I thought I was Avell enough to go home. By Mr. Rice : Q. State whether or not yon were permitted to correspond with your friends as often as yon desired to? A. No, sir; not as fully and freely as I desired. Q. Was there any restraint put upon yon in that matter? A. They refused to let me have paper and I could not write with- out the permission of the doctor. Q. Did you ever ask permission to write a letter to your hus- band when you were forbidden to do so ? A. Yes, sir ; Dr. Bloomer forbade me from writing. Q. How many times did that occur? A. I think three times. Q. How often were you accustomed to Avrite to your husband ? A. I always calculated when I could to answer the letters I got; we kept up a frequent correspondence. Q. Were you forbidden to answer letters that you received ? A. Yes, sir; they would not let me write ahvays when I wanted to. Q. Were the letters sent you by your friends inspected by the Asylum authorities? A. No, sir; I only remember of one instance like that, and that was where a letter was sent for me inclosed in one addressed to Dr. Gray ; but when I sent a letter out I had to send it unsealed. Q. All your other communications came unopened ? A. Yes, sir; all of them with that one exception. Q. When you wrote letters, did they require you to send them unsealed ? A. Yes, sir ; always. Q. If you sealed up a letter, would they refuse to send it ? A. I don't know as to that; 1 have heard patients say so; but I was told 1 must send my letters unsealed; Dr. Brigham's niece, she told me that was the rule; once I sealed one of my letters up be- fore I sent it, but I made apologies to Dr. Bloomer about it, and I think the letter was sent. Q. I understood you to say that you had seen some familiarities between male and female attendants that you Avere unwilling to state about ? A. I saw things that I would not like to speak about; it was be- tween Mr. Jones and Ann Burns, and also toward a Miss Noon that Avas there. Q. Were those familiarities in the ward Avhere you were ? 639 A. No, sir; this with Ann Burns was in the bath-room; the patients at that time would be mostly out in the yard; I was in the ward, for I did not go out very often; but I said I did not see any thing that occurred in the bath-room; when they went into the bath-room together, I Avas standing, by those large windows on number twelve; I did not see what transpired out of my sight at all, bnt before they went in I saAV him put his arms round her. Q. When Avas that ? A. Just before they Avent in, there to the bath-room. Q. Did you see him kiss her? A. No, sir; I did not see that. Q. Over what portion of her body did he put his arm ? A. He put it around her waist. Q. Now you spoke about another attendant — a Miss Noon and this Jones; how was the familiarity manifested between those two? A. That was right before the patients so that there Avas nothing wrong in that; but 1 thought they used a great deal of freedom ; I saw him go into her room with her. Q. You have stated that yon saw what you considered were famil- iarities; now if there were any improper familiarities we want to know about them ; and if yon have such knowdedge yon should giA7e it to us; I am aware it is a delicate matter, but we must ask you to state specifically if there was any thing improper occurred? Mr. Goodwin — I Avant the reporter to take all that down; all those suggestions from the committee should go down. Mr. Rice — I am willing they should go on the record. Q. How long did they remain in her room ? A. They were in there quite a while ; I could not tell you how long it was. Q. Was the door closed during the time they were in there? A. It was not entirely closed ; almost. Q. Do you know whether he had any business in her room ? A. She came to him and said that it was in the room she wanted him to fix it for her. . Q. Are you able to tell us any thing more that indicated familiar- ity on the part of attendants? A. What I saw on the hall, and by their conversation I could hear them talk about attendants that were out nights ; that there was a good deal that there ought not to be ; they would tell about this one and that one and the presents they had, etc. ; I.told them at one time that I did not think it Avas very proper to talk like that before some of the patients. Q What would they say when you would reprove them ? A. Sometimes they would take it well, and sometimes they would not. Q. Now, is it not a fact that you received great relief at the Asylum ? A. Why, I don't think I was ever mentally insane ? Q. Whether or not your condition was better when you left the Asylum than when you entered it ? 640 A. I was better right away as soon as I got a little rest and quiet; I was overdone; that was the only cause of my going there. Q. Did you go to the Asylum voluntarily ? A. No, sir. Q. It was at the instance of your husband ? A. I cannot tell you that; the first time I went there. Q. Did you knoAV that you were to go to the Asylum ? A. No, sir. Q. When you left your home did you not know it? A. No, sir, Q. Were you conscious of the fact when you left your home that you were going away from home ? A. Why, certainly I was; I remember it very Avell; the first time I went there Avas Avhen my baby was five Aveeks old; my hus- band spoke about going to New York with one of the merchants, and asked me if I would not like to go too; he thought the change would do me good ; when we got here to Utica, on our way to New Y'ork as I supposed, we stayed here at the American House and took dinner ; he asked me if I Avould like to go and see the Asylum; he said he had visited it as a teacher; I said yes, that I would like to go and see it; he called a hack and we went up there; when we got there Dr. Bingham Avas away, and Dr. Lee was the attending physician; he asked me if I would like to go up and see the ladies; I told him yes, I would ; he said they were preparing for a fair ; we went and saw some of them, and then we went into a parlor, and the doctor said "you are out of health, are you not;" I told him I was; he said " don't you think you had better stay with us awhile;" I told him no, I could not think of such a thing, that I had a little baby to take care of, and that I was just going to New York for a change. Q. Were you left there against your will at that time? A. I don't know what you would call it — I certainly had no idea that I was going to be left there. Q. And your husband Avent away Avithout your knowledge? A. Yes, sir; I did not knoAV he was going to leave me there. Mr. Morgan—To cut it short, ask her' if they left her there through deception. The Witness —I considered it deception ; I am opposed to that sort of thing; and Dr. Gray told me the second time I was there that he Avould rather they should bring patients - Q. No matter about that; how long were you in the Asylum the first time ? A. Three months. Q. At that time was your condition improved ? A. Y es, sir. Q. You had recovered your physical health ? A. Yes, sir, and I could sleep nights. Q. You felt better every way when you went home ? A. Yes, sir, I did feel much improved. 641 Q. When the time came again that you lost your health and went back to the Asylum, did you go under similar circumstances, or was it voluntary ? A. No, sir ; I had no idea that I was going. Q. Do you recollect the circumstances of your going to the Asy- lum on that occasion ? A. Yes. sir, I remember just what Dr. Kitchen said to me ; I Avas left that time also against my will; they told me if I went there to the Asylum that I should have an examination, and if they pronounced me not insane that I should go home, and I went, be- lieving they would find me not insane. Q. Did you find yourself physically better off when you left the second time ? A. Yes, sir, I was in better health when I left. Q. That is to say, yon had experienced relief at the Asylum ? A. Yes, sir, I was better. Q. When you went home the second time did your husband come for you ? A. He came, and then my sister came to Utica, and my brother that Avas here with me this afternoon, he came ; my husband came and had me released. Q. Did you, after your release the second time, make any com- plaints of ill-treatment ? m A. Yes, sir, I did complain ; I told my husband about it, and he felt very much displeased and dissatisfied at the way I had been treated. Q. Do you knoAV whether or not he made complaints to Dr. Gray ? A. I do not know ; I don't think he did ; I complained to Dr. Gray myself. Q. Did you tell him of the treatmeut you had received ? A. Why no ;♦ he called me into the office when I went home, but I did not suffer any violence or ill treatment the first two times I was there, although I did receive treatment of Avhich I complained; that is that I was not taken care of when I was sick. Q. Did yon make that complaint to Dr. Gray ? A. No, I told Dr. Kitchen about it; but a patient did not dare complain of an attendant. Q. Hoav do you account for the fact that you were returned to the Asylum the third time, notwithstanding you had informed your husband of your treatment the other times ? A. It was the last time I Avas theue that I was treated the worst; when I went the third time I was not at home and did not go from there ; I was at my son's. Q. Did your friends know that you were going to be returned to the Asylum ? A. 1 think my son did not knoAV, and did not intend himself that I should goto the Asylum, because when we got to Camden he sent my satchel and wrappings up by the stage driver; my son is a physician. 81 U 642 Q. Did your husband know that you were going to the Asylum the third time? A. I don't know that he knew it until I had been taken there; my son told me if I would go to Utica quietly — when I got off the train, I met my son, he had been in another car; says 1, "are you going home with me?" then hetook me one side, and he said, " I have papers here from Dr." - I can't think of his name, he is from Mexico — he says, my son did, " I have a telegram to take you to Utica Asylum; " and I told him I was not going there, but they brought me here. Q. On your discharge, on that occasion, did you communicate to your husband the abuses you had received ? A. Yes, sir, I told him"about it; I told hiou before I Avas taken away. Q. On your so telling him, Avhat steps, if any, were taken to re- lease you after you had acquainted him with the abuses. A. My husband wrote to them about it. Q. Was your physical condition better at the time of your dis- charge the third time? A. It was better as soon as I rested; 1 should have improved anywhere with rest. Q. Since your last discharge, have you communicated with Dr. Gray or any of the authorities of the Asplum as to the great abuses you received ? A. I wrote to Dr. Bloomer frequently about the treatment I re- ceived, but he paid no attention to my complaints. Q. Did you ever communicate to Dr. Gray or the Asylum authorities the precise abuses you received 9 A. No, sir ; I told my husband all about it though. Q. Has he ever communicated with the authorities ? A. No, sir; not since I left there, to my knowledge; Avhen I left Mrs. Barker called me a one side and detained me there more than an hour; it was at the time of the excitement over Miss Lathrop, 6hehad just left the institution ; Mrs. Barker called me and wanted to know about the treatment I had received, and what attend- ants Avere unkind to patients; I gave her their names, and I told her then, said I, " many reports that you have from attendants that patients have torn their clothes were false, the attendants tore them themselves; " I told her that, and told her other things; she asked me for the names ; she said, " Ave Avant to know these things if they occur, Ave are trying to find th^n out." Q. Miss Peck testified about the use of Avet sheets; did you ever see that done ? A. No, sir; I can't say that I ever saAV it myself. Q. Mrs. Fulford, you think you never had any mental disorder \ A. I don't thinkT was ever mentally deranged ; I do not belong to an insane race ; there has been none of it in my family. Q. Do you think that at any time in your life your mind was unbalanced ? 643 A. I do not think it ever was. Q. Were you ever guilty of any acts of violence at home ? A. No, sir ; I was not. Q. Do yon know upon whose advice you were taken to the Asy- lum ? A. The first time I suppose it AATas the doctors; I had too much doctor, and one of them, Dr. Manlius, came very nearly being my death ; I had not slept for over two weeks. Q. Did you ever ha\7e restraint put on you while you were in the Asylum ? A. No, sir ; I was locked in my room but they never restrained me ; one time when T asked Dr. Bloomer on ward ten to change me, I said, " I did not like to be with such a class of patients," he went out of the room and shut the door and held it on me, and was laughing. Q. When they locked yon in your room, was any cause assigned for it ? A. No, sir; and I cannot conceive of any cause for it. Q. Did you ever undertake to refuse, by violent acts, any of the orders of the Asylum authorities during the time you were confined there ? A. No, sir; I never used any violence to a patient or an attend- ant while I was there. Q. Was Miss Lathrop in the Asylum wile you were there ? A. Yes, sir ; she had been some time; I remember that once when we were out in the garden together, Miss Lathrop told me 6he had communicated with Mr. Silkman, but she would not state to me by what means. By the Chairman : Q. State whether or not you consider that your mental condition during the time yon Avere in the Asylum was as good as it is now ? A. Well, I don't know how to make a comparison ; when I was there I was nervous ; I went there because I had been broken of my rest; I will say this, I always took care of myself while I was there, I never had to have an attendant comb my hair, and I always took care of my own room, and took care of the attendants' rooms as well, and frequently cleaned their rooms — I had to be employed there. Q. In your judgment, Avere you insane at any time while you were confined in the Asylum ? A. I don't think I was mentally insane ; I think my nerves were unstrung; I don't think many could have gone through wdiat I did; the last time I went there 1 think Mr. Fulford was more a subject for the Asylum than I was. Q. Outside of your nervous condition was your mind as sound during your confinement in the Asylum as it is now, in your opinion ? 644] A. I don't know as I can answer; I don't think my mind was ever affected; I never lost a day, and never had a delusion. By Mr. Rice : Q; Do you think your mind was as strong then as it is now; that you were capable of as much mental action as you are now ? A. I think 1 was. Q. Do you think you could stand such mental strain then as yon can now ? A. I think I could, aside from my nerves. Q. I ask you whether you think your mind was as strong then as it is now — to-day ? A. Yes, sir; there were several attendants who said to me that they did not see what I was brought there for; that I was as sane as they were themselves. Q. You say you talked with Miss Lathrop ? A. Yes, sir; she Avas one of the patients there when I was; she was one of those who complained to me about the use of drugs. Q. That drugs were used for immoral purposes? A. Yes, sir. Q. What did she say to you ? A. She told me what condition she was in ; she said she thought it was Dr. Brush that gave her this ; she spoke in very high terms of Dr. Bloomer. By Mr. Morgan *. Q. Mrs. Fulford, you will have to throw away your delicacy and state what she told you ? A. I don't know as I can tell; I would meet her out in the yard; she introduced herself to me; she told me why she was there, and she spoke about Dr. Brush, and about the condition she was in, but I did not understand that was the object she meant — I did not take it in that way. Q. What did she tell you ? A. I say that I don't know as I can state definitely; she spoke of it; there were other patients around. Q. Did you have a conversation with her more than once about drugs being used on the patients ? A. She spoke about it several times after we went outwalking; she spoke about the condition she was in. Q. What do you mean by that; state more explicitly ? A. About her insensible condition that she was in ; she spoke something about Dr. Brush in connection with it; she said that he was a man who took a great deal of liberties, but that she thought Dr. Bloomer was a very modest man. ' 645 By Mr. Rioe : Q. Did she ever complain to you that drugs or senesthetics had been administered to her ? A. Yes, sir; she complained about that, but I could not state definitely what it was she stated about that, it w7as when we were in the yard while the other patients Avere around, that she referred to it; I heard her speak at different times about being drugged, and not knowing any thing. Q. What did she say to you about that ? A. I don't know as I can tell yon definitely what it was. Q Give the substance of what she said ? A. She intimated — I don't know as she told in plain terms — ^ Mr. Morgan — Did she say that they had taken improper liber- ties with her? A. She said she thought Dr. Brush Avas a man who would use improper liberties there; and she spoke of other persons there. By Mr. Haskell : Q. Did she say what other persons — mention any names?. A. She thought he used a good deal of liberty with them ; .but I never had any cause to complain myself of that. Q. Did she say that they gave her drugs ? A. Yes, sir; she stated that; it was when she first went there, when she was on No. 2. Q. Did she say where she was when the drugs were administered to her ? A. Yes, sir; it was in her room, must have been, because she said that the next morning when Miss Stirling came to her and Avanted her to get up she said she didn't have any life left. Q. Did she say she knew that the drugs were being administered at the time they were administered ? A. I think she said they were administered to her in something; and she told me that she was drugged at the time she was brought to the Asylum, and that when she was examined there she hardly knew where she was. Q. Did she say she was conscious of drugs having been adminis- tered to her Avhile she w7as in the Asylum ? A. I don't know that she kneAV until after she felt the effects of them. Q. How could she have drugs administered to her and not know it? A. They could prepare them, I suppose, in some way. Q. Did she say that was the way they were given to her ? A. She did not tell me that, but she said that at Rochester they were given to her in coffee. Q. But at the Asylum, I mean ; how they administered there? A. On one occasion she said she woke up in the morning and could not recover herself. 646 Q. Did she undertake to describe to you the condition of her person in any way? A. No, sir ; I don't think she said any thing about that to me. Q. Did she intimate to you in any way that her person had been outraged or violated ? A. Why, no, I never got that impression ; I don't know whether she said that or not; she said to me " I have got to be very careful wdiat I say about it, because they will report it;" but I don't think she carried that impression. The Chairman — Did she ever tell you that her person had been violated ? A. I did not get that impression at all. Mr. Rice — Was she there when you left the Asylum? A. No, sir ; she was taken out about that time — about two weeks before, I think ; Mr. Silkman came and had an interview with her before she was released; they were having an examination at Ponghkeepsie ; Dr. Brush was absent there at the time I left, on the day that Mr. Fulford came after me. JOHN H. HOUSE, Sworn and examined, testified as follows : By Mr. Morgan : Q. Where do you reside ? A. Miller's Mills, Herkimer county. Q. What is your age ? A. I am twenty-seven. Q. Were you an attendant at the Utica Insane Asylum in 1881 ■and 1883? A. Yes, sir. Q. You commenced there in April, 1882? A. Yes, sir. Q. And left the 1st of' April, 1883 ? A. Yes, sir; I think it was in April. Q. On what ward were you ? A. On the fourth ward. Q. On ward four, all the while? A. I was on that ward most of the time. Q. Who was the supervisor on your ward when you were there? A. Mr. Dillon. Q. Who was head attendant in your ward ? A. Mr. Weir. Q. Who was the other attendant on that ward besides yourself ? A. They change round some; there was a number. 647 Q. While you were on ward four, how many times did Dr. Gray visit that ward in the year you were there ? o A. I am not positive, but 1 think it was two or three times that I saw him. Q. And he came once alone, did he not ? A. Yres, sir. Q. The other times; state whether he came alone or whether there were visitors with him ? A. Visitors with him. _ Q. And it Avas not then in a professional capacity, but to show •visitors through and be with them? A. Yes, sir ; I should think so, by the appearance. Q. How far is Avard four from Dr. Gray's office? A. There are two wards between, besides a couple of halls. Q. About how many feet ? A. Perhaps one hundred and fifty or two hundred feet. Q,. On which floor is ward four? A. First floor. Q. So that to go upou ward four, Dr. Gray would not have to go up any stairs? A. Yes, sir. Q. The fifth ward is lower than the others, it is on the first floor, he would have to go down ? A. Yes, sir; he goes down instead of up. Q. Do you remember how many steps or stairs? A. Not exactly, perhaps half a dozen. Q. Did you ever see Dr. Gray on any other ward while you were there ? A. No, sir ; I think not. Q. When you made the arrangement to go there state how it was done? A. In the first place I had been attending night school at the business college ; I had a friend there, my friend used to take even- ing lessons. Q. You went to the institution and what was done there? A. They gave me a rule book and requested me to study or read it through thoroughly. Q. Now who did you see when you went up there? A. I made a bargain with Mr. Dryer; I talked with him first. Q. What was said between you and Mr. Dryer ? A. He wanted to know Avhere I had lived and what my occupa- tion had been, and similar cases. Q. How much were you to have a month? A. Nothing was said by Mr. Dryer, but supposed it was the rule to have $20 for the first six months, and $22 the second six mouths ; they paid me $20 the first six months and $22 the second six months, except a few days I had charge of the ward, and then they paid me a little extra, at the rate of $28; it was a few days. Q. That's while you were acting as head attendant? 648 A. Yres, sir. *Q. What Avas the rule in reference to putting restraints on pa- tients ? A. We had no right to put them on without reporting to the supervisor of the department. Q. What did the supervisor do ? A. It was his duty to report it to the doctors. Q. Then what ? A. Just as they order I suppose. Q. If they ordered restraints you could put them on ? A. Yes, sir; I don't know as it was really the rule, but in ex-' treme cases we used to put it on and report to him directly it was done. Q. How often did you see Dr. Gray on the wards Avhile you Avere there that year ? A. I don't think it was more than half a dozen times; well, it was not over eight times ; two or three times on the wards. Q. Then where did you see him after the two or three times you saw him on the wards? A. I saw him up in the theatrical room at the entertainment; and the day I came aAvay, I saw him as I came out. Q. What was the rule in reference to Avorking patients out on the grounds ? A. I don't know as there was any particular rule; we used to have orders to take the patients out, those patients that we thought was fit to be outside; we were to take them out and work them as we thought proper. Q. Work them until about eleven ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And then go in and go out in the afternoon ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do you know how many horses were kept there ? A. No, sir. Q. You had nothing to do with the barns ? A. No, sir. Q. What do you say as to the number of hours an attendant is required to work, whether it is more than yon think they ought to work, yourself —you had to go on at what time in the morning? A. 1 don't remember the exact hours, but at different times in the year; I think at five o'clock in the summer, and half-past five in the fall and spring. Q. And remain on duty until what hour? A. We were supposed to be on duty all the time. Q. At what hour were you permitted to retire ? A. It was about eight o'clock, I think ; or half-past, perhaps. Q. Then you were required to be on duty when they called in the night ? A. Yes, sir. 649 Q. In your judgment, Avas that more work and confinement than an attendant should be required to perforin ? A. I used to think it was while I was there. Q. In your opinion, should there not be more attendants and less hours required ? A. Oh, yes, sir ; I think there should be. By the Chairman : Q. The doctors came through at about the same hours every day, did they not ? A. Yes, sir, nearly. , ~ Q. And it is unusual to find them there at other times, is it not? A. Yes, sir, unless they are sent for. Q. Consequently at all other times the patients are under the treatment of the attendants ? A. Yes, sir. Q. When the patients are violent, do the attendants ever use force to repress them ? A. Yes, sir; Ave have to hold them very often. Q. Have you ever seen an attendant handle a patient too severely ? A. I don't think I have. Q. Have you ever seen an attendant strike a patient ? A. No, sir. Q. Have you ever seen a patient who has had bruises or black eyes ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Have you ever heard a patient complain that he had been struck by an attendant ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Have you ever had any reason to believe that it was true — now, Ave want to know the truth about that, I don't know whether it is favorable to the Asylum or otherwise ? A. I have no preference about the Asylum ; that is a pretty hard question for me to answer. I am one of those persons that do not pick up hearsay as much as some do ; if I hear something, I try to drop it soon as I can ; sometimes I would believe it Avas so, and perhaps again I Avould hear some one else plead the other side, and I would think it was not so. Q. Have you ever seen patients put in the covered beds ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Have you ever seen them, when put in, struggle or violent ? A. Y es, sir. Q. Have you ever seen attendants on these occasions use unnec- essary force? A. No, sir. Q. Have you ever seen patients come out of the covered bed suf- fering from bruises or injuries? A. Yes, sir ; I have seen them come out when they were bruised, 82 U 650 but I cannot say whether they got it in the bed, or before they were put in; I have heard patients say something about their condition when they came out. Q. Now state Avhether you have heard the patients make any complaints, coming out of the covered beds ? A. Yes, sir; they very often do when they get out. Q. Have they ever complained of ill-usage? A. Yes, sir — well, I don't knoAV as they have — well, a great many think that it is wrong to be put in there. Q. Have you ever heard them complain that they have been put in with unnecessary force ? A. I don't think I have; of course this class put in there are usually "incapable" of very strong reasoning, though usually there is some that can talk first rate ; but the majority cannot. Q. Have you ever been left alone in your ward without any other attendants ? A. Not that 1 remember now. Q. Have you ever been left with only one attendant beside your- self? A. Yes, sir. Q. How many are there usually there ? A There should be four. Q. And sometimes, you say, you have been left there with only one other attendant? A. Yes, sir. Q. In such cases, have you ever known of any violence taking place on the part of the patient ? A. I think I have, but cannot say what they were. Q. Can you state whether any violence has taken place when two of you have been together alone, so.that you have had to restrain patients ? A. I think not; I don't remember. Q. During your attendance on ward four, do you know whether any complaints were made to the doctors, by any patients, of ill- usage, or not ? A. Yes, sir; very often. Q. Can you recollect any such complaints ? A. Yes, sir; W. B. was one patient who complained of being hurt; I think it was Mr. Weir he laid it to. Q. What did he complain of; how did he complain ? A. He complained that Mr. Weir broke his ribs. Q. Were his ribs broken ? A. I don't know about that; I should judge not; I took care of him while he was there ; while he was sick a-bed; the doctor said I should take care of him ; he seemed to think more of him than of the others, and the doctor said I should take care of him. Q. Did the doctor say whether his ribs were broken or not? A. I think he told him they were not. Q. I will read the entry: 'kk Fourth ward, April 27, 1882; W. B. had a fight with J.; A. G. Weir, attendant, went to part them ; 651 B. then pitched into Weir, and in the scuffle got his left ear hurt; also the right thumb;" do you recollect that affray ? A. Yes, sir; partially ; I do remember something about it. Q. You remember B. being injured? A. Yes, sir. Q. And this states that in the scuffle he got his left ear and right thumb hurt; do you know whether his injuries wrere any greater than that, or not? A. He complained of his back; I don't know whether it was caused by the scuffle at that time; I know the doctors put a plaster on. Q. Did he complain of any thing else; A. I don't know of any thing more. Q. Haven't you stated that he complained that his ribs were broken ? A. Yes, sir; I did state that. Q. Yrou used to take care of him? A. Yes, sir. t^l; ■ ''-'•''•" Q. Was he confined to his bed ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How long ? . A. I think it was more than a week. Q. Did he appear to suffer any pain ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How frequently did the doctors call to see him during that time ? A. Quite often they called. Q. Did you consider he was suffering considerably ? A. Yes, sir ; of course he used to complain. Q. Did B, make any statement about how he was injured ? A. Yes, sir ; he thought that Mr. Weir done it. Q. Did he tell you that Mr. Weir had done it ? A. I cannot say now ; he made it very severe I know — that Mr. Weir was very cruel to him ; that is the way he stated it to me. Q. Were you present when the affray occurred ? r A. Yes, sir ; I was on the ward, at the other end. - '.J-" Q. Did you witness it ? A. Yes, sir; I did. Q. State what you saw ? A. I don't remember exactly how it started, but I know Mr. B. was a very rough patient; he had a little trouble in the dining- room ; I think they asked him to go up on the ward; I don't know whether he didn't want to go or not, but any way he was put on the ward. Q. How did Weir handle him ? A. He threw him on to the floor, well at least, they both — well, I don't know Avhether both got on the floor, but it was a sort of rough and tumble scuffle, in some way; I don't know how it hap- pened: 652 P Q. Did Weir get the best of it ? , A.I think he did. Q. Did anybody assist Weir ? A. No, sirj not that I know of ; not that I remember; at the commencement some of the patients might have got into the fuss. Q. Did any other attendant assist Weir ? A. No,-sir ; no other attendant that I know of. % Q.-Was any other attendant present besides you and Weir? A. I don't remember. Q. Why didn't you assist Weir ? A. I was away doAvn at the farther end of the room. A, What doing? A. I cannot say what I was doing, I hadn't been there a great while then. Q. When Weir had him down on the floor, Avhy didn't you then go to Weir's assistance ? A. They got right up then. Q. What was then done by Weir ? (Not answered). Q. What did he do with the patient? A. I think he got him into a chair. Q. Did he put him under restraint ? A. I think not then. Q. Where was the supervisor? A. I don't know. Q. What report was made of this occurrence? A. That I don't know, Weir was head attendant, he usually at- tended to the reports. Q. When did the doctor first see the patient, after this occurrence ? A. I don't remember as to that, but I presume in the afternoon. Q. Do you know whether any attempt was made to have a doctor attend at once or not ? A. I think not, I think he didn't appear to be injured. Q. When did he first complain of injury ? A. I think not until the next morning, but I am not positive. Q. Did yon sleep on the ward that night ? A. I think I did, I am not sure. Q. Didn't he complain, when he went to bed that night, of injury ? A. I don't remember of it now. Q. When did he complain that his ribs were broken ? A. I don't know but it was the same night about — well I don't know when it was he complained of that, he spoke of it very often when he was sick a-bed. Q. Was his face bruised ? A. No, sir ; not more than his ear. Q. Did you see that Weir used any unnecessary'violence? A. I didn't consider it so. Q. Did he strike the patient at all ? 653 A. Not that I saw. ' • i V. Q. Did he use his feet at all ? A. He used his feet but hot on the patient. Q. Did he trip him up ? A. I cannot say, I suppose so ; I could not see how. Q. Do you suppose he tripped him up ? A. It rather seems that possibly he did, bnt I could not say. Q. Did the attendants have to do that to overcome the patients? A. I think it is sometimes necessary ; yes, sir. Q. And they do sometimes trip up patients? A. Well, they sit them down in the chair sometimes—'well, 1 don't know that that would be tripping up —, I don't really mean that he — well, in some Avay or other in the scuffle — they were down, I don't mean to say he tripped him up. Q. You say attendants sometimes have to trip up patients ? A. Yes, sir; sometimes when they are very violent and pitch into us, Q. Then is it necessary to trip them up and throw them doAvn by that means ? A. Yes, sir; when they are very violent.' Q. Have you ever seen an attendant kick a patient ? A. Not more than myself. Q. Have you ever kicked a patient? A. Yes, sir. Q. What occasion ? A. One day I was shaving and Mr. F. came into my room when I was shaving, I took him out, he would not go, I took hold of, and led him out in Jdie ward, and went back to shave, he followed me back, I took him out and led him into theday-room, he followed me back, I told him to go out, and he didn't, and I hit him lightly to scare him out, and he stayed out. Q. Then you say you kicked him ? _ ,„_i; A. Yes, sir. Q. And he stayed out ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Have you ever seen any other attendant kick a patient? A. No, sir. Q. Have you ever seen an attendant punch a patient in the stomach or the abdomen ? A. I don't know; sometimes in a scuffle, possibly; I cannot say as to that; we usually grabbed hold, the best way to defend our- selves; sometimes they pitch in. Q. And you have to defend yourselves? A. Yes, sir. Q. And you use motive force, if necessary, to defend yourselves, do you ? A. Yes, sir. Q. That is necessary to complete your defense; did you ever have to strike a patient? 654 A. I don't remember as I ever struck a patient. Q. Have you ever seen an attendant, in the course of struggling with a patient, strike him ? A. No, sir; I think not. By Mr. Goodwin :» Q. You say you saw Dr. Gray on the wards, or while you were there, eight times, one of which was at the entertainment, and the second time, on the day that you came away, were the last that you saAV him ? A. I think I saw him more than once at the entertainment. Q. Did patients in your ward go out? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did yon go with them ? A. Some of the time. Q. And whether Dr. Gray was on the ward when you were out you don't know ? A. No, sir. Q. How do you know it was eight times ? A. I don't know that it was just eight. ""'"":"] Q. Why do you think it was about eight times? A. I remember once he came down — he came down on the ward and had a talk with Mr. C.; he was violent and Dr. Gray talked with him quite awhile. I'j, Q. You kept no memorandum? A. No, sir. Q. This Mr. B. was a very rough patient ? A. Yes, sir. ,'. ' - Q. Was he maniacal ? '' ^f :.] , A. I don't know about that. Q. Noisy, boisterous? A. Yes. Q. Fighting and striking ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Kicking? A. I don't know about kicking. Q. He attacked patients at times ? A. It was usually more attendants than doctors ; I have seen him throw stones at the doctors. Q. On this occasion, when he fell on Weir, do you know how that affray commenced, whether it was an attack made by Weir on him or by B. upon Weir ? A. I don't remember how it commenced. Q. Now, in reference to the tripping up of patients by attendants; when a patient attacks an attendant, does he close upon him ? A. He goes in any way, rough and tumble. Q. And in that way an attendant sometimes trips a patient ? A. Y es, sir; tries to defend himself in that way. 655 Q. Now, in reference to your kicking this patient — did you strike this man hard when you struck him, this man F.? A. I didn't intend to kick him hard, I meant to scare him away. Q. Did you or not, as a matter of fact, kick him hard ? A. I don't consider I did; I did what I could to get rid of him out of my room; patients were not allowed to be in there because we keep razors, etc., in there. Q. You were not discharged from the Asylum ? A. No, sir. Q. You left of your own accord ? A. Yes, sir. DANIEL BUCKLEY, Sworn and examined, testified as follows : By the Chairman : Q. Where do you reside ? A. Two hundred and eighteen Bleecker street, Utica. Q. What is your age ? A. About thirty-five or thirty-six. Q. What is your present occupation ? A. I am keeping a grocery store and saloon. < Q. Were you ever connected with the Utica Insane Asylum ? A. Yes, 1 was an attendant there; I think it was along in 1873-4 or '75. Q. Upon what wards were you situated ! A. On number twelve. Q. Please state to the committee whether you ever saw any ill- treatment of patients by attendants while you were there ? A. It is such a while ago, that I don't knoAV as I can remember very Avell noAv, but I will tell you just what I do remember; proba- bly I could not give you all the circumstances of each case, bnt I will give you a general idea of it; there were three of us and we had from twenty-four to thirty patients to look after, or thereabouts; and those were the very worst class of patients, that is, they could not be got along with on the other halls; they would get worse and be moved from ward to ward, until they went to number thirteen, and that was the dead house, they could not get along any further than that, they were very generally cured when they got there; noAv, as far as violence was concerned, we had to use a good deal of it; and I claim that there is no three mem that could be put there that could get along Avithout it: but, of course, I must say that I saw unnecessary violence there in some cases, and some things that I think should not be done ; when a patient attacked us, and we thought he was getting the best of us, of course we had to get the 656 best of him, and in the best way we could, and it was the general rule to kick him in the stomach or in the ribs, and that should be done too, because I think if the crazy man got the best of a fellow that he'd kill him; we Avas so few and there was many of them, and it was only by the greatest physical exertions that we could defend ourselves in fact; I have seen patients choked with a towel sometimes. Q. How was that done? A. I'll show yor ; here is a towel (talcing one from the, towel- rack); now, I'll show you if you will let me (the chairman then sub- mitted himself to an experiment); you take a strong towel and put it round their neck, and give it a twist like that (indicating), and you keep twisting it until the fellow was choked ; I saw that done the first time I was there and I could not very well look at it; the first attendant on the hall he generally oversees the whole thing; he has to answer for every thing as a general rule; w7e used to let him do the most of it; that is, we would help him; but I remember one thing that occurred with me and another fellow that was there; it was when I Avas third attendant, there was a fellow from New York, I think it was, by the name of R., a patient; he was in the crib and the attendant went out and made him sit up, and then he got a towel and choked him, like I put it on you (the chairman); well, he went to this felloAV in the crib and he choked him till he was dead and purple in the face,andafter here covered he made him sit up again, bnt the felloAV laid down and he made him sit up again and choired him and I think he poked him in the ribs with a broom in through the sides of the crib ; I saw him do that myself. Q.. W hat was the name of that attendant ? A. It was Reece; on another day I saw him do this to a patient; I forget the patient's name, but he asked for a cup of coffee — a little more coffee — and he answered him by hitting him with the back of his hand a clout in the face; that I pitied the man, for he was a good patient, and we had so many bad patients that Ave appre- ciated a good one ; and as soon as they got good, or better, they were taken away to abetter hall, and Ave got bad ones in their place. Q. How hard a blow did Reece hit this patient ? A. I should think just about as hard as he could. Q. Did it knock him down ? A. Well, he was sitting down at the time, so that he could not fall down. Q. What did the patient do ? A. He didn't do any thing; he took Avhat he got and said noth- ing ; he asked for coffee and got a clout. Q. Can yon recollect any other instances? . A. Well, in fact, it was a general thumping match all the way through; we were scarcely any day without one ; we had a fight about every day — Avell, it is a fact uoav, I assure you ; it was only some cases that I took particular notice of; another thing I would like to state to yon, gentlemen, I think it would be better if the 657 attendants had permission to do a little fighting, so that when they did it they would not have to hide it; for the bleaching out process, in my opinion, is worse than a licking for a fellow; he does not suffer so much I think from a thumping, as he does in being put into a cold bath to take the black and blue spots out of him. Q. Explain what you mean by the " bleaching out" process ; explain a little more fully ? A. I mean this: when a patient is licked, of course there are black marks on him — bruises — and to put him into cold water and i keep him there, why, it will take the discoloration out of his skin. Q. By Avhose authority Avere the cold baths given ? A. The doctors were supposed to know nothing about that. Q. Who ordered the baths then ? A. The fellow generally that licked the patient. Q. He made the prescription for him then himself? A. Yes; that was generally understood, that a cold bath would ,ake the black and blue spots off the skin. Q. How soon after the black and blue marks were given would the bath be administered ? A. Just at that moment. Q. How long would the bath last ? A. I could not exactly state. Q. Would you at once strip the patient and put him in the bath ? A. Yes, sir ; right off after the licking. Q. In what way did the attendants usually punish patients? A. With their hands and feet; when an attendant was attacked by a patient, he defended more with his feet than with his hands. Q. How did he use his feet? A. In a natural way — kicked with them; generally kicked the fellows in the stomach and ribs. Q. Why was that done ? A. In some cases the patients were so bad that the attendants had to protect themselves the best way they could ; there is no man that will allow a madman to attack him without defending himself; in some cases — even if your father or brother was there, you would have to do that; a madman would kill you if he got a chance, and you must not let him get the chance. Q. Can you recall any other instances where you saw patients struck by attendants ? A. I saw them struck most every day, but there was one case in particular — the patient's name was Heath. Q. What occurred in his case ? A. The head attendant always goes away with a patient if one is sent off; the head was away, and me and this other fellow was'left alone on the hall ; I had a good deal to do in the dining-room, and I was in there at the time ; the second attendant had told me that Heath had got a boot to hit him with, and he came to me in the din- I ing-room and he said he thought the best thing we could do was | to put this fellow in restraint; I told him I thought so too, because 83 U 658 it would keep him out of trouble, and keep us out of trouble too; I was working pway in the dining room and I had some patients with me helping, and I looked through the glass door and saw this Heath out there ; Reece asked me to come and help him as soon as he got the straps out of the clothes-room—you know what they are, perhaps; I kept looking through the door, ready to go out; as Reece came with the straps, this fellow, Heath, put up his hands in this way (pugilistically), and told Reece to come along; Avhen I see that, I turned the key in the door and jumped out and I caught Heath by the hand and by the shoulder; then this Reece and an- other fellow, a patient named O'Hara, a fellow who committed sui- cide since at Buffalo — we took him (Heath) into the bath-room and got the muffs on to him ; then this Reece he coked him with a towel, choked him and kicked him; he choked him and kicked him with the toe and heel of his shoe. By Mr. Goodwin : Q. Who was that — Reece ? A. Yes, sir ; he never touched the man until he was tied and then he choked hiin and kicked him ; then he gave him a cold bath ; then he strapped him down to the chair ; well, Dr. Gray came along that day, and I suppose he found the man in a bad condition; Dr. Gray came up to see the man ; I was working aAvay in the din- ing room; Dr. Andrews came into me and told me that Dr. Gray wanted to see me in the office, and I went doAvn ; the moment I went in the doctor said we had killed that man — that was, Dr. Gray said so ; I was stunned ; to accuse me of killiug a man; it was something queer to me; when I recovered myself, Dr. Gray had started off then and he went along, Dr. Gray did ; I started after him as soon as I could, but I did not overtake Dr. Gray ; bnt I overtook Dr. Andrews on eleven, I think; I told him I did not want to be accused of hurting that man ; he said he knew nothing about ,it; I said that I did, and that was the reason I spoke about it; then I made up my mind that I should leave, because I would rather leave than tell how the thing was done. Q. Why? A. I don't know ; but I always had an idea that informers were almost as bad as criminals ; I did not want to hang a fellow, and I thought my evidence Avould hang Reece, and I did not want to in- form on him. Q. Is there any understanding among attendants as to informing on each other ? A. No, sir ; except it is the general rule that if a person tells any thing, he is supposed to be------if he makes it a practice to tell the doctors any thing, he is------well, he is called a " sucker," or some such name as that, and they all get down on him ; so it is the general rule that one does not tell what happens. Q. Proceed Avith what took place between you and Dr. Andrews? 659 A. He went off; he said no more about it; I think it was my night out; I do not remember the circumstances, but I Avould not go out without I got permission to ; but this Reece went out with- out permission ; the doctor told him he was violating the rules; he said he didn't care; I sent a fellow to see Mr. Bulger about the thing — the present city judge, but he was neither judge nor re- corder at that time ; he was in Seymour's office ; I sent a fellow down to my uncle and told him to go to Bulger and tell him the circumstances; I am not certain whether Bulger was a judge or not at that time ; I think he wasn't; the next day I was called down to the office by Dr. Gray ; I was examined about the matter, but I did not_ tell him a word of truth; I told him the felloAV fell in the chair and "hurted" himself in that way ; when I went from the office he told me to send Reece down '; I told Reece what I had told Dr. Gray, and for him to follow what I had told him; when the other fellow came back, I told him what Bulger said about it; Bulger told me that Ave could not be compelled to give any evidence that would criminate ourselves ; he told me I had better be careful, that if the other fellow should make a statement and say that I did it, I should have to suffer; all my friends wanted me to tell how it was done, but I did not like to be an informer, I did not like to tell it; I thought if I suffered any thing it would be that I was inno- cent and that would help me to bear it; after he told me that, I Avas a little uneasy; and Dr. Ford, when he came along the next day, I told him I Avould like to have the case investigated; he said I had a right to go and tell Dr. Gray every thing I knew about it, and he thought that was the best thing I could do; he said he knew there was a rule amongst us that we did not like to tell on one an- other, but that in this case I had better tell all about it to Dr. Grry ; but I thought myself that an informer was almost as bad as a crim- inal ; I said that if I Avas sworn in a court of justice I would tell the truth, but not until then. Q. Was there any inquest held 't A. I don't suppose there was any; I don't believe there was. (See page 100). Q. Do yon know any other patient who died from the results of injuries inflicted by an attendant ? A. No, sir; I do not know any. Q. Can you recall any other case Avhere an attendant inflicted any considerable injury on an attendant? A. I don't know that I can in particular; but Ave had to do a good deal to protect ourselves, and we have to do a good deal of fighting. Q. Explain what you meant by saying that the attendant used the toe and heel of his boot on the patient? A. Kicking in this way, indicating with the toe, and stamping in that way, indicating with the heel. Q. Where on his body would he stamp on him like that ? A. In the ribs. .660 Q. Have you ever seen a patient injured in the dining-room ex- cept the man you spoke of that was hit in the face ? A. It seems to me that we had to put some of them out of the dining-room sometimes because if they got to going it in the dining- room, it Avas a dangerous place, there was knives and forks round, and it was a bad place to have a row, in the dining-room. Q. On those occasions were the men (patients, violently handled? A. I can't recollect as to that particularly, but if such a thing was necessary it was done, and if they resisted, they were forced out, and as much force is used as is necessary to put them out. Q. Did the doctors ever inquire of you as to the black eyes and bruises that occur from time to time ? A. I do not remember; I was third attendant, and for a little while I was first attendant. Q. So far as you know, do the doctors accept the statements of the attendants as conclusive, or do they sometimes ask patients? A. Sometimes they ask patients, but as a general rule the patients are too crazy to tell any thing. Q. As a general rule then the doctors limit their inquiries to the first attendant ? A. I can recollect a case where I was asked on one occasion, and that was about an attendant and patient on another hall — the patient had marks about him; I was asked about it; I told you that it is not supposed that persons tell the truth up there; the question is asked and an attendant can answer just as he sees fit; of course no attendant is going to tell any thing that will do him any harm. Q. Do you mean to say that the doctors know how the patients are treated, as you have described ? A. I should think that anybody of any common sense could tell that three men cannot take care of twenty-five or thirty mad men, without using a good deal of physical force —all they can use. Q. What time in the year did this affair with Heath occur? A. It was in December, I cannot exactly tell — it was November or December. Q. About Avhat year ? A. I should think about 1874—1873; I left there the 1st of January and it happened quite a while before that — probably a month or two before I left. Q. What became of Reece after that event? A. After a while he was discharged. Q. How long after the death of Heath was Reece discharged ? A. Probably a month ; I do not know whether he was discharged after his month was up or not. Q. Do you know whether he was discharged or allowed to leave of his own accord ? A. Well, what he did was enough to get him discharged; he went down town without leave, and that is why he was discharged. 661 Q. How long was he kept in the institution after the violation of that rule ? A. I think he was kept until his month was out; whether or not he was kept longer than that I do not know; there was only two of us in the Avhole ward when Heath was injured — that is nie and Reece, and the following day Reece went out in violation of the rules. Q. Can you recall any other circumstances connected with the institution that, in your judgment, are to be criticised. A. I don't know, but in a general way; the first introduction I got there into these matters was at time when we were alone — me and another fellow, and it was the first week I was there — there were two other attendants part of the time, tAvo and myself; there was a man there, a patient from Albany, named P. R." Q. Is that the one that yon stated was from New York ? You gave the name of a patient of that name from New York. A. They were different men ; the first R. I spoke of, I don't know, for sure, whether he was from New York or not; but this R.- was from Albany, he used to keep a hotel; there was a chair in his room and there was a fellow there by the name of P., he wanted this R. to go into the dining-room and get some knives for to kill us; I heard this, and I was only a feAV days there; I heard this P., as he was passing me, say, he would give that fellow a through ticket for h—1 before night; after dinner he wanted R. to come in and get the knives; R. would not join him, so he went and got a chair out of the sick man's room, and he Avent for the attendant'with that; this attendant had told me that if ever there was any one man on that ward that he could not lick, himself alone, that he would leave the Asylum ; he was not a very big fellow ; he Avas rather light, and I thought he must be of extraordinary good material if he could lick any one on that hall; he was the head attendant; his name was Griffiths ; well, this P. went for Griffiths, and I was going to interfere but he told me to leave it between himself and the patient ; I obeyed orders and left it betAveen them, but the patient was making sharp work of him, or Avas giving him too much, so I pitched in to help Griffiths and stop this P. ; there was a number of patients there all round and they kept shouting for to leave it between the tAvo, they were tickled to death to see a patient getting the better of an at- tendant ; I had to do all I could to keep the others from pitching in to help the patient; me and the other attendant pitched into the whole crowd of them, and.every man that had got up on his feet we locked them all in their rooms ; after that when this Griffiths had rested a little, he wanted to go at this P. again and have another lick at him ; he went to the room where P. was locked in, he went in and told me to lock the door; I locked the door, and after a while I thought I would look in to see how they were get- ting on,' I opened the door and saw they were at it, I just saw that one was a top of the other, then I shut th e door again, and waited a little while, then all of a sudden I thought that I hadn't taken 662 particular notice to see which Avas a top — I opened the door again at once to see how it Avas, and there was the patient a top, and if he Avasn't a pounding the very old Harry out of this Griffiths, so I went for the patient and give him a licking myself, I was most tired out by the time we got the best of him ; then Ave went round to all of them that took part, and there was not one of them that got on his feet that AA7e did not — Avell, we gave them all a "going over" they use that term avhen they mean that they gave them a good pounding, I held them and the other fellow pounded them. Q. How did he pound them ? A. Kicked them with his hands and feet or kicked them with his feet I mean ; we treated probably six or seven in that way ; it Avas pretty hard work, I had fought so much that I was quite tired out at night; aatc had all broken bones and black eyes; I broke that fin- ger of my hand — the little finger of my left hand ; there was only two of us, remember, and if Ave had not got them in their rooms, and they had pitched on to us together, I think they would have killed us, sure. Q. What report was made of this battle to the authorities I A. I guess they were told the truth about that ; this patient P. almost killed another patient, and he broke the chair by striking the attendant on tile shoulder; it wTas a heavy boarded chair and it was split clean through, and one-half of it struck a patient named A. and almost killed him, he had to be taken care of. Q. Did he go to the hospital? A. Well, that is quite an hospital itself. I don't know what the doctors were told about that matter, I did not tell them any thing; we had to fight for our lives that day, and if the other felloAV hadn't helped and locked them in their rooms before he Avent away, I th ink they would have killed us, I was strange there and many of them took me for a patient. Q. How long a time did this battle last? A. It lasted from somewhere about one o'clock to about half- past four. Q. And during that time did not any of the doctors put in an appearance? A. No, sir; you see it is one to so many ; now imagine one man like this gentleman here [the stenographer] having to take care of twenty-five like me; why, there was one man on that ward —a patient — he could lick all the attendants on three halls if he only once got to going. Q. Did he ever have any difficulty with the attendants? A. Yes, he got into some trouble with them; he got roughly handled ; there were all the attendants of two halls at him at once. Q. Wae he hurt? A. I don't think he was, he was so stout that I don't think any amount of pounding could hurt him. 665 Q. Can you recollect any other instance^of striking or kicking in the stomach ? A. Nothing, only that was the general rule. Q. Why did they have that rule? A. Weil, because it would leave no mark, and it would be the quickest way to get the best of them. Q. Did you ever see a patient struck in that way by an attendant? A. I did, and I struck them so myself; I know at one time a fellow attacked me, he was a stout felloAV, and I knoAV that if I had not hit him like that just when I did he would have got the best of me. Q. When yon left the Asylum, did you leave of your own accord or were you discharged ? A. I don't know as I can say whether I Avas discharged or whether I left; but I will tell you how it was and you can see: It was after this Heath affair that I told about, and after Reece left; the attend- ants thought I had told on Reece, and I found I could not get along , with the fellow on the ward with me, his name was Connors, and he had charge of the ward at the time; he found fault with every thing I did. Q. Found fault with you to whom ? A. Well, grumbled ; he wanted me to keep the milk from the patients so that the attendants could have it, and I would not do it; and he wanted me to keep things from the table; Ave did not eat them and they would only spoil, and I thought the patients ought to have them, they did not get any too much; they told me to take care of myself, and when I would be crazy to expect the same treat- ment ; I thought it Avas not a good thing to be quarreling, so I went down to the office; I told Dr. Gray I could not get along with them fellows and wanted to be changed to another ward; I told him it was not a matter I was to blame in, that I kneAV I could give satis- faction on any other ward, bnt I did not want to go on any of the wards where his friends were; I told him I would rather go out in the snow and Avork barefoot, and if I did not get a change to some other hall, I would take one myself; I did not get a change, but I had a notice from Mr. Dryer, the steward ; he told me that Dr. Gray had made up his mind that he would not make any change, so I left. Q. How frequently did Dr. Gray visit the wards during the ten months yon were there? A. We expected him about once a month ; he would probably come round with some visitors, but I don't remember of any time • when he came to see any patients, except to see one fellow that had a sore leg. Q. Was that the result of an injury received in the Asylum ? A. No, sir; I don't think it wras. Q. You say you did not see him oftener than once a month, to your knowledge ? A. I don't think he did, except to come around with some visitor; 664 I can only recall that one instance when he came to see a patient; I think he was there then. Q. Did you write a letter to the " Daily Press " of this city in February ? A. I did ; I took it there; I gave it to the one that I supposed was the editor. Q. Do you know his name ? A. No, sir; I did not know him. Q. Did you know Mr. McCauley the telegraph operator? A. I think I had an introduction to him; I met him somewhere. Q. Where did you have that introduction ? A. Mr. Welch was telling me that he introduced me to some young man, and he told me that was the man ; it was two or three weeks ago. Q. Was it before or after you sent the letter to the paper ? A. That I could not say. Q. Do you recollect whether yon subsequently met this young man McCauley at the newspaper office or not ? A. I could not say that I saw him at the newspaper office, but Lynch told me he gave me an introduction to him. Q. Hoav did you get introduced to the editor of the paper? A. I have written different articles. Q. Did you go alone to the newspaper office ? A. Not at that time, there was another fellow with me ; Mr. William Mahoney. By Mr. Goodwin : Q. Were yon upon any other ward but one ? A. No, sir; only on one ward — that was No. 12. Q. Give us the names of all the attendants that were on that Avard while you were there that yon can now recollect ? A. When I went there first there was Griffith Griffiths, David Reece and myself; then Griffiths Avas changed and Connors took his place, and Reece left and a fellow named Dillon came — Tim Dillon, he is now a politician in Utica; that was all; that is the names of all the attendants that were on the ward with me at the time I was there. Q. You only say you saw Dr. Gray on the ward on one occasion 1 A. We expected him to come about once a month, I don't re- member whether he forgot to come and make his monthly round, I , don't remember ; he was there to see this man with the sick leg. Q. And when he was there at other times yon say it was with people on the wards ? A. I could not say exactly, because it is so long ago ; he came through with the supervisors, probably, or some visitors coming through ; those are the only occasions that I remember. Q. You saAV him there when he was there with Dr. Andrews — that was another time ? 665 A. Yes, sir ; he was there at that time. Q. Did you have any difficulty with Reece ? A. No, sir. Q. Did you have any difficulty with Connors ? A. I could not say as I did until after this affair happened. Q. Did you at any time report to the authorities any of these cases of cruelty, and injuries inflicted on patients-? A. I did not, and I would leave first. Q. Did you ever tell Dr. Gray or any other of the physicians what did occur upon the wards ? A. I can't remember that I was ever asked except about this case that I mentioned; and I cannot remember just Avhat I told the doctor at that time. Q. Whatever you did tell him, it was not the truth, was it? A. I did not tell him how the man wa,s injured ; I did not tell on the other attendant. Q. You say that Dr. Ford said to you he understood that ther was an understanding between the attendants that they would no tell what occurred on the ward ? f A. I don't knoAV that he said he was aware of it, but he spoke as though that Avas his opinion about it, he said that it was a rule, or he supposed it was a rule not to tell of one what another did, but he said that this was a different matter, it was a serious thing, and he did not think it was manly for me to deny what I knew about it; that was about Heath's case. Q. How many patients have you put in baths for the purpose of removing black and blue spots from them? A. I never put any in, not individually myself; I would help put them and I have helped to do it. Q. What attendants have you seen put patients into baths to re- move bruises ? A. I saw Reece ; I don't know that I can recollect the instances to be positive about it, but I know that Avas the rule ; I don't know that I can remember now any particular cases ; it is ten years ago. Q. Did you see Judge Bulger yourself personally ? A. No, sir, I could not get away; could not get permission to get out. Q. Did you ever talk about this matter after you left ? A. No, sir, I did not mention it much. Q. Did you ever tell any one connected with the Asylum as to the cruelties practiced upon the patients by the attendants ? A. No, I don't remember that I ever did. Q. What is your best judgment whether yon ever did or not? A. I don't think that I ever did. By Mr. Olin : Q. Did you ever have any conversation with Dr. Gray about this ease of Mr. Heath other than what you have stated ? 84 U 666 A. When he called me to the office the night following after the night of that day, I told him he was a big, powerf nl man, and that we had a good deal of trouble to get the best of hiin and that in falling, he fell on the seat of the chair, so as to give him an idea that he got hurt by falling on the chair. Q. You told him that in answer to his questions and then he sent for Mr. Reece ? . A. Yes, sir, he told me to send Reece down, and I told Reece what story I had told Dr. Gray. Q. Have yon any thing further to state about the Asylum? A. I said we had to use force there, and we did ; but I will say this, that one kind-hearted attendant was worth all the doctors that can be got into the Asylum ; the other attendants claimed that I was making too free with the patients and was spoiling them. 5 ^ By Mr. Goodwin : Q. When your communication was taken to the " Press " office, was there any alteration or correction made in the copy ? A. I cannot say whether he made any corrections or not; he might have substituted some words for others; but I think all he did to it was to cross the " t's " and pip the " i's." Q. Did you see him erase any words ? A. I could not say that I did, I don't remember it; he read it over to himself when I took it; I can't tell w7hat alterations he made, if he made any; I asked him if he would publish it, if he did not think it was fit for publication, if he did that I would send him in the rest of it; he said he would insert it; I gave him that part then and I went and got the other part and brought it that night.j Q. Did he read that j over? A. I can't say whether he did or not. Q. Did he make any corrections in it — in the second part? .":", A. I can't say whether he did or not; I don't think he did any more than to cross the T's or dot the I's. By Mr. Olin : Q. Did he ask you to furnish any other communications ? A. No, sir, he did not ask for any other, g 667 JOHN J. HALPIN, Recalled : By Mr. Rice : Q. Why were you discharged from the Asylum ? A. I saw from what you told me the other day that it was seduction. Q. You said something hereabout your marriage the last time you were here ? A. Yes, sir; I stated about it. Q. Did your marriage occur without much knowledge before hand ? A. No knowledge up there at the Asylum whatever. Q. They had not heard of it ? A. No, sir; but if Dr. Gray had spoken to me like a man I could have shown him my papers. Q. How long had your marriage engagement existed before the contract was consummated ? A. It had existed for a couple of months. Q. Was any charge made against you on the part of the young lady before marriage ? A. No, sir ; never ; not at all. Q. Then the marriage was had in pursuance of an agreement previously made ? A. Yres, sir; two months before. Q. How long had the day been fixed for the marriage ceremony ? A. As near as I can remember it was a couple of months. At a meeting of the committee, Senator Goodwin being present on behalf of the Asylum, and after a private consultation of the committee, the Chairman stated that the committee had agreed upon the rolloAving programme: To-morrow (Saturday) to examine the steward of the Asylum, and such witnesses as may there be found convenient to examine. That on Tuesday afternoon at 3:30, at the room of the present committee at the Capitol, Albany, they would examine certain business men of Albany concerning certain accounts of the Asylum; that on Wed- nesday afternoon they would examine Miss Augusta Woods of Canajoharie at the same place, and that then, unless other witnesses were produced on that afternoon not now anticipated, the committee would close the taking of testimony on their part until after the Asylum authorities have made such defense or rebuttal as to them seemed expedient. That the committee would endeavor to put the counsel for the Asylum in possession of all the testimony to date early next week, and of all testimony in which the Asylum had not 668 been represented by counsel by that time. That the committee will expect the Asylum authorities to commence their answer or rebut- tal to testimony already taken at Baggs' Hotel, Utica, Thursday evening at eight o'clock. That they will sit to hear further testi- mony on the following day and on Saturday, either at Baggs' Hotel or the Asylum, or at Albany, as may be more convenient for the Asylum authorities and will continue to take such testimony as fast as the Asylum authorities can prepare and present the same, subject to such engagements in the Assembly as the committee may have. Mr. Goodwin—1 do not understand that the Asylnm authorities are limited to any number of days to put in their testimony ? The Chairman — The committee will not noAv say how many days they will restrict the Asylum authorities to, but obviously there must be every effort made to limit it to as few days as possible, in consquence of the probability of an early adjournment of the Assem- bly and the necessity of the committee closing this testimony in time to prepare their report and submit it to the Legislature before its close. Mr. Rice — I move that this committee close the taking of testi- mony on or before April 1. Seconded by Mr. Olin, and unanimously carried. Mr. Goodwin — I desire to ask the committee if the Asylum authorities will be allowed to present any rebuttal testimony to whatever evidence may be taken by the committee after the evi- dence required by the committee to be put in by the Asylum authorities commencing on Thursday evening next. The Chairman — I will not bind the committee to that now, but my impression is such testimony as the committee may put in, in reference to the Asylum authorities, will be in and of itself solely in rebuttal or sur-rebuttal to thoir testimony. Mr. Rice— But if the committee produce any more evidence-in- chief, the Asylum authorities will be allowed to answer it. The Chairman — Certainly. Mr. Goodwin — Will the committee require the managers to an- swer testimony that has not been placed in the hands of their coun- sel at the meeting on Thursday next ? Mr. Rice — Mr. GoodAvin has part of the testimony and has taken notes of the testimony of other Avitiiesses—of this old lady who testified this afternoon, for instance ; I think the notes taken should enable him to prepare to ansAver that testimony. Mr. Goodwin — If there is any evidence taken before the com- mittee that does not require an answer on rebuttal from the mana- gers of the Asylum, will the committee particularize? The Chairman — I think that is for the Asylum to say. Mr. Haskell— That views my sentiments to a dot. Mr. Goodwin — I understood when I was presented to the com- mittee as representative of the Asylum, that the understanding was that all of the testimony produced before the committee was to be submitted to the Asylum, and that after such submission counse 1 669 were to have the right to present such testimony as was deemed necessary to meet it; by the ruling of the committee, I think that rule has not been fully carried out, if the committee now propose to make counsel rebut from notes taken by him at the sessions of the committee. The Chairman — In answer to that the committee will under- take to furnish counsel of the Asylum in advance of the printed notes, a full stenographic report of all the testimony taken down to this date, by next Wednesday afternoon, if the stenographer can possibly get it out by that time; that the committee will see that a duplicate copy of the testimony is sent to the Asylum authorities at the same time that the same is sent to the printer. Mr. Goodwin — I understood from some of the managers of the Asylum that a number of names were presented to the attorney of the committee and chairman, of witnesses to be subpoenaed before the committee; and as I understood, it was agreed that such names as were presented would be subpoanaed by the committee. The Chairman — No member of the committee has knowledge of any such list of names, but the committee are informed by their sergeant-at-arms—Mr. Henderson—that Mr. Swan did give to Mr. Morgan the names of two witnesses whom he desired to have subpoenaed; one of them was Mr. Eastman, editor of the Utica Dressy and the other was Mr. C. W. Sherlock, correspondent of the Syracuse Herald; that Mr. Eastman has been, as Mr. Goodwin is aware, examined this afternoon, and cross-examined by Mr. Good- win ; that if desired the committee will subpsena Mr. Sherlock for such afternoon next week, Tuesday or Wednesday, as Mr. Goodwin may select. Mr. Goodwin — Now, I will ask if I may bring this subject be- fore the committee when Mr. Morgau is present, to-morrow? ..., The Chairman — Certainly. At this stage Mr. Morgan came in, and with reference to the fore- going matters said : " I was asked if I would have these witnesses subpoenaed, ancL,! said I would submit it to the committee; that I thought if their testimony was going to be taken they would be called." The Chairman— What names did Mr. Swan give to you ? Mr. Morgan — He gave me the correspondent of the Syracuse Sunday Herald, and he gave me the name of the editor of the Buf- falo Fxpress, J. N. Matthews, that is all. The Chairman — Did he give you the name of Mr. Eastman ? Mr. Morgan — That was spoken of at the time, but you gentle- men had already(spoken about calling Mr. Eastman; that was ar- ranged already. The committee then adjourned. 670 Saturday, March 15, 1884. The committee met at 9:30 this a. m., in the reception-room, on the ground floor of the Asylum, and continued the investigation, as follows: Present — Messrs. Howe, Haskell, Olin and Rice. EMMA BARKER, SAvorn and examined, testified as follows: By the Chairman : Q. What is your age ? A. Forty-four. Q. What position do you hold in this institution ? A. Matron. Q. How long have you been occupied with the institution ? A. Nearly twenty years ; all that. Q. What positions have you held during that time ? A. Attendant, night watch and matron. Q. How long have you been matron ? A. Since 1867. Q. What are your duties ? A. A general care, as I understand it, of the patients and their clothing, particularly with sick ones. Q. What are your duties with reference to the inspection of the wards and of the bed-rooms ? A. I consider it one of my duties to see that their beds are prop- erly cared for, clean and warm, and that the patients are warm at night. Q. How often do you go through each ward ? A. Sometimes two or three times a day; sometimes two or three days; I don't go through all the wards ; it is according to my other duties. Q. Do you go through as often as two or three days ? A. Oh, yes, sir ; I average it. Q. Hqw many attendants have you under you ? A. 1 believe we have forty-four now. Q. These are all on the female side of the institution ? A. Yes, sir ; including a dressmaker and plain sewing. ' Q. And you are the head of the ladies' side of the institution ? A. Yes, sir ; I suppose so. Q. And directly under the doctors ? 671 A. Yes, sir ;~Dr. Brush is the physician in charge. Q. And Dr. Quinn is his assistant ? A. Dr. Backus was some time ago, bnt it has changed ; it is Dr. Quinn now. Q. What attention do the physicians give to patients under your observation ? A. I do not quite get what you want. Q. How often do they go through the Avards ? A. Twice a day and in cases of sickness oftener, several times if a patient is sick. Q. In the absence of physicians who are in charge of the patients ? A. W'e are never without a physician. Q. I mean when they are away from the Avard ? A. The one that has charge of the ward, the supervisor of the department. Q. How many patients are there to an attendant ? A. I think it is about an average of one attendant to ten or twelve patients. A. Is there any difference in the proportion of the attendants be- tween the violent wards and those where patients are quieter? A. Yes, sir; we have more help on the disturbed wards. Q. What are the violent wards on the ladies side ? A. Seven, eight, nine and eleven, seven, eight and nine are the Avorst, they are about the same classification. Q. How many attendants are there on these wards ? A. Four on each. Q. About how many patients are there on each of these wards, from time to time ? A. Twenty-one and sometimes twenty-four, as we have extras. Q. Are there ever times when you are short of attendants on these wards ? A. Yes, sir; there have been a few times. Q. How long at a time are you short of attendants on these wards ? A. We do not mean to be short very long on the ward, if we can take an attendant from a better ward, w7e„ send them back to the other wards, because of the danger on the disturbed wards. Q. Do you examine attendants before they are employed, yourself? A. Yres, sir; a short examination. Q. They are first submitted to your examination before they are employed ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How long an examination or inquiry do you make ? A. Not very long; it depends a little upon the attendant. Q. How long have you been accustomed — how long have yon been consulted in regard to the fitness of employees ? A. I hardly know, specially within the last few weeks or a month, or since the civil service came in; before that, sometimes I didn't see them until after they were engaged. Q. What do you^mean by civil service ? 672 A. They pass a sort of examination, and in seeing them — the examination is passed in my room — that they can read and write, etc. Q. Do you refer to a special rule of this institution created recently ? A. I don't know that it applied to this institution any more than to any others. Q. You understand that the civil service law of the State applies to this institution ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And applicants are subjected to examination ? Mr. Goodwin — I will state that the commissioners appointed Dr. Brush and Mr. Dryer, the steward, as such committee ; I don't know when it commenced. A. I think it was about the first of January it commenced. Q. Is it a board of commissioners ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Who composes that board at present in the institution ? A. The first assistant physician, Dr. Brush, Mr. Dryer and myself. Q. What have been the duties of that board so far ? A. To examine into the condition of the attendants, if theyare in health and apparently strong, and that they can read and write. Q. Do I understand you to say that they have instituted an examination of the attendants in the institution ? A. No, sir ; only those that come in since that time. Q. How many attendants have come into the institution since the first of January ? A. Six I think have been examined, and one didn't come. Q. Have you any idea how many on this side of the house? A. No, sir; they have examinations of attendants on the ladies' side of the house, and are conducted by all three commissioners; I have nothing to do with the other side of the building. Q. What do you require as necessary qualifications for an at- tendant ? A. As to good health and good nature mainly. Q. What examination do you subject them to ? A. As to what ? Q. Any thing. A. We have simple sums in addition and subtraction and require them to write, stating their age and generally what they have been employed in before coming there. Q. Do you make any inquiry outside as to their previous circum- stances ? A. We require now a recommendation. Q. A written recommendation ? A Either that or if any one of the Board or any person who was acquainted with them and recommended them, it would be suf- ficient, I think. Q. Was not that always the case, your requiring that? A. No, sir; not always binding, it was often asked. 673 Q. Sometimes attendants were taken without such recommenda- tion ? A. Yes, sir; on their good appearance. • Q. That is to say persons came here and applied for work, and if they seem to be respectable or trustworthy, are employed without a recommendation ? A. Yes, sir ; they might be. Q. Do I understand you to say that was the general practice for some time prior to the change just made ? A. Yes, sir, as I understand it. Q. Have there been frequent changes in the staff of attendants during the past few years ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Has the institution experienced any trouble in the matter of securing proper attendants? A. I should not call it serious trouble; occasionally, of course, we have a little. Q. How long did the attendant stay on the average, there ? A. Perhaps on an average two or three years ; some stay for a long time. Q. Y ou think two or three years is the average ? A. Well, perhaps, that is not quite long enough; I have never given the matter very much thought; some of them have been there ten or fifteen years; I rather think it is not, on the average, long enough. Q. Have you ever heard complaints from patients as to ill-usage by attendants ? A. Yes, sir, I have. Q. Do you know whether attendants have ever inflicted any ill- usage on patients ? A. No, sir; I have never seen them abuse patients, not to recall an instance. Q. When you have heard such complaints, what inquiry have yon made in regard to it ? A. I generally go to the attendant and ask her what she knows of it; if there are two or three attendants, I go to one and then another, and sometimes talk it over with the patient, consider it and decide it as best I can. Q. HaAre you never ascertained that injuries have been so in- flicted ? A. Sometimes, in controlling a patient, there has been an injury, but not intentional; I know of one instance that occurred, but I didn't see it; the person admitted it; that was a case of a Miss Redner who struck a patient. Q. When was that ? A. I should think about four or five years ago, some little time ago. Q. What was done with Miss Redner ? A. She was discharged. 85 U 674 Q. Do you recollect any other case where a patient has been struck or badly used by'an attendant ? A. I cannot recollect now, I cannot think of any just now. Q. You can take your time, we don't wish to hurry you at all. Do you knoAV of cases where patients have been seriously injured in the institution on the ladies' side ? A. No, sir ; I do not recollect any now. Q. Have you ever seen patients bruised, or apparently suffering from bruises, or injuries ? A. I have seen them bruised, of course. Q. Is that an unusual sight? A. It is not very frequent, only occasional. Q. What inquiries are made when such injuries are observed ? A. How it occurred, what was the occasion for any difficulty. Q. Of whom are inquiries made ? A. Of patients and attendants, and sometimes of the supervisor, of everybody from whom we think we can get any information. Q. Do you regard the testimony of attendants, on this subject, as entirely trustworthy ? A. Sometimes I should entirely, and again I should rather make further inquiries, and do so, but generally speaking, I think I should. Q. You think,- sometimes, that attendants are not entirely to be trusted ? A. I should not think it would be justice to trust them, without making some kind of inquiry, that is if they were people with whom I had little acquaintance ; if I had known them a longtime, I should feel a little doubt about it. Q. Do yon knoAV of any patients who have died in the institution of suicide, whose death has resulted from injuries received in the institution ? A. No, sir. Q. Either by the hands of patients or attendants ? A. I don't recollect any now. Q. Do you know Ann Burns, an attendant? A. Yes, sir. Q. Is she still here ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What is her character ? A. We have always considered it good. Q. Do you regard her as a considerate attendant ? A. Yes, sir ; I do. Q. Is she a person who is considered as truthful ? A. Yes, sir; I should think so. Q. How long has she been in the institution ? A. Twelve or thirteen years. Q. What is her present position ? A. She has charge of number twelve. Q. Have you ever heard any story, or charge of any immorality on her part with an attendant ? 675 A. Yes, sir ; I have heard it. Q. Do you know any of the circumstances connected with it, whether it is true or not. A. I haven't the slightest idea ; i don't know. ' Mr. Goodwin — Ask her from whom she heard it. Q. From whom have you heard remarks ? A. From a former patient, Mrs. Fulford. Q. Have you heard from any other source ? A. No, sir. Q. Was there a man here by the name of Jones ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Is he still here ? A. Yes, sir ; he is carpenter here. Q. All you know about it is what Mrs. F. told you. A. Yes, sir. Q. When did you first hear of it from her ? A. I think it was after she left, Miss Burns was on the ward —, she was on her ward ; I can hardly tell, which told me first, the i attendant or Mrs. Fulford told me of it while she was on number four, that was one of our better wards, the attendant told me what Mrs. Fulford had said. Q. Miss Burns came to you herself ? A. She talked with me about it; it was a long time after it hap- pened. Q. How old is this Miss Burns ? A. Twenty-seven or eight. Q. Have you ever heard of anj7 stories, or remaks of immoralities committed in the institution, either upon patients or attendants? A. I have heard such talk, I have heard of it here. Q. From wbom have you heard it ? A. Well, in regard to what Miss Lathrop had said, I heard it; she never told me herself, only what I have heard from the testi- mony. Q. From whom did you hear of that occurrence? A. I cannot tell now. Q. From a patieut or attendant or physician ? A. I cannot recollect, if I can think, I will tell you bye and bye; I cannot say who told me. Q. Did you hear of it before the investigation of last year ? A. No, sir, I did not. Q. Are there any male persons connected with the institution who could get access to the female wards except the doctors ? A. I don't know, I don9t-think so, still I cannot say positively in regard to that, whether a person who takes care of the heating ap- [ paratus would have any thing to do ; I don't know. Q. Did you know whether or not the night watchmen have pass- ; keys that would admit them into such wards? A. I don't know whether they have or not. 676 Q. What is the system of night watchman on the female side of the building ? A. We have three night watchmen, two Avho pass through each ward every hour — they are women; then we have another, who has special' charge of suicidal cases, she stays on the ward and takes charge of two large dormitories, and single rooms. t Q. What check is there upon the faithfulness of the night watch- ers in performing then* duty; do they have any watchman's clock? A. No, sir ; we have to trust them ; sometimes I go on the ward frequently myself at nights. Q. But there is no check or supervision ? A. No, sir. Q. How frequently do you go through the building at night after it is closed up ? A. I hardly know how7 to answer that; perhaps I should not go if it was a particularly cold night, sometimes I would go two or three nights right along, then two or three weeks I would not go at all, but I go when a patient is sick. Q. Your visits at night are occasional ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What I understand is, that after ten o'clock the wards are in charge of the attendants, supervisors and night watchers ? A. The night watchers, yes, sir; they are in charge, of course, but they are sleeping on their different wards, it is more especially in charge of the night watchers'; they go on duty at ten; the at- tendants are never off duty entirely until half-past. Q. How often did Dr. Gray visit this side of the building? A. I do not know ; I cannot state. Q. What has been his custom during the last few years as to vis- iting the wards, as to frequency ? A. I don't know how 1 can tell that; I don't know Iioav often he goes on, for I haven't any means of knowing; I might meet him there; I have no idea how often ; sometimes I would go with him. Q. How frequently would you say that he went over the wards on that side ? A. I don't know what to say, for I really don't know. Q. How often haA7e yon seen him on that side of the building during the past year yourself? A. I have seen him there many times, I have no means of know- ing just how many. Q. Does he make an inspection of that side every day ? A. No, sir; I should not think that. . Q. Did he go as often as once a week over the whole of that side of the building ? A. I don't know what to say in regard to that, for I don't know. Q. Does he have any regular times ? A. No, sir; he goes just as he happens to. 677 Q. Are you aware that patients are sometimes controlled by at- tendants, by smothering them in wet sheets? A. No, sir; I have heard that thing, but never saw it. Q. From whom have you heard of it ? A. The first time I heard of it, Dr. Andrews told me about it, he was assistant physician, he had heard of it, and asked me if I had; I never had heard of it until that time, and that is all I know about it. Q. Have you ever undertaken to investigate that matter by ask- ing the attendants in regard to it? A. Yes, sir, at that time. Q. About what time was that ? A. I should think that must be ten years ago, but not more than that. Q. Do you regard it as improbable that the attendants should sometimes treat patients in that way? A. I don't know— I think — well I don't think it is impossible ; I think it is, perhaps, probable — I don't think it is done now, and has not been for years, I think. Q. Have any measures been taken to prevent it ? A. Closer inspection ; it was watched for very closely about that time to find out if it was done, and who did it. Q. Did you then find out that it was done? A. That it had been, a few times. . Q. Have you made any further inquiry on that subject, since then ? A. No, sir; I have had 'no complaint, anq^ no reason to suppose it was done. Q. You have made no such inquiry, as you then made, to ascer- tain whether the custom may not have grown up again ? A. No, sir; I should have thought, if it had grown up again, some patient would be likely to tell me, if they had any trouble ; I always asked the patients what they did, and I think they would be very likely to tell about it. Q. Did patients make complaints frequently to you about matters in their wards ? A. Considering the number of them, it is not very frequently. Q. Of what did patients sometimes complain ? A. Oh, abuses ; and when you come to ask Avhat it is, you fail to find any thing at all. Q. What kind of abuses ? A. Oh, they are pushed and they are pulled, and not given their clothing; their things are put on them differently from what they like; and this does not fit them ; and that hurts; and things of that kind ; but the pushing and pulling is what they complain of more than any thing else to me. Q. Do they complain of being improperly bathed ? A. No, sir; I never heard more than one or two complaints in all my life here of that. fe 678 Q. Do they complain of the medicine that is given to them ? A. Sometimes. Q. Do you know whether patients are allowed to throw away medicine that the doctor gives them ? A. They are not allowed to ; sometimes they will say they will take it and will not do it, but it is not supposed to be left in their charge to take it, with a feAv exceptions; it is in the charge of the supervisor generally; if it is a dose in the night, to the night watchers. Q. Is it ever left to the attendants ? A. Occasionally, just a single dose to be given. Q. What is the custom of the doctors, in sending medicine to patients ; do they ahvays send it by the supervisors — first hoAV does it get to the supervisor ? A. The apothecary puts it up, and sends it up in a dumb-waiter, that comes up to the different departments; it comes up with a memorandum on the bottle or cup ; each one is generally printed one the cup with directions for use; if it is a bottle, the directions are pasted on, if it is a single cup the attendants know about it. Q. What is the practice of doctors visiting patients at night; do they ahvays come or do they sometimes send directions, that such and such medicine shall be given ? A. They don't always come if it is a patient that they understand and just noisy, they send a dose of medicine to be given to that patient. Q. What is the usual sedative given ? A. I don't know ; I don't know any thing about that ? Q. Say whether4 you tjiink a lady physician would be desirable on that ward ? A. I think, as far as I am concerned, I should say not. Q. For what reason ? A. I don't know what a lady physician could do more than a gentleman does. Q. Have you ever had charge of a patient who has been treated by a lady physician ? A. No, sir, I don't recollect any. Q. Do you know of any special cases coining under your notice where lady physicians have been in charge ? A. Water cures — we have had one or two of those. Q. Do you know of any objection to the presence of a lady physician ? A. No, sir, no special objection. Q. Do you think it would be Avell to have a lady physician, avIio would be within call at night, on that side? A. I don't knoAV that there is any harm in it; I don't know how better it could be ; if any one feels 'like it there is nothing against it, but each has their way of feeling. Q. And you have a feeling against lady physicians ? A. No, sir; I would not be understood as saying that, only if I was sick I should not send for one ; I have nothing against them; let them prosper if they come, and if they like it. 679 Q. What opportunities for exercise are given to lady patients ? A. Walking around, and croquet in the summer. Q. What opportunities for out-door exercise is given violent patients ? A. They have a large yard, they are out forenoons and afternoons, for several hours, when it is suitable; during the1 proper weather they are allowed to be out every day, and some have to be carried out to go out. Q. Are there any matters connected with the management of your department, which you think could be improved ? A. I don't know what there is that I might suggest. Q. Is there any thing that you can suggest from your experience of twenty years, to'make the institution any better than it is? A. I don't know Avhat to say about that; I don't know what there is really. Q. Do you think there are sufficient attendants? . A. Sometimes they might get aldng to advantage with a few more, when they are particularly disturbed. Q. Do you think that the character of the attendants and their qualifications are sufficiently high for their duties ? A. Yes, sir; I think so. Q. Then you have no fault to find with the general run of attend- ants ? A. No, sir; we have generally had very good ones. Q. Is there any system pursued of training the attendants for their duties ? A. Yes, sir; we have lectures in training them in caring for their patients ; they have those once a week. Q. What requirement is there that the attendants shall be pres- ent at such lecture ? A. Nothing special. Q. Is it optional ? A. Yes, sir. Q. As a matter of fact how many are there in average attendance ? A. About all that can be spared I should say, generally tAventy- five, or thirty present well, perhaps, that's a little too high, twenty- five — we have had twenty-five sometimes, I am sure. Q. How long has this system of lecturing been carried on ? A. Only a short time, and regular lectures perhaps a couple of months; I don't remember when it commenced. Q. Did it commence before the accident to Mr. Hughes ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Who gives such lectures ? A. The assistant physicians in turn. Q. What are the subjects of these lectures generally ? A. Anatomy, physiology, hygiene, the care of patients, and what to do in emergencies. Q. What is the character of the table ? A. I think it is excellent; it is plain, but it is excellent, it is 680 good'— varieties of meats, vegetables in season, of meats and breads, and plain cooking. Q. Is there any complaints from patients about the table? A. Yes, sir; sometimes I think it would not be possible to set a table that they would not complain of. Q. What is the nature of the complaints on the table ? A. They are not accustomed to eat such food, that is about the gist of the whole of it. Q. Is there no effort made to supply delicacies, or special dishes, for sick patients ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And they can get special dishes, on the doctor's prescription, sent to their room ? A.' Y es, sir. Q. Do you know whether any effort is made to see that it is given to them in a considerate and careful way ? A. Yes, sir ; that is one thing I try to look after as well as I can. Q. How much attention do you giv7e to them ? A. I am in some of the dining-rooms every day when the meals come up, and go to the kitchen every once in a while to see that the extras or special dishes are properly prepared. Q. Do you follow these dishes to the room and see that they are properly given ? A. Yes, sir; I have done that very frequently. By Mr. Rice : Q. Do you know of patients being removed from one ward to another, by way of punishment? A. No, sir; I don't, though I think they are sometimes. Q. Are you able to tell us why Mrs. F. was removed from one ward to a worse ward ? A. I should say from my knowledge of the woman, because she was a decidedly disturbing element on the ward. Q. How was that manifested, that disturbing element ? A. Fault-finding, complaining, worrying other patients until she would get them nervous and excitable. Q. She was a nervous person ? A. Yes, sir; and an inveterate talker, and sometimes she would talk to them beyond Avhat they cared to listen to, and they would get nervous; she worried a good deal. Q. She was not violent herself, wras she ? A. I don't recollect any instance of violence. Q. It was never found necessary to put any mechanical restraint upon her ? A. I don't know; I am not positive as to that; I think she may have been put in her room once or twice, but I think that is all. Q. Her difficulty w7as extreme nervousness, was it not ? A. Yes, sir. 681 Q. Do you know the fact that for six weeks she was refused the privilege of going out of the house ? A. No, sir; I don't know that. Q. How can you account for it if it were so ? A. I cannot account for it, she was able to go out. Q. Would it be possible for the attendant to keep her in the house as a punishment for disobedience to their orders ? A. No, sir ; I should think not, because she would be sure to tell the doctor, and the doctor would be sure to inquire of it, and they would see that it was remedied, it would not be allowed. Q. Have you heard of her sending notes to the doctor ? A. Yres, sir ; I think so. Q. Do you knoAV, as a fact, that no attention was paid to these notes ? A. I think there might have been attention paid to them. Q. Do you knoAV whether there was or not? A. I don't remember any special note, bnt I know there has been a great deal of talk about her complaints; I Avondered what there was about them, and I knoAV the doctor spoke about her Avhen she made complaints, but I cannot specify the complaints; I have heard him talk to Miss Burns'about her; he was talking to her about Mrs. F.'s complaints. Q. Do you Iciioav of any violence ever used toward Mrs. F. by way of several attendants taking hold of her and dragging her through the wards ? A. I don't know of it; I remember her telling me so. Q. Did you make an investigation of it? A. I asked the attendant Avhat there was of it; I think it was a disturbance in the dining room, and they took her, one one side, and one the other; and took her to her room ; she called it " drag- ging," other people would call it " taking her along." Q. Did you do any more than to inquire of attendants? J A. No, sir;* not very well. Q. Did you take her statement ? A. I could not very well, because I had seen her so many'times, and I could not take all she said. By Mr. Haskell : • Q. Do you remember the occasion of Mrs. F. having some money taken from her ? A. Yes, sir; she reported that it was stolen by Miss Burns ; but it was brought doAvn to my keeping. Q. Do you know Avhere Miss Burns got the money ? A. She'took it from Mrs. Fulford; that is what I understood at the time. Q. Is there any rule of the institution prohibiting ^patients from ',. having money in their possession ? 86 u ; I L 682 A. Yes, sir; but sometimes they get it sent in a letter. Q. Do you know whether Miss Burns took the money from Mrs. F. without her knowledge ? A. No, sir, I don't'know ; I don't suppose she did, but I don't know as to that. Q. Did you ever make any investigation as to how Miss Burns got the money ? A. No, sir, I didn't; the doctor did before her husband and brother. Q. Was not the occasion of violence being used to Mrs. F. the time she was taken from her room to the yard ? , A. I don't recollect only that one instance. Q. Your recollection is not very clear ? A. No, sir. Q. Whether she was taken to the yard or not you cannot state ? A. No, sir, not positively ; 1 have seen her in the yard many times ; sometimes the doctor rather insists upon a patient going out, and sometimes they do not want to go, and will not go, and have to be taken out; sometimes if they do not go out walking, then they will complain about not going. By Mr. Rice : Q. Did you regard Mrs. F. as an insane woman while here ? A. Yes, sir, I think she was. Q. Why? A. I could not think a sane woman would act as she did. Q. How was her insanity manifested ? A. Her special nervousness and general finding fault with peOr pie, it was not here alone but it Avasat home; her having ideas that people were abusing her so much ; every thing that was done was with the idea, as she thought, of abusing her; her stories against her own people, her husband, in that line was that he had abused her. Q. Do you mean to say that she manifested delusions about abuses to herself? A. Why, I thought sometimes she did ; she exaggerated and called things abuse when they were not. Q. Do you mean to say that that is an evidence of insanity? A. Weil, I don't know that I am good judge enough. Q. You have seen a good deal of insanity in your experience; do you mean to say that a person who has such manifestations would necessarily be insane? A. No, sir; not if it was not different from what it was when she was well; when she is all right and in her better condition she is more quiet and has not so much to say ; but when she is disturbed every thing is wrong and everybody has some motive in torturing her in some way. 683 Q. Yon say that her manifestation of insanity was mainly in finding fault? A. Yes, sir; her general make-up; she used to adorn herself in such a queer way; when she was in her better condition she did not do so. Q. What peculiarities did she manifest in regard to apparel? A. Four or five different neckties on at once, a braid and ribbons on her hair, and all the pins that she could get on at once. Q. Was that clothing put on for the purpose of attending some general gathering? A. No, sir ; sometimes (right in the ward. Q. Do you know what motive she had in doing'it? A. I don't know of any motive, only personal adornment. HORATIO N. DRYER, Sworn and examined, testified as follows: By the Chairman : Q. What is your age ? A. Seventy-eight. Q. How long have you been connected with this institution ? A. I came here first in June, 1855. Q. What positions have you held in the institution ? A. For two months 1 don't know Avhat position I was holding; I did any kind of work, and on the first of August I received the position of steward, and I have held that office ever since. Q. What are your duties? A. They are numerous; they are better defined in the by-laws than I can state them from recollection ; my duties, as I understand them, are to make the purchases, and have the general oversight of the farm, to examine the kitchen, etc., see about the supplies, and I am charged with the safe-keeping of the supplies when they are purchased. Q. Please state the sytem that exists for the purchasing of supplies, for checking them as they are received and for charging the same on the books'{ A. The system is that whatever is brought here — if it be a mixed load of grcoeries for instance — provisions, or any thing of that kind, to check them off as delivered ; if they are brought here like beef ~ cattle — brought on foot, and weighed, the weight is taken and entered upon the books of the institution. Q. Where are the supplies purchased ? A. Almost anyAvhere; largely—groceries, and articles of that kind in Utica of Butler & Hamilton, principally, and of almost 684 every one in the city ; Butler & Hamilton furnish the groceries; they have furnished them a long time; the arrangement has existed further back than my knoAvledge or memory extends ; it was in existence Avhen I came to the Asylum. Q. Is there any arrangement Avith them a° to the terms upon which they shall furnish such groceries ? A. For a portion of them there is; they sell to us at their origi- nal price where they purchase them, adding five per cent for expense's and commissions. Q. What portion of the groceries does that include? A. I speak only now from an examination of one quarter's sup- plies ; a quarter aggregating about $2,200; of that $1,400 or $1,500 is of that kind ; and I think that fairly represents every quarter in the year. Q. As to the balance of the supplies, upon wdiat terms are they purchased ? A. Just as they Avould be purchased of any other person inde- pendent of that arrangement. Q. Purchased at retail, do you mean ? A. No, sir ; not exactly retail—Ave buy in larger quantities than that. Q. At what prices do you get those other articles — wholesale? A. Yes, sir; wholesale prices, unless it may be some small things; we buy down to a shilling's worth of little items of whatever may be necessary ; I think on all those they give us^wholesale prices, no matter Iioav small the pm chase. Q. But with the exception of a few articles that may be bought in small quantities, and excepting what you have already stated, are all the rest upon the five per cent basis, or at Avholesale prices ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Does that arrangement apply to any other house than Butler & Hamilton's? A. No, sir; I do not think it does \ Q. Please state how the drugs are purchased, and where? A. They are purchased largely in Brooklyn, of E. R. Squibbs. Q. Upon what terms are they purchased, if you can state? A. They are purchased in this way, that when a certain amount is reached in any given month, they allow ten per cent discount. Q. What amount of purchases entitles you to that ten per cent discount ? A. I think it is a hundred dollars' worth in a month. Q. So that if in any one month you do not reach as much as a hundred dollars' worth, you do not get your ten per cent discount ? A. No, sir ;' that is if that is the amount; I think it is a hundred dollars. Q. How—about hoAV much do the drugs aggregate in the year in cost ? M A. I can't say without I refer to the books to ascertain;' I have 685 no idea; they vary in the different years; sometimes it is —and tins is a mere guess at the amount —for a year, I should say from five to eight thousand dollars a year. Q. Has any effort been made'to secure by competition in the pur- chase of supplies any better rates than those you have referred to ? A. Not on general supplies, I think. Q. Has it been made with reference to any supplies? A. There has been an attempt made, or efforts made to unsettle this arrangement of Butler & Hamilton's and pass it into other hands, but never any terms offered that were considered as favorable as theirs. Q. State what firms haA7e made such attempts? A. D. Grouse & Sons, of Utica, for one. Q. When did they make such an effort ? A. It was some time ago, in 1866 or 1867, several years ago • and it has been made since by Comstock Brothers, and I don't know but others have competed ; but that matter is in the hands of the board of managers more than mine ; I only act under their instructions about it. Q. What was the nature of the effort that was made by the firms mentioned ? A. A committee of the board of managers called on Crouse Prothers at the time for prices for the supply ; for prices and sam- ples, and they were furnished; and Butler & Hamilton did the same, it seemed; these samples were looked at, and some of the articles examined and priced ; it appeared there was not much dif- ference in the quality of goods; the percentage was the same, but the other firms added all the freight of the heavy goods. Q. The next offer Avas made by Comstock, you say? A. Yres, sir; I don't know the result of'that; that was more recently, but I could not say the year. Q. Within how many years ago? , A. Ten, or within ten,'I should think ; I don't know, but it may be more recently than'that; I could not be positive as to that; I had nothing to do with procuring samples at that date; in the other case I had. Q. Do you recollect any other case more recently than that of Comstock Bros. ? A. No other one has come to my knowledge. Q. Do you know whether the board of managers, themselves, have instituted any proceeding to get better rates ? A. I don't know that they have; there has been nothing done to change it to my knowledge.' Q. Whom do you confer with, concerning purchases of supplies ? A. Dr. Gray, the superintendent. Q. Do you do that daily ? A. I could not say daily, it depends whether there is any thing we are out of, some article they were wanting, groceries; I don't always consult with him if we want provisions of any kind; I didn't 686 always do it then unless it was some extra venture ; but he is enti- tled to consultation in every single purchase. Q. And as a matter of frequent occurrence, you do consult with him? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do you consult with any members of the board of managers about purchasing ? A. No, sir, I don't know as I ever have ; their orders, if they issue any, come to me through the superintendent. Q. Now are your accounts supervised ? A. Our accounts are made, and always we have duplicate bills of every purchase; our custom has been to pay quarterly and get a continuous invoice of all the purchases of that quarter on two sepa- rate vouchers; that was the case originally ; it has been changed to three now by law ; then those abstracts that they made were com- pared with books that were kept here, and when found correct, were paid by my order on the treasurer and countersigned by the superintendent. Q. Who examines the books to ascertain if the vouchers cor- responded with the amounts received ? A. It is done by the auditing committee of the board of man- agers. Q. Do they make such examinations prior to the payment of the bills ? A. No, sir, they do not. Q. They make them subsequently ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What disposition is made of the three vouchers ? A. One is kept in my office, and the other by the treasurer, and the third one goes to the Comptroller of the State. Q. In what manner are the State funds placed to the credit of this institution? A. In case of any appropriation by the State ? Q. Yes, sir. A. It is done on the treasurer's books ; that is, the treasurer of the institution. Q. Do they then send cash to the treasurer? A. Yes, sir; in some instances officers are paid that way ; special appropriations are paid by a draft on the Comptroller, I think. Q. In Avhat banks are the Asylum accounts kept ? A. Oneida County National Bank ; James Sayre was the president, but he died recently ; I think his son is now president; the accounts have been kept in that bank as long as I have been connected with the institution. Q. Hoav much stock, cattle and horses are on the place ? A. I have a memoranda of that and it is in my pocket. Q. Do you kuoAv of the purchases recently of some blood stock for the institution ? 687 A. Y es, sir. Q. Please state what it was ? A. It was a bull and two calves of the Holstein breed, imported stock. Q Was it thoroughbred stock ? Q. It was imported and said to be full blooded ; we bought it as such, bought it of the importers; it was bought of Smith & Powell of Syracuse. Q. What Avas paid for that importation ? A. Something over $1,700 ; I have not the price here ; between $1,300 and $1,400. Q. Do you know what they paid for each animal ? A. I cannot state now, for the committee have my voucher; Mr. Brown and Dr. Olin took it^when they Avere here ; that is the one Mr. Brown took. Q. Mr. Brown is one of the committee you referred to ? A. Yes, sir ; a member of your committee. Q. Is there any other blood stock on the place ? A. No, sir; there is some graded stock, but nothing that has cost an extra price. Q. Is there any that you would call half or three quarters breed ? A. We have some half bred, I don't think any more than half. Q. How much of such stock have you ? A. We may have three or four cows and a bull. Q. What is that stock worth ? A. I think we paid for the bull $120, when he was fit for service, and the cows we buy as we do others, of the breeders or the farmers about, and if there is a good cow that promises well, we buy her; pay here $40, $50 or $60, and have paid in a few instances as high as $70, I think there are now fifty four cows about the place. Q. What was the purpose of buying such expensive stock as this Holstein breed ? A. I don't know. Q. Who made the purchase ? A. I Avent with Dr. Gray to make it at his direction. Q. Where did you go s A. Syracuse. Q. Were any of the board of managers with you ? A. No, sir. Q. Did they knoAV of the expected purchase ? A. I cannot say. Q. Do you knoAV whether they were consulted ? A. I don't knoAV to my own knowledge. Q. What was the object of procuring such high-priced stock ? A. I don't know. . Q. What in your judgment is the value of such stock to the insti- tution ? A. Simply as cows for daily purposes, I don't know as they are 688 any better than any other stock ; the stock as well as the issue of that stock will sell at very high prices, having them registered. Q. They are registered cattle?. A. Application has been made to have them registered, but I have not received them yet. Q. How many horses are there on the place ? A. Twelve. Q. Have any been disposed of recently ? A. Not very recently ; no, sir. Q. When Avas the last disposition ? A. I think it was last spring or summer; I think we disposed of two. Q. At what price ? A. They were horses that were worn out and bought at a small price ; we exchanged them for another horse of good service — an efficient one. Q. Are there any thoroughbred horses among the lot ? A. None that I know of; there are carriage and work horses. Q. Are there any carriage horses ? A. Yes, sir; one pair. Q. Are the rest of them farm horses ? A. No, sir; there are two horses that are kept for use and to ride round on the farm. Q. So that there are four horses kept for use on the road h A. Yes, sir ; then there is one I have, that I drive; not now very valuable, like myself, getting very old iu the service. Q. So that five horses are kept for road purposes ? A. Yes, sir. Q. To what uses are these horses put ? A. They go with the carriage, tAvo of them, and the others go with single vehicles; one is kept in use on the lawn to keep that In order, and do other work in the winter,keepi::g roads open ; another does very heavy work in the summer, and such as we have in the winter. Q. Who owns the horses ? A. The Asylum. Q. What carriages are there on the place ? Mr. Goodwin — Ask him what he paid for these carriage horses? Q. What Avas paid for the carriage horses ? A. Six hundred dollars for the pair; I could have-taken $650 for them in a few months after they were bought of the same person who sold them to us. Q. What was paid for the other horses on the place as near as you recollect? . A We have paid $150 and $250; our farm horses are all well stricken in years, are getting old, but are still able to do good work and we hold on to them. 689 By Mr. Olin : Q. How old is the one you drive? A. TAventy-three or twenty-four.* Q. Now to return to the carriage, I ask you what carriages are there on the place ? A. We have a coach and a lighter two horse carriage, and a single horse carriage and four buggies. Q. To whom do they belong ? A. The Asylum. Q. To what uses are they put— the carriages and the coaches? A. For riding purposes. Q. By the visitors of the Asylum ? A. Yes, sir; occasionally. Q. Are the patients ever 4aken out in the carriage ? A. No, sir; not that 1 know of. Q. Or in the buggies ? A. Well, that is a mere chance, it is not the custom to do so. Q. Who uses the carriage and pair, generally ? A. Dr. Gray's family. Q. Do you know the prices paid for any of these carriages? A. Eight hundred dollars, the coach was. Q. Do you know what they paid for the double harness ? A. One hundred to one hundred and twenty-five dollars; the other carriages were bought here at Utica. Q. Now about the purchases of these blooded Holstein cattle; do you know Avhether any of the present board of managers are aware of your having made such purposes ? A. I don't know to my knowledge'; I presume they are fully aware of it. Q. What is your opinion about the purport of the purchase of this stock ? A. I hardly like to give an opinion, but if it is demanded I will give it. / Q. We have asked you ; I think you may give it ? A. If it had depended on ,nry own judgment they never would have been purchased. Q. Why not ? A. Because I think, as has been said here, that it is not the legitimate Avork of an institution like this; that is my private opin- ion and is not given as any thing else. By Mr. Haskell : Q. Was there any reason given to you by Dr. Gray for buying them ? A. I don't remember any now. Q. Who made the purchase, you or Dr. Gray ? A. We were together Avhen it was made, but the doctor made it. Q. Is the doctor your superior officer ? 87 U 1 690 A. He is in such matters. By Mr. Olin : Q. If he had wanted to buy the cattle and you had not you could not have prevented it? A. No, sir; he could have prevented me but I could not have prevented him. By Mr. Haskell : Q. Did you state to Dr. Gray that your judgment Avas against the purchase of the cattle? A. I don't think I did. Q. Are purchases made of materials and things which are against your judgment? A. I don't know really Iioav to answer you; there have been expenses incurred that Avould not have originated with me in very many instances, sometimes by the superintendent, and sometimes by the managers. Q. In these instances, have you stated to Dr. Gray or to the managers your disapproval of the incurring of these expenses? A. I haAre, sometimes, to the superintendent but I never did to the managers; if I never have been consulted by them specially I have expressed a dissent sometimes. Q. You have not ahvays ? A. No, sir; I have not, simply because I Avas a subordinate, and didn't think it very becoming in me to dictate by an opinion. Q. Will you state some instances Avhere your judgment has been overruled by the superintendent? A.I don't know now as I can fix the one single instance without it was on the purchase of a pair of horses for farm purposes; I objected to that and gave my reasons, and they were not purchased. Q. Can you specify any cases Avhere your judgment Avas not taken and your objections were of no avail ? A. I don't know as I can in the way of purchases but as to some work that has been performed I can. Q. Have there been purchases made? A. Yes, sir; that I didn't make. Q. Then in a general way vou are not at liberty to exercise your own judgment in transacting business for the institution? A Not in a general way ; I am not at all anxious to be officious, for I am a subordinate .officer. - Q. And you did not regard it that you are at all responsible for the transaction of the business where' you are acting under direc- tions of Dr. Gray ? te A. Not legally responsible ; I suppose I have some moral respon- sibility in obeying orders, even if I have tried to entertain such an idea as that. Q. Dr. Gray's personal expenses are paid for by the State ? 691 A. TY.o cable , furnished by the State; and his furniture to some extent, I don't know how much. Q. Of whom does his family consist ? A. He has a wife and three children living. Q. All reside in the institution ? A. No, sir ; one is away at school and the other is attending medical lectures at New York ; the little girl, his daughter, is at home. Q. And they have all resided here since you have been steward ? A. Yes, sir; he buried three children Avithin a short time several years ago, all of them quite young. Q. Has he any personal servants except such as are attendants of the institution ? A. None that I know of; in his own department, do you mean ? Q. Yes, sir. A. Oh, yes, sir; servants for himself. Q. Are they paid for by himself or by the institution ? A. By the institution. Q. How many servants are there to attend upon himself and family ? A. Three girls. Q. Any others? A. Not that I know of. Q. Any men servants? ^ A. Well, the coachman has charge of the barns and drives the horses. Q. Do yon say he has three servant girls now ? A. Yes, sir. Q. lias the number been greater in the times past ? A. Never at the expense of the State that I know of ; there have been occasions where he has had an extra one, but paid her himself. Q. 1 suppose Avhat you have stated in regard to Dr. Gray and what the State furnishes him is also true in regard to what the State furnishes the assistant physicians? A. They all have their board and lodging here. Q. Any special servants ? A. Yes, sir, in the kitchen ; we are all supplied from the same kitchen, both dining-rooms. Q. Has Dr. Brush any special servants employed by the State ? A. He has a nurse girl just now. Q. Is she employed by the State ? A. Yes, sir, and paid by the State. Q. Was she employed especially ? A. Yes, sir. Q. To attend upon Dr. Brush's family ? A. Yes, sir. 692 By the Chairman: Q. Suppose that a doctor were living in Utica near the Asylum, would you consider that an allowance should be made for him for his servants by the State, or that they should pay for his servants if he went in the institution ?. A. I should suppose his salary would be sufficient to C0A7er it if he were keeping house outside. Q. Don't you think the same salary should cover the same ser- vices if the doctors are employed in the institution ? A. 1 don't like to give an opinion of that. By Mr. Haskell: Q. Does the table supply of the doctors include wine and lux- uries of that nature ? A. I don't know that he has them on his table ; I don't see his table very often. Q. Y"ou don't know whether he does or not; how about the other doctors ? A. Oh, the other doctors don't have any such thing. By the Chairman: Q. How many farm hands are there employed about the place ? A. There are six ; I employ them. Q. How is their time accounted for? A. I want to say, in explanation, the rule for employing help in any department of the institution, inside or out, has to be done, in every instance, by the consent of the superintendent; by his direc- tion. Q. Subject to his approval. A. Yes, sir; and by his direction. Q. How are they employed— by the month ? A. Some of them, and some by the day. Q. Those who Avork by the day — how is their time made up ? A. There is a man appointed to oversee all the work on the farm and keep the time of the employees. Q. What is his name ? I; A. Russell. i Q. How long has he been employed? A. He has been here about twenty-fi\re or twenty-s'x years. Q. Does he have a time-book ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And in that book he enters the actual time ? A. Yes, sir; and that is subsequently entered on the books of the institution. Q. How much examination is made as to the qualification of an attendant ? A. All that the civil service law requires; I examine them as to 693 health and character and degree of education ; I happen to be one of the board of examiners. Q. And you endeavor to keep np to the civil service law on this subject ? A. Yres, sir. Q. Before Ave had a civil service law what system did you have in the matter? A. We could not haA7e any real system; we took the best people we could get; there have been times when we were overrun with applicants and at times it Avas difficult to find people. Q. So that the test of efficiency varied somewhat with the market supply ? A. Yres, sir. Q. When the market was full you Avere able to apply a stricter test than you were when it Avas difficult to get help ? A. Yes, sir ; we more than often had to judge by their appearance than any knowledge that we could obtain of them. Q. Did you always require written testimonials? A. No, sir, I think not; there Avere some persons with whom some of us were acquainted, frequently. Q. And they applied with written testimonials when you did not know them ? A.'Yes, sir; and sometimes we have employed such persons; we have been obliged to do it sometimes. By Mr. Olin : Q. Were you examined last year by the legislative committee? A. Yes, sir. Q. Are these physicians employed in such a Avay that the support of their families has to be in addition to the salaries paid them ? A. I don't know any thing about the arrangement; it has been the custom when there has been an assistant physician with a family he has been cared for just as Dr. Brush has. Q. And just as Dr. Gray is? A. Weil not to the same extent; they have another servant if there is a little child to take care of. Mr. Goodwin — Ask him whether this girl that Dr. Brush has, if she does not clean the room and do the general work. Q. How is it in that respect ? A. I cannot say, I suppose she does but I don't know ; my under- standing is that the physicians are employed at a good salary and their expenses of themselves and family, by expenses I mean living and board. 694 HIRAM H. WILSON, Sworn and examined, testified as follows : By the Chairman : Q. You are a patient in this Asylum ? A. Yes, sir. Q. When did you come here? A. Nineteenth of September last. Q. State briefly the nature of your trouble ? A. I Avent to MiddletoAvn on the 31st of May ; I was at Glens Falls ; I assumed insanity for a purpose. Q. Have you any criticism to make upon the management of this institution ? A. Not in the sense of adverse criticism; of course an intelligent man, a neAvspaper man, that has been in two or three institutions must have made some observation. Q. What is your observation as to the manner and care of the other patients here ? A. My observation is that, judging from a comparison, which is the only way we can judge of any thing is, that there is a great deal more care for the general welfare of their patients here thau either Poughkeepsie or MiddletoAvn. Q. What Avards have you ever been on ? A. The sixth ward and this one — that is, number one. Q. Are there any violent patients on either of those wards? A. Not what may be termed violent patients; there are those who are demented ; there are one or two who have shown violence up there. Q. Have you ever seen any harsh treatment of patients by attendants? A. That is a matter of judgment; harsh — Q. Have you ever seen an attendant strike a patient? A. Yes, sir. Q. Have you ever seen an attendant kick a patient ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Have you ever seen an attendant strike a patient so violently as^to cause a bruise or black eye ? A. No, sir; to answer strictly, truthfully, I had to say yes to those other questions; as a matter of simple justice I should say that in another case the striking or kicking, in my judgment, was cen- surable. Q. State what those cases are ? A. A man named C, a patient on the sixth ward, a very power- ful man who said little, apparently a quiet man, used to assist in the dining-room, then the towels with which the dishes are wiped 695 are washed in the bath-room ; Mr. Jones, the supervisor, went into the bath-room one morning while they were washing the towels; some pieces of soap had been taken out of the wash-room, and they did not know who it Avas that took these pieces of soap ; at this time I refer to, I happened to be in the bath-room ; 1 did not hear the whole of the conversation, but a good deal of it,and 1 will state only what I heard and saw myself; Mr. Jones said to this patient C, he said, "Ah ? C, its you that has been taking the soap; " when he said it he saw C. take a piece of soap that belonged to the bath- room ; C. said nothing in reply, but he immediately turned round, took the wash-board in both his hands as a club and made a dive at Mr. Jones ; Jones saw his danger at onee and rushed near C. to close Avith him, and prevent his being injured by the wash-board; Jones was quick but not quick enough to avert the blow; it struck Jones hard enough to put him down on the floor; then C. jumped on to him, and tried to gouge his eyes out, but Jones shut his eyes; two or three of the patients ran up to protect him, but C. struggled violently ; Mr. Hughes was the attendant in charge of the ward, and Mr. Torpey, attendant, and a Mr. M., a patient, assisted, and C. Avas overpoAvered ; one of the attendants, I do not remember his name, kicked C, and Jones gave him a slight kick, like that (indi- cating), when he got through ; I said to C. that he was not used half as severely as he would have been if it was at Middletown — I saw a man nearly killed there for doing less than C. did. Q. Where did they kick him — where on the body? A. It Avas on the left side they kicked him — in the lower part of the ribs, Avhile he was down. Q. What did they then do — put him in restraint? A. No, sir; they watched him for a little; Jones saw hi in and asked him Avhat he struck him for, etc., and in course of half an hour he Avas removed to another ward. Q. How many attendants were there about him when they got him down ? A. Three, calling Mr. Jones, the supervisor, an attendant. Q. Was there any occasion for kicking him when they got him down ? A. Well, had I been an attendant, and I am an excitable man, I am very sure the patient would not haAre been kicked. Q. Then yon do think the attendants are to be criticised for kick- ing him? A. I think taking the average man and he Avould have kicked him, but 1 do not think a man like you gentlemen here—men of the world, who have sense enough to realize that the man was of unsound mind and not responsible for his acts — I don't think either of you Avould have kicked him under the circumstances; but here was a man who had been struck (I mean Jones), and it was a miracle he was not killed ; but there was no Avicked kicking, such as I have seen at Middletown ; if it had happened at Middletown this man C. neA'er would got up alone, he would have been picked up ; . 696 I, myself, had five ribs broken at Middletown; of course you can't go into that place, but I would like to say just a few words about that place ; I was as sane when I went there as I am at this moment, and Iioav sane I am now I do not pretend to say, perhaps I am not a good judge; the injuries Mr. Hughes received —al- though he died from the result of them —were nothing to what I received there, and nothing to what I saw inflicted upon a man from Glens Falls. The Chairman — We cannot take up any matters relating to Middletown Asylum ? The Witness—Well, I know, I knoAv; but 1 haA7e an ax to grind, if I can, and this is a good opportunity. Q. Do you know of any other cases of the striking of patients by attendants ? ' A. Do you confine me technically to striking? Q. No, state generally and briefly ? A. Well, a short time after this occurrence with C, that I have related, there Avas a patient by the name of W., a perfectly quiet man, his mental condition you might call " demented," yet a man who knowrs what he is about; it Avas probably eight w7eeks ago; the patients on the second department were about to go for a walk; by way of promise I ought to state that we had been out walking before this time. Q. Just give us the circumstance, never mind that? A. Well, it is absolutely necessary, and you, as a lawyer, will recognize that it is before 1 get through; when they went out, this man W. jumped on to the horse car, aud the attendant had the trouble of taking him off again; the next day when they were making up the party to go out, W. put on his overcoat; the attendant says " you made us all this trouble yesterday, you cannot go out today," but he kept his overcoat on; Hughes, the attendant, said again, " it is no use your putting on your coat, you cannot go out to-day ; several patients were going out, and W. tried to pass out with them; Mr. Hughes stood by the door and shoved W. back ; he made another attempt to pass out with a like result; he tried again, then Hughes grabbed him by the back of the neck of the coat, here (indicating), and made this motion (indicating), giving him a twitch which he evidently knew how to do, at the same time he tripped him with his feet and W. fell heavily to the floor; he jumped up at once and Ilughes treated him the same way. Q. Did the patient strike his head on the floor? A. Well, that I would not like to undertake to say, of course a man Avould instinctively raise his head and try and strike on his shoulders. Q. Did he throw him as heavily the second time as he did the first time ? A. Well, that is asking for too much judgment to be exercised, I could not gauge the force of the throwing each time or make a 697 comparison of one with the other; to my mind at the time it was not so much to make the blow heavy as it was to throw the patient to the floor ; he was allowed to get up again, and like a demented man unable to reason with himself, he again started toward the door; the attendant again stepped in to prevent him, and he did this (indicating), put up his fists and squared off, but not Avith much apparent energy, not as I would if I were going for a man ; Hughes says, " Ah, you would fight, eh ;" and he was then put down again ; - then there was about the same striking and kicking that I described to you in the case of C------.; they kicked him, W---— ., more in the side than anywhere else; Avhen W-----. showed fight at first my own feelings were enlisted on behalf of Hughes, who had been a good friend of mine, that I stepped up to help him ; W------. was a strong powerful man, but they got him down and I did not interfere. Q. How many attendants were there about him then ? A. There were three including Mr. Jones ; just then I was told to go out with the party, and I went, so I did not see what occurred but I was informed of what followed by Mr. R------., a patient who is in the next room to me ; I understood from him that there was some more kicking afterAvard, but of course that would not be evidence, for I did not see it myself. By the Chairman : Q. Did you afterward hear the patient complain of being hurt? A. No, sir, he was not hurt much, and did not complain to me. Q. Do you recall any other case where you saw a patient struck by an attendant ? A. No, sir; those are the only instances I recall. By Mr. Morgan : Q. What was your occupation before you came "here? A. I Avas a journalist, and had been for some time. Q. Oh ! — a printer ? A. No, sir, not a printer, a journalist — a newspaper man ; I. was at Glens Falls, but I had had editorial positions on tAvo daily papers. Q. Hoav long since is it that you were connected with any news- paper ? A. I was connected with a newspaper the day before I was com- mitted to the Asylum. Q. Do you Avrite at all while yon are confined here ? A. No, sir, I am not alloAved to write, except an occasional letter. Q. Do you think they would not let you write for a paper here ? A. I presume not, but I have not asked them to let me do that. Q. What is 37our age ? A. I am forty-three. Q. Are you a married man ? '88 U 698 ^ A. I am; I would like to state here with reference to my com- mitment, I was not insane, I feigned it. Q. You say you feigned insanity for a purpose—what was the purpose ? A. The main purpose was to learn something about them; I had heard of cases of flagrant abuses that were rife at MiddletoAvn. Q. And you feigned insanity to get in there and see Iioav it was? A. Yes, sir ; in 1877 I did feign insanity, and I went to Pough- keepsie, I was there ten days, dnring which I wrote an expose, of about ten columns which was published in the " Albany Press." Gentlemen, my OAvn case here is deserviug of attention ; Avhile I may be entirely wrong, I have been confined here under peculiar circumstances,'and there should be an opportunity given me, I think, to show that I am not a proper subject of incarceration; I was transferred from the other Asylum here. Q. And do yon complain that you are illegally detained ? A. I cannot say I am illegally here because there was a proper commitment, bnt I claim I have not been insane a moment since I have been here; I ask the authorities to define Avherein I have manifested signs of insanity ; all I want is an opportunity to have my case tested before the courts, although I have no doubt I shall ' soon be discharged. Q. Do you Avish this committee to cause any representations to be made to any of your friends ? A. I do. Q. Are you here as a county patient? A. I am. Q. Do you wish us to communicate with any person on your be- half ? A. I would like to see a lawyer; I Avould like to have a copy of the seventh edition of the Revised Statutes; three or four sheets of foolscap paper, and a notary public, and a messenger, aud I will take care of my own case; and I will say this — The Chairman — If you have any thing more to state about the Asylum, here, you cau state it, if not, that is all, our time is limited and Ave have other witnesses to examine. The Witwess— Well, let me finish, hold on ; 1 will say that if I am released, I shall go before the State Charitable Institutions with a very important communication —an excessively important one. Q. Are you alloAved to communicate or correspond Avith your friends ? A. No patient in any asylum is alloAved to communicate with his friends, except under duress, all his correspondence is known to the Asylum people. Q. Do you receive letters from your friends ? A. I have received them, but there is not a patient in this institution who has the sense, or knows enough to wash hisown face avIio would undertake to communicate with his friends outside of the Asylum •frankly and freely, and as fully as he felt he would like to do. » 699 Q. Are you not permitted to write letters and seal them up be fore sending ? A. No, sir; it never has been done; if you send for a sheet of paper and get it, and if you only use half of that, and should put half in your envelope, the supervisor asks where is the other half ; I asked the privilege of using a pencil Avhen I came here, but I was not allowed it ; I-have a pencil now, here it is, but it was given to me clandestinely ; I have .no paper to use it on. I have been told by the physicians — by Dr. Josselyn and Dr. Pilgrim — that the his- tory of my case as they received it from me and the authorities at Glens Falls indicated periodical insanity — in other words that I had been insane at certain times. HENRY RICHARDSON, Sworn and examined, testified as follows: By the Chairman : Q. What is your age ? A. My age at my last birthday was forty-eight. Q. Are you at present a patient in this Asylum ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What is your residence when you are at home ? A. My residence from which I was brought to this place was at Lansingburgh ; my occupation was treasurer of the Troy & Lans- ingburgh R. R. Co., secretary and treasurer. Q. You stated to the committee when they were on the Avards that you Avished to be heard by them; have you any communica- tion to make? A. I have my OAvn grievances to present before the committee. ^ Q. Does that relate to yoar commitment ? A. Yes, sir; I claim that I was falsely arrested, and more than that, that the motives were unworthy and criminal; the motives on the part of those who sent me here ; their names appear on the books of the Asylum ; the leading one is uoav the president of the railroad company—William Kemp, his name is, and it corresponds with the commitment which was used in my case. Q. What Avas the motive in having you placed here? A. vThe motive is this: the directors who ought to have sus- tained me in prosecuting a crime and conspiracy—highway rob- beries and burglary — robbing the cars containing the United States mails; a prosecution began about the month of February, 1876; instead of sustaining me in prosecuting and punishing, they treach- erously caused me to be arrested and put under lock and key ; these were certain directors of the road who purported to me to be strongly in favor of prosecuting this crime. 700 Q. Do you say that all the directors of the road were concerned in incarcerating you? A. None of the directors' names appear on the document except that of this one man ; but the others were sufficiently parties to it to acquisce in it; the affair was at that time knoAvn publicly, it was something that Mr. Kemp at that time acknowdedged my faithful- ness in very strong language, but he'was intimidated and in some way declined this prosecution. Q. Have you any complaints to make about the way in which you are treated here ? A. I have this complaint to make, that I am detained here improp- erly ; I had this case brought before Dr. Ordronaux, he produced certain documents here, but I claim those documents are forgeries and the signature of the judge is wholly bogus and fraudulent. Q. How do you know they7 are bogus and fraudulent? A. Simply this ; I lived a long time in Troy, or in the village of Lansingburgh, except one year in Buffalo ; I was book-keeper in a bank ten years, and Avas in a railroad office; my occupation was such as made me familiar with handwriting and signatures; and I can-swear positively that the names are forged; I would like to have produced the document that I was committed under and have you inspect it; I believe it was prepared in Utica, and I belieA7e I can prove it; I believe I ought to have legal counsel, and an op- portunity to present this ease before a lawful court, and if I can sustain my charges then I ought to be released ac having been con- fined here from uuAvorthy and criminal motives on the part of those who sent me here; my Avife is the person who is supporting me while I am here. Q. How much does she pay for you ? A. I have been told it is six dollars a week as a private patient; my clothes come here to me occasionally ; I have only seen my wife once from the time I came here; my wife came here once and I re- fused to see her or to have an interview with her; I had the little children with me and I was passing to the green-house, and did not speak to her, and the reason I did not speak to her Avas because she had aided and abetted and counseled this false imprisonment by false accusations of insanity. Q. Have you any complaint to make, aside from the injustice of your detention; have you any complaint to make of the manner you are treated ? A. There are some things' that are general in their nature, but so far as the usual treatment has gone, I have been treated, about the same as private patients usually are. Q. Do they treat private patients different from pauper patients ? A. In some respects they do, and in others they do not; that is to say,they are usually treated with rather more respect and con- sideration. Q. What ward are you on ? A. The sixth ward north ; I was on the first ward for some time. 701 i then on the ninth ward ; then I returned on to the sixth and I am still on that ward. Q. Have you ever seen a patient struck by an attendant in the institution ? A. Yes, sir, I have, more than once. Q. Have you ever been struck by an attendant ? A. I have never been struck by an attendaut, nor has an attend- ant ever laid hands on me, excepting once, and then not with vio- lence. Q. Do you see Dr. Gray on the wards very often ? A. Not very often; he comes there very rarely, I might say. By Mr. Rice : Q. Do you remember an incident that occurred at any time in relation to one W., a patient ? A. Yes, sir; he desired to go out one day, and he was rudely withheld ; I cannot say, for certain, which attendant struck him, but he Avas struck once or twice, and he resisted very little; the violence was not severe, but it Avas uncalled for; the ward I am on is seldom disturbed in that way by such occurrences as that, as it is not Avhat is called a " violent " ward. _ Q. How did the attendant treat W.; what was the nature of the violence ? A. I was in my room and heard some disturbance, and stepped out, but only in time to see the close of the affair; when I looked out Mr. Wiison Avas making a motion as if to assist the attendant, but the patient quieted down so suddenly that there was no occasion for his interfering ; it was a man named W. that was kicked and struck. Q. Did you see that ? A. I am quite sure that I saw7 him kicked and struck;, he did not fall doAvn that I saw; when I saw him he was standing up. Q. Where did they kick him ? A. I did not notice ; it was a confused,' momentary affair, soon over, and I could not testify to the details of it ; I only saw the close of it, just as he was submitting and coming back to his place quietly ; I have written a letter of eighteen pages long that was sent to Dr. Smith, and the last time I saw it, it was in the hands of John C. Devereux, of the State Board of Charities ; that letter goes more into the details of my case than I can go now; you can make that letter the basis of your action, so far as my grievance is con- cerned. 702 GEORGE TUTTLE, Sworn and examined, testified as folloAVS : By the Chairman : Q. Please state your age ? m A. I, sir, am fifty years old the fourth of this month. _ Q. How long have you been an inmate of this institution? A I came here on the 30th day of December, 1875. Q. You state to the committee that you would like.to be heard ; have you any criticism to make upon the management of the insti- tution? „ , . , A. I don't know that I have, personally, any fault to find with the management; they have always treated me, as far as I know, very fairly. . Q. Have any cases come under your personal notice where you think attendants have treated patients unfairly? A. Y es, sir; I think there have; but most everybody that I knoAV any thing about in that respect has left here long ago; as far as I am concerned, gentlemen, we as patients are here under intimi- dation as I may say ; I do not mean to say that there is any physical domination out and out, but when a patient has been here a little while he realizes the immense poAver there is over him. Q. State if you have ever seen a patient treated Avith violence by an attendant? A. Oh, yes, sir; I have; I saw an attendant by the name of Halpin on the tenth ward, during the first three months I was here; I went on the tenth hall the 20th of April, 1876 ; I saAV this Halpin come along with a patient, he shoved the patient into an open door into a room, went in himself and shut the door; I saw that man when he came out, and he looked as though he had been through a threshing machine. , Q. Did he look that way before he Avent in ? A. Oh, no, sir; he Avas all right Avhen he Avent into the room; but there has not been so much bad usage since we have had tAvo or three investigations ; investigations do a great deal of good, if it is only in that direction ; it would not be out of the way if Ave had one every winter, it Avould help the boys along somewhat. Q. Did you ever see Halpin strike any other patient 'I A. No, sir; I don't remember that I ever did. , Q. Describe the condition of the patient a little more fully ? A. He looked as though he had been pretty roughly handled, perhaps I Avas not as Avell able to judge at that time, but I knew enough to see and knoAV that the patient had been badly misused. Q. Any other cases? A. Well, I suppose I can answer as I please here, answer or not; 703 I have a little the advantage of the attendants and doctors just now, and it is a little sweet to have an advantage, even though it is brief; I suppose if I decline to answer some questions you will not do with me as the Senate did with McDonald at Albany last week ; so having such advantage I shall decline to answer some of your questions because the attendant was very good to me ; I saw a man on ward eight strapped and kicked three times, he was a violent patient at the time; this patient, having an opportunity, grabbed him as he was strapped in the chair, and they both Avent to the floor, attendant and patient, the patient bit him, and he kicked the patient three times in the ribs. Q. Did he kick him pretty hard? A. Yes, sir, pretty hard. Q. Was the patient able to get up ? A. Yes, sir, he could get up. Q. Did the patient complain of being injured? A. No, sir; he was not in a state that he could; he was after- ward removed to another Avard, and finally after his discharge from the institution he committed suicide in Chicago; he was from Buffalo. Q. What was the attendant's name? A. That is one of the questions I don't want to answer; I shall not give his name ; he was ahvays very kind to me. Q. We think it is only just that your testimony on this point may be corroborated that you should give us the name of the attendant ? A. Oh ! no, gentlemen, I shall not give that, he Avas very kind to me; not only that, but some others connected with him have also been good to me; it was a long .time ago, 1876 ; I went on to the eighth hall the 26th March, 1876 ; I was only there a month, and it was during that time. Q. What other attendants Avere there at that tine ? A. They are all gone noAv ; one was a private attendant; he Avas in charge of a patient who is here now; but he is off in tlie western part of the State somewhere, that is one of the attendants and another is dead. Q. And what was the name of the other one ? A. Ah! that is the one I don't want to tell you. Q. Can yon give us the name of any other patient avIio was in- jured by an attendant ? A. As far as I am concerned most of the time for the past tAvo years I have been on good wards; I will say this, gentlemen, some of the time there is got to be force used to keep the violent patients down, if they, were not, there would not be any rest for the quiet men who are there. Q. Have you any fault to find with the management of affairs here ? A. Nothing, only as I intimated about the secret way of getting men into this condition of domination ; in my OAvn case particularly. Q. That is a belief you have ? 704 A. It is a fact, it is not a belief; I know it is so ; when Dr. Hammond and Prof. Jennings go to work and show it publicly, I do not think there is any harm in my saying a few words about it; matters that are current in the newspapers may be mentioned, and that matter is one that has been Avritten about; and I see that our friend over there (Mr. Haskell) got a clip in one of the papers here the other day, the Utica Herald, speaking about this investigation, said it emanated from the empty mouthings of an obscure legislator. Q. State to what you referred in your statement about yourself? A. The only way I could explain it is to say that I know I am under that influence and can feel it at work on me, not only that but I hear it talking to me, that there is a system by which one person has power of will, for instance, over others ; I can explain it in a few minutes; I was in a Catholic asylum at Buffalo j I had secret voices talking to me; the voices asked me one day if I had ever thought that there was going to be a system of communication between houses Avithout the use of wires or mechanical connection; I had always thought that there would be, and I said that I had, that I did think there would be such means of communication from house to house; the voice asked me if it would be by the power of mind ; " no," I said, "I had not any clear idea just how the thing was going to be done ;" then the voice said to me again, " do you know what ails you;" I says, " no, I don't, but I know there is something ails me that had not ought to be ailing me ; " the voice then told me that I had been controlled by animal magnetism, and that I had been so controlled for fifteen years ; that was in 1875, so that \A7ould take it back to I860; now the mass of stuff that emanates from so-called lunatics most of it is unreliable, but this is reliable; I am a man of large property, I have lost control of it, and here I am, I do not know whether I will ever get control of it again ; I was in business — grain, flour and commission business ; I was on the docks in Buffalo; my father Avent there in 1847, and I went there in business with him in 1853, and stayed there until he died. Q. Are you comfortable here ; as to table and bed, etc., are they satisfactory ? A. Yres, sir, fairly so; I was going to say one thing, and per- haps I hadn't ought to say it; you were asking me about unkind treatment; Ithink that sometimes a little too much unreasonable force is used in giving medicine; extra force it amounts to some- times; I mean a great deal of force ; if a patient will not take it the attendant says he must, and he has to. Q. Are the doctors present on such occasions? A. No, sir. Q. Do you think more force is used than there would be if the doctors were present ? A. Oh, yes, sir ; there is more force than I would nee; if I were an attendant I would not make myself liable to a charge of such a thing ; but I have never taken any medicine and don't need any; I am now on ward number nine. 705 WILLIAM L. PALMER, Called. By the Chairman : Q. Ytou stated to the committee that you wanted to appear be- fore them ; will yon be sworn ? A. No, sir ; I think 1 will affirm ; [Thereupon the Avitness affirmed and said : " I do not affirm to answer every question you ask me, but what I do tell I shall tell the truth."] Q. You stated to the committee that you had some complaint to make about the institution; if you have any such complaint you can now state it ? A. It is a simple story and soon told ; I came here February 8, 1879, with a person called deputy sheriff Burns, and William O. Palmer, a man I have always considered to be my father; I sup- pose him to be so, and suppose he is the person after Avhom I was named. Q. What fault have you to find, if any, with the institution ? A. You must excuse my personality if I tell my own story; I was brought here without knowing the cause why I Avas brought here. Q. Have you any thing to complain about your treatment here ? A. Yes; I want to be examined by an impartial, able body to prove to them that I am in a fit condition to be a member of soci- ety at large. Q. Have you any complaint to make about your treatment, ex- cept what you have stated; Iioav do the attendants treat you ? A. I Avas on the fourth hall the 25th of June, 1883, and I was treated at times as a human being should not be treated ; I will tell you one little incident — perhaps you can explain it tome ; one morning I Avas taken and given a bath; there are tAvo bath- rooms, and this was in the old bath-room; while in the bath I Avas rubbed and scrubbed with a broom; and I did not mind that, I assure you ; but after that, when I was cleaned outside, a rubber tube about so long (about three feet) Avas brought, one end was placed in my mouth and the other end Avas placed to the cold water tap; the Avater Avas turned on and permitted to run until it ran over out of my mouth ; I was so full; they filled me up ; I don't kuow why it was done ; I spoke about it and they laughed ; I think it was wholly unnecessary, for I am a clean man inside and try to be out- side. Q. What other treatment were you subjected to or what other things occurred there? A. Well, it is hardly necessary to go into these petty details, I think. 89 U 706 Q. Your chief complaint is as to your unlawful imprisonment here? A. Yres, sir; that is all I wish to say ; if they have the power to confine me here, why, they have the power to confine everybody; I wish to be examined by an impartial body, able and disinterested; I merely alluded to this little washing incident as a little by-play, you knoAV — a diversion ; I hope we shall meet again, Mr. Chairman, good-bye; I do not like to say any thing that will result to the injury of any of my friends, good-bye. Mr. Rice — I want to put in evidence the papers upon which Miss Lathrop was committed to this institution. Said papers were then marked, respectively, " Exhibits Nos. 14, 15 and 16, J. H. M.," and are as follows: Exhibit 14 — Copy. State of New York, ) County of Monroe. ) I, Peter W. Neefus, a resident of Rochester, N. Y., in the county aforesaid, being a graduate of New York Homoeopathic Medical College, and having practiced as a physician three and a half years, hereby certify, under oath, that on the 17th day of October, 1880, I personally examined Clarissa C. Lathrop, of Rochester, N. Y., a female thirty-three years of age, unmarried, and by occupation, teacher, and that the said Clarissa C. Lathrop is insane and a proper person for care and 'treatment under the provisions of chapter ikQ of the Laws of 1874. I further certify that I have formed this opinion upon the follow- ing grounds, viz.: For at least tAvo years she has complained of many imaginary symptoms, especially of the brain and nervous system generally; being obliged to give up all mental labor. Her con- versation would always turn to her brain symptoms. Has been growing worse gradually and is now controlled by the delusiou that she is being poisoned by a lady boarding with her people. She believes the poison is neutralized by an alkali externally and she continually wants to apply soap, soda or ammonia. Her people can do nothing with her; she will not stay at home; will eat noth- ing in the honse or w7ear any thing from the house until thoroughly neutralized of the supposed poison. And I further declare, that my qualifications, as a medical examiner in lunacy, have been duly attested and certified by W. C. Rowdey, county judge, Monroe county. PETER W. NEEFUS, M. D. Sworn to and subscribed before me, this ) 21st day of October, A. D. 1880. J W. C. Rowley, County Judge. 707 Exhibit No. 15 — Copy. State^of New York, f County of Oneida, f I, James G. Hunt, a resident of Utica, in the county aforesaid, being a graduate of Jefferson Medical College, Philadelphia, and having practiced as a physician nine years, hereby certify, under oath, that on the 19th day of October, 1880,1 personally examined Clarissa C. Lathrop, of Rochester, N. Y., a female 33 years of age, unmarried, and by occupation a teacher, and that the said Clarissa 0. Lathrop is insane and a proper person for care and treatment, under the provisions of chapter 446 of the Laws of 1874. I further certify that I have formed this opinion upon the fol- lowing grounds, viz.: Complained of a pressure in the top of the head for the past two years; gave up the study of German at that time on the account of it; felt that her general health was failing her and her memory was not as good ; this condition, both physically and mentally, con- tinued up to within tAvo months; when she was controlled by delusions such as she suspected that she was laboring under the effects of some kind of poison administered by a lady who boarded in the same house with her people, the purpose was to put her out of the way so that she could get the young man with whom she had been keeping company with; the nature of the poison was sulphuric acid, and occasionally she feels the effects of it now, then she very promptly takes something to neutralize it; she says by taking an alkali will do it and her remedy generally when she can- not get any thing else is soap in the mouth ; cannot sleep nights. AndJI further declare, that my qualifications, as a medical examiner in lunacy, have been duly attested and certified by W. B. Bliss. JAMES G. HUNT, M. D. Sworn to and subscribed before me, this \ 19th day of October, A. D. 1880. j W. P. Carpenter, Notary Public, Oneida Co., N. T. Exhibit No. 16 — Copy. State of New York, ( Monroe County, j " It having been made to appear to me by the sworn statements of Jeraimah W. Lathrop, Nellie C. Lathrop and P. W. Neefus, M. D., all of Rochester, in said county, that Clarissa C. Lathrop of the same place hs now insane; that her insanity has come upon her 708 within one year last past; that she is thirty-two years of age and unmarried ; that she has no money or means by which to sustain or support herself while under the infliction of insanity ; that she has no relatives or friends of sufficient property or means to so sup- port her,— thereupon I do order that the said Clarissa C. Lathrop be supported in the NeAv York State Lunatic Asylum at Utica, as an indigent insane person at the cost and charge of the said county of Monroe. f[sBAL.] W. C. ROWLEY, Co. J. i Dated October 26, 1880. NO. 1. ; . Monroe County, October 26, 1880. The consent of the board of trustees of the Monroe County In- sane Asylum is hereby given to the commitment of the said Clarissa C Lathrop, in accordance to the within order. HENRY CHURCHILL, ' CHARLES S. WRIGHT, J. W. CRAIG, Trustees. No. 2. • * "■'■' No. 14,060. Clarissa Lathrop, Rochester, Monroe county. Ad initled October 19, 1880. The committee then adjourned until 3:30 p. m., Monday, March 17, at Albany. 709 Albany, N. Y., March 18, 1884. The committee met in room " B," New Capitol. Present — Messrs. Howe, Haskell and Brown. JOHN W. YAUGHN, Sworn and examined, testified as follows : By the Chairman : Q. Please state your age and residence. A. My residence is Jefferson, Schoharie county; my age is thirty-two in May. Q. What is your business ? A. Farmer. Q. Have you any special familiarity with stock and cattle? A. Yes, sir ; I am a breeder of Holstein stock and have been for three or four years. Q. Do you buy stock in the market ? A. 1 have bought thoroughbreds and sold them. Q. Where do you keep your stock ? A. On my farm. Q. Are you familiar with the market values of that class of cattle ? A. I am somewhat; I pretend to be and I calculate lam; I have taken considerable pains in the matter; I have bought and sold several. Q. What is a yearling Holstein bull worth — a thoroughbred ? A. Of course it depends considerable — of course there is as much difference in them as in any thing else; I should say from — well, I sold one the other day myself for $125 — a very fine ani- mal — a thoroughbred, registered, and from an imported cow ; you want a good, fair price; it varies — we have to average it — it varies according to the quality. Q. Within what limits does it vary ? A. You can put them all the way from $75 to — well, I should counfra good one worth what I sold mine for, $125. By Mr. Brown : Q. What would you consider a fair price for a thoroughbred bull — of good stock — coming two years old this spring ? A. There is quite a variation in them of course ; sometimes they refer back quite considerably to milking records, etc. ; you want the price of one — a two-year old coming in this spring ? Q. The price of a bull coming two years old this spring ? 710 A. Oh, a bull tAvo years old, it would not be worth as much as a yearling to me — a yearling is just as good for service as one older; I would consider a yearling worth more money, and I think I could get more money for a yearling than I could for a two-year-old, but probably there would not be much difference. Q. What would you consider a good price for a tAVO-year-old heifer, coming on this spring—a full-blooded thoroughbred? A. Two hundred and fifty dollars would be a good price; there is them that is worth that, and there is them that would be worth more, and some less; but I would count that a good price. Q. What do you consider a cow worth — at an age that would be considered the best; a good full-blooded Holstein cow ? A. It would depend whether she was wanted for making butter at present; for a cow of a good serviceable age, I should say $300; I calljj that a good price; I have got one that is worth that, and she is a good imported cow ; that is a good price, I should say. By the Chairman : Q. Have you ever known of a Holstein bull, within your own personal knowledge, to be sold as high as $500 ? A. No, sir; I never knew of that price being paid. Q. What is the highest price you have ever knoAvn to be received for a Holstein bull of any age — of your own personal knowledge ? A. I don't know as I know of any under my own personal knoAvledge that beats my sale that I made a year ago ; I speculated on one and he turned me $160; he was a yearling. Q. State w7hether or not an older bull would be worth more than that ? A. They are not worth as much in my estimation ; I will tell you why he ain't; the older a bull gets he gets a little vicious, and is worse to handle than a younger one ; most stock men had rather give a good price for a young one, good for service, than they woild for an old one. Q. Hoav high have you known Holstein cows to be sold — of your own knoAvledge? J A. The most that I know, except reading, is what I bought myself; I have read a good deal; I paid for one that I bought, and she was five years old, I bought her and paid $201 for her; she is an imported cow and a very fine one; I have got her now. Q. What is the highest price yon have known one to be sold for, other than your own purchase ? A. I can tell you of a heavy sale of a calf the other day, but that is|not a cow; Smith & Powell paid $4,200 for a young calf, a thoroughbred Holstein ; it Avas from Secretary Wells,' secretary of the American association ; it was from his cow, " Mercedes," that made the most butter of any cow on record. Q. What is a good fair price for a thoroughbred Holstein cow? A. For a thoroughbred, and a likely cow, I say that I should put it three hundred dollars. 711 Q. Have you ever known of ja cow to sell for a higher price than that within your own personal notice ? A. I never have. [A paper was then marked " Exhibit No. 17, J. H. M."; it is admilted by Mr. Goodwin, that said exhibit is a bill taken from the files of the Asylum, and is a bill for the Holstein cattle purchased by Dr. Gray, and referred to by Mr. Dryer in his testimony given March 15th.] J S Q. Look at this bill, " Exhibit ^17," and state whether or not you are familiar with the particular strain of Holstein stock represented by the bull, " First Duke of Stansted " ? A. I cannot tell you as I think that strain is any better than a good many other registered. Q.. Have yon ever heard of it ? A. I do not call this to my memory just noAv; I could look my herd books over and tell, but'I don't think the strain of that is any better than a good many others registered; I don't remember much about that. Q. Look at the bill —Exhibit 17 — please state whether or not, in your judgment, the prices charged in that bill are high ? A. Well, I count it a high price. Q. I now ask you to state Avhat you would consider stock so described could be purchased for in the market ? A. I estimate that a bull — knoAving what I do about this bull, I should put him at $150 ; the heifer and the cow at $300; I know I could buy three pretty good ones at that. Cross-examined by Mr. Goodwin : Q. You say, "knowing, as I do, about this bull, I should put him down at $150?" A. Yes, sir. Q. What do you knoAV about this bull ? A. I don't know much about this bull. Q. Do you know any thing about him ? A. I never saw him. Q. What strain of blood do you say he was from? A. Well, it w7as said here that it was — I cannot tell you the name — it was the Duke of Stans, something, I can't tell you. Q. Ytou are not familiar with it, are you? A. It is in my herd-book, I suppose. Q. Yes, sir ; but are you not familiar with the name of this strain ? A. No more than I am with others. Q. Hoav many head of Holstein ^cattle have you got on your farm ? A. Four head of thoroughbreds'. Q. What are they, what sex ? 712 A. One is a male and the other three females. Q. What is the highest price you paid for the highest one ? A. Two hundred and one dollars — an imported cow. Q. What is the lowest price ? A. The other one that I bought was not a year old, and I bought her and gave $100 for her. Q. Where did you buy the $201 one? A. I bought her of Dr. El wood of Schenectady, and I bought the heifer of him also. Q. How many have you bought altogether — how many head of Holstein ? A. How many, strictly thoroughbreds? Q. Yes, sir ? A. I haven't bought, right out, of myself, but three head. Q. Did you ever attend a State fair? A. Y es, sir. Q. Have you ever priced the animals there of the Holstein variety ? ■ A. 'No, sir. Q. Did you ever examine them ? A. I have looked at them. Q. Never inquired the price of any ? A. Not at the State fair. Q. Never knew what they sold for ? A. No, sir. Q. Do you know any thing about Smith & Powells ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What do you knoAV about them ? A. I know this much, that when I Avent into the Holstein busi- ness, I wrote them and several others, and they were so high-toned, I could not do any thing. Q. Do you knoAV any thing about Gerrit Smith, and Miller, of Peterboro, Madison county ? A. I corresponded with them. Q. Did you find them " too high-toned " ? A. I don't know as I had him price any to me. Q. Did you ever buy any of him ? A. No, sir. Q. Did you ever inquire prices of him ? A. I can't say as I ever did. Q. You never bought an imported cow in your life, did you? A. Yes, sir, I did ; I bought her of Dr. Elwood. Q. How do you know that she was imported ? A. I know they told me so, and jnove than that I have got the papers. Q. Dr. Elwood told you she was imported ; do you regard her as a first-class cow ? A. Yes, sir, and she is; I count her as good as any I know of. 713 Q. Do you regard this coav that yon bought of Elwood one of the best in the country ? A. I do ; yes, sir. Q. Would it make any difference in your mind as to the value of these animals Avhether they were Avith calf or not when they were bought ? A. Y es, sir ; it would make from seventy-five to a hundred dol- lars difference. Q. Would it make any difference in your judgment avIio was the sire of the calf; what bull got the calf? A. Yes, sir. Q. Hoav much difference Avould it make in }7our judgment? A. There is a wide range there; I understand we are talking only of thoroughbred Holsteins? Q. Yes; you may take as Avide a range as yon please from the highest to the lowest ? A. Well, I will give you —fifty dollars. Q. Then in your judgment it would make no more difference than fifty dollars, no matter Avhat bull the calf was got by ? A. No, not if it Avas a full-blooded thoroughbred bull ; we are talking of thoroughbreds. Q. How old was the cow that you bought of Dr. Elwood? A. Five years old; a good, sound coav, as straight as a horse, and a good deal straighter than most of them ; she is a coav that has taken several first premiums ; her Aveight is 1,400 pounds. Q. How long have you been dealing in these cattle l! A. About three years. Q. Do you regard any Holstein coav as being worth $450 ? A. No, nor any other cow. Q. Do you regard any Holstein heifer as being worth $400 ? A. No, sir, I do not. Q. Do you regard any Holstein bull as being Avorth $500? A. No, sir, I do not; nor any other bull. Q. Do you regard any full-blooded cow that is with calf worth $450? A. No, sir, I don't count them Avorth that, although they get it sometimes. Q. Do you regard a heifer with calf as worth $400 ? A. No, sir, I do not. By Mr. Brown : Q. Have you a neighbor opposite you avIio deals in Holstein stock ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do you know how the prices he gets for his stock compare with the prices on this bill, " Exhibit No. 17? " A. He does not get as much ; J. K. Odell, president of the Del- ^ aware County Stock Breeders' Association, told me, and I know ':. what they haA7e sold for. ? 90 U > 714 Q. Did you ever know of the sale of any Holstein stock at prices as high as those on this bill ? A. No, sir,. I never did. By Mr. Goodwin : Q. Are you a dealer in Holsteins? A. I just said I was. Q. You buy and sell ? A. I have bought and sold. Q. Did you buy these cattle for the purpose of breeding or grad- ing your stock, or to raise stock for the market ? A. I bought them to raise thoroughbred stock to make some money out of it, and I am making money out of them. GEO. W. JONES, Sworn and examined, testified as folloAvs: By the Chairman : Q. What is your business ? A. Shoemaker and farmer, and run a saw-mill and grain elevator. Q. How old are you ? A. Fifty-four. Q. Are you at present a member of the Assembly ? A. Yes, sir, from Seneca county. Q. What relation do you sustain to the Willard Asylum ? A. I am a trustee and one of the farm committee. Q. Will you please state what system is pursued at that Asylum for the purchasing of supplies for that institution ? A. What kind of supplies ? Q. Groceries ? A. We issue circulars monthly. Mr. Goodwin —I think if you are going to compare asylums, you must compare them in other ways and other manners, as well as in the purchasing of provisions. Q. I am going to show Avhat their system of purchasing is as com- pared with the system of purchasing at Utica, so as to show what knoAvledge or care is exercised by the board of managers ; proceed, Mr. Jones? S >1 > A. We issue what Are call quotations, once monthly, to different persons that we have been in the habit of buying of; if it is gro- ceries, we send a quotation to John Crouse, of Syracuse, also to two or three NeAV York firms. Q. For the same goods and the same amount? A. Yes, sir; for instance, if it is so many barrels of sugar, we name " A " sugar or "B" sugar, or whatever thev arc called by, we want so many barrels, so much tea and so much coffee, naming the kind, "Rio" or " Java," or whatever we want; [" What will you 715 furnish so many pounds of these goods at, at your store;" then they send a sample in small packages; we have a table like this one we are sitting at, and once a month Ave examine the different sugars, coffees, steep the tea, weigh so much of it out, and steep it and taste it; then they purchase what they consider is the cheapest for the price. Q. And the same Avay in purchasing goods for clothing? A. They have some goods that the steAvard purchases out and out; take clothing, for instance; if Ave are going to buy some clothing, Ave ask the different houses, of a Syracuse firm, sometimes we purchase of a Rochester firm, New7 York firms, we ask them to send us a sample of a suit of clothes, if you please, naming the kind of goods that we usually require, and we buy these and pay for them ; whether Ave accept the bid or not, we pay for whatever is sent, and we take whatever avc regard as the cheapest for the money. Q.^ To what extent are such purchases made without such com- petition? - A. My judgment Avould be that the majority of our purchases are made in that way ; there are some purchases with Avhich we could not do that ; for instance, we buy our oavii Avheat; the Avheat is bought by the steward, and it is ground at Ovid and Ave pay so much for the grinding. Q. Do you buy all your flour and wheat? A. Nearly all; when we can buy Avheat at the market price at Ovid, we have it ground and use our feed for the cows. . Q. Hoav often are bills paid ? A. Monthly, on the 10th of every month. Q. What system do you have of auditing bills? A. When a man sells any thing at the Asylum it is weighed, and the man that weighs it gives a receipt for the Aveight, and he makes a bill and a duplicate bill, and sends it to the steward ; then the steAvard takes the one bill and he makes a bill from that upon our heading, " Willard Asylum"; he makes that and attaches the original bill to that; the bills are made out in that way, and these bills, after being made out, are certified to hy the superintendent, Dr. Chapin, and the steward ; then the auditing committee is noti- fied that the bills are ready for auditing for the month, usually about the first of the month ; it may vary three or four days, but hardly ever later than the filth ; three of us are on the auditing committee, named yearly, and two of us audit those bills— that is a majority. Q. Before they are paid or after ? A. Before they are paid ; then those bills are handed to the treasurer, and he, at the tenth of every month, pays those bills, the contractor gets a duplicate or triplicate rather (for there are three) and then of course there is an account kept of all bills on the books of the Asylum ; a list of the bills is kept; after we audit, we compare the numbers of the bills and the name3 and amounts, with the bills as they are made out ; then the chairman of the auditing 716 board retains these lists as Ave call them, monthly lists, and at the end of every year we report what bills Ave have audited during the year; that you will find in our reports every year. Cross-examined by Mr. Goodavin : Q. Hoav is Ovid located as to a city ; where is the Asylum located ? A. The Asylum is three miles from Ovid. Q. About how large a place is Ovid ? A. It has about eight or nine hundred inhabitants. Q. What are the nearest large cities to Ovid ? A. Syracuse and Rochester. Q. How far is Ovid from Syracuse ? A. About seventy miles. Q. And about the same from Rochester ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And the village of Ovid does not keep the supplies on hand, necessarily? A. No, sir. Q. Is that the reason you apply to Rochester and Syracuse ? A. We apply wherever avc can buy the cheapest; the steward applies. Q. Where do you buy beef ? A. We buy it through the country in the locality. Q. And your butter and eggs, etc. ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Have you ever purchased cattle for the Asylum? A. I have purchased one bull. Q. What kind of a bull? A. A Holstein bull; I bought him of Mr. White, of Syracuse. Q. How old was he ? A. Two years old and past. Q. Thoroughbred ? A. Yes, sir; imported stock; Ave gave for that bull $150. Q. Did yon buy any coavs ? A. No, sir; we only bought the bull, and the reason we bought him was in order to improve the rest of our stock, and to improve the milking qualities of our stock; he was a pretty good animal. Q. In your judgment the purchase of a blooded animal does im- prove the rest of the stock ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And that purchase met your judgment and approbation? A. Yes, sir. By the Cnairman: Q. Hoav much stock have you on the farm ? A. I should say 140 or 150' head of cattle. 717 Q. Have you any other thoroughbreds in your stock ? A. We have another bull calf there at present, he is a Holstein; we purchased three head in all; this one of white, which was $150; we bought one of the Oneida Community, for that we paid $100 ; and the other one, a calf, we paid $250 for. By Mr. Goodwin : Q. How long have you been a manager of Willard Asylum ? A. Eleven or twelve years, I should say. Q. Hoav many meetings do you have of your board of managers in the course of a year ? A. Do you mean full board meetings ? Q. Yes, full meetings of the board ? A. We have a meeting quarterly — four a year; Ave have other committees, we have a building committee, for instance, that meets — I should say w7e average six or seven meetings a year. Q. Hoav often do you visit the asylum at Ovid personally ? A. I visit the asylum probably twice a month now, since I have been at Albany; when I am at home I visit it about every Aveek. Q. Hoav many times in the last year have you seen Dr. Chapin on the wards of that institution ? A. I could not state; I don't think I could tell, I should say half a dozen times Q. Have you ever seen any black eyes on the wards there ? A. No, sir ; I can't say that I have; I suppose you refer to pa- tients ; I never have. Q. Yours is an asylum for the chronic insane? A. Yes, sir. Q. How many patients are there in there? A. One thousand seven hundred and ninety-four, that is my im- pression. The committee then adjourned until to morroAv afternoon. 718 Room B, New Capitol, Wednesday, March 19, 1884, 3:30 p. m. Met pursuant to adjournment. Present — Messrs. Howe, Haskell, Rice and Broavn. Messrs. Morgan and Goodwin, of counsel. Proceedings continued as follows : MARY A. FELTON, Sworn and examined, testified as follows: By Mr. Morgan : Q. Where do you reside ? A. New Hartford. Q. With Mr. Comstock ? A. Yes, sir; Gilbert Comstock. Q. What are your duties in his family? A. Doing house work, and taking care of Mrs. Comstock, or look- ing after her. Q. She is insane, is she not? A. Yes, sir ; I have been there three years in May. Q. Do they have any other female help but yourself ? A. No, sir, they never have had since I have been there. Q. What is your age ? A. Thirty. Q. You have been an inmate in Utica Lunatic Asylum, at Utica? A. I have ; I was there as a patient. Q. When did you go to the Asylum ? A. It was five years ago. Q. How long did you remain there? A. Fifteen months. Q. Upon what ward were you placed when you first entered the Asylum ? A. On twelfth Avard. Q. Who was supervisor on that ward ? A. Anna Burns. Q. Who were the attendants on that Avard ? A. Jane Bolton, and Frankie Davis assisted her. Q. Hoav long did you remain on ward twelve ? A. Just about two weeks. Q. While on ward twelve, did yon see anv unkind treatment bv the supervisor or attendants of the patients on that ward ? 719 A. I think I did see a great deal; Anna Burns would fasten me in the stationary chair, and did so several times; after I Avas re- strained, she took my wrist and twisted it as far as she could, until I begged her to stop ; then she says, " there," .just as if she had conquered me; she tAvisted it as far as she could, clear over; an- other time she strapped me so tight in the chair it took the flesh off my left side; it was draAvn so tight it took the skin off; I could hardly breathe ; I. was there about twro hours in that way. Q. Did you complain that you were strapped too tight? A. I did to her; told her she would kill me ; she only laughed and said I could stay there. Q. What other unkind treatment to yourself or any other pa- tients ? A. I suffered with cold on ward twelve terribly; it was not warm enough there; I asked for my shoulder shawl one da}7 and she would not give it to me; I sat there shivering with cold; there Avas a Miss M. there who was abused terribly ; I don't know where she Avas from ; I think her name Avas Ellen ; I should say she might be forty years old, by her looks. Q. What occurred Avith her and by whom ? A. Anna Burns, she used to twist her Avrists a great deal worse than she did mine; she Avould scold when she Avas eating in the dining-room. Q. Was it enough to make Miss M. cry out ? A. Yres, sir, it was. Q. What else did Anna Burns do to Miss M. beside twist her wrist ? A. She used to get talking in the dining-room a great deal and they used to drag her out into the Avard and feed her there; take her very violently and feed her there. Q. Describe the manner in which they would take her out? A. There would be two, one take one arm and one another, and if she refused to go they would pull her arms back behind her and push her forward ; she Avas scolding because she Avas there so much. Q. What other treatment on ward tAvelve was there? A. If patients refused to take their medicine Avillingly — Miss K., she was a patient there; she would hold their nose and Miss Stirling would pour it doAvn them ; if that wasn't enough they would call for another attendant, and she would hold their arms be- hind them; sometimes it would seem to strangle them ; Miss Stir- ting Avould put her hands over their mouths ; they used her bad, that is Miss M.; Miss Stirling Avas supervisor on two Avard, and she came there with the medicines for eight, twelve and six, and, I think, five. Q. Was there any other occurrence on ward twelve that you noticed ? A. There was a patient sick and she complained a good deal about Anna Burns' treatment, she didn't pay much attention to her; she complained to me about the way she was used. 720 Q. Did you go to the bed of this patient that died and see her ? A. The one I am speaking about now; she didn't die. Q. I thought you said she died; Avas it a common Avay and prac- tice by Anna Burns to twist the wrists of patients, [take hold of their hand and twist their Avrists ? A. Yes, sir ; it seemed to be. Q. To what Avard did you go from ward tAvelve? A. On to ward two. Q. How long Avere you on ward two at that time, Avhen you went from ward twelve — Iioav long were you there ? A. I should think it was not much more than a week, I don't remember exactly. Q. Who was supervisor on Avard two ? A. Emma Stirling. Q. Do you remember who the attendants were, when you went on to ward two for the first time ? A. Hattie Leonard and Miss Curtis. Q. What if any thing occurred on ward two, that was unkind? A. I didn't see any thing there very much ; I Avas not there a Aveek the first time. Q. From ward two, where Avere you sent ? A. I Avent back to ward five. Q. Do you know why they sent you on ward five? A. Yes, sir; I took off my shoes and went in my stocking feet one night, and annoyed the patients by going into their rooms. Q. And you Avere sent to five ward ; who AAras supervisor on ward five when you went there ? A. I think her name was Miss Roberts, I cannot say for certain. Q. Do you remember the names of the attendants? A. Miss Roberts, Mabel Allen and Nellie Jones; it was either Roberts or Reynolds, I think it Avas Roberts. Q. How long did you remain on ward five ? A. I think 1 Avas there tAvo or three Aveeks. Q. Did any thing occur Avhile you Avere on ward five that seemed unkind to you ? A. No, sir ; I don't think there was any thing, only they didn't pay as much attention to some sick patients as they ought to. Q. Do you remember any pntient that they neglected ? A. Yes, sir : but I never knew her name Q. Do you remember what the trouble was with the patient they neglected, and, so far as you can, describe the manner in which the patient Avas treated ? A. The first thing I saw of her, I Avent into the dormitory, she sat there strapped in the stationary chair, and Avas dving, I kneAV she was by her looks; I went and told Miss T., a patient, I told her; she said she was dying ; I said I knew she Avas dying, but I didn't know what was the matter; she said "they fed her with that stom- ach tube," and she thought they hurt her; one of the attendants 721 Baw me, and told me not to go into that room again ; that night she died, and I never saw her after that. Q. What was the name of the attendant who told you not to go into that room again ? A. 1 think it was Mabel Allen. Q. Did you learn whether she did die ? A. No, sir ; she was almost dead when I saw her, just breathing, her head clear down. Q. From five where were you sent ? A. To ward four. Q. Who was the supervisor therp on number four ? A. It was Mary Gowen. Q. Do you remember who the attendants were on number four ? A. Mrs. Williams,; I don't remember that there were any more than two on Avard four. Q. How many patients were there on number four when you went there ? A. I cannot say for certain, twenty-five I should say ; I don't know as I ever counted them. Q. Was that a more disturbed ward than five, or less ? A. It is more quiet than five — five is a demented ward. !'" Q. How long were yon kept on five ? A. About three weeks, before I went to number four. Q. How long did you remain on number four ? A. The first time I don't think I was there over two weeks. Q. Did any thing occur on ward four while you were there that was notable ? A. No, sir ; I don't think there was any thing. Q. Where did you go from ward four? A. Back on to five again. Q. Were the same attendants there when you got back on to that ward ? A. No, sir. Q. Did any thing occur at that time, while you were on number five ? A. No, sir ; I don't know as there was. Q. How long did you stay on five the second time you were there ? A. 1 guess I was there some six weeks, perhaps. Q. Where were yon sent to from'ward five? A. On to ward six, but I was only there three or four hours ; I asked them to let me go on to number five Avard, and I would be quiet. Q. What was there about ward six that you didn't like ? A. I Avas afraid of the patients; they were so wild there and noisy, I was afraid of them; Dr. Russell said I could go back. Q. Do you know why they sent you on to six ward ? A. Y es, sir ; there was a young lady there ; she was a Catholic ; I used to take some water and tell her that I was going to sprinkle 91 U 722 her ; I called it holy water, and she got mad and complained of me and'they put me back ; her name was E. B. ; I would unbutton her apron, too, and that provoked her; she was a patient. Q. From five where did you next go ? A. I think they put me on eight — seven or eight — I always get these two wards mixed up. Q. Seven and eight are more disturbed wards than five, are they not? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do you remember who was supervisor on the ward to which you were sent, whether it was seven or eight ? A. I do; of number eight Avard Hattie Payne was there; Sarah Stirling was the supervisor there ; and Lucy Morris was there. Q. Did any thing occur on eighth ward while you were there ? A. Yes, sir ; Miss Morris after I Ayould go from the dining-room to the ward, she Avould stand at the door and take the keys and punch me in the back with them ; she punched me three or four times, but the last time and the third time I said if she dared to do it again, I would report it to Dr. Curtis, and she said he would think it was a delusion, but I didn't think delusions were so striking as that. Q. Did she hurt yon by punching you with the keys ? A. Yes, sir; of course; it was like a little hammer pounding in the back ; she would laugh and seemed delighted at it. Q. At any time when she punched you in tne back Avith these keys had you been doing any thing out of the way ? A. No, sir; I had been at the table and ate my meals quietly, and went out quietly; she didn't do it after I told her I would report her. Q. What else occurred on Avard eight ? A. There AAras another patient, Mrs. T., she had a very bad arm and hand, her hand was broken, and they said Lucy Morris broke it for her, and it was not set properly, it was in a sling. Q. Who told you that Lucy Morris broke her arm ? A. I don't remember, some of the girls told me. Q. Do you remember how long she carried her arm in a sliug ? A. All the time I was there, all the summer ; I Avas there, I think, abouttwo weeks. Q. Was there any thing else you saw on number eight ? A. I have seen patients put in the stationary chair, soon as they were dressed in the morning, and kept there until night; they were quiet and seemed stupid, and were kept in the chairs and fed there; they Avere allowed no exercise at all. Q. What kind of patients were they who were put in chairs like that; did they seem to be patients who had lost their reason mostly ? A. They did not seem to know any thing ; you had to feed them ; I fed them myself there day after day. Q. Were there intervals when they were not kept in the chair? A. Sometimes they would not be in the chair. 723 Q. What was their conduct when not kept in the chair ? A. One was an old lady ; she seemed mischievous ; she would go for the patients, and they would have to strap her down in the chair again. Q. Any other ill treatment on ward eight ? A. Well, some of the patients had to sleep on the wards in a straw bed in the day-rooms, on the floor, and they would be strapped by the Avrists to a chair. Q. The bed would be put where? A. Right up close to the stationary chair, and the patients strapped to the chair so that they could not stir in the night; it was a straw tick they were put on. Q. What dp you know, if any thing, in reference to a change of the bed, Avhen it came night in the crib beds? A. In the day time, there would be mattresses in the crib for the inspection of visitors ; when it came night there would be a lot of straw tick put in its place; the mattress would be carried out into a kiud of a closet ; it would look very nice in the day time. Q, What else occurred in ward eight; any thing that you re- member ? A. I don't know as there was any thing else. Q. From eight where did you go ? A. Back to number five ; they kept me on eight quite a while; on eight and five together. Q. Hoav long were- you on eight altogether while yon were there ? A. May be it was quite a month. Q. Did you say they took you from eight back to five ? A. I think I went on No. 10, but Avas not there but one day on No. 10 ward. Q. Do you knoAV how they came to take you to No. 10 Avard \ A. No, sir; I do not. Q. Why were you taken from No. 10 ? A. I never knew why ; two of us girls went back together, and they put me on five ; I suppose it was because we were quite sociable; she Avas from New York, Miss M. ; they would take us and put us on different Avards if we were too sociable ; I don't know where they put her; from ten I was,taken]back to five. Q. From five, where were you taken to? A. No. 2 ; that is a quiet ward. Q. When you got back to No. 2 ward, was there any thing oc- curred there that was notable ?x A. The most I saw was bed bugs ; I don't know whether they are notable. Q. From ward 2, where were von taken ? A. To four. Q. Did any thing occur on ward 4 ? A. I don't know as there was any thing. Q. From four, where were you taken ? A. I was taken home ; I was discharged from No. 4 ward. 724 t. 2Q. Is there any other ill-treatment that you saw while you were in the Asylum ? A. I shall have to look on this memorandum. By the Chairman : Q. Did you make that memorandum yourself? A. Yes, sir. Q. Refer to your memorandum ? A. I was on the dormitory one night, on No. 5 ward, and saw Emma Stirling drag a patient from her bed ; she refused to take her medicine ; she left the door open, I looked through, she dragged her on the ward ; Emma Stirling had her hands resting on her lungs; this Miss K., who always carried the medicine tray for Miss Stirling, was holding the patient's nose ; she poured it down her throat very harshly. Q. When she was pouring medicine down her throat, where did the patient lay ? A. On the floor of the ward; she had her knees right up close here (indicating) on the chest so as to keep her from moving her head; I saw a patient on eleven ward that Avas dying in the crib, there was a sheet thrown over her; as I was going in the back yard I looked and saw it, and lifted the sheet to see what Avas under the sheet, 1 saw she was just alive ; I says, " Why don't you go in and brush the flies off her face ;•" they were mad at me and pushed me out, jerked me out; I saw her the day before in the yard, and she was dead the day after that; it was very warm weather; I told the girls to take a fan and brush away the flies; the attendants, Avhen I told them, said I had better mind my oavii business ; I cannot give the names; if 1 saw the names in print I could tell you very quick; I cannot think of them now. Q. When did you next see or hear any thing of the patient that was in the crib ? A. I never saw her in the yard after that; they said she was dead; I learned she had died in the crib. Q. Was there only you went in there; was there any one in there caring for her ? A. No, sir; if there had been I should not have been there; I had to step quick to get there; when they saw me they had me come right out. Q. Did you go in there again ? A. No, sir; they told me never to go in there again, and never do that again there. Q. When you asked them why they didn't take a fan to keep the flies off, what did they say ? A. They told me to go out in the back yard and mind my own business; they jerked me out by my arm. Q. Is there any thing else that you remember to have seen ? A. I had a basket of different kinds of fruits, brought me Avhile I was there, and all I received was one kind, a few peaches given 725 me by Miss Stirling, it was in seven or eight ward, I don't know which, I get those two wards mixed up; my sister told me she brought one of the different kinds of fruit. Q. Were you quite well at that time ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Was there any time, from the time you were taken to the Asylum, until you left, but that you were in a condition so as to know Avhat was going on and know what you were doing? A. The first two weeks I went there I did not realize what I was doing, but-from that time I knew what I was doing, I seemed to realize what I was doing, I knew, bnt Iconld not help it. Q. Do you know, then, of any other cases there ? A. No, sir. Q. Was there any thing more you remember, that was done by Anna Burns ? A. The first meal I had there, I remember, she offered me two bowls of bread and milk, I hadn't eaten so much before for two weeks, I told her I could not eat it, but she made me; next day I was worse and didn't feel able to sit up, but she jerked me off the bed if I laid down ; I was sick all day and vomited all day long, she would not let me lie down but jerked me off the bed ? Q. Any thing else about Anna Burns that you recollect ? A. She wasn't good to the patients, she seemed to like to tor- ment them, if she could in any way, shape or manner ; she said if I didn't take the bread and milk, 1 would have to have the stomach tube used, I told her then I Avould take it and eat it. Q. Any thing else that you remember? A. I never saAV Dr. Gray there but once except when he went there Avith company. Q. Not but once all the fifteen months ? A. No, sir; not alone, except when he went there with company. By that 1 mean men that came and went through the committee, I mean,— visitors. Q Do yon remember when the board of supervisors passed through ? A. Yes, sir ; he was with them that time, bnt he was in Europe when 1 was there, during the summer, and Dr. AndreAVs took charge. Q. What did you see of Dr. Andrews? A. I think he Avas very good to the patients as far as I ever saw. Q. Did you ever see any thing about putting wet sheets on the patient's heads, or round the neck ? A. No, sir, I never saw any thing of that. Q. Describe Anna Burns—her appearance? A. She has got a crooked nose, she is stout looking, a little more than medium height. Q. How old is she ? A. I should think 33 or 34 years old. Q. What was Anna Burn's manner of treatment to patients, was it different to any other attendant ? 726 A. Yes, sir, she used them worse. Q. In what respect? A. Twisting Avrists, and fastening them in stationary chairs, so that they could not breathe, hardly; she did that to me ; she didn't seem to care for the patients at all or their comfort in any way ; she didn't care how they wrere treated. The Chairman — Do you wish to ask any questions, Mr. Good- win ? Mr. Goodwin — No sir. The Chairman — It is understood that Mr. Brown will produce a witness who will testify as to the accounts and purchases, etc.; that witness can be produced when a convenient opportunity may arise ; with that exception the committee have no other witness to examine at present, so that you (Mr. Goodwin) can produce such witnesses as you may desire to. Mr. Goodwin — I would like very much to have subpoenaed some- body from the Evening Journal who will give the name of the Utica correspondent who wrote the article appearing in that paper last Saturday evening. The Chairman—We will telephone for somebody from that office. Mr. Goodwin — Mr, Chairman, Professor M. B. Ander- son, President of the Rochester University, and ex-President of the State Board of Charities, was subpoenaed to appear on Friday of this week, and to bring Avith him a report made by him as chairman of the committee .who investigated the affairs of Utica Asylum in the year 1876; Mr. Anderson telegraphs that he has made all his preparations to go South, and that it Avill be extremely inconvenient for him to appear before the committee at the suggestion of the chairman ; 1 yesterday tele- graphed Mr. Anderson in substance that if he would appear at Albany on any day of this week except Saturday, the committee would give him a hearing immediately and allow him to go on his journey ; to which he replied that he had sent the report made on that occasion, which contained all his vieAvs and whatever evidence he might be able to give upon the subject; I now offer in evidence that report and desire to read it for the information of this commit- tee ; it is a report signed by M. B. Anderson and E. W. Forster, and is not dated, but I understand it was made in December, 1876. Mr. Haskkll — I do not see how that report can be admitted. [The matter of the admission of the report Avas then considered v by the committee, with the following result.] The Cnairman — I will state generally for the committee that inasmuch as this report is unaccompanied byiany testimony—is not verified in any way — that one of the signers besides Mr. Ander- son is accessible and can be subpoenaed, there appears no reason Avhy the report should be accepted ; furthermore, it appears to have been a report made in 1876, and the scope of the investigation then made and upon which the report is based does not appear; the committee 727 regard it as a species of hearsay, of the same character as letters or reports from any other persons who have been in the Asylum who may relate what they have seen and their impressions. Mr. Rice — I desire to say that I vote against the admission of this report, because it appears not to have been made upon the authority of any person having power to make it; it is addressed to nobody, and so far as it appears, is entirely private ; furthermore that it is a whitewashing report, absolving the officers of the Asylum from all blame of any character without assigning any reasons what- ever for the report. Mr. Goodwin — Have you read the report? Mr. Rice — I have. Mr. Haskell — Mr. Anderson, if he is telegraphed to to-day, will appear before this committee by Friday. Mr. Goodwin —What is your authority for that statement ? Mr. Haskell—The sergeant at arms ; I will also say, as to the report offered, that there is nothing before this committee to show whether the report is genuine, and no facts before us upon Avhich it is based, or how it came to be made; in fact we knoAV nothing about it. Messrs. Olin and Brown concurring in the foregoing remarks of the committee, the report was rejected. Mr. Goodwin —I will telegraph Mr. Anderson ; I desire to ask if Mr. Forster will be subpoenaed by the committee ? The Chairman — Certainly ; we will subpoena anybody you name. Mr. Goodwin — I desire to offer in evidence from the fortieth annual report of the managers of the State Lunatic Asylum at Utica, a letter on page 15, which is sent by Rev. M. B. Anderson, D.D., President of University of Rochester, to Dr. John P. Gray. The Chairman — Inasmuch as Dr. Anderson is living and acces- sible, the facts contained in the letter should come to the committee from the mouth of Mr. Anderson himself, as testimony; we will telegraph Mr. Anderson to be here, and Ave have no doubt he will respond. After a cousultaion between counsel for the Asylum and the com- mittee it is agreed that the committee will sit on Thursday as long as possible ; Friday afternoon and evening, Monday afternoon at 3 o'clock, until the evening session of the Assembly ; Tuesday and Wednesday in Albany, in the afternoon at 3:30 o'clock, and Thurs- day, Friday and Saturday at Utica to hear testimony produced on behalf of the Asylum authorities. 728 Albany, March 20, 1884, 3:30 P. m. ) Room " B," New Capitol, j Met pursuant to adjournment. Present — Messrs. Haskell, Olin, Rice and Brown. Messrs. S. S. Morgan and A. T. Goodwin, of counsel. Proceedings continued, as follows: MARTIN B. A1SDERSON, Sworn and examined, testified as follows : Mr. Goodwin — Mr. Chairman, I would prefer to have the com- mittee examine Mr. Anderson, reserving the right to examine him myself on such topics as are not touched upon by the committee; I do this because I do not want Mr. Auderson, or any other witness presented by the Asylum, to be regarded as a witness for the Asylum in any sense ; the persons I shall present are simply for the en- lightenment of the committee on the subject under investigation Mr. Morgan — The committee do not know where to begin or where to leave off with the witness, they knoAV nothing about his knowledge of the Asylum, or what he Avill testify to; my idea is that Mr. Goodwin had better examine these witnesses on such points as he may deem necessary, and that the committee make such further examination of the Avitness as they may see fit. Mr. Rice—1 think it Avill be quite proper for the Senator (Goodwin) to examine the witness. Mr. Haskell — That is the view I take of it. By Mr. Goodwin : Q. Where do you reside and what is your occupation ? A. My residence is at Rochester ; occupation teacher ; I am presi- dent of Rochester University. Q. Were you ever a member of the State Board of Charities ? A. Yes, sir, I was ; I was appointed when the board was organized by Governor Fenton ; I do not remember the date now. Q. How long did you remain a member of the board ? A. My impression is about thirteen years, then I resigned ; I can- not tell, I resigned about four years ago, three or four — perhaps three; it was during the administration of Governor that I re- signed. Q. Were you ever president of that board ? A. I was, one year ; I cannot remember the year. Q. While you were a member of the State Board of Charities, 729 did you give any attention to the management of the insane of this State? A. I did, a good deal of attention. Q. Be kind enough to state to the committee what, if any, asylums you investigated ? A. I was a member of the board before the Commissioner in Lunacy was appointed ; for several years the charge of the State lunatic asylums of the State was in the hands of the State Board of Charities; for some years previous to the appointment of the Commissioner in Lunacy ; during that time, and even subsequent to that time, the board was accustomed to visit and examine all the asylums in the State in turn ; different commissioners — sometimes one, sometimes another, and the secretary of the board also visited by our directions very frequently. Q. Was it through the investigation of an asylum that the State Board of Charities recommended the appointment of a Commissioner in Lunacy ? A. It was not recommended by the State Board of Charities di- rectly ; there was a charge made in the New York Tribune against the Bloomingdale Asylum and its management; so much disturb- ance was created by it that Governor Hoffman appointed a special commission to visit the Bloomingdale Asylum and report to him, apart from the State Board of Charities; General BarloAv, then At- torney-General, Dr. Thomas Hunn of this city and myself, were appointed a commission to inquire into the charges against that asylum — Bloomingdale, we spent a good deal of time there and found — Mr. Morgan — Is it at all important to go into the investigation of Bloomingdale Asylum, Mr. Chairman ? The Chairman — It does not seem to me so. Mr. Goodwin — I desire to know if the attorney for the com- mittee will have the right to object to any testimony offered by the Asylum, or the manner of its presentation to the committee ? The Chairman—I am inclined to think it is entirely within the provisions and scope of his duty. Mr. Goodwin — Then I would like to ask the Chairman what distinction he makes between the rights of the attorney for the com- mittee and the attorney for the Asylum in this investigation? The Chairman — We do not make any. Mr. Goodwin— Why, then, has there been a ruling of the com- mittee that in the examination of witnesses presented by the com- mittee's counsel, that the attorney for the Asylum has not had the right to cross-examine or make any suggestions except through the mouths of the committee ? The Chairman—My recollection is that every witness who has been sworn since the Asylum was represented by counsel — the liberty of cross-examination has been extended to the counsel,-and my recollection is that every time I have been present, that the 92 U 730 committee have considered very definitely any objections that the counsel for the Asylum desired to present. Mr. Morgan — I do not make any objection ; I simply ask if it is proper or necessary to go into the matter of an investigation made of the Bloomingdale Asylum. The Chairman — Unless there is something in regard to this Bloomingdale Asylum investigation that is pertinent to this in- quiry — Mr. Goodwin (interrupting) — I do not understand that the at- torney for the Asylum has had the right to cross-examine witnesses, but that under the rule established by the committee upon his intro- duction to the committee, he has refrained, supposing he had no right to cross examine Avitnesses; it is true that the committee have been courteous in allowing such questions to be put by the attorney as he desired to ask witnesses, but Avithout reference to his right to cross-examine. Mr. Rice — Have not suggestions been made to you at the close of the testimony of each witness, that you could cross-examine if you desired ? Mr. Goodwin —Nothing of the kind. Mr. Rice — I understand it so. Mr. Goodavin—I desire to say that on being introduced to the committee, under the rule adopted by the committee when I was not present, I regarded myself as not'being allowed by the commit- tee to cross-examine or make objections to testimony, as I Avould in a court of justice. Mr. Rice — At the close of the testimony of each witness the coun- sel has been asked to cross-examine; in'some cases he has done so, and in several, to my knowledge, he has declined to. Mr. Goodavin — With regard to that I want to say that this mat- ter—■ The Chairman — There is no use wasting time in this discussion, go on with your witness if you regard the Bloomingdale matter as relevant, go on ; if not, go on with something else. Mr. Goodwin — I do regard it as material; go on, doctor. The Witness—I merely state that I Avas appointed on a com- mission to examine Bloomingdale Asylum ; was there a week, and the result was that we discharged all-the claims or accusations made against Bloomingdale Asylum; and we recoinnieiiued that the State appoint a Commissioner in Lunacy, who should be—whose business it should be to look into the Asylums of the State, and to report each year as to their internal condition;' that is all I wish to say about the matter ; before that time the insane asylums of the State were put in charge of the State Board of Charities, which I happened to be a member of at that time. Q. Have you ever visited the Asylum at Utic* ? A. I have, several times. Q. In your official capacity, have you visited it? A. Yes, sir. 731 Q. When was the first time you visited it ? A. I cannot remember, I went there several times. Q. About how long after you were a member of the board? A. Well, every year or two for thirteen years. Q. When you were there did you investigate its management? A. I did look into it. Q. Did you go upon the wards ? A. I did. Q. Did you talk with its superintendents and officers ? A. Yes, sir; and with attendants and patients, sometimes. Q. And made a thorough investigation of its affairs ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you visit the Asylum in the month of September, 1876? A. I did. Q. What carried you there specially at that time ? A. I was appointed a committee by the State Board of Charities, to take into account a series of charges by Dr. Tourtellot. Q. Who was the other committee man ? A. Mr. E. W. Foster, of Potsdam ; shall I go on and state the facts of the matter ? Q. Yes; go on ? A. There was a series of charges made, in Avriting, to the Secre- tary of State, by Dr. Tourtellot, who had been a physician there and who had been discharged for incompetency, or some reason ; he made these charges and sent them to the Secretary of State; he being an ex-officio member of the Board of Charities, he turned the charges over to the board, and the board appointed myself and Mr. Foster a committe to investigate the charges and to take testi- mony regarding their truth; I appointed a time to meet Dr. Tour- tellot in the city of Rochester, and Mr. Foster and I met him there. Q. Come doAvn to the time you Avent to Utica, to investigate charges that occurred there ? A. After Dr. Tourtellot had withdrawn his charges (he withdrew them), we met him, and I was prepared to put him under oath, and go on with the investigation; he appeared Avith a lawyer and withdrew, in writing, all the charges he made; consequently, we were discharged from investigating that subject; but avo thought it proper, the board did, to visit the Asylum; we did so, and spent three days there examining into the condition of the Asylum and with special reference to these charges that had been withdrawn, but not Avith a view of meeting them in detail. Q. Be kind enough to state to the committee Avhat you did in the way of investigation at the Asylum on that occasion ? A. I wrent through every ward, every part of it from garret to cellar, investigating it in that Avay then, and spent the better part of three days in examining Dr. Gray and other officials, especially Dr. Gray; 1 examined him in detail, regarding all the internal ad- ministration of the Asylum, and took down his answers in writing at the time. 732 Q. (By Mr. Haskell.) Did yon examine Dr. Gray under oath ? A. No, sir, I didn't putvhim under oath. Q. You stated that you visited every ward of the Asylum ; state what you did upon the wards in the way of examination ? A. I went into them and looked at the condition of the patients, investigated the amount of restraint that was given their food, their attendance, and the ventilation, their employment, the amount of air, what opportunities to be driven out in the air, and what oppor- tunities for exercise in the way of labor; we investigated the char- acter of attendants especially, and the degree of supervision exer- cised by the physicians over the wards, the dress and bedding, and foods, etc., of the people in the Asylum. Q. Did you talk to the patients in reference to their treatment? A. I did, to some that were capable of talking. Q. And listened to all the complaints that came to you from per- sons whom you considered sufficiently rational to answer questions and ask questions ? A. Yes, sir; Ave didn't go through the Avards for that purpose; that is, didn't go through all the Avards, because in a great many of them they were perfectly wild, could not make a coherent answer, or understand a coherent question. Q. But those that could understand and answer coherently ? A. 1 had investigated all the charges that had been made of whatever kind, wherever I got information on the subject of the charges. Q. Wherever a patient made a charge to you, about cruelty prac- ticed upon them, either by attendants or patients, did you investi- gate it ? A. No such charges were made. Q. Did you ask the patients in reference to their treatment? A. I did some of them, and there was a man who was a personal friend, he was a Rochester merchant, I had him down and talked with him in detail. Q. State, if you please, the condition of the ward ? A. They we're all cleanly, well ventilated, all well cared for and all the attendance, so far as I could see, that was needed was given to the patients, and every means taken to have the wards well ven- tilated and cheerful and light; a very considerable amount of ex- pense had been made that year in giving cheerfulness and light and warmth to the different wards. Q. How was the bedding? A. Good. Q. How did you find the food ? A. Good. Q. Did you see patients under restraint ? A. I did not at that time; I investigated the subject of restraint, however. Q. Did you examine the means of restraint \ A. Yes, sir. Q. What articles of restraint were used when you were there? 733 A. Muffs and cribs, those were the only ones. Q. The camisole ? A. Occasionally, but generally muffs and the crib. Q. In reference to the muff, was there any thing in that that could of itself inflict an injury upon a patient? A. Not at all; it was intended, as I understand it, to prevent them from inflicting injuries upon themselves or the patients on the ward. Q. How in reference to the crib bed ? A. The crib bed would not injure a person put into it at all; allow me to give my opinion on that; I have investigated that in detail several times; contrary to my impression about the crib, I heard a good deal said against it; I reached this conclusion that the crib was, on the whole, beneficial to the patient; a person wild, instead of being put into a padded room, it is better to put him in the crib, because patients very soon find that they are confined, that they cannot get out of the crib, and they give up their frantic efforts, and they are saved from exhausting their vitality by efforts to get out; contrary to my first opinion about the crib, I reached the con- clusion that the crib was beneficial in that respect; the crib was so arranged it could not injure them in the slightest degree. • Q. So that upon investigation you changed your mind, on the nature of the crib and its purposes and objects ? A. Yes, sir; from my own observation and conversation with a great variety of gentlemen engaged in asylums in this State and elsewhere. Q. Be kind enough to give to the committee the character of the examination Avhich you made of the superintendent and officers of the Asylum, on that visit ? A. I examined Dr. Gray in reference to this point, especially in reference to the character of the attendants; what kind of super- vision he gave to the attendants, about kindness and care to the pa- tients in the different wards while the physicians were not present; he gave me a series of rules, Avhich he applied to every attendant in the establishment, very severe rules as I thought at the time, to the effect that if any man injured a patient, in any way, or was cruel to him, or showed Avant of patience, he was instantly discharged. That was the rule.of the institution, written,which he gave to me at the time. I may say in passing, if the chairman will permit me, that the great difficulty in managing insane asylums comes in right here: the character of the attendants in charge ; physicians cannot always be present, and patients must be for a considerable part of the tAventy-four hours in charge of the attendants ; these attendants are persons hired for comparatively small wages, as the appropriation given by the State will not permit the employment of persons of high intelligence; and there is danger always that these attendants will not be sufficiently kind, courteous and considerate to the patients — and the severity of these rules, of which I spoke, were justified by the important relation which these attendants sustained to the patients; every one of the attendants at Utica understood, that if 734 he injured, struck or Avas cruel to a patient in any way whatever, as I understood it, it would be followed by instant expulsion from the institution. Q. While on the subject of attendants, tell the committee what the character of the men employed there is, as far as you were able to investigate ? A. They are generally a very respectable class of men and women, because the rules were such tliat no other class of persons could be retained there ; many of them are persons that have become adjusted to the Avork and have stayed several years, and the moment they showed any disposition to be cruel or severe to the patients, they were discharged, and they have been sifted out one after another, and only the best ones retained ; those good and satisfactory were retained for many years, as I understood. Q. What impression, if any, did the examination of that Asylum leave upon your mind ; what Avas your conclusion from your exam- ination ?. The Chairman (Mr. Haskell) — Perhaps before you get down to that you had better let him go through in detail and give as far as possible the facts and not his impressions. Q. At the suggestion of the Chairman, state every thing you did there ? A. I have stated already that I examined the institution in detail, in all parts, its food, clothing, ventilation, and specially I gave my time to the investigation of the character of the persons in charge of the ward, the employees, and the means by Avhich the superin- tendent secured kindness, consideration and care on the part of those attendants, in the absence of the physician in charge ; physic- ians going through the wards a certain number of times each day, and then when they were out the attendants Avere in charge of the wards, of course. Q. Did the whole investigation that you made at the Asylum, at that time, increase your confidence in the administration of the in- stitution ? The Chairman—The doctor has stated what he did as an expert (and in that vieAv he is presented here); he may give his judgment based upon what he did ; but as to Avhether he felt better or worse about the institution than he did before, does not seem to me com- petent or proper. Q. In your opinion were the methods adopted by the Asylum authorities the proper methods to be used at the institution ? A. I Avill say I do not profess to be expert ; I am not a physi- cian ; I have not studied the subject of insanity, except during the thirteen years of my official relation to the State Board of Charities, but, as far as I am capable of judging, my impression and opinion regarding the administration of the Utica Asylum at that time was exceedingly favorable; I have been iu a great many asylums, and on the Avhole I think 1 have never seen any asylum Avhose in- ternal administration was superior to it, either in this State or any other State. 735 Q. While you were a member of the State Board of Charities, were any suggestions made by the board to any asylums of this State and particularly to that of Utica, which were not acted upon by the Utica Asylum ? A. We had, so far as I remember, we had no occasion to make any suggestions of any significance, except with relation to air, ex- ercise and employment; and when Ave made points on the matter of work, of exercise and employment, Dr. Gray always expressed sympathy with our views and manifested an earnest desire to carry out our views, for the purpose of increasing the amount of exercise and variety in employment given to the inmates of the institution. Q. Ytou have stated that during the time you were a member of the State Board of Charities you paid a great deal of attention to the insane ; did yon hear a great many complaints of persons who had been confined in asylums, after they were discharged? A. I haA-e had some complaints made to me of that sort. Q. Did you make any investigation of these complaints ? A. Those complaints, made to me by persons who had been dis- charged, I found Avere universally unfounded, but they were not many ; I have heard a, great many such in the course of my connec- tion with the Board of Charities. Q. Is there a period of canvalescence in which it is difficult to determine the degree of confidence to be attached to charges made by patients against asylums ? A. I Avish to answer that other question a little more definitely ; my own observation, limited as it is, I found it was exceedingly difficult to determine the point at which a person who had been insane became sane and was fit to be discharged ; I have known a great many persons discharged before they ought to be; I never personally knew a patient kept in the Asylum longer than was fit, and I have often found many persons who Avere sane after discharge, still retain their notions, prejudices and ideas which they had while insane and were unable to discriminate in their memory, between the events which occurred to them Avhile they were insane, or the notions in their mind, while insane, and those that came to them after they were sane; the}7 Avere intermingled ; the memories of their period of confinement and insanity Avere intermingled with their ideas, which came into their mind after they were insane, so that I was led always to doubt the testimony of a person who had once been in an insarte asylum regarding his experience wdiiie insane, unless it was corroborated by other evidence ; that was very strongly impressed upon my mind, and is to this day. Q. Would you giA7e credence to the statements of a patient Avho had been confined in an asylum without corroborative evidence ? A. I should be very sIoav to do it ; I cannot say but there may be instances in which I might believe a person, but from the ex- perience I have had, I should be very slow to believe it without cor- roborative evidence from elsewhere — other sources. Q: Has it been your experience that patients discharged from 736. asylnms are likely to give currency to delusions which they have received in the asylum, honestly believing them to have occurred ? A. Yres, sir ; it is not a question of insanity at all, it is a question of deceit — incapacity to discriminate between the imaginations of insanity and the facts of their sane life; when I speak of the doubt regarding the testimony of persons who have been insane, I do not call into question their honesty but their capacity. Q. What is your opinion, if you have one, upon the^subject of the pay which attendants receive in the Asylum, and number of the hours which they are employed? A. My impression has always been that the weak point in asy- lums Avas the small amount of money available to trustees for the payment of persons— attendants— to take charge of the patients on the wards. Mr. Rice— Do you think that is a fair ansAver to your question ? Mr. Goodwin—That is responsive, and, even if it was not, I do not see any objection to its being taken, do you ? The Witness (continuing) — With larger funds they might com- mand men of higher capacity and better character. Q. Is this the report (producing the same, and handing it to wit- ness) that yon presented to the State Board of Charities ? A. It is. Mr. Goodwin — I now offer that report in evidence. The CnAiitMAN— My own individual judgment is that it is not admissible ; the doctor has given us his judgment and conclusions, and he has stated what he did, and what he found. Mr. Goodwin — I ask for a ruling of the committee on this ques- tion. Mr. Rice — Mr. Chairman, I suggest that the matter be held in abeyance until the chairman (Mr. Howe) is present and we have a full committee. The Chairman—The paper will be marked as an exhibit and the question of its acceptance be reserved. [The report in question w7as then marked Exhibit No. 20, J. H. M.J Q. I now call your attention to a letter which appears in the Fortieth Annual Report of the Managers of the State Lunatic Asy- lum for the year 1882, on page 15 ; did you write that letter? A. I did ; it is a letter written to Dr. Gray in view of the serious charges that had been made against his administration. Mr. Goodavin — I now offer to read that letter and have it incor- porated in the record. The Chairman —The matter of its admission had better be de- ferred, as the report has been, to await the action of the full com- mittee ; it can be marked as an exhibit. Mr. Goodwin—Mr Chairman, I would like here and now to make a statement in reference to what I deem to be the duty of this committee in taking this testimony ; I do it because I think that 737 the position in which I am placed requires me to do it in order to do justice to my clients — The Witness — I can state the substance of that letter. Mr. Goodwin — Is there any objection to that ? The Chairman — He can state the result of the investigation he made. Mr. Goodwin — Go on, then. The Witness — The result of that three days' investigation at that time was this, on the part of the committee, myself and my col- league, that the internal administration of the Utica Asylum was good in all parts; not that there could be no suggestion made for its improvement, but, so far as regards the criticisms made against asylums, we found it entirely free from unjust cause for any such criticisms ; I think the administration of the Asylum was as good as that of any asylum I have ever visited in this State or any other State. By Mr. Morgan : '^" Q. Are you a physician or have you ever been ? j[$A. No, sir. Q. Never read medical works as a profession ? A. No, sir. Q. Have you ever made the subject of insanity a specialty in your reading or practice? A. No, I never was a physician. Q. What has been your calling ? A. A teacher. Q. In what ? A. Psychology, moral philosophy and political economy. Q. When yon were in the Insane Asylum at Utica, I understand you to say, you saw no patients in restraint ? A. I don't recollect I saAV any one the day I was there ; it is very seldom that they are in restraint. Q. What Avould you say to the practice of putting an insane per- son in a chair, and strapping them into that chair, so that they could not get out, the chair being stationary, and keeping them there with- out exercise, the entire day ? A. The ansAver depends on the circumstances of the case; I can- not tell— I cannot answer such a question intelligently unless 1 knew the circumstances of the case. Q. Would you think it desirable to keep any person under close restraint, sitting in a chair and necessarily in one position from morning until night, Avould you think that desirable in any case? A. I cannot answer the question ; I should suppose, ordinarily, it would not be ; it depends on the condition of the patient, and the degree of the acuteness of his insanity. Q. Would it not be better to put a sufficient restraint on to pre- 93 U 738 vent the patient from injury to himself or any one else, and give that patient some exercise-during the day? A. I suppose it would be under ordinary circumstances. Q. In your judgment it would be very injurious to the health of any person to lie strapped down to a chair, without exercise, for an entire day, would it not? A. No, sir; I made no such statement. Q. I did not ask you if you had; I asked you, in your opinion, would it not be injurious to the health of that person to be strapped in the chair the entire day ? A. It depends entirely on the physical and intellectual condition of the patient; lam not a physician and cannot answer it as an ex- pert in managing insane people or asylums, consequently my opin- ion on such a subject Avould be worth vrery little. Q. Y7ou would not regard it as humane treatment, to throw a patient on the floor and get upon.that patient's breast with your knees, would yon, and hold the patient down by your heft upon the patient's breast ? A. Of course not. Q. Can a;qu, in your mind, think of any case where it would be necessary to throw a patient doAvn and break the patient's ribs, and cause the death of a patient? [Objected to.] Mr. Goodavin — That is a hypothetical question not in this case, and it is not right to ask it. The Chairman — It is so much in this case that it is substantially the case of Hughes; the witness is offered as an expert and I think it is proper to test his knowledge. A. The question is an ambiguous one; it may be necessary to grapple with a patient in order to keep him from injuring others, and in the grappling he might be injured by accident; there are two questions involved there; the question is mixed; I cannot answer it. Q. Would you think it proper treatment of a patient that an attendant should strike a patient a hard blow with a large bunch of keys? A. No, sir: I do not. Q. Would you regard it as proper treatment to a lady patient to pull her out of her bed, drag her out of her room on to the ward, and there hold her down upon her back and turn medicine into her mouth ? A. ^should not, unless there was some special circumstance jus- tifying it. Q. What circumstance, in your mind, would justify that? A. That is ambiguous, there are two things stated — pouring the medicine down the woman's throat would be proper under some circumstances; pulling her ;out of bed Avould not be necessarilj proper. 739 Q. In order to give the patient medicine you would not regard it as necessary to drag them out of bed, and out of the room, and on to the ward, and there hold her doAvn and give the medicine, Avould you ? A. No, sir ; I should not think it necessary. Q. Would you regard it as proper treatment by an attendant to strike a patient a severe blow in the stomach ? A. No, sir, I should not, unless it were in order to save a patient's life; if an insane man attacked you or me, and the only condition for me to save my life would be to strike him, I would strike, so would an attendant, and he Avould be justified in doing it. Q. Would you regard it as proper treatment for an attendant to strike a patient upon the bowels a severe blow ? A. I should not. Q. Would you regard it as proper treatment of an insane person,. as a punishment for some offense, that they should send that person from a quiet ward, to which they were adapted, to a very greatly disturbed ward ? A. If the offense was due to an excess of acute insanity, the unquiet ward would be the proper place. Q. What would you say about a patient that Avas upon a quiet ward and she takes her shoes off and w7alks upon the Avard in her stocking feet; that being her offense she is transferred to a more disturbed and excitable ward ? [Objected to as hypothetical question not within the case.] Q. Would you regard that as proper treatment of a patient« [Objected to.] Mr. Goodwin — She said she was teasing patients. Q. I Avill add then, "and teasing patients" and going into their rooms ? A. If the continuance of a patient in any ward was a decided injury to others in the same ward, the removal of her would be per- fectly competent and proper. Q. • And to put her into the more disturbed ward you think would be proper ? A. It would be proper to remove her I said. Q. I am asking about putting her in a more insane ward ? A. It would be proper to put her on a ward Avhere she would, have no opportunity to injure others. Q. That does not answer the question; is it not injurious even to a convalescent patient to put them into a greatly disturbed Avard among greatly disturbed patients ; is it not injurious to them ? A. It would depend upon the character of the patient's condition ; it is a question, hoAvever, which 1 am not competent to answer. Q. In your opinion putting a convalescent patient into a highly disturbed ward would be liable to bring on nervousness, and result in making that patient highly disturbed, Avould it not ? A. I should think it might. Q. When did you last visit the Utica Insane Asylum ? 740 A. I cannot recollect the date. Q. About how long ago was it ? A. It must have been three years ago, for I resigned from the Board of Charities three years ago. Q. Did Dr. Gray have notice that you were to be there on a given day? A. When I went there ? Q. Yes? A. No, sir; I went without any notice. Q. How long did you remain in the office of Dr. Gray before you commenced your travels through the wards'? A. Dr. Gray was not there; he was not at home. Q. How long did you remain in the office before going on the wards ? A. I went immediately to the wards; I said Dr. Gray was not in his office. Q. Some one was there to receive you, Avas there not? A. Yes, sir; I presume so; we had official authority to go about the wards. Q. Do you not remember whether some one did receive you or not? A. Yes, sir ; some one opened the doors and took us round. Q. That was an orderly that opened the door ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Who was it that received yon in the reception-room or office? A. I cannot recollect the name or any thing about it ? Q. Who \yent about the wards with you ? A. Yarious persons ; Dr. Andrews went around with us, one of the attendants went around and Dr. Gray went round with us, dur- ing the three days we were there we Avere carried around by various persons ; Dr. Gray was there, because I cross-questioned him, as I have testified, or questioned him. Q. At your investigation, you at no time took evidence under oath? A. No, sir. Q. It was simple inquiries that you made ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do you say that there was no instance where a patient com- plained that they received injury ? A. No one complained to us. Q. And still you inquired in every ward, did you ? A. No, sir. Q. There were wards you did not inquire in ? A. Some wards we Avent through Ave did not. Q. Do you remember which was the most disturbed ward in the Asylum ? A. No, sir. Q. Do you remember the class of patients on ward two ? A. No, sir. 741 Q. Or on ward number one in the male department ? A. No, sir; I cannot remember any thing about the numbers of the wards at all. Q. Do you remember what class of patients were on ward four? A. 1 cannot remember any thing about the numbers of the wards. Q. How many times did you visit the Asylum while you be- longed to the commission ? A. I cannot tell you. Q. About how many times? A. I cannot tell you. Q. Half a dozen times?, A. I presume as much as that. Q. And at any time did you see a patient under restraint ? A. I cannot say that I did. Q. You don't remember it ? A. I cannot say ; I very likely did, but I cannot distinctly recol- lect ; very likely, I might have. Q. Do you remember Hoav of seeing a patient under restraint? A. I don't distinctly identify a case. Q. Then of course you cannot state on what ward it was; did you visit the female department ? A. I have just stated that I visited the whole Asylum from top to bottom. Q. I mean at each time that you visited, did >you then visit the whole ? A. No, sir, I did not, not every time I visited the Asylum. Q. Did you learn the names of any supervisors, or attendauts? A. I did, at the time. Q. You don't remember them noAv ? A. None except Dr. AndreAvs. Q. How many patients and attendants, outside of doctors — did the board of managers meet you at the Asylum at any time? A. I cannot recollect that they ever did, not at the time I A\7ent there; I may have met some of the managers there; but not at the time I spoke of when I made the examination. Q. Have you a personal acquaintance with Samuel Campbell — ex-Senator Campbell ? A. I cannot recall any such acquaintance; I have heard the name, but cannot identify the man. Q. Then of course you don't remember whether you met him at the Asylum or not ? A. I do not, sir, I cannot state. By Mr. Haskell : Q. The last time you were at the Asylnm was the time you made the investigation, which was the basis of the report that has been specified here ? A. I cannot say with confidence whether that was the last time ; my impression is it was, but I am not certain. 742 Q. How long ago do you think that was ? A. I cannot recollect. Q. How long would you place it ? A. It must have been four years ago, certainly. Q. This investigation and report was entirely voluntary on your part ? A. No, sir, it was officially ; I was appointed a committee by the State Board of Charities. Q. But you stated that the charges by Dr. Tourtellot were with- drawn ? A. Yes, sir, they were withdrawn. Q. But you still went on and made the investigation ? A. Yes, sir; we Avere directed to investigate the question, so far as we thought proper ; these charges being Avithdrawn, we thought it proper to go personally, notwithstanding. Q. Will you state briefly what Avas the character of the charges preferred ? A. 1 cannot; there were a great many of them ; charges of finan- cial maladministration against directors, the body of them; and of maladministration generally against Dr. Gray. Q. In regard to his care of the insane ? A. The time is so long ago I cannot undertake to specify the details of the charges. Q. But your general recollection is that they related particularly to the financial management ? A. Part did and part didn't ; I think it covered both grounds. Q. You directed }7our investigation at the Asylum particularly to the business management of the Asylum ? A. No, sir, to the internal management, and not the business management. Q. And your investigation did not cover the business part£ A. It did not cover the management, or the action of the board of trustees, in their disposition of funds for building, or this, that and the other, but did cover the financial matters, as far as provisions and clothing, etc., Avere concerned. Q. Did you consider the manner in wTiich they made their pur- chases ? A. Not at that time; we did at other times. Q. Subsequently? A. No, sir, I think previously ; allow me to say that while exam- ining the Batavia Blind Asylum I came in contact with the ques- tion of purchases very much in detail, and made a report at that time to the State Board of Charities, recommending, as a special feature, changes in the mode of making purchases for all State institutions; that was accepted by the board, and subsequently, a year or two afterward, a plan was carried out in accordance with Avhich purchases should be made by all institutions of the State. Q. How did that affect the Utica Insane Asylum ? A. It affected it as it did the others; but before that plan was 743 applied I retired front the board; if a man wanted to buy—'if the Asylum want a certain number of pieces of sheeting or blanketing, we suggested that they send for proposals to three or four dif- ferent dry goods dealers, asking them to send prices and samples, and telling them they would pay for the samples if not returned. Q. And, generally, that same proposition in regard to supplies ? A. Yes, sir, supplies at largo, as far as it was applicable. Q. Do you know AA7hether the Utica Insane Asylum purchased their supplies on that method of obtaining bids? A. I cannot say, because before this plan I recommended — Q. Did you ever investigate to know whether they did or not ? A. Before this plan which I recommended Avent into action, I re- signed. Q. I mean before that time, do you know whether they did or not? A. The principle upon Avhich I made that report and recommen- dation was this, that it had been the custom of all State institutions to buy locally to a A7ery considerable extent; I consider it liable to abuse, and I presume they did the same at Utica as they did any- where else. Q. Did you ever investigate to know whether they did or not ? A. No, sir; I took up very carefully the mode of purchasing at Batavia, but not at Utica, only that I had the general impression that the purchases were made the same way as they had been made at Batavia. Q. Who, besides Dr. Gray, did you converse with in regard to the institution so far as its management was concerned and how it was carried on ? A. With Dr. Andrews particularly. Q. Auy other persons? A. I asked questions of persons about the establishment Avhose names I cannot recollect. Q. Aud this examination of Dr. Gray and Dr. Andrews and others occupied how long? 'A. Three days, as I stated. Q. How long were you in making a tour of the Avards ? A. I can't remember just how long it did take. Q. Did you accomplish that tour of the wards in one day ? A. We made several •different tours for different purposes; I think Ave spent one entire day in the wards as near as I can recol- lect. Q. Do you recollect the manner in which attendants were em- ployed at the institution at that time ? A. They Avere in care of the wards. Q. How were they employed ; what was the contract of employ- ment ? A. I can't recollect it; I asked very particularly at the time, I knoAV, I asked the conditions on which they were employed, and the specific contract which they made, but I can't recollect the de- fc 744 tails of it, only this, that any violation of those rules, I understood, subjected them to immediate expulsion. Q. Do you noAv recollect what the system was then in vogue at the Asylum for discoArering Avhether the rules Ave re violated or not ? A. It would be impossible for me to ansAver that question, gen- erally— any disturbance Avas investigated by one of the physicians. Q; That is your general recollection ? A. Yes, sir. Q. But you do not recollect distinctly, as I understand you, Avhat particular system was then in vogue, in regard to discovering viola- tions of the rules? A. No, sir; I don't remember any particular system about it, only the physicians all visited the Avards twice a day, if I recollect right, and in case of any disturbance, the attendants called one of the physicians. Q. How much of Dr. Gray's personal attention to the patients did you understand that he gave? A. 1 can't ansAver that question ; I don't know ; I never did know precisely how much time he spent in the Asylum. Q. And without knowing how much personal attention he gave to the patients, do you think you could fairly form a judgment as to how he was discharging his duties? ' A. The physicians and attendants were equally competent Avith Dr. Gray for the details ; I want to say in answering that question, a physician like Dr. Gray, having charge of so great a variety of interests, finds it necessary to have, and they always do have, a physician substantially equal in professional reputation to himself; Dr. Andrews, now in charge of the Buffalo institution, was then second in charge, and I understood was there with him at the time. Q. That is not quite responsive to my question ; the stenographer will read the question. [Question read.] A. The statement I made was that the institution was Avell ad- ministered by him, but Iioav much time each individual person gave to the administration of affairs I can't tell, and I don't know. Q. And is it your recollection now that you did not find out? A. I cannot tell whether I.did or not'; my only point was to know that the institution was well administered; that was the objective point. Q. Do you think that a physician who is the superintendent of an institution of that character should devote his time principally to the care of patients, or should he have charge of the business'" de- tails of the institution ? A. My own impression is, and always has been, that so far as possible the business details of an institution of that sort — purchases and such like —should be carried on by a steward or clerk, so as to relieve, except for general supervision, "the physician in charge. Q. So that he would be able to devote more time personally to the care and welfare of the patients of the institution; if the su- 745 perintendent of the institution gave very little time personally to the care and welfare of the patients, do you not think that fact would have a bad influence upon the attendants? A. My impression is that it is better for the superintendent of an asylum — if it could be done, if the appropriation was large enough__ to have his attention directed mainly to the medical supervision of the establishment; if the State puts upon him both functions, the financial function and the medical function, he must discharge them in the best way he can. Q. How old are you ? A. Sixty-nine. Q. Hoav long have you known Dr. Gray ? A. I cannot recollect, it must have been something like fifteen years. Q. Are your relations with him very friendly? A. Not particularly; I began my Avork in the Board of Charities with perhaps something of a prejudice against him; we have never been on intimate terms, although we never had any disagreement; we never have been on intimate terms. Q. Hoav is it at the present time; do you still entertain that prejudice that you originally had against him? A. My intercourse with the institution, and knoAvledge of the institution led me to set aside my prejudices which I had regarding the internal administration ; my first knowledge of Dr. Gray was through an old friend, Dr. Wiibur, who was a violent enemy of Gray's, and that accounted for my prejudice. Q. Does that prejudice still exist? A. No, sir; it does not; not that I indorse every thing Dr. Gray. says or does, but the prejudice passed away. Q. It was not a personal prejudice ? A. No, sir ; a prejudice against his administration. By Mr. Rice : Q. Dr. Anderson, do I understand you to say that the appropria- tion for this Asylum is insufficient ? A. No, sir; not under the present law. Q. You consider that is sufficient? A. I think the appropriation sufficient under the present system, but if the appropriations Avere large enough, better attendants could be employed, and a division could be made between the medical superintendent and the purchaser of supplies, but it would require tAvo persons in the administration, possibly, to do the work now done by one, and larger salaries to be paid to the attendants in the wards. Q. You think then that the attendants should have larger salaries and a better class of people be employed ? A. Yes, sir, I do ; that is to say— that is the line in which im- provements are to be made in our asylums beyond any other. 94„U 746 Q. I understand you to criticise the Legislature, or the appropriat- ing power, for the amounts given to this Asylum; do you mean that? A. No, sir; assuming that the system is right, the appropriations have been generous. Q. Do yon mean to say that from the appropriations they now haA7e that they cannot employ a better class aud a higher paid class of attendants ? A. My impression, from the knowledge I have got, is, that they get the best class of attendants possible for the salaries they are able to pay. Q. Suppose you knew the fact that within a year past they have paid $1,300 for a bull and two coavs, what would you say about the appropriation ? A. It would depend on what use they made of them. Q. For any purpose ? A. If they Avanted them to go into breeding, it might be a good investment. Q, This is a charitable institution; I ask your judgment of such a purchase ? A. M37 impression is that they had better buy cheaper cows and cheaper bulls. Q. And have a better class of attendants ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How did you learn the character of the attendants that were in the institution at the time you visited it ? A. By looking at them, aud talking with them, aud inquiring of the physicians ; my statement about attendants refers to institu- tions all over the State. Q. Ytour knowledge of the character of the attendants is confined to the statements made to you by the physicians of the Asylum, and your personal intervieAvs with the attendants ? A. Yes, sir; and from accidents that are taking place on account of the moral incapacity of the attendants employed. Q. It was not stated to you that attendants had from time to time seriously abused patients, was it ? A. It was not put in that form. Q. No such fact was brought to your knoAvledge ? A. It came in this form; whenever an attendant in any way injured or abused a patient he was instantly discharged ; I under- stood that to be a standing rule. Q. I understood you to say that the attendants of the Asylum seemed to be familiar with the rules and regulations there ? A. I do not remember saying that; I supposed that they were; that when they were employed they were employed under' certain conditions, a contract, and that they were made familiar with the idea that they would be turned out or discharged, if they injured a patient. a Q. Then it is merely a supposition on your part ? "£*^ 747 A. It was so stated, to me by Dr. Gray, when I examined him. Q. What was so stated to you by Dr. Gray ? A. That the rules were read to them. By Mr. Haskell : Q. Do you know what salary Dr. Gray receives ? A. I do not. Q. Do you know what salaries are paid to the assistant physicians ? A. No, sir. Q. Do you know what salary is paid to the steward ? A. No, sir. Q. Then you do not know Avhether sufficient salary is paid to the steward to employ a man who can attend to the business transactions of the institution, and thus relieve the doctor from that branch of the management ? A. No, sir ; I do not know. Q. And you do not know whether sufficient is paid to Dr. Gray so that he could afford to devote his whole time, substantially, to the personal care and attention of the patients? A. No, sir ; I take it for granted it is, but I do not know what his salary is; I don't know that I ever knew; I only know that his salary is not as large as the income of a physician of his reputation in any of our cities. Q. Do you not think that'Dr: Gray, or any other superintendent of a charitable institution who retains the place should devote his entire time to the personal care and welfare of the patients in the institu- tion ? A. I think it Avould be well; there is a question of difficulty comes up there; if he is summoned as an expert, having knowledge of insanity, by courts, I suppose he is bound to go. By Mr. Olin : Q. I understood you to say that you approved of the cribs as places of confinement for excited persons ? A. Yes, sir ; under proper-—under the supervision of a physi- cian, of course. Q. Do you know whether they are used in all insane asylums in the State, or not ? A. They were; whether they are noAv or not I cannot tell. Q. Did you ever visit the Kings Connty Lunatic Asylum? A. No, sir ; I never did. Q. Do you know whether the crib is employed there or not ? A. I do not. Q. Is the crib employed at Buffalo ? A. I don't know. By Mr. Goodwin : Q. You have made special exertions, while you were a member of 748 the Board of Charities, to secure to the insane all the freedom and comfort possible, have you not ? A. Yes, sir; I wrote a report on that subject, specially. Q. State what you have done in that regard ? A. I formulated this idea that, — patients in insane asylums should have good air and exercise, and freedom, consistent with safety, as conductive more to their improvement than medicine. Q. I Avill ask you this question : if the superintendent of an Asylum has reported to him daily the condition of the patients on the ward, and has knowledge of the fact that his assistant visits each ward in the institution twice a day, in your judgment is it nec- essary for that superintendent to visit the wards daily ? A. I suppose not; I suppose he would be in the condition rela- tively with other physicians, in the condition of a consulting sur- geon or physician in difficult cases. Q. Upon the supposition that Dr. Gray is a distinguished member of his profession —a distinguished alienist — is it his duty to give the benefit of his knowledge to the profession and to the public, if not inconsistent with his duties as superintendent ? A. I suppose it is his duty to write the results of his investiga- tions and experience in his reports to the medical journals for the public at large. Q. Would he be justified in making visits to persons outside of the Asylum, provided it did not interfere with his duties as super- intendent ? A. I suppose he would if it did not take him into the condition of a practicing physician in special cases. By Mr. Rice : Q. Suppose it did interfere with his duties, what would yon say then? J J A. I should say that he ought to devote himself to the Asylum. t Q. What would you say as to the propriety of his giving lectures in the city of New York before a medical 'college —a course of lectures during the winter. Do you say that is consistent with his duties at the Asylum ? A. I should hesitate to answer that question, because I am not a physician, but my impression is against it. Q. What do you say of the propriety of his attending the trial of a lawsuit, over the contest of a will, in the city of New York, and acting as an expert under the employment and pay of one side or the other i A. My impression is that he ought to do as little of that work as he conveniently can ; but where medical skill is required, I suppose his duty to the public at large would require him to give a certain degree of attention to that sort of thing, but I should think as little as possible. * Q. What do you say as to whether that sort of business is consist- 749 ent in your judgment with his duty as superintendent of the State Lunatic Asylum ? A. I think — well, any absence of that kind ought to be reduced to the lowest point possible. STEPHEN SMITH, Sworn and examined, testified as follows : Mr. Goodwin — I make the same request with regard to the ex- amination of Dr. Smith. By Mr. Goodwin : Q. Where do yon reside ? A. New York city. Q. What is your occupation ? A. Physician and surgeon. Q. How long have you been physician and surgeon ? A. Over thirty years. Q. Please state to the committee what positions you have held as a physician ? A. Professor in the University Medical College, surgeon to Bellevue hospital, Charity hospital and St. Vincent's. Q. Have you been connected with a sanitary commission ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Are you connected, or were you, with the National Board of Health of the United States ? A. I Avas. Q. Also board of health of New York ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Are you now in connection with Bellevue hospital ? A. I am, as consulting surgeon. Q. When were you appointed Commissioner in Lunacy ? A. In May, 1882. Q. Please state Avhat your duties are ? A. To examine into the condition of the insane and the institu- tions in which they are kept in the State. Q. Hoav often do you visit the State asylums? A. I have endeavored to make it a rule to visit them every quarter. Q. Have you visited all of them ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And are all of them governed by the same laws and statutes ? FT^A. Not all; there are tAvo— the Asylum for Insane Criminals and for Insane Emigrants; other than those they are under one form of government, and the same rules and regulations in general, although they vary in the different asylums. 750 Q. Are the duties of the superintendent the same in all the asy- lums ? A. It is the same, as I understand. Q. Can you tell the committee how often you have visited the asylums generally ? A. I have visited—I think the least has been three, and the most has been six times in the year; it might vary a little, accord- ing to circumstances. Q. Have you visited the Utica Asylum as frequently as the others ? A. Yes, sir; I have visited that as frequently as any. Q. Can you give how often you have visited the Utica Asylum since your appointment ? A. I visited it during that time — a little over a year and a half — I visited it six times. Q. How much time have you spent in your visits to Utica Asylnm ? A. Two and three days. Q. Have you conferred frequently with Dr. Gray, the superin- tendent, in regard to its management? A. Yes, sir; I have. Q. Do you know the medical staff of that institution ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Will you state to the committee its efficiency, to your knowl- edge ? A. I regard them as very capable medical men, and compared Avith other asylums, they have ranked as high as any asylum in the State as a body. Q. There is no asylum in the State, in your judgment, which has a more efficient medical administration ? A. I think not, in view of the capability of the medical men. Q. If you visited the Avards of that Asylum, please tell the com- mittee in what way you have visited them ? A. My method of visitation has been to endeavor to look into every thing connected with the internal affairs of the Asylum at each visit; sometimes I have devoted most of the time to examination of patients and their complaints, and at others to other special sub- jects that have been brought more particularly to my attention ; but the rule I have pursued has been to never give notice of my coming; I always go unexpectedly and at times go at once into the wards, at others examine the records first, and other matters that I have to inquire into, and while I am there to visit at all hours of the day and night; frequently alone, frequently with the physicians, or sometimes with physicians and other times with the matron and supervisor, etc. ; in such way as would as far as possible give me a thorough knowledge of the affairs of the institution and its every day management. Q. Have you visited the wards at night? A. I have. Q. Alone? A. Yes, sir; and early in the morning, before breakfast, alone. 751 Q. You have visited them at all hours ? A. Yes, sir; I have; at all hours in the day. Q. And either alone, or Avith attendants, or with physicians, or with the superintendent < A. Yes, sir. Q. Have you talked with attendants and supervisors in regard to the condition of their respective wards ? A. I have. Q. And in regard to their duties? A. Yes, sir. Q. In regard to patients? A. Yes, sir. Q. Have you seen patients alone and talked with them? A. Yes, sir. Q. Have you listened to their complaints? A. Yes, sir. Q. And investigated them ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Was there any complaint made at any time that you have not investigated ? A. 1 think not; I have endeavored to let nothing pass unexam- ined. Q. Has the superintendent brought to your notice certain cases of patients which he desired you to see and who desired to see you ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Persons who have told him they desired to see the Commis- sioner ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And persons whom he has asked you to see upon complaints having been made? A. Yes, sir. Q. Has he sent letters written to you by patients? A. Yres, sir. Q. Now, on the question of the supervision of correspondence by officers of the asylum, please state to the committee your views in relation to that subject? « A. I can state my views; the superintendents put aside all the correspondence they do not send ; I have reason to believe that, since I have inquired into it, all the correspondence has been saved, and when I visit I look it all over by myself; I think, during the year and a half I have been engaged in it, I found but one letter that I had any question about the propriety of not sending, and that, on inquiry, 1 found was a person who had been habitually writing to one person in a village, and the superintendent could not find that any such person lived there ; no returns were made to the letters and the letter was retained ; I have found the correspondence, a lot of it, incoherent as few marks on paper; some patients Avill write on bits of paper, I presume I have a bushel ; all that has been carried home, a great deal of it has been sent that is entirely incoherent to any- 752 body, even though written so as to be read. A great many of them are mere marks and figures, etc., inclosed in letters to be sent aAvay. Then there are other letters I find are very indecent, vulgar and profane, and very little coherency about them. For instance, I find patients sending out for poisons to make use of in the Asylum, and in several instances find correspondence going on with persons outside of a A7ery lewd character, and in one instance shockingly so, disgutsingly so; in that case correspondence had been' allowed to run on.' The character of the patient — a lady — being such as to disarm any suspicion of the nature of the correspondence she was having carried on ; it was being carried on with a gentleman outside who was endeavoring, in various ways, to get her outside of the Asylum and haA7e some meeting with her. That was a perfectly indecent one — obscene — the letters he wrote to her aud the fig- ures he dreAv Avere shocking. I don't know that letters are retained, so far as my examination goes, no letter has ever been intercepted that was sent to me, and has never been unsealed until I unsealed it; and letters complaining bitterly they are forwarded and I take those with me when I go round and make as full and careful in- quiry as I can into the nature of the complaints. I am not prepared to say that the correspondence of the insane is under a right kind of supervision, but my belief from examination is, that it should be supervised by some one, and that the superintendents in this State, as far as I can discover, are very conscientious in that matter. 1 have met a great many patients Avho have recovered, and have Avrit- ten these letters in their furious conditions of mind,and when recover- ed expressed to me the greatest horror to have letters sent that ttiey recollect to have written ; that they had a dim recollection of having written. Q. Then you think there should be a supervision of the eorres- spondence in the Asylum ? A. I do ; I think it would be in the interests of the patients them- selves and of their friends; a great many efforts have been made to control it ; in Massachusetts there is a box hung up in every asy- lum and patients are alloAvep to put their letters in there, and it is otilv opened by a State officer who goes round once iu so long and takes the letters out; the result of that has been an entire failure; pieces of paper and tobacco are put in, but scarcely ever a letter. Q. (Mr. Haskell.) Do you understand by that that the corre- pondeuce of the insane is stopped by that means i A. I don't think they care, they are indifferent about making use of that method; I know an insane woman in an asylum, a very ca- pable lady, a good writer; she Avrites on some days as many as thirty letters, very lengthy; she cares nothing about their being sent; she gives them to me in bulk and throAvs them out of the window and anywhere; she is under the impression that she is [753 managing a large telegraph company and that these are her methods of distributing letters; some are very well written, but on some for- eign subject. Q. Have you discussed this question of letters being sent by pa- tients to you with the superintendent ? A. I have. Q. And did he make the proposition to you that they should be sent? i A. I don't knoAV ; I think they have always been sent. Q. Have you found any difficulty at any time in getting at mat- ters relating to the Asylum, patients' records or any thing of the kind? A. No, sir ; I think not. Q. Has any and all information you desired been furnished you by the superintendent or his assistants ? A. I think so; I never met any obstruction of any kind. Q. Have you seen, when at the Asylum, the records of accidents and restraints? A. Yes, sir; I always examine them. Q. Have you inquired into them after examining the records ? A. I have. Q. Have you seen the record of injuries that is kept in that Asylum, the record-book at Utica ? A. Yres, sir. ■" Q. Have you made investigation of the injuries recorded in those books 1 A. I have, a large portion of them. Q. All such as you thought were worthy of investigation ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Have you examined the records of medicines ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Please state to the committee wh;it you have .done in that re- gard ? A. The feature of that, that I have given most attention to, is the giviug of narcotics to patients to make them sleep, about which there has been great discussion ; I have endeavored to see all the patients that were under that kind of treatment, and to be familiar with the progress of their cases, to see how far they were wrongly dosed, or over-dosed, in all the asylums; I have made it a point of study. Q. Outside of the wards, have you visited the store-rooms ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Have you visited the apothecai/y shop? A. Yes, sir. Q. And the kitchen and barns ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And every part of the institution ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What condition have you found fdiem in ? 95 U > 754 A. Usually good ; I have seen nothing wrong about them. Q. Have you examined into the quality of the food ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And the quantity ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How did you find that ? A. I have always found it good, and on the whole, I think the largest supply of food of any asylum I have ever visited. Q. Have you investigated the distribution of food? A. Yes, sir, I have seen it distributed. Q. Have you investigated the subject of feeding the patients ; I mean in reference to feeding by the stomach tube ? A. I have seen that, and examined a good many cases. Q. Who does that feeding ? A. The physicians. Q. Do you know of any cases of accident from that system of feeding in the Utica Asylum ? A. No, I don't recollect any. Q. Have yon given the subject of heating and ventilation of that Asylum any attention ? A. Yes, sir ; I went through it once, very thoroughly with refer ence to that matter. Q. What is its condition in that regard? ^ A. At that time I regarded it as the best heated and the best ven- tilated institution that I knew of; it is ventilated by blowing air in by a fan, and in all parts of it, then the ventilation'was admirable; the heating is also good, I believe. Q. Have you ever been on i ward in that Asylum that was im- properly heated ? A. No, sir; I don't know that I have. Q. Were you ever on a ward in which you regarded as beino- too cold for the health and comfort of the patients ? A. No, sir ; some of the wards are not heated as much as. the main wards, but they have always been comfortable when I was there. Q. Did you ever have complaints from attendants or patients, in reference to the coldness of their wards; that they were too cold for comfort ? ^ A. I think not; I don't recollect any ; in fact I always regarded it as rather overheated in the main Avards. m Q. How is the temperature of the wards ; is there much difference in them ? A. I think those in the older building were warmer than those in the out-buildings. Q Have you examined into the system of baths, and water- closets and such arrangements ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How do you find them ? A. They are good, considering the time they were built, the best 755 ideas that architects and engineers had at the time; but theyare very defective in my estimation, as a system of getting rid of the waste and foul maters of the Asylum. Q. What are they as to cleanliness ? A. Always clean; I never saw them when they were not as clean as they could Avell be made; they are not always free from odor; some of the floors are wood, and they are liable to get saturated, and there is a urinous odor about a water-closet; I recollect but one that I thought was in bad condition, I talked with Dr. Gray about it, and there has been some change made in that part of the build- ing or was to be ; .that water-closet connected with it was to be re- moved, and the room devoted to some other purpose. Q. (By Mr. Haskell) —When was that ? A. I think that was this last spring. Q. (By Mr. Haskell) — Had the changes been made that you just spoke about ? A. The last time I saw it it .had been cleaned out and was in much better condition, but the alterations, or changes in the room had not been made, but it had been all cleared out. By Mr. Goodwin (resuming): Q. Have you examined into the character and quality of medi- cines and system of medication there? A. I have inquired into the system of medication ; as to the drugs, I have simply seen the apothecary shop. Q. You never had occasion to find fault with their quality ? A. No, sir ; I judged more by the manufacturer, than any thing else; you cannot' tell about drugs, they are very often liable to be adulterated. Q. HaA-e you talked with the superintendent about the duties of the officers of that institution, including assistants, attendants, and those employed about the establishment ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And about patients ? A. Yes, sir. Q. State to the committee, if you please, how familiar he has been with those matters? A. You refer to Dr. Gray, the superintendent, I suppose ; a good deal of the time I have been serving in this capacity, Dr. Gray has been incapacitated by injuries; when I first visited the Asylum, he Avas suffering from this gun-shot wound; I think I visited three times before he returned home, he w7as then very much out of health. There were several cases in the wards that attracted my attention ; their complaints and condition I spoke about, and I re- member he was very familiar with them, and I was very much sur- prised because I knew he hadn't been on duty steadily during that time, but it seemed he gave me all the information that one would who was familiar with the cases ; since that occasion, when I have visited, he seemed to be very familiar with all the cases, especially the more important ones of the institution. 756 Q. Showing a familiarity with all the cases ? A. It seemed so ; I questioned particularly to see how familiar he might be with patients ; with regard to Utica Asylum, I heard patients complain that Dr. Gray didn't visit them frequently enough; but I would say, that is a very frequent complaint in asylums, and in one where I know, the superintendent himself goes round three times a day and knows his patients as familiarly as a man could know his family ; but the patients feel they don't get attention enough or something of that kind. Q. Have you examined into the matter of extra diet at the Asylum ? A. Yes, sir; I have seen the diet lists. Q. And of wines and stimulants ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What are their character ? A. I think it is very liberal at Utica; a liberal supply. Q. Good ? A. Yes, sir; good quality, at least — good for any well-conducted hospital — for hospital purposes. Q. Have you examined any cases in that Asylum committed there as criminals? A. Yes, sir. Q. Upon whose request have you examined them ? A. Upo;i the request of Dr. Gray, and upon the request of a, judge in one case. Q. How have you found the cases; were they insane ? A. Two had recovered and were examined with reference to their discharge, and one for a transfer to the asylum at Auburn. Q. Did you examine in the case of Mr. Silkman ? A. Mr. Silkman came into the room or wanted to have a hearing; always, in these cases, I had a room by myself and had them come in and make their statements. Q. Did you examine the case of Stanton ? A. Yes, sir; I examined him two or three times. Q Did you examine the case of Miss Lathrop ? A. I have heard her statement fully, and examined her. Q. We want all the light and information we can get upon the subject of Miss Lathrop ; will you be kind enough to state what her complaints were, and the nature of them ? A. She made two complaints, one was, that her correspondence was not sent; I wrould say, I received the first letters — I received letters from her by the way of Syracuse, the first letter she sent me, and that had been sent out by a visitor, I should say*; Dr. Wilbur sent them and told me she sent them to him, and he to me, they were letters addressed to me; then she made a series of complaints, and the chief one in regard to herself, the one she attached most importance to, was in regard to her supposed intimacy, or her intimacy with doctors on the -— 757 Q. (By Mr. Rice.) Do you put in the word " supposed " or did she? A. I do, I use that word. Q. (By Mr. Rice.) She made the charge directly, didn't she? A. Yes, sir — well — her statement to me was, that there was a prevailing opinion among the women of the ward — or at least it Avas a prevailing opinion that the doctors took liberties Avith the AA7omen, and mentioned that there were tw7o or three that were especially talkative on that subject, and that, it was in that way her own suspicions were aroused, that there might be improper liberties taken with her; the statement to her was, that they etherized the patients through the space under the doors, and she asked me, if I had ever noticed them, I said " yes " ; she asked me what I thought they were for I said, " to ventilate — air the rooms;" she said (and this is as near her language as I 3an give it)—she said* " did you ever notice those spaces under the door" ; I said " yes " ; she said, " do you know what they are for"? I said, "yes, for heating the rooms, the hot air is supplied in the hallway through radiators, and these spaces are left open, for the free flow of hot air into the rooms ;" she said, " no they are not used for that purpose" ; then I inquired what they were need for, and she said the way the doctors used that was as a means of etherizing, putting the patients under ether, so that they could come into the rooms, and find them under the influence of an anaesthetic, and then of having improper relations with them ; then she told me of her experience about it; that on three occasions she believed they had come into her room, in that way, and had. Q. (By Mr. Rice.) Now, let us see; did she use the word "be- lieved," or did she say that she knew it was so? A. Oh, well, she said she. Q. (By Mr. Rice.) She said it was so, did she not ? A. No, sir; I do not think she said so, because I questioned her thoroughly about it, and she said, " is it possible 1 am deceived about it ? Is that a delusion ?'' She stated that she woke up one night and there was a smell of ether in the room ; and she was very positive ; and she had some blood on her clothes and some strange feelings about her hips, etc.; and then her suspicions — the conver- sation they had had Avas brought to her mind so strongly, that she believed they had been in her room, and that improper liberties had been taken with her. By Mr. Goodwin (resuming) : Q. Yreu Avere "going to state a conversation in which, you say, she asked if she had been deceived ? A. She wanted to know what I thought of it; I told her, in the first place, that it was impossible to etherize her while she was asleep ; in the second place, it was impossible to etherize her through that hole ; I did not believe that ether enough could be blown through there, blowing it in all the time, to etherize her, for I had worked over patients in small rooms like that, by the hour, where ether was freely 758 given,and the room was saturated with it; I sometimes got a headache and nausea, but that was all; she replied to that, " is it possible that I have been —jdiat that is a delusion — that I have been de- ceived ?" I told her I thought it was, that she could not find a physician who was accustomed to the use of ether that could see the least credibility to such a statement as regards the possibility of her being brought under the influence of ether, and ravished under such circumstances. Q. Now, doctor, is that a common delusion in asylums, in females? A. A good many nervous and excitable women suffer from it- it is a sexual excitement. Q. Believing that they have been ravished? A. Yes, sir; to such an extent that I would not, in my visits — I would not, I never think of allowing myself to be in a room alone with some — a great many patients have sexual excitement, that leads to the delusion that they actually have sexual congress with men that they see, or even think of; the last time I was at Utica, I found one of those patients in that state that she was hav- ing, as she supposed, connection with some man she knew in the western part of the State, and that it was a nightly affair with her; such delusions are common in certain cases, it is generally with young ladies with disturbed menstruation ; they have these delusions, they are extraordinary. By Mr. Haskell : Q. Do you know whether there was difficulty of such a disturbed nature in the case of Miss Lathrop ? A. She stated that she did have, and that several other women had it, and that they always alleged, whenever they had that, that the doctors had connection Avith them, and that they were having abortions, she mentioned that to me. Q. Do you recollect positively that she stated that her menses had been disturbed? A. I won't state positively that she did as to herself. Q. Then do you know whether as a fact there was or not any dis- turbance in her menses ? A. No, sir, I don't recall that statement in regard to herself. By Mr. Goodwin (resuming)': Q. Ytou regarded these statements of Miss Lathrop's to be delu- sions? A. Well, I don't know as it was a delusion — it was a misappre- hension, I think — well, her attention had perhaps been called to it by'two or three women that she alluded to, who talked to her a great deal about it; she is a lady of great refinement and intelli- gence, and nervousness; I think her feelings had been wrought up until she was in that state of nervous excitement and apprehension. 759 By Mr. Rice : Q. What evidence was there of that ? Why do you say you think it was a misapprehension on her part ? What was it you saw about her case that leads you to say now that it was a misappre- hension ? A. I say it is*an impossibility that the thing could occur. Q. A physical impossibility ? A. I was trying to say that I Avould not say it Avas a delusion, I was trying to explain it otherwise. Q. Do you say it was a physical impossibility ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Why, in your opinion, is it a physical impossibility ? A. Well, you could not etherize her in that room in that way. Q. If a person was by the bedside, could it be done? A. No, sir, and simply because ether almost strangles a person administered in that way at the outset, and they wake up; several efforts have been made to etherize sleeping patients bnt without success, yon can give them chloroform, but not ether. Q. Could any alnalsthetic be given during sleep to deprive a per- son of consciousness ? A. I think there has been but one instance where chloroform has been supposed to have been successfully used, that is all ; that was in the case of a child; it has been tried a great deal and has been regarded generally in the profession as an impossibility ; I believe recently there have been one or two cases where it has been reported to have been successful; but ether is different — it strangles. By Mr. Haskell : Q. Do you regard it as impossible that persons could be placed under the influence of chloroform during sleep ? A. I say that there have been two or three instances recently, but until lately it has been regarded as impossible. Q. Are you not aware that persons have been chloroformed in cases where houses have been burglarized, or do you regard that as impossible. A. I should regard it as impossible ; at least, I should want the strongest evidence that it was correct, efforts have been made so many times and have failed. Q. (By Mr. Olin). I would like to ask you, doctor, if, as a matter of fact, there is any anaesthetic that could be injected into a room so as to put an occupant of the room into unconsciousness? A. I do not think there is ; I don't know bnt with a bellows you might blow enough ether to do so, but I can take my own experi- ence ; I have been in a room saturated with it, where the ether is open all the time, going through with long operations. Q. (By Mr. Rice). But you say that when a person is asleep it 760 cannot be given under any circumstances so as to destroy con- sciousness ? A. No, sir, it wakes a person immediately with strangulation — a suffocation — they wake up with a suffocation, that is Avith ether ; chloroform is different. By Mr. Haskell: Q. Is there any anaesthetic that could be given to a person stand- ing by the bedside of a sleeping person that Avould render that per- son unconscious ? A. Chloroform is the only one that is ever believed to have been successful. Q. Do you regard the presence of blood upon her clothing as also a delusion ? A. Well, I don't know; no, I should not think that was a delu- sion. Q. And her feelings, as she described them, do you consider those also delusions? A. Well, I should want to know if she was menstruating prop- erly ; if she was not, she might have those pains, and also the blood; that could be accounted for; in the cases I mentioned, irregular menstruation was regarded by them as a positive sign of having had liberties taken with them. By Mr. Goodwin (resuming) : Q. Have you ever had complaiuts made by patients, with refer- ence to abortions being committed on them ? ■ A. Yes, sir, I have had such instances brought to my notice. » Q. Is that a common complaint ? TA. Not very common ; it has been made, that they have taken medicines, and that the medicines were intended for that purpose. Q. And those complaints — there was no foundation for them? A. No, sir, I saw no evidence of it. Q. Did you investigate the complaints at the time they Avere made by different people ? A. I have in regard to the medicines being given, and of the reasons given. Q. And found no truth whatever in the representations ? A. No, sir, I thinkl have found no evidence of an instance in Avhich medicine was given to procure an abortion. Q. (By Mr. Haskell.) Did you make any investigation of the two specific instances that Miss Lathrop called your attention to in regard to a young girl in the institution ? A. No, sir, I do not think I did ; there were three or four on that ward that made similar complaints ; whether those were the ones she alluded to, I cannot recollect; it is a subject that I have investigated a good many times. 761 Q. Be kind enough to state to the committee about these impres- sions ; wdietber or not they are usually effaced after recovery; im- - pressions of having been etherized for immoral purposes ; whether such impressions once obtained are easily effaced from the memory? A. No, sir; I think,they never are. Q. Is it a common thing for persons who are suffering from that delusion at any time to honestly believe that such were the facts? A. Yes, sir; I think nothing is more honestly believed by patients than those impressions. Q. Have you found in the Lunatic Asylum at Utica any person that was illegally committed or detained there? A. I have always found their commitment papers correct, and I' always examined those. By Mr. Haskell: Q. Did yon examine those of Miss Lathrop ? A. I did if she was commited while I was — sincel was appointed. Q. Y"ou do not recall any thing particular about them ? A- I recollect her case. Q. You do not recollect making an examination of her papers? A. No, sir; I cannot say that I recollect examining them. Q. Do you recall that you ever saw her papers ? A. No, sir ; I do not recall her papers particularly. By. Mr. Goodwin (resuming): Q. After you were appointed Commissioner were you called upon toact in connection with the Attorney-General in the examining of the law relating to lunacy in this State, with a view of ascertaining whether it needed any amendment or changes? A. Yes, sir; I was. Q. Please state briefly what was done by that com mission ? A. The laws were revised and a copy of the amendments and revisions were sent to the Senate, from which the resolution ema- nated ; that was last year that was done. Q. Have your recommendations become law ? A. No, sir. Q. They have not been acted upon by the Legislature ? A. No, sir; they have taken no action on the report yet. Q. From your general experience as Health Officer and as Com- missioner, examining into all the institutions in the state, have you suggested any changes or amendments as to their working? A. I have made suggestions to the superintendents. Q. Have you examined into the scientific work of the Utica Asylum ? A. I have ; I have regarded it as very important and very success- fully carried out. Q. Hoav is it in reference to the application of the microscope in the investigation into the condition of patients ? 96 U 762 A. It is good and very useful, I think, and very important in every large institution for the insane. Q. Do you regard the examination of urine as importaut? r A. Yes, sir; I do regard that as an important feature. The further examination of Dr. Smith was then postponed until Monday afternoon next, March 24. Adjourned. 763 Albany, March 21, 1884. Pursuant to adjournment the committee met in room "B," New Capitol, at three o'clock, p. m. Present—Messrs. Haskell, Rice and Bkown. A. T. Goodwin, counsel for the Asylum. Proceedings continued as follows: SAMUEL O. YANDERPOEL, Sworn and examined, testified as follows : By Mr. Goodwin : Q. Where do you reside and what is your profession ? A. I reside in New York and am a physician. Q. How long have you been a physician ? A. BetAveen thirty-five and forty years. Q. Are you connected with any hospital at the present time \ A. I am consulting physician of the State hospital at Ward's island. Q. How long have you been such ? A. I cannot say, I think it is about a year and a half. Q. Have you been health officer of the port of New York ? A. Yes, sir, I have for eight years. Q. Have you held any other official position in the State? A. Several ; I was surgeon-general under Governor King and also under Governor Morgan during the war. Q. Have you been connected w7ith any hospital in the city of Albany ? A. I have been visiting physician and consulting physician to both the hospitals, the City hospital and St. Peter's. Q. Were you ever a manager of the State Lunatic Asylum at Utica ? A. Yes, sir ; I have been on the board of management. Q. When were you appointed ? A. It was after Doctor Townsend's death, in the fall of 1867, I was appointed to take the vacancy made by the death of Dr. Howard ToAvnsend of Albany ; I do not remember by whom I was appointed. Q. How long did you continue a manager of the Asylum? A. Until within about a year since ; I must have been a manager fourteen or fifteen years. Q. Do you reecollect whether you attended all the annua1 meet- ings of the board during the time you were manager ? 764 A. I think there was one while I was health officer, while I had sickness in my family and I could not get there, I don't remember what year it was. Q. And you do not remember of being absent at any other annual meeting ? A. No, sir; I attended at different times quarterly meetings, but not regularly, my meetings were intended only for annual meetings, but I have been, I have attended quarterly meetings. Q. State generally about what time you, living away from Utica, would arrive at the Asylum, and hoAV long you would stay ? A. It was always my practice, I do not recollect any time now that I did not usually, I generally went up the day previous to the annual meeting and remained until either the close of the following day, or sometimes the day after, that was my rule when I was health officer. Q. State what you did as manager in visiting the wards of that institution ? A. I cannot except in a general way, it was always understood by the board from the time of my appointment, that my functions in the board were always rather of a medical man than a business man ; I took very little interest in the business management of the institution, I may say none whatever, because I went there at intervals, and my visits were made previous to the meetings of the board; so that if there were any questions of a medi- cal character to bring up, I might be able to understand them and present them to the board; and so in going through the wards, it was generally to examine the Avards more in relation to, so far as I could—to examine in relation to seeing the manner in which the pa- tients were treated; the condition of the wards in relation to venti- lation and heating; and almost all those changes that haAre taken place in the Asylum, most of the heating and ventilation that took place while I Avas manager was particularly under my suggestions, and the building of those extensions, those air rooms in the Avinter season—those rooms were constructed at my suggestion to make up for the defect in the original construction of the building, which had always a jail-like and cell-like look, and we wanted as far as possible to do away with that appearance, and allow the patients an opportunity to get sunlight and air in cold weather when they could not get out of doors ; for these purposes those projections were made. Q. Did yon visit generally all the wards of the institution ? A. Always, when I was there. Q. Ddi you inquire as to the treatment of patients? A. Not as to medical treatment. Q. But as to treatment by attendants? A. Y es, sir ; I used to linger a good while in the Avards ; gener- ally spent quite a time going through the Avards; much longer than the rest of the managers, and stopped and talked with the patients, and went into their rooms to see how they compared, and then 765 asked the patients how they were getting along and how they were pleased. Q. Did you hear complaints made against attendants ? A. Not specially; I would hear patients that said they wanted to go home, were kept there wrongfully, and that I ought to let them go ; that I ought to speak to the superintendent to let them o-0 • nothing as to the — I don't knovs7 that lever — nothing that fre- member was ever said to me about harshness. Q. Had you any complaints made to you about the cruelty prac- ticed by attendants in any way ? A. No, sir, it was never mentioned to me; and if it had been, I should have taken no notice of it on the violent wards, should not have taken notice of any such complaints; for in going through the wards, I haye seen patients very violent, seen them come up and seize an attendant aud try and—Avhere the attendants had to use some force, use force to settle them doAvn, they would rush out and have some imaginary trouble; and that is the case with insane people when strangers go through the Avards they would become violent; I do not think any thing of that specially ; the very fact of a stranger going through the ward Avould excite them to more or less irritability. Q. Did you pay any attention to the subject of restraint in the Asylum while you were manager ? A. I watched the progress of the stages of restraint while I was there; I think when I first went there all those or very many of those dark cells still existed in which patients were confined Avhen they Avere very violent; those cells, none of them are left now, they were on the ground floor in the rear, and during my service as manager every one of those cells were done away with, and other methods of restraint were adopted. Q. Was there or was there not great improvement in the meth- ods of restraint ? A. Instead of isolation in a dark cell, the camisole was used or the patient was strapped to his chair, or, if very restless at night, was put into a crib, a covered crib, which was considered the least offen- sive. Q. Do yon regard the camisole or muff as instruments of cruelty? A. They are necessities, because for this reason : a patient put in the camisole or seated in a chair in that way becomes quiet, whereas if allowed to move round he becomes more and more violent all the time; his violence goes on increasing; if he is forced to sit still he will remain perfectly quiet; he must be perfectly quite; it is the least painful of any form of restraint, I think, which is known ; I don't know of any form of restraint less painful; it is certainly less so than from the hands of attendants. t Q. Did you regard any form of restraint practiced in the Asylum while you were a manager not necessary for the good of the patients at times ? A. I acted under my best judgment at the time; there are — there have been — as you can see there has been great amelioration in the treatment of the insane within the last ten or fifteen years. 766 Q. Please state to the committee Avhat you think as to the advisa- bility of using what is known as the crib-bed ? A. I have seen a great many patients in the crib-bed, and I have seen patients put into the crib-bed; been in the wards at times when they were compelled to put them there, they were so violent in the wards: I have seen many patients in the crib-bed ; I don't know that I have seen any males, I do not recollect any ; I have seen females,. Avhen I have been on the wards, placed in the crib-bed be- cause they were so violent and screaming, and tearing their clothes and acting so violently that the atendants could not restrain them, and after they had been placed in about ten or fifteen minutes, would become perfectly quiet; they cannot hurt themselves in the bed, because there is plenty of room for them to turn over and yet there is not space enough for them to strike their heads or strike their bodies so as to injure them. Q. Noav, doctor, you stated that you paid particular attention to the medical administration of the Asylum. Did you at any time offer a resolution, which was adopted by the board of managers, requesting the superintendent and the medical staff to make a thor- ough and sufficient pathological investigation ? A. Yes, sir; I offered a resolution for this reason : the amount of material for pathological research was enormous in that institu- tion, with its six hundred patients, and I felt that if the profession at large were ever to be benefited by it, it was necessary that scien- tific investigations (and I mean by that microscopical examinations of the changes which take place in the nervous tissues) should be regularly made and recorded, so that the profession at large could have the benefit of it, and if possible have a positive pathology established in relation to this form of disease ; up to that time, you make a simple, Avhat is called a microscopic, examination, that is, an examination simply by the eye, of the brain of a patient who died of insanity, and nothing can be observed, be- cause changes are so minute in their character; Avhen the brain is prepared for microscopic examination, you will find that the nutri- tion of the brain is very seriously affected; all along the course of the blood vessels — the smaller blood vessels — you will find these organic changes going on, shoAving that very many of these forms of insanity are changes really in the nutritive structure of the brain ; things not really understood or comprehended until within a few years, when this form of investigation has become general in all asylums throughout the world. Q. State who they appointed pathologist under that resolution ? A. YToung Dr. Hun, of Albany, was appointed first, and after- ward Mr. Deeke, avIio is still occupying that position. Q. Did you offer at the annual meeting, held December 8, 1874, the following resolution : '• Whereas, The State, appreciating the importance of utiliziug as far as possible the large experience to be derived from this insti- tution, authorized the appointment of a pathologist; and 767 " Whereas, The labors of this office, under the direction of the superintendent, have already produced most valuable results, and "Whereas, The Bellevue Medical College has invited Dr. Gray to give a course of lectures at that institution, therefore "■Resolved, That the managers of this Asylum recommend that Dr. Gray accept the invitation, as being one of the most desirable avenues whereby the result of his experience and recent investiga- tions can be given to the profession." Did you offer such a resolution as that ? A. Yes, sir, I did ; and for this reason — it was adopted unani- mously — and for this reason — Q. Explain to the committee the object and purpose of that reso- lution ? A. While, as every one knuw7s, the profession at large knew lit- tle or nothing of insanity in its various forms, and great complaint was made, and is still made, that the commitments to the Asylum by physicians, the statement of their cases on commitments, which was imperfect from the fact that physicians really did not comprehend the different forms of insanity; that it w7as very desirable for a gentleman who had so large an experience as Dr. Gray, that he should if possible go down to this, one of the largest medical schools and give a simple, a series of lectures; they were only eight or tweh7e in number; merely to explain to the students the different forms of insanity, so that they could recognize them and illustrate them with cases, which he did, from the Ward's Island Insan Asy- lum, before the class; it was discussed in the management at the time, the managers discussed the question that jt would compel the absence of about only three or four separate times to New York, of Dr. Gray; and it was understood that he was to give three lec- tures each time, and the number of lectures, in all, was not to ex- ceed twelve ; that was the understanding at the time, and I believe the doctor Avent down and gave two lectures, oue one day and one the next, and usually returned, I think, in the afternoon of the second day. Q. And that yon regarded as a duty which would be of eminent service to the profession and the public ? A. Well, I was a teacher at the time in the school here, and I felt every thing we could do to give the young men a knowledge of the different branches of medicine was' very desirable, and we wanted to get the best authority for that purpose. Q. What is your opinion of Dr. Gray as an adienist ? Mr. Rice — What was that question ? Mr. Goodwin — As an alienist, if that is the word. A. Yes, that is correct; an alienist is a man who — the word " alienist" means one who takes charge of men whose minds are unsound —alienation of mind ; I regard him — Q. (Interrupting.) Do you regard him as having great knowledge on that subject ? 768 A. Yes, sir; he has had a very long experience, and I consider him a very bright man. Q. Are his services in that regard — would his services be valu- able to the public, and to individuals ? A. Yres, sir, very valuable, I regard it. Q. Do you regard it the duty of Dr. Gray, or any other man with his abilities and experience, to give his services to the public, or to private patients, when such services do not interfere with the ad- ministration of the Asylum of which he is superintendent? A. Yes, sir, I do. Q. Will you give to the committee your reasons why you come to that conclusion ? A. Well, for the simple reason that it is a branch of study and a branch of 'knowledge which no one, except those who are brought into contact Avith insane persons, can possibly acquire ^ no amount of study can give it to one unless he has the observation, and can apply his study and observation constantly ; I may not, in private practice, see a case once in three years, or once in five years, whereas he sees all these cases daily, and of course his judgment in a matter of that kind would be just as much, worth just as much more, of course. Q. Have you known of Dr. Gray as having been called on by very many prominent people in this State? A. That I only know from hearsay ; I have no personal knowl- edge of it ? Q. Do you think, doctor, that a man possessing Jthe ability of Dr. Gray should be encouraged by the State to give his knowledge both to the public and to private patients, when it does not conflict with his duties ? A. Yes, I think it is his duty to do it; I think that is the custom all over, now. Q. Now to go back to the Asylum: have you talked with Dr. Gray in reference to the management of the Asylum at any time. A. Our com7ersations were wholly upon matters connected with the Asylum ; when I was there my rule wras ahvays, as I told you, to get there in the eA7ening; Ave spent the evening together, and always a few hours — three hours the next morning — in talking over every thing connected with the Asylum before the board met; it never met before half-past eleven or twelve, and I would fre- quently go into the wards, and Avould talk over the management of the Asylum with him. Q. How did you find his knowledge as to the cases in the Asy- lum? A. What do you mean ; in what respect ? Q His knowledge of the cases of the patients, individual cases; his acquaintance — his knowledge — familiarity with the cases, I mean. A. I never mentioned a case, of course ; knowing I was a man- ager of the Asylum very many people would Avrite letters to me 769 before I would go there, and ask me to inquire about them or their friends in there, and I don't think I ever mentioned a case to Dr Gray, but what he had it at his fingers' ends and could tell me all about it, and would then call my attention to the case as we went through the Avard; he has a wonderful memory in that respect • it is marvelous how he can retain the history of every one of those cases, and keep them in his mind all the time; you cannot speak of a case in the Asylum but what he will give you almost a transcript of it from the history in the record book of the case. Q. You were acquainted with the medical staff of that institution as they were from time to time during your service as a manager? A. Y es, sir; I was acquainted with them more or less. Q. How did you regard their qualifications and fitness for their position ? A. I think he was remarkably fortunate in securing the gentlemen he did ; there Avas care exercised always, whenever a vacancy occurred in the selection of a man ; in the first'place Dr. Gray made a thorough examination as to the medical attainments of the gentleman ; and for the last ten or twelve years he would take no man as an assistant unless he had had a previous hospital experience; that is, had gone and made the hospital service in some hospital previous to going there; for, as he said, no man could serve there intelligently as an assistant physician who had not gone through the discipline of an ordinary hospital experience; there are some habits of life —you take a young man when he first graduates in medicine — and you have got to take your assistants from that class of men. By Mr. Haskell : Q. With reference to this subject of assistants, is that a matter of your own knoAvledge or from information given you by Dr. Gray ? A. I was going to come to that; they were selected; he always consulted with me in relation to selections he was about to make ; and those were the questions which were gone over first, were as to the qualifications of the man. - Q. And you, yourself, personally examined them ? A.I did not examine them, but I went over their record as it was given to me by Dr. Gray. Q. And that was prior to the making of any appointment ? A. Yres, sin; prior to the appointment. By Mr. Goodwin (resuming) : Q. Now, will you be kind enough to give your opinion to the committee as to the necessity of the superintendent visiting the wards of the institution ? A. In what way? Q. In frequency; the frequency of his visits? A. Well, I suppose the superintendent should visit his wards fre- quently enough to keep himself thoroughly familiar with the changes 97 U 770 i of every case; that is sufficient in my judgment; for instance, I can only illustrate that by analogy and example ; the visiting physician of an hospital—for instance, take the City hospital here; there is a house physician, the same as there are house physicians there ; when I enter the wards of the hospital I do not go to every bed in the hospital by any means ; I go to the house physician and I ask him: " What have you that you desire to call my attention to to-day, specially?" And if there is no case that he desires to be advised upon, which is obscure to him, or any unusual circumstance has taken place since my last visit, or some case like that, Avliy the thing is discussed and a course of treatment defined at that time. Q. (By Mr. Haskell.) Do yon regard your duties as a visiting physician in the City hospital similar, in respect to visitation of the patients, as those of the superintendent of an insane asylum? A. To a great extent, as far as the mere wards are concerned, I do, because the superintendent — it is almost an impossibility for the superintendent to go from patient to patient and see them; he could not, the day would not be long enough, nor would his strength, or the strength of any individual; I do not think it is done in any asylum in the world; it is a physical impossibility; I mean to do it daily, that is. Q. i By Mr. Rice.) What do you say about doing it weekly ? A. I should suppose the superintendent would go through his whole building at least once a Aveek and probably oftener; I do not mean to limit the time; I only speak of the general plan of visit- ing; I think he should be familiar Avith the cases of the patients; he should make a more or ifess perfect examination of all neAV cases; but you take the chronic cases, where changes do not take place once in six months, and Avhich are virtually incurable, when he lays down a general course of treatment, it is probable that he looks very little at that case afterward, except as he sees it in passing through the Avards, unless some new development takes place. Q. Would yon regard it necessary for the superintendent to visit such wards in his Asylum as contained cases of dementia, and chronic cases of insanity, as often as he would wards where the acute cases were found ? A. Except to look after the general administration, not as often I should say, except to look after the general administration. Q. Is it reasonable, doctor, for the superintendent to take the condition of patients from his assistants? A. Is it what ? Q. Reasonable and proper for him to take the condition of the patients from the assistant physicians ? A. I think he is compelled to ; he cannot in every case visit them ; to illustrate that by my own executive function, as health officer^ it was utterly impossible for me to visit patients personally, every sick one, or every sick vessel; I had to take the statement of my deputies as to the condition of things; I could not visit them in person. 771 Q. (By Mr. Haskell.) Do you consider your position as health officer, in regard to the various ships, etc., an exact parallel to the position and with the duties of a superintendent of an insane asy- lum, and his patients? A. Only in this way, where a man is performing executive func- tions, he is necessarily compelled to take the representations of his deputies, as to very many things in that position ; I do not speak — I am now only speaking of the general position of an executive officer Q. Did you pay any attention to the character of the attendants upon the wards of the several wards of the Asylum? A. I could not give an opinion about that; I was not — so far as when I went through the Asylum — I think no one could judge of them unless he went on to the wards a great many times, and be- came personally intimate Avith the men ; I went through the wards, and, as you can readily understand, the attendants would appear to their best advantage; I cannot pretend to give any opinion about that. Q. Doctor, do you understand that Dr. Gray, as superintendent of the Asylum, superintends both the medical and business depart- ments of the institution ? A. Yes, sir; he does. Q. Do you regard it as the best policy for the State to have the medical and business administrations united ? A. Yes, sir; I believe in centralizing the responsibility. Q. Can you give any other reason than you have for it? A. I don't knoAV that it is necessary ; only on the general prin- ciple, that is all ; yon cannot work it well if you leave one man to run the supplies and another the medicines; you never could make the thing run. Q. Are yon familiar Avith Frederick Norton Manning? A. No, sir; I am not. Q. Did you ever look at his "Report on Lunatic Asylums?" A. No, sir; I can't say that I have. Q. Do yon know of any asylums which have the medical and business administrations divided ? * A. No, sir; I do not; I am not familiar enough with the work- • ings of other asylums to judge. Q. You don't know whether they are or not ? A. No, sir; I am not familiar enough to judge. Q. Would you regard an asylum best managed, in which the superintendent was supreme in his management ? A. Yres, sir. Q. That it would be better managed by him ? A. That is, subject to the control of the board of managers. Q. Do you think that it would be best that he should have the appointment and the dismissal of all the attendants? A. Yes, sir. 772 Q. Aud that the steward or business manager of the institution should be under him ? A. That is comprised in the answer which I gave to your general question ; I don't know that it is necessary to go over all these sepa- rate subdivisions of the management. Mr. Goodwin— That is all I want to ask you. By Mr. Haskell : Q. I understand you to say that you gave no attention whatever to the business of management of the Insane Asylum ? A. Yres, sir; I gave none whatever. Q. And that all the attention you did give Avas in regard to the medical treatment of the patients ? A. Not the medical treatment of the patients, because I know nothing of the treatment of individual patients, but as to the general medical conduct of the wards. Q. That is, you mean the general sanitary— A. (Interrupting.) The sanitary arrangements of the institution and the division of the patients and their modes of restraint — methods of restraint. Q. And about how long a time would you spend in the personal examination of the vicious wards of the institution when you went there ? A. It usually took me from three to four hours, and I usually went through twice at each visit I made. Q. Usually twice during the period ? A. Yes, sir; that is, I would go through the men's ward in the afternoon and the women's ward in the morning. Q. And as I understand, you paid very little attention'to the highly disturbed wards, but rather devoted your attention to those wards in which the convalescent, and cases of that kind were? A. No, sir, I went into the highly disturbed A\7ards quite as much as into the others, except the Avards of dementia and paresis, those are the ones I did not go into — the wards of dementia and gen- eral paresis I paid very little attention to. Q. Are you familiar with the numbers of the various wards so as to refer to them by number ? A. No, sir, I cannot. Q. I understood you to say that you do not recollect any com- plaints being made to you of harsh or cruel treatment by the attendants ? £ A. No, sir, I don't recollect any. Q. I further understood you to say that if any such complaint had been made by patients in the highly disturbed wards, you would not have regarded them ? A. No, sir, 1 would not have regarded them for a moment. Q. So that while you Avere connected Aviththe institution as man- ager, you never investigated any case of cruelty or harsh treatment by the attendants upon any of the patients ? 773 A. No, sir. Q. Your business was never with that branch of the institution ? A. No, sir. Q. Do you recollect ever examining a series of books known as injury books, that were kept by the supervisors of the several de- partments of the institution ? A. No, sir; I never did. Q. While you were a manager of the institution was your atten- tion called to deaths of patients caused by violence? A. No, sir. Q. And you never made investigation of any such cases? A. There was one case — I beg your pardon — almost the last meeting I attended, of this gentleman from Troy, a minister or something of that kind ; I made a report of that case. Mr. Goodwin — I hand Dr. Yanderpoel a copy of the Woodin committee investigation, at page 499; that refers to the case? A. That is my report that I made about that matter. Q. You may state when your attention was called to that case and by whom it was called ? A. I think my attention was called by the superintendent, Dr. Gray himself. Q. Upon one of your visits there ? A. Yes, sir; our visit took place immediately after the occurrence of this event. Q. You may state what you did in regard to investigating this matter ? A. I will look at the report and see. Q. Do you mean to say that your recollection of the particular events of that investigation is so vague that yon cannot tell without refreshing your recollection in regard to this case? A. Yes, sir*; because I have a great many hundred matters on my mind, a great many hundred matters, and this occurred in 1880. Q. And the fact of this death has entirely passed from your recollection, until your attention was called to it by Senator Good- win at this time ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Having now looked over that report you made in regard to that case, have you any recollection, independent of what is con- tained in the report of the case, as to what you did ? A. No more than we had the physican, Dr. Russell, before us, he gave us an account of the manner of his death, and we all agreed upon the fact that it was a case of apoplexy. , Q. You came to the conclusion that it was a case of apoplexy ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Was your attention called to the ATarious injuries about the body? A. I read in the Troy papers at that time the accounts published in those papers; I remember perfectly well (I have forgotten now 774 the specific points), and we weighed them with the evidence pre- sented there before us. Q. Was there any evidence presented before you, in regard to the injuries upon the body of the deceased ? A. I don't remember. Mr. Goodwin— Look at that page of the report (indicating Woodin committee report). A. I have forgotten the circumstances connected with that, en- tirely; I don't remember about it; I know Judge Coxe and myself made an investigation with Dr. Ordronaux, who was present at the time. Q. Aside from this case, you have no recollection of investigating any other case of violent death? A. No, sir. Q. YTou will not say there was no case of violent death that oc- curred at the institution during the term of your being a manager? A. No, sir; I will not say that, because I was not familiar with what took place in the intervals of my visitation. Q. You depended very largely for your knowledge upon the statements of Dr. Gray and the attending physician when you were there ? A. You mean as to the condition of the Asylum and patients? Q. Yes. A. Yes, sir. Q. You don't recollect any individual or particular cases in the Asylum ? A. In what way do you mean; do you mean cases that I saw there at different times; I remember a great many cases of patients there ? Q. Independent cases ? A. Yes, sir, a great many; I had a great many personal friends there, that is I kept track of every one from Albany, and there Avere a great many there from Albany. Q. When the question of Dr. Gray's giving lectures at Bellevue hospital was before the board of managers, and under consideration, the amount of time that it would take him from the institution, was one of the elements considered by the board ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And it was regarded as an important feature that the time be reduced to the smallest possible minimum ? A. It was stated at the time that so little time would be required — that at each visit he could deliver three lectures. Q. So that you, as a manager of the institution, regarded it as highly important that Dr. Gray should beat the institution as much as possible ? A. Yes, sir, I should say so. Q- While you were a manager of the institution was there any action of the board taken in regard to his attendance as an expert witness in private cases ? 775 A. No, sir, I don't think there was ; I don't recollect any. Q. Was your attention called to the fact that he was giving more or less time to matters of that nature ? A. I was with him tAvice; sent by the Governor each time; once by Governor Hoffman and once by Governor Dix, to make examin- ations of that character. Q. That Avould hardly be a private case ? A. I knew nothing of his private matter. Q. So that your attention was never called to that branch of the matter ? A. No, sir; we examined R----f, under the direction of the ' Governor, and some man in Buffalo, at the time Governor Cleve- land was district attorney ; he was feigning insanity. Q. I understand you to say you regard it as highly important that a manager of an institution of this character should give his personal attention and be present at the institution as much as pos- sible of the time ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And do you think that the superintendent of such an institu- tion should not allow a private practice to carry him away from the institution ? A. I was not aware that he ever did do so. Q. I am asking you the question Avhether you think the superin- tendent of such an institution should not allow a private practice to carry him away from the institution ? A. Well I should say very little. Q. He should not do it at all, should he ? A. Well, on abstract principles, no. Q. And you think he should not attend private lawsuits as an expert witness where they will carry him away from the institution and where an investigation of the case will occupy a great deal of his time ? A. I Avas under the impression that it was not a matter of option with the superintendent, that when he was subpoenaed by the court he Avas compelled to go, but as an abstract principle, when a man occupies such'a position the closer he attends to that position the better. Q. And you think that the question of the amount of compensa- tion should not in any event be a material factor in the matter of the superintendent absenting himself from the institution in attend- ing to a private case ? A. Not unless he obtained the consent of the board of managers, or of the executive committee of the board, there is an executive committee of the board of managers. Q. Yon say you know nothing personally in regard to the em- ployment of the attendants, as to how they were employed, or as to their general character? A. Excepting that the matter was often spoken of, but nothing personally as to attendants, merely how much they received a month, 776 I knew that, and also he often talked about their character, how careful he was in selecting the men ; Dr. Gray did. Q. You had no knowledge, personally, of that matter, except as you derived it from Dr. Gray ? A. None whatever ; not at all; I have often talked with him ; he said it was almost impossible for him to obtain the right kind of attendants for the meagre salary he was paying them ; I could not myself see how men whom I should think good, for $25 per month, would be willing to take positions of that kind. Q. Did he ever find fault with regard to the amount he was al- loAved % A. He said they were alw7ays looking for better places, he could not — Q. Did you ever hear him state that he thought that a larger appropriation should be made for the payment of attendants ? A. I don't know as it Avas ever discussed in the board. Q. Either in the board or in personal conversation with him ? A. Yes, sir; he thought that better or higher pay would bring better men and women. Q. But I don't understand you to say that he complained that the appropriation was so small that he was not able to hire more competent help ? A. Oh, no, sir. By Mr. Goodwin : # Q. I call your attention to a report made in the matter of the death of J. G. Brown, reported on page 500 of the Lunacy Inves- tigation, ordered by the Senate on May 25, 1880, of which the Hon- orable W. B. Woodin was chairman, did you make that report? A. Yes, sir. Q. In conjunction with wdiom ? A Judge Cox and Mr. Ordronaux. Q. I call his attention to that report, and the testimony ac- companying the same made by Mr. Ordronaux as Commissioner in Lunacy, and the testimony that is in that report; you knew while you were a manager of the Asylnm, that Dr. Gray visited private patients, and had private patients, that he had been consulted by physicians ? A. That is a different term; you say that he had private patients, I never knew that he had private patients, but frequently physicians A\7ould come with patients to consult with him, and that he had gone short distances, that is what he gave me to understand; I have known of his going to Ilion to see Mr.----the gun man there, I forget his name ; and sometimes to Oswego, when he would be sent for in case of brain trouble to see a patient and the physician, that is all I know of his private cases. 777 Q. Would there be any objection if the duties of his offica were not interfered Avith in his going to see such persons? A. Well that is a difficult question to answer, you put it as an abstract question, and a man is hired by the State, the State de- mands'his services they will say, and yet as a personal matter, I don't suppose the State Avould suffer in the least if he was not ab- sent too long, providing it did not interfere with his duties; that is purely a relative question, and I do not think it is a question to which I can eive a categorical ansAver. Q. Was there any difference of opinion in your board at any time in reference to the employment of women physicians ? A. No, sir; it was never fully discussed in the board, it wras in- formally presented once or tAvice, and the expression was so de- cided, and so opposed to it, that it was never agitated; it was never brought up formally in the board. Q. Are you opposed to the employment of women physicians in the Asylum ? A. Yes, sir; and for this reason, in the first place a woman's mental constitution is not adapted to managing that form of — that is, you want some one—some person who will haA7e mental power to con- trol them ; a Avoman's sympathies are more easily aroused than those of a man, they are not as judicial in their character, and you will find as a rule throughout the world that Avomen prefer a male phy- sician rather than a female ; there are very few exceptions. Q. Were you ever asked by patients on the female Avards of that Asylum to procure female physicians? A. No, sir; I believe in female physicians in certain things; I have been instrumental in having female physicians appointed in an institution I had supervision of, the country branch of the Nursery and Child's Hospital at Staten Island ; but the young doctors down there in cases where women had been seduced — the young doctors went to repeating the dose, and we had second editions while they were there; I said to the managers, " this thing cannot go on," and we had female physicians appointed, and it acted remarkably well; I think it was desirable and proper there; I think in the care of children female physicians are better, they have more of the motherly feeling necessary to take care of sick children ; I do not think that applies to insane patients; so that in the broad sense I am not abso- lutely opposed to the employment of female physicians. Q. In your experience have you had patients who have com- plained to you of being etherized for .immoral purposes? A. No, sir. By Mr. Haskell : Q. In regard to this question of the right of the superintendent to absent himself from the institution, for private practice whether it did not interfere with his duties as superintendent of the institu- 98 U 778 tion ; in answering that question, who do you regard its judge as to whether his business interfered with his duties or not? A. The executive committee were usually the judges of that, of which President Campbell Avas chairman ; it Avas always understood if Dr. Gray was to go away that he called a meeting of the execu- tive committee, and stated the circumstances, and was not to leave without their approval. Q. The objection you raise to the employment of female physi- cians in the Insane Asylum is that you think that the female physi- cians Avould be so constituted, or that females generally are so con- stituted, that they would not be adapted to properly care for the in- sane? A. Yes, sir. Q. If that is so, how is it with female attendants who have the care and control of the patients for substantially all the time; how is it that they are able to properly discharge the duties of attend- ants? A. Well, they merely carry out the instructions of the visiting physician. Q. But they have the real control of the patients ? A. Well, I don't speak of it in the matter of control, because a physician has nothing to do with the personal control of the patients. Q. Is that your understanding of the position of the physicians — that they have nothing to do with the personal control of the patients ? A. No more than directing it. Q. And you think that wdiile a female attendant could take the full personal control of a patieut, yet a female physician would be incapable of directing it ? A. I think they are more emotional in their character ; I speak of the abstract constitution of the female. Q. They would be more tender-hearted do you mean ? A. Yes — more emotional. Q And that, therefore, they Avould hardly be strict disciplina- rians in an institution of that character ? A. Yes, sir; I would not say strict disciplinarians, because I think they would err just as much in being too strict as the other way ; 1 think that from their emotional character they would go to one extreme or the other. Q. You think the male mind is better balanced? A. Yes; I think one has the "judicial" element more strong than the other ; I think in that respect the male has the superiority. a**Q- Do you think female physicians would be apt to be too harsh ? t A. Yes, sir; too harsh. By Mr. Rice: Q. What do you say as to whether or not anesthetics can be 779 administered to a person while asleep, so as to deprive them of con- sciousness ? A. That has been a very debated question until of late, you know; physicians, as a whole, have decided that the thing could not be done ; I believe some experiments have within the last two months — I forget where it was, but I saw it in one of the medical journals, where the thing had been accomplished ; where patients had been ana'sthised wdiile asleep; but nothing but chloroform would do it; you cannot use ether; ether is too irritating and requires too much in quantity. Q. Do you understand that crimes have been perpetrated by the use of anaesthetics administered during sleep? A. It has been so stated, but has always been denied by the pro- fession until recently when some examples Avere shown in which the thing has been performed ; Avhether they were exceptional cases or whether the thing can be----; well it is not considered settled as yet, and yet the fact that some experiments have succeeded perhaps shows that it is not impossible. Q. What do you say of the propriety of the superintendent of the State Lunatic Asylum at Utica for a reward and compensation lending assistance on one side or the other in the prosecution or defense of a private lawsuit? A. It is a matter of taste, I should not want to do it if I were superintendent. Q. I ask you Iioav far in your judgment it is consistent with his duties as superintendent? A. Well, unless he had the sanction of the board I should think he had better be at home. Q. What would you say of a board that would sanction a thing of that kind ? A. Well, there might be circumstances in Avhich he can leave; you are asking me a self-convicting question ; I have been a mem- ber of the board, you know, myself, although I was not present at all the meetings, or at that meeting. Q. I am speaking now of the general rule ; of course there may be exceptions, but I ask you what in your judgment you would say generally, of a board which would consent that a superintendent should permit himself to be employed in that capacity ? A. As a matter of taste 1 should think he had better not be. Q. As a matter of right, sir, what do you say ? A. In a private case I should say as a matter of right he had better hot be. By Mr. Goodwin : Q. During the period of convalescence, a patient having been insane is it difficult to define the degree of confidence to be attached to the charges made by such patients in reference to what occurred during their lunacy? r. 780 A. I do not think that a person who has recovered from an attack of insanity has a clear appreciation of what took place during the time their mind was unbalanced ; it is a period of delusion from beginning to end. By Mr. Haskell : Q. Have you ever noticed as to whether the memory of a person who is insane — as to how much that is affected by the mental de- rangement ? A. Yes, I say to you, that they cannot separate the true from the false, entirely. Q. But their memory is very distinct, very frequently, in regard to occurrences, and they recall with a great deal of accuracy very many of the minute details, dates, and things that have occurred? A. Yres, sir ; they can remember a great many isolated facts, there is no question about that ; but it is difficult to say which are the facts and which the delusions ; what they are stating to you may be facts, and on the other hand, they may be part of their delusions ako which they have had at the time. Q. But the mere fact that a person had been laboring under insanity would not wholly discredit their evidence in regard to what had occurred during that period ? A. I should not give it very great weight ; you cannot separate the true from the false, nor they cannot, that is the essence of insanity — it is a series of delusions. Q. Do you think they would be able recall that which really occurred ? A. Yes, I think they would. Q. Was your attention ever called to the matter of the transfer of patients as a method of punishment, from a ward to which they were advanced, to a more disturbed ward ? A. Yes, sir ; but not as a'matter of punishment. Q. 1 am asking whether you know it has been done as a matter of punishment, for disturbance, or violation of the rules, or for re- fusing to perform some labor? A. No, sir ; I don't know of any such case. Q. What would you say as to Avhether it was a proper or improper thing to do as a matter of punishment for disturbance or for dis- obedience of the rules? A. I should not say it was advisable as a matter of punishment. Q. For instance a patient refusing to perform some menial labor ; would you consider it proper to punish them by sending them back to a disturbed ward? A. I should not think so. Q. In your judgment would it be a dangerous thing to do so far as the mental condition of the patient were concerned, would you so consider it, or not ? jp A. Yes, sir, I should; I should not think it a very desirable hing;to do. 781 Q. The increased excitement would have injurious tendencies ? A. Y es, sir. Q. And yon would not consider it a justifiable thing to do under any circumstances as a punishment ? A. I have seen patients that have been removed to other wards because they have been brought too soon into a quiet ward. Q. Did you ever hear any complaints of that nature while you were a manager—that patients were transferred as a matter of punishment? A. JSTo, sir; my attention Avas never called to that ; this is the first I have heard of it. Q. Was Mr. Silkman an inmate of the institution Avhile you were a manager ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Was your attention ever called to his charges in that respect ? A. No, sir. Q. Was your attention ever called to his charges in that respect ? A. No, sir; that Avas after the Commissioner in Lunacy was ap- pointed ; that Avas considered his peculiar province to investigate in reference to those cases; but my attention was never called to it for that very reason, the Commissioner in Lunacy took charge of every thing pertaining to that. By Mr. Goodwin : Q. If the superintendent of an asylum were subpoenaed in a civil case to go and give evidence, would it be his duty to obey the sub- poena? A. Idon'tknoAv any thing about that; that is a legal question, and I am not a laAvyer. CHARLES R. SHERLOCK, Sworn and examined, testified as follows : By Mr. Goodwin : Q. Where do you reside ? A. In the city of Albany. Q. What is your age ? A. Twenty-seven. Q. What is your business ? A. A journalist by profession. Q. Are you the Albany correspondent of the " Sunday Herald, Syracuse ? A. I may say I am ; yes, sir. 782 Q. I call your attention to an article — a communication in that paper of February 17, 1884. Are you the author of that article? A. I am ; I wrote it. Q. I call your attention to one special paragraph in the article, you say : k' Not even .such an exposure as the ' Herald ' made, of the horrible death, within the Asylum walls, as the result of foul play, of David Poulton was allowed to cast a shadow on the management, despite the fact that the authorities had disregarded the law of the State most flagrantly in not at once calling on the coroner to inves- tigate the murder, the unseen influence encircling the Asylum removes the superintendent and its corps from the range of blanie- Avorthiness." Where did you get your information for that paragraph ? A. I was somewhat familiar with the case. Q. Had you any other information except your oavu knowledge? A. Nothing, except what was published at the time the exposure Avas made. Q. From Avliom did you obtain the information " that no coroner was called " ? A. That Avas the e\ idence, if I remember right; that is my recol- lection of the evidence, that the case was not made public for a month or so after its occurrence. Q. Do you know when that case occurred; the time? A. I don't remember. Q. Did you consult the reports of the managers of the Asylum in reference to the Poulton case ? A. No, sir. Q. Did you know that case Avas reported to the Legislature on January 10, 1883 ? A. I did not know that, no, sir. Q. I call your attention to page 44 of the report of the managers to the Legislature, and ask whether that is not the case ? A. That is the man, David R. Poulton. Q. That is the case to which you referred in the article you wrote ? A. Yes, sir. Q. When was this article Avritten ? A. Two or three days before its publication ; February 17, 1884; two or three days before that. Q. What is the date of that report ? A. January 10, 1883. Q. Does it appear from that report that the coroner was notified ? A. I will read it and see. (Reads it.) It mentions the coroner subsequently; the coroner seems to have been called. Q. Do you know7, and does it appear in this report to the Legisla- ture, that John C. Devereux, Oscar Craig, and E. W. Foster, mem- bers of the State Board of Charities, and Dr. Stephen Smith, State Commissioner in Lunacy, came to the Asylum to investigate the matter ? A. I know that the matter was investigated. 783 Q. Does that appear in this report I have just read? A. It seems to, yes, sir. Q. Are you now of the opinion that the coroner was not called to investigate that matter ? A. It seems by that report, I don't know any thing about that, the report says that he was. Q. I ask you generally Avhether you are of the opinion that the coroner was not called ? A. I should say that he Avas, according to that report, but how soon after the occurrence of the event is a different thing. Q. 1 call your attention to this paragraph : " There is evidence enough in the mangled body of Evan D. Hughes, of Madison county, Avhose barbarous murder by the brutal hirelings of the superintendent has provoked this inquiry.''' Where did you get your information as to there being a " barbarous murder " committed by the " brutal hirelings of the superintendent ? " A. From the published evidence of the case. Q. What published evidence ? A. The evidence was published in the different papers of the State, the "Utica Herald" and " New York Jlerald." Q. Do you mean the evidence taken by the coroner's jury ? A. I do not recollect who it was taken before. Q. Where did you get your information from ? A. From the published accounts of the investigation. Q. You do not know Avhether it was from the evidence of the coro- ner's jury or afterward? A. I did not make a note of the matter, 1 should think it might have been, because that was the only investigation made. Q. Did you take the evidence — the coroner's evidence ? A. I read the evidence; I don't know whether it was the coro- ner's evidence ;. I read the evidence of the case, and a great deal of it. Q. I call your attention to this paragraph : " Hurried and insuffi- cient, as the committee of last winter were compelled to make their investigation, many things Avere proven by it which for the first time laid bare the abuses of the management." Will you please state Avhat those abuses were ? A. That matter is based on the statements of members of the committee, and on statements made on the floor of the Assembly. Q. Yrou obtained this information from a member of the House ? A. Not all of it; part of it from members of the House. Q.-jDid you obtain the information from the gentlemen of the (louse Avhose names appear in the article ? A. In part; but the substantial part of it not from him ? Q. What part of it did you obtain from him ? A. Simply a general statement that the investigation proved business abuses ; I think he used a Avord not quite as significant as that, that would warrant the State in appointing a purchasing agent. Q. Give me exactly, as near as you can, the words he used dn that occasion ? 784 A. I cannot; that was the substance. Q. Now then 1 call your attention to this paragraph : " A sup- pression of it was easy enough * * * wer.e.to on°eilu tne im- maculate Dr. Gray, was to shock the sensibilities of all the first families in the town." Where did you get your information for that statement ? A. I know very Avell that Dr. Gray is very highly thought of in Utica ; and I know any thing that would tend to injure the repu- tation of the Asylum would be received with a great deal of sorrow and regret by the people of Utica. Q. Is that your only explanation ? A. That is"the only one that occurs to me now. Q. I call your attention to this paragraph : " This Asylum is prob- ably the only public institution of the kind in the world where the milk squeezed from the udders of the coavs purchased by the State, fed by the State, and milked by demented labor, and supported by the State, is sold to the State at the market price per quart." Where did you get your information for that statement ? A. That statement was given by a member of the committee who investigated the Asylum last year; he stated it on the floor of the House. Q. Now7, I call your attention to this matter: " In the rough and tumble of adjournment, when it (the report) reached the Clerk's desk, of course no heed was paid to it, for every recommendation made came too late to be acted on, and from that day until this the report and the evidence accompanying it have never been seen; provision Avas made for printing it as a public document, but inquiries at the printer's revealed the fact that it never reached his hands. For several days Messrs. Geddes and Benedict have been searching high and low in the State archives and cubby-holes for the missing manu- scripts, but they have given up the task as a fool's errand. The matter Avas undoubtedly filched from the rubbish on the desk dur- ing the exciting hours attending adjournment." Now, be kind enough to state you knowledge for that statement made in that para- graph ? A. If you will take up the last paragraph y7ou read about its being filched ; that part of the article was true up to that point; the other part, as it turns out, the report was found, it had disappeared from the desk; there is no question .about that; it traveled all round Albany, and finally turned up in Weed & Parsons' office. Q. You say it traveled all round Albany ? Where did it go ? A. I don't know. Q. How do you know it traveled all round Albany? A. I have the word of one of the Mr. Parsons — young John D. Parsons, Jr. Q. Then John D. Parsons, Jr., is responsible for that statement — that it traveled all round Albany? A. lie is responsible as far as this (this is all hearsay): that he stated to me that the report had, according to information given to 785 him, had gone by the order of the Clerk, Mr. Bunn, first to the " Argus " office, and they kept it there for some time, and came to the conclusion that if they printed the report, they would not get any pay, for the reason that no order of the House had been given for its publication, outside of the State printers, and for that reason the " Argus" people, as I am informed, gave it to the stenographer, Mr. Ruso. Q. That is Avhat Parsons said to you ? A. Yes, sir; and that Mr. Ruso, when this agitation was made about the missing report on the eve of the investigation — Q. That is Avhat Mr. Parsons said to you ? * A. Yes, sir; that he produced this report, and I think his state- ment was, gave it to Mr. Benedict or Mr. Earl; I don't know which; and in course of time it got round to Weed, Parsons & Company's office ; where it had been in the mean time neither I nor anybody else knows ; that was the substance of it. Q. Was this conversation with John D. Parsons before or after you wrote this letter ? A. That Avas after. Q. Then where Avas your information obtained upon which you wrote this letter ? A. General report Q. Cannot you give us any better answer than that; did any par- ticular person tell you ? A. The fact that the report was missing first came to my knoAvl. edge from the discussion in the House, and nobody had seen the re- port there; it was stated by some members that an investigation had been made for it and it Avas not to be found, and that was the basis of that statement. Q. And that is the only basis you had for that statement that you have given ? A. Yes, sir, I should think so. Q. What was the basis of your statement that for several days Messrs. Geddes and Benedict had been searching high and low, etc.? A. That I got from one of the gentlemen named ; I suppose they did not use that language exactly. Q. How in regard to the assertion that " the matter was undoubt- edly filched from the desk," etc. ? A. That is something I am not satisfied with ; I plo not accept, as positive proof, the statement made about that report getting into the " Argus " office, or any thing of the kind. Q. Have you any other information than you have given us for this assertion or statement ? A. No, sir; I have not investigated that matter and I have some doubt about it; but I am willing to admi-tthat part is, perhaps, con- jecture ; it was a natural inference to draw. Q. Did you make any inquiries of Charles H. Bellew of Utica, as- sistant clerk of the House ? 99 U 786 r A Ps o sii* Q What is your authority for this " inquiries made of Charles II. Bellew of Utica, assistant clerk of the House last year, didn't aid the search for the stolen document" i A. I do not knoAV ; I cannot say' my impression is that Twas told by somebody, but I do not know; I must have been informed in some way. Q. I call vour attention to this statement, " it would be reckless, perhaps, to say that the removal of the report and evidence was made at the instigation of Dr. Gray, or his friends " ? A. That would be a reckless statement. Q. Is that all you have to say ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you intend to have this paragraph have that meaning, that it would be a reckless statement ? A. I meant that; still that was a flying rumor of the day. Q. What was a flying rumor of the day ? A. That somebody had filched, as I used the word, filched the re- port from the desk. « Q. Was the prevailing remark of the day that Dr. Gray had done it ? A. No, sir. Q. Or instigated it ? A. The Asylum authorities ? Q. I mean Dr. Gray ; that he did the filching of the report ? A. I should think not. Q. But it was the prevailing remark that the managers had done it ? A. The authorities — the Asylum people. t . Q. Who told you that the Asylum people had filched that report ? A. I cannot say. Q. Can you name any person ? A. I cannot iioav, and if I could I Avould not. Q. You don't noAv remember that any person ever told you that? A. No, sir, I do not; nobody would have positive knowledge of that, aud nobody could say that Avas so, but that was the report. Q. Can you state any person who told yon that the Asylum authori- ties had filched that report ? A. No, sir, I cannot name anybody now. Q. I call your attention to this paragraph ; the fact that three or four Uticans had official places in the Legislature by the grace of General dames McQuade, etc.; will you be kind enough to state the gentlemen who had been placed in the Legislature by the grace of General James McQuade ? A. I dou't know their names. Q. Why did you insert this paragraph ? A. Because I know General McQuade had used his influence in securing places for two or three people. Q. Who* 787 A. I don't knoAV ; that would be something that is merely a rumor of the day ; if a man comes down here and is supported politically by somebody, they say, " who is backing him? " they will say General McQuade or Senator Kernan, whoever it may be, but that might not be the case. Q. Is that all the basis you have for this assertion in the paper'« A. I should think so. Q. I read further from the article " there had been statements detrimental to the management regarding the acceptance of special fees for paying patients for special privileges ; it is known that Dr. Gray has sadly neglected his duty while drawing the salary of the Asylnm, he was flitted all over the country as an expert in mental diseases;" where did you get your information from, for that ? A. That he had flitted all over the country ? Q. Well, the whole of it ? A. I wish yon would divide that up. Q. Take it down to the word "privileges"; what do yon mean by that ? A. That the patients who paid had special privileges in the Asylum for paying for them ; there was some account in there about his re- fusal to make it known to the State Board of Charities. Q. Did you know Dr. Wilbur in his life-time ? A. Yes, sir; very well indeed. Q. Have you talked with him in reference to the Asylum ? fl A. I have frequently talked with him. i Q. 1 call your attention to this article : " The iniquities which were perpetrated in the secret places of this Asylum have, it is ventured, cost many a life, and of these the late Dr. Wilbur of the Idiot Asylum at Syracuse was knowing, under the imposition of a promise to refrain from their publication; he has told your corre- spondent the most harrowing tales. This much I may here write to you Avithout breaking a pledge to the dead." Will you state to the committee what harrowing circumstances were told you about Dr. Wilbur? A. If I told you, I would break a pledge to the dead. Q. Do you refuse to give them? A. I do, if the stenographer takes down what I say, I will say it privately. Mr. Goodavin —I ask the committee if the witness is privileged from answering that question. The Chairman — Do you desire to press the answer to this question ? Mr. Goodavin—I do. The Chairman — And desire the witness to state what Dr. Wil- bur told him there ? Mr. Goodwin — I do The Chairman— And do you claim that the answer of the wit- ness in giving statements of Dr. Wilbur to him, in regard to this Asylum, is in any way material, or affects the institution ? 788 Mr. Goodwin — Yes, sir. [The committee excused the witness from answering the question, upon the ground that the evidence is immaterial, incompetent, and could be of no service to the committee.] Q. When were these conversations held with Dr. Wilbur ? A. I think that there are none of them earlier than three years ago. Q. When was the last one? A. I mean by that, I should think it must have been certainly two years, and perhaps three years, that I had the last conversation, that is what I mean to say. Q. When was the first conversatiou about as to time ? A. I cannot place it by a date; I can by a circumstance. Q. Is it four or five years ago that you first commenced to talk with him? A. Four or five years ago ; it was the time of the agitation about the use of the crib in the Asylum ; the " New York Herald" started it; that was the occasion I first went to see him. Q. Were these statements made by Dr. Wilbur at that time, that you have referred to in this paper ? A. Yes, sir; a great many of them. Q. And you say the last was certainly two years ago, it may have been longer ? A. Yes, sir, it may have been longer ; I made no note of that at the time. Q. Were a majority of these statements that you say Dr. Wilbur made to you — were they previous to the year 1879 ? A. I should say not. Q. Were they previous to the year 1880 ? A. I cannot say; that is as near as I can place it; it would be, I should say; the last one was, perhaps, tAvo years ago, and the others covered a period of a year or so; 1 cannot place it any closer than that, for the reason that I made no note of it. , Q. How long previous to his death ? A. A long while; he died since I have been in Albany, and I have been in Albany for a year. Q. About how long ago was the last conversation you had with him on this subject; how long was that before his death ? A. Over a year. Q. Do you know whether or not Dr. Wilbur was examined by the committee known as the Woodin committee ? A. I do not; I think he was examined at some time regarding the Asylum ; I have an impression of that kind; I don't know any thing about it. Q. You don't know whether he was examined by that committee or not ? A. No, sir. Q. The committee that he was examined by — you say you think he was examined by one committee ? — - 789 A. I have an impression he testified somewhere. Q. Were these statements you heard before or after that ? A. I cannot say, because I cannot place that time,.and do not know it, only I know he came here at one time. Q. Do you know that Dr. Harvey B. Wilbur was examined by the Woodin committee at Albany, on the 24th of February, 1881 ? A. I did not know that. Q. You never have read his testimony ? A. I do not know ; I may have done so at the time; I have no recollection of it. Q. Did you get any information from that testimony for any assertion you made in that article ? A. I did not, certainly; but every statement I made in there is based on a personal inter vie av Avith Dr. Wilbur. Q. Do you think Dr. Wilbur if he had been cognizant of any eniquities indicated in this article would have refused to have given them to an investigating committee of the State, under oath? A. I cannot tell. \ k790 Albany, N. Y., March 24, 1884, I Room " B," New Capitol. j The committee met at 3:30 p. m. Present — Messrs. Haskell, Olin and Rice, and Mr. A. T. Good- win, of counsel. Proceedings continued as follows : Dr. STEPHEN SMITH Recalled: Examination by Mr. Goodwin continued : Q. Did the State Board of Charities ever make any complaints in relation to patients and other matters of the Utica Asylum to you ? A. I think not, I do not recollect of any now. Q. And ask you to remedy them in any Avay ? A. No, sir. Q. If they did call your attention to it, would you have called the attention of the managers or superintendent of the Asylum to it ? A. I should have. Q. Have you ever found it necessary, in the discharge of your duties, to suggest any change in the matters of administration of that Asylum ? A. No, I don't think I have in reference to that Asylum alone; I have talked over a good deal with the superintendent and the physicians and others the question of the methods of adminis- tration, and changes, but there has never been any single thing that seemed to require from me any thing more than a suggestion. Q. How have the suggestions that you have made been received by the managers or superintendent ? A. They have been well received, so far as discussing subjects freely and cordially ; there have been some differences of opinion. Q. Have they usually been acted upon ? A. I don't think I have made any of a kind— of a specific kind, with regard to any special occasion other than such kind of discussion as would lead to some changes in the methods of administration; they have not been connected with the institution particularly, as far as particular things are concerned, but have applied to all the asylums. Q. What position has Dr. Gray in the profession as an alienist i A. I think he ranks among the first; I think that is conceded by the profession at home and abroad ? Q. What is the sentiment of the profession regarding consulting with such men as Dr. Gray ? A. Do you refer to his standard ? 791 Q. Yes, sir. A. He is regarded in this city, and perhaps in this country, as one of the best consulting alienists. Q. Is he regarded as a man of whom a large portion of the pro- fession would seek advice upon matters of his specialty ? A. I think so ; yes, sir. Q In your judgment, have they a right to demand of such a man his knoAvledge and experience? A. I don't understand the question. Q. Being, as you say, a distinguished alienist, one whom the pro- fession regard as occupying a very superior, elevated position in his profession, I ask Avhether a physician would not feel that they had not a sort of right to consult with him upon diseases which would come under his specialty ? A. I think they would have a preference for him ; whether they would regard it as a right I do not know, in his relations to the Asylum. Q. I am speaking now in reference simply to his knowledge in that particular line ? A. 1 think he would be preferred, perhaps, to any one outside of the city of New York, at least. Q. I understood you to say the other day that you were the con- sulting physician at Bellevue ? A. Yes, sir. Q. From whom do you obtain your information in reference to the condition of patients in that hospital ? A. From the staff. Q. Why from the staff, doctor ? A. They are in immediate attendance all the time. Q. Do you deem it your duty to visit all the patients of that hos- pital ? A. Not at every visit, but I daily see all the new cases that come in, and all the cases of acute disease Avhere disease is progressing rapidly ; there are always a large number of chronic cases that I see or examine but seldom. Q. Why do you see them but seldom ? A. Their disease changes but very slowly and very slightly, and the daily observations of the young men are regarded as sufficient— the daily care of the young men— as sufficient for their treatment. Q. In your opinion, how often is it necessary for a physician who is in constant communication with the attending physicians 'to see a patient in there to know all that is necessary ? A. Well, that Avould depend on the nature of the disease. Q. Now as to the Utica Asylum, doctor, it would not be neces- sary for the superintendent to see all the chronic cases often? A. I should think not. Q. And in reference to the acute cases, if, as you say, he has a competent medical staff from whom he obtains thorough knowledge 792 of the condition of the patients, how7 often would it be necessary to see them personally ; what are your views in reference to that? A. Well, I should think there might be some that would require to be seen daily ; possibly, a great many every second or third day; or some every second or third day, but the larger number once a week, or once a fortnight; still I think that depends altogether upon the competency of the staff and the accuracy w7ith which they re- port all the conditions of the insane from day to day and hour to hour. Q. You stated, I think, that you have made examination as to the methods of the reports made at Utica by the assistants to the super- intendent ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And how have you regarded those reports? A. I think I can cover it all in a very few w7ords by saying that I think the system of reporting the condition of patients during the day and during the night there, so accurate and so thorough, that the superintendent can at any time keep himself very thoroughly fa- miliar Avith the changes in the condition of a patient every day ; at any rate, as a medical man, I think it Avould be sufficient for him in examining these returns, to feel himself sufficiently familiar with cases, even acute cases, to see them at comparatively long intervals; that is, not see them every day ; see them at longer intervals than a day. Q. In your judgment is it advisable for the consulting physician personally to investigate, or to receive his information immediately from the attending physicians ? A. He has got to do both usually ; it is largely derived from the attending physicians as a matter of necessity, but iu certain diseases, the personal observation of the consulting physician or surgeon is important. Q. From your knowledge of Utica Asylum, do you think that the public service has suffered because of Dr. Gray's absence ? A. No, I should think not, that Avould be my impression, but I Avould like to qualify that by saying, it is because I have great con- fidence in the staff of officers he has, and their qualifications for the positions they hold. Q. In your opinion, is a physician better qualified to superintend such an Asylum as that at Utica, by reason of his knowlege gained by contact Avith physicians or disease outside of that Asylum? A. I think that adds to his qualifications and improves them. Q. Will you be kind enough to give the committee your views, if you have any, upon the duty of a man standing in his profession as Dr. Gray does, to impart hisJknoAvledge both to the profession and to individuals when it does not conflict with his duty as a superintendent of a State institution ? A. With that last qualification I think it is of great value to in- dividuals and of great value to the state —his opinions —giA7en as they are —and are very desirable ; and I think it reacts on the insti- 793 tution ; and I think he himself becomes a better qualified man ; at any rate we regard it so in every branch of our profession, if a man is a consulting physician and surgeon, his hospital attendance and private practice must be combined to make him a thoroughly successful man in his profession. Q. Have you known Dr. Gray to visit people outside of the Asy- lum ? A. Not to my knowledge. Q. Has your attention ever been called to a case in Herkimer county ? A. Yres, sir. Q. Please give that to the committee ? A. That was a case in which a woman recently confined became insane, as they do occasionally, avIio Avas in very great danger, from the history of the case as I received it, of losing her life, when he was called, I think at night, and went, in the winter, and attended her, and from the course of treatment he pursued during the night it seemed to have saved her life. It was so regarded and' believed by her physician and friends. Q. Has your attention, as Commissioner in Lunacy, been directed to the two plans which seemed to prevail in Asylum manage- ment in which the administration and medical departments have been separated ? A. 1 have seen them under both ; institutions managed under both systems. Q. Which, in your judgment, is the most advantageous system? A. That where there is one executive head, and where the super- intendent is the general excecutive officer. , Q. I call your attention to a report of lunatic asylums by Freder- ick Norton Manning, published in 1868. Are you familiar with this 1 book ? A. I knoAV the man very well, and his reports ;T don't know which one you have there; he has written specially on hospitals for the in- sane. Q. This is a report in which he says that he has examined the hospitals at Trenton, Utica, Harrisburgh, Northampton, Blackwell's i island, Philadelphia, Washington, the Hospital for the Insane, Phil- ; adelphia, Boston, Criminal Asylum at Auburn, Asylum for Idiots at Syracuse, and at Boston, Asylum for Inebriates, at Binghamton, New York, and the Hudson River Asylum at Poughkeepsie, also twenty-six asylums in England, nine in France, four in Germany, five in Belgium, and in Ireland. Witness — In Canada ? A. I think he visited Canada also. Q. Ytou think he also visited Canada? I A. Yes, sir , I believe so. fc Q. I read from page 79 of his report, " on examining closely the k general condition of asylums, those are always to be found to be the K' 100 U 794 best managed in which the physician is the superintendent, one and supreme, in which the committee of visitors act only through him, and with his advice, and in which the appointment and dismissal of all attendants are delegated to him; and those are found to be the least satisfactory in which the responsibility is divided in which the committee of visitors or controlling board meddle in the internal management of the institution and direct themselves, or through their officers, any part of it; appoint and dismiss attendants, or clip in any way the authority of the medical superintendent; I ask you, doctor, do you concur in that opinion ? A. I do ; I do as our asylums are organized in this city and in the United States; they are all on the same basis. By Mr. Haskell : Q. Do I understand you to limit your concurrence to the asylums in this State ? A. I say as they are organized in this State and in the United States, the method we have of organizing asylums. Q. And do you concur Avith him as to those asylums in England that he examined ; that those are best managed which are under one head, and those are worst managed which have a divided responsi- bility ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And you also concur that those in Germany are in the same -shape? A. I never visited those asylums at all. Q. Then in your concurrence with him, it is not as to the fact whether they are or not; I understood you to say you agreed with him that these separate asylums Avere — A. (Interrupting.) I concur in the sentiment he expresses. Q. And not in the fact that he states ? A. Well, it is based on examination of certain asylums, and mine is on certain other asylums where both systems are followed. By Mr. Goodwin (resuming): Q. Have you examined asylums in which both systems have been at work ? A. I have; yes, sir. Q. Have you found a general complaint from superintendents where the system prevailed as to the want of efficiency? A. I have found complaints; and my observations went further than that, that they were well founded — the systems of two, three or four responsible parties, separated in the management of different departments of asylums; there has'been great inefficiency every- where that system has prevailed. Q. Can you state the differences, in order that the committee may see the difficulties which this divided responsibility entails ? 795 A. I would like, if it is a proper'thing to do, I would like to state, without having it taken down, the result of my observation in Canada. [Witness then made a statement which was not taken by the stenographer.] J Q. Are you acquainted at all with the number of patients that are usually in English asylums ? A. Not any further than the reports of the Commissioners. ^ Q. Can you state to the committee the number of assistant phy- sicians m an English asylum as compared with ours? A. My impressions are that they are less; that we have double the number m this State in the same class of asylums, what are called mixed asylums, acute and chronic cases. Q. Do you know by reputation of the establishment at Colney Hatch? J A I only know it is a very large asylum ; it is like our Willard Asylum. Q. Where there are upwards of two thousand patients, and more ? A. Yes, sir, they rarely have less than that. Q. And about hoAV many physicians do they have for these two thousand patients? A. I think their staff never exceeds three or four. Mr. Goodwin — Mr. Chairman, you can examine the doctor. By Mr. Olin : Q. They use for purposes of restraint at Utica the "crib" and the "chair," and a patient is fastened into it; is that uniform in all the asylums in the State ? A. 'No, sir. Q. Are there any asylums where they are not in use? A. I think it is only in use at Utica and Buffalo? Q. How are patients, who are recognized'insane patients, re- strained at the Kings County Lunatic Asylum ? A. They are not Under any restraint;'' they are allowed to move about, and with no other care than the ordinary attendants looking after them. Q. Do you look upon that system there of absence of restraint as being any better system to that at Utica ? A. Well, there is a very different class of patients at Utica; Flatbush Asylum has largely a class of chronic insane, but you never see as many acute maniacs, Avhat Ave call violent persons, in the acuteness of their disease anywhere as you see at Utica; I believe as largely as possible in Avhat is called the non-restraint system, sup- plying attendants instead of any kind of appliances and apparatus. Q. Is it not a fact, in your judgment, that that system of restraint tends to excite-and irritate? A. I don't think it always does; I think with a certain class, I know it is very subduing and quiet; I know some patients who ask to have the apparatus put upon them if they have violent fits come > 796 r ~ on ; but with the most of them, I think it is to a certain extent irri- tating ; I don't know that it is any more than to have an attendant watching all the time at the elbow of the patient; that is very annoying to them. Q. What would you say as to the number of hours, consecutively and habitually, that an attendant should be on duty ? A. Ithink an attendant should not be on duty more than the ordinary hours of a person at ordinary work, say from nine until five or six o'clock. Q. Eight or ten hours a day ? A. Yes, sir, as an extreme ; attendants should not only be entirely relieved, but should have a separate building and be able to go entirely away from the noise and confusion and excitement of the patients. Q. What in your judgment would be the effect upon an attendant upon those wards wfiere the patients were excited, what would be the effect upon him, being on duty from five o'clock in the morning until eight o'clock at night ? A. I think he gets wTorn out very much. Q. Is it reasonable to expect he would be harsh in his treatment to patients under those circumstances ? A. I think he would be very likely to be under the circumstances. Q. Get nervous and irritable ? A. Yes, sir, that is why ; I think the hours should be shorter, and the absence should be complete from the building and all connection with them, so that a man or woman attendant returns perfectly fresh from the out-door air. Q. Is it allowable in your judgment that a patient whp is a little boisterious and uproarous should be passed from one ward to another with the understanding that it was because of that uproar- iousness ? A. It is disciplining very decidedly with a great many patients, and I think the great mass of them feel a great deal the changes of one ward to another; and I think many endeavor to be on their good behavior and exercise their will-poAver to the last degree to be on good wards ; I have seen that often. Q. Then you think that if they understand that their going on to a bad ward depends on their behavior, they would be likel y to behave better ? A. Yes, sir, and if they think that for a given time if they would behave perfectly well they could go home, a great many of them would, during that time, control themselves and behave well; and (except in those forms of diseases of the brain like epilepsy where they must necessarily lose all control of themselves) they'become very docile indeed. Q. You talk about having the entire management of the Asylum ,in one person,— Mr. Rice — I want to ask one question before leaving that sub- ject. 797 By Mr. Rice : Q. Do you Avish to be understood as approving of the removal of patients from one ward to another as punishment ? A. Yes, sir ; where it is without effect. Q. I am speaking without regard to the effect ? A. I do where it has the effect of correcting the habits of the pa- tient. Q. Do you approve generally of that course of correction in the Asylum, that is, about moving them from ward to Avard according to their conduct as a matter of punishment ? A. Well, I should not like to use the word " punishment." Q. Well, we Avill say discipline? A. Yes, sir ; as discipline I should say it was very desirable. By Mr. Haskell : Q. Do you know whether that system of discipline is in vogue at Utica Asylum ? A. I think it is in all the asylums of the State. Q. And it is at the Utica Asylum ? A. Yres, sir. By Mr. Olin : Q. Your judgment, as I understand you, is decidedly in favor of the government, inside and outside, being in one person ? * A. I think that leads to the greatest efficiency, and is decidedly so in my experience. Q. Would it not also lead to the prospect of the greatest neglect ? A. No, sir; I think not neglect in any particular. Q. Is it a fair thing to presume' that a skilled physician must necessarily be skilled in all the other departments of life, such as would be necessary to run that institution? A. Well, I have not a very high opinion of a doctor's executive ability, any way; but there are men who combine that in a very high degree ; and I do not know of a superintendent in this State • that has not good executive ability with a very high standing in his profession. Q. You think all the superintendents have that? A. Yes, sir; all the superintendents in this State. Q. Y ou think that Dr. Gray has that ability remarkably developed, do yon ? A. I do; the only question of divided responsibility, it seems to me, would be where there was a large farm like the Willard Asylum, or something like that, where there is an immense industry going on. Q. How large a farm is there at Willard? A. Nearly eight hundred or a thousand acres. Q. Have you visited the asylum at Binghamton ? A. Yes, sir. 798 Q. Y on would not be in favor, then, as I understand you from your examination of this report that was read to you by Mr. Good- win, you would not be in favor of the managers being too inquisi- tive about what was going on there ? A. I think the superintendent is the executive officer of the man- agers ; I think they are the responsible men for the appointment of the superintendent and of all of his acts. Q. Theh you think the managers ought to be veiy vigilant in knowing what was going on ? A. Most decidedly they should be. Q. What would you think about it if they did not know any thing about what was going on ? A. I should not think they Avere very vigilant; but I ought to perhaps qualify that in this way: that asylum boards are generally large and scattered, bnt I think in all instances, within reasonable limits of the asylum, there are a certain number who act as executive committee. Q. Is it your judgment that the managers ought to regularly, although not at stated times, perhaps, but regularly visit the Asy- lum to know what is going on inside and outside of it ? A. Y es, sir; I think they should be held to the highest responsi- bility in that of knowing all of the internal affairs of the institution and that by personal and constant familiarity with it; there is no question about that; I would not by any means say that because there is a superintendent at the head of the institution that he should run away Avith the board and do every thing himself; if he does so, I think that is the fault of the board itself ; here is a board of man- agers appointed by the Governor and the Senate, as State officers, with a direct responsibility upon them; if they abandon their trust and give it up to the superintendent and let him run the Asylum because he is the executive officer, and they know nothing about it, it would be the highest degree of delinquency. Q. So that you think the board of managers ought to visit the Asylum often enough to knoAV what is going on ? A. I do. Q. A nd that they ought to go there without the superintendent or the authorities knowing that they are coming ? A. Yes, sir ; I think they should do so. Q. You would say that, in your judgment? A. Yes, sir; I think they should go through very much as the superintendent ought to do — at odd "times, and any times, and by the bapk door, or the front door, so as to be thoroughly familiar with the internal affairs of the institution. By Mr. Haskell : Q. You say that you are consulting physician at Bellevue hospital ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Is there a salary attached to that position ? A. No, sir. 799 Q. Do you regard your duties as consulting physician at Bellevue hospital the same relatively as Dr. Gray's, as superintendent of the Utica Insane Asylum ? A. Yes, sir, so far as the medical care of the patients is concerned. Q. That is your understanding of your respective duties, that they are similar ? A. Y es, sir, very much the same; they are different, it is true, but they are very much on the same basis. Q. You have no responsibility for the personal care and attention that is paid to the patients in the Bellevue hospital, have you? A. While T Avas on duty as a visiting physician I was responsible. Q. As a consulting physician ? A. Well, I wish to distinguish there; we have visiting physicians and surgeons, and consulting. Q. I am referring to your duties as consulting physician ? A. Well, as a consulting physician I am called in ; but I am speak- ing more Avith reference ,to my duties as a visiting physician; we have a class of consulting physicians and surgeons. Q. You have testified before the committee that— A. (Interrupting.) Wait a moment, please, I Avould like to have , that corrected so as to have it perfectly understood ; for about twenty years I was visiting surgeon at Bellevue hospital; I served it so long in that capacity, latterly I occupied a different position, now it is as consulting surgeon. Noav, as to the visiting physician; my position as visiting physician w7as very mucii like that of Dr. Gray's, or the superintendant of an asylum, though I am not a resident of the institution, but I am responsible for the wards that are under me, and their management and the management of the patients and every thing connected with them ; during the time I am not there on duty I have a staff of three resident officers under me, the house surgeon and his tAvo assistants, and they are responsible directly to me, for the care of the patients. Q. That is Avhen you were visiting physician ? A. Yes, sir; that is what I alluded to in reference to the relations between the visiting physician of a general hospital and the superin- tendent of an asylum. The position of consulting physician and sur- geon is rather honorary, though while I am in that position' I still attend the at Avards occasionally. Q. Was there a salary attached to the office of visiting physician ? A. No, sir. Q. You consider your duties as a visiting physician, in relation to the patients, the same as those of a superintendent of an insane asylum ? A. They were not unlike them as regards responsibility for the management. Q. And you consider that a visiting physician of one of those hospitals has as much responsibility in regard to the care and atten- tion that is paid to the patients as the superintendent of an insane asylum has to the inmates of his asylum ? 800 A. Yery much the same character, the only difference would be in the number of patients. Q. So that you do not regard it as the duty of the superintendent to give a great deal of personal care and attention to the inmates of his institution ? A. Oh, no; I should be very sorry to go on the record in that way. But going into Dr. Gray's office in the morning and examin- ing all that occurred the day before, and the night before, I say that I could, if I knew the condition of each patient as they came into the Asylum I could keep a very acurate idea of the progress of each case. Q. Are you not now confining yourself to the medical treatment of the patients ? A. Yes, sir; I refer entirely to their mental condition, and medi- cation, as far as required. Q. I refer to the personal care of the attendance upon the patients — the personal welfare of the patients ? A. That is the very point I Avant to try and make clear; if a man came into Bellevue yesterday with a broken leg, and I saw him, and to-day there is a report taken every hour of his condition, pulse, temperature, etc., a full report of the condition of that man, I should have as good an idea as if I went to see him. I Avould not like to be doAvn as saying that the superintendent should not visit his wards; I think it is provided in the rules that he shall visit them, and I think he should visit them as often as is necessary for the welfare of the patients under his charge. Q. What is your judgment in regard to how often a superintendent should make a systematic and thorough vistation of all the patients in his institution ? A. I think that should be done once a Aveek ; the entire institu- tion, in all its departments, should be thoroughly examined at least weekly, patients and all ; and I think there are a large number who should be seen oftener than that, in an asylum where most of them are acutely insane. Q. So that whatever remarks you have made, you do not desire to be understood as indicating your idea that a visitation is not required — personal visitation of the patients ? , . ■ A. Oh, no ; not at all. Q. What are your duties as Commissioner in Lunacy, as you under- stand them ? A. I am required to examine into the condition of the insane, and the institution in which they are kept; their care and custody, pub- lic and private, in the State. Q. And how often have you visited Utica Insane Asylum ? A. Six times since I have been on duty. Q. When were you there last ? A. I do not recollect the date ; I think it was November last. Q. And how long a time did you spend there on that occasion ? A. 1 spent two days there. * 801 Q. Has your investigation, such as you have made, of the Utica Insane Asylum been in regard to its sanitary condition only, or has it been also in regard to its business management ? A. I have endeavored to look into all departments of it; I have looked into its business management as well as into all other depart-, ments. Q. What have you to say in regard to their manner and method of purchasing supplies ? A. I should very much prefer the method adopted at Willard or Binghamton. Q. Then you do not approve of the method adopted at Utica? A. I do not think it is—no, sir; I should prefer the other method. Q. What steps have you taken to correct the system in vogue at Utica ? A. No further than to have recommended the — to have ex- pressed my preference for the method at Binghamton and Willard. Q. To whom did yoli make this recommendation ? A. To Dr. Gray and the steward. Q. When did you make the first recommendation of that char- acter ? A. 1 think it was at my third visit; that was the latter part of 1882, I think ; Dr. Gray was away most of the time ; I do not know but it Avas the first visit, in 1883 ; he bad been injured. Q. It was either the latter part of 1882, or in 1883, that you made this recommendation ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Have you ever spoken of the matter since to Dr. Gray or to the steAvard ? A. I don't know that I have; I would like to say that I looked over all their articles purchased, and their prices, and as far as I was able to discover there was little, if any, difference in the quality of the goods and prices, as compared with the Willard and Binghamton Asylums; but it is the system I am speaking about; I prefer the others. Q. How did you ascertain that there was very little difference, if any, in the prices, between what was paid at Binghamton and Willard and the prices paid at Utica? A. By personal examination. Q. How did you make a comparison ? A. I made a memorandum of the articles and of the prices in the different asylums. Q. And then from your memoranda you made comparisons ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you make a memorandum of what was paid for sugars at the Willard Asylum ? A. I do not recollect that particularly. Q. Did you make a memorandum as to what was paid for flour ? 101 U 802 A. Yes, sir, I did, but I do not remember the difference in prices; yes, I made a memorandum of that. Q. Do you now think you did of the sugar ? A. Yes, sir, I think so. Q. Did }tqu see that there was any difference ? A. No, sir, I did not take the list through ; I did not see much variation ; some were higher and some were lower. Q. That is at one institution they paid more for one article and less for others, and Utica they paid less for some of the articles and more for others ? A. Yes, sir, but I did not notice such a difference as I anticipated. Q. How close and thorough an investigation did you make in reference to that matter ? A. Well, as much as a medical man would make. Q. We do not knoAV hoAV much a medical man would make; I asked you how much did you make? A. Well, I took the prices of the articles as nearly alike as I could. Q. Upon Iioav many articles ? A. Most of the articles that they had in store — clothes, shoes, hats, flour, meats, etc. Q. Do you know any thing about the contract of the Utica Insane Asylum with Butler & Hamilton of Utica? A. No, sir, I do not recollect it. Q. Do you know that these other institutions that you referred to pay as much as five per cent advance on staple groceries ? A. No, sir, I did not knoAV that. Q. Now in regard to the divided management of the institution ; I understand you to say that you originally believed that that would be Avise ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And that you have changed your mind ? A. Yes, sir, I have. Q. Do you mean to say that the best interests of an institution would not permit the purchasing of supplies and the general dis- bursement of moneys to be in the hands of a man independent and apart from the superintendent of the institution ? A. It has not been in those institutions I have examined ; I think there might be exceptional cases where it could very well be, but not as a system. Q. Are all the institutions in this State under the general manage- ment of the medical superintendent? A. All except two —the State Asylum for Insane Criminals and the Emigrants' Asylum. Q. Now, take the Asylum for Insane Criminals at Auburn ; what is the system there ? A. There it is under the State Prison Inspector. Q. Who is the superintendent of the medical or sanitary part of that institution ? A. Dr. MacDonald. -803 « Q. And under whom is the business management ? A. Under Mr. Baker. Q. And do you mean to say that it does not work well there ? A. It works very well, very Avell. Q. I understood you to say that in all institutions where there had been a divided management you found it did not work well'!* A. I do not say in all, I say in general. Q. In regard to the institution for insane emigrants ; who has the management of that ? A. The Commissioners of Emigration ; they transact the business. Q. And under Avhose administration or management is the medical department ? A. It is Dr.------; I cannot recollect his name. Q. Does it work badly in that institution ? A. I do not think it works as well; I do not think the institution is in as good condition as the State institution ; and I might say in regard to the asylum for insane criminals that it is the superintend- ent's and the inspector's opinions—both of them—that the institution would be better if they had a board governing the institution — a local board, and had the management of it, like it is in other asylums; and I believe there is a bill before the Legislature to that effect. Q. In regard to the absence of the superintendent on private busi- ness : I understand you to say you do not see any objection to it, with the qualification, "providing it did not interfere with his duties"? A. Yes, sir. Q. Suppose it does interfere Avith his duties in the institution, what then ? A. He should not leave. Q. Who is to judge Avhether it does interfere with his duties or not ? A. That should be the duty of the board of managers. Q. Then you think, do you, that in each case, before the superin- tendent should leave on any private business he should have the consent of the board of managers, upon a submission of the case to them ? A. I do; yes, sir. Q. Is it a part of your duty to make recommendations in regard to such changes of administration and management as comes to your' attention? A. No; I do not regard that as part of my duty, but to report on the condition of the insane, and of the institution as I find them. Q. To Avhoiu do you make your report? A. I report to the Legislature. Q. Have you made a report to the Legislature iioav in session ? A. Yes, sir; I have reported to the present Legislature. Q. In that report do you say any thing in regard to a change in the method of purchasing supplies at the Utica Asylnm ? A. No, sir; not in particular. 804 Q. Why did you not do so ? A. I have spoken of it only generally — that the system at Wil- lard seemed the best system. Q. Did yon not, in your report, call attention to the method of purchasing supplies at Utica, and say that you thought a change Avas advisable ? A. I mentioned it in regard to all the other asylums, Utica as well as others. Q. Do all the asylums purchase as they do at Utica, except at Willard and Binghamton ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What is the difference in the manner of purchasing in those two institutions ? A. In Willard they send out for proposals. Q. And is it the same at Binghamton ? A. Y'es, sir; Binghamton adopted the Willard system. Q. And at Utica how do you understand it? A. They purchase as they Avant the articles. Q. From local business men ? A. Pretty largely locally, judging from the list that I took there. Q. What action have you taken, if any, with regard to a change in the hours that attendants are employed ? A. I have taken no action further than to report the facts. Q. Is there any asylum where any different system prevails? A. No, sir. Q. All the asylums in the State have the same system of continu- ous service during the entire twenty-four hours ? A. Yes, sir; there is only one exception, and that hardly comes under this head of insane institutions, and that is at Bellevue hos- pital, w7e have an insane pavilion there, and the trained nurses have regular hours of duty, and when they come off of duty, they go right out of thehospital. But in the asylums principally, this system of residence in it, and of almost continuous attendance is in operation. Q. Which asylums, did you say, retained the use of mechanical restraint ? A. Well, they are retained to some extent in all the State insti- tutions, except the Asylum for Insane Criminals; I do not think there has been any restraint used there ; there was not when I commenced my duties and there has not been since, and I think for a year or tAvo previously. Q. You said there were only tAvo asylums, as I understood you, where it was not used ? A. That was about the crib, that is onlvused in the State asylums at Utica and Buffalo, not in any other State asylums; it is used at some county institutions. Q. And also the stationary chair ? A. That is in use in all the asylums, except at Flatbush, they are not used there. 805 Q. In your visits tothe Utica Insane Asylum, have you examined the books known as " injury books " there ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Have yon made any examination of any cases recorded in those books ? A. I have examined ; I make it a rule of examining all that have occurred during the interval of my visits, Avhere the patients are still there. Q. State what examination you have made ? When were you there previously to November ? A. I think I w7as there in August, and I think in April or May. Q. What examination did you make into cases recorded in the injury books ? A. My method of examining has been to take the name of the pa- tients, and in my rounds find this patient, take him aside and make in- quiries, if they are in a condition so that I can learn any thing from them, and I get their statement of the injury and how it occurred. Q. Do the patients at any time complain that they have been unkindly or brutally treated by attendants ? Have they so com- plained to you ? A. Yes, sir, that was not an infrequent thing. Q. What pains did you take to find out Avhether it Avas so or not ? A. I haA^e examined — I usually ask patients who make complaint if there are any other patients on the ward to whom he can refer as having seen it and been a Avitness to the affair; and if they give me the names of other patients, as they not infrequently do, I take those patients aside and ask them. Q. What has been the result of such inquiries ? A. I not infrequently find that they have been ; well, I find all sorts of results, and all sorts of complaints, and all sorts of terminations to those inquiries. Q. Have you ever found that the attendants have been guilty of ill-treatment ? A. Well, that they have been rough in their usage of patients, but it has been very rare that it has not been made clear that the efforts that they had to make were of such a kind as would be interpreted as rough, avhen after all they used no more violence than was necessary ; it has been a very frequent thing that other patients have testified to that, and a great many examples I find haA7e been patients avIio are very filthy and become so much soiled in their clothing that they had to be cleaned, and then in taking their cloth- ing off for that purpose, they would resist, straighten out, and resist all efforts to get their clothing off of them ; it Avill take two or three attendants, and sometimes a patient or two to accomplish the result. Q. Do you ever find in your inquiries that patients had been treated more harshly than you thought they ought to have been ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Can you specify any cases ? A. Yes, sir; I can specify a number of cases; several. 806 Mr. Rice — You are confining him to Utica, are you not ? The Chairman,(Mr. Haskell) — Yes; I am confining you to Utica, doctor ; do you not so understand it ? A. No, sir; not in that respect ; I was going to speak of another asylum, because there I went into an elaborate investigation of the facts. Q. Now, confining yourself to Utica, state any particular cases that you have in mind ? A. I don't know that I can say that I found that the attendants there had used more efforts than were necessary to accomplish their purpose ; I don't know that I ought to say that they have used un- necessary force ; that they have acted unwisely in the use of force, but I have seen — on my fourth visit there I saw a woman — insane woman — when I was on the Avard, attack an attendant, struck her and kicked her, and it required three or four to control her; she Avas a very stout woman; in that case considerable violence was done to the patient; they used all the force they could to restrain her, and it Avas as much as they could do to prevent her doing a great deal of harm. Q. Do I understand you to say that you did in no case in making investigations regarding the complaints at Utica Asylum, that you in no case found that an attendant had been cruel or harsh to a patient? A. I did not find any where they had been cruel in the sense of unnecessarily assaulting or abusing a patient ; it was only in their efforts to. manage a patient that they may have used more force than Avas necessary ; I remember of one case being referred to me in which two of the patients, who were present and saw the assault, stated that perhaps there was more effort or violence used than was necessary, but both said that they had as much as they could do to ' control the patient, and both said that if they had been engaged in the scrape they should have used more force than was used. Q. Did you so tell the attendants ? A. No, sir ; I examined them privately ; I never examine them in the presence of the attendants. Q. YTou have spoken of taking the evidence of patients ; do you regard what they have stated to you.as reliable ? A. I had a good opportunity to judge by allowing them to make their statements, and then questioning them ; very frequently it Avas entirely unreliable ; there is a patient now in Utica, who at the com- mencement makes apparently a very clear statement, but before he gets through it is a perfectly absurd one. \ Q. I am referring to those who are not personally interested in a matter, who make statements in regard to what has occurred between attendants and other patients ? A. In regard to the testimony of patients looking on ? Q. Yes. A. Well, I regarded that as very good testimony, generally ; of course I used some discretion with regard to the patients I inquired of, and as to their methods of stating it; but where four or five 807 patients of different grades of insanity, and some of them having apparently a very clear recollection, all confirm one fact that they saw, it has seemed to me very good evidence. Q. Was there any complaint made to you by patients, especially on the fourth ward, and other disturbed Avards at Utica, — male de- partment — in regard to the treatment of patients by attendants ? A. Yes, sir ; I have had several made there. Q. \V hat did they complain of ? A. Well, it was harsh handling of them — abusive treatment. Q. Striking them ? A. Yes, sir, using force on them. Q. Striking them in the region of the stomach ? A. No, sir; I do not know as I had any specifications of that sort; it has been in general, I think, in all cases in that direction, it has been in the effort to change the filthy patients; it has been the filthy patients who have made complaint, and it has been in the effort to change their clothing. Q. Have you ever made any investigation into the matter of the death of Mr. Hughes in the Asylum ? A. No, sir, I have not; I did not because it at once went to the coroner; and in that respect my methods of procedure have been governed by the method of the lunacy commission in England, which is very much on the same basis ; these cases are always examined first by the coroner in England. Q. Are you sole Commissioner ? : A. Yes, sir. Q. Is it a general practice of the superintendents of the various asylums in this State to do quite a large outside business — of a private character ? A. I think they all do some; it differs very much, according to the location they are in and their reputation. v Q. And as Lunacy Commissioner of this State you are in favor of their doing an outside practice, as I understand ? A. If it does not interfere with their duties in the as}lum. Q. And that you would leave, in each individual case, to the board of managers who are responsible for the appointment of the super- intendent \ A. I think the board of managers are responsible. Q. And you would leave the question as to the interference of private matters with the duties of the superintendent, you would leave that to the board of managers ? A. Yes, sir; 1 do not think any of them do much private practice; I think they are mostly called by the courts, and are summoned to give their testimony. Q. What do you think of the superintendent of an insane asylum making himself a Avitness in a private case for a large compensation? A. It would depend upon how much it interfered with his duty; if it interfered at all, I think he should not do it. Q. Can the superintendent of an institution of the size of Utica, 808 with the large number of acute cases there, give his time to the consideration of private cases, thoroughly examining them for the purpose of making himself a Avitness, without interfering more or less with his duty, in your judgment ? A. I think he might if it did not take him very much from the asylum. Q. If he was at the asylum and give a large part of his time to that case, Avould it not, in your opinion, seriously interfere with his duties ? A. Well, it is difficult to say ; if I knew the case I could probably state; but I should give the same opinion; I do not think that a superintendent should be very much away from the asylum ; I think being gone a day or two might not interfere at all, but long absences, I think, are very wrong, under all the circumstances. Q. Do you think it would have a very injurious effect upon the usefulness of the attendants if the superintendent appeared to be slack and careless about his duties? A. Yes, sir; decidedly, I should say it would. By Mr. Rice: ' ■'" j Q. How do they get along Avith patients in the asylum where they use no restraints at all, as for instance, Auburn Asylum for Criminals? A. That is a small asylum, and they have a large corps of attend- ants ; and their patients are generally the chronic kind, not very many acute insane. Q. What, for instance, would they do with a man who attempted to do violence to himself, by pulling out his hair, or mutilating his person ? A. He would be watched by an attendant almost constantly; enough to prevent it; and frequently put in a room by himself when he was liable to do injury ; otherwise put in seclusion. Q. But that would not be a means of prohibiting him from doing injury to himself ? A. No, sir; in that case there would be an attendant watching him. Q. How many patients are in Utica? A. Last year I think the average Avas about six hundred. Q. And Dr. Gray is the sole manager of the business and medical department there ? A. Yes, sir. , Q. The whole charge is assumed by him ? A. He supervises it all, I understand. Q. In your judgment are his duties there constant with his de- livery of a course of lectures in the city of New York? A. I think so. Q. ^ That is to say you think one man could manage that Asylum with its six hundred patients, and still find time to visit the city of New \ ork and deliver twelve lectures ? 809 ~ A. Yes, sir ; with a competent corps of officers; he never stays more than a day or two. Q. Is your judgment influenced in any way by the fact that you are interested in Bellevue hospital ? A. No, sir; not at all; it is interested the other way ; I am not a friend of the school; I think some five or six of the superintendents are now lecturing in the schools and to my personaT knowledge the value of those lectures to the recent graduates is very great, we have never had so many competent young men able to deal with the in- sane and to give certificates as we have within the last four or five years; I examined all the commitment papers and invariably the commitment papers made by the young men who have had these course of lectures are minute and accurate as compared with older physicians who have never had any training. Q. Would not the corps of assistants at the Utica Asylum be entirely competent to run -that institution without Dr. Gray ? A. I regard Dr. Brush as a very competent man indeed, and those under him are less experienced, but they are among the best young medical men of the State. Q. You do not answer the question I put to you. The stenog- rapher will read it to you. (Question read by the stenographer.) A. Well, I think Dr. Gray is infinitely superior to any of them; I should rather have him one hour than them a week, so far as the poAver of managing and organizing. Q. Managing what, the business department? A. The whole of the department; he is practically familiar with every department of such an institution. Q. And suppose it to be a fact that Dr. Gray did not visit the wards of the Asylum of that institution oftener than once in three weeks, what would be your opinion as to whether he was doing his duty or not ? A. I think he might still be very familiar with his cases. Q. I wish yon would answer the question directly, if you can, please, whether or not in your judgment a visit of once in three weeks is entirely consistent with his duty at that Asylum ? A. No, sir, I should think not. Q. If you knew that Dr. Gray had excused his infrequent visits to the wards of that institution by reason of ill-health during the last year or two, would you still say it was consistent with his duty to deliver lectures in the city of New York? A. You mean as regards his health? Q. Yes? A. Yes, sir, I think so. Q. Then you think it is of more importance that he should de- liver lectures in the city of New York than that he should visit the wards of the Asylum as often as necessary ? A. No, sir, I don't say any such thing — that he should not attend to his duty to the Asylum ; I don't say that. v 102 U 810 Q. I understand you have said that substantially; I will repeat my question. Suppose he had excused his infrequent visits to the wards of the Utica Asylum during the last two years by reason of ill-health, do you still say that it is consistent with his duties there that he should be delivering lectures in the city of New York within that period of time ? A. I would like to say this, it would be possible for a man to de- liver a lecture very easily when it was not so easy or possible for him to walk; as I understand Dr. Gray's illness from the physician in the city who is attending him, he has always found it very diffi- cult to walk about, especially up and down stairs; now, as to the delivery of a lecture, I think a man could do that when he could not so well walk about ; I do not wish to be understood as saying Avhat he ought to do, or what he ought not to do ; but as to the mattertof physical possibility, I think he could lecture with a great deal more ease than he could go around the Asylum. Q. You understand his injury to be a shot wound in the face, do you not ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do you consider it consistent with his duties of that Asylum that he should receive compensation for his services as an assistant on one side or the other of a private lawsuit ? A. I should not like to judge as to that. Q. Why not ? A. I know nothing about the circumstances. Q. The circumstances are all combined in the question, and that is whether o»-i ot you would regard it as consistent with the per- formance of bis duties as superintendent of the Utica Insane asylum, that he should receive compensation for services as an assistant on 0113 side or the other in a private lawsuit ? A. It would depend upon the amount of time it took him away from the Asylum. Q. Suppose it took him any time away ? A. Do you mean as its effects upon the Asylum, or as a matter of moral obligation ? Q. I speak of the effect upon the Asylum ? A. I do not see that being in a private suit would make any dif- ference ; I think it is a question of the time he would be taken away from his duties. t Q. Do you think it is proper that he should devote any portion of his time as an assistant in a private lawsuit ? A. I see no objection to it. By Mr. Haskell : Q. I believe your attention was called to the matter of the surveil- lance of the correspondence in the Asylum ? A. Yes, sir ; I testified about that, Q. Do I understand you to sav that you think it proper that the letters of patients should in all cases be supervised —for instance, 811 a wife to a husband, a child to a parent or a parent to a child ; is it your opinion that in such cases the correspondence should be with- held? A. It depends upon the contents of it; I have seen those that ought to be withheld, and properly, in a good many instances; that would be my judgment. By Mr. Olin : Q. Are there any criminals in the Asylum at Utica—insane criminals ? A. Yes, sir ; a number of them. Q. What is your judgment as to the propriety of keeping in that Asylum, with people who are not criminals, those insane criminals? A. I think they should not be kept there. Q. Don't you thiuk that is an outrageous arrangement ? A. It is, and it ought to be remedied ; it is the same in the Homoeopathic Asylum ; they have several insane criminals there. Q. Can you explain, as Commissioner in Lunacy, how it is that criminals are sent to such institutions to associate with others who are not criminals; or why it is that they send insane criminals straight from Auburn to Utica ? A. It is a matter that is left to the discretion of the court; but it ought to be remedied. Q. At the Kings County hospital, or any of the hospitals where they do not have these restraints, do they use anaesthetics, more, or drugs of any sort, to control the patients ? A. Not more than they do elsewhere; they do use them there, but not to any greater extent than they do elsewhere. I fhink they probably use more at Utica, for I look upon that as cor. tabling more acute insane than any other institution in the State as a rule; but at Auburn and Flatbush they do not use any more restraint by medi- cines than in any other institution for the insane. By Mr. Goodwin : Q. What weight in your judgment, as Commissioner in Lunacy, familiar with the management of insane asylums in this State, what weight should be attached to the evidence of discharged employees and ex patients, in investigating the management of an asylum? A. I think every case would have to be judged on its own merits; I can conceive of an ex-patient, or an ex-attendant telling the truth ; but in general I should receive their testimony, naturally, with a cer- tain amount of allowance, until they proved to be credible. Q. (By Mr. Rice.) Would you receive the testimony of ex-attend- ants with that allowance ? Mr. Goodavin — I said " discharged " ex-attendants. A. The rule, in by far a large majority, I have investigated or been brought into contact with, have been prejudiced witnesses, and their statements have not proved to be reliable. 812 By Mr. Goodwin (resuming): Q. In reply to a question by the chairman, Mr. Haskell, in refer- ence to punishment inflicted by removing patients from one ward to another. You do not know that that system is practiced at Utica of your own personal knowledge, do you ? A. Well, I do not want to talk about "punishment" ; I do not believe in punishing the insane in any way. Q. I am not speaking in reference to " discipline " put " punish- ment," and the word "punishment" was used in his question in its broad sense, and I use it in that way, as it was put to you by the chairman ? A. Well I — my impressions are all very strong that in very many institutions that method of discipline is followed ; that is, patients generally aspire to be on the first Avard, what they call the first ward, they are generally very anxious to go there, and they understand that if they will preserve themselves in perfectly good order and con- dition, as against certain conditions that they are accustomed to, they may be changed, or that they are changed from the first ward to another, if there is an outbreak. Q. As Commissioner in Lunacy, upon an order of the Legislature you would have made a thorough investigation of this Hughes diffi- culty, or the Hughes accident at Utica, would you not ? A. I should have made it any way. Q. And you would have reported your conclusions to the Legis- lature ? A. Y es, sir; I should have investigated and reported. Q. Do you regard the investigation of asylums by a committee of investigation, rather than by the proper officer, to-wit, the Com- missioner in Lunacy, as beneficial, either to the asylum or the peo- ple? . A. I regard an investigation by the Legislature as greatly prefer- able. Q. Why do you regard it preferable ? A. Because I think the more the people, and their representatives, are brought in contact with asylums the better it is ; infinitely better; if there was an investigation every year, nothing could be lost, and I do not think popular feeling toward the asylums would be in the end damaged; I think the more people know about the inside of asylums, and asylum life, the better it will be for asylums, and for superintendents; I was very glad when I heard that a committee had been appointed, and I am very glad myself that they have taken the course they have in taking the testimony of ex-patients and ex- attendants. Adjourned until to-morrow afternoon at 3: 30 o'clock. 813 Albany, March 25, 1884, ) Room " B," New Capitol, j The committee met at 3 :30 p. m., pursuant to adjournment. Present—Messrs. Howe, Haskell, Olin and Brown; Mr. A. T. Goodwin, of counsel. Proceedings continued, as follows: Mr. Goodwin — Mr. Chairman, I desire to call the attention of the committee to an article which appeared in the Albany Evening Journal of Saturday, March 22, entitled the " Utica Asylum In- vestigation," and concluding " An inquiry into its abuses and man- agement," which purported to give a part of the testimony given by Dr. Yanderpoel at the meeting of the committee on Friday af- ternoon. While Dr. Yanderpoel was being examined Mr. Charles R. Sherlock, correspondent of the Syracuse Sunday Herald, was present, waiting examination. He was requested by me not to make public any matter which came to his hearing, and I would ask the stenographer if he gave to any one any information relative to what Dr. Yanderpoel testified to on that occasion ? The Stenographer — I gave no information of that kind to any person. The Chairman — In reply to the remarks made by Mr. Goodwin, the committee feel that it is a matter of great regret that any testi- mony taken should have been published in violation of the express resolution of the committee that all the testimony should be given to the public at the same time that the committee gave their report. EDWIN HUTGHINSON, Sworn and examined, testified as follows: By Mr. Goodwin: Q. What is your residence and occupation ? A. Utica ; I am a physician. Q. Of how long standing in your profession ? A. Twenty odd years; over twenty years. Q. Have you any hospital under your charge ? A. St. Elizabeth's Hospital, Utica. Q. Have you made the subject of hospital study a matter of special investigation ? A. I have. Q. State to the committee, if you please, your experience in the investigation of hospitals, both at home and abroad ? 814' A. I was stationed as a medical cadet in the general hospital for a year, from 1861 to 1862; I was on duty in 1863-4-5 as surgeon for the Second Division Hospital, Twentieth Army Corps, and for about a year of that time I had charge of that hospital; had charge of the Twentieth Army Hospital Corps, in Savannah, for some months; since 1866 I have been in charge of St. Elizabeth's Hospital, Utica. Q. Have you made any examination of hospitals abroad ? A. I have; I visited the principal hospitals in most of the cities of the continent, and I have visited the hospitals in many cities in this country; I have always been interested in the study of hospital management and hospital construction. Q. Have you visited the Utica Asylum ? A. I have, frequently. Q. During how many years have you been accustomed to so visit it ? A. During the last twenty years, I should say. Q. What has been the average number of your visits there in a year ? A. It would be impossible to say7; sometimes I would be as often as once a Aveek ; say from ten to fifty visits, perhaps, in a year; I went there any time I wanted to. Q. Have these visits been frequent within the last few years ? A. They have not within the past feAv years, during my invalidism; not so frequent as heretofore. Q. Have you inspected that building throughout ? A. 1 have. Q. Been in all its wards ? A. I have, over and over again. Q. What Avould you say as to its ventilation and sanitary con- dition ? A. I consider it the best ventilated public building of which I have any knowledge. Q. What have you to say in reference to the care and treatment of its patients ? A. So far as I have been able to judge by ray visits and inquiries, which have been frequent, and in many instances where I have had strong personal reasons to follow individual patients, I should say it was efficient and humane. Q. Have you any persons in the Asylum, as patients, in whom you have had an interest ? A. I have. Q. Have you had patients that have been placed in the Asylum ? A. I have. Q. State what, if any, complaints have ever been made by them to you in regard to their treatment while in the Asylum ? A. I never have had any person in whom I have been interested as a patient before entering the Asylum, and whom I have followed during the period of their treatment and imprisonment, complain in any way that I thought the, complaints were other than the com- plaints of a lunatic. 815 Q. What complaints have those been ? A. I do not recollect at this moment any particular complaint; it might occur to me in thinking over certain patients. Q. Have you ever heard any complaint in reference to the treat- ment of patients or attendants ? A. No; I do not remember any patient telling me of any cruelties received at the hands of attendants. Q. Have you ever noticed in any wards of that institution, at any time, a deficiency of heat ? A. Never; on the contrary it is the most uniformly warmed public hospital I have ever been in. The records, if you will allow me to state, not from personal knowledge, the records which have been kept and published, sIioav for months and for years as uniform a temperature through the various wards as would be found in any hot-house ; certainly vastly more regular and uniform than any public institution of which I know any thing. I know how difficult that is to do ; it is well known to be a difficult matter in our climate, the most variable climate in this latitude; in Utica we have the extremes — the cold extreme of Montreal, and the heat extreme of Philadelphia; it is most extraordinary there; the isothermal line runs down to Utica from Canada, and runs up from about Philadel- phia region. Q. State to the committee your impression of the character of the attendants ? A. I have known a great many attendants in and out of the Asylum ; they seem to me to be selected for their efficiency and steadiness of conduct, if I might describe it in this way ; I am familiar with men; 1 have had a large number of men under me, nurses, and these seemed to be steady men, and men of reliable dis- position and character as far as I can tell. Q. Have you examined into the food ? A. I have frequently. Q. How do you find it ? A. Good, plain, nourishing, well cooked. Q. In regard to the extra diet of that Asylum for the sick ; has your attention ever been called in that direction ? A. It has. Q. How do you find that ? A. Good, nourishing, and of good variety, especially well cooked ; the beef tea is the best I know any thing about; it is well made ; the things are well cooked; I have tasted them. Q. In reference to the medicines and stimulants, can you say any thing in reference to their quality and character of them — their efficiency for the purpose used ? A. I don't knoAV any thing about the medicines, except from the packages I have seen in the apothecary's shop; there would be no other way for me to tell, but I suppose they are of good quality; I think they almost necessarily must be ; and as to the stimulants, I can say that such as I have tasted has been, if I am allowed to speak 816 from general information—if I may state hearsay — I understand from them that they buy their liquors in a quantity and keep them; they undertake to give the sick, not new liquor, but old whisky, such as would not be apt to hurt them ; in other words, the quality of the stimulants would be good. Q. What position does Dr. Gray occupy in the profession as an alienist? A. He occupies a position at the head, or nearly at the head ; I know of none with a better reputation than he in this country. Q. Is he a man wTiose knowledge and experience is sought for by the profession ? A. He is. Q. Do you regard it as the duty of Dr. Gray to impart his knowl- edge to his profession and to the public generally, if by so doing it does not interfere Avith the management of the Asylum ? A. I most certainly do ; if I may be allowed to state, a man who has been placed in a position to acquire a large amount of valuable information which will aid his felloAV men, fellow citizens, and suf- ferers, I think he would be cruel indeed if he refused or declined on any pretext to give information which would be of service in the treatment of any desperate case. Q. How do you regard the assistant physicians, the medical staff of that Asylum, from your own knowledge of their character and ability ? A. From the first of my acquaintance I might mention some of those gentlemen, and the positions they have since occupied; I con- sider tnat the young men who have been connected with that insti- tution are unusually bright, humane and intelligent, and faithful men, well informed in their profession, and kind, I might say, in their duties ; one of the earliest men I knew was Dr. Cleveland, who is now at the head of the Hudson River Asylum ; another gen- tleman was Dr. Kellog, who is noAvprincipal assistant at the Hudson River Asylum ; another is Dr. Kempster, who was at the head of the asylum at Oshkosh, Wis.; another is Judson B. Andrews, at the head of the asylum at Buffalo; another is Dr. Smith, at the head, I think, of the Morristown Asylum at New Jersey. Q. Without spending any further time about that, how do you regard the management of the Asylum— Dr. Gray's management? A. I consider that institution wonderfully well managed. Mr. Goodwin — Mr. Chairman, will you examine Dr. Hutchin- son ? The Chairman—I have no questions to ask at present. By Mr. Haskell : Q. Are you able to state whether or not one of the wards, on any occasion, was too cold for comfort,—ward ten on the women's side of the Asylum ? A. I don't remember any thing of the kind, for I certainly don't know where number ten i6. 817 Q. All you intend to convey by your statement that the halls have always been properly warmed is in relation to those wards whose temperature your attention has been called to ? A. I stated more than that; I stated that the average temperature throughout the Asylum — that it was remarkably uniform. Q. Y"ou intended to convey by your statement about the tempera- ture of the halls that they had been properly warmed ; you intended it to apply to those wards to which your attention had been drawn, did you ? A. I intended to convey more than that. Q. You have testified generally that the attendants were reliable, and you have spoken about the manner in which they were em- ployed— what do you know about the manner in which attendants were employed there ? A. I did not say that; I said from the appearance of the men. Q. I ask yon then this questien : Do you know any thing about how the attendants were employed there in the institution, or have been employed in it during the past ten years ? A. I know how they have been employed when I have seen them in employment; when I have moved about the wards. Q. Do you know any thing about what examination is made of attendants to ascertain their fitness to fill the position? A. I don't know any thing about that; nothing whatever. Q. So that Avhat you have said in regard to the attendants is merely the impression you have formed in regard to their character from your personal observation ? A. Precisely ; that is the only thing I intended to convey, and as to those I was personally acquainted with. Q. How many of the attendants enjoyed the pleasure of your personal acquaintance ? A. I am not prepared to ansAver that question, because I think that is a proper question to ask the attendants, whether they took any pleasure in my acquaintance or not. By the Chairman : Q. Did you ever know an attendant named Reece there, some time ago ? « A. No, sir. Q. Do you know Mr. Weir, Mr. Bills, or Mr. Brown ? A. I do not. Q. Have you ever known an attendant named Buckley, who.was there some time ago ? A."I knoAV two Buckleys, but I don't know whether either of them were attendants. Q. There is a Buckley who keeps a grocery store at East Utica— Daniel Buckley ; do you know7 him ? A. I do not; I do not recollect him. Q. Were any of the patients Avhom you caused to be committed there at any time on ward four? 103 U 818 A. I don't know where ward four is. Q. It is one of the violent wards ; do you know whether any of those patients were on any of the violent wards ? A. No patient that I ever caused to be confined there was ever on any violent ward, that I remember. - By Mr. Haskell : Q. Do yon mean to say that you know so little of the institution that you do not even know the location of the wards by number? A. Humph ! what ? I mean to say — Q. That is a simple question and susceptible of a direct answer ? A. I don't know how the wards are numbered now, I used to know how they were numbered. Q. When did they change the arrangement of the numbers? A. I could not tell you. Q. Give us, as near as you can recollect, the date, or about the date, they changed the wards by their numbers ? A. I should say it was —I should say, well, let me see! it AA'as about five or seven years ago ; what I was taught to call Avard number eleven I believe was changed to ward number four ; I am guessing at it. Q. There is a good deal that you have given has been guess-work, has it not ? A. I don't think I have stated any guess-work. Q. None with the exception of this last information ? A. Not at all; you asked me a " catch question " and I answered it in my way. Q. Ytou say that five or seven years ago you were well enough acquainted v7i1.l1 the institution so that you could name the location of the wards by their numbers ? A. I did not say that; I say that five or seven years ago I could remember that the violent ward was called No. 11 (eleven); I have since been informed that it is called No. 4. Q. Was that the only ward you kneAV the location of by its number ? A. That is the only ward I can remember the location of by number. Q. So tha. >u never were familiar enough with the institution yourself to know the location of the wards by their numbers ? A. I have known the location of the wards by the numbers, but I have forgott n them ; I could not give them to you now ; neither can I tell you of all the changes that have been made. Q. I did not ask you to give the numbers; my question is this: were you ever so familiar with the institution as to know the wards ? A. A number of years ago I should say that I was. Q. About how many ? A. I should say that I suppose I knew the number of many of the wards from five to seven years ago, when I went there more fre- quently than now. 819 r Q. Then for the last five or seven years you have not been very familiar with the institution ? A. With the numbers of the wards I mean ; I beg your pardon, I have been there very often, but as to just how often' is a matter which I would not care about any more than the number of the pa- tients. Q. Then for the last five or seven years you have been very familiar with the institution ? A. I have been there very frequently. Q. Then for the last five years you have been very familiar with the institution ? A. I have been very familiar with very many thin-;' about it. Q. Please specify the things you have been familiar with ? A. I have been very familiar with the physicians; with the ad- mission of patients ; I have admitted a great many patients, that is — I have been there when they were admitted, I mear. Q. Y ou have been familiar with the physicians and methods of attendance of patients ; what else have you been familiar with during the last five or seven years ? A. I don't know what information you wish to ge'; and I don't know how to answer the question. Q. Have you been familiar with any other features of the institu- tion than those you have mentioned, during^the past five or seA en years; if so, please state what ? A. Only so far as my attention has been called during my visits to the Asylum, and walking about it, like any professional visitor. Q. At this time — five or seven years ago — were there any features of the institution that you were more familiar wTth than you have been during the last few years ? A. Yres, sir. Q. What features are those ? A. In regard to the details of its management ; in regard to the heating, the steam apparatus, and the arrangements of its ventilation. Q. And for how long a period w7ere you familiar with the heating apparatus of the institution ? A. I think that was about oue of the first things I paid attention to ; I suppose about ten years ago, but that is a matter of indistinct recollection. Q. Then for a period of about three years you were very familiar with the steam-heating apparatus ? A. I won't state that in that way. Q. We will pass that then; what other feature have you been familiar with during the period you name of five or seven years ago ? A. Medication of patients, in regard to remedies that they were taking. Q. Can you specify somewhat in regard to the remedies they were taking ? A. I was particularly interested at the time in the use of bromide [820 of potassium, when it was used with great effect to quiet restlessness and procure sleep. Q. Can you mention any other remedy that you were familiar with ? A. Yres, sir; I was familiar Avith the use, in the Asylum, of hydrate of chloral, for instance, which has been used with great effect to quiet maniacal excitement. Q. Can you mention any other matter ? A. I was familiar with the experiments Avhich were tried in the use. of carbolic acid, when that Avas a new remedy introduced to the profession and to the world. Q. When was that, if you can state the year? A. It was about 1869 or 1870; I cannot tell you positively. Q. Can you specify any other one, any other remedy that you were familiar with ? A. Do you mean any remedy that I was familiar with — any sub- ject that they were investigating, do you mean ? Q. Do you fail to understand the inquiry ? A. I do, precisely ; yes, sir. Q. Then, passing the subject of what other remedies used there you were familiar with — what other feature connected with the in- stitution have you been familiar with during the last fiwe years? A. You are pinning me down to some hypothetical three years. Q. You made the division of three years yourself ; you mentioned your familiarity during the past few years, and you stated as to your familiarity wdth the institution about five or seven years past; you have stated that there were other things you Avere familiar with; now, I w7ant to get at what those other things are ? A. My distinct answer was that when I first commenced my familiar visits at the Asylum, I went there frequently, and I informed myself as to methods of ventilation, and methods of management, cooking, heating, methods of painting, and all those details of hospital work, Avhich interested me very much; after you have learned how a building is ventilated, you can see how uniform it is kept by watching the thermometer. Q. On what wards have you watched the thermometer ? A. I have watched it by those tables. I did not say that I ac- tually watched the thermometer; I have seen the tables and records of the average temperature. If the steam pipes had broken in one of the wards or it was torn up and no patients there, that would be cold perhaps ; I would not expect it to be very hot. Q. Was there any occurrence of that kind that you recollect ? A. I never knew any thing of the kind ; I have seen wards torn up and no patients there. Q. Then why did you suggest the breaking of steam pipes ? A. Because you called my attention to some ward which was sup- posed to be cold. Mr. Goodavin — Is there any thing else, doctor, that you desire to state about; well I will ask you another question. 821 By Mr. Goodwin : Q. You told me in your examination that you regarded Dr. Gray as an eminent alienist, and one that the profession were entitled to his services, if consistent with his duties as superintendent, as I understand you? A. I believe that to be the case. Q. Do you know that Dr. Gray has been called frequently to prominent men, in their extremity, by their physicians ? A. I do knoAV that he has been so called. Q. Do you regard it as his duty to give his knowledge and infor- mation under such circumstances? A. I do. Q. What do you say as to the advisability of his lecturing at col- leges, with the consent of the board of managers ? A. I think it is his duty to lecture, if he understands the subject and is well informed, as 1 think he is and does ; he should spare a few weeks in the winter to devote to that matter. Q. Why? A. Because he instructs large numbers of young men who are to become physicians, and who are to go all over the country; those physicians are to see the insane of the future, and it is right and proper that they should be properly instructed ; and I know of no man more capable to instruct them than he. By Mr. Haskell : Q. In your judgment how much of Dr. Gray's time does he owe to the institution of which he is superintendent? A. I can say this, sir — Q" Please answer the question? A. I am going to answer it very deliberately and carefully; I can say that in my deliberate judgment, as a man who has been connec- ted with institutions more or less, that the longer experience Dr. Gray has in this particular Asylum, the less time will it take him to transact the ordinary routine business. I should say that a very feAV hours of the day would be all that was necessary for that par- ticular man to give to his duties, and have them thoroughly and per- fectly done. Q. Then I understand, that in your judgment you regard it that only a very few hours every day is all that is necessary to be given on the part of Dr. Gray in the attention to the institution as super- intendent ? A. Now you see hoAV easy it fs to be misunderstood; I said —his personal attention to the ordinary duties and details of that institu- tion ; I think a few hours a day in the morning would be all that is necessary for him to attend to it, personally, as you would under- stand if you knew any thing about institutions. He could receive and read the reports of the doctors, steward, cook, book-keeper, and the various officers; I do not mean that he should forget it imme- diately after. 822 Q. And as soon as he has spent those few hours that are neces- sary, in your opinion, to perform his duties — as soon as he has done that, and looked over these reports, after that, in your judgment, his time should be devoted to his pri\7ate practice ? A. Do you put that question in my mouth ? Q. I put the question in order that yon may answer it yes or no. A. I do not like to answer any such question as that, and I will answer it no, but 1 do not think it is a fair question. Q. What would you say in regard to what the doctor should do with the rest of the day after he has used the three or four hours that was necessary to examine the reports, etc., as you have speci- fied ? A. I do not undertake to include all the duties of Dr. Gray; I would leave the duties of Dr. Gray entirely with Dr. Gray; if there were patients to be seen, or part of the building to be inspected, or any letters to be written, or other affairs to be attended to, I should suppose Dr. Gray would know enough to attend to them. Q. Then with regard to Dr. Gray you would make him "A law unto himself " ? A. I most undoubtedly would in regard to the matters of his ju- risdiction and executive function, and I don't see how you can help doing so. Q. And whatever course Dr. Gray took as to attending private patients, being an expert witness for compensation in private law- suits between individuals, giving lectures upon the subject of in- sanity, and matters of that kind, you would consider right, because of your implicit faith in Dr. Gray's good judgment ? A. I will answer that by saying that Dr. Gray never has given me any cause to doubt his good conduct and faithfulness, and I would say certainly I would let him do just what he saw fit, and use his judgment in any such matters. Q. I will repeat the question, and please answer it, if you have any answer to make to it, either yes or no. Whatever course Dr. Gray took as to attending private patients, being an expert witness for compensation in a private lawsuit between individuals, giving lectures upon the subject of insanity, and matters of that kind, you would consider right, because of your implicit faith in Dr. Gray's good judgment? A. If I have to answer that yes or no, I will answer it yes. Q. Do you desire to add any thing to your answer, or qualify it in any way ? A. In a general way I will say that I have that confidence in Dr. Gray, as I have ansAvered (if I have answered it fairly), so that I would trust him not to neglect the interests of the State in any mat- ter which it ma} be his duty to attend to; that he would not neg- lect that duty and attend to so-called practice of a private character, although I do not consider it private; I am not employed to eulogize Dr. Gray, of course, but T have a very high opinion of him. Q. Have you added every thing to your answer that you desire to ? m A. I do not care to add any thing further, if you want to know any thing further. Q. Do you think that Dr. Gray has the right to absent himself from-the institution, and attend his private practice, or as an expert witness in private lawsuits without first obtaining the consent of the board of managers ? A. Will you give me an instance ? Q. I have asked you for your opinion in that respect ? A. Well, in answer to the first part of that double question I still say that I do not think that Dr. Gray has any private practice ; in the second place I do not know of his ever leaving the Asylum to attend to a private laAvsnit; and if he did on any hypothetical or real cause, I would want to hear the case and then tell whether or not I thought he was justified in going without first consulting his board. Q. My question is this: Do ynu think that Dr. Gray has the right to absent himself from the institution and attend his private practice, or as an expert in private laAvsuits, without first obtaining the consent of the board of managers ? A. I cannot answer that question on a hypothetical case ; if you give me any case I will answer it on the merits of the case; I can imagine a case where he could go without asking anybody. Q. Either with or without consont, you mean ? A. His judgment would be enough ; if it was a matter of life or death ; if it was a matter of serving you, Mr. Haskell, for instance, I should think that he ought to do it, perhaps. Q. Perhaps? A. It would depend altogether upon the case ; if it was a trivial case, I should say no; if it was a matter involving life or death, I should say yes. Q. Then where there was time to submit the question to the board of managers, you would regard it as Dr. Gray's duty to do so before leaving the institution ? A. That depends upon the rules of the Asylum; I am not one of the board of managers, and I don't know what the rules are ; I do not consider myself as a competent judge in that matter; one of the managers would answer that question. Q. i ou referred in an answer to my question a few minutes ago, that from your experience with such institutions, etc.— what institu- tions have you been familiar with or had experience in ? A. I have not had any experience in an institution of this character. Q. I will ask the stenographer to read your testimony in that respect ? [The testimony was read.] Witness — I did not refer to institutions ot this character. Q. That is, no institutions for the care of the insane ? A. No, sir; never; not of that kind. Q. And no other institutions other than those you [mentioned at the commencement of your direct examination ? A. No, sir; not that I remember of. s . , 824 By Mr. Goodwin : Q. Your confidence in Dr. Gray is such that you do not believe he w7ould violate any duty imposed upon him by law, or by the rules and regulations of the Asylum ? A. I do not believe he would, after a long acquaintance with him. Dr. WILLIS E. FORD, Sworn and examined, testified as follows: By Mr. Goodwin : Q. Where do you reside, and what is your business? A. I reside at Utica, and am a physician. Q. Where did you graduate as physician ? A. University of the City of New York. Q. State what positions you held previous to coming to Utica to reside ? A. I was demonstrator of anatomy; I resigned that to take a po- sition in the Charity hospital, where I served until the term of ser- vice was up, and came from there to the Asylum at Utica; I came from there to Utica along in the summer of 1873. Q. How7 long did you remain there ? A. I think it was in the first of 1879. Q. You were there from 1873 to 1879 ? A. Yes, sir; almost six years. Q. In what capacity ? A. Assistant physician. Q. Did you commence being fourth assistant ? A. No, sir; I was third assistant physician. Q. When you resigned what position did you occupy? A. I wras second assistant physician. Q. State what were your duties as assistant physician in that Asylum ? A. My duties were to carry out the rules of the institution as laid down by the book of rules, and to execute the directions given me by the superintendent. Q. How much time was spent on the wards usually ? A. By me ? Q. Yes. A. At first pretty much all the time from daylight until dark for a number of months, until I knew intimately the names and char- acteristics of the patients and names of their friends of all the cases on one side of the house where I was; on the men's side. Q. By whom w7ere you instructed as to the cases and character of cases ? A. I was told about them by the superintendent and the assistant physician who was with him. 825 Q. State what you did as a physician in reference to your inter- course with patients under your direction ? A. I visited them, all of them, daily; I prescribed for the sick; I looked at their—to see they were properly cared for, their cloth- ing and general appearance; it was my duty to see that the ward was properly cared for and clean; bedding prepared, and pretty much every thing that would pertain to the comfort and welfare of a patient in that building. Q. Did you examine into complaints made to you by patients ? A. I did, daily. Q. Complaints in reference to treatment by attendants ? A. Yes, sir, and all sorts of complaints ; sometimes they included complaints against attendants, sometimes against each other; some- times against the physician, sometimes against somebody outside— all sorts of complaints. Q. Did you converse with the attendants and supervisors in ref- erence to their duties ? A. I did ; I instructed new attendants; I gave directions to the supervisors regarding duties of attendants under them; that was part of my duty. Q. Was it a part of your duty to observe the conduct of attendants toward patients? A. It was. Q. And to inquire into the complaints made by patients of attend- ants? A. Yes, sir, it was my duty to do so. Q. What is the usual time that an attendant is upon the ward in that institution —that is, the daily hours? A. He is on duty for the twenty-four hours of the day, excepting once a month he has a half day out, and two evenings a week, he ' has the evening from a little after six until ten o'clock, and except- ing the time that he is out on Sunday, or Avhen he was excused for some special reason. Q. Have you heard attendants make any complaint in reference to the length of their hours on duty ? A. I don't now recollect that I have; I presume I have, but don't recollect it. Q. Do you regard their time of duty too long? A. No, judging from my experience with the result of that duty upon the men. Q. Do you think they receive sufficient wages ? A. No, sir, I don't think they do — well, 1 don't know — I don't think they do, perhaps, from my standpoint of wages it is on a slid- ing scale— they don't get paid as much as I pay my men that take care of my horses. Q. You have kept up your knowledge of the Asylum since you left it ? A. I have. 104 U 826, Q. What wps the character and capacity of the assistant physi- cians ? A. Since the time I left there they were men of uniform charac- ter and judgmer'", and would rank among physicians as good physi- cians. Q. Was tha'; * he character of physicians during your stay there ? A. Yes, sir, I Hink it was; there were some physicians that were thought to be better than others, of course; but I mean to say I never knew an instance in which there was a physician on the staff who was not a gentleman, a man of character, and a man of good attainments. Q. State what conferences or reports, if any, they made to the su- perintendent daily ? A. Our talk with him was constant, fifty times a day sometimes, sometimes not once a day; well, I don't believe there was ever an instance of that, but I will say it was constant, we talked of it as men do in a family about a thing that interests them. Q. What do the case-books and clinical records of that Asylum contain ? A. They contain pretty much every thing regarding the physical and mental state of patients; regarding their actions and their condi- tions while in the Asylum ; regarding their habits as to neatness, their violence or quietness; where he was each day he was in the house ; where he went to when he was removed from one ward to another; what became of him, where he went to, and how he went away Avhen he went out of the Asylum. Q. They contain a full and complete history of the cases ? A. They do ; very full. Q. State the knowledge of the superintendent as to the cases in the Asylum ? A. I think he had an intimate knowledge of them; more so than any physician ever possesses of patients perhaps in private practice; I should say very intimate knowledge. Q. Are you acquainted with the records of accidents and injuries kept in the Asylum at Utica ? A. I am. Q. State the manner in which these books are kept? A. The book as to what ? Q. As to injuries sustained by the patients ? A. They are charged from time to time; the supervisor keeps the record. Q. What was the object and purpose of that book ? A. In order that the physicians may be certain that the attend- ants are aware of what is going on and report to the physicians; it is not part of the record proper that is kept in the office, but is kept to have the physicians know every thing that goes on in the ward; this book is to show that the attendants and supervisors are up to their duty and alive to Avhat is going on among the men, and that they know whenever any thing does happen. 827 r>'■■■ ..... - Q. How does this record compare in completeness and fullness with the records of other asylums ? A. I have examined the records of other asylums; this Asylum differs in its character from other asylums, and the records are more voluminous than in other asylums, because of the character of cases. Q. How does it differ from other asylums ? A. In that it receives acute cases only, or mainly, that it is more of a curative institution than as a receptacle ; and that patients who do not get well do not remain' there, but are transferred according to the provisions of law regarding that subject, and there are there- fore a great number of changes occur in the conditions of patients; there is a larger proportion of mania — violent mania than in asy- lums, necessarily, where chronic cases are kept; they have to keep a record of the first few months more fully, and it occupies a great deal of space, for it is a medical record mainly. Q. What restraints were used in the Asylum while you were a physician there ? A. There were two general forms of restraint, you might say three; if an epileptic was liable to strike suddenly he would be allowed his liberty perfectly when the paroxysm was coining on him or was on him ; then a belt of leather was put about his waist and his arms were secured by a pair of cuffs fastened so that he could not get far enough away from his body with his fist so as to injure anybody; that was the most common form of restraint; another was used when a man tore his clothing, or denuded his person, or performed acts of inde- cency upon his person; it was rarely I think during my time; it was entirely discarded, that is, the use of what is called a muff which is an encasement for the finger, so that a man could not reach his per- son with his fingers ; those were rare ; I suppose one man in three hundred would be in it during the day or part of the day; that does not include a form of restraint used among women mainly and al- most entirely to protect them against indecent exposures of the per- son and mutilations of the person, which is more common among women than men ; that form of restraint consisted of a waist with sleeves that run into each other; that is, the sleeves Avere attached at the ends; that was not very common but it was necessary sometimes. Q. Were these instruments of restraint cruel in their construction or use? A. I never knew a man to suffer in his person or mind particu- larly from them. Q. Was there any thing in the construction of any of these instru- ments which would cause pain to the patient in the application of them? A. No, sir; if they did cause pain by reason of the condition of the patient, if a man said they were causing pain, they were removed, but I don't think it ever did give pain to any man; I don't remem- ber a case. Q. Was it a frequent cause of complaint among the patients that the instruments of restraint were painful to them ? 828 A. JNo, sir, it was not; a man who was in a condition to'frequire such a thing was also in a condition not to mind the mental effect; he was not chagrined by it, and it never gave bodily harm. Q. Will you be kind enough to give the committee your views in reference to the crib used in that Asylum ? A. In my service it Avas used for medical purposes entirely; it was used to keep sick people from standing up in the night, or pre- venting the necessity of being held by an attendant to keep them in a recumbent posture, men and women to whom such a position would be detrimental to their recovery or dangerous to their life; there are certain conditions in which a man or Avoman will stand up day and night, unless absolutely obliged to lie down, and never would lie down until he or she felt exhausted; and, as a means of securing rest, it is used; that is the only means I ever saw that was free from objection; I think it is free from objection or even criticism. Q Are there any other institutions in Avhich the crib is used now ? A. St. Elizabeth's Hospital in our city has one, and many hospitals have them ; I don't think we had one in Charity Hospital; I think they have them in most asylums ; I have seen them in most. Q. You are the medical director of St. Luke's Hospital at Utica ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And haAre been for some years ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Have you such a thing in your hospital ? A. No, sir; we cannot afford it; we Avould like one very well, but we are a pretty poor hospital; I think they are generally in use in insane asylums, and in some they are not. By Mr. Haskell : Q. I would like to knoAV what asylums they are in if you can give them? A. I am not so familiar with asylums noAv as I used to be some years back; I think they have them at Poughkeepsie and NeAv York, and on Ward's island ; I am not certain whether they use them now or not; I do not think they do, noAv. Q. In any of the asylums you have mentioned ? tA. I think at Poughkeepsie they do; but at the asylum in New York I don't think they do; I know what the sentiment of men who conduct these asylums is on the question, but as to their special practice I cannot say; I know what they say about such a thing; what they teach and believe. Q. Then you don't wish to say positively that they are used in any other asylum bnt Utica ? A. Yes, sir ; I will say they are used at Poughkeepsie; I am sure that they are used at Ovid, and I think they are used up in the Rome Insane Asylum, the county asylum; I presume 1 could think of a number of places where I have seen them. 829^ By Mr. Goodwin (resuming) : Q. State what kind of mattress was put in the crib bed while you were in the Asylum? A. Every bed was made alike, pretty much — a straw tick with a hair mattress over it. Q. Was that mattress kept on the crib day and night i A. No, sir; not always, and I don't know as I can say generally; it depends whether it w7as filthy or not. Q. And if it was filthy; was the character of the mattress the same in the day as in the night ? A. If there was any in the bed at all it would be; if it was ar- ranged at all the bed was arranged in the morning, as the man slept in it at night. Q. There would be no change of the mattress at night before the patient was put to bed ? A. No, sir. Q. I mean in its character and quality ? A. No, sir; we had not mattresses to change in that way. Q. Did yon ever knoAV a straw bed, simply, to be placed in the crib at night when the patient was put into it, and the next morn- ing, after she was taken out, that a different quality of mattress wras placed in the crib for the inspection of visitors? A. No, sir; nothing of that sort was ever done; this straw was changed daily; it was the business of one man to take this mat- tress out, and put in neAv straw and bring the ticks in; that was done daily ;the beds were left until that was done; when the bed was made up it was made up to stay; those that were not made up at all, simply the bedstead stood there. Q. You are acquainted with the heating and ventilation, bath- tubs, water-closets, etc., of that Asylum ? A. Yes, sir; I was. Q."What Avas their condition when you were there? A/ They Avere in a state of good hygiene. Q. Do you knoAV of any ward in that Asylum where a patient suffered from cold ? A. No, sir, there was never a ward in that Asylum inhabited by patients that was not heated to at least seventy degrees; it was my business to see that it was; it was my duty to see what the tem- perature actually was. Q. Did you ever find in any of your visitations upon the ward the temperature too low for the comfort and health of its inmates ? A. Not tor the health ; there are conditions of insanity in which coldness of the extremities is the characteristic physical sign, and in which the sense of coldness about the feet lasts for days; that is specially so among old and feeble men ; we had a ward for these men, which is now there with registers directly under the chairs, where they were heated warmer than seventy degrees a good deal; as warm as their health would permit; but the wards were kept. 830 seventy degrees and seventy-two degrees, and were warmer than well men would ever want them. t, Q. How in reference to the quality, quantity and distribution of the food of the institution ? A. The quantity was sufficient, I think, on all occasions; the quality, as it was generally served to the inmates, was plain and sub- stantial, and cooked nicely and clean, and of sufficient variety to insure health; in cases of sickness sometimes—ahvays 1 might say — the diet was prescribed directly by a physician and cooked by a special cook, kept for that purpose, and administered to the patient directly from the kitchen. Q. Now in regard to the business management of the Asylum; do you know any thing about that ? A. I was more or less familiar with it. Q. In your judgment should the superintendent be supreme in the management? A. Of the business affairs ? Q. Of the business and the medical ? A. I think so as a necessity. Q. And he should have the appointment and dismissal of all attendants ? A. Yes, sir ; that is a necessity for good government. Q. Should there be, in your judgment, a divided responsibility of any kind, and would that be satisfactory ? A. I cannot think of any kind of division that would work har- moniously in a large institution. Q. Be kind enough to state to the committee why you think there should be an undivided administration of the medical and business departments of the Asylum ? A. Because in the administration of affairs there are necessarily some complaints, aud some things to be righted, some things to be obtained, certain things to be changed, and it is necessary that 6ome one person should have the responsibility in order that people gener- ally may knoAV where the responsibility rests, so that there shall be no attempt to shirk responsibility from the shoulders of one person to another, or avoid any certain duties, because it is the duty of another to do it, and because also to secure the ready and rapid ad- ministration of affairs, one man should have that authority, which he may delegate if he chooses, but with him must rest the ultimate re- sponsibility. Q. Was Dr. Gray familiar with the cases in the Asylum while you were an officer ? A. Yes, sir, he was familiar with the cases of the patients. Q. Did he visit the wards ? A. He did. Q. How often ? A. I do not know ; as often as the physician asked him; I think there was a rule about it; I only had charge of one side at the time; I could only speak of one side, that I had charge of; Dr. Gray used 831 to come in with me and make a complete round of the building at regular intervals and on his own responsibility see sick people, and sometimes without my knowledge he has gone and I have seen him there; met him on the ward. Q. With a competent staff, such as you have described as being always at^ the Asylum, to your knowledge how frequently should the superintendent in your judgment visit the wards ? A. Frequently enough to keep himself familiar with the medical aspects of the cases, and also their general character and form. Q. How often is it necessary for him to see -chronic cases ? A. Unless there is some question comes up as to their discharge, or their fitness for transfer or discharge, I should say it is not neces- sary for him to see them. Q. I believe you have answered as to the necessary time that__or the necessity of seeing acute patients whenever, in his judgment such cases demands his attention ? A. I don't know as I did make that statement, but I will make such a statement, that in cases of critical illness, cases of unusual importance as to the life of an individual, I think it is his duty to see such persons oftener than chronic cases or such as the ordinary run of patients; and I will say that he did so see such people. Q. Now, doctor, what is your o;union of the general management' of Dr. Gray of the Utica Asylum ? A. I think it is characterized by sagacity more than is ordinarily seen; in the management of his affairs as an executive officer, as I compare him with other men, his executive ability is remarkable, and his foresight — his foresight — his ability to see what is going to happen, and provide for emergencies is rather beyond that of men ordinarily. Q. Is Dr. Gray a worker ? A. He is a very hard worker. Q. What is his capacity, doctor, for work ? A. Well, he is a very steady worker, he works all the while; when pushed he will accomplish a great amount of work, very great, in a | short space of time; his executive qualities — his qualities as an exec- ; utive officer — he is very prompt, he decides at once ; he has his f work so systematized as shall make things pass off smoothly without being obliged to attend to every detail every day. Q. Is he quick or slow in his judgment and comprehension ? A. You mean as a physician ? Q. Yes. A. As a physician ? [. Q. Yes. ' A. He has very fine powers of diagnosis ; I don't know that he is ,,'. quick ; I never saAV him pass a snap judgment on a sick person ; Jbut j he is usually correct. Q. How is he in his administrative capacity as to judgment ? t. A. Well, he is a man of good judgment; as I said before his exec- 832 utive abilities were rather remarkable as I compare him, as I have had opportunity, with other men. Q. What is your opinion of Dr. Gray as an alienist ? A. Do you mean as to what his reputation among physicians is as an alienist? Q. I ask your own opinion first. A. My opinion is that he is an alienist of the first rank. Q. How is he regarded by the profession ? A. I think he is so regarded by the profession, almost univer- sally. Q. Now, doctor, are his services valuable to the public in a sense wider than the simple care of an asylum ? A. They have been, and I believe they are now. Q. Has he been called by prominent men in their extremity at the request of their physicians in obscure cases ? A. Not always prominent men; he has been called. Q. Has he been called by prominent men? A. Yes, sir; do you mean by prominent men as physicians in con- sultation, or to see men in conference ? Q. I mean by physicians to see their patients in obscure cases ? A. Yes, sir, that is true. Q. What is your opinion in regard to his duty to his profession and the public in reference to seeing such cases under consent of the board of managers ? A. I have always considered it his duty ; I so advised him Avhen he was there; I often advised him to go when he thought he ought not to go, or that he would rather not; that was a matter of dis- cussion between us when I was there. Q. (By Mr. Haskell. ) What was a matter of discussion ? A. As to whether Dr. Gray should answer summonses for consul- tation in cases of great peril. Q. And in what respect ? A. As to whether it was not a question that he — as to whether he owed it as his duty to the man, or wdiether he considered it his moral duty to aid men in an extremity. Q. Now, doctor, in reference to his lecturing under the consent and direction of his board of managers ? A. I thought it a proper thing to do—a proper thing to the public. Q. What is the effect of a man of his position imparting his knowledge to a class of medical gentlemen ? A. The class of those who are able to teach this branch of medi- cine is very small; it never has been taught until the last five or six years in any college; necessarily, if that special branch was to be taught, the teachers of it must be drawn from this small, limited class of men who have had experience in the practical management of insane people, there being no others; I believe it was his duty ; 833 that he had not any choice in the matter; that it was a public ser- vice. Q. What did the profession think of his duty in that regard? A. I never have heard it criticised. Q. I ask you now in reference to the condition of memory in con- valescent patients ? A. The memory of their acts while insane? Q. Yes, and carrying them from their insane condition into.their convalescent and discharged condition, if I may so speak ? A. I think they always carry impressions, disagreeable impres- sions ; if the character of-the insanity is of a violent acute type, they very rarely retain very much impression of what goes on during the acute illness ; if it is of a slower type they do, and they correct their impressions — as they get well — they correct their erroneous im- pressions very largely by their judgment, I think, as we all do ; but I think disagreeable impressions always cling to men if they have a memory of their illness, especially regarding definite delusions, unless they are absolutely corrected by a good judgment. Q. Do you mean that a patient who has been suffering with a delusion, and is very quickly and rapidly cured, whether that delu- sion is apt to leave some impression on his mind after he is fully cured ? A. I think it does if he retains any memory; for certain acute cases it is like a delirium, and the memory is but a dream, at best; not better than the memory of a dream. Q. But he remembers his delusion ? A. He usually remembers his delusion. Q. (By Mr. Haskell.) As a reality? A. There are a certain class of cases of acute delirium where the patient does not remember any thing at all; it is absolutely blank from here to here; these men very seldom have fixed delusions; men with fixed delusions have a sloAver form of insanity — a sub- acute, chronic insanity; they remember, and that delusion will cling to them, but they corrected it as they got well by their judgment, by knoAving that such a thing could not be possible, but it remains as an impression a long time. Q. I want to ask you your opinion in reference to delusions of patients in the use of anaesthetics for improper purposes, whether that is an uncommon delusion ? A. No, sir; that is a very common delusion; electricity, spiritu- alism and anaesthetics are probably the things that more insane peo- ple talk about than all other things combined — spiritualism, elec- tricity and anaesthetics — things they cannot see and don't know much about. Q. Doctor, is it possible to etherize a person while asleep ? A. No, sir; it is not. 105 U 834 Q. How is it in reference to chloroform ? A. It cannot be done. Q. It cannot be given at all during sleep ? A. No, sir; I wish to say in qualification of that, that it used to be thought possible; I think there are some men who even now think it possible; there has been a good deal of literature within the past six months; when it was tried in the New York Infant Asylum a large number of such experiments were made, and none wTere fully established ; it was established that it could not be done. By Mr. Haskell: Q. Are you aware that successful results of administering chlori- form to persons when asleep have been performed within the last few months? A. I am not aware that it has been done; I am aware of the literature on the subject. Q. Does the literature on the subject state that it has been done? A. There are certain cases reported, Q. And you don't believe them ? A. No, sir; it is not a generally believed impression. Q. Have you ever made any experiments yourself, personally? A. I have given chloroform and ether very often. Q. To persons Avhen asleep; have you ever attempted to put a person under the influence of chloroform when they were asleep. A. No, sir; but I am familiar with the physiological effects of chloroform on persons. Q. I simply ask the question whether you have or not. You base your belief on your knowledge of the physiological effect of the drug? A. Yes, sir. By Mr. Goodwin (resuming): Q. What weight, in your judgment, should be attached to the evi- dence of ex-patients in an asylum investigation ? A. If a patient is recovered, those things which they remember they can testify to as well as I can. Those that are not recovered patients, of course, it is a difficult matter to separate their delusions from their facts ; they have some facts and a good many delusions. Q. What degree of confidence should be given to the testimony of ex patients, in reference to the treatment which they have received while insane — personal treatment ? A. I Avould make the same answer; that if a person was well re- covered, he could testify upon the things that he Avell remembered; if he Avas not recovered of course he would give you his delusions, that is all; sometimes it would require an expert to get his delusion out of him or to know Avhether it was a delusion or not. Q. What effect, in your judgment, would the publishing of irrele- vant, unheeded testimony — (tending to criminate the Asylum) — evi- dence disregarded by the committee in arriving at their conclusions, 835 have upon the public mind; would it be likely to excite the public mind and create distrust in the administration of State charities? A. You mean by your question, irrelevant testimony, what effect would it have ? . Q. Unheeded by the committee, irrelevant testimony ? A. Of a nature criminating the Asylum, do you mean ? The Chairman— I think you ought to limit it in that way. (The question was then amended as above by inserting the words in pa- rentheses.) A. I think the tendency Avould be to, of course, it must be, to cause unnecessary anxiety among those persons who have friends there, and to exclude from the benefits of Asylum treatment those whose condition need it. Q. Do you remember Daniel Buckley ? [see page 655 of the min- utes.] A. An attendant in the Asylum at one time — yes, I do. Q. Was he an attendant when you were there ? A. Yes, sir; he was there during my service. Q. In what capacity ? A. He was an under attendant; I think he was taking care of the dining-room. Q. What is the distinction between a dining-room man and another attendant ? A. The first attendant on the ward has charge of the ward and directs the under attendant; the next man to him is selected for his fitness to be next to the head attendant, and the other man has the dining-room to see to. Q. I read from the testimony of Buckley, page 655, of the printed testimony : "There was three of us and we had from twenty-four to thirty patients to look af^ter, or thereabouts; and those were the very worst class of patients; that is, they could not be got along Avith on the other halls; they would get Avorse and be moved from ward to ward, until they went to number thirteen, and that was the dead house ; they could not get along any further than that, and they were generally cured when they got there." Have you examined the records at my request as to the number of persons who died on the twelfth Avard, from March, 1873, to April, 1874, the timeAvhen Buck- ley was in the Asylum ? A. I have; I made a memorandum of that last evening at your request from the records that I knew to be correct when they were taken. Q. Hoav many deaths were recorded on that ward during that period ? A. Six from March, 1873, to April, 1874, inclusive. Q. Be kind enough to give the names ? A. II. S. Benson, he died March, 1873 ; a man died in May: his name was McCann ; one died in June; his name was E. Sullivan ; in July, J. G. Geib, and the ilext was in November, M. W. Heath, and the next in January, 1874, H. McCabe ; there was no death in February, March or April. 836 Q. These were all the deaths? A. Yes, sir. Q. What did these six men die of ? A. I can only testify tov the time I came there; I was not there in March, April and May, but beginning with September, when I came there and took charge of the men — there was no death in September or October, but in November a man by the name of Heath died. Q. Whatdid.hedieof? A. Uraemia, a form of kidney disease. Q. Any other deaths ? A. The only other death that came under my personal care was H. McCabe, AA'hodied of general paralysis of the insane; he was the only other man who did die on the ward after I took charge of the ward in September. Q. Have you also examined the records as to how many Avere transferred from that ward to other wards ? A. Yes, sir; it is part of this table I have read to you from. Q. Be kind enough to state the number of persons transferred, and when? A. In March. 1873, there was one man removed from this ward to No. 10, and one man died, which made four transfers on the ward; in April, 1873, there was one man removed to No. b> and two discharged, which made three removals in that month ; and in May there Avas one man removed to No. 4, one to No. 5, one to 7, one man to 10, and one man died, making five changes in that ward in that month ; in June one man was removed to No. 4, and four to No. 10, and two to No. 11, and one was discharged, and one died, making nine; in July there were tw7o removed to No. 10, two to No. 11, one discharged and one died, makiyg six ; in August one to No. 3, tAvo to No. 4, two to No. 8, one to No. 9, two to No. 1<>, making eight; in September there were two removed to No. 10, and one discharged, making three removals; in October one was removed to 4, and two to 8, tAvo to No. 10, one discharged and one died; in December there was one to No. 4, one to No. 7, two to No. 8, three to No. 10, and tAvo to No. 11, making nine; in Jan- uary, 1874, there Avere tAvo to No. 10, four discharged and one died, making seven; in February four to No. 10, one discharged, making five; in March there was one removed to No. 10 and one to No. 11, making two removals in that month ; in April there was one to No. 8 and two discharged, making three removals during the month ; that is the whole of this tabulated statement. [Statement marked Exhibit No. 22, J. H. M. offered in evidence and admitted. See Appendix.] Q. I send to you a statement from Mr. Buckley's testimony, at page 656 of the printed record: u I have seen patients choked with a towel sometimes. Q. How was that done ? A.I will show you; here is a towel; now I will show you if you will let me, etc., 837 etc." \reaa-tng the whole of the page]. Did you ever hear of any such instance as that ? A. No, sir, I never did. Q. Could such a thing as that happen in a ward of that kind, where it is said to have occurred, and no physician be aware of it ? A. I should think not; no, sir. Q. Do you recall an attendant by the name of Reece ? A. Do you want me to qualify that last answer? as to Avhether it is of my general knowledge of the institution, or because- of my knowledge of the insane ; I would like to state that the main reason is because that even though an attendant should conceal it, or attempt to conceal such a thing, there are patients all the while on that Avard who constantly report such things, and who would report every little tiling that goes on ; I do not think a ward is ever without a witness among the patients, and if such a suspicion is breathed by a patient, an investigation of the facts of the case is at once instituted. Q. Did it ever come to your knowledge or hearing while you were in the Asylum of any person being choked with a toAvel in that way ? A. Yes, sir, it has — that is — it has been — I have had a patient say they were choked — I have had a patient say that. Q. Did you make any investigations? A. I did. Q. What was the result of your investigation ? A. I cannot now recollect that it was ever proven to have oc- curred. Q. (By Mr. Haskell.) Or not to have occurred? A. I cannot recollect any instance in which it was not proven that it did not occur; I would like to say that in some cases I have recom- mended the discharge of attendants for A7arious things, that I con- sidered offenses, of course ; A. Yes, sir, D. H. Fonda & Co. Q. Do you know whether there is any similar house in Utica ? A. Y es, sir. Q. What house* A. J. H. Sheehan & Co., and Comstock Brothers. Q. They are wholesale dealers and jobbers ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do the firms of Sheehan & Co. and Comstock Brothers do sub- stantially the same kind of business ? 867 A. The character of the business would be the same; they solicit trade in the same way, although they sell liquors and we do not; and Comstocks sell groceries and we do not; but the drug part of the business is the same; we sell drugs and paints and glass, every thing that goes in the line. (Exhibit No. 10 shown to witness, being a bill of Butler & Ham- ilton's, June 1, 1883.) Q. Have you previously examined this bill now shown you ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Have you gone over it to ascertain in regard to the items, as to whether the goods named could be obtained at better prices ? A. I told Mr. Brown the other day when he called on behalf of the committee, and would say the same thing now, that the prin- cipal criticism of the items is that good judgment was not used, in my opinion, in making the purchases at retail Avhen the amount of purchases would entitle them to wholesale prices; that they have bought of small concerns instead of wholesale houses. Mr. Brown — Mr. Chairman, ask him if his firm supply any large institutions in this State ? Q. Has your house ever sold 'goods to any public institutions in this State ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Can you name any such institutions wbo have bought from you ? A. We have sold to Sing Sing prison and Dannemora prison ; we have also sold to the local public institutions here, Albany alms- house, the Albany hospital and St. Peter's hospital in the city. Q. Does your firm have any arrangements as to special prices with these institutions ? A. We consider institutions of that kind the same as we would consider any good concern that had capital to do business Avith, and able to pay; we give them the same prices, the same as we would give to a good merchant; we sell them just as cheap as we would sell to a merchant to sell over again ; Ave consider they are entitled to these prices, and have treated them in that way in the trade we have had. Q. Have you previously examined Exhibit No. 10 ? A. Yes, sir ; I have looked over this bill. Q. Are there any articles in that bill that come within your line of business ? , A. Yes, sir. Q. Please state such articles as you- sell of that character ? A. There is an article of " ten pounds sal nitre, fifteen cents per pound, and ten cents would be the price to a merchant; three dozen of shoe blacking at seventy-five cents per dozen, sixty cents would be the market price, we sell that article; one box of sapolio, six dozen, Ave sell that at $10 per gross; it is charged here $10.50 per gross; it is charged at seven shillings a dozen, and the jobbing price is $10 per gross ; the price is eighty-seven and one-half cents per dozen; the price per gross is [$10.50, and our price is $10 ; one dozen water-closet paper, $1.50; that price is correct; ten pounds sal soda at two and one-half cents ; price is correct; a carboy of mu- riatic acid at two and one-half cents per pound ; the price here would be two cents, but at two and a half cents it is a fair price, because it is at the owner's risk of breakage in forwarding; so that price is all straight; one case of salid oil, two dozen pints, $8.50 per dozen ; and we sell the best brand of salad oil equals two dozen pints, $8.50 per dozen ; and Ave sell the best brand of salad oil that I know of at $10 per case; this is $17 per case; the difference is between $10 and $17 ; the brand of oil is a standard brand ; I do not know any thing better than tha1,; it is called the " Antonio" brand; there are a variety of brands, but I do not know any thing that commands a higher price than this; there is one gallon of bay rum at $3, that is correct; there are some things here pretty cheap; there is a barrel of sperm oil ut $1.28 per gallon ; I think the time I looked it up oil was worth about $1.33, at that time, of the best grade. Q. (By M,-- ^rown. ) How did it range from that; how much lowrer price d'c: you have for sperm oil ? A. We only sold one grade; nothing but the best. Q. (By Mr. ^askell.) Are there etc., lower grades of sperm oil? A. Yes, sir. Q. And lower grades would be worth less ? A. Yes, sir; zhey run down to ten cents per gallon; gallon of castor oil at $1.50 ; jobbing price was $1.36 ; there is " coach body varnish," but I do not think that is one of the things; there would be a question of the quality of that; we sell a good grade of coach varnish for $1.60 per gallon; it is billed there at $2.75 ; but we have some that we sell at $2.50, and it runs up to as high as $5.00. Q. So that you are unable to tell whether it is excessive or not ? • A. No, sir; I cannot tell without knowing more about it. Cross-examined by Mr. Goodwin : t Q. Do you know any thing about the quality of those goods charged by Butler & Hamilton that you say are excessive, do you know them to be the same goods, for instance, to take " castor oil,"— do you know whether that is the same brand you would sell, that they sold at $1.50 ? J A I know they cannot sell any thing better than what we sell at $1.36. Q. In reference to "salad oil "'do you mean to say that there is no oil in the market that is worth $17 that you know any thing about? J J s A. I do not know any thing any better in the way of salad oil. Q. Do you know of any salad oil being worth more than $10 in the market ? A. No, sir, 1 do not. Q. "Sapolio" at $10.75, what do you say you would sell it at? A. It is billed at $10.50 per gross and the jobbing price is $10 per 869 Q. Are there any grades in reference to that ? A. Only one kind of sapolio. Q. So that the sapolio sold by Butler & Hamilton could not have been any better than you sell ? A. No, sir; it is the same thing; it is a copyright article. Q. Are all shoeblackings alike ? A. No, sir. Q. Is that the highest and best quality that you have — the differ- ence between seventy-five cents and sixty cents ? A. I don't know about that. Q. What I mean to say is, whether there is any shoeblacking worth more than sixty cents ? A. Yes, sir; there is shoeblacking worth $1 per dozen, according to the size. Q. How do you arrive at the fact that that charge for shoeblacking is excessive ? A. I would like to say to the committee I do not like to swear that these prices are excessive, I am only saying at what price 1 think they can be furnished ; not that it is excessive. Q. That is Avhat you are doing ? A. I explained and stated in the first part of my examination that these prices I do not consider excessive, considering the source from whence the goods were purchased, at retail. By the Chairman : Q. By that you mean purchased from retail dealers ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Considering they are purchased at retail, you consider they are reasonable retail prices ? A. Yes, sir ; I do not consider that any firm would be able to sell them cheaper at retail.. Q. Do you sell the State institutions which you have referred to similar articles at wholesale rates ? A. Yes, sir, we do ; now take Sing Sing prison, they pay a bill of $75 a month, we consider that a jobbing order. By Mr. Goodwin (resuming): Q. You state there are a large number of these articles that were reasonable in price ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do you mean by that, reasonable in a wholesale point of view ? A. There are some things charged just the same as we would have to charge for them. Q. What things are those generally ? A. Like washing soda, it is sold by the case, say one and a half cents per pound. Q. Never mind the prices ; just name the articles in the bill they sold just as cheaply as you would sell them ? 870 A. Sal soda, washing soda, muriatic acid, bottle of vaseline pomade sixteen cents ; that is wholesale price. Q. Have all the prices which you have criticised on that bill been high from a wholesale standpoint entirely ? A. All the prices all the way through ? Q. Yes, that you have criticised. A. Yes, sir. Q. And you have given me, in substance, the list of articles which you consider cheap, have you, or the character of the articles? A. Yes, sir. Q. (By Mr. Brown.) State whether or not your firm would not be willing to sell the Utica Asylum at the same prices you name here as the wholesale prices ? A. Yes, sir; should be very glad to furnish such orders at those wholesale prices I give. By the Chairman.: Q. Do you think other wholesale houses would do the same ? A. Yres, sir, if they paid promptly; any wholesale house would be able to sell them, all these prices I name. Q. At wholesale rates ? A. Yes, sir; Mr. Brown of the committee in whose custody the bills have been, says that the bill which is referred to by witness is one produced by Mr. Winston, one of the board of managers and referred to in his testimony. A bill marked "Exhibit No. 10a, J. H. M." shown to the witness. Q. Please state if the articles named in that bill are within your line of business ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do you recognize the name of the seller ? A. Yes, sir. Q. E. R. Squibbs & Co. ? A. Yes, sir. Q. That is a well-known name as a manufacturer and wholesale seller ? A. As a manufacturer and seller of his own specialties. Q. Do you deal in these specialties ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do you sell them to State institutions ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Please state whether any prices there given are higher or lower than yon give to similar institutions ? A. In buying Squibbs' goods, in buying certain articles they have used good judgment in ordering direct from him ; thev purchase them as cheaply as any wholesale druggist could buy them ; and they obtain the best discount on the articles there; ten per cent is de- ducted, and they are bottom prices. Q. Is there any thing in that bill that is excessive in your judg- ment? 871 A. There are several articles that could have been purchased cheaper elsewhere. Q. But not Squibbs' articles ? A. Well Squibbs does not make the articles that I refer to ; he does not make to my knowledge; it is on the outside column of the bill, what he does not make. Q. But which are bought from Squibbs ? A. Yres, sir. Q. And they are not as low as they could have been bought, if bought elsewhere ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Please enumerate such articles ? A. You notice that all the articles Dr. Squibbs makes, of his own, he has put down in the inside column and deducted ten per cent; those he does not make are on the outside column " Bromide of potash," supplied at $1.45 per pound; Powers and Whiteman'sbrand, which is known just as well as Dr. Squibbs' article, was sold in job- bing quantities at that time at thirty-six cents per pound, it is billed here at forty-five cents; and the item here, four pounds is a jobbing quantity, about the quantity that a druggist would buy ; then "one hundred pounds of glycerine, thirty-five cents per pound," the market price for " Sarg's " brand, which is considered as reliable as any brand in the market, was selling at the time at twenty-nine cents for that quantity; no brand is given in this bill. Q. Is there any brand sold higher than " Sarg's" in the market ? A. Yes, sir; Bowers' brand is sold higher, but it is sold at about forty-five cents per pound, and glycerine is sold in bulk; it is sold in one pound bottles, about eighty cents per pound; this is in bulk. Q. Was there any glycerine sold at thirty-five cents per pound of any brand that you know at that time? A. No, sir; " twenty pounds of bromide of potash at forty cents per pound," and Powers & Whiteman at that time sold at thirty- six cents per pound ; " five pounds of iodide of potassium at $1.90 per pound ; " Powers & Whiteman's brand sold at $1.50. Cross-examined by Mr. Goodwin :J Q. This iodide of potash — do you know what brand this is on Squibbs' bill ? A. No, sir; I do not. Q. How do you say then that it is too much to pay for that pot- assium ? A. I am giving you the market price of Powers & Whiteman's brand, which is considered the standard. a ^Q. There is no better in the market ? jpjA. Not that I know of. jjQ. And no potassium that commands a higher rate ? fctA. Not that I know of. ^,Q. Now the bromide —■ do you know what bromide was that was sold by Squibbs ? 872 A.* No, sir. Q. Do you know whether or not there is any bromide sold at forty cents ? A. I do not know of any for which there is a market demand. Q. Do you know of any that is sold ? A. No, sir; I do not. Q. Now, Mr. Walker, do you think it is a fair criticism to make on the purchases or sale of Mr. Squibbs when you do not know the quality of the goods sold ? A. The examination, if you will allow me to say, takes an altogether different course from what I supposed it would when I talked with Mr. Brown ; I told Mr. Brown that all I felt I could testify to, or would testify to, at his request, and was nothing to testify in the matter, was, that good judgment was not used in mak- ing the purchases, so far as looking over them, and that I would testify what prices standard goods could be obtained at; now, these articles of Squibbs are charged at fifteen to twenty per cent profit, when a jobbing druggist would be charged ten per cent. Q. Now in regard to the glycerine; glycerine that is charged by Squibbs amounts to $36.25; what do you say is the proper price for that ? A. I want to say to the committee, it may not be exactly a direct answer, if it is not you will pardon me; the committee, as I under- stand Mr. Brown, who represented this committee, when he brought these bills down, he said to me, will you look these bills over and see what you would furnish suitable goods for, goods that are of best quality, that can be furnished the same as you are selling to other institutions and to merchants; I looked over the prices and goods, and my answers are based upon what we sell for and without regard to what other people have furnished at. The Chairman — And you did not care, therefor, to criticise prices made by dealers except so far as your criticism as to the pur- chase of these articles at retail instead of .at wholesale ? A. Yes, sir, that has been my intention all the way through. Mr. Goodwin — You said something about this glycerine being too high. A. No, sir; I did not come here to criticise these prices; of course Mr. Squibb stands very high in the trade, and I make no criticism upon the prices charged by Mr. Squibb. By the Chaiuman : Q. You have criticised the payment by the Asylum of thirty-five cents per pound for glycerine ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Was that criticism based upon the fact that glycerine could have been purchased by the Asylum at wholesale for less ? A. Yes, sir. By Mr. Goodwin : Q. The same kind of glycerine 1 873 A. You tell me what kind they furnished and I will tell you. Q. Do you know what glycerine was furnished to tbe Asylum by Mr. Squibbs ? A. No, sir. By the Chairman : Q. Do you mean that glycerine of a standard quality could have been purchased for less money ? A. Yes, sir; Sarg's glycerine could have been purchased at that time, and we would have sold at that time at twenty-nine cents, and were willing to do so, a standard glycerine. Q. Is that glycerine used by hospitals? l •'■.._ •< A. Yes, sir. Q. Is it used by physicians in private practice ? A. Yes, sir. (Exhibit No. 10b shown to witness.) Q. Does your house deal in the article known as " emulsion of cod-liver oil ?" A. Y es, sir. Q. Is that a standard article ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Of uniform price ? A. No, sir ; it is an article that is manufactured by druggists. Q. What was the market value of that article of the best quality in December, 1882 ? A. In a jobbing way, by the gallon, $3. Q. What is charged in this exhibit ? A. Four dollars ; as I told Mr. Brown Avhen I looked the bill over, that I did not consider it an extravagant price, considering it was purchased at retail ? Q. How many gallons Avere purchased from the 2d December or the 2d January as appears by that bill ? A. Seven gallons. J Q. Hoav much from that time until the date of the last item, February 24 ? A. Eight gallons, making in all fifteen gallons. Q. Are these quantities, quantities that are regarded as retail or Avholesale purchases ? • — A. We consider it a wholesale quantity. Q. Do you consider, therefore, that these articles should have been purchased at wholesale or retail prices ? A. At wdiolesale. Q. Do you know whether such article was used about that time by similar institutions ? A. No, sir. Q. You have no knowledge of that ? A. No, sir. Q. What did your house charge per gallon for that article about that time ? 110 U iL< 874 A. The emulsion of cod-liver oil is something that nearly every retail druggist makes for himself, and something that is very seldom sold by the gallon. Q. Do you mean that it is not a great deal sold at wholesale ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Where would the Asylum get it at wholesale if they wanted to make it ? A. They could obtain it from any wholesale druggists; it is some- thing that the retailers all manufacture themselves; they buy the cod-liver oil and make it up. Q. But any wholesale druggist would fill the order ? A. Yres, sir. Q. And fill the order for a lower price for such quantities than a retailer ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And what would have been at all that time the wholesale price for that emulsion ? A. I should consider $3 per gallon a fair price for it. Cross-examined by Mr. Goodwin : Q. Do you mean to say that if the State Lunatic Asylum had ordered from you, on December the 2d, two gallons of " emulsion of cod-liver oil," you would have charged them only $3 per gallon for it ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Would you have charged any person $3 for it ? A. No, sir ; we would charge you more for it. I^TQ. Why would you charge me more ? §HA. Because you are a consumer ; we don't sell to consumers. Q. Is not the Lunatic Asylum also a consumer ? A. They would not be considered as consumers, considering the quantity of goods they purchased. Q. I ask you if the State Lunatic Asylum had sent down from Utica on the 2d of December and ordered two gallons of this bod-liver oil and you would send it, would you have charged only $3 per gallon? A. I have answered yes, sir, to that question. Q. Why ? ^ A. Because we consider that their purchase would entitle them to the jobbing prices. Q. Purchased from you ? A. Yes, sir; if we were selling to the Utica Asylum. Q. I ask you if they sent you • an order down on the 2d day of December, 1882, for two gallons of this oil without any reference to their custom, or any thing else, whether you would have charged them $3 for the oil ? A. Yes, sir, we should. Q. Or any other wholesale house ? A. I should think so. Q. Are there any other items on this bill except the cod-liver ofi that you think are too high ? 875 A. There is " five gallons, gentian and varaxacum and acid $2.25;" I think that is very low. Q. Is it lower than you would sell it ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How much lower than you would sell it ? A. I would have to look that up ; I cannot tell you exactly, but it is below the regular price. Q. What else is there about it — about that bill ? A. There is nothing else on this bill that I know any thing about. By Mr. Brown : Q. That is, you cannot tell by any thing in the bill what the real price should be ? A. Yes, sir. Q. In regard to this item you think is cheap, what is yflur idea about that; is there any difference in the quality of these acids ? A. It is lower than — it is fair to say it is lower than Wyeth's. Q. Ytou do not know any thing about the quality from the bill itself, and so you cannot say ? A. No, sir; the bill does not specify the quality. By Mr. Haskell : Q. Are there lower grades than Wyeth's ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And you can make them of any strength ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And you mean simply to say that price specified there would be low for a first quality of article ? A. Yes, sir. By the Chairman : Q. How do you know this is oris not the highest grade known to the trade ? A. I do not know, and I haven't said so; but Mr. Brown stated if there was any thing in the bills I could give them the benefit of, to do so; if any items were cheap, to name them. (A bill marked Exhibit No. 10c. and shown to the witness.) i By the Chairman : Q. I call your attention to the various items for vaseline; what [ price is given there for vaseline? ' y A. For one-pound cans of the Avhite vaseline, $12 per dozen. !Q. Is vaseline a standard article ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Is it generally uniform in price ? fe A. Yes, sir, it is ; as near as I can remember about the prices, a K long price is charged on the bill for vaseline, and the trade get fifteen 876 per cent off; I cannot swrear positively in regard to any item; in regard to this one item, 1 remember. Q. What would yon have sold the Asylum that vaseline for at that time ? A. Fifteen per cent discount 'off Colgate's list, which is the standard. Q. And that is fifteen per cent less than is charged in this bill? A. Yes, sir; on this one particular item. By Mr. Goodwin : Q. Do I understand you to say, that if the Asylum had sent down on March 23, 1883, to your firm for half a dozen pound' cans of " White Yaseline " that you would have charged them fifteen per cent less than in this bill ? A. We should have charged the regular list price, $12 per dozen, less fifteen per cent discount. Q. Is not that " 10—20," there ? (pointing to another item on the bill). A. I excluded that item ; I said the only item I said any thing about was that one 1 mentioned. By the Chairman : (Exhibit lOd shoAvn to witness). Q. Please state if these articles are within your line of business ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And if you see any article there which could be purchased at that time for a lower price, by the Asylum ? A. Four bottles of FelloAvs' syrup of hypophsphates, billed at $1 a bottle; jobbing at $11 per dozen ; one dozen belladonna plas- ters, billed at "$10.8U," Grosvernor & Rogers brand; jobbing at $9 per dozen yards. Q. Is that a standard brand ? A. Yes, sir, that is the best; " two three quart rubber bags, at $1.75," jobbing price $1.50 each; "two two ounce graduates," billed at thirty-five cents each, jobbing twenty-five cents each; one pound of sal rochelle, billed forty-four cents, jobbing thirty-three cents; one pound chloral hydrate $2.25 ; Scheri'ng's chloral hydrate, jobbing at $1.80. Q. Why do you name Schering's? A. That is considered the best in the market. Q. How did the prices vary for that market? A. They ran from that down to $1.40 a pound. Q. What is the usual grade sold to hospitals ? A. The grade sold now at $1.40 per pound, called " Saames." Q. About what price was paid by such hospitals at date of this bill, February, 1883 ? A. I should say $1.50 per pound (a dollar and a half per pound); 877 and it is charged here it at $2.25; they bought the same of Mr. Squibbs, as yon will see by his bill, and paid $1.75, less ten per cent. Q. Do you mean to say that every item in the " C. H. William- son's " bill to which you have referred in your examination, if the Asylum had bought of you, would you have given the prices you have named ? A. Yes, sir ; for the same quantities. (Exhibit No. 10# shown to the witness.) By the Chairman : Q. Are those goods in your line ? A. Yres, sir. Q. Are there any items in that bill which, in your judgment, might have been purchased to better advantage by the Asylum ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Enumerate them ? A. Chloral hydrate charged at $1.75 per pound (the same evi- dence would hold good to that as given in regard to that item in the previous bill); I testified that $1.50 per pound would have pur- chased a good, suitable quantity. Q. And you say the previous bill shows a payment of $2.28 for the same article ? A. Yes, sir; I don't know any better than Squibbs', and he charged only $1.75 per pound, less ten per cent. Q. Any thing else on the bill ? A. Three packages of nested pill boxes charged twenty cents per package, and they could have been purchased for twelve cents per package ; and there are five hundred two-grain asafcetida pills; that is one of these cases ; if the asafcetida pills were made in a mortar, made to order, they are reasonable, they are cheap at the price charged ; if they were prepared by a pharmacist, a manufacturing pharmacist, then eighty-eight cents for the five hundred would be a reasonable price instead of $1.75 ; that is all on that bill. I don't desire by my testimony to criticise the sellers of any of these articles, or the prices charged by them, but desire to be distinctly understood as directing my criticism to the purchasing of articles at retail, which can be purchased for less money at wholesale. Q. You have not referred to all the items in the various exhibits just shown you ; why have you omitted some ? A. From the limited knowledge I possess as to the exact articles furnished ; I would pass the items as being reasonable in charges as far as my judgment or my knowledge extends, and I have only directed the attention of the committee to such* articles as I could determine the value of, from the fact that they were standard articles, and also to such articles as appear to be purchased in quantities suf- ficient to be known as jobbing lots, and to have entitled them (the Asylum) to have purchased the same at wholesale prices. 878^ By Mr. Goodwin: Q. What hospitals have you furnished articles to ? A. Albany hospital, and St. Peter's hospital, and the Homoeopathic hospital; that is all in the city. Q. Any others ? A. That is all. Q. And you said you furnish the State prisons ? A. Sing Sing and Dannemora. Q. That is all ? A. Yes, sir. Mr. Goodwin — I desire, Mr. Chairman, to ask — I find in the papers—Utica papers, February, 1884—a notice sent by the counsel to the investigating committee, asking for communications from " ex-physicians, and ex-attendants, ex-patients, and all persons who can give or furnish evidence to the management of the New York Lunatic Asylum at Utica." I understand that a large number of communications have been received in reference to this investiga- tion, and I ask the committee that I be allowed the privilege of looking at the letters which have been received by counsel in reference to the matter. The Chairman — The matter will be considered at a full meeting of the committee, and they will give an answer at a subsequent session. Mr. Haskell — I suggest that if Mr. GoodAvin insists upon seeing these letters, that they be handed to him one at a time, and each one be spread upon the minutes. Mr. Morgan — I claim no privilege in this matter; it is for the committee to say; the correspondence, such as I have, I shall sub- mit ; at the same time, I desire to say it would be an extraordinary proceeding that communications that counsel should be requested, that were sent to counsel under the seal of secrecy, but giving him import- ant information upon which he has acted and the evidence, and has been produced not of the letter, but of the individuals themselves, and they have been subjected to cross-examination on the part of counsel for the Asylum ; I have offered no letters in evidence; the letters were for enabling me to find evidence that w7ould be material. Mr. Goodwin — I desire to have — I request that the Asylum authorities may at some time in this investigation examine the counsel of the committee. The Chairman — The committee will consider the matter; if counsel for the Asylum causes Mr. Morgan to be subpoenaed, he will go on the stand ; if the counsel now states that he does desire to examine him (Mr. Morgan), the committee will be happy to hear him at any time, and Mr. Morgan will be present to be examined. Mr. Morgan — The suggestion of the counsel for the Asylum is most extraordinary and unheard of; it is most insulting. 879 The Chairman — But I understood you to say that, notwith- standing, you are willing to submit to examination. Mr. Morgan — If the committee say so; I am counsel for the committee; if they tell me to go on the stand, I shall go without hesitation ; I have no privilege of my own, but I have stated what I think of the suggestion. Mr. Goodwin — In view of what Mr. Morgan says, the Asylum authorities will not examine Mr. Morgan. The Chairman —The Asylum authorities show their good senses in the course taken. Mr. Haskell — And also that " discretion is the better part of valor." Adjourned to meet to-morrow evening, at Utica, at 8 o'clock, p. m. 880 Utica, March 27, 1884. Pursuant to adjournment, the committee met this evening at eight o'clock, in room 23, Baggs' Hotel, and continued the investigation. Present — Messrs. Howe, Haskell, Rice and Brown. JOSEPH R. SWAN Recalled: By Mr. Goodwin : Q. You wanted to call attention to an error in your testimony ? Mr. Swan — Yres, it is evidently a misprint; it is on page 238, where it says " fifty " per cent, it should be " five " per cent. Mr. Goodwin — And at page 776, in reference to the Ordronaux report, where it says, " I call his attention, etc.," it should be, " I call your attention, etc." by "your," meaning the committee. Mr. KINCAID Recalled: By Mr. Goodwin : Q. You were examined on Wednesday afternoon at Albany ? A. Yes, sir. Q. You then stated, in answer to Mr. Morgan, that you had signed a verdict as member of the coroner's jury, and knew nothing what you signed, or to that effect ? A. Knew nothing of its purport or what could be done with the verdict: that is what I should have said. Q. Do you now desire to make any correction to that answer? A. Yes, sir; I think I was put in a false light in reference to it. Q. Please state what there was in reference to the verdict Avhich caused you to believe it was not such a verdict as you intended to sign ? A. I stated, in answer to Mr. Morgan, that I drafted the verdict myself; on being submitted to the jury, there was a question about it upon which Ave could not agree, and it was stated to us by a gen tleman in the room that by the addition of a word or two which I do not now recollect, he could have drawn the verdict so that it would be in accordance with the statute ; and without knowing just what the two words, or three, would lead to, in order to make a ver- dict that the jury would agree upon, seven of the jurymen, I think, •agreed to sign the verdict as it was then written. 881 Q. That gentleman was the district attorney ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And he suggested that two or three words added to your draft in order, as he said, to make it — A. Conform to the statute. Q. And by accepting that suggestion of the district attorney you rendered such a verdict as you personally did not know any thing about; is that the idea ? A. Yes, sir, that is it; we did not know what could be done writh the verdict as it was rendered. By Mr. Morgan : Q. You did not understand the legal effect of the language used ? A. That was it exactly. By Mr. Goodwin : Q. What were those two or three words? A. I do not recollect; I could — I saw the verdict, but it was — there were two or three Avords which the district attorney said Avas necessary to make it a statutory verdict. Q Do you understand it Avas the adding of these two or three words by which these men were arrested ? A. Yes, sir. Q. You did not mean by your verdict then to censure, or rather to call upon the authorities for the arrest of these men ? A. That was not the intent of seven of the jury as 1 understand. Q. And that AA7as the reason why you say you signed a verdict not knowing its intent or purport? A. I supposed there was a discretionary power with the coroner; we found afterward that there was not. Q. Discretionary power as to Avhat ? A. As to the men being held or not as he saw fit. Q. Is there any thing else you desire to say ? A. No, sir, I think not. By Mr. Haskell : Q. But you did understand that the verdict you signed authorized the coroner to have these men arrested if he saw fit? A. Yes, sir, I may say that; if he thought proper. Mr. Goodwin — I have an affidavit here from P. Y. Rogers which I desire to read, one of the managers, I desire it to go on the evi- dence. The Chairman— Read it and we will see whether it should go on the minutes or not. (Affidavit read by Mr. Goodwin.) (The question of its admission is reserved until the committee shall have had an executive session, and considered the admissibility of said affidavit.) 111U 882 Dr. FORD Recalled for continued examination : By Mr. Goodavin: Q. Doctor, it is stated in the testimony by some Avitness, I think it is Buckley, that Avhen the managers, or any authorities, go to visit the Asylum a Avhistle is bloAvn, so that attendants and supervisors upon the various wards might get ready; state whether it is true or not ? A. It was not true during my time, and I do not suppose it is now. Q. During your attendance on the Asylum were patients transfer- red from one ward to another as punishment? „ A. As punishment — no, not as punishment. Q. As " discipline," Mr. Rice suggests ? A. No, sir, I don't knoAV what you mean by that. Q. (By Mr. Haskelu Hoav can you answer that? A. Well, I a-ked him to explain his question. Q. It has been testified before this committee that a number of patients at different times, and in different wards, have been trans- ferred from one ward to another as a matter of punishment; that is the language used by the witness I think. The Chairman — I think that is true. Mr. Goodavin — I am using precisely that language. Q. Now, can you state any change made from ward to ward for any other reason than the health of the patient I A. Every change was upon the direct order of the physician in each individual case, and for only medical purposes. Q. (By Mr. Rice.) Was it for medical purposes pertaining to the person removed or other persons ? A. Well, both; if a man became so disturbed on a ward as to be a source of annoyance to people who were recovering; or, if a man should have a relapse Avhile on a convalescent ward, he would be re- moved from that ward ; not to punish the man, for he could not help it; as I understand that is what you mean, but simply to put him where he would be best cared forj and the other patients pro- tected from noise or violence. Q. If a patient on a particular ward should go into other patients' rooms, and take their clothing out of their drawers, out of the bureau, or should annoy them, undoing their dress and exciting them in A7anous ways by telling them stories which did excite them,\vould such a patient be removed from that ward i A. He might. Q. Why? A. If he retarded the improvement of other men on that ward, 883 and it became necessary for the welfare of the ward, he Avould be re- moved if that Avas true, in the judgment of the physician who inves- tigated the facts. Q. So that the removal of the patient Avould be either for his own good, or for the good of the persons with whom he Avas associated ? A. Yes, sir, I think that states it. Q. How frequently do supervisors necessarily have to go through the wards in the discharge of their ordinary duties? A. I don't know that I can state the o^xact number of times; they must go through necessarily very frequently in the course of a day ; they must go through very frequently. Q. Why did they have to go frequently ; why did their duties re- quire that there should be a frequent attendance through the wards in Avhich they Avere supervisors ? A. Because of medicines given Avhich are carried to the patients by the supervisors through the wards; sometimes he would have to , go through tAvo or three Avards in getting to the Avard he Avas going, and in matters of changes of clothing — taking clothing and carry- ing of letters and papers, and carrying the orders of the physicians to the attendants on the different wards, he must go there in order to carry them or there is communication. Q. Are their opportunities ample by virtue of their duties in ob- serving the treatment of attendants to patients? A. I do not understand yen. Q. Are their opportunities ample? A. Oh, yes, sir; they certainly have ample opportunity for know- ing what is going on and observing patients ; that is their business. Q. I call your attention generally to the statement made by Buckley of the great fight which lasted from one until four o'clock in the afternoon ; do you remember it? A. Yes, sir ; I remember the testimony you read that time on Saturday, I think, or the other day. Q. Now I ask you if patients upon such a ward as Buckley was an attendant would be apt or could by virtue of the disorders which they were under, Avhether they would have the power to concen- trate their minds so much so as^to be able to say that they desired to ', see a patient or an attendant conquer in a fight ? A. Patients generally on a Avard ? Q. In that ward—Buckley's ward ? A. I suppose there might be individual instances; it would not be so-regarding the majority of the patients of a disturbed ward. Q. Why not ? A. Because men in that condition are occupied with delusions, and fix their attention upon themselves; that very fact renders it L possible for a small number of people to take care of a large number f of violent insane people, because they are so interested in their, s. oavii delusions and notions that they do not form combinations; *' • they have nothing in common Avith each other ; I think that state- [ ■ ment could be made very broadly, that they never combine ; I never y knew a combination ever existing among insane people. i 8.84 Q. And that you regard the safeguard of the place ? A. That is the only theory on which insane people can be taken care of in any asylum. Q. Are you familiar with the supervision of the correspondence of the Asylum during the time of your service? A. I am ; yes, sir. J Q. Will you state generally what that supervision was ? A. The supervision of letters from patients ? Q. Yes, from patients first ? A. Letters from patients were all examined, excepting among convalescent patients who were known to be convalescent, or where the letter was known to be directed to the proper person; one would I become familiar, so familiar that he could say Avithout reading the letter through, that it was from such a patient and was to a friend, and that it Avas proper to send that through ; those letters were not ahvays read, otherwise communications Avere looked at. Q. What in regard to supervision of the letters sent by patients to friends ? A. Well, letters addressed to the proper person in the case, the person responsible for the patient in the Asylum, were sent pretty much regardless of any thing in them ; the others Avere put in a case and kept, manifestly insane letters. Q. What is your opinion of the necessity of supervision of corre- spondence in the Asylum ? A. I think it is an absolute necessity. Q. Do you think there are cases Avhere letters from parent to child, or from child to parent, should be supervised! A. Oh, certainly there are. Q. Why? Q. Because an insane person may have an indecent delusion, and they often do have ; a large proportion of people who have delusions have 'indecent delusions ; delusions that would, if put on record, would either disturb the persons they went to, or be a source of mortification to people who wrote them, after they got well. Q. Have you made any examination since your return from Albany in reference to the Heath case ? A. I examined the record this morning. Q. What did you find in reference to it, which you were unable to, or did not state on your examination at Albany on Tuesday ? A. I think I substantially stated all that I know, or knew, or know now, in regard to it. t Q. You made an autopsy in that case, did you not? A. I did. Q. Were there any ribs broken ? A. Not to my knowledge. ■ By Mr. Haskell : Q. Do you say there Avere not ? A. I say that there was not to my knowledge. 885 Q. That you never knew there was, or do not now know ? A. I do not know now, because I do not remember that there were any ; I say no broken ribs to my knowledge. By Mr. Goodwin : Q. Did you ever make an autopsy in that Asylum in any case Avhere there Avere broken ribs? A. I never did. By Mr. Haskell : Q. How thorough an autopsy did you make on Heath ? A. An ordinary autopsy of the brain, and lungs, and heart, and kidneys, and vital organs. Q. If his ribs had been broken y7ou would have discovered it! A. I suppose so. Q. Do not you knoAV ? A. I think so. Q. Are you able to swear positively that his ribs were not broken? A. No, sir; I do not think I would be, on any autopsy; to the best of my knowledge and belief they were not. Q. Hoav definite a recollection have you of it ? A. Of the autopsy in that case ? That was eleven years ago, about as much as a man would remember under the circumstances. Q. How much ? A. I have not a very definite recollection. Q. Had you forgotten that you did make an autopsy, until it was called to yonr attention ? A. No, sir, I never forgot that; I think I testified to that the other day when my attention Avas called to it. Q. Have you looked to see if you found the record of your au- topsy ? A. I have not found any record of the autopsy. Q. I understood you to state to me that you had forgotten some- thing about it ? A. Well, perhaps — I will make it as definite as I can —that is the best of my judgment and recollection now ; I recall the facts from other circumstances which I knoAV were present at that time, which I will relate to you if you like. By Mr. Morgan : Q. Is it not true that physicians and surgeons have made autop- sies of deceased persons, examining the internal organs without dis- covering serious fractures of the ribs ? A. I do not know whether it is true or not; I presume it might be so. Q. Do you remember reading, the celebrated Walsh case at Little Falls ? A. No, sir. Q. Where a thorough (as they claimed) examination was made by 886 three physicians, and your Dr. Deecke went there and found eight ribs broken of Mrs. Walsh ? A. I don't think I am familiar with the case ; when did it occur? Q. Three years ago. A. If I did know it I do not recollect any of the facts; I presume I saw it at the time; I should presume it might occur; oh, that Avas the woman that was murdered in Little Falls; killed by her husband ; I remember the case now ; I did not know that Dr. Deecke made an autopsy ; I remember the circumstances now. Q. Do you remember all that now ? A. I remember of the case ; I do not know that I remember all the details and I did not know until you spoke of it that Dr. Deecke w7ent down there. Q. Do you remember that Dr. Deecke went to the Falls? A. No, sir. Q. And was a witness in the case, and that there were five ribs broken on one side and three on the other ? A. I don't remember. Q. And that might occur ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And it might occur with yourself ? A. Yes, sir, I think it might; you asked me whether a serious injury could — do you mean serious enough to cause death? Q. The kicking of Mrs. Walsh caused death? A. You ask me the question wdiether it might not be so; an ex- amination might be made where fractures of the ribs had been serious enough — serious, and yet be undiscovered; I cannot im- agine how a man could make an autopsy on such a case, which would have been serious enough to cause death, Avithout discovering it; I don't know Iioav it could. Q. Is it not true that when, the wards are to be visited by visitors, that'-a whistle is blown to that Avard almost invariably ? A. It was not in my time; that I do not know about now ; I had charge of one side of the house, and I would have known it, I pre- snme, if it had been the custom. Q. In your time, if you found a patient bruised, where the bruise was visible, without removing the clothing, what means do you adopt to ascertain the cause of the injury ? A. I asked the patients—asked other patients; I asked the attendant first, unless I had — well, yes — I think that is in every case, I suppose. Q. Then, doctor, you had in each ward a book called the "injury book," had you not? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you, at any time, upon inquiry of the patient injured, or other patients, learn from them that the injury was received from an attendant ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And upon examining the injury book, did you find that the 887 r injury was reported there as having been received from a co-patient' or inflicted by a patient ? A. Whether the record was corresponding with the facts ? Q. Yes ; whether the record corresponded Avith Avhat the patient said ; did you ever find a case where the record did not correspond with what the patient said ? A. I do not know ; I presume so. Q. Did you ever correct the book then or have it corrected ? A. I do not know ; I cannot recollect any instance of the kind you mention ; I presume it may have occurred ; I have not any pres- ent recollection of that sort. Q. Yon have no recollection of the record, as made by an attend- ant or supervisor, ever having been corrected in that institution, have yon ? A. .1 do not knoAV ; I haven't any recollection of that sort; no. Q. It was a part of your duty to loo!7, through the record as made in the injury book, Avas it not ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And do you now call to mind a single case where the record, as made by an attendant or supervisor, has ever been corrected or changed in any way ? A. I do not know ; I have not thought of it; I do not think of any now ; let me say that the injury, or the facts in the case, went down in the history of the patient by me; they were recorded in the general case book ; this was not particularly for scientific pur- poses that the injury book was kept, but for to act as a check and a record. • Q. It was kept for the purpose of knowing just how the injury occurred ? A. Yres, sir, and from my recollection it was kept correctly. That is as far as I can say. Q. I again ask you is it not true that very frequently the at- tendants give one version of the cause of the injury, while the patient would give another? A. Oh, yes, sir. Q. What was the object of asking the patient, if you placed no re- liance upon what the patient said ? A. Well you would get at the facts; some patients Avould be able to tell you. Q. Then it is true that a portion of the patients are capable of knowing, understanding, and giving truthful and accurate statements as to how the injury occurred ? A. At the time—yes, sir. Q. And if they done it at the time they would do it afterward, would they not ? A. That would depend on their mental state at the time and afterward too. Q. Suppose their condition remained equally as good as when they first made the statement ? 888 A. I don't think a demented man would ever remember past a day or a Aveek. Q. Well, take a person not demented i A Well he would probably recall part of his—he would recall- he would recall particular things that happened to him, perhaps; sometimes he would, sometimes' he w7ould not, it would depend entirely on the character of the patients' sickness. _ _ Q. It is true that there are demented patients in that institution? A. Yes, sir. . . Q. That are not insane but simply idiotic ? A. No, a dememted man is insane and an idiotic man is not an insane man. , . Q. That is what I say. There are idiotic people -in there, are there not ? A. No, sir ; I never kneAV of any idiots being there. - Q. Can I call your mind to a woman, I w7on't be certain as to the ward she is on, but I think ten, who has or never had the left eje _ the sight of it, and the right seemed dim, and who stands there wherever she is placed and simply in plain terms a fool; do you remember one that has been there for years, and one. Avas on ten, not on ward ten noAv, because that is throwm up just noAv, but on ward eleven ; I may be mistaken as to the ward ? A. The woman with one eye ? Q. Yes. A. How old a woman ? Q. That is hard to tell. A. I remember Harriet B. B., is that the name? Q. I cannot tell you the name. ^ A. She has only one eye, I recollect; she has been there a long time. Q. What is the difficulty with that woman ? A. One eye is gone, but she is a woman of forty-five or fifty years old. Q. How long has she been there ? A. Well I think she was there during the years of my term of service. Q. What do you say is the difficulty with that woman ? A. She has chronic mania. Q. Describe it a little more fully. A. Well she is not, of course, she is feeble in mind and yet she is talkative enough; she is not in any way a person that you Avould call a fool; I don't think that is the person. Q. The one I have referred to yon can hardly understand a word she says ; do you think that Avoman is insane ? ^ A. Yes, sir, the one I refer to is. Q. Why are that class of patients kept in the Asylum ; why are they not removed to the poor-house in the counties Avhere they belong ? A. Many of them are. 889 Q. There are several of that character there now, are there not ? A. I don't know, I have not been there in five or six years. Q. The last time you were there, there Avere several there ? A. Yes, sir, several. Q. That had been there a long time ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Why is it that that class of patients are retained in the Asylum ■ in your opinion would it not be a proper management to send those patients to the poor houses in the counties where they belong? A. Those patients, many of them, could not be sent there for the reason that they are private patients sent there by their friends and maintained by their friends, and over whom the county officers have no jurisdiction, and never had jurisdiction. Q. Do you think it is, in your judgment, proper management for the authorities of the Asylum to take that class of patients when the institution is overcroAvded with insane patients ? A. No, I do not think it is. , Q. Then in your opinion that class of patients should not be re- tained there when complaint is actually made, and we have it upon the record that the institution is overtaxed with patients ? A. Well, no ; they ought not to be there, and the effort was con- stantly made to get rid of them ; but it is a hard thing to get rid of them. Q. They are not obliged to keep any private patient there to the exclusion of public patients, or to overcrowed the institution as against public patient, are they ? A. No, sir; I do not think that was ever done. Q. The private patients are taken there ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And if Dr. Gray says that the institution is overcrowded with patients, you would believe him,' would you not? A. That it was overcrowded ? Q. Yes? A. Yes, sir. Q. And in that case, you would say that these private patients, especially those that are demented, should be taken away, would you not ? A. If they could be cared for anywhere else and could be gotten rid of. Q. If they are able to be cared for in one case, they are in another, I suppose ? A. No, sir; that don't follow, no; that don't follow. Q. There are private asylums in this State for the care of that very class, are there not ? A. I do not know; I do not think that there is any private aslyum for the care of that class, not that I know of. Do you mean especially for the care of chronic insane. Q. No; for bemented patients ? A. If there is, I don't know it; I think Dr. Root has, down on 112 U L- 890 the Hudson river, five or six patients in his family ; but that is hardly an asylum. Q. Is tliere not a person in Syracuse who takes care of private demented persons? A. I do not know ; I do know that there was a man found somewhere in a private house in Syracuse, who was said to be in- sane ; that is all the knowledge that I have that there is such a place in Syracuse. Q. If they are a county charge, in your judgment, that class should be sent to the county where they belong, should they not? A. After there could be no longer any possibility of their recovery under treatment. Q. There are, or were in the time that you were acquainted with the patients of the Aslyum, there were demented patients that were entirely hopeless, were there not ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And yet they were retained there ? A. Well, they were tliere. Q. When you were at the Asylum, what was the method by which the supplies for Dr. Gray's family Avere procured from the commissary department? A. I do not believe I know any thing about that. Mr. Morgan — That is all I wrant to inquire about, Mr. Haskell. By Mr. Haskell : Q. When you were in the Asylum, were there any insane crim- inals cared for there ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What, in your judgment, is the advisability of caring for that class of patients in this Asylum? A. I thought it was bad policy. Q. Do you think so now ? A. I do. Q. In an asylum of this character, which receives every clases of patients, you think the line should be drawn at insane criminals ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Give us, briefly, your reason for that judgment ? A. These insane criminals are very largely chronic cases, op- erating under delusions, having been insane a long time, and are dangerous men, and the fact that a man has committed a crime, comes on to a ward, and has sense enough to tell of it, is a dis- disturbing element in the ward, and usually there can be very little use in keeping him there, because it is necessary to observe very much greater security for those that were around, and necessary to observe greater precautions. ^ Q. You think, briefly, then that the good effects on the patient himself is very slight compared with the chances — A. Some I will say were not insane. Q. And the general effect of that class of patients upon the others was bad ? 891 A. Yes, sir ; I should think so. Q. Can you state how many cases of chronic insane there are in the Asylum at this time ? A. No, sir ; I do not know. Q. In your judgment, ought a person, as soon as they pass the stage of acute mania or insanity, be transferred from this Asylum to some other ? A. No, sir. Q. You think then that it is entirely proper to retain chronic patients in this institution ? A. If there is any hope of their getting well by treatment; if they can be benefited by treatment, I think that is the reason. Q. Are there any patients in that institution that tliere is no hope of benefiting by treatment ? A. I think so. Q. Those you think should be transferred from the institution, do you not? A. Yes, sir, if a suitable place can be provided for them. Q. A re there any suitable places in the State ? A. Yes, sir, but it is possible such cases could not be provided for. Q. And some other would be a more proper place for them ? A. My general statement was only with the proviso that they should not be removed unless they could be properly cared for else- where. Q. What do you mean by that ? A. By that I mean to say that if a person belonged in a county where —■ if for any reason whatever the friends of a patient could not maintain him in a private asylum, or could not secure his admis- sion to a proper asylum elsewhere, and could not take care of him, then he ought to be retained there; I have not in my mind any instances. Q. Do you know of any such cases ? A. No, sir ; I have not any in my mind. Q. Can you conceive of such cases ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Please suggest ? A. Well, a chronic insane person who could be removed to — a patient who formerly resided in a county where the accommodations were not fit for the taking care of that class of persons ; indeed in some counties they have no such accommodations. Q. Are there any asylums in this State especially for the fcare of the chronic insane, incurable cases ? A. Yes, sir. Q. In your judgment, is not that the proper place, if there is no other place to which they could be sent ? A. There is only one such asylum, that is Willard, and that only covers a limited area of the State ; then there might be persons avIio could not be cared for at home, of course. Q. In regard to the covered bed, I understood you to testify that 892 usually there was a straw bed covered by a hair mattress; was the hair mattress, and straw too, used in all cases ? A. That was the rule. Q. Was that the rule in all cases ? A. I think so ; I don't remember particularly. Q. Were both used in the case of a patient who was in the habit of4soiling the mattrass and bed clothes ? A. It was; I presume there were instances when a hair mattress could not be used ; I can conceive of such instances. Q. Do you now recollect that tliere were such instances ? A. I presume there were ; I don't recollect any specially. Q. But it would be your best judgment that there were such cases ? A. Yes, sir. Q. So that in all instances the hair mattress was not used ? A. I cannot recollect any instance; I say it is possible a case might occur in which it was not. Q. Will you say that where a straw mattress was used for a patient at night that a hair mattress was not put into the bed during the day time ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Will you swear positively that that did not occur ? A. No, sir, of course I could not; I could not remember; no man could swear to that, one way or the other; I have seen beds with hair mattresses on, and with no mattresses on. Q. Has it been generally in the day time that you have seen them ? A. Sometimes in the day time. Q. I ask you whether generally in the day time ? A., No, sir ; I would not say that. Q. Then when you have seen the covered beds it has been gener- ally at night ? A. No, sir ; I do not say so. Q. And you will not say that it was generally in the day time ? A. No, sir. Q. Why will you not ? A. Because 1 was in the habit of seeing them all the while; there was no rule about it. Q. When did you make your visits to the wards ? A. At all times. Q. Regular visits ; did you have any regular time ? A. Oh, yes; morning and afternoon. Q. And tliere Avere very few days then that you were not on the wards twice a day ? A. Yes, sir; no days when I was visiting ; some days I did not go on to the wards at all, but was engaged in writing up the records, and then some one else went in my place. Q. Were you on the wards tAvice every night while you were in the institution? A. No, sir. 893 Q. Then you saw the covered beds oftener in the day time than at night ? A. No, sir; I think not; I do not wish to conceal any thing; 1 would be more apt to see a patient in the covered bed in the evening. Q. Were you called to see patients in the covered beds ? A. Yes, sir; I presume I would not see a bed as often empty as with some one in it, that is, 1 would not look at it; I might pass by it, but would not swear that I saw it, you know. Q. Whom do you understand to be the official and responsible head of this Asylum ? A. Dr. Gray, under the board of managers. Q. Dr. Gray, or the board of managers^ which ?" A. Dr. Gray, under the board of managers. Q. Then you regard the board of managers as the real head and responsible authority of the institution ? A. Yes; that is my understanding. Q. What objection would suggest itself to you, if any, that the board of managers should appoint a financial officer of the institu- tion, who should be responsible directly to the board of managers for the financial management, and not be responsible to Dr. Gray or the superintendent of the institution in the performances of duties connected with the financial management of the institution ? A. The statement I made the other day w7ould cover that. Q. Answer it without reference to what you have stated hereto- fore? A. Well, the objection is to any divided responsibility in the gov- ernment of all the affairs of the institution; they should all be un- der one head, and undivided. Q. What divided responsibility would there be in the mere finan- cial administration of the institution ? A. If it was administered by one man it would not be divided ; if there were two men managing it would be divided, if there were two men — one the superintendent and the other the financial management — there would be two heads and hence a divided re- sponsibility. Q. But they are two separate spheres, are they not ? A. I think not; I think they would run into each other and nec- essarily — Q. In what respect would they run into each other ? A. In regard to the purchase of supplies; the medical officer would have — he would be about the only man who would have the proper practical knowledge as to what was necessary to be bought or to be used. Q. Could he not make out a list of his requirements and send them into the financial agent? A. I suppose he could. Q. Would he be any better able to go into the market and buy them than a man who devoted his time to just that feature of the in- stitution ? 894 A. No, sir, I suppose not. Q. And there would be no objection there, in that direction, would there? A. Unless there arose a difference of opinion as to what — as to Avhat was proper to be bought, and what was necessary, or as to quantity, or quality, etc. Q. Assuming that the superintendent should give his orders to the financial agent to purchase just such goods as he Avas required to do, could there be any objection then ? A. That is the way it is done now, by the steward, precisely. Q. The steward is not responsible to the board of managers, how- ever, for the proper financial administration of his office ? A. I suppose every officer is responsible to the board, they are ap- pointed by the board' of managers, every officer is — superintendent and assistant physicians. Q. But upon "the nomination of the superintendent ? A. I don't know whether he makes the nomination or not, but I think he does. Q. And the steward has no judgment of his own in the way he makes the purchases, what he buys, or where he buys it, or what he pays for it ? A. Of his own ? Q. Yes; he is entirely under the direction of the superintend- ent ? A. Why, the steAvard has some judgment, that is what he is there for. Q. That is your understanding of the office ? Q. Would you not think it wise that the financial agent or stew- ard of the institution should have the free exercise of his judgment in matters of business, such as the purchasing of supplies ? A. I think he ought to. Q. And do you see any well-founded objection to the financial officer of the institution being directly responsible to the boa/d of managers for the proper administration of that branch of the insti- tution ? A. The only objection I made was as to divided responsibility, that there could hardly be such without conflictions or delays and hin- drances. Q. How do you mean, delays and hindrances — explain ? A. Well, if the purchasing of the supplies is in the hands of a finaucial agent, who is not responsible to the superintendent, and an exigency arises that the superintendent needs things, and the finan- cial agent has not them, and should decline to purchase them, be- canse he had a different idea from Avhat the superintendent had re- garding the purchase — Q. Would not that be a violation of his duty, if he was required to purchase all supplies as he was required to by the superintendent? A. Yes, sir; but that would virtually place him under the super- intendent. 895 Q. No ; because it would leave him free to the exercise of his judgment as to the manner in w7hich he would buy ? A. Well, yes, I think there is no objection to the steward, or the man who purchases having the right to make the selection. Q. Would it not be better that he should be responsible directly to the board of managers for the manner in which he did his busi- ness, than that he should be responsible through the sfiperintendent, and the superintendent be responsible to the board of managers? A. No, sir; I don't think it would be better, or as well, there is no reason why it should be. Q. Do you not think that the more directly responsible yon can make the head of an institution, the more liable you are to have business done properly ? A. Yes, sir ; and therefore I would have every officer in the in- stitution responsible to the superintendent. Q. Then you really make the superintendent the head of the in- stitution, and not the board of managers, do you not ? A. Oh, no, sir; he is the head of the institution as to its details. The Chairman — You mean the executive head ? A. Yes, sir ; he is the executive head. Q. When you were in the institution were you a part of the time on one side of the house, and part of the time on the other? A. Yes, sir. Q. During what part of tlje time were you on the male depart- ment ? A. I was on the woman's side of the house the last two years; previous to that time I was on the men's side ? Q. That was about two years ? A. No, longer than that; I was on the woman's side two years, and on the men's side three and a half. Q. During the time you were on the male department, how often did Dr. Gray make a systematic examination of each patient on the barious wards, and as to the general, sanitary condition of the wards? A. If you will leave out the words "systematic examination of each patient," I can answer; I do not think I could testify as to that, with that in. Q. Why not? A. I do not think he made a systematic examination of each patient at any stated intervals, that I could testify to. Q. Do I understand you to say that Dr. Gray had no stated peri- odical visitations of the institution ? A. Including the systematic examination of each patient he had not; but I think he had with regard to the visitation of each ward, but that did not include an examination of each individual patient, that is all. Q. Describe what Dr. Gray did do? A. Dr. Gray would make a round with one of the assistant physi- cians, as he went his round in the morning; Dr. Gray would go 1 % round with him, perhaps once a week. 896 Q. I want some time that you are willing to positively testify that he did? A. I will say frequently. Q. I want you to make it more definite than that; once in how long; what given period of time are you willing to swear positively Dr. Gray made a systematic round of that institution ? A. With me? Q. Yes, with you, first ? A. No ; I would not be able to give you any number of times; he went whenever 1 asked him. Q. Did he ever go unless you asked him ? A. Yes, sir; he was on the wards many times when I did not know it. Q. When he w7ent with you we are talking about ? A. If 1 had any special reason for asking him to go, he usually went. Q. Did he ever go on the wards with you when you did not ask him to go with you ? A. Yes, sir; he has gone on his own motion. Q. And made a thorough examination of the institution ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How often would he make such a thorough tour of the in- stitution with you ? A. I do not know. Q. Would he do so once a month ? A. Yes, sir; oftener than that with me. Q. How much oftener ? A. I should say a good deal oftener than that. Q. You are swearing positively now ? A. No, sir. Q. Well, I want you to fix a number of times that you will swear positively that he did go ? A. I would not be able to do that, because it is eleven years ago, from that until six years ago ; I have no means of refreshing my memory. Q. Would you swear that he made a systematic investigation of each ward and the patients thereon as often as once a month when you were in the institution ? A. No, sir, 1 cannot SAvear positively. Q. As often as once in two months ? A. No, sir ; not as often as once in ten, if you put in that testi- mony, or clause, in the question " systematic investigation of each patient," because I say it was not a part of his business to do that every time he went on the ward's. Q. Did you examine to-day the records of the institution and get for us the date of the death of the patient Heath ? A. Yes. Q. Will you please give it ? A. I think it was on the 14th ; well, it was either October or 897 November, I don't know which ; I did look it up, and it was either one of those months, October or November, 1873. Q. What book did you examine ? A. The discharge book. Q. What is the difference between the discharge book and the case book ? A. Well, the discharge book is a book containing the record of the admission and discharges of patients, with the dates, the place where they came from, the manner in which they were discharged' and where they went. Q. Did the discharge book give the full particulars of the final sickness and death of Mr. Heath ? A. It gave those statistics I mentioned. ; Q. Would the particulars also be recorded in the case book? A. Well, it is the same, the one is statistics, and the other is a written account of the man. Q. Did you examine the case book in regard to Mr. Heath ? A. Yes. Q. When did you examine it, to-day ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What is the record in the case book with regard to Mr. Heath's injury ? A. There is an account of Mr. Heath extending over from — Q. I do not ask when it was from; I ask was there a record in regard to his injury ? A. There is no record in regard to his injury. Q. No mention of it ? A. I think not; I don't know that there is. Q. Do you know who made the record ? A. I think I did. Q. Do you know why there is no mention of his injuries ? A. Well, I won't say that; the last note made of him was on the day of his death or the day previous to that, and it speaks of his violence, and of his allegations that he was hurt by an attendant; that, I think, is the extent of the record. Q. Can you swear positively that his death was in no way caused or affected or hastened by any injury received by him ? A. Not to my knowledge. Q. Can you swear to that as a positive fact ? A. I say not to my knowledge, as far as my knowledge goes ; that is all you want, what I know of my own knowledge. Q. Do you know whether it was or not ? A. 1 think I do; yes, sir. Q. Was it ? A. I think it was not. Q. So that it is an entirely mistaken idea on the part of the wit- nesses, Barrisdaile, Halpin and Mr. Buckley, that this man, Heath, was hurt seriously enough to affect his health in that institution ? 113 U 898 A. It is a fact that he was injured as I said. Q. He was injured on the arm, you swore ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Will you swear that he was not injured anywhere else ? A. Yes ; I don't know that he was. Q. You cannot say whether he was or not ? A. Yes, sir; but I cannot swear negatively to things that did not attract my attention at that time, that is all; I mean I will swear that he did not die of his injuries. Q. And that they had no effect whatever in hastening his death ? A. So far as I know, and I think I know. Q. And you think tliere is no foundation whatever for the evidence of Mr. Barrisdaile on that subject ? A. I do not know what that was. (Mr. Barrisdale's testimony, at page 100 of the printed minutes, handed to the witness.) Q. Please examine that; do you say that there is no foundation whatever for that evidence of Mr. Barrisdaile ? A. The foundation is that the man was hurt on the Avard, and that the attendant was discharged by me, who did it. Q. And you say the only injury sustained by Mr. Heath was a bruise on the arm ? A. No, sir; I do not say that; I think the man had some bruises on his person more than that, but I recollect the bruise about his arm. Q. Do you recollect the injury to his person ? A. No, sir; I do not; I presume there were some bruises some- where else. Q. Why do you presume that if yon have no recollection on the subject; is it because Mr. Barrisdaile swears to it ? A. I have no recollection of any bruise about the person. Q. Then you presume there were others from what Mr. Barais- daile SAvore to ? A. No, sir ; I presume there may have been, for I know he was a very violent man for a week or ten days prior to that time, and he may have bruised himself or become bruised in his care; I presume that was true, but I do not recollect any you know; but I presume that was true. Mr. Goodwin — Mr. Barrisdaile will appear before the committee and will explain that all he knew about the matter was from hearsay. Q. Have you ever made any other examination of the records of the institution since you were sworn before the committee the other day? A. No, sir. Q. Will you swear positively that there was no such patient in the institution as was testified to by Mr. Halpin as the man from Albany? v A. I will testify that I looked over the records. Q. And did not find it ? 899 A. Yes, sir. Q. And that is as strong as you desire to make it ? A. And I will testify that I would have found it if it had been there. Q. Will you swear positively that no such patient was in the in- stitution ? A. As those initials that are given in the testimony ? Q. Yes? A. Yes, sir; as far as I know. Q. Will you swear that there was no such patient in the institu- tion about the time, as described by Halpin, who had a difficulty with his kidneys, and that Halpin was detailed to care for him specially ? A. You read me that testimony the other day. Q. I don't think I read it to you ? A. Well, somebody read it to me. Mr. Goodwin — I read it to you when I examined you. Witness -----1 will say this, that there was no such patient as shown by the records, and I have no knowledge of any such person. Q. Then you will not say Avhether tliere was or not of your own knowledge, aside from the records of the institution ? A. No, sir ; that is all I can testify to. Q. W here is Dr. Smith now ? A. He was at Morris Plains, New Jersey ; I suppose he is tliere; he is a physician tliere. Q. Will you say that about the time specified by Mr. Halpin Dr. Smith did not perform an operation on a patient who was then in the institution suffering from kidney or bladder complaint ? A. No, sir, I will not swear to any thing that Dr. Smith did. He did not do it to my knowledge, and if any operation had been per- formed, I should have known it I suppose. Q. Might you not have forgotten it ? A. No, sir, I don't think I could have forgotten such an instance ; I might have, of course. Q. Have you since your attention was called to Mr. Halpin's evidence, have you examined carefully the case records of every patient who died in the institution during the period of time that Halpin was there, as it was in the case book? A. No, sir; oh, no. Q. Would you say that there is no record in the case book of a patient who died while Halpin was there as an attendant in the institution, that does not show that a patient was there who received some injury, and that subsequently to that he had a bladder or kidney difficulty, that it was difficult or impossible for him to pass his urine without some assistance, that Dr. Smith performed an opera- tion, and that the patient subsequently died ? A. On the tenth ward ? Q. Without reference to any particular ward—in the institution ? A. No, sir, I only examined as to the tenth ward, and records of that ward, as I testified. 900 Q. You will not say that there is not just such a case as that recorded in the case book ? A. There is none as far as relates to patients on the tenth ward ; I have not examined the others, excepting that. Q. You will not say that there is no such record ? A. I cannot say, from my own knowledge; that is all I examined. By Mr. Goodwin : Q. This case as sworn to by Mr. Halpin occurred on the tenth ward as you understand ? A. That is the testimony read to me, as I understand. By Mr. Haskell : Q. In regard to your testimony given here about the removal or non-removal of patients for discipline, 1 wish to call your attention to the fact that Dr. Smith has testified that the removal of" patients from a good ward to a more disturbed ward as a matter of discipline was in vogue in this institution ; I will ask you— Mr. Goodwin — I hardly like to correct a member of the com- mittee —Dr. Smith spoke something on that subject, but did not say that, I think. Q. Have you read Dr. Smith's testimony on that point? A. No, sir ; I don't think I have. Is there a system in vogue in the Asylum, and was there when you were there, that the behavior of a patient, his observance of the rules of the institution Avas taken into consideration in passing him from a disturbed Avard to a better ward ? A. His ability to control himself was the main consideration. Q. I will repeat the question. The stenographer will please read it to the witness. (Question read). Q. " Is there a system in vogue in the Asylum, and was there when you were there, that the behavior of a patient, his observance of the rules of the institution, was taken into consideration in passing him from a disturbed ward to a better ward ?" A. Yes, sir. Q. Do you regard his ability to control himself in this matter of the observation of the rules ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And if he disobeyed the rules in any way, you would ascribe it to the fact that he was unable to control himself; is that so ? A. In a majority of cases, yes, sir. Q. In all cases? A. I presume it might not be in all cases ; but mainly so. Q. And when there was a man who did disobey the rules and was put on to a disturbed ward, would you detain him longer on a dis- turbed ward for that reason ? A. Oh, no. 901 Q, Do you say that that never was done ? A. It never was done to my knowledge, unless he — to qualify that unless he by his actions disturbed other patients enough to retard their recovery ; I do not recollect any such instance; but I would like to put that in. Q. You presume there might have been such cases ? A. I don't remember any ; I presume there might have been. Q. Suppose the case of a patient required to perform manual labor out of doors; they were required to do that, were they not ? A. No, sir, they were not in my time; whatever work is done outside is purely voluntary, entirely so. Q. And while you were there did the patients never object to do any such work when they wer6 required to do it ? A. They were never required to do it. Q. And there is no service required to be done by patients ? A. It was understood that a man made his bed, if they were well and able to ; a good many did not do it; I don't know that that is required of them; some did not know how to and did not want to. Q. And if they did not want to, you say they would not be re- quired to do even that ? A. No; there is no way that you can require them to; there was no rule on the subject and no way of coercing a man to do any thing that he did not want to do. Q. So that when a patient did not want to do any thing of that kind you simply had some one else do it for him, and let it go at that? A. Yes, sir; that was all there was of it. Q. Then as I understand you there are no. rules or regulations in regard to the conduct of the patients, that is, how a patient shall conduct and demean himself ? A. Well, I was only speaking of the matter of work. Q. And there are rules and regulations, are there not. as to the conduct and demeanor of the patients themselves ? A. There were none that I remember ; of course you could not en- force a rule against an insane man, and could not make a rule that would apply in such a case. Q. And of course if there were no rules to break, a patient could not have been sent from one ward to another for breaking them ? A. No, sir; there was no system of reAvards and punishments; there was no such system, and it could not be made to work in such a place. Mr. Hasklll — That is all. 902 HORATIO N. DRYER, Recalled. By Mr. Goodwin : Q. You have testified before the committee that all the accounts and books relating to the business part of the institution are under your charge ? A. Yes, sir. Q. With a book-keeper? A. Yes, sir; except the treasurer's book; I don't know any thing about them; the books of the institution are kept at my office. Q. Have you at my request examined the bills of Butler & Ham- ilton of the last six months and compared them Avith the original purchase bills of Butler & Hamilton ? A. Yes, sir; I have. Q. With what result ? A. I found them to agree with the arrangement that was made with Butler & Hamilton to sell to us at their purchase-price, adding five per cent; I found no variation in the six months. Q. Did you in the fall of 1882 make up a statement to the board of managers from the books and accounts of the Asylum at the re- quest of the auditing committee of the board ? A. I did ; I caused it to be made and assisted in making it. Q. Does that statement exhibit the number of cattle purchased during the year 1882 ? A. I don't know that it exhibits the number of cattle; it gives their weight and price per pound. Q. And of whom purchased ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And the aggregate? A. Yes, sir. Q. Does it give the total weight ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And the average price of each year ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How was this request made to you, Mr. Dryer ? A. It came to me through Dr. Gray, as made to him by the auditing committee. Q. Was it in writing ? A. No, sir ; I do not think it was given to me in writing. Q. Did that statement also embrace the number of sheep and lambs ? ' A. Yes, sir; it gave the weight of the sheep, and the number «f the lambs; and the lambs were bought as they stood. £ Q. Did it also give in regard to sugars? A. Yes, sir. Q. And from whom purchased ? A. Yes, sir. 903 Q. Price and weight ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And did it give the aggregate weight ? A. It did. Q. And the price for two years ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did it also embrace the price of butter ? A. Yes, sir. Q. In the same detail as to weight and price ? A. Yes, sir; and the average. Q. Have you that statement ? A. I have an abstract of it with me; the statement I have not here. Q. Did it embrace also the purchase of flour ? A. Yes, sir. Q. The number of barrels ? A. Yes; and the average price per barrel. Q. And the total number of barrels ? A. Yes, sir; we could not get'at the average without having the total number of barrels. Q. For the year 1881 and 1882 ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Will you produce that statement ? (Produced and marked " Exhibit No. 25, J. H. M." See Appendix.) Q. When was this statement presented to the auditing committee? A. I think it was in the latter part of December. Mr. Rice — Find out if this is a copy of that statement or an abstract. Mr. Goodavin — It is a copy of the aggregate. Q. What is this paper ? Mr. Rice wants to know. A. It is an abstract of the full statement that was made. Q. Have you the detailed statement ? A. It is in my office ; the abstract was made by our book-keeper, Mr. Sanders. By Mr. Haskell : Q. When it was made, was it compared by you ? A. Yes, sir; it was compared by me. Q. So that you know it is correct ? A. I believe it to be correct; from a comparison of it with the detailed statement, I believe it is correct. Mr. Goodwin — Now, I offer it in evidence. (Admitted. See Appendix for said paper.) By Mr. Goodwin : Q. Now I ask you when that statement was presented to the auditing committee ? 904 A. It was late in December, 1882. Q. Now, I will ask you, has your attention ever been called by the auditing committee, through the superintendent, at any time during the past few years, to the cost of mill feed for the cows ? A. Yes, sir ; it has. Q. And where it has varied in price ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Is there a variety of such feed ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Have you made purchases with reference to its varieties ? A. I have. Q. Have you talked with Mr. D. D. Winston in regard to feed ? A. I am not certain that I have with regard to feed, but I have with regard to other supplies. Q. Has he ever spoken to you on the subject of feed ? A. No, sir, not that I remember; if I have, it has been in a gen- eral way when I purchased feed of him or his firm. Q. Has he ever talked with you on the question of the purchase of supplies ? A. Yes, sir ; well, flour, more particularly. Q. When was that ? A. Frequently. Q. Can you give any time ? A. I cannot name the time, except I think that the most important conversation I ever had on the subject, I think, was in June last; he had said to me from time to time, previously to that, that he kept flour for sale; I purchased and found it did not answer our purpose as well as another variety. Q. Then you cannot fix the time any more than it was the last of June on one occasion ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And you have talked with him on several occasions in regard to it? A. Yes, sir, in a general way. By Mr. Haskell : Q. Both before and after he became a manager of the institution ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Have you been in the habit of purchasing of the firm of which he is a member ? A. I have somewhat. By Mr. Goodwin: Q. Have you purchased flour of him before he became a member of the board of managers ? A. I think so, yes, sir. Q. Has he offered flour to you ? A. Before he was a manager ? 905 Q. Yes, sir. A. Yes, sir. Q. Since he has been a manager have you'purchased flour of him ? A. I have. Q. And purchased oat meal of him ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Have you talked with him in reference to the purchase of flour out of the city ? A. No, sir. Q. I mean as to the advisability of purchasing out of the city? A. No, sir, he gave no advice and offered none. Q. Have you talked Avith him about the Minnesota flour ? A. I have. Q. When was that ? A. He said to me that they were selling the Pillsbury flour, manufactured at Minneapolis ; I inquired the price; he told me, and I told him that Ave were getting the Minnesota flour considerably less. Q. What price did he give you ? A. Eight dollars. Q. And you told you were buying flour at considerably less; what followed ? A. Yes, sir, that Ave were buying flour at Minnesota that cost us less than $6, a little less than that, $5.90, I think. Mr. Brown—Mr. GoodAvin, have him designate the brand of flour. Q. Mr. BroAvn Avantsyou to designate the kind of flour ? A. I did not tell him, but I can tell you, it was that manufactured at St. Peter, Minn., by Sackett & Co.," "Diamond Bluff," "River Side," " Oshawa." By Mr. Brown : Q. Do you buy the best brand ? A. Bought them all ? Q. Did you buy the best brand that they had for $6 ? A. No, I do not say that; but it was such a flour as we wanted for our use. By Mr. Goodwin : Q. Any thing else in that conversation with Mr. Winston that you remember ? A. He was very persistent in declaring that I could not get Min- nesota flour for any thing like what I stated ; 1 said then I would join issue with him, and convince him; and Ave left it at that; there was nothing more said ; I did not buy his flour at that time. Q. Will you be kind enough to state if you have purchased oat- meal in the city here, and if so, from wdiat dealers ? A. I purchased largely from J. G. Egert. 114 U 906 Q. Who else * A. Head & Winston. Q. Who else? A. I don't recollect any others iioav. Q. Have you got those bills Avith you ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Will you produce them ? (Bills produced by witness.) Q. Were these purchases made of Messrs. Head & Winston since he became a manager of the institution ? A. Yes, sir, I think so; in June, 1883. Q. What bill have you there ? A. Head & Winston's bill commencing with June, 1883. Q. How much oat-meal did you buy of him? A. Two barrels. Q. What did you pay him for it ? A. Eight dollars a barrel. Q. Did you buy the same oat-meal from Egert? A. I did; well, I cannot say that it was all made by the same parties. Q. What did you give for Egert's oat-meal ? A. Seven dollars and seventy-five cents. Q. Can you state what brand of oat-meal it Avas you purchased of Head & Winston ? A. No, sir. Q. Can you state what brand you purchased from Egert ? A. No, sir, not noAv. Q. Did you purchase it, supposing it to be the same oat-meal ? A. The same quality of meal I suppose. Mr. Rice — What he " supposes " is unfair ; does he know ? Mr. Goodwin — Did you purchase it believing — Mr. Rice — No ; was it the same. Q. Well, Avas it the same oat-meal ? A. The same quality ; I Iciioav no difference in the use of it, noth- ing Avhatever; it was no better in the use we put it to, which was the same as the other, and it Avas no better than the other. Q. (By Mr. Rice.) Which did you purchase first ? A. I purchased it at Egert's before and after. Q. When was the purchase made from Egerts ; the first one ? A. I don't know noAv. Q. I mean from that bill that you have there ? A. This bill is March, 1883. Q. What is the amount of oat-meal that you purchased of Head & Winston ? A. Two barrels at different times. Q. And how much of Egert? A. Here on these bills, we had five. Q What are the aggregate purchases of Head & Winston, since Mr. Winston has been a manager? A. Of any thing ? 907 Q. Yes; the aggregate ? A. Tavo barrels of oat-meal; I can tell from the bill; there was flour, we had a barrel at a time, pastry flour, sometimes three bar- rels of Pillsbury flour; from the month of June to August, 1883, we had $109.15. Q. Is that a fair average for the year ? A. We have had more and less; I don't know whether that would be a fair average or not for the quarter ; I think it is larger than the average. Q. What would you say the average wTas ? A. I could not say ; I have the means of ascertaining exactly and accurately, but I cannot say here. Q. Why did you buy at Head & Winston's at a greater price than you could purchase elsewhere ? A. I don't know that I have any special reason that I can give; I Avas in the habit of buying tliere sometimes, and was in there and bought it; and after the conversation with Mr. Winston as to the price of flour, I bought another one for the purpose of ascertaining whether he would sell to us, as other dealers did in his own neigh- borhood ; that is the reason Avliy I bought the second barrel. Q. State what you paid for the flour you bought of Mr. Win- ston? A. For pastry flour I paid $6.25, $6.50 and $6.40. Q. In regard to the number of loaves of bread, did you make any experiments ? A. That was with the Pillsbury flour; I took the purchase of Pillsbury'flour, three barrels, and three barrels of flour we were us- ing ; purchased of another party altogether, Mr. Owen; we paid for the Pillsbury flour $8 a barrel, and for the other $6.25 and took them, this was after the conversation with Mr. Winston to that effect; I told him I wanted to try them ; he had said so much about the product of bread from the Pillsbury flour, and I said I wanted to make an experiment. Q. What was the experiment ? Did you make it ? A. We made it, made up the three barrels of each, and we had the bread weighed ; the bread from the Neosha, made from the same kind of wheat — Minnesota spring wheat — the bread from that Avas six hundred and seventy pounds, the bread from the three barrels of Pillsbury's flour was six hundred and two pounds; sixty-eight pounds difference. Q. Has Mr. Winston spoken to you on the subject of the purchase of supplies for the Asylum since April, 1883, as a member of the auditing committee of the board of managers? A. No, sir. By Mr. Brown : Q. I w7ould like to ask here, if there was any difference in the quality of bread made from these two kinds of flour? 908 A. There might be a little, but not enough to make up for the difference in quantity to give to our people. Q. Are you aware that the Pillsbury flour, or any of those high patent flours has to be kneaded in a different way from the common flour, to get the best results attainable? A. Yes, sir, Ave are perfectly aAvare of it; our baker understood it, I believe. Q. They have to have experience, do they not ? A. He has had experience. Q. It has got to be worked and kneaded differently from common flour, or you do not get good results? A. Yes, sir. By Mr. Goodwin (resuming): Q. Is it a fact that productions of the Asylum farm paid for by State labor is sold again to the State ? A. No, sir, not under any conceivable condition. Q. Is the milk of cows owned by the State, and purchased and fed on the Asylum farm, sold to the State? A. I answer very positively with regard to that, that it is not, un- less feeding it out to the patients avIio pay the Asylum for their maintenance maybe called selling it to the State; all "the product of the farm, almost without exception, is consumed in the house by the people tliere; the milk is all used in the house, none of it goes to any other purpose that I know of; I presume that impression is taken from the statement that appears in our annual report; it is simply an exhibit of what the farm produces, and the prices affixed to the articles, whatever they are, is the same as the prices that the articles are commanding in the market; it is a statement that I make annually to present to the managers. Q. Is there a combination of merchants in the city of Utica who have a corner in supplying necessaries to sustain life to the patients in the State Lunatic Asylum ? # A. Not to my knowledge; I am not aware of any such organiza- tion or corner. By Mr. Brown : Q- Will you please tell this committee Avhat course you pursue in order to make yourself conversant with the wholesale prices of the products you buy for the Utica Asylum ? A. I examine the market reports ; I converse with men purchasing the same kind of articles to get their views. Q. Do you consider that the goods you buy at Butler & Hamil- ton's are at wholesale prices ? A. Yes, sir. Q. I see by this bill that you are charged $3.25 for a sack of Ash- ton salt; do you consider that the wholesale price of that article ? A. I know it is a good deal less than we have paid for it. 909 Q. Have you seen any quotations that will warrant you in saying that $3.25 is the wholesale price for Ashton salt? A. Perhaps not of late ; I have noticed of late, it is high perhaps, if the Ashton salt is at all of one Aveight, I am not certain that it is. Q. When you come to Utica, what is your manner in doing ; have you a slip made up when you start from the Asylum ? A. Memorandum, yes, sir. Q. Do you examine goods in different stores in Utica and inquire as to the price ? A. I do sometimes, not ahvays. Q. Do you ever find any variation in the prices ? A. No, sir, not to any extent. Q. In the bills of Butler & Hamilton's tliere are several items of " SnoAV Flake Crackers," fifteen cents a pound ; are you willing to swear that that is the wholesale price for snow flake crackers ? A. I don't knoAV, the item is so small that I did not think much of it. Q. Have you ever examined or inquired to find out if that was the wholesale price or not ? A. I have not in any place but that. Q. Take this item of " timothy seed " of Butler & Hamilton's $2.60 and $2.70, do you know that the price charged by them is the wholesale price ? A. No, sir, I don't know what it was ; it was the price that others Avere selling at, Avhether wholesale or retail. Q. Have you any means of informing this committee the amount of supplies that goes to Dr. Gray for his own use ? A. No, sir, I have not. Q. Who would knoAV that ? A. Let me understand the question. Q. It is this : have you any means of telling the amount of arti- cles that are bought exclusively for Dr. Gray's family, for instance, articles that he uses that are not used in the Asylum ? A. No, sir, I have not. Q. Are there any articles purchased for Dr. Gray and his family that are not bought for the Asylum ? A. I do not purchase any ; if there are any he purchases them himself. By Mr. Morgan : Q. Through what source is the bill paid ? A. The same as the others are paid. Q. Whoever made the purchase, the bill would be presented and paid in the same way as the others ? A. Yes, sir; they go through my hands; all the bills do. By Mr. Rice : Q. Then are you not able to answer the question as to whether 910 any such articles are furnished to the family of Dr. Gray that are not furnished generally for the inmates of the Asylum ? A. Oh, I know there are articles furnished to him that are not furnished for the inmates, but not that are not furnished for the officers' department. By Mr. Brown : Q. State whether or not the officers of the institution are furnished with several extras that the inmates do not have, that the State pay for ; what Ave consider extras, for instance, Florida oranges? A. Most of those are for patients, and paid for by the patients; very few others. Q. What do you say to the item in the bill of McQuade's, of a high priced wine at $27.00 ? A. I don't know any thing about that. Q. You do not know what that Avas for? A. It was said to have been purchased for medicine, and I have included it in that, in the bills of medicines. Q. In this bill of Thomas & Co., 365 pounds cod ? A. That goes to the house. Q. At tAvelve cents per pound ; are you willing tosAvear that that Avas the Avholesale price of cod ? A. I think that is an exceptional bill ; sometimes it is difficult to procure it |at all; more frequently it is less than price; his bills usually are eight cents. By Mr. Haskell : Q. When he charged tAvelve cents, did you make any effort to procure it elsewhere at a loAver figure ? A. No, sir. Q. Did you at that time buy fish of any other firm ? A. Yes, sir ; Ave bought fish out of toAvn. Q. Is Mr. Thomas a dealer in Utica? A. Yes, sir. By Mr. Broavn : Q. Did you ever send for prices and samples to any wholesale firms for goods outside of Utica ? A. For some kinds of goods ; and Ave have a great many sent to us. Q. What kind ? A. For dry goods and clothing. Q. Has there been any dry goods or clothing or groceries bought outside of Utica for the last year ? A. Yes, sir. Q. To what amount, please state ? A. Not very large. Q. Can't you state the amount ? A. One hundred and fifty dollars. 911 Q. Have the prices quoted to you by firms outside of Utica been such that you have found it to be to your advantage to purchase in Utica; have you felt warranted in purchasing at Utica because of any advantage in the price ? A. For groceries we do not go out of town. Q. And do not make inquiries as to what you could buy for out of town ? A. No, sir; as I have stated before, and it is apparent to anybody who knows any thing about it, it is an arrangement made thirty years ago, to have our heavy groceries furnished by contract; I never have changed it; the prices — the percentage on them has been varied once or twice, once certainly, since I have been there, and an attempt made to do it at another time. ♦ By Mr. Haskell : Q. Who made the attempt ? A. Where was it made? Q. Who made it ? A. The Asylum. Q. What was done about it ? A. We called for bids. Q. Of w7hom? A. Crouse Bros Avas the first one; D. Crouse & Sons, when they were in business where Head & Winston are ; and Comstock Broth- ers ; and Butler & Hamilton. Q. When was it; what year? A. I cannot give you the date, it was tAvelve or fourteen years ago; and there has been one time since then. Q. When was that? A. 1 should say it was as late as 1876 ; 1875 or 1876 ; the deal- ers were called on to present bids. Q. How was notice given ? A. It was done by the managers'; I can't say ; they can answer for themselves; I don't know Iioav, but I know Mr. Crouse put in his bid. and no one else did at that time that I remember, except Butler & Hamilton. Q. And Butler & Hamilton's Avas the lowest ? A. Yes, sir; by the freight from New York on all goods they were to furnish, which was almost as much as the percentage they got, it was said. Q. What goods did the bids cover ? A. Covered the same as Butler & Hamilton's; such as sugar, mo- lasses, rice, tea and coffee. By Mr. Brown : Q. Did it include two grades of tea ? A. No, sir. Q. What grades did it include ? & 912 A. Black tea. Q. In Butler & Hamilton's bill you are charged sixty cents per pound for Japan tea; are you willing to swear that that was the wholesale price of that tea ? A. I don't know what thev call it. Q- What did you call it ? " A. I called it a very good purchase; it was an excellent quality of tea. Q. Where did you get your knowledge to base an opinion that paying sixty cents per pound for Japan tea w7as a good purchase ? A. From all my experience in the past. Q. Don't you know that the highest price tea — the best tea im- ported — was at that time being sold by H. K. Thurber & Co , of New York, at fifty cents per pound; the best Japan tea that could be pro- cured in the market ? A. I can not say what H. K. Thurber & Co. did ; I know what the dealers here do ; I can go out and buy a tea for fifteen cents a pound. Q. I will repeat my question; don't you know it to be a fact, that wholesale firms in Albany and New York sold the best imported Japan tea at fifty cents a pound ? A. No, sir ; I don't know that. By Mr. Haskell : Q. Did you buy the best Japan tea of Butler & Hamilton ? A. I don't know; I think not; I think they had a tea that was higher priced than that; but we have not bought it since the change in prices in tea. Q. You think you buy a second grade ? A. No, sir, I think Ave buy the first now. Q. The very best grade ? A. Yes, sir.;} By Mr. Brown : Q. Here is a bill of McQuaid Brothers, eighteen gallons of brandy at $6 per gallon. Do you think it is for the interest of the State Lunatic Asylum and the interest of the State to buy high-priced brandy ? A. I have no responsibility in that matter. Q. 1 ask you what is your opinion in that respect ? A. Well, my opinion—I want to state facts; I do not buy it, I don't know the use of it, or the A7alue of the different prices of liquors at all; I never have been required to make purchases except under special directions. Q. (By Mr. Morgan.) Who does make the purchase of the liquors ? A. Dr. Gray selects them. By Mr. Haskell : Q. Personal? 913 A. Yes, sir. Q. What is you judgment whether you can buy the line of groceries that you buy of Butler & Hamilton, of wholesale firms at a less rate than you buy of Butler & Hamilton ; what is your per- sonal judgment ? A. My personal judgment is that those articles under contract, I, could not buy to any better advantage anywhere. Q. In the State of New York ? A. No, sir. Q. And how as to the other articles not included in the contract? A. I don't know that I can, them. Q. What is your judgment ? A. I don't think I can. Q. You think then that you are buying at the best possible rates you can"obtain for the institution ? A. I think so. Q. What means have you taken to inform yourself of that fact, if you have taken any ? A. From what I see of the dealers in the same articles. Q. What dealers? A. All our dealers, Avhere I have occasion to know any thing about them. Q. Name them ? A. The best dealers. Q. What steps have you taken, or what efforts have you made to ascertain ? A. Not any special effort, because these articles were all arranged for; and I have not felt disposed to interfere with it, as I did not make it, and I have had no instructions to change it. Q. And you do not consider yourself at all responsible for the arangement ? A. No, sir ; not for the arrangement. Q. If it should be brought to yonr knowledge that you could buy these goods cheaper elseAvhere, you would not feel justified in buy- ing elseAvhere ? A. Any thing that is not under the contract ? Q. Those that are under the contract ? A. No, sir; I should not. Q. You would not consider it your duty to take any steps in the matter ? A. Yes; I should think it my duty to take steps; I would talk with the parties in interest, who have a right to direct, and would recommend a change. Q. You have taken no pains to find out whether these goods could be obtained for a less price during the past few years ? A. No, sir ; I have not. 115 U 914 By Mr. Brown : Q. Does Butler & Hamilton deliver to you the original bills of these goods upon which they add a percentage of five per cent? ., A. Yes, sir. Q. From whom do they purchase ? A. I don't know; they purchase from whom they please. pTQ. Do they purchase in New York city ? A. Yes ; and they purchase for cash. Q. Is the freight added ? A. No, sir; not on our original bills; that was the difference between Butler & Hamilton's and Crouse Bro.'s; it Avas the same percentage, but they added the freight, and the board of managers, or the auditing committee, decided not to change it; Ave went so far as to get samples and prices and compare them, that is, of Crouse Brothers and Butler & Hamiltons. Q. Can you deliver to this committee the bills that Butler & Hamilton give you to correspond with the bills Ave iioav have of Butler & Hamilton? A. I can with their consent; I do not have their bills except to compare and examine, and I am not at liberty to give them to any- body else, except with their consent. Q. As long as you pay them five per cent on the purchase, and take the goods, the bills virtually belong to you ? A. I do not understand it so, for we do not take the whole of their purchases at any one time; they may buy fifty barrels of sugar, and we may get ten of them. Q. For instance, they buy a bill of molasses of different grades; Avhat knoAvledge have you that they deliver to you the same that they claim to have bought for you ?' A. We knoAV something about the brand of molasses, whether it is New Orleans, or any other kind of molasses. \ Q. There are different grades of New Orleans molasses? pA. I don't know but there may be ; I presume there are. j^Q. Don't you know there are ? A. I don't from my personal knowledge; I know there is a variety of grades of molasses, but I do not know what causes it or why it is so. Q. How do you distinguish as to the tea, that you have what you call for in quality and quantity ? A. I don't know Iioav a person knows any thing unless he trusts honorable men in dealing; I think we can rely on their statement " this is the tea we bought at that price, we sell it to you at that price," and we take their weight. Q. Don't you know every chest of tea is marked with the weight gross and tare, upon it ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do you compare that with the bill? .. ,r A. Yes, sir; and we weigh the chests of tea. 915 Q. Is it not necessary that a man should be well posted in regard to prices and qualities to know about such matters ? A. Yes, sir ; I suppose it is. By Mr. Morgan : Q. Who makes out the bills against pay patients ? A. They are made in my office, under my direction, by the book- keeper. Q. Have you ever had any disagreement with pay patients or their friends as to the amount they Avere to pay ? A. I do not fix the price they are to pay. Q. When you have made the bill, have they ever complained to you that more was charged than they cared to pay ? A. It is generally inserted in the bond Avhat they are to pay per week. Q.^Do you remember the case of Giles Comstock of NeAV Hart- ford, whose Avife was tliere ? A. No, sir. Q. Do you remember of his making the claim that an arrangement was made for his Avife there at four dollars per Aveek, and that you were charging him six? A. No, sir; I do not think that there was any such arrangement made; six dollars is the minimum price for private patients and four dollars for public patients : if there is any arrangement for a private patient at four dollars, it was not according to the rules of the institution. Q. Do yon remember the case of Mr. Comstock's Avife? A. No, sir; I do not settle with them any more than to settle with the treasurer at the price named in the bond, or named to him by the doctor, who regulates that under or by the board of mana- gers. Q. When Dr. Gray buys liquor that is charged to the institution, what is done with that liquor when it is delivered to the Asylum ? A. It is usually put into a place Ave have on purpose for such things, a cellar, or is taken directly to the apothecaries. Q. When any portion of it is drawn, what is the proceeding in order to entitle a person to draw from that liquor? A. As I say, it is in the hands of the apothecary, for medical pur- poses, as I understand it; that is all I know about it; I know it goes to him. Q. Suppose Dr. Gray wants liquor, does he have to make an order for it, or give a receipt ? > A. I do not know any thing about it; he does not call on me about it. Q. Who would be the person to knoAv that? A. He would be the one to knoAV, Dr. Gray, and the person to whom he would give directions to draAv it; I don't knoAV avIio that would be. 916 Q. And whatever he'wanted, he would either draw, or cause it to be drawn ? A. It is a matter that has never come under my observation. Q. No question has been made of that to yon ? A. No, sir. Q. But the purchase of it is reported to you, and you put it on the books as a claim against the Asylum ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And it is paid for out of the Asylum funds? A. Yes, sir. Q. Is that the case with all such matters that are furnished to Dr. Gray's family ? A. So far as I know it is. Q. In your depaitment there is no separate account kept for Dr. Gray's family ? A. No, sir. By Mr. Haskell : Q. Has tliere been a meeting of the board of managers recently at the Asylum ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Were you present ? A. No, sir; I do not remember that I was in the room at all; oh, yes, perhaps I was; I think I did step in and handed in a paper that was asked for; I was not present at their deliberations. Q. Do you know whether the question of the finances of the Asylum was under consideration ? A. I do not. By Mr. Morgan : Q. Do yon know what subjects were under consideration by the board of managers ? A. I do not. Q. At the recent meeting they had ? A. No, sir ; I do not. Q. Were all the managers present — all the board ? A. I can't say; no, sir; Mr. Lawrence is in Florida, and General McQuade was not there; I do not kno'Av who was tliere. Q. Was there any investigation made by the board of managers, at meeting, of your books of accounts? A. By individual members of the board, I think. Q. Were any errors found in your books of accounts? A. I did not hear of any. Q. None reported to ou ? A. No, sir. Q. And you were not called to explain any ? A. No, sir. Q. What paper was it they called upou you for that you delivered to them ? 917 A. I think it was small ones that has been introduced or spoken of here to-night, Q. Of the bills ? A. No, sir ; it was that matter of flour, the two kinds of flour. By Mr. Goodwin : Q. When a purchase is made by the Asylum, of liquor, if it is not brought home in Dr. Gray's pockets, or by him, how is it brought ? A. It is sometimes sent by the person selling it, and sometimes carried up by our teams. Q. Where is it delivered at the Asylum? A. I believe now, uniformly at the apothecary's room. Q. Does the apothecary take a receipt for it ? A. I do not know we have all brought in that same way. Mr. Brown — Ask him Avhere the cigars are delivered that are bought for the institution. Q. Mr. Brown wants me to ask you where the cigars are delivered that are bought for the institution? A. I don't know whether they are bought for it. By Mr. Brown : Q. Don't you know that there are some purchases of cigars, and that you have the bill for them in your office ? A. I don't remember it; if so I presume it was bought for visi- tors, but I can't say ; oh, yes, I wi 1 teL you ; I bought those ciga s for a patient and they were charged to his account and paid for by him ; if you had looked the matter up, you would have found them charged to the patient avIio smoked them. Q. Do you charge a profit on any articles purchased for the patients ? A. Yery little, not generally. Q. Do you charge a profit on the oranges ? A. No, sir ; we charge them the same as we pay. Q. Upon what articles purchased to patients do you charge a profit upon ? A. Where we pay a bill of clothing, we sometimes get as high as two, sometimes four and sometimes ten cents a garment ;it depends on the cost of it; it is more for convenience that any thing else ; we do not make much profit out of the pa ients in that way. By Mr. Goodwin : Q. What other articles, if any, do you make a profit on in that institution ? A. I do not think of any thing else. Mr. Swan — Ask him where the profit goes. Q. Where does it go ? A. It goes into the fund of the institution ; it is paid for when the patient's bill is paid. L \ -? 918 THEODORE POMEROY, recalled. By Mr. Goodwin : Q. Were you at the meeting of the board of managers held in April last ? ,.-,,,. A. I will look at this book (the records of the board meetings) and see. ■<# By Mr. Haskell : Q. Do you not knoAV without referring to your book whether yon were present or not ? A. No, sir, I can't carry that in my head (refers to the book); yes, sir, I was there, 21th April. Q. Was Mr. Winston at that meeting appointed a member of the auditing committee ? A. Tliere is no record of such appointment here. Mr. Swan — I think it was an earlier date than that? Witness —It was at the meeting of April 10th; I was present at that meeting. Q. Do you remember any conversation at that meeting in refer- ence to the importance of placing a neAV man on the auditing com- mittee ? \ A. Yes, sir, I do. Q. State what was said in substance ? A. Mr. Winston was placed there, as I understand it and remem- ber it, because he was familiar with the supplies purchased so largely by the Asylum ; and being a member of the board avIio was familiar with such things, he Avas put on that committee. Q. In whose place was he put on that committee ? A. In place of Judge Coxe ; I believe he resigned ; Judge Coxe had been a member of the committee on audits ; I don't knoAV how long, but not long ; I find on referring to my records that Mr. LoAvery was appointed in place of Judge Coxe. Q. And Avhen was Mr. Winston appointed on the auditing com- mittee, if at all? A. It AA7as at the meeting of March 23, 1883 ; Mr. Winston was substituted in place of Mr. LoAvery ; that Avas a special meeting. Q. You will have to refer to your records again — that must be an error — you said it Avas April just iioav ? A. On referring to the records, I find it Avas May, and not March ; I Avrote May with a pencil, and Avhen I came to write it with ink, I wrote it March; that Avas an error ; May is the month ; it should be May 23. Q. Was there any criticism made by any of the managers there at 919 either the April or May meeting in relation to the methods then fol- lowed in regard to the purchasing of supplies for the Asylum ? A. I don't remember of any. Q. Were you at the meeting of the board in December, 1883 ? A. Yes, sir; that was the annual meeting. Q. Was the matter of supplies brought before the board at that meeting by any member of the board ? A. General McQuade brought the matter before the board, Avhen he made his report as chairman of the auditing committee. Q. Was any thing else said in regard to it? A. There Avas some considerable conversation in regard to the supplies on the part of General McQuade and other members of the board ? Q. Did Mr. Winston speak ? . • A. He did. Q. Did he make any suggestions? A. He did ; there were one or two objections or questions asked in regard to prices on certain bills ; one in regard to shavings, and meal; General McQuade spoke of the bill of shavings, that seemed to him large ; a satisfactory explanation Avas given, and Mr. Winston then spoke in regard to some other matter, some other bill; I be- lieve it was meal; he asked Dr. Gray some question in regard to that, and there was a general conversation in regard to it. Q. Did he speak in any Avay of the general management of the purchasing of supplies ? A. Not othenvise than the other members of the .board, so far'as I remember. Q. Did Dr. Gray, at that meeting state in substance that he should be pleased to adopt any manner of purchasing supplies? A. Yes, he did, as he ahvays does Avhenever the subject is up. Q. Was tliere a motion or resolution passed to refer the matter to the auditing committee to report upon the subject? A. I think there Avas; (referring to book of records of board meetings) yes, sir, this is it ; "on motion of Mr. Lowery, resolved, that the matter of the purchasing supplies, etc., for the use of the Asylum be referred to the auditing committee to report to the board such action as they recommend for adoption." Adjourned until to-morroAV morning at nine o'clock. 920 Friday, March 28, 1884. The committee re-assembled at 9:30, a. m., in room No. 23, Baggs Hotel. Present — Messrs. Hoave, Haskell, Rice and Brown. THEODORE POMEROY. Examination resumed. By Mr. Goodwin: Q. When Ave adjourned last evening, you had just completed the reading of an entry from your record ; that resolution Avas at the annual meeting on December 11, Avas it not, Mr. Pomeroy? Mr. J. R. Savann — I would ask him to state what took place at the meeting. Q. There Avas no particular attention drawn by any manager to the general management of the purchase of supplies ? A. No, sir ; there was no criticism upon it, but a desire to im- prove it; if the auditing committee would recommend some mode of improvement; Dr. Gray said, in regard to the shavings they were used instead of straAv, because they were cheaper than straw in bedding horses ; in regard to the meal, Mr. Winston asked about that and the doctor said that that meal they bought contained a large proportion of buckwheat and made it more valuable as a milk producing article for cows and in that sense he consider it cheaper than buying a lower grade that had less of that quality in it. Q. What did he say about adopting any plan the board of man- agers might suggest in the way of purchasing supplies in the way of economy or saving money for the Asylum ? A. I don't know that he said much about ; it Dr. Gray is always ready to adopt any plan and is obliged to, that the managers sug- gest, and no one was inclined to adopt a plan suggested by the com- mittee more than Dr. Gray. Q. Did Mr. Winston produce the bills of Butler & Hamilton at that meeting ? A. I don't think he had any bills of anybody; I do not remember of having seen or heard of any bills produced by Mr. Winston at that meeting. Q. Have yon heard his testimony read ? A. Yes, sir; probaoly the greater part of it, I have heard. Q. Did he refer, to your knowledge, at any meeting of the board to the prices of any items contained in any bills of Butler & Ham- ilton ? 921 A. I don't remember that he referred to their bills at all, either in general or particular at any meeting. Mr. Goodwin — I refer to page 261 of the testimony which I will read: "Do you think the pay of the attendant, is sufficient, considering the nature of their duties and their hours of labor? A. I do not think it any too much, although I have ex- pressed myself frequently in the board that I thought, particularly in the women's department, they were not paid high enough." Did you ever hear Mr. Winston so express himself frequently ? A. I know the subject was talked of, and he may have joined in the conversation ; very likely he did ; I don't know whether he did or not ; it was an impression that he had; that it would secure bet- ter service if there was an increase of pay on the part of the attend- ants, particularly the women. Q. At page 264 Mr. Winston says: " As I have said very fre- quently that the articles could be sold to the Asylnm to better ad- vantage than they Avere getting, and when I came to audit the bills I saw that a great part of those goods could be obtained at a good deal less money;" has he said any such thing to you? A. Individually, outside of the board ? Q. Yes, sir ; before this investigation at any time ? A. I have had some conversation with him since he was at Albany.* Q. Previous to that ? A. I don't remember having had any conversation with him on the subject previous to that. Q. And you have heard no such expression from him on the! sub- ject, except as you have stated ? A. I remember no other. Q. On page 264 ; has he stated, to your knowledge, to the board or the superintendent that the Asylum could buy to better advant- age buying such articles as sugar, molasses and goods in the grocery line at wholesale ? A. To the board or to the superintendent ? Q. As he stated it to the board or superintendent; either, take the board first ? A. I don't remember of any specific statement on that question any further than that might be inferred from the general discussion of that question — that general subject at the board. Q. Have you ever heard him state it to the superintendent in your presence ? A. No, sir, I have not. Q. I call your attention uoav, to pages 267 and 268, and will read it: " Is there any thing else on the bill ?;" the next thing is " pow- dered sugar, one barrel, " there is no percentage added to that; that is put down on the bill at net; Avhen we presented our report the audit- ing committee, I inquired why it was that they made a difference in- sugars — why one was charged a certain percentage and another was not —the only reply they could give was that it had been a custom 116 U " 922 from time immemorial; I said I could not see any reason for that myself. ' Q. At what price is that item charged ? A. Nine and a half cents; that would be about the right price at that time, I should think. Q. To whom did you speak about the matter ; did, you call the attention of the steward to it ? A. No, sir; Dr. Gray; it was an open m eting of the board. Q. Was the steAvard present at the meeting ? A. No, sir ; be was not there ; Dr. Gray was there. Q. And did Dr. Gray say that it had been the custom from time immemorial ? A. Yes, sir; that it was so when he came into the establishment. Q. I ask you in the first place w7hether Mr. Winston said any thing about that in the board ? A. There was talk about — perhaps about various articles; I don't remember about sugar. Q. The question is Avhen the committee bad presented its report at the December meeting, did Mr. Winston inquire why it was they made a difference in each case, Avhy one was charged a certain per- centage and another Avas not ? A. I don't remember any such conversation or any such question. Q. Do you remember whether or not Dr. Gray said the reason was it had been the custom from time immemorial, and that it Avas so when he came into the establishment ? A. I don't remember that Dr. Gray ever used any such term or conversation. Q. Would you have remembered it if he had said it ? A. I should have remembered it, for it would have been an ex- traordinary thing to say; if he said it I should have remembered it. Q. According to your recollection no such conversation took place ? A. Dr. Gray said nothing of the kind that I heard. Q. Now turn to page 270; " Q. You say that the board recom- mended that you should make further inquiries; have you made further inquiry ? A. We have talked it over ; the auditing board particularly, Mr. McQuaid, once or twice since that, and the effect of it has not been obvious upon the superintendent." Has Mr. Winston remonstrated with you or the board in reference to the purchasing of things, and has there been any change in the pur- chasing of the things ? A. What Mr. Winston said to the auditing committee I don't know; I am not a member of the committee. Q. I call your attention to page 271. " Q. Do you suppose that any kind of delicacy of feeling toward Dr. Gray has prevented the bringing up of the subject? A. It may be so. Q. Do you think it likely that it has been so? 923 A. I should think very likely that the members of the board might perhaps feel rather diffident bringing up such a matter be- fore Dr. Gray." ^ Q. Then at page 270. " There has been no change in the pur- chasing of the things, they go along just as they have been going; it seems as though they got into a groove and did not know how to get out." Now, Mr. Pomeroy, has the board — are you as a mem- ber of the board — do you feel diffident about bringing up matters in the presence of Dr. Gray ? A. Not the slightest; perfect freedom to do it. Q. Have you ever knoAvn any matter to be omitted by the board out of consideration for Dr. Gray or on account of his feelings? A. I have not known of any matter of that kind. Q. What do you think it would be your duty as a manager of the Asylum ? A. It would be my duty^to recommend any improvement and I should not hesitate to do it, and there was no reason why I should i hesitate. Q. In your opinion is the board of managers of the State Lunatic Asylum " in a groove and do not know how to get out of it" ? A. I never knew we were; I have been there twelve years and I haven't been conscious of any such thing. Q. I call your attention to page 273: " Q. Do you or do you not think it would be wise to separate the purchasing department from the executive part or government of the institution now in the hands of the superintendent ? A. I have ahvays said that when I have talked on the subject, I have always expressed myself very freely, that 1 thought they should be separated, that the duties of the superintendent should be to take charge of the medical department, and of the humanitarian and sanitarian department and that the business part — the farm, the garden, the purchasing of supplies, etc.— should be in the hands of another person who should not be responsible to him, the superintendent; I have always expressed myself freely in that way ; I may not have said it to Dr. Gray, for he is very tender on that point, and I have avoided any thing that might precipitate a controversy with him on that subject. Q. Has Mr. Winston always expressed himself to you or the board that the business or medical management should be separated ? A. I don't know that he ever has. Q. And you never heard it at the board from him ? A. No, sir. Li.* .- ing of the managers ? A. That may have been; that was in my mind, c'ertainly. Q. That was one of the objects in getting together ? A. It was one of the objects in my mind, but with no idea of disciplining Mr. Winston. Mr. Goodwin—I should like to make the statement that when I read the testimony of Mr. Winstcn,.I thought it proper that the board should have a meeting abont'the matter. By the Chairman : Q. As a result of that meeting did Mr. Winston offer to make any correction of his testimony 2 A. He took a copy of the testimony away with him, and. as I understood, I cannot swrear Avhat was said, but as I understood, it was with the idea, of making an examination, and if he saw fit to correct it. Q. Have you heard from him since, whether he expects to appear \ and make any explanation of his testimony ? A. I don't think I have spoken to him since. Q. Have you met him since ? A. No, sir. Q. Do you know whether he expects to appear here ? A. I saw him on the street yesterday without speaking to him; it was at a distance. Q. Do you know whether he wishes to appear and make any explanation ? ' A. No, sir; I do not knoAV. By Mr. Rice : __ Q. Was there any excited language at this meeting ? A. No, sir. Q. Was there any excitement prevailing there? A. No, sir. ££Q. Every thing was orderly and peaceful ? A. Yes, sir; we behaved like gentlemeu; 1 don't think there was an ungentlemanly word said to Air. Winston, or by him to any one else. By Mr. Goodwin: Q.Now, Mr. Swan, you were about to give the duties of the auditing committee under the law ? 937 A. Yes; (referring to a book) I refer to the laws of 1874, re- enacting the law with reference to the State Lunatic Asylum, and there have been no amendments of it since, Ithink ; on pages 575-6, section 2, provides : § 2. Said board shall have the general direction and control of all the property and concerns of the institution, not otherwise provided for by law, and shall take charge of its general interests, and see that its great design be carried into effect, and everything done faith- fully according to the requirements of the Legislature, and the by- laws, rules and regulations of the Asylum. §18. The steAvard, under the direction of the superintendent, shall make all purchases for the Asylum, and preserve the original bills and receipts thereof, and keep full and accurate accounts of the same, and copies of all orders drawn by himself upon the treasurer; he shall also, under like direction, make contracts in the superin- tendent's name Avith the attendants and assistants, and keep and settle their accounts ; he shall also keep the accounts for the support of patients and expenses incurred in their behalf, and furnish the treasurer every month with copies of such as fall due; he shall make quarterly abstract of all accounts to the last day of every February, May, August and November, for the treasurer and managers ; he shall also be accountable for the careful keeping and economical use of all furniture, stores and other articles provided for the Asylnm. Noav in my viewT of the duty of the managers in reference to auditing the bills —it is this : we have no power under the act to audit bills, in the ordinary acceptation of the term "auditing;" that is, the board of managers has no power to say whether a bill shall be paid or shall not be paid; they have the power, as I under- stand it after examining the statute very thoroughly, they have the power simply of appointing the steward, and the steward, by the act, is given the power of purchasing, and if he makes a contract, the Asylum is bound to pay that bill ; and even if the bill is extrava- gant we have no power to prevent its being paid ; we have the power, however, if we discover that the steAArard is making extrava- gant pm chases, or is dishonest in any respect, we have the power of discharging bim, and can discharge him at any time; and it is for that reason, I think, that originally the custom Avas adopted in this institution of auditing the bills, or examining them after the bills were paid, simply because the board of managers could not stop the payment of the bills; therefore the object of this examination of the bills by the board of managers is for the purpose of ascertaining Avdiether the steAvard has been extravagant, or dishonest, or whether the treasurer has been dishonest in the performance of their duties ; and if the board of managers discover that either the steward, or the treasurer is dishonest, then they have the power of discharging them immediately and putting some one else in their place, 118 U 938 By Mr. Rice : Q. What do you say as to the wisdom of such a law as that ? A. As far as the wisdom of it is concerned, Mr. Rice, I do not think it makes any difference; I do not see what ^ good could be obtained by examining the bills before they were paid. Q. You'would be able then to discover dishonesty, if any ex- isted, prior to paying out the money, w7ouldyou not ? A. If we did, then we should look to the steward, who gives a bond, and to the treasurer, Avho also gives a bond ; should have re- course to the bond. Q. Do you think that is a proper way to get along with it — rather than to make a correction in the bills themselves —Avould it not be better in your opinion to remedy the matter in that way, than to have recourse by an action at law against the steward ? A. As to the propriety of it, you mean? Q. I am asking you what you think of the wisdom of such a law, and if you think a revision of the law is desirable so that these bills may be examined and audited before their payment? A. I do not think it w7ould make any difference. By the Chairman : Q. I call your attention to section 9 of the act of 1874 ; section 9 of chapter 446 of title third, page 576 —" The managers are hereby directed"— § 9. The managers are hereby directed and empowered to estab- lish such by-laAvs as they may deem necessary and expedient for regulating the appointment and duties of officers, attendants and as- sistants, for fixing the condition of admission, support and dis- charge of patients, and for conducting in a proper manner the busi- ness of the institution ; also to ordain and enforce a suitable system of rules and regulations for the internal government, discipline and management of the asylum. Do you not consider that that section gives full power to the board for supervising all business matters relating to the institu- tion ? A. No, sir; not with that other section giving power to the steward to purchase and make contracts. Q. Do you not consider that under this section the board has the power to make a by-law whereby they could require their auditing committee to examine these bills before payment? A. Certainly they could, there is no doubt about that. Q. Then does not the power exist to examine and audit before . payment ? A. Yes, but not to prevent their payment; they have not the power, as I understand it, to audit a bill in the ordinary acceptation of the term "audit." lf-l!.Q. Please define your understanding of the ordinary acceptation of the term "audit"? 939 A. As I understand it, it is to hear and decide whether a bill shall be paid or not. • Q. Could not the board make a by-law under section nine of that law, requiring the steAvard to make only provisional contracts for purchasing subject to the approval of the board ? A. The contracting power is in the steward and it maybe a question of laAV that I have not thought about; it might be that the board of managers could make such a rule. Q. So as to limit the steward's contracting power? A. It might be ; I Avould not like to decide that question; it might be a very nice legal question whether they could or not. Q. Do you consider, as it stands, without such a by-law that the steAvard is authorized to make unlimited contracts to bind the in- stitution under this law ? A. I think he has the power to make contracts which are not in themselves fraudulent. Q. But as to amount and character, if honestly made, he is un- limited ? A. It looks to me as if he was. By Mr. Morgan : Q. You said you would resort to the bond of the steward — have you ever resorted to it ? A. We never have had occasion to. Q. Have you ever resorted to the bond; you said that instead of rejecting the contract or refusing to pay the'bills the board of man- agers would resort to the bond of the steward ? A. In case he was dishonest, yes. Q. My question is now one that you can answer yes or no; have you ever resorted to the bond of the steward ? A. Never had occasion to. Q. Have you ever resorted to the bond of the steward ? A. We have never had occasion to. Q. Have you ever resorted to the bond of the steward; that is a fair question ; you will please answer it yes or not ? A. I said we had never had occasion to; that is an answer, and I appeal to the Chairman if it is not. The Chairman — You can say whether you have ever done that or not. The Witness — I don't understands what he means. Q. You said you would resort to the bond ? A. I said in case of dishonesty Ave had our remedy by resorting to the bond of the steward. Q. Now I ask you if you have ever resorted to it ? A. I say we have,never had occasion to. Mr. Morgan — Mr. Chairman, I insist that is a proper and a civil question, and I submit he should answer it. The Chairman — I think your answer is not strictly responsive ; 940 you can say yes or no ; whether you have ever resorted to the bond or not ? . A. Not to my knowledge. By Mr. Rice : Q. You said in ansAver to the last question I asked you that it would make no difference if the board had the power to audit be- fore payment of these bills ; I ask you why you think it would make no difference ? A. I think the result would be the same; the object of auditing, as I understand it, is the first place to discover dishonesty, and in the next place — Q. And to discover imprudent bargains to ? A. Yes, sir; I was going to say, in the second place, to discover extravagance or improvident bargains; and they can bj discovered just as Avell after as before, and the only object would be, in case there was no remedy, then it would be better to audit before; but we have that remedy. Q. Do you think if you discovered a bargain that had been made by collusion and fraud between the seller and the steward, that it could be enforced at law ? A. No, sir. -. Q. Then do you think such things as that might be prevented by the board of audit having power to examine these bills before pay- ment? A. You see, these bills are audited — Q. I am trying to get at this—whether or not, in your judg- ment, a change of law would not be proper, providing for auditing bills before their payment? A. I do not think so; I am speaking, you knoAV, practically ; theoretically, it might be better; but when you think of it — in the first place, these bills are sworn to by the seller; in the next place, they are audited by the steward, they are audited by the superin- tendent, and then comes in another auditing by the committee of the board of managers — so that your suggestion, as it seems to me, is utterly unnecessary, as I may suggest further, when these bills are audited by the board of managers they might go to any official, like the Comptroller, and he might audit; that might be well; then 'the might be further audited by the State Board of Charities, and then they might be audited by the State Commissioner in Lunacy; theoretically, it would be well, but practically there is no necessity of it; the Comptroller already has a copy of each bill. Q. When does he get it? A. Quarterly. Q. Before or after payment ? A. After payment. r Q. Suppose of a case of collusion between a person who sells to the Asylum and a steward, an attempted fraud upon the Asylum or 941 upon the State, Avhat power is there now to prevent payment of such bills, suppose it should be actually discovered before the pay- ment of such bills, what power is there to prevent it? A. Before payment ? Q. Yes. A. The treasurer could refuse to pay. Q. What examination does the treasurer make of these bills; what are the chances that he would discover any such thing? A. I do not think he could discover any such thing. Q. Then there is no check whatever to the payment of a fraudu- lent collusive bill, is there ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What is it? A. The superintendent audits the bill; in order to perpetrate a fraud there would have to be collusion between the vendor, the , steward, the superintendent and the employees of the Asylum. Q. Do you think it is proper to intrust this whole matter to the superintendent entirely, rather than to the board of management — the examination and auditing of these bills? A. I think, as I have before stated, that it is well to put as many guards as possible around, theoretically ; practically, I think, tliere are sufficient guards as it is now.] Q. Don't you think tliere is too much poAver concentrated in the superintendent? A. No, sir. By the Chairman : Q. Has there been any inquiry by the board of managers recently to determine Avhether the finances of the institution are in a sound condition or not ? A. Why, we examine the treasurer's reports quarterly. Q. When was the last examination made ? A. In last December. Q. What was the result of that examination ? A. I think it was about $10,000 in the bank; it may have been more; I know I asked him what his average balances were, and it amounted to about $10,000. Q. And his accounts were found entirely correct ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And so far as you know they are entirely correct now ? A. Yes. Q. And there is no question whatever about the correctness of the accounts of the Asylum at the present time ? A. I have not any doubt about it; I do not mean to swear to the whole account of the Asylum, but so far as I know there is no ques- tion among the managers of the accounts being in perfectly correct condition, and I wish you gentlemen would examine the accounts, look at the books and see how the thing is done. 942 By Mr. Morgan": Q. Does the Asylum get any credit from the bank for interest on balances ? A. No, sir. By the Chairman : Q. Do they, keep an account in more than one bank ? A. No, sir. Q. Which bank is that? A. The Oneida National Bank. By Mr. Rice : Q. Do you know of any abuses, irregularities or errors in the manner .and method of conducting business at this Asylum at present ? A. I do not know of any unless you refer to something specific- ally ? Q. Are you able now to make any suggestion or recommendation as to the method of conducting business at this Asylum, any change? A. I think the business, as far as I can ascertain, is well con- ducted and economically conducted ; this concern is like a very large family that there can be improvements made in, I have no doubt. Q. 1 ask you Avliat improvements you refer to? A. I don't know of any improvements that I can suggest now in tbe business management. Q. T desire to find out whether or not you make any criticism on the method of conducting the business or the affairs generally of the Asylum ? A. There are some things that I could suggest about the internal management of the Asylum that I have already suggested. Q. Nothing more than you have spoken about ? A. No, sir; I do not think of any thing. Q. Do you think the attendants are Avorked too many hours in the twenty-four? A. I think the matter of attendants is a matter of demand and supply, if they can get attendants to work that number of hours for the pay, it is proper they should do it. Q. Do you think any man or woman can render efficient service from day to day, working from fourteen to sixteen hours ? A. If they were at hard labor, either mental or physical, I do not think it could be done, but if you will observe the attendants up there, for at least eight 'hours out of these fourteen or sixteen, for at least eight they have nothing special to do. Q. Their attention is all the time on these crazy people, is it not ? A. Yes, sir; but that is not labor. Q. I ask you the question, do you believe that a man or a women \ 943 can render faithful services as attendants from the hour of five in the morning until eight or nine in the evening ; A. It depends upon the character of the service and the circum- stances. Q. Do yon think that under any circumstance they can do it? A. It depends upon the nature of their service, I say. Q. Do you think they could perform that service faithfully and efficiently ? A. I think they can if — that is — if out of the fourteen hours, or sixteen hours they are at leisure eight. Q. What do you mean.by "leisure?" A. Sitting doAvn and doing nothing. Q. Do you call it "leisure" Allien the attention of a man or woman is all the time directed to tbe actions of a number of crazy people — can you conceive any possible leisure in that? A. It depends upon the people. Q. What people? A. The crazy people. Q. Take the fourth AA7ard for example — do you think tliere is any such thing as leisure to a person in charge as an attendant upon that ward? A. Yes, sir, I do ; I wras in there the other day and the attend- ants were sitting round doing nothing, except one man in the din- ing-room. Q. Performing no physical labor, you mean ? A. No, sir; doing nothing. Q. But their attention was directed all the time to the conduct of these insanepeople ? A. It was not necessary; the insane people were all quiet. Q. That is enough on that subject; I will not pursue that any further ; do you think the attendants are sufficiently well paid ? A. It is a question of demand and supply ; if they can get the proper kind of attendants for the pay, they ought to get them. Q. Do you think they do get the proper kind, and as good as they could if they made the pay greater ? A. That I could not say. Q. Do you believe these attendants should be required to sleep on to the wards with these insane people ? A. Yes, sir; I do. Q. In addition to their fourteen hours or sixteen hours of daily labor or daily attendance ? A. Yes, sir, I do ; I think they ought to be right there Avith the patients. Q. Do yon approve of the recent purchase by this Asylum of some blooded stock, a bull and two cows at an expense of $1,300 ; as one of the managers of this institution, do you agree with that purchase ? A. Well, I am not — I arn not capable of judging. Q. You decline to ansAver on account of your inability to judge? 944 A. I am unable to decide whether it is better to have that stock or not; I don't know. By Mr. Brown : Q. What personal attention did you ever give to the manner of buying supplies, so that you could inform yourself whether they ,Avere properly bought or not % A. I never saw an article bought for,the Asylum in my life. Q. Hoav long have you been one of the managers ? A. Since 1878. Q. Has there been any change in the manner of buying supplies > since you have been there ? A. I don't know of any. i Q. Then, as one of the managers, how can you censure Mr. Winston for saying that in regard to purchasing they are -" in a groove " when there has been no change made since you have been a manager? A.-I have not censured him for saying we were in a groove. Q. He was censured, was he not? A. Not that I know of. Q. I thought Senator Campbell said something to him ? A. Oh, I thought yon meant at this examination; Mr. Campbell said he did not think it avus very respectful, or something of that kind. Q. When it is proven here by the managers that no change has ,; been made in twelve years, wherein does Mr. Winston do wrong by saying you were in a groove, in that matter ? 1 A. I have not said he was wrong. By the Chairman : Q. I call your attention to the testimony of George W. Jones at page 714 ; Mr. Jones testified that he was trustee of the Willard Asylum, and described their system of making purchases, that they v send for samples, etc.; (handing the printed record to the Avitness) you can read what he says there — * * * having read that, what do you say about that plan ; do you consider that a more likely method of securing the best goods at the best prices for the institution, than the course now pursued by the institution ? A. Than the one of paying five per cent, you mean. Q. Than the general system iioav pursued by the Asylum ? * A. Well, that is a nlat'ter of practical experiment; I don't know. ) Q. What is your opinion about that system of purchasing? • A. I should think it Avas a good way. Q. It involves more personal attention on the part of some of the > board, does it not ? A. To steep tea, etc., and taste it, yes, sir. Q. Don't you think it would be well for the board once in a 945 while to call for quotations and compare them with the prices you are paying other people ? A. I think it would be well, yes, sir, I should see no objection to it. Q. But your board has never done that, I understand ? A. We have ascertained how much we are paying, and examined the prices; this exhibit that Mr. Dryer referred to last night would give you gentlemen more information as to the cost of supplies in this Asylum in ten minutes, than an examination of me and all the board of managers in a Aveek would. Q. Do you consider that frequent competitive quotations from dealers with whom you might deal would be better than the uni- form purchase from any house with competition ? A. I understand it that it is done Avith us to a certain extent. Q. Please state to how great an extent ? * 'A. Dr. Dryer explained it to you last night, that is as far as I know ; I can only refer to that examination, that is about all I know about.it. Q. All you know about any competition is what you have heard from Mr. Dryer in his testimony before this committee ? A. Well, I have heard the same thing before. Q. Did you hear it from him ? A. Yes, from him and Dr. Gray. Q. But to your own knoAvledge, no such competition has been had before the board ? A. Not that I remember of. SAMUEL CAMPBELL. Recalled : Mr. Goodwin — I ask that Mr. Swan may examine Mr. Camp- bell. The Chairman — Yes, certainly. \ By Mr.'Swan: I Q. Mr. Campbell, you are president of the board ? f A. Yes, sir. [■ Q. And were present at the last annual meeting? I A. Yes, sir. _. Q. What if any thing Avas said at the last annual meeting or any I meeting at which you have been present, by Mr. Winston in refer- r euce to the bills of Butler and Hamilton ? I A. I don't remember any thing being said at the annual meeting t or any meeting before he gave his testimony ; at the recent meet- I ing something Avas said. ft;.' Q. And before that ? I 119 U 946 ' A. Not any thing that I remember of. Q. Has he ever in any way called yonr attention to the mode of conducting business by the New York State Lunatic Asylum? A. No, sir. Q. At that annual meeting did we refer to any prices in Butler and Hamilton's bills ? A. No, sir. Q. Or to any of the items in any of their bills? A. Not that I know of. Q. Have you heard Mr. Winston express himself frequently in the board of management that he thought particularly in the women's department that the attendants were not paid high enough « A. I have not. Q. Has Mr. Winston said at any time either at meeting of the board or to yon personally, that the articles, sugar, tea, coffee, molasses, and goods in the grocery line, should be sold to the Asy- lum to better advantage than they were getting them ? A. He has not said so to me. Q. Has he stated to you, or to the board, or to the superintendent to your knowledge that the Asylum could buy to better advautage, these same articles at wholesale? A. He has not to me or in my presence. Q. Or to your knowledge at all? ' A. No, sir. Q. Do you remember at the December meeting when the audit- ing committee presented their report, did Mr. Winston inquire why it was they made a difference in sugars, why one was charged a cer- tain percentage, and another was not, and did Dr. Gray say that the reason has been the custom from time immemorial and had been so when he came into the establishment ? A. No, sir; not to my recollection, I do not remember any such remark. Q. No conversation of that character took place did there ? A. Not that I remember of Q. Has Mr. Winston remonstrated with you or the board, in reference to the purchasing of things, and has there never been any change notwithstanding his remonstrance ? A. He has not. Q. He has never remonstrated with you ? A. No, sir, not with me. Q. And has never referred to the subject, has he? A. No, sir; that is, not specially, to me individually. Q. Has he to your knoAvledge ? A. I would not wish to say that there has been nothing said to me at all; I am answering your questions directly. Q. Has tliere ever been any diffidence on your part, or to your knowledge, on the part of different members of the board, about bringing up business questions and matters before the boa/d in the presence of Dr. Gray ? A. No, sir, none whatever. ~ Q. And have the board acted, as far as that is concerned, in an independent Avay ? 947 A. Yes, sir, independently. Q. Has Mr. Winston ever expressed himself to you or to the board that the business and medical management should be sepa- rated ? A. He has not; now allow me to give Mr. Winston his entire due; there was at a recent meeting comparatively this thing ; I think 1 was the one that appointed him (because of his ability in that department to know) on the auditing committee; at a recent meeting, Avith some embarrassment,'he tried to signify something to us that I could not comprehend what he was driving at; it was in relation to these supplies; the amount of it was entirely insignifi- cant, but it produced this result; he having some knowledge of this business, he was requested, by a resolution, to look into this matter, and report and see whether he could do any better or not. Q. Have you ever heard from him since i A. No, sir. By the Chairman : Q. How long ago was that meeting ? A. Our last regular meeting, I think it was in April. By Mr. Swan : Q. December ? A. Well, I won't be certain it Avas one of our regular meetings ; I think he is in some embarrassment in the matter, because he deals in the business, and it would be a little difficult for him to express himself in a manner, but when he was requested to do so, in the interest of the institution, I think it is his duty to do it; he has a right to have an opportunity of saying any thing or doing any thing in that line he thinks proper, and will be listened to with respect; I thought he had assumed to say and understand a good deal, that we were running in the old ruts, which was a very inju- dicious remark, and to say the least, is not a respectful one. By Mr. Goodwin : Q. You have heard the testimony of Mr. Swan in reference to Mr. Winston at the meeting ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Is that substantially as you recollect it ? A. Yes, sir. Q. I call your attention to the annual report of the Willard Asy- lum, for tbe year 1883 ; in reference to the method of the treasurer's report, will you be kind enough to read as to the receipts of the institution ? A. I have not examined this on purpose ; my purpose was to help Mr. Swan, as to the results of other institutions; that is why I handed him these reports. Q. What does appear from the treasurer's report as to amount 3 948 of cash received from treasurers of counties and cities for current expenses in the Willard report ? A. " Cash received from treasurers of counties and cities for cur- rent expenses, $268,643.38." -Q. Now, in reference to the payment of bills paid — payments? A. "By bills paid from county account as audited by auditing com- mittee for current expenses, $260,166.94;" last year, I will say, Ave came out $10,000 below. Q. Why are you $10,000 below this year? A. It is by extra expenses, undoubtedly. Q. In this treasurer's report of Willard — A. I have no knowledge of that ; they are itemized. Q. How is it in regard to the report of the treasurer of the State Lunatic Asylum at Utica? A. It is itemized and extended ; Willard is in gross. Q. Now I ask you in regard to your opinion of the dual manage- ment — wHether in your judgment the business department should be separated from the medical department ? A. It should not.. Q. Why? A. Because it would make disturbance at once; you cannot'make two heads go together and work satisfactorily ; it would be against the interests of the Asylum, in my judgment. Q. Is there any thing else you desire to say ? A. I do not knoAv; speaking of this auditing of accounts, speaking of it the other day when I was on the stand before, I would speak of the difficulty (if you have no objection to my doing it) of doing it in the w7ay you suggested it could be done; if we Avere purchasing by the'month in a city, where Ave could get thena all, then it might be accomplished by monthly pay- ments ; but this cannot be done in many places, and it cannot be done here; there is a large number of payments ; we buy the beef for instance of farmers ; our butter and eggs from farm- ers ; they come in and it is cash ahvays; they do not want to stand over thirty days, and then come and have their accounts audited ; and we cannot be on hand to audit accounts every day, as an every day business, it would be impossible; how to better the thing in our locality, I cannot see; if it was joining a large city, we could buy our beef from a dealer, and oiir butter, etc., from the same dealer, fish, eggs and butter; get them at first hand of a dealer. By the Chairman : Q. Does it not apply to such goods as grocery bills ? A. No, sir; I should say not, because they could be easier got at; but these cash payments are necessary for the things I mentioned. Q. Do you not think that in regard to all cash purchases, and as to persons with whom you have a running account, that it would be better to have the bills examined by an'auditing committee of the board before payment ? 949 A. Well, if I had any suspicion of dishonesty it would be. Q. Do you think it Avould tend to greater exactness aud accuracy in preparing and sending in those bills? A. I think not; judging from the men I knoAV that are engaged in it. Q. Suppose that in course of time the men that you know and to Avhom you refer are taken aAvay, or leave, or resign, and others come in whom you don't know, would you still think that the bills should be paid before auditing? A. I should think very differently, for I should not then know them. Q. Then your judgment as to the present practice, is based sub- stantially on your knowledge of the individuals with whom you are dealing ? A. Yes, sir; to a great extent it is. Q. But this is a State institution, is it not? A. Yes, sir. Q. Having a continuous existence ? A. Yes, sir. / Q. Should not rules then be framed for the continuous regulation of the institution wdth reference to the presence of different individ- uals from time to time ? A. Well, there is existing rules. Q. I ask you now, would it be wise to revise the rules in that respect for the general government of the institution ? • A. It is under general \aw from the beginning and we have rules that cover pretty much all the Asylum ; our Asylum has been the parent institution and from which has been copied the by-laws. Q. I speak of the revision of the rule concerning the auditing of bills, an4 ask you would it not be wise, for the general future management of the institution, without reference to the individuals now. engaged there to revise that rule as to auditing of bills so as to require an examination of all bills of houses with whom you have a current account by some members of the board before payment? A. I think it would be, sir; I agree to that, wherein it is prac- ticable, and it might be practicable in a good many cases ; this matter is one of the difficulties we have, growing out of the nature of our location; there Avould have, to be some method by which two or more should see to it, because you would not expect us to bring the whole board together for that. The Chairman — Oh, no, not at all. A. Then some provision of that kind might be made, and I can see where it might be done without any great deal of trouble, by having a similar committee to what Ave have, and make it really an audi! ing ; now it is more a committee on accounts ; I have no doubt that we are not deceived in any thing ; I haye no doubt that these gentlemen are perfectly honest, strictly honest, here is a man who has furnished more material. 950 Q. Do yon think it would really take more time for members of the board to audit such bills before payment then have the vouchers, the checks, such bills briefly audited altogether after payment, than it would to have a separate audit of each voucher after payment from month to month? \ A. I think it should be oftener than that, if it is done at all, I think it is practicable to do it to a considerable extent and more frequently than it is. Q. Do you think it would take very much more time for mem- bers of the board to audit bills before payment? A. Yes, sir, I think so; in the first place they are audited, in a certain sense, before they receive them and it would be duplicating; when they see the accounts that have really been audited, they have confidence in their character. \ Q. And if the bills were audited by the committee before pay- ment, would it be necessary to spend as much time in auditing the bills and vouchers afterward by the same committee ? A. No, sir; I should not think it would be necessary to do it a second time. Q. Then a comparison of the checks for money paid, with the vouchers for which it is paid, might perhaps be done only annually after the bills had previously been audited at the time of payment? A. I think that wonld be a pretty long time. Q. You said tliere should not be such frequent auditing if they were already audited once. A. More frequently than annually, I meant to convey. Q. But not so frequently as monthly, perhaps ? A. Well, monthly or quarterly ; it is easier done then ; I do my business monthly. EMMA BARKER, Recalled. By Mr. Goodwin : Q. Have you ever heard any thing about medicines being given to patients as a punishment? A. No, sir. Q. Have you ever heard a patient say any thing about that? A. I recollect Miss Lathrop's case ;' she thought she had a dose given to her for punishment; I do not recollect any others. Q. Have you ever heard of patients being changed from one ward to another as a matter of punishment ? A. No, sir. Q Is there any thing of that kind to your knowledge in the Asylum? ,; 6 951 A. No, Bi'r. Q. Why are patients changed, far as your information goes? A. Sometimes for their own good, sometimes for the good of i>ther patients. Q. What do yon mean by the good of other patients ? A. Sometimes the patient that is removed annoys the other patients by talking to them ; telling them unpleasant stories. Q. And what effect does that have on the patients? A. Makes them nervous and wakeful.. Q. In that case, the patient who commits the annoyance is removed for the benefit of the others? A. Yes, sir. Q. But not in any sense as a punishment to her for her conduct ? A. No, sir. Q. Do you remember of any case of a lawyer's Avife who Avas obliged to go to the ironing-room against her will to work ? A. No, sir. Q. Would you be likely7 to hear of it? A. I should think so. Q. Why? A. Because such cases are generally reported to me by the patient, in grievances of that kind. Q. Are there any patients on the female side of the house com- pelled to work ? A. No, sir. Q. Is it a voluntary matter with them ? A. Yes, sir; they are sometimes advised to work for their own good, but are not compelled to. Q. And if a person under advice to work should refuse, what would be the consequence, if any thing ? A. I do not know that any thing would. Q. Nothing wrould be none ? '?{*" A. No, sir; and never has been. Q. Would she be compelled to work if she refused ? A. No, sir. Q. Now I ask you if there are any particular number of articles specified to be done by each patient in the ironing-room ? A. No, sir. Q. No task allotted ? A. No, sir; no task allotted. Q. What they do is entirely A*oluntary ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you ever hear Dr. Blumer at any time threaten to send a patient off a ward who did not perform the work ? A. I never did. Q. Did you ever hear any physician ? A. No, sir. Q. Did you ever hear any supervisor ? A. No, sir. 952 Q. Or any attendant? A. No, sir. Q. Has such a thing ever come to your knowledge? A. No, sir. Q. Miss Lathrop says in her testimony that she saw the matron two or three times, etc., and that she only had three conversations with her (page 531 of the testimony); it that true or not? - A. That is not true. Q. Did you see Miss Lathrop often ? A. Yes, sir. Q.;Did you converse with her often ? A. Yes, sir; very frequently. Q. Did you know Mrs. Talford ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did yon see her frequently ? A. Yes, sir. Q. She states she was kept on a ward a number of weeks with- out * being allowed to go out; do you knoAV any thing about that circumstance ? A. Yes, sir. Q. State to the committee what it was? A. She Avas kept on the Avard for a time on account of reporting to convalescent patients very unplesant circumstances that annoyed them very much, and it was thought best to keep her in for a time on that account, and she did not feel willing to go out in the back yard, she could have gone into that yard if she had chosen. Q. She was repeating stories to patients which excited them and annoyed them ? f \ A. Yes, sir. Q. And for that reason was not allowed to go out into the yard ? A. Yes, sir; into the front yard with the convalescent-patients. Q. Was she prohibited from going out into the back yard ? |: A. No, sir. Q. Have you ever heard any thing about twisting of wrists by attendants on patients, and what can you tell the committee about that ? A. I have seen attendants take hold of patient's wrists but should judge the patients twisted their own wrists instead of the attend- ant, it is an easy matter to do if you take a persons wrist, it is easy to do it in trying to get away; I never saw an attendant twist a patient's wrist. Q. Won't you please sIioav us how it is done ? [Illustrated by Miss Stirling taking the witnesses wrist and wit- ness trying to get away,*and twisting her own arm.] Q. And this twisting is by the attempt of tbe patient to get away ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Have you ever heard or knoAvn of any attendant in your asylum deliberately twist the Avrists of any patient ? ■■'J 953 A. No, sir. Q. Has that complaint ever been made to you ? A. Only in a general way. Q. By patients ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Have you investigated such cases when brought to your knowledge? A. I have several times spoken to attendants about it. Q. And what has been the result of your investigations in that regard ? A. They have always told me just as I have stated to'you that they never twisted their wrists, but sometimes patients in trying to get away would twist their own wrists. Q. Now right there, a patient complains to you in reference to ill-treatment by an attendent, what do you do in reference to it as matron of that institution ? A. I go to the attendant; I think I should first go to the attend- ant of whom she complains. Q. What would you do? A. I go to the attendant of whom she complains and ask her the circumstances, then I go to other attendants, there are always two or three others on the ward, and ask them if they know any thing about it, and hear their story and hear the patient's story, and decide the matter as best I can from what I learn. Q. Do you place any more confidence in statements'of attendants than you do in those of the patients ? A. It depends somewhat upon the condition of the patient. Q. That is her mental condition ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Now I ask you are attendants ever permitted to feed patients by the stomach tube ? A. No, sir. Q. Did you ever see it done ? A. No, sir, not by attendants. Q. I call your attention to page 723 of the testimony, about crib beds, the question asked by the committee of Mary A. Pelton : "What do you know, if any thing, in reference to a change in the bed Avhen it came night; in the crib beds ? A. In the day-time tliere would be mattresses in the crib for the inspection of visitors; Avhen it came night there would be a lot of straw tick put in its place, the mattresses would be carried out into a kind of closet; it would look very nice in the day-time." State Avhat the rule and regulation and custom is in reference to mattresses on crib beds? A. They are ahvays left on the beds if the patient is in a condi- tion to sleep on them, if the patient is uncleanly in her habits they are sometimes removed. Q. Is it not a regulation or custom in the Asylum to remove the mattress from the crib bed at nights ? A. No, sir. 120 U 954 Q. And when it is done it is account of filthy patients ? A. Yes. sir. Q. And then the mattress is removed ? A. It is. Q. Is there an attendant in the house at present named hucy Morris ? A. No, sir. Q. Do you know where she is ? A. No, sir. Q. Is Miss Roberts at the house? A. No, sir. Q. Is Mabel Allen ? A. No, sir. Q. Miss Pelton says at page 722: " Did any thing occur c, eighth ward while you were there ? Yes, sir; Miss Morris after I would go from the dining-room to the ward she Avould stand at the door' and take the keys and punch me in the back with them, she punched me three or four times, but the last time and the third time I said if she dared to do it again Iff would report it to Dr. Curtis, and she said he would think it was a delusion, but I did not think delusions were so striking as that." Did you ever hear of Miss Morris whils't an attendant upon the eighth ward, striking patients with kefs ? A. No, sir. Q. Have you ever heard it of any attendant, and if so, when ? A. I think I have heard it in relation to Mrs. Tulford's testi- mony. Q. I mean outside of that ? A. No, sir; I have not. Q. Have you ever heard any complaint made by a patient that ,an attendant had struck her any where -about the body either by a blow, or a punch with a bunch of keys? A. No, sir ; I don't recollect any. Q. You do not recolJect any complaint having been made to you in reference to that? A. No, sir; I do not. Q. ^ What, if any, interest does the superintendent of the Asylum take in the attendants ? A. I think he takes a great deal of interest in them- Q. In what Avay ? A. In the care of them ; he has an interest and care for their health and special qualifications, I think, in the various duties. Q. I call your attention to page 413 of the testimony of Miss Lucy Peck, in which she says : " What were the results? A. In one case I saw a patient terribly bruised so that she did not look like a human, being on one side of her face; her name was W. K.; it was in this way ; she did not want to go out in the back yard; they said that she must; so she saw the doctor aud got his permission 955; to stay ; Dr. Kempster told her that; bnt we had another doctor there and he made a change in the orders ; so the attendants said she must go out, but she relied on the promise of the other doctor and thought she was doing right in refusing to go out into the barn yard; she was willing to obey orders, but thought she had permis- sion to stay in ; but when she refused to go they disciplined her." Did you ever hear of a patient by name of W. K., whether it was Lasker,or Kelly, or Parker, or any thing of that kind ? A. I do not recollect any such instance. Q. Would such an occurrence be reported to you ? A. I think so. Q. Do you know who W. K. is, or do you know Miss L. ? A. No, sir. Q. Was there a patient named Miss L. ? A. I don't recollect any. Q. Have you looked to see ? A. Yes, sir; and I find no such person. Q. At the time Miss Peck speaks of did the patients go into the back yard ? A. I think not ; my impression is that the back yard was at that that time very small and only intended for one ward, the ward opening into the yard ; the patients from seven into nine never went tliere. Q. On page 419. Miss Peck speaks of the cold on ward number ten, " Have you any other matters to speak of? A. Yes, sir, I have; there was one great and universal cause of suffering on ward ten; I was on ward ten once. Q. What was the subject of qomplaint ? A. There was a great deal of suffering there ; they suffered a great deal with cold; tliere was a Miss S., I remember, one New Year's day when the fire was not out in the ironing-room that she went to it and she kept saying ' This is grand !' 'This is grand !' I have heard her say it as much as ten times. Q. Was it always cold in that ward ? A. In cold weather it was." Have you ever known in your service at the asylum that ward or any other being cold, so as to be uncomfortable for the health or comfort of the patient ? A. No, sir; with one perhaps slight exception — or exceptions, I should say ; sometimes we have a very strong wind and an intensely cold day; one part of the ward, the east or the Avest, may be cold, but there is generally some place on the ward that is comfortable that the patients can go to. By Mr. Haskell : '""'"Z Q. On ward ten ? A. On any ward, I mean. Q Has there been any change in heating ten ? A. Well, part of it is taken down and moved, it hardly exists now. 956 Q. I ask whether there has been any change in the manner of heating ward ten at any time ? A. No, sir ; not to my knowledge. By Mr. Goodwin (resuming) : Q. At page 420 of the printed testimony, Miss Peck speaks of a person who had taken cold and dying very soon after, do you re- member any such case ? A. No, sir. Q. I call your attention to this : " Q. So that the evil was finally remedied ? A. Considerably; I saw the other day in the papers that the ward was being rebuilt or reconstructed ; you asked me about the attendants complaining of cold, and I was going to say in answer to that question that several came there appparently strong healthy girls and of course while they were working they would not feel the cold, but Avhen they got through with their work they would feel it more than the patients avIio had not beeu doing any thing; a good many of them died, and I believe their colds were caused by that cold ward; I think their death Avas hastened by the cold of that ward. Q. How do you knoAV they have died since? A. Rhoda Parks left the house and died in St. Luke's Hos- pital ; Mary Comstock died, I visited her friends; Cecelia Deese, she has died since, I saw some one going to her funeral, and Nelly Campion and Annie Roscoe they both died in the Asylum about a year ago; " do you know any thing about these people I have men- tioned in the testimony ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What AA-as their difficulty ? A. Rhoda Parks was cousumptive before she came to the build- ing ; Mary Comstock left work for a vacation and was taken sick while she was aAA7ay and died ; it Avas several years after she left us that she died; she went from us to Willard, and was afterward married and left one child. Q. On page 421 she speaks of patients not being allowed to com- municate with their friends, what hpve you to say in reference to that? A. I think that is a mistake ; I think they are allowed to com- municate very freely Avith their friends. Q. That is to say in your own experience where a proper letter was Avritten by a patient, it has always been sent ? , A. Yes, sir. Q. And there has been no attempt to supp'ress proper corres- pondence ? A. No, sir. Q. She speaks at page 422, of the patients being put in solitary confinement; what have you to say in reference to that? A. I do not know any thing of the kind. Q. Did you ever hear of it ? 95> A. No, sir. Q. Have patients been put in rooms separately by themselves ? A. For confinement ? Q. Have they ever been put into rooms by themselves? A. No, sir, I do not recollect any instance. Q. Dp not you place patients sometimes in a rodm ? A. In a room with the door on the jar; I think you may have to shut them into a room sometimes. Q. Has any patient, to your 'knoAvledge, ever been placed in a room or confined there in regard to punishment ? A. No, sir. Q. She says at page 426, that patients are in covered beds for thirteen hours, what do you say in reference to that ? A. That it is not so, or I never knew a case of the kind. Q. Could it be so without your knowlege ? t A. I think not. Q. Why not? A. Because I am on the ward so frequently I think that patients would complain to me if they Avere kept in bed as long as that. Q. I suppose patients have been kept in bed for thirteen hours? A. Yes, sir, when they were sick. Q. And during that time Avhat would be done with them? A. They would be regularly taken up and beds made, and the patients attended to, hair combed, washed and redressed. Q. But there never has to yonr knoAvledge, been a case of a per- son confined in the crib for thirteen hours without attention from the attendants ? A. No, sir. Q. I call your attention to page 426 ; what is the habit in regard to patients being allowed to work on embroidery or anything of that kind if their condition allows ? A. They are ahvays allowed to do so if their condition permits it. Q. I call your attention to page 426 of the testimony: " Q. Is there any other abuses or complaints of patients, or causes of com- plaint than you have now specified, please state them, or have you \ stated all now ? A. If you were there at the hour they put patients to bed, you would see that they are left in those cribs, or covered beds, thirteen hours; if you could be there you would find that out; then, if you visit the wards, I would like you to please notice and see how many of the women patients are engaged on any kind of Avork, needlework I mean ; y7ou cannot realize hoAV a little work of that kind enlivens the time and shortens it; patients who have been confined there, who are tliere now, will tell you that it short- ens the time wonderfully. Q. I am asking you if there was any [ thing you saw that you think should be complained of? A. I am stating a ground of complaint; patients were not allowed to keep [ their embroidery work; when they came they would bring some , such work to keep them out of idleness, and it would be taken I away from them; some of the attendants would allow that to be I done—would allow them to do such work, and even in some cases 958*^ furnish the work, or furnish the things — but 'the head attendant, Miss Sayles would not do so, as she was opposed to it ; " state what there is to that ? A. There is not any thing to it. Q, Have you known any patient in proper condition to be refused or prohibited from doing embroidery or any other Avork that they desired ? A. No, sir. Q. The patient speaks — Miss Peck speaks about lousey patients on number 12, did you ever hear of that? A. We have them brought to us in that condition, occasionally, brought from the outside, and it takes several days, sometimes a wreek, to get rid of them. Q. Is there any thing about the wards over which you have super- vision in which a person would become liable to become lousey ? A. Unless it was by such a circumstance. Q. What is your rule in reference to that? A. If a patient's condition is such as to alloAv her to be bathed. Q. Would she be bathed when brought there? A. Yes, sir. Q. And she is bathed as soon as her condition will allow? A. Yes, sir. Q. And is attention paid particularly to her cleanliness? A. Yes, sir; washed and her hair very thoroughly combed. Q. Is it the duty of attendants to comb patients hair? A. Yes, sir; it is their duty and it is done. Q. Mrs. Fulford, on page 622 of the printed testimony, says, patients are not allowed papers? A. I haVe never knoAvn an instance where they were refused. Q. When in proper condition ? A. Yes, sir; in proper condition, or almost any condition if the papers are sent to them; they are sent on to the wards to the patients. Q. Is it a practice there to allow patients to read ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Not only papers, but books ? A. We have a library there, and they are allowed to go to the library and select Avorks, every patient Avho cares enough to do so, and we have exchanges and papers aud they are distributed through the wards. Q. Have yon ever heard of a patient being put into a dark room? A. No, sir. Q. Did you ever know of a patient who was secluded in a dark room, and not allowed to come out on the wards aud get warm ? A. No, sir. Q. And did not even have a chair to sit down on ? A. No, sir; I do not know of any thing of that kind. Q. Is it possible for such an occurrence as that to have occurred in the Asylum without your knowledge? 959 A. I do not think so. Q. Why do you not think so? A. Because, as I said before, the patients make complaints to me of almost every thing that can happen, and if any patient had been subjected to any such thing she would have been very likely to have told me; I may say further, that there is but one room that might be called a dark room, and that is on the convalescent ward, where a patient would not be likely to be secluded. Q. Have the attendants any thing to say in reference to the time when patients shall go to bed ? A. No, sir ; tliere are rules, I believe. Q. Who establishes those rules ? A. The physicians. Q. And the hours at Avhich patients must go to bed is according to the rules laid down by ,the physicians ? A. Yes, sir. Q. It is not a matter of discretion at all with the attendants? A. No, sir. Q. Would you know if it was a practice in that Asylum of attend- ants making patients go to bed before or even after the regulation time ? A. I have known an instance where they have been allowed to stay up later than the regular time ; that is, allowed by the attendants. Q. Have you ever known a case where they have been made to go to bed as a punishment ? A. No, sir; I do not recall any thing of that kind. Q. It has been stated that patients are not allowed to go to bed in the day time by attendants ; will you please state to the com- mittee what there is about that? A. They are alloAved to do so ; if they should go to an attendant and say they were particularly tired or sick and would like to lie down they would be allowed to do so. Q. You remember Miss Peck ? A Yes, sir. Q. How long was she at the Asylum ? A. I cannot recollect just now. Q. About how long? A. I should think she Avas there about eight months the first time and the last time I think she was tliere two years or a little more. Q. Did you converse with her ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What were her delusions ? A. One delusion was that she Avas Dr. Andrew's Avife. Q. Did she ever tell, you how she thought she was married ? A She said she was married the day she saw him in the office, one Sunday she referred to, that she Avent out of the door with one of the attendants, the door was open and she ran across the hall into the doctor's sat down on Dr. AndreAv's lap and kissed him, that was I believe her marriage ceremony. 960 Q. Have the night watchmen got pass keys that ;will admit them from ward to ward ? A. I do not think they have. Q. Have the night watchmen any keys on the women's wards. A. Not to my knowledge. Q. Please tell the committee what you know about the use of wet sheets in that Asylum if any thing? A. Nothing more than what"! heard at one time. Q. When was that; hoAV long ago ? A. That must have been fifteen years ago. Q. Upon how many occasions did you hear it was then used ? A. I did not hear any number of the times. Q. Do you know the attendant Avho used them? A. Mrs. Peterson. Q. How long was she in the service of the Asylum ? A. That I cannot remember. Q. Was it a long or a short time ? A. A long time ; I think you might call it, perhaps, a couple of years. A. Can yon state from your recollection how long she remained there after these rumors in reference to wet sheets ? A. Not very long. Q. Was she discharged ? A. Yes, sir; it came to our knoAvledge Avhile she was on a visit to Canada, and after she came back she wTas told that her services would not be required any lopger. Mr. Goodwin — You can cross-examine Mr. Barken By Mr. Rice : Q. You said no correspondence fit to be sent Avas ever retained at the Asylum? A. Not to my knowledge. Q. Were you accustomed to see the letters which were retained ? A. No, sir; well, sometimes I have seen a few. Q. It was seldom you saw them ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Then you are not able to say whether proper letters to go were ever retained ? A. No, sir. , Q. And in stating, then, that no letters of a proper character to be sent out were retained, you are speaking of that which you really know nothing of, are you not ? A. Well, my sending them would be all I could know about it. Q. I am speaking about contents of letters; you say you did not know the contents of these letters which were retained'} A. No, sir. Q. Do you know whether or not it is very often advised by the physicians of the Asylum that friends of the patients should not see the patients\ 961 ■ A. I do not knoAv that they are; occasionally I know of an instance I think, I Avanted to speak in regard to the letters, and the state- mant I made, I have heard the physicians say to patients that they would send any letter that was proper to go, that was all I know. Q. The physicians constituted themselves the judges whether the letters were proper or not ? A. Yes, sir. MISS AMY STERLING, Sworn and examined testified as follows: By Mr. Goodwin : Q. How long have you been employed at the Utica Asylum ? A. Fourteen years. Q. What is your present position? A. Supervisor on No's 2, 5, 8 and 12. Q. How long have you been supervisor ? A. Ten years. Q. And the balance of the time as attendant? A. Yres, sir; I Avas on the seventh when I first went to the house for three weeks only, then on the fourth w_ard as dining-room attendant, then on the first ward dining-room attendant, and after that for two years first assistant on the first ward. Q. Have you ever heard of persons being obliged to take medi- cine as a punishment ? A. Never. Q. Have you heard any complaints made by patients themselves in reference to being obliged to take medicine for punishment ? A. I have no recollection of hearing such complaints. Q. But you never knew of a person being given any medicine as a punishment ? A. No, sir; I never heard of it. Q. Who gives the medicines on your department? A. I carry them around and other attendants assist me in giving them. Q. You give them as a rule then ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And you have never given to any person any medicine as a punishment ? i A. No, sir ; I never have. Q. And you have never known an attendant to do it ? A. No, sir. Q. Or a physician ? A. No, sir.' Q. Have you ever known a patient being moved from one ward to another as a matter of punishment'( 121 U 962 A. No, sir ; I never looked upon it in that light. Q. How did you look upon it ? ' A. I thought it was necessary not only for the interest of the other patients but for the condition of the patient who was moved or transferred. Q. Now just state to the committee Avhat are usually the reasons for the transfer of patients from one ward to another ? A. There are various reasons ; sometimes patients become excited after conversing for a short time, and under such circumstances they were removed to more disturbed wards, and again I have known patients to be removed from quiet wards where there was a great deal of company passing through, for taking off their clothing and being untidy in their habits. Q. Have you known them to be removed for annoying other patients ? A. Yes, sir; when their annoyances of them would irritate and excite other patients. Q. In that case where would the patient be moved to? A. That was determined by the physician. Q. No person was removed from one Avard to another without the order of the physician ? A. Never to my knowledge. Q. Did you known of any patient being obliged to go into the ironing room when she was sick and being obliged to work tliere? A. No, sir ; I never did. Q. Have vou ever known w7here a patient was compelled to Avork ? A. No, sir; there is no compulsion about their work. Q. In case of refusal of a patient to work Avhat would follow ? A. Nothing ; they have been advised ; we have persuaded them, or endeavored to persuade them, when they say they do not want to. Q. Is it usually the case that a patient of pretty good physical condition desires to Avork 'i A. Not always ; there are exceptions. Q. And in those cases what is'done if any thing ? A. Not any thing. Q. I call your attention to Miss Lathrop's testimony on page 526 of the printed testimony : " Q. \Yas you at auy time sent off the ward because you refused to Avork ? A. I was not, because the attendants did not require it of me; I never thought of such a thing as doing any work, but after that I did do a little or nothing on the ward, because I did not want to be taken off the ward." Have you knoAvn any patient to be threatened by removal from the ward on account of refusing to do any work ? A. I have no remembrance of ever hearing any such thing. Q. Have you ever made such a threat ? A. No, sir. Q. Or ever heard au attendant doing it ? A. No, sir, I have no recollection of it. 963 Q. Did yon hear Dr. Blnmer threaten to send any person from the ward for not doing their work ? A. No, sir. Q. Do the patients as a rule wait for the physicians to come around before making auy complaints of their wrongs ? A. No, sir, it is very frequently they complain to the attendant. Q. Noav, what is the habit of supervisors and attendants ; what is your habit where a patient complains of some minor difficulty, like stomach ache or ear ache, or any thing of the kind, what would the supendsor do in such a case ? A. It would depend somewhat upon how severe it Avas; if a pa- tient complained of it being very severe, an acute pain, I should go to the Doctor. Q. And get medicine ? A. I would not always wait for the medicine, he would send it; but many times I would wait for the medicine in the office and carry it to the patient. Q. Have you known of any person under your supervision who had to wait any considerable length of time for medicines as not to obtain relief from their sufferings ? A. No, sir. Q. Have you ever heard of it ? A. I have no recollection of hearing it. Q. I call your attention to page 528 of Miss Lathrop's testimony. "The first occasion was after I had been in the Asylum six months; I awoke one night with a feeling of suffocation and saw that the door of my room was partially open, and that some one was stand- ing at the door." Without reading to you this testimony given by Miss Lathrop, have I called your attention to it before ? A. Yes, sir. Q. State to the committee if on any occasion Miss Lathrop ever made any complaint to you in any way in reference to this matter ? A. No, sir; she never did ; I never knew of any such thing being spoken of. Q. When did you first hear of it? A. About a year ago, before the last committee. Q. And up to that time you never heard ? A. No, sir ; never heard that she thought of any such thing. Q. Who usually sees the articles that are taken to the wash ? A. I see some of them, not all ; the first attendant on the ward with ine always sorts the clothing; I sometimes assist, but not always. Q. I call your attention to page 539 of the printed testimony : "When was the first time that Mrs. T. was sick, as you have de- scribed? A. The first time Mrs. T. was sick was during the first year I was in the Asylum ; while I was on the second ward. Q. What attendants took care of her during her sickness? A. Mrs. Sterling, I think, and a Miss Davis" — do you know who Mrs. T. is? 964 A. Yes, sir. Q. State to the committee what her trouble was? A. She had inflamatpry rheumatism, and her limbs and arms were done up with aconite and bandaged ; she was helpless. Q. Did she have any trouble or sicknesses narrated by Miss La- throp to the committee ? A. Nothing that you could infer that it was any thing but an ordinary sickness ; nothing at all that would create any suspicion. Q. And she had nothing like what is described in this testimony? A. No, sir; she had not. Q. On page 626 of the printed testitimony, I call your atten- tion to this — what occurred in 1882 when you were there? A. I told you about Dr. Brush coming on and sending me back to ward twelve; that occurred Avhen I Avas there on that occasion; I was given a single room on number twelve ; something occurred during the time I Avas there that I thought I would speak of, and my husband wished me to speak of it; it w7as this: I went to the chapel one afternoon — 1 Avas quite poorly Avhen I went to the Asylum for I had been broken of my rest ; there Avas a German lady from down near Albany ; she wanted I should read to her in the recess, and several patients came Avhile I was reading to them, and after a while she came up to me and said "I want you to sing to me," and brought me a singing-book, and there was a Mrs. S. of Otsego county ; she said " Mrs. Fulford, don't try to sing, you look so tired ; " that excited this German lady, so she took this singing- book and gave me a hard blow on the side of the face and my head begin to ache very hard, etc., etc. ;" noAv do you remember any such occurrence as that ? A. Yes, sir ; there was no Mrs. S. of Oswego there at that time; but she (Mrs. Fulford) went to chapel and was sitting, as she states, in the recess, and I do not recall any German woman ; I do remem- ber some patient slapping her, and Avent to ask if she hurt her; she said no she didn't; a little later than that she said her head ached a little and Avent to her room just about dark ; I don't remember the patient who came to me and said Mrs. Fulford was sick ; I went down to the dormitory, it was not her own room wdiere she then Avas ; she had her feet in water ; I don't remember telling her to take them out and dry them^but we took them out and dried them and Miss Davis and myself and two patients carried her in- stead of dragging her to her room, which was two doors lower down the hall than the room she was then in. Q. Did you drag her ? A. No, sir, we carried her ; we did not take her up then with our arms, bnt lifted her from the floor ; Miss Davis and I had her shoulders; we then undressed her and put her to bed, and I in- formed Dr. Brush in regard to her condition and he came up and saw her ; and 1 think she said he brought her a pill or pills, which he did not. Q. I call your attention to page 723 of the printed testimony of 965 Mary A .Pelton : " Q. Any other ill-treatment on ward eight ? A. Well, some of the patients had to sleep on the wards in a straw bed < in the day rooms on the floor, and they would be strapped by the wrists to a chair. Q. The bed would be put where ? A. Right up close to the stationary chair ; and the patients strapped to the chair so that they could not stir in the night; it was a straw tick they were put on." Noav, I ask you Avhat there is in reference to that at the Asylum ? A. Tliere are patients avIio are too maniacal to sleep in the dormi- tories, they are sometimes restrained by having a Avristlet put upon their wrists, the belt put through that, and the belt fastened around the chair, the chair being stationary. Q. What is the object of that? A. To protect them and to protect other patients who may be Bleeping in the hall. Q. Protect them in what way ? A. From injuring themselves. Q. And from getting up and going about in the night? A. Yes, sir, sometimes restrained to prevent them being on their feet all night; some patients would be on their feet all night if not put down in that way. Q. What kind of beds are they put in when put in that way? A. If it is a neat patient, she has sheets and mattress, and if not clean, she has a etraAv bed. Q. I call your attention to page 724 of the printed testimony, to Miss Felton's testimony ; she refers to a memorandum and then says, "I Avas on the dormitory one night, on No. 5 ward, and saw Emma Stirling drag a patient from her bed ; she refused to take her medicine ; she left the door open, I looked through, she dragged her on the ward ; Emma Stirling had her hands resting on her lungs; this Miss K., who always carried the medicine tray for Miss Stirling, was holding the patient's nore; she poured it down her throat very harshly." Do you knoAV who Miss K. is ? A. There is no Miss K. that I remember of ever carrying the tray for me. Q. Did ever such occurrence take place as I have just read ? A. No, sir; I have no recollection of any such case, and I know it did not occur, for I never dragged a patient from her bed. Q. Have you ever placed a patient oh the floor and put yoir knees on her breast in any way to give her medicine ? A. No, sir; I never put my knees on a patient's body in any way. Q. Did you ever drag a person on the floor for any purpose ? A. No, sir. Q. Did you ever know of any fruit of Miss Pelton's being kept away from her ? A. No, sir. Q. Did you ever know of any fruit sent to patients by their 966 friends, being kept from them if they were in a condition to receive it? A. No, sir; and never without trying the patient to see if they would eat it. Q. Do you remember any fruit being sent to Miss Pelton ? A. I don't now recollect of any, I presume she may have had. Q. If she did have, would you know whether she received it or not? A. I would. Q. Why? A. Because the fruit would be sent to me on the ward, and I should be told of it, I never knew any to come that I was not told of. Q. Would you deliver the fruit as a general thing to the patient? A. Yes, sir. Q. Have you ever kept any fruit sent to patients from their friends ? A. No, sir; I have not; other attendants do carry the fruit sometimes. Q. You have been in that Asylum a long time, tell the committee what opportunities you had of seeing the treatment of patients by attendants, how you] manage every May jand what you do in going from ward to ward ? A. I go through with the medicine, and I make regular trips through the different wards on my department; I go directly after breakfast with the medicine, and after dinner and after supper, and at eight o'clock in the evening; I go at those times every day, and many times I go at irregular times and I would be very apt to see any ill-treatment that might occur. Q. Do you give any warning to your attendant when you come into your wards ? A. Yes, sir. Q. I mean do you tell them you are coming; any thing of that kind ? A. No, sir; oh no, sir. Q. Now, when a patient complains of ill-treatment by an attend- ant, what do you do about it ? A. I listen to the patient's story, and go to the attendant whom she makes charges against, then I go to the other attendants on the ward with her. Q. Do you always believe the story of the attendant? A. Not always. Q. When you do not believe the story of the attendant, what do yon do? A. Report it to the doctor. Q. Have yon seen a patient scratched or bruised while in covered beds? A. I have seen them bruised where they did it themselves, and have helped to pad the covered beds in order to prevent them bruis- ing themselves. 967 Q. Mies Pelton states she was sent off the ward because she took off her shoes and stockings — for taking off her shoes and Avent in her stocking feet; was she ever sent off the ward for any such thing as that ? A. No, sir; not for taking off her shoes; she might have been sent for something else ; I don't know what she was sent for, except for annoying patients and going to their bureau or drawers. Q. Would they be sent from the ward for having shoes and stock- ings off ? A. No, sir ; you might find them up there to-day, their shoes and stockings both off and they Avould still be on that ward. Q. Would that be any offense at all, Avalking about in their stock- ing feet ? A. We do not like to have it, still it is done. Q. It would not be any cause for disciplining in any way ? A. No, sir. Q. Do you know what Miss Pelton did do to patients? . A. I know some things she did ; she used to go around and put her hands in their faces and unbutton their dresses and feel their heart. Q. Why did she do that? A. She never would g.hre any reason for doing it. Q. Was Miss. Pelton a troublesome patient? A. Yes, sir; she was very sly and very mischievous. Q. Was she a filthy patient? A. Yes, sir; in her habits, very. Q. Did she require the camisole or muff? A. I don't recollect; I thing she wore the camisole. Q. Why? A. Because of her habits. Q. Personal habits ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you ever hear or know of her sticking pins into patients ? A. Yes, sir; I heard of it; I had no knowledge of it myself, only what the patients said and attendants on other wards told me. Q. What class of patients are usually strapped in the chair for any length of time? A. The maniacal and those Avho are inclined to_ stand all day or "walk, and whose limbs or feet are swollen by so doing.^ Q. Take a patient who is not maniacal in being violent if she was not put into a chair what Avould she do ; what would be her habit ? A. She might hurt herself. Q. Now in regard to standing, I want the committee to know about this; would she probably stand —how long would she stand in one place ? A. I have known patients to stand for hours. Q. What is the result of that standing? A. Their feet and limbs are swollen. 968 Q. Would they be liable to lie down right on the floor ? A. I don't call to mind any now that would. Q. And they usually stood more or less, and the fact is it makes the feet sw7ell ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And these persons are put into chairs, are they ? A. Yes, sir; occasionally. Q. I call your attention to page 723 of the printed testimony, in which Miss Pelton says : " Q. What was their conduct when not kept in the chair? A. One was an old lady ; she seemed mischie- vous ; she would go for the patients, and they would have to strap her down in the chair again." Did you ever strap a patient down in the chair simply on account of niischief ? A. Not unless their mischief was of such kind that it excited other patients. Q. But never as a punishment? A. No, sir. Q. Do you know Miss Burns ? A. I do. Q. How long have you knoAvn her ? A. I have known her quite familiarly for ten years. Q. Is she one of your attendants ? A. Yes, sir. Q. On Avhat ward ? A. Twelfth ward, she is in charge. Q. How long has she been under your supervision ? .A. The ten years I have been supervisor. Q. State to the committee your opinion of her as an attendant ? A. I think Miss Burns iss a very excellent attendant; very kind to the sick and neat especially. Q. Is she petulent ? A. No, sir, I never thought her to be so. Q. Do you regard her as a first-class attendant ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do you regard her as kind to the patients ? A. Yes, sir, very kind. Q. As considerate to them in their wants ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do you regard her as good an attendant as is under your su- pervision ? A. Yes, sir. Mr. Goodwin — Mr. Chairman you can examine. Mr. Haskell — I have no questions to ask. By Mr. Morgan : Q. In what respect Avas Miss Pelton untidy in her habits ? Mr. Goodwin — The case of Miss Pelton will be put in evidence. Mr. Morgan — If this is satisfactory to the committee, it is to me; that is all. Recess until 3 p. m. 969] By Mr. Goodwin : Q. Miss Lathrop speaks, in her testimony, about medicines being kept in jars or bottles, which supervisors had access to and used; do you know any thing about that ? A. Tliere is medicine sent up, such as cough medicine and simple remedies, that the attendants have directions to give. Q. Are they accessible to patients at all? A. No, sir, they are kept in the medicine cupboard in the super- visor's room. Q. Miss Fulford spoke of an attack made on a patient by you, when she asked to go to the communion that Dr. Gibson was to administer to a patient ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do you remember that circumstance ? A. Yes, sir. Q. State it? A. Miss R. was the sick attendant to whom Dr. Gibson Avas coming to give communion ; he came to the ward where Mrs. Ful- ford was and spoke to two patients , about it, in some Avay Mrs. Fulford heard of it, and she went round talking with the other patients about going to communion; this Miss *S. she speaks of, I never knew she had been confirmed; the condition of Miss R. was such that it was not thought Avise to have more than tAvo go; I told Miss S. slie'could not go, that the doctor had so instructed; but she went to her room and went to dressing then some visitors came and she came out, supposing it was the, doctors; I told her it Avas not the doctors, to go back to her room; she said she would not, then she got her hands in my hair and screamed, aud some other attendants came, and some patients, and we got her iuto the room as soon as we could ; whether she yelled ''murder" or not, I could not say ; I know she screamed. Q. You made no attack upon her ? A. No, sir. Q. And did not take her togher room and punish her ? A. No, sir; we only took her into her own room, from which she had come out partly dressed, while company were on the ward. Mrs. BARKER, Recalled : Mr. Goodavin — I desire to call attention to some corrections in Mrs. Barker's testimony. Q. I call your attention to vour testimony given before this com- mittee on Saturday morning, March 16, at the bottom of page 671: "Q. What do you mean by civil service?" Your answer is they pass a sort of examination, etc., etc.; what have you to say in regard to that ? 122 U 970 A. I meant to say, and supposed that I did, that they pass a "short" examination in my room, to see if they can read and write: that is, as I understand, is required by7 the civil service rules. Q. What is the next place ? A. Page 676, in regard to the night watchers. Q. What is it you wish to say ? A. By " they " used in the ansAver, I mean the supervisors and attendants. Q. Now in regard to a question on page 677, the question was, " Q. Do you regard it as improbable that the attendants, etc., etc.?" A. What I Avould like to say is this, that I don't know that it is impossible, but I think it is very improbable. Q. On page 678, the question was asked yon, " Do you know of any special cases coming under your notice, etc. ?" A. What I wish to say is, unless patients from water cures might be considered such, we have had one or two of those. Q. What else ? A. At the bottom of page 679, where it says "plain cooking," at the end of the answer, it should be " plain cake ; " there is some thing on page 677, but that has been corrected; that is all that is serious. Miss JENNIE MORRIS, Sworn and examined, testified as follows: By Mr. Goodwin : Q. Have you had read to you by me the testimony given by Miss Lathrop at page 536 of the printed testimony ? A. Yes, sir. * Q. In regard to a Miss ----, you have read that testimony ? A. Yes, sir. Q. State to the committee if there is any truth in that statement made at that page by Miss Lathrop ? A. I should say it was a falsehood. Q. You knew that lady spoken of ? A. Y es, sir. w Q. And she is now in the Asylum ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And she is in one of the wards in which yo^i are supervisor? A. x es, sir. Q. And nothing of that kind has ever occurred ? A. No, sir. , Q. Would you know if it had ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How long have you been in the Asylum ? A. Eleven years. 971 Q. What is your position there ? A. Supervisor of the first department. Q. How long have you been supervisor ? A. Eight years. Q. What were you before being supervisor? A. First attendant on third department, third ward. Q. What wards have you under your charge as supervisor? A. First hall, fourth hall, ninth and eleventh. Q. I call the chairman's attention to the testimony of Miss La- throp on page 536 of the printed testimony, and ask him whether the evidence of the witness is sufficient on that point sd far as the re- buttal of the evidence is concerned, or whether it be better to go more into detail ? y The Chairman — My impression is that it is sufficient. By Mr. Goodwin (resuming): Q. Have you known punishments to be inflicted on any patients at the Asylum? A. No, sir. Q. Do you knoAv whether patients have been rempved from one ward to another for any thing of the kind ? A. No, sir. Q. In case of complaints made to you by patients, in reference to treatment by attendants, what has been your course? A. It depends on the patient. Q. In what way does it depend on the patient ? A. If she was very insane I should not pay very much attention to it. Q. Suppose she was not very insane but reasonably sane ? A. I should see as well as I could — ask the attendants on the ward — see if there was any truth in it; if there was I should re- port to the doctors. *> Q. Suppose there was a difference between the attendant's state- ment and that of the patients? A. If I was not satisfied that it was not true, I should go to the doctor and let him decide; if I Avas not satisfied 'myself that there was no truth in it I should report to the doctor. Q. State about how many times in the course of twenty-four hours you are through your different wards ? A. Some days more times than others. Q. Well, on an ^average every day ? a A. Seven or eight times, sometimes ten orvtwelve and more than that, Q. When patients are sick with some small ailment, such as Btomach or ear ache, what do you do ? A. If I think it is necessary, I wait for the doctor to come, but if it was severe and would not do to wait, I would go to the doctor. Q. Do you know of any patient suffering in that way without the doctor being notified about her condition ? A. No, sir, I don't. 972 Q. This Mrs. T., onjiage 539 of the printed testimony, do you remember her ? A. Ida Q. What was her difficulty or trouble; the account is: "Q. When was the first time that Mrs. T. was taken sick as you have described? A. The first time that Mrs. T. was sick was during the first year I was in the Asylum, while I was on the second ward? Q. What attendants took care of her duriug her sickness ? A. Mrs. Sterling, I think, and a Miss Davis ;" you took care of her particu- larly, this Mrs. T.? / A. Yes, sir; she Avas sick on the first hall with erysipelas in her hand for several weeks. Q. She had none of the symptoms described by Miss Lathrop ? A. No, sir. Q. Have you known of medicines being given as a punishment to patients ? A. No, 6ir. \ Q. Have you known any attendants to make use of the stomach tube or feed patients with the stomach tube ? A. No, sir; I never have seen it done by an attendant; the physician always did that. Q. I Avilhask you about the number of times you have seen Dr. Gray on the Avard; what is your recollection upon this subject ? A. I have seen him on the ward very often. Q. About how many times in the course of a Aveek that he has been in the institution ? A. Two or three times, and twice in one day sometimes? Q. Is he familiar with the names of the patients in your wards ? A. I should think he was; he goes up to them and shakes hands and calls them by name always. Q. Is he familiar with their particular ailments Avhen you ask them about it ? A. Yes ; he often asks me about different patients and their ail- ments. By Mr. Morgan : Q. For the last year how often do you say Dr. Gray has visited your ward ? A. I don't know7. Q. How often do yon say he has visited the wards under your supervision ? A. I cannot say at all. Q. For the last year ? A. I cannot say how often. Q. Has he done it as often as once a month ? A. I cannot tell. Mr. Morgan—That is as far as I have heard her testimony. Mr. Chairman—I do not think there are any more questions the committee want to ask. 973 ANNIE BURNS, "^ Sworn and examined, testified as follows : i By Mr. Goodwin : Q. Where do you reside ? A. My home is Williamsport, Pa.; my father lives there. Q. What is your age? A. My age 1 really cannot tell; it is either 29 or 30 next birth- day; there is a doubt about it. Q. How long have you been an attendant in the Asylum at Utica? A. Thirteen years. Q. On what ward were you first an attendant ? A. On number twelve. Q. Have you been there ever since on that ward ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Are you now the head attendant on that ward ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How long have you been ? A. Nearly ten years. Q. Who is the supervisor on your ward ? A. Miss Sterling. Q. Who are yonr assistant attendants? A. At present, Miss Thomas of Utica and Miss Jones of Madison county. Q. I call yonr attention to page 719 of the printed testimony; the testimony of Miss Pelton ; she says: " Q. While on ward 12, did you see any unkind treatment by the supervisor or attendants of the patients on that ward ? A. I think I did see a great deal; Anna Burns would fasten me in the stationary chair, and did so several times ; after I was restrained she took my wrist and twisted it as far as she could until I begged her to stop ; then she says, "there," just as if she had conquered me; she twisted it as far as she could, clear over; another, time she strapped me so tight in the chair it took the flesh off my left side; it was drawn so tight it took the skin off; I could hardly breathe; I was there about two hours in that way." Is there any truth in that statement? A. No, sir ; there is not. Q. Do you know Miss Pelton ? A. I do. Q. Was she in your ward ? A. She was; yes, sir. Q. What kind of a patient was she ? A. A very annoying patient; she would torture the patients, stick pins in them, bite them, kick them, and scratch them, and would spit in her hands and rub it in their faces. Q. Was she restrained while on your ward ? 974 A* I think I used the waist band by order of the physician. Q. What for ? A. We could watch her during work hours to keep her from hurting the other patients. Q. How in reference to herself? A. She was a very untidy patient, very obscene in her habits. Q. And was a filthy patient? A. I cannot remember whether she was filthy or not, the record will tell that. Q. Did you ever twist Miss Pelton's arms in any way? A. No, sir; I have taken hold of her arms and in trying to get >away- from me, she would twist her own arms and wrist. Q. Why did you take hold of her arms ? A. It was necessary ; she would scratch and kick and we have to defend ourselves some way, Ave cannot stand every thing. Q. In her efforts to get away when you took hold of her she would do what is called this twist of the arms, as was explained here this morning ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you ever strap her in the chair ? A. I think I did. Q. So that it took off the flesh off her left side ? A. No, sir. Q. Would it be possible ? A. I don't hardly think it would. Q. Is it possible to strap a person in such a way that it will take the skin off the left side or any side ? A. No, sir; it is not possible to do that. Q. Did you ever strap a person so tight that you could not insert your hand between her person and the belt ? A. No, sir; usually when I got a patient restrained, I put my hand betweenthe patient and the belt, very often it is so loose they get out of it, if it is a slender person. Q. I call your attention to page 720 of the testimony ; she says it was a common thing for you to twist wricts ; did you ever know- ingly, or willfully, twist any patient's wrists? A. No, sir. Q. Was it a method of punishment for you in any way to twist people's wrists ? A. No, sir. Q. Do you remember Mrs. Fulford ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you ever tear any clothing belonging to the patients? A. Well, I might in taking hold of their sleeves and they would pull away from me, if the dress was old it would tear out. Q. Have you ever torn any clothing in your attempts to quieten A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you ever tear any person's dress to pieces ? 975 A. Not to my knowledge, Q. I call your attention to page 62" or the printed testimony : " Q. How do yon know that? A. She tore it ; they took them in this way (indicating) by the neck of the dress and dragged them ; and I saw new dresses all torn to pieces; and I saw more than this the last time I was there." State whether yon have ever dragged a patient across the ward at any time ? A. No, sir; we sometimes carry a patient across the ward, some- times she will fall, we lift her up and she will fall again. Q. Have yon ever got a patient by the neck of the dress and dragged her so that the dress Avas torn ? A. No, sir. Q. 1 call your attention to page 630 of the printed testimony — Miss Fulford's testimony, her answer is, "There was a patient there by the name of Mrs. G. she Avas a young lady and I was quite interested in her; she did not do very much,but I got her so that she did considerable ; that was on Avard tAvelve ; well, she had not been to chapel since I had been there, and one day the jubilee singers came there; they came there to sing ; they came up to me and said I could go up to the chapel,if I wished; I asked Miss Burfts if Mrs. G. ; could go with me, she said ' it was so much trouble to dress her;'I said thatl would dress her and get her ready to go, and see that she was returned in safety, and finally she consented to let me take Mrs.;G. ;I got her ready for the concert, and she wore a very nice dress, it was neAv ; this Avas on Saturday, so she kept the dress out and put it on Sunday morning; and afterward they let her go to chapel with me; she Avent to hear these jubilee singers with me, and she seemed to enjoy the singing very much. Just as she was going to her room to go to bed Ann Burns saVyher, she stood right near by, she kind of struck at Mrs. G. ; and Mrs. G.; at first did' not] notice it, so she did so again; that is, Ann Burns did so again, and then Mrs. G. struck back at Burns; then Miss Burns called for more attendants and they came; they threw her down on the hall floor ; she was rather a small woman, but they sent for tAvo attendants on number eight, and they came down and I Avent to my room, for I could not bear to see it; but I saAV they were hurting her very much ; there was a crib-room, the second room from mine, on that hall, and they dragged her through,and I saAV that that new dress was all torn to pieces ; I saAV her as they dragged her past my room, and into the room beyond ; I heard them take her in there and put her in the crib, and she remained there all night"; I never saw that dress afterward." Is there any truth in that statement ? A. No, sir. Q. Do you know who Mrs. G. is? A. I think it Avas Mrs. G----r ; I think she was transferred to another asylum. Q. Did you on any occasion drag Mrs. G. as described in this answer which I have read ? 976 A. No, sir. i • « Q. Did you at any time exercise any violence upon that patient! A. No, sir. Q. What kind of a path nt was she ? A. Melancholy ; she had periods of distinctiveness and periods of violence; she attempted suicide tAvice whilst she was here. Q. Do you remember whether there was any thing in this state- ment in reference to her going to the chapel or in reference to hearing the jubilee singers? A. Yes, sir; Mrs. G. I think she went to hear the jubilee si-.gers and became frightened because they were colored, andshe came down screaming, and that day she tore her own dress, which was a black dress, not new. Q. Did you take her on that occasion — did you take her into a crib? A. No, sir. Q. What did you do with her when she came down from hearing the jubilee singers ? A. She tore her dress so that I had to change it, and after a while she became quiet. By Mr. Haskell : Q. Do you say she was not put into the crib on that occasion ? A. No, sir, she was not. Q. Did you strike her in the face on that occasion ? A. No, sir. Q. Did you strike her at all ? A. No, sir. Q. Have you told us all about this matter you can ? A. All that I remember. Q. I call your attention to page 630 of the printed testimony: " Q. Is there any thing else that occurred during the time that you were there ? A. Yes, sir ; there Avas a Mrs. A. there; she was from Auburn ; she Avas a very quiet patient; but one day when we were eating dinner in the dining-room something was said to her that excited her very much ; she was a very large Avoman ; she became excited, and this Miss Burns got in five attendants, but before they did any thing Ann Burns came to me ; she knew that I had a perfect hor- ror of seeing sueh things ; she came to me and said : 'We are going to drag Mrs. A. through and put her into the crib-room, and if you do not want to see it done you had better go into your own room ;' so I did so; just before I went into my room I saw tAvo attendants jump on to her stomach ; I think they were afraid she was getting the mastery of them." Did you know a Mrs. A. on your ward ? A. There was a Mrs. A----s. Q. Did any such occurrence as this take place? A. Not that I remember. 977 Q. Do you know \vhether you did say to Mrs. Fulford at any time that "we are going to drag Mrs. A. through and put her into the crib-room " ? A. No, sir; even if I was going to do it, I should not tell Mrs. Fulford. Q. Did yon ever drag her or any other patient through the hall into the crib-room ? A. No, sir; I never dragged a patient. By Mr. Haskell : Q. Have you ever seen a patient dragged ? A. Sometimes when we take hold of them. Q. You have seen it done, but never have done it yourself? A. No, sir; I have never done it. By Mr. Goodwin : Q. What did you when a patient was very violent and maniacal; tell me what is the first thing you do Avhen you see a woman in this maniacal condition and needing restraint; give us the operation; the modus operandi f A. In case of emergency, I take that patient into a room and put a waist-belt on her. Q. Suppose you cannot do it alone, what is done then ? A. I never try to do it alone. Q. Hoav many attendants do you have to assist you? A. Three. Q. No ; I am speaking generally in reference to such a patient as I have described ? A. It is OAving to the condition of the patient. Q. I am speaking of very maniacal patients like Mrs. D. ? A. I ahArays call assistance from another ward. Q. How many have you ever had to call ? A. I have called two from another AA7ard. Q. Hoav many then would there be ? A. Five of us. Q. At this one person \ A. Y es, sir. Q. Describe, what you Avould do with this person ? A. We would do the best Ave could. Q. State how you take her and where? A. We cannot ahvays choose our hold ; we have to take hold where we can, and how Ave can, owing to the condition of the patient; if a patient is very violent and comes at you you cannot wait to choose Avhat part yon will take hold of her ; you take hold just Avhere you can. Q. Do you lift her up and carry her i A. Sometimes we do. Q. Don't you do it every time ? 123 U 978 A. Yes, sir. Q. What do yon say " sometimes " for ? A. Well sometimes there is a chair close by and we put her in there. Q. I am speaking of taking a violent patient from the hall to take to the crib, for instance, if yon had to take to the crib ? A. Yes, sir; to the crib-room ; there is only one stationary chair in the ward, that is in the crib-room. Q. Suppose she is at the other end of the ward ? A. We carry her. Q. You never drag her? A. No, sir. Q. You have never knoAvn a case of that kind Avhich you have been speaking of, anybody being dragged in the Asylum? A. Not that I remember. Q. Have yon ever yourself jumped on a patient's stomach? A. No, sir. Q. Have you ever seen an attendant do it ? A. No, sir ; never. Q. Have I read you the testimony of Mrs. Fulford in reference to the carpenter, Jones, coming on the ward ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Has Mr. Jones at any time taken any liberties with yon ? A. No, sir. Q. Or ever offered to do it ? A. No, sir. Q. Have you ever seen him take any liberties Avith any attenu- ants in that Asylum % A. No, sir ; I have not. Q. Were you ever in the bath-room with Mr. Jones with the door closed ? A. Never with the door closed; I may have been in the bath- room or any other room, but not with the door closed. Q. If you w7ere, what Avas the occasion of it? A. I would go in and show him Avhere the repairs were to be done. Q. That Avas your duty and business? A. Yes, sir. Q. Have you ever heard any lewd or lascivious talk among attend- ants before patients? A. No, sir. Q. Have you ever heard any at any time in the Asylum by anv patients ? A. No, sir. Q. Did you hear these stories that Mrs. Fulford circulated about you before this investigation? A. Yes, sir ; I heard it Avhile she was in the Asylum. Q. Did you pay any attention to them at all ? A. I spoke to Mrs. Barker about it. 979 Q. And that was all ? A. I spoke to Miss Sterling about it. Q. Did you treat Mrs. Fulford any differently from what you did any other patient ? A. No, sir; I did not; I tried to do my duty by Mrs. Fulford. Q. Did you treat Mrs. Pelton in any way different from any other patient ? A. No, sir; I did not. Q. Have you at any time used more violence to a patient* than was necessary to protect yourself or other patients ? A. No, sir. Q. Have you at any time struck a patient ? A. Not to my knowledge. Q. Have you been struck ? A. Yes, sir', frequently. Q. Have y7ou wounds on your person ? A. Yes, sir; little finger broken (little finger on left hand), and one hand put out of joint (the right hand), and my hair, there, was pulled out by the roots so that it never grew again. Mr. Morgan — That is all, Mr. Chairman. ------ ■' "M The Chairman — In regard to this report of Dr. Anderson, made to the State Board of Charities, and offered in evidence by counsel for the Asylum, the committee are of opinion for the reasons stated on pages 726 and 727; and for the further reason that Dr. Ander- son has since been examined and has stated his knoAvledge of the institution, that in their judgment, there is no propriety in putting the report itself on record ; also with regard to the letter from Dr. Anderson to Dr. Gray, that is excluded for the same reasons. In regard to the affidavit of Mr. Rogers offered by counsel for the Asylum the affidavit is admitted ; but the committee desire to have it appear in regard to the first alleged misstatement where the I' witness is reported as saying, " I think it must be several thousand barrels a year," but now says in his affidavit that he said at that time " over a thousand barrels a year." The committee are clear in their recollection that the witness actually said " several thousand barrels a year," as reported by the stenographer in the printed !" testimony on page 400. The committee are also clear in their recollection that the witness said, " yes, sir, " in answer to the question as to whether gas was sold lower to public buildings than the Asylum. . , With the above qualification the affidavit is admitted, and is as follows: 980 Exhibit No. 24. State of New York, | , City and county of New York. \ PUBLIUS Y. ROGERS, Being duly sworn, says : That he is one of the managers of the New York State Lunatic Asylum ; that on or about the 29th day of February, 1884, he was sworn and testified as a witness upon the examination and investiga- tion into the affairs of the New York State Lunatic Asylum, by the committee of the Assembly of the Legislature of the State of New York ; that owing to his OAvn ill health and that of his wife, he has been counseled by his medical adviser to go away from home, and deponent will probably be unable to again attend before the com- mittee during the investigation, and therefore begs leave to submit to the committee this affidavit. That deponent has read what purports to be his oavii evidence as printed by the committee, and desires to correct the same in follow- ing particulars, viz.: On page 400: In answer to question, how much flour is used there monthly or annually \ I am reported as saying, I think it must be several thousand barrels a year ; whereas I said or intended to say over a thousand barrels a year. Again on page 407. In answer to question, do you know, as a fact, that the price of gas Avas lower to public buildings and hotels, etc., than the Asylum ? I am reported as saying, yes, sir ; Avhereas I said no, sir ; and now say, rto, sir. Again, I ansAvered incorrectly in saying that Manager Winston brought the matter of purchase of supplies to the notice of the board in April, 1883. I now recall the fact that at the April meeting, in assigning the new members of the board to places on committees, it was freely ex- pressed by members of the board, that having a new'member, es- pecially coiTversant with the values of commodities entering largely into necessary use at the Asylum, that the vacancy in the committee of audit should be filled by appointing such new member, and there- upon Mr. Winston was appointed to a place on that committee, according to my best recollection, at the April meeting, 1883. No criticism upon the methods then followed in purchasing supplies for the Asylum was made by any one. And deponent further says he has heard read a portion of what purports to be the printed testimony of Dwight D. Winston, which refers to the purchase by the Asylum authorities of supplies from Butler & Hamilton of Utica. ^ That this deponent was present at a regular meeting of the board 981 of managers of the New York State Limatic Asylum held on the first Tuesday of December, 18^3, and participated in its proceed- ings. That a short time prior to said meeting, said Winston on one occasion called upon deponent and called his attention to the subject of the purchase of groceries for the Asylnm, whereupon deponent advised said Winston to bring the matter before the board at its meeting then near at hand ; that at said meeting in December this deponent understood said Winston to speak in a general way that he thought there might be improvement in the ways of purchasing goods in the line of groceries ; that Dr. Gray being called upon for an opinion stated in substance that he should be pleased to adopt any manner the board saw fit to advise in the way of purchasing supplies looking toward economy and saving of money" for the Asylum. A motion was then made and a resolution was then passed to re- fer the matter to the auditing committee to report upon the subject, Mr. Winston being a member of that committee. That according to deponent's best recollection Mr. Winston did not produce at this meeting, nor at any other meeting of the board of managers, the bills of Butler & Hamilton referred to in his testimony, nor any other bills of Butler & Hamilton, nor did he refer to any items contained in any bills of Butler & Hamilton, nor did he refer to the prices of any items contained in any bills of Butler & Hamilton. That since the reference of the subject to said committee no report has been made so far as deponent's knowl- edge goes; and that from the time of such reference to the time said Winston gave his testimony, deponent has heard nothing from said Winston or any one else upon the subject. P. Y. ROGERS. Subscribed and sworn to before ) me, this 25th day of March, 1884. f Wm. M. Thomas (12), Notary Public, New York Co. 982 ERYIN SLASSON, Sworn and examined, testified as follows: By Mr. Haskell : Q. Where do you live and what is your business ? A. Whitestown, I am a brickmaker; I work by the month for Williams & Co. Q. What is your age ? A. Forty-two. Q. Is this brick-yard located at Whitestown ? A. Yes, sir; it is a mile from the village, close to the Mohawk river. Q. Do you recollect the occurrence of a man coming into the brick-yard naked ? A. Yes, sir. Q. You may state what there was to that occurrence, what he said and what there was of it ? A. What the naked man said ? Q. Yes. A. He came there naked; he wanted to know if I had an old shirt and a pair of pants for him ; we told him yes, and we went in and got them and fetched them out, and he put them on; when he got them on, two young fellows — Q. Wait a minute, who was with you, if any one ? A. My brother William. Q. Go on ? A. And he got them on, and these two fellows came and peeked through the shed and see him, and they came on a dead run ; then one fellow grabbed him and tried to throw him; he worked quite a while before he could get him dow7n ; this man never offered to wrestle with him, or hit him, or any thing; and after a while he throwed him, and when he throwed him he jumped right in his stomach with both his knees, just as hard as he could jump ; then this fellow could not get up ; he told him to get up, and he said he could not, and he was as white as a sheet, so they got hold under each arm and raised him up and his legs were bent right up, and he was as white as a sheet; bent up in this way (indicating), they were doubled right up, and that is the way they took him off. Q. Did you or your brother say any thing to these two men about the way they were treating this man ? A. Yes, my brother told them not to hurt him, but they did not make no answer. Q. Did this man who came there naked, tell you he was from the Asylum or any thing of that kind ? A. He did not until after he got the shirt, and then he said he 983 had been at the Asylum, and that they had abused him terribly Q. Never mind that — he said he was from the Asylum 2 A. Yes. By Mr. Rice : Q. Who were these men that took him away, do you know 5 A. No, sir. Q. Have you seen them since ? A. No, sir. Q. Did you learn about that time from any other source chat this man was an escaped lunatic ? A. After that, I did. Q. How soon after that ? A. It was about ten or fifteen minutes. Q. Who told you that ? A. There Avas a man came up on a horse, a gentleman, I don't know his name; I don't know who he was. Cross-examination by Mr. Goodwin: Q. When was this affair ? A. It was last summer. Q. What time in the summer ? A. I could not tell, about the middle. Q. Was it in June, July or August? A. I could not tell for certain. Q. You can't tell whidhref those months ? A. No, sir. Q. Was it in the newspapers ? A. Yes, sir ; it was in the papers after that. Q. What papers was it published in ? A. The Daily Press, I believe. Q. Any other papers ? A. Not that I know of. Q. Do you know Dr. Brush ? A. No, sir. Q. This gentleman here (indicating Dr. Brush) ? A. I never saw him, that is, not as I knoAv of. Q. Have you not seen him at the Asylum ? A. No, sir. By Dr. Brush : Q. Haven't you drawn brick to the Asylum ? A. No, sir. Q. Didn't you see me at the brick-yard when I went to look over some brick with Mr. Graham, the engineer ? A. I believe I did too. L 984 Q. You knew I was from the Asylum. A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you say any thing to Mr. Graham, or to me, about tms matter ? A. Not as I recollect. Q. It was after this matter occurred that you saw me at the brick- yard ? j A. Yes, sir. Q. And you say there Avas a man came there on horse-back ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you say any thing to him in regard to the matter ? A. No, sir, I spoke to him ; I told him they had catched him, and he started up then ; he wanted to know what man catched him, and I told him a couple of young gentlemen that worked at the Asylum. DR. E. N. BRUSH, Recalled. By Mr. Goodwin : Q. Have you heard the testimony of this last witness ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do you know any thing about the case referred to by him ? A. I never knew any thing about it until the newspaper statement was published in the press since this investigation commenced. ,v Q. vDid you make any investigation in reference to it ? A. I did. Q. What was the result ? A. I examined the only remaining attendant who is in the Asylum he denied any such assertion; I also examined James Mahar avIio went up on horse back; he said that at the time he saw two or three men gathered around in a group, talking rather excitingly, and another man spoke to him and said, "they have caught the patient, or got the patient, I may be mistaken about that, the other man said to him, those two men are saying this patient wras abused," but, "I saw the whole proceeding, and there was no abuse." Q. Do you know the name of that man ? A. No, sir, I asked him to make inquiry into the matter and find out who it was. Q. What was the name of the patient ? A. I am not sure of his first name, his last name is C, I think A is B. C, it was a case of chronic insanity, a criminal sent from Seneca Co., — I cannot recollect what he Avas doing at the time he escaped, but just before that he was employed in the kitchen ; the name of the attendant remaining there now is David Linn. 985 Q. Did you become satisfied that there was no blame to be attached to the attendants in that matter ? A. As far as my inquiry could then go. By. Mr. Haskell : Q. Did you go to see these men at the brick yard upon whose authority this piece was published in the paper ? A. No, sir, I did not. Q. Did you consider that you were making a fair examination without doing that ? A. I inferred — I thought the facts would be proven ; that the men would be called as witnesses, and that the matter would be investigated anyway; the article said that the committee ought to call these two men, and I suppose the committee would call them ; we made some investigation at the Asylum. Q. And the only reason that you did not go to see these men in the brick yard was that you thought the committee would call them ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And you would have examined them if it had not been for that? A. Yes, sir ; I don't know that I should have driven up immedi- ately, but having business transactions with the firm for which these men worked, I should have asked them at the first opportunity. Q. But you do say that yon made up your mind there was nothing in it Avithout going to examine them ? A. I made up my mind that their story was exagerated at least; the statement made to me was that the man went to the shed and had some brick-bats in his hand. Q. Who was that made by ? A. Either Linn or Mahar; I don't recollect which it was. By Mr. Rice: Q. Is that patient now in the Asylum ? A. Yes, sir, and he says there was nothing in it; I am glad you called my attention to that. Q. What is his name? A. C. I asked him ; he says he was not abused. Q. What class of patients does he belong to, disturbed or other- wise? A. He spoke to you ; he is on the tenth ward ; he spoke to you or Mr. Haskell, he asked about being shaved. Q. Is he a man who talks rationally upon any subjects? ■ A. Not very ; he is a pretty insane man, very fully controlled by [ delusions. ; By Mr. Haskell : ■ Q. Would he know whether he was hurt at that time or not ? A. I think so. 124 U 986 Q. So as'to haA7e a recollection about it noAv ? A. I think so; I asked him about going into the canal, he recol- lected that; he stripped off his clothes, and the brink yard is beyond the canal. By Mr. Goodwin : Q. He did not escape from the Asylum naked ? A. No, sir ; he threw off his clothes and swam the canal, and he did not take them over Avith him it appears. Q. Do you know Miss Burns ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How long have you known her ? A. Ever since I became connected with the Asylum; more inti- mately during the past three years ; I have been there six years. Q. What do you say of her as an attendent ? A. I regard her as an excellent attendant ? Q. What kind of ward is she over ? A. She has a ward of very trying patients, most of them Avith nxea delusions ; many of them are patients who scold, either at each other, the attendants, or at immaginary persons about them ; they are con- trolled by hallucinations of hearing and sight; some few patients are subject to paroxysms and frenzy. Q. Do you regard her as a patient, kind and humane Avoman ? A. As far as my observation has gone (and I have watched her with considerable care), I do. Q. Has she the reputation there among attendants or patients of being severe or cruel ? A. Patients on her ward, as on many wards make complaints of all sorts; I have never had to investigate any but what I found — or in which I found that she had been in the wrong. Q. Have there been more complaints made of her than of other, or ah of the other attendants in the Asylum, or than most of them \ A. No, sir. Q. Now, doctor, in regard to medicines sent to the Avards, please explain about that, to the committee ? A. We have an apothecary who puts up all the medicines. Q. Upon the prescriptions of the physician ? A. Yes, sir; these medicines are sent to the Avards, with very exceptional instances, in single doses ; a patient, for instance, who takes medicine three times a day, has her cup, or his cup, with the name plainly marked on it so that it cannot be washed off, and that cup is sent up to the ward three or four times a day, depending on the number of times the patient takes the* medicine ; the cups for each department are collected together and placed on what is termed a medicine tray ; these trays are at stated intervals sent to the de- partments with the single doses of medicine in each cup for the vari- ous patients taking medicine; the supervisors takes charge of the tray and carries it through her department, and gives the medicine 987 to the various patients; sometimes in cases of acute attacks of diar- rhoea, or a case of pneumonia or a case of cold, where medicine has to be administered every two or three hours, a small bottle of medi- cine is sent up with the name of the patient marked plainly on it, and the dose, and that is given to the supervisors or head attendant of the ward ; that is only done in exceptional cases. Q. Is a large bottle of medicine ever given to an attendant or supervisor to give out ? , A. No, sir ; I do not think any bottle larger than would hold six or eight ounces would ever be sent on to the ward. Q. Now, in reference to cough medicine, or any thing like that ? A. Perhaps a bottle containing about two dozen doses would be sent. Q. Hoav are the patients fed who will not eat ? A. They are fed by the physicians in case they resist taking food at all; sometimes patients will eat if the food is placed to their mouth — will feed themselves ; in those cases an attendant on the ward is directed and shown how tos do it; all patients who resist | taking the food are fed with the stomach tube, as a rule ; sometimes we get along without using the stomach tube. Q. Now, doctor, are attendants ever allowed to use the stomach tube? A. Never. Q. And have you ever known where they have used it ? A. No, sir. Q. Have you examined at my request the testimony of Giles Penny ? A. I have examined it. Q. Please look at his case — Mr. Rice — One moment, please, I want to ask the doctor a ques- tion or two. ; By Mr. Rice: (^. What quantities of chloral are annually used in the institution ? A. I could not say ; I very rarely see the drug bill. Q. Can you approximate it ? A. I would not care to even approximate it. Q. For what purposes do you use it ? A. It is used as a hypnotic or sleep-producing remedy. Q. Explain to what extent it is used as a sleep-producing remedy ? A. I think that perhaps to-day or to-night, perhaps one-fifth of our patients will take a dose of chloral, varying from ten grains to [ twenty grains. Q. Then there are one huudred and twenty people in the institu- lf tion avIio will to-night take chloral ? A. Somewhere in that neighborhood. Q. What is the effect of chloral upon the system ? A. It produces sleep with as little disturbance of the system as any drug known. . ....... ,___,...__«, 988 Q. What is the general effect upon the system where it is admin- istered regularly every night ? A. I do not think it has any deleterious effect; sometimes it pro- duces headache, and occasionally it is said by some authors to produce a peculiar condition of the nails — upon the matrix of the nails. Q. Does it affect the nerves any ? A. Not that I know of. Q. Are there patients in the institution to whom it is administered every night ? A. Yes, sir ; for a time, but not continuously. Q. For how long a period ? A. It would depend upon how long they were sleepless — six weeks, tAvo months, or three months. Qj Do you think that the general health or the system of the patient does not suffer from that administration of chloral ? A. I have watched it very carefully and I never saw any dele- terious effects. Q. What is chloral ? A. It is a product produced by the distillation of alcohol with chlorine ; I cannot give the scientific process. Q. Then it is alcohol and chlorine, is it ? A. That would be stating it pretty broadly ; its exact chemical composition I did know for I have seen it made, but I do not now recall. Q. What is chlorine ? A. It is a gas ; one of the elements. Q. Eliminated from what ? A. It is eliminated from the chlorates — the chlorate of potassium, chlorate of lime ; it is found natural in certain mineral waters and gas wells. By Mr. Goodwin (resuming): Q. Have you examined the testimony of Giles A. Penney? A. Yes. Q. Now, I wish you would state to the committee in regard to that? A. I have examined it and made several notes, which I have with me, and I can refer to them as I go along; the first note is in refer- ence to his testimony, on page 181, where he says he was on the seventh ward two or three weeks; he entered the seventh ward on the 21st February, and was transferred to the sixth ward on the 26th, so that he was only five days. On page 181 he was asked: " Q. Hoav long did you remain on the sixth ward? A. I was there two or three weeks." The fact is that he was transferred from the sixth ward, March 11, to the third ward; on March 25 he was transferred. to the second ward ; on the 5th of April he was transferred to No. 8. On page 182 he details his transfer from ward two to No. 8, and 98& says that he was carried and pushed along by attendants who would not allow him to walk, and aaTio took him along side passages. Mr. Penny was apparently convalescing favorably when, on the 3d of April, he was visited by his wife (on the second ward), who com- plained to patients of how badly things were going on in his absence. Mr. Haskell — Are you testifying from recollection, or from your minutes ? A. From the records of the case. Mr. Haskell — And not from recollection ? A. No, sir; and to whom the patient said he had appeared as well as possible, and had eaten every thing he could, although every thing tasted like a chip, in order to fool the doctors. On the follow- ing day he was emotional, asking to be sent home, crying, moaning and groaning and wringing his hands, much disturbed by his wife's injudicious conversation. On the night of the 5th he became dis- turbed ; was up and about and noisy ; not in his room asleep as he says; lie Avas transferred by the direction of the physicians to the eighth ward ; there are no side passages and no roundabout way to the eighth ward, that being in the story above the second ward, but over the third ward, which joins the second. The night nurses made report the folloAving morning that Mr. Penny was noisy nearly the entire night. On page 184 he says he states that he had seen patients strapped in the chair until they were "all dark," and could hardly breathe. The statement that a patient can be strapped in a chair until he is black or " all dark," and could hardly breathe, is utterly without foundation. The strap passes around the abdo- men, and no amount of pressure in that locality with a strap would make a patient turn black in the face or would materially interfere with his breathing. The statement on the same page in regard to the camisole being so constructed that the hands were so drawn that they pressed hard against the stomach, has been contradicted by several witnesses, as well as the statement on the same page in refer- ence to the buckle making the back sore as I answered in my pre- vious testimony. By Mr. Goodwin : Q. Please state it again ? A. That is not so; there is a space six or eight inches between the place where the camisole is fastened in front and the hands. By Mr. Haskell : Q. In regard to this strap, does it cross behind when it is put round a person's body, and then is it put through and fastened ? A. No, sir ; it is placed right round and the chair aud the body is included in the same circle. Q. And it does not cross entirely behind ? A. No, sir. 990 Q. Never? A- I have never seen it so. Q. Do you recollect the circumstance of our last visit to the insti- tution ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do you recollect the case of a Avoman on a very disturbed ward, who was strapped with a strap crossing behind her body, com- pletely encircling it, and then passed through the chair and fastened ? A. Yes, sir; I remember that case; I saw you looking at it at the time. Q. Then you haAre seen it in the institution ? A. No, sir ; you asked me if I had seen it passed that way. Q. Are you answering all my questions in the same technical spirit that you answered my last question ? A. I am answering the questions as I understand them ; if you Avill let me explain I will set myself clear and you too. Q. You may give any other explanation you desire? A. 1 would like the question read. (Question read by the stenographer). A. I answered the question as I understood it. Q. Is that all you wish to state ? A. No, sir ; the case to which you refer I saw, and I observed you looking at that patient; I noticed it myself, and I asked the at- tendant if she had strapped the patient in that way, she said "no, you saw that same thing happen yesterday," and I did see it happen; the patient got on the arm of the chair and twisted herself round, and if you nad examined it you would have found it was done in that way. Q. Would not the patient have to turn a complete somersault ? A. Yes, sir ; the day before it took Dr. Quinn and myself half an hour to get the strap into place again after the patient had twisted it in that Avay, and it was done in our presence. The Chairman — You don't mean she turned a somersault ? A. No, sir ; she turned right over like that (illustrating) by put- ting her feet over the back of the chair. Q. She would have to bring the center of her back up to the strap ? A. Of course she would have to make more of a somersault than I did just now. Q. Did the attendant tell you how long before we came in that occurrence had happened ? A. I did not ask her, no, sir. Q. Do you recollect that you found the strap so tight around the body of the patient that it was with difficulty you could get your finger between the body of the patient and the strap ? A. I do not recollect that I examined. Q. Do you not recollect that you called the attendant there, and made the attendant loosen the strap as much as six inches ? 991 A. I recollect loosening the strap ; and not only loosening it but putting it round in the proper manner again. Q. Do you swear that you put it in the proper manner ? A. Yes, or that the attendant did. Q. Did you yourself take the buckle and unbuckle it ? A. No, sir; I don't recollect that I did. Q. Do you recollect that you did not ? A. I know I did not undo the buckle, for I did not have a key to the lock. Q. Did you call the attendant to do that, and take the key jfrom her? A. No, sir. Q. And did you not leave the strap crossed behind the patient ? A. No, sir, I don't recollect it. Q. Will you SAvear you did not ? A. I won't swear one way or the other, because I don't recollect. By Mr. Goodwin (resuming) : Q. Now go on with the Penny case, doctor ? A. I was speaking about his statements as to the restraint; on page 185 he says that a patient with a camisole on could not turn over in the coA-ered bed ; this is also without foundation in fact. The statement on page 185 in regard to his remaining on the eighth ward two or three weeks is sufficiently indicative of the incorrect- ness of his memory ; he was on the eighth ward from April 6 to June 5, two months lacking a day. Page 186, he states that the fafucets were all taken off the Avater-pipes ; this is another indication of the patient's misapprehension and mental disturbance; patients have water at their meals and as often during the day as they desire; that statement is not true. Mr. Haskell — And was not true at that time ? A. It has not been true at any time since 1 have been in the institution. On page 187, the statement that he only saw the physi- cian once while he was on the eighth ward is entirely contrary to fact. He was seen at least twice a day by Dr. Brush or Dr. Josselyn, or both, and sometimes oftener. The same is true of the statement on page 187 that he did not see Dr. Gray while on the ward. His statement, indeed, is contradicted by his own testimony on the same page, where he says that he saw the doctor on the eighth ward, the second Sunday after he was put there. The patient was not on the eighth ward the second Sunday after his admission, nor for several Sundays after admission. Further on he contradicts his statement in regard to not having seen a physician while on the eighth ward, except once when he saw Dr. Josselyn, for he says on the same page, "I saw Dr. Brush once a week ; perhaps oftener than that." The statement on page 187, that he was not alloAved to take the camisole off, is directly contrary to fact. The camisole was_ taken off when- ever Mr. Penny's condition was such as to allow it, and is further proven untrue by the records, which show that but for a short time was he continuously in a camisole. The statement that he went to i 992 the fourth ward in June and remained until August is not true. He was on the fourth A\rard from the 5th of June until the 6th of July. On page 188 the statement that he Avas kept in restraint all the time is answered, as well as other allegations of lon-gcontinued restraint, by the following from the records. The statement at the bottom of page 188 that no one is allowed to speak on No. 4 can be con- tradicted by the evidence of the committee's own senses. The statement on page 189 that patient's lower jaAv and teeth were injured by the boots of attendants is easily contradicted ; Mr. Penny's injuries to his jaw aud face were self-inflicted, and nearly all done in the presence of Dr. Brush. The patient states on page 189 that he Avas pounded senseless, and when he came to himself Drs. Brush and Josselyn AArere standing over him; they put a bandage on his head and flax seed poultice, etc. The injury was inflicted on the 9th of June; the bandage was not applied until the 20th, when, for the first time, the patient's condition was such as to allow an exam- ination of the interior of the mouth, which revealed a fracture of the coronoid process of right side of lower jaw on the 9th of July, one month after the injury, while on the seventh ward, the roots of several teeth were removed ; the crowns of some of these teeth were broken off at the time the injury was inflicted by Mr. Penny upon himself, and some of them were old roots. On page 189, patient says that from ward four, he was removed to ward eight; on the 8th of July he was removed from the fourth ward to the seventh ward; he Avas not removed again to the eighth ward during his entire residence in the institution ; he states that he did not remain on the ward to Avhich he was removed from four over night; " I was taken to No. 5 ;" he says he was taken to No. 5 on the 15th day of July, nine days after his removal from the fourth ward; he further states, page 190, that he remained on the fifth ward nearly until he went home, remaining there several months; that he went from ward No. 5 to ward No. 3, and thence to No. 1, from which ward he went home ; the facts are that he remained on ward five from July 15, to October 20, when he was transferred to No. 6, where he remained until December 2, when he was again transferred to No. 7, where, after remaining nine days, he Avent back to No. 5, and not until the 3d of February, 1881, did he go from AA7ard five to number three; on the ninth of March he was transferred from No. 3 to No. 1, and on the 30th of April, 1881, he was dis- charged; the patient states, on page 191, that he did not see his friends in eleven months after the injudicious conversation of his wife on the 3d of April, 1880 (before which date he was visited several times) which resulted in the patient's active disturbance; he was seen on May 1st, and in August, and not again till on September 29, after _ which he was visited at frequent intervals until he went home; his friends Avere only prevented from seeing him on account of his condition, and the effect upon him of the injudicious visit of his wife. 993 By Mr. Rice : Q. How did you find out what his wife had stated to him about the bad way that business was going at home, etc. ? A. From Mr. Penny himself; and she stated to me the remarks he made about eating and about it tasting like chips, etc. ? Q. What do you know of the statement of his wife to him, apart from what he told you himself ? A, That is all I know it from ; I was not present at the interview. By Mr. Goodwin : Q. Is that all about Giles Penney that you wish to state ? A. I will call attention as to the restraint that he was placed un- der during his stay in the Asylum. He was removed to the eighth ward on the night of April 5th, 1880, previous to Avhich time he wore no restraint. During a portion of April 6th, he was restrained by a waist belt, by order of Dr. Brush ; also a portion of April 7th. On April 9th, he was restrained by a camisole by order of Dr. Brush (not Dr. Josselyn, as he states). On April 10th, restrained by a waist belt, order of Dr. Josselyn. On April 14th, by a camisole, order of Dr. Josselyn. April 21st, by a waist belt; also for a short time by a cami- sole, order of Dr. Josselyn. He was not again restrained till June 4th, when for a portion of the day he Avore a camisole. June 5th, he wore a camisole, order of Dr. Brush. June 6th, by belt and wristlets, order of Dr. Brush ; also 7th and Sth. On June 9th, waist belt and by camisole at night; 10th and 11th, camisole day and night; 13th, 14th, 15th, 16th, 17th, same; 18th, by Avristlets day and night; 19th, wristlets part of day. No subsequent restraint. Mr. Goodavin — I now offer in evidence a transcript from the case book and records of the Asylum of the case of Giles A. Pen- ney. (Transcript admitted in evidence and marked "Exhibit No. 28, J. H." See Appendix.) Q. Now, doctor, please turn to the testimony of Mr. Weir? A. I have examined Mr. Weir's testimony carefully. Q. Look at page 342 of the printed record; do you consider an attendant good authority as to when restraint is necessary, and when it should be removed ? A. No, sir; I do not. Q. Why not? A. Because sometimes a lazy attendant would place a patient in restraint in order to Ig'ive themselves rest from having the super- vision of that patient; all authorities in the conducting of asylums agree that restraint should only be applied the same as medicine; it is a portion of the treatment of the patient, and its prescription should be by physicians ; whenever an emergency arises, so that re- \ straint becomes necessary, it should be reported at once ; many authorities deny the fact that the restraint is ever necessary and write [ strongly against it. \ 125 U i ( 994 ' v, Q. Are vacancies long permitted on the fourth ward ? A. No, sir; whenever a vacancy occurs from resignation or any other cause, it is filled at once — the attendants to supply temporary vacancies being drawn from quieter wards, where they could be more properly spared. Q. Are patients kept locked up in the winter months ? A. No, sir; whenever the weather permits and the condition of the yard is such that they can be, they are out of doors; the less disturbed patients and all quiet patients can go out walking in parties. Q. How is that matter affected by the weather ? A. If it was excessively cold, or if there was a great deal of snow on the ground and it had not been cleaned up, they would not be sent out in the yard. Q. How is it in reference to walking ? A. Walking parties would be sent out, even in cold weather; that is, except the patients on the disturbed wards who would attempt to denude themselves, throw off their clothing, of course in cold weather, they could not be sent out. Q. Now take the case of G. W. B. on pages 347-8-9, are you familiar with that case ? A. lam. Q. Please state what there is of that case ? A. The case of G. W. B. apparently G. W. B----r, of Fulton county, was carefully inquired into ; he was a patient Avho was sui-, cidal and his statements were incoherent and contradictory and arose from delusions; he stated for instance, that he had at this time three feet and two bodies and that the body which he inhabited was not the body of G. W. Bowler but somebody else; he threw himself down against the chairs and frequently had to be placed in restraint to prevent self-injury ; a careful examination of the facts failed to reveal any evidence of the truth of his statements ; the attendant, Mr. Quine, who, according to Mr. Weir, gave him the statement,' was discharged for neglect and untruthfulness subsequently and his statements in regard to the matter of G. W. B. were contradictory^ for instance he stated that he saw the affray occurring on a portion of the ward while he was standing in the door of the bath-room in another portion of the ward Avhere he could not by any possibility have seen such an occurrence ; Mr. Sage was carefully examined boti by Dr. Gray and by one of the managers, as were also his associate attendants and completely exonerated himself. Q. Do you knoAv what manager, if any, inquired into that case'l j A. My recollection is that it was General McQuade; and Dr Bloomer also examined very carefully into the matter. Q. General McQuade is now on the high seas, as you understand A. He is, as I understand it. Q. He is not in Utica, or in the State ? 3 A. No, sir. 1 995 By Mr. Rice : Q. Did you see this patient, G. W. B., yourself ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you see the bruises on his person, from his hips up, when you examined him ? , A. I did not examine him at that time as to bruises, etc.; I mean that I had seen him and knew him, and knew about his case; that is what I mean. Q. And you did not make any examination of his body ? ■ A. No, sir; Dr. Blumer and Dr. Josselyn. Q. Did you not say you made an examination of the case? A. Yes, I examined into it. Q. Did you say that there was an investigation into the matter ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And the patient was acquitted? A. Yes, sir. i Q. Do you know what investigation was made ? A. I saw it during its progress; Dr. Gray examined Mr. Sage and i examined other attendants on the ward, and Dr. Blumer went on to the ward and examined into it. ! Q. So that the determination of the case was upon the testimony I of attendants ? . A. I don't think all of it was ; I think some patients were exam- ; hied; there were patients on the ward competent to give evidence. Q. Do you know of any case where an investigation into the injury of a patient resulted in the discharge of an attendant ? ., A. Yes, sir; I have ; I detailed some in my first examination. i By Mr. Goodwin : p Q. You say you detailed some in your last examination? ; A. Yes; I detailed several at Albany in my examination. Q. Can you mention any more than those you gave in your last examination ? A. I recollect one or two instances, but cannot now mention them [ specifically. Q- On page 351, Mr. Weir states that he expected to be dis- » charged for making reports, what have you to say about that ? i;' A. I can only say that Mr. Weir did make reports, and not only i made reports bnt went before the committee in April, 1883, and i detailed some matters there, and he remained in the employ of the institution until a year thereafter; Mr. Weir has been told by my- >,, self, as well as other attendants have been told, that persons who ;J saw injuries inflicted on patients and did not report them, but tried | to conceal such matters, that they would be held equally guilty with I' the person actually committing "the offense; I very distinctly re- member an expression that I have made in that connection ; I have ; told them that I should look upon them in the light of receivers of ,|toleu goods if they did not report. i 996 By Mr. Haskell : Q. What do you say right there in regard to what accion was taken by the authorities in regard to the report of Mr. Weir that he states to have been made ? ' Mr. Goodwin — I will ask him about that. : By Mr. Goodwin : Q. Take the case of T. S., on page 351, Mr. Weir names that as a case where the physician seemed to doubt the report he made ? A. If I remember right that refers to a patient named T----e S----r; he was an epileptic. Q. Do you know whether he was badly injured or not? A. I know that all these cases were looked into; Mr. Weir made this general report at this time ; Mr. S----r'scase I have not so clear a recollection of, except that I know it wTas examined into. Q. By whom was it examined into? A. By the same parties that examined into the others. Q. And you cannot say, of your own knowledge, any thing in reference to that any further than you have said ? A. No, sir. Q. Take the case mentioned by Mr. Weir in his testimony of C. O. G., page 352; what is there to that ? A. In that case I heard part of his examination ; he was exam- ined himself— it was in my presence — by Dr. Bloomer; other persons were also examined in regard to the same matter ; Mr. G. said that he was not injured ; he said that he attacked Mr. Sage and that no more violence Avas used than was necessary to restrain him. Q. Is that injury which Mr. Weir refers to recorded ? A. I am not positive about that. Q. Look at page 360, Mr. Weir's testimony, at the case — The Witness — You have missed one on page 358. Q. Oh, yes ; the case of H. C; what about that case ? A. That refers to a patient who was one of the most violent men in the institution for a long time ; the injury which Mr. Weir refers to is recorded and has been transcribed in these records in this in- vestigation in the injury books; it is Under date of November 2, 1882. By Mr. Haskell : Q. Is that all you know about the case, by the record of the in- jury ? A. The record shows that there was an investigation and who was examined; the man had been quite disturbed during the night and was transferred ; the only reason I know is that Weir says he was transferred from his ward to the twelfth ward, and that the next day he was found with a black eye, and was transferred from the fourth ward-to the twelfth ward on the first of November, and on the second this occurred ; that is shown in the record. 997 Q. So that Mr. Weir is correct ? *-';^-l A. Yes, sir; as to the^transfer and as]to the injury. By Mr. Good < in (resuming): Q. Doctor, at page 360, " Q. You say you reported to Dr. Jos" selyn as to injuries received by a patient, and that he, Dr. Josselyn'' appeared displeased at your reports ? A. I should take it that Avay by his actions." What was Dr. Josselyn's character as to strictness in demanding reports ? A. He was very strict indeed ; sometimes, I thought, perhaps un- necessarily severe at times in his strictness. By Mr. Haskell : Q. Strict with whom 1 A To the attendants. Q. Describe a little more fully what you mean by " severe " ? A. Well, it is difficult to describe it more clearly except to say that he was very positive, sometimes stern, and even on trivial mat- ters. Q. As to finding a good deal of fault with the attendants do you mean? A. I don't know as to finding fault, but being very strict as to the observance of the last letter of the law. By Mr. Goodwin (resuming): Q. At page 361, the case of Mr. M. referred to by Weir, do you know any thing about that case? A. I do not unless it refers to a patient named McA. Q. If it does refer to him, then what ? A. When McA. went away, I questioned him about the matter; he was well; he was a patient who tried to escape three times from the institution, and he succeeded once in getting as far as Whites- town and was overtaken by some attendants ; that was in the night; I talked with him about the matters of his escape, and subsequently about the charge he made of injury; he said he had no unkind feel- ings against any one; that he was very violent at times and made attacks upon attendants, and he presumed that if he was hurt (and he knew he was hurt) that it was done in struggling; he had no recollection of any attacks made by any one upon him; there was some investigation made at the time, and when he went away and 1 was having this conversation with him about his escaping, I recol- lected about his injury and I asked him about that; I think Dr. [• Josselyn investigated it at the time; I only knew from what he told me. Q. Was anybody discharged in connection Avith that case? A. No, sir! Q. What did Dr. Josselyn tell you ? A. He told me that he found no evidence of any undue violence i 998 on the part of Mr. Sage or any other attendants on the ward ; McA. was a man who stood six feet four in his stockings, one of the tallest men we had in the institution. Q. On page 362, Mr. Weir speaks about a patient without giving any name, he would not give the name, but spoke of him as a pa- tient— do you know to whom he refers? A. From an examination of the records, I am of the opinion that it refers to a patient named P., because he was the only patient on the ward during the months of November and December or January (and this was in January), who was in bed on account of an injury to his leg; Mr. P. was a patient and the history of his case shows, and the history of this incident shows, that he was a pa- tient with hallucinations of hearing; he was sitting quietly in the recess of the ward with some other patients and one or two attend- ants ; he suddenly made a violent onslaught on one of the patients; in the struggle an attendant and Mr. P. went to the floor — an at- tendant avIio came to the relief of the patient, I mean ; on the second day following, Mr. P. complaiued of pain in his ankle and he was ordered to bed ; there was a slight sprain, but he was in bed a week instead of several weeks; he gave his own account of the affair which corroborated the account given by the attendants; he further stated to me that the reason of the onslaught of the patient was that they w7ere all calling him names, and that this man was one of them. Q. When was Sage discharged from the institution? A. Thirty first of December, if I recollect right. By Mr. Haskell : Q. Do yon think it was unwise to keep him so long in the in- stitution as he was kept, after these charges were made against him ? A. The charges were as carefully investigated as they could be; they were not proven, and there was no reason to discharge the man ; there was some evidence of some feeling between him and Weir. Q. Do you know as to whether there was a general belief on the part of attendants on Weir's ward that Mr. Sage had inflicted these injuries ? A. I think they had the same belief that Mr. Weir had. Q. And do you not think that keeping an attendant in the in- stitution for months after he had been charged with injuring patients — which charges were believed by his brother attendants — would have a bad effect upon the attendants — a demoralizing effect upon the other attendants of the institution ? A. That would depend very largely upon how large a number of attendants believed the matter ; Mr. Sage was within a short time of this given charge of a quiet ward; in charge of patients who went out to work about the grounds, and about die dairies. Q. Please try to answer my question ? 999 A. I am getting at it, I shall get at it in time. Q. Do you not think that keeping an attendant in the institution for months after he had been charged with injuring patients, which charges were believed by his brother attendants—would have a bad effect upon the attendants — a demoralizing effect— upon the other attendants of the institution '* A. Under those circumstances, in view of the fact that the mat- ter was thoroughly investigated, and nearly all the attendants in the house knew it was investigated, I do not think it would have a demoralizing influence. Q. Was the transfer of Sage to a quieter ward a kind of promo- tion ? * A. It was less hard work to do ; no promotion in wages. Q. Was it considered a more desirable place ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Why did he lea re the institution ? A. He w7as discharged for being off his ward without permission. Q So that after he was charged with these offenses, he was rather rewarded than punished ? A. No, sir; I cannot say that he was; he was placed there be- cause there was a vacancy, and some one had to be appointed to fill it; he was considered the best man, but he was not put there as a matter of reward, at all. By Mr. Goodwin (resuming): Q. I now call your attention to Miss Lathrop's testimony at page 520. " During the six weeks you were on the second ward, Avhich of the physicians had charge of the female department ? A. Dr. Brush and Dr. Blumer ; they visited the ward almost every day." What were your habits in that regard, doctor. ? A. One or both of us visited the wards twice a day, as a rule and frequently oftener. Q. She speaks on page 521, of.the sick being neglected; how is it in that respect, were they neglected ? A. The sick were not neglected; they received all the care and attention they could possibly need ; and, speaking from experience more care and attention than the sick receive in most general hospitals. Q. Hoav is it in reference to messages brought by the supervisors in reference to small, minor ailments of patients? A. The supervisors are in the office, Avhen we are not on the wards, several times during the day, referring to us tbe complaints of patients — such as toothache, earache, stomach ache, boAvel com- plaint, and various things of that kind, and far into the night. Q. At page 522, Miss Lathrop speaks of the use of impure virus in vaccinating patients, what is there to that? A. The virus which was used was procured from a vaccine farm near Boston, I vaccinated my own wife with it, and most all of the officers in the institution, nearly, including the matron, and all the attendants — there were some sore arms, that is, some arms that were 1000 excessively sore, but in no greater proportion than I have seen in private practice, and I have done a good deal of vaccinating. Q. Did any patient have an arm disabled as a result? A. No, sir: I think that in justice to Miss Lathrop, I ought to explain that the case that she probably had in mind, and to whom she refers, is a patient who had an attack of erysipelas and her hand and arm were sore for some time after from that, but she entirely recovered the use of it before she left the institution. By Mr. Haskell : . Q. Was that following vaccination ? A. No, sir; but I presume Miss Lathrop got it mixed ; the ery- sipelas did not supervene from the vaccination. Q. But they followed one another in point of time? A. Yes, sir. Q. And followed one another closely, did they not? A. Well, somewhat closely, but not to have one the cause or the result of the other. By Mr. Goodavin (resuming) : Q. Can erysipelas be the result? A. Well, any sore can produce an erysipelitous inflammation; a pin scratch may do it. Q; On page 523, she speaks of patients being removed from one ward to another as a punishment; is that done? A. No, sir; patients are removed from ward to ward as their condition demands; a patient on number one ward where Miss Lathrop was, who in most respects Avould be quiet and self content, but who, from the fact that she retailed to the least extent her de- lusions, so that she disturbed the other patients on the ward; would be removed from the ward, not as a punishment of the patient, but for the good of the majority of the patients; or a patient whose habits were disgusting at the table — some semi-recovered lady, she might take her removal as a punishment, when in fact it was for her benefit and that of the patients on the ward. Q. Page 523 of Miss Lathrop's testimony, who was "the patient who was moved from number one to number seven ? A. There was a patient removed from number one to number seven, because of periodic mania and after one of her paroxysms — after putting up with her for two or three days on the first Avard, she was removed; she did appear somewhat hysterical, I admit; she became violent and was removed to the seventh ward and re- mained there some weeks ; she was not a patient who had hysteria though ; she had paroxysmal mania. Q. I call your attention to page 524 of Miss Lathrop's testimony, as to what she says about medicines given as a punishment; are they ever given as a punishment? A. No, sir; if you will allow me to say here, that I notice in 1001 reading over this testimony and that of other patients, I find that they state that immediately after talking with the doctor when they became a little excited, that medicine was sent as a punishment to them; the doctor would see them and if they required medicine he would send it, sometimes; that was the purpose of his seeing them; but they thought the interview with the doctor and their talking with him brought upon them the punishment of taking medicine Q. Look at page 527 of her testimony, about the medicine ; do the patients go and find their names on the medicines and take them ? A. No, sir ; the medicine is handed out to them by the super- visor ; it would not be safe to let them go and help themselves to the medicine cups. Q. And they take it from the supervisor ? A. Yes, sir ; either from the supervisor's hands or from the hands of the attendant whom she details to do it for her. Q. See what she says at page 527 about attendants measuring out the medicine, Iioav is" it as to that ? A. That would be ansAvered by what I have stated before ; there is a bottle of medicine sent up, the doses are put on the bottle, and the name is marked on it, for instance for some inter-current troubles, like diarrhoea or cold, or something of that kind. Q. She says about some English physician taking your place — what English physician took your place ? A. It is true that a physician did take my place while I was gone to England, but he was an American ; Dr. Spencer, of the New York Hospital, a grandson of Joshua A. Spencer. Q. Have you read the symptoms described and detailed by Miss Latlirop, that she felt after she had been ravished ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do they correspond with any symptoms detailed by her, ex • ' perienced before coming to the Asylum ? A. They do. Q In what respect ? A. The symptoms of suffocation, trembling of the limbs, pain running through the hips, etc., etc.; they are detailed here in the transcript of her case (see Exhibit No. 29 in Appendix); she said that she had trembling of the limbs, a feeling of suffocation, desire for air, etc., etc. ; this is a copy of a letter; she was admitted on the niueteenth October, and this is a copy of a letter written by her on the twenty-fifth October, detailing her symptoms while at home, which made her suspicious that she had been poisoned. Q. Now look at page 533; she speaks about the beds, fastened to the floors on some ward, etc. ; are there any beds in the Asylum fastened to the floors, on what are called the " back wards " ? A. There are one or two beds on the disturbed wards which are fastened to the floor. ,_, ; Q. For what purpose ? 126 U 1002 A. We usually use those rooms for patients in the habit of barri- cading their doors if the beds were not fastened to the floor. Q. Did Miss Lathrop receive a letter from her brother and refuse to believe it was from him ? A. Yes, sir ; we subsequently wrote to the brother ; she gave her grounds for refusal to admit it was written by him — that it was not written on paper that had his business heading on ; that he used expressions which were not peculiar to him,foreign to his style, etc.; we wrote'to the brother, asking him to write to her again, stating that he had written that letter, and try to satisfy her in that regard ; he wrrote to her and to us. By Mr. Rice : Q. And in his letter to you he admitted the peculiarities of his own letter, Avritten to her before that ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And that she had reason for criticising the letter as she did ? A. Yes, sir ; you have seen that letter, I think. Q. Now, in reference to abortions — do you know this Miss---- that Miss Lathrop mentions ? A. I know who the patient is that she refers to. Q. This Miss----of New York ? A. Yes, sir ; I know who it is. Q. What is there to that ? A. There is no ground whatever for her statement that she had an abortion, beyond the fact that her menstural periods were quite irregular — once in two or three months — and at those times she has considerable pain, and has been treated hy myself and other physicians for those troubles; her condition is well understood. The Chairman — Have the doctor state in regard to that feature, as to whether or not it is well understood that there are delusions growing out of that condition ? Q. How is that ? A. It is not an uncommon fact in any insane asylum ; case6 are recorded in the books, and among some authorities it is a classi- fication of insanity which they call ovarian insanity ; others call it uterine insanity, and the delusions that are narrated and come un- der this head are delusions of this very character, that they are pregnant or that they have been ravished ; that they have given birth to a coming Savior of the Avorld, and delusions of that charac- ter; I have in mind now a patient who came to me very quietly, and perfectly lady-like, and said: " Doctor, I should like to en- gage your services ; 1 think in about three months from now I shall be confined ; " she is in the Asylum now ; there were no symptoms of it whatever, and no reason for her suspicion ; she is a patient. Q. Have there been any births in the Asylum ? A. Yes, sir ; you will find them recorded in our reports ; we had a birth last June, a patient who came there the 22d of May; the child was born on the 10th of June. 1003 Q. Was it a full-grown child ? A. Yes, sir; they kept her at home and had an idea that they could take care of her until after her confinement; but she,became so violent that she was brought to the Asylum ; I think we have had two or three a year, and at other times a year would pass with- out any. Q. Have you had any births in the Asylum from patients who have remained there for a longer time than the time required for gestation ? A. No, sir, never; that is, you mean, previous to their confine- ment ? Q. Yes ? A. No, sir. Q. Now, I will ask you your opinion as to whether a person can be etherized during sleep ? A. The administration of ether during sleep is utterly impossi- ble; it would wake a person up; the first sensations are choking and suffocation to such an extent that a person asleep would be im- mediately aroused. By the Chairman : Q. Does that same answer apply to any other anaesthetic ? f}A. No, sir ; not to chloroform ; children can sometimes be anaes- thised by chloroform while asleep, and occasionally grown people, but very rarely ; a series of experiments have been tried lately ; some years ago, Dr. Rogers of New York read a paper before a medical meeting, in Avhich he came to the conclusion that it was impossible; I looked that up in connection with a paper I was writing myself at Buffalo ; and some experiments Avere tried by a namesake of mine in the Columbus, Ohio, penitentiary, and he succeeded in chloroforming three out of eight adults while asleep. By Mr. Goodwin : Q. Bnt with reference to ether, you say it is impossible ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Have there been some articles on the subject in the current medical literature within the past six months? A. I have seen an article on chloroform narcosis during sleep. Q. In that article does it state that chloroform can be adminis- tered during sleep? A. Yes, sir, in rare instances ; there is a great diversity of opinion on the subject, and it is not a settled question. Q. Do you know the case of Miss T., described by Miss Lathrop at page 539 ? A. Yes, sir, she is the patient that had the erysipelitous arm; there were never any symptoms which could possibly point to any abortion in her case, or any suspicion of pregnancy, except the fact that she grew remarkably stout before she left the institution ; when 1004 Miss Lathrop first knew her, she was very thin, in a very attenuated condition, and her life for a time was despaired of, but before she got well and left the institution she became quite stout. Q. Did you accompany Miss Lathrop to Poughkeepsie? A. I did. Q. Will you detail the examination that was held there at that time ? A. The writ was made returnable on the 8th or 9th of December, and I went down with her in company with Mrs. Barker, the matron ; the writ was returnable before the Hon. Joseph F. Bar- nard, of Poughkeepsie; he made a brief examination on that day, and remanded both Miss Lathrop and Mr. Mackey to the Pough- keepsie Asylum until the 20th and 21st; I went down on the 20th for a hearing in Miss Lathrop's case ; she was > brought down from the Asylum and Judge Barnard stated there that he proposed to be his own expert; the Asylum was not represented by counsel; he asked me to go on the stand ; I said in view of the fact that he proposed to be his own expert, I did not care to go on to the stand and contradict him, as I presume I might have to; he then placed Miss Lathrop on the stand and examined her for a few moments and announced himself as satisfied that she was not insane. Q. How long did he examiue her ? A. It did not exceed fifteen minutes; I asked the privilege, in vieAv of the fact that the Asylum was not represented by counsel, of asking her a few questions; I was given permission to do so, and I drew out from her, her statement in regard to poisoning; drew out the admission that she had written to this gentleman in Brooklyn that his divorced wife had repeatedly attempted to poison her, that through her machinations, she — Miss Lathrop— was then in the Asylum ; I drew out the statement that she had, under the influence of this delusion, sent hot tea and some medicine to a chemist to be analyzed ; Judge Barnard said that that did not alter his opinion, that weak and hysterical women often had curious notions, and he discharged her; I then requested to be placed on record in the matter as stating my belief that she was an improper patient to be discharged ; he stated that I might be so placed on the record ; when I returned I dictated my experiences at Pough- keepsie, to make a record of it. Q. In your judgment was Miss Lathrop insane at the time she was discharged ? A. Yes, sir. By Mr. Rice : Q. Do you consider she was a proper person to be confined in a lunatic asylum ? A. I think she was, because I think if she had remained longer that she would have improved ; I doubt if she would have ever fully recovered; I regard a lunatic asylum as an hospital. 1005 Q." You do not regard her as irrational, except upon one subject, do you ? A. I think that one subject governs her entire life, and tinges all subjects. Q. It does not interfere with her capacity to labor, and make a living, does it ? A. No, sir, I don't think it Avould. Q. And the only reason why yon say she was a proper subject for confinement in an Asylnm is, that she might be improved ? A. Yes, sir, I don't think, as far as any evidence that I have in her case, I should not regard her as a dangerous person to be at large, unless she should conceive the idea of putting this woman out of the Avay ; persons with slighter delusions than she is laboring under do those things. ' By Mr. Haskell : Q. Do you know whether, as a fact, that she did send that hot tea to be analyzed ? A. Only as her sister said that she did. Q. You have no reason to suppose that she did not, have you ? A. No, sir, unless her family intercepted it. Q. You do not know whether it was ever analyzed or not? A. No, sir, I do not. By Mr. Goodwin : Q. Have you a transcript of Miss Lathrop's case from the case book? A. Yes, sir, here it is (producing the same). Mr. Goodwin — I offer it in evidence. By Mr. Rice : Q. Does that include all the correspondence ? A. It does not include all the correspondence, some of it wras not copied, but includes all correspondence throwing light upon her direct history. (The transcript of Miss Lathrop's case was then marked " Exhibit 29, J. H. M. See Appendix therefor.) Mr. Goodwin — I will ask the doctor to read to the committee the report he made to Dr. Gray, after his return from Poughkeepsie, perhaps, strictly speaking, it is not quite competent, but I would like to have it taken and be in evidence. (After consultation the committee decided that although the statement is not relevant or competent, yet in compliance with the request of Mr. Goodwin they will admit the statement.) Mr. Goodwin— You can read that report doctor. A. This is the report I made to Dr. Gray after my return in Miss 1006 Lathrop's case : "I have to report the following facts concerning the occurrences at Poughkeepsie on the 20th of Debember, when I appeared before Judge Barnard at an adjourned hearing in the case of the writ of habeas corpus issued for Miss Clarissa C. Lathrop, of Rochester, Monroe county. I reached Judge Barnard's chambers a little before ten o'cock, and there found Judge Barnard, three or four lawyers, a reporter for the Poughkeepsie Eagle and was accompanied by a reporter of the Utica Herald. I was asked where Miss Lathrop was and why I had not brought her with me. I replied that the order remanding her to the Poughkeepsie Asylum stated " pending the examination as to her sanity," she was dis- charged from the custody of the Utica Asylum, and consequently I thought I had no more authority over her and had not therefore brought her. Mr. Silkman, the attorney for Miss Lathrop, entered the court-room shortly afterward and after some parley was directed by Judge Barnard to proceed to the Hudson River Hospital for the In- sane with a carriage and bring Miss Lathrop from the Asylum. In the interval betAveen Mr. Silkman's departure and his return with his client, Judge Barnard entered into some conversation on the case of Mr. Mackey. He criticised the Asylum authorities for holding a man in the institution as insane about Avhom the.only evidence that they gave was that there wras a departure from nis former condition of mind, which they only knew from hearsay evidence, and wdiich it was not shown that they had taken any pains to investigate, and who they swore had delusions which were1 not, by any proof, shown to be delusions. I remarked to the judge that I considered Mr. Mackey an insane man and had so sworn ; that if the evidence of the physicians at the Asylum, and their judgment in regard to the condition of their patients, was not to be taken, I did not know who was to judge for them ; that we had taken pains to investigate the insanity as thoroughly as we were empowered to do; that we had questioned his family, his, clergy- man and others who knew of his condition ; that we believed that his violence and homicidal threats Avere the result of delusions; that-we had sworn on the stand as to the character of those delusions, and had only been contradicted by Mr. Mackey himself, who had acted under the direction of Mr. Silkman, as the latter admitted ; in that Mackey had refused to admit ever telling me the delusions which I had enumerated. To this Judge Barnard replied: "Do you know that I believe Mr. Mackey ?" I said : "I do not under- stand you. Do you mean to say that when I sAvore that Mr. Mackey told me that his wife had attempted to poison him, that she had threatened to get him out of the way, and that his family had sent all of the food out of the house, at various times, so that he could not get any, I swore to what was not true? " He simply re- iterated : " I believe what Mr. Mackey says." I said : " Then you say I have perjured myself? I do not see what right you have to make any such assertion. My character has not been impeached in your court." He replied : " You are an interested party. You are 1007 interested in keeping Mr. Mackey in the Asylum." I replied that neither I nor any other physician had any power to keep Mr. Mackey in the Asylum ; that the discharge of patients rested with the man- agers of the Asylum, who discharged patients.upon the physician's certificate of recovery, or that they were harmless and not likely to be improved by further treatment; that neither of these conditions could be certified to in Mr. Mackey's case; that he had not re- covered, and was, moreover, a dangerous man. After some further conversation upon Mr. Mackey's case, the judge handed me a letter of some sixteen pages which, at its close, was marked " con- fidential," from Mr. Daniel Ketchum, an attorney from Albany, making charges of neglect against the physicians of the Asylum ; assertions that sane people were detained in the institution, and various remarks concerning the character of Dr. Gray and the medi- cal staff of the Asylum generally, and remarked that such serious charges as these demanded an answer from some source. I replied that I was not empowered to answer any charges against the Asylum, neither did I propose to answer any charges, were I so empowered, coming from a man whose insauity was well recognized, and who had been recognized for years as an insane man. At about half-past eleven Miss Lathrop arrived and was put upon the stand. The re- port contained in the Utica Morning Herald, of December 21, presents a fair account of the proceedings, which lasted less than an hour, except that at its close, not having been myself called to the stand, 1 remarked to Judge Barnard that I thought it due to my- self and the Asylum that I should be placed upon record, and that I wished admitted as testimony my assertion, in a full belief that Miss Lathrop' was noAv insane and controlled by delusions which she had enumerated on the stand, and that I considered her an im- proper person for discharge." That was addressed to Dr. Gray, and signed by me. Q. Now, doctor, do you know Miss Peck ? A. I have seen her; I know her by sight. Q. Have you ever seen any letters written by her ? A. Yes, sir, I have. Q. To whom ? A. Dr. J. B. Andrews, now superintendent of the insane asylum at ^Buffalo, written to him Avhile assistant physician at Utica, when she was out of the Asylum. Q. What was the purport of these letters? A. She addressed him as " my dear husband," and signed herself ''your loving wife ;" the general purport being to say that she be- lieved she was his wife. Q. How long ago were such letters written ? A. I saw them not infrequently up to the time Dr. Andrews left the Asylum for Buffalo, and he has told me since being in Buffalo that he has received letters there from her; in fact I saw one. Q. How long has he been in Buffalo ? A. He went in October, 1880. 1008 Q. When did you see this letter? A. Within a year or two of that time, 1880 — a year perhaps. Q. Have you read her testimony over? A. Only cursorily ; I know nothing about her history in the Asylum; she was there before I went to the Asylum. Q. Have you a transcript of the history of her case here ? A. I have (producing the same). Mr. Goodwin — I offer this in evidence. (Transcript of case admitted, and marked "Exhibit No. 30, J. H. M.") Q. Do you know Mrs. Fulford? A. Yes, sir. Q. Have you examined the recordsin regard to her ? A. I have. Q. How was she first admitted to the Asylum ? • A. She was first admitted sometime in 1848, as a case of puerpe- ral mania, mania following child-birth ; the second time it Avas a ^ase of chronic mania and she was discharged unimproved. Q. How was it on the third occasion ? A. She was received as a case of chronic mania. Q. How was she discharged ? A. She was discharged improved, the last time. Q. When was she discharged ? A. The 20th December, 1882. Q. Did you see her at the time of her discharge ? A. No, sir; at the time of her discharge I Avas away at Pough- keepsie ; I saw her before that almost constantly, from the time of her admission, on the 10th of August, to the last of July ; then I was absent until October; I saw her in October, November and December, down to a day or two before her discharge. Q. She was under your care ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Had she recovered when you last saw her? A. No, sir. Q. Did you still regard her as an insane woman ? A. She was discharged as " improved" not as " recovered." Q. During Mrs. Fulford's stay thereat the Asylum, was she ever threatened by you with removal from one ward to another for any purpose? A. No, sir; not in the way of a threat; I have said to her that I hoped she would exercise more control, or I should have to move her off the ward. By Mr. Rice : Q. What wag the object of that statement to her ? A. To induce her to control herself, to exercise greater self-con- trol. & Q. Was not that with an idea of coercion or discipline ? A. No, sir. 1009 Q. Not of disciplining her ? A. No, sir. By Mr. Goodwin (resuming): Q. Do you remember an occasion when Dr. Gibson was about to administer communion to a patient ? A. Yes, sir; I recollect the occasion; I was consulted in refer- ence to the matter, the previous day ; Miss Sterling said that Mrs. Fulford and other patients wanted to go to communion service; I said I did not tliink it proper for two reasons, first on account of t le condition of Miss R.; it was only desired on the part of the rector to have one or two communicants present, enough to comply with the rule of the church ; moreover Mrs. Fulford was not a communicant of the Episcopal Church, and I did not think it was wise or proper for her to be there on that occasion ; in regard to Miss S., the patient who attacked Miss Sterling, she was a case someAvhat similar to Mrs. Fulford, and that was my reason for1 excluding her, she* was excluded for similar reasons to the exclusion of Mrs. Fulford, and I did not think her mental condition was such that she would fully appreciate the nature of the act; 1 came on to the Avard in the midst of the attack upon Miss Sterling, I w7ent to the room and saw Miss S., in the midst of her paroxysm, they were just disengaging her hands from Miss Sterling's hair when I came into the room. Q. What, if any thing, did you order in reference to Mrs. Ful- ford at the time ? A. I do not recollect that I ordered any thing at the time ; my recollection is that Mrs. Fulford was removed from the ward a couple of days thereafter. Q. What for ? A. She was getting more disturbed and interfering with and ex- citing other patients in the same manner that she had excited Miss S. Q. Had her removal any thing to do with the attack by Miss S. upon Miss Sterling? A. No, sir ; the attack on Miss Sterling was before her removal; do you mean did her removal grow out of that ? Q. Yes? A. Yes, sir, partially; I took that into consideration with other matters, that she was a disturbing element on the ward. Q. Was she removed for punishment or discipline ? A. No, sir, but because she was a disturbing element among those patients. Q. Take the case of Miss S. of Auburu, page 631 ; do you know of that case ? » A. Yes, sir, it refers to a Mrs. S----r. „ Q. What is there to that ? A. The time that Mrs. Fulford put vaseline on her back on 127 U i 1010 account of a sore was that a blister had been applied to the Spine; she had a tender spine, hurt it in a struggle with Miss Finerty on the ward ; it was an abrasion of the skin, and a blister was applied at my direction. Q. I direct your attention to the case of Miss S. of Watertown, on page 632 ; what do you know about that case ? A. I only know of that from an examination of the record; she died during my absence in Europe ; I knoAV at one time she received a prolonged warm bath, as part of her treatment: she did not die as a result of the bath, nor for some, days after ; she had an attack of acute meningitis and the bath was administered as a remedial measure. Q. Who is Miss Yandenburg, or Yanderhoof ? A. She is in charge of the ninth ward; one of the disturbed wards; she is in the Asylum now; she is not a large girl, and has no accent, although Mrs. Fulford says she was a Dutch girl; she comes from Holland Patent, Oneida county. Q. What kind of an attendant is she ? ' A. An excellent attendant. Q. Is she kind and humane ? A. Yes, sir; so much so that I propose to have her promoted on the first of April. Q. On account of her efficiency, good conduct, experience, etc. ? A. Yes, sir. By Mr. Haskell : Q. Promoted how ? A. Promoted to a more responsible position—the charge of the suicidal ward, and where most of our sick patients are ; the attend- ant there is breaking down under the anxiety, somewhat. Mr. Goodwin —I offer in evidence a transcript from the case book of the case of Mrs. Fulford. " (Admitted, and marked " Exhibit No. 31, J. H. M." See Ap- pendix.) Q. I understand that all these copies of cases from the books are true and complete records of the cases ? A. All of them made by myself are correct, and those made by the stenographer; he has signed his name to them ; the stenographer was directed to make a full and complete copy of the case. By the Chairman : Q. You stated that you were about to relieve an attendant on the suicidal ward because she was breaking doAvn from anxiety ? A. She became a little anxious over it. Q. Is that the effect of her constant watchfulness of suicidal pa- tients? A. I do not know ; she Js naturally a nervous disposition — a 1011 nervous woman ; her temperament would be classified as the nervous temperament. Q. Is that the tendency with such attendants ? A. I should think it would be with cases like hers ; persons who feel responsibilities very much when they meet with fifteen or twenty persons constantly about them, persistently suicidal, it would have a tendency to Avear on her, and we propose to relieve her. Q. Is she on duty all the time ? A. Yes, sir ; sometimes with others; she has others to assist her, other attendants with her. Q. She is really confined to that ward then day and night I A. Yes, sir. Q. How long has she now been on that wrard ? A. Eight months, perhaps—. I beg your pardon, she has been on that ward nearly two years ; she has been in charge eight months. Q. What intermissions or vacations has she had 2 A. A vacation in each summer for two or three weeks. Q. What days, or parts of days, does she have off at other times? A. She has two evenings every week and every third Sunday, day and evening. Q. And sleeps there every night ? A. Yes, sir. Q. On her return from her evenings off she takes up her duty on the ward again ? A. Until nine o'clock she is on duty until the night watch for that ward comes on — Miss Yanderhoof, a sister of the Miss Yanderhoof I have referred to. Q. This lady, who returns to duty at that time, is liable to be called up during the night ? A. Yes, sir ; in case of an emergency. Q. What hours does she have'off on those evenings she is off duty ? A. Until ten o'clock; the stenographer calls my attention to a matter I want to correct; you asked me if, when she returned from her evenings off, she took up her duties again, and I answered "yes, until nine o'clock;" that should be corrected, I should have said ten o'clock; I mean this, that she goes on duty, if there is any necessity after she returns, the same as she would be if she were not out. By Mr. Goodwin : Q. Mrs. Fulford says in her testimony that her son did not know any thing about her coming to the Asylum ; how is that? A. Her son came with her. Q. Did she come with her son ? A. He brought her to the Asylum. Q. What did he say ? A. He rather wanted her to be deceived in regard to the matter. 1012 By the Chairman : Q. .How did he express it ? f A. He wanted me to examine her, and say I thought she had better stay in the Asylum ; that I thought it was considered wise and necessary for her to stay, but I said that we could only admit a patient on the legal papers, and we would tell her it was a proper place for her, but he would not enter any attempt to deceive her. By Mr. Rice : Q. Were yon there when she was brought there the first time? A. No, sir; I was not anywhere; it was in 1848, before my time ; only the second and third times. Recess until eight o'clock, p. m. ['...; J ^ Eight o'clock, p. m. Examination of Dr. BRUSH resumed: By Mr. Goodwin : Q. Do the physicians in the Asylum disregard the stories told to them by patients? A. No, sir. Q. What do you say in ^reference to that ? A. It depends entirely on the nature of the story ; if the story of itself on its face is a delusion it is entered as part of the patient's history. Q. If it is not a delusion ? A. If it is not on its face a delusion it is investigated. Q. I ask you whether, during your service in the Asylum, you have ever known of any conspiracy or understanding among the at- tendants to secrete from the physicians or any of their superiors any abuse of patients ? A. No, sir. Q. Do you know whether it has ever been the practice of that Asylum to notify the various attendants of the arrival of visitors by means of a whistle from the office ? A. It has never been the practice since I have been tliere. Q. Have you ever known it to have been done ? A. I have never known it to be done; on the contrary, I 1013 have met visitors at the door and taken them into the ward without even going into the office. Q. Has it been done when the board of managers or board of supervisors are going through ? A. No, sir; I never knew it to be done on any occasion what- ever. Q. Do the male employees have keys to the female wards? A. No one except the carpenter and engineer, who are only al- lowed upon the wards by a written order to make certain repairs, and the painter in the same way. The Chairman — Ask him whether they do not have the keys in their possession. Q. Do they have the keys in their possession ? A. They have during the day-time, bnt they leave them at the Asylum office. By the Chairman : Q. What check is there upon their leaving them or not leaving them? A. The night fireman at the engine-room has charge of them, and he reports if they are not left; he has reported to me once or twice. By Mr. Haskell : Q. That they were not left ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What action have you taken ? A. Reprimanded the mechanic for not doing it; it was a matter of forgetfulness on the two occasions. Q. Is it an usual or common complaint among a certain class of female patients in asylums that improper liberties are being taken with them? A. It is with a certain class of female patients; I referred to that in my testimony this afternoon. Q. What class is that? A. It is a pretty difficult matter to define the class exactly, it is sometimes a class of patients who are passing the change of life; more frequently .though with unmarried females of thirty-five to thirty-eight; I had an experience of that very kind only the night before last; I went on to one of the wards to give medicine to a patient who would not take her medicine ; 1 was in the room with an attendant and administered medicine ; when I came out of the room,she reported to one of the physicians the following" morning that I came in alone and fondled her person, especially about her bosom, as she expressed it ; I knew the character of her ideas and took special pains not to be in the room without an attendant with me. Q. Have you heard any expressions from recovered persons in reference to treatment of them by Miss Burns ? Mr. Rice — While you are on this subject, what physical ailment. l: 1014 if any, has this patient you have just spoken of, who made this charge against you ? A. Her insanity is the result, as my recollection of the history is, of an attack of meningitis some years ago; she has no uterine trouble that is discoverable ; I have made no physical examination on account of the peculiarity of her ideas; her menstruation is painless and regular. Q. Do you know whether she has ever been troubled with uterine difficulty ? A. I don't know whether she has or not. Q. Is it not the fact that where they have the delusion spoken of that there is usually some uterine trouble? A. Yes, sir. Q. And patients having delusions of that nature are usually troubled with uterine difficulties ? A. Yes, sir; I think they usually are troubled with uterine difficulties, or ovarian ; it is practically the same thing. Q. What is the difficulty with Miss S. of S., the young lady who was presented to the committee when last at the Asylum ? A. Whether she has been in the habit of practicing the habit out- side of the institution or not, I don't know, but since she has been there she has practiced self-abuse to a certain extent; her case is one of acute mania. By Mr. Haskell : Q. Has she any menstruation ? A. No, sir; I think not. Q. Do you think she has never menstruated? A. Yes, sir! Q. But there is a cessation ? A. Yes, there is a stoppage. Q. This patient that you told us about the incident that occurred to you the other night, does she frequently have these delusions that improper liberties are taken with her? A. This was the first time that she has ever charged any improper liberties ; she has intimated that the doctors have glanced at her in a peculiar manner, etc. Q. That seems to be a continuing thought running in her mind? A. Yes, sir. Q. How many female patients are there in the institution now suffering from delusions in regard to immoral acts or improper lib- erties being taken with them ? A. I can recall five or six now ; I do not know any more. Q. What is the general character of their delusions? A. Well, that they have been cohabited with, or that improper proposals are made to them; things of that character. Q. By whom ? A. Sometimes by persons who have no real existence; one patient FTr. 1015 Bays the angels come to her room every night for that purpose; an- other patient says that her husband visits her occasionally; another patient, before she came to the Asylum, had the delusion that a wagon load of men from Utica used to drive to her place, and that as many as sixteen or eighteen gained access to her room at night, etc., while she was narcotized or "drugged," as she expressed it; she has the same delusion noAv, but she will not talk to me about it; she has had the delusion since she has been in the Asylum ; she has bow the delusion—probably in addition to this one — that she is to be killed, and she is afraid of me and will not converse with me. Q. What is the general mental condition of these patients? A. Usually one of exaltation and self-satisfaction. Q. What Avards are those patients on ? A. This last one that I refer to is on the third; the first one I referred to is on the sixth ward, and one is now on the eighth ward. Q. Have you any patients subject to those delusions on the first ward ? A. I do not remember any now. Q. You have had occasionally ? A. Yes, sir; I have known patients on that ward to have those delusions; there was a patient on that ward who told me, the day she was admitted, that she had had sexual intercourse with the devil; that she knew nothing about him, but that he was a fine per- son ; she had that delusion all the time she was there. Q. Even up to the time of her leaving? A. Yes, sir. Q. Was she discharged as cured ? A. No, sir. - By the Chairman : Q. Are such patients sometimes cured, doctor ? A. Yes, sir; some patients who have these delusions get well. '* Q. After they get well, what is the effect of those delusions upon | their memory ? do they still believe they are facts? A. Well, 1 have naturally some hesitancy in talking to them about I sexual matters after their recovery. Q. And if a patient continues to talk about such matters, do you consider that such patients are still suffering under the same delu- sions ? A. Yes, sir ; you asked me about whether they remembered the j[ delusion afterward — I have in mind a case. By Mr. Goodwin : Q. In convalescing patients, what is the effect in regard to their memory of matters which have taken place while they were insane ? , A. Their memory in some matters, at times, is pretty good, at ; other times it is confused. 1016 Q. Are they apt to carry their impressions which they obtain in an insane condition into their recovered condition ? A. They do sometimes, yes, sir; I recollect a clergyman who Avas apparently entirely well; he said to me, accidentally one day, that he thought it was a curious thing that we should have the word " hell" in big black letters on the ceilings of one of the rooms in the fourth ward. Q. What credit in your judgment should be given in your judg- ment to the testimony of persons in regard to what transpired while they were insane and confined in an asylum? A. It would depend very much upon the form of the insanity which they had ; a patient with very few delusions, or a patient with perhaps many delusions not such' as would affect their general recol- lection and perception of events would have a pretty fair idea of things; whereas in a case of acute mania, where the mind was in one tur- moil of delirium, they would be very much more apt to have an in- correct idea of things; so also in a case of melancholia, although very quiet, very much depressed, yet the mind is Avorkiug rapidly, a multitude of thoughts passing through their minds, and they are apt to misinterpret the acts of their friends, in the sending of deli- cacies to them for instance, or the sending of medicine — they look ' upon it as attempts to take their lives; when they are convalescing they will look back upon such things with a vague, shadowy appre- hension that every thing was not all right. Q. Do you know Mary Pelton ? A. Yes, sir, I did know her; I know her now by sight. Q. Was she in the Asylum during your service? A. Yes, sir ; I had no service then on that side of the house, I saw her casually ; I have her case here — taken from the case-book, Q. What was her insanity ? * A. As I recollect it, it was a form of sub-acute mania, with some very unpleasant features about it. Q. What were the unpleasant features? A. She was decidedly untidy, sometimes very obscene in her talk and actions. Q. Is that all in her case ? A. Yes, sir y there is a full transcript of it in her case, here. Mr. Goodwdn —I offer in evidence that transcript in her case. (Said transcript of the case of Mary Pelton is marked " Exhibit No. 32, J. H. M." See Appendix.) Q. Have you any other case, doctor ? A. Yes; here is the case of Henry Hindman, au ex-patient ex- amined at Albany, see page 480 of the printed record. Mr. Goodwin—I offer this also. (Admitted and marked "Ex- hibit No. 33." See Appendix.) By Mr. Haskell : Q. Do you know any thing about the system of promotion of attendants to be supervisors of that institution ? 1017 A. Yes, sir. Q. What is the system ? A. They are promoted from lower grades to higher as their capa- bilities and intelligence would indicate, and persons reaching a grade beyond which they cannot pass, it is considered wise not to promote them, and others are promoted over their head. Q. Are you acquainted with the circumstances which led to this promotion of Smith to be supervisor? A. No, sir; I was not at the institution at the time ; the super- visor of the first department resigned; I was not at the institution. Q. So that you do not know how he came to be appointed? A. No, sir. Q. Your attention was never called to the subject ? A. No, sir. Q. Since you were connected with the institution . A. Yes, sir. Q. Where were you at the time ? A. I cannot recollect, I think it was when I was away on vaca- tion. Q. The rule is to appoint the eldest suitable attendant in the institution ? A. Yes, sir ; we have attendants who have been there longer than Smith who would not be suitable for supervisor. Q. Take Mr. Orendorf? A. I hardly think he would be a very good supervisor, although good where he is. Q. What qualifications has Smith that Orendorf does not possess? A. He is quick and understands directions, and carries them out perfectly as I should imagine; I have had very little to do with nim ; he is on the men's side, and I on the women's. Q. Is he not a very young person for the situation ? , A. He is rather a young man for the situation. Q. Do you knoAv any thing about his habits ? A. I do not, I never heard them called in question. Q. How many patients is this institution adapted to properly care for ? A. Six hundred in round numbers. Q. How many are there in now ? A. 1 have not looked at the census this Aveek, 615 I should think. Q. What has been your average since the first of January? A. From 628 to 640, and we have been as high as 642 or 3. i, Q. This institution is an institution for the reception| of acute cases of insanity ? A. Yes, sir ; so intended, I don't understand there is any direct provision of laAV in regard to it, but it is so regarded since the establishment of the Willard Asylum more especially. Q. How many cases of chrouic insane are there in the Asylum past the period at which you ordinarily discharge or transfer them ; 128 U 1018 that is, how many have yon'who have passe the period at which you generally transfer them ? A. I should think 120, about one-fifth. Q. Why are they retained in the institution ? A. For the reason that some of them are in process of being dis- charged, the superintendents of the poor have been notified; others are retained to see if their condition of quietness and apparent safety will not permit them to go to their homes instead of State or county institutions. Q. I refer particularly to that class of patiems that you do not expect to transfer or discharge but are simply minding as chronic cases ? A. I have given you the number. Q. That you do not expect to discharge, that you expect to retain as chronic cases? " -v. - A. No, sir ; w7e discharge one every day and over one patient a day, we are constantly discharging. Q. How many chronic cases have you there that you don't expect to discharge? A. There are a few that we do not expect to discharge and some private patients. Q. How many private patients-chronic cases of insanity ? A. Talking of the private cases there are between 25 and 40 per- haps. Q. Why are they retained ? A. Because their friends have not made provision for them to be carried over elsewhere, they are not proper to be carried over to home, and the State institutions for chronic cases do not receive private cases. Q. Does not the keeping of these tend to crowd out and interfere with the care of legal acute cases ? A. No, sir; we receive all the acute cases that come, we very rarely decline acute cases for the 6ake of private cases ; we some- times decline chronic cases ; the overcrowding is on the woman's side and is due to the fact that some wards are in process of recon- struction. Q. Can you give me the date of discharge of Buckley ?■ A. No, sir; it Avas before I came to the institution. Q. In regard to the question of removal of patients from one ward to another, as a matter of discipline do you remember the case of Mr. Silkman? A. I recollect it, yes ; sir. ^ Q. Was he transferred from one Avard to another on account of his rafrectory behavior in refusing to do some work ? A. Mr Silkman entered on the second ward and was transferred to the first wards those are the only wards he was ever on. Q. Then there was nothing of that kind ? A. No, sir ; he made a charge of that kind ; he was given at one 1019 time some work; he went out to clean out the gutters, and sweep off the leaves off the walk. Q. And that was one of the streets of Utica ? A. Yes, sir, but not in the sense that he meant it; he told me be- fore Judge Barnard that he made that statement to have it accepted in its broadest sense, to have its effect upon the public ; no coercion is used to get patients to work, although they are encouraged to work. Q. They are expected to do certain work, are they not? A. They are expected to do it on their own account. Q. But they are expected to do it ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And they feel rather compelled to do it ? A. I never knew a patient to say he felt compelled. Q. Is there not moral coercion used ? A. There may be. Q. And where a patient refuses to do the work, and is refractory about it, would you not remove him to some other ward ? A. If a patient were having a bad influence on the other patients, in preventing them from doing so, I should regard it as necessary to remove them ; occupation by the patients I regard as one of the best remedial agents we have. Q. Where you transfer a patient for that reason, you would not transfer them to a better ward ? A. I should transfer them to be with patients idle and indolent like themselves. Q. Would the transfer be to a better ward ? A. It might not be, and would not be. Q. And to a certain extent it would be a punishment? A. I should not transfer a patient with that idea in my mind. Q. It would have that effect ? A. I can't tell what effect it would have; I cannot say that. Q. Would you not intend it to have that effect ? A. I said I should not transfer them with that idea in my mind. Q. Do you know as a fact that patients regard their removal from one ward to another as punishment ? A. Yes ; I have so testified. Q. And it does operate as a punishment ? A. Of course they would consider any thing a punishment, and if a patient regards it as a punishment, it is to that person a punish- ment. Q. And it is, as a matter of fact, punishment ? A. It is to that person who considers it so. Q. Yon have removed patients from one ward to another as a matter of good government and discipline, as testified to by Dr. Smith ? A. It is not done in the way of punishment: but authorities of longer experience than Dr. Smith claim punishment is a very good thing. 1020 Mr. Goodwin — With regard to the case of J. G. B. (page 776) I again call attention to page 500 of the lunacy investigation of the Woodin committee; that report and the testimony accompanying the same upon that matter of Mr. Brown is the answer of the Asy- lum authorities in that matter, and I desire to make that report and testimony a part of this case. The Chairman — It will be so considered. Recess until 10 a. m., Saturday, March 29th. 1021 Saturday, March 29,10 a. m. The committee met at the office of the treasurer of the Asylum, and continued the proceedings, as under. Present — The whole committee, Mr. Goodwin of counsel, and Mr. Swan of the board of managers. THOMAS W.SEWARD, Sworn and examined, testified as follows : By the Chairman : Q. Please state your name and age ? A. Thomas W. Seward, seventy years old. . Q. What is your occupation ? A. This is my occupation now, solely — treasurer of the State Lunatic Asylum. Q. Are you on a salary ? A. Yes; $1500 a year. Q. How long have you held this position ? A. Eleven years ; I was appointed in 1873. Q. What is the nature of your duties ? A. My duties are to collect the bills of the asylum, pay out money on the warrant of the steward and superintendent; the joint warrant. Q. How are the moneys of the State collected and paid to the Asylum from the Comptroller ? A. That is special appropriations ? Q. Yes? A. The Comptroller authorizes me to draw on the Treasurer, through him, whenever I say I need some money ; the Comptroller collects the draft and sends it on to me. Q. When a special appropriation is nfade, do you collect it all in one sum ? A. No, sir. Q. You collect as the money is needed ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How are collections made from the counties who have patients in the institution ? A. I send the bills to the county treasurer and he pays them. Q. How often are the bills sent to the county treasurers ? A. Every six months. Q. What would you say would be the average cash balances car- ried in your bank % _ ,___. 1022 A. Now there are $10,000 monthly balance, on the average. Q. What would you say the average has been during the past five or ten years; how has it run; say for five years ? A. For two years past it has been about $10,000 a month; the average balance at one time, several years ago, when we were re- ceiving a great deal of money from the State, to make improve- ments, I think the balances were as high as $25,000. Q. Can you state, without looking at your books, about what your gross deposits are annually, or otherwise, the gross receipts of the institution ? A. The annual report is made by me to the managers and through them to the Legislature. Q. What is your present recollection of the amount of your gross annual deposits? A. In the neighborhood of two hundred thousand dollars. Q. And it will not vary ten thousand dollars from that ? A. I cannot undertake to say, but I can tell you by referring; I don't keep it in my memory. Q. What supervision over yonr accounts is exercised by the management of the Asylum ? A. The supervision is exercised by the auditing committee mainly. Q. And how do they make that supervision ? A. They examine every year certain, and oftener for that matter; they examine my books and compare my charges with my vouchers. Q. You say every year or oftener ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Has tliere been, during the last two or three years, more than one thorough inspection a year of your accounts ? A. Yes, sir; to illustrate — they examine my books up to the first of October — the 1st of October, 1883, was the last examina- tion. Q. What was the examination prior to that? A. Six months previous. Q. And then six months previous to that ? A. I cannot say. Q. Your impression is they examined twice a year? A. Yes, sir. Q. How do they make that examination; do they foot up your columns ? A. They take my vouchers and examine them by this book; it is a record of vouchers. Q. What do you call that book ? A. A record of vouchers; it is kept in this way, (explaining) it is an exact copy of the bills and corresponds with the entries on my day book. Q. This record of vouchers I see contains a detailed statement of purchases for all purposes in the Asylum ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And the aggregate of each purchase is footed up and appears 1023 at the right hand page, and that forms a column which is footed up and carried over to the next page ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Now I ask you in the examination of this book is it the custom of the auditing committee themselves to make the footing ? A. They make the footing. Q. I call your attention to initials in pencil at the foot of each column, whose initials are these ? A. General McQuade ; that is, those are his initials. Q. What does it mean ? ! A. I suppose it means that he has examined the page, or which ever member of the committee it is that examines it. Q. Do the auditing committee follow these entries all through the books to test their accuracy through the other books ? A. No, sir. Q. Do they examine your journals in connection with the ledgers ? A. They never have. Q. Have they ever tested the accuracy of your ledger entries ? A. No, sir. Q. Do you know whether in the examination of the vouchers themselves, the auditing committee make a practice of footing up items of such vouchers ? A. I do not know. Q. Have they everyone it in your presence ? A. No, sir. Q. Have you any reason to believe that they do or do not speci- ally examine the vouchers to determine the correctness of their footing ? A. I don't know that; I have no reason to believe that they do one way or the other. Q. Do you yourself add up the bills to see if they are correct * A. No, sir; I do not; I take it for granted ; that is the duty of the office of steward. Q. And you accept the signature of the steward and superintend- ent as your authority for the correctness of tbe bill ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Your duties then in regard to the bills are to make payment and see that there is no over payment of any bill which is pre- - sented to yon ? *, A. Yes, sir. Q. And has the accuracy of your account ever been questioned by the auditing committee ? A. No, sir. Q. They have always found them to be accurate and correct ? A. Yes, sir. ^. And are the accounts of the institution correct at the present [ time? A. Theyare. L 1024 Q. And the balance now standing to your credit in the bank is correctly represented on the books, is it ? A. Yes, sir; do you mean a comparison between the two ? oh, you mean does the balance that I represent to be in the bank, if it is the correct balance ? Q. Yes. A. Oh, yes, sir. Q. So that there is no irregularity whatever, to your knowledge, in the accounts and finances of the institution ? A. No, sir. Q. About how many vouchers are annually presented to you for payment ? A. About a thousand. Q. Please describe your system of accounts briefly ; the first entries on this book are made in the day-book, and such entries are these of payments of vouchers ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Youchers so paid are entered in the name of the payee ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Together with a brief statement of the subject-matter of the bill? A. Yes, sir. Q. That constitutes your day-book entry ? A. Yes, sir. Q. In the same book and on the opposite page you journalize these entries ? A. Yes, sir ; to illustrate under date of December 21, 1883, the day-book entry is as follows : " paid McQuaid Bro's, liquors $^22;" that is journalized as folloAvs : "medicines, $822 ;" that is posted to the ledger as follows: (referring to ledger) posted in the ledger pages 184-5, under the heading, " medicines and medical supplies," and appears under that head as " McQuaid Bro's, $822 ;" the same date December 31, 1883, you will find an entry payment of this voucher under its proper head of medicines in the record of vouchers. ' Q. What is your system of keeping accounts Avith the various counties ? » A. When the county bills are sent down to me from the steward's office for collection, I collect them in my day book, according to the same principle as that item I referred to, that is to say the item is entered in the day book under the head of " county." To illustrate: I call the attention of the committee to an item among the entries for November, 1883, it refers to a bill against Broome county, dated August 1st, 1883, as follows: " Board, $125.14; clothing, $20.57; miscellaneous exs., 33 cents; total, $146.04." This is journalized on the opposite page, as follows : " Broome county, $146.04." On page 23 of the ledger, under the heading " Broome county," you wiilfind this item entered on the debit side: "August 1st, board from February 1st, $146.04." Credited " November 17th, by cash, $146.04." 1025 Q. How are such payments made, in cash or by check i A. Yery generally by check ; he makes a draft on New York, generally. Q. To whose order ? A. To my order. Q. What do you do with these drafts ? A. I deposit them at the Oneida National Bank. Q. And when collected they are placed to tlje credit of the gen- eral fund of the Asylum ? A. Oh, yes, sir; certainly. Q. Do you have more than one fund in the bank ? A. No, sir. Q. There is just one general fund account ? A. There is an account called the steward's petty expenses which averages about $400 or $500 per year. Q. Do you keep any account with the steward of the institution ? A. No personal account. Q. Do you keep any account with the steward ? A. The account to*which I allude, namely, the steward's petty expenses account. Q. Please turn to that account ? (Witness turns to account in the books.) A. On turning to steward's petty expenses account it does appear that " payments to the order of Horatio N. Dryer have been made during the year 1883, by five several payments, aggregating $500;" during the year 1882, there are four several payments of $100, ag- gregating $400 ; during 1881, three such payments of $100, aggre- gating $300; during 1880, tliere were two such payments, ag- gregating $200. In the fiscal year commencing October 1, 1883, the following payments have'been made, October 26th, $100; January 29th, $100. Q. Are these all the payments that have been made during the current year, or is that all you have posted? A. That is all I have posted. Q. Are any payments made that you have not got posted. A. Yes, sir; on the 24th of March I paid $100 ; that is the last payment I have made ; this sIioavs the nature of the business, the steward's petty account. (Producing vouchers for steward's petty • disbursements.) ... Q. Do you also keep a special account with each patient in that institution ? A. No, sir, I don't. Q. Where is that kept ? A. At the steward's office. Q. Doyou not keep a special account with each private patient* A. Do you mean by that, have I an account where every item they get is charged to them ? . Q. No ; do you keep an account of the amount received from each private patient for his board ? 129 U 1026 A. Yes, sir. Q. Please state how that account is kept \ A. It is kept in the same way as the other accounts ; to illustrate it; I refer to an entry in the month of September, 1883 ; of the account of W. L. P. ,a patient; date of bill " August 1, board from February 1, 25 6-7 weeks, $155.14 ; clothing, $7.62; miscellaneous, $11.12; total, $173.88 ;" on the opposite page this is journalized "W. L. P., $173.88 ;" all thc*n there as superintendent, and during that period the changes that have been made, and the increase in the buildings have carried the ca- pacity of the institution from 400 up to 600, and, at the same time, we have abandoned the 80 basement rooms, Avhich will be equiva- lent to so much addition. By the Chairman : ' Q. How much has the farm increased ? A. About TO acres; we have purchased that much more. Q. That is the amount of land which the institution owns ? A. Well, the institution uoav owns about 200 acres. Q. Eighty of which have been purchased during your admmis- | tration ? 133 U 1058 A. Yes, sir. Q. From whom was the purchase made2 A. One purchase was made from the New York Central railroad; the rest of the purchases were made in small lots, from Mr. Hop- per and other persons who owned lots adjoining the Asylum land. Q. Was any land, at any time, sold to the institution by your- self ? A. No, sir. Q. Have you, at any time, sold or conveyed to the institution any land near or adjoining the Asylum ? A. No, sir. Q. Is there any foundation for a suggestion that you have done so? A. None whatever, except it|be in connection with the supply of w7ater, some years ago. Q. Please explain what there was to that ? A. Yes, sir; up to the year 1867 or 1868, it Avas when Judge Allen was Comptroller — I think it Avas in 1868 — the supply of water was obtained entirely from wells on the grounds, and for a time from Nail creek, a little stream half a "mile from the institution, which had been declared in the original organic act should be nsed to supply the institution with Avater, bnt it never had been condemned to that purpose, and, along in 1860 or there- abouts, the factories, finding that Nail creek had never been condemned, assumed it, and the Asylum was not permitted after- ward to take any water from it; between that period and 1868 it continued to get its supply of Avater from the wells and, in addition, from the Chenango canal,'the latter being used for scrubbing, washing and bathing, etc.; and often the supply was very much interrupted, so much so that for one time Ave had six weeks during which time we had to melt snow for a sup- ply of water; then the managers tried to make an arrangement with the city water-works to supply Avater, but the water-Avorks had neither the quantity necessary to guarantee a regular supply, nor the elevation in their reservoir Avhich Avould carry the water to the necessary height to su ply the Asylum; then the' 'managers endeav- ored to sink some wells hoping to, perhaps, strike an artesian well on the ground; that was a failure; about half a mile from the Asylum there was a large spring, and they endeavored to get pos- session of that — to purchase the land with the spring on, but the person owning it suspected what they were trying to get it for, that it was for the State, and they were'unable to do any thing with him ; aftenvard I talked with him about'it and he said he Avas not going to favor the State especially, and he would not sell; not long after that Mr. George R. Perkins, of Utica, met me on the street, and said, " do you Avant to go in with me and buy Mr. Jewett's farm i " I said, " no, [ don't want any farms, what do you mean ?" He said Mr. Jewett had made an offer to sell his farm to me; he said he wanted the upper part of it very much, because he wanted I 1059 to lay out some streets in connection with his land, but he said he did not like the swamp part; I said, " will you divide the land and you |." take the upper part and give me the swamp part ? " Well, said he, " there is something in that or you would not ask that;" I said, "to be frank with you I do not want to take any advantage of any thing, but I think the swamp part is as valuable as any other part;" but, I said, "I don't Avant any land;" he said, "well, suppose you—do you know anybody who does?" I said, "yes, I will frankly say to you that the managers of the Asylum would like to get the water that is in that region, but I cannot , do it, I cannot buy it;" I said, " if you will wait sometime, I [■ will consult the board of managers and then come and tell you ; he I said that he had only until ten o'clock the next day to do it, if at all: I went right, aAvay and consulted three of the managers, and | they told me to take it at once; to take half of it with him, take it jointly, Avith the understanding that they could take this water ; I ,. had an agreement immediately drawn up to that effect, and that I was not to hold the land if they wished it, and was not to partici- ■ pate in any advantages that might accrue in any way in the matter; I signed a contract Avith him and took this land, which was at a cost of $24,000; the reason Avas that he said he had not all the money to advance ; I borroAved the money and advanced the payment ; I | simply stood in that relation for sometime, until Mr. Perkins was unwilling to convey this to the State; there was no contest or quarrel or any thing like that about.it; it was discovered that there was not enough water for the Asylum elsewhere; the Comptroller f came up and consulted with the board of managers, I was present then, and the whole matter was talked over, and it was thought better then to have the managers apply to the Legislature for authority to condemn this land, and thus secure a sufficient amount of water at the Asylum ; it was placed in the hands of the Comp- troller and he had commissioners appointed; Delos'D. Wolfe, of [Oswego, Yan Rensselaer Richmond, who was then State Engineer, and Dr. Dutton, who was afterward Canal Auditor, who were to appraise the land; and they did so; the water is very fine Avater and furnishes a larger supply than we need, even if we reach the standard of 200,000 gallons a day; in this transaction with the | State, I declined to do any thing; 1 conveyed back to Mr. Perkins; I was unwilling to be associated with any transaction, directly or '■ indirectly, that would place me in any false position ; all that was ever done Avas that there was paid back to me the exact sum that I paid | out, without paying me the interest; that is all the relation that I f had with that matter, and that was the only matter that I was at all : connected with in-the takingof land by State tliere. Q. So that you did not directly or indirectly make any profit ? A. No, sir; on the contrary I lost six or seven hundred dollars of ' interest; the Legislature would no doubt have paid that back to me but I did not Avant to be seeming to have any profit from the State. Adjourned until to-morrow afternoon (Thursday, April 3), at [■ 3:30 p. m. 1060 April 3, 1884, ) " Kenmore," Room 76, > 3:30 p. m. ) Present —The full committee; Messrs. Morgan and Goodwin. Dr. GRAY (continued examination) : By Mr. Goodwin : Q. Who makes the purchases of the liquors in the Asylum ? A. The steward makes the purchases, or part of them, but when he makes purchases of liquors it is always by my selection of the liquors, unless it is a question where we purchase the same kind afterward. Q. Do yon make purchases yourself of liquor at times 'l ■ A. No, sir. Q. Do you select the liquor ? A. I select the liquor. Q. For instance, you Avould go to wherever you were dealing and select from that stock and then the steward would buy ? A. Well, I might if we were buying there ; I would sometimes order to send up the same amount; that is a barrel or whatever it Avas; I have done that— but the other is the more convenient way; that is, ordering it. Q. I am speaking now in reference to the quality of the liquor? A. We determine the quality of any liquor Ave buy, first by ex- amination— chemical examination—and then we purchase that class of liquor or that kind of liquor; if we change to any new, we make another examination. Q. Is the supervision of liquor more under your immediate direc- tion than that of the other supplies and stores ? A. Yes, sir ; because it is solely for medicine; now for instance, this last year, in reference to that question, we bought a large sup- ply of whisky because we were able to obtain a quality of whisky which 1 deemed was the best for our use, a malt Avhisky and we got it directly out of bond ; I know that whisky had been four years in bond, and Ave got a portion of that whisky ; if they had retained that whisky we should not have bought as large an amount, but it was whisky that would not have been retained at all. Q. I think you stated you regarded the liquors more in a medi- cinal point of view? A. I regard them solely in a medicinal point of view. Q. How is it in that connection in reference to purchasing cod- fiver oil; what is your practice in reference to that? 1061 A. We purchase cod-liver oil at times in full cans, and at other times in smaller quantities. Q. Mr. Walker^of McClure & Co., stated to the committee that the best oil that his firm sold was sold for three dollars, and the committee, in looking over your bills, find that you paid four dollars a gallon ; can you explain that ? A. That refers to an emulsion of cod-liver oil and not cod-liver oil; it refers to the making of the emulsion under a formula of our own ; the emulsion being made by inter-mixture of other ingredients in order that the oil can be taken more readily and be more digesti- ble and more useful. Q. And that emulsion could not be furnished at the price of the best cod-iiver oil ? A. No, sir; I consider that was a very moderate price for that emulsion ; Ave could buy ordinary emulsions of cod-liver oil or make it ourselves for a less price than that if we did not Avant to make a particular formula; it is the same thing as though you bought pills; you might buy a hundred pills for a cathartic purpose that might cost twenty-five cents, and you might buy other pills for a cathartic purpose that would cost one dollar and twenty-five cents; those things are entirely governed by the materials themselves, of which the compounds are composed ; I do not think, with an ordinary arrangement, they could have made that emulsion, such as we made, any cheaper; we got it made tliere because he had steam power to drive the machinery for the breaking up of the globules and inter- mixing it with the other materials. Q. It has been stated by some witness that clothing has been pur- chased by the Asylum of Walcott and Campbell; Mr. Campbell being one of the managers of the institution ; how long has it been since a purchase has been made ? A. Usually we have bought some of Walcott and Campbell's goods from their agents at the lowest, price that they could be obtained, at the lowest price at Avhich it is sold; we have not bought it from the mills; the cotton goods of Walcott and Camp- bell was a certain kind of strong cotton goods that we used for what is called " strong dresses " for women as untearable as possible and looking respectable ; they have not made any such goods for five or six years and therefore we have had to go to other places; these goods were always purchased at the lowest wholesale price. Q. Was there'an investigation made of Asylum affairs in 1868 ? A. Not by the Legislature. Q. By anybody ? A. In 1868 I requested the managers by a written communica- tion to make an investigation into the affairs of the Asylum. Q.' And such an investigation was made? A. Such an investigation was made. The Chairman — Ask him what induced him to make it. Q. What induced you to make that request ? A. Because of the circulation of certain stories, or certain state- i 1062 ments made, and communications that I had seen in writing by Dr. Tourtellot and Dr.-----. Q. To whom did you make that request; what managers ? A. The written request was addressed to Senator Kiernan and Dr. Bissell, I think, and Mr. Matteson. Q. Who were present at that investigation ? A. It was a long investigation, extending from August to Sep- tember, at various sessions occupying a great deal of time. Q. Was the Comptroller of the State there at any time? A. He was invited there at the time —at the first meeting, Comp- troller Allen, and was present. Q. I read an extract from the minutes about that time : " Resolved, That in the opinion of this board, it is not a violation of law for the superintendent to purchase supplies for the Asylum; that the statute only imposes and prescribes the duties of the steward to be per- formed under the direction of the superintendent; that there is no negative language in the statute, nor any prohibition of the super- intendent making purchases of supplies ; that the statute is only directory upon the steward, and therefore there has been no viola- tion of the statute in purchases made by the superintendent, and that, in our opinion, the purchases made by him were advantageous to the Asylum, and particularly the purchases of medical stores, and that this has been a practice of former superintendents with the ap- proval of the managers." Q. Was that resolution passed by the board of managers ? A. Yes, sir. Q. "Resolved, that the managers of the Asylum from their official intercourse with Dr. Gray, and from this investigation have not only an undiminished, but an increased confidence in his truthful- ness and integrity, his skill and ability, and in his economical and faithful administration of the affairs of the Asylum." Were those passed at that meeting ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Does the law require you to make recommendations to the managers with reference to the matters of the institution at their meetings? A. It does. Q. Have you made recommendations in reference to matters of improvement and alterations for the safekeeping, comfort and health of the patients ? A. I have. t Q. When? A. Through all the period of my position as superintendent, from year to year, such as have appeared proper, in my judgment, and necessary. Q. In relation to the building? A. Yes, sir, in relation to building ; their repairs, their imper- fections and changes and extensions, to meet the necessary condi- tions of the patients to be treated. 1063 Q. And in regard to the improvement of the condition of patients ? A. Yes, sir. Q. In regard to either securing their safety and comfort and health ? A. All these improvements and changes had had the sole object of perfecting the arrangements of the hospital, so as to secure the safety and the comfort and the recovery of the patients and the com- fort of those who were associated Avith them, and the best possible means for guarding and taking care of them. Q. Has your supervision of the pnrchase of supplies for the Asy- lum been substantially the same since the adoption of the resolution in 1868, as prior to that time ? A. Precisely ; no change whatever. Q. And these recommendations we were speaking of ; did you recommend the getting the patients out of the basements of the Asy- lum? A. I did. Q. And doing away with those cells ? A. Yes, sir ; I recommended the removal of all the patients from the basement, many patients had been removed before, the most violent class were still in the basement and those I recommended the removal of, having previously assured myself by actual experi- ment that it was entirely safe to take them from single rooms in which they had been kept and which Avas the general custom of .keeping such persons in these institutions; to take them out and * give them dining-rooms to eat in and keep them in the open.Avards, then—having demonstrated that, I recommended the erection of a ward for that purpose, which Avas carried out. Q. What if any recommendations did you make in having greater \ accommodations "for the benefit of the patients; that is, for their classification ? A. I have recommended the extension of the wards, the increase of the number of wards for the purpose of securing proper classifica- tion, which would enable the patients to be taken care^of without injurious attrition with each other, and to secure their better re- covery — quicker recovery. Q. What do you mean by " injurious attrition with each other ? " A. Well, for instance, Avhere insane persons are placed together in close proximity in small apartments without space they jostle each other, quarrel, get into troubles and difficulties and theyare very liable to injure each other and keep each other in a state of excitement and irritation ; the air is bad too when confined in such small places, which increases their irritability and sleeplessness, aud in every way renders them more liable to quarrel Avith each other. Q. Have you called the attention of the managers, and through them the Legislature, to this matter in your annual report ? A. Yes, sir ; some years ago very prominently asking the extern Bive modification of the rear building for that purpose ; I submitted it to the Legislature; submitting plans to the Legislature ; submit- i- 1064 ~fi*— : ting plans to the Comptroller at that time, as the Legislature in drafting the appropriation requiring that the plans should be sub- mitted to the Comptroller, and approved by him in Avriting; that was done and the Comptroller visited the institution a number of times; the Governor also four or five times in connection with it, examined the plans and proposal, and the methods of modification, and where it should be done ; that was Governor Dix. Q. How long did he remain at the Asylum at that time ? ■ A. Ten days or two weeks altogether. Q. Has it been the habit or custom of Governors to visit your Asylum ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How many have failed to visit your Asylum since you have been its superintendent ? A. They have all visited the Asylum but Governor Cornell. Q. Has the present Governor visited officially ? A. Not yet, he is not through his term; he has said he would do so. Q. But every Governor with the exception of Cornell and Cleve- land has visited the Asylum ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Have any appropriations for that Asylum ever been vetoed by the Governors ? A. Yes, sir. Q. By whom ? A. Governor Cornell. Q. Any others? A. No, sir. Q. After the visitation of Governor Dix to the Asylum, I un- derstand that these plans for space and light aud safety to the patient were submitted to the Legislature ? A. Yes, sir. Q. With what results ? A. With the result of appropriations from time to time that Avere necessary to carry on the work to >a certain point; under them the entire rear part of the buildings of the women's side of the house were remodeled; the side spaces in the hall for light increased, the glass verandahs or sun-rooms constructed, the large day-rooms con- structed, the bath-rooms and water-closets Avere re-constructed and floored Avith tile to make them healthy and pure ; the entire plaster, Avhich had been saturated by years of use, was taken off and it-was replastered ; the floors (which had been in use through all these years and were in great decay) were all removed, and every floor of the three front wards and the six rear wards were taken up and re- Qoored. Q. Have you from time to time made application to the Legisla- ture for funds to provide a similar room, and similar improvements 'n the wards on the men's side ? A. I never made any as superintendent, or any other way myself; I have never myself made application to the Legislature for any thing. 1065 Q. Has it been suggested or recommended by your board of man- agers ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Have you received the appropriation necessary to make the improvements on the men's side ? A. No, 6ir; the appropriations —the part of the men's side of the institution so reconstructed — that is the floors of a number of the Avards were relaid ; the plaster renewed, and over a portion of the building the water-closets and bath rooms were renewed and the tile flooring put there also; the shops were also removed further away from the building oecupied by patients, having before been directly connected with the Avards, rendering them dangerous by reason of fire. Q. I understood you to say that the improvemennt made upon the women's side had for one of its objects more room in order that there might be less injuries inflicted upon each other? A. Well, in order that they might have more space and not en- danger themselves, or be endangered of injuries, and that they might have better chances of recovery. Q. Have the injuries decreased since the erection of these day rooms on the Avomen's side of the house? A. Yes. sir; they have, very ratably and very strikingly. Q. Do you know what proportion ? A. I looked thet>ther day. Q. What Avas the result? A. It was eleven to nineteen, reduced from nineteen to eleven and I think it would be further reduced, or will be when the other ward is completed and an opportunity of better classification is afforded to that class. Q. Do you believe that there would have been fewer accidents than are now detailed had your suggestions been carried out ? A. 1 do. Q. AVill you be kind enough to state what is the origin of this injury book, what originated that? A.' I did.' Q. Is your Asylnm the first in which it is used? A I do not. know, I neA7er heard, I have never asked much about those things, or compared, myself, these measures much. Q. You were requested by the committee to prepare a tabulated statement of all accidents and injuries for the past five years?. A. I have done so. Q. Have you it ? A. Yes, sir; that is the statement (presenting the same), that tabulation that classifies the accidents and injuries and sIioavs what proportion of them occurred between patients aud patients, and AA7hat between attendants and patients, and the conditions under which the accidents occurred. • Mr. Goodwin — 1 Avould ask that this report of accidents bemade part of the evidence of Dr. Gray. 134 U WO*J*1Wt»«WWtdW -J C '"l ■* -J O — 1 ST — ST" p-3 oS-PPc-i°o££g o 2. ^- £ CD O tt re ffi b *"< '^5 '■< £ ? o o §• *= o » « » ?5oi-h>-hoPi:.!£PP- !Z| B C 3 B ro B B ' >-3 » ; cuts a bruise blood cuts a face a ee ca ck of d o . a • a> ■ rt.~ B o" ^>. p CO • to '. : s §: s o . B B • ■ o- _ ■ 3 ' 5** : ■ CO (/. . H • P CD • ^i ; »-* • to Number of cases. CO MMMMODtCKJ^^CftCn Due to accidental slipping and falling or to falling in fits and striking on floor 1-1 ■ »-■ i-1 to if». • • • co ■ or against furniture. 1 1 Due to blows and alterca- CO to . . . . to -^ to l-1 "-1 I-1 00 tions between patients. Occurred at night in rooms CO ', '. . ' *'. . . . • i-i to or dormitories. Occurred in struggles with attendants while in the immediate discharge of -» • • • • to 1—■ • • • >-' CO their duties. Occurred while exercising eo or playing. H >• CO o r>- CD O re »r p 3 ^ T3 _ p c CD CO a ■ » o" p. s- •» < P 3. o S" S' i-1 B o- GO cd o a p B CO CO CD CD D. P C cc ^ CD E M V C5 pr p| o 5" l-ts CD o o C 3 CD ST •3 990T "^ i; b" s i' 2. (t 3 j 2 £o£ =* w B a3 B! B'ChB'W B CR 33Q 0CR B0c5 a"o B^g-SS- CD " Cfi p~ Cfl ■C B q- B a" S ^O 3 O w M O 3 MWH^MMMM^a^IMW en Number of cases. (OMOr- to C< Due to accidental slipping or to falling in fits and striking on floor or against furniture. to o i-1 to e» Due to blows and alterca- tions between patients. Occurred at night in rooms or dormitories. cow^occ K^ o is co aS 2 sr'S OR B B co ,_, cr- 3 !-■ .2 Occurred in struggles with attendants while in the immediate discharge of their duties. Occurred while exercising or playing. luo\ tdoococo WflBB 1-1 B "r" — C r* c* l-J -J c «■ g P "•» » p 9 H-tfi O CJ o v. iZ. —. to O O B B CD1 ****■ » B B (t (t » D » ffi ? 2 tter°'CL P^^ B 3 p CD "J 1 ST S 3 2 B 3 B e*- CD . CA OOP rt- g. ft CD CC ca S to s to CO S. tS ►e B »8 p 03 ft o ^.B 8» o o to X p ^2 ftP B > O to t-t» ft. <-3 ft • 3 CD P a. t .o to co to Number of cases. *■ -3 CO to 1-" to to i-J CO CO c Due to accidental slipping or to falling in fits and • striking on floor'or against » B ^i t-i. . HH -J If- • i— furniture. >B B N CD Due to blows and alterca- 1 c VO _: : : : l-J to I-1 O I-4 CO -I tions between patients. B ft CD ** Occurred at night in rooms 1 CD s to- • • • co to ■ CO or dormitories. P 3 CO B Occurred in struggles with attendants while in the Cn immediate discharge of » h-.... I-J l-J to. I-J their duties. Occurred while exercising . (-J. . or playing. ► ■3 Due to b Done aci While ai crank i-3 U- Cfi c 1 < 3 s S elf-infli ttempt brew h o B" ^ ii. i-s B-^- a eakin denta work it the p o" B^ CT3 Cfi c*a-V)tw £? * 5 g B «+■ a a,cr to 3 p B - „ CO 1 o i-h co .r CO S°£.^tc 3cfi CA — a ■ p B* P §1 - to S p-» o P c ^3 CO CO 3 B-3o" 3" CD B M 5.* m J"1 ft 5. CD d bru s caus d cut t fac skull ee .. H CI P3 CD GO JS. P. : * *£ to O . ^g =>-p *) ^§° >• . ^& O "oj 95 ►*" 3 3 ED CD J<5 B" CD H p ft OS to i-j to Number of cases. tn —IMHO-^MCOM , Due to accidental slipping or to falling in fits and _ > • striking on floor or against 00 • • CO Cn • l-J CO furniture. Due to blows and alterca- CO t-J • MffiOSHKOl tions between patients. Occurred at night in rooms w • : : : _• : : or dormitories. Occurred in struggles with attendants while in the i-j : immediate discharge of • • en rf>- • • to their duties. Occurred while exercising or playing. H t K W W W o -•—• C B <-»■ t ' C5 S. tl o E, t - t ting ting ked E CO 7S o- b-"•^ CD CD o < < ' « s s p C ^ o ft ft 1. 9 3 p p o' cm aq B _,,_, g^ p CA S' 5" C5 CA CO P B 3 =3 GO CD P P CO sT- s^- P GO l-J l-J CD M sf. 5' n> o. o" CD. O* 3 fc2 ^ ^3 09'>l OO W^^ W » » g o n S _ _° tO CD c -2.S b Wcow 3 i-> P B* P rr 2- * P _ P c+- ft *Sb ^ SSu I M CO OO CO (-J Number of cases. Due to accidental slipping or to falling in fits and striking on floor or against furniture. ^3 «*s 00 w Due to blows and alterca- tions between patients. Occurred at night in rooms or dormitories. Occurred in struggles with attendants while in the immediate discharge of their duties. Occurred while exercising or playing. O ff*- p to st s S ~ - B to £ _ M ft O 3 M Number of cases. Due to accidental slipping and falling or to falling in fits and striking on floor or against furniture. Due to blows and alterca- tjons between patients. Occurred at night in rooms or dormitories. ~l Occurred in struggles with attendants while in imme- diate discharge of their duties. 1 Self-inflicted under the in fluence of delusions. 1-11 >-3 13 o _ P O p ,_, ft S- CD 3 p 1 » B * o 1-3 s P CA CD P B P B" M cc 13 - P B CD SC ft B ere CD B" . CD O 4 1 O B fee ft. «5 00 O WOT &^.:.:-,v srtl lf'i.i.1.18 p O CT B g - a. » S CD n sei ST c ft c o !~?^ P BjS 3- B-B CA CO "*■ _ P l-fc g^ft P 'HK)KlH|(i. 00 00 8401 nowow S-S-SS-p _ _ S.oo a o o co or DBitJ D-P °° £<2 r» g Cr oo co o • "1 * S- p ; r?° ' tO GO ' 3 rr- a. o " b-s.: • • tf- CD . f°; B o,. b-; CD . P . ft. 1 -- Number of cases. Due to accidental slipping and falling or to falling in fits and striking on floor or against furniture. Due to blows and alterca- tions between patients. Occurred at night in rooms or dormitories. Occurred in struggles with attendants while in the immediate discharge of their duties. Self-inflicted under the in- fluence of delusions. B £ £a ^ ^ tgg CO OO UOl w Ti co o w a w o w . CA " CD O CD P f" t» {3 Oi 3 3 2.5 S ■ CD CD CD 2 IT^ tJ ^ p =r p g p 3 B cT ftftO i_ii-ii-ji-JtotOrf*OiCn Number of cases. Due to accidental slipping and falling or to falliug in fits and striking on floor or against furniture. Due to blows and alterca- tions between patients. Occurred at night in rooms or dormitories. Occurred in struggles with attendants while in the immediate discharge of their duties. Self-inflicted under the in- fluence of delusions. O r» CD B ^ *"*" BB B ~ g OT3 ** ° o o "= < <& m ™ to to B-,. P P . BB 3 ft 3 g- to ° -3 i-b "O 3 * s o ffi CD_ "i_i o w CO p »r 3' ere ere 940T ! 1076 Summary. During the five years from 1879 to 1883, inclusive, a period of L6.0 weeks, there were 489 accidents, the majority being very slight oi.es, such as scratches and bruises, or less than an average of two a week (1.88). During the five years the daily average number of patients under treatment was a little over 611. This gives a weekly percentage of accidents of about three-tenths of one per cent (.003 + per cent), arid a daily percentage of accidents on the average number treated of three-seventieths of one per cent or .0004+ per cent. Of the 489 cases which occurred during the five years, from 1879 to 1883, inclusive, 260 were due to blows and altercations between patients. This is just one a week or .14 of an accident per day, which gives a percentage on the daily average of .000229 +per cent; 198 cases were due to slipping and falling, falling in fits, or occurred at night'while in rooms or dormitories or were self-inflicted, etc. This is .76 +of an accident per week and .108 +of an-accident per day and a percentage on the daily average of .000176 +per cent. Thirty- one cases occurred in struggles between attendants and patients while the former were in the immediate discharge of their duties; this is .00119+ of an accident per week and .00017+ of an accident per day, and a percentage on the daily average of .0000001:8 — per cent. 1077 By. Mr. Moegan : Q. In making up this report, you rely upon the reports of the attendants ? A. I get them from the injury book and case book. No injuries can be inflicted or escape the attention of the physicians and be ab- solutely within the control of the attendants. Q. You do rely upon the attendants yourself as to the cause of the injury, don't you % > A. No, sir; not solely, by any means ; we rely upon the examina- tion of the case, upon what is stated by others; on the supervisors, attendants and the patients themselves. By Mr. Haskell: Q. This tabulated statement of injuries, did you make it yourself? A. I went over them all myself. Q. Whose handwriting is it in ? A. The handwriting is one of the physicians; I went over them myself, tabulating them before I handed it to the physician. Q. This is a copy then of material furnished by you to the physi- cian ? A. No, sir; this is not a copy. Q. Specify how it was made ? A. It was made first, I went over the matter myself; over the injuries for the last five years, from the injury books; and in all cases of any thing beyond a little scratch, referring to the case book ; and I made a tabulated statement of that; then I asked one of the physicians, or two of them, to take that and go over it all carefully; then I compared it again. Q. With the material that you had made ? A. Yes, sir; and I have no doubt of its correctness. Q. So that ali the basis you have for saying, or the basis you have for saying it is a correct statement, is based upon the assumed correct- ness of the injury book ? A. Oh certainly, from the records alone ; it is not made from the memory of anybody. Q. So that this is simply an analysis by you of what appears in the injury books for the last five years? A. That is precisely what I was requested to make. By Mr. Goodwin (resuming) : Q. Were you acquainted with Miss Lathrop during her confine- ment in the Asylum ? A. I knew her very well while a patient there, not before. Q. Have patients any notions in regard to anaesthetics being given for immoral purposes ? A. Yes,«sir; that is not an uncommon thing. Q. Be kind enough to explain fully in reference to that ? 1078 A. I have known a great many, or at least quite a number of persons who have such ideas, wrho believed that not only that ether and other substances could be used, but that they are used; I have known them in their own families where I have been to see them, as well as cases in the Asylum, young women and old women, some who have said or claimed that ether or chloroform was given ; and then some would say some substance that would put them in a state of un- consciousness for immoral purposes; I have known cases where they believed that powders were dusted over them to produce a state of in- sensibility for the same purpose, and where they were intoxicated with ga^es; I have known of a woman who believed as a delusion, firmly, that gas was carried in through the window, and that she could hear the apparatus in motion, to produce a 6tate of insensibility and un- consciousness for this purpose; and a short time ago, since the com- mittee were there, a man was brought to the Asylum; he declared in the presence of his wife — first to me privately — then in the presence of his wife, insisting that she should hear it, and of his sister and his brother-in-law, that he had had practiced upon him the use of ether and chloroform to render him insensible and unconscious in his bed, and that men came in and had intercourse with his wife by his side, he knowing it, but not having the power to move; as he finally got the power of resisting it, or the secret of resisting it, they then resorted to powder, which was dusted on by a little box something like an insect powder-box he said ; and the same things wrere carried on ; that finally he was rubbed all over with powdered chloral in the same way when he was half asleep, his wife would get him half asleep and rub him all over with powdered chloral, and that as many as four persons all came into the room and had these relations with his wife in succession; that they were his neighbors and people about him; and I have had a woman on the first ward — a case I recall of a woman who would not be on the first ward he- cause of the danger to her of persons producing an effect upon her without their presence; that improper relations could be had with- out personal contact; one case where a woman took a pistol and went to the store of one of our merchants to shoot the man, on the ground that he had exercised some sort of influence, or " gases," as she called it, over her for immoral purposes in church, until she was afraid she was impregnated by these means; she never gave up the delusion; also that he had arranged to put her in proximity on the street with certain persons whom she did not know; in other words, when she was walking on the street (as I found by examination), and she was jostled by any person, that she misinterpreted that as being done by one of those persons; I have had a woman who insisted on sewing up her night-gown, making it two feet longer than necessary, and fixing over night a particular'kind of stitch up at the neck, so that she could recognize by that stitch the next morning whether she had been violated or not; she said she had been violated in her brother-in-law's house before she came, and also in the Asylum ; that there were men in women's clothes on the wards for such general 1079 purposes, yet she was a respectable, [intelligent woman; she was laboring under some physical derangement which induces this char- acter of delusion ; I have known persons laboring under similar delusions; I remember one instance of a lady who would stand by a window looking toward a certain house—a very accomplished woman — who insisted that a certain gentleman was impregnating her from his house, and she was standing at the window with her clothes up ; all these cases arise from peculiar sexual conditions grow- ing out of .their disease; they have to be looked after; I had to remove that person from the first ward, but not as a punishment by any means; I have visited patients in consultation in their own homes where women have declared to me that they had been violated by their own father. Q. (By Mr. Olin.) Reputable women % A. Yes, sir; good people; disease makes no difference between king or peasant. Q. Were you aware, at any time during Miss Lathrop's detention in the Asylum, of the delusions she had in regard to violation of her person ? A. Yes, sir; I examined Miss Lathrop very carefully within the first week of her being placed in the Asylum, and she communicated to me all the delusions that she then had with reference to persons in Rochester, with reference to poisoning ; that she was poisoned by acids, and had to wash herself in alkalies to counteract it; and with reference to her own family ; that her own family were inimical to her, and that she was in danger there of being poisoned in her own house, and had been, as she believed, and had taken certain mixtures for analyzation ; that a certain man there, whose name she gave, and all the circumstances, who was about to divorce, or had divorced, his wife, she did not know which, but would do it to marry her; that her family then received into their house this woman ; that she was in disguise, and dyed her hair and made certain changes for the pur- pose of destroying her. She then gave me all the symptoms that she had of poisoning, which, in reading her testimony over, are the symp- toms which she gives now for violation of her person, and she insisted on writing those down, and did write them down, and they are con- tained in the case book. By Mr. Morgan : Q. The symptoms which Miss Lathrop gave, were they such as vou would expect under such circumstances, that is, if her person had been violated ; did she give symptoms such as you would ex- pect? A. Well, I never knew the symptoms of any person who had ever been violated in any way of sensations or violence or any thing of the kind. Q. Has your attention ever been called to it ? A. Yes, sir ; but not as to violence ; my attention has been called I 1080 to that subject, and I should expect symptoms in way of physical, injury. Q. Such as she described ? A. No, sir ; not sueh as she described. Q. Lameness in the hips, would you not expect that ? A. I don't know whether I should expect lameness in the hip unless there had been a great deal of a struggle : I do not see any relation between sexual congress and lameness of the hip, unless it is resistance ; I have examined women who have professed to have been violated, at the request of some officer, and those who have been; but all those symptoms of Miss Lathrop's were given as a slow poisoning; they are not the symptoms of slow poisoning. Q. The symptoms she gave as occurring at Rochester- - were they such as you would expect in a case of poisoning? A. No, sir. Q. And your opinion is that the history she gave of her misfor- tunes at Rochester were delusions ? A. Yes, sir, delusions due to her impaired and feeble health, and the overwork she had gone through before hand. Q. And she thought that her own family were engaged in a con- spiracy against her? A. So she told me. By Mr. Goodwin (resuming) : Q. Is it possible, in your opinion, to etherize a person in a state of sleep ? A. Without their waking ? Q. Yes. A. No, sir; ether is a very irritating substance, and produces such irritation that it would waken the person ; now it is often a difficult process to get a person under the influence of ether with all the appliances around. Q. How about chloroform ? A. I should say the same of chloroform, though looking at the lit- erature in regard to it, there is an occasional statement that it has been accomplished. Q. Would you make any distinction between an adult and child in reference to chloroforming during sleep? A. Yes, sir, a child would be much more susceptible to this influ- ence than an adult would be, just as they are more susceptible to poisons. By Mr. Morgan : Q. Could ether be blown into one of your doors to your patients' rooms so as to stupefy a person in bed in the room ? A. No, sir, that would be physically impossible; I think it would ''fill the whole hall with ether; ether is a very permeable thing. Q. Chloroform might, might it not ? A. I doubt very much whether it would. 1081 Q. It would be more likely to be done with that ? A. Yes, sir; but I do not think a pint of chloroform blown under the door would have such an effect; it might stupefy them a little, and make them sick at the stomach, but 1 do not think it would pu^ them in a condition of prolonged anaesthesia, such as would allow of any such relations as are referred to. Q. Would it be sufficient so that an entrance might be made to the room, and then the stupefying made complete ? A. No, sir. By Mr. Rice : Q. How is ether administered ? A. It is administered usually by various machines ; either a tin cup with a wet arrangement or a sponge put in; an affair such as this {indicating with a piece of paper twisted into a conical shape); it is usually administered with a cup so arranged with a sponge in it, the sponge holds the ether, and gradually yields it from the mouthpiece over the person's mouth; for temporary purposes when such a cup, or any article or arrangement, is not attainable it may be done by placing it in a piece of paper like this (indicating), and a towel round it, and pouring ether in, and holding it over the mouth and nose in that way (indicating). Q. is it not possible to give a person ether while they are sleep- ing so that, although it may arouse them, it will deprive them of consciousness immediately afterward? A. No, sir, unless they were about to die, I should think, that is to let them wake up and then relapse do you mean ? Please repeat your question. Q. Is it not possible to give a person ether while they are sleep- ing so, that although it may arouse them, it will deprive them of consciousness immediately afterward ? A. No, sir. that would be impossible. Q. So th.it you say, do you, that to put a person under the influ- 1 ence of ether, they must be awake? A. They must "be awake to start with, you would awake them, it is bv the irritating action of the ether, they awake. Q. What you mean to say is, you must administer the ether to I them while awake '. A. Yes, sir, to secure its proper action. i \ By Mr. Morgan : Q. And how is that as to chloroform ? A. I should think it would be the same thing, but not so conspicu- ously ; I can think it possible that a person might do that, but I think it is not probable. Q. You frequently read of cases of burglaries and larcenies being committed by chloroforming people in their houses* A. I do not recall any instance where that has been verified ; I know it has been claimed, but I do not recall any instance where it was verified. 136 U i ^ s 1082 By Mr. Goodwin (resuming): Q. If insane persons after recovery, or partial recovery, have they clear or even recollection of occurrences? A. They have a confused recollection, and they have imperfect recollection, and they mix in the actual with the unreal, some of them retaining the ideas, or the false impression, through life, although entering upon the business in all their ordinary relations. Q. Do persons in convalescence still retain toward their own fam- ily the same views as to charges, etc., and wrongs as when they were insane ? A. Not when they are fully convalescent; convalescence means recovery ; convalescing means the process of recovery, and convales- cence means recovery ; when a person is fully recovered they do not retain their delusions. They may think some of the ideas they have had, that are mixed in with reality, may be true, as a person may in connection with a dream ; but when they are fully restored they recognize their delusions, and very often will recognize the dis- tinguishing lines between the delusive ideas and the reality, andean give the reasons that carried them over the boundary. The Chairman-- Into the delusion? A. Yes, sir ; into the delusion ; they very often have said that certain words uttered to them had converted an idea into a delusive reality, because a delusive reality is simply an intense delusion; and very often after apparent recovery thev retain their delusion. We have patients now in the Asylum, and have at all rimes, who seem to he entirely well, y<»u can talk to them upon some point, and you will find they are nervous directly, and develop their ideas and notions. Some time ago. a man who seemed very anxious to see some of his family, he had some very gross and unpleasant delusions toward his father, and his wife, aud the minister and the doctor; all the per- sons who were related to his case at home, and he said those delusions were all disappeared, that he did not care any thing about them. His wife came, and in an hour he was—they were all again as fully developed as ever. Q. I desire to ask a few questions in relation to the supervision of correspondence; what is the rule that obtains in the Asylum in ref- erence to that matter ? A. In reference to letters that come in — the supervision consists only of those letters coming to the table of the superintendent un- less there is— there are such cases that I recognize the handwriting and the address of the regular correspondent of the individual, if those letters come to my table, those letters go in directly to the pa- tient unopened ; if I am doubtful as to the person writing I cut the end of the letter to find out; I do not suppose I read a letter that comes once in a month; I have no idea that I do, though I see who it is from ; if it is a person who is not a correspondent of the patient and especially if it is a person whom I know the friends do not wish them to correspond with —(I know instances, persons 1083 whom the friends have directed me they do not desire to have them correspond with)— I read that letter and sometimes I have retained that letter for the friends sometimes, and have written to the person 'saying that the friends had directed me not to permit correspondence ; sometimes I have sent the patient the letter in, notwithstanding, and asked them about it; sometimes I have returned the letter to the person ; indecent letters have come to patients, improper letters in every way ; and that is all the guard that is put upon the corre- spondence entering into the Asylum ; in regard to letters of patients themselves, they are in one sense examined unless there is permis- sion to the contrary ; the letters are unsealed and come to the office, some of them are read and some are not read ; they are sent if they are from the proper person, unless they are obscene or blasphemous or in other ways improper. Q. Have patients after recovery expressed gratitude to you for the suppression of their letters ( A. That has been done in a great many instances. Q. On account of wdiat was in the letter?. ^ A. On account of what they had written ; persons will write their delusions as they speak them, will write of their families and friends the most shocking things which their families should never know, anymore than they should know the delirium of a sick person; some of them remember afterward in a general way that, they have written, and as a general rule they have exaggerated what they have written; I can recall many instances of that where I have, from the nature of the case, sealed up the letters and kept them for the per- son ; I remember some years ago a member of the Legislature, a very excellent man, his wife a very educated, cultivated woman, was brought to the Asylum and I think she was one of the most obscene women I ever knew, yet an educated, cultivated woman and a very good woman ; her departure from herself was just as far in the di- rection of perversion as could possibly be; she wrote a great many letters, if she did not write she was doing mischief in every possible >' way, I did seal these letters up, in that case never said a word about \ her condition or conduct to any one, her husband or herself or any one else, no letter ever went out; on her recovery she passed toward \ recovery into a state of melancholy depression, I found in talking toher that it was largely due to her conduct, the remembrance of much of her conduct and what her conduct would represent to i; others; finally she said to me, " i should like to go into your office, I want to see you ;" I told the supervisor when I got through the \ wards that this lady might go to the office, she came to the office and her mission was simply to know about the letters, if her letters had | been sent, I said '' no,'; and took them out of the drawer in that pack- ! age which were not sent; she said "are these the letters ?'_' 1 said ''yes;" she said did you ever say any thing to mydiusband ? No. My I uncled No. My daughter ? No. Did you ever tell them any thing I about me? No.' Well, said she, will you give me the letters to de- [ stroy ? I handed them to her, she put them in the grate and stayed I until they w7ere burned; she never said another word about them. 1084 Q. She did not look at them ? A. No, sir; she knew her handwriting; I have known her since, very well ; she has never uttered a word about it since. Mr. Goodwin — I desire to call the attention of the committee to this letter which I do not care to have on the records (Mr. Good- win then read a letter to the committee which was not taken by the stenographer) — a letter written by a female patient. Q. Now, doctor, in reference to correspondence ; if a patient were to write a letter to his or her relatives or friends complaining of the management of the Asylum, or ill treatment by attendants, or the want of proper food, would such a letter as that be suppressed ? A. No, sir, that would be their opinion, and the friends would know about it; if they did not they would inquire; I should not think of suppressing any such letter. Q. Has any such letter ever been suppressed, to your knowledge, during your service at the Asylum ? A. Not to my knowledge ; I have sent out many letters which were abusive of me and everybody else; sometime ago, two or three years ago, I sent a letter written by the wife of a lawyer, I suppose from his knowledge of his wife's condition and manner of talking of every thing else he would appreciate this letter and see it personally as an indication of her condition, and he immediately came to see me aud asked me if I had seen this letter; 1 said " yes, I inclosed it myself to you ; in that letter she said she had just given birth to twins; I said she has shown me the twins a good many times ; they are two rag dolls that she has on the bed ; she has any number of children there, I suppose you knew all about it and understood it, I said ; well, he said, " I do now," he went over and saw her, she told him they were all his; sometimes I am requested not to permit them to write letters or receive them without supervision. Q. What, if any, complaints have been made by any person against the Asylum since the Hughes accident ? A. I have not heard of any except in the newspapers. Q. How many patients have been sent to that Asylum from Madi- son county since the accident ? A. Four. Q. Can you give the dates ? A. Two of them were in February ; one February 8th, one later, two of them in March. (qj. How many patients have been sent from other localities in the State since that time ? A. Fifty-seven; I do not think there is any change in the current of influx or deflux. Q. Have any letters been received from any persons expressing anxiety on the one hand or confidence on the other, since the Hughes accident ? A. E have received one letter expressing anxiety, and a great many of an opposite character. Q. Have county officers made any statement in reference to it? 1085 A. What do you mean ? Q. Have county officers made any statement to you either ver- bally or in writing in reference to the Hughes matter ? A. Some of them have asked me about it. Q. Well, in what way ? A. Simply asking me how it occurred, there has been every ex- pression of confidence, and no expression to the contrary by public officers since this occurrence. The Chairman— What do you mean by public officers? A. I mean county superintendents of the poor who bring patients to the Asylum, and who commit them tliere. Q. Has this average of-patients since this Hughes difficulty been about the same as any other year ? A. I stated before that it has gone right along without any change whatever. Q. I call your attention to page 317 of the printed testimony, Mr. Hughes says ; " Q. You say J. R. Jones came in ? A. Yes, sir ; and father was going out of the room ; Dr. Gray came in and shook hands with father; and Dr. Gray asked me'how long has your father been in this condition ?' says I, ' since last Monday.' ' Is that all ?' say he,' yes,' says I; ' Well' says he,' I am glad of it.' ' Do you think that he will be cured?' says I; ' why, we cannot tell,' says Dr. Gray; 'his age is a little against him;' that was all that was said, and father was taken out of my sight, and I left the institution with these two men." He was speaking of the time his father was brought to the Asylum, do you remember that occasion ? A. Yes, sir, I remember his coming there, and I went into the office to examine him; after the statement had been taken down by Dr. Backus, I met Mr. Ilughes, recognized him, and shook hands with him, and he said " Air. Anderson ;" I said no, do not you know me? he then said------; says I, "were you thinking of Dr. An- drews?" he said "yes;" then he said "Dr. Gray?" I said "yes;" I then asked him a few questions as to how long he was sick ; he answered one or two questions, and then shut his lips ; I examined his pulse while I was holding his hand; I looked at the general con- dition of his face and expression ; then his son stepped up; I did not say what his son says there; I said nothing about his age being against him ; wdiatl recollect is this, I asked him how long his father had been insane; he said about a week, and then gave the exact time, the Monday before, when they first noticed it; I asked him how he had been, and he said, well, he had been very unhappy, and very anxious and depressed ; I asked him a few more questions; I don't recollect now ; I said "have you given the case to the doctor?" he said "yes;'1 I said "very well, I will read it in the minutes;" I will say this in regard to him, the son himself w7as then very nervous and agitated; and that was one reason I did not ask him much, I think he did ask if I thought he would recover; I said I did not know; I do not think any thing else occurred. Q. I call your attention to his testimony on page 318 ; after the ■-1 1086 injury or accident to his father, upon his return he says t u Q. When did you get to Utica ? A. I think I arrived at the Asylum about 6:30 p. m. Q. Where did you find your father ? A. I was called into Dr. Gray's office before I saw father. Q. State if you had any con- versation with Dr. Gray? A. Yes, sir. Q. Give us the conversa- tion with Dr. Gray? A. Dr. Gray told me what father's injuries were. Q. Try arid give us as near as you can, Dr. Gray's language ? A. Dr. Gray talked so long, and went around so much, [that it would be very difficult for me to tell what he did say ; he said so much that I was very anxious to come to the matter about my father, which he did not seem to want to do." Will you please state as much of that conversation as you remember, if any such conversa- tion occurred ? A. I do not think I conversed with him for one minute; I asked him if he had received the letter, he said he had (a letter which I had written him), and I said to him, your father is seriously hurt, his ribs are fractured and he is sick, can you come up and see him; and after you see him I will talk to you about him ; that is about the substance of what I said. By Mr. Haskell : g Q. What letter do you refer to ? A. The letter I wrote to him in respect to the injuries of his father. Q. Did not you telegraph ? A. I telegraphed and wrote both; I wrote first and telegraphed afterward. Q. (By Mr. Goodwin.) Do you remember what day it was he came to the Asylum ? A. On Monday. By Mr. Haskell : Q. Do you recollect when you telegraphed, and when you wrote? A. I wrote on Saturday, directly after the accident. Q. When did you telegraph ? A. I tried to telegraph on Sunday, but could not get Morrisville up, and then they said they would send it early in the morning; soon as they could get the office open ; that was Monday morning. By Mr. Goodwin: Q. I refer to page 320 of the printed testimony, in which Mr. Hughes was asked : "What other conversations did you have with Dr. Gray, or any of the physicians in regard to the matter of your father's injuries, than what you have stated you had with Dr. Gray on the first night? A. On Friday evening at seven o'clock I had a conversation with Dr. Gray. Q. Go on and state that conver- 1087 sation ? A.I had found out for certain that father would die soon ; about four o'clock he, changed. Q. How did you find that out ? A. By the doctor that had been up there; I think Dr. Gray had been up to see him about three or four o'clock, and he said in his room,' it is just as I expected, you can see the veins on his forehead,' and we knew from that, that the change was for the worse ; I was called into Dr. Gray's office about seven o'clock in the evening ; 1 asked him how long patients in that condition lived ; he said he had seen them live six, tw7elve, forty-eight, and even seventy two hours; I said : Do you think father willdiesoon, says I, right away ? Well, no, says he, I don't think that he will die very soon, says he, we may look for a change about two o'clock in the morning, or four o'clock ; doctor, says I, are you certain there are only three ribs broken; well says he, I cannot be certain about that, bnt we will have an examination which will give you satisfaction. Q. What time did your father die, with reference to the time of tins talk? A. This was about seven o'clock in the evening; I stayed there with Dr. Gray until 9:30, and father died at 8:40, 1 think it was. Q. Is that all the conversation that took place between you and Dr. Gray, at seven o'clock? A. Yes, sir." Is that so? A. His recollection is very different of what was stated ; I had several conversations with Mr. Hughes. After he had seen his father, I told him how I thought and believed the accident occurred and who the persons were, and said to him at several times, his father being very ill, that I doubted very much his recovery from it; in substance I said that the rib had punctured the lung, and that occasionally persons recovered after such an injury, but it was only occasionally, therefore, it was only within the range of possibilities that he would recover; my conversation with him in the room with his father was very little, because I am not in the habit of-talking at the bedside of a patient. Q. I am calling your attention now to the conversation at seven o'clock ? . A. Well, I will give that conversation : I had seen his father about half-past five ; Mr. Hughes came into the office a little while after I came down from tea, perhaps it was about seven, and asked me '. what I thought of his father ; I said I thought he was very ill, and falling steadUy; he asked.me if I thought he could go out a little [ while and get a little air and come back ; that his father would not die as soon as that. I said yes, I think you can ; he may die in an hour or he may die in four or five honrs, or I have seen persons that have passed into a condition of coma live as long as seventy-two hours ; I do not think he will; I think those were just about my words; he then went out; he did not remain in the office ; he is I mistaken there. Q. Did you state in that conversation that his rib punctured the lung ? A. No,|jsir, not in that conversation ; I had said that long before ; $ the^first day he was there ; I said in this conversation at that time in 1088 the evening nothing more or nothing about his case further; I had a conversation with him that evening after the death of his father. Q. I am going to call your attention to that now; on page 320 of the printed testimony he answers : " This was about 7 o'clock in the evening; I stayed there with Dr. Gray until 9: 3d, and father died at 8:40, I think it was. Q. Is that all the conversation that took place between you and Dr. Gray at 7 o'clock ? A. Y'es, sir; and at 11 o'clock we had another conversation. Q. Now give the con- versation that took place at 11 o'clock? A. Dr. Gray asked me if I thought it was best to have an inquest, and before 1 could answer the question he said he would call the coroner in the morning and see what was best to be done. Q. This conversation at 11 o'clock, was that after your father died that night? A. Yes, sir; and the co-nversation in regard to father, I think we began to talk about the undertaker and taking the remains home; I told Dr. Gray that 1 wanted to leave soon as possible in the morning with the remains, as it was Saturday, so as to be at home before night for them to have an inquest; says Dr. Gray, we will have it early in the morning, and have it so that you can leave to-morrow, and with regard to the undertaker, he said he would advise me to go to Whit ton's; at that time I was with Dr. Gray; and I went with Dr. Brush down to Whitton's undertaking rooms." Now what, if any thing, occurred at 11 o'clock? A. Well, that is very different from my impression, but probably not with any intent; after his father's death he came into the office and I think the first question he asked me was how soon he could fet his father's body away, if he could take the body in the morning; told him no, and then stated to him again the nature of the injury and that it was my duty to inform the coroner at once, that 1 pro- posed to inform the coroner then by a note and ask him to come in the morning at least by nine o'clock ; that I intended further to in- form the chairman of the business committee who had known of this matter, that was General McQuade, and that I proposed to send him word by a messenger at once; he asked me then if an inquest was necessary, I said it was, and it was my duty to refer the matter at once to the coroner ; I do not know whether he asked me any further question in regard to that or not, I don't recall, but I said I should like to make an examination ; he said " is that necessary ?" I said not necessary for me to form my opinion of the cause of his death, or the nature of these injuries, I know that, but I should like to do so ; he said " I would rather you would not, I want to take him home and keep him quietly over there on Sunday and bury him on Monday ; " I said I will refer the matter to the' coroner and when the coroner has taken charge of him I will have no more control over the case ; and then he said " who is the best undertaker ? " I said "there are several undertakers, that is generally left to the friends themselves to select, I said Mr. Cassidy, Mr. Whitton and Mr. Douglas ; he said, "I have been to see Mr. Whitton ;" I said " very well he is a very good man;" I do not think any thing more was said on that subject; then he said " I have been making arrange- h. 1089 i tnents to take him early in the morning; " I said " that cannot alter this, there is no question about it in justice to you and yonr father's condition, and every thing else, this must be referred at once to the coroner ; I wrote the note then as I was afraid the coroner would be in bed ; I gave directions for the night watchman, when he went off duty in the morning, to take that and leave it at the coroner's ; he (young Ilughes) said he wanted to go down; I said do you wish to remain here all night or to go down town ; he said he would go down town ; I then directed a sleigh to take the letter to General McQuade, and for him to go in the sleigh, and to take him where he desired to go and return ; I went out and gave these orders, and he remained in the office ; when I returned he asked me whether I thought that the coroner had made an examination (he did not use the word "post-mortem " and I did not use it) or viewed the body; if he could get off by the 11:40 train ; I told him I did not think it possible ; that he would have to have a jury called, and it could not be done in. that time ; he asked if it could be done by four o'clock in the afternoon ; I said I hoped it would; it was simply what the coroner would say about it; that I ' would not have any direction of the case ; he then asked if I thought it i would not do to put the body in a box, not a regular case, but a box, and take him home and have the undertaker there; I said no, I should not-advise that; I should advise to let the body alone until they were prepared to remove him ; that if they took him in that way they would have to pack the body in ice ; that as far as I was ( personally concerned I thought it Was a very disagreeable way of doing it; that if he let him remain until they were just ready to take him away, with a case around the body with ice in it, the body would becooled without the ice touching tlie body ; that was the whole of it; there might have been something else, but that was the substance. Q. I call your attention to page 321 of the printed testimony : "Q. When was the first time that Dr. Gray told you that he did not tliink your father would recover ? A. He told me on Monday even- |' ing, when I first saw him, that if he was a sane man the injuries he f had received would be nothing; that he would be willing—that [ there would not have been any doubt about it whatever. Q. About \ what? A. About his injuries, as to their being-fatal or not; he said that he was an insane person, had acute mania, a disease , which of itself was liable to kill a person ; and in addition to that he had these injuries — these fractured ribs; that he might have infusion of the blood on the brain or to the brain which would cause death. Q. Do you mean to say that the doctor told you that if your father had been a sane man, 'there would be no doubt about his ; recovery ? A. Yes, sir ; that there was no doubt he w7ould recover." What have you to say about that ? A. I am sorry to have to say that I never made any such state- , ments, and no such questions were ever asked me ; he had melan- cholia, he had not mania ; I think the sum of all my conversations with him was simply about what I have stated ; I used but very tew words in the case. 137 U u 1090 By the Chairman : Q. You say he had melancholia; does a patient suffering from melancholia ever have violent outbreaks ? A. I think that the frenzy of melancholia in an outbreak is as violent as that of mania. Q. Define the difference briefly, between maina and melancholia in that respect? A. Mania is where the ideas are expansive and exhilarating, and what is called raving; in the case of melancholia all the ideas are circumscribed—are depressing — they are full of apprehensions and fears ; in the other form they are aggressive; mania is aggressive. Q. Have you stated substantially all the conversation which you have had with Mr. Hughes ? A. I have. Q. Did you have any conversation with him at the bed-side of his father ? A. Scarcely a word ; I asked him once when I thought his father did not understand me, if he would address to him the same ques- tion that I had in Welch. Q. Did you state' to him at the bed-side of his father, that there was a great mystery about his father having his jaw fractured, as he states, on page 321 of the printed testimony ; " how could it have hap- pened ?" " well," said he, " it could have happened in many ways, he might have fallen against a chair, or even against a door, or he might have had a blow." % Q. Did you state that ? A. No, sir; I never spoke of his father's condition at the bed- side. By Mr. Haskell : Q. When did you first learn of the removal of Mr. Hughes from the ninth ward? A. I learned it after the accident had occurred ; or the injury had occurred. Q. Did you go yourself, after you heard of Hughes' injury, and visit him ? A. I will detail — I did, but there were circumstances occurred between the announcement of his injury and my going. Q. You may detail ? A. Dr. Backus came to the office and said to me that Mr. Hughes had been hurt; I said how; lie said his jaw is fractured; I said how ; he said, " I made no further inquiry than that, and reported at once to you ; " I then asked Dr. Brush to go in, and said I would follow; as 1 was about to go in — Dr. Brush had been told by Dr. Backus before he came to me on his way from the office, and had gone in ; just as I was starting in he came out to get some adhesive straps at the office, and said to me — he said he had briefly examined him, and that his ribs were fractured, at least two 1091 of them; I said, what have you done; he said we have directed him to be placed on 8 in a bed, and I am taking some adhesive straps in to put on at once; 1 then immediately telephoned, or directed to be telephoned to Mr. Campbell, president of the board, and telephoned dowm to the city, and directed that also to be done at once, for General McQuade to come up at once, in regard to an injury to a patient; then I went to see Mr. Ilughes. Q. Did you make examination of him yourself ? A. I did as far as was justifiable; I examined his jaw ; by that time they had the adhesive straps across his ribs. Q. Did you discover by your own examination, or were you ^formed by Dr. Brush, that the lung had been punctured ? A. No, sir; I discovered that at the moment I put my finger on the place. Q. Dr. Brush had not at that time informed you ? A. No, sir; he had simply said what I stated; I do not know whether he had or not, but I think not. Q. What steps did you take personally yourself to discover how the injury occurred ? A. I immediately afterward went dowrn to the ward and looked at the ward ; in the mean time my direction to one of the doctors to examine into the case; they thought they were directed to examine as to how the occurrence took place, which I did not intend they should do; I looked at the place and spoke to one or two of the patients who were standing tliere, and went out; I saw where the injury occurred; I then examined — I spoke to the supervisor, and asked what lie knew of it; I talked to the doctors, and then I talked to Mr. Weir, Mr. Bills and Mr. Brown, and examined them sepa- ; rately. Q. Was this on Saturday, the day of the injury ? A. Yes, sir, on Saturday ; I asked them how this occurred at that time; I subsequently made an examination of them further; I examined them three times separately, and talked to some of the patients about it. Q. Were the statements made to you taken down ? A. Only partial]v. Q. Not fully? A. No, sir. Q. When were you informed that Mr. Brown had stated to Dr. Pilgrim and to Supervisor Barisdale that he had struck Mr. Hughes ? A. Almost directly after I had examined him ; when Mr. Brown went out I said to him, " Is this all ? I said I expect you to speak to me as though you were on oath; you will have the answer on oath;" and then he told Dr. Pilgrim and Dr. Pilgrim told me. Q. And this was what day ? A. I do not remember the day ; I cannot recollect the day ; it was directly after. Q. Was it Monday or Tuesday? , . . A. It must have been Monday or Tuesday succeeding the injury. k 1092 Q. Why, after you received that information, did you allow, Mr. Brown to remain as an attendant upon that ward in the institution, taking charge of patients down to, I think, three weeks from the date of the injury ? , A. He was discharged just before the coroner's verdict; it was be- cause of the advice of the managers who talked with me about it. Q. Which manager advised you to retain him ? A. General McQuade, and Mr. Campbell said too that it was not prudent to do any thing under the circumstances. Q. When did they give you that advice? A. I told them this and General McQuade came up and made an examination of these men separately from me, and did not tell me of the result of his examination; he examined all these persons sep- arately. Q; Are not the rules of the institution imperative in that respect ? A. The rules are that they shall be discharged at once, and I pro- posed to do that. Q. Do you mean to say the managers prevented your doing it? A. No, sir; I think it was a question in their mind, and my mind of discretion. Q. Whether these men had done any thirtg that required their discharge ? A. No, sir; whether these men under all the circumstances of the case should not be held there, and held with such supervision, to see the result of this case, and that they might be, if it was proper, handed over to the authorities ; afterward the district attorney told me — i wanted to discharge them directly — Q. Wheu did you have a talk with the district attorney? A. I could not give you the date ; it was after the district at- torney took charge of the case I spoke to him about it, I said I felt I ought to discharge these men; he said if you discharge them I think you would be blamed, they are not going to do any mischief there, they ought to be held there to see what thcpublic ought to do with them ; after I had discharged the other men, and before Mr. Brown was discharged, I went to see the district attorney and I did not find him ; I went to see Mr. Rogers, one of the managers, and I said I feel 1 ought to discharge them, no matter what may occur with the public; I then went down and saw Mr. Winston and Mr. Lowery; Mr. Rogers thought the same, and Mr. Winston and Mr. Lowery thought the same : M r.^Swan thought the same : these are all 1 saw; I immediately discharged them; l"had prepared to dis- charge them and thought if I did it in the face of the district at- torney, and any thing should be wrong, and they should get away I should be held as not exercising discretion and judgment Q. The district attorney did not appear in the case until two weeks after the death, did he ? A. He appeared there; I have forgotten the time he appeared, but that is the whole history, and after I had discharged them I went down and told the district attorney ; he says, " I wish you had kept them until to-morrow, until the coroner's jury had returned their verdict." 1093 Q. Do you remember what day of the week it was that they were discharged ? A. They were discharged the day before the coroner's verdict. Q. Were they not discharged Saturday ? A. I don't know what day of the week. Q. And you cannot give the day of the month ? A. No, sir; not without looking at the date; I have not the elate with me. Q. It was only a day or two before the coroner's jury returned their verdict ? A. Yes, sir; I think they were discharged on Saturday, and the coroner' jury returned their verdict on Monday or Tuesday. Q. Will you swear positively that you told young Mr. Hughes that his father's lung had been punctured by the broken rib? A. Yes, sir; I swear positively that I told him the nature of it; I told him that the rib, one or more, was broken, and that it had penetrated the lung, and that it was not a matter of simply a broken rib, but that the injury to the lung would produce his death. Q. Did you tell the coroner at the time he came up to the Asylum the morning after Mr. Hughes' death to see the body that Mr. Hughes had died from — that his ribs were fractured, and that they had punctured the lung ? A. I did. Q. You swear to that positively ? A. Yes, sir; I do. Q. Did yon, in your evidence before the coroner's jury, when you were on the stand the first time, testify to the fact that the broken ribs had punctured the lung ? A. I think I did; I was not present at any of the examinations, and have never read the minutes of the coroner. Q. Do you swear positively you testified to that? A. I think I did, though I only answered questions asked me there ; I volunteered nothing. Q. Who asked the questions when you were examined ? A. Several asked the questions. Q. You were examined before the district attorney took charge of the case ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Are you not aware as a fact that nothing was known by the coroner, or his jury, or the public, that Mr. Hughes' lung had been punctured by these broken ribs until after the inquest that was held in Madison county on the body of Mr. Hughes ? A. I am not aware of that fact, but I know to the contrary of that statement, I do not think the public knew any thing' about it, but I am speaking of others. Q. Do you not know as a fact that the jurymen who composed the panel sat at the coroner's inquest did not know until after it was discovered at the inquest in Madison county that the lung had been '* penetrated ? A. I do not know what the jury knew. L 1094 Q. Do you not know as a fact that the coroner did not know of that fact until after it had been demonstrated by the coroner's jury in Madison county ? A. I know I told the coroner on the morning he came there, and I asked him about it — about the body — I told him what Mr. Hughes had said to me in regard to removal of the body ; he said u Mr. Hughes has been to me ;" I said I would like to make a post- mortem ; , he said "can you determine the cause of death without that;" I said "yes," that he died from injuries received to the lungs from a fracture of the ribs, and the ribs punctured the lung, and that I could not conscientiously say that I needed an examination or post-mortem to determine the cause of his death. Q. Did you not become satisfied that Mr. Ilughes had been im- properly treated by the attendants as early as Monday or Tuesday succeeding the injury ? A. I was satisfied in my own mind that two of the attendants had struck Mi*. Hughes from their own statement to me ; I was not sat- isfied that the other had, Mr. Bills. Q. You were satisfied that Weir and Brown had ? A. Y"es, sir, that they had struck Mr. Hughes from their own statement to me. Q. As early as Monday or Tuesday succeeding the injury ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And, notwithstanding that fact, you still retained those men in the institution ? A. For the reasons stated I did. Q. And allowed them to take care of insane persons under their charge ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Would it not, in your judgment, have a bad effect upon other attendants in the institution if men known by you to have violated a rule in regard to striking patients were retained in the Asylum ? A. As an abstract question or a practical one it would ; my sole reason of this was not concealed in any way — the sole reason wras for public consideration. Q. I assume that that was not made known to the other attend- ants in the institution ? A. I do not communicate any thing about one attendant to another under any circumstances. Adjourned until 10 o'clock to-morrow morning. 1095 Ways and Means Committee Room, ) Friday, April 4, 10 a. m. j Present — Messrs. Howe, Haskell, Olin and Rice, and Messrs, Goodwin and Morgan of counsel. Dr. JOHN P. GRAY : Continued examination by Mr. Goodwin: Q. Doctor, to the question put by Mr. Haskell at your examina- tion yesterday afternoon, " Q. Were you examined before the dis- trict attorney took charge of the case?" you answered "yes, sir." Do you desire to explain that ? A. Y^es, sir ; I understood it, as far as I could hear the question, to be " were you examiued by the district attorney before the coroner? " and I answered to that. Q. And you mean now to say that you were not examined ? A. No, sir, I was not examined — Q. Wait a minute ; you w7ere not examined at the coroner's inquest except by the district attorney ? A. Except by the district attorney, and a few questions asked me by members of the jury. Q. To the question of Mr. Haskell: " Are you not aware as a fact that nothing was known by the coroner, or his jury, or the public, that Mr. Hughes' lung had been punctured by these broken ribs until after the inquest that was held in Madison county on the body of Mr. ilughes ?" your answer was : '■ I am not aware of that fact, but I know to the contrary of that fact." What did you mean bv that? A. I mean that I knew that his ribs were fractured, and that it had punctured the lung, and that I had so stated to the coroner, and I would like to say further that I never read the testimony of the coroner in the papers, and never read the newspapers at all in refer- ence to any matters during the whole period, and did not talk to any person or permit any person to talk with me about it; I did not wish to mix my mind and. the ideas and knowledge I had with any other knowledge, or any thing that anybody else had that was said or done. By Mr. Morgan : Q. When the young man Hughes came to the Asylum upon your dispatch after the injury of his father did he appear to be sober and in-his right mind ? 1096 A. I do not think I have said any thing to the contrary. Q. No, you have not, but I am asking you the question ? A. Yes, sir ; certainly he did. Q. And did he appear while there to understand what was said to him, and what he was saying ? A. I do not know whether he understood it or not. Q. Did he appear to you to ? A. I suppose he understood what was said to him. Q. And did he appear to understand what he was saying himself ? A. Well, I understood what he was saying; I don't know what a man can appear to do. Q. Did he have the appearance of candor and of being an honest young man ? A. I think he was rather reticent. Q. Do you mean when he was there after the injury ? A. The whole period he was there, I thought he was rather reti- cent. Q. That does not answer the question % A. That won't admit of a categorical answer; he did not seem disposed once or twice to extend any information. Q. And did you think that was an indication that he meant to suppress any thing ? A. I did not think much about it in that connection; I did (at the last interview I had with him) say to him that I would like to know in substance what his father's condition was at home, that we had been — Q. Was that after his father was injured ? A. Yes, sir; after his father was dead I told him " we have been very frank and candid with you, I should like you to be equally so," that is, I should like to know your father's condition, and I stated to him that the sudden change in his father's condition from what had been described to Dr. Backus, and contained in the case book, was not usual with cases of simple melancholia, though I did say to him, as I recall now, 1 said to him some days before that, that I had thought a great deal about the case and that I could appreciate that a man in his condition would be subject to hallucinations, and that in my judgment the conduct of the patient on No. 9 was due to halluci- nations ; that he either mistook who these persons were or else he had hallucinations of hearing as well as of sight. Q. Before the injury ? A. I was going to complete that sentence, if you will allow me; he then said that he would state to me that his father at home was very violent; that part of the time it took two men, and part of the time four men to take care of him ; that they were afraid. Q. That was after the injury? A. Yes, sir, and that he was afraid that his father would kill his mother, or somebody else, and that the doctor had so instructed him; then I asked him why he did not tell Dr. Backus that in taking the history of the case ; he then said, " I did tell him he was violent" (I 1097 may not use the exact words, it is too long a time past); I said I read the case immediately afterward and talked to Dr. Backus about it. Q. Before Mr. Hughes received his injury in the Asylum, you did ascertain the fact that he was a violent patient, did you not ? A. No, sir, I think not. Q. Did not ascertain that ? A. I did not ascertain that, the son did not communicate that to me. Q. Did you not ascertain it there by his conduct in the Asylnm ? A. No, sir, because the whole period embraced a very brief space of time. Q. How long was he on number nine ? A. From Friday afternoon until Saturday morning, and the violence attacking the patient was on Saturday morning some time toward noon, and not long before this injury to his ribs occurred, and I did not know that until after the injury had occurred. Q. On what ward was he first placed ? A. On number nine. Q. Then where was he taken that morning — Saturday ? A. After that attack on the patients he was removed toward four by the direction of I >r. Backus, who was in charge ; he remained on four until the injury7 occurred. Q. That was the next week ? A. No, sir, the same day. Q. He was taken to number four on account of his violence ? A. On account of his attacking these patients on this quiet, suicidal ward. Q. Did you learn then just his condition when he was taken on to number four; did you yourself learn ? A. I stated that until Dr. Backus reported to me his injury shortly afterward, I had heard nothing of him. Q. And you heard nothing of him, except the fact that he was taken from number nine to number four ? A. I did not learn that until after the injury, because this attack on the patients occurred while — just shortly before — well, that was on nine and then he was removed to four. Q. And that was an indication that he was a violent patient ? A. No, sir, it was not; that is not an uncommon thing, under a [ sudden hallucination, in cases of melancholia or cases of mania, and the doctor saw him shortly afterward when it was quiet on number four, directly afterward. Q. (By Mr. Haskell.) That was after he was injured ? A. No, sir; before he was injured. Q. Which doctor saw him then ? A. Dr. Backus went there and saw him on his visit on that ward, 1 and attempted to talk with him, and he was then quiet and walking up and down the day room ; that was the report Dr. Backus gave 1 me; it is not at ail uncommon for a person to make an attack of j that kind, and that will end it, and the hallucination not appear again at all, or, perhaps, not for some time. 138 U 1098 Q. Were you informed of Mr. Hughes' condition on Friday night? A. That was the day he came there; there was nothing in his case Friday night; I knew nothing about his condition Friday night until I was informed by Dr. Backus the next day ; that was after he was injured. Q. Then no one reported to you his wakeful and disturbed con- dition on Friday night ? A. No, sir; that was not reported to me. By Mr. Haskell : Q. Did you not know that Dr. Backus, when examined before the coroner at the inquest, did not state any thing about the punc- tured lung ? A. I don't know; I never examined his testimony, and he did not tell me what his testimony was. Q. Did Dr. Pilgrim also fail to state that fact ? A. I don't know; I never read the coroner's minutes, or any of the testimony7, and I have not to this day. By Mr. Goodwin (resuming): Q. When patients are brought to the asylum by their friends, do they tell as good a story as possible, and often conceal material facts of violence in order that the patients may be placed on quieter wards ? A. A good many do that. Q. Are people brought to the Asylum injured and bruised? A. Yes, sir; some of them very severely. Q. Will you state the case of the man brought from Schenectady on Saturday last ? A. Y^es; he was brought there by a young physician, a son of the superintendent of the poor, his (the patient) son, and a police officer; when he came in he had iron manacles on his wrists, his hands were cut and scratched and bloody, and the skin was abraded from his wrists ; he had on straps fastening his arms back, strapped tight around each; the skin burned and abraded where the straps were; he had a large rope around his ankles, twice the size of that gas tube — about three-fourths inch in diameter, looped two or three folds round ; the skin bruised and abraded under that; in addition to that he had iron manacles on his ankles, his feet were swollen and bruised, and the skin was off under the manacles; he had bruises over vari- ous portions of his body ; he was a furious, maniacal man ; he was a man seventy-four years of age, and their statement was that it took four or five men to do any thing with him ; the officer said that either in the station-house, or the poor-house, he had torn up the iron bed-stead in the cell, all to pieces, with the pieces he had torn open the floor, and torn off the side ceiling ; and had cut himself, and bruised himself, and had taken off the end of one of his fingers with pounding on the doors ; we have had persons brought there with broken ribs, which has been done in the endeavors to take care of r • ' 1099 thenl; we have had persons brought in so badly injured7that they died within a few hours ; brought in simply to die there, and the friends to take the body away with them ; died from furious raving until they were exhausted, and from attempts to restrain them, and take care of them ; we had a woman brought in since this com- mittee were in session bruised almost all over — terribly bruised ; there was no unkindness on the part of her friends or family, but they did not know how to hold her or take care of her; another woman was brought in all bruised, and with a black eye, whic"h she said her husband had done, while he said she had done it in the t struggle in the cars; these things are inseparable from lunacy ; to | abolish all those things, you would have to abolish the disease and abolish humanity. I Mr. Goodwin — I would ask the stenographer if the portion of testimony on page 28 has been erased. (The stenographer says no, but he will so instruct the printer.) By Mr. Goodwin ; ■ Q. Doctor, did you in November last receive a letter from the | Civil Service Commission, asking your opinion in regard to methods } and details, with such modifications and recommendations as you might suggest in reference to the rules governing the admission to the service of the State of attendants at the Asylum ? A. I did. Q. Did you reply to that letter? A. I did. Q. What reply did you make; please read your reply? A. On December 1 I made the following reply: "To General Silas W. Burt, Chief Examiner, Civil Service Commission, New York. Sir—Referring to my letter of the 20th and yours of the 17th ult., respecting the application of the Civil Service Law to I. persons employed in asylums for the insane, I submit the following: » 1. " Regarding the method for ascertaining the qualifications of ' persons employed as attendants, nurses and orderlies." r As to the qualifications suggested by the Commission that "no re- [ strictions are to be imposed regarding nativity, citizenship or place or length of residence, * * * that men at the time of appli- , 'cation should be not less thau twenty nor more than forty-five years of age; women not less than eighteen nor more than forty years of age * * * to be free from physical defects or disease ! calculated to impair efficiency ; to furnish vouchers as to moral char- acter, cleanly and temperate 'habits and equable and humane dispo- sition—such applicants to be able to read and ^ write and work .correctly simple sums in addition and subtraction." All this, as you suggest in your letter, is in " accord with the present requirements in all the asylums, except as to the limits of age which you indicate." ;'■ Practically this latter is also. I have tried persons under and be- 1100 yond these ages. I have found some men under twenty and women under eighteen who fully met the requirements of attendants, but these are rather exceptional. Those who proved most serviceable are over these ages and up to thirty. We have also occasionally en- gaged persons over the proposed limit, forty and forty-five, who were highly recommended for character and even for seemingly ad- ditional qualifications in nursing, but almost invariably with ulti- mate failure. Persons engaging in this service after forty do not easily acquire the necessary systematic habits of watchfulness, care of door and keys, and personal subjection to definite rules and regulations, all so essential in the process of educating and molding the faculties and will to spohtaneons obedience and to the execution of fixed rules. The establishment of qualifications will doubtless elevate the service. While almost, without exception, the present employees would pass the examination plus, still the public mind reeds to be disabused of the error that attendants are ordinarily ig- norant, inefficient or cruel, and such promulgation of qualifications will do much to enlighten the public and sustain the hands and work of the administrative officers of asylnms. I approve this proposition of the Commission. Respecting the employment in the first grade of the eighth sub- division, attendants, nurses and orderlies, whose qualifications are above referred to, the Commission proposes that the board of ex- aminers certifying to their qualifications shall be "selected from the officers in each asylum." This would be also, as your letter states, in accord with the law and the rules and regulations and usages of the institution. The organic law, section 10, title 3, chapter 446, Laws of 1874, with which you are familiar, provides that the super- intendent shall appoint, with the managers' approval, such and so many other officers, assistants and attendants as he may think proper and necessary for the economical and efficient performance of the business of the Asylum, and to prescribe their several duties and places. The rules and regulations declare that " it shall be his duty to de- termine, under the directi, n of said board, what attendants and as- sistants are necessary to be employed, and prescribe their respective places and duties." The law further requires, section 10, that the steward shall, " under the direction of the superintendent, make contracts in the superintendent's name with the attendants and as- sistants." The rules and regulations require "in the name of the superintendent and by his directions in each case, and not otherwise, the steward shall hire attendants and assistants." | The practice has been for the superintendent to examine the ap- plicants and their recommendations, or designate a medical officer to do so. An agreement, a copy of which you have received, is then signed. The references and recommendations are filed. If it is desired to designate distinctly a board of examiners, I would suggest that it consist of the superintendent and steward, and that the superintendent should be empowered to direct any member or members of the medical staff to make examination to be submitted 1101 to the board. The further question arising in my mind is whether one of the managers should not be associated with this examining board ; that any certificate of qualifications of this board should be approved in writing by the manager so designated. The next query would be whether any thing could be gained by including, otherwise than suggested, a member of the medical staff. The sub- ordinate members of the staff have more immediate and constant relations with this class of employees, and it is their duty to report to the superintendent any defects, negligence, misconduct, etc., on their part. It does not seem advisable to me to have such officers designated as examiners, otherwise than as suggested, of persons whom it is their duty so to report to the executive head. Such an examining board as I have suggested would maintain administrative authority and responsibility conjoined, in the execution of the law as applied to administration and discipline necessary to the best working and best results in an institution. It is often quite difficult to secure a sufficient number of attend- ants. It is a common experience to receive applicants highly ap- proved by physicians and other responsible persons, supposed to be r competent to judge, who prove most incompetent in fact, and un- fortunately when the services of such persons are dispensed with, they feel unkindly toward those who have have recommended them as well as toward the officers of the institution. The difficulty in ob- taining attendants is not so much because the applicants are lacking in education, habits, character, etc., but for their lack of adaptability to the service. The service is peculiar, and though of a public na- ture, it is far more domestic in its real character than public, and the nearer such institutions can be brought to home and ordinary life the better and more efficient they will be. Respecting class seven, subdivision eight, second grade, " super- visors of asylums and wards." Persons are never originally employed as supervisors of depart- ments or wards in this Asylum. No attendant on first employment is hired for any particular place, but simply as an attendant and for such place or places as the chief officer shall determine, from time to time, that he is competent to fill. They commence either in the dining-room, or as assistants on the wards, and the promotions to the positions of head ward attendants and supervisors of departments are by advancement according to proved fitness. Not, however, as a rule applied to all, for in many cases, persons reach the maximum of their ability to do good and satisfactory work at a quarter or midway in the rcale of promotion -^-and it would be injury to the service'as well as to the individual to promote any one to a position i he would be incompetent to fill. Indeed it is not unusual for per- sons after promotion, feeling this, to request a return to their former ; positions with less responsibility and less remuneration. ■ It must appear that this grade of employees, " supervisors of asylums and wards," practically have their qualifications certified on 1 entering the institution in a different capacity. The promotion in I 1102 all cases through all grades upwards is by the direct authority of the responsible executive head. Would the Commision deem it necessary to have any formal re-examination or certification in such cases, or would it be sufficient for the examining board to certify the promotion on a record, or in what other form the Commission might determine ? During the last fifteen years all the positions in both the men's and women's department, relating to the immediate management and care of the wards and patients, have been tilled by promotion. Respecting the examination for positions in the ninth subdivision " »11 other persons employed," I have nothing to add to the sug- gestions of the Commission. The Commission would probably prepare to be printed, or furnish printed, a blank book with questions, etc., so that the examinations and certifications of the examining board would in every case be recorded, and this book open at all times to the inspection of the Commission. Within the past fifteen years 583 persons have been examined engaged as attendants in the care of the wards and patients, ninety of whom are now in the service. Of this whole number, 367 left the Asylum with a good record, either having completed their term of service or, by permission, to engage in other pursuits Eight of the number left on account of ill-health; thirty-four were found to be inefficient or negligent and discharged, thirteen were discharged for abuse of patients; six for intoxication ; fourteen for profanity and rough speech ; three were found untruthful; five were discharged for wearing articles of clothing belonging to patients; three for quarreling among themselves ; three for immorality out- side, while away from the Asylum though still in the service; twenty-four were discharged for staying out at night or leaving their respective wards without permission ; six were discharged for insubordination ; one for sending out letters, retaining money of patients and general untruthfulness ; three for sending out let- ters ; one for giving keys to patients; one for obscene language; one for impertinent language to patients. It is proper to add that the great majority who proved inefficient, negligent and unadaptable to this service were persons of full age, of good character and education, and other qualifications, some of them having been nurses outside, who upon simple examination gave promise of being useful persons. In respect to class 7, subdivision 1, "superintendents of insaue asylums," subdivision 3, "assistant physicians and pathologists in insane asylums," subdivision 5, " stewards of asylums " (in which I presume you include matrons), subdivision 6, "engineers and expert mechanics and tradesmen." You say in your letter " it is proposed that persons named to fill vacancies in the first six subdivisions shall procure before appoint- ment the certificate of the Commission that they are duly qualified and that the character, scope and degree of requisite qualifications shall hereafter be determined in conference with you and other superintendents." 1103 1. Respecting qualifications. The law declares that the superin- tendent " shall be a well educated physician, of experience in the treatment of the insane." In order that no question should arise in regard to the word "experience" it seems to me that these words should follow : " and no physician shall be appointed superintend- ent who has not served as a medical officer in an institution for the insane." In regard to the superintendents, the question as to qualifications, character, etc., it is undoubtedly assumed in the law. They ought to be either assumed or stated. The law authriozes the appointment of assistant physicians by the superintendent and managers, and the rules and regulations state that they shall be " well-educated physicians." In respect of educa- tion and character I have assumed these to be essential They ought to be stated in the law as well as the rules and regulations. When I was appointed superintendent 1 submitted to the board of managers the rule that the assistant physicians should be educated men, garduates in medicine, and as far as I was able to secure it they should have some service in a general hospital and should be men of good character and habits. 1 adopted the rule of promotion in » regular grades, to third, to second and first, but have not been in every instance able to carry out this rule. Persons might be - qualified for subordinate positions and not competent to the higher. I have never hesitated in the matter of promotion to do what seemed to me best for the public interest. For the past thirteen years every oneof my assistants has been promoted. Though applications for the position of assistant physicians have, been numerous, it has not always been easy to Obtain really suitable persons. The method of promotion has, however, enabled me to secure experienced men in the most responsible positions in tbe staff; in only one instance in thirty years the person promoted was found to be incompetent to the place. Respecting the method of determining the qualifications for these positions, the law declares: " The government of the State Lunatic > Asylum shall be vested in the board of managers. * * * The mana- gers shall appoint a superintendent; * * * upon the nomination of the superintendent four assistant physicians." The managers are appointed-by the Governor and Senate and, I observe, are not required to be classified or to pass an examination. ^ Whether the managers should not be the examiners and certifiers in the selection of the chief executive officers for whom and for whose character they are responsible, is a very vital question, and I can discuss it personally with you or with the Commission, especially as I do not expect to be atfected and only feel, as you do, the most anxious ..interest that whatever course is adopted, it shall be for the dignity, "character and welfare of the institutions. In respect to assistant physicians, I am not sure that the certificate of qualifications would work to the advantage of the service. Looking through my own experience there has been no dearth of applications, but the best men have generally got some other person 11041 to apply for them, or they have written privately, not wishing to have it known that they applied unless successful. What the effect of having a number of persons, a sort of chronic list of certified applicants, would be, I hardly know. I have had applicants recom- mended in writing by very competent medical men, who were per sons of education and good character, but who, from my personal judgment and examination, were not qualified for the peculiar posi- tions they sought, who afterward re-applied with the names of prominent men in social and political life, Congressmen, Senators, bankers, etc., accompanied, in some instances, by letters pressing me to give the appointment. The superintendent should have a staff in whom he could have implicit confidence as to their ability, character, adaptability to carry out the measures, medical and other, required for the treatment of the patients, and the order, discipline and integrity of employees; and a staff who would harmonize and respect each other in their du- ties. Though this position is one in a public service, so-called, there is very little resemblance between this particular medical ser- vice and that of the army and navy. In the latter they can remain , indefinitely under good conduct In the asylums the service'is more temporary, resembling that in a general hospital; a large pro- portion remain but a short time and then go into, general practice. The public advantage of having competent men in these positions is the increased number of medical men educated and practically familiar with insanity. Out of the six asJstnats appointed by Dr. Brigham between 1842 and 1849, three became super- intendents, namely, Dr. Buttolph of New Jersey, Dr. Brown, form- erly of Bloomingdale, Dr. Nichols, now of Bloomingdale. One went into private practice, another took a subordinate position in a similar institution until his death, and the other organized a private asy- lum. Of the five assistants appointed by Dr. Benedict between 1849 and 1854, one, Dr. Gray became superintendent (of the State Asylum, Utica), and the other four went into private practice. Of the twenty-seven appointed between 1854 and 18S3 by Dr. Gray six became superintendents, viz.: Dr. VanDeusen of the Michigan Asylum, Dr. Chapin of the Willard Asylum, Dr. Cleveland of the Hudson River Asylum, Dr. Shantz (deceased) of the Minnesota Asylum, Dr. Kempster of the Wisconsin Asylum, Dr. Andrews of the Buffalo Asylum; two accepted subordinate positions in other asylums, twelve went into private practice, one organized a private asylum, one died in the service, and five remain as the staff of the institution, making thirty-seven assistants nominated in forty years. Out of these thirty seven assistants, eleven were appointed superin- tendents, three took subordinate positions in other asylums, two or- ganized private asylums, one died in the service, sixteen went into private practice and five remain In respect to subdivision 5, class 7, " stewards (including ma- trons)." 1105 Neither the law nor the regulations mention the qualifications of those appointed to these positions. They are both offices of import- ance, and the persons filling them should be of mature age, should have a knowledge of business affairs, should be of high moral char- acter and unquestioned integrity, and be in sound health. Both of these places are filled by appointment by the managers on the nom- ination of, the superintendent. During the years from 1842 to 1849 Dr. Brigham nominated three stewards and three matrons, the latter being the wives of the former. The first steward and matron served a little over three and a half years (from September 14 to April 1, 1846). The sec- ond a little over two years and eight months (from April 1, 1S46, to December, 1848). The third a little less than a year, (from Jan- uary 22, 1849, to October 1, 1849). Dr. Benedict from 1849 to 1854 nominated two stewards and two matrons. The first steward held office a little less than a year (from November 5, 1850, to October 15, 1851). The first matron held office a year and five months (from October 1, 1850, to March 8, 1852). The second steward held office less than three years and ten months (from October 15, 1851, to August 1, 1855). The second matron, the wife of the last steward, held office a little over three years (from June 29, 1852, to August 1, 1855). Dr. Gray, from 1854, twenty-nine years, appointed but one stew- ard, who has filled the office twenty-eight years and four months, and is in the service, (from August 1, 1855). He has nominated tour matrons, one temporarily for three months, the next acted as matron eight years and three months. The next one year and three [ months. The fourth has continued in the position of matron ever since. This last matron was promoted from a subordinate position in the institution. Sub division 6, " engineers and expert mechanics and tradesmen." [There is no doubt in my mind that these persons should be certified when making application as persons of good charac- ter, temperate habits, common education and sufficient technical [ knowledge and practical experience in the sphere of their particular vocation. The present engineer in this institution was appointed [ in 1853. His recommendations were from the officers of the Lake On- tario Steamship Company, in who e service he had been as an engi- neer. Within the past fifteen years, three carpenters have been [ employed successively in charge of shops, two masons, and four ' painters, all of whom were practical mechanics. On giving my opinion on the matters suggested by the Commis- sion, I have presented certain statistical facts bearing on the qualifi- cations of officers as well as employees, which tend to show the results of the present system, and may possibly throw some light I upon the problems with'the solution of which your commission is I charged. I. That was my reply to his letter on "that matter. I received a | leetter from ' the chief examiner, saying that the Commission after considering the matter (1 do not use the exact words), had come 139 U 1106 to the conclusion that the law required that some other person than the head of the department should constitute the examining board, and that, therefore, they would request me to name three persons among the officers for such examining board, that they might sub- mit it to the action of the Commission ; I submitted the steward, the first assistant physician, and the matron, and those persons were commissioned as such examining board. Q. Will you be kind enough to state the character of the attend- ants and how they are obtained, in your Asylum, outside of what you have stated in that letter that has just been read ? A. I can only say that I believe the attendants in the Asylum are good, upright and efficient people, as much so as we have been able to get from the class of persons from whom we must draw our attendants, and I may say that my experience in attempting to get per- sons of higher positions or places in life as attendants has been a fail- ure ; they would not submit themselves to the necessary discipline and subordination, and to the drudgeryand more or less unpleasant work that is necessarily associated with the life and services of an attend- ant; of course I will say, and the very fact of discharging persons shows, that some" do not succed, that in spite of all we can do, that persons give way to sudden temper, and violate the rules, just as they7 do anywhere in the world, but that there is any thing beyond that, any system of cruelty, or any cruelty in the sense of being cruel, I do not believe it, and it is not true ; the constant supervis- ion that is exercised there would detect any thing of the kind at once; furthermore, I have tried the system tentatively of getting persons of a lower grade to do the rougher work, that has been sug- gested to me by various persons, and I have found that work poorly, the very illustration — I could give a number of illustrations where that class of persons are put in rougher work in the dining-rooms, where they have no responsibility of the care of the patients, only to do what they are told to do there, they are apt to become rough in speech |]and manner toward the patients and they soon get dis- contented and want to be placed above those that are able to fill a higher grade; they are not promoted, and then they become ugly, or become suspicious of others; I have abandoned that and made up my mind deliberately, that that is not a system that can be practiced; that the persons must all be as near as possible of the grade that can be promoted ; and when they find they are not adapted to the service, they go away, and they are allowed to leave; I have had people come in to scrub, etc., and if any patient annoyed such a person, or such woman, the patient would say disagreeable things to a patient, or threaten to strike them with a broom; and they had no idea that there was any impropriety in it ; and I ex- plained this thing then to the attendants, supervisors and matrons, that the persons there in such positions must discharge their whole duties, just, as a doctor has to do disagreeable things in the discharge of his duties, associated with his profession; necessarily he must give a patient an injection, or do any thing else required for his 1107 welfare ; and that attendants must be beyond a person who would not be willing to submit themselves to every one of these things, and I will say that the best people do it cheerfully. Q. What effect have investigations and newspaper reports of a sensational nature had upon the attendants as a rule ? A. They have had the effjct of making it very difficult to get at- tendants, and to make us lose some of our very best people; after the last committee, last year, I found it very difficult to get at- tendants, I had to write to Ohio, Canada, and various places; it was impossible to fill places and keep up the list of attendants, peo- ple said they would not come there to be called keepers and brutes and such expressions. Mr. Goodwin — In refereuce to this question I desire to read a letter I have received from Mrs. Barker, the matron. The Charman— You may do so. Mr. Goodwin—(Reading.) " Hon. Alex. T. Goodwin — Sir—In regard to the question you asked me concerning the effect of the testi- mony given before the investigating committee upon theattendants at the Asylum I desire to say, that while it has already deprived us of some that were both kind and efficient, it has a tendency to prevent our getting others at all fitted for the position. Particularly since the beginning of the investigation now in progress have I heard expres- sions of the strongest feeling against the injustice of being called upon to defend not only their best motives and kindest acts, but their character even from the grossest misrepresentation. The life of an attendant in an institution of this kind is at best one of care and responsibility, requiring an amount of patience and forbearance far in excess of that which is generally understood or accorded patients by7 their friends. Add to this the perplexity attendant upon an investigation and the duties become doubly hard and unpleasant. Some qf our best attendants have already said to me that if they are to live in constant fear of such an occurrence, no amount of money would tempt them to continue their work. Believing that I have correctly7 expressed the feeling of all, I am very respeetfually yours, EMMA BARKER." Q. A great deal has been said in reference to Mr. Sage, an at- * tendant in that Asylum, who has been accused by witnesses of grea- brntality ; what have you to say in reference to him ? ^ A. I have not seen the testimony myself; if there is such a thing I am ready to answer about it. Q. I will call your attention to the testimony of Mr. Weir, in which he relates — have you heard his testimony ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do yon know what he says about the conduct of Attendant Sage to patients? A. I think he referred to that; I do not recollect it distinctly. 1108 Q. Was there any difficulty existed between Sage and Weir, to your knowledge ? A. Only from what some person else said. Q. Did you make investigation of any charges made against Sage? A. In regard to that, that matter occurred before the former committee of the Legislature, or just previous to the investigation made by the committee of the last Legislature, that is, certain charges were made by Mr. Weir to the assistant physician that he had discovered bruises on two persons, one at this time and one at another, who had come from the twelfth ward, of which Mr. Sage had charge, to the fourth ward, of which Mr. Weir had charge, which was brought at once to my attention ; I made a very careful examination into that matter, examining each person separately, examining all persons who knew any thing about it, or could know any thing about it. Q. Examining the patients ? A. Yes, sir ; and I was satisfied that there was no - - that, well, — the bruises were on the person, that they had not occurred from any injury or brutality or any thing else from Mr. Sage; that in each particular it was exaggeration and misrepresentation ; that Mr. Weir believed this I have no doubt, but his only ground, as I learned then from him and the others, was that these persons came from the other ward there on to his ward, and that these bruises were on the body ; he knew nothing personally of how they occurred ; I found out how they did occur, and Mr. Sage was not to blame in the matter; and that matter was brought up at the meeting of the former com- mittee and there stated, and they examined Mr. Weir; I do not know whether they examined Sage; I offered Sage and all the rest of them to examine ; they said they did not want to ; Mr. Sage was discharged last fall for going out at night without permission. By Mr. Haskell : Q. He was not discharged until winter, was he? A. He was not discharged until the time I now mention ; that was for another cause. Q. That was in the winter? A. Well, he was discharged recently ; it might be called winter ; I don't remember the date, but that was the reason of his discharge. Q. Was Mr. Weir the only one who made charges in regard to Mr. Sage's treatment of the patients? A. Mr. Weir and Mr. Quine was one of the persons who made charges at that time. Q. Mr. Orendorf ? A. He did not at that time. Q. Did he at any time ? A. I don't think he did. Q. He substantiates the same charge that Weir and Quine made? A. I don't know that he did. Q. You do not know whether he did or not ? 1109 A. He could not have known any thing about it, except what he heard them say ; I found, in making a long examination, extending two or three weeks, made in accordance with my judgment in in- vestigating such matters in such an institution, that the majority just stated what they heard from other people, and stated it as their own. Roberts was on the fourth ward and not on the twelfth ward, and did not see any injuries occur. Q. Neither did Weir or Quine? A. No, sir; I found they knew nothing of* the case at all, except that they saw the bruises and heard the complaints of the patients, and heard the statements made by other attendants to them ; the other attendants could not complain to them ; that would be an ut- ter violation of the rule for the attendants to undertake any disci- pline of that kind, or inquiries; I should discharge an attendant for undertaking to assume the duties either of assistant physician or su- perintendent. Q. Discharge an attendant for inquiring what had been done on another ward ? A. No, sir; I don't say that, if an attendant went on to another ward. Q. And asked what happened ? A. Yes, sir, and neglected his duties; the rules would command me to discharge him ; he could not go off his ward without neglect- ing his duties unless he went by permission or on some service, and he could not go. Q.gY'ou would discharge an attendant for asking what had oc- curred ? A. No, sir; I would not discharge him for asking what occurred; I would discharge an attendant who undertook to make these investi- [>■ gations, and leaving this ward to go to another ward to breed insub- | ordination and disturbance; these things belong to the officers, and ; they are their duties. f Q. Suppose he did not neglect any of his duties, and did not [ make the inquiries for the purpose of breeding insubordination, but I simply his attention having been called to the fact that a patient j had been injured ; and the patient then being under his care, and I the patient claiming that he had been injured by an attendant, and . he made inquiries in regard to that so as to satisfy himself as to the i truth of the charges of the patient, would you discharge him for j doing that ? 1 A. I should not answer that categorically, because it cannot be answered so; when he has reported that matter to the officer that is the end of his dutv, and none of his duties require him to go fur- ' ther, and any attendant going further aud instituting inquiries would be outside of his duties ; it is the duty of the assistant physi- cian ; I and should not consider him a proper person to be in the service. . . . . Q Do you believe at the time Weir, Quine and the other attendants ou the fourth ward, believe'that Mr. Sage had inflicted these injuries ? i 1110 A. I said I think Mr. Weir dfd; I do not know whether Quine did or not. Q. Had you some doubts about that ? A. I had no doubts about it at all; I merely say Quine knew nothing about it. Q. He knew as much as Weir did, did he not ? A. Yes, sir; and I stated that Weir told me he had only heard it from some other persons. Q. Do you think these charges were made without foundation? . A. I think they were made on good ground, as far as they were concerned, for us to investigate, but their opinions as to how they had occurred were not based upon any knowledge whatever. Q. But Mr. Weir believed — A. Well, belief of a question does not constitute any thing in that respect without the facts. Q. Would it not have a very bad effect upon the attendants to retain a man in the institution who was believed by his brother at- tendants to have been cruel and to have inflicted injuries on the pa- tients? A. No, sir; it could not be if it was an injustce; I could not do an injustice to a man in regard to any thing of the kind ; I should not do such an injustice as to discharge a man because some brother attendant told he did a thing he did not do. By Mr. Goodwin : Q. I want to ask a question I neglected to ask ; it was as to ob- taining attendants; did you call the attention of the board to that subject in the fortieth annual report? A. I did formally at the meeting and at the time o£ the report. Q, To the matter of changes of the attendants ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And did you state in your report as follows: "There have been a greater number of changes in the attendants during the past year than usual. Indeed it has been exceptional, and during a part of the year it was difficult to obtain a sufficient number of suitable persons for this service, notwithstanding the wages are somewhat above the amount paid outside for the services requiring the same class of persons. This has been partly due to the increased demand for labor in the vicinity, but quite as largely to the disposition of the times to scandalize and degrade the hospital service. The best class of people are not tolerant of the vulgar epithets, ' keepers,' 'brutal keepers,' 'coarse and cruel hirelings,' etc., so liberally dealt out by the sensational 'authors.' These things do great injustice to the attendants and infinite harm to the service of the hospital. The rules are strict and they are law and they are well obeyed. The spirit of the rules, I can well say, in the majority, is more than obeyed. It is only justice to say it is no uncommon thing for at- tendants to voluntarily do more than theyare required. That some prove inefficient and some do wrong is only proof of a common ha- 1111 manity. The law provides that such shall not be retained, and the law is carried out. The abuse and detraction of attendants and em- ployees in a State charitable institution, a class of subordinates who can make no reply, is a pitiable spectacle under any circumstances, but especially so when those engaged in it have no knowledge of the persons or of the services the employees are required to render or how they are rendered. The corps of employees is deserving of the confidence of the public and of the friends of the patients." Did you make that ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Are these your views % A. Yes, sir. Q. Will you state to the committee your views about shortening the hours of service of attendants; do you regard them as too hard i worked ? A. I do not; that matter has been a matter of great considera- tion with me and discussion ; often, with the managers, and with other persons; I do not think that a hospital for the insane can be made to conform to the regulations in regard to the attendants in ' an ordinary hospital with any possible success; a hospital for the insane is a home, it ought to be so as far as possible, as far as the disease would permit it, and all institutional features should be ob- literated as far as possible; the attendants should be made to un- derstand that they are the companions and constant associates of the patients, and they must be with them day and night, they must be with them, they are as a person is in a family, it would be as im- \ prudent to take one person and substitute another in that way as it would be with a nurse of a child ; an attendant with the charge of a ward must have the responsibility of that ward, andcannot hand it j over at given hours to anybody else, and so the assistants must have \ their duties in the same way, (and the dining-room persons also) and they must sleep with them there, and my observation and ex- \ perience, and the observations I have made in institutions in this country and abroad touching that matter (because it is one of the most \ vital of the matters associated with the government of a hospital) ' is that the best system is that in which the attendant eats at the > same table with the patients, and is at the head of the table, and they are associated with them all the time ; I believe there is more concord, more harmony, more agreement and better service rendered ; and provisions are made by which attendants get out-door work and 1 exercise; get away occasionally to see their friends, and get out at nights sufficiently'to go to church or to go to some places of pleasure or amusement ; the fact is that attendants as a general rule improve in health if they go to the Asylum, and there are very few deaths, they have been very few indeed, either from consumption from persons who have sought that place because of the delicacy of their lungs or from cancer; we have had one or two attendants die of cancer; that is a disease that a person dies of anywhere, but from 1112 wearing out or getting nervous, so as to become insane, or any thing of that kind, that is so exceptional as not to be recognized even. By Mr. Morgan: Q. What is the greatest length of time any attendant now in the Asylum has been there as an attendant ? A. One has been from the time the institution opened —a woman, and she is a woman in good health for her age. Q. How long the next? A. I cannot tell, but a good many years ; some of our best people have been there a great many years, on both sides of the house. Q. Who is the eldest on the male department? A. I cannot recollect; I know the longer we can get attendants to stay the better it is for the institution ; and abroad they were subject, 1 noticed, to a great many more changes than we are, and the Commissioners in Lunacy speak of that in all their reports as a thing to be remedied ; persons who have got used to the service are the most forbearing, kind and considerate; I have had very good people come here who would tesign the first time a patient spit in their face; had a woman very highly, some time ago, recom- mended by a number of persons, and she said herself " I cannot bear this at all, and would not endure it;" she could not take in that they were irresponsible people, as she said she would box a child's ears for doing such a thing, she recognized that she was not adapted to the service; another very excellent woman, a very intelligent woman, I think she would have made a most admirable attendant, but could not bear the humiliation of going out walking with them; that was a sensitiveness that is not to be commended; but she could not help it, she tried to help it but could not do it. By Mr. Goodwin: Q. Are vacancies ever permitted for any length of time on dis- turbed wards ? A. No, sir. Q. How are they filled ? A. They are filled at once from other wards, and when I have not had persons that I could spare in that way, I have sometimes brought in outside help to till the vacancies. Mr. Goodwin — 1 think it should appear on the record, and I ask that it should appear, that the committee have been furnished a list of all attendants at the Asylum since the year 1874; that is true, is it not? Mr. Morgan —Dr. Gray, at my request, furnished me with the names, last known place of residence, of all attendants, giving the date of the employment, the date of the discharge (if they had been discharged), the cause of discharge, or if thev left of their own accord as stated, from 1874 to 1884, inclusive, and which I have presented to the committee, and it has been used before the committee during its various sessions. 1113 By Mr. Goodwin : Q. In regard to Miss B., how do you regard her in character and fitness for the position she occupies ? • A. I regard her as an admirable attendant; she is a woman of great forbearance and kindness, and 1 will say further that the ward that she is on is a ward where a great many of the disagreeable and troublesome patients are kept, and I consider her a woman of great forbearance and great kindness. Q. Now in regard to Mr. Halpin, you have read his testimony ? A. Yes, sir. Q. I need not, perhaps, call your attention in detail to his state- ment ; what have you to say about it ? A. Mr. Halpin was never any thing but an assistant attendant, he wae never ' placed in any position of responsibility, he was moved about from one ward to another, more or less, as a convenience ; he was a good worker and a quiet sort of man when he was there, but not a man to whom I ever gave any responsibility; the statement that he was ever a private attendant on a person is utterly untrue, his statement about a person from Albany, a hatter, with a trouble of his urinary organs, etc., is an entire fabrication, not a word of truth in it. Q. He left the Asylum some years ago? A. Yes, sir; in 1878, I think; but up to that time he was sim- ply as a worker; he was one of such men that you cannot employ as attendants or subordinates; that you must have a better class; if he was discharged for the reasons named, I do not deem it my duty or as proper that I should go into the evidence that was brought to me, touching all these matters, which were matters I was concerned [ with, as a chief officer to understand, that I fully understood them, and directed the steward to discharge him ; he was told fully about his discharge by the steward and asked to see me. [ Q. What was he discharged for ? \- A. He was discharged for immorality ; most of it outside. I Q. Since his discharge, have y7ou received letters from him? A. Yes, sir; some abusive and some threatening; he wrote a '' letter before the meeting of the last Assembly committee, demand- ing a recommending from me in place of the one he had received (as though he had received one); he never did receive any recom- mendation from me whatever; I am very sorry that I mislaid the letter; I showed it to Mr. Morgan ; I never paid any attention to any communications. By Mr. Morgan : Q. You say .you gave Halpin no letter of recommendation when he .left ? A. No, sir; I never gave him a letter or line to anybody, or about any thing. Q. But he has applied to you for one ? 140 U a L 1114 A. Yes, sir; since he has been away, he says, " I have lost the recommendation you gave me and want it replaced ;" he said "I do not want it just now, but may need it sometime." Q. Now7, in regard to Mr. Buckley ? A. Mr. Buckley came to the Asylum in precisely the same way, as a common, subordinate laborer; it was very difficult to get a better class of attendants to work in the dining-room ; he came well recommended as an honest, sober, industrious man ; I put him on a dining-room and.he never was anywhere else except in the dining- room ; he was at that time a rather silent man, very industrious and a good worker; after a time he got a little more money ahead and began to dress better; then he wanted some other employment; he wanted to be an attendant on the ward, but I did not consider him competent for the discharge of any duties above that of the ordi- nary care of the dining-room ; afterward he became rather rough; he was a coarse-grained man at any rate, in his speech, and I dis- charged him; his statement about my going into the twelfth ward and seeing Mr. Heath there is an utter fabrication; I never saw Mr. Heath on tire twelfth ward ; I saw Heath three or four days before his death in eighth ward with his brother (Mr. Heath's brother); Heath complained in the presence of his brother that he had been abused and his ribs broken^ and pounded, etc.; in the presence ot his brother, first to his brother alone in a part of the ward while I was doing something else and afterward in my presence ; and Mr. Jones, the supervisor, came over and stripped him, and he was ex- amined in the presence of his brother; there was not a bruise or an injury on him. Q. Was he examined in your presence? A. Yes, sir; all the rest is a sheer fabrication made up from one person talking to another; it is a common thing for one person to tell a story and that person to adopt it; as an illustration of that, I refer to the case that Mr. Weir speaks of, where he speaks of a person on the seventh ward, in December, a year ago, where a per- son had been injured by an attendant and was in bed for several weeks; the truth about that was, that Weir knew nothing about it whatever except what some person told him, and that person either misrepresented or Weir exaggerated; he was in bed about a week from a sprained ankle, which he got from suddenly attacking some patients right in the open recess, I have no doubt at all, under hal- lucination of sight and the endeavor or take care of him. Q. You were examined before the committee at Utica, on Feb- ruary the twenty-second ; the first witness called before the com- mittee; you then stated to the committee in reference to your visits upon the wards of tne institution ? A. I did. Q. Since that time you have read the testimony of the attendants and various other persons in reference to that subject; do you desire to say any thing further upon the subject to the committee ? A. I have given my statement, on oath, of my personal attend- 1115 ance on the wards, and what it is, and I simply repeat that, and I have nothing more to say ; that is the manner in which I have dis- charged my duties, and I have discharged them faithfully, as I have stated, and I have nothing more to say. Q. I am very anxious that the committee should hear what Dr. Gray has said on the matter of Halpin and Buckley, and I call the attention of absentees to the importance of looking at that. By Mr. Haskell : Q. I wish you would state how Smith came to be appointed supervisor ? A. Because I deemed it the best appointment I could make out of the attendants I then had. Q. He is a very young man ? A. Yes, sir; he is an intelligent, kind-hearted man and his services had been long before such as to commend him; he was not consulted about the matter, one way or another; in making this appointment I make my best judgment. Q. Do y7ou have any rule or system in regard to promotions ? A I do not promote persons in order as you will see. Q. Do you have any rule or system in regard to promotions ? A. Yes, sir; I have a rule and system of promotion; when a vacancy occurs at the head of a ward, I look over the matter with the help of the assistants, and appoint the best person that we have, that can be spared, that I believe most competent to that position, and do the same precisely with supervisors. Q. It is not then a usual or regular thing to appoint the eldest attendant ? A No, sir ; many of the eldest attendants would be entirely incompetent to any such duty. By Mr. Goodwin : Q. Now a few questions in reference to the commitment patients and difference between criminal and private patients, give a brief account how are patients committed ? A. They are committed to the Asylum on an order of the super- intendent of the poor of the county, if they are considered, by the superintendent of the poor, paupers ; that is within his own judgment, that he calls an Insane pauper. As a general rule I ma say that that class of persons are persons with very small means, and they are sent at the expense of the county, either wholly or they pay something ; a good many of these I have learned from them and their families that they repaid to the county some part of it. Q. So far as the Asylum is concerned, yon receive your pay ? A. Yes, sir ; sometimes they will say their family will furnish clothing in certain cases if they say that it is put down, and goes to the clothing clerk so that he will know ; he will only know they are 1116 there on the order of the superintendent of the poor, and the bills are charged from the counties from which they come, in detail. Q. Is it true that part of the board of the patients paid by the county is reimbursed to the county by the patient or the friends? A. County superintendents have sometimes told me that as well as their friends; an indigent person is a person described in the law as " unable to support themselves under the visitation of insanity, but not paupers," such a case is sent on an order of the county judge; as far as the Asylum is concerned, the bills g<> to the county precisely as in cases of persons sent by the order of the superin- tendent of the poor ; formerly that distinction rested upon this, that the judge sent persons who had been insane less than a year, who were not paupers, and the order contained the direction that at the expiration of two years, if they had not sooner recovered, the judge would be notified, and if they remained afterward their ex- penses would still be chargeable. By Mr. Haskell : * Q. Do I understand you to say that is not the law now ? A. No, sir. Q. What is the law? A. There is no restriction now in regard to length of time, either in respect of the insanity, existence of the insanity or their remain- ing in the Asylum. Q. Now, in regard to criminal patients, how are they brought to the Asylum ? A. There are three classes of criminals brought to the Asylum, denominated as such; the judge of the county can send any person who is dangerous to be at large and whose friends have not taken care of him; the county judge may also send any person who is confined in a jail under a charge, and who appears to be insane, af- ter due investigation with the district attorney, etc.; then there is another class of criminals sent by7 the courts, who have committed crimes, where the plea of insanity has been raised and a commission ha6 been appointed aud the insanity determined ; the judge then issues his order for their commitment to the Asylum. By Mr Morgan : Q. That was like Renshaw's case ? A. Yes, sir. Q. He was examined by a commission ? A. Yes, sir; determined by a commission ; he was not sent to our Asylum, though; the law, as it stands, allows the judge the discretion to send them to any State Asylum ; persons under indict- ment for crime may be sent at that stage, pending the indictment, if they appear to be insane, after like investigation, and persons ac- quitted after trial for crime, on the ground of insanity, may also be sent. Q. That is by order of the judge holding the oyer and terminer? A. Yes, sir. % 1117 By Mr. Goodwin (resuming) : Q. Now in reference to private patients ? A. Private patients are admitted on a bond or agreement made to the treasurer of the Asylum; that agreement always setting forth the exact sum per week to be charged to the individual, and a provision in that agreement saying, that in case of a person requiring extra attendance, or in case of death, etc., that the expenses are to be paid. Q. In case of a patient brought to the Asylum with defective papers, and suppose the bond was not in accordance with the law or what you require, what would be done in such case ? A. They would not be received ; they would not be received on auy bond (if a private patient) except, the bond prescribed by the board of managers for the treasurer. By Mr. Haskell : Q. What other papers beside a bond are required for private \ patients ? A. A certificate of two physicians who are Commissioners in Lunacy, and those certificates must be certified by the county judge from the county from which the patient comes, or a justice of the Supreme Court, within five days of the time of admission. Q. Certified in what respect ? A. Well, approved. Q. You mean that the finding of the physicians is approved ? A. Yes, sir ; you may take that as you choose; I will illustrate ! the facts ; the law provides that such certificates shall be made in all cases and that they shall be made after forms prescribed by the Commissioner in Lunacy, and blanks of the forms are filled out and the physicians give the facts, as required by the statute, in this cer- tificate, and swear to it, and they also declare under that oath the person who has authorized them as lunacy examiners ; then on the back of that the county judge says: " I approve the within certifi- cate," or something of that kind; some judges say one thing, some P another ; it is an approval by the county judge ; whatever the clause is it is an approval ; the law says "approval ;" some persons think with that carries with it— I have heard judges say they thought it carried it an approval of the actual certificate itself; others think it does not ; I have heard them say so. By Mr. Goodwin : Q. Have there not been patients brought to the Asylum on two bonds, and one is torn up or destroyed, or something of that kind? A. Sometimes they make a temporary agreement ou condition that as soon as they furnish another person in their place that that > shall be retumed to them. Q. Was that the case of Miss Lathrop? i A. No, sir; in the case of Miss Lathrop it was thus: her sister t visited the Asylum before hand ; I did not see her ; she was brought 1118 there by a doctor, and he had not the order with him ; he said she was to be received on the order of the county judge ; that steps had been taken to that end. He was informed that she could not be received except some person became responsible, and he became responsible temporarily by executing a bond on the agreement that when that order was furnished as agreed that he should not be further responsible; that is the whole of the case. It is true that persons come there without a 'single paper and a letter from a doctor, and sometimes from a lawyer saying simply, " these persons are en- tirely responsible." That is in reference to the security, and also to the commitment; in such cases either they can take them home, or they can get two physicians in Utica to examine the case before we do any thing in the matter, and then execute a bond for their support and care there, and take these papers home to the judge, and if they7 are not returned within five days as the law directs, they must remove them ; that is what we do in these cases. In the case of Miss Lathrop, I think one of the certificates was defective, and the person was, therefore, examined in Utica; I think one was de- fective ; often one is defective in haviug too long a date; it must be within the ten days within the time of admission. By Mr. Haskell : Q. Do you say the law says you're to receive any patient and wait five days for the certificate ? A. They may wait five days before the approval of the certificate by the county judge; the certificate must be made out and duly sworn to by a physician. Q. Yrou say Halpin was never employed as a private attendant in the institution — do you mean to say while he was an attendant there that he was never detailed to look after one patient par- ticularly ? fr&A. No, sir ; he never was ; and the case he refers to is an utter fabrication from beginning to end. By Mr. Olin : Q. How do you explain that ? Is he a lunatic ? A. I would not like to characterize him now. By Mr. Goodwin : Q. At page 27 of the printed testimony, you were asked whether you were aware that people outside said you were in the habit of making large sums for expert testimony ; liave you ever heard any thing of that kind ? A. I never heard any thing of that kind except from certain communications from Dr. Tourtellot, and I believe Dr. Wilbur; I have read statements, and Dr. Tourtelrot stated that before the " Woodin " committee, aud perhaps before the last committee ; they 1119 know nothing about my private affairs ; I do not know that I have spoken to them in ten years or more. Q. State to the committee, briefly, your views about expert testi- mony and what do you regard as expert testimony, testimony which vou have been summoned to give ? A. I regard what is technically called "expert testimony " as testi- mony as I stated the other day in that connection, where persons are called — where men are called to give an opinion upon a hypothesis, without their reading the testimony or hearing the case, simply the forming of a question which persons are called upon to answer before a court; medical testimony is where the person called is made familiar by reading testimony (jf it is in a will case) beforehand and by hearing the testimony if it is a case of a criminal, that it is taken before the court, and examining the criminal, or ex- amining the criminal alone, and giving opinion upon that — upon the examination. Q. Do you desire to say any thing more about the testimony at page thirty-two of the printed testimony, in regard'to the Yander- bilt case than what you have stated ?. A. I only want to say if I did not say it in that connection, that 1 occupied none of the public time no time in that caee ; I had some correspondence since in regard to the matter to refresh my own recollections about it; 1 read all the testimony, which was no small task, in the Yanderbilt will case, without getting a single hour or minute of the part of the day that I would give to the public service; I appeared four times on the stand and testified in regard to the case during part of the days that I was in New York lecturing; of course that part of the day I would simply have been doing | something else there. In regard to the case of Mr. B. I have also taken pains through others to ascertain, and I find that during the ! period of some months I was absent once two days, Saturday and Sunday, going down on Friday night and coming back on Sunday night; I was absent twice in that way and once three days, that was the whole time taken ; the rest of the work I did at nights in I that case. I was trying to think from inferences from the question, f where I had been in will cases, and I can only recollect one beyond those mentioned, some number of years ago at Bath, when I was | called by Judge Rumsey, I have not been in the habit of going to will cases, and am not willing to go for the main reason that if I had the time, if I could command the time, for the main reasonthatl am not willing to give an opinion on a hypothesis. I resolved a few , years ago that I would not do it, and I appealed to the court; and in ; regard^ to the two cases I stated, first of Mr. Smith, of Cattaraugus county, I understood they were to take very little of my time, that I would not be obliged to hear any testimony, but simply go there and answer the hvpotbesis ; I declined to do it, because I was not willing to put myself in a false position in which justice and the , profession would be misrepresented ; then an attachment was made as I before stated. 1120 Q. Have you been called upon privately for medical advice and by whom i A. I have by every class of people ; I have been called by govern- ors and senators, and- assemblymen, and congressmen and doctors, and lawyers and judges of the Court of Appeals, and Supreme Court, down to the humblest citizen. * * * * Q. Did you assume that you were right in giving this advice to persons to whom, you were requested to do ? A. I certainly did or I should not have done it, and I cannot but infer from the character of the persons calling on me for services, had they deemed it right; 1 have taken care as I stated before not to interfere with my official duties ; I view it largely at times a mat- ter of convenience with reference to my duties; sometimes, how- ever, I have instantly left my duties and gone on a case for instance, I will relate a case without its being taken down. * * * * Q. Have you been called upon to make examination and for affi- davits in reference to patients in the Asylum ? A. Yes, sir. Q. In lunacy commissions ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And in regard to pension certificates in case of death ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And for insurance policies ? A. Yes, sir ; a great many. Q. Have you ever charged any thing for these services ? A. No, sir; I never charged a patient for any service rendered directly or indirectly in any way whatever; that service is of course outside of my duties, but I have never been willing to receive any thing. Q. Have you ever left the Asylum for any length of time, with- out the knowledge or consent of the managers, or its president or executive committee ? A. I do not think I have ever been away two days in my life since I have been there, without their consent and knowledge, and in all other matters, if I wanted to go away for any recreation, as I did to Newport, I have always laid the matter before the board, and it has always been a matter of written permission. Q. Are you cognizant of the fact that protests against your £oinsr out on consultations have been sent to the bjard of man- agers ? A. Yes, sir, written protests by some doctors in Utica; Dr. Tour- tellot and two or three others. Q. What action, if any, was taken by the board to those protests? A. They showed them to me. Q. Did you ever receive any instructions? A. No, sir, no attention paid of any kind, they did not think such a thing was proper; as far as they said, I, myself, and they with me, understood what my duties were and what I should do. 1121 Q. Before commencing the Bellevue medical lectures, with whom did you consult ? A. Before I laid the matter before the board of managers, I con- sulted some prominent medical gentlemen, and I consulted Judge W. F. Allen. Q." What was his then position ? A. He was judge of the Court of Appeals ; and several others — and they all advised me to do it; I also consulted Judge Johnson, Mr. Kiernan, Judge Church, and then I brought it after that — I brought the matter to the attention of the board of managers and asked them what to do. Q. And those resolutions are in evidence? A. Yres, sir. Dr. Gray — I want to make one further statement; I was asked whether I received compensation for lectures at Bellevue; I don't know ; I did for some time; I then made up my mind that I would > rather deliver the lectures when I could make it convenient to do it gratuitously, than to take a period of time when I might not be able to devote my time for remuneration. , Q. The case 01 H. C, what was the agreement; was there any agreement made between her or her friends by which she was to be charged one price and she paid another ? A. No, sir; no such thing has ever occurred in the history of the . institution in that case or any other. Q. Did you in the thirty-fourth annual report of the mana- gers state to them your views fully upon the question of " occupa- tion for patients in the Asylum ? " A. I did. Q. And is that embraced on pages 53 to 67 of that report ? A. It is. (Part of the report referred to is offered in evidence and admit- ted, and marked " Exhibit No. 37, J. H. M." See Appendix.) Q. Did you in the same report give your views in regard to im- provements, repairs and temperature of the wards ? A. I did ; it is contained from pages fi7 to 7 L of the same report. (See Exhibit No. 37 in Appendix.) Q. Did you in the thirty-sixth annual report of the managers present a detailed statement, furnished by you at the request of the British government, concerning the appliances and methods of heating aud ventilation of the Utica Asylum? A. I did ; it is on pages 10 to 17 of that report. (Extract from report offered in evidence and admitted ; marked "Exhibit No. 3S,*J. II. M." See Appendix.) Q. In the same report, did you present an abstract prepared by you of the laws of the State of New York in regard to tht com- mitment of insane to asylums, their detention and discharge, and a j comparison of the same'with the statutory provisions of England ? 141 U 1122 A. I did; pages^fil to 77. (Offered in evidence and admitted, and marked " Exhibit No. 39, J. H.M." See Appendix.) Q. Did you in *the thirty-seventh annual report of the mana- gers give y7our views on improvements and organization in the Asy- lum ? A. I did ; pages 17 to 23. (Offered in evidence, admitted*, and marked " Exhibit No. 40, J. H. M." See appendix.) Q. Did you in the same report present your viewrs on the " pro- gress of treatment ? " A. I did ; on pages 34 to 42. (Offered in evidence aud admitted; marked " Exhibit No. 41. J. H. M." See Appendix.) Q. Did you in the thirty-eighth annual report of the mana- gersrpresent your views in regard to custody and treatment? A. Y^es, sir, I did; on pages 43 to 65 of that report. (Offered in evidence, admitted, and marked "Exhibit No. 42, J. H. M." See Appendix.) Q In the fortieth annual report of the managers, have you given your views on commitment, detention and discharge of pa- tients ? A. I have; on pages 50 to (..9 of that report. (Offered in evidence, admitted, ard marked " Exhibit No. 43, J. H. M." See Appendix.) * Mr. Goodwin — I offer these papers in evidence as exhibits giv- ing the views and opinions of- the superintendent as to the care, custody and treatment of the insane as practiced in the Utica Asy- lum. The Chairman — They are admitted. Mr. Goodwin — I desire to say that I regard those exhibits as the most important testimony presented by the Asylum authorities. By Mr. Morgan : Q. There are four horses used on the farm, are there not ? A. There must be more than four on the farm, but whatever the steward testified is correct. Q. And there is a yoke of cattle ? A. Yes, sir; whatever he testified to in that respect is correct. Q. There are seven carriage horses kept, are there not ? A. No, sir; only four. Q. How many horses are there in all? A. Four carriage horses ; one steward's horse ; four on the farm, 1123 that is nine, and the two team horses ; making eleven in all; some- times we have one yoke of cattle, sometimes two. Q. But there are not but four horses and two teams that are kept for farm purposes ? A. Only those four on the farm. Q. Is it necessary to have seven horses for the use of the Asylum, outside of the four farm horses? A. Yes, sir, it is necessary to have the other horses for the pur- , pose of doing the work; there is the work on the lawn, mowing the lawn, carrying away the rubbish — carrying out swill ; working in the garden, and for all those purposes; I do not think the service would be efficient with less. Q. Is there a large bay horse that is kept in a box stall, a valuable horse, that is not used ? A. No, sir. Q. Is there such a horse kept in a box-stall ? A. I do not recollect any horse ; I know we have a box-stall, but what horse anybody saw there, I don't know; I don't know of any such horse myself. - Q. 1 understood that there was a large bay horse in the box-stall that was not used of any account ? A. 1 don't know of any such horse as that. Q. You say the seven horses outside of the four farm horses are x necessary ? A. Yes, sir ; they are necessary for the services of the establish- ment; they are necessary in the care of the institution and grounds; there is a great deal to do, work which cannot be done without horses. By Mr. Haskell : Q. Did you prepare the paper I spoke about showing your ab sences from the institution ? A. No, sir, I could not prepare any such paper as that; I have stated all about my absences; and I have said two or three times that I never at any time left the institution except the instances I have mentioned; I have neglected no duty, either in seeing private pa- tients or any other purpose, except when I have been called by some court on an order that I could not disregard. In regard to my going to Newport, I looked that up from my bills, that has varied from two weeks to the longest period thirty-six days. Q. That is your annual absences to Newport ? A. Yes, sir; well, when I have gone, I have not gone there an- s nually, and none of those absences have been made without the permission of the board. ! Q. Has your attention been called to the evidence of Deputy Comptroller Benedict in regard to the matter of interest on de- posits ? A. No, sir. Q. On the daily balances of the Asylum funds ? 1124 A. No, sir, I would not really know any thing about that; I don't know any thing about the finances of the institution, they are neither under my direction nor care; I have never seen the treas- urer's books in my7 life; I would no more think of going to ask to see them, than I would of going to the Comptroller's office and asking to see the books tliere. Q. Aud you do not know as to the matter of balances at the bank \ A. I know the steward has informed me at times that there was no money in the treasury, and that we have had to postpone the payment of bills, sometimes a month, sometimes longer, after they were due. By Mr. Morgan : Q. Does the bank where you keep your deposits allow you to overdraw ? A. Yes, I understand so; I don't know it personally; but I understand that was the arrangement. By Mr. Haskell : Q. And you do not know what the daily average balances would be? A. No, sir, I do not know any thing at all about that. EDGAR K. APGAR, Sworn and examined, testified as follows: Note.—The testimony of Mr. Apgar, being in the nature of a reply to Dr. Gray's analysis of the "Apgar Report," will be found following said analysis, which is Exhibit No. 35, and appears at the close of the testimony in this volume. The Chairman—This is to be our last meeting; is there any thing further you have to bring up, Mr. Goodwin ? Mr. Goodwin—I understood the committee, at some previous ses- sion, to rule that if the article in the "Albany Evening Journal," written by Mr. White, was not put in evidence, that the whole of Mr. White's testimony upon it should be stricken from the record; we do not deem it of sufficient importance to put the article in, and we consent that the testimony of Mr. White may be stricken out. The Chairman The chair states that the testimony relating to that matter will be stricken out. Mr. Goodwin—I regard the exhibits put in evidence the last three days as the most important evidence submitted by the managers of the Asylum, and it is evidence, in my judgment, that it will be neces- sary for the committee to give careful consideration before any 1125 report is made; I therefore ask that sufficient time be given for the printing of all of the evidence, including exhibits, and that I may have twenty-four or forty-eight hours after I have received the final testi- mony to put in the brief suggested by the Chairman. The Chairman — The chair will see that arrangement is made to have the earliest copies sent to Mr. Goodwin, of the first printed testimony, and that he shall have the time requested to furnish the brief, viz. : forty-eight hours ; probably you shall have more, because when we get the testimony, I shall have to make a skeleton report, and we shall have to submit it to the committee, and the committee will have to consider it, and that will take probably a whole week, so that you will have time to file a supplemental brief if you desire ; but we shall hold you to the forty-eight hours on your first brief. You will have time, before the report is made up, to file any sup- plemental brief you desire to. The committee then adjourned subject to the call of the Chairman. Dr. Gray's Analysis of Mr. Apgar's Report. Exhibit 35. In his annual message to the Legislature, the Governor in speak ing of the State charitable institutions refers to information obtained from a report made six years ago by F. P. Olcott, Comp- troller of the State; the criticisms of the Governor would seem to be based mainly upon this report. This report of the Comptroller consists of a communication to the State Senate, dated April 9, 1879, in his own name, accompanied by one from Edgar K. Apgar, who was the agent of the Comptroller in examining these institutions. The Comptroller states: " The elaborate tables in the appendix have been prepared with great care, and they prove their usefulness by demonstrating the need of establishing a responsible supervision over the charities maintained by the State * * The text of the report, in a measure, presents an analysis of its tables, and various instructive comparisons are made between the institutions of our State and those of other states and countries." Just how elaborate tables which consist simply of the classification of the expenditures from the annual reports of managers of institu- tions in and out of the State of New York, made from time to time to Legislatures, can demonstrate the need of further responsible supervision, the Comptroller does not state. The institutions have long been, and were then, under the " responsible supervision " of - boards of managers, nominated by the Governor and appointed by the Senate under statutory provisions. L> 1126 The agent of the Comptroller declares that these managers are responsible men and says: " Comparatively few people, outside of those brought into direct contact with them, appreciate the magni- tude of the charities of our State. It is far from my purpose to withhold the praise due to those who manage them. One cannot spend much time in looking into the subject without being deeply impressed by the sacrifices made by so many noble men and women, in a work, the only reward of which is the consciousness of doing good. Many of the managers of our State institutions give much valuable time, and the most careful attention to the duties which are not only self-imposed and without reward, but which, though fully as useful, do not confer any special distinction as is the case in the faithful performance of another kind of public work. Thesuper- intendents and officers generally of the charitable institutions of the State accept onerous responsibilities and the hardest kind of work for small compensation. They are mostly men and women who have consecrated their lives to the service in which they are en- gaged ; and I am persuaded that in almost every case they are un- selfishly devoted to a work, than which surely none can be nobler or more useful. I believe that no class of public servants are more conscientious. If they have allowed in some cases the expenditures of their institutions to increase unduly, they have only fallen into a habit of the times ; they are not singular." The agent of the Comptroller, as the result of his investigations, states: "I am glad to believe there is no reason for thinking that dishonesty or intentional wrong-doing exists in connection with the business administration of any of the State institutions I have been called^ upon to examine." The statutes place the asylums for the insane under these boards of managers, who are charged with the control of all the property and interests connected with such institutions, and with the duty of forming such by-laws and regulations for their general business management and internal government, and prescribing the duties of the officers and attendants in the immediate care of the inmates They are to hold all lands, donations, moneys in trust, and maintain an effective inspection of the institutions by personal visitation, and in all ways to supervise, control and manage them for the sole inter- ests of the public and benefit of the insane. Under the statute adopted in 1842, in the State of New York, when the institution at Utica was organized (and every other insti- tution is organized under the same law, in this State;, each institu- tion is governed by such a board of managers, which board is charged with the responsibility of reporting to the Legislature di- rectly each year, the operations *of the institution, its condition, and its receipts and expenditures, together with such recommenda- tions as may seem to them necessary for the public good. The agent evidently has given but little attention to the statute organizing the asylums and the respective duties of the managers 1127 and superintendent and confounds these duties through his entire report. The report contains inaccuracies and misleading statements ; not- withstanding what he says of the managers and officers as to charac- ter and integrity, he states that he had consumed a great deal of time endeavoring to analyze figures contained in annual reports "to make them agree with themselves, or with the known facts accessi- ble at the Comptroller's office, or elsewhere, only to find at last that it was impossible to produce such agreement, and that the report under consideration was, from one cause or another, misleading in- stead of contributing to an understanding of its subject-matter," and adds: " It is not a necessary inference that there existed an inten- tion to mislead ; the trouble is as likely to have been that the per- son making the report or furni.-hing the figures failed to bear in mind the object of publishing ihem ; yet it may be that in some cases a desire to avoid an appearance of extravagance has led to sivh a purposed arrangement of figures as should not enable the general reader to gain a knowledge of the subject." Just here, in connection with these statements of possible manipu- lation of figures by boards of managers to. conceal their real intent, the agent in his report is himself an illustration ; for instance, he says: " The cost of fuel and light at the Utica Asylum in 1878 was $20.47per capita; at Northampton. $7-71 per capital He would permit the inference to be drawn from this that North- ampton in 1878 was actually formed and lighted at the cost of $7.71 t per capita ; the annual report of the treasurer of the Northampton | institution having put down $2,281.31 as a disbursement for fuel in 1 1878, the agent would make the misleading statement that this was the whole cost of fuel in that institution for that year, that he might draw an unfavoiable comparison with Utica. The report of the 1 treasurer of the Northampton Asylum for 1877 gives the cost of \ fuel, $7,936.34 ; for 1876, $4,774.65 ; for 1875, $8,355.53 ; for 1874, - $8,325.80 ; for 1873, $9,397.49. . We quote these figures to show the unfairness of such a statement , and the insincerity or incompetency that should lead to such a state- ment and comparison. The agent makes the extraordinary statement that an under- standing exists with the business houses of Utica to furnish the Asylum with supplies at'an advance of five per cent upon the cost; there is no truth in this, and had the agent consulted any of the manager.: or any of the business houses dealing with the Asylum, he 'would not have made such a statement; the only shadow of truth for such a statement was that the managers con- tracted, after having received bids on sealed proposals of certain i groceries in bulk, at five per cent on the wholesale prices as con- tained in the original invoices, which five per cent included boxing, cartage, freight, etc. The main supplies in the Utica Asylum are ; obtained at first hands as largely as possible; cattle, sheep, etc., are bought directly from the farmers and slaughtered on the prem- 1128 ises ; eggs, butter, poultry, etc., are bought directly from the farmers also; cotton and other goods directly from the manufacturers or their agents, and other supplies are bought either in Utica, Albany, New York, Buffalo, Boston, Philadelphia, wherever the articles can be obtained with the best economy. A large part of the report of the agent is taken up with a com- parison 'with the Utica Asylum with the Northampton institution. I have carefully examined into that part of his report. Of Utica he says: " In the case of the New York State Lunatic Asylum, at Utica, the tables contain its full and detailed financial history since 1850, and a synopsis of its financial relations with the State 6ince its foundation. These tables contain also, for all these years, a com- plete classification of the expenditures, so that at a glance may be seen the cost in detail for the support of the inmates of the various institutions and comparision may be easily iiibtituted between differ- ent institutions and different years of the same institution. The division into which the expenditures have been made are clas&ified as follows : " Salaries and wages, provisions and supplies, clothing, medical stores, fuel and light, ordinary repairs, all other expenses. We are glad to note that the agent declares the figures of the Utica Asylum to be "a complete classification of the expenditures." All the statistics contained in the report of Mr. E. K. Apgar, the agent of the Comptroller at that time, it is just to say, were pre- pared in the Asylum, cither by7 myself or under my immediate direc- tion, and in every instance they were compared by me with the original records, either in the Asylum or at Albany. These are : Table four, giving a detailed statement of expenditures of the State Lunatic Asylum from 1850 to 1878 inclusive ; table five, detailed statement of receipts from 1800tolS78, inclusive; table six, tabular statement of expenditures and legislative appropriations for buildings, furnishing, etc., from 1839 to 1857, inclusive ; table seven, statement of expenditures and legislative appropriations for water supply7 from 1843 to 1873, inclusive ; table eight, statement of enpenditures and legislative appropriations for land, improvemei.t of grounds, sewers, fences, farm buildings, city assessments for paving and grading, 1836 to 1^78, inclusive. These were all furnished by me, while table ten, showing the amount received from counties for patients for 1878, and table eleven, showing the amounts received for private patients during the year 1878, were furnished by the treasurer of the Utica Asylum. As we have before stated, the agent, in his report, selects the in- stitution at Northampton, Massachusetts, which he personally vis- ited, for comparison with Utica; he visited no other institutions out of the State; therefore, the reports from other institutions out of the State contained in the tabulations were not in any wise known to him; it is only fair, therefore, to confine myself wholly to the figures and statements contained in the report of Dr. Earle, the su- perintendent and treasurer of the Northampton Asylum and the 1129 other officers of that institution, and those given by the managers and treasurer of the Utica Asylum. Mr. Apgar starts with the proposition that the institution at Northampton and that at Utica are of similar character; this is an error ; they are not of the same character; the institution at North- ampton is largely an asylum for chronic insane, that at Utica is an hospital for acute insane ; evidently the agent did not give that at- tention to the character, thistory, statistics and expenditures of the institution at Northampton that he has to the character, history, statistics and expenditures of the institution at Utica. Since the establishment of the Willard Asylum in 1863, for the care of the chronic insane, the Asylum at Utica has become more conspicuously than before an hospital for acute cases, the most troublesome and expensive and difficult to care for; it is known, on the contrary and set forth in the reports of the institution at Northampton, that that Asylum has long been a receptacle for chronic insane. In his first annual report of the Northampton Asylum, in 1864, Dr. Earle, its superintendent, states that a very large majority of the patients there were cases of chronic insanity, many of them having been inmates of the State hospitals, and transferred as in- curable to Northampton, and adds: " Of the 334 patients remain- ing this day (end of the fiscal year) in the hospital not one in ten presents any reasonable probability of recovery." In his report for 1865, he says of the institution: "It has con- stantly been made the receptacle of the incurables of the other two hospitals," and further states that of the 134 admitted during the year, "the disease of only thirty-four was of less duration than one year; in all the rest it had passed into a chronic stage." In his report for 1866, he says: "A very large proportion of those who were admitted from the general population are incura bles, while those who are transferred from other State institutions are almost wholly so." In his report for 1S69, Dr. Earle states: "This hospital, as is well known, being the last erected, and being situated in the least populous section of the State, has always hitherto been the re- ceptacle for many of the chronic, incurable cases of the other and smaller hospitals in the Commonwealth." In 1870, Dr. Earle makes a similar statement as to the chronic character of the inmates. In 1874, Dr. Earle says: " Not nine-tenths alone, but nearly nine- teen-twentieths of the patients here are incurable." In the report of Dr. Earle, for 1877, he states that only 139 patients were admitted during the year (against 435 patients ad- mitted at Utica), and of those admitted at Northampton the report show that fifty nine were transferred from the Worcester and Taunton Asvlums, the State alms-houses and the State workhouse, and that of" the remaining eighty admitted that year from the 142 U 1130 general population "not more than one in five," according to Dr. arle, "are apparently curable." In the report of Dr. Earle, for 1878, it is stated that only seventy- eight patients were admitted during the year, against 427 in the Utica Asylum ; only twenty-six recoveries are reported at the North- ampton Asylum, against 144 recoveries at Utica. It is submitted that the statements taken from the reports of Dr. Earle himself show conclusively that the Northampton Hospital is almost wholly a chronic institution, and that there was no justifica- tion for the agent of the Comptroller to run a parallel between that asylum and the Utica Hospital, either in the matter of expenditures or responsibility. The agent himself admits, as any reasonable man must, that much more is lequired in an hospital for acute cases than for the custody of the chronic insane. The agent states: "The Willard Asylum has not been included in the following condensed statements for the reason hereafter stated, that it is intended only to receive only the chronic insane, and that a comparison of its expenditures with those institutions receiving acute cases would not be fair to the latter." The conclusion is irresistible that the agent of the Comptroller had not read and investigated the character of the Northampton in- stitution, although he visited it, as he ought to have done, if he desired to compare it with an institution in the State of New York tor public purposes. The agent has thus selected a semi-chronic institution out of the State to compare expenditures with the Utica Asylum, which he admits is an hospital for acute cases. The amount received per week for board and care of patients at public charge at that time at the Utica Asylum was (and is now; four dollars per week. At the Willard Asylum for the Chronic Insane it was $2.60 per week, while at the Northampton institution, a semi-chronic asylum, it was $3.50 per week. If \\\eper capita cost of the patients at public charge at Utica and Willard are taken together as representing both acute and chronic, the weekly cost would be $3.30 per week for each patient, which would bring them below the charge for public pa- tients at Northampton in the sum of twenty cents per week. Pages 39, 40 and 41 of Mr. Apgar's report are largely taken up with an actual quotation from the report of Dr. Earle, and yet no excerpts are taken where reference is made to its being so largely a chronic asylum. The agent quotes from the report of Dr. Earle as follows: "The amount paid by the hospital for repairs and improvements in the course of the thirteen years from September 30, 1865, to September 30, 1878, is $156,701.31;" quoting also from the report the over- surplus, cash, supplies on hand, increase of provisions, furniture, etc. Then the agent adds : 'J Let us contrast this with the financial results in the Asylum at Utica for the same period. "It appears from the report of the superintendent of the Utica 1131 Asylum, that for the year ending November 30, 1878, there was received from sundry counties for patients' board, clothing and mis- cellaneous expenses the sum of $101,946.51; from sundry private patients, $54,805.57, making a total of $156,752.08, received from counties and private patients. Dividing this sum by 600, the aver- age number of patients for the year, we find that the average amount received for each patient was $261.25, or a trifle over five dollars per week, as against three dollars seventy-eight cents and eight mills at Northampton." The agent also reports that for the same years at Utica, "For additions, alterations and repairs" there was expended $384,886.71. The agent does not take the pains to state, what the managers have fully set forth in their reports to the Legislature, that is, that this money was expended for renewal, and r arrangement, and en- largement of an old building, which had been made by these addi- tions and modifications to accommodate 175 more patients, and to abandon at the same time forty rooms in the basement. The agent also fails to state in this connection, that the Asylum at Utica has paid out for current repairs, farm buildings, land, etc., from the receipts of board of patients, etc., the sum of $104,271.81. The agent makes no reference to the report of the treasurer and no reference to the fact that at Utica the finances are entirely in the care of the treasurer; that the superintendent never either receives or disburses moneys; that the treasurer is not an appointee of the superintendent; that he is appointed by the managers; that he is required to give bonds and to deposit all moneys in a bank approved by the Comptroller of the State as treasurer of the Asylum. A point was attempted to be made that the superintendent of Utica Asylum was its financial officer, as stated above; " it appears from the report of the superintendent of the Utica Asylum, that for the year ending November," etc., making the misleading statement that the report of the superintendent actually contained and discussed the financial matters of the institution, whereas, the report of the superintendent of the Utica Asylum does not contain one sentence or word in regard to finances or expenditures. This is grossly misleading, and with the knowledge that the agent must have had, first from the fact that he visited the Utica Asylum, conversed with the superintendent upon these very points, visited the treasurer's office in the city of Utica, examined his accounts, and further, that he had the reports of the managers, treasurer and superintendent before him, is unpardonable in such an official document intending to go to the public. The whole tendency of such misrepresentation is to cast unjust suspicion upon the institutions of the State and those placed in charge of them. How about the Northampton Asylum ? The agent does not state the fact appearing in every one of the reports of the superintendent of the Northampton Asylum and in the verv one for 1878, from which he so largely quotes, that the 1132 superintendent of that institution, Dr. Earle, is the treasurer of that asylum and receives and disburses all the moneys, and that the bills are not audited before payment. On page 10 of the report of the Northampton Asylum, after the report of the treasurer we read : " We have attended to the duty of our appointment as auditors of the accounts of the hospital and have found the entries sustained by proper vouchers. ADAMS C. DEAN. SILAS C. SMITH." The agent omits to state that the actual cost is to the public at Utica for the support of the dependent classes, the only fair method in which any true and straightforward statement could be made in such an investigation. His report shows, what is true, that at Utica, there are private patients paying larger sums thau are paid by the same class at Northampton, for the agent does not array the private patients and the per weekly charge of the Northampton Asylum, which would be the only way to make any true parallel. However, in all this the agent might justly have summed up the whole financial contrast between Northampton and Utica in these regards in a few sentences, viz.: 1. At Utica the charge per week for all patients at public charge for board, care, washing, compensation of attendants, chaplain, apothecary, book-keeper, engineer, fuel, lights, wages of all laborers in the buildings, on the grounds and farm, and also the ordinary wear and tear of buildings aud materials, is four dollars per weelf. The charge at Northampton for patients at public charges for the same items is $3.50 per week; that the charges for private patients at Utica are from six dollars upwards per week (a few lower than this), according to the circumstances and requirements of the case; at Northampton, in the report quoted by the agent, Dr. Earle states: " For private patients there is no uniform price." The agent gives two pages of his report to the discussion of gas, apparently to show that the managers of the Utica Asylum were not as well posted on gas as they were at Northampton, Massachu- setts and other .places; he states that after the expiration of a cer- tain contract mentioned in the managers' report for 1860, " the managers had not received a sufficient reduction," and, to use the words of the agent, " when I came to inquire into this subject I found that the institution was paying $2.50 cash per thousand for gas, which was precisely the sum paid by the smallest general con- sumer in Utica, which was twenty-five per thousand, more than the amount paid by the hotels." Had he given sufficient attention to have made inquiry upon this point, either of the managers or at the gas works he would have learned that the concessions on gas during the twelve years to the Utica Asylum below the prices paid by ordinary consumers and hotels, amounted to $12,446.66, and he would not have been led to an absolute misstatement by saying that the hotels were only paying 1133 $2.25, when they were paying precisely the sum paid by the Asylum on the gas question, " the loose and somewhat careless method o business " would rather apply to the agent of the Comptroller than to the managers ; Dr. Earie states that he secures gas from the city works at $3.50 per thousand feet. As a further illustration of the accuracy of these statistics of the agent, he gives a table of the annu.il cost per capita of fuel and light in twenty institutions, and draws the conclusion that the three asylums for acute insane in this State " occupy the highest places in the scale of expenditure of the States;" in this table Northampton is put down at $19.01, Utica, $22.03 ; take out the cost of gas in North- ampton in 1877 from fuel, $2.17per capitaiox that year, and it leaves the Northampton institution as costing for heating or fuel $16.84:per capita / take out the^r* capita cost for gas at Utica that year, $5.26, and it would leave, according to the figures of the agent's table, the heating at Utica to cost $16.83 ; inasmuch as the agent makes an error in computation amounting to nineteen cents per capita at Utica on heating, it would leave twenty cents less per capita, or $16.64, at Utica against $16.84 at Northampton ; the error which the agent makes in his figures would represent Utica as expending $1.15 more than the real expenditure represented; more than this, the average outside temperature at Northanipton that year was six de- grees higher than that at Utica ; taking the rate of coal combustion as authorities would have shown him, and as kept by the engineer at Utica, would give in favor of Utica 180 tons of coal; in other words, if Utica had only had the average temperature at Northampton, she would have used 180 tons of coal less, and this would have reduced the per capita of heating still further below the Northampton insti- tution. We do not deem it worth while to go through the whole of this table of the agent, with the extremes of temperature like Oshkosh, Wisconsin, St. Peter, Minnesota, Jackson, Mississippi, and Catons- ville, Maryland, where no reference is made to the necessary data of temperature. It is interesting, however, to see that at Catonsville, Maryland, the agent makes the per capita for fuel and light $36.63 as against $26.46 at Oshkosh, Wisconsin. Which is gas and which is warmth in the latter institution. In respect of accounts and accounting the agent says : " It is not too much to say that the reports of none of the institutions are entirely satisfactory in this respect. A few are carefully prepared and only tall a little short of being all that is desired. Some are carelessly compiled and contain little of the information needed, while others are so meager and so blind as to convey to the general reader, at least, no accurate information of the financial records of the institution they referred to." He does not indicate, however, what institutions are defective and what ones " fall a little short of being all that could be desired." The statement of the agent of the Comptroller touching the mat- ter of clearness and uniformity of accounts would lead one to sup- 1134 pose that the institution at Northampton, Massachusetts, which he has selected as a business model, does furnish such clear statements as the agent would advise. An examination of the reports of that institution shows less detail in the presentation of accounts than is shown by the reports of the State Lunatic Asylum at Utica, both in the manager's and treasurer's report. I name Utica, not because other institutions are not as clear in their accounts, but because the agent has seen fit to run a parallel between the Utica Asylum and the Northampton institution, the latter being neither accessible to the Legislature or the people, except through the eyes and figures of the agent of the Comptroller. In this connection the agent states.: " It may be that in some cases a desire to avoid an appearance of extravagance has led to such a purposed arrangement of figures as should not enable the general reader to gain a knowledge of the subject." This is a grave accusation. This charge would seem, however, to be a mere " may be," a ghost of suspicion which can only come from rumor or from the inner consciousness of the agent. Certainly he gives no facts in his report on which to predicate such an accusa- tion. He presents no evidence or statement in the report that he was in correspondence with the board of managers touching any matters of accounts, expenditures or any7 thing else. Indeed the report in the main would convey the impression that there were no responsible managers connected with any7 of the institutions in the State of New Y'ork. The agent of the Comptroller has found in the State, however, an institution which is satisfactory. He says: " It is agreeable to turn to an institution whose showing of expenditures, as compared with former years, may be said to be entirely satisfactory." This is the Idiot Asylum at Syracuse. He begins at the year 1860, instead of at the origin of the in- stitution, as at Utica. The agent's report shows that in 1860, there were 140 idiot children there; that the per capita cost of their care was $1S6.83 or $3.75 per week, and he puts dowu repairs as $5.64 per capita per year, making a total for repairs of $780.60. Thus the cost for board, care, etc., of idiot children at that time was seventy-five cents per week more than was received at that time for the care of county patients in that year, and seventy-five cents per week more than was received for county patients at the Utica Asylnm for four years afterward. By turning to the supply bill of 1860, we find this item: "To the New York Idiot Asylum for deficiency on account of current expenditures, the sum of $5,500. The agent states that if he were to compare the financial results of 1860 with those of 1865, it would be unduly favorable to the Idiot Asylum. Turning to the supply bill for 1865 we find: "For the Idiot Asylum to meet a deficiency in annual expenditures, $6,o00." The whole financial accounts of that institution, however, as given 1135 by the agent, is so muddled in his report that it is difficult to see what he is aiming at, but it does not contain references to the supply bill which we have indicated nor references to further sup- ply bills. The supply biil of 1866 has " For tbe State Asylum for Idiots at Syracuse, $6,000." In 1^67 : " For the State Asylum for Idiots for the deficiency in the last fiscal year and to prevent deficiency for . the present fiscal year $8,000." In 1868 : "For the State Asylum for Idiots for the deficiency in the last fiscal year and to prevent deficiency in the present fiscal year, $4,000." Neither has the agent stated that the Idiot Asylum is represented in the various supply bills down to 1877 to the aggregate $168,000, and this is a school for idiot children. These facts would show either that the inquiries made in connec- tion with that institution were superficial, or that there was such a "purposed arrangement of figures, as should not enable the general reader to get a fair knowledge of the subject." He says this is " an institution where the showing of expenditures is entirely satisfactory." In following the hiatus from 1S65 to 1878—- which we are aide to do through the reports of the State Board of Charities — we find the following facts in regard to the Idiot Asylum : Eighteen hundred and sixty-six, for support, $1.15 per week; 1867, $4.25 per week; 1868, $4.25 per week ; 1869, for each pupil and an additional appro- priation to make up deficiency of $11,000, $278.57 per capita, or $5.35 per week for each child ; 1870, for support, for board and care outside of clothing and repairs, $3.94 per week; 1871, ditto, $4 per week; 1872, ditto, $4 per week; 1873, ditto, $3.92 per week; 1874, ditto, $4.25 per week ; 1875, ditto, $3.91; 1876, ditto, ; $3.89. ' The agent does not refer to the important fact in connection with the financial affairs of the idiot school that there is a summer vaca- | tion, in which a large proportion — if not most of them —are away [ at their homes. This ought to be considered in calculating pro rata. Such an exhibit would seem to lay at the agent's door the charge that he would seek to put upon others the arrangement of figures so as to conceal their real intent. It often happens that what is not said is quite as important in illustrating truth as what is said. I The agent closes the parallel between Dr. Earle, of the North- [ ampton (Massachusetts) institution — who, as we have said, is both j the superintendent and treasurer — and Dr. Cray, the superintendent at Utica. Of Dr. Earle he says: " His long experience and his natu- ■ ral capacity for work have enabled him to make the Northampton Hospital a model institution." Of Dr. Gray he says : " Dr. Gray is widely and justly celebrated for his skill as a medical superintend- ent, and for the organization and discipline which he has developed in the institution over which he presides. It is hardly to be expected that the medical superintendent in an institution with six hundred inmates, charged with the duties that belong to his position, can at I i I 1136 the same time bring to its business administration the qualities and the close attention which are requisite to secure the most economical results consistent with'the proper maintenance of a proper standard of care. It is phenomenal when in the same individual are united in the highest degree the capacity for medical superintendence and business administration." As to the question of any non-professional controlling agent in an hospital with reference to furnishing supplies " of a uniform grade," it could not be done with justice to the sick. The furnishing of a uniform diet might answer well enough for prisons, among criminals who are in good health, but it could not apply to an hospital for the sick. Neither should any n on-professional man be authorized to judge of either the quality or the quantity of food, diet or medicines that should be furnished for the sick in a hospital or insane hospital. Such matters must necessarily be under the direction of a physician, and a physician alone can judge of the needs of a patient. As an illustration of the danger that any7 such policy or system would work we have only to turn to the report of Mr. Apgar, a man who simply visits the several asylums of the State, talks with their officers, spends a day at Northampton, an asylum out of the State, and sets himself up°as an authority on the'subject of diet. From the annual report of each of these institutions he finds figures which show that less money is expended at Northampton for the cost of provisions than at Utica. He knows nothing about the patients at either place, or what they require. What is his utterance ? Of Northampton he says : "In respect of diet I am inclined to believe that in quantity and quality it is equal to Utica. If it is not, I am very confident in saying that the excess at Utica is unnecessary and does not add to its curative results." This needs no comment. In respect of expenditures for attendants and nurses in the two institutions he finds in the treasurer's report of the Utica Asylum a larger sum in proportion to the number of patients than in the treasurer's report of the asylum at Northampton. What is his com- ment? "It ought not to cost as much as four thousand dollars a year, or less than ten dollars per capita, to give Northampton a sufficient additional number of attendants to meet the only possible criticism to be made upon its administration." What are the facts ? At Northampton, in the report to which he refers, the number of attendants are given and shows that in that institution there was one attendant to every eighteen (?) patients, while at Utica there was one attendant to every seven patients. Woe betide the institutions and the insane of the State if they ever should come into such hands ! Such utterances in a public docu- ment which is intended to enlighten the people in regard to asylums and their wants can only breed distrust in the public mind. The late Governor Butler of Massachusetts, in his message to the Massachusetts Legislature January 4, 1883, states: "I would recommend that a purchasing officer for all State supplies of 1137 every name be appointed, with a salary sufficient to insure the services of a competent business man, to be commissioned by7 the executive for three years unless sooner removed for cause, to give adequate bond, with sureties for the faithful performance of the duties of his office, who should be charged with the making of all purchases of supplies of every kind now bought, or to be bought and paid for by the State." He would be " Doctor " Butler also and make a classification by "putting together those in one institution who give hopes of re- covery, in another those who are violent and need physical restraint, and in still another those afflicted with dementia or imbecility, who are harmless and need no restraint, but care only," what insane per- son needs " care only," and he proceeds : " this can be done effi- ciently only by consolidating all the hospitals under the charge of some one responsible head, of sufficient executive ability and scien- tific skill, who can, having full control, make this classification and separation which, because of our system of separate boards of trust- ees and separate government, cannot now be done ;" who but Butler could be so wise and able ? Further he would recommend the Swiss system (sic) "of families in cottages, for the harmless and quiet, which may be cheaply con- [ structed. A family of harmless chronic insane, for whom no phy- sician is needed, could be taken care of by a single man and woman, and the cottages being contiguous, tbey may have a common din- ing-room for all;" Swiss system is news ; where is it located? EDGAR K. APGAR, Treasurer of the State of New York, sworn, testified as follows : Mr. Chairman, I want to say first that about half an hour since, on going to my office from my room, where I had been detained by illness, I found this somewhat voluminous statement (Exhibit No. 35) with a note from your stenographer, saying that it was pro- posed to embody this document in "the report of the committee, as an exhibit, and that if I wished to say any thing in reply to it, I must appear before the committee do-day, as this was to be the last ■ meeting. It w7ill readily be understood that inasmuch as this re- port was made five year's ago, and that other duties of an entirely different character have occupied my attention, the whole subject ■ has passed out of my mind during that time, and I am laboring under a very serious disadvantage and embarrassment in endeavor- ing to meet, as it ought to be met, this criticism of my report which has only been in my hands about half an hour; not long enough to even read it through with care. „ The Chairman — If, from the hasty inspection you have made of it, you think it requires any serious answer, the committee will be 143 U 1138 glad to give you a hearing some afternoon next week, and will have the counsel for the Asylum present; that will give you time to look it over, unless you prefer to make an answer to it now. Mr. Apgar — I will hastily go through the report now and point ont what has struck me as calling for some reply; with the qualifi- cation I have made, I am willing to go on now. I will state in the first instance, that notwithstanding any statement made in this criticism, I stand by every statement and every figure contained in this report, and assert its absolute accuracy; (referring to the " Apgar" report,'so-called, transmitted to the Legislature April 9, 1879, Senate document 67.) The body of my report was transmitted to the Legislature April 9, 1879 ; as to this particular edition of the report I will not say that there may not be certain typographical errors ; it is a reprint of the original, but the original report I carefully compared myself, and know it to be correct; I entered upon the discharge of the du- ties assigned to me entirely without prejudice for or against any in- stitution of the State ; I carefully collected all the information ac- eessihle which I thought had a bearing upon the subject I wasabout to investigate ; I visited the several institutions, and icmained at each one as long as it seemed to me necessary to gain the infonna tion requisite to make a proper report, and as I have said, without any prejudice whatever, endeavoring to make a fair and impartial report; 1 charge that this criticism which I hold in my hand is not made in a fair and impartial manner, as I think I can prove to the committee before I close ; of course it is understood an allowance must be made for the fact that Dr. Gray is a vitally interested party, and it may be without intention to do me an injustice, and with the sole purpose of defending himself and his institution he has been misled into doing what I consider a very serious injustice to me; I will here say that if this criticism is to become a part of the record, or a part of the report of your committee, to go on file in the archives of the State as such, I think, as a matter of justice, although it may involve additional expense, I think, as a matter of justice, the report to which it is a reply should be printed alongside of it,and I simply ask those who shall read the criticism to read carefully the report, and see, on the points mentioned, if the criticism is deserved. Mr. Morgan — You will furnish the committee a report that is correct? Mr. Apgar— I will ; I want all the report to appear, because the criticism refers to other parts of the report. In my hasty examina- tion of this criticism (and I have had to glance at it as one would a newspaper) I do not know but 1 have overlooked some very important points, but two or three have struck me that seem worthy of some answer. The first criticism which strikes me as being worthy of notice is this : " Under the statute adopted in 1842 in the State of New York, when the institution at Utiqa was organized (and every other insti- tution is organized under the same law in this State) each insti- 1139 tution is governed by such a board of managers, which board is charged with the responsibility of reporting to the Legislature directly each year the operations of the institution, its condition and i its receipts and its expenditures, together with such recommenda- tions as may seem to them necessary for the public good. The agent evidently has given but little attention to the statute organizing the asylums and the respective duties of the managers and superintend- ent, and confounds these duties through his entire report." I assert here, substantially, that that criticism, as applied to the report, is meaningless ; the report deals entirely with the institutions as institutions, and nowhere is it meant to hold or decide the respon- sibility, or divide it, ox hold the superintendent or the board of managers separately responsible; it deals with those institutions as institutions—no effort was made to divide the responsibility; so that this criticism I have just quoted has absolutely no meaning as applied to that report. p. The criticism goes on to say : " The report contains inaccuracies and misleading statements," etc., etc. That I deny. The next thing that strikes my attention is this: " The agent makes the extraordinary statement that an understanding exists with the business houses of Utica to furnish the Asylum with supplies at an advance of five per cent upon the cost; there is no truth in this, and had the agent consulted any of the managers, or any of the business houses dealing with the Asylum, he would not have made such a statement; the only shadow of truth for such a statement was that the managers contracted, after having received bids of sealed proposals of certain groceries in bulk, at five per cent on the j wholesale prices as contained in the^ original invoices — which five percent included boxing, cartage, freight, etc.; the main supplies .in the Utica Asylum are obtained at first hands as largely as possi- ble; cattle, sheep, etc., are bought directly from the farmers and slaughtered on the premises; eggs, butter, poultry, etc., are bought directly from the farmers also ; cotton and other goods directly from the manufacturers or their agents, and other supplies are bought, either in Utica, Albany, Buffalo, Boston, Philadelphia, wherever the articles can be obtained with the best economy." The statement made in the report was: "Its purchases are , largely made of business houses in Utica, with which an under- standing exists, that they are to furnish supplies to the institution at five per cent advance upon the cost to them." (P. 31, Apgar Re- , port.) That information came to me direct from Dr. Gray himself at the Utica Asylum. Dr. Grav — In reference to what point? Mr. Apgar — The five per cent advance. Dr. Gray — I shall have to respectfully, just at this point, deny that. ... , Mr. Apgar — You have denied it in this criticism i Dr. Gray — And I deny it now. 1140 Mr. Apgar — I respectfully submit that Dr. Gray should wait until I get through, then he may reply. Mr. Morgan — I suggest that Dr. Gray should wait until Mr. Apgar is done. Mr. Apgar (continuing)— Although this criticism starts out by saying : " The agent makes the extraordinary statement, etc.;" before the statement closes it substantially acknowledges the gist of the report, because it says: " After having received bids or sealed pro- posals, etc. ; " * * * "as contained in the original invoices." If there were sealed proposals and bids, I cannot understand what the original invoices have to do with it; if it was done on a sealed proposal, and on a bid, I utterly fail to understand what those in- voices have to do with it ; it seems to me that that statement con- tains in itself proof of its own inaccuracy, and is a substantial admis- sion of the gist of the charge made in the report; then it goes on in great detail to talk about the comparison made by the agent, of the Utica Asylum with the Northampton institution ; it charges some inaccuracies in figures which I totally deny, and which I only ask those wdio shall see the two reports — or rather, the report and the criticism — to compare carefully the part of the report criticised with the language of the criticism ; the main part of the criticism with regard to the comparison between Northampton and Utica is made up of the statement that the Northampton institution is sub- stantially for chronic insane, while Utica is for the acute insane; now, here comes in a matter in which I am taken at a disadvantage by reason of the short time I have had to look over the criticism, and the fact that five y< ars have elapsed since the report was made; but I will say generally, what I think will be admitted by every one who has given attention to the subject, that the figures given in this criticism as showing the number of cures at Northampton, and the number of curable cases there, arises very largely from the well-known differ- ence of opinion existing between the head of that institution and the head of the institution at Utica as to the curability of insanity. It is well known that the head of the institution at Northampton believes there are a far less number ( f cases actually cured or cura- ble than Dr. Gray believes; there are such differences of opinion among experts on that matter; and with that difference, I am will- ing to admit that there are probably more cases known as " chronic" cases at the Northampton Asylum than at Utica; at the same time the Northampton Asylum is not what is called an asylum for the chronic insane, as Willard is in this State, and as this criticism would attempt to convey the impression that it was. Now, I will not attempt in detail to go over these figures, but 1 want to state that, in my judgment, the figures have been purposely (perhaps with no hostile intention to myself, but perhaps rather with the purpose 01 defending the institution and its officers, which were deemed to be assailed) that the figures have beeu purposely taken from this report, it seems to me, and used in the criticism in such a way as to convey a false impression of the facts in the case; for example, 1141 the figures are used to show that the cost or amount that the coun- ties pay, or the State pays, in Massachusetts, to the Northampton Asylum is $3.50, and that the counties here pay four dollars, and that, therefore, the difference in the cost of support, is misleading and unjust to the institution at Utica; but the criticism omits to state the fact, stated in the report (which must be taken into account in order to have a fair understanding of the subject), that while Northampton institution receives $3.50 from the public funds for the support of those who are dependent upon the public, and the institution at Utica receives $4, he omits lo state in the criticism that in the years this report covers, hundreds of thousands of dol- lars were paid to the Utica Asylum for purposes similar to which the surplus over the ordinary expenses at Northampton was suffi- cient to do for that institution; the purchases of land, repairs — not only ordinary but extraordinary repairs —at Northampton, wore paid out of the ordinary receipts of the institution to a large amount, whereas at Utica, the State was called upon to make appro- priations for the institution in that respect; I charge that this crit- ; icism, leaving that out of view, would attempt to show that there was only half a dollar difference between the cost per week of . patients at public charge at Utica and Northampton; I charge that in that respect it is an unjust criticism in making that statement without taking into account the other consideration I have men- tioned ; I charge that in that respect the criticism is misleading and unjust to the report itself. Now, here is a long criticism, perhaps it is unworthy of notice, but it seems to me to be somewhat characteristic of the whole criticism, and, as it seems to me, showing a disposition to becloud the subject and make the assertion that the agent has been ignorant, or mali- I ciously wrong, without furnishing the proof, it says: "The agent does not take the pains to state what the managers have fully set forth in their reports to the Legislature, that is, that this money was expended for renewal aud re-arrangement, and enlargement of an old I building which has been made by these additions and modifications to accommodate one hundred and seveny-five more patients and to abandon at the same time forty rooms in the basement; the i' agent also fails to state in this connection that the Asylum at i Utica has paid out for current repairs, farm buildings, land, etc., from the receipts of board of patients, etc., the sum of !■ $104/271.81." All that information will be found in this report, but the agent has not chosen, in the text of his report, to comment [ upon those facts ; it is to be supposed that the reason was that noth- ing in them in his mind demanded it, though the facts themselves are all contained in his report. In another part of the criticism which I supposed I was going to read, when I began reading the last paragraph, I noticed another part of the criticism that I in- I tended to read in that connection, but I cannot put my eye upon it immediately, and I will let it pass. Now, it is stated that the superintendent — and the superintend- L 1142 ent himself has made the same statement here this morning— that he has nothing whatever to do with the finances of the institution; that the treasurer is solely responsible lor them, and that the report is unjust in assuming that the superintendent is responsible for the financial control of the institution. I assert that during my visit to the institution I learned from the superintendent himself that he practically conducted the business affairs of the institution ; he told me about purchases that he had made ; about cattle that he had bought; he showed me on the books of the institution (not at the treasurer's office, but at the institution), tbe price he paid for gas; he told me in various details, which I will not attempt to recall; I could not recall all the things; but they showed that while the treasurer keeps the accounts, it is just as a clerk in a public office may keep the accounts ; the Comptroller probably does not go and look over the accounts as kept, but still he is the head of the de- partment; I do not know whether Dr. Gray is the head of that de- partment in its business affairs or not, but I do know, as I have said, that he stated to me that he had purchased stock on different occa- sions where he thought he had benefited the State by the purchase of such and such things, and doing such and such things, which, if he was not charged with the business management of the institution, was a usurpation upon his part. Perhaps 'the best illustration of the unfairness, and, as I assert, the untruthfulness of this criticism in part is in reference to the question of the gas supplied at 'Utica. Now this is a question which has been agitated before. The statement made in the report is: after showing that originally there was a contract with the gas com- pany to lay pipes from the city of Utica up to the institution at large cost, provided the institution would agree to take gas for ten years, at a price that was a reduction from the regular rates; I think it was fifty or sixty cents; it may have been eighty cents ; I do not remember the precise sum, but it was a considerable reduction of over fifty cents ; I will say fifty cents or over, and the argument was made in the report that inasmuch as the gas company had put down these mains at this large expense, in view of a contract from the Asylum to take its gas for ten years at this reduced price, it was to be compensated in that time for the outlay ; that they expected in that ten years to get back the cost of laying down the mains, and it was a fair argument that after the ten years expired, the Asylum should at least have as much reduction from the price paid by the private consumers as it had before, and the statement was then made, and I found when I came to inquire into the subject that the insti- tution was paying $2.50 per thousand, which was precisely tbe same price paid by the smallest consumer in Utica, and was twenty-five cents more than the amount paid by the hotels. The criticism goes on to say : " Had he given sufficient attention to have made inquiry upon this point, either of the managers or at the gas works, he would have learned that the concessions on gas during the twelve years to the Utica Asylum, below the prices paid by ordinary con- 1143 Burners and hotels, amounted to $12,446.66, and he would not have been led to an absolute mis-statement by saying that the hotels were only paying $2.25, wThen they were paying precisely the sum paid by the Asylum. On the gas question, the'loose and somewhat careless method of business,' would rather apply to the agent of the Comptroller than to the managers." I want to make this part of the criticism a test—a test of the whole criticism, and as between the fairness and absolute accuracy of the report made by me and the unfair spirit of the criticism; because this statement in the criticism is not here made quickly or thoughtlessly ; it is a subject which has been before agitated by the managers of the institution, or by some one representing them, and by the superintendent of the gas company through the public prints; the whole question has been discussed, and by reference to the columns of the Utica Herald, the Albany Argus and the Utica Observer of the period, it will be seen that the whole question was discussed. Dr. Gray, when he makes this statement, makes it knowing all the facts in the case and after mature reflection and de- liberation ; and I want the committee and people who see and read this criticism, to read also the report aud take this part of the criti- cism as a test of the fairness and accuracy of the whole of it. Now, as to the facts in this gas question: the first person I went to as to the cost of gas at the institution (as in regaid to everything connected with it) was Dr. Gray and the managers of the Asylum; I found by their books and by their statements that they were pay- ing $2.50 per thousand for tlie gas; I asked them when they paid it and was told they paid it when the bill came in, immediately ; I then went to the Utica Observer office and asked the proprietor of the Utica Observer to let me see his gas bill ; I also went to two other business institutions in Utica and saw their ga6 bills, and the bills were made out in this way : so many thousand feet of gas, $3.00 per thousand — fifty cents per thousand off for prompt pay- ment ; and every man in Utica who was a gas consumer, I assert with- ■ out a possibility of its being contradicted — I assert what Dr. Gray | knows, what the superintendent of the Utica Asylum knows and what the learned counsel here knows from his own private gas bills — that every man in Utica at the time the report was made who chose to pay his gas bills promptly, as the Utica Asylum did, had a reduction of f fifty cents per thousand, so that he was only paying $2.50, precisely the same as the Asylum. Aud if it were to be considered that this | $2.50 per thousand was fifty cents less than the regular charge, then the managers of the institution were derelict that they did not demand fifty cents off their bill for prompt payment; but, as a mat- ter of fact, they were paying precisely what every private consumer was paying who chose to pay his bills as the Asylum did, when they were sent in. The attempt is here made to put me into a falsehood, and to aro-ue that I have done an injustice to the institution, and that attempt fs made deliberately, after full reflection, and with all the facts; an attempt to show in a public document that I have been 1144 guilty of gross misrepresentation, to bring me under reproach for having either carelessly or maliciously misstated facts concerning the institution. I do not state this as an absolute fact, but from the way 1 know figures are made up at the institution, I think it will. be found, by any one who will take the trouble to look, that this amount of $12,446 is made upon the theory that the private con- sumer was paying $3.00, when, as a matter of fact, it was only $2.-"<0 when bills were paid as they were at the institution, promptly. The honorable gentleman who is counsel here—who is counsel before this committee for Dr. Gray, as I understand it, knows him- self— Mr. Goodwin— Not for Dr. Gray, no, sir. Mr. Apgar— Well, for the Asylum ; when he was a member of the Senate he received a letter from some person in authority, either from the Asylum or the gas company7,after this thing had been in controversy, charging that I had"misstated, and he showed me that letter (I do not think I am revealing any confidence) before he should read it in the Senate ; I stated the facts to him, and where I had got my information ; I said: " You know all about this thing; you know what you yourself pay for gas ; they admit they pay7 $2.50; now you know what you pay;" the letter was not read in the Senate, and the counsel knows and every private citizen in Utica knows what he pays for gas; you will find no single instance in which a private consumer who chose to pay his bill promptly paid one penny more than the Utica Asylum ; it seems incomprehensible that a man of Dr. Gray's standing should thus misstate facts, being as they are nncontrovertible, and knowing them as he does, should come before this committee and make a statement like that ; he says : "And he wouldlnot have been led to an absolute misstatement by7 saying that the hotels were only paying $2.25, when they were paying precisely the same as the Asylum; " I will state this, as to that: that I did not say $2.25, I said " twenty-five cents less" in my report, that the Asylum paid twenty-five cents more, and I make a point of that because I want to show with what great care I went over the figures connected with that report; on my return from the Asylum and after going to these private consumers, I went to the hotel at which I was board- ing— it was the Butterfield House; I asked the proprietor to come to my room ; I said, " what do you pay for gas ?" he says, " I pay— " I asked him if he had a bill, and he brought up a bill and showed me ; it was made like the bills of the private consumers, $3.00 per thousand, and fifty cents off for prompt payment, making two dol- lars and fifty cents, the same as paid by the Asylum; I said, " I should think they would throw something off, you consume such a large quantity ; that is all they charge to small consumers in Utica ;" he said, " They do ; they give me my December bill receipted ; I do not pay it at all; " there is the statement and that has been made known before; it was made known through the columns of the Utica Observer, that it was made upon the authority of the proprietor of the Butterfield House; notwithstanding all these facts have been 1145 discussed in the public prints since the report was made, and their accuracy established, notwithstanding that, Dr. Gray comes before this committee and makes this statement, which is intended to fasten upon me a falsehood, when it seems to me he must have known, ab- solutely known, that the facts stated in the report were correct in every particular; I am, I admit, I feel heated about this; I made this report conscientiously ; I had no prejudice against Dr. Gray or any institution ; I endeavored to discharge the duty imposed upon me, a duty which I accepted reluctantly upon the ground that I had no familiarity with the subject; I sought to avoid it upon the ground that I was not the best person to" undertake the work, but having undertaken it, I intended to do it, and did do it, as consci- entiously as I could; I took pains to make a very careful report, and I confess I am heated when I find Dr. Gray coming before your committee, making a statement which is to go in the public docu- ments of the State, and to be forever there recorded, I am heated, and I think I may be pardoned for being so when I find him delib- erately coming before this committee and attempting to stamp upon me a falsehood without any regard whatever for the fact s,when it lias been made publicly known that every assertion of the report was known to be true and established to be true; I desire that this one point—having had, as I said when I began, but half an hour to glance over this criticism, and not having been able to read it in detail — I desire that this one case shall he taken as a test between the criti- cism of Dr. Gray and the report of which it is a criticism, and that this committee, and every person who shall hereafter be interested to read the report of this committee, and the documents embraced in it shall examine the question with reference to this one point, and from it decide between the criticism aud the report; I ask no better test than that, and it surely is a fair test toward 1 >r. Gray7, :• because as I have said, this statement could not have been hastily made, the facts have all been brought before the public heretofore ; immediately after the report was made the Utica Herald charged upon the authority of the managers of the institution and the super- intendent of the gas company that the report was wrong in that particular, and that the facts were not so; that the private con- sumers were paying more than the institution ; the Utica Observer [ stated immediately after that that Mr. Apgar had received his in- formation as they knew from private consumers and had verified his facts; the Albany7 Argus afterward went into the whole subject, ; giving the figuies and reasons for knowing it was true, and a reply was made by the Herald and it was kept up for several days, or two or three weeks, I do not remember how long; and I state that after all that, there is absolutely no excuse; it cannot be said that this charge has been hastily made, and I assert now that Dr. Gray ; knew at the time, that he knows now, and that he has known ever since the time this report was made and for the years covered by it i when the criticism was made, as to the cost of gas in the Asylum, he knew absolutely that the private consumer who paid his bills 144 U L 1146 promptly as the Asylum did, paid just as much as the Asylum ; I do not know whether he knew that the hotels received a discount or not, but if he did not know it, he had no right in his criticism to say that it was an absolute mistake, because the agent who made that statement had taken the pains to get his information from the pro- prietor of the hotel himself. It is said somewhere in the course of this criticism — a question with reference to the Asylum at Syracuse, that is worth considering, because it shows the whole purpose and spirit of the criticism. It says, "The agent of the Comptroller has found in the State, however, an institution which is satisfactory. He says: ' It is agreeable to turn to an institution whose showing of expenditure, as compared with former years, may be said to be entirely satisfactory.' This is the Idiot Asylum at Syracuse. He begins at the year 1860 instead of at the origin of the institution as at Utica. The agent's report shows that in 1860 there were 140 idiot children there; that the per capita cost of their care was $186.83, or $3.75 per week, and he puts down repairs as $5.64 per capita per year, making a total for repairs of $789.60. Thus the cost for board, care, etc., of idiot children at that time for the care of county patients in that year, and seventy-five cents per week more than was received for county patients at the Utica Asylum for foi r years afterward." Now mark this criticism ; the whole purpose of this report was to show the enormous increase that had taken place since 1860 in the care and support of inmates at the various institutions. And at Utica, as it happened the increase had been —I will not pretend now to be absolutely accurate, but in the neighborhood of three hun- dred per cent, since the institution was formed, going back to 1850, or wherever the reports began. In some other institutions there had been a similar increase, and the reference made to the Idiot Asylum was precisely that there had been no such growth of ex- penditures in the institution since 1860, as there had been in some of the other institutions of the State. Yet Dr. Gray takes the fig- ures for 1860 and shows that because Utica has largely increased and because at that time the cost at Syracuse was much larger than now7, he attempts to make it appear that there is something wrong with the report, when the very fault he states bears evidence to the truthfulness of the statement made in the report. He says in the criticism : We are glad to note that the agent declares the figures of Utica Asylum to be " a complete classifica- tion of the expenditures." All the statistics contained in the re- port of Mr. E. K. Apgar, the agent of the Comptroller at that time, it is just to say were prepared in the Asylum, either by myself or under my immediate direction, and in every instance they were compared by me with the original records, either in the Asylum or at Albany. These are: Table 4, giving a detailed statement of expenditures of the State Lunatic Asylum from 1850 to 1878, in- clusive. Table 5, detailed statement of receipts from 1860 to 1878, inclusive. Table 6, tabular statement of expenditures and legisla- 1147 tive appropriations for buildings, furnishing, etc., from 1839 to 1857, inclusive. Table 7, statement of expenditures, etc., etc. * * * These were all furnished by me, while table 10, show- ing the amount received from counties for patients for* 1878, and table 11, showing the amounts received for private patients during the year 1878, were furnished by the treasurer of the Utica Asy- lum." ^ Now, I will state in regard to that part of the criticism that table No. 4, " detailed statement of expenditures of the New York State Lunatic Asylum for the years 1850 to 1878." While it is true that the information contained in that table was gathered from the re- ports of the institution, that table is made upon a different plan and by very great labor, the intention being to make it more clear than any tables had been made before; and to say that table was prepared at the Utica Asylum is absolutely and unqualifiedly false. The figures contained in that table were taken from the reports of the Utica Asylum for different years, not in the form in which they are here presented; they were analyzed and reduced to a per capita basis and every thing was done for the purpose of making them as clear and explicit as possible. It is not of much importance perhaps but to the casual reader (I do not know that such was Dr. Gray's intention) but to the casual reader, the inference would be that the agent had gone hastily round giving no attention to the subject, and taken such tables as the institu- tions gave him nd put them into a report and then claimed the credit for making them. I say that the greater part of a year was spent by me in hard work, tabulating and preparing this information. _ Again, in the criticism it is stated that because the agent did not visit other institutions— I do not think Dr. Gray could have been | correctly reported in that statement — but the criticism is made that because the agent visited no other institution outside the State ex- | cept at Northampton, that he has no authority for his figures ! That is absolutely absurd, as the committee can see. The agent received figures from every such institution in the United States, application was made to all for their reports, and most of the institutions asked complied with the request; and from those reports with great labor and care this systematic tabulation was made which is given in the ' report. With regard to the information {furnished by Utica perhaps it is \ just to say, inasmuch as the question has been brought up, that in some particulars the agent appointed by the State found it very difficult to secure the information he wanted at Utica. For example reference is made here to the table showing the amount received from private patients during the year 1878, " furnished by the treasurer of the Utica Asylum," the criticism says. It is perhaps worth remarking that the agent made application to the treasurer of the Asylum for such a list, and the treasurer informed him he could 1148 not give"it to him, that it was a private matter of the Asylum, and that he had no right to use it. The Chairman—What list was that ? Mr. Ap'gar — Table eleven, the number of private patients and the amount they paid the Asylum. The treasurer informed the agent that it was a private matter between the Asylum authorities and the patients; the agent called his attention to the fact that this was a State institution, that the State was the controller of its affairs and had a right to know them and to receive the information asked. The treasurer said he could not doit bnt would consult the board of managers; he did consult them and in the course of a few hours he reported to the agent that he had consulted the board of managers and Dr. Gray, and that it could not be done, that the information could not be given The agent told him if that report was not fur- nished before he left the city of Utica the next day, he would go to Albany and would subpoena every one of the board of managers and the superintendent to come to Albany and bring all the books and papers of the institution, as he was authorized to do under the law ; thereupon that report was furnished, but not until then ; I desire that statement to go in connection with the criticism made to my report, and the statement in the criticism about furnishing the tables to the agent. I have necessarily overlooked many other points that could be met as easily and as thoroughly as the ones to which I have called atten- tion ; at the risk of repetition I desire it to be borne in mind that this statement was only placed in my hands half an hour before I came before your committee ; that it referred to the subject of a work which was completed five years ago, and that, therefore, I am at a disadvantage ; but, nevertheless, as to all the statements I have made, I state them absolutely and unqualifiedly; and as to the gas question — which is the one I am most familiar with and which is most fresh in my mind, because of the controversy which arose after the report was made—as to that question, I want it to be kept in sight that the statement of Dr. Gray in this criticism is made w7ith all deliberation — made after the facts were all known ; I desire that that question — by any person who shall be interested enough in the subject to read it — shall be taken as a test of the truth fulness, fairness and accuracy of Dr. Gray's criticism, and on de- ciding upon the question of falsity as between the superintendent of the Utica Asylum and the agent appointed by the Comptroller of the State to examine the institutions of the State. Mr. Haskell — If you desire to take the criticism and desire to- make further answer to it, we shall be happy to hear it, giving us notice long enough ahead. Mr. Apgar —I cannot tell whether I should desire to do that. Mr. Goodwin — I think it is important that the committee should see and read the statement of Dr. Gray, exhibited in evidence,,so that the matter can go to the printer as fast as possible; if there can be any way devised by w;hich the exhibit might go to the printer, 1149 and at the same time Mr. Apgar have the opportunity of presenting Buch further answer as he desires, it can be printed without delay. The Chairman —Do you desire to make any reply to Mr. Apgar ? Mr. Goodwin — No, sir; only that Dr. Gray desires to deny the statements made in relation to himself. Mr. Apgar — In what respect ? Dr. Gray — Especially with reference to the point that I was the financial officer or controlled the business, or showed him (Mr. Apgar) the bills, or any thing else; that is an unqualified falsehood. Mr. Apgar — I would like that Dr. Gray be given the liberty of asking me any questions bearing upon the subject, and that I in turn may ask him some questions. The Chairman — The chair will put to Dr. Gray any questions Mr. Apgar suggests. Mr. Apgar — The question as to whether or not Dr. Gray denies that private consumers at Utica, who paid three dollars per thousand nominally for their gas, were not allowed fifty cents deduction for prompt payment; whether he does not know or believe that to be true ? Dr. Gray—I did not know that, and do not,know it now; my whole criticism was with reference to the statement that we did not secure our gas at the price that others did—that other large con- sumers did, that is all the meaning that is in it. Mr. Apgar — Another question. What ground he (Dr. Gray) had for saying that the statement that the hotels paid twenty-five cents less, etc., was an unqualified falsehood ? Dr. Gray — The sources of information I had for whatever | declaration I did make was from the hotel keepers themselves. Mr. Apgar — Did you ask the hotel keepers ? Dr. Gray — I did, afterward. Mr. Apgar — After yon made the statement ? Dr. Gray — No, sir; after the appearance of the report. Mr. Apgar — And they told you they paid two dollars and a half per thousand, did they ?" Dr. Gray — I received my information, upon which I made that statement, from them. Mr. Apgar — I desire that the statements made shall be compared together, that is all. Not* COMMUNICATION FROM THE COMPTROLLER SUBMITTING TO THE SENATE REPORT OF THE AGENT APPOINTED TO EXAMINE THE CHARITABLE INSTITUTIONS STATE OF NEW YORK. TRANSMITTED TO THE LEGISLATURE APRIL 9, 1879, ALBANY: CHARLES VAN BENTHUYSEN & SONS. 1879. i STATE OP NEW YORK. No. 67. IN SENATE, April 9, 1879. COMMUNICATION FROM THE COMPTROLLER, SUBMITTING TO THE SENATE THE REPORT OF THE AGENT APPOINTED TO EXAMINE THE CHARITABLE INSTITUTIONS OF THE STATE OF NEW YORK. STATE OF NEW YORK : Comptroller's Office, ) Albany, April 9, 1879, ) To the /Senate: I submit herewith the report of E. K. Apgar, who was appointed by I me to investigate the affairs of the charitable institutions of the State. Under examination the subject developed so much of interest that more time has been used than was at first deemed necessary. The elaborate tables in the appendix have been prepared with great care, and they prove their usefulness by demonstrating the need of establishing a responsible supervision over the charities maintained by the State. I The expenses of the several State institutions, added to the sum expended by the State for the support of inmates in institutions other ' than State institutions, amounts in the aggregate to more than [ $1,000,000 annually. It is expected that the joint expenses of the canals and prisons for | the current year will be less than the above sum. If anything is needed to strengthen the story told by the tables in favor of greater care and supervision, this statement seems to be all that is necessary. i The text of the report, in a measure, presents an analysis of its tables, and various instructive comparisons are made betweeu the institutions j of our State and those of other States and countries. ' I beg to suggest the following plan to the Legislature, as calculated to i produce the desired supervision, and that, too, without creating a new I department, or adding to the expenses of government: •1 4 [Senate, No. 67.] First. Require all the receipts of the institution to be paid into the State Treasury. Provide appropriations sufficiently large to cover all their expenses, the appropriations to be advanced by the Comptroller upon monthly estimates. Second. Require the appropriations asked for annually to be estimated for and submitted to the State Board of Charities on October 1st of each year. Make it the duty of said board to examine said estimates, and certify the amount needed by each institution to the Legislature. No appropriations to be made for any purpose, except they are so certified. Third. Make it the duty of the State Board of Charities to require of the institutions an annual report, classified as to the items of expense and receipt, covering such details as the board may deem wise. Also a statement of the quantity and price of the various articles used. It seems to me, that, with these three simple requirements, all the elements of a complete supervision will be in the hands of the proper State officials. F. P. OLCOTT, Comptroller. REPORT. Albany, N. Y., April 4th, 1879. Hon. Frederic P. Olcott, Comptroller: In June last I was designated by you as the agent to conduct the examination, provided for in chapter 252, Laws of 1878, into the finan- cial affairs and business administration of the charitable and penal institutions, receiving appropriations from the State treasury. My first efforts were directed toward obtaining from a large number of institutions outside of this State, such information, as to their busi- ness management and financial results, as would allow an intelligent comparison to be made between them and the similar institutions, which are the subject of the present inquiry. With this view, I entered into correspondence with the managers of the various institutions under State control throughout the United States, and have obtained from them a mass of statistics in relation to construc- tion of buildings, cost of support, amounts paid for salaries, labor, provisions, fuel and lights, and other details to which more particular reference will be made in another part of this report. Similar results have been gathered from a number of local and private institutions in this country, and from various public asylums in Great Britain and Canada. This information has been digested, and such of it as was deemed valuable, has been arranged in tables which are hereto appended. Much labor has been expended upon these tables and every effort has been made to secure for them fullness and accuracy, and it is believed that they will prove useful to all who may be interested in the subject to which they pertain, whether in this State or elsewhere. The prisons of the State have so recently been brought under a new system of administration, and the results of the change have been so entirely satisfactory that it has not been deemed necessary to enter into a. prolonged or detailed examination of their affairs in this connection. I have nrade personal visitation to, and examination of, the following charitable institutions and reformatories which receive aid from the State : Name of institution. Location. New York State Lunatic Asylum............................... Utica. Willard Asylum for the Insane................................ Willard. Hudson River State Hospital.................................. Poughkeepsie. State Homoeopathic Asylum for the Insane..................... Middletown. Asylum for Insane Criminals.................................. Auburn. New York Institution for the Blind............................. New York city. New York State Institution for the Blind...................... Batavia. New York Institution for the Deaf and Dumb.................. New Y'ork city. New York Asylum for Idiots.................................. Syracuse. New York State Inebriate Asylum............................ Binghamton. New York House of Refuge................................... Randall's Island. ""ffltern House of Refuge.................................... Rochester. 6 [Senate, Name of institution. Location. New York State Reformatory................................. Elmir a. New York Catholic Protectory................................. Westchester. Institution for the Improved Instruction of Deaf Mutes......... New York city. St. Joseph's Institution for Deaf Mutes......................... ForHham. State Emigrant Refuge and Hospital........................... Ward's Island. I have also visited a number of institutions which derive their support wholly from local authorities and private sources, such as the New York City Lunatic Asylum (female), the New York City Asylum for the Insane (male), the Workhouse on Blackwell's Island, the Bloomingdale Asylum for the Insane, and others. In making these visits my purpose was to familiarize myself so far as possible, especially in regard to the former class of institutions, by personal examination, with the methods of business administration and the details and sums total of expendi- ture. A not less important object, and one which could ordy be reached by personal inspection, was to ascertain the results of such expenditure in the way of attendance, diet and condition of the inmates. The report which I have the honor herewith to submit is divided into two parts. In the first are contained such general observations and reflections regarding the management of State charities as have occurred to me during the prosecution of the examination, while in the second are given detailed but brief accounts of the facts ascertained regarding each institution wkich it was my duty to visit, together with such explanations and comments as seem called for in connection with the tables therewith presented. Uniformity of Accounts. In the examination of the various institutions of the State, I have found the system of making reports characterized by such an absence of uniformity as to make the work of comparison one of great difficulty aud labor. This lack of system is one of the serious defects in the present management of our charitable institutions, and until there has been substituted uniformity and clearness in place of the complications, diversities and imperfections of the systems now in use, there will always be unjust discriminations and occasion for misunderstanding aud criticism. The advantages of a uniform system can hardly be overestimated. It would enable those who make provision for the maintenance of State institutions, to arrive at a basis upon which an equitable distribution could be made to each institution. One has only to make a casual examination of reports of institutions in the States where such uni- formity has been secured, to see the great benefits derived therefrom. It is the only way possible by which the State can place the cost of maintaining all institutions which are similar in character, on an equal footing. The executive committee of the Board of Charities of this State, in a report regarding the management and affairs of the New York State Institution for the Blind, at Batavia, used the following language: " We beg also to suggest to the Comptroller that a system of book- keeping and forms for verifying and returning accounts to his office might be^ prepared, and, subject to the modifications necessary for organizations of dissimilar character and purpose, be required in all institutions supported by the State. Such uniformity in the State institutions would lead to its adoption by the cities and counties. A No. 67.] 7 common method of keeping and verifying public accounts throughout the State would tend to prevent fraud, facilitate its detection and protect the fiscal agents of the public against unjust accusation and suspicion." I cordially concur in the recommendation thus made. There are in many of the systems existing at the various institutions excellent single features. If one system of bookkeeping and of making up reports could be adopted, embracing the best points of all the systems now in use, it could not fail to result in much good. Some of the features which ought to be provided for in any such system are here noted. There should be an inventory of all property on hand at the end of each fiscal year. The annual report of each institution should contain, first a statement of receipts and disbursements during the year, classi- fied under such general heads as salaries and wages, labor, provisions, household stores, clothing, fuel, lights, medical stores, ordinary repairs, miscellaneous. Second, a statement in detail of the expenditures under each head, as for example, under salaries, the name of each officer and his salary, the number of attendants of various grades and the pay of each grade, the pay of engineers, watchmen, etc. Under the head of provisions should be stated the quantity and cost of various articles consumed, for example, the number of barrels of flour consumed during i the year and the total cost, the number of pounds of sugar and total cost, and so on. Such a statement could be compressed into two or t three printed pages, and would thus not materially add to the length of the report. Its advantages are many and obvious. Each superintend- ent would thus have the benefit of the experience, as to quantities and (cost, not only of his own institution, but of all the others. A comparison of the quantities of various articles consumed in the different institutions, taking account of the number to be provided for in each, would attract attention at once to waste when it existed, and I would prove a valuable aid to all the superintendents and stewards. [ Such tables published in all the reports and continued from year to year, would soon come to possess great value also for the opportunity they I would offer for a consideration of the sanitary effects arising from the | greater or less consumption of different articles of food. The compari- son of one year's experience with another in the same institution, and of different institutions for various years, would be likely, in a short time, to lead to valuable results in connection with the dietary of each. So, too, with regard to the prices of articles purchased. Every superintendent would have it in his power to ascertain, at a glance, the prices paid for various articles by other institutions, and he could thus judge as to whether the prices paid by himself were excessive or otherwise. With such publicity as to quantity and prices, neither wastefulness in use nor extravagance in cost could long be maintained in any institution without attracting the attention, not only of its officers, but of the general public; nor in such case could the remedy be long delayed. An examination of the few figures collected in table No. ' 44, in reference to the cost of articles consumed in the institutions there named, will show how widely different may be the prices paid for the same article by different superintendents. I am convinced that in many cases, officers of onr public institutions are paying a higher price for many of the articles used than they would find it necessary to pay, had they the advantage which a knowledge of the purchases of other institutions would give them. I 8 [Senate, There should be, in addition, a statement of the actual cost of maintenance during the fiscal year as distinguished from the cash disbursments. This could be arrived at by charging against the institution all supplies on hand, at the beginning of the year, and crediting it with supplies on hand, as per inventory, at the end of the year, charging it with all bills due at the end of the year, and crediting it with all payments during the year on account of bills of the previous year. Such a statement is important as showing the actual cost of supporting the institution for the period covered in each report. Under the present system of giving merely cash dis- bursements, it is easy to see that fair comparisons of one year with another, or one institution with another, cannot always be made, since, in many instances, considerable sums are expended for supplies which are carried over into the next year, and in other cases bills are paid during one year, which have been incurred before its beginning. Publicity of accounts is of great value as a check upon extrava- gance. It needs no argument to prove that in order to have this value, the accounts must possess such clearness, simplicity and uniformity as will enable even the general reader to understand them. It is not too much to say that the reports of none of the institutions are entirely satisfactory in this respect. A few are carefully prepared aud only fall a little short of being all that is desired. Some are carelessly compiled and contain but little of the information needed, while others are so meagre, or so blind, as to convey to the general reader at least no accurate information as to the financial record of the institutions they refer to. In the preparation of this work, much time has been consumed in repeated instances, to so analyze the figures contained in the vari- ous annual reports as to make them agree with themselves, or with known facts accessible at the Comptroller's office, or elsewhere, only to find at last that it was impossible to produce such agreement, and that the report under consideration, was, from one cause or another, misleading instead of contributing to an understanding of its subject- matter. It is not a necessary inference that there existed an inten- tion to mislead. The trouble is as likely to have been that the person making the report, or furnishing the figures, failed to bear in mind the object of publishing them ; yet it may be that in some cases, a desire to avoid an appearance of extravagance has led to such a purposed arrangement of figures as should not enable the general reader to gain a full knowledge of the subject. It can readily be seen, from what has been said, how importaut it is to secure uniformity in the system of ac- counts at the various institutions, and especially uniformity in the manner of presenting their financial statements. No greater check to possible extravagance could be devised than such uniformity coupled with a degree of clearness that would render it possible, for those in- terested, to make a fair analysis of the figures and proper comparisons of expenditures, comparing one institution with an other, while making proper allowance for the different circumstances under which each is placed. It is obvious, however, that uniformity in bookkeeping and in the presentation of their financial statements, is not likely to be secured so long as each institution has a different and entirely independent system of administration. No. 67.] 9 State Supervision. I am very clear that the best interests of the State, and of the several institutions would be subserved by a more direct State supervision than now exists. Its advantages would be numerous. In addition to se- curing the uniformity which has been spoken of, there would be some one representing the interests of the State, as distinct from local feeling or professional pride, which sometimes leads to undue expenditure. It would secure uniformity of treatment. Now each institution comes to the Legislature directly, seeking euch aid as its superintendent or its board of managers may deem requisite. One superintendent may have economical ideas, another extravagant ones. The Legislature cannot know of the necessities in each case, and must largely rely upon the statements of superintendents. The result is, that when the necessity exists for appropriations by the State for any one of the several insti- tutions, its superintendent is obliged to present himself before the Leg- islature, perhaps to remain in Albany many days during the winter, and to make such efforts to secure the sums needed as to subject him to the imputation of spending much time in lobbying for appropriations, which could be better spent in the performance of the ordinary duties of superintendents at home. Neither the superintendent nor any other officer of a State institution should be compelled, or indeed allowed, to appear at Albany, year after year, to lobby through the appropriations which may be necessary. All estimates should be sent for approval to, and all appropriations should be recommended by, one supervising body or person. This would not only protect the State treasury, but would be an actual benefit to State institutions. The Legislature would have confi- dence in the recommendations of such a head, and needed appropria- tions could be secured without the boards of managers and superinten- dent spending half the winter, or any part of it, in Albany. All receipts ought to be covered in the State treasury, and all payments made on monthly estimates, as in the case of the prisons. From a report made last winter to the Legislature of Massachusetts by a commission appointed to inquire into the expediency of revising the system of administration of the public charities of that Common- wealth, I extract the following, which is equally applicable to our own institutions: " Another feature of the present system is a lack of unity between the several institutions. Each has been created as occasion required, without any regard to those already established. Each has been man- aged, without doubt, with a desire for the best results, both as regards economy and efficiency, so far as each particular institution was con- cerned ; but there the interest ceased. No effort has been made, apparently, to create a feeling of unity of interest, in order that the good results attained in one institution might be carried into effect in the others, and the result has been a different system of administration for each institution. The Board of Charities has only the right to advise, and in most instances whenever such advice has been given, the trustees and inspectors naturally felt they were better judges of the needs of their several institutions than an outside board, with only a limited knowledge thereof; and consequently the board having no power to enforce its advice, it went for naught; so that to-day there is no uniformity in the several institutions, as regards administration, discipline or methods of purchasing supplies, while the operation of so 10 [Senate, many supervising boards are liable to be antagonistic from the very nature of the system. Another feature of the present system is, that owing to the multiplicity of supervision, and the division of responsi- bility by the laws upon boards of inspectors or superintendents, it is almost impossible to determine the responsibility of the management of the institutions; and in cases of investigation into alleged abuses, it is naturally uncertain upon whom the blame should be placed for anything that may possibly be found wrong. * * * " In regard to the relation of the various institutions to the treasury of the Commonwealth, it is much to be desired that all should be placed on equality ; that the same, system of disbursements, of account- ing, and of everything relating to financial arrangementts should operate for all alike." The advantages of a uniform system adopted by the State of Kansas are set forth as follows by the trustees of the Kansas State Insane Asylum, in their annual report for 1876 : " In conclusion, the trustees respectfully submit that the operation of the law of 1876, consolidating the asylums under one board, fully sus- tains the expectations of its most ardent advocates. It gives a uniform direction to their management, it removes local jealousy, it enables them to compare the advantages and disadvantages of the different systems of management, and to abolish the evil and engraft the good features thereof into each to their benefit; it occasions a close scrutiny of the condition and requirements of each, and prompts those recom- mendations only which are indispensable to the public good ; it affords an opportunity to exchange the manufactures of each other, and has thus opened a market for the products of the industrial departments thereof; it impels the board to consider the demands of each from the standpoint of citizens, not champions, whose duty it is, with a due regard to the general welfare, to promote the efficiency of all, so that the benefactions of the State may accomplish the object sought, in the most economical manner, and it has resulted in a large reduction of the expense of the trustees' management of the four asylums." The Wisconsin State Board of Charities and Reform exercise a super- vision over the financial management of the State charitable institu- tions, and the carefully prepared tables which they publish, of the various institutions under their charge, make their annual reports of special value. Each is required, before receiving an appropriation, to furnish carefully prepared estimates, and upon these the board base their recommendations to the Legislature. This system enables the board to bring all institutions under a general classification. The information which they are enabled to derive from each, furnishes a basis upon which a uniform and equitable provision can be made for all. Under the laws of 1875, the State Board of Charities of Illinois, adopted a similar system, and the result has been a great reduction of expenses in all the State institutions under their supervision. At the fifth annual Conference of Charities, held in connection with the general meeting of the American Social Science Association, at Cincinnati, May, 1878, Mr. G. S. Robinson, president of the Illinois State Board of Charities, made a report from which I extract the following: " The annual cost of maintenance (1877) in our institutions averages about $200 for each inmate, part of which is derived from sources other than the State treasury. No charge is made by the State for board, treatment or tuition, in any of them; they are absolutely free to our own No. 67.] 11 citizens. We have an able body of superintendents; we retain them in their positions and pay them liberal salaries, and we think our insti- tutions will compare favorably with those of any other State. We hear very little complaint of the management from any quarter. I may say that political considerations do not enter into the appointment of any of their officers or employees, so far as 1 know; both political parties are represented on their boards of trust. Our system of financial supervision has another advantage; it makes it easy for us to estimate with great accuracy the amounts necessary and proper to be appropri- ated for their support. The Legislature has confidence in our estimates, and follows them with but little variation." The Prisons. The change in the system of prison management and the establish- ment of one responsible head has justified all the expectations that were performed concerning it, even by the most sanguine of its advocates. Three years ago the excess of expenditures over earnings in a single year was more than $700,000. The new system has been in operation about two years, and to-day the prisons of the State are practically self-supporting ; and if the rapid improvement in results which has hitherto been secured shall continue, they promise to become in the near future a source of revenue to the State. According to the last monthly reports, the excess of earnings over expenditures at the Sing Sing and Auburn prisons was greater than the deficiency at Clinton, showing that amount of net revenue to the State. This gratifying result is largely due, no doubt, to the good fortune of the State in securing for a superintendent the services of a gentleman so experienced and com- petent for the work to be done ; but it cannot be doubted that the change from divided to undivided responsibility, and the substitution of single- headed for triple-headed superintendence was in itself desirable, and is to be credited with a very considerable portion of the good work accom- plished. The Necessity for Economy. That there is need of a like change toward economy in the charities of the State, can hardly be questioned. The revolt against high taxes and extravagant expenditures in all departments of government- national, State and local—is universal. For many years there was a constant and rapid increase in public expenditures of all kinds. This increase has been so great that the aggregate burdens of taxation are many times heavier than they were twenty years ago. During the period of apparent prosperity which accompanied the era of inflation, and continued for some years after the close of the civil war, these con- stantly increasing burdens were lightly felt, but now that the inevitable reaction has come, and the people are brought face to face with the actual condition of their affairs; now that property is rated at its real rather than at a fictitious valuation; now that we have reached an ante- war basis, they have become intolerable. The demand for reduction is absolute and must be complied with. The people ask for and will have a lessening of these burdens. If they fail to secure it from one set of public servants, they will replace them with others more responsive to their demands. The growth of expenditures in nearly all the public 12 [Senate, institutions has kept full pace with the general increase in the cost of government. The Tables Contained in the Appendix. I would call attention to the very full tables, showing all the facts in connection with this question relating to the several institutions, which are appended hereto. From them it may readily be seen how, in the various institutions, the aggregate cost of support has been largely aug- mented since 1860. It will be seen that in almost every item the increase has been very marked, and so great as to preclude the belief that it has been altogether necessary. The tables have been so prepared as easily to be understood by all, and it is hoped that such attention may be given to them by the Legislature and the public as will lead to a general understanding of the financial history of the several institu- tions. It is believed that never before, in the United States at least, have tables been prepared covering so many years and containing such full and accurate information as to the financial operations of so many institutions as those herewith presented. It will be a comparatively easy task to supplement them from year to year with the latest results, thus giving them a permanent and constantly increasing value for pur- poses of comparison. It is impossible, in the limits to which I must confine the text of my report, to include here even a tithe of the inter- esting and useful deductions to be derived therefrom. Nothing but a personal examination of these tables on the part of each reader can give a just idea of their interest and value. As I have remarked at the outset, much care and great labor have been bestowed upon their preparation in order that they might contain not only full and accurate information on the subjects with which they deal, but that this informa- tion should be conveyed in a manner so clear and understandable that, though the tables are simply vast masses of figures, they would still be entirely within the comprehension of the ordinary reader, and it is hoped they possess more interest than ordinarily adheres to statistical information. In each institution the cost of support, in the aggregate a.nd per capita, has been traced through all the years since its begin- ning, except in the case of those founded prior to 1860, in which cases the tables begin with that date. In the case of the New York State Lunatic Asylum at Utica, the tables contain its full and detailed finan- cial history since 1850, and a synopsis of its financial relations with the State since its foundation. These tables contain also, for all these years, a complete classification of the expenditures, so that at a glance may be seen the cost, in detail for the support of the inmates of the various institutions, and comparison may be easily instituted between different institutions and different years of the same institution. The divisions into which the expenditures have been made, are classified under these heads: salaries and wages, provisions and supplies, clothing, medical stores, fuel and light, ordinary repairs, all other ordinary expenses. In each case for every year, the aggregate and per capita expenses under these heads are given. Like tables have also been prepared and are appended, of a large number of institutions in other States. So far as possible these tables have been made to present a comparative state- ment of the results of the operations of several years. The years selected for this comparison were 1860, 1865, 1875, 1876, 1877 and 1878. These years were selected because the expenditures of 1860 were made before the war, and upon a gold basis; those for 1865 at the close of the No. 67.] 13 war in the period of excessively high prices and with the currency so depreciated that the paper dollars with which the supplies were purchased and all labor paid for represented less than half of their face value in gold, while the years last named, 1875, 1876, 1877 and 1878, are those in which we have seen our paper money rise to an equality with gold, and the prices of commodities and wages of labor return to nearly the ante-war standard. The Growth of Expenditures. As illustrating the growth of expenditures in our State institutions, I shall here make a brief reference to the figures to be found in the tables above referred to. It is impossible, as I have stated, in this place to reproduce even a small proportion of those which possess great interest and value, and it must not be supposed that the statistics here quoted have been selected because they possessed any special completeness or value not contained in all the others. Taking first those institutions whose foundation dates back prior to 1860, let us see what has been the cost, of supporting their inmates for the following specified years : The New York Institution for the Deaf and Dumb, in the city of New York, for the year 1860, contained an average number of inmates estimated at 300. The cost of their support, including salaries and wages, provisions and supplies, clothing, fuel and light, and all other ordinary expenses, except ordinary repairs, was §160.47 per capita for the year; including repairs, $174.43. Last year (1878), the average number of inmates was 494. The cost of support, including as before, all ordinary expenses except repairs, was $270.78 per capita for the year; including repairs $293.27. It may be admitted that in some respects the cost of support in such an institution, is now necessarily somewhat greater than in 1860. Many articles have fallen below even the standard of that year; but in the main it is probable that, including labor and all articles purchased under the head of provisions and sup- plies, the average cost is now slightly in excess of the prices prevailing at that time. It cannot, surely, be claimed, however, that there is any such increase as would account for the fact that the per capita cost of support is now almost $120 greater than it was in the year first named ; and that, too, although the number of inmates for 1878 was 194 more than in 1860, a fact which should tend, other things being equal, to largely reduce the cost of support for each. The comparison with 1865 is even more startling. It will be remembered that in that year, the paper money with which all the supplies had to be purchased, aud all wages paid, was depreciated so much that it represented not more than half its face value in gold. It would surely be expected that now when we have returned to a gold standard, and when the price of labor and of provisions has been reduced probably fifty per cent below the average of 1865, that the financial exhibit of the institution should show a large decrease from that time. What are the facts? In 1865, with an average number of 363 inmates the cost of support including, as before, all ordinarv expenses, except repairs, was $227.26 per capita for the year; including repairs, $239 per capita. In 1878 with an average number of 494, the cost of support, including all ordinary expenses, except repairs, was §270.78 per capita for the year; including repairs $293.27 per capita. It is difficult to account for an increase of more than twenty per cent in the per capita cost of support for 1878 over 1865 upon any theory consistent with the belief that the institution is now 14 [Senate, managed with all the economy and all the carefulness possible in con- nection with its affairs. Either the provision formerly made for its inmates was wholly inadequate, or that now provided is in excess of their real requirements. Let us see in what consists this increase. Take the item of salaries and wages. In 1860 the amount expended for this purpose was $14,967.01, or 49.89 per capita; in 1865 the amount expended was §15,994.89, or $44.06 per capita; in 1878 the amount expended was $52,597.55, or $106.47 per capita. Comment is unnecessary. In 1860 the sum expended for provisions was $16,160.33, or $53.87 per capita; in 1865 the amount spent for the same purpose was $34,328.88, or $94.57 per capita ; and in 1878 the cost for provisious and supplies was $44,184.99, or $89.44 per capita. It is difficult to believe that there might not • have been a greater reduction than that of $5.13 per capita in the cost of provisions for the institution since 1865. In this connection I would call attention to table No. 43, in the appendix, showing the prices paid for, and quantities consumed of, different articles of food for each year since 1861, down to 1878, excepting alone the year 1862. I commend a careful study of the table to all who may be inter- ested in the subject. I shall only stop here to note that from 1861 to 1878, with an increase of sixty-one per cent in the number of inmates, the number of pounds of butchers' meat consumed in 1878 was 161 per cent greater than in 1861, the increase being just 100 per cent greater than the increase in numbers. In 1861 the consumption of milk was 1,059 quarts; in 1870 it was 6,520 ; in 1874 it was 71,459 quarts, and in 1878, with a smaller number of inmates, 107,575 quarts were used. It should be stated that the consumption of 1870 was condensed milk, that of the other years being of the common article. The consumption of ice in 1861 was 17,350 pounds ; in 1865 it was 22,050 pounds ; in 1870 it was 27,530 pounds; in 1873 it was 53,224 pounds; in 1875 it was 85,690, and in 1878, with a smaller number of inmates than in either of the three years last named, there were 136,535 pounds of ice consumed. It is not intended here to decide that the quantity now consumed of these articles is too great, but only to call attention to the surprising increase, and to suggest that, if the experience of other institutions is similar to this, we may possibly have arrived at one of the causes to account for the large growth in expenditures since 1860. The Legislature appropriated for the support of the State pupils in this institution for the years 1860, 1861 and 1862, §150 each per annum. In 1863 this amount was iucreased to $180 per pupil, which was allowed during the following years until 1868, when it was again increased to $200 per pupil. In 1869, a year of great liberality, the amount was increased to $300 per pupil, at which figure it remained until last year when it was reduced to $275. This sum has again been reduced by the present Legislature to §250 per pupil. It is impossible to comprehend how an allowance of $275, or even of $250, is now necessary, if they were able to get on down to 1862 for $150 per pupil, and after that, duing all the years of the war and of highest prices, for $180 pupil. It may here be stated that the State pupils in the New York Institution for the Blind, were paid for in the years 1860, 1861 and 1862, at the rate of §150 each per annum. For the next three years, 1863,1864 and 1865, at $200 each per year, and from 1866 to 1878, inclusive, at $300 per annum, while for the next ensuing year the rate has been fixed at $275. In the New York State Lunatic Asylum, at Utica, the average No. 67.] 15 number of inmates for the year 1860, was 516. The cost of their support, including salaries and wages, provisions and supplies, clothing, fuel and light, and all other ordinary expenses, except repairs, was §185.95 per capita for the year, including repairs, $198.72. In 1865, with an average number of 591, the cost of support, including as before, all ordinary expenses, except repairs, was $249.94 per capita, including repairs, $266.90. For the year 1878, with an average number of 600 inmates, the cost of support, including all ordinary expenses, except repairs, was §277.62 per capita for the year; including repairs, $346.59. It should be stated in this connection, that in the annual reports of this institution, no distinction is made between ordinary and extraordinary repairs, all being brought under the one head of " additions, alterations and repairs." During the last year a large portion of the expenditures for repairs, sixty-eight dollars and ninety-seven cents per capita, would appear to have been for other than ordinary repairs. In 1860 the amount paid for salaries and wages, at the Utica asylum was $26,798.45, or §51.93 per capita; in 1865 it was $33,075.50, or $55.96 per capita; in 1878 it was $56,227.97, or §93.71 per capita. For provisions and supplies, the amount expended in 1860 was $38,782.93, or $75.16 per capita; in 1865, $64,022.24, or $10833 per capita; in 1878, $60,085.58, or §100.14 per capita. It is evident that either the quantity of the food consumed by each inmate must have greatly increased since 1865, or that there has been a great improvement in quality. For fuel and light the amount expended in 1860 was §11.65 per capita; in 1865, $25.45 per capita; in 1878, $20.47 per capita. I shall have occasion to refer to this item of expenditure in another part of my report. Going back to 1850 it appears that the per capita cost of support at Utica, including all ordinary expenses, except repairs, was $140.12; including repairs, §149.45, considerably less than half the present cost. The houses of refuge make a better showing of comparative expendi- tures ; and yet it would seem not so good a one perhaps as might have been made. The New York House of Refuge, in 1860, contained an average num- ber of 574 inmates. The cost of their support, excluding repairs, was 894.01 per capita for the year; including repairs, §101.22; earnings, §32.94; net cost of support per capita for the year, $68.28. In 1865, with an average number of 820 inmates, the cost per capita was §119.62 for the year, or including repairs, §123.86. The earnings for this year were $44.38 per capita, making the net cost §79.48. For 1878, with an average number of 930, the cost of support was §115.99, or including repairs, §118.48; earnings, $33.61; net cost of support, $84.87. The amount paid for salaries and wages in 1860 was §12,636.46, or §22.02 per capita; in 1865 the amount paid for this purpose was §16,323.71, or §19.91 per capita; in 1878 the amount paid for salaries and wages was $37,454.09, or $40.27 per capita. For provisions and supplies m 1860, the sum expended was §20,197.67, or $35.18 per capita; in 1865, for the same purpose, §39,486.04, or $48.15 per capita; in 1878 the cost of this item was $43,414.23, or $46.68 per capita. In the Western House of Refuge, Rochester, with an average number of 425, the cost of support in 1860 was $81.72 per capita for the year, or including repairs, $83.77; earnings, $40.16 per capita; net cost, $43.61. In 1865 the average number of inmates was 475; cost of support, exclud- 1 16 [Senate, ing repairs, was $117.01 ; including repairs, $120.85 per capita; earn- ings, $33.25 ; net cost, $87.60 per capita. In 1878 the average number was 588. Their support cost for the year §133.54 each, or including repairs, §140.23; the earnings were $24.03 per capita, making the net cost of support $116.28 each for the year. The amount expended for salaries and wages in 1860 was $8,999.69, or $21.18 per capita; in 1865, $11,770.58, or §24.78 per capita; in 1878, $22,148.92, or $37.69 per capita. For provisions and supplies, the sum expended in 1860 was §12,268.17, or $28.87 per capita; in 1865, $20,461.63, or $43.05 per capita; in 1878, $23,722.26, or $40.34 per capita. It is agreeable to turn to an institution whose showing of expenditures, as compared with former years, may be said to be entirely satisfactory. In the New York Asylum for Idiots, Syracuse, there were for the year 1860 an average number of 140 inmates. The cost of their support, including all ordinary expenses, except repairs, was $186.83 per capita for the year; including repairs, §192.47. If I were to compare the financial results of this year with those of 1865 and 1878, it would be unduly favorable to the institution by showing a greater reduction of expenses than actually exists, because a considerable amount of the sum expended for support was on account of bills incurred in previous years. I shall therefore make a comparison with 1861 instead of the previous year. In 1861 the average number of inmates in the asylum was 135. The cost of their support, including all ordinary expenses, except repairs, was $146.01 per capita for the year; including repairs, $157.38; in 1865, with an average number of 144 pupils, the cost of support $207.74 per capita for the year, or including repairs, $223.30. For 1878, the average number of pupils was 265, and the cost of their support was §164.38 per capita, or including repairs, §177.53. It will be seen that in this insti- tution the reduction in ordinary expenses, excluding repairs, from 1865 to 1878 amounts to $43.36; while the increase over 1861 is only §18.37 per capita. In 1861, the amounts paid for salaries in the asylum for idiots was §8,144.86, or $60.33 per capita; in 1865, §9,115.82, or $63.30 per capita; in 1878, $15,670, or $59.13 per capita. For provisions and supplies in 1861, $6,096.85, or $45.16 per capita; in 1865, §12,049.58, or $83.67 per capita; in 1878, §14,380.05, or $54.26 per capita. It will be observed that the per capita cost of salaries is a trifle less than in 1861, while in the provisions the variations from 1861 to 1865 and 1878 are about what would be expected from the geueral course of prices in those years. It will, of course, be borne in mind that these comparisons are simply of the results of one year with another in the same institutions, and are not at all intended to institute a comparison of results for the same year as between dissimilar institutions. It should also be said that wherever in this report, or in the tables and explanatory comments accompanying them, the word " inmates " is used, it is not intended to include officers and attendants, bur only patients and pupils, or, in the house of refuge, the boys and girls committed their charge. In this connection a glance at the growth or diminution of expenses during recent years in the institutions founded since 1860 will not be uninteresting. The Institution for the Improved Instruction of Deaf Mutes, in the city of New York, was founded in 1867. The table relating to it contains a classified statement of its expenditures for each of the years from 1871 to 1878 inclusive. No full and accurate figures regarding its operations prior to 1871, are accessible. The average number of pupils, which was No. 67.] 17 fifty-seven in 1871, has gradually increased, until last year, when the number was 107. The annual cost per capita of support, including repairs, has been as follows: 1871, $289.66 (it is evident that the cost of support during this year was largely augmented owing to the recent foundation of the institution, and the fact that it had not yet been brought into such working order as to secure the best financial results); in 1872 $168 73 • 1873, $214.90; 1874, $209.51; 1875, §200.87; 1876, §215.91; 1877! §197.75; 1878, §200.58. It needs to be stated, in regard to this institution, that it occupies leased property, and that it has been under a yearly expense averaging §7,500, for rent. This item has not been included in the per capita cost just mentioned, for the reason that the other institutions to which refer- ence has been and will be made, occupy buildings either owned by the State or erected in whole or in part by private contributions, and have no rent to pay. It is necessary, however, in considering the relation of the Institution for the Improved Instruction of Deaf Mutes to the State, as regards the price allowed it for eacn State pupil, to include this item of rent in the per capita. Adding it would bring the cost of support for the last two years up to about $275 per year, and a larger amount for the years preceding. It is believed that, condsidering the great change in prices within the past four years, there should have been a reduction in the expenditures of this institution greater than that shown in the table of twenty-nine cents per capita, exclusive of rent. The per capita cost of salaries and wages should naturally be reduced with the increased numbers, but it is found that with a considerable addition to its numbers the amount paid for salaries and wages in this institution for the year 1878, $94.19, was larger, with a single exception, than for any of the years preceding since 1871. In the cost of provisions and supplies there has been a reduction since 1873, when the average number of pupils was seventy-five, of §6.04 per capita, the amount in that year having been $67.03 per capita, and in 1870, $60.99 per capita. New Y'ork State Institution for the Blind, Batavia. This institution was opened in the fall of 1868. The report for the year 1869 was found to be too imperfect to incorporate its figures in the table. For the years 1870 and 1871 the annual cost of support per capita, including repairs, was, for the former year, §367.27, and for the latter $338.79. The results of these years can hardly be taken for comparison with later results owing to the fact, as is always the case with newly founded institutions, that the expenditures of the first two or three years are largely augmented by causes easily understood which arise from the newness of the institution. The course of expenditure since 1871, has been as follows: Total cost per capita for support, excluding repairs, 1872, $275.54; 1873, $261.93; 1874, §252.21; 1875, §227.39; 1876, $228.27; 1877, $225.88; 1878, $280.99. It is necessary to state that in the year 1878, there was a payment of §7,152 on account of bills con- tracted prior to the beginning of that fiscal year, which would amount to about $44 per capita, and which would reduce the expenditure properly chargeable to that year to §236.99 per capita, provided no bills charge- able to 1878 were left over to be paid in the following year. It would surely teem that within the last four years, considering the course of prices, both of provisions and labor, that there should have been a large reduction in the per capita expenditures of this institution. On the [Senate Doc. No. 67.] 2 18 [Senate, contrary, we find them to have increased, even after making full allow- ance for the payment made 1878 on account of bills previously contracted. The amounts paid for salaries and wages since 1874, have been as fol- lows : 1874, $13,095.39, or $87.30 per capita; 1875, $13,770.88, or $88.84 per capita; 1876, $13,110.49, or $84.04 per capita; 1877, $14,691.24, or $90.69 per capita; 1878, $16,085.35, or $99.29 per capita. The increase per capita in the item of salaries and wages during the very years when a considerable reduction might reasonably have been looked for, led me to make special inquiry as to the facts in relation to this subject. From the results of that inquiry, I am convinced that a large reduction can be made without in the least impairing the effciency of the institution. This opinion is concurred in, not oidy by members of the board of managers, but by officers and teachers in the institution itself. There are, or were, at the time of my visit, five teachers of music; a principal at $800 per year, one assistant at $600, two at $400 and one at $300. It would seem that by a proper classification, and by making use of the labor of pupils as instructors for the beginners, a smaller force would be ample. The benefits to be derived from allowing the older pupils to teach, are manifest, giving them the very experience in teaching that they need in preparing to earn a livelihood. The reports of this institution are very imperfect, and it was impossible, from them alone, to complete anything like a satisfactory table of figures, regarding its operations. It was only by securing access to all other sources of information, and with considerable labor and difficulty, that the table was finally completed. The examination into the affairs of the New York State Institution for the Blind, made by the executive com- mittee of the State Board of Charities at your request, resulted in the discovery of a grave want of good management and of serious irregulari- ties. While my own investigations more than confirmed the existence of these irregularities at that time, I am glad to believe that there is no reason now to suppose that they continue, or that intentional wrong- doing exists in the administration of its financial affairs. I was con- vinced by my visit to the institution, of the want of harmony in its board of management, which extends to the officers of the institution, and the effect of which I am told is even visible among the pupils, and is an insuperable obstacle which must be removed before there can be hope of obtaining the best results, either financially or otherwise, in its govern- ment. I found illustrated in this case an example of both the evils likely to arise in connection with the government of State institutions by local boards. In the first place the prevalent idea in the locality, shared too largely by the managers, was that the purchase of supplies for the institution aud the employment of its labor were to be chiefly considered as sources of local patronage; and second, that owing to jealousies, partly political and partly personal, the board of managers came to lack entirely that harmony which is absolutely essential to successful administration. To illustrate the extent of the feeling existing in the board it is oidy necessary to state that for a considerable time a majority of its members refused to recognize as one of their number a gentleman appointed by the Governor, under the law, and whose commissson was placed before them. I would recommend either that the local board be reorganized, or what might be perhaps still better, that it be altogether abolished, and that the institution be placed under the direct and immediate super- vision of some central State authority. r No. 67.] 19 New York State Inebriate Asylum. This institution was chartered in 1854. The location was made in Binghamton in 1858, and the building commenced in that year. I can- not "stop here to refer to the long story of its difficulties and of the quarrels which arose in connection with its management, during many of the years of its building, and after it was opened" for patients. Though the story is an interesting one, and in some respects worth repeating, I shall refrain from doing so. I would refer, however, those who may be interested, to a pamphlet entitled "A Statement of the local trustees," reprinted in 1868, by C. S. Westcott & Co., printers, New York, and to a " Report of the commissioners of the Land Office relating to the man- agement of the New York State Inebriate Asylum at Binghamton," made April, 1871, and constituting Senate Document No 71, of that year. The table relating to the inebriate asylum covers the years from 1870 to 1878, inclusive. In the year 1870, the average number of inmates was 66; in the next year the number was increased to 84, since which time \ there has been a gradual though steady decrease, the average number for last year, 1878, being 46. The cost of their support per capita, excluding ordinary repairs, has been as follows: 1870, $585.46; 1871, §440.61; 1872, §482.27; 1873, $456.19; 1874, §495.96; 1875, §484.01; 1876, $510.06; 1877, $597.95, and 1878, $663.58. Inasmuch as during the past year the average number of private patients was 40, and of j county patients only 6, and as the charge for county patients is confined to seven dollars per week, the question of its running expenses is chiefly interesting to those who support the private patients of the institution; j yet it may be affirmed that, since it is a State institution designed for a charitable purpose, its cost, even to those who are not so destitute as to rely upon the counties for support, should be made as light as possible. For salaries and wages the cost per capita was $137.11 in 1871; §184.51 in 1874; §190.16 in "1877; and $240.94 in 1878. For provisions and supplies the amount expended per capita was §173.67 in 1871; §178.53 | in 1874; §233.77 in 1877 ; and $211.01 in 1878. For fuel and light the cost was $56.77 per capita in 1871; §48.94 per capita in 1874; §47.69 in 1877, and $83.55 in 1878. The amount expended for the construction of and furnishing this institution may be roundly stated at a million of dollars. A very small portion of this sum came from private sources; the great bulk of it from the excise moneys which belonged to the people | of the various counties, principally the city and county of New York. I was informed by the superintendent on the occasion of my recent visit, that, the present capacity was one hundred ; although it has been reported to the State Board of Charities for a number of years at two hundred. I suppose this discrepancy arises from the fact that one wing of the build- ing although enclosed, is not yet finished and ready for occupancy. The sum required to finish it would not, as compared with the amount already spent, be a large one; and the institution would then have accommoda- tion for two hundred, the number reported to the State Board of Charities. Taking, however, its present capacity, one hundred, it appears that it has cost §10,000 per capita to furnish a home for the cure of inebriates. Counting the number actually present during the past year the cost of the institution has been about $22,000 per capita. When the interest on this sum is added to the per capita cost of support for the year 1878, it makes the real expense of maintaining each patient for the year about I, 20 [Senate, §2.200. This seems a pretty large sum to expend in an effort which as yet cannot be called other than experimental, though there are those who believe it has already proved a failure. If we consider, however, only the county patients in the institution, the result is a startling one. The chief advantage which the institution offers, and in this opinion I am borne out by many who favor its existence and have had experience in its management, is in the fact, that a residence within it, is supposed to remove those who have acquired habits of intoxication beyond control, from the associations and temptations of their ordinary life at home. There are few, I imagine, who put much faith in any medical treatment to eradicate the taste for intoxicating stimulants, especially when it, has reached such a stage that its victims are ready to go, or their friends to send them, to an inebriate asylum. If this be true, it may le asserted that for the wealthy class and for those who are able and willing to pay the price charged to private patients for their support, the same advan- tage of residence and corresponding freedom from the temptations and associations of home life, could be secured if this institution were not in existence. This being a charitable institution, we need then only consider it in h,s relation to the county patients who are committed to its charge under the law, and whose support is paid for by the counties. There were six such during the past year. The counties paid for their support, seven dollars per week, amounting to the sum of three hundred and sixty-five dollars for the year. The amount paid out of the State Treasury for salaries and wages and expenses of commissioners for the last year was $6,337, being over $1,056 for each county patient. The interest on the outlay of $1,000,000 at seven per cent is $70,000, being $11,666 for each county patient. This would make the cost of supporting, for the year 1878, each inmate of the Inebriate Asylum who can properly be considered as depending upon the charity of the State §13,087. There is something almost grotesque in the appearance of these results, and if it were not for the question of taxes which imparts a serious view to the subject, the experience of the State in connection with its Inebriate Asyium, would seem farcical. The Governor has already recommended that no further appropriations be made for its support, and that it be converted into an asylum for the insane. The State Board of Charities make a similar recommendation. It is to be feared, that owing to the style of the building and the manner of its construction, the necessary alterations will cost nearly or quite as much as a new building capable of accomo- dating the same number on the plan of those recently erected at Wil- lard. There is also, 1 believe, some question as to the rights of the original stockholders in the present building, they having, I am informed, released it to the State upon the condition that it was to be maintained as an inebriate asylum. Whatever may be decided upon this point, it is quite evident that it would be an act of folly for the State to continue paying $6,000 a year for salaries, in order that five or six county patients may be cared for at, seven dollars, and thirty private patients at from ten to twenty dollars a week. Expenditures of Insane Asylums other than Utica. The Asylum for Insane Criminals, at Auburn, was opened in 1858. For the years 1859 and 1860 the expenses, owing to the newness of the institution and to causes already mentioned in connection with other r No. 67.] 21 institutions similary situated, were so large as to furnish no fair com- parison with other years. In 1861 the average number of inmates was 62, and the per capita cost of their support $201.49, or, including repairs, §228.61. Two years later, in 1863, with an average number of 80 in- mates, the cost, per capita of support for the year was §146.79, or, includ- ing repairs, §150.44. Two years later than this, in 1865, with an average number of 73 inmates, the cost per capita for the year had risen to §220.47, or including repairs, $228.75. From this time the expenses were gradually decreased until 1869, when, with an average of 80 in- mates, the expense per capita for the year was $171.43, or including re- pairs, §174.43. The next year, 1870, with 78 inmates, the expenditure per capita, including repairs, bounded up to $254.86; in 1871 the expense per capita for the year, including repairs, was $288.55; in 1872, §261.65; in 1873, $242.47 ; in 1874, $24b\i7 ; in 1875, §228.86, and in 1876, with an average of 101 inmates, the highest, cost of support was reached, being $292.18. Toward the end of this fiscal year the present superin- tendent, Dr. Carlos F. MacDonald, was placed in charge of the asylum. In 1877, with 98 inmates, the per capita for the year, including repairs, was reduced to §244.69, and in 1878, with 114 inmates, to §201.99. It is hoped to make a still further reduction during the present and ensu- ing years. The State Homoeopathic Asylum for the insane at Middletown, was opened in 1874. The table relating to it contains a classified statement of its expenditures for all purposes for the years 1875, 1876, 1877 and 1878. With an average number of sixty-six patients in 1875, the per capita cost of support for the year was $660.01, or including repairs, §661.86. In 1876, with an average number of eighty-two inmates the per capita cost of support was §607.84, or including repairs $630.64; in 1877, with 109 inmates, the per capita cost of support was §419.75, or including repairs §431.14 ; in 1878, with 130 inmates, the per capita cost was $394.23, or including repairs §402 35. During all these years large sums in excess of the amount on which this per capita is based have been expended for buildings, extraordinary repairs, improvements, farm equipments, house furnishing, etc. The number of private patients in this institution is very large and many of them pay high prices for their board (in at least one instance as high as fifty dollars per week has recently been paid); so that the charge of $4.50 for county patients, taken with the amount received for private patients and the sum appro- priated by the State for officers' salaries, will probably suffice to cover the expense of maintenance. There can be no question, however, that it is the duty of the State, in the case of private patients as well as those sent by the counties, to make the burden of their support as light as possible. The law provides for the commitment of the insane to asy- lums. These institutions are furnished by the State as receptacles for persons so committed. In a great, majority of cases the friends of private patients are people in moderate circumstances; in comparitively few cases are they so situated that the difference between a reasonable and an unreasonable charge is of little account to them. In many cases they are people who have slight means, but who are too proud to allow the insane relative to become a county charge, and it is the interest of the State as well as its duty that to such, as much as to the counties, its benefits should be open for the smallest sum consistent with a reasonable and proper care of those committed to its keeping. It is to be hoped and expected that the reduction in the per capita expense at this institu- 22 [Senate, tion will be continued until it reaches a figure very much below the present one. The Hudson River State Hospital, at Poughkeepsie was opened in 1871. The tables printed in the appendix cover the years from 1873 to 1878 inclusive. There are two separate tables published for these years of the classified expenditures of this institution, covering, as in other cases, salaries and wages, provisions and supplies, clothing, fuel and light, ordinary repairs, all other ordinary expenses, construction and all other extraordinary expenditures. One of these tables is made up from the figures contained in the reports of the superintendent to the Legisla- ture, and from such other information as I could find access to. After spending much time and labor upon it, and bringing it to completion, it was discovered that the information which it conveyed was deprived of mi"-b of its interest and usefulness from the fact already referred to, in connection with other institutions, that payments made during one year were, in many cases, on account of supplies purchased and consumed in previous year, and on the other hand that supplies purchased aud paid for during any given year were frequently carried over in considerable quantities to the next. No account was made of this fact in the reports alluded to, or in the reports to the State Board of Charities. I therefore applied to the superintendent and obtained from him a statement of his expenditures, classified as above named, charging to each year only the amount of expenditure and indebtedness incurred on account of the main- tenance of that year. From this statement was compiled the second table I have referred to. The figures which I shall here quote are from the last mentioned table, though both tables, as I have said, are published in the appendix. The years 1873 and 1874 hardly furnish a proper basis for comparison for reasons mentioned in connection with other in- stitutions similarly situated arising from the recent beginning of opera- tions. In 1875, with 207 inmates, the cost of support per capita for the year was $339.51, or including repairs, $348.73; in 1876, with 197 in- mates, the per capita cost of support was §399.69, or including repairs, $407.11; in 1877, with 219 inmates, the per capita cost of support was $353.20, or including repairs, $365.59; in 1878, with 236 inmates, the per capita cost of support was $344.40, or including repairs, $351.70. The per capita cost for salaries and wages during the last year was $135.36 ; for provisions and supplies, §124.09 ; for fuel and light, §47.99. It would seem that each one of these items was much too large. At the Utica Asylum, which may be said to be conducted with liberality, the cost for provisions and supplies for the past year was §100.14 per capita, and the larger number of patients can hardly account for so great a dif- ference. In the Massachusetts State Lunatic Hospital at Northampton, with 442 inmates, the cost of provisions and supplies for the spme year was $57.68 per capita. The cost of fuel and light at the Utica Asylum for 1878 was $20.47 per capita, at Northampton, $7.71 per capita. It would certainly seem, taking everything into account, that $47.99 per capita for fuel and light, at the Hudson River State Haspital is greatly excessive. From 1873 to 1878 the average cost for fuel and light for each year has been $52.51 per capita. At the Northampton Asylum, before referred to, the average cost per capita for the same years has been $17.26. Whether this excessive cost of fuel arises from waste now, or from the adoption of an extravagant system of heating at the beginning, extravagant not only in its original cost, but in that of sub- sequent years, I will not stop here to inquire. The question may, how- ever, be discussed in the notes to be added to the tables contained in the f No. 67.] 23 1 appendix to this report. The price charged for county patients in this institution was $5.50 per week up to the first of November last, at which time it was reduced to $4.50 per week. The cost of support of each in- mate during the year 1878, excluding officers' salaries and clothing, was $5.80 per week. At the time of my visit to the institution I was in- formed by the superintendent that the number of pay patients was | under thirty; that the highest prices paid by any one was $7.00 per week, aud that most of them were paying between $4.50 and $5.00 a week. It would appear, therefore, that the pay patients even are not paying as much as the actual cost of their support, unless that cost has been considerably reduced since last year; and it is apparent with the price $4.50 charged to county patients, there can be no other prospect than that the end of the year will show a deficiency in the maintenance account which will have to be made up by the State. The Williard Asylum for the insane was opened in 1869. The aver- age number of inmates for the year 1870 was 216 and the cost of their support per capita, excluding repairs, was $184.56. This, considering the number of inmates, and the fact that it was the first complete year | of the institution, may be considered a remarkably good showing. In 1871 with an average number of 436, the cost of support, excluding re- pairs, was $183.43 ; in 1872 with an average number of 564 inmates the i cost per capita for the year was $190.67. From this time until 1876, the average number greatly increased and the cost of support was corre- ' spondingly diminished. In 1876 the average number was 1,076, and the cost of their support per capita for the year was $164.20, or including repairs, $167.96. Last year, 1878, the average number was 1,340, and the cost, of their support per capita for the year was $148.51, or including repairs, $161.88. It is proper to state here that in this case as in the case of all the other asylums the salaries of officers, and clothing, are in- cluded in the total ordinary expenditures on which the per capita is based. The cost per capita of salaries and wages in the Willard Asylum has been as follows, since the opening of the institution : 1870, $83.69 ; 1871, $66.84; 1872, $57.05 ; 1873, $58.53 ; 1874, $56.80 ; 1875, §53.07 ; 1876, $49.63 ; 1877, $49.49, and 1878, §49.38. The cost of fuel and light the last year was $15.88 per capita ; for the preceding year, 1877, it, was $17.26 ; and for 1876, it was $19.76 per capita. The cost of light, alone, last year was but eighty-eight cents per capita. This is a good f showing. The gas used is made on the grounds by the institution. It is believed that this would be the wisest and most economical course to | be pursued at all our State institutions. In a number of cases this was formerly done, while in recent years contracts have been made with the gas companies in the cities or villages adjacent to the institutions. In every case the cost of light, after the change has been vastly greater than j before, and in one instance, at leasts as I was informed by the super- intendent, the quality was not so good. The charge to the counties for each patient at Willard has recently been reduced from $2.80 to $2.60 i per week. This, however, does not include clothing, which is made a i separate charge, nor officers' salaries, which are paid by the State. It should, of course, be borne in mind, when comparing the cost of support in this institution with our other State asylums, that the Willard Asylum is exclusively for the care of the chronic insane, while in the other insti- tutions a large proportion of cases are acute and of comparatively recent origin, and the possibility of their cure renders a somewhat larger scale of expenditure justifiable and necessary. i 1 24 [Senate, The State Reformatory, at Elmira, has been so recently opened that I am only able to furnish complete figures for the year 1878. For that year the average number of inmates was 231 ; the cost of their mainte- nance per capita for the year was §161.87. The cost for the year for salaries and wages was $38.87 per capita ; for provisions and supplies, §47.42, and for fuel and light, $23.65. It, is reasonable to expect, that a very large reduction can be made from these figures when the institu- tion shall have been brought into perfect order. The same remark will apply to its scale of expenditures for the last, year as has been made with regard to all other institutions newly opened, namely, that its expendi- tures were necessarily higher than for subsequent years. The New York Catholic Protectory in 1865 had an average number of 417 inmates ; the cost of their support per capita for the year was $126.51. In 1876 the average number was 2,115 and the per capita cost of support, for the year was $89.31; in 1877, with an average number of 2,284 the per capita cost, of support was $96.32. The cost per capita for the year 1865, for provisions, was $55.57 ; 1876, $38.14; 1877, $43.42. For fuel and light in 1865, the cost was $2.95 per capita for the year; 1876, §5.23 per capita ; 1877, §5.43 per capita. For salaries and wages there were expended in 1865, §11.42 per capita ; in 1876, §16.85 per capita; and in 1877, $20.11 per capita. The smallness of the item'of salaries and wages is accounted for by the fact that the officers and teach- ers of the institution, in the main, serve without compensation, having given up their lives to this work, and accepting nothing in return but their maintenance at the institution. It, will be observed by a refer- ence to the tables for the different State institutions that the cost of fuel and light has ranged from $2.95 per capita for the year, the lowest figure, to §89.57, the highest, or taking the year 1877, from §5.43 per capita, for the year, to §57.33. Financial Results in the New Y^ork State" Insane Asylums, Com- pared With Those of other States and Countries. It will be interesting at this point to compare the expenditures in the insane asylums of this State with those of corresponding institutions elsewhere. The tables in the appendix numbered from sixteen to twenty-two, inclusive, will be found of great value to those who may care to make a thorough examination of such comparative expenditures. Table No. 16 contains a classified statement of the expenditures of the State Lunatic Hospital at Northampton for the years 1860 to 1878, inclu- sive. Table No. 17 contains a detailed statement of expenditures of various hospitals for the insane for 1860. No. 18, a similar statement of various hospitals for 1865. Table No. 19, a similar statement for 1875. No. 20, a similar statement for 1876; and No. 21, a similar statement for 1877. In each of these tables are given for the various years named the average number of inmates and the aggregate as well as the per capita cost of support for the year both excluding and including ordinary repairs. The tables also contain for each year in each institution the aggregate and per capita cost of salaries and wages, provisions and sup- plies, medical stores, fuel and light, ordinary repairs, and all other ordi- nary expenses ; also the amounts paid for construction and all other extraordinary expenditures. Table No. 22 brings into comparison the results of the years named for several of the leading institutions. Table No. 4 contains a classified statement of the expenditures for various pur- No. 67.] 25 poses, and the aggregate thereof, in the New York State Lunatic Asylum at, Utica, for all the years from 1850 to 1878. inclusive. Tables numbered 5 to 11, inclusive, contain various details concerning this in- stitution. Table No. 12 contains a classified statement of the expendi- tures for all purposes, and of the aggregate thereof, in the Willard Asylum for the Insane, from 1871 to 1878, inclusive. Table No. 13 is a similar statement for the Hudson River State Hospital for the years 1873 to 1878, inclusive. Table No. 14 contains a similar classified state- ment, of expenditures of the State Homoeopathic Asylum for the Insane for the years 1875 to 1878, inclusive. A careful study of these tables will convey much interesting and useful information as to the financial history and administration of a large number of insane asylums in the United States aud elsewhere, and by a comparison of results in the best institutions with those of our own State, valuable deductions may be made. I shall here attempt, to do no more than make a brief reference to some of the figures which 'hese tables contain, for the purpose of in- dicating their general scope and character. With this view I have made a comparison of the expenditures of our three State asylums which re- ceive acute cases, with seventeen similar institutions elsewhere. The year 1877 has been selected for this purpose, because the statistics, which I have been able to gather, are much more complete for that year than for the year 1878. In fact it has been impossible to procure reports, or anything like complete statistics for the year last named, from any con- siderable number of asylums in other States. An effort was made to do so, but it resulted in failure, for the reason that in most cases the reports have not, yet been printed. Table No. 21 of appendix, from which the figures are taken which I shall here quote, contains a classified and de- tailed statement of the expenditures of forty-four insane asylums in various parts of the United States and in Canada. Thirty-four of these are State hospitals and asylums, one is the Government Hospital for the Insane at Washington, four are foreign asylums and the other five are leading county and municipal asylums in this country. I have selected thirteen of the State asylums, the Government Hospital at, Washington, two asylums in the Province of Ontario and the asylum at Halifax, Nova Scotia, for the purpose of comparison with our State asylums. These selections have been made because it is believed in each case that the institution named is of such a character and standing as to make the comparison legitimate and fair, the purpose having been to select, institutions of a high grade, so far as their standing could be ascer- tained. The Willard Asylum has not been included in the following condensed statements for the reason heretofore stated, that it is intended to receive only the chronic insane, and that a comparison of its expendi- tures with those institutions receiving acute cases would not, be fair to the latter. The first statement following, shows the average number of patients and the cost of support for the year 1877, both excluding and including repairs, of each patient in the institutions named. The second statement contains for the same year and the same insti- tutions the aggregate and the per capita cost for salaries and wages. The third statement shows for the same institutions and the same year, the cost per capita of provisions and supplies and of fuel and light. The figures for the Hudson River State Hospital are those furnished me by the superintendent before referred to, and are taken from table thirteen instead of twenty-one. -** *" 26 [Senate, No. 1. Statement showing total cost of support of each patient for the year 1877. name of institution. Average number of patients. Annual cost per capita excluding re-pairs. Annual cost per capita including re-pairs 651 472 604 347 350 571 727 476 577 563 487 770 542 411 434 463 245 608 219 109 8128 30 136 07 136 84 140 46 161 34 161 88 162 81 166 34 170 35 177 77 185 52 202 69 206 11 208 49 213 93 226 24 235 15 283 96 353 20 419 75 $133 39 2. Asylum for the Ii^ane', Brattleboro, Vermont--- 150 77 140 20 4. Hospital for the Insane, Halifax, Nova Scotia...... 154 27 167 58 166 00 7. State Lunatic Hospital, Taunton, Mass ............ 194 90 183 72 177 19 180 60 12. Government Hospital for the Insane, Washington, 217 81 213 64 216 92 219 45 231 59 16. Hospital for the Insane, Middletown, Conn........ 240 34 246 01 362 53 19. Hudson Kiver state Hospital, Poughkeepsie, N. T. 20. State Homoeopathic Asylum, Middletown, N. Y--- 365 59 431 14 No. 2. Statement showing annual cost, aggregate and per capita, for salaries and wages for the year 1877. Average number of patients. Salaries and Wages. NAME OF INSTITUTION. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. 651 472 604 347 350 571 727 476 677 563 487 770 542 411 434 463 245 608 219 190 $22,897 13 17,817 18 22,314 50 14,003 42 16,191 57 25,610 73 28,215 16 25,880 77 27,982 64 24,935 07 30,604 69 47,883 39 32,266 29 20,494 74 27,653 02 34.986 17 18,687 54 5R.H18 9. •du 18I 06 16,020 88 $35 17 37 75 36 94 40 35 46 2c 44 85 38 81 [ 8. .State Lunatic Hospital, Northampton, Mass.............. 54 37 48 49 44 29 62 84 12. Government Hospital for the lusane, Washington, D. C. 13. Hospital for the Insane, Oshkosh, Wis.................. 62 19 59 53 49 86 15. State Lunatic Asylum, Harrisburg, Pa................... 63 71 75 56 17. Hospital for the Insane, Catonsville, Md............. 76 28 18. State Lunatic Asylum, Utica, N. Y................ 93 62 19. Hudson River State Hospital, Poughkeepsie, N. Y....... 20. State Homoeopathic Asylum, Middletown, N. Y... 156 08 146 98 No. 67.] 27 No. 3. Statement showing annual cost per capita of provisions and supplies, and fuel and light, for the year 1877. NAME OF INSTITUTION. Average number of patients. Annual cost per capita of provisions and supplies. Annual cost per capita of fuel and light. 651 472 604 847 350 571 727 476 577 563 487 770 542 411 434 463 245 608 219 109 ,*53 14 72 65 54 52 58 62 56 39 70 84 71 70 59 37 55 67 64 10 63 58 101 74 72 00 81 87 74 38 79 95 77 42 105 88 140 78 157 22 $23 24 5 48 16 79 i. Asylum for the Insane, Brattlebsro, Vermont...... 4. Hospital for the Insane, Halifax, Nova Scotia...... 15 18 11 19 15 63 20 14 S. State Lunatic Hospital, Northampton, Mass....... 19 01 19 87 33 72 12 69 12. Government Hospital tor the Insane, Washington, D o .............................................. 10 55 26 46 21 07 18 83 17 51 36 63 22 03 19. Hudson River State Hospital, Poughkeepsie, N. Y. 20. State Homoeopathic Asylum, Middletown, N. Y .. 28 39 57 33 It will be seen that our State possesses the distinction of having her three asylums, in which are received for treatment the acute insane, occupy the highest place in the scale of expenditure of any in the list; and not merely the highest, but so much higher, taking the three to- gether, than any others as to attract and deserve serious consideration. A reference to table No. 21, from which the figures are taken, will show the same relative position for these institutions as compared with all the others therein contained, that is to say, of the forty-four institutions in the United States and elsewhere from which figures have been obtained, the Utica, Poughkeepsie and Middletown asylums rank highest in the scale of expenditure and in the order named. It will be noticed in state- ment No. 1 above that the costliest of the first four institutions named supported its insane during the year 1877 at a rate per capita, excluding repairs, more than $140 less than the rate at Utica, more than §210 less than the rate at Poughkeepsie, and more than $270 less than the rate at Middletown. This would represent, on the 608 patients at, Utica, an excess of more than $85,000; on the 219 patients at Poughkeepsie the excess of expenditure would be upwards of $46,000, and on the num- ber at Middletown (109) the excess is over $30,000, making a total ex- cess of more than $161,000 in the three asylums for the care of their inmates for the one vear 1877, over the rate in the highest priced insti- tution of the first four named above in statement No. 1. ^ I do not assume here to say whether or not the cost of supporting the insane in our State asylums should be reduced to the figures with which these comparisons are made. I merely call attention to them in order that the vast difference in the cost of supporting the insane in different institutions may be seen. A comparison of these figures, with the cost of maintenance in foreign insane asylums, is of interest m this connection. In Scotland, in 1876, there were 3,207 lunatics confined in royal and 28 [Senate, district asylums, and 440 in parochial asylums. The average cost of their support, per capita, including clothing and ordinary repairs, was $135.20 for the year. In England the county and borough asylums correspond to our State institutions. In them were maintained during the year 1877, 35,523 lunatics, and the average cost of their support per capita, including clothing and repairs, was 8130 for the year. From 1867 to 1877 the average cost of support in these institutions increased to the extent of one dollar and four cents per capita for the year. When it is remembered that in England the expenditures of both years were upon a gold basis, and that whatever improvement has taken place in the care of the iusane, has certainly been as great there as here, it will be seen that the plea for increased expenditures on the score of improved methods possesses little force. The Massachusetts State Lunatic Hospital at Northampton. This institution ranks among the foremost in the country, both for its financial management and general administration. Its superintendent, Dr. Pliny Earle, is one of the oldest and most favorably known of asylum superintendents in the United States. He has been at the head of the hospital at Northampton for more than thirteen years. Many years ago he was the superintendent of the Bloomingdale asylum in the city of New York. His long experience and his natural capacity for the work have enabled him to make the Northampton hospital a model institution. The result of a visit to it, and a careful examination both into its methods of financial management and general administration, convinced me that it provides for the care of the insane in a manner calculated to secure the best results, and that those who would ask for more in a State insti- tution must, have in their minds a very high standard. From Table No. 16 of the appendix, I reproduce a few figures to show its financial history ai.d operations. In 1860, with an average number of 259 iumates, the per capita cost of their support was $174.84 for the year, or including repairs, $179.11. In 1865, with 342 inmates, the per capita cost of sup- port, was $208.02 for the year, or including repairs, $216.34. In 1875, with an average number of 475 inmates, the per capita cost of their sup- port for the year was $173.18, or including repairs, $190.47. In 1876, with 474 inmates, the per capita cost was $167.08, or including repairs, $188.70. In 1877, with an average number of 476 inmates, the per capita cost of support for the year was $166.34, or including repairs, $183.73. In 1878, with 442 inmates, the per capita cost of support for the year was $159.93, or including repairs, $171.94. The following extract, taken from the last, annual report of this institution, gives an interesting ac- count of its financial operations since 1865: "Although a State institution, this hospital has received no gratuitous assistance from the State since the spring of 1867. Since that time it has relied for its income solely upon the products of its farm, the board bills of its patients, and the small sum of ten dollars each for the burial expenses of State patients who die in the hospital. The receipts from the last, mentioned source during the past year were one hundred dollars. " For the entire support of State patients, including clothing and all loss from breakage and other kinds of destruction, the hospital receives three dollars and fifty cents each per week from the treasury of the Com- monwealth. This is the compensation fixed by the statute law. Nearly No. 67.] 29 one-half of the inmates belong to this class. During the past year the weekly average of them was 48.14 per cent of the whole. " For town patients it receives three dollars and fifty cents each per week, from the town treasurers respectively, for board, together with pay for clothing furnished by the hospital, and for damages suffered from them. Of town patients the weekly average for the year was^ 39.75 per cent, or about two-fifths of the whole. " For private patients there is no uniform price. The average pay from all who were here September 30,1878, was five dollars and seven- teen cents aud three mills each per week. Clothing and damages are extra charges. The weekly average of these patients during the past year was 10.12 per cent, or a trifle more than one-tenth of the whole " The average weekly pay per capita which the hospital received for all its patients, State, town and private, in the course of the year, is three dollars and seventy cents and eight mills. Such are the only pe- cuniary resources of the hospital. We turn to the results of " The Finance of the Last Thirteen Years. " In April, 1865, the hospital was freed from debt, and the financial statement at the close of that month showed a balance of $302.04 in its favor. Between that time and the first of June, 1867, it received a di- rect bonus from the State of $5,000, in two appropriations, for specific purposes, one of $2,000 and the other of $3,000. "As an offset to the $5,000 bonus, the hospital has purchased and paid for several lots of land, amounting to about one hundred and forty-two acres, the total cost of which was $22,565. The State, then, has been overpaid for its bonus in the sum of $17,565. "The amount paid by the hospital for repairs and improvements in the course of the thirteen years from September 30, 1865, to September 30, 1878, is $156,701.31. " The surplus of cash assets now on hand is $27,590.88, or $27,288.84 larger than it was on the 30th of April, 1865. " The purchased provisions and supplies, including fuel and stored clothing now on hand, are estimated to have cost $11,019.57. The amount, of similar supplies on the 30th of April, 1865, was $2,500. The increase of assets under this head is, therefore, $8,519.57. " The value of household furniture in the hospital is, at a low estimate, at least $10,000 greater than it was on the 30th of April, 1865, at, the same rate or standard of appraisal. To be certain, however, of no exag- geration, let it be called $8,000. Collecting these several sums, the account of debit of the Commonwealth to the hospital appears to be as follows: Excess of cost of land over direct bonus............................. f-I'^m 3i Repairs and improvements......................................... 1^°' '£ 6L Excess of present cash assets....................................... r mq ?7 Increase of provisions and supplies.................................. &qqo 00 Increase of furniture..............................................._____'_______ Total......................................................... ^218,074^72 " The necessary current repairs of the buildings may be estimated at $3,000 annually. Deducting this sum for each of the thirteen years since September 30, 1865, a total of $39,000, there is a .remainder of $179 074/72. To this amount, then, has the hospital assisted itself to L 30 [Senate, things, for most of which it is generally expected that such institutions will rely upon direct appropriations from the treasury of the Common- wealth." Let us contrast this with the financial results in the asylum at Utica for the same period. It appears from the report of the superintendent of the Utica Asylum that for the year ending November 30th, 1878, there was received from sundry counties for patients' board, clothing, and miscellaneous expenses, the sum of $101,946.51; from sundry pri- vate patients, $54,805.57, making a total of $156,752.08 received from counties and private patients. Dividing this sum by 600, the average number of patients for the year, we find that the average amount re- ceived for each patient was $261.25, or a trifle over five dollars per week, as against three dollars, seventy cents and eight mills at Northampton. To this latter sum, however, should be added a few cents, not to exceed twenty, to cover the amount received for clothing and damages from town and private patients. It therefore appears that for the year 1878 the amount received on account of patients was at least a dollar and ten cents per capita per week more at Utica than at Northampton; or stated for the year, the amount received from counties and private patients was $57.25 per capita more thin was received from correspond- ing sources at Northampton. The excess of receipts from these sources at Utica over Northampton was greater, rather than less than this amount, for the twelve years preceding 1878, yet we find that while at Northampton during the years 1866 to 1878 inclusive, every expense, including repairs and improvements to the extent of $156,701.31, has been met out of the receipts from patients, the Utica asylum, with its receipts from this source $57.25 per capita for the year greater than at Northampton, has received from the State, during the thirteen years from 1866 to 1878 inclusive, the same period covered by the figures given above, $156,159.37 for salaries, and $384,886.71 for additions, altera- tions, repairs and other purposes, making a total of $541,046.08 received from the State, in addition to the amount received on account of board of patients. This contrast appears the more striking, when it is reflected that the excess of receipts from patients, $57.25 per capita, multiplied by the average number of inmates in the Utica asylum for 1878, produces the sum of $34,350 for that single year. If it be claimed that at Utica the proportion of private patients is somewhat larger than at Northamp- ton, and that the excess of cost of support of county patients beyond four dollars falls upon these private patients; I would suggest whether it might not, have been expected for this very reason that the State should be free from these large annual demands upon its revenues. If the com- parison between a first class institution like Northampton and the Utica asylum is so unfavorable to the latter as regards financial results, what shall be said of the asylum at Poughkeepsie, the per capita cost of sup- port at which was more than sixty-six dollars greater than at Utica, or of the Middletown asylum, the per capita cost of support in which was, for the year 1878, more than $116 greater than at Utica. From the result of my visit both to the Northampton and Utica asylums, lam of the opinion that in every point, except as to the number of attendants, the former institution compares favorably with the latter. In point of clean- liness and wholesomeness on all the floors above the basement each insti- tution seems perfect. In the basement story, where are located in each case the store-rooms, bakery and kitchens, the Northampton institution was superior, being more free from offensive odors, and in every way better arranged, if one who is not an expert can judge of these matters. I No. 67.] 31 It ought not to cost as much as $4,000 a year, or less than ten dollars per capita, to give Northampton a sufficient number of additional attend- ants to meet the only possible criticism to be made upon its administra- tion. In respect to diet, I am inclined to believe that in quantity and | quality it is equal to Utica. If it is not, I am very confident in saying ' that, the excess at. Utica is unnecessary and does not add to its curative results. I have spoken particularly of the Utica asylum, because it is by far the best known of our State institutions, if not of all the asylums in the country. Its superintendent, Dr. Gray, is widely and justly cele- brated for his skill as a medical superintendent, and for the organization and discipline which he has developed in the institution over which he presides. It is hardly to be expected that a medical superintendent in an institution with 600 inmates, charged with the duties that belong to his position, can at the same time bring to its business administration the qualities and the close attention which are requisite to secure the most economical results consistent with the maintenance of a proper I standard of care. It is phenomenal when, in the same individual, are united in the highest degree the capacity for medical superintendence i and business administration. During my examination at Utica, I thought, I could see some of the reasons which contributed to its large scale of expenditures. Its purchases are largely made of business houses [ in Utica, with wThich an understanding exists that they are to furnish supplies to the institution at, five per cent advance upon the cost to them. At Northampton, as at Willard, in this State, bids are invited from all the leading wholesale houses in the largest cities for furnishing the sup- plies needed in these institutions, and I am convinced that this course leads not merely to the saving of the five per cent alluded to, but to the securing of prices considerably below the cost to the middle men who re- ceive the five per cent at Utica. Prior to 1860 the Utica Asylum manufactured its own gas. From the report of the trustees for that year (1860) I quote : " A contract has been made with the Utica Gas Company to supply the asylum with coal gas of standard illuminating quality, for ten years, at the rate of $2.85 per 1,000 feet, with a promise of a ratable deduction from that price when- ever the company shall reduce the price charged to its general con- sumers, which is $3.50 per 1,000 feet. The contract requires a long line of independent main pipe to be laid by the company, and contains such I agreements and conditions as were deemed necessary to protect, the ! interests of the institution in all respects in reference to this subject. The gas is only about to be introduced and we cannot yet speak of its results." In the report of the previous year it, had been stated that the i gas company would not agree to furnish the supply at such rates as they (the trustees) were willing to pay, unless the asylum would contribute at least $1,500 towards the expense of laying the necessary main iron pipes. Now, since it appears that in the following year the gas com- pany consented to lay this long line of independent main pipe, at its own expense, prj/ided the institution would enter into a ten years' con- tract to pay $2.85 per thousand for gas, a sum sixty-five cents less than was being charged to general consumers, and a sum which was to be ratably reduced when a reduction was made to snch general consumers, irfis tolerably evident that the gas company fixed its price and the term of years with a view to get back, in addition to the cost of the gas furn- ished and a reasonable profit upon it, the cost of the independent main pipe alluded to. And it would seem entirely reasonable to have ex- 32 [Senate, pected, that, after the expiration of this contract, gas should be furn- ished to the institution at a reduction from the price charged to general consumers, at least as great, if not greater than that named in the con- tract. Yet, when I came to inquire into this subject, I found that the institution was paying $2.50 cash per thousand for its gas, which was the precise sum paid by the smallest general consumers in Utica, and which was twenty-five cents per thousand more than the amount paid by the hotels, whose consumption is less than that of the asylum. Now turn for a moment to the tables and note this fact, that the cost of light at Utica for the year 1878 was $6.13 per capita, while at the Willard Asylum, which makes its own gas, the cost of light was eighty-eight cents per capita. This, in itself, is not a very large item, nor did the failure of the superintendent and the managers see to it that they secured from the gas company the terms to which they were entitled, make a difference of any vast, sum to the institution ; but it can readily be seen that if in other details the same liberality toward those who furnished supplies to the institution, and the same failure to secure the best, possible terms was exhibited, we have gone far toward discovering at least one of the reasons why the cost of support is so much greater than at an institution like Northampton, where every detail is more care- fully scrutinized. I am glad to believe there is no reason for thinking that dishonesty or intentional wrong-doing exists iu connection with the business adminis- tration of any of the institutions which I have been called upon to exam- ine, but I am equally convinced that many of them, including the Utica Asylum, have grown into loose and somewhat, careless methods of busi- ness administration. I do not refer so much to the system of book- keeping, or of making up their reports, as to the failure, similar to the one I have just recited, to secure, iu every instance down to the smallest detail, the best possible terms in making purchases and contracts for the State. I believe it is because this is done at, Northampton, that that institution, while maintaining a high standard of care, shows such favor- able financial results ; and I equally believe because it is not, done in all the institutions of this State, that some of them are justly liable to the criticism that they are extravagantly conducted. It is not strange that it should be so, and they are not singular in this respect. In all depart- ments of government, Federal, State and local, extravagance and loose methods came to prevail during the war, and for many years succeeding it. Probably the institutions most subject to criticism on this score, could challenge a comparison of their affairs with other departments of State and local administration. The evil is one of the times, and it is only recently that public attention has been directed to it to a sufficient extent to insure its correction. The Argument for Expensive Management. There have been many pleas made for high-priced management on the ground that the percentage of recoveries could be largely increased by the improved methods and care which it, was claimed rendered neces- sary the enhanced cost of support. The average life of the incurably insane may be stated at from thirteen to seventeen years. An ingenious argument is made, that it is better to spend $300 on the acute case and discharge it cured at the end of the first year than to confine the expend- iture to $150, and have the case become incurable, thus subjecting the No. 67.] 33 community to the necessity of continuing the expenditure of $150 per annum for thirteen to seventeen years longer. There is scarcely a State to whose authorities some such argument as this has not been ad- dressed. The possible proportion of recoveries has been stated as high as eighty per cent. There would be much force in this argument if it could be demonstrated that recoveries are in proportion to cost of treat- ment. A brief examination of this question will be of interest. Such an examination will show that since 1850, during the very period when the cost of asylum management has so largely increased, there has been a steady decrease in the number of reported recoveries. Dr. Chapin, the Superintendent of the Willard Asylum, in a " Report on Insanity," read before the Conference of Public Charities at Saratoga, N. Y., September 5th, 1877, uses the following language : " The results of the modern asylum management, being an improve- ment upon the system preceding it, must be accepted as the best now attainable. It appears from an examination of reports of treatment in three American asylums, extending over a period of thirty years, that in the first asylums examined the percentage of recoveries to admissions for a decade, ending with the year: 1856, was................................................................. 43 1866, was................................................................. 34 1876, was................................................................. 35 " In the second asylum examined, the per cent of recoveries on admis- sions for the decade ending : 1856, was................... ............................................ 44 1866, was................................................................ 41 1876, was................................................................ 41 | " In the third asylum, the same, for decade ending: 1856, was.................................................................. 42 1866, was.................................................................. 39 1876, was................................................................ . 35 In the English county, private and borough asylums, the per cent of recoveries on admissions for eight years was........................................... 34 For ten years, ending 1876...........................<..................... 34 ****** " These statistics show results quite uniform in the treatment of the insane in different asylums, and under various systems, both in this country and in Great Britain. It also appears that, notwithstanding the advance of science, the percentage of recoveries during the last decade has not increased, but is not quite equal to that reported during the first decade." Dr. Chapin's deductions are more'than confirmed by further investi- gation. The Utica Asylum was opened in 1843. The per centage of recoveries for the first five years of its existence, based on its average population, was 49J. The percentage of recoveries on the average population for the last five years has been 22£. The difference is not so striking when the comparison is made of the per centage of recoveries based on admis- sions, but in this case also the per centage is much smaller for the last five years than for the first five years in the life of the institution. On the other hand, the per centage of deaths whether based on the whole number treated, or on the average population has been larger for the past five years than for the first five years after the opening of the asylum, yet, in the intervening time the expenses have doubled. [Senate Doc. No. 67.] 3 34 [Senate, Dr. Earle in his last annual report discusses this question in so forcible and interesting a manner that I cannot do better than to quote his words. He says: " Studies Relative to the Curability of Insanity. "In our last three preceding reports, the question of curability has been subjected to a somewhat searching investigation, by which it, was shown that the permanent recoveries from mental disorders are far less frequent than has generally been supposed, and that a very considerable proportion of the reported recoveries are not recoveries of so many different persons, but merely the recoveries of one person, or a few persons, a large number of times. Instances were given in which one person was re- ported recovered six times, and another seven times, in one year; and others in which in the course of their lives respectively, one person had been reported recovered twenty-two times, and another forty-six times. The duplicate and multiplicate recoveries of these few persons have led public opinion astray by having as reported, the appearance of per- manent recoveries of a large number of different persons. * * * "Are Recoveries in Proportion to Cost of Treatment ? " The proposition involved in this interrogation would not be devoid of interest at any time ; but at this juncture, after the experience of the last few years in greatly increasing the cost of hospitals, under a vague impression that recoveries from insanity, will always be in direct ratio with the sum of pecuniary expense, it becomes a matter of absolute importance. " That, degree of bodily comfort which is necessarily included in the best, attainable hygienic condition—pure air, cleanliness of person and surroundings, sufficient wholesome and nutritious food, a proper amount of exercise, and protection from the inclemencies of the weather—is doubtless essential to the attainment of the greatest probability of cure; but it is quite doubtful, that, beyond this attainment, the lavishing of money, however profusely, in mere luxuries, is of any benefit. And yet there are many persons who think that, it is, and who measure their hope of recovery by the sum of money expended. To such an extent, indeed, is this notion sometimes carried in practice, that the very object of treat- ment is apparently thereby defeated, and recovery is prevented, instead of secured. " There are no statistics by which either the affirmative or the nega- tive of our proposition can be positively demonstrated ; but there are some which offer an interesting study when considered in relation to it, and, so far as they go, would seem to prove that increase of expenditure does not enlarge the proportion of cures. I allude particularly to the statistics of the McLean Asylum, at Somerville, Mass., one of the oldest corporate institutions for the insane in the United States. In 1840 that asylum was under the medical care of Dr. Luther V. Bell. In the course of that year 155 patients were admitted, and the reported recoveries were seventy-five, which is equal to 48.38 per cent of the admissions. The average weekly cost of support of the patients was, for that year, three dollars and fourteen cents each ; in other words, when paying three dollars and fourteen cents each, per week, forty-eight patients in the 100 recovered. No. 67.] 35 " Thenceforward, although with some fluctuation from year to year, tliere was, upon the whole, a gradual increase in the current expenses of the institution, until, in 1875, the average weekly cost for each patient was twenty-one dollars and seven cents. The increase of cost during the period of thirty-five years was 671 per cent, or a small fraction less than seven-fold. In the course of that period, the Appleton wards, which for luxurious accomodation will not suffer by comparison with the best in Europe, were erected, as well as the two buildings for refractory patients, which, so far as I am informed, are unequaled by any others in the world. " With these additional elegancies of accommodation, and a nearly seven-fold augmentation of current expense, what was the condition of things in regard to recoveries ? Were they increased, not, indeed, seven, nor six, nor five, nor even three-fold (for that, would have been impossible); but were they doubled ? Alas, no ! They had diminished sixty-one per cent of the ratio in 1840; so that, instead of forty-eight (48.38) recoveries to the hundred admissions, there were only nineteen (18.82). The number of* patients admitted in 1875, the closing year of the period, was eighty-five, and the number of recoveries sixteen, equal to 18.82 per cent. "The following table has been prepared in justification of the foregoing assertions. Beginning with the year 1840, it was intended to present the results of every fifth year subsequently, until 1875. The reports, however, of several of those years, were not readily accessible, and con- sequently the available years most nearly approaching those fifth years were taken. The years 1876 and 1877 were added to show that the diminished proportion of recoveries was not a temporary incident. DATE. Admitted. Recovered. Daily average. Whole cost. Weekly cost per capita. Per cent of recoveries. 1840............ 155 148 143 120 123 131 111 ,82 79 93 85 92 110 75 65 82 59 56 61 54 38 33 15 16 18 15 128 164 171 195 192 185 193 166 187 173 151 160 175 $20,919 63 32,892 00 33,130 09 46,724 31 60,867 26 59,478 92 63,311 87 120,885 84 134,339 63 152,327 60 165,660 47 164,973 80 143,146 94 S3 14 3 85 3 70 4 61 6 09 6 16A 6 30 12 50 13 81 16 50 21 07 19 72 15 66 48 3S 1846........... 43 92 1848............ 57 34 1854............ 49 16 1855............ 4.5 53 1859........... 46.56 1861............ 48.65 1865........... 1870........... 1872............ 46.34 41.77 16.13 1875............ 18.82 1876............ 19 56 1877............ 13.63" -------.—t— This would seem effectually to dispose of the argument for a high rate of expenditure based on the theory of increased curative results. The Urgency of Retrenchment. The necessity for retrenchment to the lowest point consistent with reasonable and proper care is urgent. The saving of money which would result is not the chief consideration. A much more important one is to extend the benefits of our charities to all who are entitled thereto. There is a limit to the amount which the State and the counties will provide for charitable purposes. It is better that this sum, whatever it way be, should be used in such a way as to reach all those for whom it I 36 [Senate, is intended, than that half of them should be maintained in State insti- tutions in a costly manner and at a^high rate of expenditure per capita, while the other half are left without even such ordinary care as humanity demands. Of course it would be pleasing to organize and carry on a system of charitable work which would leave nothing to be desired. There are many cases of illness constantly coming under our observation where an ocean voyage or a long rest from work and care, combined with good living and agreeable surroundings, would not merely be a blessing to the individual, but where such means would save a valuable life to the community, which for want of them is lost. It might be well, if in these cases, government or society could step in and provide all these desirable things, but it is impossible. If the effort were seriously made, only a few could receive aid to such an extent, and the great mass of sufferers would be left without that aid and assistance which it is the duty of the community to extend. The argument is not for push- ing economy to the extent of parsimony; but for such reasonable pru- dence as will enable the authorities, with the amount of money at their disposal, to reach all, instead of half, those for whom it is our duty to care. It is necessary to consult what we have to do with, as well as what we would like to do. If there are so many thousand who need our care—and we know from experience that there is a limit to the means which it, is possible to obtain for that purpose—it is surely the dictate of prudence, of wisdom, and, not less, of true philanthropy, to exercise such a supervision and degree of economy as will allow all to participate in the blessings of our charity, rather than that a few should receive everything that is desirable and the many nothing. The temptation, however, in public institutions is all the other way. Even the best and most careful of men placed in charge of an institution, and having nothing to do but to go to the Legislature for such sums as they may deem neces- sary, in excess of their receipts from other sources, will find it extremely difficult, to resist the natural inclination to introduce all possible improve- ments, to give all possible comforts, and generally, not to look quite so closely to the expenditures of their institutions as they would were they responsible for the care of all the wards of the State. I have spoken thus far in this report, of the cost of support in various institutions, without discriminating as to the sources of revenue. The claim is often made that the State ought not to complain, because it after all bears only a portion of the expense of the State institutions; and, as to the insane asylums, only a comparatively small portion of such ex- penses ; that in these latter, the bulk of revenue comes from the counties and a considerable sum from private patients. In reply to this, it is to be said that the people of the counties are the same who constitute the State, and it cannot make much difference to those visited by the tax gatherer whether the burdens of oppresive taxation fall upon them as county or as State taxpayers. The State provides these institutions; in most cases legislates as to their superintendence, and by law regulates the sending to them o'f their inmates. It is the duty of the State to see that tl.ey are carefully conducted. There is a very positive and growing discontent in a large number of counties with the price which they have to pay for the care of their in- sane in the State asylums, and in a number of them steps have recently been taken with a view to withdrawing their cases from the care of the State and providing for them at home. I have no doubt it will be found necessary, in the near future, to make a considerable reduction from the No. 67.] 37 sum of four dollars a week now charged at Utica, and the four dollars and a-half a week charged at Poughkeepsie and Middletown for county patients, yet how can this be done if even at present prices one of these institutions finds a certain deficiency staring it in the face, while the other two are obliged year after year to come to the State for appropria- tions for purposes which ought properly to be provided for out of ordinary receipts. I do not see how the conclusion can be resisted that there must be a reduction in the scale of expenditure. Cost of Buildings. This subject has been so thoroughly discussed in recent years, and the popular condemnation of the extravagance which has been exhibited is so marked that little need here be said in regard to it. The erection of the Hudson River State Hospital for the Insane was begun in 1867. The institution now has a maximum capacity of 350, and its cost, exclu- sive of land, furniture, improvements and some other items which should properly be included in construction account, has been $1,163,502. This makes the per capita cost of the bare buildings, $3,324. There are in the county of Dutchess, in which this institution is located, 13,224 private dwellings, the value of which is $29,534,993, making the average cost of each dwelling $2,233.44, the average number of persons to each dwelling being a trifle under six. The average per capita value of all the private dwellings in the county is $386.92, being slightly more than one-ninth of the cost of the buildings erected by the State for the care of the indigent insane. It seems strange that the per capita cost of build- ings erected for a charitable purpose and to hold over 300 inmates should be nearly nine times as great as the per capita valuation of the separate dwellings in wThich reside the people, who not only support themselves, but who are relied upon to furnish the means for such extravagant ex- penditure. The building of the Homoeopathic Asylum for the Insane, at Middle- town, was commenced in 1872. Its present capacity is 200 ; cost of its construction excluding land, furniture, improvements of ground, etc., has been $436,147 ; making the per capita cost of buildings alone, $2,180. The per capita value of the private dwellings in Orange county in which this institution is located is $377.90. The inmates of this institution are therefore housed at a cost between five and six times as great as the per capita value of the dwellings of the self-supporting residents of the county. There had been expended upon the Buffalo State Asylum for the In- sane up to September thirtieth last $1,096,352.91. This institution is not yet open for inmates ; but is, I believe, expected to be so during the present year. The Willard Asylum with a capacity of 1,500 has cost for construction of buildings $1,008,476, the per capita cost being $672. I am of opinion that it would be to the advantage of the State to erect at Willard an ad- ' ditional group of detached buildings similar to those already completed. While it may be admitted that the cost of buildings for the reception of acute cases of insanity is necessarily somewhat higher than those in- tended only for chronic insane, it is not believed that the excess should be more than $200 per capita. Dr. Wilbur in a paper on " Buildings for the Insane, read at the Saratoga Conference of Charities, September 6, 1877, uses the following language : 38 [Senate, " To appreciate the stupendous folly of such expenditure of the public money, it may be mentioned that the cost of the ten most expensive hotels in America would probably not exceed $1,500 a guest. And, furthermore, that in a legislative investigation (in the State of Massa- chusetts), in regard to the expenditure of public money, in the case of one of these asylums, superintendents of insane asylums, experts, testi- fied ' that buildings at a cost of a thousand dollars a patient, with no expense for mere architectural display, would still afford all that is essential or really desirable for the treatment of the insane.'' ' That not a patient would be cured at one of these expensive hospitals, that could not be cured at those built at the smaller cost named.' " Dr. Wilkins, a commissioner appointed by the State of California, after visiting all the leading institutions of this country and Europe, thus speaks in his report to the Legislature of that State, of the Willard Asylum for chronic insane, in the State of New York, which cost less than $1,000 a patient. After mentioning its splendid location, beautiful and picturesque surroundings, and excellent arrangements, he adds: ' We failed to discover even the shadow of a reason why a person, becom- ing insane in the neighborhood of this beautiful asylum, should be sent to Utica because he was considered curable.' " The sums already unnecessarily expended in the construction of the extravagant buildings at, Poughkeepsie, Buffalo and Middletown, would have made ample provision for the care of all the insane in the poor- houses of the State in those counties not exempt from the operations of the Willard Asylum act, under chapter 713 of the Laws of 1871, and in which no adequate provision is made for their support. The recent strong appeal of the State Board of Charities to the Legislature presents, in a forcible manner, the urgent necessity for such provision. In this instance, at least, the wasteful expenditure of money in the erection of too costly edifices has operated to deprive nearly a thousand indigent insane of any participation in the charity of the State, in order that a smaller number of other insane may be housed in an unnecessarily luxurious and costly manner. The cost of building and furnishing the New York State Lunatic Asylum at Utica, from 1839 to 1857, inclusive, including the cost of in- troducing steam heating and ventilating apparatus ($144,957.90) and an appropriation made in 1857 for reconstructing center building and por- tions of wings and the barns destoryed by fire ($68,742), was $642,799.90. From the opening, 1843 to 1857 iuclusive, the sum expended for addi- tions, alterations and repairs was $58,675.15; from 1858 to 1867, inclu- sive, the sum expended for additions, alterations and repairs was $119,538.41, and from 1868 to 1878, inclusive, the sum expended for the same purpose was $314,404.81. From 1866 to 1878 inclusive, a period of thirteen years, there was paid by the State to the several asylums for the insane for construction, salaries, maintenance and other purposes the sum of $5,495,668.30. About half of this sum was contributed by the counties of New York and Kings, which provide for their own insane in their own buildings and at their own expense. The State Reformatory at Elmira, in the county of Chemung, was completed in 1876. Its maximum capacity is 600, and the cost of its buildings was $1,128,314, amounting to $1,880 per capita for each pos- sible inmate. The average number of inmates for the past year was 231. The per capita valuation of private dwellings in Chemung county, r No. 67.] 39 mainly occupied by the non-criminal class, is $402. If the Legislature shall deem it wise to take steps looking to the erection of a reformatory for wonfen, it is to be hoped that those who may be charged with the work will be content to begin with a small and comparatively inexpen- sive building, and to increase the accommodations only when the de- mands upon it shall indicate such a necessity. Comparatively few people outside of those brought into direct contact with them appreciate the magnitude of the charities of our State. It is far from my purpose to withhold the praise due to those who manage them. One cannot spend much time in looking into the subject without becoming deeply impressed with the sacrifices made by so many noble men and women in a work, the only reward of which is the conscious- ness of doing good. Many of the managers of our State institutions give much valuable time and the most, careful attention to duties which are not only self-imposed and without reward, but which, though fully as useful, do not confer any such special distinction as is the case in the faithful performance of another kiud of public work. The superintend- ents and officers, generally, of. the charitable institutions of the State accept onerous responsibilities and the hardest kind of work for small compensation. They are mostly men and women who have consecrated their lives to the service in which they are engaged ; and I am persuaded that in almost every case they are unselfishly devoted to a work, than which surely none can be nobler or more useful. 1 believe that no class of public servants are more conscientious. If they have allowed, in some cases, the expenditures of their institutions to increase unduly, they have only fallen into a habit of the times; they are not singular. Indeed, their very zeal for good and for producing the best results, coupled with the fact that they have only to consider the one institution | under their care, is apt to produce just that tendency towards a too liberal scale of expenditure which a more direct State supervision is needed to counteract and restrain. In the course of my investigations a large amount of information has been gathered, which it has been determined not to include either in this report or in the tables and comments in the appendix. This infor- mation relates to the system of purchasing and distributing supplies; of keeping accounts, and of the general management and discipline of the several institutions. A more or less full description of the system of keeping the books of each institution, with blank forms illustrating the manner in which supplies are ordered, charged and accounted for, has been obtained. Also, in many cases, plans of buildings, with a full de- scription and a detailed statement of their cost. It, was the original in- tention to embody these details in comments attached to the tables, but as the appendix has already grown to a greater length than was expected, and as the kind of information to which I have referred will be useful rather to those who may be charged with the duty of unifying the sys- tems now existing than to the general public, it has been deemed best to omit them, and to place them on file in your office, where they will be f accessible to those who desire to consult them. It is proper that I should, in this place, acknowledge the obligation I am under to the officers of the State Board of Charities for the readi- ness with which they have placed at my disposal all the sources of infor- mation at their command, and the interest which they have kindly manifested in my work. 40 [Senate, I should also acknowledge my indebtedness to the Commissioners of Charities and Correction in the city of New York, and to the superinten- dent's and officers of the various institutions under their charge, and I desire to mention the very creditable condition of those institutions con- sidering the means at their disposal. The charities of the city of New York, vast beyond my previous conceptions, would certainly not seem to be subject to the charge of extravagance in management. To Dr. Earle, of the Northampton Asylum, in Massachusetts, and to the Superintendents and other officers of all the institutions, I have visited in this State I am indebted for the utmost courtesy and for all the aid, most cheerfully rendered, which they could give me. I have the honor to be, very respectfully, Your obedient servant, EDGAR K. APGAR. No. 67.] 41 TABLES CONTAINED IN THE APPENDIX TO THE EEPORT. Table No. 1. List of institutions examined, embracing the several State institutions and others receiving aid from the State, their location, date of open- ing, name and date of appointment of the superintendent. Table No. 2. Classified valuation of State institutions, their capacity, number of acres, cost of land, per capita cost of buildings, and average number of in- mates, for the year 1878. HOSPITALS FOR THE INSANE. Table No. 3. List of principal hospitals for the insane in the United States, their location, name, date of opening, capacity, number of acres, cost of land and buildings, and number of inmates. Table No. 4. Detailed statement of expenditures of the New York State Lunatic Asylum, Utica, for the years 1850 to 1878, inclusive. Table No. 5. Detailed statement of receipts of the New York State Lunatic Asylum, Utica, for the years 1860 to 1878, inclusive. Table No. 6. Tabular statement of expenditures and legislative appropriations for buildings, furnishing, etc., 1839 to 1857, inclusive, Utica Asylum. Table No. 7. Statement of expenditures and legislative appropriations for water supply, 1844 to 1873, inclusive, Utica Asylum. Table No. 8. Statement of expenditures and legislative appropriations for land, im- provement of grounds, sewers, fences, farm buildings, city assess- ments for paving and grading, 1836 to 1878, inclusive, Utica Asylum. Table No. 9. Tabular statement of expenditures for additions, alterations and repairs from opening January 1843, to December 1, 1878, Utica Asylum. 42 [Senate, Table No. 10. Statement showing the amounts received from counties for patients dur- ing the year 1878, Utica Asylum. Table No. 11. Statement showing the amounts received from private patients during the year 1878, Utica Asylum. Table No. 12. Detailed statement of expenditures of the Willard Asylum for the Insane, Willard, N. Y., for the years 1870 to 1878, inclusive. Table No. 13. Detailed statement of expenditures of the Hudson River State Hos- pital, Poughkeepsie, N. Y., for the years 1873 to 1878, inclusive, made up from annual reports to the Legislature and State Board of Charities. Detailed statement of expenditures of same hospital, furnished by the superintendent, as the actual expenditures and indebtedness incurred chargeable to each year, 1873 to 1878, inclusive. Table No. 14. Detailed statement of expenditures of the State Homoeopathic Asylum for the Insane, Middletown, N. Y., for the years 1875 to 1878, inclusive. Table No. 15. Detailed statement of expenditures of the Asylum for Insane Criminals, Auburn, N. Y., for the years 1859 to 1878, inclusive. Table No. 16. Detailed statement of expenditures of the State Lunatic Hospital, Northampton, Mass., for the years 1860 to 1878, inclusive. Table No. 17. Detailed statement of expenditures of various hospitals for the insane in the United States for the year 1860. Table No. 18. Detailed statement of expenditures of various hospitals for the insane for the year 1865. Table No. 19. Detailed statement of expenditures of various hospitals for the insane for the year 1875. Table No. 20. Detailed statement of expenditures of various hospitals for the insane for the year 1876. Table No. 21. Detailed statement of expenditures of forty-four hospitals for the insane in the United States and elsewhere, for the year 1877. Table No. 22. Detailed statement of comparative expenditures of various hospitals for the insane for the years 1860, 1865, 1875, 1876, 1877 and 1878. No. 67.] 43 HOUSES OF REFUGE AND REFORM SCHOOLS. Table No. 23. Detailed statement of expenditures of the New York House of Refuge, Randall's Island, for the years 1860 to 1878, inclusive. Table No. 24. Detailed statement of receipts of the New York House of Refuge, Randall's Island, for the years 1860 to 1878, inclusive. Table No. 25. Detailed statement of expenditures of the Western House of Refuge, Rochester, N. Y., for the years 1860 to 1878, inclusive. Table No. 26. Detailed statement of expenditures of various houses of refuge and reform schools in the United States for the year 1860. Table No. 27. Detailed statement of expenditures of various houses of refuge and reform schools for the year 1865. Table No. 28. Detailed statement of expenditures of various houses of refuge and re- form schools for the year 1875. Table No. 29. Detailed statement of expenditures of various houses of refuge aud reform schools for the year 1876. Table No. 30. Detailed statement of expenditures of various houses of refuge and reform schools for the year 1877. Table No. 31. Detailed statement of comparative expenditures of various houses of refuge and reform schools for the years 1860, 1865, 1875, 1876, 1877 and 1878. INSTITUTIONS FOR THE DEAF AND DUMB. Table No. 32. Detailed statement of expenditures of the New York Institution for the Deaf and Dumb, New York city, for the years 1860 to 1878, inclusive. Detailed statement of receipts of the New York Institution for the Deaf and Dumb, for the years 1860 to 1878, inclusive. Table No. 33. Detailed statement of expenditures of the Institution for the Improved Instruction of Deaf Mutes, New York city, for the years 1871 to 1878, inclusive. L 44 [Senate, No. 67.] Table No. 34. Detailed statement of expenditures of the Le Couteulx St. Mary's Insti- tution for the Instruction of Deaf Mutes, Buffalo, N. Y., for the years 1873 to 1878, inclusive. Table No. 35. Detailed statement of comparative expenditures of various institutions for the deaf and dumb in the United States, and elsewhere, for the years 1860, 1865, 1875, 1876, 1877 and 1878. INSTITUTIONS FOR THE BLIND. Table No. 36. Detailed statement, of expenditures of the New York Institution for the Blind, New York city, furnished by the superintendent, for the years 1860 to 1878, inclusive. Table No. 37. Detailed statement of expenditures of the New York State Insti ution for the Blind, Batavia, for the years 1870 to 1878, inclusive. Table No. 38. Detailed statement of comparative expenditures of various institutions for the blind in the United States and elsewhere, for the years 1860, 1865, 1875, 1876, 1877 and 1878. ASYLUMS FOR IDIOTS OR FEEBLE-MINDED YOUTH. Table No. 39. Detailed statement of expenditures of the New York Asylum for Idiots, Syracuse, for the years 1861 to 1878, inclusive. Table No. 40. Detailed statement of comparative expenditures of various asylums'for idiots or feeble-minded youth in the United States and elsewhere, for the years 1865, 1875, 1876, 1877 and 1878. MISCELLANEOUS. Table No. 41. Detailed statement of expenditures of the New York State Inebriate Asylum, Binghamton, for the years 1870 to 1878, inclusive. Table No. 42. Detailed statement of expenditures of the. State Emigrant Refuge and Hospital, Ward's Island, New York, for'the years, 1868, 1875, 1876, 1877 and 1878. Table No. 43. Showing the quantity and cost of various articles used at the New York Institution for the Deaf and Dumb, during the years named. Table No. 44. Showing average cost of principal articles used at various institutions in the State during the years named. APPENDIX. Table No. 1. List of Institutions Examined. NAME OF INSTITUTION. New York State Lunatic Asylum.............. Willard Asylum for tho Insane................ Hudson R iver state Hospital.................. State Homu-opatliic Asylum for the Insane.... Asylum for Insane Criminals.................. New York Institution for the Blind........... New York State Institution for the Blind..... New York Institution for the Deaf and Dumb New York Asylum for Idiots....... New York State Inebriate Asylum. New York House of Refuge..'...... Western House of Refuge.......... New York State Reformatory...... New York Catholic Protectory .... Le Couteulx St. Mary's Institution for Deaf Mutes Institution for the Improved Instiuction of Deaf Mutes Central New York Institution for Deaf Mutes St Joseph's Institution for Deal Mutes........ Western New York Institution for Deaf Mutes State Emigrant Refuge and Hospital.......... Location. Utica.......... Willard....... Poughkeepsie Middletown... Auburn....... New York city Batavia....... New Y'ork city Syracuse...... Binghamton... Randall's Island Rochester..... EI m i ra........ Westchester .. Buffalo........ New York city Rome.......... Ford ham...... Rochester..... Ward's Island. 1843 1809 1871 1674 1858 1832 1868 1818 1851 1S64 1852 1-43 187R 1803 1859 1807 1875 1875 1870 1847 Dr. John P. Gray............ Dr. John 1'.. Chapin.......... Dr. J. M. Cleveland......... Dr. Seldcn II. Talcott....... Dr Carlos F. MacDonald .. William 15. Wait............. C D Wilbor................. Dr. William Porter.......... Dr. II 15.■ Williur............ Dr. Moreau Morris.......... Israel C. Jones.............. Levi S. Fulton............... Z. R. Brock way............. Henry L. Hoguet, President Sister Mary Ann Burke..... D. Greenberger.............. E. B. Nelson................. Marv 15. Morgan............. /> F. Wester vol t............. J. D. Krehbiel............... Date of appointment. July 1 1854 Ap.ril 1 1809 March 28 1807 April 13 1877 April 1 1876 October 1 1863 August 1 3 1878 1873 1851 September July _ 10 1878 April — 1863 February 15 1870 May 12 1876 --- _ 1873 J'.uiuar ;7 187(1 March _ 1873 September l 1870 --- _ 1877 --- — 1876 OS > Table No. 2. Classified Valuation of State Institutions. NAME OF INSTITUTION. Fiscal tear closes.* New York State Lunatic Asylum....................... November 30. Willard Asylum for the Insane......................... November 30. Hudson River State Hospital.............................. November 30. State Homceopathic Asylum for the Insane............ November 30. Buffalo State Asylum for the Insanet................... December 31. Asylum for Insane Criminals............................! September 30.. New York Institution for the Blind.....................i September 30!'. New York State Institution for the Blind...............i S ptember SO . New Yrork Institution for the Deal and Dumb..........j September 30 . New Y'ork Asylum for Idiots............................< September 30.. New York State Inebriate Asylum......................! December 31.. New Yrork House of Refuge............................ December 31. . Western House, of Refuge...............................i December 31.. New \oik State Retormatory........................... December 31.. State Emigrant Refuge and Hospital.................. December 31.'. Capacity. 600 1,500 350 290 300 160 225 175 550 310 100 1,000 720 600 2,000 Real Estate. Land. No. acres. 200 776 333 211 203 8 33 66 80 55 470 37i 42 280 120 Cost. $24,879 81,200 90,000 42,117 60,000 050,000 40,000 1186,000 21,800 47,000 35,000 4,200 38,052 Buildings. $037,065 1,008,470 1,163,502 436,147 1,017,760 "194,'702 292,250 417,000 163,000 1,000,000 500,000 270,770 1,128,314 Total cost of real estate. $661,944 1,089,676 1,253,502 478,264 1,077,760 t138,775 344,702 332,250 503,000 184,800 1,047,000 535,000 274,970 1,160,366 1,304,816 Percap.ta:.n^fb3f , ,\«£t. ot inmate*, buildings. m7A ,$1,002 072 3,324 2,181 3,392 867 865 1,070 758 526 10,000 500 376 1,880 U652 600 1,340 236 130 114 200 162 494 265 46 930 588 231 483 * By a recent act ot the Legislature tbe fiscal year of all State institutions is made to correspond with the fiscal year of the State, ending September 30 t Will be ready for the reception of patients on or before October 1, 1879. t Includes $70,015 estimated value of real estate in 1860, and $62,760 for ad- dition made in 1872. g Present value of land. II Includes 28 acres upon which the institution is located, and 52 acres at Tar- rytown, N. Y. IT Includes the cost of land. Table No. 3. List of Principal Hospitals for the Insane in the United States. STATE INSTITUTIONS. LOCATION. Alabama, Tuscaloosa............ California, Stockton............. California, Napa City............ Connecticut, Middletown........ District Columbia, Washington. Georgia, Milledgeville........... Iowa, Mount Pleasant............ Iowa, Independence............. Illinois, Jacksonville............ Illinois, Elgin................... Illinois, Anna.................... Indiana, Indianapolis............ Kentucky, Lexington............ Kentucky, Hopkiusville......... Kentucky, Anchorage........... Kansas, Osawatomie............ Louisiana, Jackson.............. Maine, Augusta.................. Massachusetts, Taunton......... Massachusetts, Worcester....... Massachusetts, Northampton — Massachusetts, Dan vers......... Maryland, Catonsville........... Michigan, Kalamazoo............ Mississippi, Jackson............. Missouri, Fulton................. Missouri, St. Joseph's........... Minnesota, St. Peter's............ New Hampshire, Concord....... New Jersey, Trenton............ New Jersey, Morristown........ New York,Utica................. New York, Willard.............. Name. When opened Alabama Insane Hospital............ Asylum for the Insane................ Hospital for the Insane............... Hospital for the Insane............... Government Hospital for the Insane. State Lunatic Asylum................. Hospital for the insane............... Hospital for the Insane............... Central Insane Hospital.............. Northern Insane Hospital............ Southern Insane Hospital............. Hospital for the Insane............... Eastern Kentucky Lunatic Asylum.. Western Kentucky Lunatic Asylum.. Central Kentucky Lunatic Asylum... Kansas State Insane Asylum.......... Insane Asylum of Louisiana.......... Maine Insane Asylum................. State Lunatic Hospital................ State Lunatic Hospital................ State Lunatic Hospital................ State Lunatic Hospital................ Hospital for the Insane.............. Asylum for the Insane................ State Lnnatic Asylum....... ......... State Lunatic Asylum, No. 1.......... State Lunatic Asylum, No. 2.......... Hospital for the Insane............... Hospital for the Insane............... State Lunatic Asylum................. State Lunatic Asylum................ State Lunatic Asylum................. Asylum for the Insane................ Capacity. 1861 1853 1875 1868 1855 1842 1861 1873 1S51 1872 1873 1848 1824 1854 1873 1868 1848 1840 1854 1833 1858 1877 1872 1859 1855 1851 1874 1870 1842 1848 1876 1843 1869 400 750 628 450 563 400 350 400 600 525 500 1,200 550 350 375 150 160 400 550 700 400 600 350 550 375 350 200 500 290 500 800 600 1,500 Real Estate. Land. No of acres. 320 107 208 300 419 1,250 350 320 171 480 313 160 240 375 230 215 580 325 134 375 332 197 137 200 468 500 120 400 175 170 436 200 776 Cost. Buildings. $66,000 8,000 50,000 20,000 5,000 20,100 6,875 15,100 82,672 24,879 81,200 Total cost of real estate $569,907 350,000 370,000 1,250,000 350,000 200,000 167,546 135,000 275,000 600,000 823,297 270,000 531,250 225,000 '2,225,000 637,065 1,008,476 $250,000 583,100 1,331,000 640,043 635,907 700,000 550,000 658,000 631,000 1,258,000 400,000 283,000 220,000 172,546 423,'648 295,100 1,160,195 443,175 1,520,000 ' 830,'172 500,000 '366,006 546,650 '453,'2i 3 2,307,072 061,944 1,089,670 Per capita cost of buildings. *«625 *777 *2,119 "1,422 1,012 875 1,057 *1,750 *916 *1,253 *1,262 1,041 636 *808 533 1,117 844 *1,069 500 *1,657 *1,108 *2,533 1,714 1,497 *1,333 777 *1,500 1,062 776 •906 2,781 1,062 672 No. of patients, 1878. 400 1,202 556 463 801 500 400 360 487 464 247 600 550 377 423 230 194 410 614 524 434 136 281 700 426 350 206 530 275 520 480 600 1,340 00 W M e 39 5 4! H 42 uj 43 O 44 § 45 i2 46 k> 47 ^48 ? 49 OS50 i3 51 tLj 52 53 54 55 56 57 New York, Poughkeepsie......... New York, Middletown......... New York, Auburn................ Nebraska, Lincoln................. North Carolina, Raleigh........... Ohio, Newburgh.................. Ohio, Columbus.................... Ohio, Dayton...................... Ohio, Athens....................... Oregon, East Portland............. Pennsylvania, Harrisburg......... Pennsylvania, Danville............ Pennsylvania, Dixmont........... South Carolina, Columbus......... Tennessee, Nashville.............. Texas, Austin...................... Vermont, Brattleboro.............. Virginia, Williamsburgh........... Virginia, Richmond................ Virginia, Staunton................ Washington Territory, Steilacoom. West Virginia, Weston............. Wisconsin, Mendota..... ......... Wisconsin, Oshkosh............... Hudson River State Hospital....... State Homoeopathic Asylum........ Asylum for Insane Criminals....... Hospital for the Insane............. Insane 'lsylum for North Carolina. Cleveland Hospital for the Insane.. Hospital for the Insane............. Hospital for the Insane............. Hospital for the Insane............. Hospital for the Insane............. State Lunatic Asylum ............. State Hospital for the Insane....... Western Pennsylvania Hospital.. .. Lunatic Asylum of South Carolina. Hospital for the Insane............. State Lunatic Asylum .............. Asylum for the Insane............ Eastern Lunatic Asylum........... tCentral Lunatic Asylum........... Western Lunatic Asylum........... Asylum for the Insane.............. Hospital for the Insane............. State Hospital for the Insane....... Northern Hospital for the Insane.. 1871 1874 1859 1871 1856 1855 1839 1855 1874 1862 1851 1872 1862 1828 1852 1861 1836 1773 1870 1828 1871 1867 1860 1873 350 333 200 '211 100 8 100 190 225 203 630 128 902 300 550 170 600 150 260 150 400 131 700 250 400 375 300 50 400 450 275 78 400 600 300 200 240 48 375 270 100 450 300 300 350 400 550 380 90,000 42,117 26,000 38,000 2,500 13,000 1,163,502 436,147 950,000 70,000 200,000 965,000 550,000 405,000 575,000 STATE HOSPITALS IN PROCESS OF CONSTRUCTION, WITH PROPOSED CAPACITY. Kansas, Topcka ............. Michigan, Pontiac........... New York, Buffalo........... North Carolina, Morgantown Pennsylvania, Norristown... Pennsylvania, Warren....... Illinois, Kankakee........... State Lunatic Asylum............ Asylum for the Insane........... State Asylum for the Insane..... Asylum for the Insane........... State Hospital for the Insane__ State Hospital for tha Insane__ Eastern Hospital for the Insane. 400 400 500 400 600 500 300 1,353,502 478,264 138,775 115,000 250,000 1,000,000 1,526,226 520,000 991,0C0 568,000 407,500 300,000 350,666 "ii,'7o6 200,000 588,000 500,000 615,700 * Includes cost of land. Total cost of land and buildings of 28 State Hospitals.............. $15 983 775 Total cost of buildings of 26 State Hospitals..........................\ 15, ;;o» 190 3,3-24 2,181 *867 *1,150 •1,111 *1,587 *1,692 *945 1,583 269 500 1,379 1,375 1,355 *750 *875 *174 *533 1,916 *1,428 *1,119 $31,285,965 1,203 t For colored insane. Total capacity of 57 State Hospitals for the Insane................ Total capacity of 7 State Hospitals for the Insane in process of con- struction ................................................. ... Number of patients in 57 State Hospitals for the 'insane,'undertre'a't'- ment................................................... Average number under treatment in 'each hospital!..................... 236 130 114 93 270 600 815 571 661 235 434 355 570 322 370 250 459 306 260 360 78 420 382 557 26,083 3,100 24,928 437 © OS CD Number of acres of land attached to 57 State Hospitals for the Insane... 16,814 TABLE No. 3—(Continued). ORGANIZED CITY OR COUNTY INSTITUTIONS, WITH RESIDENT SUPERINTENDENTS. LOCATION. Illinois, Chicago.............. Maryland, Baltimore......... Massachusetts, Boston........ Missouri, St Louis............ New York, Blackwell's Island New York, Ward's Island.... New York, Rochester........., New York, Flatbush.......... New York, Troy............... New Jersey, Newark........., Ohio, Carthage................ Pennsylvania, Philadelphia ., Connecticut, Hartford......... Maryland, Baltimore.......... Massachusetts, Somerville..... Missouri, St. Louis............. New York, Manhattanville__ New York, Buffalo............. Ohio, Toledo................... Pennsylvania, Philadelphia... Pennsylvania, Frankford..... Rhode Island, Providence..... Name. Cook County Asylum................. Bay view Asylum...................... Lunatic Hospital...................... St. Louis County Asylum............. New York City Lunatic Asylum...... New York City Asylum for the Insane Monroe County Asylum............... Kings County Lunatic Asylum....... Rensselaer County Lunatic Asylum.. Essex County Lunatic Asylum....... Longview Asylum.................... Dep'tmentfor the Insane, alms-house. When opened. 1870 1839 1869 1861 1871 1857 1855 1859 i860 Capacity. 375 1,000 200 250 986 431 140 450 125 '466 500 Real Estate. Land. No. of acres. 2 43| 117 Co»t. INCORPORATED CHARITABLE INSTITUTIONS. Retreat for the Insane................. tMount Hope Retreat.................. McLean Asylum for the Insane....... tSt. Vincent's Asylum................. Bloomingdale Insane Asylum......... tProvidence Asylum................... Northwestern Hospital for the Insane. Pennsylvania Hospital for the Insane. Friends' Asylum for the Insane....... Butler Hospital for the Insane......... 1824 1867 1818 1858 1821 1861 1871 1841 1817 1847 Buildings. $800,000 100,000 800,000 1,000,000 866,734 36,750 564,000 Total cost of real estate. $700,000 Per capita of buildings. 150 87 130 40 30 113 80 130 200 190 250 180 150 280,000 100 500 60 40,000 800,000 160 200,000 160,000 * Includes cost of land. t Under charge of religious orders. Table No. 3 has been prepared from data obtained from the last annual reports, or by special inquiries in each case, $800 500 3,200 1,014 1,997 262 1,253 »1,750 No. of patients, 1878. 1,555 •1,066 400 1,600 1,250 03 ma Table No. 4. Detailed Statement of Expenditures of the New York State Lunatic Asylum for the years 1850 to 1878, inclusive. YEARS. Average number of inmates. 1850. 1851. 1852. 1853. 1854. 1855 1856 1857 1858 1859 I860 1861 1862 1863 1864 1865 1866 1867 1868 1869 1870 1871 1872 1873 1874 1875 1876 1877 1878 433 440 441 423 441 467 454 403 489 509 5^6 519 626 528 560 591 643 610 589 600 629 605 588 503 581 595 615 608 600 8alahieb and Wages. Aggro- rate cost. $15,282 25 18,463 62 19,183 31 18,620 46 22,150 11 22,590 06 23,463 06 23,125 m 25,263 50 29,332 98 26,798 45 30,409 03 27,650 38 27,222 74 30,110 88 33,075 50 36,974 17 37,225 29 42,319 95 47,983 49 48,508 33 50,651 OO 49,905 30 52,291 85 55,005 24 57,471 87 58,535 96 56,918 92 56,227 97 Cost per capita PKOVISKJNS AND SU1TLIES. Aggre- gate cost 35 29 41 96 4 5 50 44 03 49 89 48 37 51 08 49 94 51 66 57 63 51 93 58 70 52 58 51 56 53 77 55 93 57 50 61 02 71 85 79 96 77 12 83 08 84 97 92 88 94 07 96 59 95 18 93 62 93 71 $22,687 99 25,768 20 27,537 42 27,997 89 30,420 41 38,706 42 34,738 46 35,423 03 33,968 53 34,657 81 38,782 9.5 31,581 51 31,606 35 42,015 50 48,941 73 64,022 24 69,399 6t 70,846 99 66,316 47 74,603 87 69,570 08 72,19.5 18 67,402 70 65,725 20 69,988 71 70,302 18 70,621 33 64,377 81 60,085 58 Cost per capita. $52 39 58 56 62 44 60 19 68 51 82 88 76 52 76 51 69 46 68 09 75 10 60 85 60 09 79 57 87 39 108 33 107 93 1'6 14 112 59 124 34 110 60 119 32 114 63 116 74 120 40 118 15 114 as 105 88 100 14 Clothing. Aggre- gate cost. $5,363 79 6,080 42 7,228 61 5,652 48 7,5S9 13 7,365 09 0,624 72 6,051 83 6,771 81 8,879 31 8,519 45 8,050 79 7,272 31 6,391 86 8,733 43 10,792 80 13,356 87 14,622 17 13,302 70 11,090 49 13,311 29 14,143 42 11,537 78 10,038 96 9,059 87 8,640 20 9,544 39 9,476 47 9,109 04 Cost per capita. »12 39 13 82 16 39 13 36 17 09 15 77 14 59 13 07 13 85 17 44 16 51 15 51 13 82 12 11 15 59 18 26 20 77 23 97 22 69 18 48 21 16 23 37 19 62 17 Si 15 59 14 53 15 52 15 59 15 18 Medical Stores. Aggre- gate cost. $1,756 65 757 89 650 05 642 90 1,103 05 2,063 68 1,080 91 1,334 55 2,042 04 2,399 38 2,096 59 2,408 32 2,775 55 2,784 47 4,545 85 4,267 76 5,874 6 5,253 43 4,137 90 4,464 89 3,735 ,M 5,221 90 4,652 15 5,088 90 5,204 12 6,353 43 7,183 42 4,711 91 4,212 62 Cost per capita. $4 05 1 72 1 47 1 52 2 62 5 06 2 38 2 88 4 18 4 71 4 06 4 64 5 28 5 27 8 12 7 23 9 14 8 01 7 02 7 44 5 91 8 6! 7 91 9 04 9 06 10 67 11 08 7 75 7 02 Fuel and Light. Fuel. *$8,265 03 6,409 58 12,330 76 17,122 31 13,276 00 $12,647 55 $10,947 46 $10,897 25 U5,801 66 til,054 00 t5,4.5l 95 t-8,70.S 38 10,409 95 12,300 11 14,452 00 12,734 87 10,211 54 8,597 83 Light. t$l,114 40 tl,455 71 tl,697 99 tl,881 69 tl,762 95 t2,415 58 12,378 00 12,501 69 t'2,781 02 t3,612 80 t3,S50 69 13,617 05 3,331 70 3,825 18 3,297 00 3,385 09 3,185 70 3,682 90 ^tal. C°*X $5,826 89 8,965 95 6,215 48 8,206 41 9,906 19 9,686 98 8,509 6,S 13,029 92 8,959 25 5,781 66 6,010 07 9,377 49 7,865 29 14,028 75 19 004 00 15,039 01 15,063 13 13,325 52 13,398 94 18,582 68 14,006 80 9,282 04 12,320 03 13,801 05 10,185 29 1 ,749 06 10,119 90 13,397 24 12,280 70 * Includes the cost of a large and substantial coal house on the Asvlum canal dock. X Includes fuel aud lights, excepting gas t Includes gas and expense of keeping machiuery in order. ^j^i^^j ^i-^^^^c; as agios a &&& a? ot&v*o*w &<5i& && HCGcr.HwoccHccttimioiKicc.wowyiM^Si^KM . t© ©l «^J OC t >Ow<©QO^^tSU)i^O:h4rO©*s|^i^)k.|Y'fOUi ■ Moo:y«tc©K.oii^i*kHo>t5©M©a:w©w i o ao cr> —j - 00 - ee a: O: a> i ICC0C«O?£nC«CCD00CDOC*^^«^O5 o;to*-xcn»-w^-h-o©©wt*j©Oi©-^tiio:^-©oiw©M»-©© ■^oi©©©©aD©2wl!,-'«-«^^^^lfcJOO'.^^w©-ow^ i«».HacccHwWOoi©ii©{Dooia:©M»ivC3Qooo'.uiai»-ui WCC(^.»KC©*Uv-JOCW*-«-l»-'vic<-*CM^JOtOK)©©W-^-ll-i ~ "-. wC l« C. W t— CA Cb ©i Ci in 4^ -^| r— 00 OS I—' K- ©! CO —J Ui«i-CC Ci wi O O ( «ifi65WWWliWI>O«»t0hSICf£^"-'MMMMl-Mi^MMMM»- i N0CN-C^£S£2Spr;«'^«:*;Wocscr. ocoooococoooooso:c5t: OOtj 2!"* Kg ! X 3£.Jg> C'S'Sb c W*J*»HtaO^WCOHiXC*'©»-C,MCyiC;MClCOGOttW©MO tt»4l*Oi^W^OWCCMM^Iv"J^-iOiX3;CaO:''lXOK)'<'M ©H-uooj.coaic»»jHwoo3Mcc. ^-ca^ii-c:oa(x»-ooH© tOQC^-JI-4*C«©tOW»4>-i^i-l*.C:UtOiCii >C C ~ w S3 P5 5-12- to i-"-1 *• co ■ w cs cc -j k> as os ■ tO OS O, Co OS »J CJi OS • o> & *- CC I-- lit CO 00 • l/j*-C0tOCO&i*.-4- aoaoioooiifoi Cost of apparatus for warming and ventilating the build'g by steam, and repairs con- nected therewith Rebuilding and repairing thecen- ter build'g, barn, and part of south wing destroyed by fire ocsm UMMK)UH(9I«>- to" cctnooocstoascocDooostfKf*. COMCMK)h-CiO,MCnJ.MH. -JOi~JI^.OOoa»tnCOf-'OOCOlf^ COtO 1—00 *- •»- WO! I--tO tO CO tO>-- CO Wrt"^WtO!00- ^.i*^.— astt^ososio KktOOCOSOS-JOiOO rf^ —CC-itai^-tOCO 10tO»OtOtCrO*-tOrOtO WwtOOC^tDOOODCtCOHtpMO*-^— O w CO *-• 00 «■! OS coocct^oio*-icjicoK.coCTtn*aooa;co^C5^.oooooo — rf^^c^j: wm*.^tncjcDW©wtcc:«eD*lCJicOMwt4c:Otf.^wtdoxQ **~liO-4 Co lil* co>— COOS to-4 00 OS CO OS #■ ' tsenotoioO'Cococoeoas>-'CO--io-. oxmooooo® - to coo i— rf^asoof to en o to to w co co c co o co os in *-os *»- > oo *» w m >-' h- k^ to co —i os co oo §00 CO-IM in in i—os 'aivwagj gg Table No. 5. Detailed statement of receipts of the New York State Lunatic Asylum, Utica, for the years 1860 to 1878, inclusive. YEARS. I860. 1801. 1802. 1863. 1864. 1865. 1866. 1867. 1868. 1869. 1870. 1871, 1872. 1873. 1874. 1875. 1876. 1877. 1878. Cash on hand at commence- ment of fiscal year. $8,455 88 14,706 03 13,926 32 27,524 05 17,442 81 11,276 69 15,922 08 19,910 02 22,078 77 13,309 46 2,381 83 17,077 69 34,862 49 34,227 89 28,510 87 9,514 60 51,193 95 29,869 17 22,778 15 $394,973 75 Appropriations from the State. For salaries of officers. $6,900 00 7,350 00 7,416 35 6,950 59 7,725 00 8,000 00 10,000 00 7,952 60 10,000 00 10,000 00 10,000 00 11,000 00 10,888 05 11,979 71 14,610 58 15,000 00 14,749 80 15,000 00 14,978 63 $200,501 31 For other purposes. £13,168 76 9,044 08 774 62 693 22 10,794 30 11,585 96 10,391 24 16,049 74 7,185 71 33,790 20 45,723 69 46,100 45 23,148 68 44,565 04 27,840*69 00,851 52 23,429 87 25,809 83 20,000 00 $430,947 64 Total from the State. $20,068 75 10,394 08 8,190 97 7,643 81 18,519 30 19,585 96 20,391 24 24,002 34 17,185 71 43,790 20 65,723 69 57,100 45 34,036 73 56,544 75 42,451 27 75,851 52 38,179 67 40,809 88 34,978 63 1,448 95 I For Support Steward's !_____________ salPs, farm j produce, etc.!From counties $2,545 00 2,993 00 3,065 00 2,837 50 3,848 91 4,588 05 2,904 59 5,310 00 6,007 06 4,745 42 3,565 00 4,190 69 4,799 50 2,565 40 5,477 15 5,026 00 6,535 42 4,520 35 5,102 36 0,677 12 $66,247 68 68,048 22 78,808 16 69,887 05 76,988 00 97,803 69 120,562 07 113,384 30 115,149 17 101,191 41 114,067 43 110,155 31 104,062 81 94,691 33 96,701 56 101,923 98 87,622 41 97,554 17 101,946 51 $1,816,857 11 From private patients. $23,253 16 25,901 63 23,413 89 26,049 45 32,S95 72 40,594 84 45,329 92 44,854 35 52,162 38 51,716 66 50,403 11 51,728 03 54,433 72 53,174 10 65,906 96 74,290 11 75,775 75 70,602 08 54,805 57 $917,291 43 From all other sources. $1 00 '"9*52 6 80 350 00 121 86 233 70 $722 88 Total receipts. 54 [Senate, Table No. 6. New York State Lunatic Asylum. Tabular Statement of Expenditures and Legislative Appropriations for Build- ings, Furnishing, etc. 1839 to 1842. Appropriations for centre building and front wing, stone, $275,000 00 For furniture, stock, etc............................... 16,000 00 For maintenance..................................... 8,000 I'O 1843 Appropriation for building two hospital wards and work- shops, brick........................................ 16,100 00 1844 to 1848. Appropriations for building two wings, brick........... li,000 00 Appropriations for completion of new buildings......... 17,000 00 1844 to 1848. Appropriation for furniture............................ 7,552 00 Appropriation for furnaces and fixture?................. 7,448 00 1844 to 1848. Appropriation for gate-house and front gate............ 1,205 02 Appropriation for fencing in front grounds.............. 1,794 98 1844 to 1848. Appropriation for constructing resin gas works.. ....... 5,000 00 1850. Appropriation for fnrniture.......................... 5,000 00 1852 to 1857. Appropriation for steam heating and ventilating appara- tus, constructing flues throughout building for same, boiler and engine-house, fan-house, new laundry build- ings, carpenters', plumbers' and painters shops....... 144,957 90 1S57. Appropriation for reconstructing centre building and por- tions of wings, and the barns destroyed by fire....... 68,742 00 $650,799 90 Table No. 7. New York State Lunatic Asylum. Expenditures and Legislative Appropriations for Water Supply. 1844. For water supply............................................ $5,000 00 1S67. For water supply v.......................................... 1,500 00 1867. or engine-house, engine, setting and connecting at pump-house, paid from current funds................................... 1, "90 79 1869. For water supply, 5,000 feet cast iron pipe, from Jewett farm to fifth lock on Chenango canal, and laying same, machinery, etc., 6,300 00 1870. For water supply, purchase of land and springs on Jewett farm, and construction of receiving reservoir...................... 11,651 02 1873. For water supply, for 4,500 feet cast iron pipe and laying same from fifth lock, Chenango canal, to asylum buildings, pumps and necessary connections, with water tanks in buildings..... 7,285 47 $33,527 28 Table No. 8. New York State Lunatic Asylum. Expenditures and Legislative Appropriations for Land, Improvement of Grounds, Sewers, Fences, Farm Buildings, Citt Assessments for Paving and Grading. 1836. Farm and building site, 133 acres, paid by State appropriation.. $10,000 00 Paid by citizens of Utica...................................... 6,000 00 1841. Appropriation for improving grounds.......................... 2,000 00 1844. Appropriation for additional land and fencing.................. 2,000 00 1846. Appropriation for improving grounds.......................... 441 27 1852. Appropriation for improving, draining and planting lawn....... 2,000 00 1860. Appropriation for forty-eight acres of land, and sewers......... 10,880 00 Paid by current funds for lots for line of water-pipe, from canal lock to asylum............................................. 1,830 00 1861. Appropriation for ftorehouee, vegetable cellar, fences and paint- ing........................................................ 3,855 52 No. 67.] 55 1870. Appropriation for main brick sewer, from Erie canal to Mohawk river...................................................... $7}170 00 1871. Appropriation paid to city of Utica, for grading and paving Court and Whitesboro streets, fronting asylum grounds............. 12 976 00 1874. Appropriation for fencing..................................... 2'000 00 1875. Appropriation for construction of iron fence in front of asylum grounds.................................................... 3,000 00 1875. Appropriation for grading, paving and sidewalks............... 676 25 1876. Appropriation for taking down iron fence around Capitol park, Albany, and putting up same on stone posts in front of asylum grounds................................................... 1,870 65 Appropriation for high picket fence on York street and grading stl>eet..................................................... 2,000 00 1877. Appropriation for reconstructing main and branch sewers on grounds................................................... 3}156 47 1877. From current funds, farm, buildings, cisterns and wells........ 12,137 67 1878. From current funds, farm buildings........................... 9 719 49 From current funds, paid for land............................. 1 '326 11 From current funds, fences, drains and roads.................. 1 352 45 $96,391 88 Table No. 9. New York State Lunatic Asylum. Tabular Statement op Expenditures for Additions, Alterations and Repairs from opening, january, 1843, to december 1, 1878. 1844. Additions, alterations and repairs.............................. $2,778 62 1845. Additions, alterations and repairs............................. 1,403 52 1846. Additions, alterations and repairs.............................. 1,641 42 1847. Additions, alterations and repairs.............................. 3,174 96 1848. Additions, alterations and repairs.............................. 2,629 99 1849. Additions, alterations and repairs.............................. 2,586 80 1850. Additions, alterations and repairs.............................. 4,039 19 1851. Additions, alterations and repairs.............................. 7,147 30 1852. Additions, alterations and repairs.............................. 7,928 86 1853. Additions, alterations and repairs.............................. 5,201 36 1854. Additions, alterations and repairs.............................. 6,919 80 1855. Additions, alterations and repairs.............................. 4,876 33 1856. Additions, alterations and repairs.............................. 4,060 04 1857. Additions, alterations and repairs.............................. 4,286 96 1858. Additions, alterations and repairs.............................. 10,201 98 1859. Additions, alterations and repairs............................. 11,567 71 1860. Additions, alterations and repairs.............................. 6,588 55 1861. Additions, alterations and repairs.............................. 16,950 59 1862. Additions, alterations and repairs.............................. 9,861 84 1863. Additions, alterations and repairs.............................. 9,976 36 1S64. Additions, alterations and repairs.............................. 8,853 60 1865. Additions, alterations and repairs.............................. 10,021 13 1866. Additions, alterations and repairs.............................. 19,446 48 1867. Additions, alterations and repairs.............................. 16,070 17 1868. Additions, alterations and repairs.............................. 29,833 75 1869. Additions, alterations and repairs.............................. 21,197 38 1870. Additions, alterations and repairs............................... 21,205 86 1871. Additions, alterations and repairs.............................. 19,705 74 1872. Additions, alterations and repairs.............................. 16,207 31 1873. Additions, alterations and repairs.............................. 34,744 80 1874. Additions, alterations and repairs.............................. 43,571 98 1875. Additions, alterations and repairs.............................. 21,471 87 1876. Additions, alterations and repairs.............................. 32,902 42 1S77. Additions, alterations and repairs.............................. 35,634 14 1878. Additions, alterations and repairs.............................. 37,929 56 $492,618 37 56 [Senate, Table No. 10. Statement furnished by the Treasurer of the New York State Lunatic Asy- lum, at Utica, showing the amounts received for board, clothing, etc., from the various counties of the State, for the year ending November 30, 1878. Board. Clothing, etc. Albany county...... Allegany county Broome county...... Cattaraugus county . Cayuga county..... Chautauqua county.. Chemung county Chenango county___ Cortland county..... Delaware county.... Dntchess county..... Erie county.......... Essex county........ Franklin county,--- Fulton connty ....... Genesee county...... Herkimer county___ Jefl'erson county..... Kings county........ Lewis county........ Livingston county... Madison county..... Monroe county...... Montgomery county. New York county ... Niagara county...... Oneida county*....... Onondaga county ... Ontario county...... Orleans county...... Oswego county...... Otsego county . ..... Queens county....... Rensselaer county... Richmond county ... Rockland county .... St. Lawrence county Schenectady county. Seneca county....... Steuben county...... Tioga county........ Tompkins county..., Washington county . Wayne county....... Westchester county . Wvoming county___ Yates county ...'..... State of New York .. Total. $16,921 709 1,141 1,027 2,901 639 2,364 2,678 1,471 1,655 625 7,292 251 499 812 25 2,598 1,420 105 1,362 788 829 3,266 499 206 3,167 9,166 2,404 2,101 326 1,228 1,042 2,302 2,734 205 105 1,779 2,462 328 1,134 443 700 2,956 1,197 1,037 1,147 290 578 3,941 26 $2,168 07 38 60 112 39 172 58 341 85 54 45 309 6t 181 40 165 35 156 20 63 63 1,013 99 17 27 47 83 57 79 18 229 34 281 13 11 38 172 37 77 39 56 16 488 56 110 50 89 506 02 715 35 358 10 271 83 49 98 147 39 126 66 299 12 226 66 25 83 12 13 262 83 233 44 59 83 154 28 58 45 81 36 408 77 209 21 143 01 113 85 56 17 153 04 $11,005 25 r- No. 67.] 57 Table No. 11. Statement furnished by the Treasurer of the New York State Lunatic Asy- lum, at Utica, showing the number of private patients and amounts received for their support for the year ending November 30, 1878. Board. Extras. Total. One patient, 19 1-7 weeks' board, at $6 .... One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $15 ... One patient, 15 4-7 weeks' board, at $6..... One patient, 3 4-7 weeks' board, at $6...... One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at *6___ One patient, 27 2-7 weeks' board, at $6 .... One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $5..... One patient, 46 3-7 weeks' board, at $6..... One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $4..... One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $10___ One patient, 43 2-7 weeks' board, at $6..... One patient, 78 1 7 weeks' board, at $6..... One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $6..... One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $5.... One patient, 57 1-7 weeks' board, at $6..... One paiient, 35 1-7 weeks' board, at $6..... One patient, 4 3-7 weeks' board, at $6..... One patient, 11 weeks' board, at $6........ One patient, 4 weeks' board, at $6......... One patient, 24 4 7 weeks' board, at S6..... One patient, 14 3-7 weeks' board, at S6..... Money advanced........................... One patient, 14 4-7 weeks' board, at $6..... One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $10 — One patient, 4 weeks' board, at $6......... One patient, 23 weeks' board, at $6....... One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $6..... One patient, 8 1-7 weeks' board, at S6..... One patient, 18 2-7 weeks' board, at $6 — One patient, 11 2-7 weeks' board, at $6--- One patient, 21 4-7 weeks' board, at $6--- i 'ne patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $6--- One patient, 66 5-7 weeks' board, at $6.... One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $6--- One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at #5. ... One patient, 51 6-7 weeks' board, at $6--- One patient, 32 1-7 weeks' board, at $6--- One patient, 9 4-7 weeks' board, at $6..... One patient, 20 17 weeks' board, at $6--- One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $6--- One patient, 28 2-7 weeks' board, at $6--- One patient, 39 1-7 weeks' board, at $7--- One patient, 52 17 weeks' board, at $5--- One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $5.50. One patient, 8 3-7 weeks' board, at $6..... One patient, 48 1-7 weeks' board, at $6.... One patient, 51 4-7 weeks' board, at $6--- One patient, 26 2 7 weeks' board, at $6--- One patient, 63 weeks' board, at $6....... One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $8--- One paiient, 14 3 7 weeks' board, at $6— One patient, 48 weeks' board, at 86....... One patient, 24 3-7 weeks' board, at $6— One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $10... One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $6— One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $6— One patient, 65 2-7 weeks' board, at $6 — One patient, 22 2-7 weeks' board, at $6 — One patient, 35 1-7 weeks' board, at $6--- One patien;, 3 2-7 weeks' board, at $8. One patient, 26 3-7 weeks' board, at $6 — One patient, 6 weeks' board, at $6........ One patient, 18 1-7 weeks' board, at $6 .. One patient, 43 3-7 weeks' board, at $6... One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $6... One paiient, 1 6-7 weeks' board, at $3--- One patient, 13 3-7 weeks' board, at $6... One patient, 15 2-7 weeks' board, at $6... One patient, 8 1-7 weeks' board, at $10... One patient, 15 weeks' board, at $6 ...... One patient, 31 4-7 weeks' board, at $6... $114 86 782 15 93 43 21 43 312 85 163 71 260 71 278 57 208 57 521 43 201 14 467 99 312 85 263 42 355 71 210 85 26 57 66 00 24 00 147 43 86 57 ""87*43 521 43 24 00 138 00 312 85 48 86 109 71 67 71 129 43 312 85 400 28 312 85 260 71 311 14 192 85 57 42 120 85 312 85 16.) 71 274 00 260 71 286 99 50 57 288 85 309 42 157 71 378 00 417 15 86 57 283 00 146 56 521 43 312 85 312 85 391 71 133 71 210 85 26 29 158 56 36 00 108 86 261 57 312 85 14 86 80 56 91 71 81 43 90 00 189 42 $2 24 288 50 1 54 1 50 32 40 6 21 8 47 92 87 39 94 26 31 4 16 8 18 19 48 9 38 10 78 17 15 6 90 4 27 4 00 27 99 7 53 12 41 5 02 24 68 1 00 24 39 21 04 3 96 6 63 12 29 6 57 29 48 12 23 16 29 20 42 5 82 9 50 2 68 4 74 25 27 5 89 11 54 10 36 13 97 43 56 61 34 72 2 29 8 21 14 53 38 1 03 69 04 169 89 14 68 3 59 7 19 24 93 8.12 2 39 16 09 3 43 2 69 14 28 1 81 15 2 87 5 39 24 74 5 87 1 38 $117 10 1,070 65 94 97 22 93 345 25 169 92 269 18 371 44 248 51 547 74 205 30 476 17 332 33 272 80 366 49 228 00 33 47 70 27 28 00 175 42 94 10 12 41 92 45 546 11 25 00 162 39 336 8d 52 82 116 34 80 00 136 00 342 33 412 51 329 14 281 13 316 96 202 35 60 10 125 59 338 12 175 60 2vS5 54 271 07 300 96 51 00 345 46 344 14 160 00 386 21 431 68 86 95 289 03 215 60 691 32 327 53 316 44 398 90 158 64 218 97 28 68 174 65 39 43 111 55 275 85 314 66 15 01 83 43 97 10 106 17 95 87 190 80 L 58 [Senate, Table No. 11 — (Continued). Board. One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $6___ One patient, 40 5-7 weeks' board, at $6--- One patient, 13 6-7 weeks' board, at $6— One patient, 8 C-7 weeks' board, at $6. One patient, 9 4-7 weeks' board, at $6..... One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $5___ One patient, 1 6-7 weeks' board, at $6..... One patient, 14 2-7 weeks' board, at $6--- One patient, 52 1 7 weeks' board, at $6 50. One patient, 17 3 7 weeks' board, at $6--- One patient, 35 6 7 weeks' board, at $6.... One patient, 37 weeks' board, at $6....... One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $5 One patient, 50 weeks' board, at $6....... One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $6.... One patient, 28 weeks' board, at $6....... One patient, 45 6 7 weeks' board, at $8.... One patient, 17 5-7 weeks' board, at *6___ One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $6.... One patient, 36 1-7 weeks' board, at $4.50. One patient, 49 6-7 weeks' board, at $10... One patient, 38 weeks' board, at $6....... One patient, 14 4-7 weeks' board, at $6..... One patient, 4 weeks' board, at $6........ One patient, 3 3-7 weeks' board, at $6...... One patient, 1 week's board, at $10....... One patient, 21 4-7 weeks' board, at $6___ One patient, 9 5-7 weeks' board, at $6...... One patient, 35 3-7 weeks' board, at $6..... One patient, 9 5-7 weeks' board, at $6...... One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $7..... One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $6..... One patient, 41 weeks' board, at $6......., One patient, 35 1-7 weeks' board, at $50___ One patient, 26 3-7 weeks' board, at $6 ___ One patient, 11 5-7 weeks' board, at $6..... One patient, 24 6-7 weeks' board, at $6..... One patient, 73 1-7 weeks' board, at $5..... One patient, 53 1-7 weeks' board, at $5.25 . One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $10___ One patient, 50 2-7 weeks' board, at $6..... One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at S15___ One patient, 40 1-7 weeks' board, at $6..... One patient, 28 weeks' board, at $6........ One patient, 10 weeks' board, at *6........ One patient, 43 1-7 weeks' board, at $6..... One patient, 10 6-7 weeks' board, at $6..... One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $7..... One patient, 31 2-7 weeks' board, at $25___ Cash advanced............................. One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $10...'. One patient, 14 weeks' board, at S6........ One paiient, 5-7 week's board, at #10...... One patient, 6 2-7 weeks' board, at $6...... One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $5..... One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $6..... One patient, 38 weeks' board, at $6........ Ono patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $6..... One patient, 14 4-7 weeks' board, at $6..... One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $6..... One paiient, 6 weeks' board, at $9......... One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at 886___ One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $7..... One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $6. ... One patient, 71 weeks' board, at $8...... One patient, 104 2-7 weeks' board, at $6.... One patient, 13 weeks' board, at $6 ...... One patient, 1 6-7 weeks' board, at V6 One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $10... One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $6..... Cash advanced.......................... One patient, 8 weeks' board, at $6!.'.'.'.'.'.' One patient, 6 weeks' board, at $6 .. One patient, 52 3-7 weeks' board, at $6*''" One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $6 One patient, 43 5-7 weeks' board, at $6 One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $6.. " One patient, 68 2-7 weeks' board, at $6 $312 85 244 28 83 14 53 14 57 43 260 71 11 14 87 42 338 72 104 57 215 14 221 99 260 71 300 00 312 85 168 00 366 86 106 23 312 85 162 64 498 57 228 00 87 43 24 00 20 36 10 00 129 43 58 28 212 57 58 28 365 00 312 85 245 99 1,757 14 158 57 70 28 149 14 365 71 278 85 521 43 301 71 782 15 240 85 167 99 60 00 258 85 65 14 365 00 760 72 Extras. 521 43 83 99 7 14 37 71 260 70 312 85 227 99 312 85 87 43 312 85 54 00 312 85 365 00 312 85 568 00 625 70 78 00 11 14 521 43 312 85 48 00 36 00 314 56 312 85 257 99 312 85 409 71 $17 34 38 20 26 84 25 29 95 18 56 92 2 08 98 55 4 49 57 II 5 88 9 74 23 04 74 59 22 56 9 50 11 60 46 25 3 51 6 62 2 22 7 29 09 7 74 1 59 6 27 88 20 87 37 9 79 3 20 18 87 63 04 34 42 84 II 54 8 31 1 65 17 50 1 40 48 16 60 31 25 00 14 89 23 11 6 59 29 21 20 03 30 46 4 93 18 45 1 00 26 19 5 29 23 97 l.J 81 34 78 4 95 23 27 79 10 54 20 00 I 22 1 55 11 09 11 03 49 29 1 39 14 79 No. 67.] 59 Table No. 11 — (Continued). Board. Extras. One patient, 56 1-7 weeks' board, at $7.................... One patient, 19 2-7 weeks' board, at $6.................... One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $6.................... One patient, 61 weeks' boai-d, at $8 ..................... One patient, 26 weeks' board, at $6....................... One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $6.................... One patient, 3 5-7 weeks' board, at $8................... One patient, 9 1-7 weeks' board, at $6..................... One patient, 26 weeks' board, at $6....................... One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $6.................... One patient, 15 weeks' board, at $6...................... One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $6.................... One patient, 52 1 7 weeks' board, at $5 50................ One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $6................... One patient, 48 4-7 weeks' board, at $6................... One patient, 52 i-7 weeks' board, at $15................... One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $6.................... One patient, 11 5-7 weeks' board, at $6.................... One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $6.................... One patient, 25 6-7 weeks' board, at $6.................... One patient, 25 6-7 weeks' board, at $10................... One patient, 21 1-7 weeks' board, at $6.................... One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $6................... One patient, 19 1-7 weeks' board, at $6.................... One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $6.................... One patient, 67 3-7 weeks' board, at $6.................... One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $6.................... One patient, 15 2-7 weeks' board, at $6................... One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $6.................... One patient, 12 4-7 weeks' board, at $6 .................., One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $6.................... Seven patients, Sailor's Snug Harbor, 365 w'ks' b'd, at $6 One patient, 20 17 weeks' board, at $6................... One patient, 9 6-7 weeks' board, at $6..................... One patient, 33 weeks' board, at $6 ..................... One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $5................... One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $8................... One patient, 30 1-7 weeks' board, at $6................... One patient, 46 weeks' board, at $6...................... One paiient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $7................... One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $4................... One patient, 5 5-7 weeks' board, at $6.................... One patient, 10 6-7 weeks' board, at $8 ................. One patient, 2-7 week's board, at $17.50................. One patient, 16 1-7 weeks' board, at $6................... One patient, 11 2-7 weeks' board, at $6................... One patient, 71 2-7 weeks' board, at $10................. One patient, 52 17 weeks' board, at $10.................. One patient, 63 1 -7 weeks' board, at $6................... One patient, 3 5-7 weeks' board, at $6.................... One patient, 39 4-7 weeks' board, at $6................... One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at $6................... One patient, 26 2-7 weeks' board, at $6................... One patient, 25 6-7 weeks' board, at $7................... One patient, 7 weeks' board, at $6............. ......... One patient, 26 5-7 weeks' board, at $6................... One patient, 19 4-7 weeks' board, at $6................... One patient, 58 3-7 weeks' board, at $6................... One patient, 52 1-7 weeks' board, at »6................... One patient, 16 1-7 weeks' board, at $6................... One patient, 15 2-7 weeks' board, at $6.........-.......... One patient, 8 2-7 weeks' board, at $6.................... One patient, 2 2-7 weeks' board, at $6.................... One patient, 4 2-7 weeks' board, at $6.................... One patient, 8 weeks' board, at $6...................... One patient, 3 5-7 weeks' board, at $6.................... One patient, 35 1-7 weeks' board, at $6................... Totals. $393 00 115 71 312 85 438 01 156 00 312 85 29 71 54 86 156 00 312 85 90 00 312 85 286 99 312 85 291 42 782 15 312 85 70 28 312 85 155 14 262 86 126 86 312 85 114 86 312 85 404 56 312 85 91 72 312 85 75 42 312 85 2,190 95 120 86 59 14 198 00 260 71 417 15 180 86 275 9!) 365 00 208 57 34 28 86 ^6 5 00 96 86 67 71 712 86 521 43 378 85 o>> •>$ 239 99 312 85 157 71 1S1 00 42 00 160 28 117 42 350 56 312 85 96 86 91 71 49 71 13 71 25 71 48 00 22 28 210 85 $51,181 54 $7 02 7 05 2 85 7 89 20 65 2 00 22 5 09 27 15 50 03 17 56 13 34 91 17 5 69 2 46 7 89 5 40 1 02 76 45 38 26 1 29 8 45 15 77 5 66 13 33 8 33 26 25 108 02 15 23 70 71 15 65 15 07 27 77 29 13 7 56 18 11 3 33 26 46 80 SI 37 39 7 90 15 51 31 15 45 9 12 23 87 18 94 36 00 8 C6 4 22 56 02 5 47 11 37 2 48 30 3 62 5 75 6 71 2 48 15 12 5,624 03 ! $54,805 57 Number of private patients......................................... 219 7,531 2-7 $6.80 Table No. 12. Detailed Statement of Expenditures of the Willard Asylum for the Insane, Willard, N Y.,for the years 1870 to 1878, inclusive. YEARS. 1870 1871 1872 1873 1874 1875 1876 1877 1878 Average number of inmates. 216 436 564 727 827 938 1,076 1,227 1,340 Salaries and AVages. Aggregate cost. $18,077 15 29,142 85 *32,177 64 *42,553 52 *46,975 26 *49,787 08 *53,401 10 60,722 11 66,164 10 Cost per capita. $83 69 66 84 57 05 58 53 56 80 53 07 49 63 49 49 49 38 Provisions and Supplies. Aggregate cost. $12,795 16 35,394 60 38,542 85 48,038 15 57,18S 33 57,722 86 06,273 75 82,137 25 72,769 93 Cost per capita. $59 23 81 18 68 33 66 07 69 15 61 54 61 59 66 94 54 31 Clothing. Aggregate cost. $2,897 57 3,181 06 7,326 60 10,938 60 11,831 95 9,535 84 11,362 60 13,264 28 17,280 16 .Cost per capita. $13 42 7 29 12 99 15 05 14 31 10 17 10 56 10 81 12 89 Medical Stokes. Aggregate cost. $675 78 536 83 1,021 91 1,283 73 1,774 30 2,190 30 2,008 30 Cost per capita. $3 13 1 23 1 23 1 37 1 65 1 78 1 49 Table No. 12—(Continued). YEARS. 1870 1871. 1872. 1873. 1874. 1875. 1876. 1877. 1878. Fuel and Light. Fuel. t$18,431 17 16,152 88 17,685 50 19,775 72 19,064 80 18,946 51 20,105 14 Light. $1,033 97 1,275 31 910 58 1,231 38 1,597 76 2,228 32 1,180 18 Total. $4,362 28 9,813 75 19,465 14 17,428 19 18,596 08 21,007 10 21,262 56 21,174 83 21,285 32 Cost per capita. $20 19 22 51 34 51 23 97 22 48 22 39 19 76 17 26 15 88 All otheu Ordinary Kxpenses. Aggregate cost. $1,057 23 1,910 15 10,028 94 17,657 71 18,047 05 24,019 23 22,606 31 22,819 85 19,501 05 Cost per capita, $4 90 4 38 17 79 24 29 21 82 25 61 21 01 18 59 14 55 Total ordinary expenses. $39,865 17 79,979 24 107,541 17 136,616 17 153,660 58 163,365 84 176,680 62 202,308 62 199,008 86 Annual cost per capita excluding repairs. $184 56 183 43 190 67 187 92 185 80 174 16 164 20 164 87 148 51 Ordinary Repairs. Aggregate cost. $1,736 41 422 94 1,167 29 4,046 97 4,764 74 U7,907 59 Cost per capita $2 38 51 1 24 3 76 3 88 13 37 Annua] cost per capita including ordinary repairs. $190 30 186 31 175 40 167 96 168 75 161 88 * l>oes not include farm wages. t Includes fuel for eighteen months. X Includes $7,616.81 ordinary repairs and 810,260.78 improvements. Table No. 13. Detailed Statement of Expenditures of the Hudson River Stats Hospital, Poughkeepsie, N. Y., for the years 1873 to 1878, inclusive, made up from the annual reports to the Legislature and to the State Board of Charities. YEARS. 1873 1874 1875 1876 1877 1878 Average number of inmates. Salaries and Wages. 171 203 207 197 219 236 Aggregate cost. $34,870 68 41,362 41 31,908 62 29,714 32 29,894 69 30,139 50 Cost per capita. $203 92 203 75 154 15 150 83 136 50 127 71 Provisions and Supplies. Aggregate Cost per cost. capita. $22,808 38 32,269 23 21,590 24 23,657 32 25,814 60 25,809 22 $133 32 158 96 104 30 120 09 117 87 109 36 Clothing. Aggregate cost. $4,227 53 3,804 91 2,502 16 2,310 29 3,736 54 3,299 83 Cost per capita. $24 72 18 74 12 09 11 73 17 06 13 98 Medical Stores. Aggregate cost. £2,538 87 3,094 57 960 54 1,926 63 1,987 91 1,869 84 Cost per capita. $14 85 15 24 4 64 9 78 9 03 7 93 Fuel and Light. Fuel. $13,653 75 11,995 56 9,038 80 10,417 07 6,133 93 8,950 64 Light. $789 04 362 41 369 33 305 08 255 09 2,155 82 Total jOstp'r lotai. Crtpita $14,442 79 12,357 97 9,408 13 10,722 15 6,389 02 11,106 46 $84 46 60 87 45 45 54 43 29 17 47 06 Table No. 13—(Continued). YEARS. All other Ordin- aky Expenses, j Total ....---------------i oi-tlin;try Aggregate Cost per' expenses. cost. capita. 1873 1374 1875 1876 1877 1878 $4,876 95 9,942 76 10,762 71 10,967 63 11,948 29 10,372 77 $28 52 48 98 51 99 55 67 54 56 43 95 Annual cost per capita ex eluding repairs. Repairs and Improvements. $83,765 20 102,831 35 77,133 40 79,2:i3 34 79,771 05 82,597 67 $489 85 506 56 372 62 402 53 364 24 349 99 Annual cost per ( capita .Aggregate Cost per including cost. j capita, repairs. $3,236 83 5,138 77 4,455 19 $16 43 23 46 18 88 $418 96 387 70 368 87 Construc- tion. $51,586 08 21,631 56 3,724 34 143,977 50 126,060 44 65,418 05 Hospital equipment, furniture, etc. $13,992 16 Interest. 5,275 48 870 63 1,813 59 Moneys refunded and ad- vanced to patients. $136 37 46 50 292 07 30« 89 All other extra- ordinary expendi- tures. •$42,638 39 t2,sio 13 Total expendi- tures. $178,176 04 138,455 57 88,945 75 227,429 80 211,262 33 154,585 39 * Amount paid to J. II. Weeks, treasurer, balance due him for payments made prior to November 30,1872, as per detailed statement rendered to comptroller. t Amount paid treasurer, balance due him for payments made prior to November 30, 1874, as per detailed statement rendered to comptroller. Table No. IB—(Continued). Detailed Statement of Cost of Maintenance of the Hudson River State Hospital, for the years 1873 to 18J8, inclusive, furnished by the Superintendent as the actual expenditure and indebtedness incurred chargeable to each year. YEAHS. Average number of inmates. Salaries and Wages. Provisions and Supplies. Clothing. Medical Stores. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. 1873.................................. 171 203 207 197 219 236 *$48,192 03 42,909 58 26,985 15 32,149 73 34,181 06 31,944 26 $281 82 211 38 130 36 163 19 156 OS 135 36 $28,758 18 32,723 54 26,398 85 28,035 97 30,831 00 29.285 87 $168 18 161 19 127 53 142 32 140 78 124 09 $3,624 51 3,780 50 3,640 78 3,409 70 3,253 47 3,636 30 $21 19 18 62 17 59 17 31 14 86 15 62 1874.............................. 1875..................... 1876........................... 1877........................ 1878........................... Table No. 13—(Continued). OS b9 Fuel and Light. Total. $13,632 12,461 10,121 10,991 6,217 11,326 Cost pei capita. $79 72 61 39 48 90 55 79 28 39 47 99 All other Ordin- ary Expenses. Aggregate Cost pei cost. capita $2,420 69 $14 16 2,404 34 11 84 3,132 43 15 13 4,152 84 21 18 2,868 88 13 09 2,675 84 11 34 Total ordinary expenses. 806,627 52 94,279 10 70,279 12 78,7:59 90 77,351 98 78,919 03 Annual cost per capita exctud'g repairs. $565 07 4154 42 339 51 399 69 353 20 344 40 Ordinary Repairs. Aggregate |Cost per cost. j capita. $1,435 96 2,808 31 1,9U9 35 1,460 91 2,713 71 1,723 57 * Includes $12,173.76 wages paid on construction. $8 39 13 83 9 22 7 42 12 39 7 30 Annual cost per capita includ'g ordinary repairs. $573 46 478 25 3(8 73 407 11 365 59 351 70 Construc- tion. $1,131 64 557 47 1,041 11 17*,756 56 126,087 60 14,099 i9 All other extra- Total ordinary expendi- expendi- tures. lures. $16,422 19 6,026 99 3,709 67 1,972 46 11,263 80 13,072 41 $115,617 103,671 76,939 260,9;9 217,417 107,814 w > Table No. 14. Detailed Statement of Expenditures of the State Homoeopathic Asylum for the Insane, Middletown, N. Y., for the years 1875 to 1878, inclusive. YEARS. Average number of inmates. Salaries and Wages. Provisions and Supplies. Clothing. Medical Stores. Fuel ane Light. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. 1875................ 66 82 109 130 '$10,347 12 *15,916 86 *16,020 88 18,562 41 $247 68 191 11 146 98 142 79 $13,412 16 19,081 09 17,137 19 18,118 71 $203 21 232 69 157 22 139 37 $678 14 1,946 61 1,183 92 1,376 46 $10 28 22 76 10 86 10 59 $403 32 1,203 27 111,755 70 11958 25 $6 11 14 67 16 11 7 37 $5,911 41 |6,3o6 34 6,249 60 7,146 62 $89 57 77 27 57 33 54 97 1876................ 1877................ 1878................ OS 03 Table No. 14—(Continued). * Does not include farm labor. || Includes books for medical library. t Does not include amount paid for house furnishing. § For legal services. Table No. 15. Detailed Statement of Expenditures of the Asylum for Insane Criminals, Auburn, N Y.,for the years 1859 to 1878, inclusive. Average number of inmates. Salaries and Wages. Provisions and Supplies. Clothing and Bedding. Medical Stores. Fuel and Light. YEARS. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. 1859t.................... 27 49 62 79 SO 79 73 70 74 78 80 78 67 84 90 94 108 101 98 114 $4,168 58 5,595 53 5,085 80 4,625 34 4,302 82 4,424 76 4,519 17 4,504 05 4,850 46 5,109 15 5,107 52 5,704 02 6,434 77 7,095 15 7,143 04 7,544 00 8,259 75 8,223 37 9,137 72 8,894 75 $154 39 114 19 82 03 58 55 53 78 56 01 61 90 64 34 65 54 65 50 63 84 73 13 96 04 84 46 79 37 80 25 76 48 81 42 93 24 78 02 $3,639 70 3,990 37 3,442 62 3,459 74 3,350 21 4,535 01 4,791 80 4,502 58 5,410 30 4,937 94 4,537 00 5,025 36 5,239 09 5,669 43 6,163 48 6,440 60 9,339 78 8,719 02 8,555 30 7,563 02 $134 80 81 43 55 52 43 79 41 88 57 40 65 64 64 32 73 11 63 31 56 72 64 42 78 19 67 49 68 48 68 51 86 48 86 33 87 29 66 34 $1,291 38 787 74 1,048 27 829,04 1,175 52 X % 1,240 93 1,295 68 1,300 89 1,539 91 1,660 47 1,798 36 2,365 74 1,628 30 2,453 89 3,137 48 2,908 69 1,413 7d 1,421 72 $47 83 16 08 16 90 10 50 14 69 t X 17 73 17 51 16 68 19 25 21 29 26 84 28 16 18 09 26 11 29 05 28 79 14 43 12 48 $587 10 168 53 44 50 26 12 53 68 56 49 61 00 72 89 53 70 62 24 83 10 102 75 107 36 214 87 204 42 171 67 360 65 580 28 393 89 308 65 $21 75 3 44 71 33 67 71 83 1 04 73 79 1 04 1 32 1 60 2 56 2 27 1 83 3 34 5 74 4 02 2 70 $974 49 1,410 51 1,272 61 1,493 87 1,794 96 1,989 49 3,437 64 3,176 54 2,356 22 3,375 93 814 61 3,699 18 1,709 29 1,933 29 2,090 95 2,017 56 1,505 62 4,368 93 1,212 42 1,890 64 $36 09 I860..................... 28 79 1861..................... 19 56 1862 .................... 18 91 1863..................... 22 43 1864..................... 25 18 1865..................... 47 09 1866..................... 45 38 1867..................... 31 84 1868 .................... 43 28 1869..................... 10 18 1870 .................... 47 42 1871..................... 25 51 1872..................... 23 02 1873..................... 23 23 1874 ................... 21 46 1875..................... 13 94 1876..................... 43 26 1877..................... 12 37 1878 .................... 16 58 t Eleven months only. The high scale of expenditure is partly accounted for by the newness of the institution. % Included in " all other ordinary expenses." o OS CO w > H M _ 0 o p p os Table No. 15—(Continued). All other Ordinary Expenses. YEAR. 1859t..• I860.... 1861.... 18(52. .. 18(53.... 1864.... OilS'tf ... 18(56.... 1867.... 1868... 1869 ... 1870.. .. 1871.... 1872... 1873.... 1874.... 1875.... 1876.... 1877.... 1878.... Aggregate cost. $2,835 23 2,269 27 1,598 13 1,431 14 1,0(56 57 2,709 65 3,284 57 1,589 37 1,517 27 2,031 72 1,632 11 1,984 78 1,827 48 1,627 95 1,421 26 1,532 33 1,718 68 3,504 90 2,636 75 2,620 26 Cost per capita. $105 01 46 31 25 77 18 11 13 33 34 30 44 99 22 71 20 91 26 05 20 40 25 45 29 28 19 38 15 79 16 30 15 91 34 70 26 91 22 99 Total ordinary expenses. $13,496 48 14,221 95 12,491 93 11,865 25 11,743 76 13,715 40 1(5,094 18 15,08(5 36 15,513 63 1(5,817 87 13,714 85 18,176 36 17,116 35 18,906 43 18,(551 45 20,1(50 10 24,321 96 28,305 19 23,349 87 22,699 04 Annual cost per capita, ex- cluding repairs. $499 87 290 24 201 49 150 19 146 79 173 61 220 47 215 52 209 64 215 61 171 43 233 03 255 47 225 07 207 23 214 47 225 20 280 24 238 26 199 11 Ordinary Repairs. Aggregate cost. $2,890 59 3,269 63 1,681 92 808 76 292 04 227 67 605 00 850 79 1,420 31 1,058 74 240 07 900 01 212 54 65 22 2(52 97 17 00 395 62 1,206 04 629 50 328 26 Cost per capita. $107 06 66 73 27 12 10 24 3 65 2 88 8 28 12 15 19 19 13 57 3 00 11 54 3 17 78 2 93 18 3 66 11 94 6 43 2 88 Total expenditures. $16,387 17,491 14,173 12,674 12,035 13,943 16,699 15,937 1(5,9:53 17,876 13,954 19,076 17,328 18,971 18,914 20,177 24,717 29,511 23,979 23,027 Annual cost per ita, in- cluding repairs. ca $606 93 356 97 228 61 KiO 43 150 44 17(5 49 228 75 227 67 228 83 229 18 174 43 244 57 258 64 225 85 210 16 214 65 228 86 292 18 244 69 201 99 Total expendi- tures, includ- ing amount received from " Utica Account." * $19,879 39 19,332 66 21,979 01 21,322 78 23,14U 17 Annual cost per capita including " Utica Ac- count." $254 86 288 55 261 65 242 47 24(5 17 ZJWSxx^^- ss s,^»«»s'^ ffi y& xs&vzsr-x. MM'iW is^rs •» Dr. Wilkie, Superintendent, though forming a part of the current expenditures. Table No. 16. Detailed Statement of Expenditures of the State Lunatic Hospital, Northampton, Mass., for the years 1860 to 1878, inclusive. Average number of inmates. Salaries and Wages Provisions and Supplies. Clothing. Medical Stores Fuel and Light. YEARS. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. Aggregate cost. Cost per Aggregate capita. cost. Costper F , capita. *uel- Light. Total. Cost per capita. 1860* ........ 1861......... 259 314 319 359 358 342 376 401 413 405 409 422 429 437 4(59 475 474 476 442 $9,303 57 11,250 41 13,589 55 12,003 57 12,049 14 13,783 07 14,495 59 15,273 85 15,184 17 16,879 18 18,479 26 19,083 37 21,024 06 23,318 59 24,714 59 24,425 95 25,862 72 25,880 77 25,857 03 $35 92 35 83 42 60 33 43 33 66 40 30 38 54 38 09 36 76 41 68 45 18 45 22 49 01 53 36 52 71 51 42 54 56 54 37 58 50 $27,247 10 14,850 00 17,233 32 19,056 36 24,948 22 23,894 68 26,987 15 34,005 91 35,602 03 29,432 76 28,502 80 29,031 98 28,295 48 30,279 29 23,848 83 29,973 69 29,033 82 28,262 80 25,493 40 $105 20 47 23 54 02 53 08 69 69 69 87 71 77 84 81 86 20 72 67 69 69 68 79 65 96 69 28 61 51 63 10 61 25 59 37 57 68 $4 25 10 32 9 13 16 56 10 37 9 43 11 06 13 12 10 34 9 66 9 39 8 43 11 43 11 39 9 19 9 25 7 49 8 85 $i,333 84 3,293 18 3,278 29 5,928 33 3,545 83 3,545 65 4,435 74 5,417 73 4,186 29 3,919 41 3,962 23 3,619 20 4,993 56 5,344 12 4,365 98 4,385 81 3,564 52 3,910 24 . $5,513 85 7,615 38 4,480 25 8,153 85 . +17,493 08 9,283 26 11,559 92 10,000 18 8,460 99 9,024 48 8,661 77 6,694 34 9,397 49 8,325 80 4 8,335 53 1 4,774 65 0 7,936 34 0 2,281 31 $2,087 34 1,740 20 2,083 65 2,198 42 1,784 25 1,134 31 1,124 85 1,085 51 1,169 22 840 10 1,080 45 999 52 1,071 43 1,222 37 1,157 82 1,182 46 1,112 61 1,124 34 $7,602 19 10,355 58 6,563 90 10,352 27 19,277 33 10,417 57 12,634 77 11,085 69 9,630 21 9,864 58 9,742 22 7,693 86 10,468 92 9,548 17 9,493 35 5,957 11 9,048 95 3,405 65 $24 21 1862......... 32 46 1863......... 18 29 1864......... 28 92 1865......... 56 36 1866......... 27 71 1867......... 31 63 1868......... 26 84 1869......... 23 78 1870......... 24 12 1871......... 23 09 1872......... 17 93 1873......... 23 95 1875......... $1,636 78 1,618 70 1,858 42 1,283 71 " $34 3 4 3 S 2 9 20 36 19 99 1876......... 12 57 1877......... 19 01 1878......... 7 71 os OS * This being the second year the expenditures were necessarily larger than for subsequent similar periods. t Includes about $5,000 for fuel consumed previous year. > W Table No. 16—(Continued). All other Ordinary Expenses. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. Total ordinary expenses. Repairs and Improve. Annual cost per capita excluding repairs. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. Annual cost per capita excluding repairs. Buildings and extraordinary repairs. All other extraordi- nary expend- itures. Total; expenditures, $8,734 92 8,465 64 9,670 71 9,463 22 9,840 68 10,643 11 11,483 23 12,616 53 16,754 61 13,365 61 12,185 49 14,620 38 16,824 29 16,712 16 16,178 69 12,366 87 12,340 84 10,562 04 10,740 29 $33 72 26 97 30 32 26 36 27 48 31 12 30 55 31 46 40 57 33 00 29 79 34 65 39 22 38 25 34 49 26 03 26 04 22 19 24 29 $45,285 59 43,502 08 54,142 34 50,365 34 63,118 64 71,144 02 66,934 19 79,016 80 84,044 23 73,494 05 72,981 54 76,440 18 77,456 89 85,772 52 84,634 40 82,262 62 79,199 00 79,177 50 70,690 32 $174 84 138 54 169 72 140 29 176 31 208 02 178 02 197 05 203 49 181 47 178 44 181 14 180 55 196 27 180 46 173 18 167 08 166 34 159 93 $1,105 13 1,219 51 2,543 97 2,554 32 3,544 17 2,846 63 3,677 44 6,632 69 8,096 30 13,694 99 11,794 68 10,579 46 18,144 09 11,979 16 10,720 13 8,214 59 10,250 67 8,277 33 6,306 56 $4 27 3 88 7 97 7 11 9 90 8 32 9 78 16 54 19 60 33 81 28 84 25 07 42 29 27 41 22 85 17 29 21 62 17 39 12 01 $179 11 142 42 177 69 147 40 186 21 216 34 187 80 213 59 223 I'9 215 28 207 28 206 21 222 84 223 68 203 31 190 47 188 70 183 73 171 94 $3,694 67 5,579 00 6,203 62 7,550 63 $534 39 2,370 88 2,038 97 6,384 25 6,529 46 ' 13,'200'66 '+2,'704'66 t5,202 32 t6,000 00 t.3,915 00 tl,400 00 * This being the second year the expenditures were necessarily larger than for subsequent similar periods. t For real estate. Note—Prior to 1875 medical stores were included in " provisions and supplies," and for the year 1860 clothing and fuel and light were also included under the same head. Table No. 17. Detailed Statement of Expenditures of Hospitals for the Insane in the United States for the year I860. NAME OF INSTITUTION Verm't Asylum for the Insane, Brattleboro State Lunatic Hospital, Taunton, Mass.... Maine Insane Hospital, Augusta........ Central Ohio Lunatic Asylum, Columbus Southern Ohio Lunatic, Asylum, Dayton.. Illinois Cen.Hos. for Insane, Jacksonv'lc* State Lunatic llospt'l, Northampton, Mass State Lunatic Asylum, Uiica, N. Y........ Northern Ohio Lunatic Asylum, Newb'rgh Gov't Hospital for the Insane,Washington Asylum for Insane Criminals, Auburn.... Salaries andWages. Average numb'rof inmates t463 3(55 236 247 tl57 230 259 516 tl36 150 49 Aggregate cost. $12,396 22 10,218 59 6,798 72 12,681 84 8,616 69 24,300 47 9,303 57 26,798 45 9,8(51 93 11,515 33 5,595 53 Cost per capita. $28 63 28 08 28 80 51 34 54 89 52 82 35 92 51 93 72 51 76 77 114 19 Provisions and supplies. Aggregate cost. $31,519 61 22,453 02 15,704 47 12,454 47 8,811 60 26,809 27 27,247 10 38,782 93 9,537 61 13,022 45 3,990 37 Cost per capita. $72 79 61 52 66 55 50 42 56 12 58 28 105 20 75 16 70 13 86 82 81 43 Clothing. Aggregate cost. $2,054 76 '8,696-86 "8,5i6'45 "496'oi 787 74 Cost per capita. $8 71 i8-9i "ie si "3'27 16 08 Medical Stores. Aggregate cost. $692 11 372 26 6:)7 14 193 51 749 30 2,096 59 369 69 302 18 168 53 Cost per capita. $1 59 "i-58 2 82 1 23 1 63 "4 06 2 72 2 01 3 44 Fuel and Light. Aggregate cost. M,66*. 88 3,530 89 7,110 50 2,583 95 6,375 21 -6,6i6'67 4,156 38 2,257 10 1,410 51 Cost per capita. $12 78 14 96 23 79 16 49 13 86 ii*65 30 56 15 05 28 79 No. 17—(Continued). All other Ordinary Expenses. Total ordinary expenses. Annual cost per capita excludi'g repairs. Ordinary Repairs. Annual cost per Buildings, extraordina- All other extraordi-nary ex-penses. Total NAME OF INSTITUTION. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita eluding or-dinary re-pairs. ry repairs and improve ments. expendi-tures. Verm't Asylum Cor the Insane, Brattleboro State Lunatic Hospital, Taunton, Mass ... Maine Insane Ilo-pital, Augusta........... Central Ohio Lunatic Asylum, Columbus.. Southern Ohio Lunatic, Asylum, Dayton... Illinois Cen. Hos. for Insane, Jacksonville* State Lunatic Hospital, Northampton, Mass $6,828 96 10,28(5 40 2,745 11 4,950 03 3,959 87 9,993 -.6 8,734 92 13,745 66 3,820 90 4,521 88 2,269 27 $15 77 28 18 11 63 20 04 25 22 21 73 33 72 26 64 28 09 30 14 46 31 $51,436 93 47,653 89 31,206 21 37,893 98 24,170 62 76,929 37 45,285 59 95,953 15 27,746 56 32,109 25 14,221 95 $118 79 130 56 132 23 153 41 153 95 1(57 24 174 84 185 95 204 01 214 (16 290,24 $6,372 75 5,114 41 3,578 85 1,437 34 2,07(5 82 13,238 06 1,105 13 6,588 55 2,058 38 4(56 91 3,269 63 $14 71 14 01 15 16 5 82 13 23 28 79 4 27 12 77 15 14 3 11 66 73 $133 50 144 67 147 39 159 23 167 18 19(5 03 179 11 198 72 219 15 217 17 356 97 $57,809 68 52,768 30 $103 11 84 02 34,785 06 39,434 43 2(5,331 46 90,167 43 46,390 72 $268 58 3,323 74 224 30 185 00 106,134 02 Northern Ohio Lunatic Asylum, Xewburgh Gov't Hospital for the Insane, Washington Asylum for Insane Criminals, Auburn...... 30,029 24 32,761 16 17,491 58 *Bienniiil report : the. iifSKre.jjates i;ivt-n are for two years. -Where the items of clothing, medical stores or fuel and light are omitted in the tahle, they t Average number estimated from tables given in reports. included under the head of " supplies," or "all other ordinary expenses." Table No. 18. Detailed Statement of Expenditures of Hospitals for the Insane in the United States for the year 1865. * SALARIE s AND Provisions and Clothing. Medical Stores. Fuel and Light. Wages. SUPPLIES. *"*"* NAME OF INSTITUTION, Average ______ _____ number of inmates. Aggregate Cost per capita. $29 56 19 15 Aggregate Cost per Aggregate Cost per Aggregate Cost per Aggregate Cost per cost. cost. capita. cost. capita. cost. capita. cost. capiia. Vt. Asylum for the Insane, Brattleboro. New York Citv Lunatic Asylum......... t463 695 $13,833 30 13,313 00 $87 04 $644 56 $1 38 50,229 72 72 27 t$13,077 40 $i.s 82 1,(598 2(5 2 44 $3,417 43 $4 96 Asylum for the Insane, Stockton, Cal... (51(5 30,798 74 49 99 39,248 64 63 72 5,261 74 8 54 1,703 43 2 77 4,194 83 6 80 State Lunatic Hospital, Taunton, Mass 353 12.360 08 35 01 30,341 14 85 95 4,486 28 12 71 814 54 2 31 8,05.) 25 22 82 Maine Insane Asylum, Augusta ........ 8,582 74 31 55 28,195 60 103 (56 3,449 17 12 (59 618 05 2 27 6,819 39 25 07 State Lun, llos, Northampton, Mass. .. 342 13,783 07 40 30 23,894 m 69 87 3,545 83 10 37 (19,277 33 5(5 3(5 State Lunatic Hospital, Worcester, Mass. 350 15,306 89 43 73 31,896 11 91 13 1,683 19 4 81 684 30 i 95 12,412 55 35 47 Asvlum for Insane Crim's, Auburn, N. Y 73 4,519 17 61 90 4,791 80 65 64 6L 0(1 83 3,437 64 47 09 State Lunatic As\ lum, Harrisburgh, l'a t293 14,505 18 49 49 26,426 42 90 19 2,405 54 8 2l' 670 31 2 29 10,563 55 36 05 Lunatic Asylum, Boston, Massachusetts 177 7,971 74 45 04 17,992 99 101 65 15,273 81 29 79 1,452 74 8 21 3,372 24 21 87 Central Ohio Lunatic, Asylum, Columbus State Lunatic Asylum, l.'tica, New York. 17,458 82 33,075 50 64 42 2(5,877 21 99 18 1,463 33 5 40 8,561 11 31 59 591 55 96 61,022 24 108 33 10,792 80 18 26 4,267 76 7 23 15,039 01 25 45 Wis. State Hos. for the Insane, Mendota. tl73 12,297 41 71 08 10,550 87 60 99 1,567 59 9 06 370 33 2 14 12,773 87 73 84 Southern Ohio Lunatic Asylum, Dayton. Northern Ohio Lun. Asylum, Newburgh. 165 tl36 10,870 15 11,517 6J 65 88 84 69 19,933 13 17,113 45 120 81 125 84 485 34 941 62 2 94 6 92 10,003 75 9,234 83 60 63 67 90 t Average number estimated from tables given in reports. t Includes bedding. $ Includes about $5,000 for fuel consumed previous year. Note.—Where the items of clothing, medical stores or fuel and light are omitted, they are either included under the head of " sujiplies," or " all other ordinary expenses. Table No. 18—(Continued). NAME OF INSTITUTION. All other Ordi-nary Expenses. Total ordinary expenses. Annal cost per capita excluding repairs. Ordinary Repairs. Annual '•ost per capita including ordinary repairs. Buildings, extraordi-nary repairs and improve-ments. All other extraordi-nary ex-pendi-tures. Total expendi-tures. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. Vt. Asylum for the Insane, Brattleboro... $7,439 84 11,915 88 8,348 69 6,722 27 2,538 50 10,643 11 13,818 66 3,284 57 10,972 21 5,905 37 13,109 40 20,521 80 8,203 23 7,208 62 12,358 62 $15 89 17 15 29 79 19 04 9 33 31 12 39 48 44 99 37 45 33 37 48 37 34 72 47 42 43 69 90 87 $62,651 91 93,681 68 99,556 07 62,779 56 50,203 45 71,144 02 75,801 70 16,094 18 65,543 21 42,468 89 67,469 87 147 719 11 45,763 30 48,500 99 51,166 15 $133 87 134 79 161 61 177 84 184 57 208 02 216 57 220 47 223 69 239 93 248 96 249 94 264 53 293 95 376 22 $4,106 46 11,685 53 3,652 01 4,654 62 1,328 29 2,846 63 1,367 96 605 00 1,661 13 1,411 39 4,703 18 10,021 13 2,784 71 3,222 18 4,859 76 $10 05 16 81 5 93 13 18 4 90 8 32 3 91 8 28 5 67 7 97 17 35 16 96 16 09 19 53 35 73 $143 92 151 60 167 54 19 L 02 189 47 216 34 220 48 228 75 229 36 247 90 266 31 266 90 280 (52 313 48 411 95 $67,358 37 $4,702 28 110,069 49 Asylum for the Insane, Stockton, Cal. ... 103,208 08 State Lunatic Hospital, Taunton, Mass... 67,434 18 51,531 74 State Lunatic Hos., Northampton, Mass.. $6,529 46 80,520 11 77,169 66 State Lunatic Hospital, Worcester, Mass. Asylnm for Insane Crim's, Auburn, N. Y. 16,699 18 State Lunatic Asylum, Harrisburgh, Pa... Lunatic Asylum, Boston, Massachusetts .. Central Ohio Lunatic Asylum, Columbus.. 636 26 275 33 68,115 93 43,880 28 72,173 05 State Lunatic Asylum, Utica, New York. ............ 187 51 157,927 75 48,548 01 51,723 17 56,025 91 Wis. State Hos. for the Insane, Mendota.. Southern Ohio Lunatic Asylum, Dayton.. Northern Ohio Lun. Asylum, Newburgh.. O Table No. 19, Detailed Statement of Expenditures of Hospitals for the Insane in the United States and elsewhere for the year 1875. o OS 'NAME OF INSTITUTION. > in* $99,109 84 73,036 30 43,198 48 81,373 45 79,986 88 90,413 39 71,413 33 82,262 62 163,365 84 100,070 09 70,587 63 110,384 27 80,695 79 20,555 29 103,302 24 24,321 96 57,170 94 113,141 35 101,282 26 88,732 96 98,410 69 73,832 47 150,080 30 57,513 32 188,298 49 82,794 93 77,133 40 103 16 43,560 97 c o se bn E.S M c, 3 q e a M S-. Ordinary Ke pairs. Aggregate cost. $73 14 122 31 123 42 125 19 128 18 156 42 172 91 173 18 174 16 179 66 187 73 202 17 202 73 205 55 212 12 225 20 232 40 234 73 237 75 243 77 247 26 268 48 278 44 281 91 316 47 322 1(1 372 62 1560 01 $386 19 2,752 28 2,233 74 4,789 91 2,757 42 8,214 59 1,167 29 6,438 23 6,083 82 8,58(5 95 10,575 90 5,189 98 3,761 13 395 62 193 43 2,203 70 11,848 92 10,131 77 8,215 83 4,012 38 7,113 39 *27,108 77 6,327 05 Cost per capita 5 c Is $1 10 4 24 3 58 8 29 6 68 17 29 1 24 11 56 16 18 15 73 2(5 57 51 89 7 72 3 66 78 4 57 32 55 25 46 29 87 8 56 34 87 45 56 24 62 S.~ tpb M.= '-I , CH3 *.; lit $124 52 129 43 131 76 161 71 179 59 190 47 175 40 191 22 203 91 217 90 229 30 257 44 219 34 228 8(5 233 18 239 30 "276' 32 272 72 298 35 237 00 316 78 362 03 346 78 661 86 = >.- ° £ — a — — CU $17,577 96 4,811 61 2,472 74 5,579 00 113,351 72 iMio'io 31,382 57 15,701 3,724 13 J4 114,952 32 u 5^ o 5 2 cu $45 11 169 03 5,202 32 3,186 11 143 12 600 00 882 51 940 67 921 30 708 01 665 94 8,085 61 216 9S 158,852 73 * For additions, alterations and repairs. Table No. 20. Detailed Statement of Expenditures of Hospitals for the Insane in the United States and elsewhere for the year 1876. NAME OF INSTITUTION. Average number of inmates. Salaries and Wages. :gregate Cost per cost. capita. New York City Lunatic Asylum (females) New York City Asylum for the Insane] (males)......"......................... West Virginia Hospital for the Insane, Weston .................................. Asylum for the Insane, Toronto, Province ot Ontario.............................. Asylum lov the Insane, London, Province of Ontario............................... Asvlum for the Insane, Stockton, Cali- fornia .................................... Nova Scotia Hospital for the Insane, Hal- Alabama Insane Hospital, Tuscaloosa... Vermont Asvlum for the 'Insane, Brattle- boro*......'............................. Hospital for the Insane, Dayton, Ohio--- Minnesota Hospital for the Insane, St. Peters.................................. State Lunatic Hospital, Taunton, Mass.. .: Willard Asylum for the Insane, Willard, New York................................ Northern Ohio Lunatic Asylum,Newburgh' State Lunatic Hospital, Northampton. M;i-s..................................... Countv Insane Asylum, St. Louis, Mo..... Virginia Western Lunatic Asylum, Staun- ton ....................................... Tennessee Hospital for the Insane, Nash ville*..................................... Iowa Hospital for the Insane, Alt. Pleasant, State Lunatic Hospital, Worcester, Mass . Maine Insane Hospital, Augusta.......... Kansas State Insane Asylum, Osawatoinie. * Biennial report, the aggregates given i Includes bedding. 1,320 $18,154 82 654 17,325 99 15,378 49 22,346 75 21,497 31 72,906 38 Provisions and Supplies. ,'gregate, Cost per cost. captta. Clothing. 385 617 627 1,306 331 36. 477 596 486 664 1,076 540 474 325 t358 3S(i 581 500 398 170 13,727 58 12,789 21 35,938 00 24,957 32 21,519 63 27,716 31 •53,401 10 26,53(5 36 25,862 72 20,805 34 19,6(57 41 44,913 53 38,428 09 34,810 62 19,437 75 13,796 53 are for two years. $13 75 26 49 39 94 36 21 34 28 55 82 41 47 35 23 37 67 41 88 44 28 41 74 49 63 49 14 54 56 64 01 54 94 58 17 16 14 (19 62 48 84 81 16 tAverage $61,445 38,535 25,740 30,616 30,9(50 62,742 19,343 21,199 95,608 49,605 30,511 47,(549 66,273 38,587 29,033 2*, 111 37 25,150 83 57,494 32,425 35,428 32.572 9,727 number $46 58 66 49 49 48 58 58 100 83 70 25 Aggregate cost. §$12,312 §6,622 2,003 §6,215 §7,495 11,725 9,000 36 4,856 27 5,475 7,571 11,362 1,538 4,385 1,996 1,893 07 1(5,(545 (5,078 5,595 4,919 2,(512 estimated from tables Cost per capita 10 13 5 21 10 07 11 95 8 98 '24'79 "815 11 2(1 II 49 10 56 2 85 9 25 6 14 5 29 21 55 10 47 11 19 12 36 11 84 jiven in repoi Medical Stores. Fuel and Light. Aggregate Cost per Aggregate cost. capita. J cost. $1,355 33 (598 04 868 85 1,758 65 2,607 10 3,692 01 2(55 33 356 67 1,955 82 1,487 90 631 97 1,328 56 1,774 30 1,998 74 1,618 70 1,878 84 932 85 1,96! 31 2,833 34 848 (52 598 10 (559 78 t. t Doe II 1 $1 03 1 07 2 25 2 85 4 16 2 83 80 98 2 05 2 49 1 30 2 00 1 65 3 70 3 41 5 78 2 75 2 55 4 88 1 69 1 50 3 83 ||$9,670 35 117,729 86 10,915 16 12,914 73 21,029 43 6,316 38 1,426 00 '"6j 666 56 9,943 53 7,879 11 21,262 56 9,636 70 5,957 11 4,442 73 5,066 13 15,043 79 13,589 92 9,780 34 9,298 21 4,278 58 s not include farm wages, or fuel only. Cost per capita. © OS Table No. 20—(Continued). NAMK OF INSTITUTION. Illinois Central Hospital for the Insane, Jacksonville............................ Northern Hospital for the Insane, Osh- kosh, Wis................................. North Western Hospital for the Insane, Toledo, Ohio............................ Connecticut Hospital for the Insane, Mid- dletown................................. Western Pennsylvania Hospital for the Insane, Dixmont........................ Illinois Northern Hospital for the Insane, Elgin ................................... State Lunatic Asylum, Harrisburg, Pa. ... State Hospital for the Insane, Danville,Pa Michigan Asylum for the Insane, Kala- mazoo ................................ Asylum for the Insane, Hamilton, Prov- ince of Ontario......................... Illinois Southern Hospital for the Insane, Anna............................. ....... Lunalic Hospital, Boston, Mass........... Now Hampshire Asylum for the Insane, Concord ............................... Asylum for Insane Criminals,Auburn,N.Y. Wisconsin State Hospital for the Insane, Mendota................................. State Lunatic Asylum. Utica, N. Y........ Hudson Kiver State Hospital, Poughkeep- sie, N. Y................................ State Homoepathio Asylum for the Insane, Middletown, N. Y........................ Average number of inmates. 467 399 100 453 500 460 417 277 594 83 204 207 260 101 334 615 197 82 Salaries and Wages. Aggregate cost. $30,625 57 26,790 50 7,745 75 31,497 57 30,057 75 33,540 00 27,362 59 17,444 55 55,410 12 6,212 64 17,264 14 15,908 95 23,075 22 8,223 37 31,301 88 58,535 96 29,714 32 *15,916 86 Cost per capita. $65 58 67 14 77 46 69 55 60 11 72 91 65 62 62 98 93 28 74 85 84 62 76 85 88 75 81 42 93 72 95 18 150 83 194 11 Provisions and Supplies. Clothing. Aggregate cost. $30,138 88 29,435 31 7,937 05 40,312 41 40,668 37 27,447 84 37,456 61 20,711 24 39,351 20 4,785 37 16,358 95 20,721 57 22,14S 08 8,719 02 25,228 93 70,621 33 23,657 32 19,081 09 Cost per capita. $64 54 73 77 79 37 59 67 89 82 74 77 66 25 57 66 80 19 100 10 S5 19 86 33 75 53 114 83 120 09 232 69 t$12,608 08 3,493 41 Aggregate cost. 4,609 21 9,354 97 tI0,645 07 6,122 22 2,514 37 7,974 05 t2,782 20 12,284 84 tl,694 14 t2,908 69 6,905 92 9,544 39 2,310 29 1,946 61 Cost per capita. Medical Stores. Aggregate cost. $26 99 8 76 10 17 18 71 23 14 14 68 9 08 13 43 33 52 11 20 8 19 '28*79 20 68 15 52 11 73 22 76 $1,921 26 1,787 93 543 01 1,677 07 2,141 25 3,563 92 1,556 57 910 21 3,166 55 431 13 1,363 06 2,481 80 1,023 91 580 28 1,064 40 7,183 42 1,926 63 1,203 27 Cost per capita. $4 11 4 48 5 43 3 70 4 28 7 75 3 73 3 28 5 33 5 19 6 68 11 99 3 94 5 74 Fuel and Light. Aggregate cost. 3 19 11 68 9 78 14 67 $7,166 35 9,743 52 1,845 62 16,306 76 9,424 47 16,527 19 9.800 12 12,085 63 29,904 30 1,755 66 3,554 67 5,772 67 11,177 64 4,368 93 15,318 29 16,119 96 10,722 15 6,336 34 * Does not include farm wages. , t Includes bedding. CO Table No. 20—{Continued). NaME OF INSTITUTION. New York City Lunatic Asylum (females)....... New York City Asylum for the Insane (males) ... West Virginia Hospital for the Insane, Weston.. Asylum for the Insane, Toronto, Province of On lario ............................. .............. Asylum for the Insane, London, Province of On- tario............................................. Asylum for the Insane, Stockton, California..... Nova Scotia Hospital for the Insane, Halifax--- Alabama Insane Hospital, Tuscaloosa............ Vermont Asylum for the Insane, Brattleboro*... Hospital forthe Insano, Dayton, Ohio........... Minnesota Hospital for the Insane, St Peters.... State Lunatic Hospital, Taunton, Mass........... Willard Asylum for the Insane, Willard, N. Y--- Northern < t'hio Lunatic. Asylum, Newburgh...... State Lunatic Hospital, Northampton, Mass...... County Insane Asylum, St. Louis, Mo............ Virginia Western Lunatic Asylum, Staunton .... Tennessee Hospital for the Insane, Nashville*___ Iowa Hospital for the Insane, Mt. Ple-isant....... State Lunatic Hospital, Worcester, Mass.......... Maine Insane Hospital, Augusta.................. Kansas State In-ane Asylum, Osawatomie........ Illinois Central Hospital for the Insane, Jackson- ville ............................................. Northern Hospital for the Insane, Oshkosh, Wis.. North Western Hospital for the Insane, Toledo,O. Connecticut Hospital for the Insane, Middletown Western Pennsylvania Hospital for the Insane, Dixmont ......................................... Illinois Northern Hospital for the Insane, Elgin.. State Lunatic Asylum, Hairisburg, Pa............. State Hospital for the Insane, Danville, Pa....... Michigan Asylum for the Insane, Kalamazoo..... Asylum for the Insane, Hamilton, Province of On- tario ............................................. * Biennial report, the aggregates given are for All other Ordi- nary EXPENSES. Aggregate cost. $9,443 49 8,121 01 3,733 77 7,361 01 8,132 82 21,623 23 9,611 31 10,551 47 13,895 29 5,341 02 10,386 62 15,639 82 22,60(1 31 10,932 94 12,340 84 1,405 09 9,234 09 11,560 31 18,327 78 11,084 04 11,965 97 3,531 41 13,934 43 13,425 94 3,426 97 5,076 19 20,816 13 15,471 90 16,081 80 13,881 79 9,794 68 4,444 09 two years. Cost per capita. $7 15 12 42 9 69 11 93 12 97 16 56 29 04 29 07 14 56 8 96 21 37 23 56 21 01 20 24 26 04 4 33 25 79 14 98 31 54 22 17 30 07 20 77 29 84 33 65 34 27 11 20 41 63 33 63 38 57 50 11 16 49 53 54 Total ordinary expenses. $112,381 94 79,032 80 47,725 78 79,213 73 83.608 27 193,718 56 49,294 21 55,322 87 147,397 23 95,338 (6 78,463 59 107,784 45 170,680 02 89,230 67 79,199 00 54,039 80 61,994 38 147,620 91 111,085 42 97,547 25 78,792 00 34,000 52 96,394 57 84,076 61 21,493 40 99,479 21 112,462 94 107,195 92 93,380 01 67,547 79 145,600 90 20,411 <)9 Annual cost per capita, excluding repairs. $85 14 120 85 123 96 128 38 133 34 148 33 148 93 152 40 154 50 159 96 161 45 162 32 164 20 1(15 24 167 08 168 12 173 17 191 21 192 22 195 09 197 97 200 04 206 41 212 22 214 99 219 60 224 92 233 03 235 92 243 85 245 12 245 91 Ordinary Repairs. Aggregate cost. $72 60 3,163u51 2,246 50 7,198 39 5,600 89 8,887 84 10,004 89 4,937 28 740 51 121,567 01 4,046 97 3,416 18 10,250 67 1,012 52 2,417 38 6,327 31 12,025 26 3.428 78 5,112 32 930 11 11,750 92 8,762 81 3,371 94 2,805 37 4,553 41 3,108 48 518 90 4,159 16 537 47 Coslrper capita. $0 19 5 13 3 58 5 51 16 92 24 43 10 49 8 28 1 52 32 48 3 76 6 69 21 62 3 12 6 75 16 39 20 69 6 86 12 84 5 47 25 16 21 96 33 72 5 61 9 89 7 45 1 87 7 00 6 47 Annual cost per capita, including ordinary repairs. $124 15 133 51 136 32 153 84 165 85 176 88 164 99 168 24 162 97 194 80 167 96 171 93 188 70 171 24 179 92 207 60 212 91 201 15 210 81 205 51 231 57 234 18 248 71 230 53 242 92 243 37 245 72 252 12 Buildings, extraor- dinary re- pairs and improve- ments. $17,313 54 10,504 18 16,281 82 94,365 45 12,399 55 4,565 21 4,184 03 24,'082 *22 6,010 36 578 07 11,178 14 © OS -4 All other extraor- Total dinary ' expendi- expendi- tures. tures. $871_00 5," 863 40 211 40 6,000 00 5,414 99 506 97 323 64 1,103 41 'i,'198'25 "729 32 5112,381 94 79,032 80 47,798 38 82,382 24 85,854 77 260,916 95 55,766 10 61,210 71 180,584 06 110,780 12 95,702 32 129.351 46 275,093 04 92,646 85 95,419 67 55,652 32 64,411 76 159,363 21 123,708 70 101,482 90 96,627 60 39,501 84 109,248 90 97,623 45 24,870 34 124,759 68 121,278 67 112,327 40 112,666 63 68,066 69 150,489 38 252 38 .................. 20,948 56 t For construction and repairs. Table No. 20—(Continued). NAME OF INSTITUTION. All other Ordi- nary Expenses. Aggregate cost. Illinois Southern Hospital for the Insane, Anna .. Lunatic Hospital, Boston, Mass.................. New Hampshire Asylum for the Ir.sane. Concord., Asvlum for Insane Criminals, Auburn, N. Y.......' Wisconsin Stale Hospital for the Insane, Mendota State Lunatic Asvlum, Utica, N. Y................ Hudson Hiver State Hospital, Poughkeepsie, NY. State Homoeopathic Asylum for the Insane, Mid- dletown, N. Y.................................... $9,503 27 6,995 36 12,926 81 3,504 90 19,959 45 29,793 35 10,967 03 5,359 18 Cost per capita $46 59 33 79 49 71 34 70 59 76 48 44 55 67 65 34 Total ordinary expenses. $50,328 93 53,574 49 70,351 66 28,305 li) 99,778 87 191,798 41 79,298 34 49,84335 Annual cost per excluding repairs. $246 71 258 81 270 58 280 24 298 74 311 87 402 53 607 84 Ordinary Repairs. Aggregate cost. $682 75 5,816 61 7,677 60 1,206 04 6,919 62 *37,422 44 3,236 83 1,869 88 Cost per capita. $3 34 28 09 29 53 11 94 20 72 60 85 16 43 22 80 Annual cost per capita, including ordinary repairs. Buildings, extraor- dinary re- pairs and improve- ments. $250 05 286 90 300 11 292 18 319 16 $23,735 74 372 72 418 96 143,977 50 4 ! 86,661 31 All other extraor- dinary expendi- tures. $4,019 49 222 18 917 13 1,874 33 * For additions, alterations and repairs. Table No. 21. Detailed Statement of Expenditures of 44 Hospitals for the Insane, in the United States and elsewhere, for the year 1877. NAME OF INSTITUTION. New York City Lunatic Asylum (females New York City Asylum lor the Insane (males), Insane Asylmn of Louisiana, Jackson....... Asylum for the Insane, Toronto, Province of Ontario.................... ................ 651 Asylum for the Insane, London, Province of Ontario...................................... 604 Nova Scotia Hospital for the Insane, Halifax, 347 Asylum for the Insane, Stockton, Cali.ornia.. 1,203 Alabama Insane Asylum, Tuscaloosa......... 371 Virginia Western Lunatic Asylum, Staunton, *360 Asylum for the Insane, Hamilton, Province of Ontario..................................... 199 State Lunatic Asylum, Jackson, Mississippi.. 350 Longview Asylum, Carthage, Ohio............ 625 Hospital for the Insane, Dayton Ohio......... 571 State Lunatic Hospital, Taunton, Mass....... 727 Willard Asylum lor the Insane, Willard, N. Y., 1,227 State Lunatic Hospital, Northampton, Mass., 476 Cleveland Hospital for the Insane, Newburgh Ohio........................................ 577 Western Kentucky Lunatic Asylum, Ho kinsville ...................................".. *340 Minnesota Hospital for the Insane, St. P tei s, 563 Hospital for the Insane, Athens, Ohio........ 661 Eastern Kentucky Lunatic Asylum, Lexingt'n, 55!) Central Insane Hospital, Jacksonville, Ill....| 437 State Lunatic Ho-pital, Worcester, Mass___I 506 Government Hospital for the Insane, Wash- ington ....................................... Northern Hosptl. for the Insane, Oshkosh, Wis. Maine Insane Hospital, Augusta.............. State Hospital for the Insane, Danville, Pa... c a Salaries and Wages. 22,897 13 22,314 50 14,003 42 71,402 97 12,980 92 19,779 02 10,176 07 16,191 57 33,015 13 25,610 73 23,215 16 60,722 11 25,880 77 27,982 64 18,932 71 24,935 07 30,080 81 24,342 60 30,604 69 35,424 20 47,883 39 32,266 29 20,494 74 19,206 56 * Average number estimated from tables given in reports. 770 542 411 312 35 17 36 94 40 35 59 35 34 99 54 94 51 14 40 26 52 87 44 85 38 81 49 4!) 54 37 48 49 55 68 44 29 45 51 43 55 62 84 70 00 62 19 59 53 49 86 61 56 Provisions and Supplies. 34,592 75 32,928 35 20,341 78 55,878 77 20,049 07 19,905 42 12,088 03 19,739 68 42,521 57 43,875 09 5.', 127 06 82,137 25 28,262 80 32,122 14 25,382 64 36,093 01 53,902 69 43,278 22 30,962 67 33,039 82 78,344 5S 30,023 27 33,649 24 22,997 66 53 14 54 52 58 62 46 45 54 04 55 29 60 74 56 39 68 03 76 84 71 70 60 94 59 37 55 67 74 65 64 10 81 54 77 42 63 58 06 48 101 74 72 00 81 87 73 71 Clothing. Aggre gate cost. t$l 1,017 08 17,817 74 2,276 45 t3,889 67 t7,919 27 4,702 91 9,501 75 10,571 31 1,711 07 tl,181 95 3,752 16 3,202 55 1,316 71 7,915 73 13,264 28 3,5(54 52 978 95 4,633 77 7,330 63 5,096 18 8,947 13 18,464 74 5,353 41 10,013 48 4,768 10 4,135 41 3,516 00 Cost per capita. $7 87 11 14 12 05 5 98 13 11 13 55 7 89 28 49 4 75 5 94 10 72 5 12 2 31 10 80 10 81 7 49 1 70 13 63 13 02 7 71 16 01 17 38 10 59 13 01 8 79 10 06 U 27 Medical Stores. Aggre- gate cost. $1,421 13 1,153 22 605 96 1,287 42 1,667 80 334 45 2,936 94 341 41 1,204 88 413 97 811 84 1,469 65 1,393 27 2,062 51 2,190 .30 1,858 42 1,876 90 709 81 629 35 ' *2,'598'2i 1,741 72 832 36 1,162 36 3,511 89 642 62 1,034 60 Cost per capita Fuel and Light. $1 01 1 64 3 20 1 98 2 76 1 II 2 44 92 3 34 2 08 2 32 2 35 2 44 2 83 1 78 3 90 3 25 2 08 1 12 4 65 3 57 1 64 1 51 6 48 1 56 3 31 Aggre- gate cost $7,289 99 8,836 89 15,132 30 10,143 25 5 268 09 19,049 97 1 575 00 4 511 87 4 295 92 3 9111 11 7 98!) 25 8 926 23 14 640 26 21 174 83 9 048 95 "i 467 08 5, 226 73 18, 982 73 11, 795 54 12, 112 43 6, 13-2 17 U) 499 41 8,119 90 14,342 14 8,659 31 4,932 29 t Includes bcddins Table No. 21—(Continued). NAME OP INSTITUTION. State Lunatic Asylum, Harrisburg, Pa....... North Western Hospital for the Insane, To ledo, Ohio................................. Northern Insane Hospital, Elgin, 111......... Western Pennsylvania Hospital, Dixmont..., Connecticut Hospital for the Insane, Middle town........................................ Texas State Lunatic Asylum, Austin......... Southern Insane Asylum, Anna, III.......... Maryland Hospital for the Insane, Catonsville Asylum for Insane Criminals, Auburn, N Y. Wisconsin State Hospital for the Insane, Men dota........................................ Hospital for the Insane, Lincoln, Nebraska.. Lunatic Asylum, Boston, Mass............. New Jersey State Lunatic Asylum, Trenton. New Hampshire Hospital for'the Insane, Con cord ........................................ State Lunatic Asylum, Utica, N. Y.......... Hudson River State Hospital, Poughkeepsie N. Y......................................• State HomceopathicAsylum,Middletown,N.i s.5 o-— boo 105 464 512 463 *214 247 215 370 93 197 •491 274 219 109 Salaries and Wages. Aggre- gate cost. $27,653 02 7,719 84 31,447 04 29,748 43 34,936 17 15,280 14 18,523 20 18,687 54 9,137 72 28,628 52 10,906 35 14,283 82 38,355 16 22,029 41 56,918 92 29,894 69 16,020 88 Cost per capita. $63 71 73 52 67 77 58 10 75 56 71 40 74 95 76 28 93 24 77 38 117 27 76 06 78 12 80 39 93 62 136 50 146 98 Provisions and Supplies. Aggre- gate cost. $32,278 82 9,056 36 31,076 21 49,600 23 37,013 82 26,569 19 20,174 51 18,967 77 8,555 30 24,610 54 7,999 51 20,950 86 44,235 49 21,059 31 64,377 81 25,814 60 17,137 19 Cost per capita. $74 38 86 25 66 97 93 87 79 95 124 15 81 69 77 42 87 29 66 52 86 01 106 35 90 09 76 87 105 88 117 87 157 22 Clothing. Aggre- gate cost. $6,200 25 396 90 +7,346 67 12,425 71 7,012 12 1,176 29 t4,136 46 1,119 36 11,413 79 5,810 51 998 29 12,875 97 5,571 44 6,702 94 9,476 47 3,736 54 1,183 92 Cost per capita. $14 29 3 78 15 81 24 27 15 15 5 4!) 16 75 4 57 14 43 15 70 10 73 14 59 11 35 24 46 15 59 17 06 10 86 Medical Stores. Aggre- gate cost. $1,398 08 563 07 2,361 39 2,220 86 1,418 90 500 00 1,895 18 1,365 56 393 89 1,106 33 597 15 1,978 80 1,673 74 914 18 4,711 91 1,987 91 1,755 70 Cost per capita. $3 22 5 36 5 Od 4 34 3 06 2 31 7 68 5 67 4 02 2 99 6 42 10 04 3 41 3 33 7 75 9 08 10 11 Fuel and Light. Aggre- gate cost. $8,171 84 1,917 94 13,403 02 7,624 58 8,108 75 2,256 37 4,701 70 8,974 84 1,212 42 16,733 54 2,999 22 5,527 48 12,410 95 15,155 37 13,397 24 6,389 02 6,249 60 * Average number estimaied from tables given in reports. t Includes bedding. Table No. 21—{Continued). NAME OF INSTITUTION. New York City Lunatic Asylum (females).......... New York City Asylum for the Insane (males)..... Insane Asylum of Louisiana, Jackson.............. Asylum for the Insane, Toronto, Province of On tario............................................. Asylum for the Insane, London, Province of On tario............................................. Nova Scotia Hospital for the Insane, Halifax...... Asylum for the Insane, Stockton, California....... Alabama Insane Asylum, Tuscaloosa.............. Virginia Western Lunatic Asylum, Staunton...... Asylum for the Insane, Hamilton, Province of On tario........................................... State Lunatic Asylum, Jackson, Mississippi....... Longview Asylum, Carthage, Ohio................ Hospital for the Insane, Dayton, Ohio............ State Lunatic Hospital, Taunton, Mass............ Willard Asylum lor the Insane, Willard, N. Y___ State Lunatic Hospital, Northampton, Mass....... Cleveland Hospital for the Insane, Newburgh, Ohio.............................................. Western Kentucky Lunatic Asylum, Hopkinsville, Minnesota Hospital for the Insane, St. Peters..... Hospital for the Insane, Athens, Ohio ............ Eastern Kentucky Lunatic Asylum, Lexington..,. Central Insane Hospital, Jacksonville, 111.......... State Lunatic Hospital, Worcester. Mass........... Government Hospital for the Insane. Washington, Northern Hospital for the Insane, Oshkosh, Wis... Maine Insane Hospital, Augusta.................... State Hospital for the Insane, Danville, Pa........, State Lunatic Asylum, Harrisburg, Pa..........., North Western Hospital for the Insane, Toledo Ohio.............................................. Northern Insane Hospital, Elgin, 111............... Western Pennsylvania Hospital, Dixmont........ * For building and repairing. All other Ordi- nary Expenses Aggregate i Cost per cost. capita $7,931 19 8,542 04 1,116 62 5,727 09 7,704 42 4,039 25 17,055 20 10,383 13 7,714 42 3,859 43 12,057 85 12,623 28 11,309 19 13,101 61 22,819 85 10,562 04 23,869 78 5,114 11 12,117 36 16,798 05 9,186 31 12,393 00 11,596 71 10,547 36 17,812 80 18,108 96 13,885 57 17,143 07 3,109 10 16,036 70 11,165 79 $5 67 12 17 5 91 8 79 12 72 11 65 14 18 27 30 21 43 19 39 34 45 20 19 19 81 18 44 18 59 22 19 41 37 15 05 44 29 25 41 16 43 25 45 22 92 13 69 32 86 44 06 44 51 39 50 29 61 34 57 21 81 Total ordi- nary ex- penses. Annual cost per capita ex eluding repairs. $109,314 53 84,579 78 23,999 49 83,526 36 82,677 59 48,739 92 175,825 60 55,900 84 54,826 68 32,015 37 56,472 21 100,851 43 92,431 22 118,362 33 202,308 62 79,177 50 98,297 49 59,999 77 100,088 15 117,613 27 100,764 90 90,348 99 98,350 94 156,071 07 111,708 49 85,690 28 65,572 68 92,845 08 22,763 21 101,671 03 112,785 60 ordinary Repairs. Aggregate cost. »78 08 120 48 126 98 128 30 136 84 140 46 146 15 150 68 152 29 160 88 161 34 161 37 161 88 162 81 164 87 166 34 170 35 176 46 177 77 178 01 180 26 185 52 194 37 202 69 206 11 208 49 210 17 213 93 216 79 219 12 220 28 $3,315 29 2,031 06 4,792 51 5,102 05 *7,686 32 2,476 65 824 69 2,185 74 1,878 66 2,350 20 123,332 54 4,764 74 8,277 33 3,949 98 2,326 38 1,593 79 1,508 84 5,373 44 15,724 43 3,196 69 8,430 71 5,862 58 4,503 33 2,514 36 7,634 20 1,074 04 13,593 66 1,905 55 Cost per capita. $5 09 3 36 13 81 4 24 20 72 6 88 4 14 6 24 3 00 4 12 32 09 3 88 17 39 6 84 6 81 2 83 2 28 9 61 32 29 6 31 10 95 10 81 10 96 8 06 17 66 10 23 29 29 43 91 Annual cost per capita in cluiling ordinary repairs. $133 39 140 20 154 27 150 39 171 40 159 17 165 02 167 58 164 37 166 00 194 90 168 75 183 72 177 19 183 30 180 60 180 29 189 87 217 81 200 68 213 64 216 92 319 45 218 23 231 59 227 02 248 41 2i>4 19 Buildings, extraord- inary re- pairs and improve- ments. 86,000 00 250 66 i6,'826-89 124,138'63 6,203 62 7,934 49 15,917 12 18,270 70 4,988 05 6,9:6 05 2,262 18 18,664 02 19,491 58 25,637 55 All other extraor- dinary ex pend- itures. $649 99 268 50 1,142 25 3,915 00 471 06 "51898 329 95 5,146 61 "986 35 1,773 20 "228 95 2,307 61 479 27 3,361 00 23,837 25 134,756 27 143,689 70 t For construction aud repairs. Table No. 21—(Continued). NAME OF INSTITUTION Connecticut Hospital for the Insane, Middletown, Texas State Lunatic Asylum, Austin............... Southern Insane Asvlum, Anna, III................. Maryland Hospital for the Insane, Catonsville..... Asylum for Insane Criminals, Auburn, N. Y...... Wisconsin State Hospital for the Insane, Mendota, Hospital for the Insane, Lincoln, Nebraska........ Lunatic Asvlum, Boston. Mass...................... New Jersev State Lunatic Asylum, Trenton....... New Hampshire Hospital for the Insane, Concord, State Lunatic Asvlum, Utica, N Y................ Hudson River State Hospital, Poughkeepsie, V \., State Homoeopathic Asylum, Middletown, N. Y.... All other Ordi- nary Expenses. Aggregate cost. $16,210 10 2,727 98 8,513 72 8,497 06 2,636 75 13,683 52 74!) 85 5,561 69 27,507 37 7,001 25 23,7H8 98 11,948 29 3,405 39 Cost per capita. $35 01 12 75 34 47 34 68 26 91 36 98 8 07 28 23 56 02 25 55 39 09 54 56 31 25 Total ordi nai y ex- penses. ifl04,749 86 48,509 97 57,914 77 57,012 13 23,349 87 90,572 90 24,250 39 51,878 62 129,754 15 72,862 46 172,651 33 79,771 05 45,752 08 Annual cost per capita ex chiding repairs. $226 24 226 68 234 59 235 15 238 26 244 79 260 75 im 33 264 26 265 92 283 96 364 24 419 75 Ordinary Repairs. Aggregate cost. $6,528 34 3,434 84 5,494 40 2,661 31 629 50 4,180 91 249 91 5,269 67 9,071 39 8,796 82 *47,771 81 5,138 77 1,241 »8 $14 10 16 05 22 24 10 SO 6 43 11 29 2 68 26 75 18 47 32 10 78 57 23 46 11 39 Annual cost per capita in- cluding ordinary repairs. $240 34 242 73 256 83 246 01 244 69 256 08 263 43 290 08 282 73 293 02 362 53 387 70 431 14 Buildings, extraord- inary re pairs and improve- ments. $3,653 59 1,556 00 3,318 57 4,895 92 126,060 44 26,875 11 .\11 other extraor- dinary. expend- itures. $1,089 406 493 44 728 2,070 154 292 5,787 Total ex- penditures. $116,021 38 53,907 41 66,757 74 60,706 88 23,979 37 94,753 87 24,500 30 57,148 29 144,450 22 83,729 66 220,577 50 211,262 33 79,657 08 * For additions, alterations and repairs. affC number of patients under treatment in the 34 State hospitals in above table... ordinarv expenses, excluding repairs, incurred in maintaining said 34 hospitals.. Average Total ordinarv exp. a vpviLre annual cost ncr capita for maintaining each patient, excluding repairs. .. . Average number of patients under treatment in the Government Hospital at Washington, and the nine county, municipal and loreign hospi- tals in above table.......................-••■:.......• •:......-•■•:••.......:: Vn V," " -l\\'...... .................................................... 77-' 4n"sH Total ordinary expenses, excluding repairs, incurred in maintaining said 10 hospitals........................................................... /<-,»w oo Average annual cost per capita for maintaining each patient, excluding re 15,273 $3,002,872 78 196 61 5,600 GO O ^Detailed Statement of Table No. 22. Expenditures of Hospitals for the Insane in the United States and elsewhere, for the different years named. w a > o Q LOCATION. Names. P Connecticut, Middletown, .Connecticut, Middletown, •Illinois, Jacksonville Illinois, Jacksonville Illinois, Jacksonville...... Illinois, Jacksonville...... Illinois, Elgin............. Illinois, Elgin............. Illinois, Elgin............. Illinois, Anna............. Illinois, Anna............. Illinois, Anna............. Q^Massach'ts, Northampton Massach'ts, Northampton, Massach'ts, Northampton, Massach'ts, Northampton, Massach'ts, Northampton, Massach'ts, Northampton, Massachusetts, Taunton... Massachusetts, Taunton... Massachusetts, Taunton. . Massachusetts, Taunton... Massachusetts, Taunton... Massachusetts, Taunton.. Massachusetts, Worcester, Massachusetts, Worcester, Massachusetts, Worcester, Massachusetts, Worcester Massachusetts, Worcester Massachusetts, Boston — Massachusetts, Boston .... Massachusetts, Boston .... Massachusetts, Boston .... * Biennial report; the Hospital^for the Insane........ 1875 Hospital for the Insane........ 1876 Hospital for the Insane........ 1877 Central Insane Hospital.......*1860 Central Insane Hospital....... 1876 Central Insane Hospital,....... 1877 Central Insane Hospital....... 1878 Northern Insane Hospital . ... 1876 Northern Insane Hospital..... 1877 Northern Insane Hospital..... 1878 Southern Insane Hospital...... 1876 Southern Insane Hospital...... 1877 Southern Insane Hospital...... 1878 State Lunatic Hospital......... 1860 State Lunatic Hospital......... 1865 State Lunatic Hospital......... 1875 State Lunatic Hospital......... 1876 State Lunatic Hospital......... 1877 State Lunatic Hospital......... 1878 State Lunatic Hospital......... 1160 State Lunatic Hospital......... 1865 State Lunatic Hospital......... 1875 State Lunatic Hospital......... 1876 State Lunatic Hospital......... 1877 State Lunatic Hospital......... 1878 State Lunatic Hospital......... 1865 State Lunatic Hospital......... 1875 State Lunatic Hospital......... 1876 State Lunatic Hospital........ 1877 State Lunatic Hospital......... 1878 Lunatic Asylum................ 1865 Lunatic Asylum................ 1875 Lunatic Asylum................ 1876 Lunatic Asylum................ 1877 aggregates given are for two years. 0) o > 426 453 463 230 467 487 496 460 464 498 204 247 394 259 342 475 474 476 442 365 353 557 664 727 613 350 487 500 506 496 177 204 207 197 • Salaries and Wages. Aggregate cost. £30,109 51 31,497 57 34,986 17 24,300 47 30,625 57 30,604 69 32,212 59 33,540 00 31,447 04 34,095 04 17,264 14 18,523 20 27,206 75 9,303 57 13,783 07 24,425 95 25,862 72 25,880 77 25,857 03 10,248 59 12,360 08 23,766 95 27,716 31 28,215 16 29,692 59 15,306 89 40,841 59 34,810 62 35,424 20 33,762 01 7,971 74 15,843 82 15,908 95 14,983 82 t Includes Cost per cap'a. Provisions and Supplies. Aggregate cost. 69 55 75 66 52 82 65 58 62 84 64 94 72 91 67 77 68 46 84 62 74 95 69 05 35 92 40 30 51 42 54 56 54 37 58 50 28 08 35 01 42 67 41 74 38 81 48 44 43 73 83 86 69 62 70 00 68 07 45 04 77 66 76 85 76 06 bedding $35,223 66 40,312 41 37,013 82 26,809 27 30,138 88 30,962 67 31,200 93 27,447 84 31,076 21 30,153 18 16,358 9=1 20,174 51 26,802 13 27,247 10 23,894 68 29,973 69 29,033 82 28,262 80 25,493 40 22,453 02 30,341 14 46,360 91 47,049 40 52,127 06 49,409 77 31,896 II 33,533 41 35,428 24 33,639 82 35,948 46 17,992 99 22,051 37 20,721 57 20,950 86 Cost per cap'a. $82 68 88 99 79 95 58 28 64 54 63 58 62 91 59 67 66 97 60 55 80 19 81 69 68 03 105 20 69 87 63 10 61 25 59 37 57 68 61 52 85 95 83 23 71 76 71 70 80 60 91 13 68 86 70 86 66 48 72 48 101 65 108 09 100 10 106 35 ; Includ Clothing. Aggregate cost. $6,783 56 4,609 21 7,012 12 8,696 86 tl2,608 08 t8,464 74 t9,792 07 tl0,645 07 47,346 67 46,405 60 t2,284 84 t4,]30 46 t8,08l 42 Cost per cap'a. 3,545 83 4,365 98 4,385 81 3,564 52 3,910 24 4,486 28 7,048 03 7,571 25 7,915 73 8,559 12 1,683 19 5,923 93 5,595 29 5,358 44 5,616 14 t5,273 81 tl,527 51 tl,694 14 2,875 97 es about $15 92 10 17 1&J5 18 91 26 99 17 38 19 74 23 14 15 84 12 80 11 20 16 75 20 51 10 37 9 19 9 25 7 49 8 85 12 71 12 65 11 40 10 89 13 96 4 81 12 17 11 19 10 59 11 32 29 79 7 49 8 19 14 59 Medical Stores. Aggr'te cost. $1,273 66 1,677 07 1,418 90 749 30 1,921 26 1,741 72 2,356 97 3,563 92 2,361 39 1,560 40 1,363 06 1,895 18 2,930 24 1,636 78 1,618 70 1,858 42 1,283 71 814 1,435 1,328 2,062 2,137 684 1,147 848 832 962 1,452 2,178 2,481 1,978 Cost per cap'a. $2 99 3 70 3 06 I 63 4 11 3 57 4 75 7 75 5 09 3 14 6 68 7 68 7 44 3 44 3 41 3 9(1 2 90 2 31 2 58 2 00 2 83 3 49 1 95 2 36 1 09 1 64 1 94 8 21 10 67 11 99 10 04 Fuel and Light. Aggregate cost. $14,448 40 16,306 76 8,108 75 6,375 21 7,166 35 6,182 17 6,675 47 16,527 19 13,403 02 10,553 16 3,554 07 4,701 70 4,149 20 tl9,277 33 9,493 35 5,957 11 9,048 95 3,405 65 4,665 88 8,055 25 9,813 19 7,879 11 14,640 26 8,087 92 12,412 55 10,007 51 9,780 34 11,499 41 11,401 12 3,872 24 6,016 68 6,772 67 5,527 48 OS $5,000 for fuel consumed previous year. LOCATION. Names. Maine, Augusta...... Maine, Augusta...... Maine, Augusta...... Maine, Augusta...... Maine, Augusta ...... Minnesota, St. Peters Mi-.ne.-ota, St. Peters Minnesota, St. Peters Ohio, Newburgh..... Ohio, Newburgh..... Ohio, Newburgh ..... Ohio, Newburgh ___ Ohio, Newburgh .... Ohio, Dayton........ Ohio, Dayton ........ Ohio, Dayton......... Ohio, Dayton ........ Ohio, Dayton......... Ohio, Toledo......... Ohio, Toledo......... Ohio, Toledo......... Pennsylvania, Harrisbu Pennsylvania, Harrisbu Pennsylvania, Harrisbu Pennsylvania, Harrisbu Pennsylvania, Danville Pennsylvania, Danville Pennsylvania, Danville Prov. of Ontario, Toronto, Prov. of Ontario, Toronto, Prov. of Ontario, Toronto, Prov. of Ontario, Toronto, Prov. of Ontario, London, Prov. of Ontario, London, Prov. of Ontario, London, Prov. of Ontario, London, Wisconsin, Mendota...... Wisconsin, Mendota...... Maine Insane Hospital..... Maine Insane Hospital..... Maine Insane Hospital .... Maine Insane Hospital .... Maine Insane Hospital .... Hospital for the Insane ... Hospital for the Insane--- Hospital for the Insane ... Cleveland Hosp for the Insane Cleveland Hosp. for the Insane Cleveland Hosp for the Insane Cleveland Hosp. for the insane Cleveland Hosp. for the Insane Hospital for the Insane...... Hospital for the Insane...... Hospital for the Insane...... Hospital for the Insane...... Hospital for the Insane...... Hospital for the Insane...... Hospital for the Insane...... Hospital for the Insane...... State Lunatic Asylum ....... State Lunatic Asylum........ state Lunatic Asylum....... State Lunatic Asylum........ State Hospital for the Insane State Hospital for the Insane State Hospital for the Insane Asylum for the Insane Asylum for the Iiuane Asylum for the Insane Asylum for the Insane Asylum for the Insane Asylum for the Insane Asylum for the Insane Asvlum for the Insane Sla'te Hospital for the Insane State Hospital for the Insane Table No. 22 — (Continued). 1875 413 1876 486 1877 i 563 1860 tl36' 1805 tl36: 1875 376 1876 540 1877 577 I860! tl57 1865, 165 1875i 578 1876! 596 1877i 571 1875! 100 1876; 100 1877 105 1865! 4293 1875i 398 1876, 417 1X77 434 1875; 240 1876! 277 1877! 312 1875! 650 18761 617 18771 651 1878 666 1875J 624 1S70 627 1877, 004 1878| 652 18651 4173 1875 364 QC GO M > Wlaconsin, Mendota...... State Hospital for the Insane'.. 1876 Wisconsin, Mendota...... State Hospital for the Insane .. 1877 "Wisconsin, Oshkosh....... Northern Hosp. for the Insane, 1875 Wisconsin, Oshkosh....... Northern Hosp. for the Insane, 1876 Wisconsin, Oshkosh....... Northern Hosp. for the Insane, 1877 Vermont, Brattleboro..... Asylum for the Insane......... I860 Vermont, P.ratlleboro..... Asylum for the Insane......... 1865 Vermont, lirattleboro..... Asylum for the Insane.........*1876 Vermont, lirattleboro..... Asylum for the Insane.........*1878 New York, Utica.......... state Lunatic Asylum.......... 1860 New York, Utica.......... State Lunatic Asylum.......... 1865 New York, Utica.......... State Lunatic Asylum.......... 1875 New York, Utica..........I State Lunatic Asylum ......... 1876 New York, Utica......... State Lunatic Asylum.......... 1877 New York, Utica.......... State Lunatic Asylum.......... 1878 New York, Willard....... Asylum for the Insane......... 1875 New York, Willard....... Asvlum for the Insane......... 1876 New York, Willard....... Asylum for the Insane......... 1877 New York, Willard ....... Asylum for the Insane......... 1878 New York, Poughkeepsie, Hudson Kiver State Hospital .. 1875 New York, Poughkeepsie, Hudson River State Hospital . 1876 New York, Poughkeepsie, Hudson River State Hospital . 1877 New York, Poughkeepsie, Hudson River State Hospital .. 1878 New York, Middletown... State Homoeopathic Asylum... 1875 New York, Middletown... stale Honm-opathio Asylum... 1876 New York, Middletown... State Homeopathic Asylum... 1877 New York, Middletown... State Hommopathic Asylum... 1878 New York, Auburn....... Asylum for Insane Criminals .. 1860 New York, Auburn...... Asylum for Insane Criminals .. 1865 New York, Auburn....... Asvlum for Insane Criminals .. 1875 New York, Auburn....... Asylum for Insane Criminals .. 1876 New York, Auburn....... Asylum for Insane Criminals .. 1877 New York, Auburn ....... Asvlum for Insane Criminals .. 1878 New York, New York city, Lunatic Asylum (females)...... 1865 New York, New York city, Lunatic Asylum (females)...... 1675 New York, New York city, Lunatic Asylum (females)..... 1876 New York, New York citv, Lunatic Asylum (females) ..... 1877 New York, New York cit'v, Asylum for the Insane (males), 1875 New York, New York city, Asylum for the Insane (males), 1876 New York, New York city, Asylum for the Insane (males), 1877 334 370 257 399 542 433 t468 477 472 516 591 595 615 608 600 938 1,076 1,227 1,340 207 197 219 236 66 82 109 130 49 73 108 101 98 114 695 1,355 1,320 1,400 638 654 702 31,301 88 28,(528 52 23,74:! 44 26,700 50 32,266 29 12,396 22 13,833 30 35,938 00 35,634 36 26,798 45 33,075 50 57,471 87 58,535 96 50,918 92 56,227 97 +49,787 08 153,401 10 60,722 11 66,104 10 31,908 62 29,714 32 29,894 69 30,139 50 $16,347 12 $15,916 86 $16,020 88 18,562 41 5,595 53 4,519 17 8,259 75 8,223 37 9,137 72 8,894 75 13,313 00 17,159 37 18,154 82 18,393 30 15,194 91 17,325 99 16,284 71 93 72 77 38 92 39 07 14 59 53 28 63 29 56 37 67 37 75 51 93 55 96 96 59 95 18 93 62 93 71 53 (7 49 63 49 49 49 38 154 15 150 83 136 50 127 71 247 68 194 11 146 98 142 79 114 19 61 90 76 48 81 42 93 24 78 02 19 15 12 66 13 75 13 14 23 82 26 49 23 19 25,228 93 24,610 54 29,052 39 29,435 31 39,028 27 31,519 04 40,7!4 21 95,008 12 08,586 81 38,782 93 64,022 24 70,302 18 70,621 33 64,377 81 00,085 58 57,722 86 66,273 75 82,137 25 72,769 93 21,590 24 23,057 32 25,814 60 25,809 22 13,412 16 19,0SI 09 17,137 19 18,118 71 3,990 37 4,794 80 9,339 78 8,719 02 8,555 30 7,563 02 50,229 72 51,912 08 61,445 69 63,261 84 33,070 35 38,535 00 41,945 18 75 53 66 52 113 05 73 77 72 00 72 79 87 04 100 22 72 65 75 16 108 33 118 lo 114 83 105 88 100 14 61 54 61 59 GO 94 54 31 104 30 120 09 117 87 109 36 203 21 232 69 157 22 139 37 81 43 65 64 86 48 86 33 87 29 66 34 72 27 38 31 46 55 45 18 51 83 58 92 59 75 8,905 92 5,810 51 4,323 04 3,49! 41 4,768 10 8,519 45 10,792 80 8,646 20 9,544 39 9,476 47 9,109 04 9,535 84 11,362 60 13,204 28 17,280 16 2,502 16 2,310 29 3,736 54 3,299 78 678 14 1,946 61 1,183 92 1,376 46 787 74 20 68 15 70 16 82 8 76 8 79 §3,137 48 §2,908 69 $1,413 79 ?1.421 72 §13,077 40 §11,246 20 * 12,312 26 HI,017 08 $5,509 56 +0,022 30 $7,817 74 16 51 18 26 14 53 15 52 15 59 15 18 10 17 10 56 10 81 12 89 12 09 11 73 17 06 13 98 10 28 22 76 10 86 10 59 10 08 29 05 28 79 14 43 12 48 18 82 8 30 9 33 7 87 8 43 10 13 11 14 1,064 40 1,106 33 1,666 49 1,787 93 3,511 89 092 H 644 5fi 1,955 82 1,915 82 2,096 59 4,267 76 6,353 43 7,183 42 4,711 91 4,212 62 1,283 73 1,774 30 2,190 30 2,008 30 960 54 1,926 63 1,987 91 1,869 84 403 32 1,203 27 1,755 70 958 25 168 53 61 00 360 65 580 28 393 89 308 65 1,698 26 1,456 18 1,355 33 1,421 13 1,101 75 698 64 1,153 22 3 19 2 99 6 48 4 48 6 48 1 59 1 38 2 05 2 03 4 06 7 23 10 67 11 68 7 75 7 02 1 37 1 65 1 78 1 49 4 64 9 7S 9 08 7 93 6 11 14 67 16 11 7 37 3 44 83 3 34 5 74 4 02 2 70 2 44 1 08 1 03 1 01 1 73 1 07 1 64 15,318 291 16,733 54 16,493 25 9,743 52 14,342 14 5$ © 9,177 10 6,010 07 15,039 01 17,749 06 16,119 96 13,397 24 12,280 70 21,007 10 21,262 56 21,174 83 21,285 32 9,408 13 10,722 15 6,389 02 11,106 46 5,911 41 6,336 34 6,249 60 7,146 62 1,410 51 3,437 64 1,505 62 4,368 93 1,212 42 1,890 64 3,447 43 8,767 36 9,670 35 7,289 99 15,716 51 7,729 80 8,836 89 * Biennial report, the aggregates given are for two years. $ Does not include farm wages. tAverage number estimated from tables given in reports. $ Includes bedding. LOCATION. Connecticut, Middletown ... Connecticut, Middletown — Connecticut, Middletown___ Illinois, Jacksonville......... Illinois, Jacksonville......... Illinois, Jacksonville......... Illinois, Jacksonville......... Illinois, Elgin................ Illinois, Elgin............... Illinois, Elgin................ Illinois, Anna................. Illinois, Anna................ Illinois, Anna............... Massachus'ts, Northampton. Massachus'ts, Northampton. Massachus'ts, Northampton. Massachus'ts, Northampton. Massachus'ts, Northampton. Massachus'ts, Northampton. Massachusetts, Taunton..... Massachusetts, Taunton..... Massachusetts, Taunton..... Massachusetts, Taunton..... Massachusetts, Taunton..... Massachusetts. Taunton..... Massachusetts, Worcester ... Massachusetts, Worcester ... Massachusetts, Worcester ... Massachusetts, Worcester ... Massachusetts, Worcester ... Massachusetts, Boston...... Massachusetts, Boston....... Massachusetts, Boston ...... Massachusetts, Boston....... Maine, Augusta.............. Maine, Augusta.............. Maine, Augusta.............. Names. Hospital for the Insane ... Hospital for the Insane ... Hospital for the Insane ... Central Insane Hospital... Central Insane Hospital... Central Insane Hospital... Central Insane Hospital... Northern Insane Hospital. Northern Insane Hospital. Northern Insane Hospital. Southern Insane Hospital. Southern Insane Hospital. Southern Insane Hospital. State Lunatic Hospital — State Lunatic Hospital--- State Lunatic Hospital ... State Lunatic Hospital--- State Lunatic Hospital — State Lunatic Hospital . ., State Lunatic Hospital — State Lunatic Hospital — State Lunatic Hospital .., Stale Lunatic Hospital ... State Lunatic Hospital — State Lunatic Hospital--- Slate Lunatic Hospital State Lunatic Hospital--- State Lunatic Hospital State Lunatic Hospital.... State Lunatic Hospital — Lunatic Asy.um........... Lunatic Asylum........... Lunatic Asylum........... Lunatic Asylum........... Maine Insane Hospital--- Maine Insane Hospital.... Maine Insane Hospital--- Table No. 22—(Continued). Alt, other Ordi- nary Expenses. Aggregate cost. $13,443 48 5,076 19 16,210 10 9,998 26 13,934 43 12,393 00 15,944 75 15,471 90 16,036 70 12,779 18 9,503 27 8,513 72 10,425 96 8,734 92 10,643 11 12,366 87 12,340 84 10,562 04 10,740 29 10,286 40 6,722 27 11,645 88 15,639 82 13,401 01 14,925 27 13,818 66 11,847 92 11,081 04 11,596 71 10,785 38 5,905 37 9,895 56 6,995 36 5,561 69 2,745 II 2,538 50 12,832 10 Cost per capita $31 56 11 20 35 01 21 73 29 84 25 45 32 14 33 63 34 57 25 66 46 69 34 47 26 46 33 72 31 12 26 03 26 04 22 19 24 29 28 18 19 04 20 91 23 56 18 44 24 35 3!) 48 24 32 22 17 22 92 21 74 33 37 48 51 33 79 28 23 11 63 9 33 32 24 Total ordinary expenses. $101,282 99,479 104,749 76,929 96,394 90,348 98,182 107,195 101,671 95,546 60,328 57,944 79,595 45,285 71,144 82,262 79,199 79,177 70,690 47,653 62,779 100,070 107,784 118,362 112,812 75,801 103,302 97,547 98,350 98,475 42,468 57,513 53,574 51,878 31,206 50,203 80,695 £ Aggregate cost. $237 75 219 60 226 24 167 24 206 41 185 52 197 94 233 03 219 12 191 86 246 71 234 59 202 02 174 84 208 02 173 18 167 08 163 34 159 93 130 56 177 84 179 66 162 32 li.2 81 184 03 216 57 212 12 195 09 194 37 198 53 239 93 281 91 258 81 263 33 132 23 184 57 202 73 Q0 GO K > H W No. 67.] 85 O'i'SSj SSS9n,oi--'N -in-4>s»cc sot^.r-05 «co-*m eoe»t-ire-*Mioeo t-Minojcor-eDcoe»iaeoeoo «C^lftCO-*0<05^o60^MCOMCOC«WOI05-»CD^COCOXIh-OICC05COr-«D!)OOt-CNX05-*MCOMOMOl'-010S t"5^9!22Sr'!SB,-M*Ot0ii;St-i0 5lO'S*C0OC«--e!O-f»^'»l0-*M95»0!aiX)«C0*l-h.Mh. Si;Pw2?fc*H^c4rtooe*t«MH^xinc4»«}«»-*^sinoo>*X)niew^iooii5-ionM«io-*iT eMXl'•,-a-ce»t•c«(^o^-8Mxx- CM 1ft O M — CM CN < . - o**OMC*ir5ior~ooo;io^i^»r»cMr~h*or~cot-ir5 050 COO — — lOCCt-.QDCIOGOOO'JOCCaDX-*50e0050C3: — iOOOOOIOOmNS r-t^ M M M M IM — CM CN 01 i* lO CO O CO O CC050-W05CO MOOOSMOO^ Sse3 —SScn ■OOf*X -* o: X«OOH|^fH*XiOD^iC^(:<-a3t-^©^^at^(re^4rtOb'»nir:^mc»C^i^WC.XNC^I^h.C; NM^^OiXtO'TIODXlNaC^lXJCX^^^r^QOOMO^Xl^Ol^^OCOi^^^^Or^XiCCOa^OWt^^H HOC^ffiifliO*-ii,r-»N,»ff3lOXh'r*,XCOO«OC:--HOCHCW*li(efflh.OOXX^OWh» Hiahhit5C00O^C:C(Mh'?.e0p-rtCtC-'Hffi«i0irtt»^«K(fieiO-Nt*X05t-«Mt^00«r>'OD>flCFN^h H(M-*'«CMW(SWf*:HeMrtn07:h. (M^MWCCWWNW^ i rH i—t ^h 01 CO -^ ft*oj^t»owr»wwoio^c.x^CJi>ic*ci3j^»^F^efl«ojM«f»*xiOt^t*r*rt54^Hh>QOiriooJO>^»os hXNHb.^ONinCMW«Dr.^O^^^N^«WWOiftX(BCOGOW'XO^M(»T#iN?l^XW^©iOOa OSh:5vOX«SwW©MCJX«OW»*«C©iOnHiOW»l^«rtOSb.^^^|^C3(S»l»l>XiOn«Ot»©^ip d -."?.">' o o s DCDSSVDU, e es cc es K^: sS»o=eccc ^1 "-, f., fl, "i~ 380«_„__. t ©eccieS^-C^.^ — — — 555£ J3.C — -" e» o o o SsSSggESE =_'£, © © cb cb . c = c > o c o 3SSS c o c ' ^55S^=J3J= o o © c o o c CB CB CB a OC 02 o © c >' > > 000 z.ti.,J.:ii.,J..'i..Ii.St ■- o © © © SHMplHi^HM ££^^Z?£? CO ^ — CB -J CB © pq..... = © © c 0 © © 1) CB O CB Table No. 22—(Continued). Names. All other Ordi-narv Expenses. Total ordinary expenses. H «j3 ©"© o X © CO "iff.{3 3~ es a =<» a es © Ordinart Repairs. <- &C=0 © g u « a a 00— © 0 0 « —* ^ "S cs es 3 = .9 a 0^3 e es u ■ to 13 cS i* . fe'SS * P.© © © > ? ^0 bDU M a cs a — c — ro-— _« w0" es a 1* CB ® © =32? • o.S b ' LOCATION. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. Total expendi-tures. $24,658 44 24,019 23 22,606 31 22,819 85 19,501 05 10,762 71 10,967 63 11,948 29 10,372 77 6,808 82 5,359 18 3,405 39 5,088 26 2,269 27 3,284 57 1,718 68 3,501 90 2,636 75 2,620 26 11,915 88 8,568 05 9,443 49 7,931 19 7,443 19 8,121 01 8,542 04 $41 01 25 61 21 01 18 59 14 55 51 99 55 67 54 56 43 95 103 16 65 34 31 25 39 14 46 31 44 99 15 91 34 70 26 91 22 99 17 15 6 32 7 15 5 67 11 67 12 42 12 17 $166,574 35 163,365 84 176,680 62 202,308 62 199,008 86 77,133 40 79,298 34 79,771 05 82,597 67 43,560 97 49,843 35 45,752 68 51,250 71 14,221 95 16,094 18 24,321 96 28,305 19 23,349 87 22,699 04 93,681 68 99,109 84 112,381 94 109,314 53 78,036 30 79,032 80 84,579 78 $277 62 174 16 164 20 164 87 148 51 372 62 " 402 53 364 24 349 99 660 01 607 84 419 75 394 23 290 24 2:0 47 225 20 280 24 238 26 199 11 134 79 73 14 85 14 78 08 122 31 120 85 120 48 *$41,380 24 1,167 29 4,046 97 '4,764 74 417,907 59 $68 97 1 24 3 76 3 88 13 37 $346 59 175 40 167 96 108 75 161 88 $1,369 70 $209,324 29 277,884 85 275,093 04 331,211 99 279,470 00 88,943 75 227,429 80 211,262 33 89,167 34 1 158,852 73 140,248 87 79,657 08 71,071 78 17.491 5S 16,999 18 24,717 58 29,511 23 23,979 37 23,027 30 110,069 49 116,687 80 112,381 94 109,314 53 78,036 30 79,032 80 84,579 78 New York, Willard.......... 8113,35172 94,365 4ft 124,138 63 62,553 55 3,724 34 143,977 50 126,060 44 New York, Willard.......... New York, Willard......... New York, Poughkeepsie... Hudson River Slate Hospital__ Hudson River Slate Hospital__ Hudson River State Hospital.... Hudson River State Hospital__ State Homoeopathic Asvlum..... Asylum for Insane Criminals Asylum for Insane Criminals Asylum for Insane Crfminals .... Asylum for Insane Criminals__ Asylum for Insane Criminals .... Asylum for Insane Criminals__ Lunatic Asylum (females).... Lunatic Asylum (females)........ Asylum for the Insane (males)... Asylum for the Insane (males)... Asylum for the Insane (males)... 8,085 61 917 13 292 07 2,114 48 6,441^8 17,634 71 5,787 41 3,448 81 New York, Poughiceepsie__ New York, Poughkeepsie__ New York, Poughkeepsie__ 3,236 83 5,138 77 4,455 19 122 46 1,869 88 1,241 88 1,055 55 3,269 63 605 00 395 62 1,206 04 629 50 328 26 11,685 53 16 43 23 46 18 88 1 85 22 SO 11 39 8 12 66 73 8 28 3 66 11 94 6 43 2 88 16 81 418 96 387 70 368 87 661 86 630 64 431 14 402 35 356 97 228 75 228 86 292 18 244 69 201 99 151 60 108,727 44 70,900 93 26,S75 11 15,316 71 4,702 28 17,577 96 New York, New York city... New York, New York city... New York, New York city... New York, New York city... New York, New York city... New York, New York city... New York, New York city... * "Additions, alterations and repairs." t Includes improvements. Table No. 23. Detailed Statement of Expenditures of the New York House of Refuge, RandalVs Island, for the years 1860 to 1878, inclusive. ^ Average number of inmates. Salaries and Wages. Provisions and supplies. Clothing. Medical Stores. Fuel and Light. All other Ordi-nary Expenses. 05 < Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. Fuel. Light. 9606 49 1,689 02 564 23 1,111 07 2,251 01 2,080 04 2,375 91 1,948 65 2,061 97 363 91 1,591 50 1,750 85 1,958 12 1,829 83 717 19 1,524 39 1,484 88 Total. Cost per capita. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. I860.. 574 511 494 537 638 820 922 990 931 848 671 764 - 691 555 740 820 924 917 930 $12,636 46 14,052 94 13,335 24 13,768 49 15,879 40 16,323 71 18,201 32 22,282 46 25,918 15 26,829 68 27,712 35 28,272 MO 34,099 88 33,238 12 34,880 52 36,061 79 37,521 93 37,014 45 37,454 09 $22 02 27 50 26 99 25 64 24 89 19 91 19 74 22 51 27 84 31 63 41 30 37 01 49 34 59 t-9 47 14 43 97 40 61 40 36 40 27 $20,197 67 17,316 43 16,604 87 20,036 32 29,609 80 39,486 04 48,822 13 55,418 51 53.069 26 48,584 58 39,885 57 41,657 08 41,516 17 38,329 56 44,521 62 45,516 21 50,492 18 52,469 75 43,414 23 $35 18 33 88 33 61 37 31 46 41 48 15 52 95 55 98 57 00 57 'J9 59 44 54 52 60 08 69 06 60 16 55 51 54 64 57 22 46 68 $8,666 07 7,752 29 6,292 25 11,824 14 12,694 76 19,793 62 23,673 47 17,496 02 12,557 44 14,672 59 7,115 30 10,759 79 12,609 84 5,612 24 9,854 90 12,846 57 14,793 60 16,258 20 11,462 79 $15 10 15 17 12 74 22 02 19 89 24 14 25 67 17 67 13 49 17 30 10 60 14 08 18 25 10 11 13 32 15 67 16 01 17 73 12 33 $388 71 287 63 416 23 448 43 359~61 535 99 690 36 551 76 574 77 501 96 159 28 200 95 536 40 242 96 325 35 166 14 255 09 378 62 329 91 $0 67 56 84 83 56 65 75 55 61 59 24 26 77 43 44 20 28 41 36. $4,784 67 3,200 53 4,195 02 5,719 55 8,601 56 7,633 12 6,670 94 7,159 43 7,714 05 6,909 87 4,562 71 4,444 43 5,329 62 7,181 97 6,542 00 6,412 87 7,639 89 6,346 70 7,097 31 $8 34 6 26 8 49 10 65 13 48 9 19 7 23 7 23 8 28 8 15 6 80 5 81 7 71 12 94 8 84 7 82 8 26 6 92 7 63 $7,863 08 4,903 60 4,557 89 6,366 66 6,669 43 14,414 92 12,283 96 9,392 11 6,623 22 8,856 94 6,404 88 8,415 56 9,652 73 8,849 08 7,517 97 11,018 45 12,674 48 9,583 33 8,110 56 $13 70 1861.. 1862.. 1863.. 1864.. 1885. 1866.. 1867.. 1868.. 1869.. 1870.. 1871. 1872.. 1873.. 1874.. 1875.. 1876.. 1877.. 1878.. $2,594 04 2,506 00 5,155 32 7,490 49 5,282 11 4,590 90 4,783 52 5,765 40 4,847 90 4,198 80 2,852 93 3,578 77 5,223 85 4,712 17 5,695 68 6,115 50 4,861 82 9 59 9 23 11 86 10 44 17 58 13 32 9 49 7 12 10 44 9 54 11 02 13 97 15 94 10 16 13 44 13 72 10 45 8 72 Table No. 23—(Continued). Total ordinary expenses. Annual cost per capita exclud-ing repairs. Ordinary Repairs. Annual cost per capita includ'g ordinary repairs. Earnings and Sales. Net expense per capita. Buildings, extraord-inary re-pairs and improve-ments. Insurance. Interest. Rent. All other extraordi-nary ex penditures. on < Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. Aggregate receipts. Receipts per capita. Total ex-penditures 1860....... $54,536 66 47,513 42 45,401 50 58,163 59 73,804 56 98,087 40 110,342 18 112,300 29 106,456 89 106,355 62 85,840 09 93,749 91 103,744 64 93,453 93 103,642 36 112,022 03 123,377 17 122,051 05 107,868 39 $95 01 92 98 91 90 108 31 115 68 119 62 119 67 113 43 114 34 125 42 127 93 122 70 150 13 168 38 140 06 136 61 133 52 133 09 115 99 $3,564 73 3,576 36 2,651 72 3,506 94 $6 21 6 99 5 37 6 53 4 24 4 64 3 01 2 53 3 16 2 65 2 64 2 89 1 47 1 74 1 72 2 08 2 67 2 49 »101 22 99 97 97 27 114 84 122 77 123 86 124 31 116 44 116 87 128 58 130 58 125 34 153 02 169 85 141 80 138 33 135 60 135 76 118 48 $18,910 27 13,728 62 14,509 82 17,027 69 25,964 00 36,394 22 45,763 60 55,090 69 52,667 18 51,268 54 40,458 20 48,789 63 46,690 15 33,506 56 42,066 29 22,511 64 36,140 34 33,752 97 31,257 87 $32 94 26 86 29 37 31 89 40 69 44 38 49 63 55 64 56 57 60 46 60 20 63 86 67 56 60 37 56 85 27 45 39 11 36 80 33 61 $68 28 73 11 67 90 82 95 81 58 79 48 74 68 60 80 00 30 68 12 70 38 61 48 85 46 109 48 84 95 110 98 96 49 98 96 84 87 $10,425 19 379 00 18,076 30 $1,510 63 1,718 75 1,813 84 1,793 75 1,896 38 1,855 66 3,057 16 3,160 75 3,276 87 2,862 78 2,329 08 2,639 85 2,654 16 2,565 65 2,590 75 2,590 75 2,590 75 2,426 25 2,426 00 $100 40 435 02 933 55 1,292 04 215 74 293 81 693 37 255 67 445 90 294 38 414 72 918 08 $363 06 428 42 413 80 397 19 451 41 476 70 620 06 746 29 649 28 349 56 458 91 509 93 539 37 513 54 465 34 393 38 373 07 492 17 325 60 $70,400 27 53,716 35 84,464 76 63,861 47 97,781 06 108,575 87 130,914 04 142,140 05 124,006 96 125,305 51 108,652 93 113,502 24 137,338 52 97,609 20 1861...... 1862....... 1863...... $16,107 60 1864....... 21,193 69 1865..... 3,479 49 4,280 20 2,977 12 2,353 61 2,679 42 1,784 03 2,018 61 1,997 35 820 47 1,288 30 1,412 42 1,929 43 2,454 18 2,324 78 3,743 07 11,322 40 3,736 87 1,989 23 461 00 660 17 7,634 69 20,897 85 1866 .. 1867....... 1868....... 1869....... 1870....... 1871....... 1872....... 1873....... 19,002 99 9,281 08 12,597 13 17,580 65 6,655 44 6,811 78 1874....... 8,661 60 895 27 1,230 95 18,251 72 14,591 38 116,648 35 118,584 47 129,871 75 146,090 09 136,418 36 1875....... 1876....... 1877....... 821 72 76^00 1878....... 7,963 63 ooooococococceooooix go cc < "*4—t—1—4—1—1—J—I—J05O5C5C ocmo: ©,*»■» to moccoo—ic ; OO 00 OO 00 oo O — ^J '. ©, 00 ©, M . © lO CO—J • CO —J **—J ! CiCCCCO . M-JOCC to to to CO —' • O-J^OOO. *■ OO, OOO O 05 OOO ©—lOOO oo oo o ©©,©©© *»-: 8 ■ o • o • o to o 8 o 8 © o o o o o IO ©, o o o to^to CU OS toco ©< o *.CO tf^ 00 ©CO ©"co O lO o to O CO O 05 00 *- UI 00 g C C5 O 0*CJi C OOO o o o o o o oooo o o oc o o Cash on hand at com- mencement of fiscal year. s|g-I 3". ^ From unexpended appropriations of former years. ^JS.A.rf^i«*C0l*.l^t^.*-i**C0COif^tCfc0tOt0IO ooo oc «ppp OO 5 O Ki»-**■ «■ OOO oo oo o o o o o o o OOO oo oo goooooooooooooooooo ooooooooooccoooooo !05»J05©,©,rfkl*^rfkl^p©il^.C>:t0^tOlO aw^iojOH^cooo OS ©i*-CC I ©i — c: — ■ >©■©, — ooooo< >OlicOOOOOOI >©©,©©©©OCl OOOOOlfCOOO casoo^xoo 88< >ooo OO O i o e o o oo ,00000 o jgggggg From ordinary appropriations for calendar year. ceo H Pm- (XODOOOC!—OGCOOO&OOC gg< JOOOOOOOOO >ooooooooo >ooooooo >o oo ooo o o © ^ -3 = rt> — 3 — — ©CC-~»tDN>COCO©00—lOSOl^CO **■ Cn ©1 00Mt0M*.CDM^qO05CD©,M —M-JOOMM »C — 00050 — -ICDO — — 005COCOMCCGD iO©05©,GC©»©-J©lCO;XMO©105CC©©COGO ^ccce*>aa co>^-4co©ioo—icomocosm 00 00 © tO m 00 05 oo»<.»*,Oim;ooom KJMMM M MM <$ tO 05 ©i Ui -1^0 M © © CO CO CO CO oo cr. cc_oo oc *.H»-©iCOO©CO©,CCi*. *.*.^tf.©HUiOO) ©I ©, © CO © ©, OS 05 ©i -J — MOlO^COOOOOi —I —©C0©©©1 —CCCDCOGOCOtOCDMM —CO ©1C00050QOO©,OOOtOC50©,tOOOO — © oo co © © © <---- 05tSO05OO00C0< >ocooooooooo From theater and circus licenses. m — wcxm — cc©i-^cDMMcocn©^ciio:cocoOO cococoM*ktoi^*.05©>©'ej>i(kCoto — — — • toco to- ©, COCN I- _ —I CO CO CC 1^ CC IO CO ■ : ^OJCDOOOCCCOCCCC©' — I to OS CO CC -»1 —I — c___ ©,cocni-oce3»ocoo — ifcoococc — •»» oo — cc cc ooocho:^co-Jco©iocom»imo5©mooh». -1com—i0005cccoco©i*.co©©,—icoootooo 3^: IfrllkCCOOCCCD—©CS00*.COt0O500O5C5COt0 OOOt000 05 00Cn5stO*.*^^llOM.05tOM «.HSIOOK.H^©^OS>(iS>O«.UQ0l^ Mrf*©©©to—1X©CD—lOOCCOCSOSOO CDOOOOOCOCnOC^JCOlO-'- >eDO5-JC0C5*:©CO From articles sold, bar- rels, rags, iron, etc. «s GO OS o CO 00 ©, ©> O OS M -J M i^-oom m-iccco mmco MtOOIOOS—IQCI<.,^CD>KtOCO toi>iCH».*ooi^a)"4 0is\ C,*l©OiOiClCJi*.||.MOl©W 0©iOC5COit»C4000COlOO — cc c: n © 3 •s £3 < tOO*-M o to i mgc—ic eo J- to*. IO O CC O CC ( 05—ICt ©1MGC—lOeOJ-OOOSCCWCXMLOOM -J000000CDOC0Ot4©,t0C0-lCC-J*-03©>Cp -^ CD—lOXH ©trt-rf^CO 000©,e5t005CC*.*- ©i 00 CO CO K* GO CO < *- to *• -J O —I to < -JtOOOUil^OOCDtOOlMOJM^MtOOCO©; - - WtOCSCSOStOO—JkO-J itooo©,*-© ©co to a H 65 © >3's 68 [79 Table No. 25. " Detailed Statement of Expenditures of the Western House of Refuge, Rochester, N. Y.,for the years 1860 to 1878, inclusive. YEARS. 1860 1861 1862 1863 1864 1865 1866 1867 1868 1869 1870 1871 1872 1873 1874 1875 1876 1877 1878 Average number of inmates. 425 •406 395 430 460 475 496 490 *413 370 352 385 406 382 367 404 457 492 588 Salaries and Wages. Aggregate cost. • $8,999 69 9,084 71 9,468 65 9,782 52 10,174 49 11,770 58 11,743 59 11,932 40 13,153 80 15,217 49 17,270 72 19,524 79 18,380 38 17,304 13 19,295 65 19,522 58 18,717 76 20,839 15 22,148 92 Cost per capita. $21 18 22 37 23 97 22 75 22 12 24 78 23 67 24 35 31 85 41 12 49 06 50 71 45 27 45 29 52 58 48 32 40 95 42 35 37 67 Provisions and Supplies. Aggregate cost. $12,268 17 11,973 60 10,185 69 13,259 25 16,225 46 20,451 63 20,386 56 24,732 01 22,277 62 20,818 23 19,870 16 19,015 70 21,062 76 18,600 87 16,241 30 18,427 63 19,234 69 23,621 92 23,722 26 Cost per capita. $28 87 29 49 25 78 30 83 35 27 43 05 41 10 50 47 53 94 56 26 56 45 49 39 51 87 48 69 44 25 45 61 42 09 48 01 40 34 Clothing. Aggregate cost. $6,374 38 6,211 13 6,796 17 7,032 74 11,150 68 10,968 96 11,844 81 11,299 33 9,608 73 7,753 13 6,354 08 7,291 78 9,169 92 7,144 75 7,920 92 7,183 59 6,476 23 7,130 64 9,026 90 Cost per capita. $15 00 15 29 17 21 16 36 24 24 23 10 23 88 23 06 23 27 20 96 18 05 18 94 22 59 18 70 21 59 17 73 14 18 14 49 15 35 Medical Stores. Aggregate cost. 87 00 124 07 221 67 373 29 259 61 430 34 504 89 364 57 299 20 354 22 483 83 405 22 231 28 211 38 434 02 410 22 278 09 348 20 Cost per capita. $0 20 21 32 51 81 55 86 1 03 88 81 1 01 I 25 99 61 57 1 08 89 57 59 Fuel and Light. Fuel. $1,611 17 1,697 28 1,970 24 2,762 98 3,761 49 3,390 82 5,049 05 2,422 03 5,814 73 Light. $666 20 646 36 723 39 725 38 843 21 1,338 92 1,632 35 1,361 51 1,911 35 Total. 52,277 37 2,343 64 2,693 63 3,488 36 4,604 70 4,729 74 6,681 40 3,783 54 3,753 53 3,917 29 4,827 29 2,334 77 5,414 41 7,726 08 6,601 65 7,287 27 6,988 23 8,285 18 7,413 17 * Average number estimated from tables given in reports. Table No. 25—(Continued). YEARS. All other Ordin- ary Expenses. Aggregate cost. $4,725 24 4,967 13 3,985 63 5,769 94 5,578 18 7,398 13 7,873 37 5,885 55 8,553 28 6,525 36 3,880 69 6,553 60 7,220 63 7,685 19 7,134 46 9,264 91 8,332 81 10,262 88 15,864 54 Cost per capita. $11 11 12 23 10 08 13 42 12 13 15 58 15 88 12 01 20 71 17 64 11 02 17 02 17 79 20 12 19 44 22 88 18 21 20 86 26 98 Total ordinary expenses. $34,729 83 34,667 21 33,253 84 39,554 48 48,106 80 55.578 65 58i960 07 58,137 72 57,711 53 54,530 70 52,557 16 55,204 47 61,653 32 58,692 30 57,405 36 62,120 00 60,159 94 70,417.86 78,523 99 Annual cost per capita exclud'g repairs. $81 72 85 38 84 18 91 98 104 58 117 01 118 87 118 65 139 73 147 38 149 31 143 38 151 85 153 64 156 42 153 76 131 64 143 12 133 54 Ordinary REPAIRS. Aggregate cost. $873 49 1,736 86 2,536 82 1,632 91 1,321 03 1,825 94 3,217 81 1,994 29 1,351 70 878 57 2,211 55 4,019 33 2,554 16 2,697 33 3,323 47 2,676 37 3,153 89 2,314 09 3,938 81 Cost per capita. $2 05 4 28 6 42 3 79 2 87 3 84 6 48 4 07 3 27 2 37 6 28 10 44 6 29 7 06 9 05 6 f2 6 90 4 70 6 69 Annual cost per capita includ'g ordinary repairs. $83 77 89 66 90 60 95 77 107 45 120 85 125 35 122 72 143 00 149 75 155 59 153 82 158 14 160 70 165 47 160 38 138 54 147 82 140 23 earnings and Sales. Aggregate receipts. $17,071 43 15,785 94 14,160 04 20,838 79 22,381 36 15,797 11 24,163 20 24,872 27 20,105 19 18,048 16 13,707 19 13,946 64 12,943 95 16,815 52 13,890 15 13,285 13 11,136 89 11,187 34 14,128 77 Receipts per capita. $40 16 38 88 35 84 48 46 48 65 33 25 43 71 50 76 48 68 48 78 38 94 36 22 31 88 44 02 37 84 32 88 24 37 22 74 24 03 Net expense per capita. $43 61 50 78 54 76 47 31 58 80 87 60 76 64 71 96 94 32 100 97 116 65 117 60 126 26 116 68 127 63 127 50 114 17 125 08 116 20 Buildings, extra- ordinary repairs and improve ments. $6,484 28 8,202 24 7,011 82 2,730 09 3,967 01 16,883 89 6,532 26 13,197 48 13,203 61 13,248 39 4,140 09 799 22 13,125 08 84,856 09 35,971 93 4,873 81 All other extra- ordinary expendi- tures.* $160 00 5i3 65 602 41 375 00 569 75 340 02 773 58 1,400 00 720 02 551 25 843 80 909 24 307 44 105 28 * Includes expenditures for interest, rent, etc. Table No. 26. Detailed Statement of Expenditures of Houses of Refuge and Reform Schools in the United States for the year 1860. Average ,,r.__1 Provisions and Salaries andWages. Supplies. Clothing. Medical Stores. I Fuel and Light. NAME OF INSTITUTION. number of inmates. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. $11 35 15 00 13 51 13 93 15 10 16 20 12 61 18 76 12 92 14 21 Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. House of Refuge.Philadel.,Pa (col'd dept ) Western House of Refuse. Rochester,N.Y. House of Refuse,Philadel,Pa (white d'pt.) 141 425 301 177 574 168 443 248 36 103 $3,799 27 8,999 69 7,547 73 3,883 81 12,636 46 3,909 15 10,068 51 8,140 56 1,792 24 3,586 66 $26 94 21 18 25 07 21 94 22 02 23 27 22 73 32 82 49 79 34 82 $3,725 24 12,268 17 8,059 42 4,788 79 20,197 67 6,422 53 15,595 55 8,556 48 1,261 15 3,556 66 $26 42 28 87 26 77 27 05 35 18 38 23 35 20 34 50 35 03 34 53 $1,600 40 6,374 38 4,065 50 2,465 07 8,066 07 *2,72I 50 5,5S3 84 4,654 29 464 98 1,464 22 $165 41 84 98 148 08 $1 17 20 49 67 35 33 1 79 90 2 17 $972 95 2,277 37 2,874 45 1,224 04 4,784 67 1,043 37 3,866 36 3,086 85 39 41 1,088 98 $6 90 5 36 9 55 6 91 Slate Reform School, Elizabeth, Maine... House of Refuge, New York City........ 388 71 59 04 146 21 442 08 32 49 223 82 8 34 6 21 8 73 12 44 1 09 10 58 State Reform School, Wec-tborough, Mass State Reform School, Manchester, N. H. State Reform School, Lansing, Mich...... No. 26—(Continued). All other Ordinary Expenses. NAME OF INSTITUTION. House of Refuge,Philadel.,Pa (col'd dept ) Western House of Refuge, Rorhester.N.Y. House of Refuge,Philadel,Pa (w lnted'pt.) State Reform School, Elizabeth, Maine... House of Refuge, New York City.......... Reform School, Providence, R I.......... State Reform School, Westborough, Mass. House of Refuge, Cincinnati, Ohio..... ... State Reform School, Manchester. N. H . State Reform School, Lansing, Mich...... Aggregate cost. $800 66 4,725 24 3,304 35 4.206 19 7,863 08 2,062 21 9,912 82 3,391 61 667 53 3,776 27 Cost per capita $5 68 11 11 10 98 23 75 13 70 12 27 22 37 13 68 18 54 36 66 Total oidinary expenses. Annual co3t per capita excludi'g repair $11,063 93 34,729 83 25,999 53 16,564 90 54,536 66 16,217 80 45,173 29 28,271 87 4,257 80 13,696 61 $78 46 81 72 86 37 93 58 95 01 96 53 101 97 113 99 118 27 132 97 Ordinary Repairs. Aggregate cost. $951 32 873 49 864 60 2,669 14 3,564 73 1,536 90 2,461 43 5,500 93 62 00 2,303 39 Cost per capita. $6 74 2 05 2 87 15 08 6 21 9 15 5 55 22 14 1 72 22 36 Annual cost per capita in- cluding or dinary re- pairs. $85 20 83 77 89 24 108 66 101 22 107 68 107 52 136 13 119 99 155 33 Buildings, extraordina- ry repairs and improve ments. 6,484 28 5,564 90 10,425 19 1,292 48 All other extraordi- nary ex- penditures. $909 17 160 00 1,027 33 793 41 1,873 69 188 37 1,350 65 Total expendi- tures. $12,924 42 42,247 60 33,456 36 20,027 45 70,400 27 19,047 18 47,634 72 33,961 17 6,040 35 16,000 00 W > 'Includes bedding- Table No. 27. Detailed Statement of Expenditures of Houses of Refuge and Reform Schools in the United States, for the year 1865. NAME OF INSTITUTION. bos- © at ©■" Salaries and Wages. Aggregate cost. House of Refuge, Philadelphia, Pa. (white dept.).................................. State Reform School, Manchester, N. H. Houseof Refuge, Philadelphia, Pa. (col'ed dept.)..................................... Western House of Refuge, Rochester, N. Y. House of Refuge, New York city.......... Reform School, Providence, R. I.......... State Industrial School, Lancaster, Mass.. State Reform School, Elizabeth, Maine.... Catholic Protectory, New York city....... State Reform School, Waukesha, Wis..... State Reform School, Lancaster, Ohio State Reform School, Westborough, Mass., House of Correction, Boston, Mass...... 466 *116 150 475 820 223 140 188 417 *146 *240 325 211 $7,874 94 2,259 25 4,195 60 11,770 58 16,323 71 5,820 00 8,191 02 3,333 29 4,763 00 4,137 74 8,702 54 11,864 81 9,475 19 Cost per capita. 19 47 27 97 24 78 19 91 26 09 58 51 17 73 11 42 28 34 36 26 36 51 44 90 Provisions and Supplies. Aggregate cost. $18,013 03 4,782 18 5,933 45 20,451 63 39,486 04 12,293 95 4,765 39 8,128 91 23,175 44 5,671 97 12,930 68 18,643 63 16,060 65 Cost per capita. $38 65 41 23 39 56 43 05 48 15 55 13 34 04 43 24 55 57 38 85 53 87 57 37 76 12 Clothing. Aggregate Cost per cost. capita. $10,450 06 1,106 47 3,471 61 10,968 96 19,793 62 t4,757 37 1,180 05 3,309 82 45,031 00 t7,409 33 7,106 83 42,231 81 $22 43 9 54 23 14 23 10 24 14 21 33 8 43 17 61 "34'46 30 87 21 87 10 58 Medical Stores. Aggregate cost. $635 28 129 18 173 19 259 61 535 39 120 56 41 96 "253 73 82 05 368 47 Cost per capita. $1 37 1 11 1 16 55 65 54 29 1 75 Fuel and Light. Aggregate Cost per cost. capita. $5,264 48 1.069 59 1,879 18 4,729 74 7,533 12 1,688 00 393 19 £2,554 (4 1,228 35 1,157 98 266 14 6,141 90 11,450 69 * Average number estimated from tables given in reports. t Includes bedding. t Inoludes furniture. Table No. 27—(Continued.) NAME OF INSTITUTION. House of Refuge, Philadelphia, Pa. (white dept)..................................... State Reform School, Manchester N. H... Houseof Refuge, Philadelphia, Pa. (col'ed dept.) Western House of Refuge, Rochester, N. Y. House of Refuge, New York city.......... Reform School, Providence, R. I ........ State Industrial School, Lancaster, Mass , State Reform School, Elizabeth, Maine... Catholic Protectory, New York city...... State Reform School, Waukesha, Wis..... Stale Reform School, Lancaster, Ohio--- State Reform School, Westborough, Mass. House of Correction, Boston, Mass........ All other Or- dinary Expenses. Aggregate cost. $2,314 65 2,660 75 1,503 92 7,398 13 14,414 92 2,289 12 2,424 14 6,122 62 23,33) 55 2,803 70 7,969 25 11,784 07 6,148 39 Cost per capita. $4 97 22 94 10 02 15 58 17 58 10 27 17 31 32 56 55 96 19 20 33 21 36 26 29 14 $44,552 44 12,007 42 17,156 95 55,578 65 98,087 40 26,969 00 16,99.") 75 23,448 68 *52,756 07 18,802 39 37,277 94 55,623 29 45,735 20 $95 60 103 51 114 38 117 01 119 62 120 93 121 39 124 72 126 51 128 78 155 32 171 15 216 75 Ordinary Repairs. Aggregate cost. $3,223 60 825 82 2,091 36 1,825 94 43,479 49 1,022 59 382 26 1,668 10 "954" 08 1,097 85 3,148 85 7,606 44 Cost per capita. 7 12 13 94 3 84 4 24 4 59 2 73 8 87 "(V53 7 07 9 69 36'05 a £ 3 '" « c P..S o >h $102 52 110 63 128 32 120 85 123 86 125 52 124 12 133 59 "*i35 3i 162 3D 180 81 252 80 .C-T3 h &* C© 2 ?t£ > f2,215 83 1,094 32 16,883 89 L, 01 t-, 1 9 S, <- h $204 44 50 00 910 10 569 75 7,008 98 1,419 29 151 00 * Includes all expenditures except for construction of buildings, purchase of ground and additions. t Includes bedding. Table No. 28. Detailed Statement of Expenditures of Houses of Refuge and Reform Schools in the United States, for the year 1875. NAME OF INSTITUTION. State Primary School, Monson, Mass.............. State Reform School, Lancaster, Ohio............. House of Refuge, New York city.................... State Reform School, Jamesburgh, N. J............ Wisconsin Industrial School for Boys, Waukesha.. State Reform School, Lansing, Michigan........... Western House of Refuge, Rochester, N. Y........ State Reform School, Westborough , Mass.......... State Reform School, Elizabeth, Maine............. House of Correction, Boston, Mass.................. House of Refuge, Plainlield, Indiana.............. State Industrial School for Girls, Lancaster, Mass. 496 462 820 186 295 *231 404 335 136 575 *298 85 Salaries and Wages. Aggregate cost. $13,763 98 14,862 23 36,061 79 5,856 76 15,175 53 12,990 98 19,522 58 18,775 40 6,946 49 18,868 04 13,005 27 9,246 14 Cost per capita. $27 75 32 17 43 97 31 49 51 44 56 23 48 32 56 05 51 08 32 81 43 64 108 78 Provisions and Supplies. Aggregate cost. $12,291 25,519 45,516 ;.8,010 : 9,321 10 942 18 427 14,6S8 4,797 31,555 28,462 4,607 Cost per capita. $24 55 55 43 31 47 45 43 35 54 95 54 Clothing. Aggregate cost. $4, tl2, 12, 4, 5, 3, 7, 4, 17^ 3, 1, 639 72 273 85 846 57 6r>9 49 119 29 865 28 183 59 379 07 339 92 575 72 080 10 273 87 Cost per capita. $9 35 26 57 15 67 25 05 17 35 16 74 17 73 13 07 17 20 13 18 10 33 14 99 Medical Stores. I Fuel and Light. Aggregate cost. $114 58 324 69 166 14 329 83 493 20 173 85 434 02 81 60 'l\'587 21' "i52-72 Cost per capita $0 23 70 20 1 77 1 67 75 1 08 24 "2*76 "i*79 Aggregate cost. $3,911 19 453 28 6,412 87 1,780 18 4,146 67 1,776 15 7,287 27 5,«9S 12 3,315 39 14,833 68 4,924 31 1,693 72 Cost per capita. $7 88 98 7 82 9 57 14 05 7 69 18 14 17 61 24 38 25 79 6 46 IS 75 * Average number estimated from tables given in reports. t Includes bedding. NAME OF INSTITUTION. State Primary School, Monson, Mass............... State Reform School, Lancaster, Ohio.............. House of Refuge, New York city.................... State Reform School, Jamesburgh, N. J............ Wisconsin Industrial School for Boys, Waukesha.. State Reform School, Lansing, Michigan........... Western House of Refuge, Rochester, N. Y......... State Reform School, Westborough, Mass........... State Reform School, Elizabeth, Maine............. House of Correction, Boston, Mass................. House of Refuge, Plainfleld, Indiana............... State Industrial School for Girls, Lancaster, Mass. Table No. 28—(Continued). All other Ordina- ry Expenses. Aggregate cost. $7,067 73 5,614 57 11,018 45 5,959 85 8,002 29 5,186 02 9,264 91 8,326 00 4,«20 32 27,968 05 13,605 95 3,213 18 Cost per capita $14 25 12 15 13 44 32 04 27 13 22 45 22 88 24 85 33 97 48 64 45 66 37 80 0 © $41,789 06 59,048 42 112,022 03 26,597 07 42,258 01 34,934 46 62,120 00 52,149 13 22,019 27 102,388 42 60,078 13 20,086 83 $84 25 127 81 136 61 142 99 143 24 151 23 153 76 155 67 161 90 178 06 201 60 236 31 Ordinary Re- pairs. Aggregate cost. $1,714 52 3,292 98 1,412 42 542 28 904 25 124 83 2,676 37 663 21 1,568 32 7,412 28 "'i,'480'24 Cost per capita $3 45 7 13 1 72 2 91 3 06 51 6 62 1 98 11 63 12 89 iiii ©"° L», ■33 Si $87 70 134 94 138 33 145 90 146 30 151 67 160 38 157 65 173 43 190 95 253 72 = "?.: cu t. $901 00 5,750 24 895 27 ""670 01 13,125 08 855 00 6,512 38 4,884 76 . ^b ;- u 3 ©^ a — i © — © ft ^©a $4,251 75 11,204 58 1,324 43 '"""909 24 '"i,'215"8i $44,404 58 58,135 42 118,581 47 38,343 93 45,156 70 35,059 29 78,830 69 53,067 34 24,803 40 109,800 70 66,590 51 26,451 83 3 u o o Table No. 29. Detailed Statement of Expenditures of Houses of Refuge and Reform Schools in the United States, for the year 1876. 3 o OS NAME OF INSTITUTION. l2_i Average number of inmates. Salaries and Wages. Provisions and Supplies. Clothing. Medical Stores. Fuel and Light. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. Aggregate cost. $4,296 08 11,072 33 729 90 6,988 23 7,639 89 1,921 37 4,16i 29 2,933 22 5,563 10 1,725 19 14,947 74 1,692 00 1,367 50 1,895 53 7,440 81 2,324 30 Cost per capita. Catholic Protectory, New York city...... State Reform School, Lancaster, Ohio.... «,£ $9,242 50 307 44 3,334 20 10,503 55 4,871 15 853 40 Total expendi- tures. 2,286 26 452 38 2," 666 '66 $46,580 63 "7i,627-5i 148,477 36 129,871 75 60,816 25 48,148 49 43,872 92 108,587 92 52,958 05 97,618 16 39,051 77 29,586 43 20,484 98 67,332 22 28,505 81 •Includes all expenditures except for construction and purchase of grounds. p OS Table No. 30. Detailed Statement of Expenditures of Houses of Refuge and Reform Schools in the United States, for the year 1877. .Average number of inmates. Salaries and Wages. Provisions and Supplies Clothing. Medical Stores. Fuel and Light. NAME OF INSTITUTION. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. Aggregate COet. Cost per capita. State Primary School, Monson, Mass..... State Reform School, Lancaster, Ohio .... State Reform School,West Meriden.Conn. State Reform School, Jamesburgh, N- J .. Wisconsin Ind'l Sch'l for Boys, Waukesha State Reform School, Elizabeth, Maine... House of Refuge, Louisville, Kentucky... 535 2,2842 547 *262 230 341 145 252 *197 917 234 566 492 *207 344 124 327 164 121 220 $14,565 69 45,949 11 16,801 75 10,507 47 6,618 22 15,429 64 5,400 05 9,919 12 9,606 52 37,014 45 12,001 70 20,645 79 20,839 15 9,304 62 25,182 78 6,258 85 21,546 07 9,885 89 10,763 56 16,207 43 $27 23 20 11 30 72 40 10 28 78 45 24 37 24 39 36 48 76 40 36 51 29 36 47 42 35 44 95 73 21 50 47 65 89 60 28 88 99 73 67 $14,295 45 99,198 87 21,689 13 8,557 31 8,745 98 10,810 88 5,420 83 9,172 04 7,293 99 52,469 75 10,537 81 26,577 00 23,621 92 12,153 59 19,068 54 5,774 99 17,189 59 8,517 86 6,043 74 13,423 85 $26 72 43 42 39 65 32 66 38 02 31 70 37 38 36 39 37 02 57 22 45 OS 46 95 48 01 58 71 55 43 46 57 52 57 51 94 49 95 61 02 $1,543 11 $2 88 18 94 12 76 16 23 12 15 16 77 16 23 4 19 17 73 12 06 9 59 14 49 17 59 5 99 19 22 8 67 16 04 12 93 20 20 $906 84 1,156 94 263 44 134 13 255 86 533 25 102 18 283 12 296 00 378 62 196 87 1,327 89 278 09 157 83 82 75 51 49 96 98 205 11 160 55 453 90 $1 69 51 48 51 1 11 1 56 70 1 12 I 50 41 84 2 35 57 76 24 41 29 1 25 1 33 2 06 $3,880 77 12,421 07 800 95 2,203 21 1,108 79 3,615 82 1,181 13 2,149 33 1,359 13 6,346 70 2,171 83 8.419 57 8,285 18 1,985 70 4,714 27 1,487 78 4,588 22 2,971 80 1,775 67 3,648 10 $7 26 5 43 410,359 50 3,342 01 3,731 92 4,141 07 42,431 69 4,089 48 823 89 16,258 20 2,821 38 45,425 39 7,130 64 43,640 46 2,061 59 2,383 14 2,834 18 2,631 22 1,564 69 4,444 37 1 46 8 41 4 82 10 60 8 16 8 53 6 90 6 92 House ol' Correction, Boston, Mass........ Western House of Refuge, Rochester,N.Y. 9 28 14 87 16 84 9 59 House of Refuge, Phil'a, Pa. (white dept. House of Refuge, Phil'a,Pa.(color'd dept. State Reform School, Westborough, Mass. State Reform School, Pontiac, Illinois.... State Indus Sc'l for Girls, Lancaster,Mass Pennsylvania Reform Sc'l,Morganza Sta'n 13 71 11 99 14 03 18 12 14 68 16 59 * Average number estimated from tables given in reports. t Includes bedding. Table No. 30—(Continued). all other Ordinary Expenses. Total ordinary expenses. Annual cost per capita excludi'g repairs. Ordinary Repairs. Annu'l cost per capita including ordinary repairs. Buildings, extraordina-ry repairs and improve-ments. All other extraordi-nary ex-penditures Total NAME OF INSTITUTION. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. expendi-tures. $9,776 09 61,342 03 6,032 34 4,199 58 5.404 05 7,711 36 S,820 27 6,927 38 6,552 05 9,583 33 5,216 88 18,564 71 10,262 88 4,023 03 4,864 41 4,722 74 11,476 22 5,259 08 2,703 04 7,115 55 $18 27 26 85 11 03 16 03 23 49 22 62 26 34 27 49 33 26 10 45 22 29 32 80 20 86 19 44 14 15 38 09 35 10 32 07 22 34 32 34 £41,967 95 *220,068 02 55,947 11 28,943 71 25,804 82 42,242 02 18,359 15 32,540 47 25,931 58 122,051 05 32,946 47 80,960 35 70,417 86 31,265 23 55,974 34 20,678 99 57,731 26 29,470 96 23,016 25 45,293 20 $84 05 96 32 102 28 110 47 112 45 123 87 126 61 129 12 131 63 133 09 140 79 143 03 143 12 151 04 162 74 166 70 176 55 179 70 190 22 205 88 $2,380 92 $4 45 1 61 6 59 11 13 1 97 6 10 10 72 8 53 2 67 12 91 6 17 4 70 14 27 17 38 16 68 8 43 33 33 13 38 1 01 $88 50 $1,524 40 $48,873 27 Catholic Protectory, New York City..... State Reform School, Lancaster, Ohio — State Reform School,West Meriden.Conn. State Reform School, Jamesburgh, N. J.. Wisconsin Ind'l Sch'l for Boys, Wauke.-dia State Reform School, Elizabeth, Maine... 879 05 1,728 83 2,559 91 672 89 884 70 2,701 40 1,080 05 2,454 18 3,0i0 94 3,503 53 2,314 09 2,954 92 5,981 02 2,008 79 2,756 52 5,477 66 1,618 63 222 40 103 89 117 06 123 58 125 84 132 71 , 139 84 140 16 135 76 153 70 149 23 147 82 165 31 180 12 183 44 184 98 213 03 203 60 206 89 5,569 04 2,134 06 3,035 33 899 34 2,000 44 $9,120 52 1,475 67 13,066 42 2,507 06 1,831 26 71,515 72 34,282 27 44,5-26 48 46.321 31 23,075 55 35,-'41 87 House of Refuge, Louisville, Kentucky.... House of Refuge, New York City......... 4,457 52 3,333 14 15,411 10 18,251 72 3,889 01 146,090 09 55,267 52 Western House of Refuge,Rochester,N.Y". 35,971 93 105 28 108,809 16 34,-'-'0 15 2,000 00 '"823'87 63,955 36 House of Refuge, Phil'a, Pa.(color'd dept.) 22,747 78 61,311 65 6,367 66 1,310 00 46,082 28 41,315 28 25,944 93 115,109 60 Pennsylvania Reform Sc'l, Morganza Sta'n 23,511 72 'Includes all expenditures except for construction of buildings and purchase of grounds. > fed Table No. 31. Detailed Statement of Expenditures of Houses of Refuge and Reform Schools in the United States, for the different years named. LOCATION. Name. Mass., Westborough...... Mass., Westborough...... Mass., Westborough...... Mass., Westborough...... Mass., Westborough...... Mass., Westborough...... Massachusetts, Lancaster. Massachusetts, Lancaster. Massachusetts, Lancaster. Massachusetts, Lancaster Massachusetts, Monson... Massachusetts, Monson... Massachusetts, Monson .. Massachusetts, Monson... Massachusetts, Boston. ... Massachusetts, Boston. ... Massachusetts, Boston ... Massachusetts, Boston.... Maine, Elizabeth.......... Maine, Elizabeth.......... Maine, Elizabeth.......... Maine, Elizabeth........., Michigan, ^Lansing....... Michigan, Lansing....... Michigan, Lansing....... Michigan, Lansing....... New .Jersey, Jamesburgh New Jersey, Jamesburgh New Jersey, Jamesburgh Ohio, Lancaster.......... Ohio, Lancaster.......... Ohio, Lancaster.......... Salakiks and Provisions and Wages. Supplies. fll l m ~ £ Aggregate S.£i cost. State Reform School .........11860 State Reform School..........1S05 State Be form School......... 1S75 State Reform \School..........J1876 State Reform School......... J1877 State Reform School..........1878 State Indus'al School for girls!ls75 State Indus'al School for girls 1870 State Indus'al School for girls: 1877 State Indus'al School for girls! 1878 State Primary School.........1875 State Primary School.........Is70 State Primary School......... 187 State Primary School.........J1S78 House of Correction..........18 5 House of Correction.......... ISTf House of Correction..........lS7( House of Correction.......... IS77 State Reform School.........18(50 State Reform School.......... 1805 State Reform School..........,18 State Reform School.......... 1877 State Reform School.........isOO State Reform School...........187.5 | State Reform School.......... 1876 I State Reform School..........11877 Stale Reform School..........,ls75: State Reform School..........i 1870 | Slate Reform School..........J1877 State Reform School..........11865! State Reform School..........1875! State Reform School.........118761 443 325 335 348 327 346 85 122 121 99 490 515 535 537 ■211 575 587 500 177 188 136 145 103 £231 231 252 186 198 230 J240 462 507 Table No. 31—{Continued). !3 o LOCATION. Mass., Westborough...... Mass., Westborough..... Mass., Westborough...... Mass., Westborough..... Mass., Westborough..... Mass., Westborough ___ Massachusetts, Lancaster Massachusetts, Lancaster Massachusetts, Lancaster Massachusetts, Lancaster Massachusetts, Monson Massachusetts, Monson Massachusetts, Monson Massachusetts, Monson Massachusetts, Boston. Massachusetts, Boston. Massachusetts, Boston. Massachusetts, Boston. Maine, Elizabeth....... Maine, Elizabeth....... Maine, Elizabeth....... Maine, Elizabeth....... Michigan, Lansing..... Michigan, Lansing..... Michigan, Lansing..... Michigan, Lansing..... New Jersey, Jamesburgh New Jersey, Jamesburgh New Jersey, Jamesburgh Ohio, Lancaster.......... Ohio, Lancaster.......... Ohio, Lancaster.......... Name. State Reform School.......... State Reform School.......... State Reform School ......... State Reform School.......... State Reform School......... State Reform School ......... State Indus'al School for girls State Indus'al School for girls State Indus'al School for girls State Indus'al School for girls State Primary School......... State Primary School......... Slate Primary School......... State Primary School ........ House of Correction.......... House of Correction.......... House of Correction.......... House of Collection.......... State Reform School.......... State Reform School.......... Staie Reform School.......... State Reform School.......... Slate Reform School.......... State Reform School.......... State Reform School.......... State Reform School.......... State Reform School.......... State Reform School.......... State Reform School........ Stale Reform School.......... State Reform School.......... StatD Reform School.......... 1860 1805 1875 1876 1877 1878 1875 1876 1877 1878 1875 1876 1877 1878 1805 1875 1876 1877 1860 1865 1875 1877 1860 1875 1876 1877 1875 1876 1877 1865 1875 1876 $9,912 82 11,784 07 8,326 0(1 5,912 08 11,476 22 4,779 31 3,213 18 2,997 07 2,703 04 2,780 49 7,007 73 8,170 53 9,776 09 12,641 71 6,148 39 27,968 05 19,608 14 18,564 71 4,203 19 6,122 62 4,620 32 3,820 27 3,776 27 5,186 02 10,325 93 6,927 38 5,959 85 4,280 87 5,404 05 7,909 25 5,614 57 7,845 68 £22 37 36 26 24 85 16 99 35 10 15 12 37 80 24 56 22 34 28 09 14 25 15 88 18 27 23 55 29 14 48 64 33 51 32 80 23 75 32 56 33 97 26 34 36 66 22 45 44 70 27 49 32 04 21 62 23 49 33 21 12 15 15 47 Total ordi nary ex- penses. $45,173 29 55,623 29 52,149 13 51,754 23 57,731 20 53,054 62 20,086 83 25,174 92 23,016 25 20,533 71 41,789 06 45,546 21 44,907 95 50,918 36 45,735 20 102,388 42 90,812 07 80,900 35 16,564 90 23,448 68 22,019 27 18,359 15 13,696 61 34,934 46 38,176 72 32,540 47 26,597 07 26,804 80 25,864 82 37,277 94 59,048 42 56,905 64 wg 60 — tf'H ^ S^On. s © *, ST 3 A© - , _ cstj « u o* u s.E'3 3 © S ** © 3 —.5 O u $107 52 180 84 157 65 152 27 184 98 176 20 253 72 214 91 203 60 219 99 87 70 90 46 88 50 99 75 252 80 190 95 166 30 149 23 108 66 133 59 173 43 132 71 155 33 151 67 169 05 139 84 145 90 143 25 123 58 162 39 134 94 123 05 £^ a g fcce °5 © 3 {j co i> s ° ^ o = *3 a. 2- 5xsg PQ » (*.H $855 00 55,597 75 4,884 76 2,286 20 1,310 00 2,443 24 901 00 1,524 40 7,034 39 2,000 44 21,947 81 3,035 33 5,750 24 © c — obu © a.9 2^3 — ^ S. ,3 *© £ M © -„.b $5,569 04 5,564 90 2,215 83 © a — S'-g a • -2ft! 1,292 48 S9,120 52 1,027 33 204 44 2,000 00 2,000 00 909 17 910 10 670 01 1,332 90 899 34 10,425 19 "895-27 1,230 95 18,251 72 14,591 38 0,484 28 16,883 S9 13,125 08 84,850 09 35,971 93 4,873 81 48,584 16 1,321 43 4,871 15 2,507 06 1,873 69 7,008 98 4,251 75 3,334 20 3,333 14 11,633 31 10(> 00 56:) 75 909 21 307 41 105 28 Total ex- penditures. $71,515 72 33,456 36 50,190 31 67,332 22 03,955 36 12,924 42 20,158 41 20,484 98 22,717 78 19,047 18 27,991 59 34,2-20 15 19,756 47 45,156 70 48,118 49 46,321 31 70,400 27 108,575 87 118,581 47 129,871 75 146,090 09 136,418 36 42,247 60 74,858 23 78,830 69 148,477 36 108.809 16 87,336 61 2,076 51 3,053 51 J Includes all expenditures except for construction of buildings, purchase of ground and additions. Table No. 32. Detailed Statement of Expenditures of the New York Institution for the Instruction of the Deaf and Dumb, Nw York city, for the years 1860 to 1878, inclusive. 1800 1807.. 1808.. 1809.. 1870*. 1871.. 1872.. 1873.. 1874.. 1875+. 1876.. 1878.. 1878.. 1 c— » C m £?-» YEARS. f- - 3 > S a 3 I860.. +300 1861.. +305 1862.. J315 1863.. +328 1804....................... +348 1805.. 303 'ALA1MES AND WAGES.j Aggregate cost. Cost per capita $14, 17, 15, 10, 17, 15, 18, 21. 24, 31. 40, 54, 61, 01, 51, 58. 849 56 47 49 51 44 43 50 53 61 53 i'O 105 1-22 119 100 112 116 1(6 Aggregate Cost. $16,160 15,247 16,130 20,289 28,922 31,328 4'), 889 42,014 54,90S 54,074 30,509 42,206 43,238 48,710 49,417 42,501 45,103 47.222 44,184 NS AND IES. Cost per capita. $53 87 49 99 51 21 61 S6 S3 11 94 57 97 35 97 56 US 33 100 58 59 59 82 76 82 83 97 23 90 56 82 52 86 90 98 59 89 44 Clothing. Aggregate cost. $4,703 25 2,005 36 3,053 95 4,108 32 4,179 73 7,082 80 8,498 18 10,904 85 13,394 77 14,215 80 9,981 81 14,000 37 12,278 03 11,625 62 11,008 37 11,391 60 10,070 08 11,720 48 11,563 74 Cost per capita $15 68 8 74 9 69 12 53 12 01 19 51 20 '24 24 95 28 87 27 71 19 49 27 46 23 52 23 21 21 01 22 12 19 41 24 47 23 41 Medical Stores. Aggregate i Cost cost. ! per capita, $354 37 454 56 359 34 560 58 791 01 891 57 1,582 93 111,297 27 1,128 75 1,270 74 1,069 66 3,134 74 702 49 83,3 81 871 65 1,193 47 I 2,1.9 19 1,205 96 1,492 14 $1 18 1 49 1 14 1 70 2 27 2 45 3 77 2 96 2 43 2 49 2 09 6 14 1 34 1 07 1 70 2 32 4 10 2 52 3 02 Fuel and Light. Aggregate cost. $5,026 36 4,353 40 5,404 96 4,967 56 8,970 49 7,682 99 10,885 35 7,444 82 7,307 21 10,967 96 7,870 24 11,120 27 8,424 92 7,843 33 10,514 67 4,628 46 1118,063 77 8,291 74 8,356 78 * Annual report for 1870 embraces only nine months, owing to change in the fiscal year. t Annual leport for 1875 embraces only eleven months, owing to change in the liscal year. + A\ erage number estimaied from tables given in reports. ? Salaries and wages of all kimls, including salaries of officers and assistants, and wages of tailor, shoemaker, fuel, house, laundry, stable and garden, || Does not include ¥740 expended for professional services during epidemic. U This includes a payment of $6,465.04 for coal chargeable to previous year. 3 3 ■vl -^1 -~J —4 -*l -., -J -^, -1 X-J OS ©i *»■ W> K< — ' oc a oc oc cc cc x cc cc :~.CTCCTS:-l~a>:cjCcr;3S C ©' CO 00 ©1 o o c 33 J- © o; Sj? 3 ft 3i _. a 3 3 E ° CB to© » S» n —■ CD S &= - I CI - iO 7, W C Oi *4 ■*- -1 7. ;D 3)^OW!OX- IlS"^-0^*00^^ r° ~ -2 M W CO hO t8 W t'j W -;; w j; M ^ C4 O ri lO 10 HHOCOH^OiODWii'-iOODw'i C ^i ^- li ;j u-> -•rcy.*!^*'*'. i f- wj iri ic i5xiT-txc-:-«-i;^a ? A S 9 X X t ^ ^ ^ w i 5 - c; m - -i !il Total ordinary I expenses. * 0!hi;m-iohi-wio;f ic ^ ff* ; U, "X ii K> tO r>0 l-S IC tC t£> K> •— lO ri, lO fcO (O IC — •—' i— — —I zz x « "x u; ^i w< — -"• V'i i- i . i;c37if-^03 O •- X C ^J *- vi v| i; M .- vi 00 *1 wi .". X ^ O •^tSCOOO;COiOCO»Wi-'*>MOWOC3SC'^ XH>*.ui3iXOSWcr;>-'w't4'^Cft*4lit5h-M ' to »C i-t *-JX. j£ — j-^j*ijfc_p JC^Cr C; !.-» *^ OC > »«^ »*- m « ii ,**. cc -1 c * h wi y< - -q ii ta x n- «s - — OOCCw CO-^OOJ4*OCDCJ'C5CDOO-^IOiCO O0vi3ilv^"sDXCCM^«qM»MeiUiH-Ul(D WUQCTtOJ^HWXvirKOJ^-ui-tDOOCOta Annual cost per capita excluding repairs. tCtWCOI*b»rf^^Cnt-»COM^C?»CWl—'K>>—» l—1 iCHMCCtOCn^Ol^CC^COOi-ii^iatOW ^.*JC7i^-'tCC7itCOiOON-COCO)-^GOCDOO-- I ' • • • • -^r0MCD-^00MO©»W OO,......M M-~J CO CC *■ O 00 ©> O 00©,......©I CD 00 CvS CO O, CO ©,-4 O om: : ■ ■ • • cotoooK^osco*-;;-. ccco o as......coowwcjicocoomco OMM hO ©, O ** ©, MHOS >S OJUItB^tOcnOO »M|ft. J*.MC5 00»KH-©,C©Otf*,OC;00l0*-4©«l>C*C^©»fKOC0 oo-iaiooooo-coaooiacoHMcsno Hswoocfrooiwoow^s^aoo All other extraordinary expenditures. *- c; ~i +- c; ~i w" cr: co ~ o< *- ic o o --J cr> cc> Ci -IC«Om1;c;UO;*. m^O ii ©^- *- b» j*- oc ©,C0O2lO^I*--^J©»^---JCCOCi*-*-—COC3i^-©, Li X *- ©I C~. • COCD-j«i-:0©mm~j gSMCOCirf*C73CDaO~JC5K>-}©»*».OS©,C£-4>fr. H(l-lHHI|,M«>OHOIXia(9BlO100UtJ Total expenditures. >» f H p co s S5j *ao;?jfiag] 90T Table No. 32—(Continued). Detailed Statement of Receipts of the New York Institution for the Deaf and Dumb, New York city, for the years 1860 to 1878, inclusive. to, © OS YEARS. 1860.. 1861.. 1862.. 1863.. 1864.. 1865. 1866. 1867. 1868. 1869. 1870. 1371. 1872. 1873. 1871. 1675. 1870. 1877 1S78 os © ■-> fl ©_ fl 3 C3 W rj CC] $296 90 Al'l'KOrRIATIONS FROM Till: STATE. Fori deficiency. For interest $15,000 00 22,500 00 44,900 00 :51,629 78 50,000 00 400 62 391 93 !!fl,089 45 $164,029 73 For support and tuition. J13,355 98 13,355 98 13,365 98 13,355 98 12,065 00 12,065 00 12.065 00 12,065 00 6,050 00 6,015 00 $113,748 92 Total from the State. 3 © 848,043 48 50,075 73 51,555 98 54,121 65 58,539 50 73,510 00 81,195 00 104,483 75 93,469 53 127,-265 00 78,750 00 99,875 24 10.5,000 00 101,009 99 103,910 92 95,761 63 96,714 15 88,645 84 90,035 01 $1,60.5,862 40 $2,530 00 2,203 60 2,341 65 2,228 61 2,795 00 3,125 00 4,612 69 5,761 56 6,714 47 7,922 65 6,634 63 10,086 33 9,443 57 10,052 58 11,205 81 17,656 38 17,814 09 16,738 75 18,343 67 $158,210 94 From the county of New York for support and clothing- $080 00 1,060 00 ' i,453 32 3,046 68 4,872 29 8,4*3 91 8,093 51 10,235 48 13,092 60 14,983 58 29,'973* 54 13,693 45 12,671 59 13,304 01 19,792 82 20,791 67 20,384 70 $196,593 15 From county treasurers for support and clothing. $3,080 63 2,360 00 4,219 70 3,083 98 5,800 90 9,286 24 12,191 71 15,443 08 15,765 51 19,848 48 23,011 07 23,957 28 22,507 51 21,172 41 20,758 69 21,585 48 23,892 60 22,944 90 _21,210 98 5292,627 23" els! $5,170 35 5,741 40 4,617 32 5,314 58 7,286 10 7,424 01 6,533 46 6,604 54 7,713 31 6,699 74 2,791 43 5,649 86 5,450 90 4,094 60 4,644 94 1,540 88 1,971 48 1,808 72 1,450 93 $92,508 60 — ? c3 3 $8,536 05 4,994 62 4,502 75 10,677 61 6,112 82 11,543 53 16,849 98 15,8(6 54 31,510 65 709 10 808 60 14,103 40 1,537 72 23,402 61 66,31-' 79 47,391 54 178,320 69 97, ('60 57 __1_18,S82 48 $659,804" 11 $68,040 07,535 67,534 77,179 83,581 109,761 132,840 150,192 165,438 175,537 1-27,039 153,672 173,903 173.425 219,504 197,640 338,S97 248,590 _ -270,313 $3,000,695 O -..^*tffc'*-.,_ Table No. 33. Detailed Statement of Expenditures of the Institution for the Improved Instruction of Deaf Mutes, New York city, for the years 1871 to 1878, inclusive. years. 1871 1872 1873 1874 1875 1876 1877 1878 Salaries and Wages. Provisions and supplies. Aggregate Cost per I Aggregate I Cost per cost. j capita, i cost. \ capita. $5,939 94 5.055 67 6,828 01 7,019 30 8,028 10 9,331 89 9,318 47 10,078 17 $104 21 76 60 91 04 81 62 87 26 97 21 93 18 94 19 $4,279 03 3,035 34 5,027 50 5,919 32 6,639 16 6,031 76 6,444 50 6,523 60 $75 07 45 99 67 03 68 83 72 18 69 ,8 64 45 60 99 Clothing. Aggregate cost. $902 40 342 16 706 45 1,092 18 940 97 Cost per capita. $10 49 3 72 7 36 10 92 8 79 Medical Stores. Aggregate cost. $56 03 94 65 96 83 t209 83 1250 76 J220 12 £246 32 Cost per capita. $0 85 I 26 1 12 2 28 2 61 2 20 2 30 Fuel and Light. Fuel. $656 25 537 50 884 75 683 87 697 62 647 30 447 00 Light. $308 77 556 65 619 31 552 51 534 49 457 41 329 54 Total. $1,389 62 965 02 1,094 15 1,504 06 1,236 08 1,232 11 1,104 71 776 54 Cost per capita. $24 38 14 62 14 59 17 49 13 44 12 83 11 05 7 26 Table No. 33 — (Continued). All other Ordin ary Expenses. YEARS. 1871 1872 1873 1874 1875 1876 1877 1878 Aggreg ate •ost $4 001 42 1 970 73 ■> 362 57 2 175 38 1 576 85 1 459 91 1 5:;8 23 1 942 74 Cost per capita. $70 20 29 80 31 50 25 29 17 14 15 21 15 68 18 16 Total expendi- tures. $15,610 01. tl 1,08-2 S4 15,406 88 17,617 29 18,032 78 19,612 88 19,748 21 20,511 34 Annual cost per capita, excluding repairs. $273 86 167 92 205 42 204 85 196 01 204 30 197 48 191 09 Ordinary Repairs. Aggregate co.st. $900 60 53 78 711 22 400 44 447 50 1,115 08 27 00 951 62 Cost per capita. $15 80 81 9 48 4 66 4 86 II 61 27 Annual cost per capita, including ordinary repairs. $289 66 168 73 214 90 209 51 200 87 215 91 197 75 200 58 Rent. 88,011 25 5,625 00 7,500 00 7,575 00 7,800 00 7,863 80 7,583 99 7,329 50 All other extra- ordinary expenses. 730 22 28 00 28 00 25 75 Total expendi- tures. $24, tie, 23, 25, 27, 28, 27, 28, 521 86 761 62 618 10 592 73 010 50 619 76 387 20 818 21 * Average number estimated l'rom tables given in reports. t Includes expenditures for nine months only, owing- to change of fiscal year. t Includes medical attendance. O GO OS w Table No. 34. Detailed Statement of Expenditures of the Le Couteulx St. Mary's Institution for the Instruction of Deaf Mutes, Buffalo, N. Y., for the years 1873 to 1878, inclusive. YEARS. 1873, 1874 1875 1876 1877 1878 *65 83 80 *83 *94 115 Salaries and Wages. Aggregate cost. $3,500 00 4,052 00 917 80 2,630 00 5,000 00 6,403 00 Cost per capita Provisions and Supplies. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita Clothing. Aggregate cost. $53 85 $4,878 00 $75 05 48 82 6,957 00 83 82 11 47 5,955 00 74 44 31 63 7,800 00 93 97 53 19 8,915 00 94 83 55 72 8,750 00 76 09 $360 00 tl,403 00 1,116 00 1,478 00 1,193 00 1,831 00 Cost per capita. $5 54 16 91 13 95 17 81 12 69 15 92 Medical Stores Aggregate Cost «ost- !ca,"ta % $254 00 +236 00 J129 00 t-220 00 S39.) 00 1672 00 $3 90 2 84 1 61 2 65 4 20 5 84 Fuel and Light Aggregate cost. Cost per capita $760 00 ! $11 69 1,119 00 13 4S 1,326 00 | 16 57 1,3.50 00 i 16 26 1,526 83 16 24 827 00 j 7 19 All other Ordi- nary EXPENSES. Aggregate '. C°f «ost" j capita. Bl,011 00 2,80.5 00 1,848 00 1,240 48 980 00 1,209 00 * Average number estimated from tables given in reports. t Includes bedding. t Includes medical attendance. Table No. 34—(Continued). YEARS. 1873 1874 1875, 1876 1877. 1873. $10,763 00 16,5 2 00 11,291 80 14,718 48 18,009 83 19,697 00 $165 58 199 66 141 15 177 33 191 59 171 23 Ordinary Repairs Aggregate cost. $140 00 213 00 113 00 269 09 169 00 311 00 Cost per capita. 3.3 >, $2 15 2 56 1 41 3 24 1 79 2 70 $167 73 202 22 142 56 180 57 193 38 173 93 g« X Ki © - 3 K- >-. 3 © tib IsS '5 c P.S. $1,700 00 1,958 00 2,825 00 560 00 4,163 35 3,796 60 © ©__ 3 OS • jjl MOO S ©'5 9 © -■r'.S >-^ c .- p. $763 34 563 00 610 00 580 00 1,735 00 1,617 00 $2,739 00 3,147 00 3,375 00 2,687 00 1,879 00 5,200 00 © CD . >>>- I- S- 3 ©"3 3 !m © $597 00 379 00 $16,702 34 22,832 00 18,214 80 18,814 57 25,956 18 30,621 60 Th-? above table loses much of its value from the fact that the treasurer's reports of this institution have been so made as to render impossible a correct analysis of the expenditures^ In each year there have appeared in the expenditures such items as these: " Paid other indebtedness existing Oct,________, for portion of the amount included in the next years report, under the head of indebtedness incurred, etc., ought to be charged to the account of salaries and w;Ues for 1875, in order to make a fair comparison possible. ° Table No. 35. Detailed Statement of Expenditures of Institutions for the Deaf and Dumb in the United States and elsewhere, for the different years named. LOCATION. Name of Institution. Connecticut, Hartford... Connecticut, Hartford .. Connecticut, Hartford... Connecticut, Hartford... Connecticut, Hartford. .. Illinois, Jacksonville ... Illinois, Jacksonville ... Illinois, Jacksonville ... Illinois, Jacksonville ... Pennsylvania, Phila--- Pennsylvania, Phila .... Pennsylvania, Phila..... Penn, Turtle Creek .... Prov. of <>nt., Belleville Pro/, of Ont., Belleville. Prov. of Ont., Belleville.. Prov. of Out., Belleville.. Tennessee, Knoxville ... Wisconsin, Delavau...... Wisconsin. Delavau...... Wisconsin, Delavau...... New York, New York city, New York, New York city, New York, New York city, New York, New York city, New York, New York city, New York, New York city, New York, New York city, New York, New York city, New York, New York city, American Asylum............. 1860 American Asylum.............. 1865 Vmerican Asylum.............. 1875 American Asylum.............. 1870 American Asylum.............. 1877 Illinois Institution ............. *1865 Illinois Insi'tution ............. 1876 Illinois Institution ............. 1877 Illinois Institution ............. 1878 Pennsylvania Institution...... 1875 Pennsylvania Institution..... 1870 Pennsylvania Institution..... 1-77 Western Pennsylvania Inslit'n, 1877 Ontario Inatituiion............ 1875 Ontario Institution............. 1376 Ontario Institution............ 1877 Ontario Institution............. 1878 Tennessee School.............. *1876 Wisconsin Institute........... 1875 Wisconsin Institute.......... 1876 Wisconsin Institute............ 1877 New York Institution......... 1860 New York Institution.......... 1865 New York Institution......... 1876 New York Institution.......... 1877 New York Institution.......... 1878 Inst, for Improved Instruction, 1875 Inst for Improved Instruction, 1,-76 Inst, for Improved Instruction,, ls77 Inst, for Improved Instruction,! 1878 * Biennial report. The aggregates given are for two years. & Includes a payment of $0,405.04 for coal chargeable to previous Salaries and Wages. Aggre- gate cost, 222 $17,38- 215! 19,767 33,026 32,915 31,442 32,285 34,174 263: 36,310 78 38,66 26,886 31,017 34,258 2,167 14,296 216 14,836 225; 15,583 15,806 22,251 11,884 15,831 13,962 300 14,967 363i 15,994 519! 58,366 479 55,361 491, 52,597 92 8,028 96 9,331 100, 9,318 107i 10,078 year. 225 122 132 145 155 91 148 150 130 8^ 103 138 127 118 105 109 54 70 68 69 70 91 112 109 90 49 44 112 116 106 87 97 93 94 Provisions and Supplies. Aggrc- C°st gatScost. J'^tll $20,000 00 16,139 90 13,316 86 12,633 42 12,423 95 37,359 85 14,911 12 1.5,350 78 16,890 85 17,244 31 33,010 66 31,030 24 3,568 73 9,959 24 10,457 87 11,595 88| 251 10,677 57 19: 12,124 96i 70| 7,749 33i 18 8,641 96' 08 8,114 25i 89, 16, KiO 33 061 34,3.8 88 401 45,11.3 92 62' 47,222 89 47, 44,184 99 26 6,639 16 211 6,031 70 18; 6,444 50 19l 6,526 60 t Includes $90 0' 75 0 59 99 57 95 53 78 99 89 45 23 58 37 55 50 75 97 111 90 108 38 89 22 49 06 48 42 51 54 47 40 49 69 58 71 59 59 52 35 53 87 94 57 86 9(1 98 59 89 44 72 18 69 08 04 45 60 99 beddin: Clothing. Aggre- gate cost $3,462 40 4,(.68 70 t3.583 79 t4,274 91 3,884 84 £15,310 0(1 +9,664 45 ' "1506 06 t356 89 t437 81 1475 79 2,735 41 698 07 745 50 541 57 4,703 25 7,082 80 10,070 68 11,720 48 11,563 74 342 16 706 45 1,092 18 940 97 Cost per c.ipita $9 26 14 15 13 62 14 06 17 II 51 89 30 78 "249 1 65 1 94 2 12 11 21 5 -29 5 14 3 49 15 68 19 51 19 41 24 47 23 41 7 36 10 921 8 79l Medical Stores Cost Fl EL AND Light. Cost Aggie- , ^ Aggre- , ilteuost-;capita ^^^-ca'pita. $47 00 '' $0 £2 S3,674 63 $17 09 116 07 52 5.101 8S 22 98 148 22 68 4,165 79 19 11 152 42 66 4,092 65 17 72 232 85 62 10,098 26 27 00 406 81 1 23 7,008 98 21 24 345 79 1 32 5,646 32 21 47 405 32 1 34 5,897 86 19 40 192 56 85 260 00 1 14 "-82'37 ......40 3,9H 88 "11V27 90 20 42 3,942 10 18 25 104 57 46 6,(91 98 29 75 146 79 65 4,293 28 19 07 809 32 3 32 1,711 19 7 01 99 42 75 2,204 08 16 69 65 45 45 3,596 53 24 80 73 40 48 2,883 10 18 60 354 37 1 IS 5,0-.6 36 16 75 891 57 2 45 7,682 99 21 16 2,129 19 4 10 M8,063 77 34 80 1,205 96 2 52 8,291 74 17 31 1,492 14 3 02 8,356 78 16 92 11209 83 2 28 1,236 38 13 44 ,1250 76 2 61 1,232 11 12 83 11220 12 2 20 1,104 71 11 05 11246 32 2 30 770 54 7 26 t Includes furniture. Includes medical attendance. Table No. 35—(Continued). Name of Institution. u cS © © 3 © «"5 9 S beg e8.» ©Cm > O < Salaries and Wages. Provisions and Supplies. Clothing. Medical stores. Fuel Ligi AND IT. LOCATION. Aggre-gate cost. $917 80 2,630 00 5,000 00 6,408 00 S,354 32 9,451 28 5,889 66 8,784 76 "658 38 Cost per capita. Aggre-gate cost Cost per capita. Aggre-gate cost. Cost per capita Aggre-gate cost. Cost per capita Aggre-gate cost. Cost pei-capita. New York, Bnfl'alo.... New York, Bufl'alo.... New Y'ork, Buffalo__ New York, Buflalo.... New York, Rome..... New York, Rome .... New York, Rochester New York, Rochester New York, Fordham . New York, Fordham . Le Couteulx St. Mary's Inst'n .. Le Couteulx St. Mary's Inst'n.. Le Couteulx St. Mary's Inst'n.. Le Couteulx St. Mary's Inst'n.. Central New York institution, Central New York Institution, Western New York Institut'n.. Western New York Institut'n.. St. Joseph's Institution........ 1875 1876 1877 1878 1877 1878 1877 1878 1877 1878 80 *83 *34 115 90 105 56 93 100 107 $11 47 31 68 53 19 55 72 92 82 90 01 105 17 94 46 "394 $5,9,55 00 7,800 00 8,915 00 8,750 00 7,004 48 8,372 42 3,112 10 5,267 95 5,273 81 7,150 72 $74 44 93 97 94 83 76 09 77 82 79 74 55 57 56 64 52 74 42 82 $1,116 00 1,478 00 1,193 00 1,831 00 975 16 1,169 05 466 70 823 93 1,224 01 2,763 48 $13 95 17 81 12 69 15 92 10 84 11 13 8 33 8 86 12 21 16 55 t$129 00 t-220 00 t395 00 t672 00 170 69 530 18 164 07 167 80 250 76 247 37 $1 61 2 65 4 20 5 84 1 89 5 05 2 93 1 81 2 51 I 49 $1,326 00 1,350 00 1,526 83 827 00 673 02 967 75 747 90 1,053 23 1,246 46 708 90 $16 57 16 26 16 24 7 19 7 48 9 22 13 35 11 33 12 46 4 24 * Average number estimated from tables given in reports. t Includes medical attendance. UI H > « O p o OS Table No. 35—(Continued). 53 p a LOCATION. Connecticut, Hartford....... Connecticut, Hartford...... Connecticut, Hartford...... Connecticut, Hartford...... Connecticut, Hartford...... Illinois, Jacksonville....... Illinois, Jacksonville....... QOIllinois, Jacksonville....... Illinois, Jacksonville....... Pennsylvania, Philadelphia Pennsylvania, Philadelphia Pennsylvania, Philadelphia Pennsylvania, Turtle Creek Prov. of Ontario, Belleville Prov. of Ontario, Belleville Prov. of Ontario, Belleville Prov. of Ontario, Belleville Tennessee, Knoxville...... Wisconsin, Delavau....... Wisconsin, Del a van....... Wisconsin, Delavau....... New York, New York city New York, New York city New York, New York city New York, New York city New York, New York city New York, New York city New York, New York city New York, New York city New York, New York city Name of Institution. American Asylum.................. American Asylum.................. American Asylum.................. American Asylum.................. American Asylum.................. Illinois Institution.................. Illinois Institution.................. Illinois Institution.................. Illinois Institution ................. Pennsylvania Institution........... Peni sylvania Institution........... Pennsylvania Institution........... Western Pennsylvania Institution, Ontario Institution............... Ontario Institution................. Ontario Institution................. Ontario Institution................. Tennessee School.................. Wisconsin Institute................ Wisconsin Institute................ Wisconsin Institute................ New York Institution.............. New York Institution.............. New York Institution.............. New York Institution............. New York Institution.............. Institution for Improved Instruc'n, Institution for Improved Instruc'n, Institution for Improved Instruc'n, Institution for Improved Iustinc'n, All other Ordinarv Expenses. Aggre- gate cost $776 37 13,185 11 10,039 00 9,210 31 8,359 54 17,844 79 17,606 98 16,122 13 16,179 42 6,369 25 741 89 447 14 3,000 59 2,900 03 3,435 51 3,436 64 4,071 38 9,471 09 5,172 68 5,131 32 4,853 55 6,931 SO 16,516 01 15,775 80 15,184 67 15,572 86 1,576 85 1,459 91 1,563 23 1,942 74 Cost per capita $3 49 61 33 45 22 42 25 36 19 Total or- dinary expenses. $38, 52, 61, 59, 50, 47 72U01, "" 78, 77, 82, 54, 53 35 61 30 53 22 28 06 2 52 1 42 75 01 14 29 15 90 15 27 18 10 38 82 39 19 35 39 31 31 23 10 45 49 30 39 31 70 31 52 17 14 15 21 15 68 78, 8, 31, 33, *37, 35, 49, 30, 34, 30, 48, 82, 149, 139, 133, 18, 19, 19, 18 101 20, 164 37 814 00 600 55 073 43 470 61 283 55 806 84 359 59 315 94 837 38 080 44 400 08 736 89 656 27 119 17 850 57 471 71 103 22 807 71 011 78 428 16 143 12 497 14 509 62 487 31 768 06 032 78 612 83 748 -21 511 34 Annual cost per capitaex eluding repairs. $171 91 245 65 277 48 270 98 244 40 270 81 238 81 294 14 270 77 241 57 271 46 249 68 218 42 155 94 153 33 168 22 157 65 201 24 233 39 234 56 196 31 160 47 227 26 288 07 291 21 270 78 1! 0 01 204 30 197 4s| 191 091 Ordinary Repairs. Aggre- gate cost $987 07 2,553 55 3,756 08 1,745 17 1,928 27 17,644 74 998 69 12,337 00 2,172 09 226 67 5,0,57 25 391 32 398 18 481 93 954 68 3,171 37 1,462 27 1,320 36 998 09 4,189 32 t4,261 61 tl9,506 65 t18,105 68 til,108 83 447 50 1,115 OS 27 00 951 62 Cost per capita $4 74 11 87 16 92 8 01 8 35 47 18 3 03 46 91 7 14 99 16 11 1 92 1 84 2 14 4 24 12 99 11 08 9 11 6 44 13 90 11 74 37 58 37 79 22 49 4 86 11 61 27 Annual cost per capita in- cluding ordinary repairs." Build- ings, ex- JA11 other traordi- j exlraor- nary re- j dinary pairs and expend improve- itures nienls. $176 65 $2,171 00 257 $9,291 67 294 40 278 99 252 81 317 99 199 45' 1,354 51 . 341 05 277 91 242 56; 121,862 88 ......., 37,481 12 265 79 Total ex- pendi- tures. 994 50 157 86 155 17 170 36 161 89 214 23 244 47 243 67 202 75 174 43 239 00 325 65 329 00 293 27 200 87 215 91 197 75 200 58 1,499 47 7,197 00 3,593 65 3,286 30 9,700 00 4,491 66 64,812 17 496 50 16,194 98 13,672 67 4,646 10 3,089 13 2,626 46 8,530 22 7,891 80 7,611 99 7,355 25 $50,614 55,167 65,3;5(i 60,818 58,398 119,922 81,160 89,696 87,774 186,620 122,053 148,269 8,736 32,047 33,517 38,332 36,420 52,771 33.769 42,529 35,019 08,527 100,431 173,662 160,682 147,503 27,010 28,619 27,387 28,818 * Includes $3,333.96 warrant to cover expenditures of preceding year. t For buildings and repairs. Table No. 35—(Continued). Name of Institution. All other Ordinary Expenses. Toial or-dinary expenses. Annual cost per capitaex-cluding repairs. Ordinary Repairs. Annual cost per capita in eluding ordinary repairs. Build-ings, ex-traordi-nary re-pairs and improve-ments. All other extraor-dinary expend-itures. Total ex- LOCATION. Aggre-gate cost. Cost per capita. Aggre-gate cost. Cost per capita. pendi-tures. New York, Buffalo............ Le Couteulx St. Mary's Institution, Le Couteulx St. Mary's Institution, Le Couteulx St. Mary's Institution, Le Couteulx St. Mary's Institution, $1,848 00 1,240 48 980 00 1,209 00 1,609 85 1,975 87 739 32 940 35 3,426 52 5,281 00 $23 10 1495 10 43 10 51 17 89 18 82 13 20 10 11 34 26 31 62 ♦$11,291 80 *14,715 48 *18,009 83 *19,697 00 18,787 42 22,466 55 11,119 75 17,038 02 *1I 421 56 *16,809 85 $141 15 177 33 191 59 171 28 203 75 213 97 198 55 183 21 114 22 100 66 $113 00 269 09 169 00 311 00 $1 41 3 24 I 79 2 70 $142 56 180 57 193 3-173 98 $2,825 00 560 00 4,163 35 3,796 60 $3,985 00 3,267 00 3,614 00 6,817 00 5,694 36 6,849 18 6,041 26 13,423 89 6,850 00 t22,483 77 $13,214 80 New York, Buffalo............ 18,814 57 25,956 18 New York, Buffalo............ 30,621 60 24,481 78 29,315 73 17,407 45 37,277 23 19,623 16 42,268 64 246 44 4 40 202 95 6,815 32 1,351 60 1,017 75 1,957 27 t Includes $12,597.27 for indebtedness existing October 1,1877. * An incomplete statement for comparison. See note to table No. 34. Table No. 36. Detailed Statement of Expenditures of the New York Institution for the Blind, New York city, furnished by the Superintendent, for the years 1860 to 1878, inclusive. YEARS. Average I number of pupils. 1860 ... 1861 ... 1862 .^. 1863 ... 1864 ... 1865 ... 1866 ... 1867 ... 1868 ... 1869 ... 1870 .. 1871 ... 1872 ... 1873 ... 1874 ... 1875 ... 1876 ... 1877 ... 1878 ... 140 165 141 148 125 118 124 124 135 133 136 141 164 165 168 173 177 194 200 Salaries and Wages. Aggregate cost. $5,350 91 6,045 65 9,432 04 9,738 55 10,240 75 9,924 20 17,006 27 14,364 12 11,039 00 15,306 40 16,138 87 13,419 17 19,650 85 21,150 31 21,412 14 21,396 64 21,999 89 22,362 95 22,573 27 Cost per capita. $38 82 36 64 66 89 65 80 81 93 84 10 137 12 115 84 103 99 115 09 118 67 95 17 119 82 128 18 127 45 123 68 124 29 115 27 112 86 Provisions and Supplies. Aggregate cost. $19,022 39 «,259 66 14,938 24 17,313 78 17,241 «1 15,715 92 25,369 60 20,745 47 19,915 26 18,367 23 13,418 57 13,079 50 18,319 85 18,329 45 17,912 22 16,410 00 17,457 01 18,064 83 16,987 48 Cost per capita. $135 87 56 12 105 96 116 99 137 93 133 19 204 59 167 30 147 52 138 09 98 67 92 76 111 71 111 09 106 62 94 85 98 63 93 12 84 94 Clothing. Medical Stores. Aggregate cost. $3,475 01 3,459 70 3,751 75 5,962 85 5,205 27 3,81983 5,997 61 4,987 00 4,793 36 4,569 52 4,173 37 3,874 55 5,947 78 6,041 62 6,555 48 6,342 49 6,876 07 5,692 75 5,485 83 Cost per Aggregate capita. I cost. $24 83 20 97 26 60 40 29 41 64 32 37 48 37 40 21 35 50 34 36 30 72 27 48 36 26 36 62 39 02 36 66 38 85 29 34 27 42 Cost per capita. Fuel and Light. Fu3l. $1,290 88 1,165 01 2,225 89 1,465 97 2,488 52 1,328 11 2,325 25 1,580 11 1,466 25 2,173 58 834 03 4,535 82 3,544 27 5,593 98 4,605 90 3,718 33 2,101 40 4,571 54 2,705 80 Light. Total. $420 75 $2,646 64 744 25 2,210 22 903 05 3,391 57 668 23 1,996 34 1,257 11 3,582 36 1,031 06 2,611 77 898 46 2,364 71 836 10 3,009 68 537 50 1,371 53 388 50 4,924 32 1,254 22 4,798 49 1,291 10 6,885 08 1,218 22 5,824 12 1,192 65 4,910 98 1,269 34 3,370 74 1,197 75 5,769 29 1,347 50 4,053 30 Table No. 36—(Continued). YEARS. 1860 1861 1862 1863 1864 1865 1866 1867 1868 1869 1870 1871 1872 1873 1874 1875 1876 1877 1878 All other Ordin- ary Expenses. Aggregate cost. $30,601 11 18,247 38 10,424 37 14,543 09 9,969 43 5,544 40 13,879 15 10,735 34 11,962 64 9,767 29 8,864 52 9,758 86 14,246 65 13,632 91 12,806 43 11,158 37 13,673 51 11,911 09 10,665 97 Cost per capita. [$218 58 110 59 73 93 98 26 79 75 46 98 111 93 86 57 88 61 73 44 65 10 69 21 86 87 82 62 76 23 64 49 77 25 61 39 53 33 Total ordinary expenses. $59,740 30 38,177 40 41,193 04 49,768 49 46,048 63 37,000 74 65,834 99 53,443 70 53,074 97 51,020 12 43,961 86 45,056 40 62,963 62 66,039 37 64,510 39 60,218 48 63,377 22 63,800 91 59,765 85 Annual cost per capita, excluding repairs. 1426 72 231 38 292 15 336 28 368 38 313 56 530 92 430 99 393 15 383 61 323 25 319 55 383 92 400 24 333 99 348 08 358 06 328 86 298 82 Ordinary Repairs. Aggregate cost. $2,150 41 1,827 42 2,082 34 655 60 4,390 13 1,877 08 1,716 87 1,116 63 1,052 69 731 88 162 72 6,191 16 4,850 23 2,904 00 1,552 56 3,430 43 3,192 06 10,136 06 3,763 30 ,Cost per capita. $15 36 11 07 14 77 4 43 35 12 15 90 13 85 9 01 7 79 5 50 1 19 43 91 29 57 17 60 9 24 19 83 18 03 52 25 18 82 Annual cost per capita, including ordinary repairs. $442 08 244 45 306 92 340 71 403 50 329 46 544 77 440 00 400 94 389 11 324 44 363 46 413 49 417 84 393 23 367 91 376 09 581 11 317 64 Buildings, extra- ordinary repairs and improve- ments. $67,507 72 37,488 04 2,522 76 729 69 2,650 00 "576*50 All other extra- ordinary expenses. $78,252 80 41,494 66 24,900 14 178,198 93 7,524 16 28,202 70 100,467 82 8,839 37 23,0S9 79 400 50 4,250 00 10,000 00 58,348 49 17,640 00 131,398 21 121,692 79 52,222 29 Table No. 37. Detailed Statement of Expenditures of the New York State Institution for the Blind, Batavia, N. Y., for the years 1870 to 1878, inclusive. YEARS. 1870 1871 1872 1873 1874 1875 1876 1877 1878 Salaries and Wages. Provisions and Sup plies. Clothing. Medical Stores. Aggregate i Cost per j Aggregate ; Cost per Aggregate Cost per j Aggregate I Cost per cost. j capita. | cost. capita. cost. capita. cost. ; capita $9,373 76 10,072 10 12,693 49 12,708 34 13,09.5 39 13,770 88 13,110 49 14.091 24 16,085 35 $110 28 95 92 104 04 90 77 87 30 88 84 84 04 90 69 99 29 $10 250 62 10 889 89 10 717 84 13 270 04 12 854 84 12 015 62 11 502 36 11 465 76 8,788 69 $120 59 103 71 87 85 94 79 85 69 77 52 73 73 70 77 54 25 $1,513 81 1,961 14 2,707 47 3,885 13 3,109 .50 3,760 92 3,087 90 4,357 57 $14 42 16 08 19 34 26 90 20 06 24 11 19 06 26 89 * $98 50 t400 00 t622 00 183 87 86 01 1482 78 t518 98 236 54 285 04 $1 16 3 81 5 09 1 31 57 3 11 3 33 1 46 1 76 Fuel and Light. Fuel $3,317 99 3,265 14 3,290 02 3,334 49 3,597 50 2,804 31 3,601 11 Light. $687 73 768 00 831 77 825 95 875 15 856 45 802 50 Total. $3,453 58 4,005 72 4,033 14 4,121 79 4,160 44 4,472 65 3,660 76 4,403 61 3,623 29 Cost per capita. $40 63 38 15 33 06 29 44 27 73 28 85 23 46 27 18 22 36 Table No. 37—(Continued). iALL OTHER ORDINA ry Expenses. YEARS. 1870 1871 1872 1873 1874 1875 1876 1877 1878 Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. 3 © 13 3 b © O ft © cd bo ©•- 5 to _ «~ '" «*s '.-; 3 u— ft < ft 5, 3, 3, 3, 1, 3, 2, tl2, 791 54 141 25 587 99 679 43 750 02 393 70 053 42 708 56 380 02 $91 67 48 96 29 41 26 28 25 00 8 99 19 60 16 72 76 42 $30,968 00 32,022 77 33,615 60 36.670 94 37,831 83 35,245 13 35,610 93 36,593 61 45,519 96 $364 33 304 98 275 54 261 93 252 21 227 39 228 27 225 88 280 99 Ordinary Repairs. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. * $250 00 3,650 00 8,697 65 *4,079 79 •2,447 82 *2.000 00 •2,000 00 1,214 04 2,146 47 $2 94 33 81 71 29 29 14 16 32 12 90 12 82 7 49 13 25 Annual cost , Buildings, | Manufactur- per capita, ; extraordi- ingmaterial) including , nary repairs br° omoorn ordinary and tin- t repairs. provements $367 27 338 79 346 83 291 07 268 53 240 29 241 09 233 37 291 24 $5,052 59 §2,909 87 §3,791 26 §6,057 97 3,779 61 7,508 97 21,009 57 15,803 09 $1,088 39 1,980 42 4,329 83 706 11 3,345 87 1,518 05 1,650 30 All otler extraordi- nary expen- ditures. II $2,412 15 836,270 59 38.482 64 47,192 90 48,7,-9 12 48,389 09 47,872 36 61,966 37 55,128 79 49,316 73 * Reported to State Board of Charities. t Includes medical attendance. X Includes $7,152 bills paid, contracted prior to September 30,1877. § For labor and improvement of grounds. II Churchman judgment. Table No. 38. Detailed Statement of Expenditures of Institutions for the Blind in the United States and elsewhere, for the different years named. LOCATION. Name of Institution. Salaries and Wages. •La © Illinois, Jacksonville.........Illinois Institution........1877 Illinois, Jacksonville.........Illinois Institution........,1878 Massachusetts, Boston........Perkins Institution.......1865 Mas-achusetts, Boston....... Perkins Institution.......1875 Massachusetts, Boston........ Perkins Institution.......1876 Massachusetts, Boston........Perkins Institution .......1877 Ohio, Columbus ..............[Ohio Institution...........I860 Ohio, Columbus............. jOhio Institution..........1865 Ohio, Columbus...............jOhio Institution..........1875 Ohio, Columbus...............JOhio Institution.........; 1876 Ohio, Columbus .......... ... |Ohio Institution..........1877 Pennsylvania, Philadelphia . Institution for the Blind., 1875 Pennsylvania, Philadelphia. Pennsylvania, Philadelphia. Province of Ont , Brantford Province of Ont., Brantford. Province of Out., Brantford. Wisconsin, Janesville...... Wisconsin, Janesville....... Wisconsin, Jaue.-ville....... Wisconsin, Janesville....... New York, New Yoik City.. New York, New York City.. New York, New York City.. New York, New York City.. New York, New York City New York, New York City.. New York, Batavia.......... New York, Batavia......... New York, Batavia.......... New York, Batavia.......... Institution for the Blind Institution for the Blind Ontario Institution..... Ontario Institution..... Ontario Institution .... Wisconsin Institution... Wisconsin Institution... Wisconsin Institution... Wisconsin Institution.....1878 New York Institution.....|J860 New York Institution ....[1865 New York Institution.....J875 New York Institution.....11876 New York Institution.....11877 New York Institution.....11878 New York St. Institution. 1875 New York St. Institution. 11876 New York St. Institution.-1877 New Y'ork St. Institution. 11878 $12,207 42 13,195 56 9,464 95 17,475 21 19,251 91 17,783 09 7,886 34 8,653 93 18,774 81 19,765 82 19,601 04 tl0,132 57 11(»,692 68 tlo,151 50 10, .552 93 11,110 00 11,611 06 5,885 29 5,978 53 6,017 82 6,565 33 5,3.50 91 !i,i)2t 20 21,396 64 21,999 89 22,362 95 22,573 27 13,770 83 13,110 49 14,691 24 16,085 35 Provisions and Supplies. $214 16 183 27 78 22 97 63 116 62 112 55 72 35 70 36 131 29 ! 130 89 ! 131 55 50 41 [ 53 19 51 54 j 103 46 96 86 ; 90 95 i 99 75 99 64 89 82 85 26 38 82 84 10 123 68 124 29 115 27 112 86 88 84 84 04 90 69 99 29 $4,627 32 5,877 67 8,593 22 11,281 12 8,753 57 9,630 20 4,361 24 8,778 34 11,489 52 12,070 99 11,894 48 141,394 93 •49,033 95 140,678 61 5,602 53 5,465 42 6,555 76 3,671 57 4,221 59 3,952 32 4,040 02 19,022 39 15,715 92 16,410 00 17,457 01 18,004 83 16.987 48 12,015 62 11,502 36 11,465 76 8,788 69 Cost per capita. $81 18 81 63 71 01 63 02 53 11 60 95 40 01 71 36 80 34 79 94 79 83 •205 94 243 95 206 49 54 93 47 53 51 22 62 23 70 36 58 93 52 47 135 87 133 19 91 85 98 63 93 12 84 94 77 52 73 73 70 77 54 25 Clothing. Aggre- gate cost. $642 13 978 74 227 34 94 79 153 34 223 59 195 40 13i 73 157 54 3,475 01 3,819 8s 6,342 49 6,876 07 5,692 75 5,485 83 3,109 50 3,760 92 3,087 90 4,357 57 Cost per capita. $11 26 13 59 2 23 82 1 19 3 79 3 26 1 97 2 04 24 83 32 37 36 66 38 85 29 34 27 42 20 06 24 11 19 06 26 89 Medical Stores. Fuel and Light. Aggregate cost. $183 00 242 50 22 79 26 21 9 15 17 70 116 82 207 65 129 99 134 02 145 53 Cost per capita. Aggregate cost. $1,572 00 1,316 04 2,200 44 3,184 23 3,135 52 2,149 34 243 23 1,550 00 2,615 03 3,784 38 3,546 22 3,142 12 3,898 14 4,206 75 2,657 96 3,-227 98 2,274 13 2,43(1 05 1,290 88 1,996 34 4,910 93 3,370 74 5,769 29 4,053 30 4,472 65 3,660 76 4,403 61 3,623 29 •Average number estimated from tables given in report. X For " household expenses. ti'or "instruction. i Includes medical attendance. Table No. 38—(Continued). LOCATION. Name of Institution. All other Ordi- nary Expenses. Illinois, Jacksonville___ Illinois, Jacksonville — Massachusetts, Boston...... Massachusetts, Boston...... Massachusetts, Boston..... Massachusetts, Boston...... Ohio, Columbus............ Ohio, Columbus............ Ohio, Columbus........ Ohio, Columbus............ Ohio, Columbus........... Pennsylvania, Philadelphia Pennsylvania, Philadelphia Pennsylvania, Philadelphia Institution fo>- the Blind Province of Ont., Brantford Ontario Institution Province of Ont , Brantford Ontario Institution . Illinois Institution....... .(Illinois Institution....... . IPerkins Institution...... .Iperkins Institution...... Perkins Institution ..... Perkins Institution...... Ohio Institution.......... Ohio Institution.......... Ohio Institution.......... Ohio Institution.......... Ohio Institution.......... Institution for the Blihd. Institution for the Blind. Aggre- Cost gate per cost. capita. Province of Ont., Rrantfor Wisconsin, Janesville...... Wisconsin, Janesville..... Wisconsin, Janesville...... Wisconsin, Janesville..... New York, New York City New York, New York City New York, New York City New York, New York City New York, New Yrork City Ontario Institution..... Wisconsin Institution .. Wisconsin Institution . . Wisconsin Institution.. Wisconsin Institution .. New York Institution .. New York Institution .. New York Institution .. New York Institution ., New York Institution . . New York, New York City iNew York Institution New Yofk, Batavia. New York, Batavia. New York, Batavia. New York, Batavia. New York St Institution New York St. Institution. New Y'ork St. Institution New York St. Institution 187 1878 186, 1875 1876 18 18601 1865 1875! 1876 11377 1875 1876 1877 [1875 1876! 1377 1875 1876 1877 1878 1860 1865 1875 1876 1877 1878 1875 1876 1877 1878 $6,097 08 4,459 56 6.795 58 6,616 93 4,669 83 6,189 27 1,018 32 1,888 73 5,971 34 6,411 35 6,349 84 1,992 00 1,59£ 00 1,522 39 3,010 02 2,745 48 3,190 88 5,936 82 6,741 92 3,417 03 3,033 95 30,601 11 5,544 40 11,158 37 13,673 51 11,911 09 10,665 97 1,393 70 3,058 42 2,708 £6 || 12,380 02 $106 97 61 94 56 16 36 96 28 30 39 18 9 34 15 36 41 76 42 46 42 62 9 91 7 92 7 72 29 51 23 87 24 93 100 62 112 37 51 00 39 40 218 58 46 98 61 49 77 25 61 39 53 33 8 99 19 60 16 72 76 42 Total ordinary expenses. $25,328 94 26,070 07 27,076 98 38,621 58 35,828 89 35,769 00 13,625 95 21,078 65 39,229 39 42,536 57 41,914 89 53,519 50 61,318 63 52,352 50 22,609 45 23,420 89 25,780 74 18,552 75 20,481 09 16,026 85 16,384 54 59,740 30 37,000 74 60,218 48 63,377 22 61,800 91 59,765 85 35,245 13 35,610 93 36,593 61 45,519 96 Annual cost per cap ita ex- cluding repairs $444 36 362 08 223 77 215 76 217 13 2-.6 39 125 0(1 17137 274 33 281 69 281 51 266 26 305 06 265 7.5 221 66 203 66 20141 314 45 341 35 239 20 212 78 426 72 313 56 348 08 358 06 328 86 298 82 227 39 228 27 225 88 280 99 Ordinary Repairs. Aggre- gate cost. $1,671 99 1,709 24 4,351 94 3,271 71 1,406 16 1,836 70 6,165 43 ' '94680 1,553 20 451 70 612 66 1,132 45 412 20 443 57 409 92 566 52 2,150 41 1,877 08 3,430 43 3,192 06 10,136 06 3,763 30 2,000 00 2,000 00 1,214 04 2,146 47 Cost per capita. ©-" o 5 «'%■?■ 9 5 ccs s ;- 5 ©5 3 mpro7ementsisincet1860e $1"2'187 exlJCnde'1 for constracUoi^anaHc^ statement, the*i "has beer^e'llded0 Xut $100,000 for buildings Table No. 40. Detailed Statement of Expenditures of Asylums for Idiots and Feeble-Minded Children in the United States and elsewhere, for the different years named. LOCATION. Illinois, Lincoln......... Illinois, Lincoln......... Massachusetts, Boston... Massachusetts, Boston. .. Massachusetts, lioston... Pennsyivania, Media.... Pennsylvania, Media — Pennsylvania, Media. Prov'ce of Onlario, Orillia Prov'ce of Ontario, Orillia New York, Syracuse...... New York, Syracuse...... New York, Syracuse....., New York, Syracuse..... New York, Syracuse...... Name of Institution. Feeble-Minded Feeble-Minded As\lum for Children* . Asvlum for Children*-................. Mass. School for Idiolic....... Mass School for Idiotic ....... Mass School /'Or Idiotic....... Training School for Feeble Minded Children............ Training School for Feeble Minded Children........... Training School for Feeble Minded Children ........... Asylum for Idiots* ........... Asylum for Idiots*.......... Asylum for Idiots............. Asylum for Idiots............. Aoj linn for Idiots.............. Asylum for Idiots............. Asylum for Idiots............. to± a <%£ 187 1878.! 18751 1876 18771 1875 1876 1377 1877 1878' 1835 1875 1876 1877 1378 77 168 90 80 81 222 224 Salaries and VVaues. Aggre- gate cost. $9,973 06 15,466 61 6,478 49 6,952 05 6,634 90 17,135 54 15,837 00 15,715 76 l-25i 8,9.55 08 141- 7,98i 11 144 9,115 82 210: 13,801 6! 215 14,049 34 230 14,182 19 205; 15,070 00 Cost per capita. $129 52 92 06 71 98 86 90 81 91 77 19 70 70 65 76 71 64 56 61 63 30 65 72 65 34 61 66 59 13 Provisions and Supplies. Aggre- gate cost. $5,605 91 11,851 72 6,867 44 6,498 42 6,271 17 17,457 04 t41,610 90 134,487 68 7,638 88 6,495 01 12,049 58 11,519 02 13,160 19 14,940 28 14,380 05 Cost per capita. $72 80 70 55 76 30 81 23 77 42 73 63 185 76 144 29 61 11 40 06 83 67 54 85 61 21 64 96 54 2(1 Clothing. Aggre- gate cost t$3,491 15 1:3,065 03 157 03 30 80 41 41 tl,840 64 +1,070 08 1,421 49 2,892 53 4,302 56 2,406 41 3,306 21 Cost per capita. $45 34 18 24 1 75 38 51 14 72 7 59 9 87 13 77 20 01 10 46 12 48 Medical Stores. Aggre- gate cost $171 36 601 13 131 38 75 95 131 45 159 98 85 13 315 91 432 33 218 95 338 25 Cost per capita, $2 23 3 58 1 46 95 1 62 1 28 1 50 2 01 95 I 28 Fuel and Light. Aggre- gate cost. $1,535 24 3,510 12 1,904 82 1,611 15 1,614 86 1,586 70 1,126 38 3,500 29 5,052 69 1,539 95 3,586 62 3,885 50 * Opened 1876. t For " house expenses." t Includes bedding. Table No. 40—(Continued). LOCATION. Illinois, Lincoln Illinois, Lincoln Massachusetts, Boston... Massachusetts, Boston. .. Massachusetts, Boston. .. Pennsylvania, Media Name of Institution. All other Ordin- ary Expenses. Aggregate cost. Pennsylvania, Media . Pennsylvania, Media . Prov'ce of Ontario, Orillia Prov'ce of On tario,Orillia New York, Syracuse...... New York, Syracuse...... New York, Syracuse...... New York, Syracuse...... New York, Syracuse.... , Asylum for Feeble-Minded Children*................. Asylum for Feeble-Minded Children* .................... Mass. School for Idiotic........ Mass. School for Idiotic........ Mass. School for Idiotic........ Training School for Feeble- Minded Children ............ Training School for Feeble- Minded Chil iren............. Training School for Feeble- Minded Children............. Asylum lor Idiots*............. Asylum for Idiots*............. Asylum for Idiots.............. Asylum for Idiots.............. Asylum for Idiots.............. Asylum for Idiots.............. Asvlum for Idiots.............. $11,604 26 $150 70 Cost per capita. 10,611 60 3,908 18 1,919 95 1,826 84 23,739 85 325 00 519 51 4,139 57 2,028 72 3.827 60 6,617 07 6.562 78 7,791 23 5,931 83 63 16 43 43 24 37 22 56 106 94 1 45 2 18 33 12i 14 39 26 58 31 61 30 52 33 88 22 571 Total ordinary expenses. $32,380 98 $420 53 45,106 24 19,447 59 17,118 32 16,520 63 58,332 41 57,772 90 50,722 98 24,320 85 18,791 46 29,914 78 40,219 43 40,047 15 43,125 63 43,561 84 262 76 257 91 212 23 194 56 133 2 207 74 191 52 186 26 187 50 164 Ordinary Repairs. Aggregate co»t. $7,956 64 1,316 36 328 68 1,567 49 937 54 531 09 2,240 59 5,216 55 4,213 56 4,841 39 3,485 37 Cost per capita. $47 36 14 62 4 11 19 35 7 50 3 77 15 56 24 84 18 32 21 05 13 15 An nual cost per capita includ'g ordinary repairs. $315 84 230 70 218 03 223 31 202 06 137 04 223 30 216 36 204 58 208 55 177 53 to£a°> $120,633 60 $1,684 31 All other extra- ordinary expendi- tures. 2,033 39 2,32(5 23 5,724 96 20,554 31 4,000 00 775 04 505 12 717 00 53,137 50 9,529 82 17,257 31 178 79 71 22 3,100 00 Total expendi- tures. $154,703 89 53,062 88 23,572 33 20,278 35 24,530 08 111,469 91 67,302 72 88,534 60 2.5,258 39 19,322 55 32,334 16 45,507 20 44,260 71 47,9(57 07 54,147 21 * Opened 1876. Table No. 41. Detailed Statement of Expenditures of the Neio York State Inebriate Asylum, Binghamton, for the years 1870 to 1878, inclusive. YEARS. 1870 1871. 18 72 1873. 1874. 1875 1876. 1877. 1878. CB S CD to^-% CS~ »3 Salaries and Wages. Cost per capita Provisions and Supplies. 6fi 84 *83 81 73 75 63 61 46 A ggre- gat e cost. $12 435 12 11 517 20 12 458 54 19 ,516 57 13 169 62 11 436 74 10 979 27 11 690 11 11 085 25 Cost per capita. $188 41 137 11 150 10 11(5 05 184 .51 1.52 49 161 46 190 16 240 91 $16,800 85 14,588 67 14,840 34 15,478 73 13,033 05 13,893 24 12,448 11 14,259 85 9,706 25 IF 25 4 56 173 07 178 79 188 70 178 53 185 31 183 00 233 77 211 01 Clothing. Aggre- gate cost. Cost per capita. $lf 521 90 $0 27 11 35 Medical Stores. Aggre- gate cost. $529 30 651 20 416 78 522 84 566 34 537 73 304 57 Cost per capita. $6 38 7 94 5 71 6 97 8 33 8 82 6 62 Fuel and Light. Fuel. $2,593 23 4,000 00 1,336 13 1,861 37 2,012 99 2,433 53 2,673 54 2,031 62 2,893 34 Light. $1,140 00 708 30 1,454 29 1,443 64 1,500 07 1,476 49 1,162 18 877 41 950 34 Total. $3,733 23 4,768 30 2,790 42 3,305 01 3,573 06 3,910 02 3,835 72 2,909 03 3,843 68 Cost per capita. $56 56 56 77 33 62 40 30 48 94 52 13 50 41 47 69 83 65 * Average number estimated from tables given in report. t This includes salaries of officers for six months only. Table No. 41—(Continued). YEARS. 1870*.................................................I $5) 670 85 1871..................................................! «,W7 lfi 1872...............................................' 9,410 2(1 1873..................................................i M56 lfi 1875..................................................i <>, :>3.> 08 1876 ........................................... 6,855 0b "77' :::::::..................................i 7,15154 1878' ..............................................| 5,0(5 27 $35 92 73 0(1 115 38 103 12 78 27 87 11 100 80 117 24 110 11 if38,(l40 05 37,Oil 33 40,028 80 37,407 67 36,205 87 36,300 92 31,684 50 30,475 01 30,524 92 Annual cost per capitaex eluding repairs. $585 46 440 61 482 27 456 19 495 96 484 01 510 06 597 95 603 58 Ordinary Repairs. Aggre- gate cost. *$1,918 50 178 50 1,190 31 1,013 23 Cost per capita. Annual cost per capita in- cluding ordinary repairs. $22 84 $463 45 512 68 617 46 685 61 Buildings, extraordi- nary re- pairs and improve- ments. F75,881 98 *3,725 00 4,773 31 7,277 60 3,890 77 3,102 17 8,546 26 3,881 64 10 00 All other extraordi nary ex- penditures. Total ex- penditures. $1,688 12 533 35 1,772 41 909 77 892 84 599 77 1,132 03 $114 42 46 4.5 41 40 44 42 32 522 03 654 83 490 23 217 62 868 05 312 86 302 10 146 73 080 18 rM- Taken from report made to State Board of Charities. H > W Table No. 42. Detailed Statement of Expenditures of the State Emigrant Refuge and Hospital, Wards Island, N. Y.,for the years 1868 and 1875 to 1878, inclusive. YEARS. Cm O u m 0) CD G> g a g CB 3 S > n.S Salaries and Wages. Provisions and Supplies. Clothing. Medical Stores. Fuel and Light. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. Aggregate cost. Cost per capita. Fuel Light. Total. Cost per capita. 1868................ 1,689 732 655 574 483 $28,225 09 32,833 93 27,811 76 26,452 76 26,028 31 $16 71 41 93 42 46 46 08 53 88 $141,205 87 48,383 86 37,783 43 30,683 51 31,112 28 $83 69 61 88 57 68 63 91 64 42 $4,835 07 2,245 12 2,157 01 3,014 23 902 03 $2 86 | $2. .592 80 2 87 .1.60') 33 $1 53 7 17 6 -28 6 29 9 23 $18,952 12 13,419 13 14,206 46 3,211 65 10,062 79 $1,803 00 1,834 84 3,372 09 1,340 93 $20,755 12 15,253 97 17,578 55 4,552 58 10,062 79 $12 29 1875................ 19 50 1876................ 3 2.1 5 25 1 87 4,113 79 3,615 06 4,458 70 26 84 1877................ 7 93 1878................ 20 83 Table No. 42—(Continued). YEARS. 1868 1875 1876 1877 1878 All other Ordinary Expenses. Aggregate cost. $33,326 72 3,024 38 3,045 78 6,345 25 4,886 62 Cost per capita. $19 73 3 87 4 65 11 06 10 12 Total ordinary expenses. $230,940 67 107,356 19 92,490 32 80,665 39 77,450 73 Annual cost per capita excluding repairs. Ordinary Repairs. Aggrega te cost. $136 73 137 28 141 21 140 52 160 35 $6,441 64 3,289 06 4,339 69 6,770 44 Cost per capita $8 23 5 02 7 56 14 02 Annual cost Builrting8i pei capita extraordinary including repairs anil orum.uy improvements. repairs. F ...... $125,769 74 $145 51.............. 146 23 ............. 148 03 .............. 174 37 .............. $4,144 79 4,170 02 3,471 69 5,003 79 5,272 50 Total expenditures. $360,855 20 117,967 85 99,251 07 90,006 87 89,493 67 Table No. 43. Showing quantity and cost of various articles used at the New York Institution for the Deaf and Dumb during the years named# YEARS. a a o — SOm C3 0 Flour, Bbls. BUTCHEH'8 Meat, Lbs. Butter, Lbs. eggs, Doz. Tea, Lbs. Coffee, Lbs. Sugar, Lbs. Molasses, Gals. Milk, Qts. Quan-tity. Price. Quan-tity. Price. Quan-tity. Price. Quan-tity. Price. Quan-tity. Price $0 60; 94.', 96] 1 09 1 10 1 09 1 08 93} 79] 75} 72] 66} 54] 49 47 45 37 Quan-tity. Price. Quan ■ tity. Price. Quan-tity. Price. Quan-tity. Price. 1861 ,. , 1863 ..... 1864...... 1865...... 18b/...... 1868...... 1869...... 1870 ..... 1871...... 1872...... 1873...... 1874...... 1875...... 1876...... 1877...... 1878 ..... 305 328 348 363 420 437 464 513 512 510 522 501 512 515 519 479 494 408 470 514 530 520 529 640 668 455 553 640 623 653 " 556 681 664 641 -_ $6 31 8 14 10 05 11 02 11 67 13 99 12 37 8 63 7 53 7 95 9 49 5 95 -' 9 14 7 56 8 27 9 00 7 75 56,260 68,849 71.713 72,940 82,209 95,814 108,115 114,368 77,112 99,335 99,951 110,417 123,079 118,636 131,854 139,814 147,314 $0 08 8i 12.i 17 14] 14] 14 14 m 11] 11} 11 11 11 10} 10 15,958 17,186 15,084 17,622 16,448 18,691 22,990 27,377 15,214 19,627 "20,767 22,973 22,233 20,637 19,624 21,107 17,788. $0 19} 274. 45] 46 [ 47J 41 55| 47} 36^ 40] 34] 37] 38] 33 i 32} 28 j 24} 597 1,034 919 505 1,178 679 1,673 1,499 1,398 2,073 2,098 1,906 $0 38 35 37 35 32 30 - 28 25} 32 24 25 14 1-5 584 570 672 712 972 1,117 1,673 1,518 1,155 1,449 1,508 1,519 1,555 1,471 1,463 1,5-6 1,392 2,315 1,593 1,199 1,550 1,902 2,633 2,945 3,654 3,026 3,158 2,895 2,847 3,070 2,636 3,232 3,459 3,474 $0 20} 39] 52} 46 42 39] 35} 32^ 30} 26] 28] 29 35 26} 31 26] 2.5} 14,824 10,461 11,922 13,563 18,812 14,486 21,457 26,096 19,362 21,301 23,335 27,112 28,391 24,510 25,058 25,531 23,883 $0 06} 13} 11 18 15 15} 15 b4a 12 12 111 Hi lOi 101 9] 10} 9 635 1,023 1,229 1,549 1,832 1,543 1,425 1,454 957 1,402 2,543 1,791 1,704 1,777 2,036 1,958 2,165 $0 33 50 89 94 89 77 78 78 76 »l 72 72 74 69 63 02 56 1,059 330 333 1,040 6,164 12,800 *4,360 *9,960 *6,520 *8,035 5,480 59,060 61,880 71,459 63,827 77,324 84,180 107,575 $0 6 6| 6i io| 10 39} 34| 301 32i 6} 6} 6} 6} 6! 6} 6} 6 * Condensed milk. In 1871 both the condensed and the ordinary milk were used; 8,635 quarts of the former and 5,480 quarts of the latter. Table No. 43—(Continued). Cheese, Lbs. Apples, Bbls. Quan- tity. 1861............. 1,164 1863............. 753 1864............. 780 1865............. 791 1866............. 522 1867.............. 659 1868............. 917 1869............. 1,277 1870............. 588 1871............ 1872............. 1873............. 1874............. 769 572 659 903 1875............ 1876............. 984 1,055 1877............. 1,002 1878............. 1,096 Price. 95 13} 19| 204, 21 135 17} 21 19 16} 17 1*] 15} 16 13 1*4 13 Quan- tity. Price. $3 20 2 91 5 07 6 00 5 49 5 71 5 07 4 77 4 45 4 00 4 24 3 03 4 16 2 67 4 01 2 40 3 16 Potatoes, Bbls. Quan- tity. 274 295 246 330 499 556 626 914 147 562 471 434 622 557 578 587 529 Price. $2 50 2 53 3 46 3 29 3 84 3 63 4 49 2 41 2 68 3 23 2 21 3 61 2 91 2 59 1 98 3 56 2 01 Rice, Lbs. Quan- tity. 7,885 4,445 2,574 4,545 3,869 3,865 4,539 4,816 3,044 3,866 4,526 5,473 5,402 3,007 4,334 4,771 6,118 Price. $0 8] 10] 11 10} 10] 10', 9; 7] 7 7} 7] 7 6; 0; 7] Lard, Lbs. Quan- tity. 705 938 1,011 1,093 2,026 1,695 2,036 2.206 1,037 1,183 1,717 1,324 1,350 1,335 1,193 1.091 1,861 Price. 12 121 19] 27 To! 19} 21} 18 151 10] 10 11] 15| 14] 12.1 7} Crack kks, Lbs. Ice, Cwt. Quan- tity. 335 264 73 130 240 123 375 1,09 1.134 1,748 i,*925 1,602 1,254 1,557 1,412 1,370 Quan- tity in lbs. 9 10 10] 20 11] Hi 9 9 10 9.1 "io] 10 10] 10] 10 9} 17,350 15,190 16,500 22,0.50 34,715 36,285 18,22.5 48,910 27,530 1 27,996 53*221* 89,800 85,090 98,905 109,940 136,535 $0 30 74 50 60 60 60 60 60 1 27 92 "'38' 43 24 36 30 32 Coal, Tons. Quan- Price. tity. 675 $4 55 403 8 13 613 10 27 620 10 56 850 8 40 976 6 18 849 5 29 1,092 6 82 970 5 32 1,186 5 97 1,064 4 69 799 6 03 1,181 6 01 348 6 21 2,3!'6 5 4(i 1,303 3 29 1*177 3 70 Gas, 1,000 Ft. Quan- tity, fee't. 630,800 564,20U 81.9,500 756,800 763,900 765,100 700,700 969,700 932,500 1,090,700 Note.— The prices given are the average prices for the year, and are obtained by dividing the total amount expended for each article named by the quantity used Table No. 44. Showing the average cost of principal articles used at various institutions in the State, during the years named. ARTICLES. Flour, barrel............ Butcher's meat, pound Butter, pound.......... Tea, pound.............. Coffee, pound........... Sugar, pound............ Molasses, gallon........ Milk, gallon............. Cheese, pound.......... Crackers, pound........ Rice, pound............. Eggs, dozen............ Potatoes, barrel......... Soap, pound ............ Coal, ton................ New York Institution for the Blind. 1860. 1865. $6 00 8 25 42 14 8 40 16 12 1 60 $10 33 18} 43 1 20 32] 19 75} 24 21] 3 00 *8 85' 1868. 1876. 1877. 1878." 23 16 48] 03 34] 15 72] 25 18 $7 31 1*1 35] 32} 31] 9] 02 26 141 1 82 6 23* $7 96 11} 32 27 26] 101 64} 24 15 3 56 4 21 40 Hi 33} 29' 22} 8] 44 23 14 1 88 4*26' New York Institution for the Deaf AND DUMB. 1865. $11 02 14} 46 j 1 09 46 18 94 391 20] 3 29 '10*56' 1868. 1876. 1877. 1878. $12 37 14] 55] 1 08 35.1 15' 78 "ni Hi 101 35 4 49 *5'29' $8 27 11 3-2.1 47" 31 9] 63 26 13 10] 0'i 24 1 98 5 46 $9 00 10.1 28] 45 20] 101 62" 26 141 10" 0] 25 3 56 3 29 $7 75 10 24} 37 25} 9 56 24 13 9} 7"! 14 1-5 2 01 New York Catholic Protectory. 1868. 1876. 1877 1878.t 3 69 $10 69 141 37" 97f 27 lof 1 01 24 21 13: 13] 24] 3 25 13 9 83 $10 41 Hi 39" 88| 24 133 71] 24 15] 13.1 10" 18] 2 82.1 6] 6 78 $6 45 9} 25} 36" 22 ~9i *•->} 141 12} 9} oi H] 1 10 7} 5 49 $7 41 9 38] 22 10 43 18] 13 11 6 13] 2 10 8 3 57 $5 75 8a 13 25 21 71 34 16 7 9 2 00 7 3 97 t Average prices during Septemljer, 1878. In regard to the supplies of meat, the cattle are purchased alive and slaughtered and dressed at the institution. to 00 ^ s O o Table No. ^—(Continued). Western House of Refuge. ARTICLES. 1860. Flour, barrel............' Sfc> 82 Butcher's meat, pound, 7 Butter, pound.......... •■•••_ , Ten, pound.............. V\ Coffee, pound...........t 24 Sugar, pound......... Molasses, gallon..... Milk, gallon.......... Cheese, pound........ Crackers, pound..... Rice, pound.......... Eggs, dozen......... Potatoes, barrel...... Soap, pound......... Coal, ton............ *60 7 4 20 1865. *63 15 7 90 1877. 1873. $S 57 $9 27 $7 09 $5 35 10 14 12 25 11] 11} 1 05 91 42 33! 30 24 22 17 12} 101 9} 56 50 38 33 t28} 127} t231 •87 9 5 40 *63 01 3 40 DEPARTMENT OP PUB- ' NEW YORK WILLARD STATE EMIGRANT REFUSE AND HOS- LiC CHARITIES AND j ASYLUM FOR PITAL. CORRECTIONS. lUIOTS. 1850. 1305. 41 $9 38 71 1:5J 21 40} 41 90 15 31] 8 151 36] 80] 16 16 *6:i 6} 74 3 91 10} 14 12 22 1868. $10 75 15 43} 97" 22} hi 1877. i 187 % -7 03 i $5 32 75] 32 8 3-5 6 94 17} 32 15 8 40 5 3 04 1865. $12 00 10 43 75 42 19} 42 4 50 11 * Price per bushel. t Condensed milk, price per quart. Average prices during July, 1878. 1868. | 1S77. S3 50 8 44 73 25 145 35 S} 2*50 8} $7 00 6 20 26 18 9} 24 6} 'i'60* 5J 9F6 95 8i 22} 41" 26J 9} 47" 16 131 .....6] **47 *3 56 Asylum for rut Insane. $4 84 5 to 6 12 to Hi M 30 KJ 17 to 3 75 Average prices for December, 1878. 1 APPENDIX. EXHIBIT No. 1. RULES, REGULATIONS AND BY-LAWS OF THE NEW YORK STATE LUNATIC ASYLUM, UTICA. Introduction. This Asylum has been erected at great expense by the State, that the insane may have a safe retreat, in the care of those who have learned the best mode of managing them, and where they may have every chance of recovery. The first impulses of insanity are often met at home and amongst friends, by resistance and opposition. The apparent difference in the conduct and feelings of their friends ex- cites collision, arouses the passions and awakens the prejudices of the victims of delusion. They now feel that those whom they loved have turned against them — that their friends purposely thwart all their plans, oppose all their desires, and resist what they conceive to be their own best efforts to promote the happiness of both. For these reasons it becomes desirable that they should be re- moved to the care of strangers, whose efforts to make them com- fortable they often acknowledge aud appreciate more correctly. From strangers they will also submit to requirements without a murmur, which would excite the greatest hostility to friends. In the various departments, all have daily much to do with the inmates of the Asylum, and some devote their whole time to their care. It becomes all seriously to consider how this duty shall be per- formed ; what discipline of feeling, and what subjugation of temper there shall be that the "law of kindness" may be administered to its full extent and in its proper spirit. Every person employed in the Asylum, in any capacity whatever, must perform the duties assigned conscientiously, and to the entire satisfaction of the managers, of the superintendent, and of those in immediate authority. ... ' No individual i's'worthy of a place in such an institution who la- bors for waa-es only. Duty, a desire to improve the condition ot all within the sphere of influence, to increase the happiness and lessen the sufferings of each and all the inmates, should be the governing motive of daily conduct. It must never be forgotten that we are dealing with fellow creatures, who, being deprived of reason, are 1152 not responsible for their conduct. The regulating power of moral action is withheld from them ; hence they are capricious, passionate, and often violent. They often also misjudge, and are led astray by perverted senses or by delusions of the understanding, which carry them far from the proprieties of rational conduct. It is because they are unable to control themselves, and because they do not readily acquiesce in the directions of their friends, that many of these individuals are placed in the Asylum. Here they are to have every comfort and every reasonable indulgence which, individually or collectively, will promote their best good. Here they look for sympathy and counsel, for assistance in their various troubles and perplexities. We should enter into their feelings, and show our willingness to spend our time and strength to promote their happiness and recovery to health. To withhold what may reasonably be required is to do them in- justice, and disregard duty. To treat them with neglect, or with unkind and hasty language, or in any way to tantalize them, or to recriminate or to return violent or abusive words, is to do them in- jury- Persuasion with a proper spirit will generally be followed by a quiet acquiescence in all reasonable requirements. Much depends upon the manner of intercourse with the insane. We should never be cold and insensible to their wants— never hasty and impatient in our intercourse — never turn a deaf ear to their representations — never treat them with neglect, nor with feelings of superiority; but mingle with them in kindness, address them with respect, and we shall secure their confidence, which is necessary to their best care. I. Board of Managers. 1. The managers shall choose one of their number president, who shall continue in office until the annual meeting next after he is chosen. 2. An auditing committee of three members shall be appointed, who shall hold their places until the annual meeting next following their appointment. 3. The treasurer shall hold his office during the pleasure of the board. 4. The annual meeting shall be held on the second Tuesday of December in each year. Quarterly meetings shall be held on the Tuesdays next after the second Monday in each of the months of April, July and October. Special meetings may be called by the president, or by any two members. 5. The Asylum shall be visited by the whole board at the annual ■ meetings, and by a majority at the quarterly meetings, and by individual members at other times. 6. One of the board shall be chosen secretary, and shall hold office until the next annual meeting. It shall be his duty to keep an accurate record of the proceedings of the board of managers, and to 1153 cause notices of all meetings to be delivered to the members residing in Utica, at their places of residence or business, and to send notices by mail to members residing elsewhere, at such times previous to the meetings, as the president or the two members calling the meetings shall at the time direct. 7. No officer shall be directly or indirectly interested in any con- tract for the supply of any article for the use of the Asylum; nor shall he receive any present or gratuity from any person dealing with the Asylum, or from any patient or visitor, or from the friends of a patient. II. Resident Officers. The Superintendent. 1. The superintendent is the head of the establishment. He has the general superintendence of the buildings, grounds and farm, | together with their furniture, fixtures and stock. To him are com- mitted the charge of the patients, and the direction and control of all persons therein, subject to the regulations of the board of mana- gers. It shall be his duty to determine, under the direction of the said board, what attendants and assistants are necessary to be em- ployed, and to prescribe their respective places and duties; also to establish and enforce, in every department, systematic order and salutary discipline. 2. He shall visit the patients, or learn their condition, daily, and as much oftener as may be necessary, and shall direct such medical, moral and physical treatment as may be the best adapted to their relief. 3. "He shall cause to be kept, in a suitable book, a record of the name, sex, age, place of nativity and residence, civil state and pro- fession, of each patient; also, as far as can be ascertained, the dates and history of each patient's disease, the time when received, and when removed, and how, whether cured or relieved, and the medical and moral treatment; whether eloped, or dead ; and if dead, the cause; together with all such other facts and circumstances in each case as are useful or usual in the statistical records of such an insti- tution. Also, a record of the names and residence of all persons employed in the institution, with the times and terms of their respective engagements; also, the stipulated wages, and the nature ' of the services expected from each, and the times and causes of their dismission. ' 4. At any visit of the managers, and at all times when required, he shall exhibit to them all the records of the institution, and inform them minutely of its affairs. Every quarter he shall give a brief -statement of its general condition; the names of persons removed and received during the three months last past, with such sugges- i turns and remarks as he may deem useful. At each annual meeting of the board he shall' present a tabular view of the institution for the year, with full and minute details from the records, and accom- 145 U 1154: panying it with a condensed report of other interesting and useful facts and circumstances, experiments and opinions, illustrating its management, condition and prospects. 5. He shall, from time to time, give to all persons employed at the Asylum, or on the farm, such instructions as he shall judge best adapted to carry into full operation all its rules and regulations. He shall cause such rules and regulations to be strictly and faithfully executed ; taking care that the steward and matron, and all others employed about the premises, perform satisfactorily aud punctually all their respective duties. Assistant Physicians. 1. The assistant physicians shall be well-educated physicians, and shall constantly reside at the Asylum. The first or second assistant shall have charge of the male division, and the other of the female division of the Asylum, and each shall exercise a general supervision of the one assigned to him, under the direction of the superintendent. 2. The said first and second assistant physicians shall visit all the patients in their respective divisions once each day, in the morning, and, if necessary, in the afternoon or evening, or oftener; carefully observe their condition, wants and treatment; and see that they have food, medicine, exercise, amusements, clothing and bedding suitable for them ; exert what moral influence they can with them, and endeavor in every way to promote their comfort and recovery. 3. They shall see that the attendants and assistants are faithful and kind, attentive to the wants of the patients, and vigilant in the discharge of their duties; aud they shall report immediately to the superintendent all instances of misconduct, unfaithfulness, neglect of duty observed by them, or of which they may receive information ; and they shall also record the particulars of all accidents and escapes. 4. For the due performance of the duties enjoined in the fore- going sections, they shall spend much time in their respective divisions; shall be in constant communication with the supervisors, attendants and assistants, and shall carry out the plans and instruc- tions of the superintendent in the best manner they are able. 5. They shall report in writing to the superintendent, daily, in books kept for that purpose, the general condition of their respective divisions, and the particular state of such patients as may be sick or greatly excited, and of those requiring restraint, removal or seclusion, or special attention. 6. They shall keep records of the cases of all the patients in their respective divisions, describing the symptoms, the changes that may occur from time to time, the mode of tretament, and altthe peculiar circumstances connected therewith. They shall also see that the records of admission and discharges are accurately kept. 7. They shall attend to the warmth, cleanliness, ventilation, and good order of their respective divisions, and direct the use of the baths. 1155 8. They shah attend the visitors when necessary, and shall always be ready to perform whatever services may be required of them by the superintendent, and, under his directions, shall assist in conduct- ing the correspondence with the friends of patients. 9. When requested by the superintendent they shall visit the entire establishment, see all the patients, and learn their condition and treatment. 10. It shall be the duty of the third and fourth assistant physicians, when not on duty on the wards, to perform such office or other duties as the superintendent shall direct; to attend to visitors ; and, in the absence of the first or second assistant physicians, to perform such of their duties as may be required of them by the superintend- ent ; and also to perform such other duties out of the office, when directed or permitted to be absent therefrom, as the superintendent may prescribe. The Steward. 1. The steward shall execute a bond, with two sufficient sureties, to be approved by the treasurer, in the penalty of $1,000, condi- tioned that he will faithfully discharge the duties of the office of steward, and pay over and account for all money that shall come to his hands belonging to the New York State Lunatic Asylum. Said bond shall be executed to the treasurer of the Asylum, and be filed in his office. 2. In all cases of purchases by the steward, he shall require dupli- cate bills, on one of which he shall indorse an order upon the treas- urer to pay the amount of the bill, and on the other take a receipt for the order given by him on the treasurer. 3. No order of the steward shall be paid by the treasurer, unless it it is accompanied with the bill of items for the .payment of which the order was given, nor unless the bill or order is countersigned or indorsed " approved " by the superintendent. 4. The steward shall keep one of the duplicate accounts, with a.copy of the order on the treasurer, in every such case of purchase by hira, and make the proper entries under the appropriate head of ex- penditure in his books. 5 The treasurer may, from time to time, advance to the steward, on his own order, and the indorsement of the superintendent, specify- ing that it is to pay petty current expenses, a sum not exceeding one hundred dollars. The steward shall keep an accurate account in ' detail, in a pass or other proper book, of all such expenses paid out of the sums so advanced to him by the treasurer, and shall settle the same with him monthly, or whenever required. Such account shall be examined and approved by the superintendent before it is settled by the treasurer, and a copy thereof, with vouchers for all sums ex- ceeding one dollar, shall be filed with the treasurer. The steward shall aScount for each sum of one hundred dollars which he shall thus receive before a further advance.shall be made to him. 6 The treasurer, on paying any bill or order of the steward, shall 1156 take a voucher for such payment, and file the same in his office, and shall enter iti his books, under the proper heads of expenditure, the sums paid by him out of the treasury. 7. The steward, under the superintendent's direction, shall pur- chase furniture, food, medicine, fuel, stores and all other necessary articles; and he shall be accountable for their safe-keeping, and for their economical use and expenditure. 8. He shall keep clear, methodical and exact accounts of all pur- chases, of all receipts and expenditures of money, and of all charges on account of any patients. He shall exhibit all his account books, and vouchers, to the managers, whenever required so to do; and he shall furnish a quarterly abstract of the same, both to the treasurer and managers, on the last days of March, June, September and December in each year. Copies of all accounts which become due to the institution shall be furnished to the treasurer, at his request. 9. All moneys advanced for pay patients, or otherwise collected or received by the steward, or by persons employed by him, shall be immediately paid over to the treasurer of the Asylum. 10. In the name of the superintendent, and by his directions in each case, and not otherwise, the steward shall hire attendants and assistants, and agree with them for their wages; and, by like direc- tion, he shall dismiss them when unfaithful, negligent or incompe- tent ; he shall keep and settle their accounts; and he shall perform such other duties, in relation to the internal management and gov- ernment of the Asylum, as the superintendent shall require. He shall see that the attendants and assistants rise and begin business immediately after the ringing of the morning bell, and that they retire at proper season at night. He shall observe their conduct, see that in all respects they do their duty, and report to the superin- tendent, immediately, any instance of misconduct or negligence. 11. He shall receive visitors, give them all suitable information, and show them such parts of the buildings and grounds as are open for their examination. 12. He shall remain, as much as possible, in the division appro- priated to the male patients, so as to be much in their presence, to see that they are kindly treated ; that their beds are in good order; that their clothes are taken good care of; that their food is properly served and distributed, and that the rooms, halls, yards, shops and out-buildings, and other apartments under his care, are kept clean and in good order, and properly warmed and ventilated ; and that the attendants observe his orders and directions, and in all respects do their duty; and that all articles made for the patients or the Asylum are carefully preserved. 13. In all his directions to subordinate agents, in executing the details of the superintendent's plans, and in enforcing the rules, the steward shall be considered as carrying the authority of the superin- tendent. It shall be his duty to preserve order in the house, and faithfulness among the assistants, and to see that the rules and regu- lations are fully put in practice. 1157 The Matron. L. It shall be the duty of the matron to look carefully to the female patients, and spend as much time with them as her other duties may allow; she shall see that they are kindly treated ; that their nurses and attendants are wrell instructed and faithful; that their food is properly served and distributed ; that their apartments are clean, warm and properly ventilated; and that their clothes and bedding are always clean, well aired, and in good order, and their apparel marked and preserved. 2. She shall also superintend the kitchen and laundry, and see that the cooking, washing and ironing are properly done; frequently inspect every department, and have an eye to the neat appearance of the whole house. It is expected that she will devote her whole time to the institution, and spare no efforts to promote the comfort and recovery of its inmates. She shall also superintend the sewing- rooms, and see that all new articles made for patients are correctly marked, properly disposed of and preserved. 3. It shall be her special duty to see to those that are sick, that they have constant and kind nurses, and proper care in all respects. She shall constantly notice the conduct of attendants and assistants, see that in all respects they do their duty, and report to the superin- tendent, immediately, any instance of misconduct or negligence. Apothecaries. 1. The apothecaries shall be physicians, students of medicine or competent druggists, and shall constantly reside at the Asylum. Under the direction of the superintendent and assistant physicians, they shall prepare and put up the medicines prescribed, and keep such records as the superintendent may require. They shall also keep the apothecary shop in order; wait on visitors, if directed, and perform such other services as may be required of them by the superintendent or assistant physicians. 2. They shall not absent themselves from the apothecary shop, without permission, unless necessarily employed elsewhere. As their intercourse with the patients will be considerable they must exert what moral influence they can to promote their comfort and welfare. Steward's Assistant. 1. It shall be his duty every morning to visit each kitchen, the bakery and wash-room, learn their condition and wants, and report to the steward immediately after breakfast. He shall also see that the various departments are supplied with such articles as have been directed by the superintendent or steward, taking care to charge m a book kept for that purpose, each article thus aehvered. _ _ 2 He shall at all times, be ready to execute all orders given him by the superintendent or steward. It shall be Ins special duty to see that faithfulness and good order prevail in all the departments of la- 1158 bor, and to report immediately to the superintendent all instances of inefficiency, unfaithfulness or misconduct. Matron's Assistant. It shall be her duty to remain in the matron's office, to attend to the reception and discharge of female patients; when requested to do so, to wait upon friends that come to visit them, and to render the matron all the assistance she is able in the kitchens and other de- partments of labor and supervision. Clerks. 1. Tliere shall be a clerk, or extra attendant in the division for men, and another in that for women, whose duty it shall be to receive the clothing of patients, and see that each article is entered upon the clothes' book; that it is plainly marked with the name of the owner, and properly disposed of and preserved. In case a patient has jewelry, money or other articles not needed for use on the ward, they shall deliver the same to the steward for safe-keeping. 2. They shall also attend to the clothing of patients when dis- charged, and see that all articles belonging to them are carefully put up and brought into the hall of the center building. When not necessarily engaged elsewhere, they shall remain in wards number one of their respective divisions, and be ready at all times to attend to orders from the officers. When not otherwise engaged, they shall assist in the ordinary duties of attendants, and both shall do all they can to promote the comfort and welfare of patients, and to maintain good order and fidelity throughout the establishment. Supervisors of Departments. 1. There are three departments for each sex. The first includes the wards numbered 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 ; the second, those numbered 6, 7, 8, 9; the third, those numbered 10, 11, 12. 2. Each of these departments shall have a supervisor, or first attendant, whose duty it shall be, in addition to the other duties of an attendant, to have a general charge of the whole department, to see to the administration of medicine, and to communicate with the physicians, steward and matron respecting the wants and condition of the patients in their respective departments, and to report to the steward all damages done by patients. 3. They shall attend specially to the sick, see that they are treated with great care and kindness; receive the orders of the physicians, and see that they are faithfully executed. It shall be their duty to instruct new attendants in their duties, and see that they are efficient, industrious and kind. They shall assist in the arrangements for the burial of the dead, and be ready at all times to attend to any extra- ordinary services that may be required of them by the superintendent. 4. They shall pay particular attention to new patients, see that they are properly introduced and informed about the establishment, 1159 their fears quieted by kind attention and friendly assurances, and that the violent and suicidal are carefully watched. 5. They shall also see that the wards are properly supplied with » furniture and articles for use, and shall often communicate with the physicians respecting the patients, and inform them of changes in their condition that require attention, and of those likely to be bene- fited or injured by exercise, labor, amusements or religious services. 6. They shall in all things endeavor to carry into successful ope- ration the plans of the superintendent, and shall constantly study* to promote the comfort, contentedness and welfare of the patients, and tor these purposes they shall visit every part of their respective departments several times each day. They shall also see to the changes of patients from one ward to another, and walk out with patients that are feeble or timid, or with others when they have time. Overseers of the Kitchens and Bakery. 1. The kitchens and bakery shall each have an overseer, whose duty it shall be to see to the safe-keeping and economical use of all the supplies furnished to those departments. They shall see that the food is well cooked and properly distributed, and that nothing is wasted —that no extra or unusual articles are cooked for those in the kitchens, nor sent into the wards, unless the persons calling for such present a written order of one of the physicians — that there is no unnecessary or improper conversation carried on with those in the wards — that there is no rude or improper behavior in the kitchens or bakery — no bad language or quarreling, but that all work faith- fully. They shall see that these departments, including store-rooms, I etc., are kept neat and in good order, and that no peddlers or idle company be suffered to visit the kitchens or bakery — nor the attend- \ ants and assistants in other departments, without special business or by permission of one of the officers. All violations of these rules, or instances of bad conduct on the part of those employed in their I departments, are to be reported by the overseer to the superintend- " ent immediately. ! 2. In such an establishment, where there are large quantities of provisions and many hands employed, constant vigilance will be necessary to guard against the feeling on the part of any, that it is of no consequence if some things are lost or squandered ; that they . belong to the State, and that there are enough left. Any remark of this kind, or conduct indicating such feelings, shall be made known at once to the superintendent. In short, the overseers are expected to know from their own observation, that the articles and food in- trusted to them are safely kept and economically used, and that good order and cleanliness prevail in all the departments under their care. It shall be their duty to see that those employed rise early, and are ( attentive and faithful throughout the day and hours of labor. 3 It shall be no excuse for the overseers that their departments . are not in good order for want of sufficient help, furniture or proper 1160 arrangements, as their application to the steward must be repeated until they are wxell furnished in these respects. Overseers of the Washing and Ironing-Rooms. 1. The overseer of the washing department shall collect the cloth- ing and other articles to be washed, as directed by the steward and matron, and see that they are properly and carefully washed, dried, and carried to the ironing-rooms. Especial care must be taken that none are lost. For this purpose he must see that he receives all the articles on the list given him, and that they are marked, and that he furnishes the same, with the lists, to the ironing-rooms. 2. The overseer of the ironing-rooms shall see that the clothes and other articles delivered from the washing-rooms are properly ironed, and correctly distributed, according to the lists furnished, as directed by the steward and matron. 3. The overseers of the washing and ironing-rooms shall not per- mit attendants or assistants, or any company, or visitor into their de- partments, except by the direction of one of the officers of the Asy- lum. Violations of this rule shall be reported to the superintend- ent immediately. Engineer. 1. The engineer shall have charge of the engine and boiler-house, and general charge and oversight of all the shops, and of the boilers, and engines; of all machinery in the shops, wash-house, ironing- rooms, and in all other places about the institution ; and of the ap- paratus for extinguishing fires, for warming and ventilation ; of the pipe fitting, sewers, water and gas supply and*distribution, of the steam cooking apparatus, dumb-waiters, etc., and of all the fixtures and appliances connected therewith. He shall have direction of the plumber, fireman, and of any other assistants under him in this de- partment. He shall see to the economical use of fuel used in the steam boilers, and in the kitchens, etc., and guard against the waste of steam for cooking, washing, etc. 2. The fireman, and any person in charge of the engines and ma- chinery, during the absence of the engineer from the engine-house, shall be diligent aud vigilant in keeping the fires under the boilers in proper condition, and the boilers supplied with water, and never leave their post of duty until relieved therefrom. 3. The doors of the attics shall always be kept locked, and no per- sons except the officers, engineer, carpenter and plumber shall enter them without the permission of the superintendent, or of one of the resident officers^ Overseers of Shops. 1. The carpenter, painter, plumber, tailor, and all who have special charge^of shops, or particular branches of business, shall see that proper use is made of all materials and tools furnished Lthem, that 1161 none are lost, or taken from the shops without the direction of an officer, and^ that good order and faithfulness are maintained by all employed in the various branches of business, and that no articles are made, and no new business undertaken, but by the order of the superintendent. 2. When patients assist, they shall be carefully attended to, and not suffered to go away, or to carry from the shop any tools, or articles not belonging to them; and at all times, and under all cir- cumstances, they shall be treated with respect and kindness, and particular pains be taken to promote their comfort, cheerfulness and recovery. 3. Every overseer of a shop shall interdict the visits of attendants and assistants, and all other company to the shop under his charge, ■ unless accompanied by an officer, or by permission of an officer. Any violation of these rules shall be immediately reported to the superintendent. The Gardener, Farmer and Carriage Driver. 1. To the gardener is assigned the special care of the gardens, greenhouse and garden tools; to the farmer, the farm and stock, including cows, hogs and poultry, and the farm teams and imple- ments ; to the carriage driver, the horses not used on the faim, and the carriages. 2. It shall be the duty of each to have every thing committed to their charge, attended to in the best manner. They shall see that the tools, wagons, implements, carriages, harnesses, etc., are kept in good order and repair, and that nothing is lost; that a place is as- signed for every thing under their care, and that every thing is kept in its' place. They shall report to the steward any needs of their respective departments. 3. They shall follow the directions given to the overseers of shops as respects the care of the patients that assist them, and be careful that none work too hard, or in Hie rain, or in a way likely to injure them. This rule shall be observed by all in the employ of the Asy- lum, who have the care of patients when at work. Night Watchers. 1. There shall be two night watchers for each division, two men and two women. 2. The night watchers shall visit the medical office every evening at nine o'clock to receive particular orders for the night. Their ser- vices shall commence at that hour and continue until the hour of six the following morning. During the night they must not fail to be faithful, never cease to be vigilant, make as little noise as possible, and enter into no loud conversation with any one. 3. They must be especially careful to guard against danger from fire, the least suspicion of which in any part of the establishment, or in buildings lumber, or wood around it, should excite their imme. 146 U 1162 diate attention and be at once reported to the superintendent. They must also be attentive to any unusual noise, and be careful that pa- tients do not escape or injure themselves or do any damage. One of the night watchmen shall visit the different halls of the center building, and pass out to the rear and to the front of the Asylum frequently during the night, and shall attend to the various fires in the kitchens, etc., as directed by the superintendent or steward. 4. One of the night watchmen, designated by the superintendent, shall see to the proper closing of all the outer doors about the insti- tution, and remain in aud about the central building and office, until all attendants who are out on permission, for the evening, shall have returned, when the Asylum shall be closed. The night watchers on both sides of the house shall see that all gas-lights are turned off at the proper hour, and that all water faucets are properly closed. They will visit all the wards every hour, note any patients who are up, noisy or sick, and the hour, and in case of the sickuess of any patient, report at once to the physician in charge. 5. It shall be their duty to guard, during the night, against any violations of the rules of the Asylum, and should such occur, or any circumstance requiring attention, they must report them immedi- ately, or early in the morning, to the superintendent. One of the men will ring the bell in the morning, at such times as directed by the superintendent or steward. III. Attendants and Assistants. Duty of Officers. 1. All persons employed in the Asylum are expected to do all they can to promote the welfare of the institution ; treat the officers on all occasions with politeness aud respect, and do, readily and cheer- fully, every duty required of them. 2. All must expect an unceasing observation of the manner of performing their respective duties; and suggestions, by an officer, of deficiencies or improvement therein are to be taken kindly and without offense, and efforts made to improve. Duty to each Other and to Themselves. 1. In the first place, self-respect is enjoined on all. Each one shall be responsible in his or her department, and should be ambiti- ous to do the duties of it to entire acceptance. 2. Patients will look to attendants for good examples; let attendants be careful in nothing to set a bad one. 3. Let your dress always be neat and clean. Avoid all ungentle- manly habits, such as wearing hats within doors, going in shirt sleeves, etc. Never indulge in loud talking or laughing. Use no profane, obscene or vulgar language. Never play at'any'game with one another, nor with patients, excepting at the 'direction of one of the physicians. 1163 4. Treat each other with politeness; be civil, cordial and frank. A calm, quiet, cheerful deportment befits your employment. Cherish a high sense of moral obligation ; cultivate an humble, self-denying , spirit; seek to be useful, and maintain, at all hazards, your purity, truth, sobriety, economy, faithfulness and honesty. 5. No attendant or assistant,^ while connected with the Asylum, ; shall, at any time, at home or abroad, make use of distilled spirits, or intoxicating liquor of any kind, and it is desirable that they should not use tobacco, but discourage the use of it by patients. Duty of Attendants to Patients. 1. The attendants are to treat the inmates with respect and at- ' tention; greet them cheerfully with "good morning," or "good evening," and show them such other marks of good-will and kind- ness as evince interest and sympathy. Under all circumstances, be kind and considerate; speak in a mild, persuasive tone of voice; never address a patient rudely, by a nickname, a christian name, or a surname, but always politely, as Mr., Mrs. or Miss. , 2. A patient is ever to be soothed and calmed when irritated; encouraged and cheered when melancholy or depressed. They must 'never be pushed, collared, nor rudely handled. To induce them to move, gentle, persuasive measures will prevail in most cases; when i these fail, report to the superintendent or one of the assistant phy- sicians. 3. If the attendant receives insult and abusive language he must keep cool, forbear to recriminate, to scold, threaten or dictate in the language of authority. Violent hands are never to be laid on a pa- tient, under any provocation. A blow is never to be returned, nor any other insult. Sufficient, force to prevent the patient's injuring ■ himself, or others, is always to be applied gently; and all struggling with a patient should, if possible, be avoided, by calling additional assistance, when a patient is highly excited or disposed to violence, before entering his room or attempting to dress or control him. 4. The attendants shall never apply any restraining apparatus unless by order of a medical officer, nor seclude a patient without giving immediate notice to one of the physicians. 5. On rising in the morning, it is the duty of the attendants to see that each patient confided to his or her care is thoroughly washed, hair combed, clothes brushed and cleaned, if necessary; collars, wristbands and suspenders buttoned, and all parts of the dress properly adjusted and secured; boots and shoes cleaned and tied; and in fact that the whole dress be neat and in good repair. All this should be re-looked to throughout the day, and especially i before going to meals or religious services, or going to ride or walk. The patients' beds are then to be made, and the wards, day-rooms, | bathing-rooms, passages and stairs to be swept, and the whole prem- . ises put in complete order as soon as it can be done, so that an in- spection may be had of the house by the physicians, commencing at \ 1164 nine o'clock. Previous to this time no patients are to leave the house to walk, labor or ride, without directions, special or general, of the medical officer. By ten o'clock the morning work should be completed, and the house in order in every part. 6. One attendant must always be in each ward with the patients, and must not leave under any circumstances until relieved. The attendants must not retire to their rooms while the patients are in the wards. This rule must be observed in all the wards. 7. xit meals the attendants must always be present to carve, dis- tribute food to those who are incompetent to do it for themselves, and to see that every one has a proper supply. One of them must be designated to see that no patient carry away a knife, fork or any other article from the table. 8. An attendant must never place in the hands of a patient, or leave where a patient can get, any razor, pen-knife, rope, cord, medi- cine, matches or any dangerous weapon or article. A constant watch of patients is to be kept in these respects; their beds fre- quently searched for such articles, and the knives and forks counted after each meal. An attendant must never deliver any letter or writing from or to a patient, without permission of the superintend- ent; nor even retain in his or her possession, without permission, any writing of a patient. 9. The attendants in each ward are responsible for the safe-keeping of the patients therein, and must not leave them, except in the care of some responsible person. There is an obvious impropriety in at- tendants sitting in their rooms, engaged in reading or writing dur- ing hours of duty; i. e., from the time the patients get up in the morning, until they retire at night. During this time, they should be in their rooms only long enough to adjust their own dress. All these hours, with this sole exception, should be devoted to the patients; endeavoring to keep them tidy and comfortable, to prevent improper conduct, bad postures (such as lying on the floor or ground, etc)., and to instruct, interest and amuse them by talking with them, read- ing to them, and the like. K). Suicides and elopements are most frequent about meal times, at dusk, and at the hour of religious services; therefore, the strictest watch is to be kept at these times. Attendants must always be stationed where they can see patients during meals or religious services, and see that no one passes out of the house, and that each one returns to his or her apartment. Attendants are to look not merely to those under their immediate charge, but with constant watchfulness, over all the patients, they must endeavor to prevent any from eloping or wandering. The clothes of suicidal patients, and every dangerous article should be removed from their rooms at night, and the windows secured. Each attendant should always know where every one is of those committed to their charge. 11. When patients ride out, it is the duty of the attendant to see that they do not leave the carriage, nor communicate with persons casually met, nor deliver letters, packages, or messages, nor procure 1165 weapons, tobacco or other articles. He is not to stop to do errands for himself or others, without permission of the superintendent. When patients walk out with attendants, they shall keep them to- gether, and observe the same prohibitions as in driving out; they shall also particularly avoid going near dangerous places, as railroads, canals, precipices, rivers, wells, machinery, etc., or into woods or other places favorable for elopement. 12. Supervisors will go to the medicine cupboard for medicines after each meal, and see that they are given at the time directed, and that all are taken. Each cup must be marked with the patient's name. Extreme care must be used to avoid mistakes, and to pre- vent patients helping themselves to medicine ; therefore all cups, vials, boxes, etc., containing medicine, must be immediately re- turned, or if directed to be kept on the ward, shall be locked up. Within an hour from the time of taking them the cups shall be cleaned and returned to the medicine cupboard. In going for the cups, and returning them, the supervisor must not delay in the pas- sage, nor hold any other conversation than to report to the medical officers, changes in the condition of the patients, which they are always to do immediately. 13. All damages by patients, and all their wants as to clothes and other articles necessary to put these rules in practice are to be reported by the supervisors, to the steward or matron. It willbe no excuse for attendants that their rooms, beds and patients are not in ample order, to say they have not what is necessary; for their ap- plication for such articles should be unceasing until they get them. Attendants must be particularly careful not to break their keys, and | when any door locks or unlocks with difficulty, immediate notice should be given at the medical office. 14. The attendants must never ridicule the patients, nor mock or imitate them, nor do any thing to wound their feelings. If a patient [ engages in any controversy, or other improper or exciting topic of discourse, the attendant must, in the gentlest manner possible, inter- fere and check it; should such means fail, one of the medical ! officers should be informed immediately. The history, conduct and i conversation of patients must never be spoken of to visitors, nor reported by attendants when abroad. 15'. Attendants must look particularly to the comfort of patients in their special charge, both day and night, and see them early in the morning, on rising. In speaking to patients of the officers, attend- ants should inculcate respect and confidence in their management, and carry into operation all directions and prescriptions, in the most ready and faithful manner. 16. Every patient must be in the charge of some responsible' individual at all times, unless permitted to be at large by the Super- intendent. The person who takes a patient from one of the wards [ shall be acountable for his or her safe-keeping until returned to the same or intrusted by a resident officer to the care of another person. 1166 17. No patient shall be permitted to go out of the ward in which his or her room is situated, without the consent of a resident medical officer ; and no new patient without an order of the super- intendent or assistant physician in charge. 18. Food is not to be carried to the rooms of patients ; nor is any one to be absent from the regular meals, excepting in cases of sickness or high excitement, without permission of one of the physi- cians. 19. Attendants will notice the habits and conduct of patients, and inform the physician at his daily visit of all circumstances requiring attention, such as loss of appetite, or any indisposition, costiveness, tendency to suicide. 20. No conversation must ever be held with patients through the windows, either by officers, assistants or visitors; nor must any thing be thrown out through a wiudow. Duty to the Institution. 1. The attendants and assistants must never leave the Asylum without permission from the superintendent or an assistant physician. Application for leave of absence should be made several hours before leaving. Attendants, when thus leaving, must deposit the keys of their ward in the office, as directed, until their return. 2. The attendants must never give up a key, nor let any person into the wards without permission of a medical officer. No man attendant, without such permission, shall enter the division for women. 3. All persons who engage in employment at the Asylum shall be considered as engaged for one year, unless a special contract is made for a longer or shorter term. It is expected that all persons will fulfill their engagements scrupulously, as to time of service and duty to be performed, agreeably to their respective contracts; and no one shall discontinue service at the Asylum, or on the farm, with- out giving at least thirty days' notice, in writing, to the superintend- ant or steward. 4. Every person employed as an attendant, or in any capacity, shall sign the following Agreement. In consideration of being employed by the superintendent of tlie New York State Lunatic Asylnm, foi the said Asylum, I do hereby agree to work for the said State Lunatic Asylum for one year from date, at any work or service assigned me by the said superintendent, or other officer, on the terms specified, payable after the first month, so that one month's wages will remain unpaid until the end of the year; and I agree to observe and obey the rules and regulations of the Asylum, and the directions of the superintendent or other officer, from time to time; and in case I leave my employment before the expiration of one year from date, without the permission of the 1167 superintendent, or am discharged for the violation of the rules or neglect of duty, I am to forfeit one month's wages ; and if I continue in the employment of the Asylum after the termination of this con- tract, I agree to its full continuance, with all the conditions above specified. Dated this day of , 18 . Name. Residence. 5. No company shall be admitted into the rooms or wards occupied by the patients at any time, except by the express permission of the superintendent; but all other parts of the Asylum and its grounds may be exhibited by the steward, assistant physician or matron. All persons employed by the institution are expected to show marked respect and attention to strangers and visitors. 6. An indispensable duty of the attendants and assistants is to secure the perfect and systematic cleanliness and neatness of the Asylum and its inmates. No part of the house is to be considered clean, when it can be made cleaner. The floors, windows, tables, beds and bedding, cellars, closets and butteries are to be scrupulously attended to every day, so as to preserve a pure atmosphere. Chamber vessels are always to be removed and thoroughly cleaned immediately , after use. and spittoons every day. All soiled clothing and bedding shall be immediately taken to the wash-house. All dust shafts and receptacles shall be emptied daily, and all dressings or clothing satu- rated with oil shall, immediately after use, be taken to the boiler-house and there burned. . 7. The attendants must look well to all doors and windows con- nected with the patients' rooms and wards ; and at bed time see that no attempts are made to get out, and that the patients' doors are all safely locked, unless otherwise direted by the superintendent, and the doors communicating with the center building. In locking doors, be careful always to hear the bolt slip ; this precaution will often pre- vent escapes. Visiting from ward to ward, and especially to the kitchen, bakery, laundry or shops, without special business, is a vio- lation of duty. 8. The whole time of the attendants and assistants belongs to the Asylum. This rule applies equally to the clerks, supervisors, over- seers, and all persons in the employ of the Asylum. This does not prohibit each one from attending to his or her own clothing ; but to no other service can they devote their time, nor can they receive any compensation, besides their regular wages, for any service or labor, excepting only by express permission of the superintendent in each case. 9. An attendant or assistant receiving a present or gratuity from any'patient in the Asylum, or the friend of a patient; or from a visitor- or selling to,'or buying anything from, a patient; or re- ceiving any perquisite, of any kind whatever, shall be instantly dis- missed. 1168 10. No smoking shall be permitted in the wards, or about any of the out-buildings, kitchens, basements, or on the grounds. 11. On the occurrence of fire at any time in the buildings, the supervisor of each department will see that every patient is brought from the rooms into the wards, and all the room doors locked ; the doors of the stairways leading out will be immediately unlocked, and an attendant placed on guard at each. No supervisor or attendant will leave their wards, unless under the direction of the superintend- ent. Hours for Rising, Meals and Retiring. 1. The morning'bell shall be rung for two or three minutes, at five o'clock, during'the months of May, June, July and August; at five and one-half during April, September, October and November ; and at six during December, January, February and March. 2. Breakfast is to be placed upon the table, in the summer, at half- past six o'clock, in the spring and fall at seven, and at half-past seven in the winter. Dinner will be served uniformly at half- past twelve m., and tea at six p. m., the year round. 3. The Asylum is to be closed at half-past nine o'clock every night; at which time the attendants and assistants must all retire to their apartments. 4. Sunday is to be a Sabbath, or day of rest and quiet, at the Asylum. The buildings and grounds are not to be exhibited to visitors on this day ; nor shall any visitor be admitted into the wards or rooms of patients or attendants, except in cases of serious illness, and by special permission of the superintendent. 5. It is expected that all persons employed in the Asylum who are well, and can be spared from the duties of the house and wards, will, unless leave of absence be granted in each case, attend public worship in the chapel, on the Sabbath. Iu the chapel, the attend- ants and assistants will take special care to guard against any disturb- ance of the service by the patients, and see that none leave the chapel, unless accompanied by an officer or attendant. Chaplain. 1. It shall be the duty of the chaplain to conduct the religious exercises of the Asylum on Sundays, unless another clergyman has been invited by the superintendent, and on every other occasion when his services may be needed ; and to have such intercourse with the patients and other inmates, as the superintendent may deem desirable for their benefit. 2. He may, at suitable times, procure the services of other clergy- men at the religious exercises of the institution, with the consent and approbation of the superintendent. Visitors. The managers of the Asylum are fully aware of the interest gen- erally felt in its prosperity, and are desirous of affording suitable 1169 opportunities for visiting it and inspecting its internal arrangements; but they are convinced that the welfare of the patients, and the proper performance of the duties of the officers and attendants, re- quire that such visitations should be subject to proper regulations. In order to secure to patients the quiet and seclusion necessary to treatment, and to shield them from the improper observation of strangers, the board of managers have adopted the following rules for the admission of visitors: 1. The Asylum will be open to visitors from 2 to 5 o'clock, p. m., except on Sundays, Saturday afternoons and holidays. 2. All visitors, except persons having business at the Asylum, will be required to provide themselves with tickets of admission from the managers, either of whom will grant the same, unless their knowledge of circumstances makes it, in their judgment, necessary to refuse. 3. No visitors will be permitted to enter the wards or the grounds in the rear of the buildings, unless accompanied by a manager, or one of the resident officers, or some one delegated by the superin- tendent. 4. Persons wishing to see patients or learn their condition1 will inquire for the superintendent or for one of the assistant physicians, and no information concerning patients will be given except to rela- tives or family friends, and to public officers; and such information will be given only by the medical officers. 5. The person or persons directed to accompany visitors through the wards will not be permitted to point out or mention the names or peculiarities or conduct of patients. EXHIBIT No. 3. Three Counties Asylum. Patients. 312 men, 359 women ; total, 671 ; 50 recoveries. Attendants. 32 men, 25 women ; 1 to llf. Restraint. No restraint. Seclusion. No seclusion. Fracture of thigh and death. Employment. Men, 53 work on the land, 38 in the shops, 34 as coal carriers, wood choppers, hair pickers, etc. ; 94 help in the wards ; women, 65 assist in the laundry, 82 sew and darn, 12 help in the kitchen, 40 on the wards; total employed, 219 men, 222 women ; 70 per cent of men employed. Amusements. No reference to amusements. Exercise. " 65 men and 165 women were confined to the airing courts." Wages. Men, 26 lbs. 8s.; women, 15 lbs. 8s.; 1 lb. per annum rise. 147 U L 1170 Berks Asylum. Patients. 149 men, 157 women ; total, 306 ; 31 recoveries. Attendants. No reference in the report to number of attendants. Restraint. No reference to restraint. Seclusion. No reference to seclusion. Employment. Men, on the land, 30; in the * wards, 41; shoe- makers and tailors, 23 ; women, in the wards. 29 ; laundry, 33; kitchen, 14; needlework, 41; total, 100 men, 117 women ; 67.11 per cent employed. Amusements. Building a room with stage appliances for amuse- ments. Exercise. " 187 are altogether confined to the airing courts." Bucks Asylum. Patients. 206 men, 264 women; total, 470; 42 discharged but their condition not stated. Attendants. 14 men and 19 women ; 1 to 144;. Restraint. No restraint since last inspection. Seclusion. 55 occasions of seclusion; one woman burned to death. Employment. Men, " many are employed on the land and a few in trades; women help in the wards and assist in needlework." Amusements. No reference to amusements. Exercise. No reference to exercise. Cambridgeshire Asylum. Patients. 149 men, 170 women ; total, 319 ; 28 recoveries. Attendants. Commissioners state the staff of attendants remains the same, without stating any number. Restraint. No mechanical restraint. Seclusion. 17 occasions of seclusion. Employment. Men, 25 ou the land, 20 in the workshops, 12 about the buildings and 47 in various ways; women, 22 in the laundry, 6 in the kitchen, 83 in other ways ; total, 104 men, 116 women ; 69.79 per cent of men employed. Amusements. 36 men and 51 women meet at a weekly dance. Exercise. " 55 men and 49 women take walks outside of the grounds ; " no assistant medical officer. Carmarthen Asylum. '. "*" Patients. 192 men, 193 women; total, 385; 19 discharged but condition not stated. Attendants. Commissioners say staff of attendants the same, without giving any number. Restraint. No reference to restraint. Seclusion. No reference to seclusion. 1171 Employment. "The list of employed patients exhibit at least as much as that reported in April, 1877;" no particulars. Amusements. Dances twice a week in winter, once in summer, with a band to play frequently out of doors. Exercise. No reference to exercise ; one death from patient being kicked in the bowels ; men and women dine together in one room ; only 47 acres of land. Chester Asylum. _ Patients. 249 men, 253 women ; total, 502 ; condition of patients discharged not mentioned. Attendants. Reference to previous deficiency of attendants and says that the number has been corrected, but does not give number. Restraint. Case of restraint for surgical reasons. Seclusion. Four occasions of seclusion. One death from accidental choking. Employment. Men, 24 work on the land, 25 at trades, 12 in other ways ; women, 88 women work in the laundry, kitchen, wards, etc.; total, 61 men, 88 women ; 24.49 per cent of men employed. Amusements. " Outdoor games and periodical associated enter- tainments are given." Exercise. No reference to exercise. Suicide by patient taking knife from attendant's pocket and killing himself. Cheshire Asylum. Patients. 235 men, 315 women ; total, 550 ; 31 recoveries. Attendants. 20 men attendants, including all artisans, gardeners, etc.; 21 women attendants ; 1 to 13f. Restraint. One girl wearing locked gloves to prevent picking face ; one woman has worn a strait-jacket for 216 hours for maniacal excitement; another, locked gloves for 444 hours for mischievous and destructive habits; another woman had worn locked gloves for 328 hours for like reasons. Seclusion. 30 occasions of seclusion. One suicide of a patient who was put on trial ; one died from choking whilst at dinner. Employment. Men, 41 on the land, 18 in the shops, 29 on the wards; women, 41 in laundry and kitchen, 59 in work-room and 47 at household work; total,' 88 men, 147 women ; 37.44 per cent of men employed. Amusements. Weekly dances and theater for dramatic enter- tainments in the winter. Exercise. " 130 men and 90 women walk daily beyond the airing courts, while about 70 men once a week extend their walk beyond the asylum estate." . .. 1172 Cornwall Asylum. Patients. 258 men, 328 women; total, 586 ; 38 recoveries. Attendants. No reference to attendants. Restraint. One man restrained in bed by waistcoat for surgical reasons ; one woman ditto ; one man restrained by gloves for several weeks; four women ditto, to prevent attempts on life and for surgi- cal reasons. Seclusion. 16 occasions of seclusion. One patient drowned while on a pic-nic to the coast. Employment. Men, 53 on the land, 18 at trades and 77 assist in various ways ; women, 45 work in the laundry, 16 in the kitchens, 70 in housework, 85 in needle-work and knitting; total, 148 men and 216 women ; 57.3 per cent men employed. Amusements. Out-door games in summer and pic nic parties ; two billiard tables here, cards and draughts. Exercise. No reference to exercise. Cumberland and Westmoreland Asylum. Patients. 227 men and 210 women ; total, 437; 65 recoveries. Attendants. 16 men, 13 women ; 1 to 15. Restraint. One man wearing jacket with sleeves; camisole; restraint had been resorted to on 63 occasions previously. Seclusion. 40 occasions for 1,231 hours of seclusion for violence. Employment. Men, on the land 108, and 163 men and women assist in various work; 27 in laundry; eight in kitchens; " a fair proportion elsewhere." Amusements and exercise. " With regard to walking, exercise and associate entertainments, there is nothing new to report." Only one medical assistant. Denbigh Asylum. Patients. 210 men and 210 women; total, 420 ; 4 recoveries. Attendants. 15 men and 16 women; 1 to 13£. Restraint. No restraint since last visit. Seclusion. 44 occasions of seclusion. One patient killed another by striking him on the head with a garden rake. Employment. No reference to employment. Amusements. Weekly dances and occasionally magic lantern. " Theatrical performances have never yet been tried." Exercise. 70 men and 60 women walk once a week beyond the grounds; "the exercise of the majority is limited to the airing courts." This asylum has only thirty-nine acres of land. 1173 Derbyshire Asylum. Patients. 205 men and 223 women ; total, 428 ; 81 recoveries ; 3 men and 5 women away on leave. Attendants. 15 men and 19 women; 1 to 12f. Restraint and seclusion. No mechanical restraint or seclusion since last visit. One case of rib fracture by a patient throwing another against a table;, one died from fractured ribs—injury inflicted by another patient. Employment, amusements, etc. "Employment, amusements and exercise of the patients are by no means overlooked." No par- ticulars. The commissioners recommend "the gradual substitution of modern for antiquated crib-bedsteads." Devon Asylum. Patients. 285 men and 479 women ; total, 764; 31 recoveries; 1 man and 1 woman absent on leave. Attendants. No reference to attendants. Restraints. No mechanical restraint since last visit of commis- sioners. Seclusion. Seclusion had been resorted to on 40 occasions. Employment. Men, 19 on the land; 24 with the gardener; 22 in trades; 60 on the wards; and 24 otherwise employed; women, 36 in the laundry; 15 in the kitchen ; 90 in sewing; 127 about the wards; total, 149 men, and 268 women; 52.2 per cent men em- ployed. Exercise. " 185 men and 320 women never go beyond the airing courts; 80 men, once a week, on Sunday, walk beyond the grounds; 50 women, once a week, on Sunday, walk beyond the grounds.'' Only one assistant physician. Another recommended. Large airing courts were being laid out. Dorset Asylum. Patients. 224 men and 269 women ; total, 493; 31 recoveries. Attendants. No reference to attendants. Restraint. 4 occasions of mechanical restraint of the hands for violence and destructiveness. Seclusion. Seclusion resorted to on 159 occasions. Employment. Men, on the land, 41 ; shops, 21 ; on the wards, 33; women, in the laundry, 34; kitchens, etc., 34; needle-work and knitting, 49; total, 95 'men and 117 women; 42.4 per cent men employed. , Amusements. 170 patients attend amusements m Recreation Hall, once a fortnight. Exercise. The commissioners say that exercise beyond the grounds is not frequent. Public objection is alleged to be made to 1174 taking patients on the roads. The commissioners recommend the construction of a walk around the boundary of the estate instead of having the patients strolling about the airing courts. Durham Asylum. Patients. 495 men and 275 women ; total, 770; 38 recoveries; 3 of each sex absent on leave. Attendants. 35 men and 24 women ; 1 to 13. Restraint and seclusion. No reference made. Employment. Of employment the commissioners say "useful employment of the patieuts is as heretofore reported." Amusements. Weekly entertainment in the hall. Exercise. 152 men and 177 women walk one day \m the week beyond the airing courts. Essex Asylum. Patients. 360 men, 442 women ; total, 802 ; 123 recoveries. Attendants. 30 men and 41 women ; 1 to 11-f. Restraint. 35 are in mechanical restraint by the vest on 35 occa- sions, one for surgical reasons and 34 for determined attempts at suicide. Seclusion. ' 56 occasions of seclusion. Employment. Men, on the land, 75 ; tradesmen, 37 ; kitchen, laundry and ward, 99 ; women, laundry, 31 ; kitchen, 14; ward, 71; knitting and needle-work, 96 ; total, 211 men and 212 women; 58.9 per cent men employed. Amusements and exercise. No reference made. Glamorgan Asylum. ^"Patients. 303 men and 280 women; total, 583 ; 31 recoveries. Attendants. 24 men and 25 women ; 1 to 12. Restraint. No restraint on the records. Seclusion. Two cases of seclusion for violence. Employment. " The employment records show no diminution in the numbers last reported ; " no particulars. Amusements. Weekly entertainments in the hall; lawn tennis, pic-nics, school class twice a week and singing once a week. Exercise. 96 men and 100 women go beyond the grounds once a week ; complaint is made of strangers overlooking the patients in the airing courts; additional land recommended to keep them further off. Gloucester Asylum. Patients. 311 men and 358 women ; 73 recovered. Attendants. 24 men and 27 women ; 1 to 13. Restraint and seclusion. Of restraint and seclusion the commis- 1175 sioners sayj. " These modes of treatment have been sparingly used since the last visit; " restraint in one case to prevent self-mutila- tion ; seclusion on 31 occasions. One man died from fractured ribs, from struggle with attendants ; one man died from being gored by a boar. Employment. Men, 57 on the land : 31 in the shops ; 10 in the ' laundry ; 58 in the house ; women, 38 in the laundry ; 65 in other work ; total, 156 men and 103 women ; 50 per cent of men employed. Amusements. Weekly dancing. Exercise. In the winter 75 and in the summer 85 of each sex walk beyond the grounds weekly or oftener in fine weather. Hants Asylum. Patients. 335 men and 381 women ; total, 716; 44 recoveries. Attendants. Report says: " Attendants are sufficient in num- ber, being in increase since the last visit." Number not given. Restraint. One woman in a straight jacket and in bed in a most excited condition, who some time ago bit off one of her fingers. Four cases of mechanical restraint for persistent attempts at self- injury. Seclusion. 72 occasions of secb;sion. Case of suicide. Man out at large who placed himself before a railway train. Employment. Men, 36 on the land; 26 in the shops ; women, 57 in the laundry; 9 in the kitchen; 137 in needle-work, and others help- ing in the wards; total, 150 men and 272 women; 44.6 per cent of men employed. Amusements. "The usual arrangements continue." Theyare not described. Exercise. Nothing said about exercise. Hereford Asylum. Patients. 142 men and 177 women ; total, 319 ; 38 recovered. Attendants. 14 men and 14 women ; 1 to 11£. Restraint and seclusion. No reference made. Employment. 117 men and 125 women are "employed in va- rious ways; " 82.3 per cent of men employed. Amusements. Entertainments as heretofore; no particulars. Exercise. No reference made. Barming Heath Asylum. Patients. 531 men and 683 women; total, 1,214; 149 recov- eries. ' , Attendants. 122 attendants—the number of each sex not given ; 1 to 9. Restraint. One person had been restrained to prevent self-mu- tilation. 1176 Seclusion. 60 cases of seclusion. Dr. Davies adds: "Nearly all were secluded in the blue-room, from which he reports * fair re- sults.' " lie has "no faith in the red-room seclusion." Mention is also made of a padded room. One woman a CU ft CU 02 CU Xi o u O u < CU X> S CU > o 55 CU S CU o CU Q s) 3 a S3 !-. 03 3 — o s- "u p. < From No. 12 to No. 3.. From No. 12 to No. 4.. 1 1 1 ... 1 1 1 From No. 12 to No. 5.. 1 1 1 1 2 2 1 2 2 2 1 2 1 4 2 1 n 9 2 2 1 §1 6 2 3 2 3 2 9 2 4 11 7 4 1 5 1 1 2 *"*2 3 2 3 "ti" 5 1 1 1 111 7 Died................. *1 4 8 3 7 *H. S. Benson, paresis. + A. McCan, erysipelas. JE. Sullivan, congestion of lungs. §J. G. Geib, peritonitis. ||M. W. Heath, uraemia. 1fH. McCabe, paresis. 1199 EXHIBIT No. 22. Deaths on Tenth Ward from March 3, 1873, to July 14, 1876. E. M. Anderson, January 15, 1874, paresis. C. Mundion, June 19, 1874, cardiac disease. S. A. Rogers, January 17, 1876, Bright's disease A. Day, February 20, 1876, exhaustion. D. Pringle, March 13, 1876, suicide. EXHIBIT No. 25. Statement. Sugar: 1881, 49,198 pounds ; amount paid, $4,454.48 ; average, 9 cents. 1882, 48,428 pounds ; amount paid, $4,426.44 ; average, 94, cents. Lambs: 1881, number, 426 ; amount paid, $2,264 ; average, $5.31. 1882, number, 411; amount paid, $2,323.50; average, $5.65. : Sheep: 1881, 21,755 pounds; amount paid, $1,425.40 ; average, 64, cents. 1882, 41,915 pounds; amount paid, $3,129.10 ; average, 74, cents. Flour: 1881, 8624, barrels ; amount paid, $5,509.61; average, $6.38. 1882, 8624, barrels; amount paid, $6,739.54 ; average, $7.81. | "Butter: 1881, 36,2084, pounds ; amount paid, $9,914.81 ; average, 274, cents. 1882, 22,912f pounds ; amount paid, $9,468.03; average, 28 | cents. i Beef cattle: ' 1881, 306,555 pounds ; amount paid, $16,313.68; average, 54, cents. ' 1882, 297,840 pounds; amount paid, $19,205.70; average, 64, cents. 120C .[Copy.] EXHIBIT No. 26. The N. Y. Statfi Lunatic Asylum, To J. G. Egert, Dr. 1883. March 3, To 3 barrels oat-meal, at $7.75.............. $23 25 March 20, 2 barrels D oat-meal, at $7.75........... 15 50 March 20, 1 barrel common salt.................. 1 00 March 31, 2 barrels D oat-meal, at $7,75.......... 15 50 K $55 25 [Copy.] EXHIBIT No. 27. The N. Y. State Lunatic Asylum, To Head & Winston, Dr. 1883. June 1, 1 barrel Pillsbury's best flour, $8; 919 mid- dlings, $1.15, $10.57............................ $18 57 June 13, 1 barrel pastry, $6.75 ; June 23, 3 barrels Pillsbury's flour, $8, $24.......................... 30 75 June 23, 1 barrel salt, $1; June 29, 1 barrel pastry, $6.75 ; 1 barrel oat-meal, $8....................... 15 75 July 11, 3 bags, 25 cents, 75 cents; 74,4, bushels beans, $2.50, $17!94......,...........-...:............ 18 69 July 21, 1 barrel salt, 95 cents; 1 barrel Quaker oat- meal, $8...................................... 8 95 July 23, 2 boxes evap. apples, 84 pounds net, 124/ cents. 10 50 July 26, 2 barrels Y beans, 290-19 (each) 542 pounds, 8|| bushels, $2.75.............................. 24 54 July 26,1 barrel salt, 95 cents ; 27, 1 barrel solar salt, $1.20, 1 barrel common salt, 95 cents.............. 3 10 July 27, 1 barrel pastry, $6.75 ; Aug. 7, 1 case apples, 50 pounds, 16 cents, $8.......................... 14 75 Aug. 14, 1 barrel pastry, $6.50 ; 24, 830 middlings, $1.15, $9.55.................................... 16 05 Aug. 27, 1 barrel pastry, $6.50; 1 barrel tine salt, $1.. 7 50 $169 15 1201 EXHIBIT No. 27a. Drugs and Liquors for year ending September 30, 1883. 1882. Nov. 10, Caswell, Hazzard & Co., drugs.............. $8 25 1883. Jan. 3, A. L. Woodruff, whisky, etc.................. 587 75 Jan. 9, E. R. Squibb, drugs, etc..... ............... 225 73 Jan. 17, Chas. Killgore, drugs, etc.................. 61 01 Jan. 22, Daniel Lawrence & Son, rum............... 82 00 Feb. 17, C. H. Williamson, drugs................... 27 36 Feb. 17, Butler & Hamilton, drugs.................. 18 27 Feb. 19, W. Blaikie, drugs......................... 25 51 i April 5, Chas. Killgore, drugs...................... 96 88 \ April 6, C. H. Williamson, drugs................... 61 30 April 6, Butler & Hamilton, drugs.................. 12 00 April 6, Wm. Blaikie, drugs........................ 30 97 April 7, McQuade, Bros., liquors................... 189 20 April 13, Caswell, Hazzard & Co., drugs............ 56 84 May 9, E. R. Squibb, drugs........................ 290 86 June 14, Killgore's drug store, drugs................ 55 34 June 28, McQuade Bros., whisky, etc................. 840 65 July 10, Butler & Hamilton, drugs.................. 15 33 July 10, C. H. Williamson, drugs................... 55 77 July 10, Wm. Blaikie, drugs....................... 120 22 July 16, A. L. Woodruff, wine..................... 690 26 Aug. 9, E. R. Squibb, drugs....................... 99 54 Sept. 13, Killgore drug store, drugs................. 30 80 Sept. 14, McQuade Bros., whisky.'... .■................ 402 50 Sept. 13, Butler & Hamilton, drugs................. 20 95 ' Sept. 18, C. H. Williamson, drugs................... 48 58 Sept. 26, Blaikie & Fitch, drugs.................... 56 57 Groceries for the year ending September 30, 1883. 1883. Feb. 17, Job Parker's Sons, groceries................ 211 33 Feb. 17, Butler ical and mental strength ; has a very fair appreciation of his con- dition: moved to No. 3, on account of improvement. March 25. Moved to two, on account of continued favorable convalescence; has received several visits from friends. April 3. Yisited by wife who complained to patient of how badly things were going at home in his absence ; told wife that he had eaten when every thing tasted , like a chip, and that he had appeared as well as possible so as to fool • the doctors. 4. Emotional, cries, wrings his hands, moans and K groans; asks to be sent home. 5. Sent to No. 8; was noisy last ■ night; is excitable, noisy and maniacal; put on morph. bromid. P gr. 1-4, milk punch ter die. 7. Is very emotional, crying and [ laughing; walks about the ward, pounds on the door, opposes and resists care ; is quite maniacal; will not stay in bed ; put on hyos- »■ cyajnine gr. 1-8 and placed in covered bed; has been restrained to 1'chair portion of past two days, on account of extreme restlessness. .9. Placed in camisole, on account of his violent and unprovoked attacks on patients and attendants; is destructive of clothing. 10. kls more quiet; camisole removed, restrained with belt; same maniacal conduct; pulse 116; tongue dry and coated; punch and morphia . discontinued and hyoscyamine increased to gr. 1-6. 12. Is out of re- ;'• straint to-day ; is more quiet under the influence of medicine. 13. Is manifesting considerable self-control; hyoscyamine discontinued in morning; tonic 3 ss. given ter die. 11. This morning had a paroxysm ; of extreme restlessness ; placed in camisole which he wore most of the forenoon. 21. Has remained in much the same excitable, i maniacal state ; has a portion of the time required restraint by cami- sole, and a portion of the time by belt. May 1. Was brought a suit of clothing by Mr. Wheeler ; after trying it on became very maniaeal; \ attacked every one within reach. May 12. Still on eight; no mental * change; is now taking hyoscyamine, \ grain, night and morn- , ing ; attacked patient B + l under the delusion that he was working : against him. June 2. Has become more quiet; hyoscyamine dis- j continued ; chloral, grs. xx, and tr. hyoscy. 3 ii, substituted at night. 5. Had a period of frenzy; requires restraint by camisole ; has de- lusion that attendant Williams has stabbed his wife ; is removed to : four, as he makes violent attacks on attendant at every opportunity ; W hyoscyamine again employed in place of chloral and hyoscy. 8. P-Has been wearing wristlets for past three days to control his vio- lence ; is failing in flesh and strength ; tonic discontinued, and punch substituted. 9. Yery destructive , tears clothing and bedding ; made a sudden and unprovoked attack on M., breaking his ndse; pounded his own head and face against the chair, bit his cheeks and lips till 1204 they bled.* 11. Is not eating well; says food is poisoned ; put on extra diet ; is failing in strength. 12. Takes food only as it is put to his mouth, and mostly liquid diet; pulse feeble, tongue coated, teeth covered by sordes, right cheek swollen and tender, the result of the pounding inflicted by self on 9th ; is now wearing restraint (camisole) to prevent attempts at self-injury : resists all attempts to examine cheek. 16. Is quite weak ; still requires to have food ad- ministered to him ; all medicine but punch discontinued ; placed on chloral, grs. xx, tr. hyos. 3 ii? nocte. 17. Swelling decreased on face; as careful an examination of jaw as possible in patient's excitable state, fails to reveal any thing but swelling and ecchymosis. 18. Is kept in bed on account of prostration ; is eating better; is wearing wristlets day and night to prevent self-injury and destruc- tiveness. 20. Still sick in bed to-day ; took food voluntarily for the first time; an examination of the jaw, which is for the first time permitted without resistance, reveals a fracture of the coronoid pro- cess of right side lowTer jaw ; the swelling has almost wholly subsided; adhesive straps and bandage applied ; on liquid diet, eggs, beef-tea, etc. 29. Small abscess at angle of injured jaw opened to-day; is gaining in strength ; quiet, but incoherent and emotional. July 1. Abscess still discharging ; no marked deformity of jaw. 4. Profuse discharge from abscess; swelling decreasing though extremely tender on pressure. July 6. Removed to No. 7 ; has been sleeping in open bed since June 26. July 9. Jaw again examined to-day; several roots of teeth removed ; abscess still discharging; the coronoid process is drawn up and away from ramus; patient very emotional and easily excited. 15. Removed to No. 5 ; makes mys- terious motions and signs, and when questioned says " you know." 16. Warns the doctor against Supervisor Jones, whom he thinks in- tends to injure him (the doctor). 21. Has a slight diarrhoea ; extra diet, thickened milk and diarrhoea mixture; is anxious to employ himself, and is allowed to sweep ward, etc. 30. Milk punch discon- tinued ; tonic, 3 ss ter die. August 16. Was visited by Mr. Wheeler a few days ago; maintained good self-control during the brief visit, but for two days subsequent was emotional and excited ; threw his slippers out of the window ; was talkative and incoherent; is now quiet. August 18. Abscess on jaw opened and is discharging again. 31. Tonic discontinued. September 11. Works out; helps make roads, and in the garden. 18. Small pieces of bone had necrosed and discharged through abscess on cheek. 24. Chloral discontinued ; is cheerful and contented. 26. Hyoscyamus discontinued. 30. Talkative and emotional; complaining of pain in head ; on bromide of potash, grs. xx, fl. ext. ergot, 3 ss, ter die. October 1. Much dis- turbed by a visit from a friend who came at wife's request; sleep- less; chloral, grs. xx, tr. hyos. 3 ii, resumed; has asthma. 5. Is now quiet again ; asthma relieved ; appears feeble minded. 13. Is becoming more quiet and less emotional, and assists in the care of the farden. 20. Sent to No. 6 for trial. 23. Tr. hyos. discontinued. Tovember 16. Pot. brom. discontinued; sits in room for the most 1205 part ; has periods of crying ; manifests no interest in himself or sur- roundings, and does not employ himself in any way. December 2. Has the delusion that Supervisor Jones is working against him, and Dr. Josselyn, and makes signs with hands and shakes his he^d when talking about the matter ; sent to seven, and pot. brom. renewed. 11. Is more cheerful and happy; cries less ; sent to five. January 18, 1881. Bromide of potash and ergot discontinued. February 3. Coherent; neat and tidy ; eats and sleeps well; ex- presses no delusive ideas, but is somewhat emotional and laughs and cries easily ; assists in the care of the ward ; sent to three because of improvement, March 2. Convalescing favorably ; all medicine dis- continued ; assists Mr. Brady in the wood-house. 9. Sent to one because of improvement; is less emotional and is gradually gaining in mental strength. April 1. Continues to employ himself regularly; eats and sleeps well, and is in good flesh and strength; realizes that he has been insane, and says he is very thankful for what has been done for him ; says if he hurt any one when he was maniacal, he is I, sorry, and hopes no permanent injury will follow; says he will always remember the Asylum with gratitude. 20. Is fast becoming established in mental and physical health ; Mrs. Penny is written that he may go home on the 30th. April 30, 1881. Discharged ! 'recovered and went home with Mrs. Penny and Mr. Wheeler. Compared with records, correct. E. N. BRUSH. • "A." Unadilla Forks, Otsego County, N. Y., ) February 21, 1880. J Doctor John P. Gray : Giles A. Penny, aged 36 years, married ; has four children ; occu- pation, farmer ; education, fair ; is a professor of religion ; habits, good ; uses tobacco; born in Plainfield, Otsego county ; residence same place ; predisposing and exciting causes use of tobacco; bad stomach and religious excitement; he is of nervous temperament, kind disposition ; his own father was an inmate of your Asylum ; he is ; troubled with asthma, and frequently has an attack at night and cannot lie in a reclining position ; the first disturbance of his mind noticed was about the third of February inst,, and at times since on the sub- ject of religion, until 16th inst. and 19th inst., had a raving attack, which required several attendants ; never was in the Asylum ; he has made no attempts to destroy either himself or others; he ate pretty regular, sleeps some; is not noisy or boisterous, except when his attacks come on, which is sometimes once or twice in a day ; he is { cleanly and is attentive to the calls of nature ; having been acquainted '* with him several years, I think that the condition of his stomach and the use of tobacco has much to do with his present condition, and as a friend and one of the family, I would request that especial care be Arprpiqpfl in reference to the attacks of asthma, especially when it ocZat night. CHARLES J. WHEELER. !-V 1206 Memoranda showing the wards Giles A. Penny was on from the date of his admission, February 21, 1880, to his discharge, April 30, 1881, the persons who visited him and the occasions: February 21, 1880, sent to the seventh ward ; February 25, on seventh ward, received call from gentleman. February 26, 1880, transferred to No. 6 ; March 2, on sixth ward, sister, daughter, and two gentlemen ; March 10, on sixth ward, wife, child and gentleman. March 11, 1880, transferred to No. 3; March 16, on 3, son, two brothers-in-law, nephew and gentleman ; March 20, on 3, sister; March 22, on 3, gentleman ; March 23, on 3, wife and daughter. March 25, 18S0, transferred to No. 2 ; March 27, on 2, two gen- tlemen ; March 30, on 2, a gentleman ; April 3, on 2, wife, April 6, 1880, transferred to No. 8; May l,on 8, Mr. Wheeler. June 5, Is80, transferred to No. 4. July 6, 1880, transferred to No. 7. July 15, 1880, transferred to No. 5 ; August, 1880, visited by Mr. Wheeler, on fifth ward; September 29, 1880, fifth ward, Mr. Wheeler and daughter ; October 14, 1880, on fifth ward, gentleman. October 20, 1880, transferred to No. 6 ; November 6, 1880, sixth Ward, brother and sister; November 12, 1880, sixth ward, gentle- man. . December 2, 1880, transferred to No. 7. December 11, 1880, transferred to No. 5; December 21, 1880, fifth ward, brother-in-law; January 18, 1881, fifth ward, sister. February 3, 1881, transferred to No. 3 ; February 16,1881, third ward, wife, brother-in-law, nephew; February 22, 1881,third ward, cousin, nephew and gentleman ; March 1, 1881, third ward, brother- in-law ; March 9, 1881, third ward, brother-in-law. March 9, 1881, transferred to No. 1 ; March 12, 1881, first ward, gentleman ; March 15, first ward, wife and two children ; March lo, 1881, first ward, wife and two children; March 26, 1881, first ward, Mr. Noble;'April 5,1881, first ward, VV. Dye; April 22, 1881, first ward, Mr. and Mrs. Brown and Mr. Lake. Discharged April 30, 1881. EXHIBIT No. 29. Case of Miss Lathrop. Clarissa C. Lathrop, Rochester, Monroe county. Admitted Octo- ber 19, 1880; age thirty -three; spinster; school-teacher: academic education ; Episcopalian; good habits ; native, of New York ; no insane relations ; date of attack, February, 1880; duration, nine months ; first attack ; first admission ; neither suicidal or homicidal; eyes blue; tongue moist and clean; pulse ninety six, weak and com- pressible ; heart and lungs normal; menstruation regular; is in fair flesh; cause of insanity ill-health from overwork ; form of insanity r 1207 sub-acute mania. Correspondent, Miss Nellie Lathrop (sister), Jones street, Rochester. Order of indigence issued by W. C. Row- ley, county judge ; medical certificates made by Drs. P. Neefus and J. G. Hunt; certified by W. C. Rowley, county judge of Monroe county ; brought to the Asylum by Dr. P. Neefus ; record of admis- sion made by Dr. Blumer. " Although the history of this case given by the patient's sister in the annexed letter conveys the idea of recent insanity it seems more than probable that it dates from last February when she left off teaching school. Oppressive headache, numbness of the left arm, wakefulness and general uneasiness were complained of at this time, and there was also an inability to fix the attention, such that she was obliged to discontinue her study of languages." The assertion of Dr. P. Neefus that she had been "a little off" for several months supports this view ; she has been treated by electri- cians, and has herself used a h .tteiy under their directions. Oh Sep- tember 6 she resumed her duties at the school-room, but only for a week or ten days when she returned home, and expressed her con- [ viction that teaching injured her circulation. About this time she conceived a strong dislike to a boarder in the family, imagining that she came between her and her lover, and acciising her of intercept- - ing his letters ; a suspicion for which there is no foundation in fact. On October 8 she began to lose appetite, took an electric bath, vom- ited and complained of feeling sticky ; in the night she took a bottle of hypophosphites to her room and hid it away, and on the Monday morning following took this and some hop tea to a chemist to have them analyzed, asserting that she felt confident that she had been poisoned. Her next freak was to consult a lawyer, and write page after page descriptive of her many symptoms; suspicion of poison- ing increased. Under the delusion that her clothing was saturated with something -t of the nature of phosphorus," she removed it [' frequently and used ammonia, soap and other alkalies as "antidotes." The patient is naturally of a nervous, sensitive and excitable tem- perament. Her sister knows of no exciting cause, except that it be "an overdose of electricity, more than she could sustain." The pa- tient is free to converse in the office, and reiterates her delusions in regard to poisoning by phosphorus, and the machinations of the lady boarder ; other delusive ideas are also elicited ; she scouts the idea of insanity; she is coherent and precise in language and ladylike in deportment. Letter of Miss Nellie C. Lathrop to Dr. Gray: an account of case': Rochester, October IS. Dr. Gray : Dear Sir — I trust you will find the inclosed history of my s sister coherent and satisfactory ; my nerves are unstrung and my heart wrung with sorrow at this calamity so suddenly fallen upon • us, and I "do so trust that you can assure us there is hope, after you have thoroughly examined her case; I don't know but I have 1208 omitted, really, the most important information, and add, therefore, here, that she has complained of a pressure on her brain or a burn- ing pain on the left side of her head a great deal ever since February and also complained of numbness in her left arm and hand, waking in the night to slap and rub her arm ; her sleep for a long time has been disturbed, wakeful and uneasy, though she has never gotten up to wander about the house; her life and health is very precious to us; there are but few of us and we have never been separated and so sad it is to be obliged to put her in confinement among unconge- nial elements, for she has only been accustomed to refined and cul- tured society, and she is so winning and sane on every other topic; is it well for us to write to her and will she be encouraged to write to us; if you will give me her attendant's address I would like to know from her what more she needs besides the supplies we have sent; our father was General William E. Lathrop, a highly respected Free Mason standing at the head of all of the degrees in this State; he died three years last April; I mention this as you may have known of him, perhaps been personally acquainted with him. Please write as early as possible, especially if you can give us hope of her eventual recovery. Respectfully yours, Miss NELLIE C. LATHRCP. 38 Jones st., Rochester, N. Y. Dr. Gray : History. Clara C. Lathrop, age 33, born in Rochester, N. Y., of American parents : no insanity developed in progenitors on either side of the family ; no tendency to intemperance or dissipation in any of the relatives; she inherits, however, a highly sensitive and nervous temperament; she has a luxury-loving nature and life has been a disappointment to her in that she has been obliged to maintain herself and help toward supporting other members of the family through the failure in business of her father ; she has naturally a very bright, cheerful disposition, fond of society and amusements; she was never married, although several times engaged; the last gentle- man to whom she was engaged died some eight years since and his death did not seem to affect her seriously; she has re- ceived attentions since from other gentlemen ; she has always been perfectly correct in her deportment; she had a good education; graduate of the free academy, and later studied languages, Gernmn and French ; she has taught school since she was twenty years old ; seemed interested in her occupation and was really a very successful teacher, though at the same time feeling that it was very hard that she was obliged to do it; she left school last February temporarily, but was never ready to return to her duties; thought herself liable to have heart disease or threatened with paralysis, and placed herself under treatment of some lady electricians and supplied herself with a battery which she has used all these months under their direction; 1209 she went into school, September 6, 1880, and taught for a little over a week, seeming better and more like herself than usual; her judg- ment good and she appeared interested, but suddenly when all looked 'hopeful she received a letter sympathizing with her, and wishing she need not teach for a month or two longer, etc.; she left school immediately, and thought what she had already taught had injured her circulation and made her worse; about this time she took a dis- ' like to a lady boarding in the family and wished to have her sent away, etc. ; October 9, her appetite seemed to fail somewhat, and on taking an electric bath was sick at her stomach and threw off the contents, and complained of feeling sticky, her hands, etc.; the fol- lowing day she seemed very quiet, remained at home (complained of great thirst and drank a considerable water) until about three p. m. she took a ride in street car and enjoyed it; in the night she came down, this seemed to be the first decided demonstration of mania, and took a bottle of hypophosphites of lime and soda (she had been taking for a strengthening tonic) up into her room and hid it away ; Sun- day she appeared sane enough, but early Monday morning she rushed " off without her breakfast taking the aforesaid tonic and some hop tea to a chemist to have them examined as she felt sure they had been poisoned; she went to consult a lawyer and wrote hundreds of pages as to her symptoms, etc., took electric treatments from the afore-mentioned electricians, and spent the night with a friend who I am quite sure saw no signs of derangement; spent Tuesday in a similar manner consulting her medical adviser and her lawyer, and writing on the same topic ; returned home Tuesday evening by their advice and then for the first time told us what she,had done, and that she suspected the lady boarder as having poisoned her, giving her rea- sons therefor; Wednesday the same, only she took to washing her hair and head in strong ammonia, and rubbing herself with soda and soap as disinfectants, taking off her underclothing frequently and chang- ing because they were saturated with poison ; Friday morning after a wakeful night she decided that lock and key could not keep the evil influence out, and left again to go to the .electrician's office where they gave her another bath which affected her stomach as before; she wrote nearly all day and toward evening she went to the house of a distinguished judge where she has since remained ; she feels safe there, but is constantly working to disinfect herself ; we had a regular physician see her on Tuesday and to-day, Sunday, October 17, but the medicines seemed to become infected in a short time; on every other topic she is perfectly sane and her memory of past events good; know of no immediate exciting cause of this sudden attack un- less, as we think now, she had an overdose of electricity, more than she could sustain ; we have tried to influence her medical advisers, but they constantly assured us that no harm could result, and that it was helping her; we could not influence her to keep away from them or omit her daily treatment; while her appetite held good it did not ;. seem to injure her so much, but she scarcely ate any thing from I" middle of week before last (that is from October 7), the latter part 152 U b 1210 of the time while at home became fearful of poison ; her appetite has been good and she has eaten freely, and slept some since she has been away from home; she has naturally a very lively, excitable imagination which we have always endeavored to keep in check; she is a member of the Protestant Episcopal church, and a regular attendant until last February when she ceased teaching, and since she has often attended a portion of the service, attending communion service as late as October 3 ; if there are any other points I will add them later. Her sister, Nellie C. Lathrop. One thing more, however, I will mention. She has had a book of anatomy and a pamphlet describing all manner of diseases and their symptoms, and comparing her sensations and taking on her own responsibility homoeopathic remedies recommended so that her mind has for a long time been dwelling on herself almost exclusively con- nected with various diseases. Also she read a book this summer wherein a woman entering a family disguised as a servant, adminis- tered the poison, digitalis, to a number of the family. This she, it proves, has been taking for palpitation of the heart. This has occu- pied her mind nearly all summer, although at the same time she has called on friends and enjoyed visiting them, etc., but has inclined to talk to them a great deal about her feelings, etc. N. C. L. After the patient had given her account of her own case and symp- toms to Dr. Gray, he requested her to write them out, which she did, October 25, 1880. They are as follows: " Symptoms of first attacks I have had at intervals during the past eight months, relieved instantly by vapor baths ; stupor (perfectly conscious all the time); mottled complexion; fixed expression of eyes; set teeth; weakness and trembling of limbs; no appetite; extra nervousness; increased action of saliva; great activity of kid- neys ; looseness of bowels ; some pain at base of brain ; extreme sen- sitiveness of auditory nerve so that I have been unable to hear music during the greater part of time, although very fond of it; weak and uncertain utterance; indisposition to exertion ; feeling of suffocation and desire for air; chilliness; falling sensation to leftside; coldness of extremities ; cold sweat; impossibility to read or write; these effects I believe due to slow poison ; have no knowledge of the symp- toms of poison; only know that digitalis, when used as slow poison, acts directly upon the brain and nervous system; was perfectly able to attend to my daily avocation until this person entered our house the Thursday previous to my leaving school; never had anything similar in my life or required medical (attendance until the ten days previous to my coming to this institution; while away from home at different times, recovered completely ; one week after my return, these symptoms reappeared." Will you be so kind as to compare these symptoms critically with those of slow poison % 1211 " Symptoms of two violent attacks during the ten days previous to I ?? c°mmg here, which I believe due to active poison ; clinching sensation at base of bram and root of nose; pain between shoulders ana across end of spine; livid complexion and fixed expression; in- Ifcreasea action of saliva ; pain in hip bones running down the limbs; i parai:ytlc P'»n m joints with numbness of extremities, etc.; nausea ; stickiness of body ; weak, trembling limbs; great thirst." Meet of the vapor bath — first attack produced running at the nose and vomiting m eight minutes, followed by great weakness and ' prostration. Effect of vapor bath, second attack, produced increased stickiness, running at eyes and nose, faintness, nausea, desire but im- possibility to vomit; desire, but impossibility to urinate; intense thirst, constantly begging for water. My friends, the electricians, *.worked over me about one-half hour this first attack. The second time at least three-quarters of an hour, and I think longer. This they will testify, I am sure, before any tribunal in the land. They ac- knowledged to me since that they had saved my life. Compared and correct. T. E. McGARR. History in the Asylum. Sent to No. 2, October 20, 1880. Says the medicine (chloral) given at bedtime produced the same train of toxic symptoms; does not willingly comply with the rules of the house; speaks of her superior refinement and culture, and of the society to which she 1ms been used, and expatiates on her many symptoms. 21. Com- municative as before; not depressed; asks to be allowed to adopt her " neutralizing " treatment by means of ammonia. 22. Writes an exhaustive letter to one Mrs. Greenleaf, using a very stilted style of compo-ition; compares herself to a tree stripped of its leafy mantle, and exposed to the rude and chilling blasts ; " the special treatment," she writes, "seems to be a direct opposition to one's simplest desires ; this, to one who has been accustomed to influenc- ing or controlling others, is far from agreeable; * * * to be told that you are insane when realizing yourself in the full possession of all your faculties ; what is the result? I go through the same proces- ses that I have been subjected to for the past year and a half, in all its miserable details, only with additional pain ; I recall, analyze, review; I question my own identity; is the sun that I see shining before me ; do I hear ? am I in full possession of all my senses? I sit down to the table with what, from their appearance, might be an army of servant girls ; * * * all this, to a person of my fastidious tastes, is not enjoyable ; immediately on my anival 1 suffered from the same kind of an attack I was afflicted with at different, times during the past eight months — stupor, chilliness, .constant urination, etc.; at first, as usual, I did not realize my condition, but afterward I decided that either Dr. Neefus had given it to me to produce that condition in me, or the doctors here had given me digitalis or medicine as a test; * * * how I long for my battery to-day, for I well know 1212 from past experience that in fifteen minutes I could relieve this burning in my head instantly ; if I could only have it here, and re- lieve not only myself, but some of the poor unfortunates I see suffering around me, I would bless the day I entered these walls; I believe the day will yet come when electricity will be used as a cura- tive agent in all brain and nervous affections ; * * * if my depart- ure was the signal for the explosion of the train that I have laid I am thankful : let justice do its perfect work ; do, my dear friend, inform me if the test has been proved, as I have every reason to be- lieve it has ; I hope I may have an opportunity to inform the doctors of all the circumstances, then tliere may seem method in my mad- ness ; * * * write to E. S. Putnam, 326 Broadway, care Tifft, Gris- wold & Co. ; tell him all the circumstances — that I am here suffer- ing in his behalf; * * * I remember Dr. Russell's words, that I should remain here until cured (meaning until I give up the idea of poisoning) ; what is the inference ; that these walls may be a living tomb to inclose the free and reasoning spirit; I am thankful to escape from all thought of this matter, but to have one's will and movements fettered, above all, one's reason questioned, this is unendurable." November 1, 1880. Patient exercises great self-control, and is grad- ually adapting herself to her surroundings; does not speak of de^ lusions. December 1. Has improved in general health, and is somewhat more comfortable mentally; moved to 1. January 6, 1881. Importunes»medical officers to obtain her release from confine- ment, alleging that she is wrongfully held; considers herself ill-used in many ways, and regards herself far superior, socially and otherwise, to her present surroundings ; affects a stilted style in her letters, discussing somewhat abstruse themes in a would-be learned and philosophical manner. January 13. To-day, informed Dr. Blumer that a few weeks before admission her feet stuck to her shoes, and that the latter became of a brown color in consequence; that there was an oblong stain on her pillow cases ; that granules fell from her hair into the wash-basin. February"13. Writes letters to her family full of reproach, and that notwithstanding theirs to her are couched in terms of affection ; writes long letters to Dr. Gray, in which she clamors for freedom ; when told that she is insane, and her suspicions of po: oning, etc., are pointed out to her as proof of her insanity, she is willing to give them up, albeit she not infrequently speaks of her "symptoms" and the persecutions of the lady above referred to. February 6, 1881. Emphatically declared that she would not remain another day, and that she would make preparations for leaving immediately after dinner. 7. Remains in " deference to Dr. Gray/' who is absent. 10. Says she never believed that her clothes were poisoned ; only thought that the lady tried to make her feel uncomfort- able. 15. Handed letter to Mr. Corning, sergeant-at-arms of Senate committee. IS. Slipped a letter into the pocket of a visitor passing through ward, and, when detected by usher, snatched it out of visitor's hand and tore it up ; has attempted to send out letters by patients ; sent to 2 as a matter of expediency; to sleep in dormitory. Feb- r1213 ruary 27. Now has a single room. March 9,1881. Writes to brother: s "A letter was forwarded to me from home, purporting to be from you, which had been returned from dead-letter office in consequence of not having stamp. This letter seemed unaccountable to me at the time, and from experience since being here am more fully per- suaded that you never wrote this letter. It acknowledges the receipt of my three letters, but disclaims all knowledge of Mr. Putnam. It is written on ordinary letter paper, and I know you ahvays use business paper with name of firm at top of sheet, and'is without date of any kind The writing resembles Miss Flamlin's more than yours, and is written irregularly. You understand the correct use of the King's English ; this is unlike you both in spirit and expression ; viz., ' seek ,rest and consolation in religion, and learn to love your enemies and pray .for them, though I know it is hard to do.' * * * * I. feel that I need scarcely ask you if you wrote that nonsense." March 24, 1881. Frequently demands to be sent home, and appar- ently thinks there is no reason to prevent her going at any time she chooses to make the demand; considers herself justified'in her attempts to get out letters clandestinely by the alleged fact of f; her being here by the machinations of supposed enemies. April 16, 1881. Is still influenced by the delusions enumerated above, and believes that had she not been removed from home the analy- sis which she thinks she has instituted would have proved at- tempts to poison her. May 21, 1881. Talks less freely of her de- 1 fusions, but still asserts her belief in them when questioned; re- moved to No. 1. June 30, 1881. jStill speaks much of her fancied superiority over other patients, and in this way makes herself an- noying to some of them ; is easily drawn into conversation upon her so-called " symptoms " before coming to the Asylum, and details them quite fully ; refers to a peculiar color imparted to the water ou one occasion when she was washing her hair, and declares that her braid was sticky and unfit to wear, the result, she believes, of some application made by Miss Hamlin. July 20, 1881. Is quiet, orderly, lady-like; occupies herself in painting, under the guidance of Mrs. N. II. Cooke, a-fellow-patient. August 20, 1881. Has im- proved in flesh, and is in excellent health, " never having an ache or a pain;" apparently contented. October 6,1881. Will not drink tea or coffee unless she sees it poured out; says it is drugged. Oc- ' tober 31,1881. Occupies herself quite industriously in painting, and has made considerable progress in the art. December 18, 1881. Reads regularly to other patients, and has thus been engaged for some time; does not ask to go home or refer to her mental condi- tion ; busily occupied in preparing' Christmas cards of her own painting, to send to her friends. February 5, 1882. Continues to paint, and evinces a. lively interest in the pictures which she has been permitted to see in the stores and art galleries of the city. April 15, 188*2. Is averse to talking about her delusions; in her let- ters to her family is inclined to attribute her detention in the Asy- lum to a desire to gratify their sinister purposes, and makes fre- 1214 quent use of harsh expressions. June 12, 1882. Is still suspicious, and will not drink the first cup of tea or coffee which the attendant pours out; declines to give any reason for this. August 31, 1SS2 Said to Dr. Spencer, and has also said the same to Dr. Blumer, that the more she thinks of her condition previously to coming here the more convinced is she that attempts were made to poison her. Sep- tember 5, 1882. Was visited to-day and yesterday by her sister, Miss Nellie Lathrop, to whom she had intimated that unless she came to take her home she did not care to see her; received Miss Nellie quite coolly, and rehearsed her delusions of suspicion ; Miss X. in- formed Dr. Blumer that when she last visited her sister, she (the patient) was unwilling to kiss her, and was quite irresponsive; has to-day, however, received her better than yesterday. November 7, 1882. Has recently got out a letter clandestinely, but will not say how. (See clipping from New York Sun in case of J. B. Silkman, case- book 58, p. 20, to whom letter was written.) To-day received a letter from Dr. Steven Smith, Commissioner in Lunacy. Novem- ber 20,1882. Declares that she did notv say directly or indirectly that she was forced into companionship with the most repulsive and violent patients, as article in New York Sun states. Novem- ber 27, 18S2. Was visited to-day by Mr. James B. Silkman, who presented an order from Judge Barnard, granting him a private interview with Miss Lathrop as her attorney. Mr. Silk- man said he could have obtained a writ of habeas corpus in the case of Miss Lathrop, but preferred to have an interview with her, to satisfy himself that it.was proper to apply for one. He had an interview for nearly two hours but declined to state the con- clusidn to which he had arrived. Mr. Silkman, in talking with Dr. Brush, after the interview endeavored to gain some information upon the case. He asks if there had been any insinuations of indis- cretion on the part of Miss Lathrop with any man, or if the charges against her in any way involved a compromise of character. Dr. Brush replied that he did not propose to talk with Mr. Silkman upon the case; that so far as he knew or had heard Miss Lathrop was as pure a woman as lived. Beyond this Dr. Brush declined to go. In the afternoon following this visit, Dr. Brush had a conversation with Miss Lathrop, most of it being in the presence of Miss McBride, in which she said she held the same ideas regarding attempts to poison her, etc., as when admitted to the Asylum, and that her friends had treated her shamefully in sending her away before a test could be made. November 30, 1882. A writ of habeas corpus was served on Dr. Gray, last night, by Mr. Silkman, returnable at Poughkeepsie before Judge Barnard, at 10:30, December 9, prox. Mr. Silkman to- day had an interview with Miss Lathrop, lasting from 11:30 a. m. to 4:30 p. m. On leaving, Mr. Silkman suggested a compromise, and wanted to know whether the case could not quietly be taken before Judge Barnard, aud let him decide the ease upon its merits, without calling witnewsses, etc., to avoid publicity, newspaper notoriety, etc. December 1, 1882. Mr. Hoyt, a deputy of the superintendent of 1215 the poor of Monroe county, and keeper of the alms-house, came to- day with a letter from Superintendent McConegal, requesting the transfer of Miss Lathrop, Mary R. Quinn and Margaret Connors to the Monroe County Asylum. Mr. Hoyt wWtold of the previous service of the writ, and Managers Mc Quade and Swan were called in to consult upon the matter. The latter said that the managers could not refuse to deliver the patient, but if removed the superin- ■ tendent of the poor of Monroe county must take full responsi- bility in the matter, and answer the writ, and if left in the Asylum the county would be charged with the expense of answering the writ. Mr. Hoyt left Miss Lathrop and returned to Rochester for further deliberation. December 4, 1882. Writes to mother for clothing and money wherewith to make herself more presentable, and says : "If you have Charles Lathrop's and the Adams home '.' address, I should like them, as I intend to visit them after I leave Poughkeepsie. It is very painful to me to be forced into such a public position, but as I am not and never have been insane, I am willing to submit to any thing that will free me from such an impu- tation." December 6, 1882. Said to Dr. Gray this morning, that she had not changed her mind or feelings in any respect since her admission, that she adhered to every thing she had heretofore said or written ; that she had the same suspicions regarding attempts to poison her, which she had previously entertained and expressed ; that her poor physical condition on admission was, as she then believed, due to the action of poisons. She showed some disinclination to talk and said: " I don't know that you have any right to ask me those questions, and I shall be governed by the advice of my counsel." Dr. Gray replied : "I have not asked you about your counsel nor any questions about your condition wdiich I :■'■ have not a right to ask as having you under care." She said she had rich and influential friends who would look after her interests7 as she had ahvays moved in the best society ; she also said that the • doctors had tried to defame her character; Dr. Gray replied: "I presume you refer to what appeared in the newspapers ?" when Miss Lathrop answered : " No ; I refer to my counsel." To which Dr. Gray said : " Dr. Brush gives a very different version of the conver- sation with Mr. Silkman ; I don't think any physician has said a word against your character." Patient was shown letter from her brother, G. T. Lathrop, in which he acknowledges the authorship of the disputed letter to which reference has been made above. Said to Dr. Blumer : " It looks like his writing," but would not com- mit herself to a positive opinion upon the subject; she examined the letter very critically, noticing the printed names in the corner of the sheet as evidence of probable authenticity, but added : that those were not his I's and that she had so often been deceived in regard to letters, and that she could prove it; that it was no ' wonder she doubted now; when pressed for a definite opinion as to whether her brother actually wrote the questioned letter, her reply was : " Under some circumstances I believe it; under others I L \ 1216 might not believe it." Dec. 8. Leaves to-day for Poughkeepsie in charge of Dr. Brush and Mrs. Barker for hearing on writ of habeas corpus before Judge Barnard. For report of subsequent proceed- ings, etc., see newspaper clippings; was remanded to the Poughkeep- sie asylum on the 9th till the 20th, and on that date discharged by him. Discharged, December 8, 1882, unimproved. Compared and correct. T. E. McGARR. EXHIBIT No. 30. Case or Lucy M. Peck. Lucy M. Peck, Kirkland, Oneida county, New York ; admitted December 6,1869 ; number for year five; indigent; woman ; aged thirtv ; single; academic education; teacher; Congregationalist; good habits; native of New York; not hereditary. Patient was not strong until she arrived at the age of twelve; from that time until she was eighteen she enjoyed good health ; at eighteen she had measles; was very sick, and has never been well since; in less than a year she had difficulty with her eyes, her mother says the doctors called it aneurosis; the disorder lasted two years ; her eyes have never been as strong since; although she has been enabled to follow her profession; since the measles she has been very nervous and has never been strong. Four years ago she went down to Fortress Monroe to teach school; soon after going there she con- tracted intermittent fever, and returned home, where she was sick for some time; after recovering she went to Union Springs, Alabama, teaching, and again became sick and returned home much exhausted ; since that time she has been almost constantly sick ; has complained mostly of exhaustion; at times has been unable to com- plete her own toilet; after returning from Fortress Monroe she complained of pain in her right hip and groin ; it has caused her to Walk lame for some time ; seems to have recovered from that now; for the past two years it has been noticed that when she appeared to gain strength she became depressed and after being a few days depressed she was more than usually lively; she had not been con- sidered insane until within the past four months ; although last winter she had a spell away from home which lasted a few days and the people with whom she was stopping called her insane ; four months ago during her menstrual flow she went into the clothes-room and denuded herself; her mother discovered her and endeavored to have her come out of the room, but she would not, and it was neces- sary to bring her out by force; she was put on the bed, resisting constantly, but after being put on the bed she became quiet and continued in a sort of unconscious condition for twenty hours; she then sang three or four hours and began to abuse some relatives who 1217 came in to see her; after a day or two she became apparently well and continued so until the next menstrual period, when she went r through much the same scene, denuded herself; became somewhat noisy, and resisted having her clothes on ; after a few days she became quiet again and apparently rational. About two months ago had a more excitable period, destroying her clothing, broke a look- ing glass, and some pains of glass, became very abusive of her friends and mother; was obscene but not profane. , Last week she had another excitable period and for the first time gave evidence of delusion; said she was dead; had been dead since the death of her father; had been abused by her friends and family; had been starved, frozen and otherwise maltreated; became so violent that it was necessary to restrain her and she was tied into a chair; at times she has been*put in a chair and held there to prevent her running away; has been bruised in this way; was confined in a room once ; then' she destroyed her bedrclothing, tore the slats off the window and broke some furniture, emptied a feather pillow out of the window; for the past few weeks she has been more willful and headstrong and-more difficult to manage; mother says "that she could not con- trol her without abusing her, and she determined to bring her here ; " mother says that while she was south she contracted chronic diarrhoea, from which she has suffered; also that, while teaching in Alabama, she had insufficient food and a very poor quality ; was compelled to board in the family of a negro and partook of the coarsest food ; the menstrual flow is regular, and there is no menorrhagia ; has had leu- corrhcea, not lately ; the last flow was preceded by a greenish fluid, very offensive ; has usually slept well; appetite capricious, sometimes voracious; has never refused food longer than forty-eight hours ; is subject to attacks of diarrhoea ; comes willingly ; is not violent, not suicidal or homicidal; is only obstinate when resisted in any whim ; is emaciated; looks feeble; skin sallow; is anaemic; cause ill-health and deprivation ; form, sub-acute mania; date of attack, 1869 ; dura- tion, six months; first attack, first admitted ; brought by her mother, Lucina A. Peck, and Curtis Miller, Jr., and E. C. Bartholomew, on order of County Judge Joel Millard ; correspond with Mrs. Lucina A. Peck, Danesville, Oneida county; telegraph to Curtis Miller, Clinton, N. Y. December 7. Rested' well last night; this morning was noisy and destructive; broke glass ; took off shoes and stockings; sent to eighth hall. December 8. Talkative, incoherent; takes the restraint from violent patients; put in camisole. December 17. Is more quiet. December 29. Helps in hall a little and in dining- room. January 3. Says she owns the Asylum; says she will dis- charge the doctors; says' she will be " head idiot" herself. January 4, 1870? Climbs up on top of wardrobe and hides herself; picks her cloth- ing in pieces; noisy ; sent to 9. January 9. Tore her bed in pieces ; removed a lock from the bureau and tore up the carpet of her room. January 16. Mischievous, talkative, incoherent; deranges the rooms of other patients ; ordered to wear a muff for a time; takes off the restraint from violent and dangerous patients. March 4. 153 U » 1218 (W. K.) Talkative, noisy; annoys other patients and tries to get them in trouble in order to see them " fight it out." March 18. Last night tried to break out glass; put in muff; noisy all night. April 14. No especial change; at times noisy. August 2. Ex- citable ; tries to escape; ran from attendant; came to office; sat down in the lap of Dr. Andrews. September 5, 1870. Broke out window grating last night and eloped. September 7. Came back to Asylum with mother, who reports that she has behaved well at home and proposes to attempt her care there, to which the superin- tendent assented. Discharged improved. Lucy N. Peck, Kirkland, Oneida county ; readmitted September 27, 1871; number for year 449 ; pauper; woman ; age 32 ; single; academic education ; Congregationalist; good habits ; native, New York ; not hereditary. For former admission see C. B. 28, page 10; was discharged September 7, 1870; improved ; friends; mother says that patient was well from the time of discharge until a week or so ago ; then she became sick, and in a few days was dangerously ill ; the doctor who attended despaired of her life on Friday and Saturday last; on Monday or Tuesday showed the first indication of insanity ; Tuesday night started from home, and walked fourteen miles; came here Wednesday morning demanding to see Dr. Andrews, to whom she said she was married; was tired and thin clad ; sent to ward; is thin in flesh and anamiic ; mother says is subject to attacks of diar- rhoea, which are quite troublesome ; sent to No. 3, and put on tonic; cause, ill-health ; form, chronic mania ; date 1869; duration two years; first attack; second admission; came alone ; correspond with Mrs. Lucina Peck, Deansville; telegraph Curtis Miller, Clinton, N. Y.; order of Superintendent Owens received September 30, 1871. September 28. Says to Dr. Andrews that she is his wife and that the dress she has on, a calico one, is her wedding dress ; that the shoes are not fit for wedding shoes ; seized the doctor and was with some difficulty removed. 29. Suddenly dropped to the floor and kissed Dr. Andrews'' foot; put on tonics October 1; removed io No. 6, October 15 ; is very erotic ; seized the doctor's hand, raised her dress and tried to put it on her genitals; talks iu a very lascivious manner. October 20.. Decorates person ; talks foolishly. 26. Yis- ited by mother. 21. Sent to No. 9. November 12. Is very mis- chievous and troublesome, taking restraint from others; throwing things out of the windows. December 1. Is very lascivious in action; got into bed with another patient; imitated sexual inter- course; exposes person ; feels the genitals of other patients ; mas- turbates; in muff and anklets. January 10, 1872. Has gained in flesh and strength ; more quiet; no restraint. February 15. Is talk- ative ; lively; does not employ self. March 5. Still asserts she is Dr. Andrews' wife and addresses him as husband; tries to hold him and follow him from ward; in fair physical condition; still pale. January 12, 1873. No change since last note ; she retains same de- lusion about Dr. Andrews and the missionaries; is in fair flesh and [ 1219 strength ; on 10th ward. May 12. No change; writes to her mother once m a while ; has same delusions. August 16. - No"** change ; delusions fixed; in usual state of general health ; on 10th ward. No- vember 9. No mental change; on 10th ward. January 1, 1874. Retains all her delusions and is fully influenced by them ; has no appreciation of her condition ; only answers to the name of Mrs. Andrews.^ Marcli 31, 1875. On lObut has been on ward 8 a part of time since last note and also on 5 for awhile; no mental or physical change; entirely governed by her delusions. April 30. No change whatever ; retains delusions and is.governed by them ; hides • from Dr. L., greets Dr. A. as her husband ; no realization of h^er condition. May 25. Removed to-day by mother Discharged unimproved and went home with mother May 25, 1875. Compared with records, and correct. T. E. McGARR. EXHIBIT No. 31. Case of Mrs. Fulford. Clarissa A. Fulford, first admission; admitted March 9, 1848? case of puerperal mania ; described by husband as noisy, talkative? singing, "much opposed to her husband; says she is not his wife ; that she has been poisoned by her nurse ; rests quietly until about two o'clock, when she wakes and is noisy ; " brought by her husband, Daniel Fulford ; the records show that: " April 1. Is now on first hall; quiet and ladylike, but retains her delusions about her husband, and still says that she has been poisoned. May 1. Says less about iier delusions, although she still retains them;"' in June "her de- lusions about her husband, etc., seem to have left her." June 20. Discharged well; returned with her husband. Clarissa A. Fulford, second admission ; admitted February 12, 1873 ; brought by Geo. Robinson, superintendent of the poor of St. Lawrence county; case of chronic mania, two years' duration; was brought from the county house ; she was placed there because peo- ple were afraid of her ; she said she " carried pistols and had burned the bonds of her husband ; " superintendent of the poor says that he knows nothing about the case, except that "her husband says that she is a chronic lunatic;" sent to No. 9 ; she was noisy, talkative, up and down, but of bed at night, scolding, fault-finding; claimed 'that she was a visitor and not a patient; rambling and incoherent in speech; exalted in manner. 16. Quiet and ladylike; .went to chapel; sent to third hall. 23. Mischievous : scolds attendants and abuses them ; tells patients that this is a bad place, and that patients are often killed here. March 4. Was transferred to ward twelve on account of her troublesome condition. April 4. Assists in dining- room work ; improved in flesh ; still abusive of husband ; says that he is living with other women, and that is the reason why she is kept here. 21. Visited by husband and a number of Methodist clergy- i 1220 men who recognize her insane condition." On the 10th of May was more quiet; transferred to the third ward. 28. Again became dis- turbed as before, and was transferred to the twelfth ward. In June more quiet. July 2. Became very much excited again while talking with Dr. Gray ; denied that she had ever been insane, and was illegally put in the Asylum under Dr. Brigham ; her brother visited her frequently. August 1. Visited by brother rind sister, who told Dr. Gray that Mrs. Fulford was very insane ; he spent an hour in conversation with Dr. Gray before visiting his sister. August 22. Brother visited her an hour and a half, and told Dr. Kitchen that her husband was able to pay her bills, and ought to make her a pr'vate patient; her husband came same day but declined to see her; continues to speak of her husband as before. September 1. Feelings toward her husband continue; says she will make it hot for her husband ; she will have him expelled from conference. September 29. Husband visited wife in company with Mr. Davis of Utica : after the visit said he was unwilling to assume the care of his wife because of her insane state and feelings toward him, but that he had no objections to her friends taking her, and telegraphed for her sister to come. She was discharged unimproved, September 30, to the care of her sister. Compared with records and correct. T. E. McGARR. Clara II. Fulford, Florence, Oneida county, New York, readmit- ted June 16, 1882 ; order, pauper; sex, woman ; age 55 ; civil con- dition, married ; number of" children, three ; occupation, clergy man's wife; education, academic; religion, Methodist; habits good; nativ- ity, New York ; insane relations, maternal cousin ; cause, ill-health following fever; form, chronic mania; date of attack, 1873; dura- tion, chronic; number of attack, two ; number of admission, three ; age at first attack, twenty-one ; suicidal, meditated ; correspond with Dr. George II. Fulford, son, New Haven, Oswego county ; telegraph to same, forward three-fourths of a mile; brought by son, the cor- respondent ; medical certificates of Drs. Johnson and Ileaton; papers, temporary bond of Dr. George H. Fulford ; order Superin- tendent Comstock. Patient was first admitted March 9,1 >4S, at the age of twenty-one; June 20, 1848, was discharged recovered. At the time she was admit- ted she was suffering from puerperal mania. She was readmitted February 12, 1873, suffering from chronic mania ; she was discharged September 30, IS73, unimproved. See C. B. 33, page 88. Her son, Dr. Fulford, says that he has never considered his mother in her right mind since she left the Asylum the last time, bnt that she main- tained very good self-control until about a year and a half ago, when she became gloomy and depressed, avoided society and manifested very little interest in any thing outside of herself. About six weeks ago she became talkative and incoherent, ran about the neighbor- hood attending the meetings of various societies. She took a great 1221 dislike to her husband, and accused him of maltreating and abusing her, and in conspiring in various ways against her. She told the neighbors that her life was miserable, that she had been tempted to drown herself, and she now says that she would rather take her own life than come to the Asylum. In the office she is very excited and runs from one subject to another with surprising rapidity, and is too incoherent to give any definite information about herself. She says she was brought here by deception, and had no idea she was to remain. Sent to two and ordered chloral nocte. June 18. Talkative, incoherent, wandering, accuses other patients of interfering with her affairs; complains ot attendants and matron that they neglect her ; patients on the ward say that she is very troublesome, and they have seen no grounds for her complaints. June 19. Is inclined to scold a great deal; says her husband and son lied to her ; that she simply came here to be examined ; is told* plainly that her son brought the necessary and proper papers to com- mit her to the Asylum. June 20. Too excited and disturbed for No. 2. Interferes with treatment of other patients; asserted last night that she was helpless ; had to be carried from one dormitory to another ; was seen by Dr. Brush ; was then in an hysterical state, refusing to speak ; opening of eyelids by physician showed pupils equally dilated, responsive to light; no muscular paralysis. 22. Communion being administered to-day to Miss Roseoe \ Mrs. F. told patients that she and they were going, although not an Episco- palian ; her talk so excited Miss A. Spencer that she made a violent attack on Miss Sterling; Mrs. F. sent to 12. June 26. Employs some of her time on the ward, sewing, etc. ; goes to ironing-room ; assists in the dining-room. 2S. Hysterical ; put on elixir of valeri- anate of ammonia. 3 i t. d. 30. All medicine discontinued. July 15. Is still on 12. Irritable and fault-finding ; accuses her husband of cruel and unkind treatment; says he struck her. August 16. No material change ; sent to No. 10 for new associations and sur- roundings. December 17. Visited by husband^ and brother, Wm. Hamilton ; brother desired to investigate certain complaints made by Mrs. F., such as removing her from her room, cleaning it out, and a charge that Miss Burns had taken $1 belonging to her ; Miss Burns came to the parlor and explained the matter (the money had been given to Mrs. Barker, the matron, as soon as found by Miss Burns in Mrs. F.'s possession) ; Mr. Fulford admitted that he did strike his wife in 'a moment of excitement with a stick across the thighs; demanded of him to be released, and threatened legal pro- ceedings if left. 2»0 r- "r-Tef ofcf i O *< rd ^ rO-*00G0C0C0JlO rlHrtHHHHN, OOr-»CNeOt-fc-*OCO"H4COM»iO'ilOHtJI8>ffl 00>OU5cM>OCOt-«)Ttl«>' b£ 9"g »S P.cS 5 •« 3 "u O a is ** 'I u'JS^ 3 3 oj « O l'^!0"O^I'c» of of of of of of of of of of of of HOiO^IOiaOJOSCOtOoM kOt-COCOOSCOCOCMl?-COcOCO 05c0C0OQ0t^C0(M01^1?o'M of of of co" of of of of of of of of T(iHt-iooiaon.Hi-OH O)t>ocaesoo>0 00«t»t- of of co" of of co" of co" of of of of l©r-llOOS.t-a0r-IC3OClTi(.t- cso^cogscqcococococoo^os r-cF.......-g *.O.fi h gs H • • • •"& a a> a a rj r OS
    -An alleged insane person should always be examined at home under ordinary surroundings, with as little unnecessary official show, excitement, parade or exposure as possible, and the privacy of families and family affairs should be as carefully kept as in any other disease. All this will be better secured where the family physician and confrere are employed. COMMITMENT OF THE INSANE. England. Commitment.—An order, a statement and the medical certificate already men- tioned are required. Pauper lunatics are sent to asylums upon the order of the parish relieving- ofiicer, acting with a clergyman or jus- tice, accompanied by the certificate of a physician, surgeon or apothecary, and a statement which is to be filled out with exactness in the form of answers New York. Commitment.—An order, a statement recorded in the case-books of the insti- tution, and two medical certificates are required for public patients, and a bond in place of the order for private pa- tients. Pauper patients are admitted on an order of the superintendent of the poor of the county in which the patient re- sides, accompanied by the two medical 1255 England. to questions embracing the history of the patient. Private patients are admitted on an order signed by a relative, friend or some person authorizing them to be placed under restraint, and the person signing the order must have seen the patient within one month of its date, and this person becomes responsible for the payment of the expenses of the patient while in the asylum. This order is iu the form of a written request, and must be accompanied by a statement similar to that required in the case of paupers, and two medical certificates. Chancery patients are committed on " an order sighed by the committee ap- pointed by the Lord Chancellor, and hav- ing an office copy of such appointmeut annexed." Criminal lunatics are committed under order of the courts. New York. certificates already mentioned. State paupers are committed with certificates on an order of the secretary of the Board of State Charities. Indigent persons, who are in such limited circumstances that they cannot "support themselves and their famine's under the visitation of insanity," are committed under the order of the county judge after proof of indigence, and that the insanity is not over a year's dura- tion, accompanied by two medical certi- ficates. Violent and dangerous insane, whom their friends neglect to confine, are also sent by the county judges, with two cer- tificates. Criminal insane were com- mitted by order of the courts. Private patients are admitted on' a bond, executed by responsible parties, for their maintenance and accompanied by two medical certificates. A statement and history of all public and private patients, in all the institu- tions, must be recorded in the case- books within three days after admission. In county and municipal institutions for pauper insane, the commitments are under special acts, which include com- mitment by local commissioners , of charities and corrections, police justices, and other municipal authorities, but in all cases the two medical certificates, judically approved, are required. Comments.— It will be observed that in England, judicial author- ity is not invoked in commitment of any of the insane, and that private patients may be confined on an order, signed by any one, whether that person be a friend, relative, or even an entire stranger, and that a month may elapse between the time of this person seeing the alleged insane person, and granting the order for his admission, and that for pauper insane but one certificate is required. It is evi- dent that the guarantees, both for private and pauper patients, are greater under the New York statutes than under the English. SUPERVISION AND VISITATION. England. Supervision.— The officers charged with this duty are masters in lunacy, Commissioners in Lunacy, visitors and borough officers. There are two masters (with salary) in lunacy who act as judges in all proceedings under the writ de lunatico inquirendo, who are barristers of ten years, or sergeants-at-arms, and are appointed by the Lord Chancellor. There are six Commissioners in Lu- nacy (with salary); three medical men New York. Supervision.— The officers charged with this duty in New York are the State Commissioner in Lunacy, the State Board of Charities, boards of managers, municipal boards, and commissioners appointed from time to time in special cases under courts. Special commissioners are appointed by the Supreme Court, as the exigency arises in cases of de lunatico inquirendo. The Governor of the State has the 1256 England. and three barristers,jwho act as visiting commissioners ; there are also six com- missioners, non-visiting, and these latter are unpaid. Commissioners must have been in medical or legal practice five years. The hoard grant licenses to cor- porations or private individuals to open asylums, visit and regulate asylums, report to the Lord Chancellor their con- dition, conduct and management, and all matters connected with the certi- fied lunatics in England and Wales. They visit all licensed houses within the limits of certain terrritory (four of these visits are made conjointly by a medical and legal commissioner, and two by a legal comimissioner), aud see all the inmates and examine as to the number admitted, discharged, died, etc. Their^urisdiction is London and West- minster, and county of Middlesex, and borough of Southwark and certain places of counties Surrey, Kent, Essex and " every other place within the dist- ance of seven miles from any other part of London, Westminster or South- wark." All other houses or asylums are vis- ited by commissioners nominated an- nually in each borough, consisting of three or more justices, who act gratui- tously, and one or more medical men who receive remuneration. Three, one a medical man, visit four times a year, and two other visits must be made by one or more of these commissioners, with two visits of supervision by a bar- rister and medical man. Two or more of the commissioners are empowered to visit all work-houses and jails where lunatics are confined. Lord C/uincellor's Visitors.—These are three, consisting of one legal and two medical visitors; they are required to visit all chancery patients in asylums as well as those in private dwellings, all being under their jurisdiction. In the Parliamentary report of the select committee, Dr. C. Lockhart Robertson presents the following tabu- lation, showing amount of visitations of private lunatics (not paupers) by chancery visitors and commissioners: The Statement. I. Chancery Visitors: Patients in asy- lums, oue visit yearly; patients in pri- vate dwellings, four visits yearly. II. English Commissioners in Lunacy : Metropolitan licensed houses, six visits yearly , provincial licensed houses, two visits yearly; lunatic hospitals, one visit New York. power also to appoint at any time a special committee of visitation and ex- amination. The State Commissioner in Lunacy (with salary) is appointed by the Senate ou nomination by the Governor, and is charged with the visitations of all asy- lums, public and private, and is author- ized to inquire into their management and conduct, and report annually to the Legislature, and to make investigations into any alleged negligence or improper treatment of the insane, and iu the name of the people of the State to issue an order foT the remedy of any negli- gence, improper treatment or provision, and to report to the Supreme Court for relief if the order is disobeyed or negli- gently executed. He also visits all chronic lunatics in the custody of the county asylums or- ganized under a license from the Board of State Charities, and those confined in municipal and city asylums, on all of which he reports annually to the Legis- lature. The State Board of Charities consists of eight members, one from each judi- cial district, appointed by the Senate upon nomination of the Governor, and, excepting the secretary, serve without pay. They are empowered to visit and examine into the condition of all chari- ties of the State and all institutions, public or private, where insane are under treatment or in custody, to in- quire into their government and man- agement in all respects and the condi- tion and treatment of patients. Boards of managers are appointed by the Senate, on nomination of the Gov- ernor, and have entire control and di- rection of State asylums, and appoint the chief officers, establish by-iaws, rules and regulations. A board is ap- pointed for each institution, the mem- bers of which act without pay. A ma- jority is required to visit the asylums once a quarter, and the whole board once a year. They have the power to regulate the admission and discharge of patients, and control and direct the en- tire fiuancial affairs, and are required to report annually to the Legislature, within fifteen days after the opening of the session. These boards consist of eight or more members in each. The municipal boards are local boards created under laws authorizing the or- ganization of municipal and county asy- lums, over which they have full power of visitation and control. 1257 England. New York. yearly ; patients in private dwellings, one visit yearly ; (not chancery luna- tics). III. Scotch Commissioners in Lunacy: Patients in asylums, two visits yearly; patients in private dwellings, one visit yearly. Licences.— Persons or corporations Licenses.—The State Commissioner is desiring to take out licenses to open and authorized to license private asylums, carry on asylums, large or small, must and every application must be accom- make applications to the board at least panied by plans of the premises, a de- fourteen days before a stated meeting scription of the buildings, the extent of the commissioners. This must state and location of the grounds, the number the number of patients, the sex and the of patients of each sex proposed to be arrangements for separation, must give accommodated, and, after a personal ex- th'e place of the house, number and size amination of the premises, if he finds of rooms, and quantity of land attached, them suitable, he may grant the li- and whether for public or private pa- cense. tients. The State Board of Charities have power to grant licenses to counties to erect and organize asylums for the , . . chronic insane, and to fix the rules and regulations for their government, and to withdraw the licenses if theyare not properly conducted. Comments.—It will be observed that, under the English and New York statutes, there are visiting, controlling and local boards, with varied functions and duties, similar in character, and so con- stituted as to embrace all the interests, requirements and rights of the public and individual growing out of the establishment of insti- tutions for the insane of every grade and character, and securing the personal liberty of those committed to them, as far as the con- ditions arising in the disease will justify. In a recent report of a special parliamentary committee on lunacy laws,.a printed quarto of six hundred pages, a large number of prominent men were examined. At the conclusion, Rt. Hon. the Earl of Shaftesbnrv, who has been on the English Lunacy Commis- sion nearly fifty years, and permanent chairman since 1845, who was also member of the first committee of inquiry in 1828, and who had, by permission of the House of Lords, been attending this in- vestigation, gave his views at great length. He stated : u I cannot recollect a single instance in which a patient has been brought into an asylum in whose case there was not sufficient grounds for saying that he was the proper subject for care and treatment. I can hardly recollect a single instance. I see, by referring to the evi- dence which has been given before your honorable committee, that 6uch is the testimony of every man of experience, who has been con- sulted on the matter." To the question, " At the same time there is a feeling which has been expressed, not only generally, but by witnesses before the committee, that a large number of persons are admitted into asylums in a state of sanity and kept there % " he re- plied " I have no doubt those statements would be made, because ! ' 158 U "I • 1258 I never knew the case of a patient, either under confinement or after confinement, who did not say that he had been most unjustly confined. I hardly know an instance." Question : "At any rate, it is your lordship's opinion that, the admission into an asylum is now sufficiently guarded?" Answer: "I tliink so." Question: "Would you say the same with regard to their detention there; is it not the case that they are sometimes kept there longer than is necessary ? " Answer : " I don't think they are so now;" and he adds: " It is a very great responsibility to send out a patient upon the world, both with respect to the patient himself, and in respect of society, before you are satisfied that he is cured, or, at any rate, in such a state that he can be safely trusted." When Governor Hoffman, of New York, in 1874, appointed General Francis C. Barlow, then Attorney-General of the State, Dr. Thomas Hun, of Albany, and M. B. Anderson, LL. D., presi- dent of Rochester University, a committee to examine into all in- stitutions, public and private, they reported that no persons were improperly confined in the State, and no cases have since been re- ported, either by the State Commissioner in Lunacy or the State Board of Charities. Such facts go to show the efficiency of the law and the fidelity of the medical profession to the principles of science and humanity. DISCHARGE OF THE INSANE. England. New York. Discharge of Patients.— Private pa- tients are discharged from any licensed house or hospital by the direction, in writing,of the person who signed the order of admission. If such person be dead,absent or insane, then the husband or the wife, the father, the mother, then the nearest of kin, or finally the person who made the last payment of account, may successively have power to give such order, and if there be no relative, friend or qualified person thus required to act to make the order, then the com- missioners may direct the discharge as they see fit. In the case of pauper patients the guardians of any parish or union, or an officiating clergyman of any parish not under guardians, with one overseer or any two justices of the county or borough may, in writing, direct the dis- charge or removal, provided they are not certified in writing as dangerous or 'unfit to be at large, by the medical offi- cer in charge,of any pauper insane pa- tient. Any two or more of the commis- sioners may discharge any pauper patient from houses licensed by them- selves, after two visits, with seven days intervening, if such patient is detained Private patients are discharged by the managers of asylums, or may be re- moved by the persons executing the- bond upon which they are received. Those who have been committed upon a warrant of a j udge as dangerous to be at large, may be discharged upon the order of a justice of the Supreme Court, or if recovered, may be discharged by the board of managers upon the super- intendent's certificate of recovery. In- digent patients are discharged by the managers upon recovery, and if not re- covered in two years are liable to be removed after notification to the county judge, and they may also be discharged to the county authorities or friends by the board of managers. They may also be removed by their friends, though uu- cured, at any time before the expiration of two years, on presentation of a cer- tified copy of a bond with sureties, ap- proved by the county judge of the county from which the patients were sent,the boud being filed in the county clerk's office. This boud must guaran- tee " the peaceable behavior, safe cus- tody and comfortable maintenance with- out further public charge" of the luna- tic so removed. 1259 England. without sufficient cause ; and for like reasons two commissioners, one a physi- cian,may discharge any pauper patient from houses licensed by justices, but in all cases the medical attendant of the house or hospital shall be examined, if desires to be, upon the subject be- fore the discharge, and his statement shall be in writing and recorded. No lunatic, certified to be dangerous, can be removed from any house or hos- pital, without first obtainiug the consent of the Commissioners and Visitors. Criminal insane are discharged by the courts,after due investigation. New York. The managers, on the superintendent's certificate of complete recovery, may discharge the pauper patient, aud whether admitted as dangerous or not, " Upon the superintendent's certificate that he or she is harmless and will probably continue so, and is not likely to be improved by further treatment in the asylum." They may discharge any such patient to their friends upon the same guarantee as to safety, mainte- nance, etc., as mentioned in regard to indigent patients. Criminal Insane.— A patient of the criminally insane class can only be dis- charged by an order of a j ustice of the Supreme Court, or a circuit judge, if upon due investigation it shall appear safe, legal and right to make such an order. Municipal and County Asylums.— In the counties of New York and Kings the county commissioners of charities having charge, discharge, but only on "the certificate in writing of the physi- cian thereof, which certificate shall be filed and kept in such asylum, stating that such discharge is safe and proper." No insane person can be discharged from any poor-house or county asylum (excepting New York and Kings) except upon an order of a county judge or jus- tice of the Supreme Court, " founded upon satisfactory evidence that it is safe, legal and right to make such discharge." Any other person or officer making such a discharge commits a misdemeanor and is punishable by a fine of not more than $500 or less than $100, in the discretion of the court. Comments.—In England and America the provisions for the dis- charge of the insane are essentially the same. As in the initiatory proceedings for confinement, the responsibility is mainly thrown upon the medical profession, so also is the responsibility of discharge. In the discharge of pauper patients tliere is no practical difference in the two countries. In respect to private patients, the statutes of New York are more simple and practically effective. In New York the mana-ers of each asylum have the power to discharge without formality, and even without the assent of the relations or guardians while in England the consent of the person who signed the request or order for admission must first be obtained, or his successor, which may cause delay, annoyance, or even work to the detriment of the patient. Indeed, the parliamentary report .spoken of shows that the institutions have frequently to invoke the influence, and some- times the official power of the commissioners to compel the removal of ^vatepatients. In New York the bond, or as termed by the 1260 English law, the order, on which private patients are admitted, pro- vides for discharge " whenever he shall be required to be removed by the managers or superintendent,'1 and in case of refusal, for the payment of "all expenses incurred by the managers or superin- tendents, in sending such patients to his friends." This compulsory provision has had to be enforced at times by the managers. Of course, in both countries the writ of habeas corpus stands as an ever-present protection against any possible wrong. This, how- ever, has not been appealed to but three times at the Utica Asylum since my connection with the institution, in 1850, * and in these three cases the patients were immediately remanded to the Asylum by the courts. The statute of New York provides against any prob- ability of unnecessary or improper detention of private patients, under any circumstances, as it makes the delivery of the patient by the officers to the friends a mere matter of request at any time, as the friends are not even put to the slight inconvenience of mak- ing a formal order in writing, as in the English law, and the mana- gers may discharge summarily. Since writing the above, the State Commissioner in Lunacy, Dr. John Ordronaux, has brought out a very valuable work, entitled " Commentaries on the Lunacy Laws of New York, and on the Ju- dicial Aspects of Insanity at Common Law, and in Equity, including Procedure in England and the United States." He announces as the result of his observations and experience as a Lunacy Commis- sioner, of his studies in revision of laws, and of his examination of institutions, that: u In the organization also, and management of our asylums, and the provisions made for the care of the pauper and indigent insane, this State has made great progress; and lastly, in establishing a sys- tem of supervision of its insane wards, it has completed its guard- ianship of all departments of its public charities. "To unfold, therefore, the reason of the laws of governing the civil and criminal status of the insane has been the object to which I have addressed myself in these commentaries. They are designed to cover, not only the Revised Statutes of New York, bnt the while field of those decisions in law and equity, which give rise to some of the most difficult questions in jurisprudence. And inas- much as they would be incomplete as a manual, without some dis- cussion of the practical methods of enforcing these laws, I have added a chapter on Procedure ; prefacing the whole work with a digest of adjudicated, principles in the Jurii-prudence of insanity, together with a synopticl sketch of the development of our statute aw, herein, in the form of a History of Lunacy Legislation in England and the United States." ' Since that time there have been admitted 10,600 patients. 1261 REGULATIONS, CONDITIONS AND FORMS Concerning Admission of Persons to the New York State Lu- natic Asylum. For the information of those desirous of placing patients under treatment in the Asylum, we append the following extracts, require- ments and forms of law : The law relating to the insane is chapter 416, Laws of 1«74, entitled "An act to revise and consolidate the statutes of the State relating to the care and custody of the insane ; the management of the asylums for their treatment and safe-keeping, and the duties of the State Commissioner in Lunacy." Title 1, § 1. No person shall be committed to or confined as a patient in any asylum, public or private, or in any institution, home or retreat for the care and treatment of the insane, except upon the certificate of two physicians, under oath, setting forth the insanity of such person. But no person shall be held in"confinement in any such asylum for move than live days, unless within that time such certificate be approved by a judge or justice of a court of record of the county or district in which the alleged lunatic resides, and said judge or justice may institute inquiry and take proofs as to any alleged lunacy before approving or disapproving of such certificate, and said judge or justice, may in his discretion, call a jury in each case to de- termine the question of lunacy. § 2. It shall not be lawful for any physician to certify to the in- sanity of any person for the purpose of securing bis commitment to an asylum unless said physician be of reputable character, a graduate from some incorporated medical college, a permanent resident of the State, and shall have been in the actual practice of his profession for at least three years, and such qualifications shall be certified to by a judge of any court of record. No certficate, of insanity shall be made except after a personal examination of the party alleged to be insane, and according to forms prescribed bv tbe State Commis- sioner of Lunacy, and every such certficate shall bear date of not more than ten days prior to such commitment. § 3. It shall not be lawful for any physician to certify to the in- sanity of any person for the purpose of committing him to an asylum, of'which the said physician is either the supertntendent, proprietor, an officer or a regular professional attendant therein. TrrLE 3, §37. The terms "lunacy,"" lunantic," and "insane," as used in this act, shall include every species of insanity and ex- tend to every deranged person and to all of unsound mind, other than idiots. It will be seen, from the above sections, that the requirements of the law for the commitment of an insane patient to an asylnm and and holding him there in confiement are : 1. The certificate of two physicians, under oath, settting forth the insanity of such person, as defined in the section last cited. 2. The physicians signing the certificates must be duly qualified as 1262 medical examiners in lunacy, and be certified bv a judge of a court of record, to possess the qualifications specified in the first paragraph of the second section. The certificates must be made on personal examination of the patient, and in accordance With the forms pre- scribed by the State Commissioner in Lunacy, and bear date not more than ten days prior to the commitment. 3. The certificate must be approved by a judge or justice of a court of record of the county or district in which the patient resides, before, or within five days after the patient is placed in confinemen/t, in or- der to authorize his confinement more than tive days. The following is the form of medical certificate prescribed by the Commissioner in Lunacy: Form of Medical Certificate. State of New York, ) County of , ) *" " I, , a resident of , in the county aforesaid, being a graduate of , and having practiced years as a physi- cian, hereby certify, under oath, that on the day of , I personally examined. of* *(Here insert sex, age, married or single, and occupation.) and that the said is insane, and a proper person for care and treatment, according to the provisions of chapter 416 of the Laws of 1874. I further certify that I have formed this Gpinion upon the follow- ing grounds, viz. : * *(Here insert, facts upon which such opinion rests.) And I further declare that I possess the qualifications specified in section 2 of title 1 of chapter 446 of the Laws of 1874, and that my qualifications as a medical examiner in lunacy have been duly attested and certified by * *(Here insert the name of the judge granting such certificate.) Sworn to and subscribed before me, ) this day of , 187 . f The judge's certificate of qualification, the form of which we give below, need not be attached to the medical certificate, as the physician makes oath to the fact of being qualified, in each instance. It may be retained by the physician or placed on file in the county clerk's office. Judge's Certificate of Qualification. State of New York, County of I hereby certify that of , is a physician of reputable character, a graduate of an incorporated medical college, to-wit: , and a permanent resident of the State, and that he has been in the actual practice of his profession for at least three years. ss. 1263 J udge s Approval of the Finding in Certificates of Lunacy. To be Printed or Written upon the Back of such Certificated State of New York, j County of j **"; Pursuant to the provisions of chapter 446 of the Laws of 1874, I hereby approve of the findings of lunacy against A. B. upon the facts set forth in the within certificate. Dated, __________________ ------------of----------court Admission of Patients. Patients are admitted to the Asylum upon public orders or upon the bond of friends guaranteeing the prompt payment of bills. Of those committed on public orders there are two classes — pau- per and indigent patients. Pauper patients are sent to the Asylum upon the order of the superintendent of the poor of the county in which the patient resides, in accordance with section 5 of the law. The order of the county, or special county judge, or judge of the superior court or common pleas of the county where the patient re- sides, secures the admission of indigent persons not paupers. A certificate of indigence entitles the person in whose favor it is issued, to two years' treatment in the Asylum if he is not sooner cured, and is by law limited to cases of insanity of not more than one year's duration. The object of this humane provision is, undoubtedly, to extend the benefits of this institution to persons of limited means, whose in- sanity is of recent date, and, therefore, probably curable, and, if re- covered in the space of two years, restoring them to their families and their property unimpaired, and saving them from the paralyzing influence upon their future life of finding themselves, by the loss of health and reason, reduced to poverty. Patients sent through this channel generally supply their own clothing and pay their own travel- ing expenses to and from the Asylum. Patients supported at their own expense, or that of their friends, are received, when there are vacancies in the Asylum, giving prefer- ence to recent cases, upon the certificates of two physicians, duly qualified as medical examiners, approved by the judge of the county or district in which the patient resides, and upon a bond signed by two persons whose financial responsibility is certified by some bank or county officer, or some well-known, responsible person. The form of a bond, to be executed by the friends of the insane person admitted as a patient, is as follows: Whereas, of in the county of , an insane person, has been admitted as a patient into the New York State Lunatic Asylum, at Utica : Now, therefore, we, the undersigned, in consideration thereof, jointly and severally bind ourselves to Thomas W. Seward, treasurer 1264 of said Asylum, to pay to him and his successors in office the sum of dollars cents per week, for the care and board of said insane person, so long as he shall continue in said Asylum, with such extra charges as may be occasioned by his requiring more than ordinary care and attention, and also to provide him with suit- able clothing, and pay for all such necessary articles of clothing as shall be procured for him by the steward of the Asylum, and to re- move him from the Asylum whenever .the room occupied by him shall be required for a class of patients having preference by law, or whenever he shall be required to be removed by the managers or superintendent; and also to pay all expenses incurred by the man- agers or superintendent in sending said patient to his friends, in case one or either of us shall fail to remove said patient when re- quired to do so as aforesaid ; and if he shall be removed at the re- quest of his friends before ■ the expiration of six calendar months after reception, then to pay board for twenty-six weeks, unless he shall be sooner cured, and also to pay, not exceeding fifty dollars, for all damages he may do the furniture or other property of said Asylum, and for reasonable charges in case of elopement, and funeral charges in case of death ; such payments for board and clothing to be made semi-annually, on the first day of .February and August in each year, and at the time of removal, with interest on each bill from and after the time it becomes due. In witness whereof, we have hereunto set our names this day of , in the year 18 . (Name.) [l. s.] (P. O. address.) (Name.) [l. s.] (P. O. address.) This will certify, that I am personally acquainted with and , the signers of the above bond, and consider each of them fully responsible for the prompt discharge of its obligations. (Name.) [l. s.] (P. O. address.) This agreement, or bond, is generally signed by near relatives or other friends of the patient, or legal guardians, if any such there be, at or prior to the time of admission. It may, however, be signed subsequently, and sent to the Asylum, if, upon the admission of the patient, a sum of money sufficient to secure its execution is deposited. Upon application, we will furnish any of the above forms of medi- cal certificates or bond for private patients, in blank. We regret to be obliged to call the attention of county officers to the following law, which is too frequently overlooked or disre- garded : " All town and county officers sending a patient to the Asylum shall, before sending him, see that he is in a state of perfect bodily 1265 ; cleanliness, and is comfortably clothed and provided with suitable changes of raiment, as prescribed in the by-laws." We request, especially, that patients brought to us from couuty houses be clean and free from vermin. All persons require at least two suits of clothing, and several changes of under garments. Most of the patients go out regularly, and consequently require clothing suited to the season. For males, great coats and boots are required in winter; shoes answer in sum- mer ; slippers are worn in the house. Females also need ample clothing for walking and riding in the winter. The supply should be liberal when it can be afforded. All cloth- ing is marked with the name of the patient to whom it belongs, and much pains are taken to have it kept in good order and repair. The removal of a patient should not be attempted while laboring under severe bodily disease, as fevers, erysipelas, large and danger- f ous wounds or sores, consumption, etc. In conveying a patient to the Asylum, let it be done, if necessary, by force, rather than by deception Truth should not be compro- mised by planning a journey to Utica or a visit to the Asylum, and, when there, suggesting the idea to the patient of staying, while his admission was already decided upon ; nor should patients be induced to come and stay a few days to see how they like it, under the im- f pression that they can leave at pleasure. Such treachery not only destroys confidence in friends, but also, too often, in us, by the seem- ing conspiracy to which we are supposed to be a party, than which there can scarcely be a greater barrier to improvement. The pa- tient should be brought by an intelligent and intimate acquaintance, r who will be able to give a minute history of the case, or a written account should be transmitted. In the latter should be stated the name, age, married or single, number of children, occupation, degree of education, profession of religion, habits, nativity, residence, pre- disposing and exciting causes. Here give a minute history of the patient from youth up, temperament, peculiarities, disposition, etc.; also the cause supposed to have affected the patient immediately preceding the attack ; state what relatives, near or remote, are or have been insane or peculiar; also what disease the patient has suf- • fered from, fits, skin diseases, dyspepsia, constipation, piles, ulcers, etc. Give the date of the attack, going back to the first noticeable disturbance, no matter how slight ; also the duration of the more marked and decided symptoms, the number of attacks (if this be not the first) and, if ever before admitted, the number of admissions to this Asyliiio,'and how complete was the recovery in the interval of the attacks ; 'state fully the condition of the patient at the time of admission ; whether suicidal or homicidal ; whether he eats, sleeps, .' strikes breaks, destroys, or is noisy or inattentive to personal clean- t liness, and whatever else that may occur to the friends, likely to be ' useful to us. . i • • t_ i 1, It is desirable that application for admission be always made be- fore the patient is brought to the Asylum, in reply to which any de- 159 U 1266 sired information will be cheerfully furnished. All correspondence about or with patients should be post-paid, and addressed, to Dr. John P. Gray, Superintendent of the State Lunatic Asylum, Utica, N. Y. EXHIBIT No. 40. Improvements and Organization. I would call your attention to the importance of building a small wing or hospital for the special care of the more feeble and sick class of men, similar to that erected in 1874 for the women. My experience as an assistant medical officer so impressed me with the importance of such special provision that in my first annual report as superintendent, in 1851, I brought this matter of an hospital for- ward. I then said : " Our arrangements for taking care of the sick, though probably as good as in other similar institutions, must be regarded as very imperfect. All sick patients should be immediately removed from the wards to an hospital department, properly arranged, where every attention demanded by their condition could be be- stowed ; where the physician could visit them frequently during the day. and in the night, if necessary, without disturbing others ; where those very ill could be visited, and, if advisable, nursed by their friends." I have urged this since in my reports. A single large room was originally designated as an hospital which was'directly over the rooms of the most excited patients, and in connection with the shops. It was soon found to be unsuitable for the purposes of the sick and feeble, and this class have always been cared for in the wards with the other patients. They undoubtedly can be well cared for in this way, but it would be much better to have special hospital provision. The experience of the great benefit of the small hospital wing for women makes the need of the one for the men seem more urgent. Such a wing could be put up with all the necessary bath- rooms, etc., and arrangements for steam heating, similar to that for women, for $10,000. I would recommend the extension of the shops on the line of the road to the barns, and the discontinuance of that part of them ad- joining the rear one-story wing for the more disturbed men, and its conversion into a day-room for this ward. This would remove the carpenter and paint shops farther from the occupied buildings, and make them more convenient of access, and safer, and the portion thus disused could be made into a day-room at moderate expCnse. The remodeling of the women's wards, 7, 8 and 9, and the erec tion of three large day-rooms in connection therewith, which was progressing at the close of the last year, have been substantially com- pleted and they are now occupied.' The painting of the walls can- not be done until the plastering is thoroughly dry, but this can be done without vacating them or seriously interfering with comfort. 1267 vi ^ekonninal construction of these wards no day-rooms were pro- vided beyond a small room at the extremity of each, which was not only contracted, but being constructed across the end of the wards, shut out the light and prevented the free movement of the air through the halls, where the patients spend most of their time. A number of years ago we partly remedied these defects by taking out one room on the side of each ward, and making it a recess or open , sitting-room, giving at the same time more light to the ward. These changes were made when the work of putting in the heating and ventilation was being carried out. Still, the defects were manifest, and appeared more conspicuous as experience revealed more and more clearly the necessity of light, space, and cheerful surroundings, so essential to the well-being of this class of persons. When in 1872 1 urged the remodeling of these wards, and the construction of large day-rooms for all the disturbed classes, and your board directed me to make out and submit plans for the work, I felt that a most im- portant step was taken toward the higher usefulness of the institu- tion. I had seen the marked increase in the order and quiet of the wards, and the better condition, in every way, of the patients of the most disturbed classes when they wrere removed years ago from the basement rooms to the larger and more airy wards, specially erected for them, where they had space to move about freely, without jostling each other, or coming in unnecessary collision. Although these day-rooms have been open but a short time, they have demonstrated their usefulness in the additional comfort they afford to patients, and in the greater ease and convenience with which the attendants are able to take care of them, to say nothing of the cheerfulness and sanitary value which the sunlight gives to the wards. The provisions for the care of the quiet and convalescent classes in an asylum are comparatively simple, and if an institution can select its patients and receive only the quiet, the arrangement of an asylum would be as easy as that of an ordinary hospital. The difficult problem is the care of the disturbed. An ordinary visitor going through the wards of an asylum is very naturally struck with the contrast between the most quiet and con- valescent wards and the most disturbed. If the institution is well organized, and the patients properly classified, he will see that the difference, as he proceeds from ward to ward, is not only noticeable, ' but is a steadily increasing one. The first two or three are so quiet and so much like well-ordered outside life that he can hardly under- stand why these people are not in their own homes. He does not take in the fact that the most of them have been in the several more disturbed wards, as each case may have required, during certain stages of the disease; that the twelve wards for each sex are not simply so many apartments for reception of a certain number of people, but so many wards, arranged for the subdivision of the patients, to correspond with the various manifestations of the disease in each case. As he looks at a profound case of melancholy, a rest- less unhappy and uneasy patient, whose mind and very soul are i 1268 tortured with distressing delusions, or at a case of mania, where per- haps some form of restraint may be necessary, to prevent denuding the person, or self-inflicted injury, or violence to others, it does not occur to him that soon these very persons may take the places of the quiet and cheerful convalescents he has just seen. He sees in a large institution like this, where so many cases are annually ad- mitted, and so many are manical or melancholic, and so many feeble, helpless or old, the whole of insanity spread out, as manifested in all these hundreds before him, but he does not see clearly if at all the reason why one is in a certain ward and another in another; in other words, he does not appreciate the law of classification which supposes each individual placed where it is best for him, for the time being, in order to secure his most speedy restoration. He does not understand that this laige subdivision into wards is for the very purpose of meeting moie successfully the condition and symptoms, both mental and physical, of the disease. Some patients may go through almost every ward, and others three or four, and again, in some instances tieatment may not,be necessary except in one. The basis of classification is simply the power of self-control as manifested in the manner, speech, and personal care which the individual may exercise. There is more curative power in an institution in its large means of classification than in one where there are but few wards. Each ward becomes precisely what the condition of the patients may there represent, and they are moved from one ward to another as their condition changes. An asylum should be so constructed as to give ease of access to every part, from the central or administration building. Every ward should have abundance of light, and should be so arranged as to afford easy observation of every part of it by the attendants; the form or outline of the building should be such that the wards for the more disturbed are at some distance from the more quiet, while remaining connected they should have a different outlook from those of the quiet and convalescent. The various classes should overlook each other in their external view as little as possible, and for the best order and the highest good of the patients, the grounds for exercise should also be separated ; that is, there should be at least two divis- ions of the grounds for each sex ; one for the convalescent and more quiet, the other for the several classes of more disturbed. Of course this does not imply necessary confinement of the patients to these grounds, because they walk and take exercise not only upon the grounds, but far beyond them, while the men patients are also about the barns and over the garden and farms, but these special divisions mentioned are for ordinary out-door airing and lounging for the more invalid and the more excited who are not able to work, and for the use of all who can be out of doors and under observation at such times as they do not work. In this institution these provisions have always existed, to a certain extent. The aim has been constantly, as oppor- tunity has afforded, to make the ward-separation more complete, to arrange the day-rooms so as to afford more independent and separate 1269 outlook, to give the largest possible amount of sunlight, and to ex- tend the airing or exercising grounds so as to take away as far as possible the sense of confinement. With the new day-rooms and the special hospital rooms constructed for women (and we hope the same improvements will not be long delayed for the men), the institution will be arranged for the best care of all classes of patients for which it is designed. The whole institution constitutes a double hospital, one for each sex, separated by a central building, which is for the purposes of administration, and the residence of the officers, the chapel, theater, etc. Each side is under the care of two medical assistants, with a steward for the men, a matron for the women, and a general clerk for each, the superintendent having supervision of the whole. Each side contains twelve wards, five on the first story, four on the second, and three on the third. Each story is a department, and six super- visors, three of each sex, have the' care and supervision under the physicians, each of a department. Each ward has a chief attendant and as many assistants as the number and condition of the patients may require, and also a dining-room attendant. Thus each ward practically constitutes a family living together in and out of doors. Each supervisor has constant oversight, under the immediate direc- tion of the physicians in charge, of the wards assigned to his or her department, They go through all these frequently during the day, observe the conduct and manner of the attendants, give them all necessary directions in regard to any matters that may arise concern- ing their duties, administer the medicines that are prescribed, carry messages to and from the medical office throughout the department, report to the office any thing unusual that may occur, before or after the visits of the physicians, and see that all the orders of the physi- cians are carried out bv the attendants, and report any inefficiency, neglect or defective service on the departments. The chief attend- ant on each ward has charge of the patients and the direction of those associated in their care. The dining-room attendant has the care of the dining-room, tables, etc., and assists on the ward in all leisure hours when not engaged in his or her special duty. The various sewing-rooms are under the seamstresses, who have charge of the work and oversight of the patients who assist; so also of the ironmg- -' rooms For the men the tailor has charge of the shop and the over- , si-lit of such patients as work with him; so also of the carpenter ' shop, plumber shop, paint shop, wash-house and kitchens, in each place the person in charge having the oversight and direction of the patients who assist and work with him. 1 he same rule prevails m the out-door work with the persons in charge of the horses cows, pigs, 1 etc The men patients who work in the garden, and on the farm, are under the immediate direction of the attendants who are assigned to take them out, and work with them, while the general labor is under the direction of the farmer and gardener, throughout the whole institution in every ward, dining-room, sewing or other work-room, and in every shop, and in the kitchens, wash-house, and wherever 1270 employed persons are engaged in labor, tliere are always patients work- ing with them. All attendants, and those engaged in in-door employ- ments, and all attendants who work with patients on the farm and garden, live in the wards with them, taking their meals in the dining- rooms with them, and are thus constantly associated with those whom they have in charge, while those having charge of the shops, barn3, etc., simply have the care of them through the day or through the hours they are with and assist them. Thus a wise regulation is car- ried out, that " every patient must be in the charge of some respon- sible individual at all times, unless permitted to be at large by the superintendent." Every employee of the institution has a printed copy of the by-laws, rules and regulations, where their several duties are distinctly set out and to which they are required to conform. As the officers and attendants all reside in the building, their duties are practically without hours, as they are all liable to service at any mo- ment, and they are always accessible. The night protection is secured outside by the persons who sleep at the barns, and the night fireman in charge of the engine-house, shops, etc. Inside, in charge of the wards and patients, there are two regular night watchers for each sex. They go upon duty before the attendants in charge retire. They pass through the wards, hourly, and go off duty after the ringing of the morning rising bell. They receive from the physicians in charge each night a written fist of the persons they are especially to look after and such verbal directions as may be necessary, and report in writing in a book in the morning. Their duties are to look after the sick and feeble, maintain constant watchfulness and observation over the wards, taking up those who need that sort of care, and communi- cating with the physicians in charge if any one is taken sick in the night, or is unusually disturbed. To maintain integrity and efficiency in this body of employees for such arduous, constant, and often perplexing duty, it requires not only care in their selection as to character, plain rules and regula- tions for their guidance, but also that they should be provided with suitable recreation and respite from the constant strain. To secure all this and at the same time give social life, religious and other privileges in the midst of the discharge of these duties, I have given a great deal of reflection. This requires such organiza- tion as before stated, as will insure unceasing supervision of the patients, and a sufficient number of attendants so that for limited periods all the necessary duties can be performed by a part of them, that is, by certain ones remaining in while others are out. No at- tendants can ever leave the wards in which they are on duty with- out permission. This permission presumes the necessity of passing the duty of one to the other for the time being. As this permission of absence must be in writing, in the office, it is known to all mem- bers of the medical staff what persons are temporarily absent and who assume their duties. To accomplish this systematized recrea- tion or respite, on each department the attendants are grouped into threes so as to give rotation in absences. For instance, one attendant 1271 out of the three is absent one Sunday of the month all day and the other two are at home; so they alternate on week day evenings and it is so adjusted that there are always two in for one out. Each is permitted to be out at church, lectures, or to visit their friends two , evenings of the week, so under this arrangement of grouping they are permitted to be out for a brief airing or exercise in the day, when not out walking with the patients, but are not permitted to go off the grounds without permission. Each is allowed one-half day of every \. month for any personal business matters, and the necessary time for the care and procurement of their own clothing, etc. If the illness of patients or any other exigency of the service requires the- tempo- rary abridgement of these privileges, the attendants are expected to acquiesce, and they do. When they are employed they are given ;, the rules and regulations to read so that they may understand fully f the requirements of the position, and I find as a matter of practical observation that such as fail to appreciate the importance and respon- sibility of the duties do not long remain. In my judgment and > observation of the working of this plan the employees have sufficient j open air exercise and recreation to maintain good physical and men- tal health, and to keep up the necessary social relations of life, and ' at the same time to insure a constant interest in the work in which they are engaged. In this great problem of daily and hourly care, I have always felt it to be of the highest importance that the attend- ants should be as happy and contented as possible, to give them the proper spirit and endurance for their work. The whole organization is intended to secure the medical and gen- eral supervision of the patients night and day. The constant re- sponsible oversight and care of this great institution, in all its in- terests, is a charge which involves the life and welfare of six hun- \ dred helpless sick, and at least a million of dollars of property. 1 The organic law creating the Asylum, with all the amendments and modification, to the present time, with the by-laws originally : adopted and subsequent amendments, together with the rules and regulations for the administration of all the affairs of the institution in all its departments, as they now stand, are the outgrowth of expe- rience. The present thorough organization has, therefore, been a jk matter of gradual growth. The institution was opened in January, 1843. Within a year after the opening of the Asylum, the superintendents throughout the United States and Canada organized an association, embracing all the medi- cal superintendents of American institutions for_ the insane. This association of men have met annually ever since in international con- '■. vention, to discuss the important questions involved in the construc- tion and organization of hospitals, and the care and treatment of the insane. All the practical questions relating to the management of asvlums have been discussed and re-discussed by this body with the constant b>ht of advancing science and accumulated experience. Amonc the important contributions of this association was the early enunciation of a series of propositions relating to the establishment, 1272 location, construction, and organization of hospitals for the insane, which from time to time have been expanded until they now consti- tute an invaluable code of principles for guidance in these matters. EXHIBIT No. 41. Progress of Treatment. However admirable in construction hospitals for the insane may be, however perfect the organization, insanity as a disease is precisely the same as it has always been, a disease marked by changes from the slightest to the most extraordinary, in the character, manner, habits of thought, and conduct of the individual. These very feat ures in the disease have made hospitals and isolation from home an imperious necessity. The hospital itself means, in a broad sense, more or less seclusion from the world and restraint of personal liberty. In the words of Chief Justice Shaw of Massachusetts, " the right to restrain an insane person of his liberty is found in that great law of humanity which makes it necessary to confine those whose going at large would be dangerous to themselves or others." Again he says, " besides it is a principle of law that an insane person has no will of his own. In that case it becomes the duty of others to provide for his safety and for his own." It is this great law which has created asylums. Though the history of insanity is really coeval with the history of man in all ages, and may be traced through all sacred and profane literature, little can be said showing successful treatment until within a century past. Until what may be called the modern treatment wras adopted attention was mainly directed to protection against the violent and dangerous conduct of the insane rather than the medical treatment of the disease. The problem of caring for the noisy, violent and destructive pa- tients has always been and still is one full of difficulty. The mani- festations in this direction are the offspring of disease, and in fact, symptoms of disease. Formerly when insanity was not as well understood, strong repressive measnres were deemed necessary for almost all of the insane, and were almost universally resorted to. This was not because our predecessors were cruel or barbarous, but simply because medical science then had not taken particular interest in the care of the insane, and experience was almost entirely confined to the question of custody and safety. We cannot speak of these medical men as barbarous anymore than we could denominate methods of surgery in past centuries as barbarous, when the fathers in medicine were slowly and experimentally working out problems, perhaps simple enough to us now. For more than a century men have been practically working out the best methods for the care and treat- ment of the insane. When Shakespeare said " who can minister to the mind diseased ?" he indicated the state of knowledge at that day. It wsa a question which no one had undertaken to solve. He might 1273 f' with equal significance, at that time, have asked " who can heal a lung I disease, or tie the carotid artery 'i " When Henry the Eighth confis- | cated the priory of Bethlem, and ordered that it be turned into an ■ ' asylum for lunatics, he was really laying the foundation for the h beneficent work we now see moving on throughout the world. In the light of what men are pleased now to call " humanity," the history ' of Bethlem, for a long period of years after its opening, is a dark line of cruelty and horrors; but viewed from a standpoint of those I times, and side by side with the prisons of that age, and with the -general harshness of men as they then were, its history is only the ': expression of the sentiment of that period. If we read the history :, of the Tower of London and consider the bloody deeds there exe- fcuted upon . men and women, and even children, we only read a reflection of the sentiment of that age. The men and women who governed and directed the affairs of the Tower governed and directed the affairs of Bethlem. The administration of civil government which executed men for opinions, hung them for petty thefts, and put them into vile dungeons and to the rack, kings and princes and . even the most delicate women, was merely expressive of the senti- ment of that age, as were the chains and dungeons for the violent ■ insane within the grand old walls of Bethlem. When recently in London, I visited Bethlem and also the Tower. Bethlem, now under one of England's best medical superintendents, is the expres- sion of the enlightened views of the care of the insane, both in a humane and a scientific aspect. Dr. Savage, the medical superin- tendent, who is himself a lecturer on insanity, and the asvlum a place of clinical instructions, gave me a full view of that establish- ment, and pointed out certain changes already made and others still to be made, to keep pace with the progress of the times. The new light everywhere, the bright decorations on the old walls, the com- fortable furniture, the kindly attendants movjng through the wards, all forced upon my mind the wonderful contrast with a now buried' or rather a historical past. In the Tower the implements of torture, the- dreaiy dungeons, whose walls are covered with emblems expressive of the injustice of a past age, and odorous of the gentle blood so rudely shed, were ex- hibited for what they formerly were, gloomy and bloody records, now gone, not shown to reveal what England now is. From the end of the reign of Henry the Eighth, 1547, for two hundred years, tliere is no liTstory of the care of the insane which we desire to dwell upon. I These were centuries of war, fanaticism and bloodshed, and the in- sane shared the common fate of all who could not help themselves. j They were left to themselves while the violent and dangerous received simplv such care and attention as the safety of the public I required. All' this, however, stands not as a history of wanton cru- i eltv but a history of mankind in progress from the rude to the 1 refined, from science in swaddling clothes to science advaucing to ta About that time. 1750, St. Luke's Hospital, England, was estab- 160 U 1274 lished by voluntary subscription, and the good people of Philadel- phia, Pennsylvania, simultaneously put forth the idea of a better and more humane care of these unfortunates. So about that period was liberty expanding and science progressing, and the origination of these movements for the amelioration of the condition of the insane was among the beneficent outgrowths of this enlarged sentiment of the time. Illustrious men in medicine, in law, and in science gave their aid in both countries. The year 1815 found England looking into her mad-houses, and then appeared the famous parliamentary "blue book" with the evi- dences Of the condition of Bethlem. At that same period the State of New York was discussing the enlargement of her provisions for the insane in connection with the New York hospital, and beginning seri- ously to look after the insane poor in the poor-houses. As a result of this early movement in this State, Bloomingdale Asylum was built and commenced its benevolent work, but it was from the first almost entirely utilized by the independent classes, and the poor still re- mained largely uncared for. In 1830 a movement was set on foot to establish a State asylum. Out of this came the State Asylum at Utica, gradually developed, and opened for the care of patients on the 16th of January, 1843. It is simply the truth of history to say that at the opening of this institution such were the ideas of the necessity of seclusion and strong apartments for the care of maniacal patients, that special rooms were constructed. Says Dr. Brigham : "As is well known, the present building forms only part of a contemplated establishment. It was originally intended solely for the quiet and convalescent class, conse- quently no strongrooms were provided for the noisy and violent. We are therefore without any now, though by lining some of the rooms with boards, and making stronger doors, we have made some of the rooms safe and comfortable for this cla^s, but we have no cells or dungeons. Every patient has a good sized room, well ventilated and warmed." Again he says of these rooms : " They are well ceiled with boards, handsomely painted, which makes them warmer, safer and better for patients than those with plastered walls, the upper part of the door opening into the hall from each room is open lattice work so that the patients can look into the hall and constantly be seen through it. The window which lights each room is strongly secured by a lattice shutter, so opened that the patient can look into the yard or garden. If he is disposed to tear his bed or bedding they are re- moved from the room during the day." The windows had double iron grates, one of cast and one of wrought iron, and in addition a wooden shutter, and all those rooms were in the basement. In the wings subsequently erected strong rooms were provided. These were lined with heavy planks and the windows were guarded like those previously constructed. Part of thedoors were strong heavy wood with glass in the upper part for a point of observation, and others were made of heavy oak slats, or open frame work, and some of them were lined with boiler iron, firmly riveted, and a padlock 1275 j. put on in addition to an ordinary lock. Even in the ordinary wards ; there was firmly anchored in many of the rooms an oak plank to [serve as a seat which could not be used as a weapon, and at the end of each wing, where the disturbed classes were to be cared for, there was an inclosed yard for exercise, forty feet square. All these i arrangements undoubtedly represented the foremost ideas of that [ period, and the institution was placed under the charge of Dr. Ama- riah Brigbam. one of the ablest medical men at that time engaged in I the care and treatment of the insane, and they were simply intro- duced because it was believed such strength of structure and such [..arrangements were necessary. The projection and construction of the additional wings containing a number of strong rooms in the [ basement similar to those described in the original structures, by Dr. Brigbam, after he had assumed the charge of the institution, is con- clusive proof that he believed that such requirements were both wise and humane. In addition to the rooms already mentioned, there were twelve special " strong rooms," six for-each sex, " to afford accommodations to some of the most noisy patients requiring seclusion." They were not built in the basement, but a story above ground, in a block of ', buildings* used for shops, etc., but attached to the other wings. They were seven feet by nine, built of heavy brick walls, laid up in cement and plastered with cement, the floors also being cement laid [ upon brick arches. They were constructed without any windows, [ but in the center of the building, with a corridor passing entirely around them, the light and air admitted, not directly from the outside, [ but from the corridor through the slatted doors. These doors, like those of the other strong rooms, were an open frame-work of oak, and in the wall of each room there was a small opening, six by ten inches, } lined with heavy oak plank and guarded by an oak door opened with a lock. This aperture was designed to pass in food and drink with- out the necessity of opening the large door. This, however, was only one phase of the institution ; it was the exceptional side of this great charity of the State. The humane care of the classes for whom all these, now to us, extraordinary, pains- taking, and expensive arrangements were made, was a great problem which experience only could solve. , These arrangements were not inconsiderate and inhuman ; they were determined upon deliberately, , after the most careful consideration by Dr. Brigbam and the com- missioners, who were men of the highest character. These " strong , rooms" were not erected as "abodes of cruelty," but were simply expressive of the belief of the best people at that time in regard to the dangerous character of the insane and the necessary provisions required for their safety. Some of those rooms, in the basement, remain as they were, except the heavy locks. They have long been I used as store-rooms. # • I have said this was only one phase of the institution. Io be sure it is that one phase which always stands out, and by which the incon- siderate would be most likely to judge of the whole. The problem 1276 was then, as now, how best to ameliorate the condition of theinsane and especially of those cases where the disease manifests itself in violence of speech and conduct, and disregard of the proprieties and derencies of life, to secure against violence the most troublesome and dangerous as they were then considered, were kept much in their rooms where they could be observed through the open-work frame doors. This was the case when I entered the institution in 1850 as an assistant. A number were then confined in the strong rooms, and only taken out for short periods, and these took their meals in their rooms, for in the most disturbed wards there were no dining-rooms. Restraints were freely used as then deemed necessary. Yet from the opening of the institution in January, 1843, to 1850, ameliorations were going on, and elements of comfort were being constantly introduced, the medical aspect of insanity was receiving attention; the American Journal of Insanity was projected by Dr. Brigbam, the first journal of this kind founded. An association had been formed by the medical superintendents of America with a view to discussing this broad subject, and elevating the standard of the care of the insane; newspapers, books, and other reading matter were introduced into the wards, with games such as checkers, dominoes, etc. The nucleus of a library had been formed, and the amount of seclusion had been lessened, a certain proportion of the strong rooms had been discontinued, or used simply as ordinary rooms. In every direction science, experience and humanity were moving together toward improvements, increasing the comforts of the patients and the means of recovery. In 1851 the " Opal " was started, a publication the contributions to which were from the patients, the proceeds being used for books, ^ amusements, etc. With the permission of Dr. Benedict, who was then superintendent, I went to Boston, New York, Philadelphia and Washington, and personally solicited books from publishers and others, and secured in this wTay 1,129 volumes. In 1852, being then in charge of the male department, by permission of the superin- tendent, I had a small portion of the most disturbed ward set, off for a dining-room, and on a given day took out every man who was in seclusion and brought them all into the dining-room where we had > knives, forks, and other ordinary table furniture, remaining myself with the attendants while the patients took their meals, until it was considered safe. From that day seclusion was banished, anjd the strong rooms used thereafter only as ordinary rooms, and as speedily as possible remodeled. Since then no person has been secluded except temporarily for extreme noisiness, or on account of some ill- ness. In connection with this movement, large airing courts wTere arranged, and all this class of patients wrere permitted to go out, and, . as a further result, very soon a large number were taken out to work and all restraints were lessened. Though the question of occupation had been much discussed, it was practically limited in its application to a small proportion of the patients, and no record was kept of what was done ; in fact the whole 1277 question was then in its infancy. Dr. Brigham, as his annual reports show, had appreciated the value of labor, and had recommended the erection of work-shops, and in 1847 he says, under the head of "shops, farm, and labor " : " They are found to be well-adapted for the'purposes for which they were designed, and give us ample room for shops and other purposes. Thus we have a plumber's and painter's shop, two for joiners, one for tailors, one for shoemakers, and two rbonis for printers, and other rooms for sewing, mattress- making, etc. In all these patients are more or less employed." Undoubtedly these small apartments then and for some time after- ward considered ample, fully represented the ideas of labor at that period. These were beginnings, and though small, as I look back upon them, they seemed large then. They were indeed great advances, for it must be kept in mind that it was comparatively a new thing for the insane to work, and it was quite natural that what was done should be made the most of. As experience showed, from year to year, what might be done, occupation became more and more extended and systematized. As I have stated in the thirty-fourth report, when appointed an assistant in 1850, among the duties assigned tome was the charge of the occupations, amusements, schools, labor, etc., and I noted the in- fluence of these means on the bodily health and mental condition of the patients. In 1851 a system of improvement was commenced on the farm, garden and grounds ; and during 1851 and 1852 over twenty-five thousand tile were laid for the drainage of the garden and farm, making over five miles of under drains, and an open water-course carried through the grounds some two thousand feet, into which the under drains could empty. The front grounds also, some ten acres, which had been in a rough state, were worked over, subsoiled, graded and then tile-drained. All this work, together with the ordinary work of the farm and garden, was done largely by patients and attendants; and I personally supervised it, being part of each day with the patients for the very purpose of observing the effect of occupation, and the character and amount of it which would seem most advisable. Following upon this for several years, extensive alterations and re- pairs of the buildings were made in connection with the introduction of steam heating and forced ventilation ; and in such work as carry- ing out rubbish and in assisting in the unskilled part of the labor, patients worked with the attendants. From this time forward in the farm and garden work, making roads and keeping them in order, grading about the premises, keeping in order the lawns and grounds, the patients, with the attendants, have done all the work that has been deemed proper. In 1861 we established a system of organized labor in the Asylum, at the same time instituting a series of records of the same, which have been kept ever since. Previous to that period I had given much consideration to the subject, and to the importance of "practically carrying out such physical and mental oc- cupation as would be beueficial to the patients and at the same time 1278 promote the public interests, I had come to regard the word " oc- cupation " as much more applicable to the needs of the sick than the word "labor." As I have stated in a previous report, " occupation for the sick is any thing in the nature of labor, exercise, amusement, reading, talking, looking at objects in nature, or at pictures, or in- deed any thing that for the time takes wholly or in part the attention of the patient," not confounding occupation with laborious physical work; but giving it that wide application which is needful and use- ful in an hospital or institution of any kind for the sick, insane, or in- firm ; and further, as stated in previous reports, " the great majority of those admitted to this institution are overworked and under-nour- ished people of both sexes. Many of them are old, and others are " feeble and suffering under chronic diseases and infirmities. They, indeed, need rest more than work, rest of body and rest of mind. When we look at the causes which lie at the foundation of the mental disorders in the vast majority of cases that come here, we can well realize this truth. These underlying causes too are largely traceable to the toils, anxieties and sacrifices in the discharge of the legitimate duties and responsibilities of life, and only in a minor measure to dissipation and vice. I repeat, the most need rest and suitable occupation for the time, in the nature of diversion rather than labor, of which latter they have had too much." Durino- my visit in Europe the present year, I made the question of occupation a special point of inquiry and observation in connec- tion with the institutions I saw, and in conversation with prominent men in the specialty. Without going into details, I am well satis- fied, as a result of such inquiry, that labor is quite as thoroughly carried out here as in the institutions abroad. Furthermore, among the best men there, labor, or more properly speaking, " occupation " for the insane, is understood in the light in which I have heretofore viewed it, and have heretofore represented. Tailoring and shoe- making are more largely represented there than in this country, but they admit a larger proportion of that class of operatives than we do here. The occupation most sought after, and considered the most beneficial, was that which could be accomplished out of doors in the open air. I saw there bodies of patients going out to the farm and garden, and others walking about the grounds, also about the shops and barns, presenting the exact counterpart of the daily summer life of the institution here. , I saw the labor records of some of the institutions where it may be said special attention had been given to out-door work and exercise, and they were about the same as those that, had been kept here for a series of years. Their ornamented grounds, their tennis and other games, their amusement halls, etc., showed that it was not all work; and that they endeavored to carry out in these institutions, in some measure, the enjoyments of outside life. In 1865 I wrote, " I have no doubt of the great value of labor as a curative means, but it requires care to determine who shall work and how much work each may do. As among men everywhere, so 1279 here it sometimes happens that those who would be better for labor are lazy and selfish, and will say, ' I pay and will not work,' or ' the county pays for me and I do not wish to work.' These instances are comparatively rare, and when attendants themselves are thought- ful and industrious there is little difficulty in getting all to work who should do so. Indeed, if not guarded many would over-work. It must be borne in mind that the average day's work would not be over six hours, or less, and that the workers are not able-bodied men who can accomplish an ordinary day's work. I am well satisfied from long and careful observation that from 22 to 25 per cent would be the highest estimate of six hour workers who could be depended upon. Some might work eight or ten hours, while others could not work over two or four and maintain their bodily health." What I said fourteen years ago, experience has justified. While the tabula- ted statements show a larger number than 25 per cent of the popu- lation did some kind of work, I am satisfied that the true average of labor would not be over 25 per cent of six-hour labor per day. In reviewing and presenting this subject in a previous annual re- port, I said : " I am well persuaded that the system adopted is cor- rect and humane, and only needs expansion and perfecting in de- tails." This is what we have constantly been doing. From the be- ginning we have kept ever before us the fact that the patients are sick people ; that the institution is an hospital for their care, their comfort and recovery ; and that all responsibility touching their exercises, labor and care, in every way, as well as the responsibility of their medical treatment, must be entirely in the hands of the medical staff, and must be directed in accordance with the varying condition of each patient; and the constant recognition of this, and the application of such principles makes the institution what it was intended to be, an hospital for the sick and not a work-house. As experience shows the way, we have sought to utilize all the means and sources within and around us for the benefit of the patients. No year has passed during which we have not added something toward improving and beautifying the institution and its surroundings, and multiplying the resources which contribute to the happiness and welfare of'those whom the misfortunes, accidents, trials, duties and afflictions of life have committed to our care. Our endeavor has always been to make the institution assimilate to home and ordinary life as far as possible, and to take away from it institutional pecu- liarities. These I consider the true methods of occupying or employ- ing patients in such an institution as this. Among the subjects to which I gave particular attention in my visit to Europe was that of restraint. Not the question as to whether restraint should be used, as that is an indisputable proposition, but whether it should be, as practiced by many of the most prominent British alienists, by the hands of attendants, holding and restraining, or by certain mechanical means. The uses of restraint in this insti- tution, as has been announced in previous reports,are as follows: 1. In cases of suicidal disposition, where it is so determined and persist- 1280 ent that watchfulness will not insure the necessary safety. 2. Where there Js determined and persistent disposition to self-maiming, or exposure, or denuding of the person, or self-abuse. 3. Where there is great destructiveness or violence toward others. In 1860 I used the following language : " Restraint and seclusion per se are inadmissible. As means of treatment they should be recognized according to their remedial value." This I reiterate as the basis upon which I would still use restraint, and I would prefer, wherever it is necessary, to be used for any length of time, it should be by the simple means of the camisole, waist-belt, or mittens, rather than trust to prolonged holding by attendants. 1 have no hesitation in saying that so used restraints are a merciful provision and contribute to the protection of many cases against themselves, from the violent and often dangerous pro- pensities in the disease. I saw no camisole or mittens in the institu- tions I visited in England, but I saw strong dresses, fastened with lock buckles, precisely such as we are in the habit of using here, and also what they called "ticken" dresses. I saw restraint in Scot- land. I saw a variety of restraints in the French and other institu- tions which I visited on the continent. I also saw what were called " strong rooms " and " padded rooms" everywhere abroad ; saw patients in them and heard what could be said in favor of, and against them. I should prefer the use of the covered, or as Dr. Lindsay of Scotland calls it, the "protection bed," to the strong rooms for excitable feeble patients. In the former, the patient is locked in the room where lie can only be seen by the night watch, by opening the door, and unless he is making some noise it cannot be known whether he is asleep or awake, or whether he is exhaust- ing himself by standing up or walking about the room, and whether he needs any assistance or not. With the covered bed the room door is left open and the night watch can hear and see the patient every hour through the night and administer to his wants. In the 18th annual report, 1860, the covered bed is thus described : " This bed is constructed like an ordinary child's crib, with the addition of a slatted cover. This arrangement does not interfere with the movements of the patient in rolling from one side of the bed to the other, or moving the limbs in any way. It merely pre- vents the patient from sitting up or getting out of bed. As the sides and top are open, the air circulates as freely about the body of the patient as in an ordinary bed. Restraint in a horizontal posture is used in cases of exhaustion where the physical health of the patient demands that he be kept in bed. The medical thought involved is readily appreciated. Sick people ordinarily lie in bed under the advice and direction of the physician, but the same class when insane will not always do so, and these arrangements are to effect this end." Of restraint generally I then said : " We look upon restraint and seclusion directed and controlled by a ov/uouieuiious and intelligent medical man, as among the valuable 1281 alleviating and remedial agents in the care and cure of the insane. Thatthey are agreeable in their application or use, either to the physician or patient, no one will . maintain. Indeed, few, if any, medical prescriptions are agreeable. The bitter of nauseating draughts, the abstinence in diet, the seclusion of the patient to the sick room, and the exclusion therefrom of friends, are prescriptions for the cure of disease, as are the knife and appliances of surgery, and they are adopted and prescribed as such/ The physician who would not administer the best remedy, because it might offend the taste, or the surgeon who should not use the knife, or other means, bscause he might thereby cause pain; or the obstetrician who would lay aside, under any such consideration, the reinedies required in critical cases, would be unworthy of the profession, and the confi- dence of the public. " We have been led to these remarks, first, because the public and those who have friends in the institution are interested in knowing the general and special means and appliances for the proper and humane care of those, who, by reason of tlieir disease, are unable to care for themselves, or remain in their families; and, secondly, be- cause in this branch of the profession, especially in Europe, and to a small extent in this country, there has been a movement toward the substitution of the hands of attendants, padded rooms, seclusion and depressing remedies for mechanical appliances ; any and all of which are, in our opinion, more uncertain in results, and more liable to abuse than restricted mechanical treatment." EXHIBIT No. 42. Custody and Treatment. The proper control of the insane has been a problem at all times difficult to solve satisfactorily. The great difficulty of the problem lies in the fact that in their care or treatment there is, from the first, interference with personal liberty. But the disease itself being a dethronement of reason, leaving its victim to the impulses of his own emotions and passions, renders him not only dangerous to others, . but incapable of taking care of himself. Therefore, as a matter of necessity, society has protected itself by the summary and secure confinement of the lunatic, and laws have been enacted to carry out this purpose. The next step was the care of the property that any lunatic might possess, the State thus becoming his guardian. The English statutes first placing thedunatic under the care of the State were enacted in 1272, in the reign of Edward I * And from that *In the reign of Edward I, 1272, a statute was made giving to the king the custody of idiots and insane persons and in the subsequent reign an act was passed '" De Prserogativa Regis " in which their rights were further guaranteed. "The king shall provide, when any that before-time hath had his wit and memory happen to fail of his wit, as there are many per lucida intervalla, that their lands and tenements shall be safely kept without waste and destruction, and that they and their household shall be maintained comfortably with the profits of the same • aud the residue shall be kept for their use, to be delivered unto them when they come to be of a right mind." 161 U 1282 time forth the rights of the insane were under the care of the crown. There has been since that period scarcely any question as to the right and humanity of restraining the insane by law. This legal restraint at the same time has guaranteed more or less their protection and treatment. Institutions for their reception, their care and treatment have grown out of this exercise of guardianship which the law has assumed, whether public or private. State institutions are the highest expression of this provision of law. .They constitute the means devised by the State to carry out its will in the confine- ment, protection and treatment of its wards. The law undertakes to say what classes of persons shall be so confined ; how the question of insanity shall be determined in every case; and designates the officers to' conduct the inquiry ; and prescribes all the forms of law necessary to confinement, treatment and discharge. As far, there- fore, as the law is concerned, the restraint is absolute, the law gov- erning and controlling the insane in a degree measured solely by the degree of loss of self-control or the measure of responsibility. The fact that insanity is manifested in such a wide range, in loss of self- guidance and self-control and power of self-protection from the slightest to to the most complete degree of helplessness, makes the problem of adapting the law to each particular case a difficult one; but, nevertheless, the law of this State leaves the determination of the question, as far as it relates to confinement in asylum's, to the judgment of medical men, of prescribed qualifications, subject to the approval of the courts. Each State institution has a board of managers, who are the legal guardians of the institution, and all its concerns and its inmates, who are appointed and removed conjointly by the Governor and Senate ; and they are authorized to make all needful and suitable rules and regulations for the administration of affairs ; and are to appoint and remove those who are charged with the immediate administration and the personal care and treatment of the insane. Of the commitment and treatment of the insane in this State^ the statutes are very specific, very simple, and very clear. _ No difficul- ties have occurred in connection with any of the patients brought to this institution since their revision and codification in 1874, al- though since that time more than 2,500 persons have been admitted. Creating asylums by statute is an acknowledgment of the wisdom and the necessity of restraint upon personal liberty. Tliere is no power except that of the State which can interfere with the personal liberty 'of the individual, and this in regard to the insane grows out of the manifestations of the disease itself, and is quite as much a matter of protection to the individual and for his cure as to the safety of the public. Thus far there seems to arise no question as to the necessity, wis- dom and humanity of restraint, though the law takes the insane from their own homes, out of the care of their own immediate fami- lies, and places them/in the hands of its own agents. All*this is done for the double protection of society and the individual, and for the welfare especially of the latter, securing to him the chances of 1283 recovery from his disease or its alleviation as far as possible, or his proper care if the disease persists. To what extent this restraint of his liberty shall be exercised vduring his residence within the hospital, and who shall be.responsi- ble for the exercise of that restraint, are two of the most import- ant questions to be considered. They involve primarily the origi- I nal question of protection of the person against the manifestations of the disease with which he is afflicted, and the comfort of those j about 'him with whom he is necessarily associated. These necessi- i tate an organization to carry out, as far'as practicable, the order and discipline needful to secure the highest personal good of all those confined within asylums. Whatever the rules and regulations may be to secure these ends, they must be carried out by individuals. The question, therefore, of restraint assumes the most difficult aspect at this point where it must be exercised under personal responsi- bility and control. How far can the insane be left to themselves, I how far can they be guided by persuasive measures, and how far is it necessary to control their wills by the will of another? If they can guide and control themselves, hospitals are not necessarj'; if by simple persuasion they could remain harmless in their own homes it would be superfluous to remove them. It is because they can neither be left to themselves, nor to persuasion, that the law has stepped in and authorized control. The history of the disease leaves no room here for argument. How to exercise these three conjointly in the most judicious, wise and kindly manner is the problem that enters into the organization and the constant conduct of any insti- tution. Without this personal direction an institution would be a scene of chaotic disorder, exhibiting the ungoverned and undirected delusions of its inmates, with violence, indecency and indifference to personal habits. With this personal direction and constant vigi- lance, an institution shows in the main order, peace and scrupulous care of person. A well-organized hospital, therefore, should repre- sent the maximum of personal freedom which the disease will allow, and the minimum of restraint which it compels. While under such organization the patients will in general need nothing beyond such personal guidance as has been spoken of, but there will always be certain exceptional cases in which the disease at times will mani- fest itself in such severity, that 'the victims will disregard all rules, all persuasions, all proprieties, and will require physical restraint to protect them from injuring others, from indecent exposure, and from becoming the victims of debasing passions. What means shall be emploved in the exercise of this necessary physical control in such cases ? Shall it be by direct physical force at the hands of those in immediate charge of the patients? Shall it be by placing them in solitary seclusion, allowing them free play in their ideas and con- duct • or shall it be by certain appliances in the form of modes of dress, or such other simple appliances as still protect them, and yet keep them in the constant presence of others and of their attend- ants '( The question reduces itself, therefore, as far as direct physi- cal restraint is concerned, to that of personal or mechanical means. 1284 Nothing more strikingly illustrates the prevailing tendencies to push theory to extremes than the history of this question in regard to the use of physical restraint in the custody and treatment of the insane. So rapid, has been the comparatively recent progress of medical science that the practice of hardly more than a generation ago is already associated in our minds with many features of the " dark ages," when insane persons were regarded simply in the light of dangerous beings with an incurable disease upon them, whom no person could approach without risk. Confinement wTas the harsh and solitary imprisonment of a cell, and all the means of physical restraint had reference mainly to protection against their violence. We need not go through the history of this period, or of the gradual progress to the present views in regard to the. disease, and the modern institutions for its care. The question we would propose to ourselves, therefore, is whether, having so far modified direct physical restraint, it would be judicious or right to abandon it alto- gether. Whether it would be in the way of progress to relinquish what are called mechanical appliances, and resort only to personal physical force in the exceptional cases requiring to be controlled? For I assume that no man, short of a fanatic, would advocate the policy of leaving the lunatic entirely to himself; and really, the sub- stitution of solitary seclusion for the present mild forms of restraint is simply retrograding toward the very barbarities from which the lunatic has in modern times been rescued. To illustrate—whether the determined suicide should be con- tinually watched or held by human hands, or whether he should wear a mode of dress restraining his hands, or a simple strap about his waist, by which his arms are restricted to limited motion, or whether he should have his hands encased in mittens, or as our English brethren say " locked gloves," to xprevent the numberless mischiefs which a man?s hands can do when beyond the control of reason. The exceptional cases where restraint is necessary, either by force of attendants or by the physical appliances indicated, form but a small proportion of the insane, but as a matter involving a great principle it is just as important medically and as important for the individual as though every insane person required one or other of such measures. I have given this subject the most careful and conscientious consideration and review during the past thirty years, and in my annual reports from time to time have set forth the actual practice in this institution, describing the exceptional cases, and the means of restraint used. Twenty years ago I said : "Restraint and seclusion per se are inadmissible. As means of treatment they should be recognized according to their remedial value." The class of cases in which mechanical restraint is here used are : First. Cases of suicidal disposition, where it is so determined and persistent that watchfulness will not secure the necessary safety. Second. Where there is determined and persistent disposition to f '}' ! 1285 I self-maiming or injury, or denuding of the person, or debasing self- [ abuse. Third. Where there is great destructiveness or violence toward others. The means of restraint we use are the camisole, the waist-belt, buckskin mittens, and in rare instances the leather muff. No means i of restraint are ever applied, except in each instance by the order of a medical officer. That the three classes of exceptional cases exist among the insane in every country, no one who has seen any thing of insanity will deny. In small institutions, where the patients admitted can be V selected, such cases might not be found ; but in institutions where all (, classes and conditions of the insane are received, they will be found, [ especially in acute mania and melancholia. As already stated, the question simply resolves itself into bow they shall be so controlled as not to injure or improperly expose themselves or injure others. No person having any familiarity with the insane, or any correct ; views of the modern treatment in hospitals would, for an instant, think of punishment in connection with these helpless classes. The . necessary restraint of such persons, whether by the physical force i of attendants or by mechanical means, implies only preventive meas- ures in the sense of actual and necessary protection, and the ques- tion can only be properly argued from a strictly medical standpoint. No physician, conscious of his responsibility to his patients, could abandon them to themselves in such a perilous and irresponsible state from any mere sentimentalism or love of notoriety. Necessary vigilance and control must be exercised, either by the means already stated, or by putting the patient under the influence of drugs. After faithful trial in the same class of cases ot restraint, by the hands of attendants and by tbe mechanical means above mentioned, I am forced to the opinion that the latter method is judicious, safe, less irritating, and less painful io the patient. After visiting_ Europe, where there has been much more discussion upon the subject than in this country, and where the most earnest efforts have been made to limit, if not to abolish, all the means of, restraint, applied to the hands, arms, etc., and after seeing persons held by attendants, see- ing them in strong rooms and in padded rooms — all these actually being only different means of restraint —I still prefer the camisole, belt and mittens, where the patient is kept in the presence of others, to either of the forms of repressive seclusion, or to the personal coercion by the physical force of attendants, always bearing in mind the principle of guidance I have laid down, the maximum of per- [ sonal freedom which the disease will allow, with the minimum of physical restraint which it compels. There are feeble, anaemic cases of mania and melancholia, and i certain cases of general paresis and paralysis, which are so indiffer- - ent to their personal needs and so incapable of self-guidance or self- control that the ordinary arrangements of associate dormitories or single bed-rooms are inadequate protection ; and others again, whose 1286 delusions are of such a nature as to lead them to disregard their necessary comfort and welfare. Though they absolutely need rest in bed in a horizontal position, they will not remain in bed, but be about their rooms standing up, walking, exerting themselves in various ways as their morbid fancies may suggest or their delirium drive them. These patients must either be watched and held in their beds .by attendants, or fastened in their beds by some physical measures, or placed in covered or protection beds, or left alone in their rooms to wear out and exhaust themselves. As I said in my annual report twenty years ago, " feeble, anaemic sick people ordinarily lie in bed under the simple advice of the physician, but certain of the insane, in the same physical state, will not do so." For these we use the covered bed, or, as Dr. Lauder Lindsay, of Scotland, calls it, the "protection bed." I have, in several annual reports, mentioned and described this bed as like an -ordinary bedstead, with sides like an ordinary child's crib and a slatted cover. These beds have a wire mattress and ordinary mattress and bedding, making a most com- fortable spring bed, and they are so roomy that the patient can turn and roll about and make all the movements that he could in any bed except that he cannot sit up or get out of bed. At night the room door is left open so that the night-watch can see the patient without the noise of opening a door, and can administer to any wants. This method of securing horizontal posture for rest and sleep in such cases is, in my judgment, more humane and kindly than locking them in strong rooms with mattresses on the floor, or in padded rooms with the same arrangement where they are necessarily left to themselves, or than holding by attendants, or fastening them to ordinary beds by sheets or by what is known as the •' bed-straps," * which some seem to prefer to the covered bed. In obedience to the instructions of your board, I lay before you the latest opinions of European alienists on the question of restraint, in Germany, France and England. The declaration of the German and French superintendents are taken from the published transac- tions of the German Psychiatrical Society at Berlin and Heidelberg, and from those of the Medico-Psychological Society of Paris. In regard to the practice of restraint in English asylums, the facts pre- sented are taken from the last annual report of the Commissioners in Lunacy. These utterances are the latest and most authoritative on the subject, as they come from men promineutly associated with the management of asylums and the treatment of the insane. I quote * The bed-strap consists of a leather strap, about eighteen inches wide and twenty-two inches long, with a center and two side straps at the top, and two long straps at the bottom, and one about the middle of it. The central top strap is fastened to the head of the bed, and the two bottom straps to the foot; the patient is then placed on the cushion : the middle strap is passed about his waist, and the two remaiuing straps at the top passed forward diagonally across the breast, and buckled to the waist strap, thus confining the body of the patient to the cushion. Two bights or anklets move on rings on the straps attached to the foot of the bed. These are buckled around the ankles and attached to the straps going to the foot of the bed to regulate, and in a measure restrain, the motion of the feet. 1287 fully with a view of giving as clearly as possible their views in their 0Wn Wh • ^sPecially where definite opinions were expressed. Hemrich Schule, the well known superintendent of the asy- lum at lllenau, Germany, in the second German edition of his hand- book of mental diseases, 1880, discusses this very class of cases, in the phapter in which he treats of restraint. "i ^e? in bed f°r hi^hly an3einic patients. With these must be included a great number of emaciated melancholies, with feeble pulse, cold extremities, and little power of assimilating nourishment. The horizontal position, rendering possible an increase of blood supply to the brain, together with the invigorating influence of the warmth of the bed, acts as the first and most rational means of quiet- ing the patient. Anseuiic maniacal patients, also, who exhibit the same enfeebled state of circulation, are often very quickly quieted when we succeed in keeping them in bed. * ' * * Do these patients, however, for which rest in bed seems to be imperative, really stay in bed ? This leads us to the question of the admissi- bility of mechanical restraint." The author then, while favoring non-restraint ideas, which, he says, should be tbe leading principle in the treatment of the insane, remarks that, though this system has had great success, it has also led to extremes, and adds : " It has been attempted to elevate this ' free ' treatment to an ab- solute dogma, with an exception in surgical cases. In this lies, in my judgment, an extravagance which in special cases can hardly be more mildly criticised than was formerly the opposite extreme. There are morbid psychical symptoms which demand an imperative intervention, and against which the ' non-restraint' system struggles in vain." He refers to certain cases of chronic mania and of strongly marked melancholia, and asks where is there any " adequate protec- tion " against the uncontrollable impulse to various forms of self- mutilation ? And adds, " shall there stand day and night for weeks a double watch of attendants, and is this indeed a sufficient protec- tion ? Does this rather not excite the patient still more ? Such cases must be witnessed wdth an earnest desire for ' non-restraint,' and while in possession of an able corps of attendants, in order to bring home the practicable limits of this ' free ' treatment. Like instances could be greatly multiplied, and even aside from these cases 'of self- injury, there are cases among the female patients which in the interests of decorum and decent behavior will at all times impose a duty even upon the most enthusiastic ** non-restrainer.' This is not the place to enter more closely into this detail of asylum practice which, for some years back, has so unnecessarily agitated some minds. Let us confess it candidly ; true ' non-restraint' lies in the spirit of the medical treatment in general. If this be directed by pure humanity, so that, in every detail, we are conscious of meeting the various phases of the disease only, and always by the most intelli- gent means of combat and tranquilization, then will the appro- priate modification suggest itself in each individual case. The phy- 1288 sician then, in his earnest desire to carry out the ' free' treatment system, will proceed to the utmost limit, yet he will not consent to be so far misled by the love of a dogma, to jeopardize the interest and welfare of his patient. The conscientious asylum practitioner, with a patient in a state of acute delirium, who threatens to exhaust his powers to the verge of death, must employ restraint, and if it can- not be otherwise, patiently bear the anathema as long as his oppo- nents are unable to reveal the secret of meeting this life endangering waste in a more reasonable manner, for the patients are placed in our care for cure and not for mere observation." The Zeitschrift fur Psychiatric, vol. XXXVI, contains a discus- sion on the subject of restraint which took place at a meeting of the German Psychiatrical Society in Berlin, in June, 1879. The discus- sion was opened by Dr. Schafer, who started with the proposition that there could be no question as to restraint in the wider sense of the word. It is implied in the structural arrangements of asylums, in- closures, seclusion-rooms, etc.; in the arrest and transfer of insane patients to hospitals ; in many cases of sickness, and in surgical opera- tions where patients cannot be allowed the free use of their limbs. The only question is as to the degree, mode and extent of the forms of restraint to be resorted to. The personal experience of all may not agree, each one may view the matter from his individual stand- point ; we may treat the subject in two ways: Either by collating isolated facts, or by laying down general principles. The old bar- barous mode of treating lunatics has given away to the advance of science1 and humanity, and the improvements in buildings and in medical treatment, which has rendered less restraint necessary. Re- straint in itself is considered an evil; but it is not yet proved that it would be for the welfare of the patient to dispense with even its occasional application. Dr. Schafer adds : " The avoidance of me- chanical restraint may do positive harm, first, by putting the patient in a position to injure himself, and second, by the prejudicial effects in certain circumstances of the substituted means, such as the long continued use of narcotics, constant watching and restraint by the hands of attendants, all of which may do more harm than the appli- cation of mechanical restraint. If it be said that unless we make complete disuse of restraint, there will be temptation to resort to it unnecessarily, this reproach applies equally to all therapeutic meas- ures, as all may be abused. A good physician appreciates the value of perfect liberty when he can give it, butalso knows how to avoid its disadvantages where occasion requires. All agree in ifsing only the minimum of restraint that is necessary. On this principle there will be little difference in treatment in different institutions." Dr. Ideler thought absolute non-restraint was impossible. He re- ferred particularly to cases in which tliere was a tendency to self- injury and where restraint was indispensable. Dr. Jastrowitz held that the diversity of opinion in regard to non- restraint was due to the diversity of definition, each man interpreting for himself the meaning of the term. He thought it better, there- 1289 fore, to enter upon the subject practically. Non-restraint did not mean that the patient should have his own free will, no one regarded isolation as restraint, nor could one question the propriety of apply- ing restraint in cases requiring surgical treatment, or as a means of saving life in patients who refuse food. The clothing of patients with untearable coats and dresses, or with unremovable gloves or mittens, could not be regarded as restraint, the gloves did not really constitute mechanical means, because they did not prevent the free use of the extremities. Dr. Tigges found non restraint in vogue when he entered the Sachsenberg Asylum, and continued its use with but few exceptions. He confessed that he had doubted whether it was always in the interest of the patient to pursue the non-restraint system. He spoke of narcotics as being a most important means of support in carrying out the system, such as morphia, chloral and a combination of mor- phia and chloral. By using these within bounds, accidents could be 'avoided. As instances in which non-restraint was apparently fraught with disadvantage, he mentioned cases of pneumonia in winter, in patients of lowered vitality. It was impossible to avoid decrease of temperature during the night, and this was the cause of death in such cases, so that at the post-mortem one could not reject the scruple that the patient's life might have been saved by keeping him in bed by mechanical means. He cited the case of a madman who had murdered his wife, and who threatened physicians and attendants with violence, so that all stood in awe of him. He was put in seclu- sion, and narcotics could not be used in any form. Under the develop ment of delusions and hallucinations, he became so fond of this isolation that all attempts to bring him among others were answered with the same violent threats and acts. This state of affairs lasted three or four years. In this case the idea forced itself upon one that by using the strait-jacket it would have been possible to bring this man'among his fellow patients, and by the use of enemata render his entire surroundings more human. Surgical cases and forcible alimentation constituted the exceptional cases in which he had used restraint. He cited five cases of death, from patients jumping out of windows without protection. Dr. Edel had no doubt that non-restraint was the leading principle in the treatment of the insane. There were exceptions, however, in which the temporary use of restraint by means of gloves, waist- straps, and even the strait-jacket, was indicated. These were: First, in the'transfer of acute maniacs; second, in cases of injury; third, in dangerous patients, whose delusions constantly compelled them; to ao-o-ressive acts; fourth, in disturbed paretics, to prevent self-' Dr Midler did not think it right to regard mechanical restrains as preposterous The alienist was justified in using it, as occasion ■ required, no less than the practical physician, the surgeon and the At a subsequent meeting of this society, held at Heidelberg, in 162 U 1290 September, the discussion of restraint was resumed. Dr. Westphal opened the discussion, and expressed himself as strongly in favor of the views of Conolly being carried out as regarded all mechanical restraint, which he maintained were based on humanity, but added that tliere were alienists equally humane who could not concur in Conolly's views. It seemed as if the advocates of non-restraint had, as it were, " taken a lease of humanity," which he considered a wTrong standpoint from which to regard the question. Humane-im- pulses in the treatment of insanity were to be found everywhere, and the question was, " What were the best and most appropriate means of treating certain patients ?" He would put the question in these terms : "■ First. Is it possible to further develop the present state of science in relation to the treatment of certain forms of in- sanity to the point of abolition of all mechanical restraint? Second. Is the abolition of all coercive measures of advantage in the treat- ment of the insane, or does it involve such disadvantages, in view of which, we ought not to make the attempt I" These questions had been theoretically discussed ad nausea///,. Such dicussion was, however, wholly without value, as a settlement of the question could only proceed from actual experience. He states that in his own personal experience he had abolished all mechanical restraint, though in Germany, opinion was divided on the question whether it was advantageous to entirely abolish restraint or to retain it for a certain set of cases apart from those which were surgical, which he declared Conolly himself had excepted, while adding that those who had entirely dispensed with it were of opinion that neither necessity nor advantage justified its partial use. Dr. Nasse declared himself in the main in accord with Westphal. He took exception, however, to the designation of non-restraint as a special system ; the mildness of the system of Conolly had been exercised before that reformers time; the peculiar feature of Conolly's proposition was that he insisted on the absolute abolition of every mechanical physical restraint. The idea of abolishing all restraint in the treatment of the, insane could not be entertained. He claimed that the unconditional acceptance of^non-restraint was fraught with danger, and said that in England, in many places, medical freedom of treatment had been compromised by the en- croachments of the laity on this account; that non-restraint was merely apparent and not an actual fact. He stated that while he was an advocate of the abolition of mechanical restraint, he believed that "exceptions were indicated where restraint must be used. These were surgical eases and diseases of the eye; persistent self- injury ; excessive self-abuse, especially in women ; cases where patients obstinately remain out of bed and stand on their feet to the point of oedema ; cases of extreme anaemia which need rest in bed ; patients who persistently occupy the kneeling position to the point of creating a slough ; cases of excessive motor restlessness in sick, feverish patients, etc., as in melancholia agitata, and the acute de- lirium of paretics ; those rare cases in which the patient himself 1291 begs for restraint to prevent self-injury ; in forcible alimentation.'5 He added, it must be considered that there were cases in which the utmost patience onrthe part of the attendants'became exhausted; cases whereby the lives of the attendant were endangered and out of consideration for whom restraint was necessary. To wholly ex- clude mechanical means of restraint in the treatment of such excep- tional cases, he regarded as an injury to humanity. The careful use of restraint, on the other hand, he held to be the duty of the phy- sician and beneficial to the patient. He concluded with the maxim of Dr. Yellowless of Glasgow : " Non-restraint so far and so long as it is best for the patient." Dr. Snell considered the question of seclusion as of the greatest consequence; he said that Conolly had insisted on non-seclusion, except in padded rooms. He proposed as a substitute the holding of the patient, good feeling, etc., but it seemed difficult to him to avoid seclusion, especially with aggressive patients. Dr. Filter maintained that he " had succeeded in abolishing all re- straining apparatus. He thought that the exceptions set forth by Dr. Nasse could be treated by constant watching." Dr. Brosius stated that the discussion had thus far not given the substitute for the strait-jack, etc.; while all agreed that the greatest possible extent of non-restraint ought to be carried out, he had abol- ished the strait-jacket, and had substituted a larger one therefor, to-wit. the seclusion cell, and the asylum itself, with its walled courts. He could not conceive how Dr. Filter managed in the cases men- tioned by Dr. Nasse. He thought that disturbed patients could not be held day and night by attendants. Such excellent attendants were not to be had. One great difficulty in the discussion of this subject is that the use of the word "non restraint" appears to be contrasted in the | minds of many with the general prevalence of the restraint in for- [. mer times, and thus does not really mean total abolition of re- straint, but only means the establishment of a rule to which | restraint shall be the exception. Iu other words, that we should aim at the minimum, in which it may be fairly said that all practi- cally agree, since no one would advocate it except as a necessity for the welfare of the patient himself in securing the treatment he re- quires. This would seem to be clearly expressed in the foregoing discussions. Even Dr. Westphal, the most enthusiastic for non- [■■' restraint, admitted the use of seclusion, though "it only occurred as the exception during the day in the Charite Asylum, and then only ! . for a certain time."" He does not say Avhether he would consider holding patients forcibly a nlatter of restraint. It must also be observed that the exception made by the various speakers really [. cover the whole ground, at least in principle, and that the reasons for the use of restraint could not have been more strongly stated than ' by Nasse, a professed advocate of non-restraint. In this connection I would also refer to a pamphlet issued by Dr. Van Andel superintendent of the asylum at Ziitphen, on the ques- 1292 tion of restraint, a paper read before the international medical con- gress at Amsterdam in September, 1879. He starts with the propo- sition that " the rational carrying out of the principle of non-restraint system must be adopted as the general rule." He would state the question, "in what cases and under what circumstances are mechani- cal means of restraint to be permitted in the treatment in the insane ?" He holds that the use of mechanical restraint is allowable in excep- tional cases. In regard to the views entertained in France on the subject of restraint, we have the most recent expression of leading alienists in the transactions of the Medico-Psychological Society of Paris in Marcli, during the present year, and published in July, 1880, in the " Annales Medico-Psychologiques." The discussion was opened by Mr. Dagonet. After referring to the question of non-restraint which had long occupied public opin- ion, and to the work of Conolly, he remarks: " One would have thought it entirely settled; be this as it may, since it presents itself anew to-day, it is right to inquire if the abso- lute and systematic suppression of the camisole is to be considered a step in advance, and if the means proposed to take its place in order to meet exceptional cases where its employment is rendered impera- tive do not constitute a method difficult to put in practice, and to be rejected at this day by the majority of physicians as being much more inhuman." He refers to the introduction of the camisole by Pinel as the substitute for the barbarous confinement of the insane. " It was Pinel who first traced with a master hand the rules for the proper application of coercive measures." " We must," he said, "accord to lunatics as much freed o,m of motion as is compatible with their own safety and that of others ; give them liberty to run about; to expend tlieir agitation in a closed space, limiting ourselves to the simple expression of the strait-waistcoat." He then quotes from the article in the Dictionnaire de Medicine etde Chirurgie P*ractiques, by Dr. Pain, on the camisole. " Cassimir Pinel remarks with reason that non-restraint exists in England no more than in France ; that the means of restraint only differ. The use of the camisole has been replaced by the hands of attendants and darkened rooms. It is, therefore, simply a question of comparing the advantages and drawbacks of each. Whatever form may be adopted, restraint is indispensable in a great number of cases. In order to suppress restraint, it would be necessary to abolish at the same time the delusions and hallucinations which cause these deplor- able manifestations. There is certainly quite a category of lunatics, for whom the application of the camisole is an absolute necessity. No other means could be substituted with advantage." He then refers to patients who refuse food and struggle with dreadful energy and who must be restrained and fed as a question of life or death to them. " Every physician has had occasion to observe those destructive patients whose irresistible impulse to tear and destroy every thing within reach noth- ing can check." He says that though these are exceptional cases, if 1293 allowed freedom of movement thev would utterly destfoy their cloth- ing, bedding, etc., and adds: " To thwart this instinct of destruction, are they, when otherwise inoffensive, to be shut up entirely nude for whole weeks and months i n a cell ? or must they be su bjected to the pun- ishment of being held fast by attendants, whose patients cannot well be indefinitely depended upon ? A suitably applied camisole is a much more practical means of meeting such emergencies. Every one has seen patients possessed during their periodic paroxysms with irresisti- ble and persistent suicidal and homicidal impulses. They even come themselves to beg the application of the camisole, which in certain cases affords them a sufficient guaranty against their own dangerous tendencies." He then refers to a strong case in his own experience, when a young man in a paroxysm had inflicted a severe wound with a butcher knife on another person in an attempt at homicide, who had several paroxysms lasting from fifteen days to three weeks, and at such times had " himself begged to have the camisole applied, " and adds, " this very simple means permitted him during his period of delirium to exercise freely and to enjoy, under suitable surveil- lance, the common life of the place. Would it have been better, in accordance with the new ideas which men would impress on us as progress, to have shut him up in a padded and dark cell ? " He re- fers also to epileptics with violent and furious delirium, and after giving an illustrative case asks: "How should we have succeeded in giving him the necessary care which probably saved his life at that juncture, had we not been able, by means of a camisole suf- ficiently large and well-supplied, to keep him in bed ? who could have wished to compel attendants, at the risk of being killed or grievously wounded, to restrain the patient day and night ? These means would have been absolutely impracticable. Restraint applied by the hands of attendants is in most cases impossible, and seclusion in a dark and padded cell is a form of restraint harsher than the application of the camisole. It is prejudicial to the patient in every point of view ; it prevents his taking the exercise necessary for his health, and enjoy- ing in the open air this relative liberty, indispensable as it is to the performance of his different functions. " After again stating that it should be employed in exceptional cases, he says: " Its absolute and systematic suppression, and its substitution by other means, such as restraint applied by attendants or prolonged seclusion in a cell, con- stitute, I repeat, a more objectionable and deplorable means of re- straint', and one which is but erroneously dignified with the name of " philanthropy. " He then refers to the use of restraint in England and concludes : . " Conolly wished to bring about a reaction against deplorable abuses but to Pinel belongs the immortal honor of having put non- restraiiit into practice, and if he did not invent the word, he dis- covered the method. Since his time lunatics have been treated like all patients, with humanity, and they enjoy a freedom, relative, without doubt, but as complete as possible. According to the pre- cepts of this great teacher, the camisole ought only to be applied in 1294 cases really exceptional, and the means which it is proposed to sub- stitute for it by a sort of infatuation and reaction have, from all points of view, more serious inconveniences. The English them- selves are abandoning this latter method ; let us render homage to their practical spirit and not seek to renew in France an experiment upon which our judgment has long since been passed, and against which our neighbors across the channel are themselves now protest- ing. " M. Magnan, after speaking of his use of restraint, preferred the muff to the camisole, but after visiting the asylum at Sainte Anne, says: " I was surprised to see patients in a great state of agitation, completely free. The attendants, readily excited, as you know, in the presence of excited lunatics, seemed, on the contrary, very calm. When the patients reach an inordinate degree of agitation they are shut up in padded cells " He then resolved to try the same methods, and had been continuing them, with his colleague, M. Bouchereau. This would seem to be restraint by seclusion. M. Labite— "If we wish to calm excited patients we have only to put them into an immense court. Thus, if you put twenty into a hectare of land, they isolate themselves and eventually become tranquil. In my institution the men, who have large airing-courts, are less excited than the women, whose courts are smaller. " At the September meeting of the society, M. Bouchereau said he could only repeat what M. Magnan had said on the question at the last meeting. To questions by M. Legrand du Saulle, as to how he managed cases of suicidal melancholia, especially at night, and maniacal and epileptic furor, M. Bouchereau replied, that in his insti- tution all patients of that category were placed together in the same ward, and during the night they were under the surveillance of two night-watches, and that " the latter patients are put in padded cells without camisoles. " M. Motet believed that the use of the camisole was more humane than that of non-restraint. " Surely it was preferable, when the patient was maniacal, to employ a mode of restraint so long in use rathdr than to have him held by five, six, or even eight attendants who compress the patient and cause ecchymoses aud sometimes even luxations." He referred to accidents and fractures " caused by the suppression of the camisole and the intervention of attendants. " He declared " the camisole, as employed at the present time, is not an instrument of torture, as people are too prone to speak of it, but its application, made in moderation and only when tbe thing is indis- pensable, was even a humane measure. M. Luys could only corroborate M. Motet's observations as regard- ing himself; when he saw the struggles which take place between patients and attendants, he always gave preference to the camisole. M. Mabille entertained the same views, and he stated the case of a patient from Ville-Evrard, with ideas of suicide, who came from another asylum with a complete loss of his hair. To preclude the possibility of a similar accident they had lost no time in applying a camisole and fixing him to a chair. 1295 M. Bouchereau did not think that he had yet absolutely carried ont non-restraint in his practice. If he applied it in his service, it was by way of experiment and comparison with the system hereto- fore generally adopted. _ M. Christian, at a subsequent meeting of the society where the discussion was continued, after referring to the unquestioned use of restraint by ordinary practitioners, and in ordinary hospitals in cases of surgical operations where chloroform is not "used, and also in cases of delirium where persons got out of bed in the night aud disturbed the associates in the whole ward, went on to ask : " Do you believe that one would hesitate to fix him in bed and, if necessary, to apply a camisole ? Indeed, families themselves, be their social status what it may, have no such scruples. When one of their members, under the visitation of disease, becomes boisterous, violent and dangerous, he is rendered incapable of self-injury by restraint; and with what gentleness this is applied, )ou may gather from the condition of the unfortunates who are brought to us covered with contusions and abrasions, and bearing on their ankles and wrists the visible traces of the cords with which they have been bound." He remarks that it is the safety and interest of the patient him- self which demands the restraint. "The madman must be pre- vented from injuring himself and others, and here we have a motive before which every other consideration must yield." He deprecates seclusion, and quotes from Pinel upon that point. After referring to the history of the reformation of asylums and the claims that have been set forth in favor of non-restraint, he thus refers to the substitutes : " It may be a padded cell in which the patient can be abandoned to himself without fear of self-injury; gloves like those used by boxers or fencers which they apply to prevent him from injuring himself or others, or garments of a thick, substantial fabric buttoned behind, and used to prevent his removing or destroying them ; or again, they may envelop him in a sheet; finally and especially, it is surveillance, a surveillance exercised every instant by two, four, or it inny be six of these model attendants, who delicately seize the patient in their robust arms whenever he becomes too boisterous, and without struggle, without violence, have him glide into the padded cell." He refers to the experience of England, Germany and Switzer- land for some years, where efforts had been made to adopt non- restraint, and to'the remarks of Dagonet at the former discussion, and quotes the words of Dr. Laehr: "I know no alienist in Ger- many who accepts non-restraint in an absolute manner. Nor is there any who voluntarily adopts means of restraint and applies them sys- tematically," and adds: "I venture to say that in France we are all of the same opinion. We avoid restraint as much as possible, but when it is imposed on us by force of circumstances it is our duty to apply it, for we have to protect the madman against himself, and ourselves against him. 1296 Conolly himself was unable to do otherwise, and to attribute to him the honor of a great discovery is really to be satisfied with mere words." He then refers to the various strictures that had been made in re- gard to the use of the camisole, and to his own experience at Mare- ville and Charenton, and adds: " I use the camisole, but I use it as seldom as possible. On an average I have never had two per cent of patients on wdiom it was applied. * * * Finally it is only used on a physician's order and under his control. Not only does it not hamper the patient's movements, but it enables him to move about at liberty, and if need be, he may be afforded sufficiently free motion of the arms and hands. If, in viewing the question from its sentimental aspect, you deplore the insult offered to manly dignity by camisoling a fellow- creature, let me ask if this manly dignity is not already compromised by the fact of patients covering themselves with ordure, denuding and mutilating themselves and striking those about them ? Is this anything more than a piece of humanitarian sentimentalism ?' I may say that for me, the camisole possesses one immense advantage. It prevents struggling between the patient and his attendants. Were this the only reason for retaining its use it would appear to me all sufficient." After alluding to the difficulty of always obtaining at- tendants who have the necessary patience and indifference to insult which is acquired only by reflection and a high sense of duty, he refers, as a last consideration, to the frequency of rib fractures and other injuries from non-restraint, and adds: "This has become so common that the question has been raised forsooth whether the bony system of lunatics is not more friable; if their blood has not a tend- ency to decompose. I do not know wdiat foundation tliere is for this supposition. I only know that in France we have as yet seen nothing of the kind. I know that this singular alteration of the bones and blood only occurs in non-restraint asylums, and should I appear sceptical I believe that the best prophylaxis will be to-dis- pense with the gentleness of model attendants, and return to the humane and reasonable use of the camisole." M. Delasiauve to the question: "Is it true that the methods of treatment extolled by Conolly differ in essence from our own, or that they are at all superior," answered with an emphatic negative, and declared that there were patients who must be restrained in some way or another, and would give the preference to the camisole over padded cells and restraint at the hands of attendants.' He added: "But let it be well understood that non-restraint being the rule with us as with our neighbors, the use of the camisole only applies to the very exceptional cases where restraint is necessary." As a practical illustration he stated that at Quatremares, with 550 to 600 patients, only from four to seven were in camisoles, which he considered " did not point to any inferiority on their part." M. Lunier expressed the opinion that mechanical restraint might 1297 still further be reduced with a more numerous corps of attendants; that there ought never to be less than one to every fourteen patients; that win e favoring the greatest limit of its use " complete suppres- sion ot the camisole seemed an impossibility." M. Lasegue cited two cases showing the advantages and drawbacks ot the camisole. In one instance the friends of the patient, horror- stricken at the suggestion of the camisole, themselves "subsequently bound the maniac with ropes in such a manner that his wrists still bear the marks of the restraint." The other was in an ordinary hospital where a typhoid fever patient " was clumsily camisoled bv a nurse and found dead on the following mornino-." _ M. Foville fully indorsed the paper of M. Christian on the ques- tion of restraint. _ From an examination of the last report of the English Commis- sioners in Lunacy, we are forced to the conclusion that non-restraint does not mean, in practice at least, the abolition of physical restraint or coercion, or even the abolition of mechanical means of restraint; and the commissioners have nowhere directed or even recommended the discontinuance of such measures. They use these words : " Re- straint appears to be a method of dealing with the more uno-overn- able cases." They also apply the word "treatment" when speaking of restraint. The memoranda or records of their visitations in fifty-nine public asylums shows that in twenty-seven of them, such mechanical means of restraint were used as camisoles, locked gloves, waistcoat, strait- waistcoat, strong sleeves, jacket, ancl vest. And also such expres- sions as " hands tied," " hands fastened to the side," and " tied and secured to the bed," and they record iu one of the wards of one in- stitution, " sixteen women who, owing to destructive habits, were wearing exceptionally strong dresses." These methods are recorded by the commissioners as being used for surgical reasons, for violence and destructiveness, for picking the face, to prevent suicide, for de- structive propensities, for extreme violence, for self-in jury, self-mu- tilation, persistent destructiveness. In five other institutions where the above means are not said to have been used, packing, either with wet sheets or dry sheets, has been used for medical reasons; to allay excitement; to prevent exhaustion; for the treatment of acute mania; and in one instance the commissioners remark for " acute mania and with beneficial results." In one of these institutions where both wet and dry packing were used three, four, nine, and even ten hours, the commissioners remark : " Considering that this is absolute restraint of a very complete kind, it is important that it be not unduly prolonged, and in our opinion should never exceed six hours continuously." In one other institution where the com- missioners say restraint is rarely if ever used, they say: " The occa- sions on wliich the men were placed in the shower bath appear to have been 259 ; of women there are 118 entries of this treatment." This is an institution with 6^9 patients. They do not record the cases held by attendants though they refer 163 U 1298 ■'■- in one instance to an institution where no restraint is recorded where they wrere called upon to inquire into a case on the score of "harsh and unkind treatment by an attendant," in which they exonerated the attendant, finding that the " patient had been violent, requiring a certain amount of manual control and coercion.'' In another in- stitution where they speak of no instances of mechanical restraint, and where there were complaints of " ill-treatment at the hands of attendants," they say that after full inquiry they would state that " no more coercion was used than was absolutely necessary in the circumstances." Including under mechanical restraint wet and dry packing, which the commissioners characterize as absolute and complete restraint, there are thirty-two out of fifty-nine institutions where such means are found to be absolutely necessary. Seclusion is recorded as being used in forty-nine of the fifty-nine institutions. Generally the rea- sons for seclusion are not given. In the report,, as far as they are stated, they were for maniacal excitement, for acute mania, for vio- lent and dangerous cases, and for violent and troublesome patients. The attention of the commissioners being called to the question of unlocked doors they make this remark: " The question of having unlocked doors in the asylum appears to have been under discussion here. Where so many lunatics, a large percentage being suicidal or dangerous to others, are congregated, we cannot approve of a pro- ject which appears to be attended by much risk without correspond- ing advantage." It would seem that the English superintendents and the commis- sioners have the same exceptional classes to deal with, and that they find in practice some mode of protective restraint must be resorted to. Their variations of practice would indicate that, instead of a settled conviction of the benefit of some particular method,- they were disposed rather by a variety of means to apply whatever might be the best to accomplish the desired object of necessary protective control with'the least discomfort and risk to the patient. We are obliged to take it for granted that those who have figured as advo- cates of non-restraint do not really mean the abandonment of all * coercive measures, for after all, seclusion against the will of the pa- tient, or the use of padded rooms, wet and dry packing, showering and manual force of attendants, can be regarded in no other light than as restraint. I think it must be admitted from the foregoing that there is no real difference in principle among experienced professional men who have devoted their lives to this branch of science applied to the practical^ ends of humanity and benevolence. Compared with the manner in which the insane were treated in former times the present system is indeed one of "non-restraint." Intelligent medication, exercise in the fresh air, good and abundant food, moderate and pleasant amusements, congenial occupation, as far as practicable, combined with comfortable surroundings, have proved a sufficient treatment for the greater proportion of the insane, so far, at least, 1299 as to make the necessity of forcible means and mechanical appliances the " exception to the rule." But as these exceptional cases do exist on the universal confession, and always will, they require ex- ceptional treatment. How their best and most humane care can be accomplished is the serious problem that brings itself to every con- scientious mind. The principles on which all must agree are simplv these: The guiding object should be the welfare of the patient (not forgetting also the safety of those about him), his care and cure in the surest and speediest manner possible. The responsibility of all measures to these ends must rest upon medical decision and judgment alone; whether control over extreme violence, manifest- ing itself suicidally or homicidally, shall be established by the simplest mechanical restraint, or by' drugs, or by the application of water in shower baths, or by wet packing, or by the hands of attend- ants, with all the risks of personal struggles, or by seclusion in rooms with or without clothing or bedding, with the risk of self- injiiiry, by such means as still remain to the patient, or by any other measures known to science and experience, must all depend ulti- mately upon what the medical man on the whole shall deem best for the patient. All this must come under the one head of medical care and treatment, precisely as is the case with the physician in general practice in the treatment of other diseases, or the treatment of any diseases in any ordinary hospital, with this difference, per- haps, that whatever the physician in the case of the insane in hos- pitals advises, he is expected to see carried out. Wherever the question of restraint arises in connection with any individual case among his patients, he must judge of the nature and extent of that restraint, and he must be presumed to know and be able to judge between what is cruel and what is humane, protective and curative, as well as the surgCon knows and judges in his operations between necessary pain and useless barbarity. I would close this with what I uttered twenty years ago : " We look upon restraint and seclusion, directed and controlled by a conscientious and intelligent medical man, as among the valu- able alleviating and remedial agents in the care and cure of the in- sane. That they are agreeable in their application or use, either to the physician or patient, no one will maintain. Indeed, few, if any, medical prescriptions are agreeable. The bitter and nauseating draughts, the abstinence in diet, the seclusion of tbe patient to the sick-room, and the exclusion therefrom of friends, are prescriptions for the cure of disease, as are the knife and appliances of surgery, and they are adopted and prescribed as such. The physician who would not administer the best remedy because it might offend the taste or the surgeon who should not use the knife, or other means, because he might thereby cause pain ; or the obstetrician who would lay aside under any such consideration, the remedies required in critical cases, would be unworthy of the profession, and the confi- dence of the public." 1300 EXHIBIT No. 43. Commitment, Detention and Discharge of Patients. When abroad, in 1879, I gave special attention to the questions of commitment, detention and discharge of patients ; also to the gen- eral management, internal and otherwise, of hospitals for the insane, privileges granted, occupation, treatment, etc. I had the honor and good fortune to meet some of the Commissioners of Lunacy, and among them the distinguished chairman, the Right Honorable the Earl of Shaftesbury ; also some of the most prominent present and Ex-Chancery Visitors in Lunacy and many of the medical super- intendents. From these gentlemen, as well as from personal ob- servation, I was able to obtain knowledge of the law and practice obtaining, and of the government, general and internal, of hospitals for the insane. 1 was strongly impressed with the close resemblance of the law and practice of the State of New York in regard to the admission and discharge of patients, the guarantees, however, being greater in New York than in Great Britain, especially in respect of medical certificates and official magisterial interference. The New York law and practice in respect of discharge is also much simpler in regard to both private and public patients. In the appendix of my report for 1878 I presented the resemblances and differences in these and other respects between the English Lunacy Statutes and those of New York. I beg to present here, the opinions on the English and Scotch laws, in their practical application, on the most important matters which concern the insane, which were given before a Parliamentary Com- mission of 1877 under a resolution of Parliament ordering " That a select committee be appointed to inquire into the operation of the lunacy law, so far as regards the security afforded by it against vio- lations of personal liberty." I might have summarized the matter and thus brought it into briefer space, but it seemed best, as far as possible, to give the exact language used. I have drawn from the testimony of men of large experience and great distinction in connection with the care of the insane and management of hospitals, as wrell as from the testimony of officials exercising governmental supervision, and it is an interest- ing and significant fact that the opinions expressed before that com- mission by the distinguished medical men called before it were fully indorsed by Lord Shaftesbury, a man of such a vast experience and such illustrious name in the annals of philanthropy in connection with the care of the insane. The unanimous opinion of the law held by such men on all vital points concerning the care of the insane, and indorsed by such an authority as Lord Shaftesbury, should be conclusive of its wisdom and practicability. The English law in regard to medical certificates is much simpler and much less guarded than that of the State of New York. Two medical certificates are required in cases of private patients, and but 1301 one in the case of paupers and no medical certificates in the case of chancery patients. All the qualification requires is that the medical men " shall be registered physicians or apothecaries." They are not required to be approved by any judicial or other authority. In New York the law requires in all case's, private or public, two medical cer- tificates, and these must be made under oath by medical men author- ized as examiners, and the certificates must be approved in writing by a judge. Mr. Perceval, Secretary of the Lunacy Commissioners, on his ex- amination before the Parliamentary Committee of 1877, testified in answer to the question, " Is it necessary that the two medical men who signed the certificates should be qualified practitioners? " that up to 1858 there were no qualifications specified ; that patients could be sent by a physician, apothecary, or surgeon ; that the medical act of 1858 provided for the registration of all medical practitioners, and when the lunacy acts were last amended, in 1862, advantage was taken of that circumstance to get a proper definition of the words ' physician, apothecary, or surgeon.' These words throughout the lunacy acts now mean medical practitioners registered under the act of 1858, and no other person can sign a certificate. " Q. He may be a physician, surgeon, or apothecary ? " A. He may be a physician, surgeon, or apothecary. We do not care what he is, so long as he is a registered medical practitioner. He has such a qualification as entitles him to be on the register, and that is sufficient." The English lawT provides that the medical man must have seen a patient within seven days before admission ; copies of the certifi- cates are sent to the Commissioners in Lunacy within twenty-four hours after the admission of the patient, and any defects may be remeded within fourteen days after being issued, and the certificates must always be in form. The New York law provides that the certificates must be in form as required by the Commissioners in Lunacy, and must be completed and approved by the court within five days. Mr. Perceval testified in regard to private patients that two medi- cal certificates and a request, or order, by some friend or acquaintance is all that is required ; in regard to public patients an order of the magistrate accompanied by one certificate. To the question whether the certificates should not be countersigned by some public officer he answered : " I do not think there would be any additional protec- tion to the patient at all; but there are of course two sides to every question, and you would interpose an additional difficulty, no doubt, if that is your objection upon that which is hard enough already." " Q. I wish to know whether you do not think there should be some public officer, or some public record of the incarceration of people against their will ? "A. You have a public record, and I do not personally think that the intervention of a public officer would be of any material value at all to the liberty of the subject. It would certainly not be a ma- 1302 terial guaranty, and it would oppose an additional difficulty to the earlier treatment of insanity, which is so very important. " Q. Are there different forms of insanity, some of which may be aggravated by early treatment, and others cured.? "A. That is a medical question which I will leave, if you will allow me, to the medical witnesses." Mr. James Wilkes, one of the Commissioners of Lunacy, in answer to the question: " Do you think the protections which the law at present provides against the detention of persons who are not luna- tics are quite sufficient to protect the interests and person of the sub- ject ?" replied : " I think they are ; I must say that if I myself were to be insane, or had any one belonging to me afflicted in that way, I should place perfect reliance in the present safeguards which the certificates and orders provide. " Q. Do you regard the medical certificate as in itself a personal protection to liberty ? "A. Of course it would not be, apart from the order and the statement, but is a most important thing in deciding on the insanity or not of a patient, and as to the propriety of placing that patient under care and treatment. " Do you think the precaution which the law at present provides sufficient ? A. Yes, sir. " Q. The certificate now is permanent, lasting until the patient is discharged ; do you think that is a good thing, or that the certificate ought to be for a limited time and renewable? "A. I do not think there is any necessity for renewing it. Many of the patients in licensed houses are very poor ; they are received and kept really at rates which are little above pauper rates, and any additional certificate would be a tax upon the friends, for I presume it would fall on the friends, and I really do not know what good it would do. " Q. I understood you to say that you think it desirable in all cases that they should be very early treated ? "A.I think so. " Q. You make no exception ? " A. No, sir. There may be an exception as to the period ; it de- pends upon what is called early treatment. There might be some very slight insanity, a first attack, which gets well'very rapidly, per- haps before any one would tliink of removing a patient to an asylum. " Q. You think there are no cases of a very excitable temperament, in which, being sent to those places, miglit increase the complaint and tendency to mania ? " A. No, sir; I do not think so. I think the removal from home associations, and from the exciting causes of the disease, tends very rapidly to the recovery of the patient." 1303 > Dr. J. Lockhart Robertson, one of the Lord Chancellor's visitors in lunacy, and previously a medical superintendent, was examined. Io the question as to qualifications of the physician, he replied: " I do not think a special knowledge of lunacy is so important as being a well-educated physician. " Q. Are you of the opinion that the present mode, by the certifi- cate of two medical men, surgeons for instance, or apothecaries, is a sufficient safeguard to the liberty of the subject ? " A. I tliink it is. I think tlie difficulty is to get the certificates. I think medical men are so afraid of actions that the great difficulty is to get the certificates signed. In an urgent case early treatment is, of course, of great importance to the patient. " Q. You are decidedly of the opinion that the safeguards against the improper admission and detention of persons in'asylums, hos- pitals and licensed houses are practically sufficient, and that a more complicated system of checks would do more harm than good ? "A. Yes, decidedly." Dr. Robertson expressed the opinion that it might be desirable to have some official order by a magistrate in cases of private patients; this would give protection to the friends as well as the physicians making the certificates. Dr. J. Crichton Browne, Lord Chancellor's visitor in lunacy, and previously a medical superintendent, was examined. " Q. I will ask you the same question that I asked Dr. Robertson. Are you decidedly of the opinion that the safeguards against the im- proper admission and detention of persons in asylums are practically sufficient, and that a more complicated system of checks would do more harm than good ? " A. I am. " Q. That is an opinion based on your experience- in your official capacity, and also on your previous experience? "A. It is. " Q. I do not know whether you concur with Dr. Robertson in the opinion that the additional order, or inquiry, before a magistrate might be desirable in the case of private patients, generally speaking. " A. Before a magistrate? " Q. Yes, such a one as is now in use with regard to pauper patients ? "A. I really do not believe that there would be any additional security in such a provision ; iu signing the orders for pauper patients many magistrates regard it, if a certificate is in due form, as a ministerial act. They sign the order merely as a matter of course. Such an arrangement with reference to private patients might cause delay, as it does sometimes in the case of paupers when there is a difficulty in finding a magistrate. I think, also, it might increase the prejudice against asylum treatment. The public would look upon insanity as in some way connected with crime, if a patient had • to be taken before a magistrate. 1304 " Q. Would you recommend that the certificates should be renewed from time to time i " A. I have thought over that and I do not tliink that would be any additional safeguard. " Q. Might not some system of medical referees in such a case possibly be established instead of taking any chance medical man that comes first ? Might there not be some person who would pass an examination in mental diseases, to whom all these cases might be referred instead of taking the first chance medical man '. " A. It might be so, but I think it would tend rather to diminish public confidence to have specialists signing certificates. The public would come to associate them with mad doctors, and my impression is that it is better to have general practitioners sign the certificate. The public have more confidence in the decision of the ordinary family doctor." Dr. Browne's treatment was that the early treatment was of the greatest possible value. Dr. John Charles Bucknill, over eighteen years a medical super- intendent and Lord Chancellor's visitor in lunacy thirteen and one- half years, testified: " Q. With reference to the admission of private patients into asy- lums and their discharge, what do you think the principle of that ought to be \ "A. I tliink the principle should be to make the admission as easy as possible; in order to provide for early treatment, and to make the discharge as easy as possible ; in order also to provide for early treatment, for if there is difficulty in getting a patient out of asy- lums there will be a disinclination to send them in. This is a point which has been very well worked out by the Scotch Commissioners in Lunacy and they have proved it by statistics." Dr. Bucknill expressed the opinion that with the medical certifi- cates in case of private patients, the law should provide that the per- son who gave the order should bear some relation to the patients, saying: " As to the person himself, the statute gives no indication as to who the person should be, and in point of fact aud practice the most improper persons may sign the order. A gentleman's foot- man may sign for the gentleman's son ; a foreigner will sign for his lunatic friend and leave the country immediately : a solicitor's clerk will sign ; all manner of people will sign, people who cannot be held responsible. " Q. You think the order is considered more as a matter of form and that the certificate of the medical man is really relied upon ? " A. No ; the real power is possessed by the man who signs the order. The certificate and the order go together; with regard to the admission, the patient once admitted, the man who signs the order holds the staff to such an extent that the patient cannot be re- moved from the asylum unless the person who signed the order is incapable. If he becomes incapable, by disease or by insanity, of if 1305 he is dead, or has left the country, then the statute lays down the rule that certain other persons may order the discharge ; but other- wise, if he is not incapable, no one but the person who has signed the order can procure the discharge of a patient once admitted into a licensed house or an hospital. " Q. What remedy would you propose for such a state of things as that ? " A. It is very difficult to meddle with the existing forms with- out increasing the difficulty of obtaining early treatment; I think that the rule which had been laid down with regard to the discharge of patients from asylums, namely, that if a man who signs the order is incapable, then the husband or wife could act, and if tliere be no husband or wife, then the father or mother or the next of kin may very well be introduced in the order for admission, that if a pa- tient has a husband or wife, he or she should sign the order, or in default, the father or mother, or next of kin, or a solicitor could for any of these, or, in case of a lunatic who has no relative to be found, 1 think a solicitor might be employed to act for any friend. " Q. You have traveled a good deal in America and examined the state of things there. Can you tell us what the American law is in regard to the admission and detention of persons in asylums ? " A. It varies in every State. A good deal of change has taken place quite recently; the State of New York seems to have made the best change. There thevcertificates before the year before last j, could be signed by any two 'men calling themselves medical men. The new law requires that they shall be qualified medical men, and that they shall also have a certificate from some judge of a court of record, to whom they are personally known as competent for their duties. An attempt is being made to create a class of medical men who understand something about insanity, and are capable of giving certificates. " Q. Have you considered whether easy discharge from asylums would tend to"the more frequent admissions to the asylums in the early stages of the disorder, and to the early treatment of the dis- ease? " A. Sir James Coxe has clearly pointed out that not only the highest percentage of cases, but the shortest duration of treatment in Scotland is found in the Renfrewshire asylums, which are paro- chial asylums, in which the inspectors of the poor can put a patient on the outbreak of insanity, without any difficulty, and also remove I him without any difficulty whatever. He points out that the au- thorities of asylums might, perhaps, unwillingly increase the indis- position to place patients in asylums by throwing impediments in • the way of their easy removal from asylums. I take it that the succession of events which Sir James points out is this, that you get easy discharge from these Renfrewshire parochial asylums; there- fore you get early treatment, and a much larger percentage of cures effected in short time. 164 U 1306 " Q. You think that in all cases it is a great object to get early treatment ? " A. Yes, I tliink that is the greatest point to aim at. " Q. Therefore if the facility of obtaining the discharge would in- duce the people to send all patients in the early stages to the asylums the percentage of cures would be greater, and the cures would be more rapid ? " A. Yes ; that is exactly what I mean." Sir James Coxe of the Board of Lunacy in Scotland testified : " Q. In the report of the General Board of Commissioners of Lunacy for Scotland for the year 1859, signed by yourself, there are one or two paragraphs which I should like to read to you. ' It can- not be too often repeated, that in the treatment of insanity loss of time is unfavorable to recovery, or that every impediment that is thrown in the way of immediate treatment acts most prejudicially upon the patient, by tending to render permanent the aberration from normal action, which, under favorable circumstances, would speedily have subsided ;' is that your opinion ? "A. Yes, sir. " Q. We are, therefore, of opinion that asylums are capable of ren- dering to mankind far greater services than they have yet achieved; is that also your opinion now ? " A. Yes, sir; Sir James Coxe testified that the medical certificates were acted upon in Scotland by the sheriff.* 'In the case of the sheriff there is no reference to any independent medical man at present.' " Q. The sheriff himself determines for himself whether the grounds stated for the medical men are sufficient ? " A. Yes. " Q. He does not refer it to any independent medical man ? " A. No, he judges for himself. " Q. In your judgment, would it be an improvement that the cer- tificates, before being acted upon, should be, if necessary, canvassed, and further inquiry directed by some independent medical official ? " A. I tliink it would merely complicate matters. " Q. You think in practice it is a sufficient precaution, the sheriff examining the certificates and the grounds stated in them ? " A. I think so. Dr. Harrington Tuke, Fellow of the Royal College of Physicians of Loildon, having had practice at Han well under Dr. Conolly, and at present having charge of a private asylum at Chiswick, testified: " Q. Would you suggest that no certificates -should be signed ex- cept by medical men wdio had special practice in lunacy'? * Note.—The sheriff in Scotland approves certificates instead of the judges as in the State of New York. His office is still that of a local judge, and not merely ministerial, as in England. 1307 " A. I would rather suggest that the knowledge of lunacy should be made more general than it is. " Q- You would not have a special class of medical men for lunacy cases ? "A. No, I think not. " Q. We have had the opinion already expressed both ways, that there should be a special class of medical men, skilled in lunacy, who should sign one of these certificates, and also that it would be a mischievous thing to have any special class of that sort ? "A. I think there would be less confidence of the public in specialists in any particular class than any two physicians taken at hazard, but I think that the physicians should be better trained. " Q. Are you of opinion that it would be desirable also that the medical certificate should have a temporary effect, or that the certifi- cate should be signed by medical men who had special knowledge of lunacy ? " A. No, I am not so ; the result of giving it to special medical men would lead to still greater distrust than there is at present, be- cause, as far as I have seen, the ignorance of medical men leads them to refuse to sign medical certificates. " Q. Would you not think it desirable to limit the effect of the certificate ? " A. No, it would lead to so much mischief in so many cases that I doubt its efficacy. It would do so much mischief to the patient by the necessity of a fresh examination, and then there are actually so few cases where there is any doubt, that it would be a great pity to make a general rule for them. " Q. Do you consider that if any obstacles were placed in the way of the committal of the insane to public or private asylums that would have a tendency to interfere with the cure and with that early treatment, which, we have some evidence, is thought to be necessary for cure? " A. Any delay in instant medical treatment is most disastrous. Dr. Conolly and myself wTent over the statistics of three asylums with which we were connected. We found that seventy-seven per cent that were treated under three months recovered ; those that were treated later diminished in an absolute geometrical ratio, until at last it sank to, after twelve months, something like twenty per cent fully cured. I think any obstacle in the way of medical treatment, either in an asylum or otherwise, most injurious." ' Dr Henry Maudsley, a physician, practicing in London, testified that in his opinion, the law "with regard to the admission of patients is sufficiently stringent and quite as stringent as can be properly consistent with the treatment of insanity in its early stages." He testified that if insanity was to be cured the person must be put under treatment early, " because recoveries are entirely in propor- tion to the early stage at which treatment is adopted. It regulations are made more'stringent than they are now (and, indeed, the present 1308 regulation operates to some extent in that direction), the friends of patients will, instead of sending them from home, as is almost essen- tial in the case of insanity — unlike, in this respect, other diseases — keep them at home under improper conditions, and so very much in- jure the chance of recovery." As to any alteration in the law touching the certificates he testi- fied : " I have considered the matter. If it is considered desirable, as I have heard suggested, that the certificates should go before some public official before they were acted upon, it seems to me that no public official would be in a better qualified position to judge of the value of the certificates than the commissioners, to whom exact copies are sent within twenty-four hours ; indeed, not really so much so. If he entered really into the matter in each case it would be a very anxious responsibility and a formidable matter for him to un- dertake ; and, if he did not, would simply become a mere matter of routine, adding to the publicity, adding to the expense, and adding to the delay of getting a patient under care, and would make the early treatment more difficult than it is." Again, he testified that people " would shrink very much in- deed, according to my experience, from having a public officer come in to proclaim, say a young lady at eighteen, a lunatic, or a wife after child-birth who is insane, perhaps, for a month or two. To a professional man such a public thing might be almost ruin." "Q. Would there be a greater publicity in that way than there- would be from a certificate given by a medical man in the neighbor- hood ? " A. Yes, it would be thought so; because, as a matter of fact, certificates are often given in this way: The medical man of the family, who is in regular attendance, gives one of the certificates. He calls in a physician in consultation, who then sees the case sepa- rately afterward and gives the second certificate. There is no alarm of the patient. It is simply an ordinary matter of consultation as it appears to him. Dr. Duckioorih Williams, medical superintendent of Sussex County Asylum, Hayward's Heath, testified : " Q. Do you attach importance to the pauper lunatics being sent early to the asylum ? " A. Very great. " Q. From the lunatic wards of the work-house ? "A. They should be sent at once, in my opinion, without going to the lunatic wards at all. "Q. You think that as soon as the ordinary forms are complied with the patient should go at once to the asylum and not go to the work-house first ? "A. Certainly. " Q. Do you say that because you think tliere is more chance of cure in such cases ? 1309 " A. Because thore is more chance of 'cure, and also on the score of economy." Dr. Williams testified to the evil of. insane being taken to the work-houses without any certificate, which was the common customs and in condemning this, he spoke the opinion of all the authorities. The Right Honorable the Earl of Shaftesbury attended before the committee by permission of the House of Lords, and was ex- amined. _ He testified that he had been a member of the lunacy commission " now close upon fifty years. I was associated with Lord Gordon on the first committee of inquiry in 1828, then in 1829, in bringing in the first bill received since that time ; for twenty years I was in the habit of visiting continually." He was perma- nent chairman from 1845. He testified to the law generally and to changes from time to time in the statutes. " Q. Do you consider that the facility with which patients are ad- mitted into asylums is not too great at the present time ? " A. No, certainly not. I think that the whole of our experience confirms us in the opinion that it is not. We stated so in 1859 and we state it still more emphatically now. I cannot recollect a single instance in which a patient has been brought into my asylum in whose case there were not sufficient grounds for saying that he was a proper subject for cure and treatment; I can hardly recollect a single instance. I see, by referring to the evidence which has already been given before your honorable committee, that such is the testimony of every man of experience who has been consulted on the matter. It was likewise the opinion of the committee that sat in 1859, for they reported in that sense. " Q. At the same time there is a feeling which has been expressed, not only generally but by witnesses before the committee, that a large number of persons are admitted to the asylums in a state of sanity and kept there? " A. I have no doubt those statements would be made, because I never knew the case of a patient, either under confinement or after confinement, who did not say that he had been most unjustly con- fined. I hardly know an instance. 1 do not know that any instances have been adduced to prove the truth of that allegation. " Q. At any rate, it is your lordship's opinion that the admission of patients into an asylum is now sufficiently guarded ? " A. I think so. " Q. Would you say the same with regard to their detention there ? Is it not the case that they are sometimes kept there longer than is necessary ? " A. I do not think they are so now ; it was rather my opinion in 1859 that under some circumstances they may have been detained beyond the time that it .was absolutely necessary, but then I tliink that a o-reat deal was to be said in extenuation of that. It is a great responsibility to send out a patient upon the world, both with re- spect to the'patient himself and in respect to society, before you are I 1310 satisfied that he is cured or, at any rate, in such a state that he can be safely trusted. Since 1859, I should very much modify the opinion I then gave. "Q. Does your lordship consider that many of the stories that we hear, from time to time, of conspiracies and of ill-treatment are themselves delusions in the minds of people who are intending to say what is accurate ? " A. I tliink so, and it is a very remarkable thing that in many instances one of the first indications that a man gives, or a woman gives, of a state of aberration, is the belief of a conspiracy. I have never heard of a conspiracy being formed for a purpose of that de- scription." In regard to chronic cases and others being taken first to the work-' house, his lordship testified : " I think it highly necessary that in every instance the patient should go to the asylum first and pass from the asylum to the work- house, and not from the work-house to the asylum, which is very often the case. Lie gets into the work-house and there is detained, when if he went to the asylum it would be adjudged at once whether he was a fit case for the asylum ; and if not, he would be sent back to the work-house. In that way a great number of the recent cases are kept back to a very late period when they might have been treated and sent back to the world perfectly well. " Q. The practice is exactly the reverse of what it ought to be? "A. Yes." He testified concerning suicidal and homicidal cases to show the absolute necessity of taking those cases in due time. After dealing with the statistics of suicide at large he stated that there were then in confinement in the various asylums six thou- sand and ninety-six suicidal patients. Referring to the criminal asy- lum at Broadmoor, he said that leaving out all that there were there for minor cases "there are one hundred and forty-five men charged with murder. In seventy-five cases the insanity was not recognized before the commission of the crime. In twenty-nine, insanity was recognized, but the persons were reputed harmless. In thirty-three, the insanity was recognized in the persons, not probably recognized as being altogether harmless, but insufficient precautions were taken. In eight, exact circumstances were not known. " Of ninety-eight, " charged with attempts at murder, maiming or stabbing, in forty-two the disease was not recognized before the com- mission of the crime; in twenty-nine, they were reputed harmless, of twelve, insufficient care was taken, and in fifteen, the exact circum- stances were not known. When you come to the women there are seventy-one women charged with murder; in twenty-eight, the in- sanity was not recognized before the commission of the crime; in thirteen, the insanity was recognized but the persons were reputed harmless. In twenty-three, the insanity was recognized and the per- sons were not regarded as altogether harmless, but insufficient pre- cautions were taken. Then you come to the stabbing; in four, the 1311 insanity was not recognized ; in six, they were reputed harmless, in two sufficient precaution was not taken. " He adds : " This is a very important matter, because it shows the very large number of cases in which through inattention, the insanity is not detected till an overt act has been committed. That is the evil way in which a large proportion of the public judge of sanity or insanity. They will never hold a person to be insane until some' overt act lias been committed, and that is always, invariably, the case before juries. Then an overt act having been committed furnishes a proof that the disorder is very far advanced, almost to be inveterate, and consequently incura- ble. What I state shows the absolute necessity of great precautions ; the absolute necessity of paying attention to the earliest stage of the disorder, and though I could by no means render admission into the asylums more easy than it is, I most undoubtedly would not render it more difficult because I am certain society is in very great danger. We always have felt as commissioners that we have a double duty. We have a duty to the patients and a duty to society. We have a duty to the patient to see that he is not needlessly and improperly shut up, but we have also a duty to society to see that persons who ought to be under care and treatment should be under care and treat- ment, and moreover that they should be set at large before they can be considered safe to mix in society. " Q. Do not these facts, which are very remarkable, point rather to a want of knowledge of lunacy among medical men ? " A. No, I tliink not; I am not going to say that there is sufficient knowledge of lunacy among medical men, but such cases as this have never been brought under their observation; they have, been suffered to roam about; nobody has taken any trouble about them ; in the case of many of them the family did not suspect the madness; they might have thought the man was queer and they never thought of consulting a doctor on the matter; I have no doubt a great number of medical men, if they had seen such a case at an early period, would have come to the right conclusion about it; as I was saying, the large mass of society, even educated persons, are wholly unable to form an opinion unless they see something that is very decided; that they consider aberration ; something very peculiar ; something out of the common way ; another is this —it very often happens a great change of character is very often the indication of coming in- sanity ; and then many people say, and very naturally, ' what is the matter with this person — he is getting very cross ; he is quite a changed man ; he is not half as good humored as he used to be ; he has become crabbed and ill-tempered ;' they do not see that this very often is an indication of his approaching insanity ; they put it down to a sudden change of temper. " Q. Lias your lordship any suggestions to make upon that point ? " A. No ; I have no suggestions to make, because I am very un- willino- to say any thing that should restrict in any way, more than is now restricted, the person or liberty of the subject; I only wish to call o-reater attention to these things, that people may have their 1312 eyes open and then they may put their heads together and see if they can devise something by which a remedy may be applied, but I have no particular suggestion of my own to make ; I only give it as a very striking fact and one that should put us on our guard very much against juries, because they never deal with the matter unless there is an overt act, which overt act, ninety-nine cases out of one hundred, is a proof that the disorder is incurable. " In regard to medical certificates his lordship testified : " It is very remarkable, taking it altogether, that the certificates have been so sound considering the great number that have been given every year; of course we must admit that they have been signed by medical men who have no very extensive knowledge of lunacy, but it is certainly very remarkable that the number of cer- tificates which have passed through our hands since 1859 — the date of the last committee — amounts to more than 185,000, and yet of all those certificates, I do not think so many as half a dozen have been found defective; it sounds very well to say that persons acquainted with lunacy should be the only persons to sign certificates, but the fact is, as matters now stand, that a great amount of scientific knowledge as to lunacy is not possessed by many people; there are a certain number who are well informed, but the great mass of the community know very little about it, and, with the large number of the insane, dispersed as they are all over the country, you must trust to the medical men of the several districts; I have a very strong opinion on this point; the certificates hitherto have been very correct, and I am quite certain that out of the lb5,000 there was not one who was not shut up upon good, fair, prima facie evidence that he ought to be under care and treatment; such is the testimony of all the physicians of note who have been summoned before this com- mittee ; for what does that arise from — it does not arise from the great knowledge of the medical man of the lunacy that they handle, but it arises in a great measure from the habit of keeping back the patients so long, because the parents and friends do not like to admit to themselves that the patient is affected, and so delay to call in a medical man. And then begins, when the medical man is at last called in, the fear and apprehension that the patient may be sent to a lunatic asylum and the whole affair become public; so that when the final examination is made by the medical man, who has to sign the certificate to send them to any asylum, the symptoms are so evident and so pronounced that few people can mistake them. I have very little doubt that such is the case, and such is the reason why we have so few faulty certificates. But, on the other hand, what follows from that course? Why, that the cases are very far advanced and have got pretty nearly in the category of the incurable. " Q. And this is not very satisfactory ? " A. "Very far from it." , His lordship testified against special doctors making certificates: " I think something has been said about having what they call a system of special doctors. I confess to you that I have a very great fear of a special doctor. But, assuming them to be good, in the first 1313 place they must be very numerously spread over England and Wales, because they are wanted at the instant, and were there not an ample supply of them, you have to send a great distance to reach thees special doctors. I should like to see how Parliament would define a special doctor before I can give an opinion. I confess I should be very much alarmed if there were persons who kept themselves exclusively to that study without a constant experience of both, of all the various circumstances that beset lunacy at large and under confinement, moral as well as physical, that attend it; all the social circumstances, the ten thousand other circumstances ; * * * I re- member the case very well of a medical man, a doctor, an excellent man, who thought that I had some influence in obtaining the ap- pointment of medical men to the commission. I knew him very well. He came to me and told me what he wished. To show his extraordinary knowledge of the subject, he gave me a sheet of paper as big as that, with a list of the forms of insanity. ' My dear sir,' said I, ' this will never do; if you reduce your principles to practice you would shut up nine-tenths of the people in England,' and so they would. If you have special doctors they would shut up people by the score. " Q. Tliere was another proposal which was to require a certain knowledge of lunacy on the part of the medical officer of health, and who are scattered over the country, and to employ them as checks upon the asylums and as a kind of deputy visitors, to supplement the visits of the commission ? "A. To that I should very much object. I wish to speak with the greatest respect of them, but I think medical officers of healt, to a great extent, are young men, and uninstructed men, who have taken the office merely because they think it gives them a position and qualifies them to get on in their profession. Theyare not likely to have any great knowledge of lunacy. Then, again, being local people, they would be in friendship or in antipathy with the superin- tendents of asylums. Consider another point; we must do every thing we can to keep the best medical men in the service and to get them to sign the certificates. I am sorry to say that now the very best medical men refuse to have any thing whatever to do with the certificates, they are so afraid of the responsibility and of being hauled over the coals,' as the phrase is, that they will not do it. "Q. Another proposal was to take a person whose mind was affected to an hospital where he would be treated as he would be in any other hospital, and that afterward, provided he became fully insane, he should go to an asylum, but that otherwise he might be restored to society without having any taint of insanity upon him ? "A.I think it would eventually come to the same thing. These probationary asylums would be considered lunatic asylums, and it would be said of the people taken there : ' Oh, you know he escaped going to the asylum, that is true, but he was in a probationary asy- 165 U 1314 lum. He was so queer and so odd that they were obliged to send him there.' The taint of lunacy, which I see this commi-ttee is so justly afraid of, would be as much fastened on him as if he had gone direct. " Q. In process of time the hospital would get the character of a lunatic asylum ? "A. Yes, they would be called semi-lunatic asylums, and all that sort of thing; they would come under the same category at last." In regard to certificates his lordship further testified : " Q. Should you not think it an additional security to the free- dom of the subject if one of the signers of the certificates was a person in some official capacity ? Now, as your lordship is aware, there are two medical men — they may be surgeons, apothecaries or physicians — who sign the certificates. Do not you tliink it would be an improvement if one of the signers of the certificates was in some public capacity ? > " A. No, sir. In the first place, I should be sorry not to have two medical certificates for the confinement of any patient in a licensed house. I do not know where we could find a public man who was also a medical man. " Q. By a public capacity I meant an officer connected with the union or somebody responsible to the public ? " A. I tliink it was the right honorable chairman who put the question to me the other day on that subject. I said, I strongly ob- jected to an officer of the union. He was not a man of sufficient standing. Oftentimes he has merely taken his place because it gives him a status. He is not a man of sufficient standing. Some of the medical men who sign the certificates are of very high standing and degree, and you could not allow them to be overruled by an inferior officer. " Q. Do you not think that it would be an improvement if the certificates did not partake of the final character they now assume; that they should be of a more temporary character than they are now ? " A. I do not think so. " Q. We were told that in Scotland the patients cannot be sent to the lunatic wards of work-houses without a certificate ; does your lordship consider this a good plan ? " A. An excellent plan ; it is not the same with us. " Q. In England, of course, a lunatic may be sent to the lunatic' ward of a work-house without any certificate at all ? * " A. Yes; the relieving officer may send him in, or any one may send him in. " Q. He only wants a certificate signed when he goes into an asylum from the lunatic ward ? "A. Quite so. " Q. You think the Scotch plan of requiring the certificate upon the lunatic going in the lunatic ward of the work-house is prefera- ble? F 1315 " A. Very much preferable. "Q. We have had evidence from the Scotch Commissioners in Lunacy, m which comparisons very favorable to the Sotch system have been drawn, with regard to the intervention of the sheriff. 1 our lordship has, I tliink, already expressed an opinion with re- gard to the intervention of a public authority. Would you consider that the prospects of cure derived from placing a patient under early treatment would be considerably interfered with if the law were altered so as to necessitate the intervention of the magistrate in this country ? " A. Most undoubtedly ; the great fear in England of so many people is publicity, and any thing that tends to bring the patient before the public and to make the case of a patient notorious would induce people to keep that patient so long as they could before they submitted ^ him to the treatment of an asylum or of a single house. It would interfere very materially with it. " Q. On the whole, your opinion is most decided that the inter- vention of the magistrate would be injurious to the person, as regards his recovery, and no protection to him as regards his liberty ? "A. None whatever; I tliink it would take away nine-tenths of the protection he now has. I cannot conceive any thing which, to my mind, would be worse. I will do any thing that I can in the world to protect the patient, but I know if I were to assent to what is proposed I would assent to that which would be irreparable injury. " Q. I think your lordship is under some inisapprehensi6n as to the part that the sheriff acts in the matter; he has the option of act- ing according to his own discretion, either ministerially or judicially. He may judge, and usually does, of the fitness of the evidence upon which the medical men grant the certificate, or he may not do so. He may judge, and usually does, of the fitness of the persons to give evidence under the circumstances; for instance, relationship, or any thing of that kind, might be regarded as a disqualifying char- acteristic in a person signing a certificate? "A. That is what we should object to; we should object to any inexperienced layman taking upon himself to reverse the decision of the medical man. " Q. He would not in that case reverse their decision; he would merely remit it to other medical men, who, in his opinion, were com- petent to grant the certificate ? " A. It is all very right that it should be so, but then see what it ends in ; it ends, after all, in the opinion of a medical man, for it is only one set of medical men against another set." 1316 EXHIBIT No. 44. Case of Habeas Corpus. Mr. James B. Silkman was brought to the asylum May 21,1882, by Henry B. Ford, deputy sheriff of Westchester county, on the certificates of Drs. G. B. Balch and A. C. Benedict, two qualified examiners, whose certificates were duly approved by Hon. S. D. Gifford, county judge of Westchester county, the agreement for his support while in the asylum being executed by Theodore H. Silk- man, his son, D. G. Crosby and D. Seybel. He remained in the Asylum under treatment until August 19, when he was taken to Poughkeepsie to appear before a court on a writ of habeas corpus and was recorded in the books of the institution as discharged by an order of the court on the writ. At the time of his admission and during his stay in the Asylum I was laboring under such physical disability from the attempt upon my life that 1 had no knowledge of his case except the record in the case-book, and the information obtained from the physicians in charge. The history of his case, as recorded in the case-book on his admission, and while under treat- ment in the Asylum, in my judgment, shows that he wras insane when admitted to the institution, and during all the time he was therein, and at the time of his discharge on an order of the court. In my absence from home on account of illness, Dr. A. S. Russell, the phy- sician in charge, who had had constant observation of Mr. Silkman during his stay in the Asylum, gave sworn testimony to the court to Mr. Silkman's insanity during his residence in the Asylum and at the time of his discharge by the court. Fatal Casualty. In the table of deaths the case recorded as fracture of the skull was the case of George F. Brown, a patient who was killed by an- other patient on Sunday morning, the 7th of May, 1882. Mr. Brown was admitted to the Asylum April 21,1882, was seventy-six years of age and was in a condition of dementia. He was also in feeble bodily health, but well enough and strong enough to associate with other patients on the ward. David R. Poulton, the patient who made the fatal assault, was admitted to the Asylum February 9, 1882. Dr. Brush, who was in charge during my illness covering this period, described the case as follows: There were no evidences or manifestations on the part of Poulton previous to this attack that he had any feeling toward Mr. Brown, nor had he made any threats in regard to any persons in the Asylum, his suspicions and delusions referring mainly to persons in Syracuse. The attack was made in the morning while the patients were dressing and preparing for break- fast. Mr. Brown at this time was up and on the ward, as was also Mr. Poulton. Mr. T. E. Williams, the attendant in charge, was aiding other patients when he glanced down the ward and saw Mr. Brown with his coat on his arm going toward the wash-room, and 1317 Poulton with a leg of a table which he had wrenched off following. Mr. Williams immediately ran, but before he reached Poulton the latter had struck the fatal blow. Poulton was at once disarmed and the physicians in charge of the male department, Drs. Russell and Josselyn, summoned. It was found Mr. Brown had sustained a fracture ol the skull, from which he died about an hour afterward. When seized by the attendants Poulton said: "I have demanded the keys three times." Subsequently he told Dr. Hunt, the coroner, that he had not meditated striking Mr. Brown until he saw him passing down the ward and then instantly decided to kill him, take the keys and liberate the patients, "insane persons who are brought to the Asylum to be killed." Then he at once wrenched off the table leg and gave the blow. He afterward said he had struck the wrong man ; that he meant to kill a doctor or an attendant. The coroner, Dr. James G. Hunt, and Mr. Brown's son, residing in the city of Utica, were notified and came at once. The coroner went on the ward, viewed the body, examined the three attendants who were present at the time and talked with Mr. Poulton. As the killing was done openly, in the presence of a number of persons, and tliere was no question as to the cause of death, the coroner did not deem it necessary to summon a jury, and the son expressed the hope that no unnecessary publicity would be given to the case. The coroner made'the following statement: I have fully investigated the matter and find that neither the Asylum authorities nor the attendants were in any way responsible. On the 16th of June following, Messrs. John C. Devereux, Oscar Craig and E. W. Foster, members of the State Board of Charities, and Dr. Stephen Smith, State Commissioner in Lunacy, came to the Asylum to investigate the matter. In addition to their interview with the physicians, they examined Mr. Williams, attendant, pri- vately, saw and conversed with Coroner Hunt, and the son of Mr. Brown, and also with Mr. Poulton. No report of the result of their deliberations has been sent to the managers of the Asylum or to the superintendent. It may not be improper to say that some of the members of the committee expressed the opinion at the Asylum that such matters should be made public through the newspapers, the State Commissioner in Lunacy, however, dissenting from this view State of New York, County of Oneida, Utica, N. Y., February 2, 1884. Ogden Backus, being duly sworn, says : Mr. Hughes entered the Asylum last Friday morning, January 25, 1884. He was brought here by his son'; Mr. Hughes' was a re-admittance; he was brought here in 1878 and remained three months, and was discharged cured • he went home and attended to his business; he was a farmer 1318 Mr. Hughes when he came here was in fair physical condition and seemed to realize where he was; his pulse was eighty ; tongue coated. After the history given by his son he was sent to the ninth ward, which is the suicidal ward ; he ate a good dinner and told At- tendant Orendorf that he was crazy again and that he had probably overworked himself ; that afternoon the patient was quiet; toward evening he ate his supper and then went to bed, sleeping in the dormitory where the night watchman could watch him; between eleven and two o'clock he began to grow restless in bed ; this Friday night, February 25, about twelve o'clock I was notified that the patient was very noisy, and that they were obliged to place him in a covered bed ; I sent the patient some quieting medicine, consisting of two drachms of tincture hyoscyamus, fifteen grains of chloral. By the Foreman : Q. What is a covered bed% A. It is a bed surrounded by slats ; it is an ordinary low crib with a cover ; the patient remained noisy all night, disturbing the ward all night; I believe he took the medicine that I sent him ; did not go to see him when I was notified that he was noisy; he was on the ward where the night watch could see him constantly ; the night watch stays in that ward all night and does not leave it; the next morn- ing while sitting in this office with Dr. Brush, Supervisor Jones in- formed me that Mr Hughes was very viofent, striking patients and attendants and he wished some instructions to know what to do with the patient; I directed that he be sent to the fourth hall, which is the ward for disturbed patients; I then started on my rounds through the house and saw Mr Hughes in the day-room of four; he was walking the room with his hands in his pockets, am not quite positive; I went up to him and put my hand on his shoulder and said to him : "Mr. Hughes, what made you so disturbed this morn- ing ? " He looked very sullen and refused to answer ; I then asked him why he struck the patients; he did not reply, but simply walked away; I repeated the question and followed him ; he turned on me and muttered something in Welsh, I think it was; I do not under- stand Welsh ; I then saw I was disturbing him by questioning him and deemed it wise not pursue the matter; I then left the day-room and went to finish my rounds about the house ; about twelve o'clock, this was Saturday, while on the twelfth ward, Mr. Barrisdale, super- visor of first department, came up on to twelve and told me Mr. Hughes was very bad, and asked me what to do with him; I went down immediately with Mr. Barrisdale to the fourth ward and found Mr. HugheSiSitting in one of the strong chairs with a waist belt put around him; there was some blood on the chair, on the floor, and the floor for some little distance about was wet with water as if it had been mopped up ; his mouth was bloody, although the blood was not run- ning from it; I asked of the attendants how did this happen, but did not get any satisfactory statement; I put my finger in the patient's mouth to ascertain where the blood came from and I found a frac- 1319 Z ™ti 5^1 er JT a little t0 the riSnt of ^e center; the attend-' nfflv n tal^e1care' doctor> he will bite you, but the patient did not TrL\ Y V1°i-n^ t0Waid me; after maki«S mJ examination I re- ported immediately to the office of Dr. diaries W. Pilgrim, who is in charge of the men's side; we then together saw Dr. Brush, then Iieported the affair to Dr. Gray, the superintendent. Dr. Brush, Dr. 1 ilgrim and myself then went on to the ward, removed the waist belt ot the patient he was then quite feeble, we took him into the attendant s room which opens from the ward, pulled up his shirt and tound there were two or more ribs fractured. By the Coroner : Q. Which jaw did you find fractured ? A. It was the lower jaw ; I found the ribs fractured on the left side ; under Dr. Brush's direction I went up to the eighth ward to get a room ready for him ; shortly after the patient came up stairs with Dr. Brush, Dr. Pilgrim and an attendant; I do not recall the name of the attendant; the patient was undressed, placed in bed and his side dressed with adhesive straps ; he was then quite feeble and a little whisky and carbonate of ammonia were administered By a Juror: Q. Did the patient walk to his room when he was taken from the chair ? A. He walked to his room by the assistance of Dr. Brush, Dr. Pilgrim and one of the attendants. (Copy.) OGDEN BACKUS. Albert Spencer, Coroner. State of New York, ) County of Oneida, \ '' Utica, N. Y., February 2, 1884. John Charles Hughes, being duly sworn, says: I am a son of the deceased Evan D. Hughes; I recognize it to be the body of my father; I reside in the town of Nelson, Madison county ; that is where my father lived ; one week ago last Monday my father worked during the forenoon ; during the afternoon father and mother went to Morrisville ; this is three and one-half miles from where we live ; they came home about six in the evening of the same day ; I was alone in the house at that time; mother called me out and father and I took care of the horse; I inquired about the business he was going to do, and got no satisfactory answer ; he seemed all right at this time ; at the same time he seemed to be worrying for a day or two previous about some trouble. 1320 By the Coroner : Q. What was the nature of the trouble ? A. He had a lawsuit and had paid the cost of the court; we first discovered that my father was insane one week ago last Monday evening ; wdien mother was showing me the things they had bought at Morrisville, he said : " You bought a good many things to-day ; I do not think we will be together to enjoy them long ;" to the ques- tion why ? he said something is going to happen before morning ; to the question what is going to happen ? he said that he was going to die; this was the first we noticed that he was insane ; he was violent at times before we brought him here ; one week ago last Tuesday I went to Morrisville to consult a doctor; before I got home he was violent and attempted to leave the house; he had the idea that the dog was mad and turned back and went to bed; from the time I returned from Morrisville we had extra help in the house; Tuesday night he w*as restless, but showed no violence; one week ago last Wednesday he became very violent; he told my mother and myself that if he had a razor or axe he would cut himself; we had two men there all the while, and then four; on the 25th day of January, at noon, we placed him in the Asylum ; our reason for placing my father in the Asylum was that we had been advised to do so; that he had become so violent that it was necessary as a pro- tection to himself and ourselves; Dr. Chase told us that we had better take him to the Asylum while he was under the influence of the chloral that had been administered to him. (Copy.) JOHN CHARLES HUGHES. Albert Spencer, Coroner. State of New York, "( County of Oneida, \ Utica, February 6, 1884. John W. Jones, being duly sworn, says: I am an attendant here at the Asylum ; I am supervisor of the second department; that embraces the ninth ward ; I knew this patient Mr. Hughes; I have been an attendant at this institution for nearly twenty years. By the Coroner : Q. What are your duties in your department ? A. I have a general supervision of the department, and do as directed by the doctors in the care of the patients; I carry medicine around. Q. What portion of this institution comprises the ninth ward ? A. It is the second department; I distinctly remember when Mr. Hughes was brought here; that was the 25th of January; he was taken up on the ninth ward and left there by an attendant; there are three attendants there constantly; I am not there all the while; 1321 wfa'hvE W.f VfH m?oherent in his talk ; he was not raving ; this I+W 2' H 25th' toe day he was brought here; I next saw the Kw a wi 7 A: M*' ?atnrda.Y 5 he then was crazy; taking off his clotles and throwing them about the ward; the n£xt I saw of him aftei that was at 10 o'clock of the same morning on the ninth ward ; he had his coat and vest off at that time, and a slipper in his hand, and I was told by Mr. Mahoney and J. M. Jones that he had been striking some of the patients with it; I told the two attendants tliere to take care of him until I could report him to the doctor; I reported him to Dr. Backus; he told me to remove him to the fourth ward; I gave him in charge of Mr. Weir, and told him that the patient is violent, and to take charge of him ; that was all; I then went back into my own department; I saw the patient after that on the eighth ward after he was brought back. Q. At what time was he brought back on to the eighth ward ? A. It was about half-past 12 of the same day ; he was in an injured condition ; I noticed that his lower jaw bone was injured ; I do not know from personal knowledge how this happened.' Q. Did he remain in that ward until he died ? A. He did. By a Juror: Q. Did this man's son see the patient Hughes before he died ? A. He saw him every day ; I think he (the son) was here three or four days ; he took some of his meals here and lodged in an opposite room to his father while he was here. (CopyO J. WILSON JONES. Albert Spencer, Coroner. State of New York, County of Oneida, ) Utica, February 6, 1884. J. B. Orendorf, being duly sworn, says : I am an attendant here in the Asylum ; I have been employed here the last time fourteen years ; I came here in April, 1863, and was here about five and one- half years; I recollect the patient, Mr. Hughes, that was brought here January 25 ; he was placed upon the ninth ward, which is a ward for patients predisposed to suicide. Q. What was his condition at that time ? A. He was somewhat depressed and I thought it wras a case of mel- ancholia. Q. How long did he remain on your ward ? A. From Friday at one o'clock until Saturday at ten o'clock, I should judge ; I was away Friday evening from half-past six until eleven ;' when I returned he was walking in the dormitory in his night clothes; I left him in charge of Mr. James Mulherron, the night watch, and went to bed. * 166 U 1322 By the Foreman : Q. What kind of a bed was Hughes placed in that night? A. It was an open bed placed in the ten bedded dormitory ; at six o'clock the next morning John M. Jones, an attendant on the ninth ward, and myself got Mr. Hughes up and he dressed himself; when I came in the morning we took him out of a covered bed which he had been placed in during the night; he was very much depressed, that morning and ate very little breakast; after breakfast he stood on the hall with his arms in this manner (shown) nearly half an hour, with his eyes looking up to the ceiling and fixed ; I went and got a chair and set him into it; he did not show any resistance; we wanted to sweep the hall and we took him and carried him down to the day-room; he would not or could not walk ; he seemed to be laboring under some delusion ; we made a sort of a basket of our hands and so carried him down, and then instead of sitting up in the chair he sprawled himself out; we tried to sit him up in the chair; he seemed to imagine that he could not sit up straight; at half-past nine of Saturday morning I went to the theater to work, I think by the order of Dr. Backus ; I was absent about twenty-five minutes; when I came back Mr. Jones and Mr. Mahoney were holding him in a seat, each had hold of an arm ; he was kicking and frothing at the mouth ; he spit at the attendants and tried to bite them ; Supervisor J. W. Jones had gone to the office to report it; when he returned he said the orders were to take him to No. 4 ; Supervisor Jones, assisted by J. M. Jones and Mahoney, took him there. (Copy.) JOHN B. ORENDORF. Albert Spencer, Coroner. State of New York, ) j V qq * Count/i) of Oneida, \ Utica, FeVy.6, 1884. John M. Jones, being duly sworn, says: I am an attendant here on the 9th ward ; I came here the 24th day of December last; I recollect the patient Ilughes, that was brought here one week ago last Friday, January 25 ; he came into my ward about half-past one Friday afternoon; after he had got through dinner Mr. Orendorf told me that I had better bathe him and I did so; I afterward took him down to the day-room and stayed with him that afternoon; he was quiet there until six o'clock; we remained until eight o'clock in the evening, and then I undressed him and put him to bed ; I placed him in the third bed from the door, in what we call the ten bed dor- mitory ; this was all I had to do with him until six o'clock the next morning ; at that time Mr. Orendorf and myself went up and took Mr. Hughes out of the covered bed. By the Coroner : Q. Is this all you know of this case ? 1323 ' f" i^q J* 1S not' l was called out by Mr- Mahoney about ten o ciock baturday morning, the day after he came, to assist him to place ivir. Hughes m a seat; we seated hiin down and put on his coat and vest, he stayed on the seat very quiet for a few minutes and vTii .?• i t0 Vlyr WOrk; X was at mY work a°°"t five minutes I should think, and I was called out again by Mr. Mahoney to assist him; Mr. Mahoney and I stayed with him about ten minutes, one on each side of him ; I told Mr. Mahoney that I thought it best to go and report him to Supervisor Jones'; I stepped up to the 8th ward and reported, and Mr. Jones came down, and Mr. Hughes was removed to the 4th ward ; when Mr. Ilughes went into the 4th ward he was violent. A (Copy.) JOHN M. JONES. Albert Spencer, Coroner. Inquest Resumed at Asylum. • February 7, 1884. John Somers, sworn and examined : By the Coroner : Q. Mr. Somers, you are an attendant here, are you ? A. Yes, sir; night watchman ; attendant first and night, watch- man afterward. Q. How long have you been employed here ? A. Since May 23, 1876 ; eight years from this May ; I was attend- ant first and appointed night watchman. Q. Did you know this patient, Mr. Hughes, brought here ? A. Yes, sir; I saw him here that night he was brought here. Q. You were on duty that night ? A. I was on duty relieving Mr. Mulheron on the ninth while he was at supper, and I saw Mr. Hughes ; he would not stop in bed ; I could not keep him in bed ; then I took another man out of the covered bed and put him in ; he was not noisy then; he went into the covered bed quite voluntarily, and I closed him down ; that was between 11 and 12; then between 12 and 1 o'clock Mr. Mulheron, the regular night watchman on that ward, called me and told me about him being very noisy, and I went to see Dr. Backus about it; he prescribed some medicine, and he took and drank it all; I did not know any thing more about him, only in the morning I took from the night watchman the report that he was noisy from 12 to 4; at 12, 1, 2, 3, 4, and awake at 5, and that is all I know about it. Q. You didn't see any thing more of him ? A. No, sir; that is all I know about it. By Mr. Shearman : Q. Have you heard auy of the attendants of number four speak of what occurred there ? 1324 A. I heard them speaking of there being a fuss. Q. Did you hear them say as to what was done with Mr. Hughes ? A. No, sir. Q. Haven't you heard any one speaking of what occurred ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And who was engaged in it ? A. I couldn't say. Q. Haven't you heard any of them say they were engaged in it ? A. I heard Mr. Weir and Mr. Brown were the parties there, but I haven't heard any thing about it, sir. Q. Haven't you heard any thing further about it ? A. No, sir, only that they were sorry any thing had occurred. Q. They said that ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What did they say and who was engaged in it ? A. I couldn't say. By Mr. Spencer: % Q. Do you know that these parties were there when he received those injuries ? A. I couldn't say, sir; I am not here at all in the day time. Q. You did not have to use any violence in putting this man in the covered bed. A. No, sir. Q. There was no one else there at the time except yourself ? A. No, sir; no one but myself. Q. What was your idea in putting him in a covered bed ? A. Because he wouldn't stop in the other bed; he would not stop in the open bed; I would hardly be out of the room before he would be after me. By Mr. Becker : Q. He took the medicine all right ? A. Yes, sir; he sat up in the covered bed and drank it all up. Q. Do the doctors usually prescribe without going to see a patient ? A. Well, sometimes if a patient is noisy they send something to quiet him. Q. They do not go to see him? A. Yes, sir, they do; if a patient is very violent the doctor goes to see him, but if a patient is just noisy they send him medicine and I give it to him. By Mr. Martin : Q. After you put him in the covered bed he was noisy ? A. Well, when'the other watchman came he found him so. Q. Did he want to be taken out of the bed ? A. Well, I don't know; I took only the report from the other watchman in the morning. JOHN SOMERS.' 1325 A. C Weir, sworn and examined : By the Coroner : Q. Mr. Weir you are in attendant at this institution ? A. I am. Q. How long have you been employed here, sir ? A. Twenty-nine months. Q. What is your business particularly ? A. I have got charge of a hall. Q. Which hall ? A. No. 4. Q. You knew this patient, Mr. Hughes, that was brought here on the 25th of January ? A. I did not know him, but was told about him when he came on my ward. Q. What time was he brought to you, Mr. Weir ? A. I think it was half-past ten. By the District Attorney : Q. In the day time ? A. In the forenoon. Q. On which day ? A. It was on the 26th he came to my ward. Q. That is the 4th ward? A. Yes, sir. Q. Where was he brought from, as you understood ? A. From the 9th ward. Q. Who brought him ? A. Mr. Jones and Mr. Mahoney. Q. And are they employed on the 9th hall ? A. They are; and also by Supervisor Jones of the second de- partment. Q. Are there other attendants on the 4th hall except yourself ? A. There are. Q. How many others besides yourself? A. Three besides myself. Q. Now when did this injury occur to Mr. Hughes ? A. That I could not tell.' • Q. Well what time in the day or evening was there any difficulty whatever out of which this arose? A. I should think about twenty minutes to twelve of the same Q. Then he had been on your ward about two hours ? A. About an hour and a half. Q. During the time he was there on the ward how many attend- ants were there ? A. There was three. Q. Besides yourself ? A. Two besides myself. Q. Who were they % 1326 A. Mr. Bills and Mr. Brown. Q. They are the regular attendants on the ward ? A. They are. Q. Now, Mr. Weir, were you there all the time that Mr. Hughes was there ? A. I was not in trie day-room all the time he was there; I was on the hall all the time he was there on the hall. Q. How long did you remain there after he was first brought there ? A. I remained, I should think, it was about twenty minutes to twelve, when I went up to report him to Supervisor Barrisdale. Q. You say he was brought about ten or a little after ? A. About ten. Q. You remained until about twenty minutes to twelve ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Had any altercation taken place in that time ? A. I think tliere had. Q. We will begin from the time when he first came there, and you will state his condition and what occurred ? A. When he came to the ward I was sitting on the third chair from the north end of the ward; I saw him come in and the attend- ants holding him by each arm, and they kind of dragging him along, and I got up and Mr. Jones locked the door behind him, and Mr. Jones and I went down to the day-room after him, and Mr. Jones told me he had been very violent and striking the patients on nine, and we went down to the day-room and Mr. Jones, the attendant, and Mr. Mahoney sat him in a chair, and Mr. Mahoney says : " Here is a bad patient, you will have to look out for him ;" I was in the day- room at the time. Q. Now after he sat him down what occurred ? A. He sat there quiet as long as I remained in the day-room ; I remained until Mr. Jones and I came back to this end of the ward. Q. Then what occurred ? A. A few minutes after that, I could not tell the number of minutes, he came up to my end of the ward from the day-room; he was very much excited; he looked at the windows and acted as if he would dive out through the windows ; I got between him and the window and tried to talk to him, and tried to quiet him down, and asked him not to get excited, and he remained there a few minutes and then went into the day-room again. Q. Were tliere any other attendants with you at this time ? A. Not then. Q. Were there any in the day-room ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Who? A. Mr. Bills. ' "; Q. He went to the day-room then ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What did you next see of him or learn ? A. It was a very few minutes after that the doctor came on the ward. 1327 Q. What doctor ? A. Dr. Backus. Q. What did he say ? A. He asked me where Mr. Hughes was, and I told him he was in the day-room, so the doctor and I walked down into the day- room and the doctor went up and spoke to him ; he could not get any answer from him; he muttered something, in Welsh, I should think ; 1 could not understand what he said. Q. What was he doing? A. He was walking around. Q. What next ? A. The doctor took him by the hand and he twitched his hand away from him ; we did not say any thing more to him then. Q. Did the doctor leave then ? A. The doctor and I returned from the day-room to the ward and talked a few minutes together about the patients. Q. Then he left the hall ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Then Mr. Hughes was in the day-room ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How soon after that did you learn any thing of him ? A. Well, I should tliink perhaps twenty minutes or half an hour ; I could not tell the exact time ; Mr. Bills came to the end of the ward with him ; Mr. Bills and another patient had hold of him ; he was kind of resisting and they were fetching him along ; when they came through the passage way I got up and met them and said, Mr. Bills : " Mr. Weir, you will have to take care of this man ; I can't do any thing with him ; " we fetched him up and sat him on the chair where I got up from ; Mr. Bills says: " I will have to go to the dining-room ; it is about time to get dinner;" we sat him in the chair where I got up from, and as soon as we sat him there he jumped up, and I stepped around to his side and sat him in the chair again ; he put his arms on the chair arms and got up, and I could not well hold him down, and I didn't want to get in front of him because he was violent; I stepped around to the left side of him and took hold of him by the collar with my right arm, and with my left I had hold of his left arm; I had a little purchase that way, because I was a little behind the chair ; Mr. Brown was in his room changing his clothes. Q. That was the other attendant ? A. Yes, sir; that was the other attendant; he stepped around, Mr. Brown did, on the opposite side and took hold of him ; he came and we held him down as well as we could, because we saw that the man was very much excited and he tried to bite us and kick us, and we had to go around to the side and handle him as carefully as we could * I was there, I should think, at least five minutes; I should think perhaps a little over five minutes, and I said to him : " Mr. Hughes I think you know better than to act the way you do;" after a while he seemed to sit all right and kind of quiet; " now, 1328 Mr. Brown," says I, "it's getting near dinner time ; you take care of him and I will go up and see what is to be done with him ;" I went up, but did not see the supervisor on No. 1 ; I waited there over five minutes for him. Q. Which supervisor ? A. Supervisor Barrisdale ; I started to come back to the ward and I met Supervisor Barrisdale, and I told him that.I came to see what was going to be done with Mr. Hughes ; that he was so very violent that it was necessary to have something done with him ; when I got back on the hall Mr. Brown was about half way from the bath-room door to where Mr. Hughes sat with a basin of water and a sponge; I went to Mr. Hughes and I saw there was trouble and I asked him "What is the trouble?" Then I asked Mr. Brown, " Have you had trouble with Mr. Hughes, Mr. Brown?" And he said, "We have had trouble, and I wished you had strapped, him before you had gone up ; " I could see blood on Mr. Hughes' mouth and face and knew there was trouble ; I assisted Mr. Brown to sponge him off — his face and his hands ; we could not do that very well because he tried to resist and blew a bloody spittle at us ; I stood at one side and held him; after we got him sponged off as well as we could, I went up and got a basin of water, and I asked Mr. Hughes to rinse out his mouth ; he kicked at me, and I stepped back so that he did not kick me ; I talked with him a few minutes and asked him to drink some of the water, but he struck the cup of water out of my hand ; I went up to the water-closet and got a mop and tried to mop up the water; just as I was setting the mop away Dr. Backus came in ; he stepped up to Mr. Hughes and opened his mouth to see where he was bleed- ing ; I said, " take care, doctor, he will bite you;" he put his finger in his mouth and he made no effort to bite him ; " Mr. Weir," says he, " how did he come by this injury ; his jaw is broken ? " I could not answer him ; I says, " Doctor, I can't tell you, I was not on the ward; " I could not answer his question because I did not know ; the doctor immediately left the ward, and the bell rung and the patients went to dinner, and I sat down beside Mr. Hughes, and he says, the first word, "you have no business to strap me in this chair." Q. Was he then strapped in the chair ? A. Yes, sir; he was not strapped when I left him. Q. You left him with Mr. Brown ? A. I did. Q. He had him strapped to the chair? A. Yes, sir. Q. And_ that was the condition in which you found him, with blood on his face ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did Hughes say- any thing else? A. I asked him : " How did you come to be injured, Mr. Hughes ?" He said: " I will let you know when the doctor comes down ? " I said: " Don't you know that you were very violent and tried to in- jure us, and I thought this was the best to do ?". 1329 Q. What did he say to that ? A. He didn't make any reply then. Q. Was Mr. Brown the only attendant left on the hall when you left 5 A. He was. Q. And the only attendant when you came back % A. He was. Q. Mr. Brown is here now ? A. He is. Q. How long did Hughes remain in the chair— strapped there— after you went back and found he was injured? A. Probably twenty minutes; it might have been half an hour. Q. Did any thing else take place during that time ; any conversa- tion take place between you and Brown and Hughes ? A. No, sir. Q. And was any thing done for him except what yon have said ? A. That was all; we sponged him off. Q. Did any other doctor come back except Dr. Backus. A. Yes, sir ; three others. Q. Who ? A. Dr. Brush, Dr. Pilgrim and Dr. Backus. Q. And Dr. Backus was the one first came and found the injury? A. He was. Q. Did they make an examination % A. Yes, sir. Q. While he was still in the chair? A. No, sir; they took him into my room. Q. What did they do? A. They stripped up his shirt there. Q. And made an examination? A. They did ; Dr. Brush placed his hand on each side standing behind him and extended his hands to the front of his body; Dr. Brush then said something to Dr. Pilgrim wdiich I did not under- stand ; then Dr. Pilgrim placed his hands in the same way — one on each side. Q. How long were they engaged in that * A. I should say fifteen minutes. Q. Where was he taken from there ? A. To the eighth ward. Q. You did not see him, or have any thing to do with him after ward ? A. No, sir. Q. About what time was he taken there ? A. It was nearly one o'clock. Q. About how long were you gone when you went up after this supervisor, and before you came back and found the injury ? A. From five to ten minutes. 167 U 1330 Q. And when you went back and found he was injured and strapped in the chair, were there other patients about there ? A. Yes, sir, the chairs were nearly all filled. Q. Nearly every chair occupied ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Most of the patients seated ? A. Some sitting, others not. Q. Was there any thing said by Mr. Brown as to how the injury occurred ? A. Mr. Brown reached the patient with the basin of water from one side about the time I reached him from the door; then I said: " What in time is the matter here ? Have you had trouble with him ?" Mr. Brown says : " Yes ; I wish you had strapped him to the chair before you went up." After that I made inquiries from the patients and I found one patient who said he had struck his face on the chair when he was trying to jerk away from him. Q. Who was that patient? A. Mr. Winnie. 4 Q. Is he a violent patient ? A. No, sir. Q. Is there any thing else, Mr. Weir, in addition to what you have stated, that can throw any light upon the subject ? A. All I can say is that I made full investigation as to how the injury occurred because I was very much worked up about it; I had had charge of the hall seventeen months and nothing had occurred, and it worked me up quite a good deal, and I was bound to find out where the injury was received; I said: " Mr. Brown, if you have had such a tussle with him you must know how this injury was re- ceived." He positively declared he did not know. Q. Did Mr. Brown say that he had had a tussle with him ? _ A. He did, and that he had to call one of the patients to assist him. Q. Did hp say any thing as to how it began ? A. He did not say: Q. Did he say any thing with reference to his having a tussle in order to keep control of the patient ? A. He said he had a tussle with the patient, and that other pa- tients helped him. Q. That was his remark ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Is it customary, Mr. Weir, to call upon patients to assist you ? A. Sometimes. Q. Do you mean by that it is simply a custom ? A. It is done sometimes. Q. How many attendants are usually in charge of that ward you speak of ? A. Four; it is a very large and crooked ward. Q. Where were the others when you went away ? 1331 A' ®ne m the dining-room with a patient getting dinner; one — Mr. Brown — was with me, and the other place was vacant. Q. So that there were only three attendants there ? A. That was all. Q. You say it is sometimes necessary to call upon patients to as- sist the attendants? A. It is. Q. And what occasions that necessity; is it by reason of their violence ? A. Yes, sir ; sometimes patients come out of their rooms in the morning and take hold of you ; they come out of their rooms some- times quite naked and make sudden attacks on you and you have always to be on your guard, and in cases of that kind it is sometimes necessary to call patients to your assistance because the other attend- ants are not within sight or hearing.' Q. Well, from knowing Mr. Hughes as you did, do you think it was necessary for Mr. Brown to call upon patients to assist him ? , A. Well, I couldn't hardly answer that question. Q. You could not say as to that without knowing how violent the man was ? A. No, sir. By Mr. Barnes : Q. How many patients have you on that ward ? Q. Twenty-nine on the ward. A. Is it part of the duty of the attendants to take care of the din- ing-room and assist about dinner. A. Yes, sir ; one of the hands takes care of that. Q. He leaves about 11:30 to take charge of the dining-room ? A. Yes, sir. Q. That takes one of the men away ? A. Yes, sir. Q. The attendants have their rooms on the hall ? A. Yes, sir. Q. You stated that Mr. Mahoney helped to bring Mr. Hughes down? A. Yes, sir. Q. How long did he stay there { A. He stayed three or four minutes ; not long; he went right back; the two attendants went back before Mr. Jones, the supervisor, went back. By Mr. Martin : Q Did you learn in any way how he could have broken his ribs in the tussle ; whether he fell or any thing of that kind ? A. I could not learn. 1332 By the District Attorney : Q. Did Mr. Brown say as to whether they had fallen on the floor ? A. He didn't say any thing about that. Q. Did you ask him any thing about that ? A. I did. Q. What did he say ? A. He said he did not know as he fell on the floor. By Mr. Kincaid : Q. Mr. Weir, what was your object in leaving the ward ? A. I thought I had better have some restraint to put upon him at that time of day when we were going to have dinner. By the District Attorney : Q. Do you mean by that that you were liable to have less attend- ants and it was necessary to have some restraint to put on him ? A. Yes, sir; it was necessary for the attendants to have dinner ready and some of us have to go in to dinner with the patients and that would leave only one man on the ward and it was necessary to have some restraint. Q. Do you go to the dining-room ; some of the attendants with the patients? A. Yes, sir; if some of the patients are not fit to go to the dining- room they remain on the ward and some of the attendants must stay with them. Q. So that in that case one attendant would be left with Mr. Hughes ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And you thought restraint had better be put upon him without leaving him there with one attendant? A. Yes, sir. Q. Is it customary to leave the hall with one attendant when there are violent patients that way ? A. It could not be otherwise on that hall; that hall is so crooked that the attendants cannot always be together and can't always see each other. A. G. WEIR. James Brown, sworn and examined : By the Coroner : Q. Mr. Brown, you are an attendant in this institution ? A. I am, sir. Q. How long have you been employed here, sir \ A. Since the 20th of July last. Q. In what department are you ? A. I am on the fourth ward. 1333 By the District Attorney : Q. How old are you, Mr. Brown ? A. I am twenty-six years old. Q. Always lived in this country? " A. No, sir. J Q. When did you come here ? A. Eight years ago. Q. You know Mr. Hughes ? A. I do know him, sir. Q. The man who was injured ? A. Yes, sir. Q. You were on the fourth ward when he was there ? A. Yes, sir. Q. On the same ward with Mr. Weir? A. Yes, sir. Q. You knew when Hughes came there ? A. No, sir; I did not. Q. You did not know when be was first brought on the ward ? A. No, sir. Q. When did you first see him ; where were you at the time he came on the ward ? A. I was in my room dressing. Q. What time in the day was that ? A. In the forenoon, Saturday. Q. Saturday, the 26th ? A. Yes, sir. Q. You were in your room dressing, as you understood, when he was brought there ? A. Yes, sir. Q. After dressing, you came out and saw Hughes there? A. Yes, sir. Q. Who else was there with Mr. Hughes ? A. Mr. Bills and Mr. Weir. Q. What time in the day was that ? A. I should think it was about half-past eleven. Q. When was he brought there, as you understood; how long before that ? A. Well, he was in there for some time; I could not say; half an hour, or such a matter. Q. Where was Hughes when you first saw him ? A. Coming through the hall; tliere was an attendant on one side of him and a patient on the other. Q. Walking along ? A. Walking along. Q. Who was that attendant ? A. Mr. Bills. Q. Who was the patient ? A. Mr. Winnie. ,„ , 1334 Q. He has been a patient on that ward how long ? A. Well, I don't exactly know. Q. He has been there since you were there ? A. Yes, sir; he was there four or five months. Q. They were walking along the hall then in a quiet way, or was Mr. Hughes violent ? A. He was very violent. Q. Struggling? A. Yes, sir; and trying to get away. Q. Where did they go with him ? A. They sat him in a chair. Q. Well, what else was done ? A. Well, when I saw he was so violent, I stepped back of the door and got a waist belt. Q. What was done with that ? A. It was not put on. Q. It was not used at that time? A. No, sir. Q. What did you do with the waist belt ? A. Nothing then. Q. What did you do with the waist belts — strap them to the chairs ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And the chairs are fastened to the floor ? A. Yes, sir. Q. It was not used at that time ? A. No, sir. Q. What else was done with Mr. Hughes ? A. Mr. Bills then went away and I came; Mr. Weir and I were there. Q. Mr. Weir and yourself ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What did you have to do, if any thing ? A. I tried to keep him in the chair with Mr: Weir. Q. Just state what he did and what you did ; just describe to the jury what occurred, in your own way, and what his condition was and what you had to do. A. He tried to get out of the chair several times ; he stood up and we sat him back in the chair, and we did that five or six times ; Mr. Weir stood behind the chair and I stood in front; Mr. Weir had one hand on the coat collar, and with the right hand he hit the patient. Q. He did what ? A. He hit the patient. Q. Where did he hit the patient ? A. In the face. Q. Mr. Weir hit him ? A. Yes, sir. Q. In what way ? A. With his fist. 1335 Q. With his fist? A. Yes, sir. ' Q. Just describe how he did it. A. Well, he closed his hand in that way (indicating). Q. Which side of the face did he strike ? A. The right hand side. Q. The right hand side ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Any thing else done ? A. I hit the patient. Q. You hit him ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How many times did you strike him ? A. Once. , Q. With the clenched fist or with the hand ? A. With the fist. Q. Where did you hit him ? A. In the abdomen. Q. Was that while he was sitting, or standing ? A. While he was sitting; just as they sat him down. Q. Why did.you hit him?' A. Well to see if we could keep him quiet. Q. You understand what the rules are ? A. I do. Q. You know that one of the rules is, that you are never to strike any of the patients under any circumstances? A. Yes, sir; in that ward we can't help it. Q. You are aware of that rule ? A. Yes, sir, I am. Q. How long did that continue ? A. Well, I should think four or five mintues. I ' Q. We will come to the time when Mr. Weir went away ; do you remember that ? A. I do. Q. And leaving you there the only attendant ? A. I do. Q. About what time in the da}r was that ? A. Perhaps that was about twenty minutes to 12 o'clock. Q. About how long was Mr. Weir gone ? A. Well, I should think about eight or nine minutes. Q. During the time that he was gone did you have any altercation with Hughes ? A. I did. Q. Were any others present except patients ? A. No, sir. Q. Patients there ? A. Yes, sir. •,,.-, Q. Now will you state in your own way what this altercation was between you and Hughes ; how did it occur and what was done ? A. I tried to help him in the chair ; he resisted and tried to get 1336 away ; then he got out of the chair on the floor on his knees; I put him back in the chair again ; he was struggling to get away ; I was afraid if he got away he would hurt the patients or me. By the Coroner : Q. Did you get the patient back in the chair yourself ? A. I did, myself. Q. What next ? A. I put the strap on; by that time or a little after that the doctors and Mr. Weir came ; there was blood on the floor before Mr. Weir left the hall. By Mr. Becker : Q. Did you put the strap on alone ? A. With the assistance of a patient. Q. What next ? A. There was some blood on the floor before Mr. Weir left the hall; there was some blood on the floor and the doctor asked me how that came there ; I told him I didn't know ; he asked me how the patient got hurt; I did not tell him. By the Coroner : Q. This was Dr. Backus % A. Dr. Backus. By the District Attorney : Q. What reply did you make to him ? A. I told him I did not know. Q. You did know, didn't you, Mr. Brown ? A. I did; Dr. Backus examined his mouth and found his jaw fractured; he could not get any satisfaction how it was done. Q. He tried to find out how it was done ? A. He did. Q. He asked you various questions about it and your replies were , that you did not know ? A. I didn't know. Q. He went and reported it ? A. He went away and came back himself with Dr. Brush and Dr. Pilgrim. Q. What was done then ? A. They removed the waist belt from the patient, and they took him into the bedroom where I sleep; I believe they examined him; I do not know. Q. You do not know what they said % A. No, sir. Q. Now were you there when Mr. Weir came back ? A. I was. Q. And the doctor came soon after Mr. Weir returned % 1337 A. He did. Q. And when Mr. Weir came back did you have a dish of water with a sponge ? A. I did. Q. And where did you get that ? A. I got that in the bath-room. Q. And Hughes was strapped to the chair then before you got that of course? A. He was. Q. And you went to get' that for the purpose of washing the blood from his face ? A. Yes, sir; I washed off the blood from his face. Q. Now, Mr. Brown, you state you said to the inquiries of the doctors as to what occurred that you did not know ? A. Yes, sir. Q. You say, though, that you did know ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Well, will you tell just how it occurred, knowing as yon did just how it occurred ? A. I have stated just how it occurred. Q. No, you have not told us how the injury occurred? A. I told you that Weir stood back of the chair and I stood in front, and Mr. Weir hit the patient. By Mr. Kincaid : Q. More than once ? A. Twice. By the Coroner : Q. With the clenched hand ? A. With the clenched hand. By Mr. Kincaid : Q. Both times in the face ? A. Once in the face. Q. Where did he hit him the second time ? A. In the head. By Mr. Barnes: Q. Did he him with his knuckles ? A. With the side of his fist; he hit him first on the jaw, the second time on the head. Q. On which side of Hughes' face. ? A. On the right side. By the District Attorney': Q. Now, Mr. Brown, how many nimes did you hit the patient ? A. Once. ( Q. Was that with the fist ? j A. Itwas.H^- 168 TJ 1338 Q. Just indicate about on your person where you hit him ? A. Right here (indicating the abdomen). Q. That was while you and Mr. Weir were there together % A. Yes, sir. Q. It was before he went after the supervisor ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How long before ? A. A few minutes before. By Mr. Van Emburgh : Q. Had he bled before Mr. Weir left ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Where from ? A. From the mouth. By the District Attorney : Q. Now, while Weir was gone did you have any scuffle with the patient ? A. I did not have any more than to get him into the chair. Q. Did you call on any patients to assist you ? A. No, sir. Q. Then when Mr. Weir came back you say you had the dish with the sponge and was endeavoring to sponge off the blood; did Mr. Weir ask you how any injury occurred ? A. No, sir ; the doctor asked him and Mr. Weir said the man was all right when he went away. Q. Did the doctor ask Mr. Weir. A. I could not say he asked him what occurred; Mr. Weir said he was all right when he went away. Q. What else was said right then ? A. Then the doctor asked me how it occurred; I told him I did not know. Q. Did you say to the doctor at any time that you had hit him, and that Mr. Weir had ? A. Not that I know of ? Q. Well, was there any scuffle between you and Mr. Hughes while Weir was gone in which Hughes fell over the chair, or against the chair ? A. Not that I know of. Q. Did you strike Mr. Hughes at all while Mr. Weir was gone ? A. No, sir, I did not. Q. Did you use any violence in the way of giving a blow ? A. I did not. Q. Either with the fist or with the foot ? A. No, sir. Q. You did not jump on him with your knees ? A. I did not. Q. Was he on the floor at any time while Mr. Weir was gone ? A. Only on his knees. 1339 Q. Was he down on the floor at any time while' you and Mr. Weir were there together ? A. No, sir. Q. Was there at any time a blow inflicted, either with the fist or with the feet, excepting the three that you have stated ? A. That was all. Q. And from the time you came on the ward and saw Mr. Hughes, after you had dressed, you were not away from Hughes until after the injury ? A. Only to go after the water. Q. That was after the injury, was it not ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you learn afterward, Mr. Brown, that ribs were broken ? A. I did not; well, afterward I did; after he had been taken to ward eight. Q. Did you learn from the doctor that came that the jaw was broken ? A. I did. Q. Did you realize then how the jaw became broken ? A. I did. Q. Did you understand how the ribs were broken ? A. I did not, Q. You learned afterward that ribs were broken ? A. I did. Q. When? A. After he went to ward eight. Q. Was that after the three doctors had been called ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did anybody else than you and Weir have any thingjto do with Mr. Hughes, or take hold of him in any way ? A. They did before we did. Q. Who was that? A. Mr. Bills and Mr. Winnie, as I understood. Q. Mr. Winnie, the patient ? A. Yes, sir. Q. You have described their walking up the hall ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Was Mr. Hughes all right at that time ? A. As far as I saw. Q. When he came into your charge was he then all right? A. As far as I saw. Q. When he came then into your charge, when you and Mr. Weir got him, he was all right ? A. I could not see any thing the matter with him. Q. There was no blood ? A. No, sir. Q. How long afterward was it that you struck him i A. A few minutes; perhaps three minutes. 1340 By Mr. Van Emburgh : Q. Mr. Weir struck him twice ? A. Yes, sir. By Mr. Barnes : Q. You say you know how the jaw was broken ? A. Yes, sir; by the blow delivered by Mr. Weir. Q. You are satisfied that that blow broke his jaw ? A. Well, I did not know at the time, but when the doctor ex- amined it I believed it was from the effects of the blow. Q. Then it is your belief it was broken in that way ? A. Yes, sir. By Mr. Keim : Q. From being there with him all the time, is there any way that you can think of now how he could have received these other in- juries ; did you push him violently into the chair ? A. No, sir ; not so that he got hurt. Q. Which side was Weir ? A. He was back of the chair. Q. Did Mr. Weir have, at any time, hold of him with the right arm, and take hold of him with the left; was Mr. Weir, as you are sitting there, exactly back of him, or side ways from him ? A. Exactly back. Q. And when he hit him, he was exactly back of him ? A. He hit him sideways, like this (indicating). Q. He was right back of his head ? A. Yes, sir. Q. You we're exactly in front ? A. I was exactly in front. Q. Did you think it was a terribly powerful blow that he struck him? A. I did not think the blow was sufficient to do that ? Q. Where do you think you hit him ? A. I am sure I hit him down pretty low. • Q. Was it not in some way that might have broken his ribs ? A. No, sir ; it was not. Q. When they removed him from the chair to your room, did he get up and walk by himself? A. No, sir; 1 think he was assisted ; I don't know but that he could walk, but they were afraid to let him go alone. Q. Did lie make any complaint of being hurt then ? A. Not that I know of. Q. Now, you say that when Weir was behind Hughes, he had hold of Hughes' collar ? A. Yes, sir ; with the left hand ; he had hold of his collar with the left hand, and he struck with the right hand. Q. Now, just recall the position; just get that into your mind 1341 and then describe it; do you state that Weir stood behind him with the left hand on the collar ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Was this the way ? A. Yes, sir. Q. You are certain ? A. I am certain. Q. Now, are you sure that Mr. Weir did not strike in this way (indicating) ? A. I am. Q. Are you certain that he was not in this position at some time ? A. He may have been, but not at the time he gave him the blow Q. How did you hit him ? A. 1 had hold of Hughes' right arm with my left, and 1 struck. the blow with the right; he was struggling to get up. Q. Why did you hit him, Mr. Brown ? A. To see if I could not keep him quiet. Q. When did he stop resisting you? A. Not until the strap was put on, and then he tried to get out and he couldn't go, and then he got quiet. Q. Was he so weak "that he couldn't walk when they took him out of the chair ? A. I should think he could, but they led him out. Q. How far did that strap go ? A. It was put around the waist and strapped to the chair. Q. After you put that strap around him did he continue to struggle ? A. He did. Q. How long was it after that — after you had put the strap on — that Weir came back ? A. About five minutes. Q. After Weir came back did he continue to struggle until the doctor came? A. I could not say. Q. Was he apparently quiet after the first doctor came ? A. I think after the doctor came Mr. Weir told him to look out; that the patient would bite his finger when he put it in his mouth, but he did not bite him. By Mr. Barnes : Q. From your experience on the hall, and seeing the waist belts put around patients, and seeing them struggling after they were put on, could a patient struggle hard enough against that belt to break his own ribs ? A. Well, he may if he kept rocking like that (indicating) ; I think he could. By Mr. Becker : Q. How wide is the belt % _„ ___, 1342 A. I should think about an inch and a half in width. By Mr. Keim : Q. Was he very violent when Weir left to see the supervisor ? A. Yes, sir, he was. Q. You say it took as much as Weir and you both could do to handle him ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Well, you say you put him in the chair alone ? A. I put him in the chair alone, but a patient helped me to put the strap on him. Q. You say a patient helped you to secure him? A. Yes, sir. By Mr. Kincaid : Q. You went for this belt just as soon as you saw the patient coming through the hall ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Is there any reason why you did not put it on to restrain him before he was struck ? A. Well, the head attendant was there, and I could not put it on until he told me to do so. Q. Not unless Mr. Weir told you to do so ? A. No, sir; I knew though that if the belt was put on he would be kept from hurting himself or us. Q. Have those chairs arms to them ? A. They have, something like this (indicating a chair with high arms). Q. These chairs in which they are strapped have arms to them ? • A. Yes, sir, similar to this. By Mr. Keim : Q. You claim that you had to hit him to conquer him ? A. That was what I intended. Q. How was it that this occurred ? A. I put him in the chair once and then I had to strap him after that; I knew I could not keep him there, and that he could get away and might hurt me or some one else. By Mr. Barnes: Q. As violent men run on your ward, did you consider him a violent patient ? ^.^ A. He was the most violent patient I have ever seen there. Q. How long have you been on there ? A. Since the 20th of July last. Q. Where do you live ? A. Utica. 1343 Q. Did you see the doctor make an examination with reference to the injured jaw ? £' "Lia^,him put his fin£er in his mouth. y. Which side did he examine« A. The right side. Q. Did he make any examination of the left side? A. He may; I cannot say. Q. You say he discovered that the right jaw was injured ? A. 1 saw him pull his lip down and examine his mouth. Q. Did you hear the statement there that the jaw was broken on the right side ? v A. I heard Dr. Backus say so. (A waist belt, such as was used, was shown to the jury.) Q. Could you say how this waist belt was fastened to the chair; by one post or two ? A. I think it was fastened to the right post; it was the right post; I remember that well. Q. Could a patient twist around with that and break his ribs in this way ? A. He might if it was not put on tight. Q. Which side did you approach him from when you came near him? A. The right side. Q. Will you stand by me and show just where Weir stood by the patient when he struck him ? A. Right there (indicating). Q. It was directly behind ? A. Directly behind. Q. Now describe how he got out of the chair when you were there alone with him ? ^r: J Q. He got out of the chair and pulled me over on hirn; and I fell over on him and kept my arms around him and pulled hirn back again into the chair. (Illustrates the manner of holding patient by passing his arms around juror Barnes and bending him over.) Mr. Barnes — Now that could break his ribs if he fell on him as he did on me then. By Mr. Becker : Q. Did he get clear out of the chair? A. Yes, sir; I kept my arms around him without letting go of him. Q. You are not sure whether you fell on him or not ? A.I did not fall on hifi ; I did not let go of him because I . thought he would hurt me or some one else. Q. How tall a man was Mr. Hughes ? A. He was nearly as tall as I am ; he was taller than Mr. Barnes; he pulled me right on top of him and I pulled him back again and sat him again in the chair. 1344 Q. During that scuffle did he go on to the arm of the chair ? A. I could not tell; he may have. Q. He was struggling to get away ? A. Yes, sir; and I was struggling to keep hiin in the chair. By Mr. Kincaid : Q. Mr. Brown, from what you know of the scuffle with him during the time he was in your care, have you any idea of how the ribs became broken ? A. No, sir ; unless in that way. Q. Were you at all surprised when you heard that these ribs were broken ? A. I was, although I did not know what occurred in the day-room. By Mr. Martin : Q. You mean by that that you thought they were broken ? A. I knew nothing about it; I could not tell whether they could be broken in that way or not. Q. How much do you weigh ? ) A. About two hundred. Q. What was your judgment as to whether there was enough violence used to break trie ribs ; do you think they may have been broken in that way when he got out of the chair ? A. They may in the struggle ; I couldn't tell; I tried so hard to keep him in the chair. Q. You say you were not surprised when you learned that his ribs were broken ? A. I was surprised, but I say I did not know what occurred in the day-room. Q. Did you think you had used violence enough to break his ribs? A. I did not think I had ; that tliere was while I was on the hall; I don't know whether he broke them when he was running up and down on the hall or not; I heard he was running up and dowi Q. Do you know whether he fell down there or not ? A. I do not. Q. Have you heard any such thing ? A. No. By Mr. Van Emburgh : Q. What assistance did this patient give you when you strapped Mr. Hughes in the chair ? 4 A. He took hold of him by one hand when I was putting him in the chair. Q. Who was that patient \ A. Mr. Winnie. Q. Any one else assist you ? A. Mr. McQueen held him on the other side. 1345 Q. And then you went to get the strap 1 A. Yes, sir. r Q. You called these patients to your assistance? A. No, sir ; they came. Q. Are they violent patients ? A. No, sir; they were the best two patients we have on the hall? Q. Did they kick or strike him ? A. No, sir. By Mr. Becker : Q. What object did you have innot telling the doctor about that ? A. I did not want it to come out till it was necessary. Q. Have you and Weir had any conversation about this matter since then ? A. No, sir. Q. You have not said any thing to Weir ? A. No, sir. Q. Nor Weir any thing to you ? A. No, sir. Q. Is that patient that helped you quite rational at times ? A. They are both quite rational, both of them. Q. Are they reliable persons ; persons that you could depend upon ? A. Well, sometimes they have spells; you could depend upon them sometimes and sometimes not; they might say that we struck them when we had not struck them for some weeks. Q. You can't possibly be mistaken about Weir's striking him ? A. No, sir, I am not. Q. Has Mr. Weir been in charge of that hall since? A. Yes, sir. Q. You have been an attendant there since ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Been daily in association with him ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Has not this matter been the subject of conversation at all ? A. No, sir ; not between Mr. Weir and I. Q. Has it been between any one else and you ? A. I have told Mr. Bills something. Q. Do you know whether Weir and Mr. Bills have had any talk about it ? A. I think Mr. Weir and Mr. Bills have talked about the matter. By Mr. Martin : Q. Is there any unpleasantness between Mr. Weir and you ? A. No, sir; not any. 169 U 1346 Q. Have you had any difficulty with him ? A. Not any. Q. Any words of any kind ? A. Never. Q. When he came back there, did he ask you how it came that the patient was bleeding ? A. He did not. Q. What did he say when he came back ; what was his manner ? A. He said something to the doctor. Q. You say that Hughes bled before he went out; did he say any thing in your presence about the injury ? A. No, sir. Q. Before the doctor came, he did not say any thing ? A. No, sir. Q. Did he make any remark that the man was hurt when he came back? A. No, sir. By Mr. Kincaid : Q. He did not say that he was sorry that any thing of that kind had occurred on his department ? A. Afterward he did. Q. How long afterward ? A. Perhaps in a day or two. Q. Not immediately after his return to the hall that day ? A. No, sir. By Mr. Barnes : Q. When he came back, after seeing the supervisor, did he say : " For goodness sakes what has happened since I went away," or any thing of that kind ? A. No, sir. Q. When he told the doctor that he was all right when he went away, you knew that was not true ? A. Idid. Q. But you did not explain to the doctor ? A. No, sir. Q. Have you explained to the doctor since ? A. I have to Dr. Pilgrim. Q. Any one else ? A. To Mr. Bills. Q. Any one else ? A. Not that I know of. Q. You have explained to them just as you have to us ? A. Not perhaps just like this. Q. But in substance this ? A. Yes, sir. * Q. Are you in the habit of striking patients ? 1347 A "No, sir. Q. Are any of the others on the ward in the habit of striking patients ? A. No, sir ; Mr. Weir does not like to strike any one or to see any- body struck. J Q Have you ever seen him strike patients before ? A. I have. Q. Have you ever struck them yourself ? .,■£-• ^es' ^ is necessary to strike them sometimes or they would be killing us ; we have to defend ourselves at times. By the Foreman : Q. Were you defending yourself when-you struck him like that ? A. Well he tried to bite and kick us. Q. Mr. Weir had one arm and you had the other ? A. Yes,'sir. By Mr. Kincaid : Q. Would you not have avoided all that by strapping him in the first place ? A. Yes, I think it might have been avoided by that. Q. Mr. Weir could no^ have put it on without orders from the doctor ? A. No, sir. Q. Then he went up to report him and see what was to be done, and you strapped him then before the doctor gave orders ? A. I did, because I was afraid he would kill me or one of the patients. By Mr. Barnes : Q. Then in your care of him, you exercised what was your best judgment ? A. I did. JAMES BROWN. Franklin Bills, sworn and testified: By the Coroner : Q. Mr. Bills, you are one of the attendants ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How long have you been an attendant here ? A. A year the 15th of this month. Q. Where did you live before coming here ? A. In the town of Marcy. Q. And you are on which hall Tt A. Fourth ward. Q. That was the one where Mr. Hughes was at the time he re- ceived his injuries, as you understand ? 1348 A. Yes, sir. Q. Do you remember what time in the day it was when Mr. Hughes was brought to that ward ? A. It was between ten and eleven o'clock, 1 think. Q. You were there when he was brought tliere ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What other attendants were there at the time ? A. Mr. Weir and Mr. Brown were on the ward. Q. Was Mr. Hughes violent ? A. Yes, sir, he was. Q. Very violent ? A. Yes, sir, he was pretty violent in my presence. Q. Did you have any charge of him at any portion of the time? A. When they brought him down to the ward I was in the day- room, in the further day-room, and they sat him down in a chair next to me. Q. Who did that? A. Two attendants from the ninth hall. Q. They brought him from the ninth hall ? A. Yes, sir. Q. You saw him as quick as he was brought in ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Before he was seated ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Just describe what he did as to his violence ? A. Well, he sat in the chair very quiet for fifteen to twenty minutes ; that was the first thing ; then he got up and walked down to the hall from the day-room where I was and walked into the other part, and was probably gone ten minutes, I should think, then came back and walked around the room, and went to one of the doors and commenced knocking against it with one of his hands; I went to him and asked him to sit in a chair and he sat there, and after a while got up and went to kicking another door ; I went toward him and he went away from that door and began kicking at another; I went to him and put my hand on his shoulder and sat him in a chair, and I thought I would talk to hirn and try to quiet him : I put my hand on his shoulder and he commenced to bite and kick me, and I took hold of him by the collar and hand and we held him, Mr. Winnie and I, there about ten minutes ; thdh it was time for me to go to the dining-room ; Mr. Winnie helped me to hold him and I took the patient from the chair, Mr. Winnie and I, and took him up into the other room and sat him in a chair ; then I went back and got a patient to go into the dining-room with me, and I went right up to the dining-room, and that was all I saw of him. Q. That was the last ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Were you notified or did you learn that he was injured before he was taken away ? A. I heard of it; the attendants came down, Brown and Weir 1349 and they said the patient was hurt; they didn't say where he was Q. Did they enter into any particulars at that time? A. No, sir. Q. Did you learn who hurt him ? A. No, sir. Q. Have you since learned how the injury was inflicted ? A. I have learned some things. Q. Yon may state what you know upon the subject'? A. Mr. Brown said that Mr. Weir hit the patient once; he said he stood on one side of the chair and hit him once here (indicating the side of the head), and that he hit him in the abdomen ; that was what Mr. Brown told me. Q. Did they say any thing about a scuffle ? A. No, sir, I do not think they did, to me. Q. Did Mr. Brown speak about the patient falling over the chair and being injured in any way ? A. I do not think he did. Q. In speaking of these injuries did Brown claim they were re- ceived by those blows which you have mentioned ? A. No, sir. Q. What did he say as to how they were received ? Did he make any claim as to what his theory was ? A. No, sir. Q. You asked him how the man got hurt ? A. No, sir. Q. The subject of his injury was the subject of conversation ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you understand Brown to be describing how the man was hurt ? A. I asked him if he struck him and he said yes ; I asked him if Mr. Weir struck him and he said he did. Q. Did you learn that the man's jaw was broken ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you learn that his ribs were broken ? A. Yes, sir ; I heard Weir say so. Q. Had you heard of that before Brown had the talk with you ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you make any inqury of Brown as to how the ribs were broken ? A. No, sir. Q. Now, you have had a talk with Mr. Weir about it ? A. I think I have. Q. You have had some conversation ? A. I have asked him some few questions; he said very little about it. Q. Did you ask Mr. Weir if he struck Mr. Hughes ? A. Yes, sir ; I think I did. Q. Was there any thing said about the striking, either by you or Weir? 1350 A. I think there was. Q. By you? A. asked him if he struck him, and he said he slapped him on the side of the face. Q. He said he gave the patient a slap on the side of the face? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you ask Mr. Weir or did Mr. Weir say any thing at any time about this man getting hurt ? A. He said the man was not hurt until he went out to report him. Q. Did you say any thing to Brown as to how he was hurt ? A. Mr. Brown said he was hurt while Mr. Weir was there. Q. So that they differed in conversation about the subject ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Weir claimed that he was not hurt until after he left the hall, and Mr. Brown claimed that he was hurt before he went away? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did Brown give any reasons for saying that the man was hurt before Weir left the hall ? Did he say any thing about indications of an injury being apparent ? A. No, sir; nothing beyond what I have told you. Q. Did he say that he knew Mr. Hughes was hurt because he bled before he went away ? A. I heard him say that there was blood ou the floor before Weir went away. Q. Did you see the place where the blood was on the floor? A. I saw the place where it was mopped. Q. It was directly in front of the chair ? A. I think it was. Q. About how far from the man's feet, if he sat in the chair ? , A. About two feet from the chair; I should think it was about a couple of feet. Q. Could you see from where you stood, and was the man's head probably over like this, and the blood in front, directly down from that? A. I think so. Q. You think that the spots were near enough to indicate that blood dropped from his mouth as he sat in his chair? A. Yes, sir. Q. Were the blood spots far enough away to indicate that the blood came from his mouth ? A. As he bent forward, yes, sir. Q. You would tliink that the man was in the chair ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Was there much blood ? A. I didn't see any blood. Q. Was tliere indications of such ? A. I couldn't say ; it was all mopped up. Q. How large a spot had been mopped up ? 1351 A. Only a small spot, about two feet square or such a matter. t^. Now, have you had any conversation with Mr. Brown in which any thing else was said by him in addition to what you have given« J A. No, sir ; I don't tliink I have. Q. Have you given us all you said to Mr. Brown and all he said to you ( A. I don't know as I could state it all. Q. Just state in your own way what you said to Brown and what he said to you ; first tell me where it was you had the conversation ? A. It was on the ward ; I couldn't tell you exactly where. Q. How soon after this man was hurt ? A. It was a day or two afterward. 0. Fix it as definitely as you can ? A. I shoidd think it was two days after. Q. Was that the first conversation you had ? A. I think it was. Q. Now will you state what you said to him and what he said to you, as near as you can think; if you can give the exact language do so, and if you cannot, as near as you can. Who commenced the conversation ? A. I could not tell who spoke first ? Q. Tell it as nearly as you can ? A. I think I spoke to Mr. Brown, and asked him first how it oc- ccurred, and asked him what he had done after Mr. Weir went away ; he said he tried to keep the patient in the chair with Mr. Winnie; that they tried to. keep him in the chair; I understood him to say that the patient got down on the floor once and he raised him and put him back in the chair; that was the way he stated it to me; then he said that he went and got the strap and strapped the man in the chair; then he went and got a sponge and some water and sponged the blood from his mouth. Q. Did he claim that he did that after Weir went away ? A. Yes, sir; then I asked him if he struck the patient after Weir went away or had any scuffle with him and he said no, sir, he did not; he only put him back in the chair just as I told you. Q. Then he said he had no more trouble with him after he had him strapped in the chair? A. No, sir. Q. Any thing else ? A. No, sir; I don't tliink there is any thing else. Q. That is all he told you ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Will you tell us what Mr. Weir said to you; first tell us when it was ? A. Mr. Weir stated to me that the patient was not hurt; and he claims he did not see any blood on the floor up to the time he went away to see the supervisor. ... Q. When did you have this talk with Mr. Weir? 1352 A. Yesterday. Q. Was that the first? A. Yes, sir, I think it was. Q. Yesterday he told you that there was no blood on the floor ; and that the patient was not injured until after he went away? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you tell Weir that Brown claimed that he was hurt before he went away ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What did he say to that ? A. What did he say ? Q. Yes. A. Well, he said that he did not see any thing the matter with the man when he went away. By Mr. Becker: Q. Have you ever had occasion to strike a patient ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Often? A. No, sir. Q. Have you ever seen Mr. Weir strike a patient ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Have you ever seen Mr. Brown strike them ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Is it necessary, sometimes, to protect yourselves and the other patients ? A. Yes, sir; it is. Q. You are almost obliged to use force at times, are you? A. Yes, sir; you can't avoid it sometimes. Q. Do you know whether you have been reported at the office for the striking of a patient ? A. No, sir; I don't. Q. Whose business would it be to report ? A. The head attendant on the ward. Q. Mr. Weir? A. Yes, sir. FRANKLIN BILLS. James Mulheron, sworn and examined: By the Coroner : Q. You are employed here as an attendant ? A. Yes, sir. Q. In what capacity? A. Night-watch on the 9th ward. Q. You know this man, Mr. Hughes ? A. He slept on my hall one night; I went to supper at quarter 1353 past eleven, and when I got back, fMr. Somers had him put in a covered bed; he was very restless and noisy all night, so that when he was put in a covered bed he was perfectly safe as far as doing harm to myself or any one else was concerned; in the morning I went home, and that is all I saw of him. Q. Did you assist in putting him into this covered bed? A. No, sir, he was put in while I was at supper. Q. Did you see the patient after that ? A. I visit the patients every quarter of an hour; he remained noisy all night; I could not keep him quiet; I could not make him understand any thing I said to him. Q. Did you see him after that ? A. No, sir, I came the next night at eight o'clock, and he was not on that ward. Q. He had been injured then ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you learn how he had been injured ? A. No, sir. Q. You did not know any thing about that ? A. No, sir. Q. Is that all you know of the matter? A. Yes, sir. By Mr. Shearman : Q. Were you present when he was taken to the 4th ward ? A. No, sir; I left at six in the morning and went home. JAMES MULHERON. Dr. Ogden Backus recalled: By the District Attorney : Q. You took the statement that was given by the son of Mr. Hughes when he was brought here ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Was he asked to disclose all the circumstances of the case ? A. Yes, sir ; that isjhe rule. Q. And as they gave it you reduced it to writing ? A. I took it in lead-pencil and wrote it out in the case book after- ward. Q. Were these preserved ? A. The pencil notes were not preserved. Q. And from what they said to you what was the condition of the patient ? A. The condition was one of melancholia, with suicidal tenden- C1GS Q. Did they say to you that he was melancholy, and had threatened suicide ? A. Yes, sir. 170 U 1354 Q. And did they give you any information as to his being a vio- lent patient toward other people ? A. No, sir; none whatever. Q. Did they disclose the fact to you that two or four men had been employed to take care of him ? A. No, sir; the first I heard of it was when I read of it in the paper in Mr. Hughes' evidence. Q. And you received him here as a patient suffering from melan- cholia with suicidal tendencies? A. Yes, sir. Q. And he was sent to a suicidal ward ? A. To the ninth ward; yes, sir. Q. Had they disclosed the facts that you have since learned, would you have made the same disposition with him ? A. I would have sent every patient with suicidal tendencies to the ninth ward, because if they are sent to other wards at night they are not so closely watched. Q. But if you had learned that he was violent, with suicidal ten- dencies ? A. I should still have sent him to the ninth ward. Q. What was there in his case that would lead any one-to believe that there were suicidal tendencies ? A. For the simple reason that his son had said that he was suicidally disposed ; that he had delusions that every one was down on him, and generally those delusions are connected with a tendency to suicide: Q. And in spite of that, doctor, was he a violent, maniacal patient as distinguished from suicidal patients ? A. No, sir ; his history was suicidal from what they said. Q. But with reference to his conduct here ? A. Well, as to his conduct here ; we have a condition of melan- cholia with frenzy sometimes; a patient may be suicidal, may be very melancholy, and yet at times have a condition of frenzy; these we still consider as suicidal cases, although while in this con- dition they may not be suicidal; as soon as the frenzy passes off the suicidal tendency again returns. Q. You were not informed that it took three or four persons to take care of him ? A. No, sir. Q. Doctor, you understand the rules of the institution governing the conduct of attendants toward patients ? A. Certainly; yes, sir. Q. And is it one of the rules of the institution that a patient is not to be struck at any time, or under any circumstances by an attendant ? A. That is one of the rules emphatically laid down. Q. What is the penalty, if any is prescribed, in case of the viola- tion of this rule ? A. Instant dismissal of the attendant. OGDEN BACKUS. 1355 Dr. C. W. Pilgrim, sworn and examined : By the District Attorney : Q. You know Mr. Brown and Mr. Weir 1 A. Yes, sir. Q. And you know Mr. Hughes ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you go up to see him after he was injured ? A. After he was injured, yes, sir. Q. Who was there with you ? t £•' } Think Pr' Brush and Dn Backus got there right after me ; 1think 1 got there a little while before them; Dr. Backus had been there before and reported it; they were right behind me ; I do not think they were over three or four seconds after me. Q. Did you make an examiuation then to any extent ? A. We did not make a very careful examination. Q. Was Hughes strapped in the chair then ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Was he violent then ? A. No,.sir. Q. At that time he was comparatively quiet? A. Yes, sir. Q. Now you have had some conversation with Mr. Brown since the injury ? A. Yes, sir. Q. As to how it occurred ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Will you state to the jury what went on and what was said ? A. It is all down ; Mr. McGarr took notes of it. Q. This conversation was had in the presence of the stenographer ? A. Yes, sir. Q. At the time ? A. Yes, sir. (The notes of the previous examination were then read.) Q. Did you make an examination afterward ? A. No, sir. Q. Doctor, with reference to the statements as to whether they saw nothing wrong with them, did they mean nothing irrational or did they mean there was nothing in the way of an injury ? A. They meant no injury. Q. Doctor, have you since had any conversations with Mr. Brown or Mr. Weir on the subject ? A. Yes, sir ; nothing very extensive though. Q Any thing that differs from this statement ? A. Nothing essential, although there have been a few additions made. Q. By which one ? A. By Brown. Q. What were those additions ? 1356 A. He claims that he saw Mr. Weir strike the patient. Q. Before he left to report him ? A. Yes, sir. WQ. And did you ask him, doctor, if he did not strike him before Weir went away ? A. I could not say whether I asked him that or not. Q. There was no claim made at this time that Weir struck him ? g|A. No, sir. Q. When was that interview with Brown when he claimed that Weir struck him ? A. I do not remember the date ; it was a few nights before the patient died. Q. It was after that interview that was put on paper ? A. Yes, sir; that was on Saturday. Q. How many times did he state Weir struck the patient ? A. I think twice. Q. Did he say any thing about whether he had struck him him- self or not? A. I do not think he did at that time, but he has since; then he has admitted that he struck him in the lower part of the stomach or abdomen. Q. Was there any thing said between you and him as to the force of the blow or how violent it was ? A. I asked him if he was sure that he had struck him low down and he said yes ; I asked him if he was sure that his knee had not struck him in any way while he was on the floor; he said he was sure they had not. By Mr. Barnes : Q. In that interview with Mr. Brown that was taken down by Mr. McGarr, Mr. Brown just answered your questions ? A. Yes, sir; he did not volunteer any thing. Q. Did you ask him any questions when you first went up ? A. I asked Mr. Weir, at the time, how 'this had occurred ; his reply was, "I don't know, doctor;" of course I saw the man was very sick, and I knew the inquiry could wait much better than the man could. Q. Did you make inquiry of Brown then ? A. I think he was standing there, but I did not address my inquiry to either one particularly ? Q. Mr. Weir said he did not'know how it occurred ? A. He did. Q. And Mr. Brown was silent ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Any one else make inquiries ? A. Not that I know of. Q. What did you do next ? fc-....-^...... 1357 ,,A-/^e attended to the man as soon as we could and got him to the attendants' room. Q. Who was the first physician saw him 9 A. Dr. Backus. CHAS. W. PILGRIM. Dr. Ogden Backus, recalled : By the District Attorney : Q. Did you see the blood after Hughes was injured ? A. Yes, sir. J Q. About how much was there and where was it ? A. Well, tliere was a little on the chair and a little on his beard but the floor had evidently been mopped up. Q. You saw the spot where it had been mopped up ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Was that directly in front ? A. It was diagonally in front. Q. To the right or left ? A. To the left. Q. Did you see any on the wall? A. No, sir. Q. Which arm of the chair was it on ? A. It was on the left arm; it seemed as if it had dropped, a drop or two; I think there was a drop or two on the front edge of the chair. Q. And these spots of blood indicated that they had just dropped there ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Was there an extensive bleeding from the mouth ? A. No, sir ; I was surprised that there was not more; tliere was no froth ; of course there was a little saliva. Q. This break of the jaw was it a complete break ? A. Yes, sir : it came down just here (indicating) and moving it produced acrepitis ; you could see the line of fracture. Q. Was there any opening in which you could put your finger ? f> A. No, sir; of course you could separate it, but the skin wonld hold it together and prevent the insertion of the finger; it dropped down a little so that in setting it you would have to raise it ; that was caused by a contraction of the muscles. Q. Was there auy thing that indicated any internal bleeding from the lungs ? A.P Nothing that would indicate it, no, sir. Q. You examined Mr. Hughes before the other physicians saw A. Yes sir; I examined simply his face ; I found hisjjaw fract- ured and reported it immediately. Q. Where was the jaw fractured? 1358^ A. It was fractured a little to the right of the center. r Q. When you first went to see Mr. Hughes who had been injured, who was present of the attendants ? A. Well, I can't positively state who. Q. Was Brown there ? A. I cannot state positively; I did not notice especially; my attention was taken up with the patient. Q. Do you know whether Weir was there ? A. I could not state positively. By Mr. Cheney : Q. Don't you know which of the attendants cautioned you to, take care about the patient biting you? A. I could not state positively. Q. Do you know, Doctor, whether you made an inquiry after you got there of the attendants, as to how the man got hurt ? A. Yes sir. Q. What was the reply ? A. As near as I can recall it I asked " how did this happen 't'' I remember saying that; then somebody, I don't know who, said that the man hurt himself against the chair; then somebody said that he slipped; I was taken up entirely with the patient and did not devote any attention to the matter. By the Coroner : Q. You stated on your first examination that you did not get a satisfactory explanation ? A. That was simply because I was taken up with the patient; I simply did not press the investigation, as I thought my first duty was to report to Dr. Gray. By Mr. Barnes : Q. Would a blow on the side of the face be likely to fracture the jaw in that way that Mr. Hughes' was fractured ? A. By a blow on the side of the face ? Q. Yes? A. I think so; you take the construction of the jaw ; a blow struck on the side would be likely to break there (indicating a little to the right of center). Q. Would striking on his face be likely to break his jaw ? A. Yes, sir; a man might fall on his face on the floor and fracture his jaw. By Mr. Martin : Q. Was this a complete break ? A. Yes, sir; a complete break. 1359 Q. Doctor, did you think there were more than three ribs frac- tured in this affair ? t A-Iknew there were two, and I didn't know how many more ; 1 pulled up his shirt, and I found what is known as crepitis over two ribs. * By the Coroner : Q. There is a statement from the coroner and physicians in Mad- ison county that every rib was broken on that side ?' A. I knovv there were two broken, but the man's condition was such that I did not deem it advisable to investigate further, as his treatment would be the same in any case, whether one or more ribs were fractured. OGDEN BACKUS. A. G. Weir recalled : By the District Attorney : Q. Mr. Weir, after you came back after you had gone to make a report to the supervisor, you stated that you saw Mr. Brown with a dish of water and a sponge ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Was he going away from the patient or coming toward him ? A. Coming toward him. Q. When he came up to him did he use the water and sponge? A. We both used it. Q. Did you say any thing to Mr. Brown as to what had occurred ? A. I did; I asked Mr. Brown what occurred ; he said he did not know ; he said he had a tussle with M,v. Hughes and had to get one of the patients to assist him and that he did not know what had occurred ; I said, "Mr. Brown, you certainly must know some- thing about this, because we must find out about it.'J Q. What did he say then ? A. He said "I wish you had strapped him before you went to see the supervisor." Q. Did you strike the patient at any time ? A. I could not say as I struck himl; had a hand around him and let it down on his shoulder. Q. Will you say that you did not strike him ? A. I slapped him. Q. Where was that ? A. It was toward the back of the neck; I stood on his left side ? Q. That was with the flat hand ? A. It was. Q. Did any one see you do that ? A. I think Mr. Bills saw me do that. Q.' You think Mr. Bills saw it ? A. I think so. 1360 Q. How many times did that occur ? A. I think I slapped him twice. Q. You struck him more than once ? A. I slapped him twice in that way. Q. Did Brown strike Mr. Hughes in your presence ? A. He did. Q. Where did he strike him ? A. He walked right out of his room, and the first thing he did he struck twice. Q. He struck him where ? A. In the abdomen ; the first words I said were : " Go esay ; go easy;" he did not have his coat on at the time; I was holding him in the chair at the time and he came up and struck him twice. Q. Was that at the time yon had slapped him ? A. I had slapped him before that. Q. Was Mr. Brown present when you slapped him ? A. He was a little ways off. Q. Then he saw you slap him ? A. I think so. Q. Then he came up and struck him twice and you said '' Go easy ?" A. " Go easy," yes, sir. Q. Did you see blood on Mr. Hughes' face before you went to report to the supervisor ? A. There was no blood on his face when I left him Q. Any blood on the floor ? A. None when I left; he was sitting quietly in a chair when I went away ; he had been violent before and I thought Mr. Brown could manage him all right until I could get back. Q. Your idea was that he was a violent patient and that you would get him into restraint during the dinner time? A. Yes, sir ; I would say I came back Sunday night; Mr. Brown rooms with me and he says to me: " Mr. Hughes' ribs are broken," I said, " this is a very said affair;' and he said " I dou't know how it occurred, you might ask the patients; " then I asked the patients and since then I have thoroughly investigated among the patients to see how this occurred and by whom he got his injuries; I am not able to find out thoroughly how his ribs came to be injured. Q. Have you learned any thing from the patients with reference to the tussle between Brown and Hughes while you were gone ? A. Yes, sir ; I learned that there was a tussle and that he was on the floor. Q. From whom did you learn that? A. From Mr. Winnie and from Mr. Rappenberger, a German patient; I could not understand all that he said, but he showed' me where his finger was bitten by Mr. Hughes during the struggle; that was while I was gone; I could not understand very well what he said ; since I found out the man's ribs were injured I asked the doctor where he was injured and where his ribs were broken, and i3ei IrVn^T lhat th,ey were broken on the front side.; I do not think, it could be from the time he struck him. w*« Vh« «7°iU Ca™e back and fdund Hughes injured, Dr. Backus was the first physician that came there ? A. Yes, sir. Q. He came right behind you * A. Yes, sir. J Q He made a personal examination of Jiis face sufficient to de- termine that his jaw was broken » A. Yes, sir. Q. Did*he make inquiry as to how his jaw was broken ? A. He asked me; I was right there; Lsaid, "Doctor, I couldn't tell you how that occurred." Q. Do you know Dr. Pilgrifh ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do you remember his asking you how tbe injury occurred ? A. Yes, sir. ■■.«?■..■> -, \....; . -,■, i Q. Did you say there that it occurred after you left the ward ? A. Yes, sir. .-•,■.,, ■ ••^ : . - >; Q. When you stated to the physicians that it occurred while you were away, did Brown say anything about your statement as to whether it was true or not ? A. Mr. Brown was not in the room when Dr. Pilgrim asked me these questions. Q. Do you remember any thing that was said ? A. The doctor asked me how that occurred; it;was done, I said, while I was away\ [ tQ. Did Brown say any thing then ? A. Not while Dr. Pilgrim was examining me; he was not present. Q. Now, did you see any blood on the floor in any way \before you went away? A. No, sir; there was no blood on the floor when I left. Q. How long was it aftea- you slapped him and Brown struck him before you went to see the supervisor? . , A. I should think about ten minutes; something about that time; I remained long enough to see that he was quiet and that it was safe for me to leave him. Q. And it was five or ten minutes after that? A. Yes, sir. Q. You were gone how long ? A. I should tliink ten minutes. Q. So that from the time you slapped him and Brown struck him there was a period of about twenty minutes elapsed before you came back and saw Brown with the basin of water? A. Yes, sir. Q. And up to that time you could not see any blood ? A. No, sir; and he could never have received any injury up to that time. Q. You were not apprised that he received any injury ? A. No, sir. . -.-isa 171 U A . 1362 By Mr. Spencer : Q. Is it customary or the rule to report all such occurrences ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do you know how it happened that Dr. Backus came into the room immediately after you? A. I do. Q. How was it ? A. He came in with Mr. Barrisdale. Q. You had reported to the supervisor and he had met the doctor? A. Yes, sir; I told the supervisor and he met the doctor. Q. So that Dr. Backus came in with the supervisor? A. Yes, sir. Q. And the supervisor was there with the doctor ? A. Yes, sir. Alexander Barrisdale, sworn and examined : By the District Attorney: Q. Mr. Barrisdale, you are the supervisor of one of the departments? A. Yes, sir. Q. Which department ? A. First department. Q. And included in that department is the fourth ward ? A. Yes, sir. Q. You knew Mr. Hughes, or who he was ? A. No, sir ; I can't say I did; I saw him. Q. You know there was such a man ? A. Yes, sir. Q. When did you first see him ? A. I saw him first on the fourth ward sitting in a chair. Q. That was after the injury ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you go to the ward to see Mr. Hughes in company with Dr. Backus ? r J A. Yes, sir. Q. And had Weir called on you to report the Hughes case to you ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did he report him as a very violent patient? A. Yes, sir. Q. Requiring unusual restraint? A. Yes, sir. Q. He reported that he was very violent and excitable, and the object m reporting to you was that you should give your attention to the subject? J A. The object was that I should see the doctor and see what was best to be done. Q. Then you discovered that he had been injured through Dr Backus' examination ? J ° ' A. Yes, sir. 1363 Q. Did you see any blood there ? A. I saw some blood on his lips and mouth. Q. Did you see any on the floor ? A. No, sir. * Q. Had that been wiped up ? A. Yes, it seemed so. Q. Was there a spot on the floor where they had been apparently mopping something up ? A. Yes, sir. Q. That was close by the chair ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Was Mr. Brown there at the time ? A. Yes, sir ; I believe he was. Q. Was he using a sponge and a basin of water ? A. No, sir; he had got through with them when Dr. Backus and I went down. Q. Was Mr. Weir there at the time ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Anybody else ? A. No, sir ; I do not think there was. Q. Any other attendant there at the time ? A. No, sir. Q. Did you hear Dr. Backus say how the man received the in jury ? A. Yes, sir; I believe I heard him ask the attendant that came up, or something to that effect. Q. You did not know who said any thing? A. I could not say who replied to the doctor; the answer was to the effect that they did not know the man was injured. Q. Did you hear Mr. Weir1, while you were there, say that he did not know how it occurred; that it occurred while he was away after you? A. I asked him about it, and he said he did not know how it oc- curred ; he made the remark that the man was not injured while he was present. jjfj^Q. Was Brown there at the time? A. I couldn't say, but I don't think he was at that time. Q. Were you and Dr. Backus, Brown and Weir there together ? A. Dr. Backus was not there when I asked that question of Mr. Weir. Q. Were Brown aud Weir and you there together ? A. They were on the ward at the time. Q. And at the time Weir said this, did Brown make any reply ? A. Mr. Brown was not present, I don't think, at the time Weir made that statement. Q. Have yon heard Weir make that statement in Brown's pres- ence at any time ?, A. No, sir. ,.■,!.. Q. Did you hear Brown say any thing about how it occurred ? 1364 A. Mr. Brown told me that he did not know how it occurred. Q. Did Mr. Brown ever claim to you that it occurred before Weir weDt to notify you? , . . A. Mr. Brown claimed that the accident must lr&ve occurred be- fore Mr. Weir left the ward ; he claimed it must have been before that. Q. Did he state the fact in way of argument ? A. He stated that it must have been before Weir left the hall. Q. Could you state that was his expression ? A. I believe he said it must have occurred before Weir went away. Q. Did he at auy time state that it occurred while Weir was there ? A. He said afterward that he believed the man's jaw was broken on the ward but that he did not know the ribs were broken. Q. Do you know how long it was before you were found or went to the spot where Hughes was after Weir had notified you ? A. I reckoned it was not over ten minutes. Q. You think it would be about ten minutes from the time you were notified ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Do you know whether Weir when he went to notify you had to wait to see you ? A. Yes, sir ; he waited on the first ward. Q. Did he say any thing to you as to how long he had waited ? A. No, sir. Q. But in fact he had waited there ? A. Yes, sir. , ALEXANDER BARRISDALE,: Dr. John P. Gta/y, sworn and examined: By the District Attorney : 1 Q. Doctor, you may state what your position in connection with the Asylum is? A. I am the superintendent of the Asylum. Q. And how long have you been superintendent; about how many years ? A. For about thirty years Q. You knew.this man Hughes, the patient who was brought here ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And did you know when he was brought here last? A. Yes, sir; I saw him the morning he was admitted, in the office, and talked with him in the office. Q. Were any of his family with him? A. His son was standing near him when I was talking with him 1365 ?' ^J10 else aocomPanied him, if you know? A. 1 do not know ; I did not address myself to any one else. . Q. How were you on him? ^ A. I think I could show you by having a gentleman come here. r Q. Did you kick him at any time ? A. No, sir. Q. Did you get on him with your knee ? A. I did not. Q. With neither of them ? A. I did not. Q. Mr. Brown, f wish you would explain, if you will, in your own way, how the blood came on the floor, whether from spitting from Mr. Hughes, or whether it spurted from him ? A. Well, I thought he spit it; some such way as this (indicating); I don't know as it was exactly a natural spit; I don't think he did it in that way. Q. Was it in spots as though it was spit, or was it spattered ? A. Most of it was in spots. Q. After you saw the blood there was there any tussling between you and Weir and Hughes? A. There was some after Weir left. Q. In such a manner that the blood could get on the chair ? A. Well, I don't know but it splashed out when he spit in that way. Q. Was he out of the chair in that wTay after Weir went away ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And he went out of the chair when Weir went away ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Was he at the right of the chair then so that the blood could get there then ? A. Not that I could say. Q. Now, Mr. Brown, have you told with reference to this matter all that you know ? A. I have, sir. I don't know of any thing more. I think I have told every thing that I know and every thing that I saw. Q. Have you thought over the matter carefully since the coroner's jury examined you first for the purpose of refreshing your recollec- tion? A. Yes, sir; I have read over my testimony and I could not say any more with reference to what I saw except one thing. If I re- member right you asked me if I was surprised when I heard his ribs were broken and I said I was not. In one sense of the word I was 1387 in thp 1 mother I was not. By what I heard of what occurred thp r1-hoay~r°°1m ^ was not surprised, and then again when I heard tne ribs were broken in my part I was surprised. dav rn™ 9 J°u !leard any thinS with reference to the tussle in the A I had y°U ed he WaS in]'ured ? Q. When did you hear that he was injured ? n^o; W-aS 0n Sunda.y evening, I heard the ribs were broken; Sunday evening. ' Q. When did you hear that his jaw was broken? A. the same day it was broken! Q. A few minutes afterward, when the doctors were there 3 A. Yes, sir. Q. Who told you about his ribs being broken ? A. I think it was one of the attendants from 8 ; I couldn't tell as to that; some attendants; I was surprised to hear that they had been broken in my part. Q. Who told you about the tussle in the day-room ? A. I asked the paper hangers about that. Q. When? A. The same day that it occurred. Q. Where did you ask them ? A. In the day-room. Q. After the jaw was broken you asked them how it occurred 8 3 A. I did. ' * J Q. Which one did you ask ? A. The young man ; Mr. Seeley was on the scaffold the time it occurred. Q. Did he tell you how it occurred ? A. He told me he was badly abused. Q. Did you tliink a man could struggle and offer the resistance Mr. Hughes did after he came from the day-room into your depart- ment with his ribs broken ? A. I should not think his ribs were broken ; I do not know how an insane man will act after his ribs were broken. Q. Is there any other correction ? A. Not that I know of. Q. You say you have read it over? A. Yes, sir. Q. You read it yourself and signed it ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And as you read it over you found it to be correct, except as to the matter you speak of, and you have corrected that ? A. Yes, sir. By Mr. Shearman : Q. Did you see the finger that was alleged to have been bitten i A. I did. 1388 Q. Had it the appearance of having been bitten or injured in some other way ? A. It was just a little speck; I couldn't say. Q. Sufficient to draw blood ? A. I guess the skin was off. Q. When did you see that ? A. That was, I guess — I couldn't say exactly; it was that day some time. Q. Was it after that struggle between you and Hughes, or before? A. I think it was after Mr. Weir came back ; I think I heard Mr. Weir talking after that about the finger; I couldn't be positive about it. Q. Did he talk with Rappenburg about it ? A. I think Weir showed the finger to the doctor. Q. Had it the appearance of a fresh injury ? A. Well, it seemed as if it had. Q. From what you saw you would say it had been recently done? A. Yes, sir, I should think it was. By Mr. Becker : Q. Do you know what caused that struggle; do you know what cause Mr. Weir had to sit him in this chair ? A. No, sir; I was not on the hall just then ; Mr. Bills and Winnie brought him into the hall, and when I saw them coming I stepped behind the door to get the waist-belt. Q. You didn't see Mr. Hughes do anything? A. He was kind of violent, trying to get away. Q. He was brought through the hall by Bills and Winnie '. A. Yes, sir. A. And delivered to Weir ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And did Weir sit hiin in the chair ? A. He was sitting there when I got there; I didn't see them sit him tliere; they were coming toward the chair when I stepped behind the door to get the waist-belt, and he was struggling and re- sisting. Q. Is that the usual course, to seat a violent man, or is it custom- ary to turn him loose ? A. Well, when he is brought in from the front he is usually turned loose ; we try sometimes to keep them in a chair ; to seat him in a chair and keep him there. Q. Did you know how violent he had been the night before ? A. I did not. _ Q. Were you informed when you came out of your room as to how violent he had been in the day-room ? A. I was not aware of it. Q. Was any thing said in your hearing by Mr. Bills or anybody 1389 about his being a violent patient; as being too violent to be in the day-room ? b A. Not that I know of. Q. But, from his conduct, you saw he was a violent man, and you stepped back to get the strap« A. I did. F' Q. You say it was not used ? A. It was not used then. Q. I understood you to say that after Mr. Weir went away two patients did have hold of Mr. Hughes with you ? A. They assisted me. Q. Who? A. Mr. Winnie and Mr. McQueen. Q. Where did they have hold of him ? A. They had hold of each arm. Q. When was that ? A. That was after Mr. Weir left. Q. What position was Huglies in then ? A. He was sitting in the chair. Q. You were behind him ? A. I was behind him trying to put the waist belt around him. Q. They held each hand while you were doing that ? A. They were. Q. Is that the only time they had hold of him ? A. That was the only time. Q. During the struggle between you and Hughes, did they assist you ? A. Just at that time they did. Q. While you •were on the floor, when he went down, did they have hold of him in any way ? A. Not that I know of; they came there; I did not ask them to come. Q. Did they come while you were engaged in that struggle ? A. They were tliere at the time, and helped me to strap him ; that was just as I sat him in the chair after the struggle ;, the strap was right near me, right in front; they got hold of him. Q. Did they have hold of him before that ? A. Not that I know of. Q. Did they give you any assistance before that ? A. I guess not. Q. While you had hold of him, and you went down partially or wholly, did they have any hold of him ? A. I could not say as they had. Q. Are you certain as to whether or not they had hold of him, and went down with you? A. They did not. Q. The only two persons that went down was Hughes and your- self ? A. That was all. 1390 Q. You saw no altercation between Hughes and the patients ? A. No, sir. Q. Of any kind? A. No, sir. Q. Did you see any violence inflicted by Hughes upon any patient? A. I did not. Q. There was not any ? A. Not that I saw ; no, sir. Q. You saw all that occurred in that part ? A. Yes, sir; all that occurred then. Q. So that so far as you are able to state no patient got hold of him while you were on the floor ? A. Not unless they did when I was after the strap ; I got the strap after he came on the hall. Q. Coming down to the time Weir had gone away, during any of the time Weir was away, did any patient take hold of him except as you have stated ? A. No that I could say. Q. Can you state whether or not they took hold of him before he and you got up from the floor, or was it after you got up ? Q. After I got up with him from the floor. Q. Then it was that the two patients held him in the chair ? A. Yes, sir. Q. That is the only time that you can state ? A. Yes, sir. By Mr. Barnes : Q. After you got up off the floor you say the two patients went to your assistance ? Was that because he was violent? A. Yes, sir; he was so violent then that I could not put on the strap without their assistance. Q. After you sat him in the chair and had the strap on him you had nothing to do with him in the way of violence ? A. No, sir; I only went after some water then. Q. What did he do after you and he got up from the floor ? A. As I sat him in the chair I strapped him then ; then he slapped his hands and feet like this (indicating) and mumbled some- thing to himself and tried to get out but he could not. Q. He did that after he was strapped ? A. He did. Q. How long were you gone, Mr. Brown, after this water ? A. Perhaps a minute and a half. Q. You went quickly, did you? ': A. Not any quicker than if it had not happened ; the bath-room was only a few steps. 1391 % Mr. Barnes : Q- You knew he was secure then ? A. Yes, sir. By Mr. Shearman : Q. What is your weight, Mr. Brown? A. About two hundred pounds. Q. How near that? A. Well, when I weighed last I weighed that to a notch. Q. Did you see any blood upon Mr. Hughes' clothing ? A. I did. t> ■ to Q. Where? A. On the coat. Q. Just indicate where ; up and down in front ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you see any upon his pants ? A. Not that I could say. A. Anywhere else ? A. Nc not that I could see. Q. How much blood was there upon the floor when you and he went down together? A. Well, I couldn't say as to that. Q. Was there any on the floor at that time ? A. Yes, sir ; there was. Q. When you and he went down together did you go over or in the blood ? A. Well, I don't know but his knees may have struck the blood ; I couldn't say as to that. Q. Was there more blood after you and he got up from the floor than before ? A. I should say not; there may have been a little speck more. By Mr. Cheney : Q. Did he go over on his face ? A. No, sir. By Mr. Martin : Q. When did you first discover any bleeding or blood coming out of the mouth ? A. As soon as the stroke was given. Q. That was before you had the struggle with him when you pitched forward? A. That was before Weir left the hall. By Mr. Shearman : Q. Before or after he struck him in the face ? A. After he struck him. 1392 Q. How much blood did you see before Weir went away ? A. I could not say, sir. Q. That was on the floor in front of him ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Where else % A. A little on the arms of the chair. Q. Anywhere else ? A. A little on his coat. Q. Anywhere else? A. Not that I could state. Q. Was there as much on the arm of the chair, the floor or other places before Weir went away as there was after ? A. There was more after lie went away; there was more after he got back than there was when he went away. JAMES BROWN. Inquest in the Matter of the Death of Evan D. Hughes. February 11, 1884. Proceedings Monday afternoon. Dr. Charles H. Ransom, sworn and examined : By the District Attorney : Q. Doctor, what is your name ? A. Charles II. Ransom. Q. And your place of residence ? A. Erieville, Madison county. Q. You are a physician and surgeon ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Are you one of the coroners of the county of Madison ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you know Evan D. Hughes in his life-time i A. No, sir. Q. Well, you have since learned of such a person ? A. Yes, sir. Q. State if at any time you saw the body which was said to be that of Evan D. Hughes? A. Yes, sir. Q. When did you first see it, doctor ? A. On the 4th of February, 1884. Q. Where did you see' it ? A. At his residence. Q. And that is where ? A. Town of Nelson, Madison county. Q. Do you know when that was with reference to the time it arrived there from Utica ? 1393 A. I thmk it arrived from Utica on Saturday evening, the second. Q- 1 ou saw it Sunday ? A. Monday following. Q. It arrived Saturday evening, and you saw the body first then on Monday ? J J A. Monday morning. ^ Q. Did you call upon any physician, doctor, to assist you in mak- m a post-mortem examination ? A. Not that day ; I did the next Q. That would be Tuesday ? A. Tuesday. Q. Whom did you call upon ? A. Dr. Chase, of Morrisville. Q. He resides at Morrissville ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did Dr. Chase perform the autopsy ? A. He did. Q. When? A. Tuesday, the fifth. Q. The Same day he was called? A. Yes, sir. Q. Where was it performed ? A. At his residence. Q. At the doctor's residence ? A. Evan D. Hughes' residence. Q. Where you first saw the body ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did anybody assist him ? A. He had a partner who was tliere. Q. What was his name ? A. His name was Hammond. Q. Do*Jyou know his first name ? A. I do not; he did not assist him much. Q. He was about there ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Were you present tliere ? A. Yes, sir. Q. You saw what was done ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Observed ehe condition the body was in at the time the au- topsy was begun, during its progress and when finished ? A Yes, sir. Q. Will you state in the first place what they did with reference to making the autopsy ? A. He made an incision on the median line and opened the thor- acic cavity, that is where the lungs are. Q. He made the incision then crosswise ? A. Yes, sir. 175 U 1394 Q. You may state in your way just how it was done ? A. First we examined and found the ribs were broken. Q. You made an external examination ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And satisfied yourself that the ribs were broken ? A. Yes, sir. Q. How many ? A. We did not know how many ; we made an opening and found the floating ribs and three besides. Q. When you speak of the three ribs you mean those attached to the breast bone or sternum ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Were the parts examined externally, doctor ? A. Yes, sir. Q. State whether there was any injury there ? A. Yes, sir. Q. What did you examine ? A. The lung. Q. What did you find with reference to the lungs ? A. We found that the ribs had penetrated the lung; that the lung had collapsed as you might say; the air was let out; we found the cavity where the lungs are situated filled with serum and blood ; the lung was in a congested state. Q. Where; just indicate where this place was where the lung had been penetrated ; what portion of the lung ? A. I could not tell in regard to that particularly; the doctor kept the minutes of the autopsy; I should think it was near the center of the lung. Q. Was an examination made to see what had penetrated the (lung? A. Yes, sir; we could not tell, I think because there was nothing penetrating it then; we supposed it was a rib because the rib had a sharp point; nothing remained in the lung at the time ; we made an examination to satisfy ourselves as to how it was done. Q. Did you satisfy yourselves from the examination as to how it was done ? A. We were quite conclusive in mind that the rib had penetrated the lung; where the rib was fractured it had a sharp point; the end of it was quite sharp. Q. Did you examine any of the other parts ? A. We examined the other lung, the liver, stomach and intestines Q. What was the condition of those organs? A. Healthy. & Q. Which of the lungs was it that nad been penetrated a A. The left. 1395 Q- Which side were the ribs broken on \ A. The left. Q- Can you state where they were broken ? A. I could not exactly. Q. And was any of the ribs broken more than once ? A. 1 think not; the doctor could tell you more particularly as to that than I could; it was one break. Q. So that the end that slivered off must have been down ? A. Yes, sir ; it looked that way, and penetrated the lung. Q. Did you make an examination of the body before making the post-mortem, for the purpose of discovering whether there was any other injuries except breaking the ribs ? A. Yes, sir ; we found his jaw fractured. Q. About where ? A. I should think about half an inch to the right of the center. Q. Did you find any indications of a blow or bruises about the head ? A. We found one spot on the side of the head was black and blue. Q. How large ? A. About as large as a two shilling piece. Q. Skin broken ? A. No, sir. Q. Where was it ? A. That was on the temple, a little front of the temple ; right on this point on the side of the head (indicating). Q. Do you tliink, doctor, that the jaw could have been broken by a blow at that point where you found the black and blue spot? A. It would be hard to say as to that; I think he must have re- ceived a blow from some cause ; either a blow from the fist or some- thing. Q. Do you think that the break which you found could have been inflicted by a blow at the black and blue spot ? A. I think not, sir. Q. Did you make any further examination as to whether there^ were other black and blue spots? A. We examined the head but found no other black and blue spots; perhaps there was a little cut on one of the lips; not very deep; it was more like a scratch than any thing else. Q. On the end of the lip ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Sufficient, doctor, to produce any flowing of blood? A. Well, I should say not. Q. And did you examine where the ribs were broken with ref- erence to seeiuo- whether there were any black and blue spots there? A. Yes, sir. Q. Were there ? A. Yes sir; all along the back from the shoulder blade, down to the hip. 1396 Q. Opposite the ribs that were broken ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Had that the appearance of an injury inflicted from the out- side or was it a post-mortem appearance ? A. It was different from a post-mortem appearance; it looked as if the blood had settled there before death ; his back was red from post-mortem. Q. From.its appearance you thought it was occasioned by coming in contact with some substance during life? A. Yes, sir. Q. Had it the appearance of having been made with a sharp instrument ? A. I think not. Q. Would you say with something blunt? A. Yes, sir. Q. Quite blunt to have produced that appearance ? A. Well, it had not broken the skin; it must have been some- thing blunt. Q. How far did it extend up and down ? A. We did not measure, but from the shoulder-blade almost down to the hip. Q. Well, then, it was black and blue the length of ten or twelve inches? A. I should think so. Q. That would indicate that they came into contact with some substance of that size or length to have produced it? A. I am unable to say what — but something— some large sub- stance ; it looked so. Q. Do you think the condition of the ribs as you saw them — do you think it could have been produced by a blow from the fist? A. Well, if tliere was, it must have been more than one blow, I should think ; one blow could not have produced such a fracture. Q. You do not think it could have been produced by a blow from the fist ? A. I think not. Q. You do not think, as a physician and surgeon, that they could have been broken in that way by a blow? A. I should say not; that would be my opinion. Q. If that jaw had been broken by coming into contact with a sharp substance, there would have been external evidence? A. I should say so. Q. And you would have been less likely to find black and blue spots had the injury been caused by coming into contact with a blunt substance? A. I do not understand the question. r Q. If the blow had been inflicted with some large or blunt surface I ask whether you would have been likely to find these spots? A. I should think so. Q. As likely as if it had been done by a sharper instrument? 1397 A. That would have broken the skin. ^- Well, a smaller instrument? n tv J°uld have been aPt to- W,- Did you find any black and blue spots there ? A. No, sir ; we found no mark on the skin. tio?^^^?1^ a0d bIUG SP°tS 6XCept th6 °nG '0U "^ A. No, sir. Q. And the little scratch on the lip? A. Yes, sir. K ' Q. poctor, do you think a man striking another on the face with the fist could break the jaw as this was b?oken ? A. Well, I should say if he struck hard enough he might fracture his jaw. ° & Q.. Would it require a very severe blow, doctor? A. Well, it would depend upon how he struck. Q. Well, suppose a man struck another on the right side of the face on the jaw with the fist, would it have been likely to have pro- duced this injury? A. I am unable to say just to that extent. Q. Well, in your opinion ? A. It might have been done; yes, sir. Q. When you say you are unable to say, you mean you are unable to &ay how it occurred ? A. Yes, sir. Q. The question is whether it could have been done in that way? A. I think it might. Q. Would it have required a very heavy blow ? A. Well, it would require quite a heavy blow to break the jaw. Q. Would it require a blow that would be sufficient to knock a man down ? A. I could not say as to that; sometimes a small blow could do that and other times it would require quite a severe one. Q. You could not say whether it would require such a blow as would knock a man down to have done that injury ? A. I could not say; I should say it would perhaps. Q. Doctor, if a blow had been inflicted by a person with the clenched fist on the right side of the face, striking with the bottom of the hand in that way, indicating—-thesoft part of the hand, do yon think that could have broken the jaw ? A. Well, hardly; a blow inflicted in that way. Q. Say a blow inflicted by a person standing behind ? A. I should hardly think so ; it might. Q. Of course I do not mean to indicate the force of the blow; I mean simply striking in that way, do you think a blow could have been struck sufficiently hard to have produced that effect ? A. I tliink it must have been quite a hard blow ; he might have struck sufficiently hard to have fractured the jaw. Q. Doctor, how old a man was Hughes ? 1398 A. I think they said he was 55 or 54; he had that appearance. Q. About how tall? A. I should say perhaps he was a man five feet teu inches, in that neighborhood. Q. A very large, strong-looking man ? A. Not.so very large; about medium size. Q. About what would be his weight ? A. Perhaps somewhere in the neighborhood of ] 160 pounds — may be more, may be less; I never knew the man ; I saw his body. Q. Did you find any injuries — any black and 'blue spots on any other part of the body than you have mentioned ? A. No, sir ; I did not. Q. On the arms or on the limbs? A. No, sir ; we did not discover any. Q. Did you find any on the front part of the body ? A. No, sir ; the black and blue spots were around nearer the back and near the shoulder blade, running down to the hip. Q. Now, doctor, what would that indicate, finding no black and blue spots in front but in the rear, as to the injury ; was it a blow from behind or in front ? A. It looked as if the blow was from the side; the black aud blue spots were not around on the back; it was a little back of the arm, near the arm, but a little back of it. Q. Well, finding the black and blue spots there and none in front, would it indicate to you that the substance with which he came into contact was about that part of the body? A. It looked so; it looked as if some pressure or something of that kind might have produced this. Q. Well, if a man was falling over a chair and would strike it with that part of the body where you found the black and blue spots, and another person was in front of him, they all falling to- gether, do you think that could have produced the injury ? A. Well, it may have produced it; of course I am unable to say as to that. Q. Well, if a man should fall on the floor with another man hav- ing hold of him in a tussle, who weighed 200 pounds or thereabout, and the 200 pound man should fall upon him on the ribs, do you think they could have been broken in that way ? A. There might have been sufficient force to fracture them. By Mr. Martin : Q. Did I understand you to say that three ribs were broken be- side the floating ribs? A. Yes, sir. Q. Making seven ? A. Yes, sir; if the doctor was here that kept the minutes of the autopsy he could tell you more about that than I could; they were not all in a line ; some in the back and some near the front. Q. The break of the ribs in different places, would that indicate that they were broken from the effects of a sudden blow ? 1399 broiKrlff°l?ld think not>no, sir ; wherever the sudden pressure was to be perhaps there was where the fracture would be apt hvSL?V°-lIild tnis,indicate that they were rather crushed in than broken with a sudden blow ? of the^ackbon indi°ate that the Pressure was uneven ; it was in front Q. How far ? A. I could not say in regard to that. % Q. How hard a blow would it require in the abdomen to produce a b!ack fnd blne sPot : would it require a severe blow ? A. Well, quite a severe blow through his clothing. Q. It might be apt to knock him down before it produced a black. and blue spot ? A. Yes, sir. Q. You found no such thing I A. No, sir. Mr. Kincaid — Suppose I am Mr. Hughes, I am pretty nearly his weight,* I am sitting in a chair which is fastened to the floor with arms like these arms somewhat, and a man weighing 200 pounds is standing by me; holding me as Mr. Barnes is now; I am in a frenzy trying to get out of the chair, I have been doing so for some time. Mr. Barnes—Now I pull this man over the chair arm and we all go down in a heap to the floor, striking the side of the chair, then falling over. By Mr. Kincaid : Q. Now, my question is, is it more likely that the injury was inflicted in that way rather than by a blow ? A. Yes; it looks like that more than if it came from a blow ; that would be my opinion. Q. Rather than it was caused by any blow in front? A. Yes, sir; it looked as if he had been jammed or crushed against something; his side looked as if he had been crowded or pushed against something. Q. Well, suppose that these circumstances occurred in that way, could the ribs have been broken in that way ? A. It m^ght have taken place in that way. By Mr. Martin : Q. WouldiVt he have to be struck back pretty well to have struck the floating ribs ? A. Pretty well back, but he might go over the chair in that way and break those ribs. Q. Well, from the fact that the ribs penetrated the lungs, would it seem to you that tliere had been a sudden pressure or crushing of the ribs to have produced that injury — to have forced the rib into the lung ? * A. Well, it was supported by adhesive plaster; that might have some tendency to have kept the rib there. Q. You don't quite understand the question. Suppose that a blow should have been inflicted in such a way as to break the ribs would it have been as likely to have crushed it in as pressure ? 1400 A. I think not. Q. The fact is then, that you think they were crowded in or crushed in ? A. Yes, sir. Q. And penetrated the lung in that way ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Doctor, if two men were in a tussle, assuming that Hughes, for instance, and a man weighing 200 pounds were having a tussle and that they should fall upon the floor in the tussle, and the 200 pound man should fall upon him, would that be sufficient to fracture the ribs ? A. Well if the weight fell a sufficient distance, I should think so. Q. Suppose the man was partially behind him and Mr. Hughes was over the side of the chair and the 200 pound man should fall over on him, could his ribs have been broken in that way ? A. Well, if he struck him with his knees when he went to the floor, something of that kind, I think might do it. Q Now, suppose I have had my arms around you in this way, you raise up partially and go right over with this elbow over here (indicating) and I fell on you, could those ribs be broken in by your own elbow ? A. I should think not, hardly with his own elbow. By Mr. Kincaid : Q. Supposing that in the melee or tussle of this kind these men both fell over the chair upon the floor, Mr. Ilughes underneath, he fell over and struck his chin on the floor, could that have produced that fracture of the jaw ? A. It might have. Q. If he went over in that way that would have been more likely to have fractured his jaw than any blow ? A. I could not say. By Mr. Bachelor : Q. If he struck that way, it would have been likely to leave a mark ? A. Yes, if he struck on his chin it would have left a mark. Q. Then the way you found the fracture of the jaw would indicate more that the blow came from the side, rather than upon the chin ? A. Yes, sir. By Mr. Van Emburgh : Q. Did you have any theory as to how the jaw was fractured, while you were making the autopsy ? A. No, sir. Q. But there was no external evidence of a blow ? A. No, sir. 1401 lEy Mr. Barnes : ;'»' *<*•. Well, suppose that a man is very crazy, perfectly wild, and it •requires two men to hold him in a chair; and one man is called away and one is left; and that the man remains wild, and in a scuf- [ne they tall together on the floor; after the fall, the man is raised up oodily and put in a chair, and he is quieter, and in a few minutes you examine him and find two or three ribs broken—would you think that would be likely to occur, and that the fracture made it so that the one man could hold him ? A. I should say he would be apt to be quieter after his ribs were broken and they penetrated the lung. By Mr. Becker : Q. Do you think the ribs being ^broken in this way, and his jaw broken, he could resist a great deal ? A. Not afterward ; no, sir. Q. Could he if the jaw was broken and the ribs not? A. Yes, sir. Q. With the jaw broken, doctor, could the man spit ? A. He could not spit very far, I should think; he might be able to let it run down out of his mouth. Q. Could he bite ? A. I should say not. Q. Could he talk much ? A. No, sir. Q. Now, doctor, is there any thing else in addition to what you have stated that you can state with reference to these injuries and the condition of things that you found that will assist us in reaching a decision as to the cause of this man's death ? A. No, sir; that is the full extent, I think. Q. From the examination you made of him you would say that death resulted from the penetration of the lung by the rib ? A. Yes, sir. Q. That was the cause of death ? A. Yes, sir ; I should say so. Q. With reference to that black and blue spot on the face, do you think that was caused by a blow ? A. I am unable to say how that was caused; it was discolored. Q. To what extent ? A. I should say as large a spot as a two shilling piece. Q. Much discolored ? A. Well, about as much as you would find from an ordinary bruise, a yellowish tint; I could not say whether it was occasioned by a blow or not; I think it was not a,post-mortem appearance. Q. You saw no black and blue spots in any other place on the head or face except the one you mentioned near the temple ? A. No. Q. And that was on the left side ? A. Yes, sir. 176 U 1402 Q. The same side the ribs were on ? A. Yes, sir. By Mr. Kincaid : Q. Supposing I was struck by a blow from a man's fist on the left side of my face, or I fell over fr/om a chair and struck the floor on my chin, which would have been likely to have produced the most discoloration, the blow of kthe fist or the striking against the floor ? A. I should say the blow from the fist. Q. That would produce the most discoloration ? A. It> would be more likely to. Q. Either one might cause a fracture ? A. Yes, sir. Q. Could a blow from the fist, doctor, be sufficiently hard to have produced this fracture without leaving a discoloration ? A. Well, I should think perhaps it might. Q. Without discoloring the face at all ? A. Well, I should think so ; it might not. Q. And in making an examination if you found the jaw broken and found no discoloration, would it be your opinion that the jaw was not broken from the blow of the fist on the side of the face ? A. I should not want to swear to that, but that would be my opinion. Q. It would be your opinion that it would not have been done by a blow from the fist ? A. Not on the face. Q. Doctor, how long have you been practicing medicine? A. A little over ten years. Q. And you are a graduate of what school ? A. University Medical College, New York city. Q. And what school ? A. Allopathy. Q. You have been coroner of your county how long? A. Going on three years. Q. Do you think of any thing now, doctor, in addition to what you have stated that will give us any new light on the subject ? A. I do not know as I do ; if the doctor was here that kept a copy of the minutes of the autopsy he might give it to you in a little more minute form ; he might give you the minutiae of it; but I have given you the extent of the injuries I found. C. H. RANSOM. This is to certify that the above is a true and correct copy of the minutes taken by me on the inquest of Evan D. Ilughes, by the cororner of Oneida county, excepting the evidence of Ogden Backus, John Charles Hughes, J. Wilson Jones, John B. Orendorf and John M. Jones, which was taken by Mr. Spencer, the coroner's clerk which is attached hereto. T. E.'McGARR. NLM005609507